# Any actual photographers out there?



## Aldo (Jul 8, 2012)

Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?


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## bdunbar79 (Jul 8, 2012)

Aldo said:


> Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?



You lose. Play again.


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 8, 2012)

I turn the dialy thing on top of this big, black box to the green square thingy and press the little button on top with my finger. There's this clicky sound, and I see a picture on the back of the box. I haven't figured out why pressing the little zoom in/out buttons on the back doesn't zoom the big lens like it does on every other camera I've used, you'd think with a big lens like that it would work right. Also, can someone tell me how to get that little picture it shows me on the back onto my Facebook page?


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jul 8, 2012)

Aldo said:


> Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?


Show us some of your marvelous knowledge, and post some images. Your first time post did not quite manage to convince.


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## DrDeano (Jul 8, 2012)

Aldo said:


> Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?



I have not been around here long enough to form an opinion of other's work. 

I'd love to you read your wisdom that comes with a higher level of understanding of photography and see your work so we can critique it though.

I consider myself in a perpetual state of learning. Teach away!


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## helpful (Jul 8, 2012)

The OP has a point. Hardly anyone seems to check their "facts." I am guilty of that, too, sometimes repeating what I think I "know" and never finding links to back it up / explain to others so they can understand and not just take my word for it. For instance, people still say things like bits are stops of dynamic range. If that was true, then both the D800 and 5D3 would have exactly 14 stops of DR. Perhaps we should all start including high quality links with our opinions, the way that the world wide web was designed to work, which is now become just the internet.

As far as quality of images goes, I for one am never going to turn my best images over to canonrumors.com even if the TOS says they are still mine. I think that it still constitutes publishing them, and would interfere with the legalese of how I am paid. I don't want to violate any fine print because it could come back to bite me.

And at my age and position in life I feel like it's very immature for me to post at all on canonrumors. If I just posted one post, like Aldo, it would probably represent somebody who has more self-control and maturity. So I don't count Aldo's "newness" of having 1 post against him. It could just show that he is 107 times wiser than I am. But I just enjoy acting like a teenager after almost forgetting how.

Now old people tend to lose track of their topic, and I'm sorry if I do that now. But in fact, I can't help it if one thought leads to another. The fact is that Canonrumors is the first forum that I've participated in for almost ten years, because other forums where I tried to contribute--math, photography, computer programming--always seemed to degenerate into people trying to impress one another; and the sites *almost* always seemed to degenerate into profit-making machines rather than doing any work to earn the visits of their audience.

*Warning: heresy against Canon Rumors* In this paragraph I am going to commit the heresy of criticizing the powers that be. Mods, feel free to delete this paragraph... here goes. For an example of what I was saying above about good websites become profit making machines rather than serving their visitors, has anyone noticed that admin seems to be AWOL about further information the 1D X even though he now has it? And yet he has taken the time to post links to a very lukewarm deal on the 7D and promoting it like it was the greatest deal ever. (I know it is just lukewarm because just this month I added a fifth 7D to my inventory for $1149 including the 28-135mm lens with a U.S. warranty, and it was shipped instantly and in my hands the next day from an authorized dealer. Other well-known price points on 7Ds have included several instances of the body only for $1,100. So for the admin to advertise the "body package deal" for $1,349 was simple commercialism just like Ken Rockwell does.) I for one was extremely disappointed with the 7D body only "package" advertisement, which at that price was not doing a service to any visitors to Canon Rumors, and have also been disappointed by many similar posts to "deals" rather than the time to provide good info to us about products. I know that the admin is providing this entire site to us out of his good will, so I do appreciate that--however, the good will equation is starting to become a profit equation now that the website has become so popular. I hope that the admin can resist the temptation of the "love of money" because that will be the demise of this website and the end of its popularity.


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## dr croubie (Jul 8, 2012)

photographer (fəˈtɒɡrəfə)
— n
a person who takes photographs.


Yep, so that sounds like all of us. What of it?


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## dr croubie (Jul 8, 2012)

dilbert said:


> has anyone noticed that admin seems to be AWOL about further information the 1D X even though he now has it?



Yeah, you get the best canon camera ever made ... and then sit on a computer writing about it for others out of the good of your heart and advertising revenue, and not once even go outside to take pictures with it.

If I ever get a camera that good, you won't hear from me for a month, if at all ever again...


