# A few new Canon products have been cancelled due to the supply chain issues



## Canon Rumors Guy (Oct 8, 2021)

> I have been talking to a few people about upcoming products that haven’t come to fruition yet, and it looks like a few may have been cancelled and are being “refreshed”.
> While no products were directly named by my sources, one from retail mentioned that they were shown products last year that haven’t made it to market and have been removed from internal product documents.
> A second source said it’s likely that some of the cancelled products are being refreshed to meet the expectations of the market once supply chain issues have been resolved. This makes a lot of sense for cameras, as the specifications can be dated quite quickly in that space. Lenses on the other hand exist for many years, and Canon can continue to roll them out.
> With the NABShow in October being cancelled, a lot of new Cinema EOS products may have been cancelled or delayed. The next NABShow is scheduled for April 2022. That said, I do think we’ll see some Cinema EOS announcements this year, but it’ll likely be for...



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## EOS 4 Life (Oct 8, 2021)

It does make a lot of sense to postpone products that they can't supply


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## xow (Oct 8, 2021)

Please god not the RF 35L


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## unfocused (Oct 8, 2021)

I find this a bit confusing and maybe it's just semantics. Are products being cancelled? Or are they just being put on hold and possibly revamped?

I find it hard to believe that once Canon has done all the market research, design and development work on a camera that they would simply cancel the product. That would indicate a pretty glaring failure of their research. 

Perhaps it's more a case of shelving certain products until supply chain issues are resolved and then revisiting them in light of changes that have occurred in the market.


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## amorse (Oct 8, 2021)

Here comes the panic! Time to guess which product we're each after was on the chopping block! Let the speculation begin!


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## privatebydesign (Oct 8, 2021)

Crop R camera?


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## amorse (Oct 8, 2021)

unfocused said:


> I find this a bit confusing and maybe it's just semantics. Are products being cancelled? Or are they just being put on hold and possibly revamped?
> 
> I find it hard to believe that once Canon has done all the market research, design and development work on a camera that they would simply cancel the product. That would indicate a pretty glaring failure of their research.
> 
> Perhaps it's more a case of shelving certain products until supply chain issues are resolved and then revisiting them in light of changes that have occurred in the market.


I would have guessed you were right. Put off some niche products until they can be reliably produced, then update whatever needs updating prior to release.

As an example, we've seen rumours of a high megapixel camera for ages, even before announcement of the R5. If that was indeed a different body in development which was put off to make room for the likely more in-demand R5, then whatever they planned to release may look long in the tooth if they don't think they can get it to maket until 2023. I could absolutely see a change in direction as some of these production issues persist.


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## privatebydesign (Oct 8, 2021)

amorse said:


> I would have guessed you were right. Put off some niche products until they can be reliably produced, then update whatever needs updating prior to release.
> 
> As an example, we've seen rumours of a high megapixel camera for ages, even before announcement of the R5. If that was indeed a different body in development which was put off to make room for the likely more in-demand R5, then whatever they planned to release may look long in the tooth if they don't think they can get it to maket until 2023. I could absolutely see a change in direction as some of these production issues persist.


I'd think from a corporate point of view Canon need to have an R1 and an R5C available even if just in limited quantities so people making system changing decisions do actually know what is out there. Things like the high mp R5s and crop R camera I wouldn't think would matter too much if they got delayed.


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## jolyonralph (Oct 8, 2021)

Bye bye EOS R5S


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## landon (Oct 8, 2021)

My guess. 
C90 delay: not ebough C70 being sold. 
C50 delay/cancelled: Back to the drawing board for better specs and/or to avoid friendly fire with the Komodo.


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## unfocused (Oct 8, 2021)

Looking at the lens roadmap that has been published on this site and thinking about rumored new bodies, I'd say that Canon is sitting in a pretty good position to hit the pause button if they need to. 

With five R bodies and all the core lenses released, most of what's being rumored or listed falls into the niche category. 

I can't see them rushing an R1 into production until they can gather sufficient feedback on the R3. They need to put sufficient space between the two models to make the R1 a compelling upgrade and I'm not sure two CFexpress slots and a different resolution alone are sufficient. 

The 500 and 800 big whites were never upgraded in the last EF cycle, which may say something about Canon's assessment of that market. 

I suspect we will see still see some releases in 2022, but at a slower pace and consumer grade products may be the priorities.


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## entoman (Oct 8, 2021)

amorse said:


> ....whatever they planned to release may look long in the tooth if they don't think they can get it to market until 2023.


Yes, that’s the likely logic behind thus move.

They’ve probably put some bodies on hold while they wait to see what Nikon and Sony release, and how they are received in the market (does anyone *really* want a 100MP FF camera when they could get a GFX100 instead?).

Although frustrating to buyers, it would make more sense commercially to concentrate on meeting the demand for more popular bodies and lenses, rather than push out the more niche stuff.


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 8, 2021)

entoman said:


> Although frustrating to buyers, it would make more sense commercially to concentrate on meeting the demand for more popular bodies and lenses, rather than push out the more niche stuff.


OTOH, the niche products can make a splash and since they're niche they won't strain production lines as much as new, popular products. With a lens like the new dual-fisheye, they can probably do a single small production run and that will last quite a while.


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## entoman (Oct 8, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> OTOH, the niche products can make a splash and since they're niche they won't strain production lines as much as new, popular products. With a lens like the new dual-fisheye, they can probably do a single small production run and that will last quite a while.


If it’s supply chain related, which seems highly probably, the products put on hold may well just be dictated by availability of specific chips.

Or maybe Canon are just trying to increase pent up demand for those products **


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## amorse (Oct 8, 2021)

entoman said:


> ... (does anyone *really* want a 100MP FF camera when they could get a GFX100 instead?)....


I do (though I can survive without either). I don't really want to rehash old discussions, but I'd definitely prefer a higher-resolution RF mount body to the GFX as I don't see Fuji catching up on lenses any time soon. I really want that RF 100-500 and I just don't see something like that becoming available for the Fuji GFX series in the near future. If Canon released something in the 60-100MP range and not outrageously more expensive than an R5, it would likely be my first preorder. 

With that said, I know I'm in limited company there and expect that the high resolution body would likely be one of the first to be delayed in the event of supply chain disruption.


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## unfocused (Oct 8, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> OTOH, the niche products can make a splash and since they're niche they won't strain production lines as much as new, popular products. With a lens like the new dual-fisheye, they can probably do a single small production run and that will last quite a while.


Yes, but there are niche products and then there are niche products. Things like the 16mm f2.8 and the dual fisheye are niche, but they are also innovative. The dual fisheye holds out the promise of selling more cameras to a new audience and the 16mm f2.8 is cheap and will probably generate a nice dependable little revenue stream at minimal cost. 

But, then there are niche products like a 35L and the 500 f4 that aren't going to generate a splash and aren't going to be big sellers. Same with all the tilt-shift lenses. Those are the kinds of niche products that can easily be put on hold.


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## amorse (Oct 8, 2021)

privatebydesign said:


> I'd think from a corporate point of view Canon need to have an R1 and an R5C available even if just in limited quantities so people making system changing decisions do actually know what is out there. Things like the high mp R5s and crop R camera I wouldn't think would matter too much if they got delayed.


I could see the crop R being a challenge actually - anything that would need to be produced in significant volume (especially if it's a narrow margin body, or not something that will move a lot of lenses) could be hard to manage in a shortage environment. With that said, that's assuming the crop R would be a volume mover (i.e. very price conscious product, or a somewhat price conscious weather-sealed sports shooter like a 7D series). But yeah, I would expect the R5s to be on the back-burner.


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## landscaper (Oct 8, 2021)

Hundreds of thousands of Canon users will jump ship to Sony A7X / A9 
and Fuji GFX models
if NO High Resolution R5S or RS Model is Launched in 2022 .

