# EOS 7D Replacement Coming for CP+? [CR1]



## Canon Rumors Guy (Jan 11, 2014)

```
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<p>The CP+ trade show runs in Tokyo, Japan from February 13, 2014 until February 16, 2014. Canon has announced products for this show in the past.</p>
<p>There’s word that Canon will announce the replacement to the EOS 7D for this show as well as “other products”. We’re told a couple of lenses and PowerShot cameras should also be expected.</p>
<p>More to come….</p>
<p>Source: [<a href="http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/cameras/Canon_rumours.html" target="_blank">NL</a>]</p>
<p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">c</span>r</strong></p>
```


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## chmteacher (Jan 11, 2014)

In for one.


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## candc (Jan 11, 2014)

Yah! I hope its true and this camera is what we're expecting. I have a 70d but I want a bigger camera with an even better AF system and more resolution for wildlife shooting with the big lenses.


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## stilscream (Jan 11, 2014)

30MP, 8fps with 240fps @1080 video built in wifi, same rugged build, dual card slots, better af and IQ. That would sell me.


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## mkabi (Jan 11, 2014)

stilscream said:


> 30MP, 8fps with 240fps @1080 video built in wifi, same rugged build, dual card slots, better af and IQ. That would sell me.



Look at your current equipment list, and be happy with what you have...
Second, always expect the worse so that when something better does show up... You're pleasantly surprised, instead of being underwhelmed and pissed off at the "lack of innovation" by Canon.

I think it will be exactly like the 70D, plus
-more fps
-better ISO
-pro-body


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## candc (Jan 11, 2014)

mkabi said:


> stilscream said:
> 
> 
> > 30MP, 8fps with 240fps @1080 video built in wifi, same rugged build, dual card slots, better af and IQ. That would sell me.
> ...



All the rumors are saying, "new sensor" I am hoping 24mp and good at iso 6400.


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## RomainF (Jan 11, 2014)

candc said:


> mkabi said:
> 
> 
> > stilscream said:
> ...



LoL
You want a somehow better camera than the 1Dx… for 2500$. That'd be too easy.


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## Don Haines (Jan 11, 2014)

RomainF said:


> candc said:
> 
> 
> > mkabi said:
> ...


And gold plated with a lizard-skin grip.....


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## candc (Jan 11, 2014)

RomainF said:


> candc said:
> 
> 
> > mkabi said:
> ...



I suppose the extra mp isn't necessary but the 70d is good at iso 1600, marginal at 3200. So its reasonable to think that this new one will be good at 6400, that's progress and that's what I am looking for.


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## Twostones (Jan 11, 2014)

I would be happy with a better focus point system, higher ISO performance, Pro weather sealed body and a larger better performing sensor. I'm not really interested in Wi-Fi or GPS. Photo quality is what I am seeking.


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## mhlas7 (Jan 11, 2014)

What do you guys think the new lens(s) will be? Personaly I'm hoping for the rumored 50 f/1.8 IS.


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## mkabi (Jan 11, 2014)

candc said:


> mkabi said:
> 
> 
> > stilscream said:
> ...



70D sensor is a "new sensor"
They never said that it would be different from the 70D sensor, 
And guess what...its never been in the 7D before 
Again, dont expect too much and if they give us 24MP sensor... Cool...


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## Gert Arijs (Jan 11, 2014)

If they put dual pixels in it, they could do one line iso 100, the other iso 1600 and have incredible DR. Without losing resolution etc. It would be copying Magic Lantern but no one would complain .
I just hope it to be worth the (quite long...) wait. And if too expensive, i'll get a 5d3 first and some years later a 7d2.
In for a new ine and waiting for 2 years now...


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## ewg963 (Jan 11, 2014)

Excellent I'm very interested in seeing the specs.


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## bradcast46 (Jan 12, 2014)

Thoughts on the 7D Mark II (or whatever they call it): It appears Canon is putting a lot of effort into dual pixel technology and we’ve heard there is more to come in terms of capabilities with this sensor structure. If we want to make DSLRs better, as far as I’m concerned, one of the last remaining flaws in these cameras is autofocus for stills. Especially with lenses at f2 or wider, focus can often be off. Focus micro-adjust can mostly fix this on cameras that have this ability. I’ve shot with my f1.4 lenses wide-open occasionally and my “hit rate” for proper focus, even though the camera says I was in-focus, is not all that great. This is after I’ve micro-adjusted the lenses to the camera. Auto-focus sensors optimized for f2.8 are just not that accurate with faster lenses.
Let me proposed a way to fix this. We know a camera that knows which of its autofocus points is in-focus, can matched it to a spot on the image sensor. We can also estimate that an exposure sensor, with enough pixels, could keep track of where this point is, even if you recompose before taking the shot. Starting with this, after the shutter bottom in pushed, in single-shot mode the camera would swing the mirror up, then fire the shutter let’s say at the flash-synch speed (~1/200 sec) where the entire sensor is exposed. At this point the dual pixel sensor could fine-tune the focus at the point it knows is the intended focus point. The shutter could then close and reopen again to make the image. Another way to do this is to open the mechanical shutter and fine-tune focus, and then allow an electronic shutter to take the final image, before closing the mechanical shutter. This technique could probably be used at a low-rate continuous shooting mode (eg. 3-5 fps, as I assume the max. 10-12 fps is set more by the mirror mechanism than the mechanical shutter). This technique could only be used with decent ambient light and would not work below a certain illumination. But perhaps flash could be made to work with this technique. With enough light, this technique could allow lenses with teleconverters that produce an effective F-stop higher than f5.6 or f8 to be autofocused. I assume this would be a selectable feature on the camera and not necessarily the default. Just some thoughts on how dual pixel could make DSLRs better.


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## RGomezPhotos (Jan 12, 2014)

A month away.. Good timing too.

I for one am going to be extremely optimistic that the 7D replacement is going to knock a lot of socks off. I hope it's going to be the benchmark for which all other APS-C cameras are measured by for quite a while.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jan 12, 2014)

Gert Arijs said:


> If they put dual pixels in it, they could do one line iso 100, the other iso 1600 and have incredible DR. Without losing resolution etc. It would be copying Magic Lantern but no one would complain .
> I just hope it to be worth the (quite long...) wait. And if too expensive, i'll get a 5d3 first and some years later a 7d2.
> In for a new ine and waiting for 2 years now...


Why do you believe it would be copying Magic Lantern? Canon reveived a patent that allows for it and applied for the patent some years ago. Its the other way around, except that the Canon patent will work and not just halfway.


