# Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed for 2017 [CR3]



## Canon Rumors Guy (Feb 27, 2017)

```
<p>We’ve been told by a couple of sources now that we will definitely be seeing a Canon EOS Rebel SL2 in 2017. We don’t yet know exactly when we’ll see the new camera, but we don’t expect an announcement at least until after the brand new EOS Rebel T7i begins shipping at the end of March.</p>
<p>We had been told previously that a new EF-S prime lens would be coming, and it would make sense if these two products came around the same time.</p>
<p>We think that’ll likely be it for APS-C DSLRs from Canon in 2017, there won’t be an EOS 90D or EOS 7D Mark III this year.</p>
<p>Specifications are unavailable at this time, but we’ll obviously pass them on if we hear anything.</p>
<span id="pty_trigger"></span>
```


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## mclaren777 (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

You should ask your source about the rumored 85mm IS.

I'm dying to hear more about a possible release date.


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## Crosswind (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

Now if it'd feature a flippy screen and the new sensor with on-chip ADC + DPAF... then this will be a real hotcake... and probably a bit of a rival to the EOS M series.


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## jolyonralph (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

SL2 (110D?) will, if trend follows, probably have the same 24mpx sensor as in the 80D, M5, 77D, 800D, but with a slower framerate of 4-5 fps and, probably, DIGIC 6 rather than DIGIC 7. No flippy screen.

This would, if it happens, mean that the same sensor powers every production APS-C DSLR that Canon currently produce, with the exception of the quite old 7D II. [Edit: and the M10. But I can't see them keeping the old 18mpx sensor in the 110D.

I know the rumors say the 7D III isn't coming out this year, but I really can't see the 7D II lasting another year.


As for the prime lens, if it's not a EF-S 35mm f/1.8 (or, if they've being lazy, f/2.0) STM I'll be SHOCKED. Seriously shocked. It'll be between $150 and $200.


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## Crosswind (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Canon Rumors said:


> We had been told previously that a new EF-S prime lens would be coming,...



Did you try to ask your sources something like if it is more of a wider focal lenght or not... nothing too specific... just a tiny tiny tidbit for us to chew on  would be great!


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## LDS (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

Ouch, just now I was almost convinced to buy myself an M5 for my birthday... now I need to see how this compare to it...


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## Jopa (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

That's very good news. I have a 40/2.8 ready for this camera


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## Canon Rumors Guy (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



mclaren777 said:


> You should ask your source about the rumored 85mm IS.
> 
> I'm dying to hear more about a possible release date.



I know more, I just can't say anything yet. Soon... I promise.


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## jebrady03 (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Canon Rumors said:


> mclaren777 said:
> 
> 
> > You should ask your source about the rumored 85mm IS.
> ...



This lens just didn't seem possible to me for a while, but I've thought about it more and see that it is. Are you positive it's an "L" and not a line extension of the 24/28/35 IS models?


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## larjon (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

Will that be a 150D in Europe and a Kiss X8 i Japan?


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## Canon Rumors Guy (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



jebrady03 said:


> Canon Rumors said:
> 
> 
> > mclaren777 said:
> ...



It is 100% an L, no doubt about it.


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## EduPortas (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



> I know the rumors say the 7D III isn't coming out this year, but I really can't see the 7D II lasting another year.



How so? Are you not convinced about its blazing fast AND accurate AF system at a constant 10fps? 

Its DPAF technology? Its 1080 60p for video with both mic and headphone inputs? Its rock-solid construction? 

Its more than capable sensor for 99.9% of everything a good photog does, save for absurd -5EV shadow recovery?

I don't see Canon launching a new 7D when this one is so recent and their product cycles are so dilated.

It's a superb camera.


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## LonelyBoy (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



jolyonralph said:


> SL2 (110D?) will, *if trend follows, probably have the same 24mpx sensor as in the 80D, M5, 77D, 800D,* but with a slower framerate of 4-5 fps and, probably, DIGIC 6 rather than DIGIC 7. No flippy screen.
> 
> This would, if it happens, mean that the same sensor powers every production APS-C DSLR that Canon currently produce, with the exception of the quite old 7D II. [Edit: and the M10. But I can't see them keeping the old 18mpx sensor in the 110D.
> 
> I know the rumors say the 7D III isn't coming out this year, but I really can't see the 7D II lasting another year



I was hoping this would come to happen: a rollout of the new sensor tech causing all the bodies to get upgraded in short order, in sequence. If they do the SL1 and the 6D updates, per rumors here, that would just leave the 7DII and 5DS/r, right?


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## traveller (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

I think that in some ways Canon had the market for the SL1 wrong. The SL1 was specified and marketed as an entry level camera, a traditional alternative to the small mirrorless cameras that Canon felt could compete on size, as well as perhaps a hedged bet on the future of the EOS-M. Whilst small cameras have enjoyed some success in the entry level market, particularly with Asian women, simply making cameras small has not stemmed the decline in camera sales. This is partly because the target market already has small cameras called smartphones with "good enough" image quality and far better connectivity. 

Will repeating the SL1 formula by fitting most of the latest generation "Rebel" in a smaller body resonate with the market? I'm sure they'll sell enough to make the venture profitable, but I think that they could make far more impact by taking the SL2 upmarket. For me, this would mean: 


100%, 1.0x, pentaprism viewfinder
tilting screen (not side hinged, flip out style!)
dual control dials
45pt AF sensor
weather resistant body

On top of the latest generation sensor and meter technology. Basically, a scaled down 80D... 

Produce that camera and launch it with some compact EF-S primes and you might just pry me away from Fuji when I'm looking for a compact carry anywhere system to complement my Canon full frame kit.


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## IglooEater (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Canon Rumors said:


> jebrady03 said:
> 
> 
> > Canon Rumors said:
> ...



That kinda makes me sad- I hope they're not dropping the 1.2 line. :'(


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## hoodlum (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

Will the 18mp sensor finally be put out to pasture after 8 years?


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## ajfotofilmagem (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



hoodlum said:


> Will the 18mp sensor finally be put out to pasture after 8 years?


After 7D, 60D, 60Da, T2i, T3i, T4i, T5i, T5, T6, SL1, M1, M2, M10, now is over.


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## Canon Rumors Guy (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



IglooEater said:


> That kinda makes me sad- I hope they're not dropping the 1.2 line. :'(



They are not dropping the EF 85mm f/1.2L II for the EF 85mm f/1.4L IS I have been told.


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## ahsanford (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Canon Rumors said:


> We’ve been told by a couple of sources now that we will definitely be seeing a Canon EOS Rebel SL2 in 2017. We don’t yet know exactly when we’ll see the new camera, but we don’t expect an announcement at least until after the brand new EOS Rebel T7i begins shipping at the end of March.</p>
> <p>We had been told previously that a new EF-S prime lens would be coming, and it would make sense if these two products came around the same time.</p>
> <p>We think that’ll likely be it for APS-C DSLRs from Canon in 2017, there won’t be an EOS 90D or EOS 7D Mark III this year.</p>
> <p>Specifications are unavailable at this time, but we’ll obviously pass them on if we hear anything.</p>
> <span id="pty_trigger"></span>



1) We shouldn't be surprised at all about the 7D3. If a 7D Mark III drops this year it would be _two_ years too soon. Very un-Canon to update a brand faster than prior updates of that same brand -- in fact, it hasn't happened in 8-10 years or so across all SLR brands.

2) _*Why the hell are they making another SL1? *_ See plot below -- SL1 didn't exactly set the world on fire. Surely the tandem of M5/M6 could address the need for folks to keep things small without throwing away functionality. An SL2 seems like throwing more money at a bad idea, IMHO.

- A


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## ahsanford (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



jolyonralph said:


> I know the rumors say the 7D III isn't coming out this year, but I really can't see the 7D II lasting another year.



More than rumors -- past track record applies as well. The 7D been a steady 5 year lifecycle brand for its two iterations. There are only so many takers for a ~ $1500 flagship APS-C rig. Canon will not rush out a 7D3 unless the D500 starts gobbling up share, and I've seen no data to suggest that is happening.

- A


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## ahsanford (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Canon Rumors said:


> IglooEater said:
> 
> 
> > That kinda makes me sad- I hope they're not dropping the 1.2 line. :'(
> ...



Daaaaaaamn look at CR Guy doling out the tells today!

My turn: next non-L 50 will be _when_, exactly? 8)

- A


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## unfocused (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> ... _*Why the hell are they making another SL1? *_ ...Surely the tandem of M5/M6 could address the need for folks to keep things small without throwing away functionality...



Because Canon has determined there are sufficient customers out there who are completely uninterested in mirrorless offerings, but who would like small, light DSLR.

I've made the case before and I am making it again. There is a market for this camera. 

I believe the difference between the SL1 and SL2 will be similar to the difference between the 7DI and 7DII. 

The 7DI was an all-around, general purpose camera for those wanting the best possible APS-C available. The 7DII is a beast that is targeted to a specific niche market -- action photographers who either want APS-C to supplement their full frame, want the extra reach APS-C offers or simply can't justify or afford 1DX price tag. While the 7DII certainly is a great all-around camera, it is much more targeted than the original 7D.

I see the SL2 fitting into a similar niche. Small and light for those who want that, but who want a real viewfinder and want to be able to use their collection of lenses without adapters or compromises. 

I would definitely consider an SL2 for hiking when I don't want to take either a 1DX or a 7D. Pair the SL2 with the 18-135 nano USM and you've got a very portable combination that is great for hiking. Without much more weight, you can even throw in the 55-250 STM. 

