# Latest 2016 Camera Sales Data from Japan - BCNRanking



## Woody (Jan 14, 2017)

It's official. Canon has overtaken Sony to hold the second biggest market shares for MILCs in Japan. Wow!

https://www.bcnaward.jp/award/gallery/2017/hard/p2.html

MILCs: 
2016 - Olympus (26.8%) Canon (18.5%) Sony (17.9%)
2015 - Olympus (34.5%) Sony (24.8%) Canon (13.6%)

DSLRs:
2016 - Canon (63.3%) Nikon (31.6%) Pentax (4.8%)
2015 - Canon (56.2%) Nikon (36.7%) Pentax (6.7%)

Lenses:
2016 - Canon (24%) Sigma (14.3%) Nikon (12.5%)
2015 - Canon (24.1%) Nikon (15.2%) Sigma (13.5%)

Nikon appears to be shrinking in their home ground.


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## kphoto99 (Jan 14, 2017)

That is not good news for anybody but Canon shareholders.


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 14, 2017)

kphoto99 said:


> That is not good news for anybody but Canon shareholders.



It's good news for Canon shooters. It means continued presence in the market and thus ongoing support. It means more investment in R&D to give current users an upgrade path. It means more investment in MILCs, more dedicated lenses. 

It's not good news for Nikon shooters, as Mitsubishi may just drop Nikon and strand the user base. Nor is it good news for Sony shooters, since Sony has a penchant for dropping product lines. 

It's bad news for all those predicting Canon's doom due to other makers 'superior' ILC products.


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## kphoto99 (Jan 14, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> kphoto99 said:
> 
> 
> > That is not good news for anybody but Canon shareholders.
> ...



I agree with you on your assessment of all other companies than Canon, but I disagree with your opinion about Canon. 

This is a basic laws of capitalism, less completion means less investment in R&D. You seem to think that Canon will spend more money on advancing technology in there camera products out of the goodness of their hart.
They will spend the extra capital that they have due to lower competition on purchasing companies in other markets so they can increase the value to shareholders not increasing value proposition to the buyers of DSLR and MILC products.

But I do agree with you that as a Canon user I don't have to worry about them dispersing. I just can't expect to see lots of value in products from Canon.

And yes, doom sayers were always out to lunch.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jan 14, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> kphoto99 said:
> 
> 
> > That is not good news for anybody but Canon shareholders.
> ...



Perhaps I am mistaken, but I recall Nikon restructuring, and forcasting a 8% + profit for FY 2017 ending this march. Like others, The photography sector was hit hard by Brexit, but still doing reasonably well for tough times.


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## Bennymiata (Jan 14, 2017)

With the release of the M5, I bet their mirrorless share of the market will increase even more.

I love my M5.

Nikon needs to bring out a new D810, as1 it seems that Nikon have lost their mojo somewhat.


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## Jopa (Jan 15, 2017)

A co-worker asked me an advice what camera to buy for her food blog. She needed good stills and video with reliable AF. 2 years ago I would say go with the A6000. Today an A6000 successor doesn't seem like a good choice anymore. We went with the M5. The camera is wonderful. It's so well thought and polished - you'll never see anything close from Sony, even my A7r2 looks like a cheap knock-off compared to her M5. The touch screen is a pleasure to use. The output quality is amazing. The 28mm macro is a beauty...
I personally have more cameras than I really need, but I'm thinking about getting an M5 myself - GAS go away ARGHHH!!!


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## unfocused (Jan 16, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> kphoto99 said:
> 
> 
> > That is not good news for anybody but Canon shareholders.
> ...



Predicting Nikon's or Sony's doom is no more credible than predicting Canon's.


