# Canon EOS 6D Mark II Has Begun Shipping



## Canon Rumors Guy (Jul 26, 2017)

```
<p>We’re told by various retailers that the brand new Canon EOS 6D Mark II has begun shipping today and that a lot of people should expect to receive their cameras tomorrow.</p>
<p>Allocation has been pretty good, and we’re told that there will be EOS 6D Mark II w/24-105mm f/4L IS II kits available once all preorders have been met.</p>
<p><!--more--></p>
<p>The embargo on selling the EOS 6D Mark II ends tomorrow.</p>
<p><strong>Canon EOS 6D Mark II Body</strong></p>
<ul>
<li><strong>USA $1999</strong>: <a href="https://bhpho.to/2tmBfEW">B&H Photo</a> | <a href="http://amzn.to/2sjTrPL">Amazon</a> | <a href="https://mpex.com/canon-eos-6d-mark-ii-dslr-camera-body-only.html?acc=3">Midwest Photo</a></li>
<li><strong>UK £1999:</strong> <a href="http://www.awin1.com/cread.php?awinaffid=292297&awinmid=6241&p=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.parkcameras.com%2Fp%2F1010062T%2Fdigital-slr-cameras%2Fcanon%2Feos-6d-mark-ii-dslr-camera-body">Park Cameras</a> | <a href="http://www.awin1.com/cread.php?awinaffid=292297&awinmid=2298&p=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wexphotographic.com%2Fcanon-eos-6d-mark-ii-digital-slr-camera-body-1630560%2F">WEX Photographic</a></li>
<li><strong>Canada $2599:</strong> <a href="http://www.pjtra.com/t/TUJGRU1GTEJGRk5HSklCRkhMRklH?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.henrys.com%2F98225-CANON-EOS-6D-MK-II-BODY.aspx">Henry’s</a></li>
</ul>
<p><strong>Canon EOS 6D Mark II w/24-105mm f/3.5-5.6 IS STM</strong></p>
<ul>
<li><strong>USA $2599</strong>: <a href="https://bhpho.to/2s3TmM9">B&H Photo</a> | <a href="http://amzn.to/2triKPZ">Amazon</a> | <a href="https://mpex.com/canon-eos-6d-mark-ii-dslr-camera-with-24-105mm-is-stm-lens.html?acc=3">Midwest Photo</a></li>
</ul>
<p><strong>Canon EOS 6D Mark II w/24-105mm f/4L IS II</strong></p>
<ul>
<li><strong>USA $3099</strong>: <a href="https://bhpho.to/2tnn96a">B&H Photo</a> | <a href="http://amzn.to/2u0EWh6">Amazon</a> | <a href="https://mpex.com/canon-eos-6d-mark-ii-dslr-camera-with-24-105mm-f4l-is-ii-usm-lens.html?acc=3">Midwest Photo</a></li>
</ul>
<p><strong>Canon EOS 6D Mark II Body w/24-70mm f/4L IS</strong></p>
<ul>
<li><strong>UK £2379:</strong> <a href="http://www.awin1.com/cread.php?awinaffid=292297&awinmid=6241&p=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.parkcameras.com%2Fp%2F1010063D%2Fdigital-slr-cameras%2Fcanon%2Feos-6d-mark-ii-dslr-ef-24-70mm-f4l-is-usm-lens-kit">Park Cameras</a> | <a href="http://www.awin1.com/cread.php?awinaffid=292297&awinmid=2298&p=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wexphotographic.com%2Fcanon-eos-6d-mark-ii-digital-slr-camera-with-24-70mm-f4-l-is-lens-1631339%2F">WEX Photographic</a></li>
</ul>
<p><strong>Canon BG-E21 Battery Grip for EOS 6D Mark II</strong></p>
<ul>
<li><strong>USA $300</strong>: <a href="https://bhpho.to/2s4e6TL">B&H Photo</a> | <a href="http://amzn.to/2u0nzgx">Amazon</a> | <a href="https://mpex.com/canon-bg-e21-battery-grip.html?acc=3">Midwest Photo</a></li>
<li><strong>UK £199:</strong> <a href="http://www.awin1.com/cread.php?awinaffid=292297&awinmid=6241&p=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.parkcameras.com%2Fp%2F1150097F%2Fgrips%2Fcanon%2Fbg-e21-battery-grip">Park Cameras</a> | <a href="http://www.awin1.com/cread.php?awinaffid=292297&awinmid=2298&p=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wexphotographic.com%2Fcanon-bg-e21-battery-grip-1630561%2F">WEX Photographic</a></li>
</ul>
<span id="pty_trigger"></span>
```


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## derekmccoy (Jul 26, 2017)

Any current 6D owners have one on the way? I'd like to play with some comparison RAW files.


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## Skywise (Jul 26, 2017)

Eagerly awaiting the reviews.

I'm on the fence as there's some nice-to-have features I'd like that my current 6D doesn't but no need-to-have ones. If the DR is roughly equal (enough that a little LR post-processing will cover the spread) I'm leaning towards a maybe.


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## Point22 (Jul 26, 2017)

Two days with me


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## Point22 (Jul 26, 2017)

Skywise said:


> Eagerly awaiting the reviews.
> 
> I'm on the fence as there's some nice-to-have features I'd like that my current 6D doesn't but no need-to-have ones. If the DR is roughly equal (enough that a little LR post-processing will cover the spread) I'm leaning towards a maybe.



+- than old 6D with DR and ISO..


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## arthurbikemad (Jul 26, 2017)

Hahaha, all the internet chatter and I know loads of people (not on forums) who have pre orders... The internet say one thing, people do another...lol


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## Andries (Jul 26, 2017)

Got confirmation today that my 6D Mark II has shipped and will arrive tomorrow !
Eagerly waiting to get my hands on it. Will be a great addition to my current 80D !


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## bergstrom (Jul 26, 2017)

No 4K and this article on canonrumours 

http://www.canonrumors.com/canon-eos-6d-mark-ii-dynamic-range-talk-sample-images/

was enough for me to hold off and hope the 5d5 with 4k (or even 6k) and better compression of video files will deliver the goods.


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## jmoya (Jul 26, 2017)

I'm getting mine in tomorrow. I'll be doing a short unboxing and some file comparison at high ISO between the 5D III and new 6d mark II. Video will be up over the weekend on my youtube channel. Jorge moya. I plan on using it as my cinematic sequence camera on Malaysia and Bali vlogs in 3 weeks. Fingers crossed!!!


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## mnclayshooter (Jul 26, 2017)

Point22 said:


> Two days with me




What is the little button right next to the shutter but in front of the dial on the top?


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## Talys (Jul 26, 2017)

that1guyy said:


> Are people actually excited about this camera?



Sure. I hope I can pick mine up tomorrow  I ordered at a local shop, instead of online, which probably means I'll have to wait longer, but oh well.

Oh crap. I just realized, I have to fill out the form to make sure I get my free jacket & shirt. The jacket actually looks nice.


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## lightwriter (Jul 26, 2017)

that1guyy said:


> Are people actually excited about this camera?



Yep. My other camera is a T4i, so it is an upgrade for me. All the "faults" don't matter to me because I never had them in the first place.

I wanted full frame, and I have some good EF glass, and this was at the price point for me.


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## Talys (Jul 26, 2017)

lightwriter said:


> I wanted full frame, and I have some good EF glass, and this was at the price point for me.



This pretty much describes me to a T. Except that also, I really need the articulating screen.


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## gts (Jul 26, 2017)

mnclayshooter said:


> Point22 said:
> 
> 
> > Two days with me
> ...



AF Area Selection Mode. Each time you press the button the AF area selection mode changes.


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## rfdesigner (Jul 26, 2017)

lightwriter said:


> that1guyy said:
> 
> 
> > Are people actually excited about this camera?
> ...



I can see how a lot of Non 6D owners might make the jump to the MkII, and those that really want the articulating screen would want one.

Otherwise...


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## Point22 (Jul 27, 2017)

rfdesigner said:


> lightwriter said:
> 
> 
> > that1guyy said:
> ...


Feeleing of this camera ( AF, shutter speed reaction, handling, vari angle screen and and.. ) is Great! AF precision on the all AF points ist 100 and 1 then 6D


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## Andreos (Jul 27, 2017)

I'm planning to upgrade my 6D alright ... to a nice used Nikon D750. Canon can take their sensor banding, their amp glow, their crap dynamic range, their insulting marketing segmentation games, and shove them all where the sun don't shine.


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## weixing (Jul 27, 2017)

Hi,


Andreos said:


> I'm planning to upgrade my 6D alright ... to a nice used Nikon D750. Canon can take their sensor banding, their amp glow, their crap dynamic range, their insulting marketing segmentation games, and shove them all where the sun don't shine.


 Sensor banding & amp glow?? I never seen them in my Canon. Anyway, good luck with your Nikon D750... make sure check your Nikon D750 shutter had been fixed if the serial number fall into the latest recall range.

Have a nice day.


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## Luds34 (Jul 27, 2017)

rfdesigner said:


> lightwriter said:
> 
> 
> > that1guyy said:
> ...



Original 6D owner and I could care less about the articulating screen. I upgraded for the modern AF system. Now the camera fits better into the "jack of all trades" thinking. Aka, it can do some action, tracking, ai servo.


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## dak723 (Jul 27, 2017)

that1guyy said:


> Are people actually excited about this camera?



Why shouldn't they be? The 6D had excellent IQ, but many folks weren't happy with the AF. The improved AF along with articulating screen will be welcome to many. The IQ will be as good, too, so a lot to look forward to.

Oh, you must mean all that DR hysteria? If you aren't a 5 stop underexposer or a pixel peeper, then the DR would be of little concern, since the original 6D has plenty enough DR to take excellent pics.


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## Andreos (Jul 27, 2017)

weixing said:


> Sensor banding & amp glow?? I never seen them in my Canon. Anyway, good luck with your Nikon D750... make sure check your Nikon D750 shutter had been fixed if the serial number fall into the latest recall range.



Oh, so you ain't seen it, so it don't exist, right?

Shutters can be repaired. Sensor problems can't.

Have an adult day.


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## weixing (Jul 27, 2017)

Andreos said:


> weixing said:
> 
> 
> > Sensor banding & amp glow?? I never seen them in my Canon. Anyway, good luck with your Nikon D750... make sure check your Nikon D750 shutter had been fixed if the serial number fall into the latest recall range.
> ...


Hi,
I didn't said that... I just said that I didn't see it in my Canon camera.

Also, are you sure the sensor had problem? The sensor performance didn't meet the expectation is not same as the sensor had a problem... it's just didn't meet your expectation. 

Have a nice day.


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## Talys (Jul 27, 2017)

Andreos said:


> weixing said:
> 
> 
> > Sensor banding & amp glow?? I never seen them in my Canon. Anyway, good luck with your Nikon D750... make sure check your Nikon D750 shutter had been fixed if the serial number fall into the latest recall range.
> ...



Actually, in the case of cameras, this is literally true. It isn't a problem for you, unless you experience it. 

"Don't buy this camera because it will seize up and stop working in -50C weather" is a terrible proposition if you don't like travel and live in Florida. "Don't buy this camera because it's terrible at ISO 12,000" is meaningless all you shoot is birds. "Don't buy this camera because it doesn't shoot 4k video" isn't helpful for someone who only wants to shoot stills. 

People usually don't make camera buying decisions based on aspects that are perfect OR terrible, if those are things they'll never do. Most people who actually use their cameras upgrade or buy new gear because there is some benefit in the type of things they like to shoot. The success or failure of a camera is usually what percentage of prospective buyers find that it's technically suitable at the price point that they're happy with. The likelihood of buying the next iteration is usually how happy they've been with the last. 

I stick with Canon (which is my 3rd major brand over 30ish years, where I've invested in a pretty full range of interchangeable lens, by the way), not because of theoretical technical superiority, but because they're a pleasure to use and very dependable.

So if you encounter sensor banding with Canon cameras, you should stop buying them. It would be insane to do otherwise. But for people who never experience that, it really isn't a thing. I occasionally read about people complain about sensor banding on either Canons or Nikons. I'll even take you at your word that you've experienced it. But I've never had sensor banding in a bazillion photos over many, many cameras, so *shrug*.


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## Point22 (Jul 27, 2017)

dak723 said:


> that1guyy said:
> 
> 
> > Are people actually excited about this camera?
> ...


-5Ev correction in camera and then +5Ev in Lightroom CC 3 minutes postprocessing..


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## meho1a (Jul 27, 2017)

Point22 said:


> dak723 said:
> 
> 
> > that1guyy said:
> ...




Is this taken with 6D mk2?


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## Khalai (Jul 27, 2017)

Banding is apparent in lifted shadows areas, such as TV screen. But still, not bad for such extreme push...


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## Point22 (Jul 27, 2017)

Khalai said:


> Banding is apparent in lifted shadows areas, such as TV screen. But still, not bad for such extreme push...



You just need to darken black locally ( in LR brush tools and black -20 )


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## Point22 (Jul 27, 2017)

meho1a said:


> Point22 said:
> 
> 
> > dak723 said:
> ...



Yes man 6D mark II + my PP 

And this is ISO 25 600


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## Jack Douglas (Jul 27, 2017)

I think all the past negativity makes the present reality seem better. 

Jack


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## Point22 (Jul 27, 2017)

meho1a said:


> Point22 said:
> 
> 
> > dak723 said:
> ...


 + local adjustments.. Is this no simple fot postprocessing but with skills everything goes


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## meho1a (Jul 27, 2017)

Point22 said:


> meho1a said:
> 
> 
> > Point22 said:
> ...




I dont see myself ever pusing up the shadows for 5 stops. 
Can you judge how it does for example at 2 stops in comparison to other cameras like 5D mk4 oc 80D?


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## Point22 (Jul 27, 2017)

meho1a said:


> Point22 said:
> 
> 
> > meho1a said:
> ...


 2 stops?? So how 80D  easily


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## mahdi_mak2000 (Jul 27, 2017)

the last time that I was more disappointed of my purchase was when I used the doll catching machine.


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## mahdi_mak2000 (Jul 27, 2017)

Point22 said:


> Two days with me



how AF work with this tamron. plz dont tell me they have compatibility issue...


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## candyman (Jul 27, 2017)

Just to clarify: picked up my Canon 6D MK II this morning and it comes with firmware 1.0.2


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## Point22 (Jul 27, 2017)

mahdi_mak2000 said:


> Point22 said:
> 
> 
> > Two days with me
> ...


 He has compatibility issue but with SP 70-200di VC USD and only in LiveView mode ( new firmware fixed this issue ) .. Same as 80D ( DPAF ) 
With 24-70 it is not problem


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## candyman (Jul 27, 2017)

mahdi_mak2000 said:


> Point22 said:
> 
> 
> > Two days with me
> ...