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## RomainF (Jan 12, 2014)

bradcast46 said:


> Thoughts on the 7D Mark II (or whatever they call it): It appears Canon is putting a lot of effort into dual pixel technology and we’ve heard there is more to come in terms of capabilities with this sensor structure. If we want to make DSLRs better, as far as I’m concerned, one of the last remaining flaws in these cameras is autofocus for stills. Especially with lenses at f2 or wider, focus can often be off. Focus micro-adjust can mostly fix this on cameras that have this ability. I’ve shot with my f1.4 lenses wide-open occasionally and my “hit rate” for proper focus, even though the camera says I was in-focus, is not all that great. This is after I’ve micro-adjusted the lenses to the camera. Auto-focus sensors optimized for f2.8 are just not that accurate with faster lenses.
> Let me proposed a way to fix this. We know a camera that knows which of its autofocus points is in-focus, can matched it to a spot on the image sensor. We can also estimate that an exposure sensor, with enough pixels, could keep track of where this point is, even if you recompose before taking the shot. Starting with this, after the shutter bottom in pushed, in single-shot mode the camera would swing the mirror up, then fire the shutter let’s say at the flash-synch speed (~1/200 sec) where the entire sensor is exposed. At this point the dual pixel sensor could fine-tune the focus at the point it knows is the intended focus point. The shutter could then close and reopen again to make the image. Another way to do this is to open the mechanical shutter and fine-tune focus, and then allow an electronic shutter to take the final image, before closing the mechanical shutter. This technique could probably be used at a low-rate continuous shooting mode (eg. 3-5 fps, as I assume the max. 10-12 fps is set more by the mirror mechanism than the mechanical shutter). This technique could only be used with decent ambient light and would not work below a certain illumination. But perhaps flash could be made to work with this technique. With enough light, this technique could allow lenses with teleconverters that produce an effective F-stop higher than f5.6 or f8 to be autofocused. I assume this would be a selectable feature on the camera and not necessarily the default. Just some thoughts on how dual pixel could make DSLRs better.



I invite you to have a look to the Hasselblad "True Focus" system.


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## Marauder (Jan 12, 2014)

I'm very excited for this camera! I think that 24mp and 10-12fps with a 61pt AF system isn't unreasonable given that it matches the specs for the prototypes that were previously mentioned. It's possible that the 70D's sensor could be used, but we've already had one rebuttal rumour that indicated the 7D II (or whatever it get's called--for the sake of simplicity, I'll refer to it as 7D II for the rest of this post) will have a brand new sensor and will not share the 70D's. That makes sense. I expect the 70D's sensor will find its way into the 2014 Rebel lineup, and I think Canon will want to differentiate the 7D II from the rest of the APC lineup, especially given the much, much higher price. Will it be worth it, when one can buy a full-frame 6D for much less? Absolutely! I've said it before, but it bears repeating, different camera's fit different types of photographer and photography. If I was shooting a wedding or other low-light event, I'd prefer a 6D or 5D II full-frame camera to any APS-C camera. But I'm not, and neither of those cameras would be stellar performers for the wildlife and action based photography that is my passion. Granted, a 5D III, with its superb AF system and decent (6fps) burst-rate still makes a good choice for either type of photography (unlike the 6D and 5D II), but still a 7D II with 10-12 fps and the cropped frames tighter framing with a given lens makes a very compelling camera for wildlife and sports photography. 
I often read here the opinion that the 7D II won't be special because it would be too close to the 1DX, but I don't concur with that assessment at all. No matter how good the chip is, the APS-C isn't going to match the low-light capability of the 1DX and pros are still going to prefer it (and whatever replaces it), although I will not be surprised if many of them don't grab a 7D II as a second body! In the end though, they are competing in different market-places. What's more, Canon isn't bringing this camera out in a vacuum--they need to make sure this camera is good enough to lead APS-C technology for the net 3-5 years, so it has to be more that merely "good." Like the original 7D, it must be ground-breaking and class-leading if it's going to compete in the $2,000 + price range. It should also be remembered that when the original 7D arrived in 2009, the top of the line action camera in the Canon lineup was the 1D III, with 10MP and 10fps. Canon didn't worry that the 7D matched it with 19 cross-type AF points (although the 1D III has 45 AF points, only 19 of them are user-selectable and cross-type). If they didn't worry about making the 7D too close to the current 1D III in 2009, I doubt they'll worry about the 7D II being too close to the 1DX in 2014! This is especially true given the level of competition the new camera faces compared to what the 7D did 5 years ago. Why will the 7D II be awesome? Because it simply HAS to be! Of course, there will still be nay-sayers, even if it has the specs I expect it will have. I've seen posts where someone wrote "yawn" at these very specs, even as I was salivating over them! And I've read repeatedly that many just don't "get it" when one can buy a full-frame camera for less, or because it will be big and "pro", rather than small and mirrorless. I think they miss the essential point--those of us who want this camera, know what we want, and why we want it. If it doesn't fit your style of photography, then of course you ought not to buy one--purchase the camera that fits your shooting style and subjects. Photography would be far less interesting if there was just one style of camera and one kind of photography. Myself--I can't wait for this camera! 
On a side note, I'm more interested in specs and capabilities than I am in the name, but I DO think 7D Mark II has a GREAT ring to it!!! ;D


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## Chosenbydestiny (Jan 12, 2014)

Even to have the ISO capability just barely below the 5D mark II from Canon would be a miracle =P


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## Don Haines (Jan 12, 2014)

Marauder said:


> I'm very excited for this camera! I think that 24mp and 10-12fps with a 61pt AF system isn't unreasonable given that it matches the specs for the prototypes that were previously mentioned. It's possible that the 70D's sensor could be used, but we've already had one rebuttal rumour that indicated the 7D II (or whatever it get's called--for the sake of simplicity, I'll refer to it as 7D II for the rest of this post) will have a brand new sensor and will not share the 70D's. That makes sense. I expect the 70D's sensor will find its way into the 2014 Rebel lineup, and I think Canon will want to differentiate the 7D II from the rest of the APC lineup, especially given the much, much higher price. Will it be worth it, when one can buy a full-frame 6D for much less? Absolutely! I've said it before, but it bears repeating, different camera's fit different types of photographer and photography. If I was shooting a wedding or other low-light event, I'd prefer a 6D or 5D II full-frame camera to any APS-C camera. But I'm not, and neither of those cameras would be stellar performers for the wildlife and action based photography that is my passion. Granted, a 5D III, with its superb AF system and decent (6fps) burst-rate still makes a good choice for either type of photography (unlike the 6D and 5D II), but still a 7D II with 10-12 fps and the cropped frames tighter framing with a given lens makes a very compelling camera for wildlife and sports photography.
> I often read here the opinion that the 7D II won't be special because it would be too close to the 1DX, but I don't concur with that assessment at all. No matter how good the chip is, the APS-C isn't going to match the low-light capability of the 1DX and pros are still going to prefer it (and whatever replaces it), although I will not be surprised if many of them don't grab a 7D II as a second body! In the end though, they are competing in different market-places. What's more, Canon isn't bringing this camera out in a vacuum--they need to make sure this camera is good enough to lead APS-C technology for the net 3-5 years, so it has to be more that merely "good." Like the original 7D, it must be ground-breaking and class-leading if it's going to compete in the $2,000 + price range. It should also be remembered that when the original 7D arrived in 2009, the top of the line action camera in the Canon lineup was the 1D III, with 10MP and 10fps. Canon didn't worry that the 7D matched it with 19 cross-type AF points (although the 1D III has 45 AF points, only 19 of them are user-selectable and cross-type). If they didn't worry about making the 7D too close to the current 1D III in 2009, I doubt they'll worry about the 7D II being too close to the 1DX in 2014! This is especially true given the level of competition the new camera faces compared to what the 7D did 5 years ago. Why will the 7D II be awesome? Because it simply HAS to be! Of course, there will still be nay-sayers, even if it has the specs I expect it will have. I've seen posts where someone wrote "yawn" at these very specs, even as I was salivating over them! And I've read repeatedly that many just don't "get it" when one can buy a full-frame camera for less, or because it will be big and "pro", rather than small and mirrorless. I think they miss the essential point--those of us who want this camera, know what we want, and why we want it. If it doesn't fit your style of photography, then of course you ought not to buy one--purchase the camera that fits your shooting style and subjects. Photography would be far less interesting if there was just one style of camera and one kind of photography. Myself--I can't wait for this camera!
> On a side note, I'm more interested in specs and capabilities than I am in the name, but I DO think 7D Mark II has a GREAT ring to it!!! ;D



