# Images of the Canon EOS Ra appear – UPDATE



## canonnews (Nov 5, 2019)

> Product images of the upcoming EOS Ra have appeared.  It’s very likely we’ll see this camera very shortly.
> The EOS-Ra is an EOS R with a sensor modification that allows for h-Alpha wavelengths to pass through unimpeded by the IR cut filter that sits in front of the sensor.  Normally a stock IR Cut filter that digital cameras employ has around a 2-3 stop loss at the h-Alpha wavelength of 656.28nm.
> 
> Why is this good for astrophotography? Atypically emission nebulae emit this wavelength, and as well, the Sun’s atmosphere (take proper precautions if you try this!).  Letting more of this light to reach the sensor allows for better contrast and detail when it comes to nebulae and deep sky astrophotography.
> Since the EOS Ra is modified to pass more light of the 656nm wavelength, white balance and colors will be a bit off for normal photography.  You can, however, use a hot mirror filter that screws on the front of your lens to correct the filtering for normal color photography...



Continue reading...


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## Cinto (Nov 5, 2019)

Nice to see Canon producing niche products that some people will love.


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## LensFungus (Nov 5, 2019)

According to my own sources Canon will also release the Canon EOS BRa for boudoir photographers and the Canon EOS aRRR for pirates.


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## IsaacImage (Nov 5, 2019)

LensFungus said:


> According to my own sources Canon will also release the Canon EOS BRa for boudoir photographers and the Canon EOS aRRR for pirates.


Good one ))
Count me it


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## sulla (Nov 5, 2019)

Also, the RF to EF adapter with a drop in filter is a great solution for IR-filtering instead of front filters for the EOS Ra. (only works for EF lenses though, but for all of them).


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## Sparky (Nov 5, 2019)

LensFungus said:


> According to my own sources Canon will also release the Canon EOS BRa for boudoir photographers and the Canon EOS aRRR for pirates.


I hope the pirate edition comes with a skull and crossbones camera strap! And the boudoir one with, er, ...a leather strap?


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## Del Paso (Nov 5, 2019)

Sparky said:


> I hope the pirate edition comes with a skull and crossbones camera strap! And the boudoir one with, er, ...a leather strap?


No, it will be sold with a pink garter- belt.


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## TominNJ (Nov 5, 2019)

Adorama has this camera available for preorder with quite a bit of information about it


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## 3dit0r (Nov 5, 2019)

This is a great announcement. It is the specialist elements of the Canon system which are about to bring me back from a few years with Fuji - the newer T/S lenses with more advanced movements and this astro-specific camera really show that Canon cares about the needs of every photographer. I really like the way they have thought about the new RF 2.8 zooms, like the 70-200 and lost a lot of size and weight making the most of mirrorless too. Bravo, bravo.


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## BradC (Nov 5, 2019)

sulla said:


> Also, the RF to EF adapter with a drop in filter is a great solution for IR-filtering instead of front filters for the EOS Ra. (only works for EF lenses though, but for all of them).



Is this drop in IR filter something that already exists or are you saying it would be logical to offer it that way? If that’s all you meant, then I totally agree.


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## Joepatbob (Nov 5, 2019)

I would like to see a sample from an Astro camera taking regular shots. Just curious as the look. If it more or camera looking or something else.


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## xanbarksdale (Nov 5, 2019)

I'm sure that there are 13 people who will be thrilled about this camera!


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## tron (Nov 5, 2019)

Joepatbob said:


> I would like to see a sample from an Astro camera taking regular shots. Just curious as the look. If it more or camera looking or something else.


Reasonable request. At the Adorama site they mentioned:

"With a 30.3-Megapixel, full-frame CMOS sensor and Digic 8 image processor, the EOS Ra produces stunning image results, day or night."

Which looks like marketing to me. Nothing concrete.


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## uri.raz (Nov 5, 2019)

I think this model makes sense.

The EOS 60Da was released in 2012, seven years after the 20Da. Seven years & a new mount later, I'm not surprised there's another astronomy model coming out.

