# New 5DSR Vs. refurbished.



## Labdoc (Apr 26, 2017)

I am in the market for a 5DSR. Canon has refurbished for around $2800. I sent an email asking about if they had a shutter count policy concerning refurbished bodies and was told I could not get a shutter count on those products and they have no published policy on at what count do they do a replacement before sale. They reinforced the 1 year warranty and that they are proud of their refurbished products.

I can easily shoot over 1000 pics in a single day and I'm worried that in a year or two, I might need a new shutter on a refurb body. I have bought Canon refurb lenses in the past and been very satisfied but this is a little different with respect to wear and tear. Would folks buy it anyway and take a chance? How much does a new shutter run? I am a CPA member.


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## Eldar (Apr 26, 2017)

I have never bought a refurbished Canon product. However, I have used Canon for 40 years and I know the quality level of Canon services. There is no reason for Canon to push an inferior product through their refurbished sales. If it is a faulty product, it will show up during the warranty period. On that background, I would not hesitate to buy, if you think the price level/discount is right, compared to a new or alternative second hand.


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## R1-7D (Apr 26, 2017)

Just for interest's sake, I just bought a new 5DSr from a grey market dealer on eBay for $2768 USD. If you want new, it's definitely an option. The camera shipped to me in Canada without an problems.


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## tron (Apr 26, 2017)

I would also agree more with the grey import brand new choice assuming it is from a reputable seller.


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## nc0b (Apr 26, 2017)

I purchased my 5DsR gray market from GetItDigital before Canon shut them down. The 5DsR was $3K and I think the 100-400mm II was $1800. I don't know to what extent gray market still exists for Canon products. These purchases were over a year ago, and I couldn't be happier. Both products registered on line without any issues. I have only purchased a couple refurbished items, which all looked brand new. Neither were a body, so I don't know what would be typical as to shutter count. A replacement shutter isn't that expensive anyway. My brother purchased a refurbished 6D that had a very low shutter count. By the way, the cropping ability of images taken with the 5DsR is amazing. Often wildlife shot with a 400mm lens is still focal length limited. The 1.4X TC III does work well on on the aforementioned zoom with the 5DsR


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## Labdoc (Apr 26, 2017)

Thanks, it seems like a safe bet. 

I bought a grey market L lens last year and it also registered on line. Being overly cautious maybe to a fault, I ended up getting a 3 year replacement warranty from the dealer for accidental damage and manufacturer's defect. It kind of defeated the purpose of saving money but I did get a better warranty for the same price. Have had no problems with that lens.


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## stochasticmotions (Apr 26, 2017)

I bought a 5DS last year from canon refurb, no problems or issues at all. Most refurbs are returns that haven't been used much, but if you are very concerned about the shutter usage then you will likely feel more confident with the options above.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Apr 27, 2017)

Labdoc said:


> I am in the market for a 5DSR. Canon has refurbished for around $2800. I sent an email asking about if they had a shutter count policy concerning refurbished bodies and was told I could not get a shutter count on those products and they have no published policy on at what count do they do a replacement before sale. They reinforced the 1 year warranty and that they are proud of their refurbished products.
> 
> I can easily shoot over 1000 pics in a single day and I'm worried that in a year or two, I might need a new shutter on a refurb body. I have bought Canon refurb lenses in the past and been very satisfied but this is a little different with respect to wear and tear. Would folks buy it anyway and take a chance? How much does a new shutter run? I am a CPA member.



I've bought refurb cameras that could be checked for shutter count, they ranged from about 25 to 250. 

However, the sales that Canon has on refurb cameras sell out the popular ones in short order, sometimes in minutes.


Know what you want, and be ready to jump, otherwise they may be sld out as this camera is.

You can get a new USA model for $3199, which is about $200 more after taxes are added to the Canon Refurbished camera, so its not all that great of a deal.