WELL SAID!


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## ScottyP (Jan 12, 2014)

Don Haines said:


> Marauder said:
> 
> 
> > I'm very excited for this camera! I think that 24mp and 10-12fps with a 61pt AF system isn't unreasonable given that it matches the specs for the prototypes that were previously mentioned. It's possible that the 70D's sensor could be used, but we've already had one rebuttal rumour that indicated the 7D II (or whatever it get's called--for the sake of simplicity, I'll refer to it as 7D II for the rest of this post) will have a brand new sensor and will not share the 70D's. That makes sense. I expect the 70D's sensor will find its way into the 2014 Rebel lineup, and I think Canon will want to differentiate the 7D II from the rest of the APC lineup, especially given the much, much higher price. Will it be worth it, when one can buy a full-frame 6D for much less? Absolutely! I've said it before, but it bears repeating, different camera's fit different types of photographer and photography. If I was shooting a wedding or other low-light event, I'd prefer a 6D or 5D II full-frame camera to any APS-C camera. But I'm not, and neither of those cameras would be stellar performers for the wildlife and action based photography that is my passion. Granted, a 5D III, with its superb AF system and decent (6fps) burst-rate still makes a good choice for either type of photography (unlike the 6D and 5D II), but still a 7D II with 10-12 fps and the cropped frames tighter framing with a given lens makes a very compelling camera for wildlife and sports photography.
> ...




Correct. It has to be. If they don't have a truly new and better sensor they need to wait until they do. An extra couple fps is not enough improvement to justify the upgrade. Nor is improved AF alone, since the AF was already pretty good. 

Improved high ISO performance is what would set it apart. Improved DR would also get noticed. I hope we see some of that.


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## Richard8971 (Jan 12, 2014)

mkabi said:


> Look at your current equipment list, and be happy with what you have...



I couldn't agree more. Of course I am anxious to see what Canon will come out with if they decide to replace the 7D, but I am really happy with my current 7.

Unless something happens to my camera, I don't plan on buying a new camera anytime soon, even if the 7D2 comes out in the next few months. There isn't a camera body that's currently better than my 7D for the money.

Even if something does happen to my 7D, replacement bodies are cheap right now and will be even cheaper if and when the 7D2 comes out. I will probably be shooting with this camera for quite some time. 

D


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## Don Haines (Jan 12, 2014)

ScottyP said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > Marauder said:
> ...



I really hope it is a new sensor.... the old sensor design is subject to ghosting...


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## jrista (Jan 12, 2014)

ScottyP said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > Marauder said:
> ...



Totally agree. The 7D II needs to be more than a mediocre evolution...it needs to contain a little bit of revolution! 8)


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## starship (Jan 12, 2014)

*EOS 7D Replacement: it needs a far better sensor-quality than the 7d,70d,60d... *

*i will buy a new 7D if it´s sensor has...*


... a minimum of 1/2ev better (raw-) high-iso performance (compared to all that 7d,70d,60d,700d,600d,550d sensors)
... 2+ ev better dynamic range
... 20-24 mpix


in other words: ... the sensor has to have *at least* the quality of the current nikon/sony dslrs

i won´t buy any new 7D with a *raw-image-quality* of all the (more ore less) same 7d, 70d, 60d, 700d, 600d, 550d sensor-design, canon is offering since 2009.


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## jrista (Jan 12, 2014)

*Re: EOS 7D Replacement: it needs a far better sensor-quality than the 7d,70d,60d... *



starship said:


> *i will buy a new 7D if it´s sensor has...*
> 
> 
> ... a minimum of 1/2ev better (raw-) high-iso performance (compared to all that 7d,70d,60d,700d,600d,550d sensors)
> ...



From another site:



> Some info of upcoming 7D Mark II:
> 
> Speed, AF and high ISO performance will be improved.
> Solidly built
> ...



No mention of more DR, sadly. Sounds like all the rest of the things on your list, however, should make it.

I suspect we won't see improved DR until the big megapixel camera. Not sure why, but for some reason I don't see that making it'ts way into the 7D II first...given that the 7D II is primarily an action shooter's camera, which means most users would be using higher ISO more so than low ISO. Outside of doubling the 7D II's Q.E., it's also unlikely we'll see a massive improvement in noise quality with the 7D II. I suspect a moderate improvement, along with a full stop higher native ISO (12800 native, 25600 and maybe 51200 expanded.) 

One of the things I'm very curious about with the 7D II is how strong it's AA filter will be. I like AA filters. I don't like them to be too weak, however I guess the 7D II could withstand a slightly weaker AA filter than the 7D, and not suffer too much from moire. I certainly hope it does NOT drop the AA filter...IMO, that would ruin it for one of it's primary use cases: bird photography. Bird feathers are about the most supreme way to create interference patterns on the face of the planet.


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## Chaitanya (Jan 12, 2014)

This was a long wait. I hope Canon adds improved AF unit and a dual memory card slot. I really don't care about Megapixels or video features as most of times I only shoot Macro and birds.


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## Marauder (Jan 12, 2014)

jrista said:


> ScottyP said:
> 
> 
> > Don Haines said:
> ...