My guess is Canon makes good money on a very little investment in those models (probably very little beyond the IR filter, e.g. change model number in ROM), and leaving customers who shoot astronomy without an upgrade path when their camera goes out of maintenance is bound to piss them off and lead to negative PR.


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## TominNJ (Nov 5, 2019)

they made the camera now how about a coma corrected lens? I think this camera is aimed (heh) at telescope users rather than night sky shooters but still...


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## BeenThere (Nov 5, 2019)

It will be interesting to see just how correctable to “normal” color this camera can be with a drop in filter. If pretty close with a standard post processing prescription, then it could end up in more kits than seems to be expected.


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## KirkD (Nov 5, 2019)

There may be a lot of universities and collages, not to mention advanced amateur astronomers, interested in this. My own alma mater had a small store room filled with telescopes, and other equipment including a few cameras, that students could book out or use for astronomy assignments.


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## gruhl28 (Nov 5, 2019)

Looks like Adorama has removed the page, I'm getting a "404 Not Found" error clicking the link. Likely they accidentally put it up before they'd intended it to be public.


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## Hector1970 (Nov 5, 2019)

For some one who has never done deep sky astrophotography (but has had a lifetime interest in space). What would you ideally use this with?
Any recommendations on a suitable telescope with tracking ability? (auto alignment if possible).


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## Joules (Nov 5, 2019)

Hector1970 said:


> Any recommendations on a suitable telescope with tracking ability? (auto alignment if possible).


It is not required to go full out on astro gear to capture deep sky images. I got myself a Fornax Lightrack II portable tracking mount and use my Sigma 150-600mm lens, which is still a combination I could take out into the field when I want to escape the light pollution. I haven't done that yet, but I'm pleased with the results so far.

For less extreme focal lengths, a more inexpensive tracking mount like a Skywatcher Star Adventurer or something from iOptron are good choices as well. If you really want advice in a telescope, I'm not sure I would seek it in this forum. It's a pretty niche topic and I believe there are more fitting forums for it.


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## padam (Nov 5, 2019)

This also means that the EOS R Mark II is probably farther away than what people expect.
It will probably change in more ways than a 5D Mark V compared to its predecessor, so it probably will not follow it immediately afterwards.


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## Joules (Nov 5, 2019)

padam said:


> This also means that the EOS R Mark II is probably farther away than what people expect.


What makes you think so?

I believe this camera is designed for such a specific niche, it doesn't really tells us anything about what Canon intends to do with the rest of the market.

If anything, the opposite might be true. Maybe the next generation of mirrorless is not that far away and Canon wants to make good use of their old sensor platform while it lasts.


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## Jethro (Nov 5, 2019)

padam said:


> This also means that the EOS R Mark II is probably farther away than what people expect.
> It will probably change in more ways than a 5D Mark V compared to its predecessor, so it probably will not follow it immediately afterwards.


I'd expect it to come in parallel with a 5Dv - that seems to be the business model going forward, at least as long as they keep making DSLRs, and I suspect that will be for a good few years yet, at least at the FF level.


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## Jethro (Nov 5, 2019)

xanbarksdale said:


> I'm sure that there are 13 people who will be thrilled about this camera!


Nobody but Canon knows how many of the 60DA they sold, but they've had an astro specialist camera available for 15 years, and that would be because they can make money selling it. It's another example of Canon utilising existing tech to produce new products (with distinctive features) with minimal development costs. Its smart.


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## Jethro (Nov 5, 2019)

Not that I would buy this, but the 30x magnification option (both in live-view and EVF) sounds awesome!


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## sulla (Nov 5, 2019)

BradC said:


> Is this drop in IR filter something that already exists or are you saying it would be logical to offer it that way? If that’s all you meant, then I totally agree.



