# Want the 90EX?



## bauerman (Mar 12, 2014)

Here is a great deal on what appears to be brand new stock...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Canon-Speedlite-90EX-Flash-for-Canon-EOS-M-Camera/191084767271?pt=Digital_Camera_Flashes&hash=item2c7d8a2827&afsrc=1

$49.99 and FREE Shipping.


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## daemorhedron (Mar 18, 2014)

Not sure if it's changed or what, but link now shows as $149 with $39 shipping. =P


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## Drizzt321 (Mar 18, 2014)

daemorhedron said:


> Not sure if it's changed or what, but link now shows as $149 with $39 shipping. =P



Yea, me too  That's unfortunately, I'd have picked one up for $50.


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## sagittariansrock (Mar 18, 2014)

For another $ 10 more, a white box item from an authorized dealer:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?sku=1003531&Q=&O=&gclid=CL650tTjnL0CFUtk7Aodx2QAYQ&is=GREY&A=details


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## Drizzt321 (Mar 18, 2014)

sagittariansrock said:


> For another $ 10 more, a white box item from an authorized dealer:
> 
> http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?sku=1003531&Q=&O=&gclid=CL650tTjnL0CFUtk7Aodx2QAYQ&is=GREY&A=details



Oh. Good call. Thanks!


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## bauerman (Mar 18, 2014)

Yep - the deal is apparently done - they sold however many they wanted to at that $49.99 price and now they are back to basically full retail. (Glad I pulled the trigger quickly on that one.)

If I see it for that price again will post in this thread...


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## sama (Mar 19, 2014)

and this one on the amazon for under $52 :


http://www.amazon.com/Canon-Speedlite-90EX-Flash-Camera/dp/B00GFWBOFC/ref=pd_sim_p_4?ie=UTF8&refRID=07SJ4XE8NZT2VAEF6AV1


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## slclick (Mar 19, 2014)

and these can be used as a Master?


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## privatebydesign (Mar 19, 2014)

Guys don't get too excited about the 90EX, I got one in an M kit, it is useless; utterly useless as a flash, or even for fill, its only practical use is as an optical master but even then it is somewhat limited having no power, bounce, or swivel capabilities.

Having used one I wouldn't value it at anything like $50.


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## Vivid Color (Mar 19, 2014)

sama said:


> and this one on the amazon for under $52 :
> 
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Canon-Speedlite-90EX-Flash-Camera/dp/B00GFWBOFC/ref=pd_sim_p_4?ie=UTF8&refRID=07SJ4XE8NZT2VAEF6AV1



Thank you for providing this information as well as the link. I've been thinking about getting one of these so I just bought it at Amazon. What a great price!


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## Vivid Color (Mar 19, 2014)

privatebydesign said:


> Guys don't get too excited about the 90EX, I got one in an M kit, it is useless; utterly useless as a flash, or even for fill, its only practical use is as an optical master but even then it is somewhat limited having no power, bounce, or swivel capabilities.
> 
> Having used one I wouldn't value it at anything like $50.



Even if it's flash capabilities are not all that great, isn't $50 for an optical master a really good deal?


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## privatebydesign (Mar 19, 2014)

It's flash capabilities are not _"not all that great"_, they are non existent.

It depends on how much you want a severely limited optical master. Personally, and I own both, I'd recommend spending a little more and getting a secondhand ST-E2 (around $110), it isn't much bigger, is much more "powerful", it has a focus assist, and you don't have to do everything from the camera menu.


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## jdramirez (Mar 19, 2014)

Vivid Color said:


> privatebydesign said:
> 
> 
> > Guys don't get too excited about the 90EX, I got one in an M kit, it is useless; utterly useless as a flash, or even for fill, its only practical use is as an optical master but even then it is somewhat limited having no power, bounce, or swivel capabilities.
> ...



I put in some new panasonic batteries and while I wouldn't say the batteries were great... they took their sweet time to recharge. I play around with the 90 ex and my two 580 exii's in slave mode and I like the results... I played with the ratios and I do like having a dual flash set up... but I would happily sell my 90 exii for a $50 if anyone wants to give me that much (via Craigslist)... it is ok... but there were enough times where I was annoyed because I assumed the flash would be ready and it wasn't.