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## picturesbyme (Jul 8, 2012)

Like any other camera forum(s) this one is pretty diverse too.. 
Bunch of people here have awesome photos and yet barely posting any so you have to hunt for their site 
Some has more money than eye and/or knowledge.... What's new..? Try a car forum or any other forum... 
Look at what kind of people are driving sport cars 
This is mainly a gear site so if you are looking for amazing photos this might be the wrong one.. and for the same reason you might find more ..well, let's say less experienced shooters with simple questions looking for advice...


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## SuperCrazySamurai (Jul 8, 2012)

Aldo said:


> Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?



I love to learn. Teach away amigo and lets see some of your pics. 

Cheers!


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## preppyak (Jul 8, 2012)

helpful said:


> I hope that the admin can resist the temptation of the "love of money" because that will be the demise of this website and the end of its popularity.


Hah, keep living that myth. Ken Rockwell is probably raking in the ad money while putting little to no effort into his reviews...every link gains him affiliation money, etc. Still popular as ever, and usually one of the first links that pop up when you google search a lens. 

If CanonRumors gets the rumors and details right before others, it'll thrive. If not, and someone does it better, people will go there. To date, I haven't seen anyone doing it better


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 8, 2012)

dilbert said:



> has anyone noticed that admin seems to be AWOL about further information the 1D X even though he now has it?



He had it...but does he _have_ it? Keep in mind, he runs a camera/lens rental business - don't you think that maybe, just maybe, given the limited availability and high demand for the 1D X, the unit(s) he has are rented out?


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## distant.star (Jul 8, 2012)

Aldo said:


> Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?




.

I thought about this for a while, and I came up with only one response:

So what?


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## expatinasia (Jul 8, 2012)

I agree with some of the comments. I also feel there is a reasonable amount of immaturity, which perhaps addresses some of the issues that people have made above.

Perhaps if we had our real age next to our user names we could be more forgiving of some of the silly and often rather inflammatory comments.

I have come across similar in other forums, and I was wondering why. Worked out most of the members posting were students aged 15-25/30! Still very young in my eyes...


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## robin (Jul 8, 2012)

DON'T FEED THE TROLS!


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## bdunbar79 (Jul 8, 2012)

helpful said:


> The OP has a point. Hardly anyone seems to check their "facts." I am guilty of that, too, sometimes repeating what I think I "know" and never finding links to back it up / explain to others so they can understand and not just take my word for it. For instance, people still say things like bits are stops of dynamic range. If that was true, then both the D800 and 5D3 would have exactly 14 stops of DR. Perhaps we should all start including high quality links with our opinions, the way that the world wide web was designed to work, which is now become just the internet.
> 
> As far as quality of images goes, I for one am never going to turn my best images over to canonrumors.com even if the TOS says they are still mine. I think that it still constitutes publishing them, and would interfere with the legalese of how I am paid. I don't want to violate any fine print because it could come back to bite me.
> 
> ...



And the answer is..............No


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## Richard8971 (Jul 8, 2012)

Wow.... ???


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## Imagination_landB (Jul 8, 2012)

Im am myself an enthusiast and I learn a lot here. and even if people are wrong about something they're not here to be insulted or to be pretentious, they are here for the love of taking pictures and to add some knowledge or giving people some of their own knowledge, this is a rumor site to know everything little thing about future canon stuff, and it's wonderful as it is. these are forums, if you don't like those "amateurs work" just tell them by giving constuctive comments.And YES there are photographers. (sorry english is not my first language) Help us by showing your work


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## victorwol (Jul 8, 2012)

I wonder to which group you belong.. The ones that do not know anything and post the best they can do, or the ones that knows a lot and don't need to show it off? Usually knowledgeable people don't go around showing it off.. Knowledge usually comes with experience, experience comes with time, and with time people learn to respect others.. Even if they are not as good as you..... think you are...


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## birdman (Jul 8, 2012)

I would have to say, NO, I am obviously not a Professional Photographer - - one whom earns revenue off their photography. That is why I like landscape shooting so much....because I don't need any criticisms or critique. I know what looks good, and like any art - - photography is very SUBJECTIVE.

If most of the people on here were getting paid enough to justify spending less time in forums, then how could we ever answer asinine/trollish/ignorant/controversial/rude/garbage questions such as the one you posed? 

