# Here is the Canon EOS R announcement live



## Canon Rumors Guy (Sep 5, 2018)

Continue reading...


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Okay, I'll stay up for this. Just a for a bit.



- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

After the launch of the EF mount in 1987, "the time has come for something new".

EOS R is announced.

- A


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## nitram (Sep 5, 2018)

Is there another livestream? It’s not working so well on my end...


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## Vendrame (Sep 5, 2018)

Worst live stream ever


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## wanako (Sep 5, 2018)

i can count the pixels on that video feed.


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## ThomsA (Sep 5, 2018)

Internet resources are popping up:

https://global.canon/ja/news/2018/20180905.html


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

'The star of this new system isn't the body, it's the mount'

- A


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## lalilulelo (Sep 5, 2018)

nitram said:


> Is there another livestream? It’s not working so well on my end...


Scott Kelby is live on Facebook


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Large throat + smaller flange distance = Larger rear elements now possible (despite same throat diameter?) 

- A


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## syyeung1 (Sep 5, 2018)

Hope that the EOS-R will have slightly better video quality, or we are *******!


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## traveller (Sep 5, 2018)

You’d think that Canon would have an official livestream for a launch event, rather than relying on some hack’s smartphone.


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

'lenses will have significantly better image quality'


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## AE-1Burnham (Sep 5, 2018)

These events are always a little painful to watch/listen to, but a multi-billion dollar company should be able to arrange a decent webcast..! FFS! (Takes breath, repeats "patience, patience") ...Tech VP says, "The innovation with the EOS R system is not the camera, it is the mount." Translation: Canon really hates the idea of selling this as their entry into FF mirrorless segment.


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

traveller said:


> You’d think that Canon would have an official livestream for a launch event, rather than relying on some hack’s smartphone.




Ja, this feels budget. This may be one of many events happening. This one is in Hawaii.

- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Starting with lenses. Interesting.

- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

'worlds first f/2 standard zoom lens'

(Sigma calls it's lawyers)


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Macro is 1:1

Not illuminated.

- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Control ring on lenses (The knurled bit on the front) controls whatever you customize it to:

ISO
Av
Tv
EC (if I heard that right)

- A


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## ThomsA (Sep 5, 2018)

lalilulelo said:


> Scott Kelby is live on Facebook


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Adaptor has drop-in CPL (like the superteles) and drop-in variable ND options.

They specifically called out the 11-24L as getting a leg up from this.

- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

The multifunction bar is either very powerful or very confusing. 

Need to play around with this.

- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

EOS interface menu-wise

- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

'3 easy to use adaptors that maintain all the functionality of the EF lenses'

- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

EF-M 32 f/1.4 being outed now

Still very little talk about the body


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Zero discussion of IBIS when the guy went through the new features. 

I think that's the nail in the coffin for IBIS.

- A


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## miketcool (Sep 5, 2018)

traveller said:


> You’d think that Canon would have an official livestream for a launch event, rather than relying on some hack’s smartphone.



The official stream for North America is tomorrow morning.


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Jordan Drake (at the event) on Twitter right now: "10 bit 4:2:2 HDMI output"

- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

miketcool said:


> The official stream for North America is tomorrow morning.




They are announcing it in North America as we speak (Hawaii I believe). There might be something tomorrow, but it's being outed right now.

- A


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## Mark D5 TEAM II (Sep 5, 2018)

Audio's gone to the crapper, but if I understood correctly, the touchbar can control Eye AF, slide left or right to select either eye.... So Eye AF confirmed.


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Got really choppy and I missed that.

- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

'product is aimed at today's dreamers and creators' -- trying to hype the younger generation

- A


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## julius071 (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> Jordan Drake (at the event) on Twitter right now: "10 bit 4:2:2 HDMI output"
> 
> - A


60p?


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

'Confidence is something earned'

- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

No price yet


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## Timedog (Sep 5, 2018)

please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

From Nokishita right now:

Viewfinder: approx. 3.69 million dot magnification about 0.76 times 

Reservation start date: September 12, 2018 at 10 o'clock
 Scheduled release date: late October 2018
- A


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## Timedog (Sep 5, 2018)

"at the right price"!!!!!!


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Must read:

https://translate.google.com/transl...w.nokishita-camera.com/2018/03/blog-post.html

Prices for all the lenses, still no word on the body

- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Superteles now being outed


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## Timedog (Sep 5, 2018)

these lightweight telephotos though!


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## padam (Sep 5, 2018)

Wow that 50/1.2 is pricey.
The price increase on those new tele lenses is also shocking (but sort of expected)


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## Deleted member 380306 (Sep 5, 2018)




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## Talys (Sep 5, 2018)

Cool info on the 400/600's.


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

*All USD values below are pure conversion and likely will be different than the exact figures below:*

28-70 2 = 420000 Y = $3769
24-105 4 IS = 155000 Y = $1390
50 1.2 = 325000 Y = $2916
35 1.8 IS Macro = 75000 Y = $673
EF-M 32 f/1.4 = 72000 Y = $646

- A


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## Timedog (Sep 5, 2018)

the stream has devolved into nonsense. A guy screaming in an unknown language while some guy fumbles with a camera in 240p


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## traveller (Sep 5, 2018)

Why do Japanese camera companies always keep wittering on about stuff that no one in the room gives a toss about, like their history and corporate vision. Just get to the point and present a clear marketing message about why the new product is something we will want, why it’s better than what we use now and what the competition has available.


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## Talys (Sep 5, 2018)

Timedog said:


> please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500 please be under 2500


MSRP $2501


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## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

LOL ... 650 bucks for that crop 32/1.4 ... hehehe! never ever!


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

A lot of weight was shaved off the superteles. The gift bags given the photographers had some heavy object inside (not a camera, perhaps a memento) and the presenter asked everyone to hold it out in front of them for a few moments.

'That's how much weight we took out of these lenses' -- a few oohs and ahhs followed (small crowd)

- A


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

fullstop said:


> LOL ... 650 bucks for that crop 32/1.4 ... hehehe! never ever!



My guess it will be $499ish. Original conversion always seems high.

- A


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## JoSto (Sep 5, 2018)

These lenses are insanely expensive. Just add taxes, then we have a 3000€ 50mm and a 1500€ 24-105. Dont see how this should work with an enthusiast body.


