# Could This Be the Goal of the 6D Hysteria?



## Cory (Jul 25, 2017)

They say in politics to believe none of what you hear and half of what you see. I wonder if that's also true with photography forums. 
While enjoying my new 6D and feeling like I'm owning the world with it someone went and posted a whole thing about how inferior it and it's replacement are. My initial reaction was "NONSENSE", but found myself frantically researching Fuji mirrorless cameras and lenses.
Could the 6D hysteria be a diabolical plot to encourage GAS. It got so bad that I was almost about to buy that Fuji camera and their 10-24 and 35mm lenses, got a hold of myself and immediately cleared out my Wish List on DP Review (except, of course, for the 70-300L that'll serve well when visiting the Marine Corps Silent Drill team, my son's upcoming graduation and the like).
The pending doom of my GAS crisis was the upcoming trip to Italy figuring that a mirrorless system would be ideal. If I order quickly enough I'll have time on the plane to learn how the camera works.
But, alas, GAS would thereby take time away from the family. There'll be a fine balancing act on this trip between trying to get a handful of pics suitable for a magazine cover and spending time with my family. My wife's declaration of "Maybe leave the tripod at home?" was a clue.
Cinque Terre, Florence and Lake Como await (actually starting on this ****** Thursday, by the way) and they shall be captured in all their glory with my beloved 6D and 40mm pancake lens only. Not ideal, but with minimal criticism from my wife and kids and I've completely avoided my wife beating the **** out of me for spending money that probably doesn't need to be spent no matter how you cut it.
GAS be damned!!!!!!!!!!!!! (although I did buy a separate CPL for my 40mm lens vs. a step-up ring, but no one needs to know of this). Resistance need not be futile.


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## Khalai (Jul 25, 2017)

Cory said:


> They say in politics to believe none of what you hear and half of what you see. I wonder if that's also true with photography forums.
> While enjoying my new 6D and feeling like I'm owning the world with it someone went and posted a whole thing about how inferior it and it's replacement are. My initial reaction was "NONSENSE", but found myself frantically researching Fuji mirrorless cameras and lenses.
> Could the 6D hysteria be a diabolical plot to encourage GAS. It got so bad that I was almost about to buy that Fuji camera and their 10-24 and 35mm lenses, got a hold of myself and immediately cleared out my Wish List on DP Review (except, of course, for the 70-300L that'll serve well when visiting the Marine Corps Silent Drill team, my son's upcoming graduation and the like).
> The pending doom of my GAS crisis was the upcoming trip to Italy figuring that a mirrorless system would be ideal. If I order quickly enough I'll have time on the plane to learn how the camera works.
> ...



GAS is ubiquitous in any system. I'm jealous of Sony and Zeiss close cooperation and have been eyeballing A7 cameras for a while (actually rented A7 II for a while). Loxia and Batis lenses are strongly appealing to me. But then one realizes that every system has its pros and cons. I've had Fuji for almost a year along my Canon bodies and lenses. Friend borrowed me his D610 for a week or so, when he's upgraded to D750. And GAS is everywhere. You can only control it, never get rid of it.

After all, if gear what you have now does not limit you in any way and you're happy with output, why bother switching? Renting first should be no-brainer.

As for derogatory reviews of 6D and 6D II - it will always happen and frankly, Canon did ask for that a bit with recent 6D II sensor measurebating DR latitude. But I've had my trusty old beaten 6D for around four years, over 20 weddings and countless portrait sessions and landscape trips. I've never been disappointed by its output and it just worked even in rain, wind or snow. So anyone telling me, that 6D is somehow a trash camera, incapable of anything serious, should spend more time taking images and less time trolling forums.


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## ahsanford (Jul 25, 2017)

The 6D2 witch hunt is tantamount to seeing a new car loaded with advantages over the prior model year, we yet throw a fit that it's less peppy _only in first gear_.

Yes -- Canon could have easily given the 6D2 a peppier first gear (the base ISO DR) -- there is no denying that. But just about everything else on the camera is a compelling upgrade over the 6D1. I am highly confident the 6D2 will sell like hotcakes because Canon is the most compelling ecosystem to be part of and their gear reliably works without any surprises.