I also confirm - no compatibility issue.
The AF outer focus points respond well. 
However, it is not tested *on the AF outer focus points* with continuous shooting in AI servo on a fast moving subject. That was the real challenge for the Tamron 24-70 f/2.8 VC G1. I have to look into that.


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## mnclayshooter (Jul 27, 2017)

gts said:


> mnclayshooter said:
> 
> 
> > Point22 said:
> ...




Got it, thanks. I tried about 3 different times yesterday to download the manual, and the transfer would stall and fail each time.


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## jeffa4444 (Jul 27, 2017)

I'm at work and my wife has text to say the 6D MKII has just arrived. First time Ive bought a camera on launch day but my 6D has been such a great camera and would have been greater with more AF points and the flippy screen for very low tripod shots that it was an easy decision for me especially as I already have the 5DS. 

Tests tomorrow on the High Resolution CIPA chart.


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## infared (Jul 27, 2017)

Talys said:


> that1guyy said:
> 
> 
> > Are people actually excited about this camera?
> ...


No DR improvement but you get a jacket AND a shirt. I AM IN!!!!!


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## Luds34 (Jul 27, 2017)

jeffa4444 said:


> I'm at work and my wife has text to say the 6D MKII has just arrived. First time Ive bought a camera on launch day but my 6D has been such a great camera and would have been greater with more AF points and the flippy screen for very low tripod shots that it was an easy decision for me especially as I already have the 5DS.
> 
> Tests tomorrow on the High Resolution CIPA chart.



Ditto, my first pre-order jump on the bandwagon right away too. All the extra cross type focus points is the big reason I upgraded as well. Of course I just got my shipping confirmation and it is not expect to arrive until next Tuesday. :'(

Ahh well, what's a few more days. Have fun with the new toy!


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## rrcphoto (Jul 27, 2017)

Andreos said:


> I'm planning to upgrade my 6D alright ... to a nice used Nikon D750. Canon can take their sensor banding, their amp glow, their crap dynamic range, their insulting marketing segmentation games, and shove them all where the sun don't shine.




always have to love the new users come in and say the same thing.. seeya? have fun dealing with the shutter recall there.

especially with a used D750


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## LonelyBoy (Jul 27, 2017)

bergstrom said:


> No 4K and this article on canonrumours
> 
> http://www.canonrumors.com/canon-eos-6d-mark-ii-dynamic-range-talk-sample-images/
> 
> was enough for me to hold off and hope the 5d5 with 4k (or even 6k) and better compression of video files will deliver the goods.



If you're after 6k and high-quality video compression, why don't you just buy a video camera? That seems like it would fit your needs better. The 5D5 is unlikely to appear for quite some time.


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## wildwalker (Jul 27, 2017)

LonelyBoy said:


> bergstrom said:
> 
> 
> > No 4K and this article on canonrumours
> ...



Yes, you would expect the rumours of a 5DMk5 (or possibly a new line, as Canon numbers are starting to overlap) to be in around 3 years.


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## wildwalker (Jul 27, 2017)

Hope you all enjoy the new 6K Mk2, can't wait to hear your feedback.


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## RiceCanon (Jul 27, 2017)

I was so excited to upgrade my 6D to the Mark ii until I saw the dynamic range tests. Canon included the other features I wanted to see but DR is a very important factor for me and the reality that 4 or 5 years later Canon takes a step backward with DR in the Mark ii is just inexcusable. 4 or 5 years on EVERY feature to a follow on model should be absolutely a lot better. This is a technology product! 4-5 years is an eternity in the tech world. 
This is a company that acts like they have no competition out there. Really dumb! I'm not planning on buying this camera now. So disappointed in Canon.


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## infared (Jul 27, 2017)

jayt567 said:


> infared said:
> 
> 
> > Talys said:
> ...



Not complaining...notice smiley face please!....just thought is was funny. I was joking around. Is that allowed? I am sure that the 6D II is a fine camera, as are the Nikons..etc...etc..etc.. If you have a good shot...they all work.
(supposedly have a 5D IV??????? I have a 5DIII also...and a trove of MFT gear which is GREAT, too!!!! Maybe you need to disconnect your identity from your camera?????) Have a fun day!
;D


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## TeT (Jul 27, 2017)

Andreos said:


> weixing said:
> 
> 
> > Sensor banding & amp glow?? I never seen them in my Canon. Anyway, good luck with your Nikon D750... make sure check your Nikon D750 shutter had been fixed if the serial number fall into the latest recall range.
> ...



What a dork Troll.


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## Don Haines (Jul 27, 2017)

jayt567 said:


> Anyway, not sure what you meant by the identity comment but if you are referring to the camera under my user name, never used a power shot camera and haven't found a way to change that. Enjoy all your gear!



The camera under your name is based on how many times that you have posted. With more posts, it changes to a more expensive camera, and then to expensive lenses. The only question I have with it is how long before Neuro gets "hubble space telescope" under his name.......


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## RiceCanon (Jul 27, 2017)

jayt567 said:


> RiceCanon said:
> 
> 
> > I was so excited to upgrade my 6D to the Mark ii until I saw the dynamic range tests. Canon included the other features I wanted to see but DR is a very important factor for me and the reality that 4 or 5 years later Canon takes a step backward with DR in the Mark ii is just inexcusable. 4 or 5 years on EVERY feature to a follow on model should be absolutely a lot better. This is a technology product! 4-5 years is an eternity in the tech world.
> ...



Nope. After 4 to 5 years since the release of the 6D and its sensor I expect meaningful improvement in every respect to the updated sensor. This doesn't appear to be what Canon is delivering. That's just very disappointing to me and gives me a lot of pause.


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## Deepboy (Jul 27, 2017)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeezLCMWt10

Minute 2:14 comment?


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## Jack Douglas (Jul 27, 2017)

RiceCanon said:


> I was so excited to upgrade my 6D to the Mark ii until I saw the dynamic range tests. Canon included the other features I wanted to see but DR is a very important factor for me and the reality that 4 or 5 years later Canon takes a step backward with DR in the Mark ii is just inexcusable. 4 or 5 years on EVERY feature to a follow on model should be absolutely a lot better. This is a technology product! 4-5 years is an eternity in the tech world.
> This is a company that acts like they have no competition out there. Really dumb! I'm not planning on buying this camera now. So disappointed in Canon.



I know the feeling - had a 386, then a 486, then a Pentium, wow, and then ... Hmm something began to happen that just wasn't as impressive.  But the prices - considering what you get - now that was nice. We're spoiled IMHO.

Jack


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## Jack Douglas (Jul 27, 2017)

Epaminonda said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeezLCMWt10
> 
> Minute 2:14 comment?



Bluetooth, phone in hand. It couldn't be easier and that's great ... until the wind blows the tripod over. 

So they say the 6D2 is going to be a flop, do they?  Canon executives are not dumb. 

Jack


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## Jack Douglas (Jul 27, 2017)

I like that: "disconnect your identity from your camera". However, it's probably of the heads of those who need to relate to it. 

Jack


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## x-vision (Jul 27, 2017)

RiceCanon said:


> I was so excited to upgrade my 6D to the Mark ii until I saw the dynamic range tests. Canon included the other features I wanted to see but DR is a very important factor for me ...



My experience exactly. 

The 6DII is spec'd very well for its intended buyers, IMO, and the price will only get better over time. 
However, the dynamic range issue is the fly in the ointment for me. 

But for those who aren't bothered by that, I'm sure that the 6DII will be terrific.


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## x-vision (Jul 27, 2017)

jayt567 said:


> In reality, if you hadn't read any reviews and purchased the camera you would have been happy as a clam with it.



Do you really believe that 6DII buyers are that stupid??

Well, speak for yourself.


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## SteveM (Jul 27, 2017)

I think it is very 'canny' what they have offered, you look at the pluses and it is a very tempting camera; fps, resolution, af, tilting screen - they just haven't given up all they have to give. No surprise, they are a business after all (and very successful). Acutely frustrating for some but Canon (and Nikon) have operated like this for many years. The original 5D to mkll gave us mp and better high noise but left us with a not so great af and low fps. Nikon, sadly, have taken to reducing features on the D7200 - 7500; taken away one card slot, taken away the contacts for a battery grip. I expect the replacement for the D750 to go a similar way. Enjoy the camera everybody, there are workarounds for the DR issue, but none to increase fps and a much better af. it is a very good camera, you just can't have all the contents of the goodie bag all at once.
Can anyone guess what the selling points of the 6D mklll will be? ........yup, you got it, class leading DR and ISO invariance.....+ 4K for those who want it.
The DR issue frustrates me as well by the way, but if I had a 6D I'd upgrade to this mkll - like I say, a very 'canny' move from Canon, you have to applaud them for that.
Enjoy the camera.


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## derekmccoy (Jul 27, 2017)

Point22 said:


> + local adjustments.. Is this no simple fot postprocessing but with skills everything goes



That banding wouldn't have happened with the 6D...
I'm afraid the Mark II is a downgrade for landscape or anyone doing heavy shadow lifting.


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## Jack Douglas (Jul 27, 2017)

Well stated SteveM. People who get the jitters due to other peoples comments should reconsider and do their own real life evaluation because many of the comments are spec sheet based and don't represent 90% of reality. 

Some people if offered a plane ride to heaven would start fretting about what seat on the plane they would have. Then presumably they'd find some complaint about their destination!  

I'll be overjoyed if the price drops before spring.

Jack


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## hbr (Jul 27, 2017)

Jack Douglas said:


> Epaminonda said:
> 
> 
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeezLCMWt10
> ...



From that height if the tripod fell over, I think the camera would be a smash.


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## Jack Douglas (Jul 27, 2017)

I read CR for the humour or is it humor! Yes, the 6D2 is going to be a smash hit. 

Jack


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## stevelee (Jul 27, 2017)

Don Haines said:


> jayt567 said:
> 
> 
> > Anyway, not sure what you meant by the identity comment but if you are referring to the camera under my user name, never used a power shot camera and haven't found a way to change that. Enjoy all your gear!
> ...



That's interesting. The last message of mine I saw, it had the G7X, a camera I really do have in the Mark II incarnation, so I wouldn't have guessed it as a forum status thing.


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## Channone (Jul 27, 2017)

For those who do Astrophotography the tilty-flippy screen should be a big win. No more heating up of the sensor with Live View.


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## Jack Douglas (Jul 27, 2017)

Channone said:


> For those who do Astrophotography the tilty-flippy screen should be a big win. No more heating up of the sensor with Live View.



Some time back I bought the a motorized tracker for star shots and was quite frustrated with being out in the winter cold on my knees looking up. So, I kind of abandoned that activity but now I think the new 6D2 will be helpful.

Jack


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## EduPortas (Jul 27, 2017)

Everyone's bashing the new 6D while I happily wait for the original release to come down in price.

I was a previous owner of that model back in 2014 (sold due to financial reasons) and can

honestly say it remains a superb product. Beautiful FF aesthetic for a more or less decent price is a medium sized-body.

Yeah yeah it has practically one really good centered AF point, so what?

For serious AF work I use my 7D mark II and rip 10fps. 

Video? Nah. Why would I buy a newer body with a tilt screen when I doesn't have a headphone jack?

Again, for that I'm using my 7D mark II which has mic and headphone jacks and also DPAF.

Cheers.


----------



## testthewest (Jul 27, 2017)

jayt567 said:


> RiceCanon said:
> 
> 
> > I was so excited to upgrade my 6D to the Mark ii until I saw the dynamic range tests. Canon included the other features I wanted to see but DR is a very important factor for me and the reality that 4 or 5 years later Canon takes a step backward with DR in the Mark ii is just inexcusable. 4 or 5 years on EVERY feature to a follow on model should be absolutely a lot better. This is a technology product! 4-5 years is an eternity in the tech world.
> ...



You know him or what? He said DR is impoprtant to him. If he buy the 6D Mark2 coming from a 6D and the chart is telling the truth, then he will not see any improvement in the DR with his new camera. Even a clam can realize when things stay the same.

Btw: I had the 6D II on preorder until I saw this DR disaster. I am sorry, but I at least expected similar DR like the 5D IV, instead you get something slightly worse than the previous model. Not cool. And yes, I didn't care for 4K or even the autofocus spread. But getting an old tech sensor is not worth 2K$ to me.


----------



## Yasko (Jul 27, 2017)

jayt567 said:


> Channone said:
> 
> 
> > For those who do Astrophotography the tilty-flippy screen should be a big win. No more heating up of the sensor with Live View.
> ...



:-X

Now think again about what you just wrote...
Yes you still need LV, but the heat source (display) is tilted away from the camera, thus introducing significantly less heat into the camera body.

gn8


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 27, 2017)

EduPortas said:


> Everyone's bashing the new 6D while I happily wait for the original release to come down in price.
> 
> I was a previous owner of that model back in 2014 (sold due to financial reasons) and can
> 
> ...



Makes sense to me. You can see what I've accomplished with the 6D the last 4 years. On the other hand, I sold it only a couple weeks ago and will get the 6D2 when prices hopefully drop and that also makes sense to me. My wife will be very happy with this, trust me. In other words we all have our needs, desires and restrictions and end up doing what's best for #1. However, I know such commentary doesn't make for very exciting debating on CR. 

Jack


----------



## LonelyBoy (Jul 27, 2017)

Yasko said:


> jayt567 said:
> 
> 
> > Channone said:
> ...



I thought the major source of sensor heat in LV was the sensor itself, constantly reading and writing frames.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Jul 27, 2017)

LonelyBoy said:


> Yasko said:
> 
> 
> > jayt567 said:
> ...



It is, but technical knowledge evidently isn't everyone's strong suit.


----------



## Don Haines (Jul 27, 2017)

Channone said:


> For those who do Astrophotography the tilty-flippy screen should be a big win. No more heating up of the sensor with Live View.



actually..... Those who do astrophotography tend towards long exposures, and the screen is dark for those anyway....


----------



## Don Haines (Jul 27, 2017)

bluetooth on the 6D2..... does it couple to bluetooth speakers or microphone?


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 27, 2017)

Am I wrong? Didn't the initial stink about the DR of this camera peg it at around 9 and state it to be worse than the 6D? The Trusted Reviews review displays a curve with ISO 50 yielding DR = 12.2 and stating it exceeds the 6D.

http://www.trustedreviews.com/reviews/canon-eos-6d-mark-ii-performance-image-quality-verdict

So what's happening here, or is it apples vs. oranges again?

Jack


----------



## daphins (Jul 27, 2017)

Wait, there was a moratorium on selling them? I picked mine up on Monday :-\

ANYWAY, I LOVE the new camera. I'm coming from a 60D, so the full frame, DPAF, AF, and Touch Screen are enough to put me in 6D MKII heaven. I haven't had much time with it at this point, but I'm excited! Sure, I'd love 4K and better HDR, but at the end of the day, it's good enough for what I'll be using it for.