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## Mikehit (Sep 5, 2018)

Did the crappy sound quality obscure mention of IBIS?


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## wanako (Sep 5, 2018)

4K crop like 5DIV and only 1 SD card slot


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

JoSto said:


> These lenses are insanely expensive. Just add taxes, then we have a 3000€ 50mm and a 1500€ 24-105. Dont see how this should work with an enthusiast body.




They won't be _that _pricey. Rough swag might be 80% of the straight yen conversion.

- A


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## Timedog (Sep 5, 2018)

stream dead for everyone else?


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Mikehit said:


> Did the crappy sound quality obscure mention of IBIS?


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## Deleted member 380306 (Sep 5, 2018)

Action starts @5.12


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## MartinF. (Sep 5, 2018)

I still have the feeling of being left behind with my 6D and my EF lenses exactly as I was in '87 with my AE1-P and my FD lenses.
I understand the need for leap jumping but damn, I hate adaptors. An how about my planned investment in a 24-70 f/2.8 II L and the 135 f/2.0 L ? Will I do that now? Probably not. Or maybe by some used ones.
My guess is, that with this launch Canon is going all in on EOS-R, and we will probably see a lot more new RF mount cameras. I will be surprised if we will ever see an 7D or a 6D mkIII. We will might see a new 5D and 1D, but that will be it. The rest will RF cameras.
I will probably keep my beloved 6D until it is totally worn out, and then buy a RF mount camera, and RF 2.0 or 2.8 "standard-zoom" and a few primes, and the reuse my old EF lenses - maybe even buy some extra adaptors to be fixed on the most used lenses.
Canon is probably doing the right thing with the RF mount - I just have to take it in.....


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Timedog said:


> stream dead for everyone else?




Stream over, the invitees are just playing with gear now.

Expect someone to frantically confirm IBIS / Eye AF / 4K crop any moment on twitter.

- A


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## Roo (Sep 5, 2018)

Specs on the Australian store site

http://store.canon.com.au/digital-cameras/eos-r-body.html


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## fentiger (Sep 5, 2018)

eye af and C log


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## wanako (Sep 5, 2018)

no IBIS. digital IS only.


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## Punio (Sep 5, 2018)

well now we wait for the 1DX MM


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## Talys (Sep 5, 2018)

JoSto said:


> These lenses are insanely expensive. Just add taxes, then we have a 3000€ 50mm and a 1500€ 24-105. Dont see how this should work with an enthusiast body.



The Sony50/1.4 is something like $1500 and the 24-105/4, which I personally find a bit underwhelming, is very nearly that - before taxes.


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## kj_in_hk (Sep 5, 2018)

Considering the size of the company, the impact this system is suppose to have, this presentation is kind of crappy and cheap. It's like a school headmaster presentation or something.


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Kai Wong was at a different event going on elsewhere it appears:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1037237581593960448
- A


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## Talys (Sep 5, 2018)

wanako said:


> no IBIS. digital IS only.


Shocking!!


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## ThomsA (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> *All USD values below are pure conversion and likely will be different than the exact figures below:*
> 
> 28-70 2 = 420000 Y = $3769
> 24-105 4 IS = 155000 Y = $1390
> ...



Nokishita: Canon R "

Canon Online Store Price: 237,000 yen [$2127 / €1840]

"


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

EF-S glass is formally compatible with EOS R (via adaptor) as we'd expect.

- A


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## Talys (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> A lot of weight was shaved off the superteles. The gift bags given the photographers had some heavy object inside (not a camera, perhaps a memento) and the presenter asked everyone to hold it out in front of them for a few moments.
> 
> 'That's how much weight we took out of these lenses' -- a few oohs and ahhs followed (small crowd)
> 
> - A


Yeah, the weight reduction of something like 2.5 lbs off the super teles was impressive.


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## MartinF. (Sep 5, 2018)

Well the control ring is smart - very smart. I have always missed the aperture ring - with EOS R and RF lenses (and EF-ER adaptors) I will have it - and more too.
The slidebar (or whatever it is called) seems to be a very smart replacement for the control wheel. But Damn it will not be easy to switch between an Current EOS EF body and an EOS R body


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## henrikolsen (Sep 5, 2018)

Eye Detection AF: ON (@02:00 in RF lens video)

Yes!


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## Timedog (Sep 5, 2018)

ThomsA said:


> Nokishita: Canon R "
> 
> Canon Online Store Price: 237,000 yen [$2127 / €1840]
> 
> "


Yessssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss


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## Jack Douglas (Sep 5, 2018)

People who stay up for this in the middle of the night must be nuts!

Jack


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## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

Surprise: EOS R does have Eye-AF. Well implemented multi-function slide-bar doodad too. 
See other thread with official Canon videos.


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## kj_in_hk (Sep 5, 2018)

JoSto said:


> These lenses are insanely expensive. Just add taxes, then we have a 3000€ 50mm and a 1500€ 24-105. Dont see how this should work with an enthusiast body.


Come buy them in Hong Kong. Tax fee.


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## Talys (Sep 5, 2018)

ThomsA said:


> Nokishita: Canon R "
> 
> Canon Online Store Price: 237,000 yen [$2127 / €1840]
> 
> "


R price is good. I think ~$2k is an easy sell. 28-70/2 price is just right... to maximize profit on it, IMO.


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## JoSto (Sep 5, 2018)

Lenses and body are misbalanced. Feels like they had multiple options availible, and waited for Nikon to see what they made. Then pushed out the EOS R we know fast, fast which fits the Nikon Z best. So we have an entrance level Camera and an 28-80 f2. Doesn't fit.


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## Talys (Sep 5, 2018)

fullstop said:


> Surprise: EOS R does have Eye-AF. Well implemented multi-function slide-bar doodad too.
> See other thread with official Canon videos.


Cool!


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

ThomsA said:


> Nokishita: Canon R "
> 
> Canon Online Store Price: 237,000 yen [$2127 / €1840]
> 
> "



They just added that. So (there's some regional windage in the pricing) it would appear that the ~ $2k price point is actually happening. 

This thing will sell very very well. 

If you want a 5D4 with a tilty-flippy and silent shutter on the cheap, you're fired up.

If you want an on-chip ADC sensor on your 6D2, the same.

If you need IBIS, you are mashing exclamation points somewhere right now.

