# Anyone gotten a full spectrum conversion done on their camera?



## g2 (Sep 16, 2012)

Howdy,

I'm thinking of getting a T3i (600D) converted to full spectrum. Objective is to use it for IR and visible light (with external filters) Have a few queries, would appreciate if any of you could help me with them.

1. How good will the visible light IQ be with a quality UV/IR cut filter when compared to a stock camera? 

2. I've read different wavelengths of light focus at different focal planes resulting in chromatic aberration when shooting full spectrum, any remedy to this? Also would I still get CA when say shooting only IR or Visible with filters?

3. Your recommendations on a quality UV/IR cut filter.

Would love to see some samples, if you have any please do post.
Any additional info you can provide would also be appreciated.

Thanks,
g2


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## g2 (Sep 17, 2012)

Anyone?


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## Timothy_Bruce (May 29, 2013)

I modified my old 350D to full spectrum. Still testing it and need something to replace the IR-Filter to get infinity focus back. 
some of the first testshots


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## g2 (May 29, 2013)

Thanks mate, I got the conversion done a while back, couldn't resist. (shortly after this question actually ;D) 

You doing the conversion yourself?


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## Timothy_Bruce (May 29, 2013)

nice to know!  
are you happy with it ? what filters do you use ? 

Yes I have done it myself. The only not that easy step was removing the soldered on metal shielding above the sensor assembly. 
When I was about to get the main circuit board out I noticed that there was only ONE screw loosely in its place.
The other 3 were gone and I was only able of finding 1 of the missing ones, stuck to some tape. 
So 2 screws missing inside the Body. 
Scared me a bit because my 7D just luckily got its battery status back working after 2 fallen screws messed it up. 
The tech that found them showed it to me and told me that that is really dangerous to kill the board by shorting it when the screws roll around in the body. And there is a lot of uncovered circuit boards in the 350D and even more in the 7D. 
( sorry for my englisch )


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## g2 (May 30, 2013)

I got the full spectrum conversion done from lifepixel, pretty pleased with their service 

I like the IQ I get from the camera, pics are nice and crisp, noise seems a bit more, not sure if these are due to the conversion or just the output from a 600D in general as I bought it and directly sent it in for the conversion. 

You need to custom WB everything, auto WB will not work, also I have read that the phase detect AF won't work in IR very well as the cameras are calibrated for visible light and IR focuses at different wave lengths, contract detect (the slow live view focus) works fine.

I use the MaxMax UV-IR cut for visible light and have Marumi 700nm, Tiffen red (around 600nm) and a cheapo 720nm for IR 

I wouldn't touch the insides of the camera myself and what you have mentioned about the screws is very scary indeed.

Liepixel sells only the filters for DIY conversion but they cost 2/3 of the cost of the conversion, check them out if you are in need of the filter only.

Cheers,
g2


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## g2 (May 30, 2013)

Some pics from my end.
Not shot anything in ages and I miss it so terribly 
These were shot a while back.

Cheap 720nm 







Cheap 720nm 






UV-IR






Tiffen Red (600nm or so)


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## hgraf (May 30, 2013)

g2 said:


> Howdy,
> 
> I'm thinking of getting a T3i (600D) converted to full spectrum. Objective is to use it for IR and visible light (with external filters) Have a few queries, would appreciate if any of you could help me with them.
> 
> 1. How good will the visible light IQ be with a quality UV/IR cut filter when compared to a stock camera?



Pretty much as good as original, depending on how the conversion is done.



g2 said:


> 2. I've read different wavelengths of light focus at different focal planes resulting in chromatic aberration when shooting full spectrum, any remedy to this? Also would I still get CA when say shooting only IR or Visible with filters?



CA will vastly depend on lens, some control the IR portion more then others. Some lenses are horrible in the IR region, having weird hot spots.

As for when shooting WITH an IR block, the result will be pretty much the same.

By using an IR block filter all you are effectively doing is MOVING the filter from in front of the sensor to in front of the lens.



g2 said:


> 3. Your recommendations on a quality UV/IR cut filter.
> 
> Would love to see some samples, if you have any please do post.
> Any additional info you can provide would also be appreciated.
> ...



I just finished modding a 350D to full spectrum. I pulled the IR block and replaced it with a UV filter that I cut into the right shape. Since the glass is different (both in properties and in thickness) I had to adjust the focus using the focus adjust screw on that era of bodies.

The results are pretty damn good if I do say so myself! 

This is one of the first shots I took, it looks pretty "normal", but if you look closely, the tree that's light brown in colour actually has dark brown leaves!  And the grass is alot lighter then it normally is.


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## hgraf (May 30, 2013)

Timothy_Bruce said:


> I modified my old 350D to full spectrum. Still testing it and need something to replace the IR-Filter to get infinity focus back.



The 350D (and 30D and one other) has a focus screw in the light box that can be adjusted with a 1.3mm (0.5 inch) allen wrench. I replaced my IR cut with a thinner piece of UV filter cut to size and then adjusted focus.