We've been waiting almost 7 years for this upgrade from the 5ds/5dsr

"As of March 2019 Sony has developed the IMX555cqr 
Full Frame 102 Megapixel Sensor with 6K 12 bit video with pixel binning mode , along with a unique high-speed digital readout for 16bit stills. 
Stills from the sensor are a mammoth 12288 x 8192 resolution. That’s 12K in video terms a super fast readout given the amount of data coming off the chip.
the sensor can do a 4096 x 2160 RGB 4:4:4 stream directly on-chip.
It’s speculated A75 or A9 stills camera using such a sensor will utilise this Cinema 4K mode as well as a 6K Video mode " 

Let's pray Canon has their new 
high resolution model well on the way 

My 60" x 90" + Prints could use the Resolution of a such a Sensor and its rumoured pixel shift technology 

Or perhaps Canon can Licence this Sensor from Sony like Nikon and many other brands do 

God Speed Canon !!!


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## t.linn (Oct 8, 2021)

Meanwhile, I'm wondering if the RF 28-70 F2 L has been cancelled since it has never appeared on Canon's list of supply-constrained lenses and yet remains missing in action since spring when I placed my order for it. (Yes, I'm being sarcastic. It is obviously still "available" since they just raised its price.)


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## Tidy Media (Oct 8, 2021)

xow said:


> Please god not the RF 35L


I just wanna complete the trio :'(


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 8, 2021)

landscaper said:


> Hundreds of thousands of Canon users will jump ship to Sony A7X / A9
> and Fuji GFX models
> if NO High Resolution R5S or RS Model is Launched in 2022 .
> 
> We've been waiting almost 7 years for this upgrade from the 5ds/5dsr


Lol. People have been predicting calamity for Canon on these forums since they've been around. Canon has led the ILC market for nearly two decades, and last year Canon gained more market share than Sony.

But hey, keep predicting doom for Canon. Maybe this time you're right...


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## unfocused (Oct 8, 2021)

landscaper said:


> Hundreds of thousands of Canon users will jump ship to Sony A7X / A9 and Fuji GFX models if NO High Resolution R5S or RS Model is Launched in 2022 .


I was waiting for @neuroanatomist to respond and I see I wasn't disappointed. Do you really think there are "hundreds of thousands" of people buying high resolution cameras?


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## amorse (Oct 8, 2021)

unfocused said:


> I was waiting for @neuroanatomist to respond and I see I wasn't disappointed. Do you really think there are "hundreds of thousands" of people buying high resolution cameras?


Hey, there are thousands if not hundreds of us


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## HenryL (Oct 8, 2021)

unfocused said:


> I find this a bit confusing and maybe it's just semantics. Are products being cancelled? Or are they just being put on hold and possibly revamped?
> 
> I find it hard to believe that once Canon has done all the market research, design and development work on a camera that they would simply cancel the product. That would indicate a pretty glaring failure of their research.
> 
> Perhaps it's more a case of shelving certain products until supply chain issues are resolved and then revisiting them in light of changes that have occurred in the market.


I, too, thought it odd to use the word "cancelled". After reading it again, I suspect you're on point with that last statement. It reads to me that lenses, having longer cycles, will likely continue mostly as planned. Camera bodies might be delayed (rather than cancelled), and "refreshed" to make sure specs are modern at time of release. Maybe trickle down tech from the R3 like eye-control focus or BSI sensor that might otherwise not have been in the original plan. I wouldn't expect drastic changes. Who knows...certainly not me!


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## unfocused (Oct 8, 2021)

HenryL said:


> ...Who knows...certainly not me!


Where would we be if we let ignorance stop us from taking part in this forum.


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## EOS 4 Life (Oct 8, 2021)

privatebydesign said:


> I'd think from a corporate point of view Canon need to have an R1 and an R5C available even if just in limited quantities so people making system changing decisions do actually know what is out there. Things like the high mp R5s and crop R camera I wouldn't think would matter too much if they got delayed.


I agree that an APS-C camera can't wait.
I am not so sure about the R5S


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## miketcool (Oct 8, 2021)

Canon is not the only company struggling with this. 

Hundreds of political leaders with no economic understanding made poor decisions over the past two years that will impact the next 5-10 in many unforeseen ways. I have turned my glass away from idyllic countryside scenes and focused on the day-to-day struggles around us. It's going to get darker before it gets better. Hope everyone is doing alright.


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## takesome1 (Oct 8, 2021)

As rumors go this one is extremely vague. 
Statements like "may have cancelled.." , "it looks like..." or "source said it’s likely..."
And were not really sure what these products might even be.

Has any one checked to see if the R3 has suddenly disappeared from the website and internal documents. I bet that would get 60 pages of posts really fast.


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## entoman (Oct 8, 2021)

miketcool said:


> I have turned my glass away from idyllic countryside scenes and focused on the day-to-day struggles around us. It's going to get darker before it gets better. Hope everyone is doing alright.


Yikes, you’re a real prophet of doom…

Get out there and enjoy yourself!


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## Pixel (Oct 8, 2021)

t.linn said:


> Meanwhile, I'm wondering if the RF 28-70 F2 L has been cancelled since it has never appeared on Canon's list of supply-constrained lenses and yet remains missing in action since spring when I placed my order for it. (Yes, I'm being sarcastic. It is obviously still "available" since they just raised its price.)


Fine, then mine will appreciate rather than depreciate.


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## unfocused (Oct 8, 2021)

t.linn said:


> Meanwhile, I'm wondering if the RF 28-70 F2 L has been cancelled since it has never appeared on Canon's list of supply-constrained lenses and yet remains missing in action since spring when I placed my order for it. (Yes, I'm being sarcastic. It is obviously still "available" since they just raised its price.)


It was in stock two hours ago at the Canon store, so keep hope alive.


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## unfocused (Oct 8, 2021)

miketcool said:


> Hundreds of political leaders with no economic understanding made poor decisions over the past two years that will impact the next 5-10 in many unforeseen ways...


I don't want to get into a political debate, but I do wonder who those hundreds of political leaders are and what poor economic decisions they've made in the past two years. An unexpected pandemic spread across the world. At the outset there was no cure, no effective treatments and no immunization from the virus. Today, there are several highly effective vaccinations available, in no small part due to political leaders who committed financial resources and offered incentives to companies to expedite research and testing. The medical community has developed a number of effective treatment programs that can mitigate the impact for many patients. The pandemic is still with us and it has disrupted supply chains and led to shortages in many areas, that have also been exacerbated by unforeseeable events.

At the same time, a worldwide financial meltdown has been prevented largely because of government spending. The stock market today is stronger than anyone expected it to be. Unemployment has been kept to a minimum despite the economic disruption of the pandemic. Thanks to the aggressive response of political leaders, the United States has, for the first time ever, established financial support for families that will lift hundreds of thousands of children out of poverty.

Across the western world, we are seeing governments and people finally taking the first tentative steps to acknowledge the systemic racism that has plagued us for centuries. 

That's not to say that there are not political leaders who have build their careers on divisiveness and bigotry. There are. And people need to reject those leaders.

But, the single biggest detriment to progress seems to me to be coming from individuals who buy into conspiracy theories and refuse to take modest steps like vaccination, out of some bizarre and flawed idea that they have a right to endanger and infect others. 

/RANT OVER


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## john1970 (Oct 8, 2021)

Interesting discussion, but not surprised at the delays and potential cancelations. We know there are two new ILCs coming in 2022 and I would also suspect 4-5 RF mount lenses as well. Personally, I hope that both a RF 35 mm 1.2 and RF 500 mm f4 are among them.


