# Advice needed: performance of 6D



## daniela (May 30, 2013)

Sorry, guys!
But I need some advice: For the high school graduation of one of my sons, I am looking for an Camera. He likes to photograph birds and planes, and now landscape at climbing.
Which Camera? I do not want to spend 3000€ for a 5D3. Would be the cheaper 6D an alternative? How is the performance of this Camera in the field for shooting fast objects? How fast is the Cam saving the images? I know that the image quality is very good.

Or should I buy an 700D first and wait for the 70D or 7D2? How fast is the 700D at RAW continuous shooting saving the images on the card? Faster then my 60D?

(I owned an 7D, but when I photographed with it, I did not use the continuous shooting mode. After it crashed, I use an 60D. But my son tells me, that the 60D takes a lot of time to save the images when the buffer is full. Sometimes he is not able to shoot another RAW series of 10 images for 3-4 minutes.)


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## funkboy (May 30, 2013)

There are a zillion 6D threads here, just have a look for yourself...

But the short answer is that unless the primary purpose of your photography is shooting fast-moving subjects like sports or birds, the 6D is absolutely fantastic. So just get one .

60D taking more than 30 seconds to dump the buffer sounds like hogwash to me, and you can still keep shooting while it's doing it (perhaps you have the world's crappiest SD card?). Here's what DPReview says: http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos60D/9
BTW you can almost double the buffer depth if you turn off "high ISO noise reduction".


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## daniela (May 30, 2013)

funkboy said:


> There are a zillion 6D threads here, just have a look for yourself...
> 
> But the short answer is that unless the primary purpose of your photography is shooting fast-moving subjects like sports or birds, the 6D is absolutely fantastic. So just get one .
> 
> ...



Thanks for this advice. *Above which Iso is the high ISO noise reduction visible? Does it affect Raw images too?*

@ "60D taking more than 30 seconds to dump the buffer sounds like hogwash to me, and you can still keep shooting while it's doing it": There is an Sandisk extreme 16 GB class 10 card inside, or an Sandisk uhextreme pro uhs 1 45mb/s . But it is not a "hogwash". I tried it by myself. After about one dozen of RAW images, I was able to shoot 1 image every 3-4 seconds. For about 2-3 minutes. And after that, the buffer was full after less then 10 imgages. And I tried other cards too, which I rented from friends. It is a pity, that everybody is distrustfully and thinks that a poster is not honest. 

@ zillions of threads: True, but most of the persons that post, do not own this Camera. And the topic buffer frames are not very often mentioned....

Much thanks for your time to post.


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## bholliman (May 30, 2013)

The 6D is a great camera, excellent IQ and low light/high ISO performance. But, its probably not your best choice if shooting fast moving objects is your son's top priority. Maybe give him a rain check for a 7DII when its released assuming he already has a decent camera to use in the mean time (the aforementioned 60D?).

I'm a bit surprised by the buffer write time issue you describe. I've owned 4 Canon DSLR bodies, including some lowly Rebels, but never experienced anything like this. Your SD card should be plenty fast enough, maybe there is a problem with the camera?


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## daniela (May 30, 2013)

bholliman said:


> The 6D is a great camera, excellent IQ and low light/high ISO performance. But, its probably not your best choice if shooting fast moving objects is your son's top priority. Maybe give him a rain check for a 7DII when its released assuming he already has a decent camera to use in the mean time (the aforementioned 60D?).
> 
> I'm a bit surprised by the buffer write time issue you describe. I've owned 4 Canon DSLR bodies, including some lowly Rebels, but never experienced anything like this. Your SD card should be plenty fast enough, maybe there is a problem with the camera?



I sent it to the German Canon support, because of an sensor problem. They repaired this problem, but refused that my cam is suffering from an speed problem at saving the images on the card. I am sorry, but I just can report this problem. The 7D was my first DSLR, I used analogue SLR before. So I do not have much experience with the DSLR performance. And some month befoer it broke, I bought the 60D as an second body for my children. Now the Cam is about 30 month old, and it would be to expensive to repair this feature. 

