# 6D as a Compliment to 5DMkiii



## Wilmark (Feb 24, 2013)

There has been a sort of love hate reaction toward the 6D. I feel that the 6D is the perfect complimentary camera to the 5Dmkiii. Many pro photographers need a second camera, and I believe the 6D is perfect if you use the 5Dm3 as your primary camera. Almost every feature is complimentary. The 5D lacks the fancy connectivity/gps capabilities not to mention the remote EOS software for your phone, the low light focusing ability. The 6D lacks superior focusing, video ability and a few others. All while maintaining similar IQ. I have not heard this discussed. If you own both, you have almost all you bases covered with duplication of the most important qualities. If only the 6D could be had for 1500$ or less - maybe in a few months, the ebay offers will appear.


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## RMC33 (Feb 24, 2013)

If I ever have to replace my 5DII for events it will be with a 6D.


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## Marsu42 (Feb 24, 2013)

Wilmark said:


> I have not heard this discussed. If you own both, you have almost all you bases covered with duplication of the most important qualities. If only the 6D could be had for 1500$ or less - maybe in a few months, the ebay offers will appear.



I'm sure Canon wants it and designed it this way - another point is that the 6d focusing screens are exchangeable while the 5d3 is fixed (unlike 1dx btw). However the usability is quite different: joystick vs. multicontroller, right-hand control vs. both sides, single- vs. dual button layout. When I compared the 6d to the 5d3 in a shop I had trouble with the 5d3 control because I'm used to my 60d (= 6d control) - so I don't know how shooting both in parallel would be.


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## Wilmark (Feb 24, 2013)

Marsu42 said:


> However the usability is quite different: joystick vs. multicontroller, right-hand control vs. both sides, single- vs. dual button layout. When I compared the 6d to the 5d3 in a shop I had trouble with the 5d3 control because I'm used to my 60d (= 6d control) - so I don't know how shooting both in parallel would be.



Well maybe Canon didnt quite intent it that way, and my point was that this was overlooked - most likely their primary target was users wanting FF maybe coming from consumer grade DSLR. However you raise a valid point - for it to be a good second camera to the 5D3 its ui should be similar - and it couldnt be more different. However the 6D represent a modern approach, and I am sure that most of us tech savy users wont find this daunting.


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## Dick (Feb 24, 2013)

Wilmark said:


> I believe the 6D is perfect if you use the 5Dm3 as your primary camera.



I disagree. These 2 bodies are for very different ways of shooting. With 5D3 you focus in various places and then capture photos, whereas the 6D is a recomposing machine.

I would say that it makes most sense to have two bodies of the same kind if two bodies are needed for the same purpose.


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## bdunbar79 (Feb 24, 2013)

If you have a 5D Mark III, there wouldn't really be any reason to buy or have a 6D, unless you shot with a backup camera and didn't want to spend the resources to buy another 5D Mark III. Pretty much all the wedding photogs I know shoot with a backup camera, so this makes sense. That's really the only reason I can see in owning both, and I don't think in the real world the 6D offers much anything over the 5D3. However, I can see advantages of the 5D3 over the 6D.

The 6D market is primarily I'm guessing for those entering FF for the first time and who want to get serious about photography. I look at the 6D as what the 5D2 was back in 2008. So there's really no reason for 5D2 owners to complain about the lack of differences between the 6D and 5D2, because there weren't intended to be any. The 6D probably has a better sensor and that's it.


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## Wilmark (Feb 24, 2013)

Dick said:


> I would say that it makes most sense to have two bodies of the same kind if two bodies are needed for the same purpose.



I disagree and here is why. If you are extremely focused on one genre of photography what you are saying is true. However, most photogs even pros are interested in expanded function. So if you choose your second body so that it expands the functionality as well as offer backup and duplication then thats a good thing for many. I have see Canon photogs go out and buy a D800 + the wide angle nikon glass and use it on the same assignment with their canon gear because that combo offers some advantages.


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## Wilmark (Feb 24, 2013)

bdunbar79 said:


> If you have a 5D Mark III, there wouldn't really be any reason to buy or have a 6D, unless you shot with a backup camera and didn't want to spend the resources to buy another 5D Mark III. Pretty much all the wedding photogs I know shoot with a backup camera, so this makes sense. That's really the only reason I can see in owning both, and I don't think in the real world the 6D offers much anything over the 5D3. However, I can see advantages of the 5D3 over the 6D



So you dont see any benefit in controlling your camera wirelessly or the GPS functionality (yes I know that you could spend a couple hundred dollars on a gps sensor for the 5D). The 6D is said to focus is said to work better in low light, and i have experienced this annoying characteristic in the 5D3.


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## Dick (Feb 24, 2013)

Wilmark said:


> Dick said:
> 
> 
> > I would say that it makes most sense to have two bodies of the same kind if two bodies are needed for the same purpose.
> ...



I agree with you there completely. That is why I mentioned the need being for the same purpose. Personally I'd prefer the controls to be the same on bodies I switch constantly even if the bodies bring different features to the table.


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## bdunbar79 (Feb 24, 2013)

Wilmark said:


> bdunbar79 said:
> 
> 
> > If you have a 5D Mark III, there wouldn't really be any reason to buy or have a 6D, unless you shot with a backup camera and didn't want to spend the resources to buy another 5D Mark III. Pretty much all the wedding photogs I know shoot with a backup camera, so this makes sense. That's really the only reason I can see in owning both, and I don't think in the real world the 6D offers much anything over the 5D3. However, I can see advantages of the 5D3 over the 6D
> ...