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## takesome1 (Oct 9, 2021)

unfocused said:


> I don't want to get into a political debate, but I do wonder who those hundreds of political leaders are and what poor economic decisions they've made in the past two years. An unexpected pandemic spread across the world. At the outset there was no cure, no effective treatments and no immunization from the virus.



My opinion is that politicians left, right, communist and capitalist botched the whole thing.
Politicians in general overreacted, ignored, underreacted, covered up, ignored science, ignored common sense because science didn't back it up, waited on science, and we still lack educating the public for what masks really do. All the shut downs were intended to slow the virus, but my own state didn't take that time to add ICU beds and now they are full again. At the start the government educating people and discouraging people to wear masks (out of fear of no masks for those on the first time not having a mask), I thought that one would be an easy one.

Most of the stimulus money was a big money grab. Certain industries were shut down that didn't need to be, others were left unchecked and their employees suffered due to lack of regulation.

In my opinion, *who are those hundreds of political leaders,* just about all of them. Thousands might be a better number.


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## privatebydesign (Oct 9, 2021)

EOS 4 Life said:


> I agree that an APS-C camera can't wait.
> I am not so sure about the R5S


I think you misunderstood me?

I think the crop R and the high resolution R5 (R5s?) could easily be delayed without any real impact on system viability. 

I also think Canon would prioritize getting an R1 and R5C in some peoples hands even if in only limited numbers to maintain interest and a competitive edge. The R1 already has the Sony A1 (MkII) and the Nikon Z9 effectively in the market space, and the Sony FX3 is in that R5C space. Leaving both those market segments without a model seems short sighted.


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## Skux (Oct 9, 2021)

RIP the retro-styled RP Mark II


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## fastprime (Oct 9, 2021)

t.linn said:


> Meanwhile, I'm wondering if the RF 28-70 F2 L has been cancelled since it has never appeared on Canon's list of supply-constrained lenses and yet remains missing in action since spring when I placed my order for it. (Yes, I'm being sarcastic. It is obviously still "available" since they just raised its price.)


Where'd you order from? Mine took about 2 weeks to ship when I decided to pull the trigger and order from Canon USA.


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 9, 2021)

unfocused said:


> I don't want to get into a political debate, but I do wonder who those hundreds of political leaders are and what poor economic decisions they've made in the past two years. An unexpected pandemic spread across the world. At the outset there was no cure, no effective treatments and no immunization from the virus. Today, there are several highly effective vaccinations available, in no small part due to political leaders who committed financial resources and offered incentives to companies to expedite research and testing. The medical community has developed a number of effective treatment programs that can mitigate the impact for many patients. The pandemic is still with us and it has disrupted supply chains and led to shortages in many areas, that have also been exacerbated by unforeseeable events.
> 
> At the same time, a worldwide financial meltdown has been prevented largely because of government spending. The stock market today is stronger than anyone expected it to be. Unemployment has been kept to a minimum despite the economic disruption of the pandemic. Thanks to the aggressive response of political leaders, the United States has, for the first time ever, established financial support for families that will lift hundreds of thousands of children out of poverty.
> 
> ...


The problem with managing a pandemic is finding the balance between limiting infection spread and limiting economic harm to individuals, states and nations. Just like camera design, everything is a compromise (As I keep reminding everyone!), and all decisions have consequences that we have to live with.

Looking at photography forums (not this one) where cashed up old men argue over lenses worth more than most people's monthly incomes, and complain that they need better $6K-$9K camera bodies with increasingly higher technical specs, one can be forgiven for thinking that we're not in the middle of a global pandemic where lots of people are suffering due to political and economic decisions.

I think the point miketcool was making was simply that the world is being affected by the global pandemic and it's impacting camera manufacturers, which don't operate in a vacuum. Car manufacturers have the same issue. Some of those companies foresaw the potential for semiconductor parts shortages, and stocked up. They're still putting out cars. Others made bad predictions, and now can't ship cars because of the semiconductor shortages. Looks like Canon's management tasked with ensuring supply chain continuity messed up, so no new toys for people with cash to splash in a time when many people are barely making ends meet, just to keep things in perspective!


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 9, 2021)

takesome1 said:


> My opinion is that politicians left, right, communist and capitalist botched the whole thing.
> Politicians in general overreacted, ignored, underreacted, covered up, ignored science, ignored common sense because science didn't back it up, waited on science, and we still lack educating the public for what masks really do. All the shut downs were intended to slow the virus, but my own state didn't take that time to add ICU beds and now they are full again. At the start the government educating people and discouraging people to wear masks (out of fear of no masks for those on the first time not having a mask), I thought that one would be an easy one.
> 
> Most of the stimulus money was a big money grab. Certain industries were shut down that didn't need to be, others were left unchecked and their employees suffered due to lack of regulation.
> ...


Just a minor point, the science was always there for masks, and many other things such as airborne virus transmission of other types of coronaviruses. You can look up the research journals and even the CDCs own material pre-COVID. Politics has been polluting the objectivity of science, and even WHO advice, by making a string of logically fallacious statements, one after another, that fail the rules of basic informal logical, let alone scientific scrutiny.

Next time you hear a political or a health authority utter the words "we have no evidence that...", listen to what follows. They used that argument to suggest that masks weren't needed by the public, and people were safe from airborne viral transmission! A lack of evidence doesn't mean anything more than "we don't know", so we can't conclude that something is safe or unsafe, works or doesn't, exists or doesn't exist! This logical fallacy is called _argumentum ad ignorantiam_ or the argument from ignorance.

Expect more of this, because science constantly revises its understanding when new information comes in, while politics is invested in unquestionable dogma! 

Back to the original topic, using the same argument, without evidence, we can't say whether certain cameras or lenses will be dropped, put on hold or just be delayed, all we can do is speculate based on limited evidence from rumour sources!

It would be a mistake to assume that every internal product release plan is set in stone. Canon can always reassess the changing market, and decide whether certain products or product lines are no longer viable or profitable.


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 9, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> Lol. People have been predicting calamity for Canon on these forums since they've been around. Canon has led the ILC market for nearly two decades, and last year Canon gained more market share than Sony.
> 
> But hey, keep predicting doom for Canon. Maybe this time you're right...
> 
> View attachment 200677


I think you're referring to the "Now Canon is *******" mantra of the Sony fanboy tribal group.


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## EricN (Oct 9, 2021)

fastprime said:


> Where'd you order from? Mine took about 2 weeks to ship when I decided to pull the trigger and order from Canon USA.


Same here


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## Bahrd (Oct 9, 2021)

privatebydesign said:


> Crop R camera?


Should the rumors follow the cancellation pattern or should they compensate for it?


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## koenkooi (Oct 9, 2021)

LogicExtremist said:


> [..]A lack of evidence doesn't mean anything more than we don't know, so we can't conclude that something is safe or unsafe, works or doesn't, exists or doesn't exist! This logical fallacy is called _argumentum ad ignorantiam_ or the argument from ignorance.[..]


To say in a more cutesy manner: Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.


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## John Wilde (Oct 9, 2021)

miketcool said:


> Hundreds of political leaders with no economic understanding made poor decisions over the past two years that will impact the next 5-10 in many unforeseen ways.


Political leaders didn't force companies to use just-in-time manufacturing, which makes companies more vulnerable to supply chain disruptions.


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 9, 2021)

John Wilde said:


> Political leaders didn't force companies to use just-in-time manufacturing, which makes companies more vulnerable to supply chain disruptions.


Many companies use just-in-time manufacturing, some just have better contingency planning than others, and Canon's not one of them!


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## john1970 (Oct 9, 2021)

privatebydesign said:


> I think you misunderstood me?
> 
> I think the crop R and the high resolution R5 (R5s?) could easily be delayed without any real impact on system viability.
> 
> I also think Canon would prioritize getting an R1 and R5C in some peoples hands even if in only limited numbers to maintain interest and a competitive edge. The R1 already has the Sony A1 (MkII) and the Nikon Z9 effectively in the market space, and the Sony FX3 is in that R5C space. Leaving both those market segments without a model seems short sighted.