I'm trying to spend less time reading forums & more time focusing on other aspects of my life....like my health, family, and primary career. But this site is fun and conversation is light (or it needs to be). That's the great aspect of being a human being: We're given mental abilities to focus on different objects or subjects. You ought to try it, OP. It's nice.


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## dirtcastle (Jul 8, 2012)

One of the great things about photography is that people of minimal artistic talent or experience can have a great time doing it for very little (or no) money. It's like softball... you don't need to be good or take it seriously to have fun.


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## Christian_Stella (Jul 8, 2012)

expatinasia said:


> I agree with some of the comments. I also feel there is a reasonable amount of immaturity, which perhaps addresses some of the issues that people have made above.
> 
> Perhaps if we had our real age next to our user names we could be more forgiving of some of the silly and often rather inflammatory comments.
> 
> I have come across similar in other forums, and I was wondering why. Worked out most of the members posting were students aged 15-25/30! Still very young in my eyes...



Age has nothing to do with it. For every young student there is a middle aged man trying to get back into photography in the digital age. There are people here of all ages and experience levels. 

I am 27 years old and have been running a $100k+ a year food photography business for four years. The last (released) cookbook I photographed is the second highest selling cookbook of the year to date (according to Nielson Bookscan and Publisher's Weekly). To date, cookbooks I photographed (and designed) have sold over a million copies. 

But I still think I know crap about photography... That's why I'm here. I'm critical of everything I do and want to get better. There are people here that know a heck of a lot more than me, skill wise... And there are people here that know a heck of a lot more about the tech. I am equally interested in both because you need not only a foundation, but one that is future-proof as new tech emerges.


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## And-Rew (Jul 8, 2012)

The OP point will always be valid because photography is such a subjective activity!


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## samkatz (Jul 8, 2012)

This website is called Canon Rumors...So I come here to find out about........rumors relating to Canon.

The owner can make all the $$ he wants to the way website owners do...linking ad content to editorial content. If I don't like it, I can leave. As far as the level and quality of info provided, again, it's not called Canon Facts, How to Buy A Canon, or the Canon Bible. Yet, it's still one of the most entertaining sites around, I find I'm spending more time here than on dprerview.

As far as the level of quality of the photos posted: See line one of this post. I personally learn the "artistic side" by going to specific books, museums or websites to see images published by specific photographers and artists who I have learned to admire. I see a lot of other good photos in my day to day web travels but have zero expectation of seeing them here. That doesn't mean that members of this forum and other forums don't post great shots....it has no bearing on whether I visit it. All I want from this site are......Canon Rumors.


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## NotABunny (Jul 8, 2012)

And-Rew said:


> The OP point will always be valid because photography is such a subjective activity!



I thought that's why his point is *invalid*. Since photography is a form of art and art is subjective (more exactly, subjective is the reason why a work of art pleases or has some influence on viewers), the OP should first explain what high quality photography means.

Also, this forum is not a portfolio exhibition, it's just a forum (as in a place where people talk).


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## Tov (Jul 8, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> I turn the dialy thing on top of this big, black box to the green square thingy and press the little button on top with my finger. There's this clicky sound, and I see a picture on the back of the box. I haven't figured out why pressing the little zoom in/out buttons on the back doesn't zoom the big lens like it does on every other camera I've used, you'd think with a big lens like that it would work right. Also, can someone tell me how to get that little picture it shows me on the back onto my Facebook page?



Lol. What r you going to do when that 1Dx black box arrives, it doesnt have a green square thingy?


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## And-Rew (Jul 8, 2012)

NotABunny said:


> And-Rew said:
> 
> 
> > The OP point will always be valid because photography is such a subjective activity!
> ...



And there we have a perfect example of subjective - your interpretation on the thread is the opposite to mine


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## troy19 (Jul 8, 2012)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> Aldo said:
> 
> 
> > Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?
> ...



I didn't think, the OP wanted to offend someone, I think he is just asking, if others see it the same way. Maybe it would have been helpful if he gave an example of what he thinks is poor quality.

Maybe we can agree when saying there's a great variety of image quality.

I would rate myself as a poor photographer, but know pretty well the difference between a good and a poor image. IMO there's no need to be a good Photographer to discuss others images.


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## Archangel72 (Jul 8, 2012)

Aldo said:


> Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?


