# All is quiet regarding the EOS 90D and EOS M6 Mark II



## Canon Rumors Guy (Aug 19, 2019)

> Over the last week or so, our inbox has become really quiet as far as EOS 90D and EOS M6 Mark II announcements go. It’s surprising that this close to the August 28, 2019 announcement for each camera that we aren’t hearing new things almost daily.
> Interestingly, we have been told by a couple of Canon dealers around the globe that Canon is setting up major training and showcasing of new products in early September, one of the retailers told us that this training seems to be above and beyond what Canon usually does for a new consumer EOS DSLR and EOS M cameras. This tells us that either these new products are a big departure from their previous iterations, or there could be another product being announced that hasn’t leaked at all. Canon has become really good at stopping leaks.
> We have heard that an EOS M5 Mark II is coming, and was originally going to be announced alongside the EOS M6 Mark II, but has been delayed. There has been no word on when we can expect a new flagship EOS M...



Continue reading...


----------



## Canon1966 (Aug 19, 2019)

I hope it's decent with something(s) new...I'm no longer anxious...


----------



## amorse (Aug 19, 2019)

The calm before the storm... maybe?


----------



## sdz (Aug 19, 2019)

> Interestingly, we have been told by a couple of Canon dealers around the globe that Canon is setting up major training and showcasing of new products in early September, one of the retailers told us that this training seems to be above and beyond what Canon usually does for a new consumer EOS DSLR and EOS M cameras. This tells us that either these new products are a big departure from their previous iterations, or there could be another product being announced that hasn’t leaked at all. Canon has become really good at stopping leaks.




Odd as it may seem, by keeping a tight lid on the information circulating about new gear, Canon merely increases the anticipation potential buyers have for what they will offer in the near future!

A quick search did not return links to press releases that announced the existence new fabrication plant.....


----------



## Maximilian (Aug 19, 2019)

Canon Rumors Guy said:


> ...
> or there could be another product being announced that hasn’t leaked at all. Canon has become really good at stopping leaks.
> ...


Bad times for rumor sites 

But it keeps the tension high


----------



## rosstcorbett (Aug 19, 2019)

And what about the RF 15-35? I'm desperate to order this. This anticipation is killing me


----------



## DonS (Aug 19, 2019)

On YouTube:


----------



## rosstcorbett (Aug 19, 2019)

DonS said:


> On YouTube:



Well, hello 90D!!


----------



## sdz (Aug 19, 2019)

Canon1966 said:


> I hope it's decent with something(s) new...I'm no longer anxious...



It was believed by many that the R line was a knee-jerk response to the threat Sony posed to Canon's camera businesses. But subsequent reports indicated that Canon had begun working on what became the R line years before it launched. If Canon has quietly gestated a platform shift, from mirrored to mirrorless cameras, using newer, more complex CMOS sensors, there may come a day when a product flood shows itself.

Time will tell.


----------



## nostrovia (Aug 19, 2019)

DonS said:


> On YouTube:



Wow, they managed to fit a joystick on there!


----------



## navastronia (Aug 19, 2019)

DonS said:


> On YouTube:



Oh hell yeah.

-10 FPS shooting
-Some weather sealing
-120/1080p
-24/4K


----------



## Proscribo (Aug 19, 2019)

DonS said:


> On YouTube:





> Canon has become really good at stopping leaks.


Lol.


----------



## amorse (Aug 19, 2019)

DonS said:


> On YouTube:


Good find! Looks like Canon Australia is more than a few timezones ahead of us in North America today 

Looks like an evolutionary upgrade all in all.


----------



## nostrovia (Aug 19, 2019)

navastronia said:


> Oh hell yeah.
> 
> -10 FPS shooting
> -Some weather sealing
> ...



Things I didn't see (as compared to the previous rumors):

- Dual Digic 8
- Dual Card Slot
- 4K 60 seems to be off the table
- no mention of bluetooth/GPS


----------



## amorse (Aug 19, 2019)

navastronia said:


> Oh hell yeah.
> 
> -10 FPS shooting
> -Some weather sealing
> ...


Looks like no auto focus at 120, and cropped in. Also, they note that the 4K is output through processing? I wonder if that just means pixel binning or something else?


----------



## unfocused (Aug 19, 2019)

If the video is genuine and it certainly looks like it is, this will be quite a camera. More 7D than 80D. In my opinion, full coverage of viewfinder is more important than the number of focus points. All cross-type and probably all f8 focusing.

As far as the "training and showcasing" goes, I would not be surprised if that will be focused as much on the R as on the 90D and M series. From my own experience, the R is the type of camera that can really benefit from hands-on and one-on-one sales demonstrations.