Interesting hypothesis. It will be interesting to see which cameras Canon releases next. I suspect an entry level camera to replace R and RP and maybe a high-res R. I would not expect a R1 camera so shortly after a R3, but I strongly suspect a R1 announcement in 2023.


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## AJ (Oct 9, 2021)

These products are made with an alloy containing unobtainium. I hear it's in short supply.


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## cinemanimal (Oct 9, 2021)

I really hope the "low Volume" product to be released is the C700 II. Maybe a C900. Swing for the fences Canon and make a true flagship Cinema Camera.


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## jvillain (Oct 9, 2021)

takesome1 said:


> As rumors go this one is extremely vague.
> Statements like "may have cancelled.." , "it looks like..." or "source said it’s likely..."
> And were not really sure what these products might even be.
> 
> Has any one checked to see if the R3 has suddenly disappeared from the website and internal documents. I bet that would get 60 pages of posts really fast.


With out telling us what was cancelled this article is worthless beyond being able to point to it in the future and say rumor X was right but got nuked by the cancellations. See here is an article abut the cancellations.


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## ERHP (Oct 9, 2021)

In a somewhat related story, the last couple of days I've been talking with RRS about an order for work. Some tripod models have been discontinued but the only way to know is just not finding them on their site(or having an order cancelled). Ironically those are still listed on B&H, which was a good thing for comparing specs. Some of this is around realigning less popular models to focus production capability, some on parts, and others on shifting to what seems to be an even more versatile line, albeit at a slightly higher price point. If you do go on their site to just look around, you might notice most items are currently backordered.


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## dcm (Oct 9, 2021)

To summarize: some things that might have happened may happen later or not at all.


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## capa150 (Oct 9, 2021)

landon said:


> My guess.
> C90 delay: not ebough C70 being sold.
> C50 delay/cancelled: Back to the drawing board for better specs and/or to avoid friendly fire with the Komodo.


Dunno why Canon would care about Komodo sales. Canon and RED aren't on the same team.


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 10, 2021)

ERHP said:


> In a somewhat related story, the last couple of days I've been talking with RRS about an order for work. Some tripod models have been discontinued but the only way to know is just not finding them on their site(or having an order cancelled). Ironically those are still listed on B&H, which was a good thing for comparing specs. Some of this is around realigning less popular models to focus production capability, some on parts, and others on shifting to what seems to be an even more versatile line, albeit at a slightly higher price point. If you do go on their site to just look around, you might notice most items are currently backordered.


A couple of weeks ago I was checking to see if there were dedicated plates for the RF 100-500 or 70-200/2.8, and I noticed that nearly everything seemed to be out of stock.

There wasn’t anything dedicated for my two new lenses, just the L-85 lens plate (backordered like most items, but since those lenses replace my EF 70-300L and 70-200/2.8 IS II that I recently sold, I already have the plates).

I plan to email RRS. Although they’re clearly having supply issues (and they don’t make anything containing microchips), and designing new products may not be an active area for them now, I think they should make plates for the RF lens collars. The two that I have both have the machined hole for the standard anti-twist pin (typically found on camcorders), which obviates the need for the anti-twist tabs that don’t fit as well on the more curved back of the tripod foot. The RRS B-26 plate I have for my camcorder fits perfectly, but it’s short and there’s only one safety stop available.


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## ERHP (Oct 10, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> A couple of weeks ago I was checking to see if there were dedicated plates for the RF 100-500 or 70-200/2.8, and I noticed that nearly everything seemed to be out of stock.
> 
> There wasn’t anything dedicated for my two new lenses, just the L-85 lens plate (backordered like most items, but since those lenses replace my EF 70-300L and 70-200/2.8 IS II that I recently sold, I already have the plates).
> 
> I plan to email RRS. Although they’re clearly having supply issues (and they don’t make anything containing microchips), and designing new products may not be an active area for them now, I think they should make plates for the RF lens collars. The two that I have both have the machined hole for the standard anti-twist pin (typically found on camcorders), which obviates the need for the anti-twist tabs that don’t fit as well on the more curved back of the tripod foot. The RRS B-26 plate I have for my camcorder fits perfectly, but it’s short and there’s only one safety stop available.


I'm waiting for an answer back on replacement collars for the 100-500. The part I find interesting is the demand, based on what they have said, seems to be high and growing even while there is a huge economic mess happening worldwide. They moved from CA to UT in 2018, which was a good thing considering how they would have been deemed 'non-essential' by CA policies and shuttered or at least severely restricted when the COVID-19 policies were enacted last March.

Seeing people bash Canon for having supply issues when it seems to be affecting most, if not all, businesses that provide products is somewhat weird. New cars, car parts, tires, and a lot of new tech devices all seem to be in short supply.


----------



## kaihp (Oct 10, 2021)

ERHP said:


> Seeing people bash Canon for having supply issues when it seems to be affecting most, if not all, businesses that provide products is somewhat weird. New cars, car parts, tires, and a lot of new tech devices all seem to be in short supply.



I've heard that just raw aluminum and seat/pillow foam for sofas are in backlog on a worldwide scale. 

I've heard from a few contacts that manufacturing companies in China have been ordered to limit their energy consumption because there's not enough electricity for all as the grids are overloaded from the factories trying to catch up with the demand after the covid down-turn.

One contact said that the companies he was working with, that were normally running 24x7, were told to go down to 2-3-4 days a week. It's the worst energy rationing in 20+ years, apparently.

I have no idea if this is limited to certain areas or a widespread issue across China. 

The current problems does go to show how lean and hence vulnerable the global supply chains had become, simply because we got used to the extremely efficient global supply chain pre-covid. We simply didn't see this as a potential risk.


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## SnowMiku (Oct 10, 2021)

Perhaps the rumored RF APS-C and the entry level Full-Frame are on hold for now until they can get all the parts in and manufacture them in a timely manner, it will also give them time to catch up on the current lineup of cameras and lenses. This is a global issue that effects many different industries. It will get back to normal one day but it will just take time, maybe in a year? Or possibly even longer?


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## koenkooi (Oct 10, 2021)

SnowMiku said:


> Perhaps the rumored RF APS-C and the entry level Full-Frame are on hold for now until they can get all the parts in and manufacture them in a timely manner, it will also give them time to catch up on the current lineup of cameras and lenses. [..]


I hope they'll spend some time on improving the firmware as well, sharing improvements over all recent models. Seeing how delayed the announced updates have been (the Atomos V+ support earlier, now the VR support), the firmware team could use some extra people and a review of their process.


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## John Wilde (Oct 10, 2021)

My guess it that it's "postponed and redesigned" rather than "cancelled".


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 10, 2021)

ERHP said:


> I'm waiting for an answer back on replacement collars for the 100-500.


I’m curious, why a replacement collar? AFAIK, they’ve only done collars for a couple of Nikon lenses with poorly designed collars. I’ve been happy with my Canon lens collars. In addition to the included ones, I purchased the Canon collars for the 70-300L and the 100L macro. I do use the RRS replacement foot for my 600/4 II, but the collar itself is fine.

The RF collars do lack the detents at 90° intervals, is that the issue? I haven’t used the lenses on a tripod yet, may never do so with the 70-200/2.8, and the 100-500 might be used very rarely on a monopod. My main use for the collar is as an attachment point for my BlackRapid strap (connected to the lens plate with a Kirk 1” clamp LocTite’d to the strap lug).