A decent, but modest autofocus is sufficient, since it won't be used for birds in flight with a super-tele. A tilt screen would be okay, but not necessary. What it will need is good connectivity (Wi-Fi, NFC, bluetooth), GPS and touch screen (already on the SL1). A bit of weathersealing would be good, but don't do anything to increase the weight (maybe even cut it slightly, as they did with the 80D vs. 70D).


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## jolyonralph (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ajfotofilmagem said:


> hoodlum said:
> 
> 
> > Will the 18mp sensor finally be put out to pasture after 8 years?
> ...



Nitpicking, but the M3 has a 24mpx sensor.


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## ajfotofilmagem (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



jolyonralph said:


> ajfotofilmagem said:
> 
> 
> > hoodlum said:
> ...


Thanks for the correction.


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## slclick (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

This changes things for a few folks waiting or on the fence


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## ahsanford (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



unfocused said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > ... _*Why the hell are they making another SL1? *_ ...Surely the tandem of M5/M6 could address the need for folks to keep things small without throwing away functionality...
> ...



Sure, I get it. But that statement above _is exactly what the SL1 tried to do_. Are you arguing the SL2 just needs to try harder and get hooked up with the latest tech?

I have zero doubt you want one, and I don't want to marginalize your perspective, but the SL1 failed for a reason, didn't it? I have a feeling that reason had little to do with whether is had the latest sensor / DPAF / touchscreen etc. or not. It might have been because the lower end of the APS-C market is saturated with offerings and the ace up SL1's sleeve -- it's size -- wasn't as compelling an option as a more fully featured Rebel, but I certainly could be wrong.

I'm not saying mirrorless is best and efforts to similarly reduce space like the SL1 are futile -- I'm saying that they tried and it wasn't a hit. I fail to see what would change that this go-round.

- A


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## ajfotofilmagem (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> unfocused said:
> 
> 
> > ahsanford said:
> ...


At the time SL1 was launched, it lacked:

Price compatible with the features offered.
Image quality to compete with Fuji and Panasonic.
Good connectivity to post on social networks.
18-55mm STM, compact like de new model F4-5.6.
24mm STM pancake.
50mm STM decent and almost pancake.


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## slclick (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> unfocused said:
> 
> 
> > ahsanford said:
> ...



DPAF, Flippy, brighter VF, better button layout. Maybe a tad wider and a smidge thinner...like the M5 you say?


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## TeT (Feb 27, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

the only thing I don't like about my SL1 is the manual ISO selection range. What users love is the size.

Looks like a 6DII + SL2 kind of year for me...

(Would still trade it all for a canon FF mirrorless system)


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## slclick (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

I know buying bodies, especially Canons are sometimes a compromise and I'm ok with that but it will be just my luck that the SL2 will check all the boxes the M5 didn't for me.


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## rrcphoto (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> Canon Rumors said:
> 
> 
> > We’ve been told by a couple of sources now that we will definitely be seeing a Canon EOS Rebel SL2 in 2017. We don’t yet know exactly when we’ll see the new camera, but we don’t expect an announcement at least until after the brand new EOS Rebel T7i begins shipping at the end of March.</p>
> ...



the US price plots are meaningless unless you show them with the corresponding import price or Yen to USD exchange value.

it also really has no relation to sales either.


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## goldenhusky (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

Even though I liked form factor of SL1 it was too plasticky for my taste. Not sure how well canon will sell this in 2017 or 2018 whenever it starts shipping, considering the stiff competition from other mirrorless manufacturers and canon' own. IMHO Canon could spent their resources in designing more fast lenses including primes for their EF-M mount instead of flooding the lower end of DSLR market.


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## neuroanatomist (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> 2) _*Why the hell are they making another SL1? *_ See plot below -- SL1 didn't exactly set the world on fire. Surely the tandem of M5/M6 could address the need for folks to keep things small without throwing away functionality. An SL2 seems like throwing more money at a bad idea, IMHO.



At the risk of picking at another thread's scab, unless you believe that Canon would sell the SL1 at a loss for >2 years, what does it say about the profit margin for an entry-level camera that Canon can drop the price ~38% from launch and still turn a profit?


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## Woody (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

Woohoo!!!

Exactly what I have been waiting for!


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## Woody (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> It might have been because the lower end of the APS-C market is saturated with offerings and the ace up SL1's sleeve -- it's size -- wasn't as compelling an option as a more fully featured Rebel, but I certainly could be wrong.



Comparing the SL1 to EOS M5 (both with viewfinders):
407 g (SL1) vs 427 g
OVF vs EVF
Battery life of 380 vs 295
Slightly more grip for SL1

The biggest draw for me: OVF vs EVF.

Also, to adapt my EOS lenses to the M5, I need to use the EF adapter which weighs ~ 100g, making the total weight of the M5 > 500g.


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## Tangent (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

Quite surprised. Shaping up to be a very good year for Canon -- 77D is good value for the money (a boo for the missing afma), M6 looks like a nifty mirrorless, and now an SL2. The 6DmkII around the corner. Good stuff.


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## michi (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*

I love my SL1. I sold all EF-S lenses but my 15-85. That's my basic vacation and general drag it around with me combo. My 5DII and IV are too heavy to lug around with L lenses. I have the original EOS M and enjoyed it but decided I don't want to invest in a third lens system. I'll probably just replace the SL1 with the SL2. My only hope for change would be obviously better image quality/high ISO performance, and I would also like to see an improvement in the controls. Some of the buttons are too small or close to each other. They could definitely be spaced and sized a little more ergonomically. Better AF? Sure, I'll take it. That's all.


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## unfocused (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> ...the SL1 failed for a reason, didn't it? ...I'm saying that they tried and it wasn't a hit.



Where did Canon say it was a failure? I'm not saying they didn't say that. I'd just like to see a statement from Canon, or some sales figures, or something that supports your statement. If you are basing it solely on price history, that's meaningless. 

Note that the 6D price history pretty much follows the same trend line as the SL1, yet there is strong evidence that it has been one of Canon's greatest hits (consistently beat all other full frame cameras on Amazon's best sellers list, not for months, but for years. Currently sitting at #10 and beating all of Nikon's full framers) 






And, as Neuro points out, it's unlikely Canon would have kept the SL1 in the lineup if it wasn't selling and was losing them money. 



neuroanatomist said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > 2) _*Why the hell are they making another SL1? *_ See plot below -- SL1 didn't exactly set the world on fire. Surely the tandem of M5/M6 could address the need for folks to keep things small without throwing away functionality. An SL2 seems like throwing more money at a bad idea, IMHO.
> ...


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## Ozarker (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



unfocused said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > ...the SL1 failed for a reason, didn't it? ...I'm saying that they tried and it wasn't a hit.
> ...



Don't take Sanford too seriously. He just makes stuff up as he goes along... including "facts". In his alternative universe there is no big picture. Just a single data point... his imagination.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



neuroanatomist said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > 2) _*Why the hell are they making another SL1? *_ See plot below -- SL1 didn't exactly set the world on fire. Surely the tandem of M5/M6 could address the need for folks to keep things small without throwing away functionality. An SL2 seems like throwing more money at a bad idea, IMHO.
> ...



I'd doubt that the cost to make one exceeds $150. The rest of the price is the cost to advertise. ship, provide service, allow for currency fluctuations, and last and definitely not least - profit. Every one and everything along the way from production to the customer grabs a chunk of money, and even after delivery, service must be provided.

The high initial price allows them to pay off development costs, and the costs to stock tens of thousands worldwide, stock parts and service tools. After that is paid for, they can cut the price and still make a profit.

Canon would not be coming out with a new model unless they expected to make a nice profit.


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## rrcphoto (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



neuroanatomist said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > 2) _*Why the hell are they making another SL1? *_ See plot below -- SL1 didn't exactly set the world on fire. Surely the tandem of M5/M6 could address the need for folks to keep things small without throwing away functionality. An SL2 seems like throwing more money at a bad idea, IMHO.
> ...



not quite that simple. the SL1 isn't manufacturered in USD.

the Yen in the start of 2013 was coming off historical highs.

the cost of manufacturing is only one part of the puzzle. distribution, reseller / channel margin, canon USA margin, cost of support / warranty insurance,etc,etc are all factored into the base cost. some of it, such as warranty,etc can decrease over time because there's more certainty. the yen dropped over their extreme highs in 2012 and was still very high in 2013.

MOST of canon's cameras during this period of time have dropped a far amount of value, even the 5D Mark III dropped around 30%.

it's hardly any sort of precursor or meaning when the export value would have dramatically changed over it's lifecyle.


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## ahsanford (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



neuroanatomist said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > 2) _*Why the hell are they making another SL1? *_ See plot below -- SL1 didn't exactly set the world on fire. Surely the tandem of M5/M6 could address the need for folks to keep things small without throwing away functionality. An SL2 seems like throwing more money at a bad idea, IMHO.
> ...



I think Canon tacked a premium onto small and cut that premium when it wasn't selling well, but in fairness, RRC is dead on that I lack foreign exchange considerations. 

But as a thought exercise, let's compare the SL1 to the same-timeframe-released T5i. The T5i retained its price over the same time period better, even after the T5i was replaced with the two T6i/s models and the SL1 was not replaced.

Again, I'm not saying there's not a market for the SL1. I'm saying other products are protecting their price better, which one might imply corresponds to more robust sales. It's merely speculation, I admit.

- A


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## ahsanford (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Canon Rumors said:


> We had been told previously that a new EF-S prime lens would be coming, and it would make sense if these two products came around the same time.



Right, so if this is the current rumor -- it would make sense that the new EF-S prime is _*tiny *_to make the most of the SL2's (presumably) very small body.