Exactly. And there was a rumour sometime ago that the 7D II sensor was going to be a major upgrade to noise reduction compared to previous generations. That being said, I think we naturally do need to keep realistic expectations. I certainly don't expect it to match the 5D III or the 6D in that regard, and I don't know if it will even come close to the 5D II for that matter. Full-frame is king when it comes to noise performance. But the comparisons I've seen between the 70D and the 7D on a couple of threads show that the former handily outperforms the latter in terms of noise performance, and I'd like to see that trend continued even further. Many reviews appear to indicate that the D7100 slightly outperforms the 70D in noise performance, so at least matching the competition's APS-C sensors should be a definite goal. Still, it's the improved AF that most interests me. My current 7D really hits the AF at times, but at other times, it's just slightly out, especially in Servo with BIF. Frustrating when you can see that your AF point was right where you wanted it to be, but the pic is still out. Irritating when other images in the burst, are tack sharp! I mean, if I can't hold the AF point on target, well I won't blame the camera, but it's aggravating when one tracks the target and STILL has an OOF shot! Grrr. I'm pretty happy with 8 fps currently, but 10 or 12 (especially 12!) would be awesome! More images to choose from for fast subjects like birds in flight and aircraft doing cross-overs at airshows, all nicely in focus (as long as I do my part!) would be fantastic. Add in a reasonable (within the laws of physics) improvement in low light and this will be an amazing camera! 
Oh, and thanks for the compliment Don! Love the "ghosting" 7D shot! LOL Happens on the T3i too, as you will see in this spectral self-portrait!!! LOL ;D


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## mkabi (Jan 12, 2014)

*Re: EOS 7D Replacement: it needs a far better sensor-quality than the 7d,70d,60d... *



jrista said:


> From another site:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Remember the 70D sensor is over 20MP by 0.2


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## RGomezPhotos (Jan 12, 2014)

Marauder said:


> I'm very excited for this camera! I think that 24mp and 10-12fps with a 61pt AF system isn't unreasonable given that it matches the specs for the prototypes that were previously mentioned. It's possible that the 70D's sensor could be used, but we've already had one rebuttal rumour that indicated the 7D II (or whatever it get's called--for the sake of simplicity, I'll refer to it as 7D II for the rest of this post) will have a brand new sensor and will not share the 70D's. That makes sense. I expect the 70D's sensor will find its way into the 2014 Rebel lineup, and I think Canon will want to differentiate the 7D II from the rest of the APC lineup, especially given the much, much higher price. Will it be worth it, when one can buy a full-frame 6D for much less? Absolutely! I've said it before, but it bears repeating, different camera's fit different types of photographer and photography. If I was shooting a wedding or other low-light event, I'd prefer a 6D or 5D II full-frame camera to any APS-C camera. But I'm not, and neither of those cameras would be stellar performers for the wildlife and action based photography that is my passion. Granted, a 5D III, with its superb AF system and decent (6fps) burst-rate still makes a good choice for either type of photography (unlike the 6D and 5D II), but still a 7D II with 10-12 fps and the cropped frames tighter framing with a given lens makes a very compelling camera for wildlife and sports photography.
> I often read here the opinion that the 7D II won't be special because it would be too close to the 1DX, but I don't concur with that assessment at all. No matter how good the chip is, the APS-C isn't going to match the low-light capability of the 1DX and pros are still going to prefer it (and whatever replaces it), although I will not be surprised if many of them don't grab a 7D II as a second body! In the end though, they are competing in different market-places. What's more, Canon isn't bringing this camera out in a vacuum--they need to make sure this camera is good enough to lead APS-C technology for the net 3-5 years, so it has to be more that merely "good." Like the original 7D, it must be ground-breaking and class-leading if it's going to compete in the $2,000 + price range. It should also be remembered that when the original 7D arrived in 2009, the top of the line action camera in the Canon lineup was the 1D III, with 10MP and 10fps. Canon didn't worry that the 7D matched it with 19 cross-type AF points (although the 1D III has 45 AF points, only 19 of them are user-selectable and cross-type). If they didn't worry about making the 7D too close to the current 1D III in 2009, I doubt they'll worry about the 7D II being too close to the 1DX in 2014! This is especially true given the level of competition the new camera faces compared to what the 7D did 5 years ago. Why will the 7D II be awesome? Because it simply HAS to be! Of course, there will still be nay-sayers, even if it has the specs I expect it will have. I've seen posts where someone wrote "yawn" at these very specs, even as I was salivating over them! And I've read repeatedly that many just don't "get it" when one can buy a full-frame camera for less, or because it will be big and "pro", rather than small and mirrorless. I think they miss the essential point--those of us who want this camera, know what we want, and why we want it. If it doesn't fit your style of photography, then of course you ought not to buy one--purchase the camera that fits your shooting style and subjects. Photography would be far less interesting if there was just one style of camera and one kind of photography. Myself--I can't wait for this camera!
> On a side note, I'm more interested in specs and capabilities than I am in the name, but I DO think 7D Mark II has a GREAT ring to it!!! ;D



Well said. Though try using some paragraphs :-D

I really hope the 7D II will rock. The specs I've seen are pretty darn good IMO. I would LOVE to have a 7D MKII for my event/action photography. I love my 50D but with it's ISO of 1600, it gets really difficult to photograph a poorly lit event. Even with a flash. Yes, you'll get your subject well lit, but how about the surroundings?

Even if the ISO performance is one stop down from the 5D MKIII, the 7D MKII would be a hot camera. I still drool over the pictures I saw from a 5D MKIII taken at 10k ISO...


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## Marauder (Jan 12, 2014)

LOL There are paragraphs...I just didn't separate them well enough to have them appear sufficiently....er....paragraphie.  Look! I just invented a word!!!!


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## jrista (Jan 12, 2014)

Marauder said:


> Still, it's the improved AF that most interests me. My current 7D really hits the AF at times, but at other times, it's just slightly out, especially in Servo with BIF. Frustrating when you can see that your AF point was right where you wanted it to be, but the pic is still out. Irritating when other images in the burst, are tack sharp! I mean, if I can't hold the AF point on target, well I won't blame the camera, but it's aggravating when one tracks the target and STILL has an OOF shot! Grrr. I'm pretty happy with 8 fps currently, but 10 or 12 (especially 12!) would be awesome!



Ditto! I've complained about it before. I call it the 7D AF jitter...even though the subject remains exactly where it was, the 7D AF system just can't seem to sit still, particularly in AI Servo. It actually kind of diminishes the value of 8fps when shooting continuously. The hit rate can reduce the sharp keeper rate down th 4-6 shots out of every 8, and it's extremely annoying. Probably the most annoying thing about the 7D. Really hope the 7D II gets the 61pt AF system (or something very similar, like a 51pt or 41pt system.)


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## sanj (Jan 12, 2014)

Are we not tired of discussing 7DII over the last full year again and again?


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## MichaelHodges (Jan 12, 2014)

jrista said:


> Marauder said:
> 
> 
> > Still, it's the improved AF that most interests me. My current 7D really hits the AF at times, but at other times, it's just slightly out, especially in Servo with BIF. Frustrating when you can see that your AF point was right where you wanted it to be, but the pic is still out. Irritating when other images in the burst, are tack sharp! I mean, if I can't hold the AF point on target, well I won't blame the camera, but it's aggravating when one tracks the target and STILL has an OOF shot! Grrr. I'm pretty happy with 8 fps currently, but 10 or 12 (especially 12!) would be awesome!
> ...