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## AlanF (Oct 10, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> I’m curious, why a replacement collar? AFAIK, they’ve only done collars for a couple of Nikon lenses with poorly designed collars. I’ve been happy with my Canon lens collars. In addition to the included ones, I purchased the Canon collars for the 70-300L and the 100L macro. I do use the RRS replacement foot for my 600/4 II, but the collar itself is fine.
> 
> The RF collars do lack the detents at 90° intervals, is that the issue? I haven’t used the lenses on a tripod yet, may never do so with the 70-200/2.8, and the 100-500 might be used very rarely on a monopod. My main use for the collar is as an attachment point for my BlackRapid strap (connected to the lens plate with a Kirk 1” clamp LocTite’d to the strap lug).


I too use the collar of most lenses mainly for attaching to a BlackRapid. digigal reported early on a saga with a faulty collar for her 100-500mm and was unable to get it replaced, until Canon eventually replaced the whole lens.


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## ERHP (Oct 10, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> I’m curious, why a replacement collar? AFAIK, they’ve only done collars for a couple of Nikon lenses with poorly designed collars. I’ve been happy with my Canon lens collars. In addition to the included ones, I purchased the Canon collars for the 70-300L and the 100L macro. I do use the RRS replacement foot for my 600/4 II, but the collar itself is fine.
> 
> The RF collars do lack the detents at 90° intervals, is that the issue? I haven’t used the lenses on a tripod yet, may never do so with the 70-200/2.8, and the 100-500 might be used very rarely on a monopod. My main use for the collar is as an attachment point for my BlackRapid strap (connected to the lens plate with a Kirk 1” clamp LocTite’d to the strap lug).


Mainly to allow adding the Arca-Swiss mount to the foot without extra size/weight of a plate. With the 100-400 II it was a simple swap of the foot but with the 100-500 it is either add a plate or swap the entire collar/foot if that becomes available. I should state this is not necessarily for me but for work as I'm fine with a plate. Have a plate on my RF70-200 but have yet to use the 100-500 other than handheld. My user base will need to have the 100-500 on a tripod.


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 10, 2021)

ERHP said:


> Mainly to allow adding the Arca-Swiss mount to the foot without extra size/weight of a plate. With the 100-400 II it was a simple swap of the foot but with the 100-500 it is either add a plate or swap the entire collar/foot if that becomes available. I should state this is not necessarily for me but for work as I'm fine with a plate. Have a plate on my RF70-200 but have yet to use the 100-500 other than handheld. My user base will need to have the 100-500 on a tripod.


I hope they come through for you, but personally I doubt we’ll see replacement collars for RF lenses. The collars for the 100-500 and 70-200/2.8 are different (F III and E III, respectively), so RRS would need more than one design, whereas the feet on those collars are similar so I can see a market for a custom plate with the anti-twist pin. Actually, not much customization is needed at all – it would just need to be a longer version of the current B-26 plate with safety stops at both ends. Such a plate would work on the white RF lenses and on the RF 600/800 lenses as well (though a foot might be a better design choice for those, the plate would at least allow tripod mounting).


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## David - Sydney (Oct 10, 2021)

landscaper said:


> "As of March 2019 Sony has developed the IMX555cqr
> Full Frame 102 Megapixel Sensor with 6K 12 bit video with pixel binning mode , along with a unique high-speed digital readout for 16bit stills.
> Stills from the sensor are a mammoth 12288 x 8192 resolution. That’s 12K in video terms a super fast readout given the amount of data coming off the chip.
> the sensor can do a 4096 x 2160 RGB 4:4:4 stream directly on-chip.
> ...


I don't think that Canon will release a new body that doesn't have dual pixel AF. That feature alone provides better video AF than the rest of the market although I agree that a R5s is more likely a stills focussed camera rather than video.


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## David - Sydney (Oct 10, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> A couple of weeks ago I was checking to see if there were dedicated plates for the RF 100-500 or 70-200/2.8, and I noticed that nearly everything seemed to be out of stock.
> 
> There wasn’t anything dedicated for my two new lenses, just the L-85 lens plate (backordered like most items, but since those lenses replace my EF 70-300L and 70-200/2.8 IS II that I recently sold, I already have the plates).
> 
> I plan to email RRS. Although they’re clearly having supply issues (and they don’t make anything containing microchips), and designing new products may not be an active area for them now, I think they should make plates for the RF lens collars. The two that I have both have the machined hole for the standard anti-twist pin (typically found on camcorders), which obviates the need for the anti-twist tabs that don’t fit as well on the more curved back of the tripod foot. The RRS B-26 plate I have for my camcorder fits perfectly, but it’s short and there’s only one safety stop available.


Semiconductors aren't the only supply issue at the moment. Aluminium prices have soared 50% this year which would impact RRS
https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/b...nium-prices-have-soared-sky-high-7470071.html

Not to mention coal prices. China's decision last year to ban imports of Australian thermal coal for political reasons has bitten them badly and is one of the reasons for the lack of electricity generation capacity in China. China has a few problems at the moment especially with Evergrande's debt issues.


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## David - Sydney (Oct 10, 2021)

kaihp said:


> I've heard that just raw aluminum and seat/pillow foam for sofas are in backlog on a worldwide scale.
> 
> I've heard from a few contacts that manufacturing companies in China have been ordered to limit their energy consumption because there's not enough electricity for all as the grids are overloaded from the factories trying to catch up with the demand after the covid down-turn.
> 
> ...


There is a widespread issue for power generation capacity in China due to peaking thermal and coking coal prices and generators in China would make a loss ie input costs high and not able to pass on the costs. Industrial consumers will need to be allowed to pay more. Big consumers like aluminium smelting are being paused as China's increasing need for residential heating especially in the north east provinces coming into winter. The CCP will do anything to avoid widespread consumer unrest but are a hostage to raw commodity prices.

https://www.smh.com.au/business/com...d-a-global-energy-crunch-20210929-p58vox.html
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-09...-record-mining-steel-resources-jobs/100486198

Australia-China relations are at an all-time low but we are still a major exporter to them for raw materials. Petty import tariffs in some imports eg wine/lobsters haven't helped reduce the overall balance of trade in dollar terms. Iron ore prices have dropped a lot recently with China reducing demand but coal still represents ~60% of China's power generation. This will impact their GDP growth overall.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-01...ell-after-chinese-trade-restrictions/13090436


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 11, 2021)

David - Sydney said:


> There is a widespread issue for power generation capacity in China due to peaking thermal and coking coal prices and generators in China would make a loss ie input costs high and not able to pass on the costs. Industrial consumers will need to be allowed to pay more. Big consumers like aluminium smelting are being paused as China's increasing need for residential heating especially in the north east provinces coming into winter. The CCP will do anything to avoid widespread consumer unrest but are a hostage to raw commodity prices.
> 
> https://www.smh.com.au/business/com...d-a-global-energy-crunch-20210929-p58vox.html
> https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-09...-record-mining-steel-resources-jobs/100486198
> ...


Breaking news that explains everything! *[CR0 Rumor]*

The Chinese people will be okay, their government has promised every household a Canon R5 camera, with instructions to run it continuously in 8K video mode to heat their houses. They will also supply a solar charger for the LP-E6NH batteries, to take the demand off the power grid and make these heating systems totally sustainable!

The real reason that Canon is experiencing a shortage of parts, and is delaying pre-orders, is because they're using everything they have to make this record number of R5 cameras for the Chinese population! This will immediately make Canon the most popular brand in the world, and in exchange, every recipient of a camera will be required to take a single stock photo of a particular subject as instructed, which they will email, back to Canon.

Canon will put these images on the Chinese 500px website to build the largest repository of stock photos ever, and completely monopolize that industry. This will compensate for the decrease in profits due to the decline in the global camera market, and increase Canon's annual earnings back to previous levels and higher.