Hello Aldo, 

I'm into amateur photography for 11 years now.
2.5 years in stock photography, won some photo contest, joined some photo-oriented sites, exchanging my humble knowledge, but let me tell you... I didn't even "scratch" photography with level of my "knowledge" in this profound art.
And after 11 years of using Sony cameras, I'm about to make a "light speed jump" to Canon.
And when I do that... learning will start for me at completely new level.
Maybe after 30-40 years I will be good enough to call myself a photographer.
Check my portfolio on Dreamstime if you have a little time. 
When I buy my new "beauty" I'll feel free to share some photography with all of you people.

http://www.dreamstime.com/Archangel72_info


Best regards 

Archangel72


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## CowGummy (Jul 8, 2012)

OP - can you expand on what you deem to be poor photography?

Reason I ask is that a lot of my images seem to divide viewers reactions quite a bit. Some people (including fellow photographers) have given me praise, published my images and even given me a photographer of the year award. Others, again including fellow photographers, call my work tacky, over-processed and 'not real photography'.

As said before, photography or art in general is highly subjective. I've always been happy to accept that some will love my work, others think it's a lot of shite. 
Would love to hear how you quantify an image as being of 'high quality'??

Regards,
Steve


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## wellfedCanuck (Jul 8, 2012)

Aldo said:


> Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?


The OP may be a fine fellow (with only 2 posts it's hard to tell), but let's face it- this post was a troll. He makes two rather subjective, condescending statements without supporting evidence and thereby infers his superior knowledge _and_ skill? :

This place is primarily a hobbyist forum, nobody expects an Encyclopedia Photographia and we’re all here for fun and entertainment with our widely varying abilities. I wouldn’t ask anyone to provide a pedigree UNLESS they're criticizing others and claiming expertise. So- put your money where your mouth is, dude.


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## Rob Wiebe (Jul 8, 2012)

I'm guessing there are more pro and semi pro 'lurkers' here that actually come by for information. I skip most topics as of no interest. What I do like is presented technical info from users who have experience, and avoid the whining. Of interest to me lately are the arrival dates of the 1DX as I am waiting for one in Alberta. CPS etc but not on the olympic list ;-) Bt the way picked, up the 40mm pancake yesterday and it is fun. Nice build, certainly more solid than the old cheap 50 1.8, and looks kind of funny on the 5D3 with grip!

;-) Have a great day everyone and go shoot some pictures.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jul 8, 2012)

troy19 said:


> Mt Spokane Photography said:
> 
> 
> > Aldo said:
> ...


If others ask you to discuss their images, thats fine. To jump in and claim that the images are horrible is to imply that he is a expert and his images are superior??. 
If he is such a expert rather than acting like a 9 YO kid, (9 YO's can be experts too), he should post on some of the forums and answer newbies questions with the correct answers. Thats the way you establish your expertise, by helping others with the right answers.


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## briansquibb (Jul 8, 2012)

wellfedCanuck said:


> Aldo said:
> 
> 
> > Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?
> ...



+1000 about trolls

Why would people showcase rather than show samples or examples. The galleries are stuffed full of good pictures - this isn't a fine art forum


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## crasher8 (Jul 8, 2012)

I walked 3 miles today with a film camera and only took 3 shots so no, I'm no photographer…


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## unfocused (Jul 8, 2012)

wellfedCanuck said:


> Aldo said:
> 
> 
> > Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?
> ...



Well said. 

The OP claims to be a landscape, wildlife and commercial photographer who is purchasing a 1Dx. I'm wondering why he feels the need to critique the images that are shared on this site (mostly by amateurs trying to learn the basics) and why he doesn't provide his portfolio's website address to give others a frame of reference. 

Instead, he decides that for his first two posts, he will create two new threads, both somewhat inflammatory and neither one saying anything interesting or constructive. 



helpful said:


> ...And yet he has taken the time to post links to a very lukewarm deal on the 7D and promoting it like it was the greatest deal ever. (I know it is just lukewarm because just this month I added a fifth 7D to my inventory for $1149 including the 28-135mm lens with a U.S. warranty, and it was shipped instantly and in my hands the next day from an authorized dealer. Other well-known price points on 7Ds have included several instances of the body only for $1,100. So for the admin to advertise the "body package deal" for $1,349 was simple commercialism just like Ken Rockwell does.)