So, no, this isn't GAS at play so much as a number of (I would say) legitimately disappointed Canon landscapers looking to upgrade + an absolute mob of folks that flock to disappointment and stoke the flames. The latter group thought that no 4K / single card slot were the great offenses to rant about, but then Canon threw them a real bone: _sensor tech from 2012._ 

Let them rant -- it's a free internet -- but I won't associate any higher meaning to it.

- A


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## unfocused (Jul 25, 2017)

Amusing post. 

One thing people tend to overlook is that all sites, reviewers, magazines, etc., etc., earn their livings through the sale of products -- some directly and some indirectly. It is in their best interests to foster debate and coverage, whether good or bad, because it drives traffic and generates interest. 

After all, how many people would come to a site that says, "the newest model has some incremental improvements over the last model and is about the same as all the competitors' models"? So we have to magnify tiny differences and place huge weight on things that really don't have that much impact. 

Couple that with people who are always seeking to find the magic tool that will make them great at whatever. 

My mother used to say, "The difference between men and boys is the cost of their toys." A lot of truth to that.


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## Luds34 (Jul 25, 2017)

Khalai said:


> So anyone telling me, that 6D is somehow a trash camera, incapable of anything serious, should spend more time taking images and less time trolling forums.



Careful there making statements that make far too much sense.


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## Khalai (Jul 25, 2017)

Luds34 said:


> Khalai said:
> 
> 
> > So anyone telling me, that 6D is somehow a trash camera, incapable of anything serious, should spend more time taking images and less time trolling forums.
> ...



Sorry, I'll increase my meds and refrain from further common sense in the future. Won't happen again, I swear


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## Luds34 (Jul 25, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> Let them rant -- it's a free internet -- but I won't associate any higher meaning to it.
> 
> - A



Oh-oh, Another level-headed rational thought.


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## Luds34 (Jul 25, 2017)

unfocused said:


> One thing people tend to overlook is that all sites, reviewers, magazines, etc., etc., earn their livings through the sale of products -- some directly and some indirectly. It is in their best interests to foster debate and coverage, whether good or bad, because it drives traffic and generates interest.



Okay, I'm done. I must have crossed into another dimension. This is the Canon Rumors forum and I'm seeing rational and intelligent statements being made post after post. This just isn't right. 

Alrighty, instead of just getting easy posts under my belt, I suppose I could attempt to add to the discussion. However the bar has been set kind of high and I am feeling a bit of pressure to maintain such sanity. Okay, I'll just echo the thoughts that it can get easy to fall into the "chasing the gear" and geeking out over new toys. And to the OP, Cory, yeah they Fuji system is pretty sexy, pretty cool. I'd recommend checking it out if you get a chance. But do not have any insecurities about your 6D. The 6D is as good or even a better camera in a lot of ways. I like the Fuji system for being a handy small, compact, great for travel sort of system. I reach for the Canon and my "big glass" when I'm more photography focused. And it's less "those are how the systems are" and more "that is how I built out my versions of each system" if that makes sense.

In short, the 6D2 is going to be another great camera, just as the current 6D still is today. Both are capable of taking awesome pictures, just like most of the gear we compare and debate about it. Obviously this forum exists to talk about the equipment, gear, but it doesn't hurt to get out and shoot a little more and worry a little less about what camera or lens is in your hands.


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## BillB (Jul 25, 2017)

unfocused said:


> Amusing post.
> 
> One thing people tend to overlook is that all sites, reviewers, magazines, etc., etc., earn their livings through the sale of products -- some directly and some indirectly. It is in their best interests to foster debate and coverage, whether good or bad, because it drives traffic and generates interest.
> 
> ...



+ 1. 

DR frenzy is largely the result of cunning DPR self promotion. I have no idea how much they believe their own stuff. The real question isn't so much how accurate it is, but more how significant it is (or isn't). DPR hijacked the term Dynamic Range and appled it to shadow lifting at base ISO, and then came up with magic DR numbers that have become an expected part of the new camera release cycle, in which there is great fanboy silliness on all sides.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jul 25, 2017)

Every new camera model has people doing weird things trying to bring attention to themselves. Photos with a lens cap on and boosted 5 or more stops, DR measurements, everything you could imagine plus a lot more.

