# Here is the Canon Cinema EOS C500 Mark II



## Canon Rumors Guy (Aug 27, 2019)

> The Canon Cinema EOS C500 Mark II will be announced on or around September 5, 2019, ahead of IBC in Amsterdam.
> Below are the specifications that we’ve been told but have been unable to confirm. The image, however, is exactly what the Cinema EOS C500 Mark II will come as.
> 
> 
> ...


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Continue reading...*


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## Ozarker (Aug 27, 2019)

Priced too high. Canon is protecting the 90D.


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## Canon Rumors Guy (Aug 27, 2019)

CanonFanBoy said:


> Priced too high. Canon is protecting the 90D.



Absolutely


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## CarlMillerPhoto (Aug 27, 2019)

Looks pretty sexy. They should've made it R mount though to take advantage of that new glass + even easier "User Interchangeable Mount" with existing adapters. My guess is $16,999.


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## raptor3x (Aug 27, 2019)

Glad to see Canon is moving forward with CFExpress. I was a bit worried they were going to do something short sighted like double down on CFast.


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## C200User (Aug 27, 2019)

She's gorgeous


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## uri.raz (Aug 27, 2019)

CarlMillerPhoto said:


> They should've made it R mount though to take advantage of that new glass + even easier "User Interchangeable Mount" with existing adapters.



All the more so as the EF mount is dead. Oh, wait...

The absence of R mount does make me wonder. Maybe there's a mechanical design issue.


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## Avenger 2.0 (Aug 27, 2019)

uri.raz said:


> All the more so as the EF mount is dead. Oh, wait...
> 
> The absence of R mount does make me wonder. Maybe there's a mechanical design issue.


You have the internal ND filters. Maybe they aren't small enough to fit with RF mount?


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## PerKr (Aug 27, 2019)

uri.raz said:


> All the more so as the EF mount is dead. Oh, wait...
> 
> The absence of R mount does make me wonder. Maybe there's a mechanical design issue.



Maybe it's just that they felt they needed to have PL mount without an adapter and EF mount was the easy alternative. Or maybe they made it modular and an RF mount is coming later. Lots of customers with expensive EF and PL lenses, not so many with RF lenses.


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## much (Aug 27, 2019)

4k? wake up Canon, BM is doing 6k right now


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## C200User (Aug 27, 2019)

much said:


> 4k? wake up Canon, BM is doing 6k right now


8k is coming for Canon already. C300 Mark III is rumored to have it before Olympics next year. 


uri.raz said:


> All the more so as the EF mount is dead. Oh, wait...
> 
> The absence of R mount does make me wonder. Maybe there's a mechanical design issue.


It's not a design issue, it's still early in the R mount evolution. There are hundreds of thousands ef lenses out there. It makes sense to keep using the format that works and then introduce the R mount as a option later along side the ef mount.


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## Deleted member 381342 (Aug 27, 2019)

Fantastic to see this is using CFExpress, hopefully it's a sign of CFExpress hitting the next 1D bodies too.


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## cpreston (Aug 27, 2019)

Specs don’t seem right. 4K and 2K RAW doesn’t seem logical. Would Canon add a line skipped or 2x cropped RAW mode?Maybe the source misunderstood a near lossless 14bit 444 recording mode.


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## Etienne (Aug 27, 2019)

It'll be a good camera to rent as needed, if the rental prices aren't too high.


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## Stereodude (Aug 27, 2019)

C200User said:


> 8k is coming for Canon already. C300 Mark III is rumored to have it before Olympics next year.


If the rumored specs on the C500 II (no 8K) are correct it seems rather unlikely that a C300 III will get 8K. Canon very rarely undercuts a higher end model with a lower end one.


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## LDS (Aug 27, 2019)

uri.raz said:


> All the more so as the EF mount is dead. Oh, wait...
> 
> The absence of R mount does make me wonder. Maybe there's a mechanical design issue.