It still has a little front focus at f/1.8, but at f/5.6 and up it's bang on. Good enough for my uses! Since IR photography works BEST midday in bright sunlight I don't see many times where I'll be shooting below f/8, and when I will (i.e. macro or really nice DOF shots) I'll just focus bracket. I could have adjusted the focus more (and I might) but my allen wrench is bent quite a bit, I don't want to bend it any more for fear of breaking it!


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## hgraf (May 30, 2013)

g2 said:


> Liepixel sells only the filters for DIY conversion but they cost 2/3 of the cost of the conversion, check them out if you are in need of the filter only.
> 
> Cheers,
> g2



FWIW those filters are so insanely overpriced it's astonishing. They obvious price the filters so high so that noone actually buys the filter, and instead uses their conversion service.

There are TONS of other filter options that work just as well, and don't cost that much.

TTYL


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## Timothy_Bruce (May 30, 2013)

hgraf said:


> Timothy_Bruce said:
> 
> 
> > I modified my old 350D to full spectrum. Still testing it and need something to replace the IR-Filter to get infinity focus back.
> ...


Nice to know!
I don´t know the term light box. 
can you tell me where exactly I find that focus screw ? 
Thanks


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## g2 (May 31, 2013)

@hgraf
Thanks for all the info mate 

Funny, this post was started in September last year and is generating interest now ;D
All info is still appreciated of course.


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## g2 (May 31, 2013)

One question.

I mentioned the images from my converted cam seemed crisp with more noise, my assumption was that when they replaced the hot mirror filter with a clear glass filter the anti aliasing filter was removed as well, I assume it would be part of the hot mirror filter.
Is this correct?


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## neuroanatomist (May 31, 2013)

g2 said:


> I mentioned the images from my converted cam seemed crisp with more noise, my assumption was that when they replaced the hot mirror filter with a clear glass filter the anti aliasing filter was removed as well, I assume it would be part of the hot mirror filter.
> Is this correct?



Half correct. Literally!  The AA filter is actually a two-part filter, with separate horizontal and vertical filters. The horizontal part is in the 'outer' stack (which vibrates as part of the self-cleaning sensor) - that's removed as part of the conversion. The vertical part of the AA filter is fused to the CMOS sensor itself (along with the microlenses and CFA), and is not removed with the conversion.


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## g2 (May 31, 2013)

neuroanatomist said:


> Half correct. Literally!  The AA filter is actually a two-part filter, with separate horizontal and vertical filters. The horizontal part is in the 'outer' stack (which vibrates as part of the self-cleaning sensor) - that's removed as part of the conversion. The vertical part of the AA filter is fused to the CMOS sensor itself (along with the microlenses and CFA), and is not removed with the conversion.



;D ;D Thanks.

Wold removal of half of the filter result in more noise in pics?
AA blurs fine details a bit so I'm guessing it would blur the noise too and make pics appear cleaner.


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## neuroanatomist (May 31, 2013)

g2 said:


> Wold removal of half of the filter result in more noise in pics?
> AA blurs fine details a bit so I'm guessing it would blur the noise too and make pics appear cleaner.



The AA filter blurs the image to remove moiré. Noise is introduced later in the image chain, at the sensor and after. Fine detail tends to mask noise, actually. I expect you're seeing the aliasing that results from the reduction in strength of the AA filter (AA = _anti_-aliasing, after all...).


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## hgraf (May 31, 2013)

Timothy_Bruce said:


> Nice to know!
> I don´t know the term light box.
> can you tell me where exactly I find that focus screw ?
> Thanks



The area between the lens mount and the shutter. To access the screw, put the camera in sensor cleaning mode, this will lift the mirror and give you access. The screw is located at the top-middle of the box, on the wall away from the battery.

TTYL


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## g2 (May 31, 2013)

neuroanatomist said:


> The AA filter blurs the image to remove moiré. Noise is introduced later in the image chain, at the sensor and after. Fine detail tends to mask noise, actually. I expect you're seeing the aliasing that results from the reduction in strength of the AA filter (AA = _anti_-aliasing, after all...).



Thanks.
That makes perfect sense, noise is generated by the sensor (and not present in the scene) so AA filter would not make any difference. 
I just found the pics had more noise than from my ex 30D, guess it's just the 18mp sensor.

One more question.
When I see pics taken on film they seem to have different colour tones when compared to digital, is it anything to do with film being sensitive to IR (and UV perhaps) and distorting the colour a bit? We can see the colours being distorted in the example hgraf has posted.
Does that make sense? Sorry late Friday night and have had a few ;D

Cheers ;D


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## neuroanatomist (May 31, 2013)

g2 said:


> When I see pics taken on film they seem to have different colour tones when compared to digital, is it anything to do with film being sensitive to IR (and UV perhaps) and distorting the colour a bit? We can see the colours being distorted in the example hgraf has posted.



The spectral sensitivity curve of digital and film are fairly different (and films differ widely, too, which is why there were so many types available). The CFAs differ between cameras, too, so you'll even see differences between converted dSLRs of different models.


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## g2 (Jun 1, 2013)

neuroanatomist said:


> The spectral sensitivity curve of digital and film are fairly different (and films differ widely, too, which is why there were so many types available). The CFAs differ between cameras, too, so you'll even see differences between converted dSLRs of different models.



Thanks.
Possible to develop filters matching some film frequencies to emulate the same look?


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