The cameras started shipping yesterday, before that, there were a few prototypes floating around which were likely close to production, but we will see lots of testing going on.

I'm sure its not a promotion by Canon, the DR measurements are done by a person who does every make of camera as a hobby. 

I had considered a 6D MK II, but finally decided to go for a mark IV. I'd probably be very happy with the 6D2. I may buy one when the price drops. I have not noticed any DR issues with my new MK IV, mainly because I don't underexpose 5 stops. If you expose correctly, them most images will be fine. Those that have need of super high DR can be handled by bracketing exposures and combining the images in post.


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## Darkly (Jul 26, 2017)

Cory said:


> They say in politics to believe none of what you hear and half of what you see. I wonder if that's also true with photography forums.
> While enjoying my new 6D and feeling like I'm owning the world with it someone went and posted a whole thing about how inferior it and it's replacement are. My initial reaction was "NONSENSE", but found myself frantically researching Fuji mirrorless cameras and lenses.
> Could the 6D hysteria be a diabolical plot to encourage GAS. It got so bad that I was almost about to buy that Fuji camera and their 10-24 and 35mm lenses, got a hold of myself and immediately cleared out my Wish List on DP Review (except, of course, for the 70-300L that'll serve well when visiting the Marine Corps Silent Drill team, my son's upcoming graduation and the like).
> The pending doom of my GAS crisis was the upcoming trip to Italy figuring that a mirrorless system would be ideal. If I order quickly enough I'll have time on the plane to learn how the camera works.
> ...



Technical comparisons are just that, comparisons, and lose relevance when you're out there taking photographs in the real world - unless of course you really enjoy taking several different cameras with you wherever you go in order to capture exactly the same scene and pore over the technical differences later, in which case you're simply obsessed with metrics and not photography itself.

The best camera is the one you have with you, whatever that may be. In my opinion the 6D is a great piece of kit, and a worthy alternative to the 5D mkIII if you want to save money to put towards some nice glass. One thing that's easily overlooked is it can take the same range of focusing screens as the 5D mkII. This means if you find yourself hitting the limits of the AF system you can always change to a screen better suited for MF with large aperture lenses. That's a pleasure that's denied to owners of newer cameras ;D

One thing to be aware of with the 6D is the lack of weather sealing on the lens release button, this can allow liquid ingress which can later cause lens locking issues. I bought an infrared modified 6D at a bargain price a couple of years back, and unfortunately it had a stuck lens release button meaning lenses couldn't be locked into place. I didn't want to send it back as it had been modified at some expense by the previous owner, and I got it dirt cheap anyway so I held on to it and eventually got round to stripping the front cover off. The problem was immediately obvious when looking at the casework - there's a small unprotected aperture inside the well that the release button sits in, it's not obviously visible from the outside but it's there. It looked like at some point in the past it had been slightly exposed to saltwater, and this had penetrated the aperture and worked its way into the shaft that the button slides in. This caused a small degree of corrosion in the alloy front case and so the button wasn't returning freely to lock lenses in place. A wooden cocktail stick dipped in metal polish soon removed the corrosion from the shaft and the button was free to move once more, and lenses now secure properly.

This could be a potential issue for anyone photographing near saltwater so it's worth bearing in mind, although the release button will be fairly well protected if you hold the camera properly with the lens cradled in your left hand.


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## Pookie (Jul 26, 2017)

What you'll notice here or on any forum is those that bought into one camera will suddenly praise it as the end all be all of cameras. Everything else is trash and obsolete....

6D owners swear by its low light capabilities... which owning one I find to be a very optimistic characteristic. 

The new 5D4 is the best camera ever... not hardly, I own one and a ton of 5D3's. They are all great cameras but I would never say the 5D3 is obsolete. The 5D4 is a modest improvement over the 4. You should have heard the panties twisting in the wind when I made that comment here after new ones were in peoples hands.

The 1DX II superb !!! Ehh, better than the 1DX yes... vastly no.