My 7D is in the shop right now for this (second time). It works great at focal lengths below 150mm, but AF consistency drops big time with telephoto lenses, especially in AI Servo. Combined with the high noise, a frustrating camera.


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## jrista (Jan 12, 2014)

sanj said:


> Are we not tired of discussing 7DII over the last full year again and again?



It's likely the closest new Canon camera due for release. What else are we supposed to rumormonger about?? Seriously...


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## jrista (Jan 12, 2014)

MichaelHodges said:


> jrista said:
> 
> 
> > Marauder said:
> ...



When you get it back from the shop, does it ever perform better? I had a tripod head break in Dec. 2012. My 7D and 100-400mm lens dropped about 3 feet or so to sand. At first, I didn't notice anything wrong. Turned out, the lens ended up getting misaligned from that, and I had to send it in for repair. I have not sent the 7D in for repair yet...I honestly haven't really noticed any major differences before or after that incident...but maybe it actually exacerbated the whole AF jitter problem.

Anyway...would be nice to know what your experience is with sending the 7D in for repair, whether it was effective or not.


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## starship (Jan 12, 2014)

it´s about time to get past the 2009-raw-sensor-performance.



Marauder said:


> Many reviews appear to indicate that the D7100 slightly outperforms the 70D in noise performance, so at least matching the competition's APS-C sensors should be a definite goal.


"*slightly* outperforming" ???
look at the measurements of dxo:
http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Compare/Side-by-side/Nikon-D7100-versus-Canon-EOS-7D___865_619#tabs-2

dxo-sensor ranking:
Nikon D7100: rank 18
Canon EOS 7D: rank 112

2ev better dynamic range for nikon/sony sensors
about 1/2-3/4 ev better low-light iso 

but as long photographers are *keep buying underperforming sensor-quality-dslrs*, canon won´t offer better, competitive technology.

to be honest: why can´t canon build a APS-C sensor with at least the high-iso quality of a 5D (mk1) of 2005? after almost 9 years?

nikon&sony seem to be able to do that for quite a while:
http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Compare/Side-by-side/Nikon-D7100-versus-Canon-EOS-7D-versus-Canon-EOS-5D___865_619_176
and they have a 2ev better dynamic range than the old 5d (mk1) as well.

btw: i don´t expect a rrp of over 1.600$/€ (street price 1.200 within a few month).


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## MichaelHodges (Jan 12, 2014)

> When you get it back from the shop, does it ever perform better? I had a tripod head break in Dec. 2012. My 7D and 100-400mm lens dropped about 3 feet or so to sand. At first, I didn't notice anything wrong. Turned out, the lens ended up getting misaligned from that, and I had to send it in for repair. I have not sent the 7D in for repair yet...I honestly haven't really noticed any major differences before or after that incident...but maybe it actually exacerbated the whole AF jitter problem.
> 
> Anyway...would be nice to know what your experience is with sending the 7D in for repair, whether it was effective or not.




Yes, but it seems to "backslide" with use. I also use a 300 F4 L IS (bought new) that has been in five times due to AF issues (it's in with the 7D now). I actually had to order a new camera this winter while on the road (a 6D). While the focus issues occasionally popped up on the 6D with the prime, they were far worse on the 7D, even though the 7D was calibrated with the prime last year by Canon. It's pretty much a yearly thing...send in, get fixed, system backslides with use (unpredictable misfocus that can't be micro adjusted). The 7d works really well with anything under 200, but when it "slips" any telephoto is completely inconsistent (300 prime, 100-400, 200-400, etc).




> Frustrating when you can see that your AF point was right where you wanted it to be, but the pic is still out.



Oh yes. Especially when it's a wild golden eagle in flight.




> Irritating when other images in the burst, are tack sharp! I mean, if I can't hold the AF point on target, well I won't blame the camera, but it's aggravating when one tracks the target and STILL has an OOF shot! Grrr.



I agree. It's not a good feeling. I basically switched out the 7D this trip with the new 6D, and it smoked the 7D in every way in the field *except* for suddenly having to lock onto birds in AI Servo. If you knew the bird was coming, no problem. If it surprised you and took off at a strong angle, focus acquisition is longer than 7D.


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## CarlMillerPhoto (Jan 12, 2014)

sanj said:


> Are we not tired of discussing 7DII over the last full year again and again?



+ 8 million.


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## jrista (Jan 12, 2014)

MichaelHodges said:


> > When you get it back from the shop, does it ever perform better? I had a tripod head break in Dec. 2012. My 7D and 100-400mm lens dropped about 3 feet or so to sand. At first, I didn't notice anything wrong. Turned out, the lens ended up getting misaligned from that, and I had to send it in for repair. I have not sent the 7D in for repair yet...I honestly haven't really noticed any major differences before or after that incident...but maybe it actually exacerbated the whole AF jitter problem.
> >
> > Anyway...would be nice to know what your experience is with sending the 7D in for repair, whether it was effective or not.
> 
> ...



Do you use CPS, or do you pay for repairs each time you send it in? When I sent my 100-400 in, it cost me about $420 for all the work they did (apparently, they had to disassemble the lens, realign the elements, fix some issue with the AF drive (they discovered that once it arrived), clean, reassemble, and finally test the alignment and AF repairs.) I had expected it to cost about $200 based on their original estimate, and I was a little surprised by the final bill (and I had shipping on top of that.) I don't qualify for CPS myself (sucks, in the US, you have to be a full time professional...something like two thirds of your income must come from your photography, and at the moment I'd say about 1/10th of my income comes from photography), but I would really love to have it...would save me a ton of money on repairs and yearly cleanings and the like. 



MichaelHodges said:


> > Irritating when other images in the burst, are tack sharp! I mean, if I can't hold the AF point on target, well I won't blame the camera, but it's aggravating when one tracks the target and STILL has an OOF shot! Grrr.
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. It's not a good feeling. I basically switched out the 7D this trip with the new 6D, and it smoked the 7D in every way in the field *except* for suddenly having to lock onto birds in AI Servo. If you knew the bird was coming, no problem. If it surprised you and took off at a strong angle, focus acquisition is longer than 7D.



It is the one thing about the 7D I think is bad. Everything else about the camera is phenomenal, especially the ergonomics (I absolutely LOVE the button layout.) I am hoping that once I get a 5D III, I'll have a lot better consistency. I don't think the loss of frame rate will matter all that much given how inconsistent the 7D is...I only get 4-6 keepers per second as it is anyway, so if I can consistently get 5-6 keepers per second with a 5D III, that's actually an improvement.


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## MichaelHodges (Jan 12, 2014)

jrista said:


> Do you use CPS, or do you pay for repairs each time you send it in?




