# 5d4 soft images/af issue



## jeanluc (Oct 7, 2016)

Hi

I just got my 5d4, and tried it out side by side with my 5d3. I was surprised to see the 5d3 was markedly sharper.

So I thought this must be a afma issue. I set up afma (Spyder lens cal) and tried it out.

I shot with the regular AF, and then using af with live view ......the live view images are razor sharp, the regular af ones are not.

Any ideas?


Thanks!


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 8, 2016)

I always bolt my new cameras to a well anchored light table and tether them to my computer, then carefully taking photos. They have always been razor sharp. If subsequent photos are not sharp, I know who to blame and correct my technique. It took me some effort when the original 7D came out, I had to use faster shutter speeds with the high pixel count and it turned out I was using the wrong settings.

If your camera will not take sharp images when carefully mounted to a sturdy tripod using liveview and a fast shutter speed, it might have a problem.

Why not post links to a full sized raw image with exif intact, you might gain some insight.


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## KeithBreazeal (Oct 8, 2016)

I'm not seeing any problems and most of my shooting is high speed subjects. 



CCA 2016 Mike Wiskus knife edge ribbons 8609 © Keith Breazeal by Keith Breazeal, on Flickr



CCA 2016 CF-18 Hornet approach 6341 © Keith Breazeal by Keith Breazeal, on Flickr



CCA 2016 CF-18 demo 7365 © Keith Breazeal by Keith Breazeal, on Flickr



CCA 2016 Blkues field light 0211 © Keith Breazeal by Keith Breazeal, on Flickr


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## jeanluc (Oct 8, 2016)

Nice shots.

So I called Canon, and they told me that since the camera is focusing well with the sensor, ie. live view but not with regular AF, that there is likely a problem with the AF assist system, and it needs to go back........

This is hopefully just a random thing.

Now I get to see how B and H returns work.

Too bad, since the camera is great. the touch screen is very well done, and I must say the dual pixel AF in live view is a ,lot better that on previous models.

If anybody is having "soft issues" with their new 5d4, check this to see if you are having the same issue.


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## turtle (Oct 10, 2016)

Did you do AF Micro Adjust?

Sounds to me like its almost certain that you just needed to do some adjustment for the lenses you own so everything is pixel perfect when using regular AF and not the live view. This is entirely normal.



jeanluc said:


> Nice shots.
> 
> So I called Canon, and they told me that since the camera is focusing well with the sensor, ie. live view but not with regular AF, that there is likely a problem with the AF assist system, and it needs to go back........
> 
> ...


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 10, 2016)

turtle said:


> Did you do AF Micro Adjust?
> 
> Sounds to me like its almost certain that you just needed to do some adjustment for the lenses you own so everything is pixel perfect when using regular AF and not the live view. This is entirely normal.
> 
> ...



His original post says he did a AFMA!


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## jeanluc (Oct 11, 2016)

I sure did...first thing I tried...set up my spyder 
Lenscal and the image was best right at the main target point, and by 
this I mean quite soft. The image got worse symmetrically both in front and behind the targeted plane.
In other words it was soft everywhere, but best at the target, indicating no front or
back focusing.

If afma was out, I'd expect to see it sharp somewhere in front or back of the targeted plane...


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## turtle (Oct 11, 2016)

This is very strange indeed. Do you see the same when shooting normal scenes at normal distance in brighter outdoor light (i.e. higher shutter speeds)?

It might otherwise sound like a vibration issue, with the use of regular AF and a moving first curtain causing vibration, but seeing as the new shutter is known to produce less vibration than the 5D III shutter, that would not make sense.

If you have not done so, I would compare in bright light and so higher shutter speeds and see if the issue is still there.



jeanluc said:


> I sure did...first thing I tried...set up my spyder
> Lenscal and the image was best right at the main target point, and by
> this I mean quite soft. The image got worse symmetrically both in front and behind the targeted plane.
> In other words it was soft everywhere, but best at the target, indicating no front or
> ...


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## Valvebounce (Oct 12, 2016)

Hi Jeanluc. 
I'm curious, based on your previous reply, did you get a replacement camera? Is it ok? How did B&H returns work out? 

Cheers, Graham. 



jeanluc said:


> Nice shots.
> 
> So I called Canon, and they told me that since the camera is focusing well with the sensor, ie. live view but not with regular AF, that there is likely a problem with the AF assist system, and it needs to go back........
> 
> ...


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## jeanluc (Oct 12, 2016)

Hi all

I sure did try it out in "real" light.....set it up on a tripod out of the wind and did my "brick wall test"...first shot the 5d3 with same lens, same exposure etc all with 2 sec timer delay like I use in the field all the time, then the same setup with 5d4.

When I uploaded the images, the 5d4 was just slightly out of focus. So I thought, it's got to be vibration etc. so I retried it. Sure enough, still not looking good.

So then I thought it's got to be an AFMA issue. I set up my AFMA apparatus and tried. Still soft. The interesting thing was that the entire focal range was slightly blurry, but it was "clearest" on the marker indicating that the lens was not focussing either in front or behind the target, ie it actually seemed to be "on the mark".

Then I tried this again using live-view focusing. Razor sharp. 

That's when I ran out of experience and knowledge and posted here. Also called Canon, tried a few things with AF settings but this did not help.

So now camera is on road back to NY....B and H was awesome to deal with, no problems at all....but with the holiday, I doubt I'll see a new one for a couple of weeks. 

Too bad, since I will be in Yosemite all next week and Great Smoky Mountains the week after. I was really looking forward to shooting the 5d4 on these trips.

Luckily my 5d3 won't stop taking good pictures just because the new one's out. 

I almost went with the 5DSR...........maybe I should have. But the touch screen on the 5d4 rocks, and the AF using Live View does too.


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## turtle (Oct 14, 2016)

Sometimes these things are a total mystery. I had one with Eos 3 film bodies and the 85mm f1.8 EF. Neither of the two bodies I had in Afghanistan would focus accurately with either 85mm f1.8 I bought. I tried one lens, got a replacement and it was the same. What's odd is that focus was perfect through the viewfinder, but miles out on film as distance grew. The greater the focus distance, the greater the error and by 5m it was about 3m out! At minimum focus, it was fairly accurate. At, say, 3-5m the error was so huge that even stopping right down could not account for the massive error. I had used both Eos3 bodies on lenses from 24mm to 200mm and they were performing perfectly in all cases. In all my years I had never experienced anything like this.

At this point I could not understand how both 85mm f1.8 lenses could do the very same thing on BOTH my Eos 3 bodies and the error occurring defied reason. How could the image be perfect on screen, the camera lock focus perfectly at all distances and the actual negatives look like I had focused in a different county?!.... yet when I changed to ANY other lens I owned, everything was peachy perfect. It all pointed to the lenses, but how? What?

In desperation I ordered a 85mm f1.2 L II and that lens was perfect on both Eos 3 bodies. It later proved to be just fine on the Eos 1nHS body I had (but not with me at the time I was trying the 85mm f1.8 lenses). Years later I bought a third 85mm f1.8 for my 5D III and it too is perfect on my digital bodies.

I never did figure this one out and nobody has ever been able to explain it to me either. I went through about ten careful test rolls trying to find something to make sense of and it drove me nuts. Here I am bringing it up seven years later! It makes no more or less sense than your problem with the 5D Mk IV!

I got my portraits in the end (you can see some here:http://www.thomasstanworth.com/afghan-heroin-not-for-export/) and I absolutely love the 85 f1.2 L II as a result. Maybe it was meant to be


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