# Thinking of downgrading my 5d3 system



## KKCFamilyman (Jan 6, 2013)

I have been considering selling my setup

5d3
24-70 2.8 mkii
70-200 2.8 is mkii
Cf cards
600 exrt speedlite

To get a 6d 
24-70 f4 is
70-300l
Newer speedlite 430ex ii replacement

I just spent thousands of dollars this year and have hardly used the gear. When I do its for candids or vacations. I wonder if I am wasting the money and should sell it to downgrade to something more enthusiast level and cheaper. Also it's just so much to lug around. Just not sure and wanted some opinions.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jan 6, 2013)

Its easy to get sucked into buying something you don't need when you listen to the hype. At this point, it might not be a good idea to trade down to a 6D, used MK III's run about $2300, you might only save $300 - 400 by going to a 6D. 
The price of the MK III is going to rise now that Christmas sales are over. Spring is the best time to sell during ordinary times, but nothing seems ordinary right now.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 6, 2013)

I was thinking about that. The crazy thing is part of me wants to continue with a 35l prime and some studio lights. But it seems too expensive to do for a hobby. So I was thinking get out while you can but retain some system.


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## Standard (Jan 6, 2013)

If you're only using your gear sparingly but still love to shoot and don't want to lug a giant dslr around, a great option is to either go with a basic Leica setup like a Leica X2 (or even an older X1), a Fujifilm system like a Fujifilm X-E1( X-Pro 1 or X100) with one or two interchangeable lens, or a Sony RX100. Anyone of these are superb cameras that are much smaller, lighter and more discreet.


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## Botts (Jan 6, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> I have been considering selling my setup
> 
> 5d3
> 24-70 2.8 mkii
> ...



If you want to stay SLR, you may want to wait for the 6D w/ 24-70 IS kit to arrive and prices to have a rebate.

Right now, you'd probably get $2,300 for the 5D3, and pay $1,899 for the 6D body. If you could get a good deal with a 6D/24-70IS kit on rebate, it may be worth the change.


For the lenses, you could even sell those now, and make not bad money. The 24-105mm used is sub $800, you could probably sell one in 6 months to a year for a negligible drop from there. I'd seriously consider doing this, and then downgrading the 600RT for a used 430EX. The 70-200 f/2.8 II is also going to net you some cash when downgrading to the 70-300L.

The CF cards are likely going to be something of a write off on the used market.

All in all, I'd consider selling the lenses and flash, but keep the body until you can get a cheaper 6D & 24-70IS kit, if you are set on the 24-70.


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## drmikeinpdx (Jan 6, 2013)

I know what you mean about being too much to carry around when on vacation or even just walking around. I think people who carry big cameras and lenses when they are trying to enjoy a vacation are either crazy or way more manly than I am! LOL

What I did was pick up a cheap T2i with the stabilized kit lens (18-50). It is perfect for vacation pictures and weighs next to nothing compared with my 5D3 and a fast lens. With a bit of photography skill it takes great vacation pix and I am giving it a try for street photography, something which I have been wanting to explore.

You can get a T2i really cheap from the Canon refurbished web site. No need to sell the 5D3. Your Mark 3 will still be a great camera in five years that will do anything you need. I suspect that you will regain your interest in high level photography eventually and you will wish you still had your Mark 3.


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## Dylan777 (Jan 6, 2013)

Unless you REALLY REALLY need the cash....WHY 6D, 24-70 F4 IS????????????????????

Don't listen to what people said about 6D + 24-70 f4 IS. Most of these people came from T3i & t4i to FF. 

To remind you, this is why we buy 5D III + 24-70 f2.8 II
http://albums.phanfare.com/isolated/zI4RaRdU/1/5903066

6D + 24-70 f4 IS is great for shooting 90yrs old man crossing the street


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## EvilTed (Jan 6, 2013)

Keep the 5D MK3 and all your gear - you may get back into it.

Go out and buy a Fuji XE-1 and the 35mm F/1.4 and enjoy taking photos again 

ET


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## Rocky (Jan 6, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> I have been considering selling my setup
> 
> 5d3
> 24-70 2.8 mkii
> ...


If you want a "light weight" vacation, sell everything you got and get a Sony RX 100. Its AF is almost as fast as a DSLR and the picture quality is also as good as a DSLR. Panasonic LX-7 is my second choice.
As for changing from your original list to the proposed list , you will stil end up a slightly less weight and a slightly smaller bag. But it is not substantial. It is not my kind of change over.


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## knifez (Jan 6, 2013)

If you decide to continue using a dslr, I would 

- sell the 600 as its big and you probably don't need it. 
- sell the 70-200 as its a big white beast that scares children. 
the 70-300 is more discrete, with more range... and you'll be more likely to take it on travels. 

- keep the 5D. 
The AF system with 61 af points is enough a reason to never go back to a 9 or 11 point af system
less re-compositing = more pics in focus. 

I don't think you'd really save that much by switching now anyway, the 5D price has dropped quite a bit, while the 6D hasn't. 

cheers!


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## x-vision (Jan 6, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> I have been considering selling my setup



Replace your lenses first and then decide whether to keep or replace the 5DIII.

Getting the new 24-70/4L is a very good idea but you might want to reconsider getting the 70-300L. 
Why don't you get a prime to complement the 24-70/4L? Like the 100/2 or maybe the 135/2.
This will considerably reduce the size/weight of your kit.

Or maybe get the 70-200/4L IS instead of the 70-300L.

Going from the 5DIII to the 6D is not such a big saving in terms of size/weight, so I wouldn't do it if I were you.


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## Eli (Jan 6, 2013)

If it were me, I'd sell the lenses, and get a 24-105 for travel and some primes that'll spark your photography interest; get the 35mm 1.4! Don't sell the body, you won't recoup much money from it. Even a 5d + 35mm setup would be great for all purpose and not too heavy to lug around. Blackrapid + general purpose kit = win.


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## esaleris (Jan 6, 2013)

I have the same conundrum. It's incredibly hard to justify the expenditure (note I do not say investment, since I am not a professional and do not earn money with photography) when it is just a hobby. I ordered a 5D Mark III over the holidays but am inclined to return it without opening.

I am a believer that usefulness resides in the extremes. If you're taking candids and vacation photos, would an EOS M work? It's completely different from a 5D, not FF, etc., but would be infinitely more portable. A 6D doesn't seem incrementally lighter or easier to carry than a 5D in reality, but a EOS M would make the experience completely different.


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## hawaiisunsetphoto (Jan 6, 2013)

I don't think that you should make radical changes. I think that you get the most bang for the buck by selling the 70-200mm f/2.8L II, which has held it's value pretty well, and pick up the MUCH lighter and cheaper, and still sharp-as-a-tack 70-200mm f/4L (non-IS) -- which can be had used for about $450 and new for around $550. You'd take about $1300 -$1400 out of the deal. It's a fine lens. You'd still have one very versatile, fast lens (24-70mm f/2.8 II) for portraits, people, and lower light; I think that's worth keeping. You don't gain much by moving down to the 6D, I'd keep the 5D Mark III.....


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## hawaiisunsetphoto (Jan 6, 2013)

And, check out the new Sigma 35mm.....


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## knifez (Jan 6, 2013)

+1 on a 35mm lens. It was one of the first primes I purchased which got me back into enjoying photography. Before that I used zooms and they lacked the magic of a prime. Maybe changing the zooms for other zooms isn't the solution :-\ But it's a matter or personal choice and style. Good luck with your decision


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## M.ST (Jan 6, 2013)

A lot of people buy professional gear, but don´t really need it.

If you have a lot of expensive CF cards and want to track subjects, stay with the 5D Mark III.

For private use you don´t need the 600 flash or the EF 70-200 2.8 II. Sell it and get the EF 70-300L if you don´t want to shoot portraits with it.

I highly recommend the EF 24-70 2.8 II. You are more flexible in low light conditions with this lens.