With new record profits, Canon will finally be able to act on the wish lists they've compiled from all the photography forums over the years, and build THAT camera. Yes, you know the one, the 200MP global shutter, quad-pixel auto-focus camera with 22EV dynamic range, 120FPS electronic shutter burst mode with no rolling shutter, no noise at ISO 256,000, with four memory cards, an EVF with no lag that looks just like an OVF but with all the extra info, and auto-composition AI so the camera does absolutely everything. This new camera will also utilize a scaled-down NASA satellite radioisotope power system with a battery life of at least 17 years, for continuous shooting requirements and long time lapse videos. It will also come with a USB 4 port for connecting a USB power bank in case of emergencies, such as a breach of the casing around the plutonium-238 dioxide fuel core.

Having revolutionized the camera industry, there will be so much money that Canon will buy the Sony camera division, and retail their products as Canon's new budget line, even it it's at a considerable loss. This would be purely out of principle, to troll the Sony fanboys who published all the nasty comment about them on forums over the last decade or so. After that, the camera world will return back to peaceful, harmonious state once again.

Now, that's such a visionary corporate strategy, that I could not possibly just make it up, so it must be true! So, please be patient with your pre-orders, the people in China need to stay warm over winter first, and to make it up to you, Canon will finally build THE ultimate camera, and end forum debates forever!


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## kaihp (Oct 11, 2021)

LogicExtremist said:


> Breaking news that explains everything! *[CR0 Rumor]*


I think you misspelled Humor.

@Canon Rumors Guy maybe be need a new CH0-CH3 scale for CanonHumor.


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 11, 2021)

kaihp said:


> I think you misspelled Humor.
> 
> @Canon Rumors Guy maybe be need a new CH0-CH3 scale for CanonHumor.


No, but I think you may have, it's spelled *humour* [ hyoo-mer ] _noun, verb_, there's a second 'u' in there in the English language, it rhymes with the the word 'rumour' which has similar spelling lol! 

Are you really doubting my CR0 rumour??? How could you! I'm shocked! Even Greta Thunderbird is saying "how dare you!" What part of it doesn't sound credible? It's as legit, and based on equal evidence as most of the discussion speculation about unreleased cameras, lenses, their specifications, and assumptions about what Canon is thinking, or should be doing as a company. It's a little more credible than the 'cargo cult' wish list making, so it should fit right in. When in Rome, do as the Romans do, as they say...


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## maulanawale (Oct 11, 2021)

Bit of a grumpy old man post:

Granted I assume Canon knows why and how they do things,
But IMO it'd look much better if they were consistent when it comes to the consequences of the industry shortages
As it stands, they're saying:
Unreleased products - delayed because "problems"
Just released products - delayed because you all want one 

It might have worked the first time someone did it, now it just looks like a futile attempt at creating hype and desirability.


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## koenkooi (Oct 11, 2021)

maulanawale said:


> Bit of a grumpy old man post:
> 
> Granted I assume Canon knows why and how they do things,
> But IMO it'd look much better if they were consistent when it comes to the consequences of the industry shortages
> ...


Ehm, Canon isn't saying anything about their unreleased products, CanonRumours is.


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## maulanawale (Oct 11, 2021)

koenkooi said:


> Ehm, Canon isn't saying anything about their unreleased products, CanonRumours is.


Correct, I shouldn't have said "they're saying", but more like, they're implying with this product cancellation.

Fact is, they're following the trend of claiming that newly released products are out of stock because of high demand, which although not a lie (demand is indeed higher than what they can manufacture at the moment) is not what most people would call the truth either. I understand it is a way to try and turn an unfavourable situation into a marketing stunt, but is not a trick you can use more than once without it looking obvious.


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 11, 2021)

maulanawale said:


> Fact is, they're following the trend of claiming that newly released products are out of stock because of high demand, which although not a lie (demand is indeed higher than what they can manufacture at the moment) is not what most people would call the truth either. I understand it is a way to try and turn an unfavourable situation into a marketing stunt, but is not a trick you can use more than once without it looking obvious.


My pre-order for the 600/4 was delayed due to ‘high demand’. That was the EF MkII version, and there was no pandemic and no microchip shortage in 2012.


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## maulanawale (Oct 11, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> My pre-order for the 600/4 was delayed due to ‘high demand’. That was the EF MkII version, and there was no pandemic and no microchip shortage in 2012.


Absolutely, I'm not saying high demand cannot be the cause for delays.
Specially for more niche products with very high price tags that not a lot of retailers would want gathering dust on a shelf. 
But this delays are affecting all sorts of products, of all levels and price ranges.

I'm talking about contorting the truth and instead of saying, "the demand is higher than our manufacturing capacity is at the moment due to X reason", saying "X product is out of stock because of high demand" sounds much better, and it is factual truth I'm not saying it isn't. But once you've seen Sony do it with the A1, Nikon with their just released consumer level lenses, etc, it simply sounds a bit lame at this point, because not all products are bestsellers they're just selling all the units of a decimated batch.


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## kaihp (Oct 11, 2021)

LogicExtremist said:


> No, but I think you may have, it's spelled *humour* [ hyoo-mer ] _noun, verb_, there's a second 'u' in there in the English language, it rhymes with the the word 'rumour' which has similar spelling lol!


I'm sorry. I'm used to use Simplified English on this board which is mostly visited by The Colonials, vs Traditional English like the True Mainland British.


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## unfocused (Oct 11, 2021)

kaihp said:


> I'm sorry. I'm used to use Simplified English on this board which is mostly visited by The Colonials, vs Traditional English like the True Mainland British.


Complicated by the fact that @Canon Rumors Guy is Canadian.


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## VicP83 (Oct 11, 2021)

xow said:


> Please god not the RF 35L


Last I checked it’s not on the road map. I wish it was.


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 11, 2021)

kaihp said:


> I'm sorry. I'm used to use Simplified English on this board which is mostly visited by The Colonials, vs Traditional English like the True Mainland British.


It's okay, you're forgiven, nobody's perfect! 
Mind you, you probably don't want to mention colonialism too loudly, it's not too popular these days in the English-speaking countries! 
Hope you realise this is all in jest...


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## AlanF (Oct 11, 2021)

unfocused said:


> Complicated by the fact that @Canon Rumors Guy is Canadian.


go to www.canonrumours.com and you will end up here as well. Canon Rumours Guy has it covered all ways. The Brits and the Commonwealth have a better sense of humour than the Yanks have humor.


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## JoseB (Oct 11, 2021)

kaihp said:


> I think you misspelled Humor.
> 
> @Canon Rumors Guy maybe be need a new CH0-CH3 scale for CanonHumor.


May be with a few drops of CH2-OH ...


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 11, 2021)

JoseB said:


> May be with a few drops of CH2-OH ...


–CH₂−OH is a methanediol subgroup, it cannot exist alone as a stable molecule. I suspect you mean CH₃−CH₂−OH, aka ethanol.


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 11, 2021)

JoseB said:


> May be with a few drops of CH2-OH ...


Guessing you mean CH ₃−CH ₂−OH, it does tend to help people lighten up and not be so uptight, especially in casual discussions about camera gear! Cheers, let's drink to that!


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 11, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> CH₂−OH is a methanediol subgroup, it cannot exist as a stable molecule. I suspect you mean CH₃−CH₂−OH, aka ethanol.


You beat me to it by a split second!


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 11, 2021)

JoseB said:


> May be with a few drops of CH2-OH ...


Best for people not to get their CH₃CH₂OH confused with CH₃COOH though when responding to things written in jest, the latter tends to stifle the sense of humour in forums, and imparts emotions similar to its taste!


----------



## neuroanatomist (Oct 11, 2021)

LogicExtremist said:


> Best for people not to get their CH₃CH₂OH confused with CH₃COOH though when responding to things written in jest, the latter tends to stifle the sense of humour in forums, and imparts emotions similar to its taste!