1) Perhaps you don't know the difference between an "Ad Post" and a news post. Ad Posts are sponsored and paid for. They are ads. They are one of the things that keeps this forum in business and allows the rest of us to post and share. 

2) Please enlighten us as to what dealer is selling you five 7Ds with a 28-135mm kit lens for $1,149 each, including U.S. warranty. That is a great deal. Sounds too good to be true. I'm sure everyone on this forum would like to know the details. Especially since CanonPriceWatch.com indicates the lowest price ever for that kit was $1,500. 

Back to the original post for a bit.

I don't come to this forum for advice or critiques of my images. I'm here because I enjoy reading about and speculating on new camera equipment. Let's all admit it, this is primarily a gearhead forum. That doesn't mean that gear freaks can't be good photographers. (If you look up any of the member websites, you'll see a lot of very accomplished photographers.) 

I'm here because there are people who care about and understand the technology of photography to a far greater degree than I ever will. One can be a good photographer without having any technical knowledge and one can be a great technician without having any photographic skill. But, generally, it helps to have a little of both. 

It's a hobby and entertainment for me and frankly, I kind of enjoy the company. I have the illusion that I actually know something about some of the participants and I appreciate that. I can discuss and debate with people from across the world, which is something I can't do otherwise. 

It's also fascinating to me to see the variety of careers that encompass photography. People like V-8 Beast who turned a love of cars into a career. There are a number of very good wedding photographers. There is a professional Polo photographer. There is someone who runs a rental studio for other photographers to use to take pictures of silicone enhanced models. Until ignorant idiots drove him off, we had MacFly, who was clearly one of the best celebrity photographers in Hollywood. 

If I'm interested in buying a new piece of equipment I can post a question here and Neuro (who owns everything) and others will give me a broad range of advice.

If I'm curious about how sensors really work, I can ask and I'll get dozens of answers that I won't really understand, but I'll find informative anyway.

In fact, I find the OP's statement about "low level of knowledge" not only condescending, but ill-informed. For a bunch of amateurs, I'm always surprised at how much some of the contributors to this forum know about technical subjects.

In short, I really couldn't care less about the quality of the images that people post on the sharing portion of the forum. If that's why you come here, there is nothing wrong with that, but it's ridiculously unfair to evaluate the forum and its participants on that narrow basis.


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## dafrank (Jul 8, 2012)

Well, as far as the OP's opinon is concerned, I can't say that I have read or viewed images on this forum enough to offer a very informed opinion, but I am a litle skeptical, at least, about his expectations. This is a gear forum, and pictures here usually meant to illustrate some point about gear, not to display some persoal masterpiece. As to the advice, I would expect a wide range of expertise and knowlege here as there is no bar to people of all experience levels to particpate. When sometimes absolutely silly advice comes through, it usually can be attributed to the well known concept of not knowing enough to know that you really don't know anything, typical of not just internet forums, but just about all discussions about anything.

Personally, I doubt that I would or will post anything of great quality on his site. That effort, I reserve for my cients' jobs or for display on my website. I do hope that any advice I might give would be sound and based on a lot of real experience. I can't speak for anyone else, however, and must leave to others' judgment the value of whatever I do contribute. Finally, if, I, myself, find other people' advice unhelpful, I usually just ignore it; no harm done.

On another matter, as to the "commercialization" of this website for _profit_, I say: wake up; without the profit motive, very little of either good or bad consequence would ever take place. Take from others efforts what you will, but do not begrudge them the opporunity to earn a reward for poviding a service to people who want it. That's just how the real world works.


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## bdunbar79 (Jul 8, 2012)

I can't believe people are actually posting to this thread. The OP is clearly trolling. It is not designed to provide a rich environment for intellectual stimulation.


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## briansquibb (Jul 8, 2012)

bdunbar79 said:


> I can't believe people are actually posting to this thread. The OP is clearly trolling. It is not designed to provide a rich environment for intellectual stimulation.



Yes you are right - the problem is that we have so many trolls on this forum that we dont spot another appearing/ At least this one wasn't anti-Canon


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jul 8, 2012)

He is helping CR pay for the servers and web site costs, so there is always a bright side. I remember when they almost had to shut down because Canon attorneys issued a cease and desist letter. Fortunately, they backed off.