Me personally, no and no. I don't care to control anything wirelessly and I have no reason to use GPS and the 6D's focus is only better at center, and since I'm a sports photog, I don't care about center focus. The 6D has no real-world improvements for real-world shooting over a 5D3. In fact, for a sports photog like myself, the 6D is worse. The 6D is not meant for me. I think wedding photogs could really, really benefit from it, but in reality, if you already have a 5D3, you're not going to really notice it as much as if say, you were coming from a Rebel. The sensor in the 6D has to be better than the 5D2 and we all probably already realize this. I think the 6D makes for a great wedding, portrait, and landscape camera, but for me, not a sports camera and since I already own a 5D3, I have little reason to even consider a 6D. In fact, the 1DX is actually the ultimate "everything" camera, and would whip both the 5D3 and 6D at wedding photography .


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## V8Beast (Feb 24, 2013)

I'm sure that the 6D would be a nice complimentary body to the 5D3 for some users. Personally, I'd rather buy a second 5D3 or a used 1Ds3. I almost never use the center focus point, and aside from the additional 50 AF points that the 5D3 offers over the 6D, what makes those points so useful is how much of the frame they cover (53% horizontally). 

The 6D's -3EV center point focusing ability is very impressive. Even so, I find the 5D3's low-light focusing ability to be astoundingly good, even when it's so dark outside that you can hardly see your feet  

















Another great perk of the 5D3/1Dx AF system is how many of its 61 AF points function as cross-type sensors, even with slow glass.


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## Nishi Drew (Mar 28, 2013)

I was one to poo-poo the 6D but seeing how the prices have come down to a much more reasonable deal I've started looking at it again. I've read up on a wedding photog shooting with both a 5D3 and 6D and said the 6D worked fine, said it's AF worked very well in low light with the 85L, even the outer points were useful when needed. But naturally, for tracking moving subjects, especially such as the bride coming down the isle, the 5D3 would do much much better.
My concern though is with video work as well, and it's possible the 6D fails there (as well along with everything else to complain about with the 6D's nature) and has as much or worse moire than the 5DII, while the 5D3 is plain soft, even though sharpening works.


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## Skirball (Mar 28, 2013)

Nishi Drew said:


> But naturally, for tracking moving subjects, especially such as the bride coming down the isle, the 5D3 would do much much better.



I guess I go to boring weddings. Every one I've ever been to the bride slowly inches her way down the isle. Hardly a test for any AF system I've ever used.


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## V8Beast (Mar 29, 2013)

Skirball said:


> Nishi Drew said:
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> > But naturally, for tracking moving subjects, especially such as the bride coming down the isle, the 5D3 would do much much better.
> ...



Same here, nothing but boring weddings for me. It would be much more exciting if the bride sprinted down the aisle and animated her jiggly bits ;D


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## J.R. (Mar 29, 2013)

bdunbar79 said:


> If you have a 5D Mark III, there wouldn't really be any reason to buy or have a 6D, unless you shot with a backup camera and didn't want to spend the resources to buy another 5D Mark III.



+1 

This was the reason I bought the 6D as a backup body to the 5d3. Similar IQ for less price but compromising on some of the excellent features of the 5d3.

The interface is quite different between the 5d3 and the 6d and it takes some time to get used to shooting with both cameras at an event.


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## J.R. (Mar 29, 2013)

V8Beast said:


> I'm sure that the 6D would be a nice complimentary body to the 5D3 for some users. Personally, I'd rather buy a second 5D3 or a used 1Ds3. I almost never use the center focus point, and aside from the additional 50 AF points that the 5D3 offers over the 6D, what makes those points so useful is how much of the frame they cover (53% horizontally).
> 
> The 6D's -3EV center point focusing ability is very impressive. Even so, I find the 5D3's low-light focusing ability to be astoundingly good, even when it's so dark outside that you can hardly see your feet
> 
> ...



The third shot is awesome


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## ashmadux (Mar 31, 2013)

V8Beast said:


> I almost never use the center focus point, and aside from the additional 50 AF points that the 5D3 offers over the 6D, what makes those points so useful is how much of the frame they cover (53% horizontally).
> 
> Another great perk of the 5D3/1Dx AF system is how many of its 61 AF points function as cross-type sensors, even with slow glass.



I can appreciate when a shooter mentions they rarely use the center focus point. Within all of the photo forums that i peruse, all i hear is people crowing about how "they dont need" more than one focus point or "focus and recompose" is the best way to go, etc. Im still on the 7d/rebel level of bodies due to budget, and was appalled and eventually killed my 6d purchase mainly due the weak AF canon put in there.

I pretty much never use the central focus point, for my portrait, street style and even landscape work.


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## Skirball (Apr 1, 2013)

ashmadux said:


> V8Beast said:
> 
> 
> > I almost never use the center focus point, and aside from the additional 50 AF points that the 5D3 offers over the 6D, what makes those points so useful is how much of the frame they cover (53% horizontally).
> ...



Congratulations?


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## Dylan777 (Apr 2, 2013)

Wilmark said:


> There has been a sort of love hate reaction toward the 6D. I feel that the 6D is the perfect complimentary camera to the 5Dmkiii. Many pro photographers need a second camera, and I believe the 6D is perfect if you use the 5Dm3 as your primary camera. Almost every feature is complimentary. The 5D lacks the fancy connectivity/gps capabilities not to mention the remote EOS software for your phone, the low light focusing ability. The 6D lacks superior focusing, video ability and a few others. All while maintaining similar IQ. I have not heard this discussed. If you own both, you have almost all you bases covered with duplication of the most important qualities. If only the 6D could be had for 1500$ or less - maybe in a few months, the ebay offers will appear.



