# Lens suggestions for 3 weeks trip to Egypt and Jordan



## minim2 (Oct 21, 2012)

Hi All,

I have been following canonrumors for few years now but first time registered today and my first post.

We are planning a 3 weeks trip to Egypt + Jordan (other than usual highlights like pyramids, luxor, petra etc... I am hoping for few days in desert too. both in egypt and in jordan).

I was rebel user (550D + 15-85 + some other lenses listed below), and recently upgraded myself to 5D II and currently own below lenses (550D and EFS lenses are sold)

24-105 (I bought it with 5DII as kit)
24 1.4 II
40 2.8 STM
50 1.4
85 1.8
70-300 L
+ I am hoping to add one ultra wide angle but haven't decided which one 

430 EX II + Yonguno trigger (I will carry this)

I am thoroughly confused about which lenses to carry... when I look at my china travel trip with 550D, most of pics were around 15mm.. so logically I may be using 24 mm more but not sure if it will enough for egypt/jordan too (on wide side + I never had anything wider than 15 mm on rebel).

I am currently confusing myself with below thoughts

1) sell my 24 1.4 II + 24-105 to fund 24-70 II.... carry it with 50 1.4
2) get 17-40 + 24 1.4 II and 85 1.8
3) 17-40, 24 1.4 II, 24-105

I am travelling with one small kid too... so dont want to carry more than 2-3 lenses + I assume egypt and jordan will be on bit dusty side.

I think I will gift one decent point and shoot (S110 or similar) to my wife before our trip anyways... so not sure if 24-105 will make sense or not.
Actually, so far I am not that impressed with 24-105... its good but not as good as my 15-85 which I sold (not 100% sure if it is consumer level camera settings which set default saturation etc more aggressive than model's like 5D II...I increased saturation level of my 5D II today, will spend few days and see how it works).

I know no-one can decide for me but your thoughts, comments and opinions will surely help me making up my mind.

Thanks,
Sid

PS: 70-300 L is a beautiful lens but with current state of affiar in egypt.. i will rather not carry any attention grabbing lens.


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## IIIHobbs (Oct 21, 2012)

Egypt will offer a variety of venues both wide and narrow. The 24-105 is a great all purpose lens, the kind of lens, if you only carry one, its the one to have.

I am surprised by your comments that the 15-85 on the Rebel performed better than the 24-105 on the 5DII. Technically speaking, this shouldn't be the case as the 24-105 is sharper. Focus adjust or lens adjust may be needed. 

That being said, the 17-40 performs similarly to the 24-105, but with quite a bit more vingeting on a FF body. Remember, the 18-85mm on your Rebel gave you an effective focal length of 28-135mm; the 24 should be plenty wide for what you are use to.

If you prefer to travel light and focus time with your family, take just the 24-105 and leave it on your camera (no dust). You could include the 50 1.4 for low light situations (interior/evening) as needed! but, the 50 1.4 is not weather sealed like the zoom. A good clear filter (like the B&W with MRC) for the 24-105 is worthwhile for added protection from the elements.


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## RC (Oct 21, 2012)

Don't sell any of your lens, get the 17-40 in a heartbeat or consider the 16-35 if you got the bucks. AFMA your 24-105 or send it in to Canon. 



IIIHobbs said:


> ...Remember, the 18-85mm on your Rebel gave you an effective focal length of 28-135mm; the 24 should be plenty wide for what you are use to....


15-85 is 24-136 FF equivalent. You will love widening out to 17 or 16 from your current limit of 24. Enjoy, stay safe.


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## candyman (Oct 21, 2012)

Besides focal length think about weatherconditions. I would take weather sealed/resistent lenses. There is a lot of sanddust (it can appear fast). Next to the sea you will have saltwater in the wind.


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## RC (Oct 21, 2012)

candyman said:


> Besides focal length think about weatherconditions. I would take weather sealed/resistent lenses. There is a lot of sanddust (it can appear fast). Next to the sea you will have saltwater in the wind.


Excellent point. Both the 17-40 and 16-35 require a filter to complete the weather sealing.


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## sanj (Oct 21, 2012)

Same as Mr. Hobbs. Ditto.


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## minim2 (Oct 22, 2012)

Thanks All for your replies.

First time I asked for suggestions on forum and I can say (at least in my case), it helps a lot...
After reading your comments, suddenly I stopped even thinking about 24-70 II..... that's one pricey lens after all !!!

