# 6D HDR problem



## chrysoberyl (Jan 3, 2015)

Until recently, I have been able to use the HDR feature and take RAW shots. Now it is unavailable; in the menu, it is shaded and I must select JPEG only. Is this the result of a software update? Can it be reversed?


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## tron (Jan 3, 2015)

Check the following dpreview thread:

EDIT:

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/51111796

It does not clarify though what was happening in earlier firmware versions. By the way what firmware do you use?

Also, you cannot have the intermediate photos saved in 6D. In addition, the result is always a JPG (Even in 5D3) so there is no big deal except from the fact that you have to switch from raw to jpg and back every time you need to take an on camera hdr picture.


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## gregorywood (Jan 3, 2015)

tron said:


> Check the following dpreview thread:
> 
> http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/
> 
> ...



I was curious about this, also so I went to look The link throws a 404 error. Can you check the link and repost?

Thanks!
Greg


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## tron (Jan 3, 2015)

gregorywood said:


> tron said:
> 
> 
> > Check the following dpreview thread:
> ...


Ooops sorry! I must have missed something in copy paste. I will search again and report back.

EDIT: 

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/51111796

It's text follows:

My guess is that you have raw selected. Set it to jpg and it will not be grayed out.

More info follows:
IMPORTANT

If you shoot a moving subject, the subjects movement will leave afterimages.
The color gradation of the sky or white walls may not be reproduced correctly. Irregular colors or noise may appear.
HDR shooting under fluorescent or LED lighting may result in unnatural color reproduction of the illuminated areas.

REFERENCE

Only the merged HDR image will be saved. The three images used to produce the merged HDR image will not be saved.
You cannot select RAW and RAW+JPEG. The HDR mode cannot be set if RAW or RAW+JPEG is set.
If you set AEB, white balance bracketing, Multi Shot Noise Reduction, multiple shot exposures or if you shoot bulb exposures or a movie, HDR mode cannot be set.
Flash will not fire during HDR shooting.
HDR shooting is not possible with ISO expansion. (HDR shooting is possible within the range of ISO 100 - 25600.)
Since HDR shooting merges the images, it will take a longer time to record the HDR image to the card than with normal shooting. During the processing of the images, "buSY" will be displayed in the viewfinder and on the LCD panel and you cannot take another picture until the processing is completed.
In HDR mode, the options grayed out in the camera menu cannot be set. Note that when you set HDR mode, the Auto Lighting Optimizer, highlight tone priority, and exposure simulation will be set to [Disable] before shooting.


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## dcm (Jan 4, 2015)

Page 155 in the 6D instruction manual, page 74 in the 6D basic instruction manual. Both manuals list the cautions and restrictions shooting HDR. I don't believe RAW was ever available, it records in JPG even if RAW is your default mode.

Just checked it out on my 6D with the new 1.1.6 firmware. HDR automatically switches to JPG even though it was RAW in other SCN modes. The LCD screen shows JPG as well. As you noticed you cannot change it back to RAW via the first MENU screen while in HDR mode; you can only change the JPG level.


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## PureClassA (Jan 4, 2015)

Bracket 2-3 shots in RAW. HDR merge in post production. Done. Much better than in camera.


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## tron (Jan 4, 2015)

dcm said:


> Page 155 in the 6D instruction manual, page 74 in the 6D basic instruction manual. Both manuals list the cautions and restrictions shooting HDR. I don't believe RAW was ever available, it records in JPG even if RAW is your default mode.
> 
> Just checked it out on my 6D with the new 1.1.6 firmware. HDR automatically switches to JPG even though it was RAW in other SCN modes. The LCD screen shows JPG as well. As you noticed you cannot change it back to RAW via the first MENU screen while in HDR mode; you can only change the JPG level.


Exactly! And it is the same for the result with 5D3. The main difference with 5D3 is you get to keep the intermediate raw files to process later.

So the best HDR is to ignore this mode completely, bracket say 5 shots and process them later.