New wider angle pancake? Possibly some magic compact telescoping longer lens? _Surely not AvTvM's mythical EF-S 85mm f/2.4 STM IS pancake..._ 

The mind wanders.

- A


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## slclick (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> Canon Rumors said:
> 
> 
> > We had been told previously that a new EF-S prime lens would be coming, and it would make sense if these two products came around the same time.
> ...



Samsung has a decent 16 pancake, Sony a good 20. I don't see why they can't do something a little wider than the very nice already ef-s 24. 

Perhaps an 18 2.0(?) which is 28 FF equivalent and a very nice wide FL for street, travel and tight indoor.


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## ahsanford (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Tangent said:


> Quite surprised. Shaping up to be a very good year for Canon -- 77D is good value for the money (a boo for the missing afma), M6 looks like a nifty mirrorless, and now an SL2. The 6DmkII around the corner. Good stuff.



+1. We expected Rebels this year to accompany the end of the FF rollout of 1DX/5D4/6D2. But the strides with EOS M5/M6 and now an SL2 is shaping up to be _lot _of new body options in fairly quick succession. Go Canon.

...and I'll take that EF 50mm f/1.4 USM II whenever you're ready. 

- A


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## 9VIII (Feb 28, 2017)

WHAT!?!?!?!??!
WHAT?!?!?!?!!?

I MUST BE DREAMING!


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## neuroanatomist (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> But as a thought exercise, let's compare the SL1 to the same-timeframe-released T5i. The T5i retained its price over the same time period better, even after the T5i was replaced with the two T6i/s models and the SL1 was not replaced.
> 
> Again, I'm not saying there's not a market for the SL1. I'm saying other products are protecting their price better, which one might imply corresponds to more robust sales. It's merely speculation, I admit.



What was the price over time in Japan (Kiss X7)? The SL1 is a small camera, those typically do better in Asian markets. Consider the original M, which tanked in the USA and fell from $800 to $250, but was the #2 best-selling MILC in Japan.


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## ahsanford (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



neuroanatomist said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > But as a thought exercise, let's compare the SL1 to the same-timeframe-released T5i. The T5i retained its price over the same time period better, even after the T5i was replaced with the two T6i/s models and the SL1 was not replaced.
> ...



Again, that's entirely fair -- I only have US prices from CPW to go on. The SL1 may be a top seller in Japan, EU, etc. for all we know.

Forgive me everyone, I'm raining on everyone's parade with my comments. I know a number of folks *really *wanted an SL2 and it looks like it's happening, so way to be -- I'm honestly geeked for you. 

Please don't mistake me as a grinch or naysayer here, I'm just honestly surprised that it's happening.

- A


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## AJ (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> 2) _*Why the hell are they making another SL1? *_


It's the gateway drug


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## ahsanford (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



AJ said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > 2) _*Why the hell are they making another SL1? *_
> ...



I thought the gateway drug was one of the less expensive L zooms, like the 17-40L. ;D

- A


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## AJ (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> AJ said:
> 
> 
> > ahsanford said:
> ...


Yep, that's another one. Also 70-200/4 non-IS


----------



## slclick (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> AJ said:
> 
> 
> > ahsanford said:
> ...



That would be the 70-200 f/4L

Seriously.


----------



## MintChocs (Feb 28, 2017)

It must be Xmas! Finally a positive for 2017, whilst it won't be interesting for others I still have my Xsi that needs updating. I just hope it's not going to cost a small fortune.


----------



## quiquae (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > ahsanford said:
> ...



EOS Kiss X7 has been--and still is--consistently among the best selling ILCs in the Japanese market.
In fact, BCN ranking shows the X7 double zoom kit at #1 among all ILCs last week, and GfK ranking at #3.


----------



## ahsanford (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



quiquae said:


> EOS Kiss X7 has been--and still is--consistently among the best selling ILCs in the Japanese market.
> In fact, BCN ranking shows the X7 double zoom kit at #1 among all ILCs last week, and GfK ranking at #3.



Had. no. idea. 

Wow! Thanks for the data.

- A


----------



## benkam (Feb 28, 2017)

The new reduced size 18-55 f4-5.6 kit lens would be an ideal package for the SL2 (200D?).
The 24 STM (this really also ought to be a kit option for the SL-series) and 50 STM would also still be a perfect primes combo for size, price and function.

I'm a 100D/SL1 user who thinks the only slightly bigger and slightly more expensive 700D/T5i would've been a better buy for the articulating screen and more buttons for control, but otherwise generally satisfied with its performance as a small DSLR.

It would be interesting to find out if the SL2 keeps to its price range and gets 750D/T6i internals (as the SL1 currently has 700D/T5i) or if it moves up to the 800D/T7i price range with DPAF and 45pt AF. I'm guessing the former but we'll see.


----------



## Woody (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



quiquae said:


> In fact, BCN ranking shows the X7 double zoom kit at #1 among all ILCs last week, and GfK ranking at #3.



Can you provide a link for GfK camera ranking? I can only find the BCNRanking site https://www.bcnretail.com/research/ranking/.


----------



## Poz (Feb 28, 2017)

This is a welcome surprise - I want an improved sensor in a small package, and I had almost given up on an SL2! Go Canon! 8)


----------



## Daan Stam (Feb 28, 2017)

I really hoped the 90d would come this year with them putting the 77d so close to the 80d.


----------



## Woody (Feb 28, 2017)

benkam said:


> It would be interesting to find out if the SL2 keeps to its price range and gets 750D/T6i internals (as the SL1 currently has 700D/T5i) or if it moves up to the 800D/T7i price range with DPAF and 45pt AF. I'm guessing the former but we'll see.



If the SL2 does not get 77D/80D sensor with DPAF, it's a no-go for me. Don't need 45 AF pts.

Note the SL1 was announced on 21-Mar, together with the 700D/T5i. The 750D/T6i was only released in 2015, 2 years later. So, there is a good chance the SL2 will share the same internals as the 800D.


----------



## benkam (Feb 28, 2017)

Woody said:


> benkam said:
> 
> 
> > It would be interesting to find out if the SL2 keeps to its price range and gets 750D/T6i internals (as the SL1 currently has 700D/T5i) or if it moves up to the 800D/T7i price range with DPAF and 45pt AF. I'm guessing the former but we'll see.
> ...



You could be right, Canon could go that way as they trickle down DPAF in their new releases. But, that would also mean quite the jump in price from currently being a budget camera as it'll then likely be priced not much less than the 800D.


----------



## BasXcanon (Feb 28, 2017)

What Canon is doing is [size=12pt]*WRONG*[/size]!

800D, 77D, SL2, 85mm IS, making the stuff that is perfect for selling to the lesser informed people.
Those 77D/M5 are price tagged like the 80D, yet miss all the stuff that really matters, 2nd sync curtain, shutter speed up to 8000's, missing C modes on the 77D. I bet the new SL2 will have electronic shutter curtains as well.
A new 1400D with Digi 7 processor for noice cleaning is the only upgrade that should be done in the entry section.

Now Nikon wants to focus at the higher end, Canon thinks they have the chance throwing up all new entry bodys on the market. 

But in the long haul, canon is way better of designing an M model with dual card slots, 1/8000S shutter speed, no compromises on sync speed, integrating the Lp 6N batteries in an Eos M model, 
Spending resources in Eos M lenses,
Spending resources on a new 7Dm3,
Spending resources on developing a Mirrorless Full frame, 
Spending resources in a new G5X with better raw buffer and DPAF that can compete vs Fuji x100 and Sony RX100,
What the point of a 85MM IS?, stabilization will be obsolete within 2-5 years when ISO performance will improve, (something that the D500 and A6500 now have).

I could not care less about new portraiture L lenses, what ever Canon/Nikon/Fuji/Sony/Pentax/Sigma makes, it gets beaten by Zeiss lenses. Canon knows that for sure, hence the few lens updates.

Every camera company now has a 2000$ crop body that is awesome, now it is canons turn!
There is plenty enough in the 1DXm2 that could migrate to a new 7Dm3, buffer, fps, new AF system, video stabilization, etc...

But I guess there is still a lot of $$$ in it to sell crap to the lesser informed people in Asia.


----------



## arcer (Feb 28, 2017)

benkam said:


> Woody said:
> 
> 
> > benkam said:
> ...



Sorry, I don't understand your argument.
The SL1/100D and T5i/700D were both released together and have almost the same features except size and mass, fps, and the articulating screen. Their released price were $650 and $750 respectively. So I don't understand why you stated that the SL2 needs to have T6i/750D internals to stay competitive to the T7i/800D.
I think you are confusing the SL series with the bottom of the ladder tier, T6/1300D.

Even if the SL2 was released with T7i/800D internals or even the 77D internals, its price will still stay below or similar respectively.

Furthermore, as Canon is now moving its whole line onto the new sensor fab, it would be weird to put an old sensor tech into a 2017 Canon camera that is supposed to be competitive in its respective market.

P.S. I rarely used current market price as the basis of Canon's intended market segmentation, as market situations and currency exchange will change as time goes by.
P.S.S. Just because the SL1 was an awkwardly marketed product in the US, doesn't mean it wasn't profitable for Canon globally.


----------



## sylvestrerato (Feb 28, 2017)

I hope the SL2 will have more battery life because that's one of the reasons that kept me from buying the SL1 with high ISO noise.


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## arcer (Feb 28, 2017)

BasXcanon said:


> What Canon is doing is [size=12pt]*WRONG*[/size]!
> 
> 800D, 77D, SL2, 85mm IS, making the stuff that is perfect for selling to the lesser informed people.
> Those 77D/M5 are price tagged like the 80D, yet miss all the stuff that really matters, 2nd sync curtain, shutter speed up to 8000's, missing C modes on the 77D. I bet the new SL2 will have electronic shutter curtains as well.
> ...



