# Laowa STF 105mm f/2 Lens Coming Next Week



## Canon Rumors Guy (Jan 14, 2016)

```
We received the following information (third party summary) about an upcoming new lens from Laowa, a 105mm f/2 that will be available for Canon’s EF mount:</p>
<p>After the Laowa 60mm f/2.8 Macro 2:1 and the Laowa 15mm f/4 Shift Macro 1:1 lenses, the Chinese company Anhui Changgeng Optical Technology Company Limited, better known as Venus Optics (see <a href="http://www.venuslens.net/about"><span class="s2">http://www.venuslens.net/about</span></a>), will announce shortly a new 24×36 lens: the <b>Laowa STF 105mm f/2 (T/3.2)</b>.</p>
<p>It is a portrait lens with an apodization filter that gives a more progressive and velvety bokeh than an ordinary lens (STF stands for <i>Smooth Trans Focus</i>). This is the same principle as for the Minolta AF / Sony 135mm f/2.8 [T/4.5] STF and close to that of the Fujinon XF 56mm f/1.2 R APD.</p>
<p><!--more--></p>
<p>The Laowa has the advantage over the Sony of being one EV brighter. Hereafter its main features:</p>
<ul>
<li>11 elements, including the apodization filter, 1 element made of glass with high refractive index and 3 elements made of low dispersion glass, in 8 groups</li>
<li><span class="s1">Manual focus <i>(the apodization filter is hostile for phase-detection autofocus)</i>

</span></li>
<li><span class="s1">Minimum focusing distance: 90cm

</span></li>
<li><span class="s1">Maximum magnification: 0.16x

</span></li>
<li><span class="s1">Filter diameter: 67mm

</span></li>
<li><span class="s1">Dimensions: 76 mm (maximum diameter) x 98.9 mm (length) <i>(depending on lens mount)</i>

</span></li>
<li><span class="s1">Weight: 745 g <i>(depending on lens mount)</i>

</span></li>
<li><span class="s1">Available mounts: <b>Canon EF</b>, Nikon F, Pentax K, Sony A and Sony E

</span></li>
<li><span class="s1">Available in black and silver

</span></li>
<li><span class="s1">Launch date: January 18, 2016

</span></li>
<li><span class="s1">Price in China: the equivalent of €500-550 <i>(probably more in Western countries)</i></span></li>
</ul>
<p>You can find more details and many pictures taken with the lens on two threads from the Chinese forum Xitek:</p>
<p><span class="s2"><a href="http://forum.xitek.com/thread-1533456-1-1-1.html">http://forum.xitek.com/thread-1533456-1-1-1.html</a> & </span><a href="http://forum.xitek.com/thread-1444928-1-1-1.html"><span class="s2">http://forum.xitek.com/thread-1444928-1-1-1.html</span></a></p>
<p>You will also find a number of images (pictures of the lens, optical formula, MTF curves and a dozen of sample images as full-resolution jpeg files) in the dedicated Flickr album I have set up: <a href="https://flic.kr/s/aHsksPyYgn"><span class="s2">https://flic.kr/s/aHsksPyYgn</span></a>.</p>
<span id="pty_trigger"></span>
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## nicksotgiu (Jan 14, 2016)

I must say I've never heard of this manufacturer before...


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## painya (Jan 14, 2016)

Is that f stop and T stop disparity common for primes?


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 14, 2016)

painya said:


> Is that f stop and T stop disparity common for primes?



Some disparity is common (that's why cinema lenses are specified by T-Stop). A disparity of 1.3 stop is extreme, a lens marketed as f/2 that is actually slower than f/2.8?


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## heptagon (Jan 14, 2016)

neuroanatomist said:


> painya said:
> 
> 
> > Is that f stop and T stop disparity common for primes?
> ...



That might have to do with the apodization filter which filters out light.


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## NancyP (Jan 14, 2016)

So far Laowa has come up with some interesting specialty lenses. It's not trying to compete with the OEM or large third party manufacturers on price, like the company making the knock-off of the 50mm f/1.8 II. It's not making inexpensive manual versions of common focal lengths, like Samyang.


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## Mistral75 (Jan 14, 2016)

Here's an interesting website that somebody set up to explain how the Minolta / Sony 135mm f/2.8 [T/4.5] STF works: http://www.the135stf.net/apodisation.html

The same applies to the Venus Laowa STF 105mm f/2 [T/3.2] lens that includes an apodisation filter/element too.


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 14, 2016)

heptagon said:


> That might have to do with the apodization filter which filters out light.