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## daemorhedron (Mar 19, 2014)

90ex as a flash is...'interesting'. It is weak with slower recharge than desirable but as an optical master it is absolutely brilliant. It gets you two critical things: Awesome flash sync speeds (up to 1/4000 actually, the limit of the camera), and the ability to manually control power levels right from the EOS M/M2 via touchscreen (although the interface for this is a bit klutzy). I use them with Yongnuo 568EXII's right now and it saved me from having to buy pocketwizards or the like. Also does the whole ETTL thing if that's your bag.

Absolutely recommended, so long as it's not your only flash (unless maybe it's macro photography with a homemade ring of some kind).


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## bholliman (Mar 19, 2014)

privatebydesign said:


> It's flash capabilities are not _"not all that great"_, they are non existent.
> It depends on how much you want a severely limited optical master. Personally, and I own both, I'd recommend spending a little more and getting a secondhand ST-E2 (around $110), it isn't much bigger, is much more "powerful", it has a focus assist, and you don't have to do everything from the camera menu.





jdramirez said:


> I put in some new panasonic batteries and while I wouldn't say the batteries were great... they took their sweet time to recharge. I play around with the 90 ex and my two 580 exii's in slave mode and I like the results... I played with the ratios and I do like having a dual flash set up... but I would happily sell my 90 exii for a $50 if anyone wants to give me that much (via Craigslist)... it is ok... but there were enough times where I was annoyed because I assumed the flash would be ready and it wasn't.



+1 I owned a 90EX for 7 months and recently sold it for $40 on eBay. Since it can't swivel to use for bounce flash, I only used it as an optical master, and it didn't perform well in that role.

As an optical master it works, but I found the recycle time to be incredibly slow. In the studio I was missing lots of shots with our toddler while waiting for it to recycle. Also, since its fixed, you are forced to keep your slave flashes in front of you to trigger them. I recently purchased two 600EX-RT's and now use one of those as my master, so the 90EX was just gathering dust.

I recommend spending a little more money on a more capable flash.


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## jdramirez (Mar 19, 2014)

bholliman said:


> privatebydesign said:
> 
> 
> > It's flash capabilities are not _"not all that great"_, they are non existent.
> ...



I don't play with optical triggering that much.. but I assumed that the red front part of the flash needed to be facing your subject... at least that is what I did when I use it. and with the fully articulating head of the 580 or 600, it seems like the flash doesn't HAVE to be in front of the camera. I could be wrong on all fronts though.


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## sagittariansrock (Mar 20, 2014)

jdramirez said:


> I don't play with optical triggering that much.. but I assumed that the red front part of the flash needed to be facing your subject... at least that is what I did when I use it. and with the fully articulating head of the 580 or 600, it seems like the flash doesn't HAVE to be in front of the camera. I could be wrong on all fronts though.



Optical trigger uses visible light, that is the actual flash head. 
In case of 580 or 600, the raw strength of the light might be able to bounce and activate the slave, if needed. However, the maneuverability of the head is useful since a direct line of sight is ideal and in case of a puny master like the 90EX, it is necessary. I can't imagine how restrictive that will be in terms of placing the slaves.
Thanks, PBD, you saved me 60 bucks!


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## jdramirez (Mar 20, 2014)

sagittariansrock said:


> jdramirez said:
> 
> 
> > I don't play with optical triggering that much.. but I assumed that the red front part of the flash needed to be facing your subject... at least that is what I did when I use it. and with the fully articulating head of the 580 or 600, it seems like the flash doesn't HAVE to be in front of the camera. I could be wrong on all fronts though.
> ...



I guess I'll be using it indoors only. It did work when I used it the other day, but it isn't my ideal option.


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## bauerman (Mar 20, 2014)

For those of us using the M for everyday photography - the 90EX works GREAT for basic fill flash - what it was primarily intended to do. 

I'm not a semi-pro wanna-be like some that bemoan its ability to trigger other off-camera flashes....


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## jdramirez (Mar 20, 2014)

bauerman said:


> For those of us using the M for everyday photography - the 90EX works GREAT for basic fill flash - what it was primarily intended to do.
> 
> I'm not a semi-pro wanna-be like some that bemoan its ability to trigger other off-camera flashes....