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## chrysoberyl (Jan 4, 2015)

Thanks all, for your input. However, I have hundreds of HDR RAW shots, shot with my 6D. It was quite convenient and I post-processed in DPP. So clearly firmware is the problem. I am emailing with Canon on this but so far they are denying that it happened.

Can anyone advise how I can revert to the earlier firmware?

BTW, I purchased my 6D 2/28/2013.

Thanks,
John


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## tron (Jan 4, 2015)

chrysoberyl said:


> Thanks all, for your input. However, I have hundreds of HDR RAW shots, shot with my 6D. It was quite convenient and I post-processed in DPP. So clearly firmware is the problem. I am emailing with Canon on this but so far they are denying that it happened.
> 
> Can anyone advise how I can revert to the earlier firmware?
> 
> ...


Can you tell us the current and the previous firmware of your 6D?


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## MarkPS (Jan 4, 2015)

I have the 6D as well. I was a bit disappointed when I read the manual and discovered that the 6D would only save in camera HDR images as JPG's. Instead, I just bracket the RAW images and post process them later at home. Works out better in the long run anyway.


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## Emil (Jan 4, 2015)

I don't think it's ever been possible to shoot RAW in HDR mode on the 6D, atleast I have never been able to do it with mine. HDR is greyed out if you have RAW selected and RAW is greyed out if you have JPEG selected and HDR activated.


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## kirkcha (Jan 4, 2015)

Emil said:


> I don't think it's ever been possible to shoot RAW in HDR mode on the 6D, atleast I have never been able to do it with mine. HDR is greyed out if you have RAW selected and RAW is greyed out if you have JPEG selected and HDR activated.



I would have to agree. I am using the original firmware (1.1.2) that was on the camera when I purchased in January 2013. I just checked and HDR is unavailable with any RAW selection.


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## Marsu42 (Jan 4, 2015)

chrysoberyl said:


> Until recently, I have been able to use the HDR feature and take RAW shots. Now it is unavailable; in the menu, it is shaded and I must select JPEG only. Is this the result of a software update? Can it be reversed?



I'd like to know how you've got raw hdr from the 6d in the first place  ... Canon crippled the fw so "no can do" raw, and worse: you cannot save the (jpeg) *source* files along the assembled shot for alternative post-processing, the camera insists on deleting them!

This makes the in-camera hdr function essentially broken on the 6d, because the only advantage on the 5d3 is that you get a resulting raw shot. But rejoice: You'll get much better results with proper bracketing (hint: automatic with Magic Lantern) and a good hdr software on the pc.


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## chrysoberyl (Jan 6, 2015)

Marsu42: I would love to know how I captured all those RAW shots, too!

Here is the latest from Canon:

*From: Robinson, John 
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2015 7:52 AM
To: '[email protected]'
Subject: RE: Response from Canon - EOS Digital Cameras > EOS 6D [#1871552]

Nick,

I have hundreds of RAW shots, taken too closely together for any manual changing of the shutter speed to have taken place, as the metadata clearly shows. Would you like me to send you a selection?

Yes, my 6D did have this ability.

It is time to bump this up a level; please do so.

Thank you,
John Robinson

From: Canon Support - EOS Digital [mailto:[email protected]] 
Sent: Monday, January 05, 2015 7:56 AM
To: Robinson, John
Subject: RE: Response from Canon - EOS Digital Cameras > EOS 6D [#1871552]

Dear John Robinson:
Thanks for following up with us.
You cannot revert the firmware to an older version, but in any case, the camera never had this ability. You can see as much by referencing page 155 in your manual. 
Let us know if you have any other questions, and thanks again for choosing Canon. 
Sincerely,
Nick
Technical Support Representative
*

Sigh...they are still in denial.

John


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## AdjustedInCamera (Jan 6, 2015)

John,
I think there's some confusion here with the modes. HDR requires two things:
- Stage A: get multiple images with different exposures
- Stage B: post-processing to create the HDR image

The 6D will do stage A in RAW no problem - it's called Automatic Exposure Bracketing. You can get the camera to take up to 7 images one after the other. What I believe the camera will only do in JPG is Stage B, that's what the 6D HDR mode is for.