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## rrcphoto (Jan 16, 2017)

*Canon #2 in mirrorless in Japan. BCN Rankings*

Canon continues to climb in mirrorless and stakes an even larger lead in DSLR's. Unit sales based upon store receipts.

https://www.bcnaward.jp/award/gallery/2017/hard/index.html

http://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/2016-companies-market-shares-japan/

Stupid Canon


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## AvTvM (Jan 16, 2017)

*Re: Canon #2 in mirrorless in Japan. BCN Rankings*



rrcphoto said:


> Canon continues to climb in mirrorless and stakes an even larger lead in DSLR's. Unit sales based upon store receipts.
> Stupid Canon



Yes. Imagine where they'd be, had they launched potent mirrorless systems for APS-C and FF. Nikon would already be bankrupt.


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## ahsanford (Jan 16, 2017)

*BCN Japanese market share data*

No idea how these numbers are put together, but FYI:
http://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/2016-companies-market-shares-japan/

If these numbers are correct, it would appear that Canon's unsexy but methodical approach to EOS M is working in Japan. I don't know if this is due to the M5 finally looking like a (more or less) complete mirrorless product* or if this is just the power of the Canon brand, but it would appear that EOS M is finally getting some sales momentum.

- A

* Many grumble about the lack of native lenses, lack of IBIS, lack of 4K, etc. but let's face it, at least it has a _viewfinder_ now.


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## unfocused (Jan 16, 2017)

*Re: BCN Japanese market share data*

Need to merge this thread with this one: http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=31699.0


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## ritholtz (Jan 16, 2017)

*Re: Canon #2 in mirrorless in Japan. BCN Rankings*



AvTvM said:


> rrcphoto said:
> 
> 
> > Canon continues to climb in mirrorless and stakes an even larger lead in DSLR's. Unit sales based upon store receipts.
> ...


Sony lost market share in DSLR and gained in mirrorless. Let us see if it happens with Canon. Sony needs to find a way to sell more lens. What is going on fixed lens camera sales? Isn't Sony suppose to be there?
This news is kinda jolt to lot of forum members in various photo websites. All Sony needs to do is listen to Neuro instead they went with rest of the photo forum community which is lead by AvTvM.


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## Orangutan (Jan 16, 2017)

*Re: Canon #2 in mirrorless in Japan. BCN Rankings*



AvTvM said:


> rrcphoto said:
> 
> 
> > Canon continues to climb in mirrorless and stakes an even larger lead in DSLR's. Unit sales based upon store receipts.
> ...



[list type=decimal]
[*]This assumes it's feasible to make a "potent" mirrorless to compete with DSLR at an acceptable pricepoint.
[*]Nikon has been a motivator for Canon improvements, I don't want them to go bankrupt
[*]The reverse goes for Nikon and Sony: if they weren't so stupid as to neglect the compelling features of Canon's lineup, then Canon would have been forced out of the camera market by now.
[/list]

For a corporation, there's nothing stupid about profit. For a consumer, there's nothing stupid about fierce competition among the manufacturers.


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## rrcphoto (Jan 16, 2017)

*Re: BCN Japanese market share data*



ahsanford said:


> No idea how these numbers are put together, but FYI:
> http://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/2016-companies-market-shares-japan/
> 
> If these numbers are correct, it would appear that Canon's unsexy but methodical approach to EOS M is working in Japan. I don't know if this is due to the M5 finally looking like a (more or less) complete mirrorless product* or if this is just the power of the Canon brand, but it would appear that EOS M is finally getting some sales momentum.



this is sales in Japan. M5 is pretty meaningless. the earthquake may play a bit into this though.


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## ahsanford (Jan 16, 2017)

Bennymiata said:


> Nikon needs to bring out a new D810, as1 it seems that Nikon have lost their mojo somewhat.



Agree the D810 would be due for a replacement. But I think it's less about mojo and more about strategy.

1) Nikon has not been sitting on its hands. The D500 did not suck, and a 200-500 f/5.6 IS lens for $1,400 is something a lot of Canonites would give their left nut for.

2) Their failure in mirrorless was a prediction that smaller was the way to go, so they went with a minuscule sensor that didn't really shower itself with accolades. It was a bad prediction. But what compounded their error was further committing to the brand with a non-trivial proliferation of bodies and some added lenses before they realized cell phones could take nearly as good a picture. Ouch.