- A


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## Joules (Sep 5, 2018)

ThomsA said:


> Nokishita: Canon R "
> 
> Canon Online Store Price: 237,000 yen [$2127 / €1840]
> 
> "


Way to good to be true. If true, is there really anything to complain about at such a low price? Although... On-Chip ADC confirmed yet?


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## keriboi (Sep 5, 2018)

Ok what is eye af?


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

CR guy is posting prices now. 


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1037246375459737600

The Canon EOS R body will be $2299 / $3399 w/RF 24-105mm f/4L IS (USD). 
$2299 for the RF 50 f/1.2L USM
$2999 for the RF 28-70 f/2L USM 
$499 for the RF 35mm f/1.8 IS STM Macro (caaaaaaaaaaalled it)

- A


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## Del Paso (Sep 5, 2018)

padam said:


> Wow that 50/1.2 is pricey.
> The price increase on those new tele lenses is also shocking (but sort of expected)


If you find it expensive, take a look at the Leica price list (Gaaasp!)


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## miketcool (Sep 5, 2018)




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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Joules said:


> Way to good to be true. If true, is there really anything to complain about at such a low price? Although... On-Chip ADC confirmed yet?




It has DPAF + DPRAW. It's 30 MP. It's the 5D4 sensor or something very very close. Would be stunned if it didn't have on-chip.

- A


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## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

keriboi said:


> Ok what is eye af?



AF detects eye of subject and keeps it in focus. ... just see for yourself here:


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Adaptor $200. Nikon's was $249. Makes sense.

Those drop in filters are not cheap though!

- A


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## Mikehit (Sep 5, 2018)

wanako said:


> no IBIS. digital IS only.


So that's only for movies if I understand correctly.


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## Mark D5 TEAM II (Sep 5, 2018)

*Eye Detection AF On* confirmed for great justice!!11elevenoneone


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## keriboi (Sep 5, 2018)

Adaptor should be free


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## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

Basic adapter 99 USD. YES!
Control Ring adapter 199 - also yes. Adds a multifunctional "aperture and much more ring" to each and every EF lens.


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## Talys (Sep 5, 2018)

On that same video, we can also see that it has 9 and 5 point expanding AF, and center vertical and horizontal zone AF, which is cool. The multi slidy thingy for the thumb (instead of the joystick) I'm not so sure about. It could be really decent or awkward, not sure. There seem to be good customization options. And the top display looks really nice.


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Brace for impact. (CSTV and now DPReview) video ace Jordan Drake is there right now:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1037245432303239168
- A


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## JoSto (Sep 5, 2018)

Any news on EF compatiblity?


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## padam (Sep 5, 2018)

Del Paso said:


> If you find it expensive, take a look at the Leica price list (Gaaasp!)


There is an inevitable comparison to that and the old EF 50/1.2 it might not nearly be as sharp but it is a lot lighter way less expensive, draws nicely and might focus well enough in live-view mode. I can understand the 28-70mm f/2 more because there is no comparison.

But the US price on the lenses is less than I expected from the Japanese one.


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## clicstudio (Sep 5, 2018)

Those are great prices. It will sell like hot cakes! it looks impressive!


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## traveller (Sep 5, 2018)

It seems that only YouTubers got invites to these presentations (like with the Nikon Z). It doesn’t seem like DPReview have got their hands on a the system pre-launch (like they did with the Nikon Z), nor do they seem to have been invited to the launch event. Perhaps there will be a later press launch at a better time of day for the USA (well done to all you American night owls, I’m enjoying this over breakfast here in the U.K.!).


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

JoSto said:


> Any news on EF compatiblity?




It needs an adaptor, but yes, EF works on this camera.

- A


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## Joules (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> It has DPAF + DPRAW. It's 30 MP. It's the 5D4 sensor or something very very close. Would be stunned if it didn't have on-chip.
> 
> - A


I was stunned when the 6dII didn't have it. Was the reason I got an 80D and some lenses for the money instead. From the Look of it, this EOS or its succesors may be a really interesting option to go for affordable full frame eventually.

Anyway,I was just joking. No on-chip adc would just be madness for a direct A7 competitor.


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## Mikehit (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> Brace for impact. (CSTV and now DPReview) video ace Jordan Drake is there right now:
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1037245432303239168
> - A


In other words, the 5DIV without the mirror box plus a decent eye AF and a thousand bucks less. Sounds interesting.


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## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

keriboi said:


> Adaptor should be free



no. People starting new without EF lenses don't need it. Why should they pay for it with camera price?
And for all with existing EF glass 99 bucks should be no issue. Or better, spend 199 for the adapter with multi-functional control ring.
Or the versions with CPS or variable (!) ND filter. Saves a ton of money if you got EF glass with different size filter threads or large front lens diameters.
perfectly done, Canon.


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

traveller said:


> It seems that only YouTubers got invites to these presentations (like with the Nikon Z). It doesn’t seem like DPReview have got their hands on a the system pre-launch (like they did with the Nikon Z), nor do they seem to have been invited to the launch event. Perhaps there will be a later press launch at a better time of day for the USA (well done to all you American night owls, I’m enjoying this over breakfast here in the U.K.!).




Incorrect. Jordan and Chris -- who used to be CSTV but now are at DPR -- are there.

As is Phoblographer (presume it was Chris Gampat, but I wasn't sure who was manning their video feed).

- A


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## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

Mikehit said:


> In other words, the 5DIV without the mirror box plus a decent eye AF and a thousand bucks less. Sounds interesting.



No. Overall and performance-wise it really is a mirrorfree 6D III with 5D IV sensor. It is a Nikon Z6 competitor, not Z7. 
No IBIS, yet MSRP price higher than Nikon Z6 and Sony A7 III.


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## Timedog (Sep 5, 2018)

Has EyeAF, 2300 dollars. Will preorder the first day preorders are available.


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## JoSto (Sep 5, 2018)

What hypes me the most is the coming price-drop on used EF Lenses.


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Mikehit said:


> In other words, the 5DIV without the mirror box plus a decent eye AF and a thousand bucks less. Sounds interesting.




And a tilty-flippy, something the 5D4 doesn't have. 5-series people will get in on this, 'lower middleweight' specs be damned.

- A


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## Talys (Sep 5, 2018)

fullstop said:


> Basic adapter 99 USD. YES!
> Control Ring adapter 199 - also yes. Adds a multifunctional "aperture and much more ring" to each and every EF lens.