All of the repairs have been free due to the track record of the equipment. I appreciate that, but it doesn't quite make up for the unreliability a month into shooting the Rocky Mountain Front.




> When I sent my 100-400 in, it cost me about $420 for all the work they did (apparently, they had to disassemble the lens, realign the elements, fix some issue with the AF drive (they discovered that once it arrived), clean, reassemble, and finally test the alignment and AF repairs.) I had expected it to cost about $200 based on their original estimate, and I was a little surprised by the final bill (and I had shipping on top of that.) I don't qualify for CPS myself (sucks, in the US, you have to be a full time professional...something like two thirds of your income must come from your photography, and at the moment I'd say about 1/10th of my income comes from photography), but I would really love to have it...would save me a ton of money on repairs and yearly cleanings and the like.



I'm not a CPS member, but I do have a business that relies on my work in the field. I'll have to check their full requirements.




> It is the one thing about the 7D I think is bad. Everything else about the camera is phenomenal, especially the ergonomics (I absolutely LOVE the button layout.) I am hoping that once I get a 5D III, I'll have a lot better consistency. I don't think the loss of frame rate will matter all that much given how inconsistent the 7D is...I only get 4-6 keepers per second as it is anyway, so if I can consistently get 5-6 keepers per second with a 5D III, that's actually an improvement.




Right. I pretty much love the layout, build, feel, and other intangibles of the 7D. But with the issues I've had, it really takes away from that love. And of course, misfocus exaggerates noise even more, especially when shooting in dim winter conditions.

Also, the drop in FPS did not hurt me on the 6D. In fact, the 6D, IMHO, is a better wildlife camera than the 7D. Why? Well, most wildlife comes out in crappy light. The 6D is much better at shooting in these conditions, and the image quality is superior to the 7D. You can shoot at ISO 3200 with the 6D at dawn and dusk and not worry. The color and sharpness is also on another level. Also, if a raptor flies over you and is back-lit, the ability to recover the feather detail is much better on the 6D.

The 5DIII would make an even better wildlife camera with its advanced auto focus, but, side by side for two months in the Montana wilds, the 6D beat up on the 7D for wildlife. Bad. In good light, when everything goes right, the 7D is a gem. But that's a lot of if's in a hostile, light-fleeting environment full of animals that don't really listen to what you want them to do.


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## Aglet (Jan 12, 2014)

Sensor tech is getting close to the ceiling imposed by physics for high ISO.
Improvements here are more about computational processing.
Fuji and others can show them the way to do it.

Canon sure has a lot of room to improve the low ISO end tho.

I'm eager to see what the 7d2 sensor will perform like... it's the only reason I've held on to my 100-400L lens until now.
Even at that, I'm tempted to dump it and get the new Tamron 150-600 for my D800 for similar crop performance with an already excellent 3D AF system which would likey to a better job of tracking BiF than the sparse AF of the 7D.


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## 2n10 (Jan 12, 2014)

sanj said:


> Are we not tired of discussing 7DII over the last full year again and again?



Ummmm, let's see.....No freaking way!!!!!! ;D


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## sanj (Jan 12, 2014)

[/quote]


In fact, the 6D, IMHO, is a better wildlife camera than the 7D. Why? Well, most wildlife comes out in crappy light. 
[/quote]

So true.


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## sanj (Jan 12, 2014)

jrista said:


> sanj said:
> 
> 
> > Are we not tired of discussing 7DII over the last full year again and again?
> ...



DR. Of course! Hahahahaha.


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## jrista (Jan 12, 2014)

sanj said:


> jrista said:
> 
> 
> > sanj said:
> ...



Yeah....you really want more DRivel, instead of some legitimate rumormongering?!? Seriously!? ;D :


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## dufflover (Jan 12, 2014)

Well as soon as Canon has some competition equalling DR then we'll stop rumouring over it  lol
It'd be nice to get some bang-for-buck there for once.


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## jrista (Jan 12, 2014)

dufflover said:


> Well as soon as Canon has some competition equalling DR then we'll stop rumouring over it  lol
> It'd be nice to get some bang-for-buck there for once.



I agree. I have this tiny little knot in the corner of my stomach, though, that tells me it will first arrive in a $5000+ package...so maybe not exactly more "bang for the buck", as the saying goes.


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## Efka76 (Jan 12, 2014)

I really do not have big expectations from 7DII. Take a look at rumours before 6d release and real camera. In new 7dII i expect the following:

- the same sensor as in 70D
- slightly better autofocus ( worse than in 5dIII)
- slightly higher fps (maybe 10)
- wifi and gps

Forget about better DR and high ISO performance. Canon does not want aps-c camera to match FF camera in performance (i guess it is not possible technically if you do not develop new sensor, which is smaller in size than in 5dIII but is much better).

Canon does not have new sensor, which people expect. When such sensor is ready it will be introduced in 1d camera body for which Canon will rip customers by asking to high price.

All these talks about 7dII remind me rumours about iPhone 5s when people had very high expectations but received practically the same phone. Canon is milking the same cash cow and doing that quite well. What is the purpose of introducing cutting edge technology when you doing so much cash without significant investments in R&D. That's the sad truth.


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## Quasimodo (Jan 12, 2014)

Has there been an official announcement from Canon that they have abandoned the APS-H line? If they have indeed done so, official or not, then the 7D II would be THE (given that the specs are what people are hoping for) wildlife camera. Would not spotmetering at any focus point be essential? (like pretty much any Nikon camera has). If they even throw in the ability to AF on F8 with a TC, - we would have a killer camera!


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## Ricku (Jan 12, 2014)

jrista said:


> dufflover said:
> 
> 
> > Well as soon as Canon has some competition equalling DR then we'll stop rumouring over it  lol
> ...


Canon's high DR high MP sensor will most definitely arrive in a big ass elephant camera with a premium price tag.

They'll market it with words like groundbreaking, revolutionary and amazing, even though SoNikon had their's since 3 years ago, at a much smaller price.


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## Marsu42 (Jan 12, 2014)

Ricku said:


> Canon's high DR high MP sensor will most definitely arrive in a big ass elephant camera with a premium price tag. They'll market it with words like groundbreaking, revolutionary and amazing, even though SoNikon had their's since 3 years ago, at a much smaller price.



The "price" question will be if Canon "only" bangs up the metapixies value, leaving the sensor design the same - essentially making a ff sensor with crop pixel density - or if they introduce some new technology. If the latter and there's 4k video, more dynamic range and a steady 1dx-like dr curve vs. iso plus good high-iso capability the thing might have an introductory price of $10000+.


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## Eimajm (Jan 12, 2014)

More consistent autofocus for tracking moving subjects and a little yellow border around the histogram I would want, pro style body would be nice too. I don't have too much of an issue with high iso performance but any improvement would be welcome. Not that I would upgrade until my current 7d dies on me...


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## candyman (Jan 12, 2014)

sanj said:


> Are we not tired of discussing 7DII over the last full year again and again?