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## Marsu42 (Jan 6, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> I have been considering selling my setup



Interesting and refreshing anti "just get the best" post  ... the cf/sd card problem has been mentioned, but I also think that the 70-200is2 is over the top (price, size, weight) for many people and applications (look at your stats how often you needed f2.8 @200mm).

Personally, for the current price difference I'd keep the 24-70ii, except if you want the semi-macro capability that badly - but you can also do large magnifications with the tele zoom. As written above, you might loose some low light capability with the 70-300L, so it might be smart to keep f2.8 @70mm. If you want to replace your expensive standard zoom and save money, rather look at the Tamron.

I wouldn't recommend dumping your large flash, just get an additional one (maybe the 430ex2 replacement) because two real flashes allow for so much more creativity and the larger flash makes a big difference in reach outdoors (more power, 200mm reflector) and recycling time when bouncing. The on-flash menu system is also a big plus since you don't need to wade through the camera's flash menu.



knifez said:


> The AF system with 61 af points is enough a reason to never go back to a 9 or 11 point af system
> less re-compositing = more pics in focus.



... that is if you're not the focus & recompose type, the op will know. But the main advantage of the 5d3 is that the af is more precise with current lenses than the 6d, no matter how many af points are used.



knifez said:


> I don't think you'd really save that much by switching now anyway, the 5D price has dropped quite a bit, while the 6D hasn't.



However, the 6d won't drop as much as the 5d3 because a) it isn't as overpriced to begin with and b) it is simply cheaper in absolute terms, so personally I plan to buy a 6d after the early adopters fee has been cut.


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## MintMark (Jan 6, 2013)

Nobody else has suggested it yet... how about the 40mm pancake lens?

It's cheap, sharp and changes any DSLR into something more portable.


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## Stu_bert (Jan 6, 2013)

I think what you haven't mentioned, which has a lot of implications, is when you bought all that kit, what did you intend to do with it? What style of photography and where? And why do you feel you are not able to do it? Is it solely the weight? 

When I do vacations with family I tend to do sunrise & sunset by myself, and during the day stay with family (while scouting locations for sunset / sunrise). 

Before you change anything, I think you need to look at what is preventing you from achieving your original aims with the MK III


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## madmailman (Jan 6, 2013)

My old kit was the 7D with 17-55 and then my wife got me the 5D3 with the 24-105. I also have a G12 as my "point & shoot" for things like dinner parties and other times I don't want to lug the SLR. Well since getting the 5D3 I never want to go back to the 7D af again. I also don't know exactly where my G12 is anymore. The 5D3 with either the 40mm pancake or my nifty fifty is my new point and shoot.

Don't get rid of the 5D3 you will always regret this. Take some of the other advice here, especially with regards to the telephoto end. Get yourself one of the smaller primes, they are not expensive and more versatile than you think.


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## markhbfindlay (Jan 6, 2013)

I have just upgraded to a 5diii (I already had the 24-105) from 7d, which I sold, but kept my 550d (t2i) + 15-85 as it's good for going away with, also 60 2.8 macro and 55-250 zoom as these are light and good quality. I also have (boo hiss) a panasonic g3 which great when cycling. All my L lenses where bought used (and the pany with 14-140 lens). So I have 3 kits. I think you're better off getting a cheaper lightweight kit rather than selling your fabulous 5d3 and lenses, which are unequaled in quality. Any of the lightweight option suggested by others could be good. Have a great time whatever you decide...


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## smithy (Jan 6, 2013)

Stu_bert said:


> I think what you haven't mentioned, which has a lot of implications, is when you bought all that kit, what did you intend to do with it? What style of photography and where? And why do you feel you are not able to do it? Is it solely the weight?


+1. This is what I'd like to know too. Was it just a situation where the OP had a lot of money and just wanted to own a pro camera, or was there a creative objective and the 5D3 was the best tool for the job?


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## christianronnel (Jan 6, 2013)

Classic case of buyer's remorse. You've already spent the money, just try to be happy with the decision. I don't wait for something t go on sale nor I'm a professional and can claim all my purchase as business expense. So I can empathize with you, but what's done is done. Depending on when you purchased each of the items, you may just end up getting the same amount of money to buy the said "downgrade" gear.

IMO, all the advice here regarding selling the 70-200 and the flash makes sense and you'll be able to get almost the same amount you paid for them. I agree with you about the 70-200 not being travel friendly. It's not a lens I would use unless I'm getting paid to get the shots. I don't feel very creative with it. After you sold the 70-200, try sitting on your hand before pulling the trigger on 70-300L. See if you need anything else other than your 24-70. 

Buy one or a couple of $50 Yongnuo 560 to replae the 600RT. They are manual only but the challenge to think about adding speedlights as your key lights would get you back on the creative process.

I added the EF85mm lens to my system so I don't have to lug the 70-200 around for portrait shoots but I still kept it for the occasional event jobs. I'm thinking about selling it to get a couple if tele primes like the 135L or the 85L.


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## AJ (Jan 6, 2013)

Don't even think about a 6D. It's just as heavy.

Sell all your stuff. Get a T4i, 15-85 IS and 100/2 or 100/2.8 IS.

Simplify. Enjoy the lightweight and great IQ.


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## nismohks (Jan 6, 2013)

keep the 5d3 and keep the 24-70II

however, downgrade the 70-200 2.8 IS II to the 70-200 4IS to save a significant amount of weight and the 1 stop difference is often easily afforded by the 5d3 with an ISO bump and/or noise reduction in post. this is precisely why i havent gotten the 70-200 2.8 IS II as i go overseas a bit and dont want to lug heavy gear around. my 70-200 4IS does the job perfectly whilst remaining relatively discrete and in a very manageable packaging and is still weather proof

600 you can also change for a used 430 if you dont need the power, or a yongnuo ttl flash if you wanna save on cash but dont mind the size.

40 pancake with the 5d3 is actually a pretty powerful combo for street shooting and are really quite cheap now. if you can find a used one, then even better and if you dont like it, you can sell it for as much as you paid used for it too


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## East Wind Photography (Jan 6, 2013)

Keep it all. In my opinion, photography is purpose built. Meaning I use the gear I need to for the shots I'm taking. For example, if I'm shooting wildlife, I prefer the long lens and the 5DIII. For skiing, I use a pocket camera, mainly a panasonic. Sometimes my macro gear sits in the bag for a year but I'm glad I have it when spring comes around.

So my point is, as soon as you unload your gear, you will certainly find yourself missing that equipment. I wouldnt sell, trade in, just because you find yourself too busy at this time to make good use of it.


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## FunPhotons (Jan 6, 2013)

I've thought the same as you periodically*. Usually it's a sign that I haven't been shooting. I mean, what happens is I take the gear out and shoot, have a wonderful time, then forget about it until the next time I neglect the photography. 

Something I've done to alleviate the problem is to have a couple of side setups, so I have a S100 and a Fuji X100. I don't like having this much gear, I'd much prefer having one setup, but this way I've got a setup for every circumstance, with the benefit that while the big DSLR doesn't get out all the time, at least I'm cycling through my gear and keeping it going. 

* Ironically enough I consider going on this board and asking the same question!


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## RLPhoto (Jan 6, 2013)

The mk3 is not the problem, the problem is those heavy 2.8 zooms which the 70-200L weights about 4LBs. 

That's one reason I've come to love small, light primes. 24L + 50 1.4 + 135L are fantastic to carry. If you want mobility and lens speed, try some small primes.


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## EvilTed (Jan 6, 2013)

The 24L II is almost as heavy as the 24-70 II 
I have sold all my primes because most of them are not as sharp or focus as accurately as either the 24-70II or the 70-200II (I have both).
As I recommended, keep everything and maybe invest in a good tripod system and use the MK3 primarily with this.