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## gary samples (Jul 8, 2012)

seem's be be here troll's job is to see how many come back's he gets with the fewest words !


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## LetTheRightLensIn (Jul 8, 2012)

Aldo said:


> Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?



it's a rumors forum so why the shock if people mostly discuss rumors and tech specs here ???
??? ??? ??? ???


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## wellfedCanuck (Jul 8, 2012)

bdunbar79 said:


> I can't believe people are actually posting to this thread. The OP is clearly trolling. It is not designed to provide a rich environment for intellectual stimulation.


Yeah, but the conversation has moved beyond the troll and has provided some friendly dialogue. I like Unfocused's point about camaraderie. As one of the worst, least-knowledgeable photographers on the site- I appreciate the technical help but I also enjoy the social aspect of a shared interest. Sometimes this place is almost like being a member of a club.


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## Fishnose (Jul 8, 2012)

bdunbar79 said:


> I can't believe people are actually posting to this thread. The OP is clearly trolling. It is not designed to provide a rich environment for intellectual stimulation.



Fascinating. YOU just posted here.


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## Fishnose (Jul 8, 2012)

Tov said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > I turn the dialy thing on top of this big, black box to the green square thingy and press the little button on top with my finger. There's this clicky sound, and I see a picture on the back of the box. I haven't figured out why pressing the little zoom in/out buttons on the back doesn't zoom the big lens like it does on every other camera I've used, you'd think with a big lens like that it would work right. Also, can someone tell me how to get that little picture it shows me on the back onto my Facebook page?
> ...



<:gasp:> No green square thingy? NOW what? :-\


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## crasher8 (Jul 8, 2012)

Oh I thought the green square was for a border around my pretty pix. I was going to save it for my St. Patty's day snapshots. I've been using C3 but keep getting PO'd at my bad shots.


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## RC (Jul 8, 2012)

wellfedCanuck said:


> The OP may be a fine fellow (with only 2 posts it's hard to tell), but let's face it- this post was a troll. He makes two rather subjective, condescending statements without supporting evidence and thereby infers his superior knowledge _and_ skill? :
> 
> This place is primarily a hobbyist forum, nobody expects an Encyclopedia Photographia and we’re all here for fun and entertainment with our widely varying abilities. I wouldn’t ask anyone to provide a pedigree UNLESS they're criticizing others and claiming expertise. So- put your money where your mouth is, dude.



Nicely stated!


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## RLPhoto (Jul 8, 2012)

Aldo said:


> Love this site and the various topics that seem to get people hot under the collar. But am amazed at the rather low level of knowledge out there on the subject of photography and the poor quality of work being showcased in these forums. Is it just me or do others agree?



Yes, There is alot of photography here that isn't very good but I dont judge. Art is in the eye of the beholder and I cannot say that one persons photos are better or worse than my own. All I can do is give my opinion on what my eye likes or doesn't like.

Then there is the person who orders the very best of equipment but cannot take a good photo. There is more to photography than equipment, and that is more important to the final product, PHOTOS.


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## pwp (Jul 8, 2012)

Isn't a definition of an expert "someone who knows just a bit more than the next person..."? Like my last car mechanic.

This list is populated with photographers with abilities that range from beginner, to some slightly out-of-reality equipment enthusiasts, to often startlingly perceptive hobbyists, and plenty of very accomplished amateurs to deeply experienced professionals in an age range that spans decades. And we all have something valid to offer each other. 

To the OP, you'll find that this is largely an inclusive and accommodating list that respects and salutes the different ability level that each poster is presently at. If you are an advanced photographer yourself, then there inevitably was a time that you were a wide eyed novice who valued creative, positive and nurturing responses to your images and ability level. 

PW


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## wickidwombat (Jul 8, 2012)

briansquibb said:


> +1000 about trolls
> 
> Why would people showcase rather than show samples or examples. The galleries are stuffed full of good pictures - this isn't a fine art forum



thank god its not a fine art forum, it seems everyone that took an under
/ over exposed blurry photo calls themselves a fine art photographer these days


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## dr croubie (Jul 9, 2012)

wickidwombat said:


> thank god its not a fine art forum, it seems everyone that took an under / over exposed blurry photo calls themselves a fine art photographer these days



Damn, well there goes my last hope of being a 'fine art' photographer, you've seen through my idea already.

Oh well, at least i've got a day job not to quit...


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