----------



## Don Haines (Jul 27, 2017)

Jack Douglas said:


> Am I wrong? Didn't the initial stink about the DR of this camera peg it at around 9 and state it to be worse than the 6D? The Trusted Reviews review displays a curve with ISO 50 yielding DR = 12.2 and stating it exceeds the 6D.
> 
> http://www.trustedreviews.com/reviews/canon-eos-6d-mark-ii-performance-image-quality-verdict
> 
> ...


As said repeatedly ( and few seemed to listen) never believe reviews, good or bad, until you have multiple confirmation from respected sources using cameras bought as retail units. Let's wait and see what happens here....


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 27, 2017)

Don, I'm the happy to wait type of guy but obviously lots of reviewers jumped the gun and dumped all over this camera. But why should I care, other than I think of myself as liking to represent fairness and honest dealings and don't like the stench of folk like Donald T!


----------



## EduPortas (Jul 27, 2017)

Jack Douglas said:


> EduPortas said:
> 
> 
> > Everyone's bashing the new 6D while I happily wait for the original release to come down in price.
> ...



Yep, you're correct. I'm still optimistic that the newer camera will have better S/R processing. 

The original model is no slouch, so any improvement there would be an eye-opener.


----------



## Don Haines (Jul 27, 2017)

Jack Douglas said:


> Don, I'm the happy to wait type of guy but obviously lots of reviewers jumped the gun and dumped all over this camera. But why should I care, other than I think of myself as liking to represent fairness and honest dealings and don't like the stench of folk like Donald T!



I try to wait and be fair too. I find that the truth is usually in the middle and not at the extreme viewpoints. As to camera reviews, I work in a research lab..... results must be verifiable and repeatable, and the only way to characterize a commercial product is to go get one from the shelf, and not one cherry picked by the manufacturer. When I test something, the report contains a detailed report as to how the tests were performed and even lists model numbers and serial numbers of test equipment as well as the last calibration dates/data, this is very different from sites like DXO with their secret rating system.


----------



## CanonGuy (Jul 28, 2017)

I'm member of a few fb Photographer groups (Mastin, VSCO, looks like film, slr lounge etc.). Before someone bashes these group, FYI, these groups have the most popular wedding photographers of the entire world (saying this because I know some members of this group lives in the cave and disrespects/dont count these groups. Yes cave people still exists and apparently they have big mouth lol).

There has been at least 20 different posts in these groups about 6d2. I'm very pleased to see the general disappointment towards Canon in these groups. I hope Canon will learn a lesson this time. Hopefully d850 and a7riii are released soon. I'm keeping my 5d3 and 6d till then. 

Then adios to Canon.


----------



## privatebydesign (Jul 28, 2017)

CanonGuy said:


> I'm member of a few fb Photographer groups (Mastin, VSCO, looks like film, slr lounge etc.). Before someone bashes these group, FYI, these groups have the most popular wedding photographers of the entire world (saying this because I know some members of this group lives in the cave and disrespects/dont count these groups. Yes cave people still exists and apparently they have big mouth lol).
> 
> There has been at least 20 different posts in these groups about 6d2. I'm very pleased to see the general disappointment towards Canon in these groups. I hope Canon will learn a lesson this time. Hopefully d850 and a7riii are released soon. I'm keeping my 5d3 and 6d till then.
> 
> Then adios to Canon.



And how many of those people have already used the camera at several weddings and posted illustrative images showing exactly where the 6D MkII is failing them?

Adios...... :


----------



## LarsCS (Jul 28, 2017)

Ordered it and will receive it on Tuesday.


----------



## CanonGuy (Jul 28, 2017)

privatebydesign said:


> CanonGuy said:
> 
> 
> > I'm member of a few fb Photographer groups (Mastin, VSCO, looks like film, slr lounge etc.). Before someone bashes these group, FYI, these groups have the most popular wedding photographers of the entire world (saying this because I know some members of this group lives in the cave and disrespects/dont count these groups. Yes cave people still exists and apparently they have big mouth lol).
> ...



I still can shoot a full wedding with 5d mk ii and get excellent result. But that's not an excuse or reson for Canon to be idiotic with their sensor. A sensor is a main part of the camera. And everyone expects that to be better in the next version of a body. Every other vendors are doing that and showing that on the face of canon. 

This inability and cash grab mentality of canon is what irritates me. that's why decided to not support them anymore.

will the 6d2 DR be enough for me? Certainly! Will the other vendors put out bodies with better DR in the same price range? Certainly, too. So why would I pay canon? I will always support the company who innovates and has less cash grab mentality. Exactly why I am replacing all my canon glasses to art. gradually.


----------



## jmoya (Jul 28, 2017)

Ok. So I got my 6d mark II today. It's badass... only one problem. Lightroom isn't ready for it and Raw files won't open. Lightroom can't read them. So I called canon. Tech told me Lightroom won't have the plug ready for several weeks to a month. So till then you have to use canons editing software. Also, i used the last free Lightroom before the creative cloud version with my 5d3. Now I'll have to pay for the creative cloud version. Double bummer? Camera is sick though.


----------



## privatebydesign (Jul 28, 2017)

jmoya said:


> Ok. So I got my 6d mark II today. It's badass... only one problem. Lightroom isn't ready for it and Raw files won't open. Lightroom can't read them. So I called canon. Tech told me Lightroom won't have the plug ready for several weeks to a month. So till then you have to use canons editing software. Also, i used the last free Lightroom before the creative cloud version with my 5d3. Now I'll have to pay for the creative cloud version. Double bummer? Camera is sick though.



Don't you love it when you contact a supposed expert and they talk sh!t?

Adobe Camera RAW 9.12 opens 6D MkII files.

https://helpx.adobe.com/camera-raw/kb/camera-raw-plug-supported-cameras.html#Canon


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 28, 2017)

I hope the camera isn't sick! 

Jack


----------



## privatebydesign (Jul 28, 2017)

CanonGuy said:


> privatebydesign said:
> 
> 
> > CanonGuy said:
> ...



So in answer to my question, none.... : : :


----------



## Yasko (Jul 28, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> LonelyBoy said:
> 
> 
> > Yasko said:
> ...



Lol you're right... didnt think about the sensor :-X.
Well but cooling might still be better as the body is less thick
:-X


----------



## Andreos (Jul 28, 2017)

LonelyBoy said:


> I thought the major source of sensor heat in LV was the sensor itself, constantly reading and writing frames.



You are 100% correct about that.


----------



## Khalai (Jul 28, 2017)

CanonGuy said:


> will the 6d2 DR be enough for me? Certainly! Will the other vendors put out bodies with better DR in the same price range? Certainly, too. So why would I pay canon? I will always support the company who innovates and has less cash grab mentality. Exactly why I am replacing all my canon glasses to art. gradually.



I don't know how about you, but I never pay for DR only. I also pay for great ergonomics and handling, reliability, consistency and good repair and maintenance services. The whole Canon system is very cohesive and reliable. I'm not buying just a sensor in a box.

All companies have cash-grab mentality, it's just Canon is on top, so it's most prominent. Have you seen latest Sony GM lens prices? Almost make L-lenses look like a bargain.

I understand your frustration, I really do. It's a shame that Canon did not improved 6D II in DR deparment, while they certainly have the means to do so. And? Big deal, just skip that body altogether. If your 6D serves you just fine, why change it? Never fix, what ain't broke


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 28, 2017)

Whiners and grovelers in general aren't interested in logical commentary. They just want to kick the cat in frustration and well, whine and grovel.  It is what it is, don't worry, be happy. 

Jack


----------



## dflt (Jul 28, 2017)

Come down to ground. Here is the latest from Canon's 2nd quarter:

"Within the Imaging System Business Unit, although sales volume of interchangeable-lens digital cameras
**declined compared with the previous year, owing to the shrinking market**, unit sales of compact-system
cameras, including the newly launched EOS M6, increased from the same period of previous year, allowing
Canon to maintain the top share in major countries in Europe, the U.S. and Japan"

And ppl. expect that a 6DMK2 will have 4K, 30Mpix and other 5dMKIV rivaling features. Well it's a shrinking market, so they maximize profits.

We'll see what did Sony/Nikon achieve on the 1st/3rd of August.


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 28, 2017)

dflt said:


> Come down to ground. Here is the latest from Canon's 2nd quarter:
> 
> "Within the Imaging System Business Unit, although sales volume of interchangeable-lens digital cameras
> **declined compared with the previous year, owing to the shrinking market**, unit sales of compact-system
> ...



Yes and Sony/Nikon are just going to give all their features away for free on the upcoming cameras. The cameras will have twice the features and cost half as much and the companies will be twice as profitable and provide better service to boot with half the number of emplyees. ;D ;D ;D It's another version of the new math.

Jack


----------



## Confused Man (Jul 28, 2017)

Jack Douglas said:


> Am I wrong? Didn't the initial stink about the DR of this camera peg it at around 9 and state it to be worse than the 6D? The Trusted Reviews review displays a curve with ISO 50 yielding DR = 12.2 and stating it exceeds the 6D.
> 
> http://www.trustedreviews.com/reviews/canon-eos-6d-mark-ii-performance-image-quality-verdict
> 
> ...



It turns out that a mistake might have been made with the original 6D data and that Trusted Reviews are now planning to do a re-test - please see link below with a response from Trusted Reviews:

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/59890647


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 28, 2017)

Yes, that glimmer of hope may fade.

Jack


----------



## LonelyBoy (Jul 28, 2017)

Confused Man said:


> Jack Douglas said:
> 
> 
> > Am I wrong? Didn't the initial stink about the DR of this camera peg it at around 9 and state it to be worse than the 6D? The Trusted Reviews review displays a curve with ISO 50 yielding DR = 12.2 and stating it exceeds the 6D.
> ...



But of course, no one is going to pay attention to this part:

"In real-world use I did find there to be more than enough leverage to pull back detail from shadowed regions, albeit not quite as impressive as the EOS 5D Mark IV."


----------



## Pax2You (Jul 28, 2017)

privatebydesign said:


> jmoya said:
> 
> 
> > Ok. So I got my 6d mark II today. It's badass... only one problem. Lightroom isn't ready for it and Raw files won't open. Lightroom can't read them. So I called canon. Tech told me Lightroom won't have the plug ready for several weeks to a month. So till then you have to use canons editing software. Also, i used the last free Lightroom before the creative cloud version with my 5d3. Now I'll have to pay for the creative cloud version. Double bummer? Camera is sick though.
> ...



Yes a but I have LR 5.7 so DPP is all I get for now. I will resist grumbling about Adobe and their cash grabbing. Others will support it soon enough.......


----------



## LonelyBoy (Jul 28, 2017)

CanonGuy said:


> I'm member of a few fb Photographer groups (Mastin, VSCO, looks like film, slr lounge etc.). Before someone bashes these group, FYI, these groups have the most popular wedding photographers of the entire world (saying this because I know some members of this group lives in the cave and disrespects/dont count these groups. Yes cave people still exists and apparently they have big mouth lol).
> 
> There has been at least 20 different posts in these groups about 6d2. I'm very pleased to see the general disappointment towards Canon in these groups. I hope Canon will learn a lesson this time. Hopefully d850 and a7riii are released soon. I'm keeping my 5d3 and 6d till then.
> 
> Then adios to Canon.



Why not sell your two bodies and pick up a 5D4? That seems easier than switching brands and selling everything.

Of course, what I think you'll actually do is not get the 5D4, not switch to Nikon or Sony, and just hang around and whine about Canon.


----------



## LonelyBoy (Jul 28, 2017)

Pax2You said:


> privatebydesign said:
> 
> 
> > jmoya said:
> ...



Then you were wrong and don't "have the last version before the CC version" (in the sense that you can get 6.X without CC, anyway), and you don't "have to pay for the CC version" (at least in the sense of using CC, you can just get a standalone perpetual license for 6.X).

Come on, you spent $2000 on a camera body and you're balking at less than $100 on upgrading to the new version of LR to work with it? And you're blaming it on your unwillingness to switch to CC, which you don't have to do? Really?


----------



## LesC (Jul 28, 2017)

Even if Trusted Reviews got the DR figure for the original 6D wrong, their measurement for the 6D MKII at iso 100 is 12.2 whereas DPR's chart shows it as 9.11. So has someone got it wrong?


----------



## Khalai (Jul 28, 2017)

LonelyBoy said:


> "In real-world use I did find there to be more than enough leverage to pull back detail from shadowed regions, albeit not quite as impressive as the EOS 5D Mark IV."



Why would they? It does not fit into "Canon has only 12 EV DR, therefore Canon is *******" propaganda


----------



## Khalai (Jul 28, 2017)

LesC said:


> Even if Trusted Reviews got the DR figure for the original 6D wrong, their measurement for the 6D MKII at iso 100 is 12.2 whereas DPR's chart shows it as 9.11. So has someone got it wrong?



If they measure it in different manner, those result are not directly comparable.


----------



## LesC (Jul 28, 2017)

For those who now have their 6D MKII - is the GPS function the same as the original 6D ie when you turn the camera off does the GPS still drain the battery unless of course you remove it?


----------



## wildwalker (Jul 28, 2017)

x-vision said:


> RiceCanon said:
> 
> 
> > I was so excited to upgrade my 6D to the Mark ii until I saw the dynamic range tests. Canon included the other features I wanted to see but DR is a very important factor for me ...
> ...



I know the feeling, but looking at some videos where people are using for real images, the camera seems to work really well, especially at high ISO. Those tests were about pushing three stops from blacks, do we do that all the time? They don't seem to be particularly real world tests.

The High ISO performance is very good though. 

If you are that worried, do what I did, I purchased a 5DMk4 from overseas, it arrived in 4 days and only cost me £360 more than the 6DMk2, which I did have pre-ordered, but a deal like that for the 5 was too tempting. I got the 5 today and hardly have time to finis...


----------



## jeffa4444 (Jul 28, 2017)

derekmccoy said:


> Point22 said:
> 
> 
> > + local adjustments.. Is this no simple fot postprocessing but with skills everything goes
> ...


You are joking right? The 6D is a great camera but to state it would not have presented banding is nonsense its one of its weaknesses.


----------



## jmoya (Jul 28, 2017)

So I guess there's no way around it. If I want to edit in lightroom with the 6d mark II I nee to buy the latest lightroom CC? My canon 5d III was doing just fine on lightroom 5 non CC version. There's the other hiccup. I was so upset yesterday getting the new camera in and not being to import files to see them for post.


----------



## Takingshots (Jul 28, 2017)

Folks at Canon esp. public relation dept needs to address some of the concerns to ease the anxiety to those who have waited and want to upgrade 6DMKii. This is the right thing to do. ... Put the concerns to rest > what can be fixed or upgraded and what cannot be done because of the specifications(limits).