As FunPhotons said (and I'll reiterate), maybe it's just the big DSLR thing that bugs you (I know it bugs me).
I have a 40mm pancake, but I still don't think that a DSLR is much fun to lug around the streets.

A Fuji will slow you down, change the way you take photographs and inspire creativity in ways only old film cameras and Leica's can. 
You can get the XE-1 with the 28-85mm IS lens for $1400, which is about the price of a prime lens.
FWIW, they are also due to announce the successor to the X100 on Monday and it's supposed to include Focus Peaking.

I know I reach for one of my Fuji's 99% of the time and considered selling all my Canon gear, but the money is spent and you will just lose it if you downgrade or add new stuff to it. That will just lead to a cycle of more remorse.
A 6D is not going to be any better than the 5D MK3 in this respect.

Also, the 5D MK3 is good for tracking fast moving subjects and the combination of 24-70II and 70-200II is probably all you need for capturing your growing family. 

This is something the Fuji isn't good at.
I have a 19 month old daughter, so I kept my Canon setup for her.

I also think you'll be pleasantly surprised when you get images as good (or better) than your 5D MK3 from such a small, cheap package.

Anyway, I've been there recently and my advice is don't sell it and don't add to it.
Just try a different approach to your photography and see what happens.

ET


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## RLPhoto (Jan 6, 2013)

86 oz for 24-70 2.8 + 70-200 2.8 zooms vs 56 oz for 24L + 50mm 1.4 + 135L 

The speed gain vs weight & versatility. That almost two pounds shed in weight.


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## Marsu42 (Jan 6, 2013)

EvilTed said:


> Just try a different approach to your photography and see what happens.



The op has stated this different approach: Carry less weight & size and have more fun, it seems to me that would also exclude juggling multiple primes even if that'd cut some weight, too.

Selling the gear of course comes at a loss of functionality and money, but if the result is more fun with photography it should be worth it - the op should have bought mid-range gear in the first place, see how his usage patterns and skills develop and then step up instead of being talked into buying "the best" (= most expensive & heavy) pro-oriented gear right away.


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## ishdakuteb (Jan 6, 2013)

my suggestion for you is not to downgrade since you will lose decent amount of money when downgrading. if you really need cash, then sell your 24-70mm II to get 24-105mm...


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## alan e (Jan 6, 2013)

Hi
I understand the weight issue !! (as i'm 60 and have been reducing the weight of my gear !)
firstly if you don't need 2.8 then.....
70-300L IS is an excellent lens i own it !! (just about every owner raves on it)
24-70 F4 L IS is obviously going to be a good lens
24-105L IS is a cheaper alternative its a good lens with extra reach over the 24.70 BUT..
beware of the barrel distortion at 24mm (i own it !!) but lightroom takes care of that
Optically and sharpness you will be giving up very very little by changing lenses ..go for it !!

5d3-60D don't know that i'd do that yet ..(wait for 6D +24.70 F4 IS IF !! ones comes out ??)....you do save 200g on weight tho by going to 6D ...your call !!


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## mb66energy (Jan 6, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> I have been considering selling my setup
> 
> 5d3
> 24-70 2.8 mkii
> ...



I have a simple procedure:
I bought the 5.6 400mm lens for 1200 EUR.
Estimated time of usage: 20 Years.
Price per year: 60 Euro,
price per day: 16 ct.

Compare it to other expenditures (my data as example):
electricity: 1 Euro per day
natural gas: 2,50 Euro per day
Gasoline: 2,50 Euro per day
Health Care: 12 Euro per day
Food and Drinking: 5-10 Euro per day (some sort of health care 

Use good gear as long as possible and enjoy it ... and do a little bit math!

Best Michael

PS(edit): Others proposed it to: convert the 70-200 2.8 into a 70-200 4.0 IS or non-IS - I have the non-IS, it is lightweight, compact and most importantly makes great photos and combine it with the 40/2.8 which has great image quality but transforms my 40D into a fat but compact camera!


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## picturesbyme (Jan 6, 2013)

Marsu42 said:


> EvilTed said:
> 
> 
> > Just try a different approach to your photography and see what happens.
> ...



This.

and...

1. what do I shoot?
2. what's the minimum gear I need for that?
.
.
3. if I'm awesome at it and my skill hits the ceiling I UPgrade...


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## jp121 (Jan 6, 2013)

The weight is a huge factor. I have tried many straps to help me carry the 5D3 around. I finally got around to buying the BlackRapid Curve. AND WOW! what a difference.

The 5D3 plus 70-200 2.8 II was finally easy to carry. Plus it hangs around hip level, so it becomes discreet. When it's around my neck everyone comments about the size of the lens. But around the hip, no one noticed.

I recommend you try the BlackRapid Curve with a small lens. Go 'classic', ie photograph with a normal prime. The normal prime will force you to be more creative and think it terms of framing to get the shot.

Then decide whether to jump ship.


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## crasher8 (Jan 6, 2013)

I sold my 24-70 for a 24-105 and I use it a TON more. No More Bricks


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 6, 2013)

Marsu42 said:


> EvilTed said:
> 
> 
> > Just try a different approach to your photography and see what happens.
> ...



Just to clarify

I had a t2i then 60d then 5d3 24-105 combo then same body and 2 2.8 zooms. 

I simply love the camera just maybe since its winter I just don't find myself using it as much maybe I will strap a 35mm prime and see how the weight fairs out then also I think I will see what gets annnounced this month. It is not like I cannot use the features I love the 2.8 dof isolation my zooms bring. Especially when your grabbing your kids in a crowd or low light.


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## bdunbar79 (Jan 6, 2013)

The problem with selling current gear always, is that you will have a net loss in money because you won't ever sell it all back at or more than what you purchased. You probably could, but with what you have, it's not likely. 

You already bought the stuff. Whether you need it or not, it's not entirely relavent, because you already have it. The gear is great so my personal opinion is that you should just keep it and use it when you can. If you sell and purchase other gear, you can only lose money from where you are now.


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## christianronnel (Jan 6, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> Just to clarify
> 
> I had a t2i then 60d then 5d3 24-105 combo then same body and 2 2.8 zooms.
> 
> I simply love the camera just maybe since its winter I just don't find myself using it as much maybe I will strap a 35mm prime and see how the weight fairs out then also I think I will see what gets annnounced this month. It is not like I cannot use the features I love the 2.8 dof isolation my zooms bring. Especially when your grabbing your kids in a crowd or low light.



I had a feeling that's what you did. Since you've had the 24-105 and upgraded to the new 24-70 you must see the night and day difference in IQ. From your style of shooting, may I recommend the EF85mm. It's small and light weight, and fantastic for subject isolation. It's very sharp wide open and the AF is really fast. That would be a great pair to your 35mm prime.


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## Dylan777 (Jan 7, 2013)

RLPhoto said:


> The mk3 is not the problem, the problem is those heavy 2.8 zooms which the 70-200L weights about 4LBs.
> 
> That's one reason I've come to love small, light primes. 24L + 50 1.4 + 135L are fantastic to carry. If you want mobility and lens speed, try some small primes.



Not a solution for everything, unless you carry at least 2 bodies around. Again, not for family photos.


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## RLPhoto (Jan 7, 2013)

Dylan777 said:


> RLPhoto said:
> 
> 
> > The mk3 is not the problem, the problem is those heavy 2.8 zooms which the 70-200L weights about 4LBs.
> ...



I've taken plenty of family photos with just a Minolta maxxum AF and a 50mm 1.8. Just takes a different approach.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 7, 2013)

Thanks everyone.

I am just going to hold for a month or so and see what happens. I am thinking of getting a sony nex 6 for smaller shots. Eosm is too slow.


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## robbymack (Jan 7, 2013)

Sell 70-200 2.8 buy any of the following, nex 6/7, Fuji x pro, or micro 4/3. When you feel you need the tele length again go with 70-200 f4 or the IS version. Or maybe just buy a telephoto for one of the systems above.