I said before and I'm going to say it* again*: - Most 6D owners were from Rebel(budget issue). Therefore, the high lighted features above are so dam important more than AF system. Who take picture @ -3EV?

I don't see $6800(1D X) body has "fancy connectivity/gps capabilities not to mention the remote EOS software for your phone"

I'm sure 5D III & 1D X owners will have no problem adding those accessories if they feel is needed.


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## bdunbar79 (Apr 2, 2013)

ashmadux said:


> V8Beast said:
> 
> 
> > I almost never use the center focus point, and aside from the additional 50 AF points that the 5D3 offers over the 6D, what makes those points so useful is how much of the frame they cover (53% horizontally).
> ...



Exactly! Thank you! Seems like a lot of people on here offer advice only because they have some damn personal connection to a particular lens or body. The ultimate BACKUP camera is the SAME camera. If you want to expand your capabilities, fine go ahead, but I highly doubt I'm looking to expand my capabilities when I pull for my backup camera when the football offensive drive is getting closer. Maybe I should term it my SECOND camera so as to avoid confusion. But, I want the SAME camera with only a shorter focal length because I don't have time to fiddle with different controls. And oh my gosh if you are looking to expand your capabilities from a 5D Mark III, please do not buy a 6D. Finally, I never use the center point either. Why would I? 

There, I'm done.


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## Skirball (Apr 2, 2013)

bdunbar79 said:


> Finally, I never use the center point either. Why would I?



Just for amusement I thumbed through the first three pages of your Flickr stream to see what you shoot. I found it amusing that all but maybe 2 photos had the subject smack dab in the center.


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## J.R. (Apr 2, 2013)

Dylan777 said:


> Wilmark said:
> 
> 
> > There has been a sort of love hate reaction toward the 6D. I feel that the 6D is the perfect complimentary camera to the 5Dmkiii. Many pro photographers need a second camera, and I believe the 6D is perfect if you use the 5Dm3 as your primary camera. Almost every feature is complimentary. The 5D lacks the fancy connectivity/gps capabilities not to mention the remote EOS software for your phone, the low light focusing ability. The 6D lacks superior focusing, video ability and a few others. All while maintaining similar IQ. I have not heard this discussed. If you own both, you have almost all you bases covered with duplication of the most important qualities. If only the 6D could be had for 1500$ or less - maybe in a few months, the ebay offers will appear.
> ...



I guess that is a fair assessment. The only reason I got the 6d is because I couldn't justify shelling out $$$ for another 5d3. The Wifi and the GPS are nice features but not enough in themselves to justify getting a 6d. I only bought the 6d because the IQ was at par with the 5d3, probably a tad cleaner. 

IMHO, the wifi and GPS are sweeteners provided by Canon to help you to justify getting a 6d. Canon's current pricing is such that a "free" wifi and GPS feels like Christmas has arrived early - I don't know how much the 6d owners have used these features but for me it feels inconsequential. 

BTW, the EOS app is plain dumb. If I wanted a remote shooting device, I'd probably get a Camranger.


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## bdunbar79 (Apr 2, 2013)

Skirball said:


> bdunbar79 said:
> 
> 
> > Finally, I never use the center point either. Why would I?
> ...



This is just the stupid comment I was expecting from you. The faces are in focus right? They're faces aren't in the center. They are two AF points up the vertical set of AF points on my camera. 

In other words, you're wrong. See ya.


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## florianbieler.de (Apr 2, 2013)

bdunbar79 said:


> Skirball said:
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> 
> > bdunbar79 said:
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No offense but this seems to be the right time to ask what the heck you shoot there anyway. Two 1DX, a 5D3 and all I see is completely random sports boredom. Are you a professional booked solely for this purpose? I'd sure use that gear for other stuff in my spare time.


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## Wilmark (Apr 2, 2013)

Dylan777 said:


> Wilmark said:
> 
> 
> > There has been a sort of love hate reaction toward the 6D. I feel that the 6D is the perfect complimentary camera to the 5Dmkiii. Many pro photographers need a second camera, and I believe the 6D is perfect if you use the 5Dm3 as your primary camera. Almost every feature is complimentary. The 5D lacks the fancy connectivity/gps capabilities not to mention the remote EOS software for your phone, the low light focusing ability. The 6D lacks superior focusing, video ability and a few others. All while maintaining similar IQ. I have not heard this discussed. If you own both, you have almost all you bases covered with duplication of the most important qualities. If only the 6D could be had for 1500$ or less - maybe in a few months, the ebay offers will appear.
> ...



YES !! we got your point, dont know why you have to shout it out - this is not a group decision, everyone here has a free choice. But obviously everyone does not have your shooting habits and quirks. I dont care to. I think if the 6D was more inexpensive it would make a great companion. You are making my point that you have to pay MORE to have the functionality that is already in the 6D (the gps and connectivity). By owning both the 5D and the 6D you have access to this extra functionality. I never take the same picture with both cameras at the same time. So I have more of an expanded feature set by using the 6D as a backup. The down side is where you are using both cameras for the same shoot and maybe want the advanced auto-focus on both, which is not a huge deal for me. And yes I have encountered many many instances where the 5D3 wont focus because there isn't enough light. Having GPS is great for documentary and landscape photography. And I will repeat this again - you are free have your choice on this and so do others - there is no one right answer or consensus.