On my 550D, I use to love my 15-85 a lot...and I am expecting similar or better performance from 24-105... I dropped it to canon service today along with 5D II. 

Now, I am thinking to keep an eye on good deal for used 17-40 or 16-35 II ..

Thanks,
Sid


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## Imagination_landB (Oct 22, 2012)

minim2 said:


> Now, I am thinking to keep an eye on good deal for used 17-40 or 16-35 II ..


There's a used 16-35 on BH or Canon store carry refurbished ones. At least there were some today.


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## Ew (Oct 22, 2012)

There is also the wonderful Tokina 11-16 2.8, which on a FF will work as a 15-16mm - effectively providing a relatively low cost fast UWA prime.


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## Tjarko (Oct 22, 2012)

After my experience in Egypt i would take at least the 24 and 50 1.4 prime lenses. in the monuments they don't allow u to use flash. and the fast lenses will help u a lot.


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## Rob (Oct 22, 2012)

Take your 24-105 & either the 50 or 85. I would probably take the 85 for some candid portraits of the locals with some nice bokeh!


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## wickidwombat (Oct 22, 2012)

my 2c

since I love the 16-35L II (last time i was in china i think 90% of my shots were with this lens
I say get that, it is considerably better than the 17-40 IMO and the extra stop is usefull inside lots of the buildings take the 50 f1.4
and take the 70-300L along in case you want it ie from a balloon ride over the valley of the kings or shooting while cruising down the nile (i highly recomend this tour BTW) its light and relatively compact.

with those lenses you will have everything covered but the 16-35 or 50 will be your most used lenses
and the few times you want the reach of the 70-300 you will be glad its there just keep it in the bag until you need it then its not grabbing much attention.


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## Marsu42 (Oct 22, 2012)

wickidwombat said:


> and the few times you want the reach of the 70-300 you will be glad its there just keep it in the bag until you need it then its not grabbing much attention.



I taped mine w/ black tape, looks way cheaper now and less white, you might want to do the same - and it protects the white paint from scratches as an added bonus.

It's just as it been said before - usually you'll want an ultrawide (standing inside a temple or close in front of a pyramid , tight-spaced local markets) and a tele for far-in-between shots. I'd say the 17-40 + 70-300 + the 50/1.4 for very low light indoor shots. Then you can just choose one zoom according to the occasion and mostly stick to it, you don't want to switch lenses in dusty or crowded places. And bring a sensor cleaning kit! And a mini travel-tripod.



minim2 said:


> We are planning a 3 weeks trip to Egypt + Jordan (other than usual highlights like pyramids, luxor, petra etc... I am hoping for few days in desert too. both in egypt and in jordan).



If you're going not now but next summer you might think about giving your wife a Rebel instead of a p&s so you can share lenses and - most important - you have an eos backup if one fails. This happened to me in the middle of my Egypt trip in Assuan, it's just been too hot, the camera couldn't take it - very frustrating experience.



Rob said:


> I would probably take the 85 for some candid portraits of the locals with some nice bokeh!



And remember to have enough $$$ around for baksish, the locals won't understand if someone with a big camera isn't giving away lots of tips, that's the tradition and the local social security system! Personally, I found taking portraits extremely annoying, so I preferred sticking to columns and temples that don't bug you to buy a talisman.


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## AmbientLight (Oct 22, 2012)

Doing portraits of locals in Egypt may be a really weird endeavour, because in case you are a tourist visiting tourist areas only, you will only see people working in the tourism industry, but no normal folk at all.

You will need to get away from those tightly secured, separated tourist areas and then oh wonder, people will suddenly not be eager to sell you any souvenirs.

You better stick to taking photos of temples unless you want to completely jump out of the touristic routine to see the other and quite large part of Egypt.

My lens suggestions would be:
8-15mm fisheye zoom, 14mm f2.8 prime, 24mm f1.4 prime, 16-35 f2.8 zoom

The previous recommendation for fast lenses is quite important. You will definitely need a low-light wide angle combination.

Ah and when I am at it: When in Egypt, you should rent a sailing boat for a cruise on the Nile, at best in the evening and with some authentic food.


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## Marsu42 (Oct 22, 2012)

AmbientLight said:


> You will need to get away from those tightly secured, separated tourist areas and then oh wonder, people will suddenly not be eager to sell you any souvenirs.