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## timmy_650 (Apr 27, 2017)

I have brought two cameras from Canon refurbished. One of the first things I did was check the shutter. My t2i was 23 and and my 6D was like 50. To me that is pretty much brand new just them testing it. My plan was if my camera had a horrible high shutter count was just return it. I would buy refurbished before I brought grey market, if they were the same price.


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## monkey44 (Apr 27, 2017)

We bought 7D refurb with shutter count of 4, that's right FOUR clicks. And a 60D with 68 count. BOth were in like-new condition, with all accessories and in Canon box with refurb stamp ... Excellent products. We've bought lenses too, also excellent. All come with a Canon one-year warranty.

If the price is right, would never hesitate to go Refurb with Canon...


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## kirispupis (Apr 27, 2017)

You won't be able to check the shutter count of the 5DsR without sending it to Canon. I tried several different utilities with a 5DsR I bought from KEH and that's what I found out.

In terms of buying refurbished from Canon, I bought my 6D that way and had no issues.

Personally, especially for the 5DsR I would buy it refurbished or barely used. I had mine for about two months, but I was unhappy with the image quality so I wound up selling it for what I paid.


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## Maiaibing (Apr 27, 2017)

Labdoc said:


> I am in the market for a 5DSR. Canon has refurbished for around $2800.



You can get it new for $2598. Why even look at refurbished?


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## bluenoser1993 (Apr 27, 2017)

I bought a used 5Ds with 6k on the shutter (trusting the seller and aligned with the file numbers) just after Christmas for $3000 CAD. That's just a little over $2200 US, considering the tax on new or referb I am very happy with the savings.


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## kaswindell (Apr 27, 2017)

I purchased a refurb 5D3 from Canon about two years ago, it has been rock solid.


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## AcutancePhotography (Apr 27, 2017)

Labdoc said:


> I can easily shoot over 1000 pics in a single day



One thousand 60-80MB shots in a single day? Yikes That's a lotta data!!

What are you shooting that you need that many 50mp frames?


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## Hector1970 (Apr 27, 2017)

As some one who often shoots more than that in a day it is a crazy load of data. A 5D3 would be more practical. I prefer my 5DIV to the 5DSR and previouly my now deceased 5DIII.
The 5DSR is great at 100 ISO on a tripod. For it's goes downhill rapidly as the ISO goes up and you need steady hands.


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## C4RBON (Apr 27, 2017)

I would not hesitate to buy a refurbished 5DSR. I have bought 3 L lenses from Canon's refurbished store, and all three have been flawless. Other than not coming in retail packaging, I couldn't tell they had ever been used. I don't think many people buying $3500 cameras or $1500 lenses mistreat them brand new.

I personally would choose refurbished over new "gray market" because of the warranty.


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## monkey44 (Apr 27, 2017)

Whooops -- need to amend my comment above ... our Canon Refurb cameras and lenses came in white boxes, not Canon boxes. Not sure how much difference that makes, except when anyone resells it, the box shows an original Canon purchase, and not grey market. But again, I concur with most above that say refurbs are a solid purchase.


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## Skatol (Apr 27, 2017)

AcutancePhotography said:


> Labdoc said:
> 
> 
> > I can easily shoot over 1000 pics in a single day
> ...


I often go out for wildlife shoots and spend 10-14 hours per day. On a really good day with cooperative subjects I can easily hit 1500-2000 frames in a day. It takes about an hour to transfer 120GB. The trouble is culling through those shots to pick out the 10 - 15 keepers.

Back on topic...Canon refurb and service is incredible. I would not hesitate to purchase Canon refurb.


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## AlanF (Apr 27, 2017)

Why do you call yourself Skatol: = beta-methyl indole; a malodorous nitrogen compound found in feces, formed by protein decomposition in the intestines? (Skatos = Greek for sh*t).


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## Valvebounce (Apr 27, 2017)

Hi Alan. 
I'm going to go with "to find the anoraks out here that actually knew what it meant and see if anyone would ask!"  :   

Cheers, Graham. 



AlanF said:


> Why do you call yourself Skatol: = beta-methyl indole; a malodorous nitrogen compound found in feces, formed by protein decomposition in the intestines? (Skatos = Greek for sh*t).