----------



## amorse (Aug 19, 2019)

unfocused said:


> If the video is genuine and it certainly looks like it is, this will be quite a camera. More 7D than 80D. In my opinion, full coverage of viewfinder is more important than the number of focus points. All cross-type and probably all f8 focusing.
> 
> As far as the "training and showcasing" goes, I would not be surprised if that will be focused as much on the R as on the 90D and M series. From my own experience, the R is the type of camera that can really benefit from hands-on and one-on-one sales demonstrations.


I don't think they're all f/8 based on this frame or else it shouldn't matter what lens is attached, I think?


----------



## Canon1966 (Aug 19, 2019)

If the video is genuine...I will sell my 80D.


----------



## amorse (Aug 19, 2019)

While we're at it, it looks like they leaked the M6II as well:


----------



## amorse (Aug 19, 2019)

amorse said:


> While we're at it, it looks like they leaked the M6II as well:


Looks Solid to me:
14fps
4k
32.5MP
That Raw burst looks like it starts shooting and keeps going until the buffer is full then starts erasing the earlier images until you trigger it to stop. I.e. so if you're waiting for the action to start you can start shooting way before without risk of filing the buffer and then once the action stops you let off the shutter to keep the last x images remaining in the buffer. That is a killer feature, and I likely butchered the explanation (or misinterpreted the video).


----------



## Proscribo (Aug 19, 2019)

amorse said:


> I don't think they're all f/8 based on this frame or else it shouldn't matter what lens is attached, I think?
> View attachment 186046


Actually it could matter, check 7DII manual for example (from page 100 onwards): http://gdlp01.c-wss.com/gds/2/0300016942/04/EOS_7D_Mark_II_Instruction_Manual_EN.pdf


amorse said:


> That Raw burst looks like it starts shooting and keeps going until the buffer is full then starts erasing the earlier images until you trigger it to stop. I.e. so if you're waiting for the action to start you can start shooting way before without risk of filing the buffer and then once the action stops you let off the shutter to keep the last x images remaining in the buffer. That is a killer feature, and I likely butchered the explanation


MFT has had that since 2016, at 60fps.  Nice to see others implementing it too.


----------



## amorse (Aug 19, 2019)

Proscribo said:


> MFT has had that since 2016, at 60fps.  Nice to see others implementing it too.


It was a good feature there, and I bet it would be an interesting feature here. Depends on that rolling shutter I guess though!


----------



## koenkooi (Aug 19, 2019)

amorse said:


> It was a good feature there, and I bet it would be an interesting feature here. Depends on that rolling shutter I guess though!



I'm curious how big the crop for that is since the menu states '(crop)'.


----------



## Proscribo (Aug 19, 2019)

amorse said:


> It was a good feature there, and I bet it would be an interesting feature here. Depends on that rolling shutter I guess though!


Yes, tho for some reason I guess the crop is there for that reason... maybe ~1/30s readout while in that mode.


----------



## Joules (Aug 19, 2019)

A CR post about nothing getting out of Canon lately and on the first page the upcoming announcements are leaked! Fantastic timing right there. 

But man, nice time ahead. 14 FPS on the M6. So they actually managed to get their speed under contro?! 14 * 32.5 MP/s is 42% more throughput than the 1DX II can handle. And the M6 isn't even near to being a flagship mirror less. That get's me quite excited for the higher end R bodies.

And if they managed such a drastic improvement in that area... If they also managed to improve Dr even further, Sony is *******!


----------



## prodorshak (Aug 19, 2019)

Nicely summed up I guess:


----------



## navastronia (Aug 19, 2019)

Joules said:


> A CR post about nothing getting out of Canon lately and on the first page the upcoming announcements are leaked! Fantastic timing right there.
> 
> But man, nice time ahead. 14 GPS on the M6. So they actually managed to get their speed under control. 14 * 32.5 MP/s is 42% more throughput than the 1DX II can handle. That get's me quite excited for the higher end R bodies.
> 
> And if they managed such a drastic improvement in that area... If they also managed to improve Dr even further, Sony is *******!



The 14 fps is going to be crop, though, so not 14 * 32.5 MP/s.

The 90D, at 10 * 32.5 MP/s, is almost exactly the same throughput as the 1DX II (16 * 20.2 MP/s).

EDIT: I would delete this because I think I'm wrong, but I'll leave it up and say "I think I'm wrong."  It's 30 FPS burst and 14 FPS (like you say) in normal operation.