That's true - they might want to tell you their strong opinion about America and criticism of their prophet in a very close and personal way. Arguing that official western policy is not necessarily what you think won't do you any good.

I know people who grew up in Egypt and still have western as well as local friends there - even they wouldn't want to take a lucky hike into really local areas right now, manners have changed when terrorism started about 5 years ago and the Egyptian state reinforced oppression, resulting in the recent uprisings.


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## albron00 (Oct 22, 2012)

I guess you should make a place in your gear bag for Kalashnikov as well 8)


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## Cosk (Oct 22, 2012)

You need something very wide, and very fast... inside the temples and tombs, things are very big, there isn't much space, and there are a lot of people. If you have the widest lens in the tomb, you get to step in front of everyone and get a shot without any other people, while everyone else with a point and shoot is fighting to back up as much as possible. 

Also flashes are not allowed... so you want fast

I spent a month in Jordan and Egypt, with a sigma 12-24mm f4.5-5.6 on a full-frame, and that focal length worked like a dream. I did wish it was faster... and I wasn't happy with the build. 

I no longer have that Sigma, and replaced it with the 17-40... which is tougher but not nearly as wide... and every mm of width matters when you're in a tomb. If I were to do that trip again, I would personally be debating between the 16-35 and the 14/2.8 prime, or even getting that sigma lens again.


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## Marsu42 (Oct 22, 2012)

Cosk said:


> Also flashes are not allowed... so you want fast



But even then, a f2.8 lens (w/o IS) might not be enough for handheld shots because some tombs are *really* dark for the same reason no flashes are allowed. When I was in Egypt it wasn't so crowded and I often had time to do shots with my mini-tropod or simply put the camera onto a towel on some railing or something else. This way, you can also do hdr shots if the lighting is very uneven so the dynamic range of one shot is not enough.



albron00 said:


> I guess you should make a place in your gear bag for Kalashnikov as well 8)



Absolutely - the locals might put it to good use after they mugged the op  !

But really, since the op was asking about real life advice here, I'd like to point out that this a serious matter and taking a stroll with his family (including the woman, maybe in non-compliant clothes) with the camera gear into unprotected, local suburbs to get good shots of real life imho is an extremely stupid idea.


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## willis (Oct 22, 2012)

I would personally take:
-Wide angle (16-35L II or 17-40L)
-Telezoom (70-200L II or 70-300L)
-Walk-around (24-105L)


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## ender78 (Oct 22, 2012)

I took the Mark II and 24-105 and 17-40 with me when I visited Egypt two years ago. The 24-105 was likely used for almost all my shots save a few taken with the 17-40. If you decide to take a camel ride around the pyramids, dont even think of bringing the SLR. The walk of the camel is about as stable as that of the back of a bucking bronco and you need to need to hold on the the saddle to protect your um .. equipment. 

Dust can be really bad. We had a sandstorm hit at Sakkara so I was glad to not have the camera with me.

It is very dark in the temples as stated by others. You'll want to push the ISO as far as you're comfortable and then push it another stop or two. Failure to comply with flash or tripod regulations may result in confiscation of equipment [and dont expect to get it back, the guard may not actually turn it in but just keep it].


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## AmbientLight (Oct 22, 2012)

Please note that when I pointed at the opportunity to exit the tourist areas this was not to induce someone to act in any way that would provoke unrest or general unfriendly reactions from locals. Instead I wanted to guide you to some of the really beautiful contemporary spots in Egypt, where locals would hang out. Yes, I have been there several times and I have a good number of Egyptian friends.

Generally your risk of becoming another victim of a terrorist attack drops severely once you have moved outside tourist areas, which are obvious targets. Your second best chance for becoming a victim may be Coptic churches, of which there are plenty. Nevertheless I recommend going there as these are really interesting, if you are into Christian culture.

In case you adapt to reasonable, acceptable behaviour and do not act in a way completely ignorant of local culture you will have a fun time and no trouble whatsoever.

Of course as Marsu correctly stated if you buy into what some of the western media present about the Arab world  and go arguing that with local residents :-[ they will not be likely to react friendly any longer. There are limits to what people may put up with.


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## pardus (Oct 22, 2012)

Check out this amazing footage shot of Egypt / Lebanon Montage on Vimeo shot by Khalid Mohtaseb in Egypt and lebanon on a 5D mark ii *edit. video might have embed turned off but click the link above to view.