----------



## jeffa4444 (Jul 28, 2017)

Don Haines said:


> Jack Douglas said:
> 
> 
> > Don, I'm the happy to wait type of guy but obviously lots of reviewers jumped the gun and dumped all over this camera. But why should I care, other than I think of myself as liking to represent fairness and honest dealings and don't like the stench of folk like Donald T!
> ...


Don I couldn't agree more. Even high end movie cameras from blue chip Japanese companies show variances from one camera to another in DR and other parameters. We also calibrate our devices and have independent verification on a regular prescribed basis and like you feel DXO methods are flawed. We test lenses on and off axis on the MTF, project lenses and measure how accurately the f or T stops are. Cameras & lenses are tested independently of each other and on the camera and all serial numbers are recorded. Finally we shoot subject matter and charts and can view these in a theatre if needed. 
Our staff are trained at the manufacturers and we have the tooling to make changes or repairs in-house and have been doing so for over fifty years (yes back in the film days). 
As manufacturers ourselves we cannot afford to be anything but as precise as we can be reputations depend on it. 

Whilst Ive not had the time today to test the 6D MKII I will be and reserve judgement until then (for fun not for work).


----------



## LesC (Jul 28, 2017)

Takingshots said:


> Folks at Canon esp. public relation dept needs to address some of the concerns to ease the anxiety to those who have waited and want to upgrade 6DMKii. This is the right thing to do. ... Put the concerns to rest > what can be fixed or upgraded and what cannot be done because of the specifications(limits).



I'm sure they won't because a) that would be to admit there were shortcomings and b) I and expect Canon too don't see there's any need too.

Whenever a new camera comes out, there's always some people who will moan, it doesn't have this or that but for the people it's aimed at (and I include myself as one of those), it will be perfectly fine and an improvement over the original 6D. I mean, look at the shots earlier in this thread where a shot under exposed by 5 stops was recovered pretty well. I've never underexposed a shot intentionally or not by that much!

Whether the DR of the 6D MKII is the same as or slightly better/worse than the original _in theory_ is not important to me; what happens in the real world is. And as for DPR's claim that it's worse than the 80D, I just don't see it - I have the 80D and the original 6D and the 6D blows the 80D away no trouble. So the new 6D would have to be a hell of a lot worse for the 80D to beat it.


----------



## stevelee (Jul 28, 2017)

LesC said:


> For those who now have their 6D MKII - is the GPS function the same as the original 6D ie when you turn the camera off does the GPS still drain the battery unless of course you remove it?



I haven't bought or ordered the 6D2 yet, but I have been reading the manual as well as online stuff. I seem to recall that if the camera times out and turns itself off, the GPS is still at work and draining battery. If you switch the camera off manually, the GPS turns off, too. I am only reasonably certain that I saw that somewhere, but it seems like it was a caution in the manual.


----------



## bc29 (Jul 28, 2017)

jmoya said:


> So I guess there's no way around it. If I want to edit in lightroom with the 6d mark II I nee to buy the latest lightroom CC? My canon 5d III was doing just fine on lightroom 5 non CC version. There's the other hiccup. I was so upset yesterday getting the new camera in and not being to import files to see them for post.



Adobe updated their website to indicate the 6D mk II is supported in their standalone Lightroom 6, if updated to version 6.12. 

https://helpx.adobe.com/camera-raw/kb/camera-raw-plug-supported-cameras.html

The upgrade from any prior Lightroom version to Lightroom 6 should be USD $79.


----------



## privatebydesign (Jul 28, 2017)

LesC said:


> For those who now have their 6D MKII - is the GPS function the same as the original 6D ie when you turn the camera off does the GPS still drain the battery unless of course you remove it?



Page 143 of the manual. The GPS has the two modes the 1DX MKII has, you can set it to always keep GPS connected or have it power down when you turn the power switch off.

I use Mode 2.


----------



## LesC (Jul 28, 2017)

@privatebydesign Excellent, thanks


----------



## jeffa4444 (Jul 28, 2017)

I can confirm the above just set that up in my camera. Big improvement over the 6D as it drained the battery. 

Another good reason for the upgrade for Landscape shooters.


----------



## Pax2You (Jul 28, 2017)

LonelyBoy said:


> Pax2You said:
> 
> 
> > privatebydesign said:
> ...



LonelyBoy. Drink a bit more java and follow the names. I believe you assumed I'm jmoya. Regardless, adding a camera profile to existing versions of lightroom is a piece of cake for adobe. As I stated in my post, I'm not interested in signing on to their monthly fee program. I have other software for RAW conversion that will work fine.


----------



## privatebydesign (Jul 28, 2017)

Pax2You said:


> LonelyBoy said:
> 
> 
> > Pax2You said:
> ...



You bashed Adobe, a common sport around here, for not supporting an older version of their software. In fact they do, they have the free DNG convertor that enables you to retain your .CR2 and lets LR 5 open 6D MkII files. Adobe go above and beyond many software companies in their efforts to enable people to use old software with their new cameras and still not sign up for monthly payments.

How easy or difficult it is for them to keep supporting your old software has to be weighed up against why should they bother if you are not part of their revenue stream? If it is a legal copy you spend around $100 several years ago, they don't care about you as a customer because you aren't one.


----------



## LonelyBoy (Jul 28, 2017)

Pax2You said:


> LonelyBoy said:
> 
> 
> > Pax2You said:
> ...



Indeed I did. Nonetheless, my point stands - you are not required to sign up for CC to get LR6 and support for current cameras. No monthly fee, just a $79 upgrade charge. Now, you're free to carry on with other software, but please stop repeating this falsehood that you have to sign up for the monthly fees to get LR6. We have too many unchecked falsehoods running around these days already.


----------



## Pax2You (Jul 28, 2017)

Bashing adobe may be common sport, but I simply said I wasn't interested in the way they do business. LR 6 is a temporary fix until they choose only to update CC. CC is reasonably priced only so long as it stays reasonably priced. It is up to adobe and their business model and not our input. I like to pay for things outright and I have moved on to other software as I noted in my original post. LonelyBoy you don't know me but you sure were ready to jump down my throat. Privatebydesign you are right. I am not part of adobe's current revenue stream.


----------



## jmoya (Jul 28, 2017)

privatebydesign said:


> Pax2You said:
> 
> 
> > LonelyBoy said:
> ...


----------



## LonelyBoy (Jul 28, 2017)

Pax2You said:


> Bashing adobe may be common sport, but I simply said I wasn't interested in the way they do business. LR 6 is a temporary fix until they choose only to update CC. CC is reasonably priced only so long as it stays reasonably priced. It is up to adobe and their business model and not our input. I like to pay for things outright and I have moved on to other software as I noted in my original post. LonelyBoy you don't know me but you sure were ready to jump down my throat. Privatebydesign you are right. I am not part of adobe's current revenue stream.



Yes, I jumped down your throat. I'm going to jump down your throat again.

You are acting like a petulant child throwing a tantrum. LR6 is and was available for standalone purchase, so if you chose to not get the new version to support new cameras, that's because you chose not to, not because you don't like CC (I don't either). If you moved on to other software because of that or whatever other real reason, great! However, when you say "I have LR5.7 so DPP is all I get for now", _I don't believe you've really moved on_. If you had, you wouldn't care that 5.7 doesn't support the latest cameras, because you wouldn't have even tried to use it. If you don't want to support Adobe, that's great, but then you don't also get to whine that they aren't giving you updates when you also aren't a customer.

Either (actually) move on to the new software, pay Adobe the one-time fee for the upgrade, or use the various workarounds. Whichever you do, _stop whining_. No one, not Adobe, not Canon, and not me, has put you into the unreasonable situation you're claiming to be in.


----------



## snappy604 (Jul 28, 2017)

rants and frustrations aside..

have any of the forum members recvieved their 6d mk ii yet and have some RAWs to play with? any comments?


----------



## Khalai (Jul 28, 2017)

snappy604 said:


> rants and frustrations aside..
> 
> have any of the forum members recvieved their 6d mk ii yet and have some RAWs to play with? any comments?



There are plenty members with 6D II, but sadly no CR2 files to play with yet...


----------



## monsieur_elegante (Jul 28, 2017)

Has any members with the 6D II already happen to try and see if old 6D L-brackets would still work? I have a nice RRS L-bracket that I'd be sad to need to replace. I'm not counting on it to work with the 6D II, but still...


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## Pax2You (Jul 28, 2017)

Imaging resource had an update on the status of their review saying first shots from a retail unit were posted, but I don't see them
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/canon-6d-mark-ii/canon-6d-mark-iiA.HTM


----------



## Pax2You (Jul 28, 2017)

Sorry. They describe it as a production level camera


----------



## snappy604 (Jul 28, 2017)

Pax2You said:


> Imaging resource had an update on the status of their review saying first shots from a retail unit were posted, but I don't see them
> http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/canon-6d-mark-ii/canon-6d-mark-iiA.HTM



They indicate it was a pre-production model and it was only JPGs... was hoping some forum members might have a raw or two from their production models. Something like a sunny day (high contrast), some low light stuff etc. I tend to recover a lot of shadows and curious to see how it behaves (band shots in dim bars, heavy movement in low light). oh and some high iso in lowish light like 3200 and 6400 

I have the 80d and after learning the differences (quite surprised how images process so differently) it was a nice improvement over my 7d.. but wondering if the 6d mkii would improve enough to go for it. A full frame would remove the crop telephoto factor (tend to be close) and full frame supposedly does better in low light.


----------



## anthonyd (Jul 29, 2017)

I've been waiting for the 6DmII to upgrade to FF coming from a 60D. I'm more than happy with all the features (yes, even with the tightly packed AF points) but I'm curious about the DR. I never lift shadows by 5ev, so this kind of comments are irrelevant to me, but can someone tell me if I'd be able to do better with the pictures I'm attaching?

These were taken with a 60D last month. The light comes from the sun near sunset, with no clouds and no modifiers or reflectors. Unfortunately when I tried to lift the shadows on the left part of the face by more than 1.5ev, or so, I started seeing patchy noise. As a matter of fact, you can see some noise in what I'm attaching already. I did the lifting by producing two versions (+0ev and +1.5ev) of the image in Canon's DPP4 and did the blending in GIMP using masks. The crops are at full resolution (the pp is rotated by 2 degrees too).


----------



## jmoya (Jul 29, 2017)

bc29 said:


> jmoya said:
> 
> 
> > So I guess there's no way around it. If I want to edit in lightroom with the 6d mark II I nee to buy the latest lightroom CC? My canon 5d III was doing just fine on lightroom 5 non CC version. There's the other hiccup. I was so upset yesterday getting the new camera in and not being to import files to see them for post.
> ...


----------



## jmoya (Jul 29, 2017)

bc29 said:


> jmoya said:
> 
> 
> > So I guess there's no way around it. If I want to edit in lightroom with the 6d mark II I nee to buy the latest lightroom CC? My canon 5d III was doing just fine on lightroom 5 non CC version. There's the other hiccup. I was so upset yesterday getting the new camera in and not being to import files to see them for post.
> ...


----------



## Jopa (Jul 29, 2017)

anthonyd said:


> I've been waiting for the 6DmII to upgrade to FF coming from a 60D. I'm more than happy with all the features (yes, even with the tightly packed AF points) but I'm curious about the DR. I never lift shadows by 5ev, so this kind of comments are irrelevant to me, but can someone tell me if I'd be able to do better with the pictures I'm attaching?
> 
> These were taken with a 60D last month. The light comes from the sun near sunset, with no clouds and no modifiers or reflectors. Unfortunately when I tried to lift the shadows on the left part of the face by more than 1.5ev, or so, I started seeing patchy noise. As a matter of fact, you can see some noise in what I'm attaching already. I did the lifting by producing two versions (+0ev and +1.5ev) of the image in Canon's DPP4 and did the blending in GIMP using masks. The crops are at full resolution (the pp is rotated by 2 degrees too).



That's a great photo! It may benefit from processing as pretty much any picture, but the subject is already "cuteness overloaded"  I wouldn't worry much about noise - that's such a negligible thing... If you post the RAW here I bet some folks can process it for you.


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## Talys (Jul 29, 2017)

My camera shop got in their initial shipment of 6D2 today and I picked mine up.

What can I say? It's pretty much _exactly_ what I expected, and it will be perfect for what I need for studio work and fantastic for non-professional hobby use as a versatile, full frame camera that nicely complements my 80D.

I took some test shots with a 24-70 f/4 -- which is going to be on it a lot -- and I love the output, benchmarks be damned one way or the other. High ISO photos are pleasing, on the relative scale of things, though my high ISO photography is nearly nonexistant. The build quality is fantastic, like pretty much every Canon DSLR, and the ergonomics are great -- the 6D2 feels really good in the hand, and the smaller than 5D size is nice. Like other modern Canon DSLRs, there's a very pleasing organization of controls, with just the right amount of tactile feedback and an overall satisfying feel to snapping photos.

Funny thing, by default, it has the guide UI (or whatever it's called) enabled, so when you change exposure modes it tells you, hey, you're in Shutter Priority -- you can go this way to freeze the waterfall, or this way for it to appear flowing! Really? There are people who buy a FF camera who don't understand how exposure modes work? Scary!

The camera comes with an inch thick "booklet" that's titled "Basic Instruction Manual"; I'd hate to see the Advanced one. There's a strap, battery, charger, and warranty card. No CD or USB cables. Enough empty space in the box to stuff in several more 6D2s 

For me, it's pretty much Christmas in July. Very happy with purchase.


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## Jack Douglas (Jul 29, 2017)

Talys, enjoy and don't look back (at negative reviews). 

Jack


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## privatebydesign (Jul 29, 2017)

anthonyd said:


> I've been waiting for the 6DmII to upgrade to FF coming from a 60D. I'm more than happy with all the features (yes, even with the tightly packed AF points) but I'm curious about the DR. I never lift shadows by 5ev, so this kind of comments are irrelevant to me, but can someone tell me if I'd be able to do better with the pictures I'm attaching?



Yes the 6D MkII would do 'better'. 

There will never be any getting around the simple physics of the thing, a ff sensor is more the 2.5 times the size of a Canon APS sensor, that gives you over one stop of noise performance in every shot.


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## Khalai (Jul 29, 2017)

Talys said:


> Funny thing, by default, it has the guide UI (or whatever it's called) enabled, so when you change exposure modes it tells you, hey, you're in Shutter Priority -- you can go this way to freeze the waterfall, or this way for it to appear flowing! Really? There are people who buy a FF camera who don't understand how exposure modes work? Scary!



I'm a regular atendee of a certain landscape photographers meeting and workshop. One time, there came a guy, who had brand new 5D III with 24-105/4L and 70-200/4L IS, all wrapped in boxes. His first humble request was - how do I mount the lens and how do I take photos? Go figure 

Fortunately after two years, he's a regular as well and proficient user, who takes nice imagery. So yeah, UI guide is definitely helpful for some


----------



## Talys (Jul 29, 2017)

Is there any way to get Windows thumbnails of 6D2 RAW files to display? 