Unfortunately such a product does not exist yet. It would only be logical for Canon to release one with the Ra camera. Unfortunately the Canon drop-in filters for the big whites, which readily accept any gelatin filter foils via a simple spring loaded frame gel holder, are not compatible with the EF-RF adapter, so those can't be used. The reason for this is that for the EF-RF adapter the adapter glass is part of the optical formula of the adapted lens and this piece of glass of a certain thickness therefore cannot be omitted (so there is the need for a clear glass filter and there is not just a blank cover of the drop-in slot, also the drop-in filter adaper is slightly longer than the other 2 adapters). Also, I am not aware of any third party drop-in filters for the EF-RF adapter yet.

Having said that, the clear filter can be removed from the drop-in holder, so to exchange that one with an IR-filtered glass is technically not difficult and comes down to getting a filter glass of the correct size or grinding an oversized piece of glass to shape.


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## dolina (Nov 5, 2019)

Good on can


xanbarksdale said:


> I'm sure that there are 13 people who will be thrilled about this camera!


That may be a reason why astro cameras get a new release every 7-8 years.

2005 - 20Da
2012 - 60Da
2019 - Ra


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## jvillain (Nov 5, 2019)

If they can do this I can't imagine why they can't stick a crop sensor in an R body.


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## Hector1970 (Nov 5, 2019)

Joules said:


> It is not required to go full out on astro gear to capture deep sky images. I got myself a Fornax Lightrack II portable tracking mount and use my Sigma 150-600mm lens, which is still a combination I could take out into the field when I want to escape the light pollution. I haven't done that yet, but I'm pleased with the results so far.
> 
> For less extreme focal lengths, a more inexpensive tracking mount like a Skywatcher Star Adventurer or something from iOptron are good choices as well. If you really want advice in a telescope, I'm not sure I would seek it in this forum. It's a pretty niche topic and I believe there are more fitting forums for it.


Thanks Joules. Yes its a pretty niche product . I have seen other forums that deal with these topics and there seems to be a general lack of ability to explain simply (while it is a complex subject - it can be explained).


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## SteveC (Nov 5, 2019)

jvillain said:


> If they can do this I can't imagine why they can't stick a crop sensor in an R body.



Of course, they'd have to _want_ to.

I'm sure there's no technical reason they couldn't do it (and I was sure of this before this news item came out). And they could announce such a thing tomorrow, but my _suspicion_ is that they would rather that crop sensor people who want those RF lenses...move to an R like, full frame camera.


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## sanj (Nov 5, 2019)

xanbarksdale said:


> I'm sure that there are 13 people who will be thrilled about this camera!


They are photographers too and deserve to get the camera they want.


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## HarryFilm (Nov 6, 2019)

xanbarksdale said:


> I'm sure that there are 13 people who will be thrilled about this camera!



---

This camera is ALSO useful for Thermal Nightvision if you get glass that is PURE QUARTZ which lets Infrared through unobstructed. Just add a high powered IR continuous light or IR flashlamp and get some STUNNING nighvision shots. That means you would get MUCH BETTER and much higher resolution security or surveillance footage from the Ra camera than almost ANY other major camera system which tend to max out at 1920x1080 resolution for video and 2.7k for stills.

In fact, I do believe there is an Infrared (i.e. short IR and long wave IR) security and surveillance systems market in the MANY HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS for such an Ra camera, especially if the image quality is going to be 10x to 25x better than that $150 security camera set you buy at Best Buy! Major industrial companies ALSO NEED high resolution, fast shutter speed IR cameras that can see industrial processes in the thermal emissions EM range and I would expect another 10,000 Ra cameras sold over the years just for that!

.
YUP! I do see a LOT of industrial and commercial uses for an IR-boosted version of the Ra camera with QUARTZ glass elements for FULL Infrared transmission! Add in some remote control software and live IR (or even UV) stills/video stream out and Canon could be RAKING IN THE DOUGH with the Ra !!!

.


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## woodman411 (Nov 6, 2019)

jvillain said:


> If they can do this I can't imagine why they can't stick a crop sensor in an R body.



Canon RP bodies are going for under $1000 on eBay now and will definitely be under $1000 retail for Black Friday. With the cost of FF entry this low, there is little reason to do this.