1st statement and 2nd paragraph are your own subjective opinion.

Nikon is most likely leaving the entry level for the near future as it knows Canon has almost completely dominated that market. They will come back to the entry market when they have produced a matured high end pro ecosystem that can compete with Canon toe to toe. In the end, you still need entry bodies to introduce new buyers into your ecosystem. (Reason why Canon won the race atm.)

Regarding the M, you have misunderstood the intended methodology of the M series.
...... M lenses, you sure Canon is not spending resources?
...... 7D3, R&D is not a 6-month garage project. R&D takes years and I don't want a 7D3 with incremental improvements.
...... FF ML, you're not an occasional reader of CR for the past few months, aren't you?
...... G5X, why chose that specific camera as competitor of the Fuji or Sony? Why not the G1X?
...... 85mm IS, seriously? IS will be irrelevant? You make me question who is the less informed one.

Canon shouldn't make any new L lenses? Comparing Canon/Sigma/Nikon/Sony to ZEISS? Seriously? Again?

Hey, I rather have newer features in my new 7D3 than just adopting those from the 1DX2.

Yes, Canon will earn a lot from the rebels and XXDs, but they are not crap, and people in Asia are not less informed. Fyi, almost all camera brands are in Asia ffs. And saying the rebels are crap is like admitting that you are an excrement from a canine compared to the best photographers in the world.


----------



## arcer (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> Tangent said:
> 
> 
> > Quite surprised. Shaping up to be a very good year for Canon -- 77D is good value for the money (a boo for the missing afma), M6 looks like a nifty mirrorless, and now an SL2. The 6DmkII around the corner. Good stuff.
> ...



With the barrage of new bodies these 2 years, I really hope that the following 2 will see the flood gates open for new lens. You know, your beloved lens might be in the mix also.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Feb 28, 2017)

BasXcanon said:


> What Canon is doing is [size=12pt]*WRONG*[/size]!
> 
> 800D, 77D, SL2, 85mm IS, making the stuff that is perfect for selling to the lesser informed people.
> Those 77D/M5 are price tagged like the 80D, yet miss all the stuff that really matters, 2nd sync curtain, shutter speed up to 8000's, missing C modes on the 77D. I bet the new SL2 will have electronic shutter curtains as well.
> ...



Speaking of lesser informed people, thanks for sharing your opinion. Perhaps you can remind us which global market-leading ILC manufacturing company you run. No? Perhaps then the global, multi billion market cap tech-focused company you lead. Still no? 

Ahhh, well...armchair internet experts who know better than Canon how Canon should spend their ¥, and who know better than consumers worldwide what they should want to buy with their hard-earned income, are not uncommon around here. For some reason, you all seem to have widely disparate opinions on exactly what Canon must do, but hey, I guess that's why Y'all are the expurts you are. 

:


----------



## LonelyBoy (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> I have zero doubt you want one, and I don't want to marginalize your perspective, but the SL1 failed for a reason, didn't it?



I'm pretty sure I've said this same thing before, but the _exact same statement_ can be made about the original M, which got a follow-up. Several, in fact, and the newest, best ones seem to be successfully commanding a _higher_ price than the original failed at. Why only apply this logic to the SL?

As for your price chart, CPW charts look like that for a lot of Canon stuff; there seems to have been a lot more variability a few years ago, then they mostly flatline at a low point. That's not evidence for much of anything.


----------



## quiquae (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Woody said:


> quiquae said:
> 
> 
> > In fact, BCN ranking shows the X7 double zoom kit at #1 among all ILCs last week, and GfK ranking at #3.
> ...



http://www.itmedia.co.jp/lifestyle/articles/1702/20/news122.html


----------



## ashmadux (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



EduPortas said:


> > I know the rumors say the 7D III isn't coming out this year, but I really can't see the 7D II lasting another year.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




It WAS a superb camera...until it launched. The 7d2 was DOA, and the d500 has eaten its lunch, breakfast, dinner, and stole it's wife. Canon went safe- too safe- and it killed the 7d legacy. They almost did the same thing with the 5d4...just playing it too damn safe. You start to forget about the 10fps (nice!) because the camera is so old hat and boring.

No touch screen, Horrible sensor (dude, there's nothing awesome about it at all), no big difference from the 7d1, and, um, NO ONE is talking about how much they want a 7d2. Even the M cameras have more chutzpah then the 7d2.

If a post comes up about a 7d3, i can bet you dollars to donuts that the onus would be more like "um, ok...." as opposed to the former feeling os "here we gooooooo, yeah!".

Canon bodies are more known now for what they leave out then what they put in. And that,s pretty sad because they make good cameras.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ashmadux said:


> It WAS a superb camera...until it launched. The 7d2 was DOA, and the d500 has eaten its lunch, breakfast, dinner, and stole it's wife.



Yeah, except that the 7DII is still outselling the D500 on Amazon, both in the US and in Germany. But hey, don't let reality get in the way of your delusions… :

Hope your indigestion improves, and maybe your wife is happier now.


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## jolyonralph (Feb 28, 2017)

The new SL2 will use the LP-E17 battery for sure. For those wishing that the low-end cameras (and mirrorless) will switch to LP-E6(N) sorry, that won't happen.

The LP-E17 has far more sophisticated security features for anti-counterfeiting which means that Canon can make much more money from selling spare batteries ensure your camera is not using potentially dangerous third-party batteries 

Expect standardization on LP-E17 on low-end cameras and LP-E6(N) on higher end (except the 1DX series) for a while.


----------



## Orangutan (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ashmadux said:


> and, um, NO ONE is talking about how much they want a 7d2.



I want one!! They're too expensive for me right now because demand is keeping the price up. Even refurbs aren't dirt cheap, and never stay in stock. Please verify your speculations before you present them as fact.


----------



## tr573 (Feb 28, 2017)

I'd be in for an SL2. My wife has the 1, and it's a decent little camera. Makes for a good light-vacation shooter with the 24&40 pancakes.

I tried the X100T for that purpose myself, but ended up selling it inside of a year - I loved a lot of things about that camera but found that EVF is simply not for me (I would get nauseous when it was on if I moved the camera at all with it up to my eye) and the AF was simply too slow and hit or miss when shooting in OVF mode. 

Even a tiny rebel mirror finder works out better for me than the M5 EVF would. Everyone's got their own thing though.


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## sylvestrerato (Feb 28, 2017)

jolyonralph said:


> The new SL2 will use the LP-E17 battery for sure.



That should mean battery life will not be much longer :-(


----------



## LDS (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



neuroanatomist said:


> Yeah, except that the 7DII is still outselling the D500 on Amazon, both in the US and in Germany.



On Amazon Italy, the 7DII is the 9th camera most sold, the 100D the 16th, the D500 is 62nd...

BTW: the M10 is the most sold mirrorless...

Different markets may have very different dynamics, depending on brand recognition, price, availability, etc. etc.


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## vau (Feb 28, 2017)

Call me a loser, or a cheap bastard, but I'm actually enjoying my SL1 very much and can't wait to have the SL2.

My reasons:

- Nice and compact, no doubt about this
- It was cheap, I'm not afraid to use it anytime. Second hand price is near that, there are plenty, so it's almost disposable.
- The second hand market for canon mount lenses is huge, I got my Tamron 28-75 f2.8 for about 200 bucks. 
- If my pictures suck, that's usually not because my camera is limiting me. That's a nice excuse, but it's just not true. 

The SL1 does perfectly well for almost everything. People made exceptional bird photos with motor drives as well. I find it lame that the benchmark for a good camera is not usability, but the capability to machinegun the sht out of the landscape with 24mpx jpgs.


----------



## rrcphoto (Feb 28, 2017)

I played around with an SL1 last month for a bit. it amazed me how tiny it was.

I want an SL2 24mp APS-C .. no 4k or crap.. basic camera and cheap. and then I want a SL2x .. it's mirrorless full frame cousin with an EF mount.


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## magarity (Feb 28, 2017)

sylvestrerato said:


> I hope the SL2 will have more battery life because that's one of the reasons that kept me from buying the SL1 with high ISO noise.


Battery technology goes in leaps every year thanks to pressure from the smart phone industry. The problem with camera batteries seems to be getting the OEMs to upgrade the replacement batteries over time. Why is Canon still selling SL1 batteries at the original spec while misc brands have a 50% increase? I think Canon didn't bother to have its engineers revisit the old model. Be wary of the super cheapo 3rd party batteries but I think it's ok to use decent ones for a huge boost.
For example, genuine Canon NB2LH are still made and sold with the original 800mah. A new 3rd brand is 1800mah.


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## [email protected] (Feb 28, 2017)

The sleeper feature of the SL1: It rocks an intervalometer. I can get 4,000+ shots on that little guy with a battery when the shots are close together. The electronic internals appear to draw much less power than those of other cameras. 

I got two of them for < $300 each, added a couple third party battery grips, and I can go an entire day taking pictures every few seconds. I don't worry about them as much, either, as they sit out on public lands doing this. If they get taken, I'm not out 30 percent of the value of my gear. 

Very, very useful little buggers. So long as I keep it to 400 ISO or below, the images are great.


----------



## benkam (Feb 28, 2017)

arcer said:


> benkam said:
> 
> 
> > Woody said:
> ...



I'm clear I also think the SL2 would be priced below the 800D. Of course. If it's cost-effective for Canon to produce an SL2 with 800D internals, while being able to keep the price noticeably below, then great! But I've also read here that the 750D and 760D won't be discontinued just yet but will be kept to have less expensive models in the range. So Canon has a choice of which path to take with the SL2.