----------



## SUNDOG04 (Aug 19, 2019)

If the 90D is like the video, that would be huge! Now if only they did similar to the 6DII. I have and really like the 6D, but if mine would crap out, I am not sure what I would do. 5D4 is overkill, too big, too heavy and too expensive for my photography, mostly nature and landscape. A slightly faster frame rate for occasional running events but especially a non-crippled focusing system would be nice. Not holding my breath, though.


----------



## PeterT (Aug 19, 2019)

Canon1966 said:


> If the video is genuine...I will sell my 80D.



For which feature (asking seriously)?
Different people, different expectations and needs...

If the video is genuine, I have no reason to sell my 80D. Video is not important to me (FHD 60FPS is more than enough), 10FPS and improved focusing seem to me not an improvement big enough for the upgrade. And 32.5MP is an overkill (more a problem than a welcome feature to me).
The previous rumors mentioned IBIS. *That* was the only feature for which I would consider upgrading...


----------



## bitcars (Aug 19, 2019)

Hold on.. They didn't mention dual memory card slots now did they?


----------



## Joules (Aug 19, 2019)

navastronia said:


> The 14 fps is going to be crop, though, so not 14 * 32.5 MP/s.
> 
> The 90D, at 10 * 32.5 MP/s, is almost exactly the same throughput as the 1DX II (16 * 20.2 MP/s).


Where did you get the impression that the 14 FPS are cropped? I didn't spot that. The 30 FPS Burst mode is cropped.


----------



## LensFungus (Aug 19, 2019)

I wanna thank Australia for Hugh Jackman, Margot Robbie, AC/DC and the Canon leaks.


----------



## navastronia (Aug 19, 2019)

Joules said:


> Where did you get the impression that the 14 FPS are cropped? I didn't spot that. The 30 FPS Burst mode is cropped.



I was wrong. Edited post.


----------



## prodorshak (Aug 19, 2019)

DonS said:


> On YouTube:


Does the '90' in the '90D' look more white than 'D' in '90D' in color to others?


----------



## jvillain (Aug 19, 2019)

I wonder what the MSRP is going to be?


----------



## jvillain (Aug 19, 2019)

prodorshak said:


> Does the '90' in the '90D' look more white than 'D' in '90D' in color to others?


The D is actually made up of stripes rather than being solid like the numbers which is why it looks different


----------



## jvillain (Aug 19, 2019)

amorse said:


> Looks like no auto focus at 120, and cropped in. Also, they note that the 4K is output through processing? I wonder if that just means pixel binning or something else?
> View attachment 186045



Is it real 4K or is it an up scale like on the R is the first question. 

There had been patents floating around for IBIS on a DSLR. That is not here which I would have expected if the tech was coming in the near future.


----------



## bitcars (Aug 19, 2019)

If this picture is accurate, look at the sealing of the memory card door, then 90D is likely to have only a *single SD card slot*..




Canon, I am not sure 7D II users will be too happy about that.. 

Edit: I guess there is still hope that they perhaps figure out a way to stack 2 vertical SD cards in that little space?


----------



## Joules (Aug 19, 2019)

The video mentions that the 90D will have spot AF. I'm curious - is that not a hardware feature? The 80D doesn't have it, the 7D II does. Could it be that this 45 point AF sensor is not just the same from the 80D? Or is it not a hardware feature and Canon just 'crippled' the 80D all this time?


----------



## josephandrews222 (Aug 19, 2019)

What I like about the M6 II (so far) as far as ergonomics are concerned:

(1) In my hands, the ISO was too easily accidentally changed in the M6 I. It looks like this has been changed.

(2) In my hands, in certain specific usage patterns (i.e. dangling around my neck with a non-stock [much-smaller] strap...while mated to te 18-150 lens), the camera was able to turn itself on. There are threads on this at a couple of places on the 'net. It looks like this has been changed, too.

(3) It looks like the focus position, when the viewfinder is attached, is more like the m5 in that you can move it around on the touchscreen with your fingers

I will buy at least one.


----------



## amorse (Aug 19, 2019)

josephandrews222 said:


> What I like about the M6 II (so far) as far as ergonomics are concerned:
> 
> (1) In my hands, the ISO was too easily accidentally changed in the M6 I. It looks like this has been changed.
> 
> ...


If the price is right, I could be convinced as well. As a light weight travel camera, that could be right on the money.


----------



## Random Orbits (Aug 19, 2019)

bitcars said:


> If this picture is accurate, look at the sealing of the memory card door, then 90D is likely to have only a *single SD card slot*..
> 
> View attachment 186051
> 
> ...