Not to bemoan your technique... but any flash that is attached directly above the lens and pointed directly at your subject will have some negative ramifications. The subject looks flat and featureless, there are flash reflections that are harsh... 

You don't have to be a pro to like the look from off camera flash. But to not understand the benefits of the same and to belittle it... Seems a touch ignorant. 

But it's fine... I'm sure most of your photos involve sunsets and second curtain fill flash with a modifier...


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## bauerman (Mar 20, 2014)

jdramirez said:


> bauerman said:
> 
> 
> > For those of us using the M for everyday photography - the 90EX works GREAT for basic fill flash - what it was primarily intended to do.
> ...



If I want more pleasing bounced flash - I can certainly pop on my 430EX or my 580EX - but they don't look or feel proper on the top of my M. The whole point of the M for me is simplified photography - and for that - the 90EX works VERY well for me.


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## bholliman (Mar 20, 2014)

jdramirez said:


> bholliman said:
> 
> 
> > privatebydesign said:
> ...



I tried to locate my slaves at various points in relation to the 90EX optical master and found they had to be within maybe 60 degrees of the direction it was facing or they would not fire. Yes, I had the sensor (red front) facing the master. I could generally deal with this limitation however, it was the slow recycle time and lack of swivel/pivot capability that really soured me on the 90EX.


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## sagittariansrock (Mar 20, 2014)

bauerman said:


> jdramirez said:
> 
> 
> > bauerman said:
> ...



I think the first sentence of your original comment was completely acceptable, but you unnecessarily (maybe unknowingly) offended with the second one. I am sure the 90EX is working out great for you, but calling someone looking for a cheap optical trigger "a semi-pro wanna-be" is uncool. No one is diss-ing the 90EX for it's original purpose. Relax!


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## bauerman (Mar 20, 2014)

Actually this was said earlier in this thread - 



> *Guys don't get too excited about the 90EX, I got one in an M kit, it is useless; utterly useless as a flash, or even for fill, its only practical use is as an optical master but even then it is somewhat limited having no power, bounce, or swivel capabilities.
> 
> Having used one I wouldn't value it at anything like $50*.



That's the more ridiculous and over-the-top statement than anything I have said so far...


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## Random Orbits (Mar 21, 2014)

bauerman said:


> If I want more pleasing bounced flash - I can certainly pop on my 430EX or my 580EX - but they don't look or feel proper on the top of my M. The whole point of the M for me is simplified photography - and for that - the 90EX works VERY well for me.



I got a 270EX II for the M instead. It can tilt 90 degrees and has just enough power to bounce of normal ceilings and it's not that large (takes 2 AAs). It's dumb as can be (slave only), but I've got other options if I need a master.


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## jdramirez (Mar 21, 2014)

This reminds me of a conversation I had a few years back. The 75-300mm lens was being sold at a cheap price and I owned it for a year. I hated it for most of that year... A few people were disparaging the lens and took the counterpoint that while it wasn't great, it was a decent beginner lens and you can get some adequate results for the price and in decent lighting. 

The discussion almost became personal. I think many of us identify with our gear... so if our gear is under attack, we immediately taken offense. 

all gear has some value... even really crappy image degrading uv filters... but at the same time there can be valid criticism of gear without the critique being taken personally.


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## sagittariansrock (Mar 21, 2014)

bauerman said:


> Actually this was said earlier in this thread -
> 
> 
> 
> ...



And your first comment "For those of us using the M for everyday photography - the 90EX works GREAT for basic fill flash - what it was primarily intended to do" aptly addressed that statement. The second one raised the hackles.



jdramirez said:


> This reminds me of a conversation I had a few years back. The 75-300mm lens was being sold at a cheap price and I owned it for a year. I hated it for most of that year... A few people were disparaging the lens and took the counterpoint that while it wasn't great, it was a decent beginner lens and you can get some adequate results for the price and in decent lighting.
> 
> The discussion almost became personal. I think many of us identify with our gear... so if our gear is under attack, we immediately taken offense.
> 
> all gear has some value... even really crappy image degrading uv filters... but at the same time there can be valid criticism of gear without the critique being taken personally.