DPP works with latest version
Photoshop works with ACR 9.12 update
Lightroom works when updated

Not sure what makes Windows (file explorer) thumbnails to display CR2 contents anymore. It used to be a Codec pack, but all my RAW files have worked without installing anything since Win10.


----------



## LonelyBoy (Jul 29, 2017)

Talys said:


> Funny thing, by default, it has the guide UI (or whatever it's called) enabled, so when you change exposure modes it tells you, hey, you're in Shutter Priority -- you can go this way to freeze the waterfall, or this way for it to appear flowing! Really? There are people who buy a FF camera who don't understand how exposure modes work? Scary!
> 
> The camera comes with an inch thick "booklet" that's titled "Basic Instruction Manual"; I'd hate to see the Advanced one.



It's sorta funny to see these two statements juxtaposed.  There are people for whom the Guide UI will _be_ the manual, and the information is less a bout the photographic instruction part and more about "this is what this control does". Remember that the labels and icons on the buttons aren't exactly intuitive, and there are people who, for whatever reason, will skip crop bodies and go straight to FF, or may get this when they switch to Canon.

Also remember, this will still be the case in a few years, when the price has dropped. If the 6D2 gets down to $1200, for a lot of people that's a tolerable price to toss in the cart when they have a kid, or get a dog, or just want a new hobby.


----------



## testthewest (Jul 29, 2017)

anthonyd said:


> I've been waiting for the 6DmII to upgrade to FF coming from a 60D. I'm more than happy with all the features (yes, even with the tightly packed AF points) but I'm curious about the DR. I never lift shadows by 5ev, so this kind of comments are irrelevant to me, but can someone tell me if I'd be able to do better with the pictures I'm attaching?
> 
> These were taken with a 60D last month. The light comes from the sun near sunset, with no clouds and no modifiers or reflectors. Unfortunately when I tried to lift the shadows on the left part of the face by more than 1.5ev, or so, I started seeing patchy noise. As a matter of fact, you can see some noise in what I'm attaching already. I did the lifting by producing two versions (+0ev and +1.5ev) of the image in Canon's DPP4 and did the blending in GIMP using masks. The crops are at full resolution (the pp is rotated by 2 degrees too).



Well, look at this article: https://www.dpreview.com/articles/3416153698/canon-eos-6d-mark-ii-dynamic-range

There is a test picture in which you can add as much ev as you wish and compare alot of different camera models. While 60D isn't in there, there is the 70D. I just tried the 70D vs 6Dii vs Sony A7rii all with +2ev, and you can see a step up in each of them (in this order). So while you might never use +5ev, the advantage of the sony sensors is on every +ev level. Wheter that matters too you, you will have to decide yourself!


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## Confused Man (Jul 29, 2017)

Takingshots said:


> Folks at Canon esp. public relation dept needs to address some of the concerns to ease the anxiety to those who have waited and want to upgrade 6DMKii. This is the right thing to do. ... Put the concerns to rest > what can be fixed or upgraded and what cannot be done because of the specifications(limits).



I have a theory, well to be honest it's more of a wish than a theory.

Imagine if say during mid 2018 Canon brought out a FF Mirrorless camera with a curved sensor and a bunch of prime lenses that were compatible with this new camera. IF that were to happen then bringing out the 6D Mark ii with improved autofocus but a not much improved sensor MIGHT make sense because you would have the following line up:

7D Mark ii (or even Mark iii) for top of the range APS-C with top of the range autofocus capabilities.
6D Mark ii for entry level FF with good autofocus and OK image quality.
Curved Sensor FF Mirrorless for entry level FF with OK autofocus and excellent image quality (and maybe 4k.)
5D Mark iv for professional level does everything FF
5DS R Mark i (or even Mark ii) for professional level FF with top of the range image quality.

Like I say it's just a theory but I can't imagine that Canon didn't notice the 6D Mark ii sensor wasn't a big step forward so it does make you think (hope) there is a bigger strategy.


----------



## dak723 (Jul 29, 2017)

Confused Man said:


> Takingshots said:
> 
> 
> > Folks at Canon esp. public relation dept needs to address some of the concerns to ease the anxiety to those who have waited and want to upgrade 6DMKii. This is the right thing to do. ... Put the concerns to rest > what can be fixed or upgraded and what cannot be done because of the specifications(limits).
> ...



I have another theory for you. Canon does not believe anything needs to be fixed. Their market research showed that the main features the users wanted to improve on the 6D II were AF and a tilt screen. Their market research showed them that they needed to price the camera as low as possible - definitely under $2,000. Their market research told them that users were completely satisfied (and even more) with the 6D IQ. Their market research showed them that photographers that don't pixel peep had no issues with noise. Their market research showed them that a real photographer doesn't underexpose from 3 to 5 stops, so that type of information is irrelevant. In other words, there should be no anxiety from potential buyers as this camera meets their needs as best as possible at it's price point.


----------



## Confused Man (Jul 29, 2017)

dak723 said:


> Confused Man said:
> 
> 
> > Takingshots said:
> ...



Good theory and no doubt the most accurate theory. 

As a potential buyer of this camera I just wish they had paid a little bit more to the market research company so that the research company could have also asked the question "If our new entry level FF camera has Dynamic Range that is less than one of our cheaper APS-C cameras would you still be interested in buying our new camera."

Anyway the good thing to come from all this is that it has made me realise how good my 7D Mark ii is (with truly excellent autofocus capabilities & apparently the same DR as its new FF cousin) and instead of worrying about moving to FF I should focus on getting the correct lenses that satisfy my APS-C requirements.


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 29, 2017)

One thing that's pretty obvious but still seems to be overlooked by some is this. Telephoto users like reach and so APSC gets acknowledged in that department. Well, wide angle users like wide angles and APSC doesn't fill that bill too well. Two cameras of course does the trick but I for one prefer only hiking with one; that's heavy enough and less clumsy.

Jack


----------



## BillB (Jul 29, 2017)

Confused Man said:


> dak723 said:
> 
> 
> > Confused Man said:
> ...



Well, we don't know what Canon market research did or didn't ask potential buyers of a 6DII. My guess is they asked enough to satisfy themselves that there wasn't enough demand for additional low ISO shadow lifting capabilities for it to make sense to use a sensor with ADC on board. Canon doesn't seem all that concerned about what numbers DPR comes up with about so-called "DR" or how the internet reacts.

I was very surprised that Canon apparently chose to use an "old style" sensor without ADC on board in the 6DII, since they seemed to be using the new sensor in everything, but such is life. Like you say, canon's decision did make it easier to live with what I have. I have also learned some very useful information about correct exposure and using Lightroom well.


----------



## Talys (Jul 29, 2017)

I have another theory.

Canon researches and builds cameras based on a ranking of features and price points that it feels users want and has been indisputably successful in this endeavor.

A segment of the interwebz explodes with nerd rage that people would dare buy cameras based on features and price points that they care about, rather than more advanced technology in all sorts of areas that they care less about. They are enraged that all the sheep out there just keep buying cameras that are pleasing to use and provably reliable rather than taking off the blinders and just reading the technical charts that prove that a Canon sensors are totally unusable. 

They are mortally offended by how a company could possibly be successful launch a product based on price, selected mix of features, and target market, because the way the world should work, in their mind, is that each new premium product should leapfrog every preceding product, and be better in every way; companies should stop trying to maximize their profits, and instead, they should simplify their offerings, and focus on always giving customers the most that is possible the lowest cost possible.


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## IglooEater (Jul 29, 2017)

That's about says it Talys


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## brad-man (Jul 29, 2017)

Talys said:


> I have another theory.
> 
> Canon researches and builds cameras based on a ranking of features and price points that it feels users want and has been indisputably successful in this endeavor.
> 
> ...



Actually you just restated DAK723's theory from the previous page.


----------



## Mt Spokane Photography (Jul 29, 2017)

that1guyy said:


> Are people actually excited about this camera?




Only photographers.


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## Mario (Jul 29, 2017)

I picked up my 6DII yesterday and had a brief test today. Nothing scientific but from what I see, the high ISO is significantly better than the 5DIII I had, and comparable to my 1DXII. I would be very surprised if that's an old style sensor in there.

Mario

Great tit, 6DII, 600II + 1.4x @ 840 mm, 1/320, f/8, ISO 2500, 0 EV, subject @ ca 6 m, no noise reduction (although there is some kind of default luminance colour (sorry, made a mistake, it has to be colour, not luminance) noise reduction)


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## LonelyBoy (Jul 29, 2017)

Mario said:


> I picked up my 6DII yesterday and had a brief test today. Nothing scientific but from what I see, the high ISO is significantly better than the 5DIII I had, and comparable to my 1DXII. I would be very surprised if that's an old style sensor in there.
> 
> Mario
> 
> Great tit, 6DII, 600II + 1.4x @ 840 mm, 1/320, f/8, ISO 2500, 0 EV, subject @ ca 6 m, no noise reduction (although there is some kind of default luminance noise reduction)



Obviously unacceptable results.


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## zim (Jul 29, 2017)

Hey Mario, I think you're missing the point posting a properly exposed lovely image, you should be posting a graph this isn't a photography forum


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## Cthulhu (Jul 29, 2017)

Mario said:


> I picked up my 6DII yesterday and had a brief test today. Nothing scientific but from what I see, the high ISO is significantly better than the 5DIII I had, and comparable to my 1DXII. I would be very surprised if that's an old style sensor in there.
> 
> Mario
> 
> Great tit, 6DII, 600II + 1.4x @ 840 mm, 1/320, f/8, ISO 2500, 0 EV, subject @ ca 6 m, no noise reduction (although there is some kind of default luminance colour (sorry, made a mistake, it has to be colour, not luminance) noise reduction)




I don't think you know how to use the internet. You need to underexpose that image by about 2 stops and then raise the shadows until you find noise, when that happens please lower NR all the way and raise the exposure a bit more. Bonus if the shot is poorly framed.


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## Don Haines (Jul 29, 2017)

Mario said:


> I picked up my 6DII yesterday and had a brief test today. Nothing scientific but from what I see, the high ISO is significantly better than the 5DIII I had, and comparable to my 1DXII. I would be very surprised if that's an old style sensor in there.
> 
> Mario
> 
> Great tit, 6DII, 600II + 1.4x @ 840 mm, 1/320, f/8, ISO 2500, 0 EV, subject @ ca 6 m, no noise reduction (although there is some kind of default luminance colour (sorry, made a mistake, it has to be colour, not luminance) noise reduction)


Nice to see an example from the real world


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## Pax2You (Jul 29, 2017)

Nice work Mario!


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## dak723 (Jul 29, 2017)

Lovely photo Mario! The beautiful background colors make this one an especially excellent photo!

Alas, most of the forum members won't be looking at the bird, the beautiful colors, the fine composition, but will be zooming in and trying to determine how much noise is in that background. Maybe someday they will understand how irrelevant noise is to whether a photo is successful or not.


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## scyrene (Jul 29, 2017)

jmoya said:


> I shot some at 6400 during the afternoon hours and pulled out the shadows in some trees. maybe 1 stop and theres was plenty of noise. Not impressed.




You're raising shadows at ISO 6400 and are surprised there's noise? ???


----------



## testthewest (Jul 29, 2017)

zim said:


> Hey Mario, I think you're missing the point posting a properly exposed lovely image, you should be posting a graph this isn't a photography forum



This! If it was a photography forum or even site, it wouldn't just report the newest gear and discuss it.
Also getting a good pictures is possible with almost everything. If that would be mattering, we could be shooting film.
So screw that bird and give us graphs that show us that you could have shot that bird at midnight at ISO 100 by simply raising the shadows!


----------



## neuroanatomist (Jul 29, 2017)

scyrene said:


> jmoya said:
> 
> 
> > I shot some at 6400 during the afternoon hours and pulled out the shadows in some trees. maybe 1 stop and theres was plenty of noise. Not impressed.
> ...



Prototypical wetware error.


----------



## jmoya (Jul 30, 2017)

testthewest said:


> zim said:
> 
> 
> > Hey Mario, I think you're missing the point posting a properly exposed lovely image, you should be posting a graph this isn't a photography forum
> ...


I totally agree! I'm a midnight bird photographer and need to be able to pull those shadows. I guess this camera was only made for the people who like to shoot in the day. Where's the challenge in that?


----------



## zim (Jul 30, 2017)

jmoya said:


> testthewest said:
> 
> 
> > zim said:
> ...




Or people that work with light.

Midnight bird photography  is pretty nich and a 6 d wouldn't be my choice but the mk2 seems to be better at high ISO and AF than the MK1 so would be a better choice in that situation.


----------



## Khalai (Jul 30, 2017)

scyrene said:


> jmoya said:
> 
> 
> > I shot some at 6400 during the afternoon hours and pulled out the shadows in some trees. maybe 1 stop and theres was plenty of noise. Not impressed.
> ...


LOL. There will be noise at ISO 6400 even in properly exposed photo with -1 EV in the post anyway


----------



## lalilulelo (Jul 30, 2017)

I was testing auto-focus on the 85L at f/1.2, and the focus is more accurate using the 1-point AF on live view than spot AF on the viewfinder. Is this normal?


----------



## Avenger 2.0 (Jul 30, 2017)

How is the moiré in video with the new Canon 6D II compared to the original 6D? Is it as bad or better like the Canon 5D III?


----------



## Khalai (Jul 30, 2017)

lalilulelo said:


> I was testing auto-focus on the 85L at f/1.2, and the focus is more accurate using the 1-point AF on live view than spot AF on the viewfinder. Is this normal?



LV focusing is always more accurate, it eliminates any AFMA inconsistencies, which may occur during phase detection AF. Remember, in LV you are focusing directly on sensor, instead of light going through secondary (sub)mirror onto AF module.

And since 6D II has DPAF, LV focusing should be noticeably faster from previous 6D, right?


----------



## mahdi_mak2000 (Jul 30, 2017)

scyrene said:


> jmoya said:
> 
> 
> > I shot some at 6400 during the afternoon hours and pulled out the shadows in some trees. maybe 1 stop and theres was plenty of noise. Not impressed.
> ...



of course, do it on 3 years old D750, Apsc a6500 , No problem. why I as canon user should not be able to do it? I m doing bird photography and I face with lots of back light scene. I need to be able to push 3 stop at 6400 bcz cheaper, older cameras can do


----------



## SecureGSM (Jul 30, 2017)

are you saying that your Nikon/ Sony supercams have 3 stop advantaged at ISO 6400? 
lets see:

Nikon D750 Low Light ISO : 5270
Canon 5D IV Low Light ISO: 5011 - just a fraction of the stop less. what is not to love?
Canon 6D II Low Light ISO : 4178 - 1/4 stop less
Canon 6D Low Light ISO : 4070 - 1/4 + a bit
Canon 5D III Low Light ISO : 3652 - 1/2 stop less
Sony 6300 Low Light ISO : 2756 - 1 full stop less.

http://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm




mahdi_mak2000 said:


> scyrene said:
> 
> 
> > jmoya said:
> ...