Ultimately, I'm an SL1 user who doesn't plan on getting an SL2 so I don't feel strongly either way really. 

If the SL2's price with the 800D is close, I'd say if you're considering a purchase in this price range, IMO I'd rather get the only slightly bigger 800D for the articulating screen and the slightly greater number of buttons they can't fit on the smaller SL series. Or maybe even save a little more to spring for the 77D if you want to stick in this DSLR _size _range. As with many things, YMMV. 

Also, anybody attracted to the SL2 for its size should also consider the mirrorless option. I will when I feel its time to replace my 100D/SL1. It would be interesting where the M5's price would fall by the SL2's release, whenever that is or later, such as say the end of this year.


----------



## Sporgon (Feb 28, 2017)

This is a camera that would certainly interest me. Whilst I like the size and concept of the M3, having had it for the best part of a year now I'm beginning to wonder why I don't just use the G1X when I want small and compact. For me the M3 ( and therefore the 5 and 6 also) comes into its own when matched with the EF lenses, but then I'm left thinking "why not just put them on the 5D anyway' ?

I do prefer the instantaneousness ( is that a real word ?) of the reflex, and personally I'd like Canon to _not_ make this SL2 an 'entry level' camera. They have the 1300D for that. Make it a dslr that is a pleasure to own and shoot, give it a decent, bright pentaprism. Include features such as AFMA and the rest. Pitch it in price somewhere between the M5 and M6. I'd be happy.


----------



## Maximilian (Feb 28, 2017)

Late entry, but didn't had the time earlier:
If this CR3 becomes true, I'd be really glad and surely in if price and specs are deckend.


----------



## ashmadux (Feb 28, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



neuroanatomist said:


> ashmadux said:
> 
> 
> > It WAS a superb camera...until it launched. The 7d2 was DOA, and the d500 has eaten its lunch, breakfast, dinner, and stole it's wife.
> ...




Neuro, while I enjoy your hubris filled dissertations, you're not exactly a comedian. PLEASE Don't quit your day job, tee hee hee 

Anyways, as to what your probably trying to say: '..but it sells more..', and 'You're delusional'

Sorry, I guess you were too busy prepping your joke to realize _no one was comparing sales_  . So your point is exactly where my "wife" is- non-existent   : 8)

That said, 7d2 was one of the most highly anticipated, depressing letdowns in recent memory - FOR ACTUAL USERS. I stand by what I said. And they almost repeated with the 5d4 (luv it though). We love their cameras(M1 FTW), but man, the GLARING OMISSIONS from their bodies have seriously racked up over the years. Canon bodies are almost the equivalent of apple laptops- you're only going to get 'enough', and that's that. AND you will pay out of the ass for it. It's a terrible new legacy to build, after the at-the-time 7d/5d2/5d3 were unquestionable goliaths in their categories.


----------



## LesC (Feb 28, 2017)

Good news, still enjoy my SL1/100D, produces great photos & as small as/smaller than some mirrorless cameras too. Great for those times you want to travel light but don't want to compromise on quality.


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## LonelyBoy (Feb 28, 2017)

benkam said:


> Or maybe even save a little more to spring for the 77D if you want to stick in this DSLR _size _range. As with many things, YMMV.
> 
> Also, anybody attracted to the SL2 for its size should also consider the mirrorless option. I will when I feel its time to replace my 100D/SL1. It would be interesting where the M5's price would fall by the SL2's release, whenever that is or later, such as say the end of this year.



I might go for the 77D (I had already written off the possibility of the SL2 and started talking myself into the 77D) for the top display and flippy screen. It is, in the end, not _that_ much bigger than the SL1, and a lot more useable.

Mirrorless is not going to happen; I want something to give my wife to shoot my races, and I'm not going to trust mirrorless for that for some time yet.


----------



## LonelyBoy (Feb 28, 2017)

Sporgon said:


> This is a camera that would certainly interest me. Whilst I like the size and concept of the M3, having had it for the best part of a year now I'm beginning to wonder why I don't just use the G1X when I want small and compact. For me the M3 ( and therefore the 5 and 6 also) comes into its own when matched with the EF lenses, but then I'm left thinking "why not just put them on the 5D anyway' ?



That's the crux of the problem with the M platform for me: I might as well weld the 22/2 on it if I got one. As soon as you use one of the zooms, or the EOS-M adapter, you can't slip it in (my) pocket. It "almost" fits, but that's not good enough, and the SL1 + pancake "almost" fit just as well. If it's not going to quite fit, I'd rather have the OVF and PDAF (and maybe a bit less "almost" and gain the flippy screen and top display, as posted above).


----------



## Khufu (Mar 1, 2017)

Bonus info-nugget:

The 100D/SL1, for some time, EXCLUSIVELY had THE best Canon APS-C sensor on the market, better than the 700D, which was announced on the same day, with the older sensor, better than the 60D sensor, which itself was better than the 7D sensor. This SL1 sensor is the 18mp Hybrid AF II, which wasn't put into anything else until the M2, with its much better AF than the EOS M; the 100D/SL1 already had this Hybrid AF II sensor, and those silly ISO testing sites rated it above all the other 18mp sensors... (I'm not sure which sensor eventually went into the EOS M10)

So I don't know where the "bad ISO" performance comment came from (if relative to other Canon APS-C cameras) but the comment about the third party grips, yeah, the SL1/100D is really cool with one of those!

I hate that they took away the 3x video crop mode right before these cameras rocked up, and I hate that, having resurfaced for the M2 and M3, it's been pulled AGAIN from the M5 (RUINED the M5 for me, absolutely gutted about this omission)... Now I fear the SL2 will not have this feature... and I'm to carry on with my M2 for video reach, with no sensor upgrade, perhaps everrr (unless I give the M3 and all its shortcomings a go)

Please come back, >3x video crop mode


----------



## scyrene (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> jolyonralph said:
> 
> 
> > I know the rumors say the 7D III isn't coming out this year, but I really can't see the 7D II lasting another year.
> ...



I've no reason to doubt the 7D2 will be current for a while yet, but you can't talk about 5 year cycles when there's only one data point (the time between the mark I and the mark II) - you can't reasonably extrapolate from so little data. Nitpicking maybe, but still.


----------



## scyrene (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ashmadux said:


> No touch screen, Horrible sensor (dude, there's nothing awesome about it at all), no big difference from the 7d1, and, um, NO ONE is talking about how much they want a 7d2. Even the M cameras have more chutzpah then the 7d2.



I've seen hundreds of truly excellent bird photographs taken with the original 7D, let alone the mark II. What's your definition of horrible?



ashmadux said:


> Canon bodies are more known now for what they leave out then what they put in. And that,s pretty sad because they make good cameras.



Isn't this self-contradictory? Either the cameras are good, or they leave all the good stuff out.


----------



## Woody (Mar 1, 2017)

Sporgon said:


> Make it a dslr that is a pleasure to own and shoot, give it a decent, bright pentaprism. Include features such as AFMA and the rest.



Isn't that the 80D? ;D

Its price won't be cheap compared to mirrorless counterparts because DSLRs have many more components.


----------



## Mt Spokane Photography (Mar 1, 2017)

vau said:


> Call me a loser, or a cheap bastard, but I'm actually enjoying my SL1 very much and can't wait to have the SL2.
> 
> My reasons:
> 
> ...



But, will you pay $700 for a new one? The SL-1 price has dropped over the years, but a replacement is going to start at a much higher price. That is the way it works, if buying a camera, a car, or even a smart phone. The SL-1 is one of the few true bargains right now when you can find one.


----------



## tapanit (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ashmadux said:


> 7d2 was one of the most highly anticipated, depressing letdowns in recent memory - FOR ACTUAL USERS.


As an actual user who upgraded 7D to 7D2, I don't agree with this. I didn't find the 7D2 a letdown at all, let alone depressing in any way, even though it obviously could have been better (but that's always the case and doesn't surprise me, I don't anticipate miracles).


----------



## figaro28 (Mar 1, 2017)

For me this is the best news that I have ever read on Canon rumours. 

I have too many wonderful lenses to change systems (First Canon was an EOS 1000 FN), I am too old to use an EVF, which I find detestable (M5 out), and I am too lazy to carry around a brick (80D out). 

I was getting ready to splash on a 77d to replace my tired SL1, but this changes everything! Within reason, price will not be an issue.


----------



## Sporgon (Mar 1, 2017)

Woody said:


> Sporgon said:
> 
> 
> > Make it a dslr that is a pleasure to own and shoot, give it a decent, bright pentaprism. Include features such as AFMA and the rest.
> ...



Nope !


----------



## 9VIII (Mar 1, 2017)

Sporgon said:


> This is a camera that would certainly interest me. Whilst I like the size and concept of the M3, having had it for the best part of a year now I'm beginning to wonder why I don't just use the G1X when I want small and compact. For me the M3 ( and therefore the 5 and 6 also) comes into its own when matched with the EF lenses, but then I'm left thinking "why not just put them on the 5D anyway' ?
> 
> I do prefer the instantaneousness ( is that a real word ?) of the reflex, and personally I'd like Canon to _not_ make this SL2 an 'entry level' camera. They have the 1300D for that. Make it a dslr that is a pleasure to own and shoot, give it a decent, bright pentaprism. Include features such as AFMA and the rest. Pitch it in price somewhere between the M5 and M6. I'd be happy.



I would take 5DS capabilities in an SL body if I could.
Take the best that Canon can do and shove it into the smallest possible body.

And then make a 7Dx that takes 1D batteries and lets users enjoy 1D level features without paying $5K.