Or would it be two SD-size card slots?


----------



## rbielefeld (Aug 19, 2019)

Does this mean that when looking through the optical viewfinder of the 90D and shooting full rate of 10 fps the AF is fixed; as in you have no AF available when shooting stills at 10fps? please tell me I am misinterpreting this.


----------



## josephandrews222 (Aug 19, 2019)

My view of the article which these posts follow is below. No snark intended.

The article contains the following: "We have heard that an EOS M5 Mark II is coming, and was originally going to be announced alongside the EOS M6 Mark II, but has been delayed. There has been no word on when we can expect a new flagship EOS M camera. "

In my mind, these two sentences sum up the dilemma (opportunity!?) that Canon faces with the M series of cameras.

Why, you say?

Because to me, a properly-specced M6 (with its smaller form factor)...an M6 that can do everything that the M5 can with the add-on viewfinder...to me:

The M6 is the flagship of the M series of cameras (not the larger, bulkier M5).

A lot of folks just don't understand the M. Perhaps they don't want to.

The image below was acquired with the M6 and its fill-flash...using the 15-45mm kit lens (speaking of which, the lens in the M6 II video did not seem to be a 15-45 II, did it?). Two minutes post-processing at most.




...while walking the beach in Encinitas CA. I didn't go there to take pictures. The M6 is a very useful tool!


----------



## dtaylor (Aug 19, 2019)

*CANON. IS. DOO*...oh wait 

Random thoughts...
* Both cameras look very impressive.
* Love the 100% viewfinder on the 90D, but this also points to it being intended as a 7D replacement which 7D2 fans may not appreciate.
* A lot of people will complain about 32mp but going lower would not improve high ISO or DR as is commonly believed. This is a big gain for wildlife and sports.
* 7D2 fans may still find some things to dislike. It looks like 1 card slot and the 45pt system, not the 65pt system. On the card slot I can sympathize. But the AF sensor is backed by the best iTR sensor made so far, so it might just offer better AF than the 7D2.
* Uncropped 4k w/DPAF was a must hit target and it looks like Canon did it.

For months I've flirted with the idea of getting an XT3 mainly for the video. I kept hesitating because I'm basically a stills photographer with Canon glass who wants to play with video, and it felt like the XT3 would end up being only for video. I can't see myself getting a Fuji lens kit or suffering with the AF issues of adapted Canon glass. (The Fuji adapters aren't as good as the Sony ones.) 

These cameras will work with all of my existing lenses with DPAF video without compromise, and I can see either one filling a stills niche as well. I'm in no hurry so I'll wait for reviews, but I think one of these will find a home in my kit.


----------



## dtaylor (Aug 19, 2019)

rbielefeld said:


> Does this mean that when looking through the optical viewfinder of the 90D and shooting full rate of 10 fps the AF is fixed; as in you have no AF available when shooting stills at 10fps? please tell me I am misinterpreting this.
> 
> View attachment 186054



I'm reading it as AF fixed or tracking because of the "/". I can't imagine it would be AF fixed at 10 fps. Off-mirror AF at 10 fps is old tech for Canon. If it was fixed at 10 fps and only active at, say, 7 or 8 fps that would be a big disappointment. I hope that's not the case.


----------



## Joules (Aug 19, 2019)

dtaylor said:


> * Love the 100% viewfinder on the 90D, but this also points to it being intended as a 7D replacement which 7D2 fans may not appreciate.


100% Viewfinder isn't new. The 80D has it as well. The joystick, spot AF and advertised wheather sealing are 7D features that make it much clearer that this is indeed the replacement for both, I think.


----------



## dtaylor (Aug 19, 2019)

Joules said:


> 100% Viewfinder isn't new. The 80D has it as well. The joystick, spot AF and advertised wheather sealing are 7D features that make it much clearer that this is indeed the replacement for both, I think.



My mistake, and good notes on the other new features.


----------



## Sharlin (Aug 19, 2019)

Heh, clearly Canon timed the video leaks right after this "everything is quiet" post so as to maximize the dramatic irony.


----------



## Aussie shooter (Aug 19, 2019)

So no IBIS on either model? Or did I miss something? Not that I personally care about IBIS but if it isn't there it will be used as a way to ignore the positive aspects of the cameras. As a 7d2 shooter however, despite the good bits about the 90d it is not a replacement for me


----------



## neuroanatomist (Aug 20, 2019)

sdz said:


> It was believed by many that the R line was a knee-jerk response to the threat Sony posed to Canon's camera businesses.


It was believe by many who have no understanding of product development timelines.


----------