Better still to not confuse it with CH₃OH, because the liver enzyme that converts ethanol to acetaldehyde (which gives you the hangover headache) converts methanol to its corresponding aldehyde, namely formaldehyde (which has effects far more deleterious than a headache). A bit of vinegar isn’t so bad, especially when one is poaching eggs or dressing a salad.


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## JoseB (Oct 11, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> –CH₂−OH is a methanediol subgroup, it cannot exist alone as a stable molecule. I suspect you mean CH₃−CH₂−OH, aka ethanol.


Right!
My chemistry stoped more than 40 years ago!


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## SteveC (Oct 11, 2021)

JoseB said:


> Right!
> My chemistry stoped more than 40 years ago!



Wrong excuse. You SHOULD have said you made the mistake because of too much CH3CH2OH. (Sorry, can't find the subscript option.)


----------



## AlanF (Oct 11, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> Better still to not confuse it with CH₃OH, because the liver enzyme that converts ethanol to acetaldehyde (which gives you the hangover headache) converts methanol to its corresponding aldehyde, namely formaldehyde (which has effects far more deleterious than a headache). A bit of vinegar isn’t so bad, especially when one is poaching eggs or dressing a salad.


The enzyme that catalyses the reaction is very interesting in that the hydride transfer step has a contribution from quantum mechanical tunnelling.


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 12, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> Better still to not confuse it with CH₃OH, because the liver enzyme that converts ethanol to acetaldehyde (which gives you the hangover headache) converts methanol to its corresponding aldehyde, namely formaldehyde (which has effects far more deleterious than a headache). A bit of vinegar isn’t so bad, especially when one is poaching eggs or dressing a salad.


With formaldehyde on your poached eggs or salad, they'll never spoil, but flavour might not be so great, and there's the little issue that IARC would probably advise against it on the grounds of it being a group 1 human carcinogen. 

Interestingly, there's a drug used against alcohol abuse, disulfiram, which inhibits the enzyme acetaldehyde dehydrogenase that oxidizes acetaldehyde into acetate, causing a build-up of acetaldehyde. If you take it and then drink alcohol, the hangover comes in 5-10 min. Ouch!


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## takesome1 (Oct 12, 2021)

LogicExtremist said:


> With formaldehyde on your poached eggs or salad, they'll never spoil, but flavour might not be so great, and there's the little issue that IARC would probably advise against it on the grounds of it being a group 1 human carcinogen.
> 
> Interestingly, there's a drug used against alcohol abuse, disulfiram, which inhibits the enzyme acetaldehyde dehydrogenase that oxidizes acetaldehyde into acetate, causing a build-up of acetaldehyde. If you take it and then drink alcohol, the hangover comes in 5-10 min. Ouch!


_"A few new Canon products have been cancelled due to the supply chain issues"_​Someone that jumps in to this thread on page 4 will be completely confused.


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 12, 2021)

takesome1 said:


> _"A few new Canon products have been cancelled due to the supply chain issues"_​Someone that jumps in to this thread on page 4 will be completely confused.


Then I guess I shouldn't point out that technically, formaldehyde is a gas and it would be difficult to put on poached eggs or salad unless that gas is dissolved in water to create formalin (in which case it exists mainly as methanediol, CH₂(OH)₂). I say this as someone who has personally on many occasions heated paraformaldehyde (polymerized formaldehyde) powder in phosphate buffer to make neutral buffered formalin.


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 12, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> Then I guess I shouldn't point out that technically, formaldehyde is a gas and it would be difficult to put on poached eggs or salad unless that gas is dissolved in water to create formalin (in which case it exists mainly as methanediol, CH₂(OH)₂). I say this as someone who has personally on many occasions heated paraformaldehyde (polymerized formaldehyde) powder in phosphate buffer to make neutral buffered formalin.


Ah, perhaps, if you want to be really, really, really specific! I'm not, as we're really pushing it with the chemistry discussion of ethanol and related compounds in a photography gear rumour website!!! 

Fact is, both what you and I have mentioned are considered accepted usage.

From PubChem: "_Formaldehyde is a colorless poisonous gas synthesized by the oxidation of methanol and used as an antiseptic, disinfectant, histologic fixative, and general-purpose chemical reagent for laboratory applications. Formaldehyde is readily soluble in water and is commonly distributed as a 37% solution in water; formalin, a 10% solution of formaldehyde in water, is used as a disinfectant_..."

Most of the applications listed above appear to refer to aqueus solutions rather than use of the gaseous form.

On the PubChem Compound Summary page, the compound with the molecular formula CH₂O or H₂CO is listed with the following accepted synonyms: formaldehyde, formalin, methanal, paraformaldehyde, formol, and few more. https://pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/compound/formaldehyde

We're both right, depends how fine you like to split hair, for some, whole samples are sufficient, while others prefer to use a microtome! 

Thanks, I think we better get back to the topic of photography, hopefully our social service of promoting science education is well received!


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## LogicExtremist (Oct 12, 2021)

takesome1 said:


> _"A few new Canon products have been cancelled due to the supply chain issues"_​Someone that jumps in to this thread on page 4 will be completely confused.


Agreed, apologies for going off on a tangent, this thread is about why Canon isn't shipping various cameras and lenses.

Three reasons:

Global pandemic disrupting supply chains at various levels.
Bad contingency planning by Canon not foreseeing possible shortages and stocking up. Other companies, such as some auto manufacturers have and aren't as badly impacted.
Canon marketing capitalising on the shortages and delays to create a greater sense of demand, and urgency to purchase. This plays on the psychological 'fear of missing out', a well-used marketing ploy to drive up pre-orders. Speculation is they may also be intentionally delaying some releases for the same reason. 
I think that's all of it!


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## kaihp (Oct 12, 2021)

unfocused said:


> Complicated by the fact that @Canon Rumors Guy is Canadian.


They go under The Colonials as well, no matter how they spell ... ou parler canadien français


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## AlanF (Oct 12, 2021)

LogicExtremist said:


> ....
> 
> On the PubChem Compound Summary page, the compound with the molecular formula CH₂O or H₂CO is listed with the following accepted synonyms: formaldehyde, formalin, methanal, paraformaldehyde, formol, and few more. https://pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/compound/formaldehyde
> 
> We're both right, depends how fine you like to split hair, for some, whole samples are sufficient, while others prefer to use a microtome!


A most unfortunate use of metaphor of "split hair" when discussing formaldehyde. Aqueous formaldehyde is a protein cross-linking reagent, which will react with then protein keratin in hair, and is unfortunately used in some hair straightening procedures see: https://www.harpersbazaar.com/beauty/hair/advice/a1266/how-keratin-damages-hair/


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## amnesia0287 (Oct 12, 2021)

Seems to me like. They likely looked at the products they were planning and their ability to source components or alternates, and nothing cost effective worked, thus rather than just sitting and doing nothing and waiting to launch these products when they are out of date in a year or two but can finally be stocked, they are simply sending them back to the drawing board to more or less recreate the same product to launch in 1-2 years with the tech that will be available then. So for example they could consider finding an asic av1 encoder (though I dunno if one will be viable in time).

If they are for example having issues sourcing parts for R5, why would they wanna make anything that would share components.

it’s also possible they found a more cost effective way to implement the backlit sensor design from then R3 and decided it was worth iterating all their sensors rather than just waiting and releasing products they know won’t be competitive and will still struggle to be stocked to begin with.

As long as they don’t waste the time it ultimately means better cameras for us… eventually.


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## cayenne (Oct 12, 2021)

LogicExtremist said:


> With formaldehyde on your poached eggs or salad, they'll never spoil, but flavour might not be so great, and there's the little issue that IARC would probably advise against it on the grounds of it being a group 1 human carcinogen.
> 
> Interestingly, there's a drug used against alcohol abuse, disulfiram, which inhibits the enzyme acetaldehyde dehydrogenase that oxidizes acetaldehyde into acetate, causing a build-up of acetaldehyde. If you take it and then drink alcohol, the hangover comes in 5-10 min. Ouch!