----------



## canonlover (Jul 30, 2017)

scyrene said:


> jmoya said:
> 
> 
> > I shot some at 6400 during the afternoon hours and pulled out the shadows in some trees. maybe 1 stop and theres was plenty of noise. Not impressed.
> ...



;D ;D ure so right these guys are killing me


----------



## Orangutan (Jul 30, 2017)

mahdi_mak2000 said:


> scyrene said:
> 
> 
> > jmoya said:
> ...



Please show examples.


----------



## Point22 (Jul 30, 2017)

Avenger 2.0 said:


> How is the moiré in video with the new Canon 6D II compared to the original 6D? Is it as bad or better like the Canon 5D III?


 Much Much better ( 6D vs 6D2 )


----------



## unfocused (Jul 30, 2017)

Now that it is shipping, it looks like the 6DII is back in the top position among full-frame DSLRs on Amazon. 

No. 5 among all DSLRs. No. 10 is the original 6D. No. 13 is the 5D IV. Nikon D810 is at No. 17. Ranking as of 9:30 a.m. Central Time this a.m.


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 30, 2017)

Orangutan said:


> mahdi_mak2000 said:
> 
> 
> > scyrene said:
> ...



You guys are nearly as bad as Neuro, throwing out facts and rational thinking and spoiling peoples parties. I used to assume written statements would be more reliable than verbal because they would get reviewed before being published (antidote to loose mouth/bowel syndrome) but CR corrected that thinking for me. 

Jack


----------



## x-vision (Jul 30, 2017)

mahdi_mak2000 said:


> I need to be able to push 3 stop at 6400 bcz cheaper, older cameras can do



Are you being sarcastic? 

If not, you are plain wrong. 

Any FF camera will have certain amount of noise at ISO 6400.
And at high ISOs in particular, Canon cameras have historically edged out other brands for both noise and dynamic range.


----------



## Adelino (Jul 30, 2017)

Khalai said:


> Talys said:
> 
> 
> > Funny thing, by default, it has the guide UI (or whatever it's called) enabled, so when you change exposure modes it tells you, hey, you're in Shutter Priority -- you can go this way to freeze the waterfall, or this way for it to appear flowing! Really? There are people who buy a FF camera who don't understand how exposure modes work? Scary!
> ...


----------



## Don Haines (Jul 30, 2017)

mahdi_mak2000 said:


> of course, do it on 3 years old D750, Apsc a6500 , No problem. why I as canon user should not be able to do it? I m doing bird photography and I face with lots of back light scene. I need to be able to push 3 stop at 6400 bcz cheaper, older cameras can do


When shooting a subject against a bright sky, have you considered using exposure compensation..... or spot meter... or manual..... or a fill flash........ or a number of other methods to expose the subject properly......


----------



## Adelino (Jul 30, 2017)

Jack Douglas said:


> One thing that's pretty obvious but still seems to be overlooked by some is this. Telephoto users like reach and so APSC gets acknowledged in that department. Well, wide angle users like wide angles and APSC doesn't fill that bill too well. Two cameras of course does the trick but I for one prefer only hiking with one; that's heavy enough and less clumsy.
> 
> Jack



Which brings up a good point, Canon have the refurbished 6d and 80D at a price that one can get BOTH for less money. That's a pretty compelling setup.


----------



## Don Haines (Jul 30, 2017)

Adelino said:


> Jack Douglas said:
> 
> 
> > One thing that's pretty obvious but still seems to be overlooked by some is this. Telephoto users like reach and so APSC gets acknowledged in that department. Well, wide angle users like wide angles and APSC doesn't fill that bill too well. Two cameras of course does the trick but I for one prefer only hiking with one; that's heavy enough and less clumsy.
> ...


funny you said this......

I was just talking cameras with a friend, and said that for me the ideal setup would be a 7D2 and a 5D4, but if you wanted to go cheap you could almost do as well with an 80D and a 6D  and with the money saved on the bodies, get better glass and you would be further ahead!


----------



## Talys (Jul 30, 2017)

Don Haines said:


> Adelino said:
> 
> 
> > Jack Douglas said:
> ...



Personally, when I go out specifically for photography, I like a 2-camera harness. Time will tell, but I'm excited at the prospect of 80D + 6D2. 

The reason I have never seriously considered 7D2, 6D or 5D4 is that in the studio, when a camera is rolling around a tall tripod pointed downwards, the articulating screen pretty much overrides every other feature. The 5D's price has always been more than I wanted to spend on a body, but if either 5D4 or 5DSR had a been available with an articulating screen, Canon would probably have gotten my money by now anyways... because I tend to buy a lot of stuff that is more than I want to spend


----------



## CTJohn (Jul 30, 2017)

Can anyone comment on the noise level between ISO 6400 on the original 6D and the Mark II? I typically limit my ISO at 6400 on the 6D. Do I gain a stop (or more) on the new one?


----------



## Don Haines (Jul 30, 2017)

Talys said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > Adelino said:
> ...


I was out (unsuccessfully) taking pictures of the Milky Way last night. I would have loved to have had a 6D2 on the top of the tripod. The tilt-swivel screen would have been greatly appreciated, and I an very curious to see how the Bluetooth connection to a phone or tablet would work in real life.....


----------



## Orangutan (Jul 30, 2017)

Don Haines said:


> mahdi_mak2000 said:
> 
> 
> > of course, do it on 3 years old D750, Apsc a6500 , No problem. why I as canon user should not be able to do it? I m doing bird photography and I face with lots of back light scene. I need to be able to push 3 stop at 6400 bcz cheaper, older cameras can do
> ...



As someone who occasionally photographs birds, I can say that's easier said than done (for me).

>EC
Yup, use it, and it definitely helps. It's harder in partly-cloudy skies with BIF because it throws off metering.

>manual
My 70D does not have M+EC. I hear that 80D does, and I may get that eventually. Again, manual is fine for stationary birds, but it's a challenge when they move.

>fill flash
I just recently bought a flash extender, but have not learned how to use it properly. First attempts were more humorous than anything.

I find that bird photography + proper exposure is more probabilistic than deterministic: I learn how to increase my odds of getting a proper exposure, but I'm always anxious when I have a fleeting opportunity to shoot without adjustment. Shadow lifting is a desirable quality, thought not enough to overwhelm the other considerations. Having clean shadow lifts would definitely save a few shots, though I don't think I could put a number on that.


----------



## Deepboy (Jul 30, 2017)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNrpuUES3Sw

From 10:00 to 10:20

Looks pretty pretty bad... :'(


----------



## Yasko (Jul 30, 2017)

Epaminonda said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNrpuUES3Sw
> 
> From 10:00 to 10:20
> 
> Looks pretty pretty bad... :'(



That's what I have been waiting for. The Camera Store is one of my favorite channels that I trust most (as well as Dustin Abott and Christopher Frost, for lenses) and sadly the example images even in comparison to a T7i really show what everyone means by restricted DR of the 6D mk II ???

I guess it's just for me to wait for a FF mirrorless from Canon and keeping my trusty 70D as my main body .


----------



## Don Haines (Jul 30, 2017)

Orangutan said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > mahdi_mak2000 said:
> ...


Fill flash..... my efforts to date with small birds have been somewhat less than successful, but I have developed a wonderful technique to scare birds away from the feeder.....


----------



## Talys (Jul 30, 2017)

A couple of photos I snapped from my patio to try out 6D2 at ISO 1600 and 3200 in good lighting. I thought the ISO 1600 output was pretty great. Both photos were autofocused, which worked well even at f/6.3.

6D2, Sigma 150-600 @ 600mm, f/6.3, 1/4000 ISO 1600
Full Image (unmodified) - http://www.versadyne.com/talys/branches.jpg
Cropped to display at 100%:






6D2, Canon 70-300 II @ 170mm, f5, 1/4000 ISO 3200
Full Image (cropped, but otherwise unmodified) - http://www.versadyne.com/talys/raccoon-3.jpg
Cropped to display at 100%:





I think as-is, the ISO 3200 output is pretty decent. Sure, there's graininess at 100%, but practically, if what you want is to view them on a screen, when you reduce the photo to 1200x1200 pixels or so, the visible noise pretty much disappears. Also, when it comes to noise, I'm much less bothered by graininess than by chroma.

Side note, the reason I was playing with the 70-300 II (the nano USM one) was that I noticed yesterday that I couldn't manual focus when AF was on. Turns out, the control is "Lens electronic MF - Enable after One-Shot AF ON".

I took a bunch of studio shots too, to test under ideal conditions, but *shrug*, what can I say... the pictures are indistinguishable from any other modern DSLR with good glass. Output is great, of course, sharp, nice colors, and all that. The extra 1.6x field of view will be greatly appreciated when I really use it.

Now, all I want is to be able to see CR2 thumbnails in File Explorer


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 31, 2017)

Useful/interesting recent comments. I had a rule with my 6D that I would not generally shoot above ISO 1250 since I typically would be cropping pretty heavily my mostly bird shots. Now, full frame is a different matter and I think 6400 is not so bad. 

For BIF sky shots the button programmable option to change the camera settings including shutter speed and Fstop is wonderful. I presently use * for that with EC.

Jack


----------



## ShootTheStars12 (Jul 31, 2017)

I am a current SL1 owner chomping at the bit to get a nice budget full frame camera, so I was extremely excited for the release of the 6D Mark II. However, I still haven't put in an order for one because of the plethora of bad reviews (especially the DR). I've always heard that Canon has the best glass, which I'm sure is true, but is it truly THAT much better? 2 of the main things I want to shoot are astrophotography and landscapes. Do you guys think this is the right camera for me? I can't justify the price of a 5D Mark IV when I'd also be buying L glass to take advantage of full frame.


----------



## brad-man (Jul 31, 2017)

ShootTheStars12 said:


> I am a current SL1 owner chomping at the bit to get a nice budget full frame camera, so I was extremely excited for the release of the 6D Mark II. However, I still haven't put in an order for one because of the plethora of bad reviews (especially the DR). I've always heard that Canon has the best glass, which I'm sure is true, but is it truly THAT much better? 2 of the main things I want to shoot are astrophotography and landscapes. Do you guys think this is the right camera for me? I can't justify the price of a 5D Mark IV when I'd also be buying L glass to take advantage of full frame.



I have not seen bad reviews, only reviews that indicate disappointment in the lack of sensor improvement. Since IQ between version 1 & 2 are so similar, perhaps you would be better served with the original. It is on sale for $1100 refurbished at the Canon USA website. More $ leftover for glass...

https://shop.usa.canon.com/shop/en/catalog/362776?WT.mc_id=C126149


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 31, 2017)

Canon added the things people griped about, as has been stated many times, so how can it not be a great camera. I sold my 6D and will likely get it, but as a second camera, so when the price drops. It really is sad how the DR tempest in a tea pot upsets so many relative to their confidence in a purchase. My 6D shots held up very well relative to my friends 1DX and everyone has always raved about the 1DX so how can the 6D2 not be a fine camera? Oh I forgot, it doesn't have 4K video. Over 35 k shots on my 6D and around 1 hour of video, so for me ...

Jack


----------



## pj1974 (Jul 31, 2017)

Jack Douglas said:


> One thing that's pretty obvious but still seems to be overlooked by some is this. Telephoto users like reach and so APSC gets acknowledged in that department. Well, wide angle users like wide angles and APSC doesn't fill that bill too well. Two cameras of course does the trick but I for one prefer only hiking with one; that's heavy enough and less clumsy.
> 
> Jack



Hi Jack

I am addressing your statement that "APS-C doesn't fill the [wide angle] bill too well". 

While that may have been the case about 10 to 12 years ago, the truth is that for several years now, APS-C DSLR cameras have many great 'wide angle'- indeed, 'ultra wide angle' lens options. Many of these out-perform their FF cousins, particular in terms of sharpness and contrast in the extreme corners.

I have used both FF and APS-C for landscapes and architecture. Here are some APS-C lenses available for Canon APS-C sized sensor DSLR cameras which really provide an amazing amount of bang for the buck:
- Sigma 8-16mm f/4.5-5.6 - an extremely capable lens - widest available zoom for APS-C
- Sigma 10-20mm (both f/3.5 and f/4-5.6 versions are good)
- Canon 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5 USM - Canon's initial, and still competitive UWA zoom
- Canon 10-18mm f/4.5-5.6 IS STM (small, compact and great value with IS!)
- Tamron 10-24mm f/3.5-4.5 Di II VC HLD - a recent and high quality lens
- Tokina 11-16mm & 11-20mm f/2.8 lens range (fast glass: low light & astro photography)

I challenge you to compare the results that are capable with any of the above lenses, with FF UWA zooms. Use them in the real world, and also analyse credible, scientific data via proper professional reviews.

Furthermore, I could also present you similar information relating to UWA prime lenses. (Though yes, that's another slightly different story). Please (kindly!)  refrain from suggesting that APS-C cameras / lenses do not have adequate capacity in the wide to ultra-wide department.... in fact this is one reason I often use APS-C cameras - their UWA choice and performance (without needing / being an uber-expensive big UWA FF lens).

The Canon EOM 11-22mm IS STM lens is also highly regarded as an amazing UWA mirrorless lens. 

Cheers....

Paul 8)


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 31, 2017)

Paul, I have no interest in putting down APSC for wide angle usage. You presumably know what you're talking about and I'll accept that. It is not my policy to pontificate about any of these things because I'm just an average amateur enthusiast; I have no problem being chastised. 

Freedom is a wonderful thing. Choose what you like, everyone.

Jack


----------



## derekmccoy (Jul 31, 2017)

I have a 6D and I need a second body, so I think I'm just gonna get another one as I can't see where the upgrade is on the 6D2. A good condition 6D can be picked up for £700, so can I justify a 6D2 for an extra £1400 when the only upgrade is a tilty touchscreen? I don't think so.


----------



## tomscott (Jul 31, 2017)

derekmccoy said:


> I have a 6D and I need a second body, so I think I'm just gonna get another one as I can't see where the upgrade is on the 6D2. A good condition 6D can be picked up for £700, so can I justify a 6D2 for an extra £1400 when the only upgrade is a tilty touchscreen? I don't think so.



The AF must be worth it alone.

That 11 point AF system is a challenge unless your doing anything but landscape. For fast glass and portraiture with focus recompose as with such slim DOF you move the plane of focus. Once you have more option its so difficult to go back to a 9 or 11 point system.