Non enough RF lenses yet, and no Cinema RF lenses yet as well. Not sure if cinematographers would have liked an adapter, and how it could impact rigging needs. Not sure also if RF fully motor-driven focus would play well with the needs of focus pulling - but I never had a chance to use an RF lens yet.


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## BillB (Aug 27, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> If the rumored specs on the C500 II (no 8K) are correct it seems rather unlikely that a C300 III will get 8K. Canon very rarely undercuts a higher end model with a lower end one.


If the rumors are true, Canon might start by putting 8K in the C300 first either for engineering reasons, such as ease in meeting processing requirements or overall ease of implementation, or because it is aiming for a specific market niche or price point.


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## will4m (Aug 27, 2019)

cpreston said:


> Specs don’t seem right. 4K and 2K RAW doesn’t seem logical. Would Canon add a line skipped or 2x cropped RAW mode?Maybe the source misunderstood a near lossless 14bit 444 recording mode.


If the rumors that it is using the C700FF sensor are true, then the 4K raw mode would make sense as a S35 mode. My guess would be that it can record S35 4K CRM up to 60fps and FF 6K CRM up to 30fps. (With the Codex Raw recorder on the C700FF, you can record 6K raw up to 60fps and 4K raw up to 72 fps.)


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## will4m (Aug 27, 2019)

LDS said:


> Non enough RF lenses yet, and no Cinema RF lenses yet as well. Not sure if cinematographers would have liked an adapter, and how it could impact rigging needs. Not sure also if RF fully motor-driven focus would play well with the needs of focus pulling - but I never had a chance to use an RF lens yet.


Agreed that very few people would use with RF lenses at launch. But with this type of camera, you will want to use it for at least 5 years (by which time RF options will have proliferated). My hope is that: since the lens-mount is user-swappable, that users could swap to an RF mount. However, looking at this picture, I am worried that the body might protrude just a bit too much (so that the 24mm shorter RF mount might have to be recessed in the body, which likely wouldn't happen). As pointed out by @*Avenger 2.0*, one design constraint might be the depth added by the inclusion of ND filters. However, Sony has managed to fit two full-frame ND filter wheels into the Venice (which can be swapped to an E-mount which is shallower than RF) – therefore, it is physically possible to have a short-flange-distance mount with full-frame filter wheels.


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## cpreston (Aug 27, 2019)

This looks to be a fairly well thought out evolution of the cinema line that will be backwards compatible with a lot of the accumulated peripherals from the newer cinema cameras. I am not sure why timecode would be optional, but maybe Canon has decided to keep the bodies as cheap as possible and then charge for extras that can be moved from body to body. My one wish is that the base model had an rf mount, but maybe they will find a work around.


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## RunAndGun (Aug 27, 2019)

Yes. It’s easy enough to get ND behind shallow mounts. E and FZ, which are both shallower, are the native mount on the Fs7 series and F55/5, respectively. And as was mentioned, the “FF” Venice has an E mount and a dual tray 0-8 stop ND system.

And technically on the Venice, the E mount isn’t swappable, at least in the conventional sense. It’s actually located beneath the removeable PL mount. You could say it’s the native mount of the camera and almost say it’s the base mount, but the PL mount doesn’t actually attach to it/in it. It bolts-on around it/over it.


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## cinemanimal (Aug 27, 2019)

If these are really the frame rates Canon has another missed opportunity on its hands. This is little more than an updated full frame C200. C400 would be a more accurate name. I would rather have had s35 and 4K 120fps+. 2k 120fps is fine in something like a 1dx2, and not a camera like this. I really hope this is wrong. The big push to full frame is over rated and overhyped. But maybe enough people will buy into that hype. “But” it’s full Frame!”, and cheap!


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## DrToast (Aug 27, 2019)

So no DPAF? Do I understand that correctly? 

I can't help but wonder if it's time for Canon to ditch DPAF on its stills cameras. I've read the DPAF is what's preventing the full frame 4k on its DSLRs. Too much data to process. I don't know if that's the case, but it would make sense.