Rehab is for quitters.


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## entoman (Oct 12, 2021)

LogicExtremist said:


> I think you're referring to the "Now Canon is *******" mantra of the Sony fanboy tribal group.


Canon is no longer “*******”, in fact since the announcement of the RF dual fish-eye, they are *domed*


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## stevelee (Oct 13, 2021)

unfocused said:


> Complicated by the fact that @Canon Rumors Guy is Canadian.


I’m still trying to figure out “Mainland British.” I’ve been to the UK a number of times, but never did find the mainland.


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## stevelee (Oct 13, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> Then I guess I shouldn't point out that technically, formaldehyde is a gas and it would be difficult to put on poached eggs or salad unless that gas is dissolved in water to create formalin (in which case it exists mainly as methanediol, CH₂(OH)₂). I say this as someone who has personally on many occasions heated paraformaldehyde (polymerized formaldehyde) powder in phosphate buffer to make neutral buffered formalin.


So if ants crawl over you food, will that act like a preservative?


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## maulanawale (Oct 14, 2021)

stevelee said:


> I’m still trying to figure out “Mainland British.” I’ve been to the UK a number of times, but never did find the mainland.


To add to that, I'm a foreign national (Spanish) living in the UK for almost a decade.
I used to think that there was such a thing as British English , then I lived in Northern England, then in the South, then in the middle. . . .
If there's a British way of speaking English, please tell the brits, cause in some areas you drive 10 miles and you're presented with a whole new world  

Funny-ish anecdote, I lived in Lancashire for Uni, I still remember asking someone where the bus stop was ( Bus pronounced /bʌs/) and it took us a few tries until he said, "Oh the Bus stop! (pronounced /bʊs/). That broke my confidence in that I know how to speak English forever


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## maulanawale (Oct 14, 2021)

takesome1 said:


> _"A few new Canon products have been cancelled due to the supply chain issues"_​Someone that jumps in to this thread on page 4 will be completely confused.


I haven't been in this site long, but even so, there are a handful of users that I'd love to have them sit in front of me, feed them beer, soft drinks and snacks, and let them talk for hours on end. So much knowledge about so many things! 
Canonrumors: Come for the rumours, stay for the organic chemistry, etymology, entomology, latin. . .


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## kaihp (Oct 14, 2021)

stevelee said:


> I’m still trying to figure out “Mainland British.” I’ve been to the UK a number of times, but never did find the mainland.


It's an in-joke based on Traditional Chinese script vs Simplified Chinese script, and how the Chinese differentiate on whether you're Hong Kong Chinese, Macau Chinese, Taiwan Chinese, or from mainland China.

If comparing to American English and British English, surely American English is the Simplified English, whereas British English is the Traditional English.


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## takesome1 (Oct 14, 2021)

maulanawale said:


> I haven't been in this site long, but even so, there are a handful of users that I'd love to have them sit in front of me, feed them beer, soft drinks and snacks, and let them talk for hours on end. So much knowledge about so many things!
> Canonrumors: Come for the rumours, stay for the organic chemistry, etymology, entomology, latin. . .


I wasn't sure if the thread had been highjacked or derailed. I just haven't researched the nuances of the two.
Considering they were discussing ethanol at one point I assumed it was "high"jacked.


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 14, 2021)

takesome1 said:


> I wasn't sure if the thread had been highjacked or derailed. I just haven't researched the nuances of the two.
> Considering they were discussing ethanol at one point I assumed it was "high"jacked.


Alcohol is a depressant, so does that mean the thread was LoJacked? We certainly use enough automobile analogies here...


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## Rocky (Oct 14, 2021)

I was once told that England speaks “Queen’s English”, New England speaks “King’s English”. Can someone verify this ??


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## takesome1 (Oct 14, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> Alcohol is a depressant, so does that mean the thread was LoJacked? We certainly use enough automobile analogies here...


Carful with the analogies, it is common knowledge Alcohol and Automobiles do no not mix.


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## takesome1 (Oct 14, 2021)

Rocky said:


> I was once told that England speaks “Queen’s English”, New England speaks “King’s English”. Can someone verify this ??


Starting with Monty Python I have watched many British sitcoms, and have watched the movie "The King's Speech". 
I am not sure either of those statements are true.


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 14, 2021)

Rocky said:


> I was once told that England speaks “Queen’s English”, New England speaks “King’s English”. Can someone verify this ??


New England speaks...well, I don't really know what to call it but it bears only a passing resemblance to the English I learned growing up in California. I'm generally good with thick accents – in science, I have many international colleagues and no issues understanding their heavily accented English (which is their second or even third language). However, when a local plumber, carpenter or Dunkin Donuts cashier is speaking, I sometimes have real trouble figuring out the meaning...and even more trouble translating it to written English.

Me: "Where is that store?"

Lifelong New England resident: "Ahhh, thaaahts ahhht tawahd wuhstah."

Me: "Can you write that down, please?"

Lifelong New England resident writes: "Oh, that's out toward Worcester."

Me:


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## stevelee (Oct 14, 2021)

neuroanatomist said:


> Lifelong New England resident: "Ahhh, thaaahts ahhht tawahd wuhstah."


In the ‘90s I moved to six miles from where my college roommate’s mother-in-law lived. She found out I was nearby and used to play a lot of bridge. She called me one day to see if I would be her partner at the duplicate games on my day off, so we played for several years. She was from Massachusetts but had married and moved to NC after WW II. She sounded to me as if she had never left New England. It was most obvious when she bid “fo’ hots.” She would go back to Massachusetts each August to visit friends and relatives and get out of our heat. People up there would kid her about her Southern accent she had acquired.


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## USMarineCorpsVet (Oct 15, 2021)

unfocused said:


> I don't want to get into a political debate, but I do wonder who those hundreds of political leaders are and what poor economic decisions they've made in the past two years. An unexpected pandemic spread across the world. At the outset there was no cure, no effective treatments and no immunization from the virus. Today, there are several highly effective vaccinations available, in no small part due to political leaders who committed financial resources and offered incentives to companies to expedite research and testing. The medical community has developed a number of effective treatment programs that can mitigate the impact for many patients. The pandemic is still with us and it has disrupted supply chains and led to shortages in many areas, that have also been exacerbated by unforeseeable events.
> 
> At the same time, a worldwide financial meltdown has been prevented largely because of government spending. The stock market today is stronger than anyone expected it to be. Unemployment has been kept to a minimum despite the economic disruption of the pandemic. Thanks to the aggressive response of political leaders, the United States has, for the first time ever, established financial support for families that will lift hundreds of thousands of children out of poverty.
> 
> ...


"I don't want to get into a political discussion...". Then don't! Most people come here to read about Canon Rumors and not some political propaganda.


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## GoldWing (Oct 18, 2021)

The Cinema products are now less competitive also. Blackmagic, RED, GoPro.... you can go on and on. 

Canon's loss to Nikon with the Z9 vs the R3... really puts a lot of pressure on the R1.

If I were Canon, I would drop the way too heavy video emphasis and concentrate on the R1 being a "Photographer's Camera"

They will need 80MP at 15fps to blow away the Z9


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 18, 2021)

GoldWing said:


> The Cinema products are now less competitive also. Blackmagic, RED, GoPro.... you can go on and on.


Haters gonna hate. Maybe your babble will have some significance if Canon starts losing market share to their competitors.



GoldWing said:


> Canon's loss to Nikon with the Z9 vs the R3...


What loss? Oh, you mean the one in your mind. No one really cares what goes on in there (if anything).


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