----------



## LDS (Mar 1, 2017)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> But, will you pay $700 for a new one?



I would, for example, if the specs justify it - but the real question is how many people within the Canon target for this camera would.

If it has sold well (in some markets, maybe not everywhere) because its price and size, Canon would be crazy to move it to an higher price segment - unless it is confident enough that's exactly what is needed to sell better.

But the most important question is: will be it available in white still?


----------



## benkam (Mar 1, 2017)

Woody said:


> Its price won't be cheap compared to mirrorless counterparts because DSLRs have many more components.



Not in the Canon world currently. The M5, which I'd argue is the mirrorless 77D not the ML 80D, is similar to or even a little bit more expensive than the 77D.


----------



## LukasS (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Woody said:


> Woohoo!!!
> Exactly what I have been waiting for!


I've been on a lookout for this news for a looong time . My 100D was for last 1,5 year most used camera, and for some time i'm using it more and more for vlogging (10-18mm EF-S and RODE mic) - it's great combo.

I would love to see [email protected], DPAF and increased number of AF points. Bought it for around 300USD with additional battery (3rdp) and photography book (gave it away).


----------



## Sharlin (Mar 1, 2017)

benkam said:


> Woody said:
> 
> 
> > Its price won't be cheap compared to mirrorless counterparts because DSLRs have many more components.
> ...



Yeah, it's not about the number of components, it's simple economies of scale. Most of the basic building blocks of an (EF-S) DSLR cannot be shrunk even in principle (mount, mirror box, mirror, sensor, viewfinder) so they can just use their standard issue off-the-shelf parts for those. Not much extra engineering required.


----------



## LukasS (Mar 1, 2017)

BTW. probably someone already did mention this, or will in the future. But how about that weight and size of the SL2 - it's really important factor for users!

Let's just think about it while looking at this setup:


----------



## slclick (Mar 1, 2017)

LukasS said:


> BTW. probably someone already did mention this, or will in the future. But how about that weight and size of the SL2 - it's really important factor for users!
> 
> Let's just think about it while looking at this setup:



Please elaborate just what you are trying to convey with that image. Unless you are calibrating your afma, I'm not sure that trio of body/lens/pod is a real world analogy for making a point. Not picking fights here just trying to understand. 

fwiw, I think they could go a little bigger with the new body, not a lot but still keep it smaller than the T line and give it better ergonomics with dial layout. However, there were rumors that it will be even smaller still.


----------



## benkam (Mar 1, 2017)

LukasS said:


> BTW. probably someone already did mention this, or will in the future. But how about that weight and size of the SL2 - it's really important factor for users!
> 
> Let's just think about it while looking at this setup:



Haha. Now stick it with an 800mm.
And put it next to a 1DX with a 40mm pancake, please.
Thanks.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ashmadux said:


> Anyways, as to what your probably trying to say: '..but it sells more..', and 'You're delusional'
> 
> Sorry, I guess you were too busy prepping your joke to realize _no one was comparing sales_  . So your point is exactly where my "wife" is- non-existent   : 8)
> 
> That said, 7d2 was one of the most highly anticipated, depressing letdowns in recent memory - FOR ACTUAL USERS. I stand by what I said. And they almost repeated with the 5d4 (luv it though). We love their cameras(M1 FTW), but man, the GLARING OMISSIONS from their bodies have seriously racked up over the years. Canon bodies are almost the equivalent of apple laptops- you're only going to get 'enough', and that's that. AND you will pay out of the ass for it.



Apparently, you don't understand the point of referencing sales figures. Every 7DII that was sold means someone made the decision to buy a camera they believed would best suit their needs. When you make an assertion that the D500 is vastly superior, the fact that more people are choosing to buy the 7DII makes that assertion ridiculous. 

As for the 7DII being a 'depressing letdown', if you're speaking for yourself, too bad you were depressed by it. Have you considered Prozac? But, in fact, you seem to be speaking generally, for 'everyone'. In that case, that pushes your statements beyond ridiculous and into asinine. 

Incidentally, my five-year-old Apple laptop is better than my brand-new, work provided the Lenovo PC – both in terms of computing performance and in terms of reliability. I'm not sure what Apple 'glaringly omitted' from my laptop, but we can leave that ridiculous assertion of yours for another day.




ashmadux said:


> It's a terrible new legacy to build, after the at-the-time 7d/5d2/5d3 were unquestionable goliaths in their categories.



The 7D was an 'unquestionable Goliath'?? You might want to have your metacognition checked. How can you say that about a camera that, according to you, had unusable autofocus and terrible noise at base ISO? 



ashmadux said:


> Lord help you if you receive a 7d with wacky AF...once my AF went, the camera was completely unusable fort the last year i had it. The most frustratingly under performing camera i have ever come across.





ashmadux said:


> The 7d creates mush-tastic images. Also, the 7d's atrocious iso 100 noise is nothing like ive seen on any other canon camera.


----------



## LonelyBoy (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



neuroanatomist said:


> Incidentally, my five-year-old Apple laptop is better than my brand-new, work provided the Lenovo PC – both in terms of computing performance and in terms of reliability. I'm not sure what Apple 'glaringly omitted' from my laptop, but we can leave that ridiculous assertion of yours for another day.



I would love to know what CPUs are in each laptop, because it is a ridiculous assertion that a five-year-old CPU is better than a remotely comparable new one.

Our work laptops are regularly brought to their knees by McAfee, which is apples to oranges with your personal laptop.


----------



## EduPortas (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



> The 7d2 was DOA...



Dude, have you actually USED the camera we're referencing?

You know, like in the ACTUAL field?

I could care less what Nikon does, like most people on this forum. Yet the 7D2 hits all the marks at $1,400

for people who actually make a living with their gear without spending $5,000+ for a 1DX. 

For APS-C Canon users, that's a really good deal.


----------



## rrcphoto (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



LonelyBoy said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > Incidentally, my five-year-old Apple laptop is better than my brand-new, work provided the Lenovo PC – both in terms of computing performance and in terms of reliability. I'm not sure what Apple 'glaringly omitted' from my laptop, but we can leave that ridiculous assertion of yours for another day.
> ...



Not sure about 5 years, but a i7 haswell isn't that much slower than the newer skylake processors. if you trick out a skylake based laptop (ie: i have NVMe's and 2 SSD hard drives and a 980 graphics processor and a desktop 6700K in my laptop) then yes, but for normal laptops? probably not much different in a generation of laptops.


----------



## Sharlin (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



rrcphoto said:


> LonelyBoy said:
> 
> 
> > I would love to know what CPUs are in each laptop, because it is a ridiculous assertion that a five-year-old CPU is better than a remotely comparable new one.
> ...



Yep, it's not the 90s anymore. Advances in CPU technology during the last five years have gone first and foremost towards power efficiency, _especially_ when it comes to laptop processors.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Sharlin said:


> rrcphoto said:
> 
> 
> > LonelyBoy said:
> ...



Core i5 2.53 GHz vs. Core i7 2.6 GHz, but to clarify I wasn't referring to performance in a Geekbench-type test, but rather operational performance – opening and scrolling through a 150 MB PowerPoint file, for example. I can count on my Win PC to crash occasionally, to have Office365 apps hang and need a process force quit occasionally or system restart. The only time I ever need to reboot my Mac is when a software update requires it, and the only apps that crash or hang are niche, coded-in-my-basement things like FoCal.

As for power, yeah - the Lenovo will last quite a bit longer on battery than my 17" MB Pro (but not as long as my previous MB Air).


----------



## LukasS (Mar 1, 2017)

benkam said:


> Haha. Now stick it with an 800mm.
> And put it next to a 1DX with a 40mm pancake, please.
> Thanks.



At least one of you gets it . 

Maybe the will announce grip for it this time?


----------



## slclick (Mar 1, 2017)

LukasS said:


> benkam said:
> 
> 
> > Haha. Now stick it with an 800mm.
> ...



Oh I get it, it's just it's all in the delivery and yours was sending mixed signals. I mean, some folks are serious, dead serious about tiny bodies on great whites. M series with 800's, the web is full of them. It was that tabletop pod that threw me I guess. THAT is what I would say is the truly humorous part of all of it.


----------



## LonelyBoy (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



neuroanatomist said:


> Core i5 2.53 GHz vs. Core i7 2.6 GHz, but to clarify I wasn't referring to performance in a Geekbench-type test, but rather operational performance – opening and scrolling through a 150 MB PowerPoint file, for example. I can count on my Win PC to crash occasionally, to have Office365 apps hang and need a process force quit occasionally or system restart. The only time I ever need to reboot my Mac is when a software update requires it, and the only apps that crash or hang are niche, coded-in-my-basement things like FoCal.
> 
> As for power, yeah - the Lenovo will last quite a bit longer on battery than my 17" MB Pro (but not as long as my previous MB Air).



You didn't list actual models there, but I'd look at what's wrong with your Windows laptop. It should be able to do much more than that smoothly, and mine reboots for security updates, essentially.

And it's hardly as if Apple products never break; quite the opposite in my experience. But I'll let this wonderful rabbit hole go, because it's clearly about your subjective preference.


----------



## 9VIII (Mar 1, 2017)

benkam said:


> LukasS said:
> 
> 
> > BTW. probably someone already did mention this, or will in the future. But how about that weight and size of the SL2 - it's really important factor for users!
> ...



My primary use for the 1100D is with a Supertelephoto lens (the venerable, not terribly heavy but still large 400f5.6).
My favorite lens to use on a gripped 5D2 (basically the same size and weight as 1D) was the 40mm Pancake.

It's ironic that in practice I find the best lens/body combinations are opposite of what most people "think" would work best.