Yeah, that qualifies as possibly sexy.


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## Del Paso (Sep 5, 2018)

keriboi said:


> Adaptor should be free


Canon is not a welfare company...


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

fullstop said:


> Saves a ton of money if you got EF glass with different size filter threads or large front lens diameters.
> perfectly done, Canon.



Not necessarily. if you like weathersealing this doesn't help you. Still need a front filter for many L lenses to complete the sealing, don't you?

- A


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## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

Talys said:


> Yeah, that qualifies as possibly sexy.



plus the versions with CPL or variable (!) ND filter. CPL or ND filter for each and every Canon EF and T/S lens. Including those with huge and/or bulbous front element. Saves a ton of money for high-quality CPL filters if you have multiple lenses with different / large filter threads. 

And the variable ND adapter version should be a god-sent for video/hybrid shooters.


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## padam (Sep 5, 2018)

JoSto said:


> What hypes me the most is the coming price-drop on used EF Lenses.



I really doubt that.
In fact, they just became a whole lot more desirable for video with DPAF and ND filters behind them.

So what they've done to the audio input?


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## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> Not necessarily. if you like weathersealing this doesn't help you. Still need a front filter for many L lenses to complete the sealing, don't you?
> 
> - A



I really hope new RF lenses are wheathersealed without front filter attached. Even with EF (L) lenses, only a few need a filter for sealing. None of my EF L lenses need it. And if you got some lens that needs it, you can still slap a multi-coated clear "Protector" filter [not UV!] up front. So - no issue in real life. 

Kudos Canon for the 4 adapter versions. Truly "elegant" solution!


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## Timedog (Sep 5, 2018)

I just spent 500 on ND filters 2 weeks ago for 1 lens (((((((((((((((((((((

oh well! Great innovation, Canon!


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## AlanF (Sep 5, 2018)

2480g for the 400mm f/2.8 III. That's only 300g more than the 400/4 DO II. One in the eye for Sony.


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## traveller (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> Incorrect. Jordan and Chris -- who used to be CSTV but now are at DPR -- are there.
> 
> As is Phoblographer (presume it was Chris Gampat, but I wasn't sure who was manning their video feed).
> 
> - A


You are correct. This is presumably where DPReview is getting their updates from. It still doesn’t look like Canon let them (or anyone else) get their hands on anything before the launch.


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## Jack Douglas (Sep 5, 2018)

So the 11-24 is blessed with a sweet solution to NDs.

Jack


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## traveller (Sep 5, 2018)

AlanF said:


> 2480g for the 400mm f/2.8 III. That's only 300g more than the 400/4 DO II. One in the eye for Sony.


Not that I need a 400mm f/2.8, but does anyone else wonder how much strength was removed along with all that weight? Unless Canon has unbeknownst to us, introduced some new optical wonder material, that kilo must have come from the housing and mechanical parts.


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## Jack Douglas (Sep 5, 2018)

So why aren't we seeing Canon is ******* yet?

Jack


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## Timedog (Sep 5, 2018)

Jack Douglas said:


> So why aren't we seeing Canon is ******* yet?
> 
> Jack


Because the price is reasonable


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Jack Douglas said:


> So the 11-24 is blessed with a sweet solution to NDs.
> 
> Jack




Sweet solution for CPL you mean. ND already had a rear slot-in filter, didn't it?

- A


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## miketcool (Sep 5, 2018)

Jack Douglas said:


> So the 11-24 is blessed with a sweet solution to NDs.
> 
> Jack



I used the drop in filter slot on the mount just fine.


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## Jack Douglas (Sep 5, 2018)

Timedog said:


> Because the price is reasonable


I'd say so. I passed on the 6D2 and might reconsider on this one.

Jack


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## Jack Douglas (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> Sweet solution for CPL you mean. ND already had a rear slot-in filter, didn't it?
> 
> - A


Yes but not cheap and isn't this much more friendly?

Jack


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## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

EF-M 32mm f/1.4 STM

Having a focus delimiter implies good things for max magnification, no?

- A


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## Timedog (Sep 5, 2018)

Jack Douglas said:


> I'd say so. I passed on the 6D2 and might reconsider on this one.
> 
> Jack


Same. I bought a 6D instead because of the decreased dynamic range on the mark II, but will probably sell my 6D soon.


----------



## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Jack Douglas said:


> Yes but not cheap and isn't this much more friendly?
> 
> Jack




Sure, but you still need to expose the mount to get a filter in there. But if it's good enough for a supertele, I'm sure we can trust it.

- A


----------



## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

File under '@#$% I knew it and I'm bummed about that'


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1037237283177431040
- A


----------



## fentiger (Sep 5, 2018)

if you use grad filters i think you will still need front filtering


----------



## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1037255326121086976
- A


----------



## vjlex (Sep 5, 2018)

Sub-$2500 is a really good price. Hard to resist. It's put me in quite a hard spot at the moment. I love my 5D4, but I've wanted a tilty flippy for so long (macro, landscape), and I really don't need more than 2 bodies (a main and a backup). At this point, what are the advantages of the 5D4 over the R? It's a slow-burn, but I'm becoming enticed by the R.


----------



## J9canon (Sep 5, 2018)

Can you put a RF lens on the ND mount? If not, the EF lenses might have some advantages. Also, is the 35mm lead screw STM?


----------



## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

shunsai said:


> Sub-$2500 is a really good price. Hard to resist. It's put me in quite a hard spot at the moment. I love my 5D4, but I've wanted a tilty flippy for so long (macro, landscape), and I really don't need more than 2 bodies (a main and a backup). At this point, what are the advantages of the 5D4 over the R? It's a slow-burn, but I'm becoming enticed by the R.




A more comfortable grip
OVF doesn't burn battery like an EVF
Native mounting of EF lenses -- no need to buy an adaptor or new RF lenses
Faster burst (with proper AF working)
Larger buffer
Two cards
Proper control wheel and buttons around the thumb grip

(someone keep typing -- I'm sure I've forgotten stuff)

- A


----------



## Jack Douglas (Sep 5, 2018)

shunsai said:


> Sub-$2500 is a really good price. Hard to resist. It's put me in quite a hard spot at the moment. I love my 5D4, but I've wanted a tilty flippy for so long (macro, landscape), and I really don't need more than 2 bodies (a main and a backup). At this point, what are the advantages of the 5D4 over the R? It's a slow-burn, but I'm becoming enticed by the R.