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## RayValdez360 (Aug 27, 2019)

DrToast said:


> So no DPAF? Do I understand that correctly?
> 
> I can't help but wonder if it's time for Canon to ditch DPAF on its stills cameras. I've read the DPAF is what's preventing the full frame 4k on its DSLRs. Too much data to process. I don't know if that's the case, but it would make sense.


where do you get this from. it has a 1 shot af button on the front like all the rest. the c700 has it and it is full frame.


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## DrToast (Aug 27, 2019)

RayValdez360 said:


> where do you get this from. it has a 1 shot af button on the front like all the rest. the c700 has it and it is full frame.



I was asking a question because it doesn't list DPAF in the specs.


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## cpreston (Aug 27, 2019)

DrToast said:


> I was asking a question because it doesn't list DPAF in the specs.


Possibly because the PL mount version will not be able to use DPAF.


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## robotfist (Aug 27, 2019)

The biggest issue I see with this camera are the codecs and the over cranking. I own a C200 and I'm getting tired of these massive file sizes. I thought I'd be fine with it, but it's too much. I've been shooting with an Alexa over the past month and I don't see the need for Raw at all. I feel like Canon chose Raw not because it's a benefit, but because it's the easier route. The camera doesn't have to compress and process the image, and therefore, it's easier to engineer. You'd think that it would mean Canon could over crank easier, but no. Their slow motion sucks. Anything over 60 on the C200 is completely unusable. It looks like muted, washed out mush. Canon has never considered over cranking a priority to filmmakers.


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## jvillain (Aug 27, 2019)

Is there a way to use SSDs rather than buying a bunch of CFX cards with the cinema cameras other than using an external recorder? 

-*Full-frame sensor *
-*Records 2k120p in Super16 crop in Cinema RAW light *


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## bgoyette (Aug 27, 2019)

With the updated specs, this is seeming more like the C700FF Lite with the biggest feature being internal RAW recording. (the CR specs are a little iffy on whether 5.9k full frame is recorded internally to the CFExpress or not). If so, then this would repair some of the complaints (mine) about the C700 in that it required extremely expensive Codex hardware to record any kind of raw. Sure, some folks will go on and on about the BMPFCC (F added by me) -- but that's not "really" a video/cinema camera. This feature set would be a first for cameras in this category, coming on the heels of the Alexa Mini LF with its less earthbound recording media. This camera is aimed at that. What bugs me is the Red like "module" structure...meaning the camera isn't going to be as slick out of the box as a Canon usually is. Canon has never been known to follow up with accessories that improve functionality of their cameras, and this seems like a way of stripping down a C700, only to require the user to build it back up for the same price. Time will tell.


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## Kit. (Aug 27, 2019)

cpreston said:


> Possibly because the PL mount version will not be able to use DPAF.


Manual Focus Assist?


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## cpreston (Aug 27, 2019)

Kit. said:


> Manual Focus Assist?



Manual focus assist only works on ef lenses.


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## cpreston (Aug 27, 2019)

bgoyette said:


> What bugs me is the Red like "module" structure...meaning the camera isn't going to be as slick out of the box as a Canon usually is. Canon has never been known to follow up with accessories that improve functionality of their cameras, and this seems like a way of stripping down a C700, only to require the user to build it back up for the same price. Time will tell.



I would feel the same way other than the fact that I'v already invested in a bunch of different Canon modules and batteries. I mean it isn't great to be locked into an eco system, but I am happy that Canon letting modules be used on different cameras.


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## Stereodude (Aug 27, 2019)

BillB said:


> If the rumors are true, Canon might start by putting 8K in the C300 first either for engineering reasons, such as ease in meeting processing requirements or overall ease of implementation, or because it is aiming for a specific market niche or price point.


Perhaps, but there's probably too much money to be made milking people at the intermediate 6K step for Canon to skip it and go straight to 8K.