On that basis is it possible that your collection of RAW images are the result of lots of AEB and you have been doing the post-processing elsewhere as implied in an earlier post in this thread? This would never have required the HDR mode of the camera AFAIK.


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## Marsu42 (Jan 6, 2015)

chrysoberyl said:


> Yes, my 6D did have this ability [...] Sigh...they are still in denial.



Their denial only proves that they've got something to hide :->


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## chrysoberyl (Jan 6, 2015)

AdjustedInCamera: No, AEB is not it. Am I the only one to experience this? I am glad I never deleted the RAW files shot in the HDR mode.

Marsu42: Thanks for the humor in this and other posts! Regarding Magic Lantern - really - you can set the bracketing and it will take the three consecutive shots with one shutter release? That would be what I had before...

John


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## Marsu42 (Jan 6, 2015)

chrysoberyl said:


> Marsu42: Thanks for the humor in this and other posts! Regarding Magic Lantern - really - you can set the bracketing and it will take the three consecutive shots with one shutter release? That would be what I had before..



If you want Magic Lantern will even take any amount of shots *automatically* with one button press until it has covered the whole dynamic range - be it 2,3,7,10,whatever brackets. And yes, if you're not using ML you're missing out big.


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## AdjustedInCamera (Jan 6, 2015)

chrysoberyl said:


> Marsu42: Thanks for the humor in this and other posts! Regarding Magic Lantern - really - you can set the bracketing and it will take the three consecutive shots with one shutter release? That would be what I had before...
> 
> John



Just for completeness, the AEB on the 6d can take 2, 3, 5 or 7 shots at different exposures with one shutter release.

For one shutter release to take all the pictures you need to be in one of the supported drive modes: 2sec, 10sec, there may be others.

To avoid the mirror flapping up and down, I normally put the camera in live view first.

This will not however create an HDR image for you. It will just collect the multiple RAW images on the memory card for you to PP elsewhere into an HDR.


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## chrysoberyl (Jan 7, 2015)

AdjustedInCamera: Noted regarding AEB - I will investigate further. It sounds like this is what I want, since I was post-processing to HDR anyway. And for this kind of shot, I always use live view and mirror lock up.

I would try Magic Lantern, but after this experience, I distrust Canon customer service. I am concerned that if I sent my camera in for servicing, that they would detect the ML software and refuse to service it.

BTW, Canon customer service has gone mute on this problem. Why they didn't suggest AEB?

Once again I am impressed with the support provided by the forum. Thanks!

John


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## Marsu42 (Jan 7, 2015)

chrysoberyl said:


> I would try Magic Lantern, but after this experience, I distrust Canon customer service. I am concerned that if I sent my camera in for servicing, that they would detect the ML software and refuse to service it.



That never happened, and you can remove ML anytime you want w/o trace. Or disable it when the camera starts, btw.


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## chrysoberyl (Jan 7, 2015)

Well, I'll believe Huba Huba, the exceedingly joyous leopard, over Canon any day. Thanks once again.


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## Skirball (Jan 8, 2015)

chrysoberyl said:


> AdjustedInCamera: No, AEB is not it. Am I the only one to experience this? I am glad I never deleted the RAW files shot in the HDR mode.



Can you post a link to a RAW HDR shot? I don't see how that's even possible. RAW is RAW - unprocessed, and HDR is, by definition, a processed shot from multiple pictures.


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## mackguyver (Jan 8, 2015)

You cannot save the final shot as RAW in any current model, and since they first came out (no firmware changes) the 5DIII allows you to save the RAW exposures that produce the HDR JPEG, but the 6D is crippled to save only the final JPEG.

Here's more about the HDR feature from Canon: http://learn.usa.canon.com/resources/articles/2012/5d3_hdr_capabilities.shtml keeping in mind that the 6D works the same way, minus saving the RAW files.

Also, you can take some solace in knowing that Canon's top dog, the 1D X doesn't even have the HDR feature


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## Skirball (Jan 8, 2015)

mackguyver said:


> Also, you can take some solace in knowing that Canon's top dog, the 1D X doesn't even have the HDR feature



I'd also guess that the majority of 1Dx owners would prefer the control of doing it in post over in-camera. Then again, I'd like to think that 6D and 5d owners feel the same.