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## verysimplejason (Jan 7, 2013)

You don't have to sell your gear. You just have to improve your photography.


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## crasher8 (Jan 7, 2013)

AND sell your photography.


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## Dylan777 (Jan 7, 2013)

RLPhoto said:


> Dylan777 said:
> 
> 
> > RLPhoto said:
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How do you approach this type of situation, when you are 1.5ft away from your subject? No room to go back or forward: http://albums.phanfare.com/isolated/0TKGEcfb/1/5903138


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## RLPhoto (Jan 7, 2013)

Dylan777 said:


> RLPhoto said:
> 
> 
> > Dylan777 said:
> ...



Find a different approach.


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## Dylan777 (Jan 7, 2013)

RLPhoto said:


> Dylan777 said:
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> 
> > RLPhoto said:
> ...



Since you are a prime shooter....what approach would you take? Swap to wider prime


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## RLPhoto (Jan 7, 2013)

Dylan777 said:


> RLPhoto said:
> 
> 
> > Dylan777 said:
> ...



See, You answered your own question.


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## Dylan777 (Jan 7, 2013)

RLPhoto said:


> Dylan777 said:
> 
> 
> > RLPhoto said:
> ...



Carry multiple prime lenses in a sunny day like this for family photos...WOW, what a creative photographer : NO THANKS


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## RLPhoto (Jan 7, 2013)

Dylan777 said:


> RLPhoto said:
> 
> 
> > Dylan777 said:
> ...



You yourself said it.


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## crasher8 (Jan 7, 2013)

Keep it up guys, then we'll have another one of those cool geometric quote posts that looks like Bingham Copper mine.


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## Famateur (Jan 7, 2013)

^ LOL!

With the Bingham Mine outside my window, I just had to laugh. Too funny...


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## Midphase (Jan 7, 2013)

I wish I was sitting on the type of cash that would allow me to buy the best of the best in photography gear, and then a few months later decide that it's not really doing it for me and decide to downgrade losing a bunch of my original investment in the process.

Someday... ;D


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## Marsu42 (Jan 7, 2013)

Midphase said:


> I wish I was sitting on the type of cash that would allow me to buy the best of the best in photography gear



Fine by me if it's only the well-off people who let themselves be talked into buying the more/most expensive gear ... imho the potential problem is with people who read forums, listen to marketing and scrape their last $€ together to improve their pictures by buying the latest body/lenses while neglecting building their skill and buying non-"core" gear like lighting accessories.


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## jcollett (Jan 7, 2013)

So many good ideas presented; I have not read them all yet so I apologize if I am repeating someone else's idea. Well, remember that expensive equipment can be rented from lensrentals.com so if you only need the big glass for specific vacation trips or whatever, no need to own it, just rent it! If you end up renting the same piece of glass like 3 times, then consider purchasing it. As to what piece of glass to own, only the OP can really know what that is for them. I would recommend going back to basics when feeling creatively blocked. Go out and use a mid focal range lens on a walk around shoot and note what length comes up most on the EXIF of the pics. Get a prime in or near that length and only shoot with it for 1 - 3 months. See if your creative juices start to flow again once your mind is freed from thinking about the equipment like if you should have "the other lens" on the body.
Good luck on finding your mojo!


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## Nick Gombinsky (Jan 7, 2013)

I'm gonna go a bit further away with the suggestions: Have you thought about Micro 4/3?

I've seen amazing images from the Olympus OM-D E-M5. That, coupled with the 12-35mm f2.8 (24-70 eq) and 35-100mm f2.8 (70-200 eq), could be a great option for vacations.

You would "suffer" from more depth of field and not so crazy high ISOs, but really, who needs higher than 6400? (I never shoot over 1000)


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## SPL (Jan 7, 2013)

Mmm,…this is a great thread that most likely many of us can relate. I myself have purchased professional level gear over the past year,….makes me sit back and think if this is practical….but we all enjoy our profession/hobby. Just my 2 cents,…my opinion,….sell everything except the 5D III. Keep the 5D III, it’s a great camera and will serve you well for many years. Next, save the cash and get a 50 f 1.4 and use this exclusively for maybe 6-12 months just as a photography exercise. Re-evaluate in year and see what direction to go….


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## bholliman (Jan 7, 2013)

SPL said:


> Mmm,…this is a great thread that most likely many of us can relate. I myself have purchased professional level gear over the past year,….makes me sit back and think if this is practical….but we all enjoy our profession/hobby. Just my 2 cents,…my opinion,….sell everything except the 5D III. Keep the 5D III, it’s a great camera and will serve you well for many years. Next, save the cash and get a 50 f 1.4 and use this exclusively for maybe 6-12 months just as a photography exercise. Re-evaluate in year and see what direction to go….



+1 
Good suggestion.


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## babiesphotos.ca (Jan 7, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> I have been considering selling my setup
> 
> 5d3
> 24-70 2.8 mkii
> ...



Hey, Hey, no one is trying to help you here!!!

Here, I've got 5d mk III with some cheap lenses and can use 24-70L II. I've got to offer you in exchange:

# Option 1: Sony A57 with kit lens, 35 1.8, 50 1.8, 55-200, and Tamron 28-75 2.8
# Option 2: Sony F3 with kit lens, Sigma 30 2.8, Sigma 19 2.8, EOS->NEX adapter, FD->NEX adapter, ALPHA->NEX adapter and 3 FD lenses, 50 1.8, and 2 tele zooms

You pick either option for your 24-70. Gee, I'll even get you some money. After this, you have full system, and bunch of equipment to sell and park the money. Great shape, few months old. I went crazy few months ago and built 2 more camera systems, just like you did, but I recognized it, so I went crazy on the inexpensive systems  I blame it on pursuit of baby/fast/indor camera, but I'm not sure that theory would hold water. 

Now to be serious for a moment, I want to share my experience. Always was interested in photography. Cobbled decent 30D system with few lenses 6(?) years ago, was active, and then this hobby fell along the wayside. Equipment gathered dust. Used twice a year. 

My kids were born 16 months ago, and that revived passion. Upgraded couple lenses, got 5D mark II, sold, upgraded to Mark III, got crazy, got one sony system (Alpha - fast Live view focus) and then other (NEX - ultimate lego for grown up, could attach ALL my lenses to it). But in reality, without impetus of babies, I could have been dormant for another 10 years... You need to recognize where you interests lay, because it may happen you don't do much for YEARS. Keeping lenses is usually ok financially, but you'll lose everything on a camera body. And, can you afford to keep lenses and sit on quite a bit of dormant capital? 

I'm joking about trade 
Unless you're not, I'd like 24-70 II, and I'm not convinced I need 3 camera systems...


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## 7enderbender (Jan 7, 2013)

Interesting thread indeed. I can relate in that I am a bit of a gear head on the one hand - but also try to pick my stuff carefully for different purposes. And what's worse: I do this not only with photography but with music as well. Neither I just consider a "hobby" even though I have a full-time job that is totally unrelated. And I have high standards and try to get the best within a reasonable budget that fits my purpose. And the purpose can change. Take music for instance. When I was very active and played live a lot there was good reason to have a bunch of guitars a big tube amplifier stack and a large rack full of gear. And in that world you will hear the same voice telling you that it's all nonsense citing some blues musician who does it all with an old beat up Strat and combo amp. Problem is that if you are into certain kinds of music you need a bit more variety than that. And then stuff gets heavy and cumbersome and expensive. That was pre-digital/virtual amplification. Now things are different - but I still have my old amps and racks available, even though I use a little Line6 amp simulator 99% of the time both live (if ever lately) and in the studio/at home.

With photography I don't really see that alternative yet depending on what you do. For what I like best I still feel like having a full frame SLR (at least) and a few fast primes is what I want to use. And that can get in the way to the point that you don't have a camera when you wish you had one. I really hope the market will catch up with an affordable rangefinder solution soon. Until then I really don't see the alternative while the Leica M is just not in the budget.