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## tcmatthews (Apr 28, 2017)

I would not hesitate to buy a refurbished 5DSR from the Canon store if I was in the market for one. But I would wait for one of their sales. I bought a 7D II from them and it was in new condition. Still had all the original protective plastic covers. It came with new battery, charger and manual. But with a plain brown Canon box. 

I was tempted to buy one during the Black friday sell.


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## Skatol (Apr 28, 2017)

Valvebounce said:


> Hi Alan.
> I'm going to go with "to find the anoraks out here that actually knew what it meant and see if anyone would ask!"  :
> 
> Cheers, Graham.
> ...


This actually goes back about 15-20 years. We picked a word of the day from the dictionary and I came across this one. I used it as a gaming name because that's how I played. I also don't have to worry about coming up with a unique user name....no one else ever seems to use this one.  ;D


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## AlanF (Apr 28, 2017)

Valvebounce said:


> Hi Alan.
> I'm going to go with "to find the anoraks out here that actually knew what it meant and see if anyone would ask!"  :
> 
> Cheers, Graham.
> ...



In case you haven't realised it, Graham, CR is for anoraks: anorak = Derogatory term, most frequently directed at people who obsessively pursue hobbies which consist almost entirely of gathering information about a favourite topic, generally a fairly benign and arcane device such as a specific type of computer.


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## Eldar (Apr 28, 2017)

AlanF said:


> Valvebounce said:
> 
> 
> > Hi Alan.
> ...


Anorak in Norwegian is a special type of outer clothing, usually something we (used to) wear while skiing in the mountains. Colours preferably red or blue. If you are really crazy, you can wear grey.

Skatol, which is the old written form, now more commonly spelled Skatthold, is a special desk, which you can lock up, in the old days it was to hide the fact that you occasionally worked, today it is to hide from your wife that you spend too much time on CR ... :


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## Valvebounce (Apr 29, 2017)

Hi Alan. 
Here I am used to being an anorak about my specific brand of classic cars! Anoraks encompass cars, bikes, buses, trains and more. I never intended to be derogatory towards you, it was meant as a throw away comment plain and simple. 
My apologies if I did offend, unfortunately a lighthearted tone of voice seems to be lost when written, I did try with the string of emojis! 

Cheers, Graham. 



AlanF said:


> Valvebounce said:
> 
> 
> > Hi Alan.
> ...


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## bholliman (Apr 29, 2017)

Labdoc said:


> I am in the market for a 5DSR. Canon has refurbished for around $2800.



I have no experience buying refurbished camera bodies, but have purchased 5-6 refurbished lenses with excellent success. They were all flawless, looked and performed as good as the new lenses I've purchased. Your shutter count question is a good one, but I don't believe it that expensive to replace the shutter if it comes to that.



Hector1970 said:


> As some one who often shoots more than that in a day it is a crazy load of data. A 5D3 would be more practical. I prefer my 5DIV to the 5DSR and previouly my now deceased 5DIII.
> *The 5DSR is great at 100 ISO on a tripod. For it's goes downhill rapidly as the ISO goes up and you need steady hands.*



The myth of the 5Ds(R) being a tripod-only camera dies hard.

The 5DsR is definitely great at ISO 100 on or off a tripod, but its also excellent hand held at higher ISO's. I shoot up to ISO 3200 and occasionally 6400 without reservation. Sure, the 5DIV and 6D are better low light cameras, but the 5DsR is pretty capable at higher ISO's.

I use my 5DsR hand held 95% of the time have no problem getting sharp, clean images. You need somewhat better technique and higher shutter speeds than with a 5D3 or other 18-24mp FF camera, but it can certainly be used a as general purpose camera - that's how I use mine and couldn't be happier.


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## Rockskipper (Apr 29, 2017)

Not that it's of any consequence, but I bought a refurbished Canon M lens that came in a PowerShot box.

I thought maybe there'd been a mistake until I opened it. It was a perfect lens, looked brand new.