You're not alone and for me skipping the 6D2 after selling my 6D it's looking like a great value (I also wanted the flip screen).

Jack


----------



## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> Sweet solution for CPL you mean. ND already had a rear slot-in filter, didn't it?
> 
> - A



yes. But you cannot operate/turn a VARIABLE ND filter in it.
Those adapters are truly "elegant" ... and "useful".


----------



## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

No more need for a 6D III. 
And once they bring the higher-end mirrorfree model, no more need for a 5D V.

'SLAPPER DOOM!


----------



## Mark D5 TEAM II (Sep 5, 2018)

The RF 24-105/4 L IS USM has Nano USM, not Ring USM like the EF version.


----------



## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Limited in higher fps pursuits though it may be, the EOS R appears to be a mirrorless 5D4 + a tilty-flippy + a silent shutter + Eye AF for *$2400* (body plus vanilla adaptor).

I'll say it. EOS R is going to cut into 5D4 sales. Never thought I'd see Canon undercut a flagship product so aggressively like this. Canon must be making a mint on those lenses once they draw folks in to justify this.

Good on them, and good for us. This camera is going to sell very well.

OK gnight Zzzzz

- A


----------



## Jack Douglas (Sep 5, 2018)

fullstop said:


> No more need for a 6D III.
> And once they bring the higher-end mirrorfree model, no more need for a 5D V.
> 
> 'SLAPPER DOOM!



Tonight's mirror-less honeymoon won't last. It's not all roses. Down the road though is a different story.

Jack


----------



## Mark D5 TEAM II (Sep 5, 2018)

C-Log also comes free, unlike the paid firmware upgrade for the 5D4, so that's another $200 less.


----------



## Jack Douglas (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> Limited in higher fps pursuits though it may be, the EOS R appears to be a mirrorless 5D4 + a tilty-flippy + a silent shutter + Eye AF for *$2400* (body plus vanilla adaptor).
> 
> I'll say it. EOS R is going to cut into 5D4 sales. Never thought I'd see Canon undercut a flagship product so aggressively like this. Canon must be making a mint on those lenses once they draw folks in to justify this.
> 
> ...



Me too Zzzzzzzzzzzz

Jack


----------



## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

Mark D5 TEAM II said:


> The RF 24-105/4 L IS USM has Nano USM, not Ring USM like the EF version.




Apparently this is only USM RF lens claiming Nano USM tonight. The other two just say USM without definition.

Jordan Drake from DPR is at the event and stated that the lenses (plural, presumably all of them) are FBW.

- A


----------



## vjlex (Sep 5, 2018)

Jack Douglas said:


> You're not alone and for me skipping the 6D2 after selling my 6D it's looking like a great value (I also wanted the flip screen).
> 
> Jack



It might sound silly to some, but I'm now seriously contemplating selling my 5D4 right away. I forgot about the dual card system advantage (shows how much I used it). But if my calculations are correct, I might be able to sell/trade the 4 and get the R + control ring adapter and break even.


----------



## Sharlin (Sep 5, 2018)

Mark D5 TEAM II said:


> C-Log also comes free, unlike the paid firmware upgrade for the 5D4, so that's another $200 less.



Wasn’t it that the FW upgrade is only needed for 5D4s sold before the C-log update, new bodies come with C-log built in?


----------



## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> Limited in higher fps pursuits though it may be, the EOS R appears to be a mirrorless 5D4 + a tilty-flippy + a silent shutter + Eye AF for *$2400* (body plus vanilla adaptor).
> I'll say it. EOS R is going to cut into 5D4 sales. Never thought I'd see Canon undercut a flagship product so aggressively like this. Canon must be making a mint on those lenses once they draw folks in to justify this.
> Good on them, and good for us. This camera is going to sell very well.



Agree with most of your statement. Except: EOS R offers exactly what a 6D III should have been, at 6D III price. It is a Nikon Z6 / A7 III competitor. 
Speed/performance is just nowhere near 5D IV. 

But ... mirrorfree 5D IV / Nikon Z7 / A7R III / A9 competitor in the works and hopefully coming soon.


----------



## Timedog (Sep 5, 2018)

What is the issue with focus by wire on a mirrorless? The camera needs to be on in order to show an image anyway. And these lenses don't fit on older cameras...


----------



## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

Focus by wire is absolutely fine. IF it is implemented really right: 100% responsive, precise/smooth operation. I don't see a reason why it could not also be combined with a [mechanical] "hard stop" at both MFD and infinity. Then it would be truly perfect.

If all new aircraft are FBW, why should 21st century lenses not be? I fully welcome FBW. Actually, I would not even manual focussing capability at all. 

FBW just has a bit of a bad rap because of so many (earlier) cr*ppy implementations - eg in compact cameras - with all sorts of lag, "play", coarse, unprecise, wobbly, underpowered operation.


----------



## lucuias (Sep 5, 2018)

is it 4k with crop?


----------



## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

Jack Douglas said:


> Tonight's mirror-less honeymoon won't last. It's not all roses. Down the road though is a different story.
> Jack



What? lol. 

IF the next higher-end Canon EOS R comes with 
* 10 fps with full AF tracking 
* IBIS 
* 4k/60 and FHD/120 
@ 3500 USD ... 

THEN ... end of mirrorslapping.


----------



## Timedog (Sep 5, 2018)

Yep. Don't buy if you need it for video and have really wide lenses while somehow not needing to go really wide.


fullstop said:


> What? lol.
> 
> IF the next higher-end Canon EOS R comes with
> * 10 fps with full AF tracking
> ...


And I might immediately sell my new EOS R to buy it. Hopefully they announce a higher end model before EOS R is on shelves, but I doubt it.


----------



## kj_in_hk (Sep 5, 2018)

fullstop said:


> What? lol.
> 
> IF the next higher-end Canon EOS R comes with
> * 10 fps with full AF tracking
> ...


Based on Canon's history. Maybe in 10 years time.


----------



## padam (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> EF-M 32mm f/1.4 STM
> 
> Having a focus delimiter implies good things for max magnification, no?
> 
> - A


The minimum focus distance is _written_ on the lens, it implies more that it might be a bit slower without it...