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## Midphase (Jan 7, 2013)

jcollett said:


> Well, remember that expensive equipment can be rented from lensrentals.com so if you only need the big glass for specific vacation trips or whatever, no need to own it, just rent it!



Yup, that is solid advice. It's exactly what I did with the 5DmkIII which I have now bought since I liked it so much after renting it for a week from lens rentals.com 

Big thumbs up for lensrentals.com (except for the "sales tax" part which I don't really understand)


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## sdsr (Jan 7, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> I have been considering selling my setup
> 
> 5d3
> 24-70 2.8 mkii
> ...



1. If the reason why you don't use it is the weight, switching from 5DIII to 6D is pointless - the difference is trivial. Ditch the lenses instead. (If the reason isn't just the weight, what is it about the 6D etc. combination that makes you think you would use it more?) 
2. How picky are you about image quality, and how much do build quality and mechanical reliability matter to you? For instance, you might find that the differences in image quality between the L and non-L versions of the 70-300 are exaggerated and that the much lighter weight of the non-L outweighs the obvious mechanical superiority of the L version. You might be better off replacing your lenses with 17-40L + 70-300 L or non-L (or, if 200mm is long enough, 70-200 f/4 Ls - they don't weigh much) and fill the gap with a 50mm 1.4.
3. Do you like swapping lenses? If you don't, the prime route won't appeal. If you would rather not swap lenses at all and aren't that picky about image quality, Nikon D600 + 28-300 lens might make sense - just don't look to closely at the results when comparing them to photos you took with your current gear....
4. If the gear you have now is simply too much stuff and you wish you had something simpler instead, consider a tiny Sony RX100, which, despite its size, is capable of near-DSLR quality (crop, at any rate) - the results won't be as good as what you could get now with your current gear if you used it, but you're not....


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## traveller (Jan 7, 2013)

7enderbender said:


> Interesting thread indeed. I can relate in that I am a bit of a gear head on the one hand - but also try to pick my stuff carefully for different purposes. And what's worse: I do this not only with photography but with music as well. Neither I just consider a "hobby" even though I have a full-time job that is totally unrelated. And I have high standards and try to get the best within a reasonable budget that fits my purpose. And the purpose can change. Take music for instance. When I was very active and played live a lot there was good reason to have a bunch of guitars a big tube amplifier stack and a large rack full of gear. And in that world you will hear the same voice telling you that it's all nonsense citing some blues musician who does it all with an old beat up Strat and combo amp. Problem is that if you are into certain kinds of music you need a bit more variety than that. And then stuff gets heavy and cumbersome and expensive. That was pre-digital/virtual amplification. Now things are different - but I still have my old amps and racks available, even though I use a little Line6 amp simulator 99% of the time both live (if ever lately) and in the studio/at home.
> 
> With photography I don't really see that alternative yet depending on what you do. For what I like best I still feel like having a full frame SLR (at least) and a few fast primes is what I want to use. And that can get in the way to the point that you don't have a camera when you wish you had one. I really hope the market will catch up with an affordable rangefinder solution soon. Until then I really don't see the alternative while the Leica M is just not in the budget.



Did you have a volume dial that went up to '11'? ;D


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## dslrdummy (Jan 7, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> I have been considering selling my setup
> 
> 5d3
> 24-70 2.8 mkii
> ...


I suggest you keep the 5Diii, at least for now.
I have had a 5Dc for many years and was looking to upgrade. My favourite lense is the 70-200mm f/2.8ii which is a heavy mother and like you I was sick of lugging all that weight around, particularly when travelling or at family outings etc., so I seriously looked at the 6D. In the meantime, I looked around at the compact options and on the basis of the overwhelmingly positive reviews decided to buy the Sony RX100. It is not only the best point and shoot camera around (IMO) but also a very competent camera all round with a relatively large sensor and a terrific zeiss lense. If vacation and family shots are all you really do then I can highly recommend it and it won't break the bank. And because it is not a beginner's camera it has plenty of functionality to allow you to continue to improve your photography as you use it.
If you decide after a time that it doesn't meet all your needs then you will still have the 5Diii, and a great second option in the Sony.
For me, the Sony reminded me why I need/want a FF dslr and so I ended up buying the 5Diii and I couldn't be happier with my two camera set up. The Sony goes everywhere with me and I pack the 5Diii when I know I will use it.


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## dunkers (Jan 8, 2013)

No point in selling the 5D3. The weight difference between the 5D and 6D are negligible imo. Plus if you still have the af speed/fps if you ever needed it.

I'd sell the 70-200 and pickup the 70-300L. Longer reach + lighter = perfect for vacation and candids. Not to mention, you could get quite a bit for the 70-200. If I didn't shoot sports, I probably would have picked the 70-300L instead.

I'd keep the 24-70 II simply because it's relatively "close" to the 24-70 f/4 in price. Also you'd have a f/2.8 lens if you found a need for shallow dof. If you really want to sell the 24-70 II, I'd replace it with the Tamron 24-70 VC instead. You'd still keep f/2.8 and you get VC. The sharpness (according to lensrentals) of the Tamron vs the 24-70 f/4 is near negligible. Better value in the Tamron imo.

With this setup, you have the 24-300 range covered. Perfect for vacations/candids.


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## bycostello (Jan 8, 2013)

to sell a 600 to buy a 430 would be break even at best so unless u need the small/ lighter size...


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## jrh (Jan 8, 2013)

Little different idea...get a good photo printer. Your obviously doing well on income to just buy this stuff as a hobby. When I added a home printer it made me grow as a photographer, I felt like I had more control over the process and owned the photo. It is completely different, IMHO, to hold your print than to just look at images on a computer screen. Another benefit was my kids got more interested and are learning the art of photography now as well.


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## scrup (Jan 8, 2013)

If its not breaking your back or the bank keep the existing gear.

Not a substantial weight difference and you will lose more money than saving based on the initial price you paid for the gear.

Also think about the hassle of selling the gear. If you are going for a more substantial gear change then that would be a different story.

If you want lightweight and cheap get the 40mm pancake.


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## Marsu42 (Jan 8, 2013)

scrup said:


> Not a substantial weight difference and you will lose more money than saving based on the initial price you paid for the gear.



Substantial is subjective, it's not just the absolute weight alone but also the distribution of it (like a heavy flash on a bracket or the longer 70-200L vs the short 70-300L). And when crossing the personal pain/fun threshold, 100-200g might make the decisive difference, esp. if shooting for a longer time.

As for money: Of course selling gear to downgrade is bad business, but money is also lost when letting top gear rot in the bag - esp. camera bodies loose value, like the 30% drop of the 5d3 since release a year ago. Cheaper camera bodies simply cannot loose as much value in absolute terms.


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## crasher8 (Jan 9, 2013)

I think a 200g difference is a make or break amount.I went from a 24-70 mk1 on a 5D3 to a 24-105 and have never been happier.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 9, 2013)

crasher8 said:


> I think a 200g difference is a make or break amount.I went from a 24-70 mk1 on a 5D3 to a 24-105 and have never been happier.



Would you have made that switch if it were the mk ii?


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## thien135 (Jan 9, 2013)

Sorry to hear about your decision. However, if you are determined to sell your gears, I would like to purchase the lens. Plz contact me at [email protected] with ur prices.


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## Rienzphotoz (Jan 9, 2013)

drmikeinpdx said:


> I know what you mean about being too much to carry around when on vacation or even just walking around. I think people who carry big cameras and lenses when they are trying to enjoy a vacation are either crazy or way more manly than I am! LOL


I don't think people who carry their "big camera & lenses are crazy" and am not sure if they are "more manly or not" ;D ... but I think they might be more passionate about photography than most others. I just returned from a 16 days vacation in December and throughout that period I carried my 5D MK III with 24-105, 70-200 f/2.8 IS II and a 600EX-RT speedlite ... I strapped on the "Lowepro Street & Field Series Modular Carrying system" around my waist, which allowed equal distribution of weight around my body, with almost no fatigue from carrying lenses and it also kept both my hands free.


drmikeinpdx said:


> No need to sell the 5D3. Your Mark 3 will still be a great camera in five years that will do anything you need. I suspect that you will regain your interest in high level photography eventually and you will wish you still had your Mark 3.