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## Robert Welch (Apr 2, 2013)

I picked up a 6D originally as a camera for my wife, since it was a compact size and weight I thought she could handle it easily (she currently uses a 7D, the 6D is actually smaller). I also wanted to test it and see how I liked it as a 'second' camera to my 5D3. I must say, I like it a lot. I find I go to it often instead of the 5D3, it's very nimble and easy to handle. I just use the center focus sensor, and recompose when needed. I find that center sensor to be extremely reliable, and more sensitive in low light than the 5D3. The camera is a pleasure to use, not a replacement for the 5D3 obviously, but a nice and very usable camera. My biggest gripe with the camera would be it doesn't have dual card slots, I would prefer that.


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## J.R. (Apr 2, 2013)

Wilmark said:


> Dylan777 said:
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> 
> > Wilmark said:
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1) 6D as a second camera is great;
2) no-one who can afford a second 5d3 is going to buy the 6d as a backup /second body;
3) it is better if you have the same system on both your cameras;
4) the gimmicks of wifi and GPS are neither a deal maker, neither a deal breaker. They are just sweeteners allowing you to justify your purchase.

BTW, I love my 6D but I'm afraid I'll sell it once I get my head around to buying the 1DX (after upgrading my lenses, of course).

Period!


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## Nancy Goodenough (Apr 2, 2013)

*Re: 6D as a Complement to 5DMkiii*

I got the 5D3 with the first ship and love it, esp for BIF. We were going to Colombia, South America for 3 weeks and I didn't want to carry the mkiii there for security reasons, so got the 6D to take there, as well as a backup to the mkiii.

The 6D was fabulous. Lighter and a little less obvious than the mkiii (I used gaffer's tape over the logos). Got some images in a dark market that I didn't expect. I didn't use the GPS because it drains the battery even when the camera is turned off. After the fact, I probably should have set it up and turned it on and off to capture where I was at the time. I even got a BIF with it, though not as effective as with the 5D3.

I had wanted the EOS-M as a backup and travel camera, but as we know it's horrible. The 6D worked great and I'm glad I got it for backup and this trip.

www.flickr.com/photos/nancygoodenough

I don't have much from Colombia up on flickr yet. Just back.


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## Wilmark (Apr 2, 2013)

J.R. said:


> 2) no-one who can afford a second 5d3 is going to buy the 6d as a backup /second body;


I wont labor the point except to note that this is YOUR criteria. Photogs like to pretend that their preferences are somehow 'better' than those of others. We see this here in this post. If you want to see how unreasonable photographers want to make their 'opinions' into science check the post on "Crazy... go Nikon?". Your point #2 is what I would be weary of .. "who can afford" Professional/Serious photography is about needs and business justification - buying all that you can afford (and that usually involves overspending) this is gearhead and fanboy talk! PERIOD!


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## RLPhoto (Apr 2, 2013)

florianbieler.de said:


> bdunbar79 said:
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> > Skirball said:
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Ouch, I even found that harsh. At least he goes out and shoots, some of these trolls coming into CR don't even leave they're test chart rooms.


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## mustafa (Apr 2, 2013)

Compliment/complement. Similar word, but very different meanings.

Also isle/aisle, FWIW.


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## florianbieler.de (Apr 2, 2013)

Well, in my opinion it is harsh to come at other members only because he owns and uses not one but two 1DX and a 5D3, but then on the other side he's got nothing to show but coverage of unknown sports events. With that gear it is not so special to do that and that provides no good base for a discussion about this camera detail crap whether to use the center point or one above, it probably makes absolutely no difference anyway.


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## bdunbar79 (Apr 2, 2013)

florianbieler.de said:


> Well, in my opinion it is harsh to come at other members only because he owns and uses not one but two 1DX and a 5D3, but then on the other side he's got nothing to show but coverage of unknown sports events. With that gear it is not so special to do that and that provides no good base for a discussion about this camera detail crap whether to use the center point or one above, it probably makes absolutely no difference anyway.



I'm not coming at anybody. Do I think the 6D is a great camera? Yes I do. I think the 6D is a great camera. I merely mentioned that the BEST compliment to a 5D3 is another 5D3. Would the 6D make a great compliment? Sure, why not, but IMO it's not the BEST compliment. And I explained why, and I think I have valid points. Not everyone agrees with me, but And for the record if you read back, when I first stated this, I was questioned and told I was wrong. But anyways, enough of that.

People on here will only personally attack you, and provide no photos of their own (not you by the way). This is normal.

And, the thread isn't about center point AF. It's about 6D as a compliment to the 5D3. I stated my opinion that it wasn't the BEST compliment as the discussion was heading in that direction. For a professional photographer yourself, I'd expect much better from you than personally attacking someone. It is not my fault that I do sports photography mostly and also the only photos I choose to share. I shoot a lot of other things, but I don't put them on my flickr account. Sorry if I have nothing to "show for it" and I won't personally attack anyone.


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## bdunbar79 (Apr 2, 2013)

florianbieler.de said:


> bdunbar79 said:
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> > Skirball said:
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Yes, and I make a lot of money doing it. Thanks.

Well, a lot is subjective. Many of my photos are used by the AP and lowly area newspapers. I also do all of the 8 x 10's for the athletic hallways. I know sports isn't always the most interesting or artistic type of photography, especially in crappy gyms where it is so difficult to get artsy. I also shoot for the GLIAC and NCAC, but I'm getting long-winded.

I know my photos don't go big places, and sorry they are boring to you. But it's what I'm told to do.


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## bdunbar79 (Apr 2, 2013)

RLPhoto said:


> florianbieler.de said:
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> > bdunbar79 said:
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Thanks. There are real people who go out in the trenches and shoot in tough situations.