Your are right, the 6D is just a compromise. But I did not want to spent 2800-3000€ for the 5D3. Maybe I should really buy an 700D and bridge the gap to the 7D2 or 70D.


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## ecka (May 30, 2013)

5D3 is much better for tracking, shoots 6fps and clearing buffer to CF card is faster than SD. My 6D with Transcend 64GB Class10 UHS-1 shoots 15 RAW images at 4.5fps before slowing down to 1fps. The buffer clears pretty fast and for shooting 10 frames series there should be no problem. However, 5D3 is a better tool for action.


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## Chosenbydestiny (May 30, 2013)

If your son wasn't happy with a 60D he'll be even less happier shooting a 6D for action. Not saying the 6D can't do it but the 60D should be able to do it better. 6D just doesnt seem to fit his style of shooting. Perhaps give the 7D another try, or even a used 1D mark III where buffer clearance and fps will favor his style better  The 6D is an awesome camera, but it's not for everyone.


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## Marsu42 (May 30, 2013)

daniela said:


> But I need some advice: For the high school graduation of one of my sons, I am looking for an Camera. He likes to photograph birds and planes, and now landscape at climbing.



For birds, you *don't* want a full frame camera like 6d or 5d3 because crop cameras have a 1.6x longer reach - that's why birders that don't want to spend $10000 on a lens have the 7d.



daniela said:


> (I owned an 7D, but when I photographed with it, I did not use the continuous shooting mode. After it crashed, I use an 60D. But my son tells me, that the 60D takes a lot of time to save the images when the buffer is full. Sometimes he is not able to shoot another RAW series of 10 images for 3-4 minutes.)



I've got a 60d, and 3-4 min is certainly an overestimation, though the buffer of the 60d is not as deep as on the 7d and the 60d/7d don't support the newests/fastest sd card standard. Anyway, for landscape and climbing, and even for wildlife you don't necessarily do spray'n pray but take selective bursts, so I've never found the 60d buffer limiting myself - and for action, the 6d is for low light shooting and would be a step down (slower fps, worse autofocus).

My advice, even if you are planning to do differently: Use the cheaper 7d/60d and get a good lens like 70-300L or even a tele prime, it's the lens that takes the pictures.


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## Delish (May 30, 2013)

For birding also consider the price of optics, since longer is almost always better.
A crop camera will give you more pixels on the bird shot at the same range (vs full frame), somethings to consider if you live in a area were birds are not particularly tame.

Here in Norway a nicely used 1DIV costs a bit less than a 5DIII, and gives you a good combo of cost, reach, speed and tracking for birds.


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## RLPhoto (May 30, 2013)

The 6D is good as long as you use the center point.


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## awinphoto (May 30, 2013)

Holy Crap, a 6D for a graduation present? I wish you were my parent haha. For my graduation I got a cheap Rebel G film camera for $100. =)


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## Sebring5 (May 30, 2013)

I have a 6d and shoot birds (usually in flight.) It works great. I'm not even considering replacing it with another model camera. Used to have a Rebel T4i and I like the 6d far better. It is much easier to catch the bird with full frame and use Photoshop to crop. I do use the center focus point only, autofocus, a 400mm f5.6 lens and single shot. I could easily afford the 5D Mark III or 1 D X but I cannot see any advantage to switching.


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## djkmann (May 30, 2013)

daniela said:


> Sorry, guys!
> But I need some advice: For the high school graduation of one of my sons, I am looking for an Camera. He likes to photograph birds and planes, and now landscape at climbing.



Sounds like the 7D would be a great camera for him - great AF system for birds and motion, super fast continuous frame rate, APS-C sensor to give more "reach" to the lenses. Perhaps with a 70-300mm if zooming in close is always the priority. Or perhaps the 70-200mm f/4 IS for more "general" use beyond just birds and planes, (or the 70-200mm f/2.8 II IS version if he is a super serious photographer). You could wait for the 7DII if he really needs "more camera" than the 7D offers, but who knows when that will actually come out.