DREV is selling the 6DMKII for the cheaper than the 5DMKIII at £1595.

Seems a pretty stellar camera for that sort of money.


----------



## derekmccoy (Jul 31, 2017)

tomscott said:


> derekmccoy said:
> 
> 
> > I have a 6D and I need a second body, so I think I'm just gonna get another one as I can't see where the upgrade is on the 6D2. A good condition 6D can be picked up for £700, so can I justify a 6D2 for an extra £1400 when the only upgrade is a tilty touchscreen? I don't think so.
> ...



The 6D was the low light king when it was released. I would have rather it had a -4EV center point to rival the competition. I've always focus and recomposed. The counter argument is that an upgraded AF for the 6D2 was such an obvious expectation, it's not even worth mentioning. Although 4K and improved DR were also obvious expectations..... I guess Canon shooters should just expect disappointment. Hopefully Canon is reading this and fix the 6D2 with a firmware update, otherwise I'm switching to Fuji.


----------



## tichy (Jul 31, 2017)

pj1974 said:


> I have used both FF and APS-C for landscapes and architecture. Here are some APS-C lenses available for Canon APS-C sized sensor DSLR cameras which really provide an amazing amount of bang for the buck:
> - Sigma 8-16mm f/4.5-5.6 - an extremely capable lens - widest available zoom for APS-C
> - Sigma 10-20mm (both f/3.5 and f/4-5.6 versions are good)
> - Canon 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5 USM - Canon's initial, and still competitive UWA zoom
> ...



Hello,

I'm not the one being challenged but here are my thoughts on your list anyway ;-)

All lenses except the Tokina 11-16 are slower than F2.8. And even that lens has less FOV than a Tamron 15-30 on a FF body. 

Since I use the (U)WA lenses mainly for shooting auroras, every f-stop matters to me there and the availability of lenses with F2.8 (or faster) at a very wide FOV is a buying reason for a FF body. You really can neither compensate with ISO (I'm occasionally shooting at 6400) nor time (I'm down to 20-25 seconds sometimes). Every time I shoot, I'm balancing between shutter-speed and ISO (aperture constantly at

```
2.8
```
). Every step I can reduce the ISO-value I gain in quality and/or less hassle in post.

Greetings, Tichy


----------



## neuroanatomist (Jul 31, 2017)

derekmccoy said:


> I have a 6D and I need a second body, so I think I'm just gonna get another one as I can't see where the upgrade is on the 6D2. A good condition 6D can be picked up for £700, so can I justify a 6D2 for an extra £1400 when the only upgrade is a tilty touchscreen? I don't think so.



Yeah, those were the only improvements. No improvement to the AF, frame rate, etc. None. 



derekmccoy said:


> The 6D was the low light king when it was released. I would have rather it had a -4EV center point to rival the competition. I've always focus and recomposed. The counter argument is that an upgraded AF for the 6D2 was such an obvious expectation, it's not even worth mentioning. Although 4K and improved DR were also obvious expectations..... I guess Canon shooters should just expect disappointment. Hopefully Canon is reading this and fix the 6D2 with a firmware update, otherwise I'm switching to Fuji.



An example of -3 EV is 1/15 s, f/2.8, ISO 102400. I'm sure there are lots of situations where -4 EV AF would be a huge benefit for real world use. 

News flash, Canon isn't reading this and doesn't care about you or your needs. If you're disappointed (and clearly, you are), don't wait...switch to Fuji now. 

Bye.


----------



## jeffa4444 (Jul 31, 2017)

pj1974 said:


> Jack Douglas said:
> 
> 
> > One thing that's pretty obvious but still seems to be overlooked by some is this. Telephoto users like reach and so APSC gets acknowledged in that department. Well, wide angle users like wide angles and APSC doesn't fill that bill too well. Two cameras of course does the trick but I for one prefer only hiking with one; that's heavy enough and less clumsy.
> ...


Hi Paul
Owning both Canon APS-C and Canon FF cameras & lenses and in particular wide angle zooms and having the ability to test both in controlled environments for the vast majority your completely right. 
I currently have the EF-S 10-18mm and had the EF-S 10-22mm before it, I use the APS combo when travelling lighter and it works a treat. 
However the EF 16-35mm f4L IS USM lens takes some beating this is simply one of Canon finest lenses with great sharpness out to the very corners of the frame any landscape photographer shooting FF should own this optic.


----------



## derekmccoy (Jul 31, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> An example of -3 EV is 1/15 s, f/2.8, ISO 102400. I'm sure there are lots of situations where -4 EV AF would be a huge benefit for real world use.
> 
> News flash, Canon isn't reading this and doesn't care about you or your needs. If you're disappointed (and clearly, you are), don't wait...switch to Fuji now.
> 
> Bye.



I'm speaking from experience. An example of -4EV is a dark dancefloor (shooting with speedlites). I normally have to rely on a handheld mini flashlight or DJ lights to grab focus. For example, I know that the D500 can focus in those situations.

I'm loving the sarcasm though, keep it up!


----------



## Don Haines (Jul 31, 2017)

pj1974 said:


> I have used both FF and APS-C for landscapes and architecture. Here are some APS-C lenses available for Canon APS-C sized sensor DSLR cameras which really provide an amazing amount of bang for the buck:
> - Sigma 8-16mm f/4.5-5.6 - an extremely capable lens - widest available zoom for APS-C
> - Sigma 10-20mm (both f/3.5 and f/4-5.6 versions are good)
> - Canon 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5 USM - Canon's initial, and still competitive UWA zoom
> ...



I have a 7D2.....
my most used lens is the 17-55F 2.8.....
going really wide, it's the Tokina 11-16 F2.8...

You can definitely go wide on a crop with a F2.8 lens and not break the bank.....


----------



## privatebydesign (Jul 31, 2017)

derekmccoy said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > An example of -3 EV is 1/15 s, f/2.8, ISO 102400. I'm sure there are lots of situations where -4 EV AF would be a huge benefit for real world use.
> ...



On that situation what is stopping the Speedlite AF assist working?


----------



## pj1974 (Jul 31, 2017)

Jack Douglas said:


> Paul, I have no interest in putting down APSC for wide angle usage. You presumably know what you're talking about and I'll accept that. It is not my policy to pontificate about any of these things because I'm just an average amateur enthusiast; I have no problem being chastised.
> 
> Freedom is a wonderful thing. Choose what you like, everyone.
> 
> Jack



Hi Jack

Thanks for your gracious reply. My post wasn't so much a chastise, as a gentle correction.  Cheers! 

Indeed... freedom IS a truly wonderful thing! Peace.

Paul


----------



## pj1974 (Jul 31, 2017)

tichy said:


> pj1974 said:
> 
> 
> > I have used both FF and APS-C for landscapes and architecture. Here are some APS-C lenses available for Canon APS-C sized sensor DSLR cameras which really provide an amazing amount of bang for the buck:
> ...



Hi Tichy

Thanks for writing... In the area of auroras (and a few other specialised applications) - sure, there is an advantage that FF has (larger sensor, less noise).

My initial post was addressing Jack's statement that APS-C do not cover wide angle well (thus I was using the appropriate generalisations to respond to this broad statement). 

Some of Canon's later sensors (e.g. 80D etc) do quite well in low light. The Tokina's f/2.8, or even faster primes will obviously help whatever size sensor. (The new Sigma 14mm f/1.8 looks great for example!) Cheers

Paul


----------



## pj1974 (Jul 31, 2017)

jeffa4444 said:


> Hi Paul
> Owning both Canon APS-C and Canon FF cameras & lenses and in particular wide angle zooms and having the ability to test both in controlled environments for the vast majority your completely right.
> I currently have the EF-S 10-18mm and had the EF-S 10-22mm before it, I use the APS combo when travelling lighter and it works a treat.
> However the EF 16-35mm f4L IS USM lens takes some beating this is simply one of Canon finest lenses with great sharpness out to the very corners of the frame any landscape photographer shooting FF should own this optic.



Hi Jeffa444, 

Thanks for adding your 2 cents also. Seems we have similar experiences... and currently I have the Sigma 8-16mm and the Canon 10-18mm STM IS. Both very good lenses, and each have their application.

I have used a Canon 16-35mm f/4 IS and yes, that would likely be my UWA if I was to go FF. The combination of its zoom range, IS and optical quality is a great accomplishment by Canon.

Both my real world testing, and the tests by photozone.de indicate that the corners of it are good, but e.g. there are some APS-C lenses which have superior relative sharpness right into the corners.

Again, cheers... appreciate your post!

Paul


----------



## unfocused (Jul 31, 2017)

derekmccoy said:


> I guess Canon shooters should just expect disappointment. Hopefully Canon is reading this and fix the 6D2 with a firmware update, otherwise I'm switching to Fuji.



Given that the 6DII seems to be selling very well (best selling full frame DSLR on Amazon), I'm doubting they feel compelled to "fix" anything just to please you.

I'm curious, which full-frame Fuji are you switching to?


----------



## derekmccoy (Jul 31, 2017)

privatebydesign said:


> derekmccoy said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...



I'm off camera flash. 2-4 speedlites positioned around the room. Although to be honest it's not a deal breaker. I just said -4EV is preferable to a more sophisticated AF system. But that's my situation in particular, some people would rather an 80D style Af system.


----------



## derekmccoy (Jul 31, 2017)

unfocused said:


> I'm curious, which full-frame Fuji are you switching to?



Fuji don't do FF, but I've been looking at the XT-2 which is an upgrade in every way I need from the 6D, including IQ.

Although maybe you're right, maybe the IQ is satisfactory and "good enough" for some.


----------



## SecureGSM (Jul 31, 2017)

I understand that you are shooting with off camera 3-4 flashes. Cannot you utilise AF assist beam of your wireless flash trigger/ controller to assist your camera to focus then?
As Neuro noted in a very polite way, that -4EV exposure level is practically a pitch black situation. -3EV is not far from that as well. example: T=1/15, F=1.4, ISO = 25600, this is way darker than you would experience shooting typical dance floor.



derekmccoy said:


> *I'm speaking from experience. An example of -4EV is a dark dancefloor (shooting with speedlites).* I normally have to rely on a handheld mini flashlight or DJ lights to grab focus. For example, I know that the D500 can focus in those situations.
> 
> I'm loving the sarcasm though, keep it up!


----------



## privatebydesign (Jul 31, 2017)

derekmccoy said:


> privatebydesign said:
> 
> 
> > derekmccoy said:
> ...



What are you triggering your off camera flash with and what is it? If it is Canon Speedlites, which I assumed it was because of your spelling, they can all be controlled with the ST-E2 that has a built in AF assist lamp, or if you are RT then the 430 EX III RT and 600 EX RT and 600 EX RT II can all do the controlling without adding to the exposure and have an AF assist lamp.

My personal experience of all low light AF systems is that they are easily fooled and take way too long to acquire people dancing on a dance floor, personally the differences between -3 and -4 in your specific situation seem mental rather than practical as I wouldn't trust any of them to get me reliable focus of moving subjects at those light levels.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Jul 31, 2017)

privatebydesign said:


> My personal experience of all low light AF systems is that they are easily fooled and take way too long to acquire people dancing on a dance floor, personally the differences between -3 and -4 in your specific situation seem mental rather than practical as I wouldn't trust any of them to get me reliable focus of moving subjects at those light levels.



+1

But hey, maybe he's worried about the AF assist beam being a distraction to the dancers. DJ's tend to like their dance floors dark and quiet...


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jul 31, 2017)

I read CR for the humour.  I know, not every appreciates my sense of humour. 

Jack


----------



## pj1974 (Aug 1, 2017)

Jack Douglas said:


> I read CR for the humour.  I know, not every appreciates my sense of humour.
> 
> Jack



Ha ha... yes, Jack

I often read it for the humour too. I get that! ;D

Here we are discussing UWAs lenses on APS-C sensored DSLRs, on a thread to do with shipping of a new FF DSLR! 

Regards,

Paul


----------



## pj1974 (Aug 1, 2017)

Don Haines said:


> pj1974 said:
> 
> 
> > I have used both FF and APS-C for landscapes and architecture.
> ...



Hi Don

Thanks for your post here too, mate.

Yes, the Tokina 11-16mm f/2.8 can do a great job for a lot of circumstances.

As you wrote, you currently have a 7D2... would you find a 7D3 with an improved sensor tech interesting or tempting to upgrade from? 

(I currently have a 7D and an 80D - the 80D being my most used camera... love it!)

Always appreciate your input on these forums, Don. 

Regards

Paul


----------



## Don Haines (Aug 1, 2017)

pj1974 said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > pj1974 said:
> ...


I picked the 7D2 over the 80D because of the sealing.... I shoot in the Canadian winter, plus on the water, so for me the sealing was by far the biggest factor. Other than that, the 80D is the better camera overall.....

I tend to skip models, so the 7D3 is probably not for me, unlesss they make it spectacularly better than the 2.... I was interested in the 6D2, but the same problem arises.... it is not better by enough to tempt me. I did want an improved body for high ISO, but decided to get one of the Sigma F1.4 Art lenses instead.

I still might go for the 6D2, but I am waiting for the initial rush to be over and the inevitable price drop.


----------



## tencachon (Aug 1, 2017)

Sorry to switch the topic, but has anyone run into Error Message 70 when doing shoots through LiveView?

I was excited yesterday when received my shipment, completely understand the lack of 4K (I don't do video), and hoping the soft dynamic range is something I can work with, but most of my lens are Sigma lens (HSM and art).
While the art is impressive, the HSM seems to have poor calibration issues with Canon Camera so I relied heavily on Liveview DPAF but this Error Message 70 is turning me off. When you touch screen for focus and take the picture, the message appears, the RED line showing the image is being recorded to the memory card stayed on and won't turn off. Only thing I can do is to remove the battery and restart.

I've seen people on the internet talking about using a different memory card. I'll try it again later today.
Any thought?


----------



## Jack Douglas (Aug 1, 2017)

tencachon, can only help with sympathy. Good luck.

Jack


----------



## hbr (Aug 1, 2017)

Mine arrived yesterday afternoon and I went out and took about 300 photos with my 70-200 L USM lens. I put the camera in TV mode and set the shutter speed from 2500-4000 and the aperture at f/28 and auto ISO. The camera always chose ISO 100 and sometimes raised the aperture to f/32. These were airliners taking off at the local airport and were daylight only through the OVF. I liked the colors and the AF and the noise was much finer than my 6D and easy to clean up. I will be taking more challenging photos in the coming days. If someone would tell me how to put full size untouched RAW files on this site I will upload a few photos from time to time for everyone to play with in your favorite PP program.

Brian


----------



## Jack Douglas (Aug 1, 2017)

hbr, I'm interest in seeing your shots. As far as I know you have to upload the photos and link to them.