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## J.R. (Apr 3, 2013)

Wilmark said:


> J.R. said:
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> 
> > 2) no-one who can afford a second 5d3 is going to buy the 6d as a backup /second body;
> ...



If your budget is limited, get a 6D. If you can get another 5d3, get a another 5d3. That's all I'm saying. 

For me affording is something I can buy that it within my reach without having to extend myself unnecessarily. Your definition may be different. 

By your own logic though, what you wrote is YOUR criteria ... What's the whole point of getting oh so emotional over it?


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## J.R. (Apr 3, 2013)

florianbieler.de said:


> Well, in my opinion it is harsh to come at other members only because he owns and uses not one but two 1DX and a 5D3, but then on the other side he's got nothing to show but coverage of unknown sports events. With that gear it is not so special to do that and that provides no good base for a discussion about this camera detail crap whether to use the center point or one above, it probably makes absolutely no difference anyway.



It's equally, if not more harsh to flame someone for what he gets to shoot professionally (and get paid for it). 

BTW, do you shoot sports?


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## bdunbar79 (Apr 3, 2013)

J.R. said:


> florianbieler.de said:
> 
> 
> > Well, in my opinion it is harsh to come at other members only because he owns and uses not one but two 1DX and a 5D3, but then on the other side he's got nothing to show but coverage of unknown sports events. With that gear it is not so special to do that and that provides no good base for a discussion about this camera detail crap whether to use the center point or one above, it probably makes absolutely no difference anyway.
> ...



Thank you.

However J.R., there's no sense in trying to deal with these people. 

It is puzzling how my comments were taken as an attack on someone somehow or other. Secondly, then me, and my work, was attacked. All for really no reason. For stating an opinion (which was taken out of context). Apparently I am reduced to random sports boredom. To be clear though, obviously the photos are for public viewing. This can be changed, however, if they are too boring. Also, random sports boredom is a completely ignorant thing to say. Why? Tell that to the mother who had insufficient funds to come and watch her daughter swim and qualify to the NCAA meet. The mother lived in California while the meet was in Canton, OH. Because I was there photographing we were able to get her hundreds of photos. 

So yes, boring may be, but there's more to photography than being technically interesting to someone I don't even know. These photos are for parents and players, and NOT to entertain YOU. If you'd like it if I took my link down I will and to avoid future personal attacks I can also take down my signature file.

J.R., again, I should stop typing because dealing with these people is futile. Thanks again though.

Back on topic, and as I stated earlier, I think the 6D is a great camera. It probably does perform better than the 5D2 at both ends of the ISO scale. Many friends have turned from Rebels to their first FF camera using the 6D. My point was that I don't like using two different camera systems as main and backup.


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## J.R. (Apr 3, 2013)

bdunbar79 said:


> random sports boredom is a completely ignorant thing to say.



+1. There is always a method to the madness and someone who has never shot sports will never know that. Too many people feel that getting a 1DX will automatically make you a pro-sports photographer. I wish life were that easy! 

There is so much that can go wrong in a sports shoot because you don't get a second chance as you would with a landscape or a pretty model in a studio. The time to take the shot is infinitesimal and though the 1DX is exceptional, it takes considerable skill to get tack sharp shots. 

If I were a pro-sports photographer or aspiring to be one, what would I stack my Flickr account with ... images of the Grand Canyon? Sheesh ...

Back on topic, if you are shooting landscapes or portraits, you'll be pretty safe with the 6D, even as a primary body - whether it will get you off the 5D3/1DX AF itch ... maybe, maybe not!


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## Dylan777 (Apr 3, 2013)

Wilmark said:


> Dylan777 said:
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> > Wilmark said:
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About getting a Powershot as 5D III backup since AF system is NOT important. AND Yes, it does come with GPS and others crappppppp


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## Skirball (Apr 3, 2013)

J.R. said:


> Wilmark said:
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That's funny, because that's the same criticism I'd give back to you two. 

I disagree with this idea that you only get a 6D if that's all you can afford, otherwise get a 5D3. That's all I'm saying. But as you say, people get all emotional over it. Most the people on here seem to decide what camera they want, then they reverse engineer the reasons of why they NEED it. Which is fine, if it doesn't put them out financially. My problem is when they come on here and convince everyone else that they NEED to do the same, usually by exaggerating the lack of capabilities of everything below that camera. So you get more noobies coming on here saying that they were going to by XXX camera but read online that they need to get the YYY. Sorry for trying to give them more than one sided opinions.


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## Chuck Alaimo (Apr 3, 2013)

Wilmark said:


> There has been a sort of love hate reaction toward the 6D. I feel that the 6D is the perfect complimentary camera to the 5Dmkiii. Many pro photographers need a second camera, and I believe the 6D is perfect if you use the 5Dm3 as your primary camera. Almost every feature is complimentary. The 5D lacks the fancy connectivity/gps capabilities not to mention the remote EOS software for your phone, the low light focusing ability. The 6D lacks superior focusing, video ability and a few others. All while maintaining similar IQ. I have not heard this discussed. If you own both, you have almost all you bases covered with duplication of the most important qualities. If only the 6D could be had for 1500$ or less - maybe in a few months, the ebay offers will appear.



In a similar boat. I just rented a 6d to give it a test drive and see how it stood up against/with the mk3. The 6d did impress me, many of the things I thought would be an issue weren't (that center point can AF in very dark conditions!!!). I'm giving it a month and a half to make the final decision - if I can find one of those refurb mk3's for under $2500, I may go that route. But for a backup body, I just can't justify the extra 1k+ it would cost to get one new or used, especially given how well the 6d performed.