Yes. And I am selling my 7D to buy something totally different: a Panasonic HC X920


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## Gorku (Jan 12, 2014)

...I believe it when I see it - until then .... :-X


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## Don Haines (Jan 12, 2014)

Quasimodo said:


> Has there been an official announcement from Canon that they have abandoned the APS-H line? If they have indeed done so, official or not, then the 7D II would be THE (given that the specs are what people are hoping for) wildlife camera. Would not spotmetering at any focus point be essential? (like pretty much any Nikon camera has). If they even throw in the ability to AF on F8 with a TC, - we would have a killer camera!


APS-H is DEAD!

It only existed because yields on FF sensors were so low.... That reason has gone away... In fact, with economies of scale, it is probably now cheaper to make the FF sensors than a smaller production run of APS-h sensors.

You can only use FF lenses with an APS-H sensor, so why not go FF? One of the appeals of APS-c is lower cost, both body and lenses.....plus " reach".... With APS-H you don't get the reach, you don't get to use the lower cost lenses, the body will cost more, and you won't get the IQ of FF.

You end up with all the disadvantages of both systems and none of the advantages of either..... It's DEAD!


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## Woody (Jan 12, 2014)

Efka76 said:


> I really do not have big expectations from 7DII...
> 
> Forget about better DR and high ISO performance.



+1

I've given up hoping for new sensor technology from Canon.


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## cellomaster27 (Jan 12, 2014)

Woody said:


> Efka76 said:
> 
> 
> > I really do not have big expectations from 7DII...
> ...



What about DPAF?? Sure it doesn't help with stills not through live view... Basically a video tool. But that is an improvement on the sensor. MP, I have no doubt that that will increase. Anyways, I disagree on the sensor tech non improvement.. But I think we can all expect a new sensor in the 7DII regardless of what that improvement is. 

One thing that better be there (IMO) is dual cf slots. Not sd. Dual!!! :


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## Don Haines (Jan 12, 2014)

cellomaster27 said:


> One thing that better be there (IMO) is dual cf slots. Not sd. Dual!!! :



Right now, an 18M sensor shooting RAW makes about a 25Mbyte file.. the larger sensor in a 7D2 will make a larger file, let's assume around 30Mbytes.

Go SD card... the fastest card on the market can write at 90Mbytes/second. The camera could sustain a burst speed of 3 frames per second.... 

Go Compact Flash... the fastest cards have a write speed of 150Mbytes/second. The camera could sustain a burst speed of 5 frames per second.... 

Go Cfast Pro.. the INTRODUCTORY! cards have a write speed of 350Mbytes/second. The camera could sustain a burst speed of 11.7 frames per second....

BTW.... from the Sandisk site.... *The SanDisk Extreme PRO CFast 2.0 memory card was designed in parallel with leading-edge camera manufacturers.* This is good clue that it is coming on "pro" cameras....


I am hoping for dual slots, one SD for convenience/interoperability, and the other Cfast for blazing speed.


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## jrista (Jan 12, 2014)

Don Haines said:


> cellomaster27 said:
> 
> 
> > One thing that better be there (IMO) is dual cf slots. Not sd. Dual!!! :
> ...



Burst rate is due to the buffer memory speed, not the memory card speed. The DIGIC processors suck in data from the sensor, process it, and dump it into the frame buffer memory first. Buffer memory is a hell of a lot faster than card memory. From the buffer, the images are then dumped to the memory card at a slower rate. That is why you can eventually fill up the frame buffer.

On Canon cameras, flush to memory card occurs simultaneously with write to buffer, so even once the buffer is full, you can still get a decent frame rate of 2-3 frames per second or more (depends on the memory card speed). Also, if Canon rates their max frame rate at 8fps for 35 continuous frames for 600x CF cards, and you drop in a 1000x CF card, you still get 8fps, but you get 8fps for more than 35 continuous frames...you get maybe 40 or 42 continuous frames before you slow down. However once you slow down, your frame rate with the 1000x CF card would be higher...maybe 4-5 fps rather than 2-3 fps.


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## skycolt (Jan 12, 2014)

I hope not. 6D has 5Diii above it while 7dii supposes to be the king of it's kind. If that's the spec and it's priced at ~$2000 I doubt how many will sell. 5D3 or 1D4 will be a better choice than 7d2 then.



Efka76 said:


> I really do not have big expectations from 7DII. Take a look at rumours before 6d release and real camera. In new 7dII i expect the following:
> 
> - the same sensor as in 70D
> - slightly better autofocus ( worse than in 5dIII)
> ...


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## skycolt (Jan 12, 2014)

I'd rather have 2 CF card slot, with a optional CF-SD adapter



Don Haines said:


> cellomaster27 said:
> 
> 
> > One thing that better be there (IMO) is dual cf slots. Not sd. Dual!!! :
> ...


----------



## Don Haines (Jan 12, 2014)

jrista said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > cellomaster27 said:
> ...



agreed, but I was just thinking of the last part of the puzzle, dumping the image to the card... (I did say SUSTAIN a burst rate  ) slap in a cFast card at 2333X and you never fill the buffer...

SD cards are everywhere... it seems like every device can read them, so from a portability/compatibility point of view that it is highly likely that most cameras will have one. I can plug one into my TV, into the DVD player, into my laptop, into my tablet, and into my computer. They are fast enough now for all but the most demanding users.

Compact Flash cards, although they used to be far superior to SD cards, are now fairly close in capabilities... I don't think that there are any that can double the speed of the best SD cards...

cFast is a different story.... the first cards are 2300X and the target rate is 4000X. 4000X would keep up to a 50Mpixel sensor at 10 frames per second... think of a 600Mb/sec hard drive in a flash memory card... This is going to be needed for 4K video..


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## jrista (Jan 12, 2014)

Don Haines said:


> jrista said:
> 
> 
> > Don Haines said:
> ...



Oh, I understand now.

I totally agree. I'd love to see dual CFast slots in the 7D II, even if it means I have to buy new cards. I'd be quite happy with 2300x, but 4000x, damn strait...you'd have near-infinite continuous shooting. Not that you would really want to do that...but those times when you hit the buffer limit, and miss that perfect pose because it happens inbetween those 2-3 frame spurts...bah!


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## Harry Muff (Jan 12, 2014)

Bored now. It gets here when it gets here.


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## Don Haines (Jan 12, 2014)

jrista said:


> I totally agree. I'd love to see dual CFast slots in the 7D II, even if it means I have to buy new cards. I'd be quite happy with 2300x, but 4000x, damn strait...you'd have near-infinite continuous shooting. Not that you would really want to do that...but those times when you hit the buffer limit, and miss that perfect pose because it happens inbetween those 2-3 frame spurts...bah!



It is quite possible that this is the beginning of the end for the compact flash card. It will not be able to compete with cFast for speed and it already can not compete with SD for convenience/versatility.