When I have a large lens strapped to my body I want the camera body to fit within the same width and height as the lens, carrying the whole camera by my side while hiking, a large body is always digging into my side.
The smaller body (the 1100D is only slightly larger than a SL1) is much more comfortable, not to mention being about a pound lighter.
If the body were small enough I could even put the whole thing in a single lens sized pouch.

I took the Gripped 5D2 through Disneyland a few years ago, it went on all the rides (including Splash Mountain) stowed between my feet, walking around it only took a few seconds to whip it out of my backpack.
Of course Disneyland is not the most extreme theme park, I probably wouldn't have taken it anywhere with more "serious" rollercoasters, but the principle proves well enough, putting a pancake lens on one of the largest camera bodies available does indeed make it vastly more portable.
Similar to my reasoning with a small body on a large lens, when you have a body that's tall and wide, but relatively flat, then using a flat lens complements that shape, it basically creates a "turtle" shaped profile that is very convenient to handle.
Oppositely, putting a "normal" lens on that body gives you something with effectively the same footprint as a toaster oven.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



LonelyBoy said:


> You didn't list actual models there, but I'd look at what's wrong with your Windows laptop. It should be able to do much more than that smoothly, and mine reboots for security updates, essentially.
> 
> And it's hardly as if Apple products never break; quite the opposite in my experience. But I'll let this wonderful rabbit hole go, because it's clearly about your subjective preference.



What's wrong with my Windows laptop is Windows.   8)

BTW, the AV software isn't McAfee. 

Seriously, the differences are really pretty minor, but I've had expected 5 years to be pretty noticeable. I can certainly tell that my wife's MacBook and my old MacBook Pro are slower, but the former still gets the job done for her general tasks and the latter is being used by my kids...and they're from 2008 and 2006, respectively! I wonder how many 9-11 year old Windows laptops are still going strong?


----------



## 9VIII (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



neuroanatomist said:


> LonelyBoy said:
> 
> 
> > You didn't list actual models there, but I'd look at what's wrong with your Windows laptop. It should be able to do much more than that smoothly, and mine reboots for security updates, essentially.
> ...



My laptop from 2010 is still running fine, but I also only run Linux on that machine so I'm not sure if that's a counter-point or supportive of your argument (that I haven't really bothered to read the context of).


----------



## bf (Mar 1, 2017)

I want to see how SL2 will look next to M5! EVF vs. OVF,EF-M mount vs. EF-S.


----------



## Sharlin (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



9VIII said:


> My laptop from 2010 is still running fine, but I also only run Linux on that machine so I'm not sure if that's a counter-point or supportive of your argument (that I haven't really bothered to read the context of).



My desktop has a Core i7 from 2009. It runs everything fine. Photoshop, LR, games, whatever you throw at it. Current equivalent offerings are at at most twice as fast. Been a while since CPU speeds doubled every eighteen months.


----------



## Fleetie (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Sharlin said:


> 9VIII said:
> 
> 
> > My laptop from 2010 is still running fine, but I also only run Linux on that machine so I'm not sure if that's a counter-point or supportive of your argument (that I haven't really bothered to read the context of).
> ...


CPU speed has stagnated almost completely. Clock speeds are totally static. You get more cores, but only if you're prepared to pay INSANE prices, especially with Xeons. Power consumption is going down a bit. CPU speed for a given power consumption is going up, very slowly.

But for actual CPU speed per core... Basically, it is not increasing. It has stopped.


----------



## Crosswind (Mar 1, 2017)

bf said:


> I want to see how SL2 will look next to M5! EVF vs. OVF,EF-M mount vs. EF-S.



I guess the SL2 will pretty much look like the SL1. So, ... actually there's not too much difference in terms of size when compared to the M5, when the EF/EF-M adapter is attached (in my case I never detach it because I do only have FF lenses): http://j.mp/2ldMb4s

One big advantage of the OVF will be the much much lower energy consumption. You can effectively get a lot more shots out of your rebel with one battery.

I come from the EOS 6D (sold it to buy the M5) and I do not miss its OVF. One big reason being the live exposure preview which really helps getting exactly what I want. I do not have any problems with the downside of an EVF that it consumes a lot more energy, as I always carry a (Canon) spare battery with me, so I do not have any worries.

And with mirrorless you never have to worry about front- or backfocus. I know there are things like AFMA, but... will it be featured in a rebel SL2? I'm not so sure.

There are tons of advantages and disadvantages. In fact, if the SL2 was available at the time I bought my M5, I'd have had a hard decision which one to buy, as long as the DSLR offers a flippy screen and at least the same low iso DR as the 80D/M5. 

Once, I had the rebel SL1 in my hands. It felt really great. Nice finish. Nice ergonomics. I just missed the flippy screen and I didn't want to buy the same old 18MP sensor I already had many years ago with my EOS 600D.

Maybe the SL2 will get a hybrid VF? Who knows.


----------



## ahsanford (Mar 1, 2017)

bf said:


> I want to see how SL2 will look next to M5! EVF vs. OVF,EF-M mount vs. EF-S.



Presuming the SL1 is a rough guess of the SL2 form factor, there you go. The size is comparable, but EF-M pancake is a stop faster.

- A


----------



## Don Haines (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Fleetie said:


> Sharlin said:
> 
> 
> > 9VIII said:
> ...


if you are dealing with a single threaded process, it can run slower when you add more cores! Turning hyperthreading off can improve speed.... 

The real improvement with "new" computers is faster solid state drives and GPU processing on your video card. If your software supports GPU processing, buying a decent video card makes much more difference than buying a new computer...


----------



## ahsanford (Mar 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



Fleetie said:


> CPU speed has stagnated almost completely. Clock speeds are totally static. You get more cores, but only if you're prepared to pay INSANE prices, especially with Xeons. Power consumption is going down a bit. CPU speed for a given power consumption is going up, very slowly.
> 
> But for actual CPU speed per core... Basically, it is not increasing. It has stopped.



+1. I can't speak to how factual that is (I'm not terribly well read on this), but I can share an anecdote that might reflect that.

Photos/web/life/this forum/etc. --> I'm on my Mac. Much like Neuro said, I have zero problems with it, even if I could get zippier performance in a less reliable and more frustrating Windows machine.

But I have a second box for gaming, and it's a windows PC. I don't game that much these days (I knock out perhaps 2-3 large time commitment titles per year), but I have that second rig built expressly for gaming and I replace it every 5-6 years or so -- sometimes upgrading the vid card / GPU long the way. 

Anyway, A friend of mine is a chief egghead at 3D engine programming/optimization for the huge AAA video games, so I rely on him for spec'ing the new build each time. My rig is 6-ish years old, so I thought the mid-cycle vid/GPU swap wouldn't cut it at this stage and I'd need an altogether new mobo/CPU/etc.

Not so.

Since yours truly he had the foresight to spec a six core CPU all those years ago and that processor still easily punches its weight versus today's consoles, he said all I needed -- _even six years later_ -- was a new vid card and I'd be back to buttery framerates at high settings on the latest games. Go figure.

- A


----------



## Don Haines (Mar 2, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> Fleetie said:
> 
> 
> > CPU speed has stagnated almost completely. Clock speeds are totally static. You get more cores, but only if you're prepared to pay INSANE prices, especially with Xeons. Power consumption is going down a bit. CPU speed for a given power consumption is going up, very slowly.
> ...


Yup! A good video card. I recently upgraded mine and yes, it certainly makes a difference.... plus it supports 8K video......now if I only had an 8K monitor........


----------



## benkam (Mar 2, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



ahsanford said:


> Anyway, A friend of mine is a chief egghead at 3D engine programming/optimization for the huge AAA video games, so I rely on him for spec'ing the new build each time. My rig is 6-ish years old, so I thought the mid-cycle vid/GPU swap wouldn't cut it at this stage and I'd need an altogether new mobo/CPU/etc.
> 
> Not so.
> 
> Since yours truly he had the foresight to spec a six core CPU all those years ago and that processor still easily punches its weight versus today's consoles, he said all I needed -- _even six years later_ -- was a new vid card and I'd be back to buttery framerates at high settings on the latest games. Go figure.



That's because GPUs, which are optimized for that task have become much more sophisticated than CPUs. Much more. As in CPUs may have a few or several "cores" but GPUs can have hundreds and into the future, potentially, thousands! When it comes to gaming and other intensive graphics, the CPU is just there for the ride, the GPUs are the ones throwing things around.

I still remember the old video chips and cards and now some of these GPUs, even the so-called dedicated entry-level or mid-range ones, are quite mind-boggling. In photography terms, I'm thinking if the body is the CPU and the lens the GPU, it's like you were shooting birds, happy and content, with a classic 7D and an 18-135 and then somebody hands you a 100-400 or even a 600 to play with, I reckon you'd be a fair bit happier even if you keep the old body.


----------



## slclick (Mar 2, 2017)

Just jumping in might think the SL2 was a laptop.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Mar 2, 2017)

slclick said:


> Just jumping in might think the SL2 was a laptop.



No, I think we all know that it's a camera. The question is, who makes it?


----------



## bf (Mar 2, 2017)

Crosswind said:


> bf said:
> 
> 
> > I want to see how SL2 will look next to M5! EVF vs. OVF,EF-M mount vs. EF-S.
> ...



To me SL1 body was very hard. I hope they implement a softer grip similar to EOS-M5. M5 is a more retro looking camera with a thinner body due to hosting ef-m mount and no mirror. Weight and volume are almost identical. The feel and taste would be different on these.


----------



## Crosswind (Mar 2, 2017)

bf said:


> To me SL1 body was very hard. I hope they implement a softer grip similar to EOS-M5.