Inspirational footage to say the least. You didn't indicate that you were shooting video but any of these clips/locations would make a truly fantastic still. He has a few threads up that he talks about his gear and his experience shooting there off the beaten path. Some good advice there and discussion. There was another thread on it too but can't seem to find it in my bookmarks. http://www.cinema5d.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=6205&p=43411#p43411


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## Marsu42 (Oct 22, 2012)

AmbientLight said:


> Yes, I have been there several times and I have a good number of Egyptian friends.



Well (*knock on wood*) I hope you're correct for the op's sake - because I remember some situations (well, it was not Egypt but Palestina) where the local youths didn't exactly care if you behave decently or not, apparently being rich (i.e. everyone by their standards) and western was sufficient to make us feel happy once we were out of there.


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## mrsfotografie (Oct 22, 2012)

Whatever you do, go weather sealed on your zooms (that would otherwise suck dust in). Invaluable as I discovered recently in Rajasthan India (desert region) where my 24-105 performed beautifully when I got caught in a dust storm. 

On a previous trip to Oman and UAE I took my 24-70 L, but to be honest there's little need for an f/2.8 lens in these places with plenty of sunshine. The longer reach of the 24-105 is preferred especially as some people in these countries tend to be a little camera shy.

Take that 40 2.8 STM for indoor/night/soukh (market) use. It's nice and small and with a MkII, f/2.8 will do just fine.

No tele needed, esp if you bring the 24-105.

By the way my 24-105 is definitely sharper than my 24-70.


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## CharlieB (Oct 23, 2012)

Personally....

If I couldn't do it all with the 24-105L with its IS... and a small flash, it probably not worth doing.
Sometimes... just sometimes, you might be in a place that requires a long lens. But it doesn't sound like that sort of trip. American West, Africa... wildlife, birds, etc.... sure. Mideast... unless you're going specifically for the aforementioned.


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## Bosman (Oct 23, 2012)

The pyramids deserve the 24LII! The 40 would be perfect for travel you don't give up on image quality but on weight. If you add a third i'd do the 85. Most ranges are covered and the results, god If i could take my 24L there and shoot!


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## minim2 (Oct 23, 2012)

Thanks all for your replies, I will split mine in two (camera+lens and egypt)

I am going in mid Jan so I have little more than 2 months.

About camera and lenses :

-> Based on everyone's reply I am not even thinking about 24-70 II... and that means 70% of my problem solved... for some strange itchiness, I think I was bending towards that direction earlier... but it does not make sense to me now.

-> I am currently based out in Hong Kong so BH may not be a good option and refurb lenses it seems are not available here . Over here, used market is pretty active but most of those forums are in chinese and not expat friendly (translation in english )... but I am taking help of local friends.. so hope to find a good deal.

So Far, below is what I am thinking :-

5D II
24-105 (hope it will be upto its reputation once back from canon service)
24 1.4 II or 50 1.4 or both (confusion stays)
17-40 or 16-35 II (not confusion but I intend to buy used one and whichever comes first.. If 17-40 then I think I will carry my 24 1.4 II, though I am trying to follow 16-35 II ads first)
70-300 -- Not sure about this one.. if 24-105 continue to disappoint me then I will leave that behind and carry this instead... making it look cheap with tape is a good idea indeed  

430 EX II - wont carry this inside monuments, its not allowed anyways. It's more for other occasions. 

S110 or S100 or xyz - gift to my wife (I tried sticking my old trusty 550D+15-85 in her hand earlier...but boy... getting engineering degree was easier...her only interest in photography is how good she looks in a photo 

* Good suggestions on weather sealing...other than 50 1.4 others are weather sealed with filter so I should be fine I think (if changing lenses kept to minimum).
* I will read some articles and go through videos on cleaning sensors etc.. have never done myself.


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## minim2 (Oct 23, 2012)

Bosman said:


> The pyramids deserve the 24LII! The 40 would be perfect for travel you don't give up on image quality but on weight. If you add a third i'd do the 85. Most ranges are covered and the results, god If i could take my 24L there and shoot!



Thanks. I am leaning towards 24 1.4 II... I have started to think this way ... Which one I may miss/regret more.
esp due to
inside monuments where flash is not allowed
sound and light shows in pyramids, abu simbel and luxor
overnight stays in deserts and night sky..