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## Ozarker (Nov 6, 2019)

woodman411 said:


> Canon RP bodies are going for under $1000 on eBay now and will definitely be under $1000 retail for Black Friday. With the cost of FF entry this low, there is little reason to do this.


Heck. They are $999 now at Adorama, including the $99 adapter. No sales tax. Free shipping.


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## home_slice (Nov 6, 2019)

I couldn't wait any longer for Canon to release a new pro body suitable for a fulltime commercial / wedding photographer and had to pick up a 2nd 5D IV body. That means I probably won't be buying any R lenses for a few more years. It was a really bad move for Canon to leave the working pro with no good options to upgrade for so long. good for the astrophotographer but how many of them really needed this?


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## TAF (Nov 6, 2019)

Joepatbob said:


> I would like to see a sample from an Astro camera taking regular shots. Just curious as the look. If it more or camera looking or something else.



I have not tried it, but my expectation would be that the image would lean slightly reddish, in as much as they are allowing more red light to hit the sensor.

Not excessively so, but perhaps more like Kodachrome (if you are old enough to remember that particular slide film) than Ektachrome (which is, in my opinion, what Canon digital tends to look most like).

My personal preference is toward the blues and greens (Ektachrome), which is probably why I prefer Canon over their competitors.

For someone whose preference runs toward the red end of the spectrum, this might be a very nice option.


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## navastronia (Nov 6, 2019)

home_slice said:


> I couldn't wait any longer for Canon to release a new pro body suitable for a fulltime commercial / wedding photographer and had to pick up a 2nd 5D IV body. That means I probably won't be buying any R lenses for a few more years. It was a really bad move for Canon to leave the working pro with no good options to upgrade for so long. good for the astrophotographer but how many of them really needed this?



I'm waiting for everyone to pile on you about how new the RF ecosystem is and how the EOS R is a perfectly good camera, and those people make valid points, but I still feel your pain, wanting a mirrorless pro body that innovates or pushes boundaries.

That being said, I shot a wedding and an engagement with a pair of 5D classics last weekend (each of which I picked up used for $300 in the last year) and was perfectly happy. The pro R will be here eventually, though if I had to guess, the images it makes will be almost indistinguishable from those made with a 5DIV, which you already own.


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## ethanz (Nov 6, 2019)

I see a post about this from the official Canon instagram. As well, the link from Adorama works again.


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## Antono Refa (Nov 6, 2019)

home_slice said:


> I couldn't wait any longer for Canon to release a new pro body suitable for a fulltime commercial / wedding photographer and had to pick up a 2nd 5D IV body. That means I probably won't be buying any R lenses for a few more years. It was a really bad move for Canon to leave the working pro with no good options to upgrade for so long.



Camera sales have taken a nose dive, so Canon can't upgrade cameras as often. And as most photographers do like you, and buy a different camera from the same manufacturer, why rush?



home_slice said:


> good for the astrophotographer but how many of them really needed this?



It's a ROI / low hanging fruit thing. Cheap & easy to make, quick to make a profit.


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## addola (Nov 6, 2019)

ethanz said:


> I see a post about this from the official Canon instagram. As well, the link from Adorama works again.


It's also on Canon's website! 
I wanted to see if they kept that touchbar on the back from the EOS R, but the images don't show it.


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## Joules (Nov 6, 2019)

Hector1970 said:


> I have seen other forums that deal with these topics and there seems to be a general lack of ability to explain simply (while it is a complex subject - it can be explained).


Yes, that seems to be an accurate observation from my research as well.

I also get the impression that since all the equipment is so niche and expensive, any recommendations you'll get won't be based on elaborate testing and comparisons, but personal experience with a few pieces of equipment. And that's certainly still worth something, but such a different approach than what we're used to with cameras and lenses where every metric has been tested and debated intensely.