I agree


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## Marsu42 (Jan 9, 2013)

crasher8 said:


> I think a 200g difference is a make or break amount



I'd speculate that a lot more people want/would like a lighter camera bodies, amateurs as well as pros that shoot for hours and hours.

It has hasn't been legit to ask for it because just as the 70-200ii the "the" lens to get of course everyone wants a sturdy, full-metal body that is build like a 1d tank - or you probably needed your head checked. But now that Canon has released the 6d suddenly there are lots of people around who very much like the idea (though not the specs) of the 6d.

Disclaimer: its-just-fine-people-buy-expensive-heavy-gear-for-amateur-purposes-but-ymmv


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## rj79in (Jan 9, 2013)

You may need to consider whether by downgrading, will you actually be shooting more pics?


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## mrsfotografie (Jan 9, 2013)

Eli said:


> If it were me, I'd sell the lenses, and get a 24-105 for travel and some primes that'll spark your photography interest; get the 35mm 1.4! Don't sell the body, you won't recoup much money from it. Even a 5d + 35mm setup would be great for all purpose and not too heavy to lug around. Blackrapid + general purpose kit = win.



+1, 

I travel with a gripless 5DMkII and 24-105L. The weather sealing has proven its worth on several occasions in India (dust, rain, sweat).

Depending on the destination I usually also take a small fast prime (50mm f/1.8 mkI), light weight wide (17-40L) and a Tamron 70-300 just for the occasional tele-shot. I'm an available light shooter so I never bring a flash, high iso's and wide apertures do the job for me.

I initially bought the 24-105 as a vacation lens only, but as I took it out a few times to get a feel for it I found that it's on my camera body way more than my 24-70L. The 24-105 is sharper and the colors have more 'pop'.

When the light gets dim I prefer to switch over to my Sigma 50 mm f/1.4.


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## vlim (Jan 9, 2013)

keep your 5D mark III and go light with so good F/4 lenses ; the 24-70 f/4 L IS should be a very good one and the ultra light 70-200 f/4 L IS is a great one !


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## rj79in (Jan 9, 2013)

Considering you are into candids, you can also sell the 70-200 2.8 II and buy the 135L which is a very good portrait lens (I'm planning on getting one myself having used it in the past few days). 

If you really need the zoom, I suggest you sell the f/2.8 and get a f/4 (IS or without IS) and comfortably shave off the extra 800 gms or so.


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## 5D2-shooter (Jan 9, 2013)

I’ve owned various EOS models for years and have been using a 5D2 for a while so I can sympathise about weight and bulk.

For me the obvious recommendation is to get rid of the 70-200L f2.8. These lenses may be great optically but they are ridiculously heavy and bulky. Who wants to walk around on a family holiday, for example, looking like a paparazzi ? Keep the 5D3 and the other zoom for now. You'll lose too much money if you sell them and the difference compared to a 6D is not worth the trouble. Maybe buy one of the cheaper primes. Buy a Micro 4/3 camera. With CES here and various new models coming out, the old ones will be discontinued and go on sale. Wait for a bargain opportunity and splash out. Last year I bought a new Panasonic GF3 with kit lens for the equivalent of US $300 during a closeout and love it. The image quality is not the same as the 5D3 but it’s almost as good as a 5D. What are you going to do with your images anyway ? M4/3 cameras will produce great 12 by 8 inch prints. If you really need a 36 by 24 inch print get the 5D3 out and buy the 40mm f2.8 or the 100mm f2. The important thing is that because something like the GF3 is so small and light you can have it with you most of the time and you don’t look like a completely twit when you’re walking round a tourist location.


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## fugu82 (Jan 9, 2013)

Consider keeping what you have, and getting a travel camera for casual use and unexpected opportunities. I carry a Fuji X10 in my purse, and it is awesome - small, discrete, cool/retro, and very versatile. For serious photo trips, I drag out the 5D3 with all its inevitable baggage.


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## criza (Jan 12, 2013)

SPL said:


> Mmm,…this is a great thread that most likely many of us can relate. I myself have purchased professional level gear over the past year,….makes me sit back and think if this is practical….but we all enjoy our profession/hobby. Just my 2 cents,…my opinion,….sell everything except the 5D III. Keep the 5D III, it’s a great camera and will serve you well for many years. Next, save the cash and get a 50 f 1.4 and use this exclusively for maybe 6-12 months just as a photography exercise. Re-evaluate in year and see what direction to go….



+1 
I like this as well. Instead of the 50 f/1.4 you could also try the new Sigma 35mm 1.4, if you like it a bit wider!


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## 2trout (Jan 13, 2013)

as has been said before, keep the gear, unless you really need the money, and buy a small point and shoot, there are so many really good models out there now.
We all go through phases with our hobbies, one day we're right into it, the next we don't care either way. Chances are, once you've sold all your gear, there'll come a day when you may really regret that!


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 16, 2013)

crasher8 said:


> Keep it up guys, then we'll have another one of those cool geometric quote posts that looks like Bingham Copper mine.



LOL!! I was thinking the same thing! Love it! ;D


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 17, 2013)

FWIW, I think all of us question our own sanity from time to time after we think about our photography addiction and expenditures. As for me, if I didn't shoot tons of stuff for scouts, school and church, I would probably shed a lot of gear. For me, I feel relevant and necessary when I shoot to benefit others. If it is just for me, that's fine for a while but I'm not a pro and if I don't have steady "jobs" to help me justify all the expenditures and equipment, I'll start to feel a little silly having all this stuff and just shooting family candids and other stuff for myself.

So I suggest the OP first consider how he can put everything to use and in perspective before he sells. Can he become more motivated and inspired by shooting for friends, charity, volunteer, etc. It will be challenging and rewarding. It will add another layer of purpose to your hobby and you'll be appreciated.

Just a thought...


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## StepBack (Jan 17, 2013)

KCCFamilyMan I'd sleep on it. Before u return anything of the quality u bgt consider what u'd get in return. The AF sys on the 5D3 is worth the dough. The 6D has been reviewed and the best idea I read was for a studio shooter to use it as a backup or a photojournalist to use it as a less expensive backup. The AF tracking if it's as good as advertised is awesome if u have the need. I don't think family shoots require tracking but if they're teens involved who play sports it would be good. A one cross type focus pt system to me for a full frame is really cheap. I can't use any other word. Not the two grand. But for Canon to try and bait people with that is beyond me. But that's business. Anyway all the good ideas have been mentioned so I'll add something about competitor systems which might allow u to compare what u have already and than rethink what u think u'll get with a trade. In any event don't act impulsively unless u really hate the dang. And believe me there are a lot of amateurs who would pry it out of your hands but unfortunately for a lot less than u paid. Best of luck


First I'd look at the mirrorless for lighter and still functional sets.
Assuming u don't want a film Rangefinder of which there are some Voigts which cost considerably less than your Canon think about an ILC with some small primes. And finally I think a worthy idea is a fixed focal length DSLR. So look at the Olympus, Sony and Fuji sites to start. And than go to the store. Feel the things around. Read about them. Think it over. do your due diligence. And in the end pick something u want not what the rest of us dream about. Good shooting.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 18, 2013)

StepBack said:


> KCCFamilyMan I'd sleep on it. Before u return anything of the quality u bgt consider what u'd get in return. The AF sys on the 5D3 is worth the dough. The 6D has been reviewed and the best idea I read was for a studio shooter to use it as a backup or a photojournalist to use it as a less expensive backup. The AF tracking if it's as good as advertised is awesome if u have the need. I don't think family shoots require tracking but if they're teens involved who play sports it would be good. A one cross type focus pt system to me for a full frame is really cheap. I can't use any other word. Not the two grand. But for Canon to try and bait people with that is beyond me. But that's business. Anyway all the good ideas have been mentioned so I'll add something about competitor systems which might allow u to compare what u have already and than rethink what u think u'll get with a trade. In any event don't act impulsively unless u really hate the dang. And believe me there are a lot of amateurs who would pry it out of your hands but unfortunately for a lot less than u paid. Best of luck
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks

Thats what I plan on doing waiting a few months getting an ilc and deciding which way to go. Really I was planning on adding a 35mm prime then I said do I need all this money sitting here? I decided in about two months it will start to get warmer and I am sure I will get that itch.