Regarding the buffer issues, as mentioned turn off the High ISO Noise Reduction feature, and make sure you are shooting only RAW and not RAW+JPEG, turn off Peripheral Illumination Correction, and perhaps even turn off Auto Lighting Optimizer and Highlight Tone Priority.


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## funkboy (May 30, 2013)

It's really pretty cut & dry. The 7D is the best sports/action camera short of a 1D series, but the 6D spanks it in high ISO shooting. If you want a camera right now, you need to decide whether you want the best speed & AF and merely decent high ISO performance (in which case you get the 7D), or vice-versa & get the 6D. If course the 5DIII has better AF & similar IQ, but it's bigger and a kilobuck more, and you still don't have the pixel density of the 7D that gives you the "reach" factor (and is also responsible for the lower high ISO performance). Or you can wait 'till the 70D &/or 7DII come out and see how they do, but it may be a while (esp. for the 7DII).

Or you could just figure out what's wrong with his 60D &/or send it in for service, and get him a nice telephoto lens like the 70-300L that will hold its value much better over time than any camera body...

For my graduation, I got a loan payment, & I was glad to get it...


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## whothafunk (May 30, 2013)

Sebring5 said:


> I have a 6d and shoot birds (usually in flight.) It works great. I'm not even considering replacing it with another model camera. Used to have a Rebel T4i and I like the 6d far better. It is much easier to catch the bird with full frame and use Photoshop to crop. I do use the center focus point only, autofocus, a 400mm f5.6 lens and single shot. I could easily afford the 5D Mark III or 1 D X but I cannot see any advantage to switching.


Sebring5, compared to T4i, could you please tell me if 6D's center focus point attains focus noticeably faster than the T4i or are they about the same? I use a 550D for sports and always use center focus point as its f2.8 sensitive, so AF points count and how fast the DSLR chooses the correct AF points, is not what im after. But I could do with a faster center focus point, AI Servo isnt the fastest on T2i.

A 7D is a big no-no due to its ugly High ISO noise, same as my T2i's. I shoot indoor volleyball, handball and basketball from October to May. I would buy a 7DII in an instant but im pretty sick of Canon and the long await of 70D/7DII. So sick


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## Marsu42 (May 30, 2013)

Sebring5 said:


> Used to have a Rebel T4i and I like the 6d far better.



Considering the t4i/6d age and price difference, everything else would be an absolute disgrace, it's about 60d/7d vs 6d here really...



Sebring5 said:


> It is much easier to catch the bird with full frame and use Photoshop to crop.



... and of course it's all about capturing something on the whole sensor for min iso noise and max magnification, if you only plan to cut out a piece anyway the 6d minimal af point spread and less reach won't be an issue.


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## daniela (May 30, 2013)

awinphoto said:


> Holy Crap, a 6D for a graduation present? I wish you were my parent haha. For my graduation I got a cheap Rebel G film camera for $100. =)



Well, his average grade is a 1,1. So he is able to study medicine in here in Munich. The alternative would have been to send him to Austria to study Medicine, where only an entrance test has to be passed. So it is cheaper to give him such a gift, as to buy an very expensive appartement. ;D


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## daniela (May 30, 2013)

Ok, I see thath a crop body would be best. But I don´t want to buy an "aged" Camera. Maybe the best is to wait and to buy an 7D2 or 70D. And in the time between, maybe an cheap body is the spaceholder.

I bought an used 100-400 L and an used 70-200 L 2.8 for him. So, the lenses are in midrange.


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## Marsu42 (May 30, 2013)

daniela said:


> Ok, I see thath a crop body would be best. But I don´t want to buy an "aged" Camera. Maybe the best is to wait and to buy an 7D2 or 70D. And in the time between, maybe an cheap body is the spaceholder.