I like to take an approach to such topics that is not trying to go for the end goal in one step but rather tries to add minimal new stuff in each of many steps. I started doing milky way photography with my 600D and Sigma 35mm 1.4 Art. Then I got an 80D and later a Sigma 150-600mm and learned to use these properly for bird photography. Then I put the combo on a tripod and imaged the moon a few times, including a total lunar eclipse, and I tried to take an image of the Orion nebula using short, untracked exposures. Just to get a feel of what can be done with that equipment and where it falls short. Now I got the Fornax tracking mount, and a polar wedge, but no scope. I experimented with using a camera for alignment and have gotten better at that. I also got a light pollution filter, a new geared head and an intervalometer, but these still need to be tried out. Unfortunately the weather isn't cooperating. But with these small steps I can at least judge how much I really need. I try to only make purchases that I can use for regular photography as well. The exception to that are obviously the tracking mount and polar wedge. But compared to how much a lens / telescope would cost, that could gather more light than my current lenses, it is just the obvious choice. 

To a degree, reading online has helped with all of that. But to make it really click, experiencing this stuff in your own or viewing videos and pictures seems more beneficial than all that technical talk to me.

If you pose a more specific question I'm sure you'll get a good answer on this forum. It's just that these recommendations I think require experience with at least some variety of gear and the cost of gaining that makes it hard to come by that experience, with the specialized forums being the place with the highest chance of finding it.


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## TMHKR (Nov 6, 2019)

CanonFanBoy said:


> Heck. They are $999 now at Adorama, including the $99 adapter. No sales tax. Free shipping.


And both of you conveniently forgot the added price of full frame lenses, especially for new adopters who only have crop ones.


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## Ozarker (Nov 6, 2019)

TMHKR said:


> And both of you conveniently forgot the added price of full frame lenses, especially for new adopters who only have crop ones.


Didn't forget anything. Loads of people have FF lenses on their Canon APS-C cameras already. Canon's FF mirrorless will adapt both APS-C lenses and FF lenses.

BTW: "Conveniently forgot", to benefit whom? Just curious. We aren't selling anything here.


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## uri.raz (Nov 6, 2019)

Joules said:


> If anything, the opposite might be true. Maybe the next generation of mirrorless is not that far away and Canon wants to make good use of their old sensor platform while it lasts.



Something Canon has done in the past. The 1000D used the 400D's sensor after the 450D was released with a new sensor. Then the 1100D was released with the 450D's sensor, after the 500D was released with a new sensor. The 1300D was released with an older 18MP sensor after the 750D was released with a 24MP sensor. IIRC, Canon did the same with the AF sensors - put an older xxxD's chip in a new 1x00D body.

Canon has already invested in design and got the manufacturing facilities running, makes financial sense to squeeze the last dollars of profit in it in another camera targeted at an audience satisfied by it.


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## Ozarker (Nov 6, 2019)

home_slice said:


> I couldn't wait any longer for Canon to release a new pro body suitable for a fulltime commercial / wedding photographer and had to pick up a 2nd 5D IV body. That means I probably won't be buying any R lenses for a few more years. It was a really bad move for Canon to leave the working pro with no good options to upgrade for so long. good for the astrophotographer but how many of them really needed this?


Probably a bunch. They've got their APS-C 60Da on life support by now (Released 2012, 7 years ago). The 5D Mark IV was released in September 2016 (3 years ago, so not old at all), with a 5D Mark V coming out in 2020. That time frame, in the 5D series, is about standard for Canon. My previous 5D Mark III was released in March of 2012.


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## BillB (Nov 6, 2019)

SteveC said:


> Of course, they'd have to _want_ to.
> 
> I'm sure there's no technical reason they couldn't do it (and I was sure of this before this news item came out). And they could announce such a thing tomorrow, but my _suspicion_ is that they would rather that crop sensor people who want those RF lenses...move to an R like, full frame camera.


I agree that it is not a technical issue. The main question would seem to be how many aps-c cameras with an RF mount Canon could sell at a price where they could make money. An aps-c camera would provide more reach for a given lens, and an aps-c body might be cheaper than a full frame. On the other hand, at this point, all of Canon's longer lenses still have EF mounts, so an aps-c camera with an RF mount isn't all that appealing.