Totally agree  
I felt the same way regarding an ongoing thread about the 70-300 non-L. I hated its ergonomics when I had it, but felt it was a perfectly reasonable lens for the price. However, people were (and still are, if I am correct) bashing it for being soft compared to the 70-200 and 70-300 Ls, and I almost posted a long thread defending it...


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## privatebydesign (Mar 21, 2014)

I am dissing the 90EX for it's original purpose. It is a POS. 

I am the one who is being called ".. a semi-pro wanna-be like some that bemoan its ability to trigger other off-camera flashes....". But I am not the only one who has pointed out _"I only used it as an optical master, and it didn't perform well in that role."_ or _"I tried to locate my slaves at various points in relation to the 90EX optical master and found they had to be within maybe 60 degrees of the direction it was facing or they would not fire"_

As for saying this _"That's the more ridiculous and over-the-top statement than anything I have said so far..."_ about my comment _"Guys don't get too excited about the 90EX, I got one in an M kit, it is useless; utterly useless as a flash, or even for fill, its only practical use is as an optical master but even then it is somewhat limited having no power, bounce, or swivel capabilities."_

My retort would be this image. This was taken with the M and 90EX, I was shocked at what I thought was the bad performance of ETTL in this situation so put the flash in manual and full power, turned out it wasn't the ETTL..... 

EXIF: 1/30 sec, f5.6, iso400, manual flash full power, the ambient light levels are low as it is early evening, the subject about 4-6 feet from me, you can tell the flash fired because of the catch lights in the eyes. Batteries were brand new.

Now call me a "wanna be pro" all you like, but if a dedicated flash can't provide on axis fill at 4-6 feet in EV8, for a real world guide number of under 10, then it is a POS.


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## sagittariansrock (Mar 21, 2014)

privatebydesign said:


> I am dissing the 90EX for it's original purpose. It is a POS.
> 
> I am the one who is being called ".. a semi-pro wanna-be like some that bemoan its ability to trigger other off-camera flashes....". But I am not the only one who has pointed out _"I only used it as an optical master, and it didn't perform well in that role."_ or _"I tried to locate my slaves at various points in relation to the 90EX optical master and found they had to be within maybe 60 degrees of the direction it was facing or they would not fire"_
> 
> ...



I thought maybe the 90EX bypassed your subject and lit up the mountain-side in the back! 

Edit: Um... fake mountainside, I think.


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## philmoz (Mar 21, 2014)

privatebydesign said:


> I am dissing the 90EX for it's original purpose. It is a POS.
> 
> ...
> 
> ...



Did you have the wireless optical control turned on in the custom flash functions?

If the wireless control is enabled the 90EX fires at very low power - even if it's set to Manual & Full Power in the settings.

I've had no trouble using the 90EX up to 3-4 meters from the subject.

It's not the greatest flash; but it's definitely not a POS.

If yours doesn't work correctly, and the wireless control option is off, then it sounds like it's defective.

Phil.


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## dcm (Mar 21, 2014)

I haven't used it a lot, but it works fine for me - much better light output than any P&S flash and much more flexible. Yes, I do wish it had tilt/swivel capabilities but that would just add to the size and I kinda like it's small form factor more.

You need to check the Flash Function Settings under the External Speedlite Control options in the first menu screen. The key is to make sure wireless is turned Off if you want the flash to fire normally. It is a little confusing to see OFF next to the ETTL/M selection. I do wish there was a shortcut to this menu. I forgot to reset it once and got results similar to yours. 

I just did some simple tests to verify my understanding. No problem shooting in P with the 18-55 at 55 from 12-15 feet using ETTL with wireless Off, first/second curtain synchro. A bit hot if anything so I dial it down 1/2 to 1 stop in ETTL mode. Shooting manual with wireless Off lets you adjust the power output of the 90EX from 1/1 to 1/64. I needed to dial the 90EX power output down between 1/2 and 1/4 for this range in manual. 

The 90EX also goes nicely with the 40f2.8 on my 6D as a small, relatively light DSLR kit. The 6D menus appear to be identical to the M. ETTL works fine but I have to drop the power output to 1/16 for the 12 foot range when using the 40 due to larger aperture.