----------



## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

kj_in_hk said:


> Based on Canon's history. Maybe in 10 years time.



it will happen fast now. I think they got the higher-end EOS R "almost ready" but could just not finish it in time for photokina 2018 announcement. I do expect launch around next photokina - May 08-11 2019.


----------



## Kit. (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> A more comfortable grip
> OVF doesn't burn battery like an EVF
> Native mounting of EF lenses -- no need to buy an adaptor or new RF lenses
> Faster burst (with proper AF working)
> ...


Startup time 0.1s vs. 0.9s.
OVF as a scope (and in general, we haven't yet seen if the EVF is about as good as the OVF for evaluating the scene in non-WYSIWYG mode)
More information on the top LCD (but it's also about not burning batteries as fast as with back LCD turned on).


----------



## Mikehit (Sep 5, 2018)

AlanF said:


> 2480g for the 400mm f/2.8 III. That's only 300g more than the 400/4 DO II. One in the eye for Sony.


That is awesome!


----------



## traveller (Sep 5, 2018)

J9canon said:


> Can you put a RF lens on the ND mount? If not, the EF lenses might have some advantages.


No. Even if they would physically mount (which I doubt they will to avoid people making such errors), the ND adapter would make anything other than macro focus impossible by increasing the back focus distance. 



J9canon said:


> Also, is the 35mm lead screw STM?


Yes. See the third bullet point in Canon’s press release:
https://www.dpreview.com/news/0463137161/new-32mm-f1-4-stm-joins-canon-s-ef-m-lens-collection


----------



## AlanF (Sep 5, 2018)

fullstop said:


> If all new aircraft are FBW, why should 21st century lenses not be? I fully welcome FBW. Actually, I would not even manual focussing capability at all.


Have you tried taking a photograph with a new aircraft?


----------



## traveller (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> A more comfortable grip
> OVF doesn't burn battery like an EVF
> Native mounting of EF lenses -- no need to buy an adaptor or new RF lenses
> Faster burst (with proper AF working)
> ...



For me, the main reason to choose an EOS R over the 5D4 would be to make use of those new RF mount lenses... Like that new 50mm... 

I get the impression that this is how Canon are promoting the EOS R at launch too, as they seemed to have a lot more to say about the RF lens mount and the new glass than the actual camera body. 

I note that they are also being careful to send out the message that RF will live alongside EF for the foreseeable future... or at least, until they have an RF mount pro-body and enough long RF glass to change their marketing message.


----------



## traveller (Sep 5, 2018)

AlanF said:


> Have you tried taking a photograph with a new aircraft?


Do these count? 
https://www.dpreview.com/files/p/articles/8532025911/JeanetteDMoses-DJI-13.jpeg


----------



## Mark D5 TEAM II (Sep 5, 2018)

> "The Canon EOS R is pretty unique in that when you turn the camera off and remove the lens the shutter comes down. That protects the sensor. As simple as this sounds, no one else does this. Innovative? In this case, yes. But no one else does it and I’m not sure why.



From: https://www.thephoblographer.com/20...-r-canons-first-full-frame-mirrorless-camera/


----------



## Mark D5 TEAM II (Sep 5, 2018)

fullstop said:


> Focus by wire is absolutely fine. IF it is implemented really right: 100% responsive, precise/smooth operation. I don't see a reason why it could not also be combined with a [mechanical] "hard stop" at both MFD and infinity. Then it would be truly perfect.
> 
> If all new aircraft are FBW, why should 21st century lenses not be? I fully welcome FBW. Actually, I would not even manual focussing capability at all.
> 
> FBW just has a bit of a bad rap because of so many (earlier) cr*ppy implementations - eg in compact cameras - with all sorts of lag, "play", coarse, unprecise, wobbly, underpowered operation.




The HondaJet disagrees.


----------



## fullstop (Sep 5, 2018)

Mark D5 TEAM II said:


> From: https://www.thephoblographer.com/20...-r-canons-first-full-frame-mirrorless-camera/



"Shutter down when camera off and lens removed" comes as a little surprise. Sounds very good.


----------



## Mikehit (Sep 5, 2018)

Mark D5 TEAM II said:


> From: https://www.thephoblographer.com/20...-r-canons-first-full-frame-mirrorless-camera/







> I will fully admit that Canon is doing some innovative things in terms of lenses and with some of the new features


Surely not....


----------



## Aussie shooter (Sep 5, 2018)

I wonder how good the f11 focusing will prove to be? Quite a phenomonal achievement if it works effectively


----------



## Mark D5 TEAM II (Sep 5, 2018)

I think the reason why is because it draws some power to keep the shutter closed, maybe the other manufacturers think that's a drawback no matter how small, hmmm...


----------



## Mikehit (Sep 5, 2018)

Aussie shooter said:


> I wonder how good the f11 focusing will prove to be? Quite a phenomonal achievement if it works effectively



I wonder if it will be limited like the Sony with AF only on the first frame?


----------



## AlanF (Sep 5, 2018)

traveller said:


> Do these count?
> https://www.dpreview.com/files/p/articles/8532025911/JeanetteDMoses-DJI-13.jpeg


No, they are drones.


----------



## Aussie shooter (Sep 5, 2018)

Mikehit said:


> I wonder if it will be limited like the Sony with AF only on the first frame?


Perhaps. But with the EV-6 capability it might function well


----------



## AlanF (Sep 5, 2018)

£2,349.00 UK price plus £11,999 for the 400/2.8 III. £199 £99 for the basic adapter is a rip-off price. It will be be bundled free with some deals. No point in buying if you have a 5DIV, and we don't know how fast the AF is yet.


----------



## BillB (Sep 5, 2018)

Talys said:


> R price is good. I think ~$2k is an easy sell. 28-70/2 price is just right... to maximize profit on it, IMO.


Doubt that 28-70 f2 will ever be a big volume item.


----------



## BillB (Sep 5, 2018)

fullstop said:


> No. Overall and performance-wise it really is a mirrorfree 6D III with 5D IV sensor. It is a Nikon Z6 competitor, not Z7.
> No IBIS, yet MSRP price higher than Nikon Z6 and Sony A7 III.


Also has Digic 8


----------



## BillB (Sep 5, 2018)

fullstop said:


> No more need for a 6D III.
> And once they bring the higher-end mirrorfree model, no more need for a 5D V.
> 
> 'SLAPPER DOOM!