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## CanonGrunt (Aug 28, 2019)

Come to me my precious.


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## NorskHest (Aug 28, 2019)

I own a lot of canon gear and I see these current specs and can’t help but think hello Panasonic s1h. If there is no 4,5or5.9k 120 then this will flop. Until you give us a reason to switch from red, Arri, Sony or Panasonic this will be a non starter. Why switch from my massive CRL files to even bigger files and shitty slow mo. This is another attempt to not cannibalize one of their cameras. The lack of compression choices for raw we have learned is due to red getting a monopoly patent on codecs, this could be why canon has shit slomotion. My local rental house has not rented either of their 2 c700s. Which according to them next to no one has rented their c700s. I love canon but they are lazy and so behind when it comes to innovation. The sensor in this is a 1dxmkii sensor, it’s a great sensor but come on, take a risk. Stop repurposing. And yes I know this has bells and whistles the s1h doesn’t but that will sell and this will not unless it has more frame rate choices and more compression choices.


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## Stereodude (Aug 28, 2019)

NorskHest said:


> I own a lot of canon gear and I see these current specs and can’t help but think hello Panasonic s1h...


Or BMPCC 6K + LucAdapters Magicbooster.


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## C Tographer (Aug 28, 2019)

Specs = Excellent

This is the first Canon camera where I'm not disappointed by the specifications.

User interchangeable lens mount is great. Being able to add RF-mount at a later date future proofs this camera.


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## snoke (Aug 28, 2019)

uri.raz said:


> All the more so as the EF mount is dead. Oh, wait...
> 
> The absence of R mount does make me wonder. Maybe there's a mechanical design issue.



Calendar issue and marketting issue.

Cannot change mount mid-series. New product series for new mount.


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## jvillain (Aug 28, 2019)

NorskHest said:


> The lack of compression choices for raw we have learned is due to red getting a monopoly patent on codecs, this could be why canon has shit slomotion.


Well Blaclk Magic Raw is open sourced so Canon could use that and I would suggest should use it, but of course won't. But beyond that there is nothing preventing Canon from developing their own codecs with compression, they don't have to use Red's. But as some one still s[rewed by Canons CR3 stills file format where they wouldn't release the format to companies that make photo editing software so few support it yet, I am leary of Canon doing things in house. I really hope more companies embrace BM Raw.


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## cpreston (Aug 28, 2019)

jvillain said:


> But beyond that there is nothing preventing Canon from developing their own codecs with compression, they don't have to use Red's.



Canon already has developed their own compressed codecs. They have both Canon Raw Lite and various forms of H.264. The C300 MKII even has a 12bit 444 RGB format that was just as robust as the compressed RAW formats. And then there is ProRes RAW available with Atomos. 

Canon's weakness will probably always be high frame rates at high resolutions at cheap prices. Some day, Sony will be shooting 16K at 1000fps and Canon will only be able to shoot 16k at 600 fps and we will still be seeing posts about Canon being ******* because they are crippling their cameras.


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## C Tographer (Aug 29, 2019)

*Full frame = glorious wide angle shots*


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## Dragon (Sep 1, 2019)

Avenger 2.0 said:


> You have the internal ND filters. Maybe they aren't small enough to fit with RF mount?


That is almost certainly the case. There isn't much room between the back of the lens and the sensor with R (probably almost none with some lenses). Also, this is a cinema camera and most users are going to be looking at parfocal lenses, so not much real interest in R glass. Lastly, the ultra fast wide angle advantage of the R mount does not relate to a significant percentage of cinema work. In any case, running the rapids is more likely to be shot with a disposable body than a $16k studio camera.


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## transpo1 (Sep 3, 2019)

CanonFanBoy said:


> Priced too high. Canon is protecting the 90D.



Just checking- it does 24p, right?


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## RayValdez360 (Sep 3, 2019)

CanonFanBoy said:


> Priced too high. Canon is protecting the 90D.


it probably will be missing something to protect the c700 aka the camera no one cares about.


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