Thanks, missed that in the description.


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## jeffa4444 (Jan 14, 2016)

neuroanatomist said:


> painya said:
> 
> 
> > Is that f stop and T stop disparity common for primes?
> ...



The simple answer is f stops are calculated and T stops are measured. You may see variation with f stops but should not with T stops. This is more critical in cinematography because you are matching shots from different lenses.


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 14, 2016)

jeffa4444 said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > painya said:
> ...



Yes, that's obvious. But that 'simple answer' does not address the question about the larger-than-typical gap between F-stop and T-stop reported for this particular lens. Normally, differences run less than 0.5-stop, the 1.3-stop difference in this case is likely due to the use of an apodization filter.


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## NancyP (Jan 14, 2016)

The bokeh is REALLY NICE on that Minolta apodization lens, see that site linked a few messages earlier in this thread. Manual focus, no focus confirmation (apodization eliminates sharp difference between focus and out of focus parts of the AF sensor) - likely to be somewhat challenging to use.


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## danski0224 (Jan 14, 2016)

How would this lens be better than the Nikon 105 or 135 mm f/2 DC?


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## mrsfotografie (Jan 14, 2016)

Mistral75 said:


> Here's an interesting website that somebody set up to explain how the Minolta / Sony 135mm f/2.8 [T/4.5] STF works: http://www.the135stf.net/apodisation.html
> 
> The same applies to the Venus Laowa STF 105mm f/2 [T/3.2] lens that includes an apodisation filter/element too.



Thanks for that, I've learned something new today


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## Maiaibing (Jan 14, 2016)

danski0224 said:


> How would this lens be better than the Nikon 105 or 135 mm f/2 DC?



They are soft focus lenses - they blur the picture - no need to buy them anymore in a digital world. This however, is an entirely different lens solution. It lets the main subject remain 100% sharp but ensures an ultimate smooth bokeh. It is a real plus that we now can have this for the Canon mount. It is a far more useful solution which can only be achieved optically.


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## Maiaibing (Jan 14, 2016)

painya said:


> Is that f stop and T stop disparity common for primes?



This is what you get with this kind of a lens. The special filter that creates the fantastic bokeh this lens type is associated with reduces the total amount of light just as a ND or POL filter does.


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## danski0224 (Jan 14, 2016)

Maiaibing said:


> They are soft focus lenses - they blur the picture - no need to buy them anymore in a digital world. This however, is an entirely different lens solution. It lets the main subject remain 100% sharp but ensures an ultimate smooth bokeh. It is a real plus that we now can have this for the Canon mount. It is a far more useful solution which can only be achieved optically.



That's how those 2 Nikon lenses work.


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## vscd (Jan 14, 2016)

> That's how those 2 Nikon lenses work.



Let's forget the fact that they don't work like this lens, for a moment. How do they help a Canon EF bajonett user?


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## NancyP (Jan 14, 2016)

Most manual Nikkors work well with a simple adapter, some newer Nikkors require a specialized adapter to work on EF mount Canon bodies. I have the simple adapter and a few old film era lenses eg AIS Nikkor 135 f/2.5.


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## danski0224 (Jan 14, 2016)

vscd said:


> Let's forget the fact that they don't work like this lens, for a moment. How do they help a Canon EF bajonett user?



Almost any Nikon lens can be used on a Canon camera with a simple adapter. It would be 100% manual and probably no EXIF data (I haven't looked at chipped adapters).

Excluding the EXIF data, no changes.

The Nikon 105 and 135 DC have, for lack of a better description, adjustable bokeh. Or, absolute sharpness. These lenses are generally very well regarded. I don't know what the T stop is, but there is no internal filter. 

I am curious to know what benefits the filter in the posted lens has over the DC lenses.

I do have the 105 DC.


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## aceflibble (Jan 15, 2016)

105mm f/2.8 (and equivalents for medium format) have been go-to portrait lenses for decades. 85mm is more popular these days, but from the early days of Hollywood right up until the early 90s, 100-110mm was the more popular general portrait lens. Getting the lens up a stop to f/2 to then be able to use an APD element and get more or less the same light as other 105mm f/2.8 lenses see wide open is a pretty smart design.

No AF or focus confirmation shouldn't really be a problem; anybody looking for this kind of classic result is probably well versed in manually focusing without aids.