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## minim2 (Oct 23, 2012)

Since there are some interesting feedbacks and comments on egypt travel, I thought I will try to summarize what I intend to do in egypt… please feel free to comment as that will help me in planning if I have not taken that into consideration 

* I have two separate tickets booked.. one return ticket to Amman from HK and then second one is Amman to egypt cities and return.
This way if something unforeseen happens in egypt, I will cancel my second phase and will book myself to turkey or some other place close by… on in worst case enjoy wadi rum and jordan more.

* I have good travel insurance covering egypt trip cancellation due to unrest or if govt raises the warning level to egypt etc. + All my bookings can be cancelled without any penalty if cancelled before 48 hours including air tickets (well for air ticket I will be losing around 1100 HKD which is 100 sh USD.. which should be fine and even easier to claim from travel insurance).

* I was reading forums for last three months and it seems most of issues happens around demonstration which happens after fridays prayers. I am not staying in cairo on any of fridays and other than that obviously will be avoid any kind of demonstration, other than that it seems life is as usual in Egypt (as per their standards).

* I generally try to rough things out but this time I am making an exception… cannot take chances esp with family. After spending lot of time on tripadvisor, I have found some highly recommended guides for cairo and luxor (those who does not cost an arm and a leg).
Hopefully this will save me from some hassle and from touts as well.

* Yes I want to do nile cruise, luxor temples, cairo, abu simbel etc… but one place I am really looking forward to is
White Desert, Black Desert, Sea of Sand … I am planning 4 nights in this area… this is the only off beaten track I am willing to take.
More I read about these places, more I want to go there… Most of problems in remote areas are happening around Sinai (which is western side) and these areas are on eastern desert so hope this should be fine… still trying to figure it out though.

We always wanted to go to Egypt and planned and cancelled it few times earlier.. hope things will work out this time.


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## akclimber (Oct 23, 2012)

Is it too off base to suggest renting, borrowing or maybe even buying an M4/3s or other smallish, high quality combo that will attract less attention, be easier to carry and produce really nice images? I'm only suggesting this because I'm struggling with much the same issue with a non photo centric trip to Iceland/Belgium in the spring and I keep thinking I don't want to lug my 5D3 or D800 with me. An M4/3s or similar system is an attractive travel option.

Anyway, if you're set on taking the 5D2, I'd take my 24-105 or rent a 28-300L and call it good. It seems the 24-105 has some serious copy/expectation variation. I love mine on the 5D2 and 5D3 but others hate it or are kinda unimpressed. Go figure. The 28-300L would be a do it all lens that could stay on your body and not let dust in but it's heavy and would attract attention. That said, I'd suggest that carrying a DLSR and changing lenses would also attract attention.  I guess another thought is to take your 24 and 85 and call it a day. That'd be a light, useful and manageable combo as well.

Good luck, be safe & have fun on your trip!


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## Marsu42 (Oct 23, 2012)

minim2 said:


> * Yes I want to do nile cruise, luxor temples, cairo, abu simbel etc… but one place I am really looking forward to is White Desert, Black Desert, Sea of Sand … I am planning 4 nights in this area… this is the only off beaten track I am willing to take.



Good research, I'm sure you'll have a great time if you're careful like that. Egyptians are very nice and hospitable people, it's just that under the current circumstances you simply wouldn't want to meet some on their way home after the big prayer. 

Except for the usual temples/pyramids and a Nile cruse for the family (booooring!) I also liked the desert best, less tourists there (well, except us ) but here it really won't hurt to have a micro travel tripod around - place it on one large boulder and take hdr pictures @iso100 at dawn or sunset w/o putting your camera too near the dusty ground.

Plus it's smart to get a good guide, and to read something a bit about Egypt culture and religion before going - otherwise every temple is like a blur ("And here we have another row of columns and another wall of hieroglyphs...). 

And as you surely know don't drink anything with ice cubes and be sure to have every bottle opened for the first time before your very own eyes, or it'll be a short trip esp. with three people the probability is 3x larger for someone to catch it :->


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## AmbientLight (Oct 23, 2012)

Considering the choice of bringing the 50mm f1.4 or not, perhaps it helps, if I list what gear I will bring for my next trip to Egypt:
1D-X, 5D Mark III
14mm f2.8
24mm f1.4
50mm f1.2
85mm f1.2

The only thing I would be missing with this setup is a tripod. It is a good thing to bring for night time shots outside of the usual temples and such, when you might want a rather small aperture. During my last visit to Egypt I managed to loan a tripod from a local photographer, so that helped me out, when I needed it.


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