Jack


----------



## hbr (Aug 1, 2017)

Jack Douglas said:


> hbr, I'm interest in seeing your shots. As far as I know you have to upload the photos and link to them.
> 
> Jack



Jack, I just loaded 2 files into Google Drive and set up sharing. Try copying this into your internet title bar. 

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B2lFTWTRuXxtcHJlci1tLURMam8?usp=sharing

Let me know if it works or not. It did for me. Feel free to download and play with them. They are not copyrighted.

Anyone that has the above link can download them.

Brian


----------



## LarsCS (Aug 1, 2017)

Just got mine today. Might take it on a backpacking trip this week. 

Too bad that the L-Bracket I had on my old 6D limits the flip screen motion too much (fits perfect otherwise). I need a new design.


----------



## Jack Douglas (Aug 1, 2017)

hbr said:


> Jack Douglas said:
> 
> 
> > hbr, I'm interest in seeing your shots. As far as I know you have to upload the photos and link to them.
> ...



Just downloading now. I always played with my 6D RAW in DPP and so I'll get a pretty good idea. Thanks.

Jack


----------



## Jack Douglas (Aug 2, 2017)

Well, I'm no expert but I played around and here is one of them converted with DPP. I brought the shadows up and cut the highlights a bit and stepped the contrast up one. There is no NR and the sharpening is at the typical default of 3. Seems it could be lower with little loss. So good, bad , indifferent here it is. Seems fine to me.

Jack


----------



## hbr (Aug 2, 2017)

Jack Douglas said:


> Well, I'm no expert but I played around and here is one of them converted with DPP. I brought the shadows up and cut the highlights a bit and stepped the contrast up one. There is no NR and the sharpening is at the typical default of 3. Seems it could be lower with little loss. So good, bad , indifferent here it is. Seems fine to me.
> 
> Jack



Thanks Jack for playing with the photo. I will be posting more if anyone is interested. What I am trying to do is to get familiarized with the new camera, especially the limitations and to show some real world sample images, (both good and bad), to those who are on the fence about purchasing this camera. I also do all my RAW processing in DPP.

I am going to be busy today - I will try to post some more images this evening. Early this morning a hawk showed up in my back yard and I was able to take a lot of photos. I had set the upper limits of the Auto ISO to 40,000, so I have a lot of pictures from 25.000 ISO to 40,000 ISO. Even at these higher ISO values, I was able to do a reasonable job of cleaning up the noise.

Brian


----------



## alvarow (Aug 2, 2017)

Mine is on the mail coming from Canada  Can't wait for it to get here. First FF, coming from 70D after building my lens collection: 100L Macro, 24-70 II, 70-200 II and 100-400 II...

Whatever folks say about DR this and that, I was waiting for a 70D full frame, and I got it, so I am happy


----------



## alvarow (Aug 2, 2017)

I had that error on Canon 80D after having an SD card placed back into the camera with files Geotagged by Exiftool. Once I realized it, I took the card off, formatted it on my Mac and placed it back on the camera and formatted it again on it. No problems since.




tencachon said:


> Sorry to switch the topic, but has anyone run into Error Message 70 when doing shoots through LiveView?


----------



## hbr (Aug 3, 2017)

Jack Douglas said:


> Well, I'm no expert but I played around and here is one of them converted with DPP. I brought the shadows up and cut the highlights a bit and stepped the contrast up one. There is no NR and the sharpening is at the typical default of 3. Seems it could be lower with little loss. So good, bad , indifferent here it is. Seems fine to me.
> 
> Jack



Hi Jack,
Here is another picture. It is of the hawk out back yesterday morning. This one is a little bit more challenging as it is at ISO 40,000. Noisy, but still usable I think. I recommend setting the white balance to white priority and the noise slider to 17.

This was shot using my 400 5.6 L with a Kenko 14x teleconverter. Outside was darker under the trees than the photo would make you believe.

Give it a go and let me know what you think. I don't think my original 6D could handle this high ISO as well.
Here is the link again:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B2lFTWTRuXxtcHJlci1tLURMam8?usp=sharing

Thanks, (So far I am pretty happy with the purchase).

Brian


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## Don Haines (Aug 3, 2017)

hbr said:


> Jack Douglas said:
> 
> 
> > Well, I'm no expert but I played around and here is one of them converted with DPP. I brought the shadows up and cut the highlights a bit and stepped the contrast up one. There is no NR and the sharpening is at the typical default of 3. Seems it could be lower with little loss. So good, bad , indifferent here it is. Seems fine to me.
> ...



You shot that at ISO 40,000 and through a teleconverter? ? ?

Darn you! You may have just cost me $2000


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## hbr (Aug 3, 2017)

Hi Don,

In the EXIF data the lens data will not show that the teleconverter is attached as it does on my other bodies. But The Focal length will show 560mm instead of 400mm and the aperture will show f/8. Interestingly also is that since the teleconverter is not reporting back to the camera as the Canon model would, I can use all 45 of the focus points available at f/8 with this combo.

Cheers,
Brian


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## Quirkz (Aug 3, 2017)

Don Haines said:


> hbr said:
> 
> 
> > Hi Jack,
> ...



That's.... actually really good 40k. Color is great, grain is nicely random. Problem with a lot of the number crunching and test chart crowds is that they don't characterize things like noise and color at higher ISO. This shot is what I consider an impressive result. I don't have my 6D any more to compare, anyone willing to do a high ISO shot to compare? Seems better to me from memory.


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## hbr (Aug 3, 2017)

Here is the converted JPEG file that has not been edited, (the RAW file has been edited). I am posting this so everyone can view the EXIF data, (hopefully).
I've never posted an image on this site so here goes.


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## SecureGSM (Aug 3, 2017)

this image looks what 6D/ 1 DX / 5D IV files do look like at ISO 4000 with good noise reduction applied. Not questioning the RAW EXIF data as it may well be was that dark.. and F9 , -0.7 EV exposure compensation and everything, but image does not looks falling apart or any signs of colour degradation. I am open to believe this new Canon sensor is that good... or may be not... 

some 1DX II high res shots for comparison with some 1:1 crops towards the bottom of the page.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/canon/1dx-mk-ii.htm#highiso





hbr said:


> Here is the converted JPEG file that has not been edited, (the RAW file has been edited). I am posting this so everyone can view the EXIF data, (hopefully).
> I've never posted an image on this site so here goes.


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## neuroanatomist (Aug 3, 2017)

SecureGSM said:


> this image looks what 6D/ 1 DX / 5D IV files do look like at *ISO 4000* with good noise reduction applied. Not questioning the RAW EXIF data as it may well be was that dark.. and F9 , -0.7 EV exposure compensation and everything, but image does not looks falling apart or any signs of colour degradation. I am open to believe this new Canon sensor is that good... or may be not...



You missed a zero...it's ISO *40,000*.


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## SecureGSM (Aug 3, 2017)

I see that it is ISO 40000 file ( according to EXIF data), but it looks like ISO 4000 file to me. could be due to oversampling / down sampling. I am looking at the posted JPG file. 



neuroanatomist said:


> SecureGSM said:
> 
> 
> > this image looks what 6D/ 1 DX / 5D IV files do look like at *ISO 4000* with good noise reduction applied. Not questioning the RAW EXIF data as it may well be was that dark.. and F9 , -0.7 EV exposure compensation and everything, but image does not looks falling apart or any signs of colour degradation. I am open to believe this new Canon sensor is that good... or may be not...
> ...


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## neuroanatomist (Aug 3, 2017)

SecureGSM said:


> I see that it is ISO 40000 file ( according to EXIF data), but it looks like ISO 4000 file to me. could be due to oversampling / down sampling. I am looking at the posted JPG file.



Or...it could just be a pretty good sensor.


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## SecureGSM (Aug 3, 2017)

better than the one in 1DX II? right! 



neuroanatomist said:


> SecureGSM said:
> 
> 
> > I see that it is ISO 40000 file ( according to EXIF data), but it looks like ISO 4000 file to me. could be due to oversampling / down sampling. I am looking at the posted JPG file.
> ...


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## hbr (Aug 3, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> SecureGSM said:
> 
> 
> > this image looks what 6D/ 1 DX / 5D IV files do look like at *ISO 4000* with good noise reduction applied. Not questioning the RAW EXIF data as it may well be was that dark.. and F9 , -0.7 EV exposure compensation and everything, but image does not looks falling apart or any signs of colour degradation. I am open to believe this new Canon sensor is that good... or may be not...
> ...



Hi Neuro,
I think he was saying that the picture looked as good as these other cameras at the lower, (4,000) ISO. I know that the noise reduction is much better than my 7DII.
It was not dark outside but the sky was overcast and I have never been able to take decent photos with any light under these trees without the noise level killing the detail. When editing the picture, you do lose some detail. The file on the link is the RAW file directly from the camera, (no editing except the values I set up in the camera).
Anyway, I have not been able to test the camera enough to recommend someone go buy it, but so far I am very happy with it.

Brian


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## hbr (Aug 3, 2017)

SecureGSM said:


> better than the one in 1DX II? right!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Hi, SecureGSM,
The RAW file that the JPEG was taken from is highly edited, the RAW file on the link is not. You should be able to copy or download the RAW file on the link and view the EXIF data in your RAW processing software.

Thanks,

Brian


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## SecureGSM (Aug 3, 2017)

No worries, Brian. I will have a go. Thank you.



hbr said:


> Hi, SecureGSM,
> The RAW file that the JPEG was taken from is highly edited, the RAW file on the link is not. You should be able to copy or download the RAW file on the link and view the EXIF data in your RAW processing software.
> 
> Thanks,
> ...


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## hbr (Aug 3, 2017)

Same setup but different photo that I just added to the link at ISO 32,000.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B2lFTWTRuXxtcHJlci1tLURMam8?usp=sharing


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## hbr (Aug 3, 2017)

Since this camera has been poo pooed s much, all I am trying to do here is to put up some RAW files straight out of the camera for the forum members so that they can download them and edit them for themselves to determine if this camera is really as bad as everyone is saying. 
These photos have nothing to do with my photography or editing skills. Until there are plenty of files and reviews for everyone to decide if they want to purchase one or not, I will be adding photos from time to time. I am not making any comments abut how good or how bad the camera is - now you can check it out for yourselves, other than to say That so far am very pleased with the camera.
Thanks,

Brian


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## LesC (Aug 3, 2017)

I'm far from an expert at noise reduction and this is just a quick effort processed in Photoshop CC - ACR. If it can do this at iso 40,000 I'm happy it will be an improvement on my original 6d and way better than my 80D!


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## SecureGSM (Aug 3, 2017)

here is a very quick one. please see attached. from what i can see, 6D II files are much easier to clean due to better quality of noise. its randomicity is more random  Hence easier for the RAW editor to differentiate noise from the data. I would say, it looks about 1/2 stop better than similar 6D files do.

p.s. actually, seems at least 2/3 of stop better than 6D original in the high ISO noise reduction department.
p.s.2. no sharpening or contrast adjustment were applied. I could clean up the file even more if that need be but it looks good to me as it is. I would not for a second hesitate shooting at ISO 6400 with this cam. 

(


LesC said:


> I'm far from an expert at noise reduction and this is just a quick effort processed in Photoshop CC - ACR. If it can do this at iso 40,000 I'm happy it will be an improvement on my original 6d and way better than my 80D!


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## hbr (Aug 3, 2017)

Here is my cleaned up file from the 32,000 ISO RAW File..


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## Luds34 (Aug 3, 2017)

stevelee said:


> LesC said:
> 
> 
> > For those who now have their 6D MKII - is the GPS function the same as the original 6D ie when you turn the camera off does the GPS still drain the battery unless of course you remove it?
> ...



I just got back into town last night and my 6D2 was waiting for me. I haven't had much time to play with it but I did see two modes for the GPS. One mode works just like the 6D, where it is on all the time. The 2nd mode, is that the GPS turns "off" when the camera is off. I say "off" as it apparently will occasionally check it's location and try to maintain things and that if one is not going to use the camera for a long time it is recommended to turn the GPS completely off. That's at least my understanding.


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## Luds34 (Aug 3, 2017)

Adelino said:


> Jack Douglas said:
> 
> 
> > One thing that's pretty obvious but still seems to be overlooked by some is this. Telephoto users like reach and so APSC gets acknowledged in that department. Well, wide angle users like wide angles and APSC doesn't fill that bill too well. Two cameras of course does the trick but I for one prefer only hiking with one; that's heavy enough and less clumsy.
> ...



I once thought like that (owned a 70D and a 6D). The 70D was my action camera, and the 6D my landscape, portrait style camera. Problem I ran into is that when I'd go somewhere I didn't always know what I wanted to do and I didn't like carrying two cameras. Sometimes one has to pay a premium to get "a little bit of everything" in one body.


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## Don Haines (Aug 3, 2017)

hbr said:


> Hi Don,
> 
> In the EXIF data the lens data will not show that the teleconverter is attached as it does on my other bodies. But The Focal length will show 560mm instead of 400mm and the aperture will show f/8. Interestingly also is that since the teleconverter is not reporting back to the camera as the Canon model would, I can use all 45 of the focus points available at f/8 with this combo.
> 
> ...


Mine arrived today.... 

First impression is that it seems like a toy beside the 7D2.....

The menus all seem to be intuitive, I will worry about the wifi and Bluetooth stuff later.

I like the tilt swivel screen and the touch interface makes changing settings better. It is hard to say which user interface is better, the 7D2 has better/nicer buttons knobs and switches, but the 6D touchscreen is really nice. Canon, if you are listening, PUT A TOUCHSCREEN ON THE 7D3!

AF system seems nice. A world better than the 6D, but not as good as the 7D2....

The goofy explanation that popped up on the screen every time you touched the mode dial can be turned off (YAY!)

to go take a few pictures!


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## hbr (Aug 4, 2017)

Don Haines said:


> Mine arrived today....
> 
> First impression is that it seems like a toy beside the 7D2.....
> 
> ...



I agree about it being like a toy against the 7D2 but wait until you see how much less noise you have, how easily the files clean up and actually being to shoot at high ISOs.

Congratulations on the purchase!

Brian


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## Don Haines (Aug 4, 2017)

hbr said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > Mine arrived today....
> ...


decided to be really stupid/brave.... shot this in a very dim room at ISO102400! First shot is an unprocessed crop, second shot is about 15 seconds worth of corrections in lightroom


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## hbr (Aug 4, 2017)

Great shots, Don. I am surprised that it cleaned up so well.I have taken some shots that in my living room with no lights and they were impossible to correct in DPP. The better one can properly expose his shots the easier it is to clean up the noise. That is something I have to get better at.

Looks like the sensor is pretty good, wouldn't you agree?

Brian

P.S. Sorry I made you spend 2 grand. (Hee Hee Hee)
P.S.2 It is so nice to be able to shoot indoors without using a flash.


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