I see your reasons given this is supposed to be a good present, but a 60d is rather cheap by now, has the standard 18mp Canon sensor but good handling (very important!) so it's a good way to learn photography. If you cannot get good shots from a 60d, you won't be get them from a 70d, 7d2, 80d, 7d3 or 5d3 for that matter - esp. in special circumstances like tracking action or low available light for large prints.

Better figure out what lenses he'd like if you've only got the tele range covered and he'd also like to do landscape (maybe a 16-35L or 17-40L)... or a really good prime, that is much more fun than another boring camera body.


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## greger (May 30, 2013)

You now have the lenses your son will need for BIF pics. As for the camera? 7D for BIF pics. It will serve him well till the new Canons come out and have been tested and reviewed. Then you can repost which camera to get. Good Luck.


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## whothafunk (May 30, 2013)

what does BIF stand for?


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## serendipidy (May 30, 2013)

whothafunk said:


> what does BIF stand for?



birds in flight


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## wickidwombat (May 31, 2013)

daniela said:


> Sorry, guys!
> But I need some advice: For the high school graduation of one of my sons, I am looking for an Camera. He likes to photograph birds and planes, and now landscape at climbing.
> Which Camera? I do not want to spend 3000€ for a 5D3. Would be the cheaper 6D an alternative? How is the performance of this Camera in the field for shooting fast objects? How fast is the Cam saving the images? I know that the image quality is very good.
> 
> ...



get a used 1Dmk3 i know its only 10 megapickles but it still produces better images than any 18 pickle crop they are cheap now second hand find one in good condition, they have much better AF than anything other than a 1Dmk4 1Dx or 5Dmk3 and are a much much much better option for what he likes to shoot than a 7D then maybe when the 7Dmk2 comes out have a look at that if its actually any good but that is probably a year away
look at getting him a 100-400 IS L lens and a 24-105 ISL to start out


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## Act444 (May 31, 2013)

I'm quickly finding out that the 6D is better than it appears on paper. Still, don't think it would be the right fit for someone doing sports or birds...


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## CTJohn (May 31, 2013)

Act444 said:


> I'm quickly finding out that the 6D is better than it appears on paper. Still, don't think it would be the right fit for someone doing sports or birds...



+1. I've been very pleasantly surprised by my 6D. The ISO performance changes photography for me.


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## daniela (May 31, 2013)

wickidwombat said:


> daniela said:
> 
> 
> > Sorry, guys!
> ...




An used Cam would be an alternative, until the 7D2 appears on the market.
My son is taking very good pictures, he takes shots for 5 years now, using my or my husbands equipment.

Does anybody know an good and honest company/forum e.g. where I can look for used Cams? 
I do not want to buy at Ebay, I was cheated buying the 300mm 2.8 lens (lenses inside were broken).


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## RadioPath (May 31, 2013)

daniela said:


> awinphoto said:
> 
> 
> > Holy Crap, a 6D for a graduation present? I wish you were my parent haha. For my graduation I got a cheap Rebel G film camera for $100. =)
> ...



Congratulations!!!


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## Marsu42 (May 31, 2013)

daniela said:


> Does anybody know an good and honest company/forum e.g. where I can look for used Cams?
> I do not want to buy at Ebay, I was cheated buying the 300mm 2.8 lens (lenses inside were broken).



Lenses are a big gamble because you cannot really check them, but afaik it's different for camera bodies: The only moving part is the mirror, and you can just ask how many shutter cycles it has (there are windows utilities for that, or use Magic Lantern) & compare vs. the shutter rating Canon warrants. If you then check for dead pixels (get a raw shot) & the overall impression (in person or photos), imho there are few things that can go wrong. If in doubt, check ebay Kleinanzeigen and such for local offers and get the item in person and not via mail.

Buying used has one advantage: you can get older pro-grade bodies very cheap, check for the Canon 1D IV - 16mp is enough for just about everything and for still shooting this is an absolutely stunning camera with 1.3x crop factor for birds.


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