Wanting it in RAW makes it even more a mystery to me. If you shoot RAW then obviously you post process. If you PP, why wouldn't you want to do your HDR in post?


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## mackguyver (Jan 8, 2015)

Skirball said:


> mackguyver said:
> 
> 
> > Also, you can take some solace in knowing that Canon's top dog, the 1D X doesn't even have the HDR feature
> ...


I find the 5DIII's HDR pretty interesting and certainly wouldn't mind having it on my 1D X. It's nice for a casual HDR shot and I use it here and there. 

Also, having the final RAW would rock, but only if it's a high-bit file such as a 48-bit format - that would also need to be supported by PP software. I think someone (Phase One or Hasselblad perhaps?) has this feature, but I can't remember who it was or where I read it.


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## AdjustedInCamera (Jan 8, 2015)

mackguyver said:


> You cannot save the final shot as RAW in any current model, and since they first came out (no firmware changes) the 5DIII allows you to save the RAW exposures that produce the HDR JPEG, but the 6D is crippled to save only the final JPEG.
> 
> Here's more about the HDR feature from Canon: http://learn.usa.canon.com/resources/articles/2012/5d3_hdr_capabilities.shtml keeping in mind that the 6D works the same way, minus saving the RAW files.
> 
> Also, you can take some solace in knowing that Canon's top dog, the 1D X doesn't even have the HDR feature



I _think _we are all saying the same thing and I believe your discription of the HDR mode on the 6D is right although I have never used it. 

I do HDR with the 6D using its AEB mode. This allows me to take multiple RAW files at different exposures (with one shutter press) that I then PP to create the final image.


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## Marsu42 (Jan 8, 2015)

Skirball said:


> RAW is RAW - unprocessed



Nope, "raw" from current bayer sensors simply means mosaic data. Magic Lantern's dual_iso postprocessing utility, for example, assembles 2x 14bit cr2 into 1x 16bit raw dng. You still need to feed it to a raw converter like ACR to get a usable picture.



Skirball said:


> and HDR is, by definition, a processed shot from multiple pictures.



Nope, hdr simply means high dynamic range which in turn means almost nothing. You have to specify what you're talking about, in this case an assembled shot from multiple brackets - high-bitres like openexr/fp tif, or tonemapped/fused to a low-bitdepth picture.


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## Ivan Muller (Jan 9, 2015)

sorry I haven't read any replies....so may its been said before but

afaik the eos 6d only does HDR in jpeg, not RAW,

anyway my experience is that you don't need multiple exposures to get a wide DR, ettr and you should be ok to get most details in highlights and shadows...


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## mackguyver (Jan 9, 2015)

Ivan Muller said:


> anyway my experience is that you don't need multiple exposures to get a wide DR, ettr and you should be ok to get most details in highlights and shadows...


I expose to the right for just about everything other than portraits and that works most of the time, but there are some scenes that go well beyond the sensor's exposure range. That leaves some options - split ND filters, HDR processing, polarizers (which are sometimes just enough to cut out the brightest highlights), or just living with blown highlights or crushed shadows. I find most HDR processing to be unnatural (my own included), so I tend to go with the other options.


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## Marsu42 (Jan 9, 2015)

mackguyver said:


> I find most HDR processing to be unnatural (my own included), so I tend to go with the other options.



Imho the smart way is to limit "hdr" to specific areas as the easiest way to prevent this "unnatural" look. 

Examples can be the sun's/moon's corona, giving it a bit less blown look is easily +3-4 stops more. The other side is raising the shadows in a specific part to get more *resolution*. The latter is *not* the same as tonemapping, but unless you bracket yet get an "aliased" look as there are only few bits left to work with.


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## mackguyver (Jan 9, 2015)

Marsu42 said:


> mackguyver said:
> 
> 
> > I find most HDR processing to be unnatural (my own included), so I tend to go with the other options.
> ...