Need and demand are not the same thing. But Canon has to work that one out for itself. Thanks for your opinion though.


----------



## Mikehit (Sep 5, 2018)

does the R have the same heavy codec as the 5DIV?


----------



## Kit Lens Jockey (Sep 5, 2018)

I'm really thrilled to see that the camera closes the shutter when you remove the lens. It's completely mystifying to me why no one else does this. The biggest concern I have using mirrorless is having that big, expensive, easily damaged sensor hanging out in the open when I change lenses. Canon seems to have figured out the solution to this that should have been second nature to all manufacturers all along. Once again Canon seems to be the only manufacturer who understands what making a camera durable under real world conditions means.

And hopefully it's designed in a way that it does not drain the battery just to hold the shutter closed. Perhaps there's a locking mechanism that engages that holds it shut without the use of battery power. If they had the foresight to make the shutter close when you remove a lens, hopefully they had the foresight to make it so that the camera isn't sitting there draining the battery any time a lens is removed. But then again, who just leaves a camera sitting around for long periods without a lens on it anyway?


----------



## 3kramd5 (Sep 5, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> I'm really thrilled to see that the camera closes the shutter when you remove the lens. It's completely mystifying to me why no one else does this. The biggest concern I have using mirrorless is having that big, expensive, easily damaged sensor hanging out in the open when I change lenses. Canon seems to have figured out the solution to this that should have been second nature to all manufacturers all along. Once again Canon seems to be the only manufacturer who understands what making a camera durable under real world conditions means.


It’s probably because shutters are delicate and less prone to damage when open.

Something which will damage the sensor, which is covered in glass, would probably do so through a closed shutter. This might keep dust off during lens changes.


----------



## Kit Lens Jockey (Sep 5, 2018)

Fair enough. You're right with regard to actual damage to a sensor. Just having the shutter there isn't much protection. I guess ultimately I'm more concerned about dust and dirt, which this solution should go a long way in protecting from.

And honestly, if you're allowing any object to come close to your camera's shiny parts when the lens is removed, whether it's a mirror, shutter, or sensor, you get what you get. Dust and dirt protection is the biggest thing everyone needs to be worried about, and this should help a lot.


----------



## traveller (Sep 5, 2018)

AlanF said:


> £2,349.00 UK price plus £11,999 for the 400/2.8 III. £199 for the basic adapter is a rip-off price. It will be be bundled free with some deals. No point in buying if you have a 5DIV, and we don't know how fast the AF is yet.



The basic "Mount Adapter EF-EOS R" is $99, it's the Control Ring Mount Adapter EF-EOS R that is $199.99: 
https://www.dpreview.com/news/0628186309/three-ef-to-rf-adapters-available-for-eos-r

I find it a bit odd that Canon put the control ring at the front of the new RF lenses, as it means that it will be in a totally different position to adapted EF glass using the _Control Ring Mount Adapter EF-EOS R,_ which produces an awkward cognitive dissonance if you use both EF and RF lenses.


----------



## Durf (Sep 5, 2018)

Sounds like a pretty decent camera for their first FF Mirrorless.
Personally not for me but it's a good sign of things to come if sometime in the future I did want to switch from DSLR to Mirrorless.
They will only get better!!!!


----------



## AlanF (Sep 5, 2018)

traveller said:


> The basic "Mount Adapter EF-EOS R" is $99, it's the Control Ring Mount Adapter EF-EOS R that is $199.99:
> https://www.dpreview.com/news/0628186309/three-ef-to-rf-adapters-available-for-eos-r
> 
> I find it a bit odd that Canon put the control ring at the front of the new RF lenses, as it means that it will be in a totally different position to adapted EF glass using the _Control Ring Mount Adapter EF-EOS R,_ which produces an awkward cognitive dissonance if you use both EF and RF lenses.


You are right, but £99 is a rip-off. It is already being bundled here.


----------



## neonlight (Sep 5, 2018)

It is going to give APS-C users a harder choice than FF users, except perhaps 6D users. 7DIII or R?


----------



## neo302 (Sep 5, 2018)

They needed to release a super wide lens RF lens with that 4K 1.6 crop. 
You can't vlog with a 24mm lens, or a 3lb lens (28-70). The 24-105 also has a min. focusing distance of 17.71 inches...
Yes, you can adapt to an ef-s lens (no 60P) 10-18 which is much lower quality or use an other existing wider lens that will introduce noise when focusing. Unfortunately, this likely won't work for me.


----------



## fentiger (Sep 5, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> I'm really thrilled to see that the camera closes the shutter when you remove the lens. It's completely mystifying to me why no one else does this. The biggest concern I have using mirrorless is having that big, expensive, easily damaged sensor hanging out in the open when I change lenses. Canon seems to have figured out the solution to this that should have been second nature to all manufacturers all along. Once again Canon seems to be the only manufacturer who understands what making a camera durable under real world conditions means.
> 
> And hopefully it's designed in a way that it does not drain the battery just to hold the shutter closed. Perhaps there's a locking mechanism that engages that holds it shut without the use of battery power. If they had the foresight to make the shutter close when you remove a lens, hopefully they had the foresight to make it so that the camera isn't sitting there draining the battery any time a lens is removed. But then again, who just leaves a camera sitting around for long periods without a lens on it anyway?



i presume it draws power to keep shutter open, for me that would be the logical thing to do.


----------



## Mikehit (Sep 5, 2018)

neo302 said:


> You can't vlog with a 24mm lens...


 really?


----------



## 3kramd5 (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1037255326121086976
> - A


Erm... how can the same sensor have more phase AF pixels when it uses DPAF?

It’s the same sensor with a different software implementation for selectable locations.


----------



## Mark D5 TEAM II (Sep 5, 2018)

Actually, Canon missed a marketing coup by not saying that the EOS R has 26,492,928 DP AF points, which, for purposes of usability, was simplified to 5655 selectable AF points.


----------



## Kit Lens Jockey (Sep 5, 2018)

I was going to say... Isn't every pixel on a DP sensor essentially its own phase detect AF point? I mean that's kind of the whole point of the technology, right?


----------



## Mark D5 TEAM II (Sep 5, 2018)

Exactly. Canon missed highlighting that back with the 70D & 7D2. Imagine the press release with "16 Million AF points in Live View & EOS Movie shooting".