True that. The SL1's body might feel a bit "harder", but it is actually made out of good quality plastics (unlike the M5) - at least that was my impression.


----------



## derekmccoy (Mar 2, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



LonelyBoy said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > Core i5 2.53 GHz vs. Core i7 2.6 GHz, but to clarify I wasn't referring to performance in a Geekbench-type test, but rather operational performance – opening and scrolling through a 150 MB PowerPoint file, for example. I can count on my Win PC to crash occasionally, to have Office365 apps hang and need a process force quit occasionally or system restart. The only time I ever need to reboot my Mac is when a software update requires it, and the only apps that crash or hang are niche, coded-in-my-basement things like FoCal.
> ...



I have a 2011 i5 MacBook Air, runs just like new if not faster with the new Mac OS. I also have a 12 month old HP 840 with an i5 and twice as much RAM as the MacBook. It runs dog slow in comparison. The MacBook is just responsive and everything is fluid when doing things. The HP feels cluncky and jerky when doing the most basic tasks.
Apple simply makes better, more efficient hardware and software. Microsoft is know for making terrible operating systems and software in general, so it's no wonder the difference is marked. Even the way they arrange the UI elements and their poor choice of typefaces, it makes me cringe. If you dig deep into Windows folders, you'll find 20 year old drivers, icons from Windows 9x, etc. If that's the sort of care they take with what you can see, the code underneath must be a mess held together by duct tape and chewing gum.

Almost every mac user has also used a pc yet stick to mac. On the other hand, most pc users have only ever used a pc. That tells you everything really.


----------



## AlanF (Mar 3, 2017)

Crosswind said:


> bf said:
> 
> 
> > To me SL1 body was very hard. I hope they implement a softer grip similar to EOS-M5.
> ...



What is your evidence that the SL1 is made out of good quality plastics and the M5 isn't? What type of plastic is each made from - I haven't been able to find out on the web?


----------



## LonelyBoy (Mar 3, 2017)

*Re: Canon EOS Rebel SL2 Confirmed in 2017 [CR3]*



derekmccoy said:


> I have a 2011 i5 MacBook Air, runs just like new if not faster with the new Mac OS. I also have a 12 month old HP 840 with an i5 and twice as much RAM as the MacBook. It runs dog slow in comparison. The MacBook is just responsive and everything is fluid when doing things. The HP feels cluncky and jerky when doing the most basic tasks.
> Apple simply makes better, more efficient hardware and software. Microsoft is know for making terrible operating systems and software in general, so it's no wonder the difference is marked. Even the way they arrange the UI elements and their poor choice of typefaces, it makes me cringe. If you dig deep into Windows folders, you'll find 20 year old drivers, icons from Windows 9x, etc. If that's the sort of care they take with what you can see, the code underneath must be a mess held together by duct tape and chewing gum.
> 
> Almost every mac user has also used a pc yet stick to mac. On the other hand, most pc users have only ever used a pc. That tells you everything really.



Wow, I really touched a nerve on this with a whole lot of people.

There is nothing magical about the chips Apple buys from Intel versus the chips HP buys from Intel. If your HP is dog-slow and clunky, maybe try to figure out why that is, because mine aren't. And I've used MacBooks, and they drive me up the wall. I even switched back to an iPhone 7 after using Windows Phone for years so I could iMessage with my wife while she's overseas for work and the damn thing still frustrates me every day, by comparison, even after a month. Not everyone likes what you like, believe it or not.

Now, I'm very sorry I picked at this thread when Neuro made his analogy. Can we please get back to discussing the damn SL2?


----------



## dafrank (Mar 3, 2017)

*Couldn't help myself*



LonelyBoy said:


> derekmccoy said:
> 
> 
> > I have a 2011 i5 MacBook Air, runs just like new if not faster with the new Mac OS. I also have a 12 month old HP 840 with an i5 and twice as much RAM as the MacBook. It runs dog slow in comparison. The MacBook is just responsive and everything is fluid when doing things. The HP feels cluncky and jerky when doing the most basic tasks.
> ...




Sorry, I just couldn't help myself.

I've been a serious user of computers for digital imaging from pretty much before there was any desktop computer for serious digital imaging, since about 1990 or so. Over the years, starting with Macs and various versions of Unix (among which SGI Irix was my most used), I spent literally hundreds of thousands of dollars and tens of thousands of hours doing this computer work. Sometime in the mid 1990's, I started to gradually switch my computer mix over to the workstation version of Windows NT3.5. By about 2000, and to this day, I have used only Windows machines for desktop computing. Why? Because if you go to a real reputable custom Windows builder, or build one yourself, with just a passing acquaintance of component quality and performance, you can spec out a very reliable, reasonably priced and extremely fast computer that should work very well for higher end digital imaging for between 5 and even 12 years, depending on your need for speed to match the sluggishness of whatever new programming pops up. All of my machines have been nearly dead reliable, maintained their speed over time, and been able to be partially upgraded along the way. I've almost never had any issues with any of the Windows operating systems, although Windows 8 was probably the worst, so I merely avoided it and kept 7 going until Windows 10 was viable. I'm typing this on a still very fast for imaging computer I had built in 2009, now using Windows 10, and showing no slowdown whatsoever for Lightroom or Photoshop. Last year, with 4K video in mind, I built a newer system as well, and it is a speed demon monster, built at a high, but reasonable cost, literally thousands of dollars cheaper than what an equivalent Mac would cost. Windows 10 runs smooth as butter on both machines.

The answer to all of the crazy "Windows stinks and is killing me" memes out there is simple: maintain your machine with decent anti-virus and clean-up programs (free and provided Windows Defender, plus CCleaner work great), don't be a fool when surfing the net, don't put any more software than what you need and know to be legitimate on your computer, and, if you're a gamer, keep the games on a computer other than the one you do your photo work on. Follow these prescriptions and proscriptions and I pretty much guarantee that Windows will run fast and efficiently on your machine for many, many years.

Finally, as far as laptops go, the physical design and build of Mac Pro's is currently the best in the industry. Their performance is very good as well, although still not the best for the money. The OS is very stable and solid, works very well, looks very good and is "entertaining" in the way that Mac fans love. I did buy a Mac Pro less than 2 years ago. Like it very much. But, neither the operating system, nor the performance, is superior to a current Windows 10 machine. And, for performance, any small efficiency gained by the Unix-like Mac OS over a Win 10 machine is usually more than made up for in cheaper PC costs. However, in the laptop realm, the Win 10 advantage is definitely smaller.

Last, and I know Mac fans will howl, I think the Windows OP is more straightforward, logical and simpler to use, when the operator is equally acquainted with both. Here the Windows machines are actually whittling away that advantage by making the OS, like Macs, more and more "entertaining," forcing operators through more layers to get work done. However, the ability to use touch controls in Windows 10 is so far unmatched in the Mac world, something that has some actual real-world benefits as well. 

Well, enough about that. Let's get on with the SL2. Again, my apologies to the forum for this lengthy distraction.

Regards,
David


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## neuroanatomist (Mar 3, 2017)

Macs rule, PCs drool.


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## Crosswind (Mar 3, 2017)

AlanF said:


> What is your evidence that the SL1 is made out of good quality plastics and the M5 isn't? What type of plastic is each made from - I haven't been able to find out on the web?



Because I had the SL1 in my hands a while ago and played around a little bit - and the M5 is my new camera since January 2017. The SL1 feels a bit sturdier and more solidly built than the M5 (which is neither bad nor good). But again, as I've already said, that's the only (minor) downside of the EOS M5 (imo).


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## rrcphoto (Mar 3, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> Macs rule, PCs drool.



my laptop doesn't look as prudy as a macbook, but it looks at a macbook and snorts and goes .. that's it?

i sadly had to underspec my screen at 1080 because work servers don't like 4K screen resolutions

but other than that, it runs rings around any macbook except battery life  I consider my laptop a portable desktop.

(i7-6700K desktop CPU, 980M, 64GB memory, 2x1TB SSD, 512GB NVMe)


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## ahsanford (Mar 3, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> Macs rule, PCs drool.



Much like I'd like a great mid-level 50 prime :, I'd love to see Apple offer me something between a Mac Mini and a Mac Pro as far as desktops go.

Current choices for Apple desktops are:

Mac Mini (underpowered, RAM is dickishly soldered to the board, black I/O ports are impossible to see)
Powerbook (all that tech permanently sitting in a dock is a huge waste of money)
iMac (integral monitor included each time )
Mac Pro (the definition of overkill / unnecessary)

I just want to cut a check for about $1500-2000 every 6-7 years and replace the box on my desk with something more powerful, likely to be used with my existing monitor, peripherals, backup HD, etc. But with that canvas of options and my 2009 MBP aging away, I grabbed a Mini last year with the full knowledge I'd throw it away in half my normal cycle time since it was relatively underweight. Sad.

- A


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## neuroanatomist (Mar 3, 2017)

Silly me, I used too small an emoticon. I'll try again. 

Macs rule, PCs drool.


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## ahsanford (Mar 3, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> Silly me, I used too small an emoticon. I'll try again.
> 
> Macs rule, PCs drool.



Re-read my post, dude. You just posted a Mac Pro smiley face. I need a smiley face in between the size of that one and the original Mac Mini smiley face you posted.

- A


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## LonelyBoy (Mar 4, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> Silly me, I used too small an emoticon. I'll try again.
> 
> Macs rule, PCs drool.



Now that's creepy.


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## e17paul (Mar 6, 2017)

That's great news - I'm really enjoying my 100D (SL1) both as a lightweight option for when I dont need the performance of full frame, and to give each of my full frame lenses and extra purpose in life.


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