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## K3nt (Jan 18, 2013)

Dude! That is one sweet setup you got there. I wouldn't sell at all. You're covered. But I like the idea someone already posted that you should get, maybe an EOS M, or the Fuji or Sony mini's for that easy to carry with you bits, but then you'd have that good kit to fall back on once it is appealing again, because it will be. 
Downgrading to a 6D and selling your lenses will, in the long run, most likely only do you a loss.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 19, 2013)

K3nt said:


> Dude! That is one sweet setup you got there. I wouldn't sell at all. You're covered. But I like the idea someone already posted that you should get, maybe an EOS M, or the Fuji or Sony mini's for that easy to carry with you bits, but then you'd have that good kit to fall back on once it is appealing again, because it will be.
> Downgrading to a 6D and selling your lenses will, in the long run, most likely only do you a loss.



Yeah I was playing with some pics around the house and just love the quality. What was I thinking? I am either going for another lens or a smaller sony nex 6 or rx100 for times when its not around. Also think I may get a 35mm f2 and a small bag for a more portable setup.


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## robbymack (Jan 19, 2013)

Fuji x100s? I'm toying with the idea myself. My current pocketable iPhone is great for what it is but it leaves something to be desired when compared to my 5diii. I'm thinking a x100s could satisfy the walk around itch I get mid lunch break every few weeks and wouldnt take up too much space in my gym bag.


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## EvilTed (Jan 19, 2013)

You might just find that this pocketable Fuji is way superior to your 5D MK3 in most respects except fast tracking AF 

I know I prefer my Fuji X cameras (X-Pro1 and XE-1) to my 5D MK3 with any L or Zeiss lens you care to nominate.
I've owned or tried most of them and they are soft and lackluster in comparison...

ET


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## smithy (Jan 20, 2013)

EvilTed said:


> You might just find that this pocketable Fuji is way superior to your 5D MK3 in most respects except fast tracking AF
> 
> I know I prefer my Fuji X cameras (X-Pro1 and XE-1) to my 5D MK3 with any L or Zeiss lens you care to nominate.
> I've owned or tried most of them and they are soft and lackluster in comparison...
> ...


Fuji cameras are pretty - I have an X10 because it has decent image quality, is reasonably small, has a manual zoom, and looks cool. Some of my friends have bought X10s too - simply because it looks stylish (they're not interested in taking photos with it - they have iPhones for that). I've tried getting to the point where I can go out on a serious photo mission with nothing but my Fuji, but I always find myself wishing I had my 5D3 or 1V with me. I'm just an SLR person really. I like the responsiveness and the no-nonsense layout of the controls (especially on the 1V). I've handled the XE-1 at my local camera shop and felt that it was still quite a large camera and I couldn't really see the point in buying one when I already have SLRs. The XE-1 is well known for its sharpness though - it lacks an AA filter which contributes to this. (I'm not sure how this affects its moiré aliasing though - probably badly).

Today I had a play with an EOS 6D with the new Sigma 35mm f/1.4 lens attached. The lens was gorgeous. The 6D just felt like a x00 series EOS, but full-frame... Sturdy and trustworthy, no doubt, but overpriced for what it is.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 20, 2013)

I have been reviewing some of my recent pics and wonder if I downgrade body, f4 lenses, smaller flash will it net me the same results. I will try to post some examples. This was handheld 1/60 and with Is would have been sharper.


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## Robert Welch (Jan 20, 2013)

The only Canon camera you can downgrade to that wouldn't result in lower IQ would be a 6D. You would be giving up a few very nice features, gain a couple (GPS & WiFi), and reduce size.

As for lenses, the photo you just posted I assume was at f/2.8. If you get a 24-70/f4.0 you'll probably give up just a little bit of IQ (from the test I've seen so far, the 24-70/2.8II is the sharpest in it's class), but will get the ability to handhold in a couple of stops lower light with reasonable results.

All in all, stirckly speaking I don't think you can get better results over all by downgrading your equipment, but you can reduce the weight of the equipment you are carrying around and may be able to increase your handholding capabilities by up to 2-stops perhaps, but otherwise you'll be downgrading for the most part.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 21, 2013)

Robert Welch said:


> The only Canon camera you can downgrade to that wouldn't result in lower IQ would be a 6D. You would be giving up a few very nice features, gain a couple (GPS & WiFi), and reduce size.
> 
> As for lenses, the photo you just posted I assume was at f/2.8. If you get a 24-70/f4.0 you'll probably give up just a little bit of IQ (from the test I've seen so far, the 24-70/2.8II is the sharpest in it's class), but will get the ability to handhold in a couple of stops lower light with reasonable results.
> 
> All in all, stirckly speaking I don't think you can get better results over all by downgrading your equipment, but you can reduce the weight of the equipment you are carrying around and may be able to increase your handholding capabilities by up to 2-stops perhaps, but otherwise you'll be downgrading for the most part.



Yeah just the weight and bulk of all the gear seems a bit much sometimes. Also i cannot stand the lack of IS. I will get another up that concerns the noise my camera produces at iso 5000. I thought this camera was supposed to be great at higher iso but anything above 3200 seems to loose to many fine details and has too much luminance noise for my tastes.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 21, 2013)

See this is the noise I am talking about. Iso 5000 1/125 f4


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## wickidwombat (Jan 21, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> See this is the noise I am talking about. Iso 5000 1/125 f4



he's playing the drums you can hardly expect it to not be noisy.... 

but seriously Lightroom really works a treat on 5Dmk3 noise it can clean up iso 5000 so that the noise will be un-noticable in print


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 21, 2013)

wickidwombat said:


> KKCFamilyman said:
> 
> 
> > See this is the noise I am talking about. Iso 5000 1/125 f4
> ...



Yeah but maybe I am doing something wrong because as I slide over the luminance nr the pic loosesall its details. I know this is a wierd side step but would the 1d x be that much cleaner?


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## East Wind Photography (Jan 21, 2013)

Combination of luminance, color, and sharpness filters will fix that right up. At 5000 you are going to have some noise but it should be random and not patterned. Random noise is ok to the eye and when printed you dont even see it. I rarely use higher that 3200 indoors except outside at night where I run it up as high as it needs to be. I also us all F2.8 lenses or faster. Doesn't sound like much but if it means ISO 5000 or 3200 it can make a BIG difference when it comes to noise.



KKCFamilyman said:


> wickidwombat said:
> 
> 
> > KKCFamilyman said:
> ...


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 21, 2013)

East Wind Photography said:
 

> Combination of luminance, color, and sharpness filters will fix that right up. At 5000 you are going to have some noise but it should be random and not patterned. Random noise is ok to the eye and when printed you dont even see it. I rarely use higher that 3200 indoors except outside at night where I run it up as high as it needs to be. I also us all F2.8 lenses or faster. Doesn't sound like much but if it means ISO 5000 or 3200 it can make a BIG difference when it comes to noise.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yeah I agree 3200 would be better but i wanted more in focus than 2.8 would allow to get my son and the drums.