----------



## Kit. (Sep 5, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> I was going to say... Isn't every pixel on a DP sensor essentially its own phase detect AF point? I mean that's kind of the whole point of the technology, right?


There could be practical limitations in how these pixels are grouped together for more reliable (less noisy) phase detection.


----------



## 3kramd5 (Sep 5, 2018)

Kit. said:


> There could be practical limitations in how these pixels are grouped together for more reliable (less noisy) phase detection.


Agreed. I assume software establishes line pairs (albeit with a single column of pixels) in specific locations rather than having some amorphous blob.

It’s likely that some locations work better than others, and additionally having discrete predetermined locations is computationally lighter than some dynamic implementation.


----------



## Sharlin (Sep 5, 2018)

3kramd5 said:


> Erm... how can the same sensor have more phase AF pixels when it uses DPAF?
> It’s the same sensor with a different software implementation for selectable locations.





Kit Lens Jockey said:


> I was going to say... Isn't every pixel on a DP sensor essentially its own phase detect AF point? I mean that's kind of the whole point of the technology, right?



The area of the sensor that can be used for AF is roughly 80%x80% in the 5D4 generation DPAF. Whether the rest of the sensor physically has "normal pixels" or if it's only a software limitation to prevent potentially poor AF behavior near the edges I don't know, but the end result is the same. In the R, like in the M50, the area that is usable has increased to 88%x100%. So it is fair to say that there are more AF pixels (effectively if not otherwise).


----------



## Kit Lens Jockey (Sep 5, 2018)

Has anyone noticed if DPRAW files are exactly double the file size of non DPRAW files? I guess you'd have to take the exact same photo twice to know for sure since RAW file sizes do fluctuate.

I can't imagine that there's some periphery around the edge of the 5D4 sensor that physically does not have dual pixels compared to the middle of the sensor. Seems like it would be much harder to manufacture a sensor like this compared to one that just has uniform pixels throughout.

Also, in relation to that bokeh shift feature on the 5D4, I don't think you could do that without some weird artifacts around the edges of the photo if the sensor did not have dual pixels all the way through.

Not having 100% focus coverage is probably just a software and processor thing. Besides, if the subject you're focusing on is really that far to the edge of the frame, maybe you should just consider recomposing your photo.


----------



## Sharlin (Sep 5, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> Has anyone noticed if DPRAW files are exactly double the file size of non DPRAW files? I guess you'd have to take the exact same photo twice to know for sure since RAW file sizes do fluctuate.
> <snip>



Yeah, after I posted it occurred to me too that DPRAW certainly implies that the whole sensor is dual pixel.


----------



## ThomasH (Sep 5, 2018)

Can someone tell me where the bottleneck is that gives us 5fps in servo mode? They claim “worlds fastest autofocus” and there is no mirror which is suppose to give us more FPS. So what’s the deal and how do they fix it in the Pro model?


----------



## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

ThomasH said:


> Can someone tell me where the bottleneck is that gives us 5fps in servo mode? They claim “worlds fastest autofocus” and there is no mirror which is suppose to give us more FPS. So what’s the deal and how do they fix it in the Pro model?




The claim is fastest to lock, not fastest throughput. With fps, the bottleneck can be the mirror, shutter, AF system, or CPU/buffer to move the data. Yes, the mirror is removed, but the other bottlenecks may remain.

The (sort of) SLR equivalent of this camera, the 5D4, has 7 fps as an SLR and only 4.3 fps (I believe) with Liveview -- which is how the EOS R also focuses. So in that light, 5 fps isn't terrible. My guess is that DPAF + tracking (i.e. Servo) is too large a computational lift for high framerates in this class of camera, and that will improve over time.

- A


----------



## fentiger (Sep 5, 2018)

May be when the R series gets to the level of 1D, it will be larger, thus able to have 3 processors with one dedicated for AF and increase frame rate.
Beings the Olympic games are in Tokyo 2020 it may appear before that, so 18 months time.


----------



## ahsanford (Sep 5, 2018)

fentiger said:


> May be when the R series gets to the level of 1D, it will be larger, thus able to have 3 processors with one dedicated for AF and increase frame rate.
> Beings the Olympic games are in Tokyo 2020 it may appear before that, so 18 months time.




The 1DX2 already can shoot 16 fps in Liveview with AF working ...but not under Servo AF. I've been looking around for a published actual top speed with Liveview burst shooting doing the tracking work and I can't find it at either TDP or Canon proper. (Anyone know?)

Total bushleague thumbnail calculation based on EOS R specs:

EOS R
30 MP x 8 fps = 240 MP/sec possible in Liveview + AF (but no Servo AF)
30 x 5 = 150 possible in Liveview *with Servo AF*
---> Servo AF under Liveview saps 37.5% of the throughput.

1DX2
16 MP x 20 fps = 320 MP/sec possible in Liveview + AF (but no Servo AF)
37.5% less throughput would be 200 MP / sec
200 MP/sec by 16 MP = 12.5 fps

Now this math is a bit off as a 1DX2 only has 20 MP of a Liveview read to fight through with DPAF, whereas the EOS R has 30, and I have no idea how that scales (or if it's even appropriate to compare).

- A


----------



## Kit Lens Jockey (Sep 5, 2018)

You know, for all of the ways that this camera seems a little lackluster... No dual card slots, not the fastest fps, at least they're giving us essentially the best full frame sensor they've got. Yes, it would've been wonderful for it to be an all-new sensor with even better specs than anything else they've released.

But, at this price point, they could have just thrown the 6D II sensor in there and called it a day. And then I would be really conflicted, because that would set up the choice between having better image quality in the 5D4, or the mirrorless technology in the EOS R.

As far as ultimate image quality goes, this camera doesn't seem like it will force us to compromise compared to a 5D4, and that's really nice.


----------



## fentiger (Sep 5, 2018)

ahsanford said:


> The 1DX2 already can shoot 16 fps in Liveview with AF working ...but not under Servo AF. I've been looking around for a published actual top speed with Liveview burst shooting doing the tracking work and I can't find it at either TDP or Canon proper. (Anyone know?)



Hi just checked the manual, and it says continuous shooting during live view will lock AF and exposure, so on that basis live view can not track but can do 16 frames per second, might have to wait until digic 8,9, or 10 for that to happen :-(


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