When you own more than one body and/or more than one maker you see life a bit more clearly... ALL cameras have pros and cons. None are perfect. I love my Mamiya's. I love my Leica's, I LOVE my 645Z !!! I love my Canon's but I can also admit none is perfect and I love having a choice when heading out the door. Be it film or digital I love using each to their best. What you have here is a group of die-hard fan boys for Canon... as it should be, this isn't Nikon Rumors or Leica Rumors. What is asinine is the constant bickering about who's camera is better when taking images in a closed closet and semantics. If you read all this and then go out to look for a new camera because the one in your hand is now garbage after reading 52 pages of flaming about a sensor or a blah, blah blah... that's your own fault for buying into this as gospel. What you're witnessing is the wall of technological advances height and most new cameras are just minor tweaks and adjustments. Get over it and enjoy the cameras you own.

You should be going out more often and just shooting... Have you ever wondered how someone who spends over a year in time on this site finds time to actually take photos? Or how some who doesn't own a 50L can swear it's garbage because they read about it. I do...

Now I'm heading out with my new camera but first I'm going to find 14 articles on how good or bad it is before I take one single image.


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## ahsanford (Jul 26, 2017)

Speaking of hysteria, here's a keeper:

https://www.slrlounge.com/canon-6d-mark-ii-dynamic-range-worse-than-its-predecessor-aps-c-80d-who-is-it-for/

The story is not the news here, similar posts are making the rounds at PP, DPR, etc. But check out one of the comments:

_"Just sold my Canon 6D and 5DIII along with my 35mmf/1.4L II, 24-70mm f/2.8L II, and 70-200mm f/2.8L II. Bye Canon, forever. Got myself the D750 and a couple of lenses, couldn’t be happier. 

What’s sad is that all I needed was an increase in dynamic range and low light capability. I preordered the 6DII hoping that I would get that but ended up cancelling that order after hearing the devastating news about its DR performance. I also was able to use some of my extra money from selling all that stuff to buy a sweet bike. Thanks Canon, I owe that to you."_

Everything about the way this news has been disseminated, hyped up to be really important, and driven some folks frothing mad feels like that guy who stormed the Washington pizzeria with a rifle last year. The 6D2 is not fake news, mind you -- the DR finding appears to be legit -- it's how people are processing the importance of that news and the actions they are taking that is so disconcerting.

- A


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## YuengLinger (Jul 26, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> Speaking of hysteria, here's a keeper:
> 
> https://www.slrlounge.com/canon-6d-mark-ii-dynamic-range-worse-than-its-predecessor-aps-c-80d-who-is-it-for/
> 
> ...



Apparently the buyers who snapped up his plethora of Canon products are still happy with Canon!


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## Khalai (Jul 26, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> _"Just sold my Canon 6D and 5DIII along with my *35mmf/1.4L II, 24-70mm f/2.8L II, and 70-200mm f/2.8L II*. Bye Canon, forever. Got myself the D750 and a couple of lenses, couldn’t be happier.
> 
> What’s sad is that all I needed was an increase in dynamic range and low light capability. I preordered the 6DII hoping that I would get that but ended up cancelling that order after hearing the devastating news about its DR performance. I also was able to use some of my extra money from selling all that stuff to buy a sweet bike. Thanks Canon, I owe that to you."_
> 
> - A



Oh my... You would have to pry those lenses from my cold hands when I'm dead. Nikkor counterparts are good, but they are not THAT good. He may have helped himself with base ISO DR, but otherwise that was more of an sidegrade, rather than upgrade...


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## ahsanford (Jul 26, 2017)

YuengLinger said:


> Apparently the buyers who snapped up his plethora of Canon products are still happy with Canon!



YL, you've cracked the code!

Clearly the DR hysteria is being fueled by a shadowy Breitbartian figure that is trying to whip people into a frenzy to ditch Canon for SoNikon cameras so that he can scoop up 2nd hand Canon gear on the cheap for subsequent resale at market prices. Genius.

- A


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## ahsanford (Jul 26, 2017)

Khalai said:


> Oh my... You would have to pry those lenses from my cold hands when I'm dead. Nikkor counterparts are good, but they are not THAT good. He may have helped himself with base ISO DR, but otherwise that was more of an sidegrade, rather than upgrade...