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## AlanF (Apr 29, 2017)

bholliman said:


> Labdoc said:
> 
> 
> > I am in the market for a 5DSR. Canon has refurbished for around $2800.
> ...


+ 1
I use it at my standard iso 640 setting for routine bird photography hand held. The noise level and image degradation are hardly worse than with the 5DIV, and the lack of AA filter gives it a real edge. I am spoiled for choice between using my 5DIV and 5DSR. For telephoto work, the 5DSR has about the same resolution as the same lens on the 5DIV with a 1.4xTC, and has an extra stop of light plus less shake with a shorter focal length, which is usually gives better results.


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## Act444 (May 2, 2017)

Pair the 5DSR with a top-quality lens and it will not get in your way. The only thing to watch would be shutter speed.

Of course, if the light requires above ISO 6400, from my experience you're better off with a 5D3 or 5D4. At 6400, the R files do NOT take very much brightening before falling apart.


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## Eldar (May 2, 2017)

This is not a new vs. refurbished, but a highly unscientific 5DSR vs. 1DX-II.

I was able to shoot this kingfisher with both the 5DSR and 1DX-II. It was sitting on the same branch and lighting was pretty similar. The 1DX-II shots were a bit over exposed, so I had to reduce exposure by one stop in post. Both are shot with the 600 f4L IS II + 2xIII extender, mounted on a RRS TVC34 tripod with a RRS full gimbal and cropped a lot. You can check the resolution figures. 

AFMA becomes absolutely critical, but very difficult at 1200mm. However, I believe they both are OK.

First is 5DSR, second 1DX-II


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## privatebydesign (May 2, 2017)

Hi Eldar,

Very interesting real world sample. I was interested in the 5DSr but decided I would wait for the MkII that will have the various niceties and sensor tech the 5D MkIV has.

Do you have any other insights into using the two cameras side by side?


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## privatebydesign (May 2, 2017)

Eldar, I took the liberty of downloading both your images and resizing the 1DX MkII to the pixel dimensions of the 5DSr in PS set to Bicubic Smoother along with a Smart Sharpen layer.

Personally I am shocked at how little difference there is. Obviously you have the ability to do the same enlargement/resample to the 5DSr file so the differences would still potentially be there, but it was a bit of an eye opener for me yet again. I did a similar comparison to the 1DS MkIII and 7D years ago with very similar results.

I attach a full sized screenshot of both images at 100% view.


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## Eldar (May 2, 2017)

privatebydesign said:


> Hi Eldar,
> 
> Very interesting real world sample. I was interested in the 5DSr but decided I would wait for the MkII that will have the various niceties and sensor tech the 5D MkIV has.
> 
> Do you have any other insights into using the two cameras side by side?


I have used it side by side with a 1DX and now the 1DX-II on several occasions, including two safaris in Africa. Those who claim that the 5DSR is a specialist tool and is made for studio, tripod and slow photography work, have either never used one or alternatively don´t have a clue what they´re doing. I am very happy with it and I have used it for just about anything. I almost sold it, when I bought the Hasselblad, but I decided not to. It can do lots of stuff the Hasselblad is incapable of, so I´ll hang on to it. Nobody should be surprised if I buy the Mk-II when it comes. In your case Scott, I believe you would have been very happy with one, especially in a combo with a 1DX-II.

With the 5DSR you have to be more concerned with shutter speed. So in general terms, compared to a 1DX/1DX-II, you lose one stop, unless you have lots of light. If you´re not careful with this, you lose the advantage of its resolution. AF is very good, but not as good as the 1D alternatives and not as good as the 5DIV.

Exposure is a bit more critical on the 5DSR. If you under-expose on anything above ISO800, you will have problems in post processing. Shadow areas fall apart faster than with the 1DX-II. However, if you expose correctly, you can make very good results at very high ISO settings.

I like the button layout on the 1DX-II better than the 5D cameras. However, in actual shooting situations, I rely on exactly the same buttons, which are pretty much in the same position, so in landscape mode I don´t even have to think.