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## Chuck Alaimo (Apr 3, 2013)

bdunbar79 said:


> If you have a 5D Mark III, there wouldn't really be any reason to buy or have a 6D, unless you shot with a backup camera and didn't want to spend the resources to buy another 5D Mark III. Pretty much all the wedding photogs I know shoot with a backup camera, so this makes sense. That's really the only reason I can see in owning both, and I don't think in the real world the 6D offers much anything over the 5D3. However, I can see advantages of the 5D3 over the 6D.
> 
> The 6D market is primarily I'm guessing for those entering FF for the first time and who want to get serious about photography. I look at the 6D as what the 5D2 was back in 2008. So there's really no reason for 5D2 owners to complain about the lack of differences between the 6D and 5D2, because there weren't intended to be any. The 6D probably has a better sensor and that's it.



backup/2nd bodies CAN have different uses and differet funtions. The way this is worded, one must have the same lens on each because your doing the same with each. I look at it a little differently...one body as a scalpel, and the other as a macheti. This is how I see the 2 complimenting each other nicely. A wider lens on the 6d, and a long lens on the 5d3...using each cam to its strengths. Of course in a perfect world we'd all have 2 5d3's ad a 1dx too. But this isn't a perfect world and sometimes compromises must be made.


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## Chuck Alaimo (Apr 3, 2013)

bdunbar79 said:


> Wilmark said:
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AHA....ok, yeah, if i were a sports shooter I would be on the exact same page...but...I am not a sports shooter!!!!

Edit: now after reading all this...uggggg people are silly. is the 5d3 the better camera, heck yeah it is. But, with all things there are compromises that need to be made depending on level of income and expenses. For me right now, a second mk3 is definitely an option, if I can find a refurb for $2500. If not, then the 6d is the more reasonable choice because I would like my secondary body to be performing a different task than my main body. Backup covering the wide and mid range, main covering the longer range/finer detail work. For me, this is how I'd run the combo regardless of whether it was with 2 5d3's or a 5d3 and a 6d....

All that said, I am still not convinced either way!!! LOL. When I rented the 6d, I was basically trying to find reasons not to snag one. But that little camera impressed me enough to make the decision much harder...so it all comes down to price point.


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## J.R. (Apr 3, 2013)

Skirball said:


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Why would you buy the 6D if your budget allows for a 5D3? :


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## Skirball (Apr 3, 2013)

J.R. said:


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Because I don't feel a need to have the best just to have the best. My budget could allow a 1DX, why not that? Why not a 600mm to go with it? Everything in life is cost vs. benefit, and I didn't see a significant enough benefit given the cost difference and my intended use. It's different for every single one of us, I just don't understand why those of you that justify these purchases to yourself have to degrade everything else.


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## J.R. (Apr 3, 2013)

Skirball said:


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Dunno what gives you the idea that when I say that the 5D3 is a better camera means that I am degrading the 6D. I could easily get back and say your are simply degrading the 5d3 for not being value for money and justifying your not purchasing the 5d3. 

The 5d3 makes more sense than a 6D, maybe not too you but that doesn't mean those advocating the 5d3over the 6D are wrong or justifying their purchase. The sales of the 5d3 have far outstripped those of the 6D and for good reason.


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## Skirball (Apr 3, 2013)

J.R. said:


> I could easily get back and say your are simply degrading the 5d3 for not being value for money and justifying your not purchasing the 5d3.



I looked through the last two years of my photos when deciding which camera to purchase and saw that I shot a very low percentage of action shots. I further saw that my trusty Rebel did ok at the times that I did. I reasoned that it wasn't worth an extra $1000 for a function that I use a low percentage of the time. I'm sure RLPhoto will shoot holes in my logic, but I did try to objectively look at the situation before buying.





J.R. said:


> The 5d3 makes more sense than a 6D, maybe not too you but that doesn't mean those advocating the 5d3over the 6D are wrong or justifying their purchase.



I'm not saying advocating it as a great camera is wrong, I simply think that there is a majorit here that vocally chant the 5d3 mantra regardless of a prospective users background, financials, or type of shooting s/he does. Look through the forums on here, people suggest it before they even know what people shoot. Yes, it's a great camera, but there are many situations when a lesser camera can do every bit as good. Hell, a lot of people on here could take a moderately priced Point and Shoot and capture a landscape pic better than half the crap that's put on Flickr everyday from high end dSLRs. Why? Because 61 points doesn't help when the earth doesn't move. And you don't need 25.6k ISO if the lights good. Do I care that some guy goes online and decides he needs a 1DX to capture photos of his granddaughter to put on Facebook? No, but it'd be nice if when he went online there wasn't an overwhelming chorus convincing him that he needs to do so.




J.R. said:


> The sales of the 5d3 have far outstripped those of the 6D and for good reason.



I could argue that that proves my point every much as you yours.


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## RLPhoto (Apr 3, 2013)

Skirball, can you simply let a different opinion/s alone? I was in the same spot of buy a 2nd 5d3 or the new 6D. It came down to saving that extra cash to buy what later on won't limit me.


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## Chuck Alaimo (Apr 3, 2013)

For me, this is why I am considering the 6d over the 5d3 as a backup/secondary body. This is only my second season shooting weddings. So my income is not at the level it should be, and I want my shots to be as good as they can be. So a secondary body is needed, mostly so I can get 2 uniquely composed shots without having to run to the bag to swap lenses, and also for the piece of mind a second body gives you (the good old just in case!) From that perspective, the mk3 gets a big extra point because then I have no falloff in capabilities. Now lets add in the other factors. I am currently using the older non-IS 70-200 2.8. I am interested in upgrading to the v2 IS because IS would improve my keeper rate at the long end, and give me more flexibility in Shutter speed. I'm also considering options with my 24-70 v1, seeling it and upgrading to the v2, or, fill in the gap with another prime (either the 24mm or the 35mm). I would also really like to snag a 135 f2...