With my 430EX in the M's hotshoe the wireless option blanks out, Zoom becomes operative, and high speed sync appears in shutter synchronization. With manual flash I have to drop the power output to 1/64 for this range, but that's easy to do through the menu. So the 90EX appears to operate mostly same as 430EX, with the expected drop in power. The M is a lot easier to handle with the 90EX on it.

If wireless is ON with ETTL or Manual flash, it just sends a minimal control flash and the off camera flash is expected to provide all the lighting. You still have exposure compensation or flash output level control with the off camera flash. I use this to control an off camera 430EX with a softbox for portraits in ETTL or M modes, from both my M and 6D. 

You might want to experiment with the settings a bit more before dismissing the flash. Or you may have a defective unit as someone else suggested.


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## privatebydesign (Mar 21, 2014)

sagittariansrock said:


> privatebydesign said:
> 
> 
> > I am dissing the 90EX for it's original purpose. It is a POS.
> ...



Yep, fake. Disney in Florida so just about as fake as you can get, fun ride though.


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## privatebydesign (Mar 21, 2014)

philmoz said:


> privatebydesign said:
> 
> 
> > I am dissing the 90EX for it's original purpose. It is a POS.
> ...



Phil, you might well be on to something there, the wireless control is/was off but I just tested it as fill on a 1Ds MkIII and it is much more powerful, so I do seem to have a technical issue with either my M or my 90EX. The wireless control being off was a conincidence by the way, I wasn't aware of the output limit when it was on.

Thanks for making me look at it again, obviously all the other limitations still apply, but I will investigate the fill flash capabilities in a new light on different bodies. Thanks.


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## bholliman (Mar 21, 2014)

dcm said:


> I haven't used it a lot, but it works fine for me - much better light output than any P&S flash and much more flexible. Yes, I do wish it had tilt/swivel capabilities but that would just add to the size and I kinda like it's small form factor more.
> 
> You need to check the Flash Function Settings under the External Speedlite Control options in the first menu screen. The key is to make sure wireless is turned Off if you want the flash to fire normally. It is a little confusing to see OFF next to the ETTL/M selection. I do wish there was a shortcut to this menu. I forgot to reset it once and got results similar to yours.
> 
> ...



I suppose it really depends on how you use flash. I almost never use direct, on-camera flash. I am looking for flashes that allow me to bounce flash when on-camera or to be a master for off camera slaves. The 90EX doesn't work well for those purposes. 

It apparently does work well for on-camera direct flash (providing wireless is turned off in the menu settings). So, it's value will vary depending on intended use as with many other things.


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## jdramirez (Apr 1, 2014)

How's this for a testament. As I said before... I own the 90ex and I was going to do some optical triggering with it along side my 580ex ii's... and after 2 sessions with it... I'm buying a wireless transceiver because I do not like the 90 ex. I do not like it on a train... i do not like it on a boat... I would not use it in Spain... i do not like it with a goat... sam I am...

It was slow to reload... which is a problem when shooting my 7 month old... she will smile intermittently so I have to have the shot ready when that happens... and no... the 90 exii went to sleep too often... 

Sure it is fine for what it is supposed to be... a travel flash on a unit with no flash... but I whole heartedly hated the thing... and the experience MADE me to and buy something else. I hate being forced to buy something when a stop gap measure will do just fine... this is not just fine.

Sorry... but it was pretty awful.


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## bholliman (Apr 10, 2014)

jdramirez said:


> How's this for a testament. As I said before... I own the 90ex and I was going to do some optical triggering with it along side my 580ex ii's... and after 2 sessions with it... I'm buying a wireless transceiver because I do not like the 90 ex. I do not like it on a train... i do not like it on a boat... I would not use it in Spain... i do not like it with a goat... sam I am...
> 
> It was slow to reload... which is a problem when shooting my 7 month old... she will smile intermittently so I have to have the shot ready when that happens... and no... the 90 exii went to sleep too often...
> 
> ...



+1 sold mine for the same reasons. We have a 22 month old son, and I was missing way too many shots waiting for the 90EX to recycle as an on camera trigger.


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