Yeah, my rebuttal on that thread called him out for giving up _those_ three lenses. It was as if he was saying the lenses didn't matter at all in his decision, such was his DR madness.

- A


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## Khalai (Jul 26, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> YL, you've cracked the code!
> 
> Clearly the DR hysteria is being fueled by a shadowy Breitbartian figure that is trying to whip people into a frenzy to ditch Canon for SoNikon cameras so that he can scoop up 2nd hand Canon gear on the cheap for subsequent resale at market prices. Genius.
> 
> - A



Look at the bright side, he made someone very happy with such lenses


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## Luds34 (Jul 26, 2017)

Khalai said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > YL, you've cracked the code!
> ...



Especially if he/she unloaded all of his/her equipment that fast. It can take me a few months (sometimes half a year) to unload a single lens, but usually the patience is worth it as I feel I end up receiving fair value. If I unloaded all my Canon gear in the time frame this person did, I think I'd be taking some large losses.


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 26, 2017)

Luds34 said:


> Especially if he/she unloaded all of his/her equipment that fast. It can take me a few months (sometimes half a year) to unload a single lens, but usually the patience is worth it as I feel I end up receiving fair value. If I unloaded all my Canon gear in the time frame this person did, I think I'd be taking some large losses.



The DRade-off was more than worth it, apparently.


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## BillB (Jul 26, 2017)

Luds34 said:


> Khalai said:
> 
> 
> > ahsanford said:
> ...



Right. Doubt that it ever happened. My guess is that the original email was a fabrication, to stir the pot. CR0


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## StudentOfLight (Jul 26, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> The 6D2 witch hunt is tantamount to seeing a new car loaded with advantages over the prior model year, we yet throw a fit that it's less peppy _only in first gear_.
> 
> Yes -- Canon could have easily given the 6D2 a peppier first gear (the base ISO DR) -- there is no denying that. But just about everything else on the camera is a compelling upgrade over the 6D1. I am highly confident the 6D2 will sell like hotcakes because Canon is the most compelling ecosystem to be part of and their gear reliably works without any surprises.
> 
> ...


I pulled up my LR stats (attached) & apparently I sit in "1st gear" a heck of a lot. Perhaps 1st gear is important to some people...


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## Khalai (Jul 26, 2017)

StudentOfLight said:


> I pulled up my LR stats (attached) & apparently I sit in "1st gear" a heck of a lot. Perhaps 1st gear is important to some people...



Nobody ever said it's not. Everybody has a different needs and priorities. Which is why any generalization is generally (  ) frowned upon. And you also sit two thirds of the time in ISO, where interbrand DR differences are irrelevant. Now, which one of that is bigger priority for you should dictate if 6D II is a camera for you or perhaps not


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## StudentOfLight (Jul 26, 2017)

Khalai said:


> StudentOfLight said:
> 
> 
> > I pulled up my LR stats (attached) & apparently I sit in "1st gear" a heck of a lot. Perhaps 1st gear is important to some people...
> ...


Also I have issue with the it's merely "1st gear" analogy.

With imaging I'd tend towards the lowest practically usable ISO in order to deliver the cleanest files. In ideal conditions I'd use low ISO not anything else.

OTOH, when driving I wouldn't ideally want to drive around in 1st gear because 1st would be very heavy on fuel and most destructive to the engine per distance traveled. In ideal conditions I'd use a higher gear in order to achieve better fuel efficient and reduced wear.

I don't think the "1st gear" analogy is a good representation of imaging as it fails to align with the priorities inherent in good image-making practice.


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## Khalai (Jul 26, 2017)

StudentOfLight said:


> With imaging I'd tend towards the lowest practically usable ISO in order to deliver the cleanest files. In ideal conditions I'd use low ISO not anything else.



I guess that's only natural and I honestly don't know anyone willing to increase ISO just for the sake of it. When I'm shooting landscapes, ISO 100 and tripod is a given. But when doing reportage, Auto ISO 100-3200/6400 with minimum shutter speed of 1/60s or 1/125s is my bread and butter and I could not care less about used ISO. So back again to individual priorities. I guess that hardcore landscapers are not very pleased with 6D II, but they can always pick up e.g. Sony A7rII and adapt their Canon lenses, if they feel they can't part with them...


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