I can't make bold moves with glass if I spend 3k on a body, an mk3 now means no new glass until the end of the season or next season (and in theory, I could do a 6d now then glass, then sell the 6d over the winter and snag a used mk3)...

Add in another factor, I am getting married this year, and weddings are freaking expensive!!!!!! 

So whats the better option, a 5d3/6d combo with top end glass? Or, 2 mk3's and no moves on glass?


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## Skirball (Apr 3, 2013)

RLPhoto said:


> Skirball, can you simply let a different opinion/s alone? I was in the same spot of buy a 2nd 5d3 or the new 6D. It came down to saving that extra cash to buy what later on won't limit me.



Heh, really? Pot:Kettle? I was just trying to answer his questions. I don't see where I'm attacking or dismissing. And as I said, I don't think advocating buying the best is wrong, it'd just be nice if it were more balanced.


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## J.R. (Apr 3, 2013)

Chuck Alaimo said:


> For me, this is why I am considering the 6d over the 5d3 as a backup/secondary body. This is only my second season shooting weddings. So my income is not at the level it should be, and I want my shots to be as good as they can be. So a secondary body is needed, mostly so I can get 2 uniquely composed shots without having to run to the bag to swap lenses, and also for the piece of mind a second body gives you (the good old just in case!) From that perspective, the mk3 gets a big extra point because then I have no falloff in capabilities. Now lets add in the other factors. I am currently using the older non-IS 70-200 2.8. I am interested in upgrading to the v2 IS because IS would improve my keeper rate at the long end, and give me more flexibility in Shutter speed. I'm also considering options with my 24-70 v1, seeling it and upgrading to the v2, or, fill in the gap with another prime (either the 24mm or the 35mm). I would also really like to snag a 135 f2...
> 
> I can't make bold moves with glass if I spend 3k on a body, an mk3 now means no new glass until the end of the season or next season (and in theory, I could do a 6d now then glass, then sell the 6d over the winter and snag a used mk3)...
> 
> ...



You suggest the perfect solution yourself  6d now, then glass, then sell the 6d over the winter and snag a used mk3.

The 6D is pretty good (I don't think I need to tell you that) but it appears a compromise over the 5D3 - though in reality it might not be a compromise at all for shooting weddings ... after all prior to the introduction of the 5D3, more than half the weddings were clicked with the good old 5D2 and the 6D is even better. 

BTW, do you feel a used 5D2 will not suit your purpose as a backup / second body? Why not get a used 5d2 AND glass right now - I would say better glass would improve IQ more than a 6D over a 5D2. 

It's entirely my opinion, Skirball may differ 

Cheers ... J.R.


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## Chuck Alaimo (Apr 3, 2013)

J.R. said:


> Chuck Alaimo said:
> 
> 
> > For me, this is why I am considering the 6d over the 5d3 as a backup/secondary body. This is only my second season shooting weddings. So my income is not at the level it should be, and I want my shots to be as good as they can be. So a secondary body is needed, mostly so I can get 2 uniquely composed shots without having to run to the bag to swap lenses, and also for the piece of mind a second body gives you (the good old just in case!) From that perspective, the mk3 gets a big extra point because then I have no falloff in capabilities. Now lets add in the other factors. I am currently using the older non-IS 70-200 2.8. I am interested in upgrading to the v2 IS because IS would improve my keeper rate at the long end, and give me more flexibility in Shutter speed. I'm also considering options with my 24-70 v1, seeling it and upgrading to the v2, or, fill in the gap with another prime (either the 24mm or the 35mm). I would also really like to snag a 135 f2...
> ...



I considered a 5d2 (have been actually since before there was a 6d). The 5d2 is a great body, but, its so close (used price even) in price to the 6d that it's a hard sell (LOL, b&h still has new 5d2's with a price tag of 2199!!!!) my fear in buying a 5d2 would be that it would sit in the bag for the vast majority of the day - it would get lots of use for outdoor ceremonies, but indoors I can see myself heavily favoring the mk3 (leaving the mk2 as an expensive lens holder). I just sent a rental 6d back to lensrentals... I had kind of hoped that using a 6d would give me more reasons to opt for the mk3, but, I was pleasantly surprised, which makes the decision that much harder because it is a fun little camera to use (and yeah, weight is a factor, i rather like the idea of being able to switch to the 6d later on in the day - lighter, easier to move and yeah, deep into the reception at weddings the weight does become an issue). It does in fact do quite well at the high ISO's too, and I like to do a combo of natural light, on cam light and off cam light --- I think the 6d outshines the 5d2 for those situations (thinking reception, ambient light, 16-35mm lens...center point is just fine for that kind of stuff!)

Edit: I will admit, at MAP price ---I would not opt for a 6d at $2099...the biggest reason I am considering it is because B&H is still offering it at $1779. IF i can find a refurb 5d3 for $2400 then that is what i get (it would make my glass plans more difficult, but still possible), but at $2800 used, and $3100 new...that would end up being the only gear move I made this year...


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## J.R. (Apr 3, 2013)

Skirball said:


> J.R. said:
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> ...



You must not have visited CR for very long. There are lots of balanced posts out here, probably more than you think. 