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## woodman411 (Nov 6, 2019)

navastronia said:


> I'm waiting for everyone to pile on you about how new the RF ecosystem is and how the EOS R is a perfectly good camera, and those people make valid points, but I still feel your pain, wanting a mirrorless pro body that innovates or pushes boundaries.
> ...



Isn't it apparent from the R's 1.4 firmware released just last month that Canon was simply not ready for a pro mirrorless on the AF and tracking side, in addition to the increased data bandwidth that is just now showing up on the M6II? I suspect that is what many would have and will expect in a pro level mirrorless, meaning Canon was correct in delaying it.


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## jvillain (Nov 6, 2019)

woodman411 said:


> Canon RP bodies are going for under $1000 on eBay now and will definitely be under $1000 retail for Black Friday. With the cost of FF entry this low, there is little reason to do this.



I am willing to bet that there are far more people who have tooled up over the years for crop shooting than do astro photography considering crop shooters have been about 2/3s of Canons business traditionally. Please make the case that owning an RP is is exactly the same as owning a 7D to a 7D owner and see how that flies. The RP is a POS and I would change brands before owning one.


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## Quirkz (Nov 6, 2019)

jvillain said:


> I am willing to bet that there are far more people who have tooled up over the years for crop shooting than do astro photography considering crop shooters have been about 2/3s of Canons business traditionally. Please make the case that owning an RP is is exactly the same as owning a 7D to a 7D owner and see how that flies. The RP is a POS and I would change brands before owning one.



I currently own a 5d4, a Fuji x-e3, and.... an RP. (Previously a Sony a7s, canon m5, Panasonic m43, and many other canon dslrs)

Based on those to compare with, I can assure you that the RP is most definitely not a POS. It’s a rather fantastic and capable little beast of a camera quite capable of taking magnificent images, and I now prefer it over those other cameras, especially for travel. And that’s before we even look at the price vs performance.


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## Ozarker (Nov 6, 2019)

jvillain said:


> The RP is a POS and I would change brands before owning one.


People that actually own and use the RP might disagree with you. I've read a few here on this forum saying they like it. Enough that I am thinking seriously about getting one and dumping our Olympus M43. Not a hard call, really.


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## SteveC (Nov 6, 2019)

TMHKR said:


> And both of you conveniently forgot the added price of full frame lenses, especially for new adopters who only have crop ones.



Even if they didn't forget, how could they possibly assess it? They don't know what you have or don't have.

I have two EF-S lenses I'd have to find replacements for, and a fair number of full frame lenses. (I exclude EF-M lenses from this, since I bought them knowing they'd never go on anything but an EF-M camera.) I adopted a policy recently of not buying crop EF lenses, anticipating a move to full frame someday. I still haven't made that move, but the RP at this price is tempting.


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## Deleted member 378664 (Nov 6, 2019)

Joepatbob said:


> I would like to see a sample from an Astro camera taking regular shots. Just curious as the look. If it more or camera looking or something else.


There is this comparison of a regular shot from the sky taken with the Ra and R on the german product page:



regards
Frank


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## woodman411 (Nov 6, 2019)

jvillain said:


> I am willing to bet that there are far more people who have tooled up over the years for crop shooting than do astro photography considering crop shooters have been about 2/3s of Canons business traditionally. Please make the case that owning an RP is is exactly the same as owning a 7D to a 7D owner and see how that flies. The RP is a POS and I would change brands before owning one.



Does the M6II not do it for you? Honest question, never had a 7D series so not sure where the M6II lacks (with the exception of battery life and weather sealing I'm guessing). On paper, it seems to be a noticeable upgrade over the 7d2 - more fps, more resolution for cropping, cleaner images, etc.


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## uri.raz (Nov 7, 2019)

I wonder about the choice of resolution.

The EOS 60Da has an 18MP resolution. A full frame sensor with the same pixel size would have 18 * 1.6^2 = 46MP, about 5DS resolution. The EOS R has 30MP.

So astro photographers would gain about a stop on light gathering, they would lose in reach. Don't recall who wrote it, but astro is one of those cases where you can't zoom with your legs.


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