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## East Wind Photography (Jan 21, 2013)

So the 1dx would help. At 6400 it should equal 3200 on the 5d3. Understood that in low light to get any dof you sacrifice something, either noise or shutter speed.



KKCFamilyman said:


> East Wind Photography said:
> 
> 
> > Combination of luminance, color, and sharpness filters will fix that right up. At 5000 you are going to have some noise but it should be random and not patterned. Random noise is ok to the eye and when printed you dont even see it. I rarely use higher that 3200 indoors except outside at night where I run it up as high as it needs to be. I also us all F2.8 lenses or faster. Doesn't sound like much but if it means ISO 5000 or 3200 it can make a BIG difference when it comes to noise.
> ...


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## dlleno (Jan 24, 2013)

you need MORE toys, not less, lol. a softbox on a stand would light up the subject better, allow you to reduce the ambient light level to make the subject pop. perhaps add some bounce from the ceiling/walls or a reflector for extra interest; use the sunlight from the window as rim/hair light.   hmm... a lightstand (voice activated or not), softbox, 2-3 speedlites, reflector-- that should add more fun than you could possibly stand.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 25, 2013)

dlleno said:


> you need MORE toys, not less, lol. a softbox on a stand would light up the subject better, allow you to reduce the ambient light level to make the subject pop. perhaps add some bounce from the ceiling/walls or a reflector for extra interest; use the sunlight from the window as rim/hair light.   hmm... a lightstand (voice activated or not), softbox, 2-3 speedlites, reflector-- that should add more fun than you could possibly stand.



Do you have some examples of items I could get that would light up the room better?


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## dlleno (Jan 25, 2013)

strobe lighting is a very broad topic, and for the record I am not a studio photographer -- I am a student of light because I do product photography and "family lighting" is of great interest to me. depending on your budget and areas of interest there are a boatload of options, ranging from one speedlite to a whole raft of home studio lighting equipment. The point is that even for family stuff I find that even a few efforts can turn a snap shot into a photo. I'm not sure I understand your particular goals very well, but suspect you are investigating options and possibilities -- so I'm not claiming the below is necessarily the best option for you, just offering suggestions that I personally find to be good, and what came to my mind when I saw the picture you posted.

rather than write an epistle here let me offer an approach to learning about this particular area -- I highly recommend the two books by Syl Arena, which are available from Amazon (just search for Syl Arena). you really need to start somewhere, and all I can say is that Syl's books will give you a lot of practical and specific guidance. One of his books is "speedliters handbook" -- probably the best place to start, imho. BTW THere are a lot of folks out there selling books, but too many of them have a tendancy to show of their work without telling you how they did it. Not Syl he tells you how in a way that is both compelling and understandable. 

syl's blog is at pixsylated.com

the other thing you can do right away is start reading at strobist.com. another excellent source of lighting info. read through the lighting 101 article and poke around there -- David Hobby is another one of the leaders in small flash and lighting techniques. 

In general you'll discover the merits of moving your flash off camera, and modifying the light it produces. I don't know if the following approach is of interest to you (it requires more gear and set up time), but here is one of many many possible suggestions. Those that know this space will recognize that I'm endorsing Syl's choices of equipment:

put an Apollo Orb

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/820996-REG/Westcott_2336_Apollrb_36_91_4.html

with one speedlite inside, on this Manfroto light stand

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0023RRPE2/ref=ox_sc_act_title_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

with this adapter

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001ENW61I/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

using this hot shoe extension cord

http://ocfgear.com/cords-for-canon-ettl/ettl-cord-extra-long/

You'll have a cord going from the hot shoe on the camera, running along the floor, up the light stand and into the Orb, where it will now impersonate the camera hot shoe (mount the speedlite there). in this configuration the camera thinks that the flash is mounted on-camera, and even though the flash is now "hidden" inside the apollo Orb, you can control it from camera menu. use full ETTL and HSS if needed. Yay for Canon for allowing flash control from the camera. big wahoo. 

yes there are many fun and compelling options to this that involve even more toys. radio triggers are available to replace the cord for example. more speedlites in the Orb, other speedlites in the room, hanging from the ceiling or whatever. booms and arms to help position the Orb. All Fun, but more $$ and more complexity. For me, just getting the flash off camera and modified (with a softbox) will open up a great many possibilities and the best place to start. 

Anyway, with the light coming in from the window, you could put the Orb at camera left or right, close to the subject (just out of the frame). that will produce nice soft light on the face, and the light from the window will strike the back of the head. 

if you don't want to deal with light stands or soft boxes, off-camera details, etc. and you just want to light up the whole room, without concentrating light on one subject, you could probably do that with a single on-camera flash bounced off the ceiling. Or add 2nd speedlite (slaved) sitting somewhere else pointed at a wall or the ceiling.

I happen to like the speedlite method of lighting for family stuff especially because you can take full advantage of high speed sync and ETTL metering. The setup time is short, and the lights are small and portable. in the controlled chaos of a family living room, these things are great benefit. Yes there are a great many who turn off ETTL and go manual, and that is loads of fun too, but to start I just recommend moving the ETTL flash off camera into a box of some sort. Then you can cogitate on whether you want more speedlites or if you want strobes that have to plug in, whatever,

btw -- an inexpensive option for speedlite compatible flashes is Yonguo. they are getting good reviews now, particularly because they are very affordable. the 568EX for example, is essentially a 580EX clone that can act as a slave (but not a master), respects ETTL and HSS -- and its $170! at this price I can afford three, instead of getting one Canon. yes, the new Canon radio system is awesome, but again its expensive. If you already have one genuine article 580EX or 600 rt, then you just add the Yonguos to the mix. thats what I'm fixing to do...


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## smithy (Jan 25, 2013)

With lighting, I'd suggest starting with a Yongnuo 568EX speedlite (as suggested above), combined with the Yongnuo 622 trigger (if you can afford the Canon gear at 5x the price, by all means buy it). Buy a lightweight stand with a cold shoe and an umbrella adapter on top, combine with an umbrella or softbox and BOOM! Instant mini lighting setup for around US$350. 

I have a pair of studio strobes, but I'm mostly using the above speedlite approach at the moment (mostly for baby photography).


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## KKCFamilyman (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks for those suggestions. That sounds like a good idea to bring more light into the scene.I am going to pursue that. I will let you know how it pans out.


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## dlleno (Jan 26, 2013)

News flash check out the new yn560iii.


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## Marsu42 (Jan 26, 2013)

dlleno said:


> News flash check out the new yn560iii.



Now I'm really wondering if it was smart to buy a 600rt - I won't be needing the larger af spread on the 6d :-\ ... though the 600rt sure is nice and has the 200mm reflector the price is ridiculous, the st-e3 controller doesn't have af assist and there still aren't any triggers.

http://www.lightingrumours.com/yongnuo-yn560-iii-flashgun-announced-with-built-in-2-4ghz-radio-3257


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## Omar H (Jan 26, 2013)

now this was interesting, in another hobby I've downsized (reef aquarium) and don't regret it, but that was related to the operating costs and time needed for routine tasks which were a burden at the time that it was a good move. Money-wise, it's very difficult to get your investment back.

So your ordeal is that you already have this equipment. Operating cost won't change, so really it's just the burden related to handling. I'd say don't sell, get a smaller pocket camera if you just want to ease carrying around. There's some fantastic cameras nowadays that have extraordinary zooms from the top brands. These offer some of the same functions offered in dslr's. At the end of the day, your skill as a photographer is more useful than the equipment.

You have some fantastic equipment already, use it and enjoy.


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## dlleno (Jan 27, 2013)

the chinese are starting to provide real and viable alternatives to the high priced canon flash. one can seriously consider building as system with third party stuff. sadly i expect canons next move will be some sort of digital key authorization preventing third party flashes and triggers from working in ttl for example


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## DocMo (Feb 7, 2013)

Hey All,

New to the forums and just wanted to say that this thread was one of the most interesting threads that I've read in a long time!


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