Only things I do see being a problem is that any Nikon user who wants this kind of thing already has many, many options, and Canon users who want this kind of range have the 100mm f/2 and the 100mm f/2.8L IS to choose from, depending on which aspects they value most. Sony users likely already have adapters for one brand or another, so they're also unlikely to be missing this focal length if it's something they want. I'm not well versed in the Pentax range, but I have to imagine it's a similar case there, too..

So who is it that is used to this more classic portrait focal length and has one of these common systems and wouldn't already have a lens that does this job? Sure, APD is a bit of a unique selling point, but it stops having an effect after around f/4.5 or so and it's hard to imagine people giving up their current Canon/Nikon/whatever glass for the sake of an apodization filter, which actually can be retrofitted to any lens anyway. Meanwhile, Nikon users can pick up DC if they like, unique to them, and Canon users get to choose from a genuinely brighter lens or macro + IS; none of these things can be retrofitted like apodization can.

Cool lens, and I can totally see the _use_ for it, but I'm struggling to see the _market_ for it.


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## candc (Jan 15, 2016)

Maiaibing said:


> danski0224 said:
> 
> 
> > How would this lens be better than the Nikon 105 or 135 mm f/2 DC?
> ...



The Nikon 105 and 135dc lenses are not soft focus but rather "defocus control" they are also very sharp but allow you control some aspects of the defocused area with a ring on the lens.

http://kenrockwell.com/nikon/135mm-f2-dc.htm


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## risc32 (Jan 15, 2016)

I don't own one thing from nikon yet even i know that the dc nikons aren't soft focus lenses. 
that minolta lens was very interesting(back in my minolta days), but for me, it just never seemed worth it. Sure you could get a nice smooth focus transition, but you weren't gaining the benefits of an actual fast lens. It was actually slow for it's focal length, and manual focus only on top of it. Sure you might be able to manual focus pretty well, i can also, but it makes the lens even more of a specialized piece of kit. 
personally, i think anyone who would rather use this chinese MF lens over any of the number of alternatives must really like abuse, and frankly should just go all the way and shoot film. and develop it. and enlarge it, and print it.


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## Bennymiata (Jan 15, 2016)

I think this lens has a very nice look to it, and for the money, it would be cheaper to buy this than get a lens converted.
I wonder if anyone will be selling these into Australia?


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## Mistral75 (Jan 15, 2016)

Bennymiata said:


> I think this lens has a very nice look to it, and for the money, it would be cheaper to buy this than get a lens converted.
> I wonder if anyone will be selling these into Australia?



May I suggest your contacting Kevin from Venus Optics at [email protected]? You can tell him you are doing so on the advice of Mistral75.


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## chromophore (Jan 15, 2016)

neuroanatomist said:


> jeffa4444 said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...



Moreover, it may be interesting to point out that this difference should get smaller as the lens is stopped down; so for example, if the lens is shot at f/4, the t-stop will not remain over one stop slower, since the filter's proximity relative to the aperture stop should be as close as possible. At f/8, transmission losses should be on par with a normal lens.


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## NancyP (Jan 15, 2016)

I will say that having an extra-fine focusing screen helps considerably with manual focus lenses on modern DSLRs. My accuracy rate went way up when I replaced the conventional screen with the S screen, an option on the 6D. I don't use too many lenses that are slower than f/2.8 on that camera, so a dark screen at f/4 or f/5.6 isn't the problem - the f/5.6 lens gets used on the APS-C.

I do think that the Minolta has a different look to it. The apodization lenses surely are specialty lenses, meant to be used close to wide open, in this case f/2.8 to f/4 or f/4.5 - no point in it if you stop down to f/8.


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## mrsfotografie (Jan 15, 2016)

vscd said:


> > That's how those 2 Nikon lenses work.
> 
> 
> 
> Let's forget the fact that they don't work like this lens, for a moment. How do they help a Canon EF bajonett user?



if you must have softfocus, try to find one of these:
EF135mm f/2.8 Soft Focus (with Softfocus mechanism)
http://www.canon.com/c-museum/en/product/ef268.html


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## Maiaibing (Jan 15, 2016)

NancyP said:


> The apodization lenses surely are specialty lenses, meant to be used close to wide open, in this case f/2.8 to f/4 or f/4.5 - no point in it if you stop down to f/8.



Absolutely.


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## yorgasor (Jan 15, 2016)

I'm a sucker for these kinds of lenses. I'm always looking for something that will give me a more unique look to my portraits, and this looks like it would be a lot of fun to use. Is there any sign of when this will get released?


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## NancyP (Jan 16, 2016)

The PR release said that the lens will be shown next week. When it ships to your area - who knows?


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