I'd say how I feel sorry for people with Compact Flash cards.... but I'm one of them... I recently purged my kit of an item that should have been on the "useless accessory" thread... a bunch of 32M compact flash cards... they only had space for 1 picture per card... (Yes, I tried it  )


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## Marauder (Jan 12, 2014)

I can't help but wonder if the 100-400L II will also be announced concurrently with the 7D II. Combining one of the most anticipated cameras with one of the most anticipated lenses would seem to make sense, from a "OMG, OMG, OMG!" sense of excitement, given that a fan of one, is likely to be a fan of the other as well--an "affordable" action camera and an "affordable" long L series telephoto. If so, I'm wondering if it's _possible_ that Canon would have a combo deal on both products. I've never seen them do such a thing, but I'm relatively new to this---bought my first SLR (the T3i,) in 2011, followed by the 7D in 2012. For those of you with more experience in Canon's product line, is this likely, or even remotely probable? I'd love to hear your opinions.


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## candc (Jan 12, 2014)

Marauder said:


> I can't help but wonder if the 100-400L II will also be announced concurrently with the 7D II. Combining one of the most anticipated cameras with one of the most anticipated lenses would seem to make sense, from a "OMG, OMG, OMG!" sense of excitement, given that a fan of one, is likely to be a fan of the other as well--an "affordable" action camera and an "affordable" long L series telephoto. If so, I'm wondering if it's _possible_ that Canon would have a combo deal on both products. I've never seen them do such a thing, but I'm relatively new to this---bought my first SLR (the T3i,) in 2011, followed by the 7D in 2012. For those of you with more experience in Canon's product line, is this likely, or even remotely probable? I'd love to hear your opinions.



I wouldn't expect any incentives on a new product launch that is going to sell very well. Canon has offered discounts on certain lenses in the past. I think the most recent was on the 70-300 non l. If you bought a kit combo you got a discount on the additional lens. I would definately like to see it but its not likely


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## Marauder (Jan 13, 2014)

candc said:


> Marauder said:
> 
> 
> > I can't help but wonder if the 100-400L II will also be announced concurrently with the 7D II. Combining one of the most anticipated cameras with one of the most anticipated lenses would seem to make sense, from a "OMG, OMG, OMG!" sense of excitement, given that a fan of one, is likely to be a fan of the other as well--an "affordable" action camera and an "affordable" long L series telephoto. If so, I'm wondering if it's _possible_ that Canon would have a combo deal on both products. I've never seen them do such a thing, but I'm relatively new to this---bought my first SLR (the T3i,) in 2011, followed by the 7D in 2012. For those of you with more experience in Canon's product line, is this likely, or even remotely probable? I'd love to hear your opinions.
> ...



Yeah, I was rather afraid that might be the case. It'd be fantastic if they did though!


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## emag (Jan 13, 2014)

Replacement for the 7D? Hey now, that's news.


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## jiphoto (Jan 13, 2014)

Don Haines said:


> jrista said:
> 
> 
> > I totally agree. I'd love to see dual CFast slots in the 7D II, even if it means I have to buy new cards. I'd be quite happy with 2300x, but 4000x, damn strait...you'd have near-infinite continuous shooting. Not that you would really want to do that...but those times when you hit the buffer limit, and miss that perfect pose because it happens inbetween those 2-3 frame spurts...bah!
> ...



Long time lurker here, first time poster...
I'd add to jrista's observations that the implementation of CFast here is probably not for burst rates anymore, but more for video. As a current 7D owner, and a user of MagicLantern (or whatever it is now... TragicLantern maybe?), the card write speeds are far too slow for RAW video and generally pretty iffy for higher-bitrate H.264, so any card write speed improvements would probably be for video, not photos. Even the 1DX has a buffer that will eventually fill up, and if Canon would try to design any camera to be able to sustain a burst, I'd expect them to work on the 1D series. I certainly wouldn't say no to a sustained burst on a new 7D though!


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## Rockets95 (Jan 14, 2014)

jiphoto said:


> Long time lurker here, first time poster...
> I'd add to jrista's observations that the implementation of CFast here is probably not for burst rates anymore, but more for video. As a current 7D owner, and a user of MagicLantern (or whatever it is now... TragicLantern maybe?), the card write speeds are far too slow for RAW video and generally pretty iffy for higher-bitrate H.264, so any card write speed improvements would probably be for video, not photos. Even the 1DX has a buffer that will eventually fill up, and if Canon would try to design any camera to be able to sustain a burst, I'd expect them to work on the 1D series. I certainly wouldn't say no to a sustained burst on a new 7D though!



I think you need to start posting, as you seem to know what you are talking about. We can all benefit from your knowledge.


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## DanielW (Jan 14, 2014)

Rockets95 said:


> jiphoto said:
> 
> 
> > Long time lurker here, first time poster...
> ...



I agree!


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## DanielW (Jan 15, 2014)

Something just occurred to me now... How likely is it that a new 7D will have many advantages over the current 5D3?
Possible advantages I see (sure many debatable):
- Crop factor for birding, wildlife and sports
- Compatibility with EF-S lenses
- Built-in flash
- Higher burst rate and bigger buffer
- Price
Is that it? I am aware, from reading previous discussions here, that the crop factor is not a huge advantage (if at all), and compatibility with EF-S lenses is probably not relevant. The built-in flash may not even come with the new 7D anymore, and some people even dislike it. Burst rate, well, here I see a difference, but it is not important to me (I understand other folks may need it, though).
Anyway, when the 7D2 finally arrives costing US$ 2,000-2,200 body only (more? less?), how much will a 5D3 be costing? I have just found prices under 2,900 on canonpricewatch.com, and rythercamera.com has the 5D3 for 2,499 right now. Even Canon sells it refurbished for under 2,800.
What do you guys think? Will the 7D2 be worth buying when the price of the 5D3 drops even further? I am not so sure anymore.
Cheers
Daniel


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## jiphoto (Jan 15, 2014)

DanielW said:


> Rockets95 said:
> 
> 
> > jiphoto said:
> ...



Thanks for the encouragement, guys! I think I've picked up most of my knowledge from reading these forums (Neuro in particular LOL!), but I'm happy to share!


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## ajfotofilmagem (Jan 15, 2014)

DanielW said:


> Something just occurred to me now... How likely is it that a new 7D will have many advantages over the current 5D3?
> Possible advantages I see (sure many debatable):
> - Crop factor for birding, wildlife and sports
> - Compatibility with EF-S lenses
> ...


I can see some advantages in a future 7D mark ii, over 5D mark iii, but image quality at high ISO should not be one of them. I am an advocate for APS-C, which has real advantages for me. But if you expect a big improvement in high ISO, I recommend going with current full frame cameras. I like the depth of field of APS-C, and the size, weight, and more compact lens, and lower cost. But do not believe in big improvements in high ISO without a revolution happening in image sensor technology.


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