Having used the vertical grip on a 1D camera as much as I have, I really don´t like the battery grips for the 5D series (or any of the others for that matter). They are just big and bulky. So I am using my 5D cameras without one. That makes portrait shooting, with big lenses, a bit of a problem. However, I prefer that to the battery grip. A problem though is that all my horizons are tilted, when I shoot in portrait.

Here´s the full size image I posted above, shot at 1200mm. I cropped this to 2000x3000 pixels and printed on a 13x19 and it turned out great. There is a river between where I stood and where the bird is nesting, so I cannot get any closer. I don´t believe you find many cameras that could have made as useful a shot as this, at that distance.


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## Eldar (May 2, 2017)

privatebydesign said:


> Eldar, I took the liberty of downloading both your images and resizing the 1DX MkII to the pixel dimensions of the 5DSr in PS set to Bicubic Smoother along with a Smart Sharpen layer.
> 
> Personally I am shocked at how little difference there is. Obviously you have the ability to do the same enlargement/resample to the 5DSr file so the differences would still potentially be there, but it was a bit of an eye opener for me yet again. I did a similar comparison to the 1DS MkIII and 7D years ago with very similar results.
> 
> I attach a full sized screenshot of both images at 100% view.


I made a comment in an other thread earlier that the quality of the 1DX-II images makes it look like a much higher jump in resolution than the actual numbers. It is apparent that the actual pixel quality is very high and a big jump from its predecessors. DR, colour quality and how noise appears is clearly a division above the others. You´ll see some of the same effect with the 5DIV.


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## privatebydesign (May 2, 2017)

Thanks for those followups Eldar. 

I'm sure I'll end up with the same conclusions as you, the 1DX MkII's are supposed to ship early next week and I have bid on a few secondhand 5DSr's but really want the newer sensor tech from the 1DX MkII and 5D MkIV you point out is noticeable so am holding out for the 5DSr MkII. Because of that my bidding has been unenthusiastic ;D

Also toying with getting an M-5 for a personal trip to Hawaii in a few weeks, turns out to be the year of the body for me...

Thanks again for your insights.


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## jeanluc (May 7, 2017)

I too was thinking 5dsr vs 5d4. I went with the 5d4. Literally just finished a week of landscape shooting, can't wait to see how stuff looks compared to my 5d3. 

I shoot almost all my landscapes with live view, and the dual pixel af together with the touch screen makes this way easier and faster than on the 5d3. So I would wait for the 5dsr mk 2 and it's new sensor tech at this point, or get a 5d4. The difference while actually shooting is worth the wait imho.

I also got a m5 for a Hawaii trip, and it is a very, very good camera. IQ with the efm lenses is very acceptable, and the new sensor tech is very noticeable in post. Shadow noise is very low. I am going there again in a few months, seriously thinking of taking the m5 instead of the 5d4 just for portability. Am planning on some lava at night shooting if it works out, that is my only concern on just going with the m5.

When the 5dsr mk 2 cones out, I'm in.


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## LonelyBoy (May 12, 2017)

Eldar said:


> I made a comment in an other thread earlier that the quality of the 1DX-II images makes it look like a much higher jump in resolution than the actual numbers. It is apparent that the actual pixel quality is very high and a big jump from its predecessors. DR, colour quality and how noise appears is clearly a division above the others. You´ll see some of the same effect with the 5DIV.



Is it crazy that I feel the same about the 1D3? Every time I look at the images from one of those they look creamy and beautiful, despite the low resolution. Makes me wish I could get a modern version of the same sensor into a smaller body.


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## LonelyBoy (Jun 16, 2017)

Eldar said:


> AlanF said:
> 
> 
> > Valvebounce said:
> ...



Anorak came to mean "nerd" (sorta) because British (I think it was British) trainspotters would watch and record train passage while wearing anorak jackets, because it's Britain and cold. Anorak then went from referring to a coat to referring to trainspotter nerds to nerds of all stripes.

If you're on this forum you probably qualify.


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