Nikon will rebound, but they need an entire mirrorless reboot strategy, stronger video AF (with their SLRs in LiveView), and a tour de force update to the D810.

- A


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## privatebydesign (Jan 16, 2017)

*Re: Canon #2 in mirrorless in Japan. BCN Rankings*



AvTvM said:


> rrcphoto said:
> 
> 
> > Canon continues to climb in mirrorless and stakes an even larger lead in DSLR's. Unit sales based upon store receipts.
> ...



Ha, clearly for their target audience they did regarding the APS-C! 

I believe Canon think the FF mirrorless market is still an extreme niche that they just aren't willing to cater for yet.


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 16, 2017)

*Re: Canon #2 in mirrorless in Japan. BCN Rankings*



privatebydesign said:


> AvTvM said:
> 
> 
> > Yes. Imagine where they'd be, had they launched potent mirrorless systems for APS-C...
> ...



It's astounding how some people can just ignore reality even when it's slapping them upside the head.


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## Don Haines (Jan 16, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> 1) Nikon has not been sitting on its hands. The D500 did not suck, and a 200-500 f/5.6 IS lens for $1,400 is something a lot of Canonites would give their left nut for.



If you are after reach on a limited budget, the D500 and the 200-500 F5.6 combo blows any Canon combo in the same price range out of the water. The 7D2 and the D500 are a fairly even match (I would put the D500 ahead) as some features are better on one, and some are better on the other.... but for reach with a Canon lens at that price???? Nothing!

Yes, I am a Canon shooter, but I am neither blind or delusional. Nobody is ahead on everything and people need to evaluate based on their needs, not some opinion on the internet or a review site.... and when you evaluate, look at body, YOUR ergonomics, lenses, flashes, accessories, batteries, software, service, support, sealing..... everything!


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## ahsanford (Jan 16, 2017)

*Re: Canon #2 in mirrorless in Japan. BCN Rankings*



AvTvM said:


> rrcphoto said:
> 
> 
> > Canon continues to climb in mirrorless and stakes an even larger lead in DSLR's. Unit sales based upon store receipts.
> ...



How do you define _potent_? Because I have a feeling it involves Canon offering an EF-M 85mm f/2.4 IS STM.

Don't hold your breath -- with (seemingly) one hand behind their back and only _6_ first-party EF-M lenses*, Canon has raced to 2nd place! It's a minor miracle we even got a body with an integral viewfinder!

- A

*disregarded repeat lenses in separate colors


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## AvTvM (Jan 16, 2017)

"potent" in this context means: had Canon launched the M5 along the 80D 2 years ago [in addition to M3] and priced it somewhat more sensibly rather than "premium", they would have sold an awful lot more EOS bodies and EF-M lenses by now. 

In 2017 EOS M5 is still "underpowered" and definitely not a what I would consider a "potent" camera.

As far as EF-M lenses are concerned, the line-up is perfectly fine [except that missing 85/2.4 IS STM of course]. Only some review sites like dpr and a tiny minority are asking for all sorts of "fast primes" for a compact crop-sensor system. I happily prefer EF-M 6 lens lineup over all the Sony E-lenses combined and over all those crazy expensive Fuji lenses with their stupid manual aperture rings. Not surprised, that market likes EF-M glass: compact, optically decent to excellent and dirt cheap! Wonderful! 8)


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## 3kramd5 (Jan 17, 2017)

*Re: Canon #2 in mirrorless in Japan. BCN Rankings*



ritholtz said:


> Sony needs to find a way to sell more lens.



Maybe that's what the new A99 is about.

It is unclear whether their mirrorless platform (e-mount) is appropriate for long lenses, perhaps hence the vast array of standard focal lengths with scarce options above 100mm. You can't go on selling 35-85mm lenses forever, and if your platform sucks with supertele, you have to revive or introduce a different platform to sell supertele.


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