BTW, you didn't like the "balanced" idea of RLPhoto suggesting a used 5D2 over the 6D - really, there is not that much of a difference between the two cameras in the field. 



Skirball said:


> J.R. said:
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No you can't, unless your argument borders on the assumption that you know what you are doing while the others don't. It is undeniable that the 5D3 is the better camera so why is it a sin in your eyes if posters recommend it to someone who comes asking for an opinion? 

Cutting the chase, most (please see that I say most, not all) 6D users will want to get a 5D3 but the chances of the opposite happening are range right up there between slim and none


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## J.R. (Apr 3, 2013)

Chuck Alaimo said:


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I'd say, get a 6D and some glass. 

5D3 + good glass = good photos
6D + better glass = better photos

Part of my reason for buying the 6D as a backup body over the 5D3 was that I was roughly in the same lens-upgrade boat wanting to upgrade my lenses with the 70-200 f/2.8 II, the 24-70 f/2.8 II and a few more. I am saving up for the lenses but was unwilling to blow an extra $ 1,500 for the 5D3 at this moment in time.


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## Wilmark (Apr 3, 2013)

After reading the Crazy... go Nikon? thread under "Third party manufacturers", I think the D800 is the best compliment to my 5D3. Sure I will have to buy some extra glass - but you cannot beat the DR and the shadow detail. I shoot alot of wide angle, and long exposures. The Nikon glass is great at wide angle. Ill get one of the best wide zooms say the 14 -24 and a couple of general purpose zooms - up to maybe 300mm and leave the long stuff for the 5D3. that way i'll have duplication and alot of extra functionality.


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## Chuck Alaimo (Apr 3, 2013)

J.R. said:


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yup. I think my threshold price for a backup body is $2500 if I want to make any other moves with glass this season.


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## Marsu42 (Apr 3, 2013)

J.R. said:


> 5D3 + good glass = good photos
> 6D + better glass = better photos



My thinking exactly (and Canon's, that's why they get away with the 6d specs) - except if the shots aren't in focus, i.e. the keeper rate is to low for the desired application, or the faster fps really make a difference like for sports.


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## Skirball (Apr 3, 2013)

J.R. said:


> BTW, you didn't like the "balanced" idea of RLPhoto suggesting a used 5D2 over the 6D - really, there is not that much of a difference between the two cameras in the field.



That has nothing to do with it. I believe I even addressed this in this thread, but I'll say it again. I, personally, don't want to buy used for an electronic at this price. It's just not worth my piece of mind. I have no problem with refurbished, but to me $1600 is a lot of money for a camera, and it's worth a couple hundred to me for that piece of mind (and some fluff tossed in for good measure. I know a lot of people who have had no issues buying used, and good for them. I'm glad to see things get reused instead of tossed and replaced. But I'm just not willing to do it for an electronic of this complexity. Lens, fine, but I won't do it for a body.



J.R. said:


> Skirball said:
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I have a hard time following your train of thought, it seems to jump around. So what are you arguing, that the fact there are more sales of 5d3 than 6D means it's a better value? Please, there are far too many variable involved to draw any conclusion.





J.R. said:


> Cutting the chase, most (please see that I say most, not all) 6D users will want to get a 5D3 but the chances of the opposite happening are range right up there between slim and none



See, this is the heart of the matter, and I disagree. It's not that everyone is recommending the 5D3 , it's that their doing it with this thought behind it. That it's a compromise, that we couldn't achieve 5d3 status, so we settle for 6D It's wrong, we don't all feel that way. 

There have been several people on here that said they bought the 5d3 first and returned it for a 6D and are happy with that decision. I think at least one of them posted in this very thread; so I don't know about your slim to none. There are many more who have repeatedly stated they love their 6D, so I'm going to put them in the not upgrading camp. That's what I'm trying to get at: there is a niche for the 6D and it's not full of sulking, jealous paupers who dream of one day upgrading. It's a fine camera that fits our needs. There are people whose needs fit the 5D3. It's ok to have both.


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## J.R. (Apr 3, 2013)

Skirball said:


> J.R. said:
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> > BTW, you didn't like the "balanced" idea of RLPhoto suggesting a used 5D2 over the 6D - really, there is not that much of a difference between the two cameras in the field.
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Please note, I didn't say that, YOU DID!

I like my 6D but another 5d3 would have been better. Aspiring for something better doesn't make someone a sulking, jealous, pauper as you suggest. 

A couple of users returning the 5d3 for a 6d would fall under "slim".

Losing you cool and making wild allegations seemingly claiming that I am suggesting the 6D users are sulking, jealous, paupers is uncalled for. I'm as entitled to my views as you are to yours and there is no reason for you to try to burn me here. 

Its better to agree to disagree and move on! Back and forth arguing doesn't resolve anything,


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## Skirball (Apr 3, 2013)

J.R. said:


> Losing you cool and making wild allegations seemingly claiming that I am suggesting the 6D users are sulking, jealous, paupers is uncalled for. I'm as entitled to my views as you are to yours and there is no reason for you to try to burn me here.
> 
> Its better to agree to disagree and move on! Back and forth arguing doesn't resolve anything,



Fair enough. Though I don't feel like I've come across as losing my cool and making wild allegations, my apologies if that's your interpretation. You're over analyzing my comment and trying to turn it into an attack, it was merely some light hyperbole; obviously anyone who can buy a dSLR isn't a pauper.


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## iaind (Apr 4, 2013)

You may find the 6D a disappointment unless budgetary considerations rule out a second 5d3.

IMHO backup should be a 5d3 or possibly a 1dx


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