Good points, Marsu, and I tend to be a little lazy with my PP unless I'm doing paid work. Probably not a good attitude...but my time for photography and editing has been very limited over the last year or so


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## chrysoberyl (Jan 12, 2015)

There have been comments about RAW HDR shots - that was not the case. Before, I would scroll down to HDR, select it, adjust the bracketing, and begin shooting in RAW. I would post-process then combine the images in DPP. Now, when shooting in RAW, HDR is greyed out.

I suspect that all 6D's are capable of this, but after some of the early units, Canon decided to remove this feature.

AdjustedInCamera and later, Canon, explained how I can do what I did before with AEB. Not that I shoot very much in RAW (it can look unnatural if overused), but I dislike loosing features from my camera. And I dislike Canon's denials.

John


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## tron (Jan 12, 2015)

chrysoberyl said:


> There have been comments about RAW HDR shots - that was not the case. Before, I would scroll down to HDR, select it, adjust the bracketing, and begin shooting in RAW. I would post-process then combine the images in DPP. Now, when shooting in RAW, HDR is greyed out.
> 
> I suspect that all 6D's are capable of this, but after some of the early units, Canon decided to remove this feature.
> 
> ...


As I have asked before: Can you tell us the before and after firmware versions?


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## chrysoberyl (Jan 12, 2015)

DominoDude: I never claimed to produce RAW HDR images in-camera. Please re-read: I would post-process then combine the images in DPP.

Frankly, I think it was an elegant way to do what AEB does, while limiting the number of shots to three, thus making it simple to process in DPP.

In any case, I am pleased that I can again take three bracketed shots with one shutter activation. I am less pleased with Canon’s response.


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## dcm (Jan 12, 2015)

chrysoberyl said:


> DominoDude: I never claimed to produce RAW HDR images in-camera. Please re-read: I would post-process then combine the images in DPP.
> 
> Frankly, I think it was an elegant way to do what AEB does, while limiting the number of shots to three, thus making it simple to process in DPP.
> 
> In any case, I am pleased that I can again take three bracketed shots with one shutter activation. I am less pleased with Canon’s response.



I preordered my 6D. I have always been able to take bracketed shots with one shutter activation in both AEB and the HDR scene mode. The HDR scene mode will do it independent of any other settings. The AEB mode requires you to select the appropriate drive mode separately. If you select single shot, you will have to trigger the shutter for each frame. If you select continuous shooting, you need only press the shutter once for the camera to shoot the entire sequence. It has always operated this way. Perhaps you didn't make the connection to the drive mode.


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## mackguyver (Jan 12, 2015)

chrysoberyl, I think you have confused the heck out of everyone here by using the word HDR in your post title and making us think you are talking about the in-camera HDR processing. I think what you are actually talking about is the "Number of bracketed shots" setting. It's in the Exposure menu and if it's like the 5DIII, you can set it to take 2, 3, 5, or 7 shots.


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## chrysoberyl (Jan 13, 2015)

mackguyver: Yeah, you're right - I should have said taking RAW shots after selecting the HDR mode, but noting that *the bracketed shots had to be processed into HDR in DPP*.

DominoDude: Sorry for the confusion.

dcm: Please confirm that you shoot RAW while in HDR mode, then combine the RAW shots into the HDR version in post-processing.


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## dcm (Jan 13, 2015)

chrysoberyl said:


> mackguyver: Yeah, you're right - I should have said taking RAW shots after selecting the HDR mode, but noting that *the bracketed shots had to be processed into HDR in DPP*.
> 
> DominoDude: Sorry for the confusion.
> 
> dcm: Please confirm that you shoot RAW while in HDR mode, then combine the RAW shots into the HDR version in post-processing.



I always shoot in RAW or RAW+JPG mode. 

My first HDR was done with a T2i. No builtin camera mode for in camera HDR and the Canon software did not do HDR. I shot RAW in Av with AEB and processed in Photomatix Pro. You can also preprocess the images in the Canon software for lens, etc. corrections and save as TIF or JPG before loading into Photomatix Pro.

I use the same approach with the 6D - shoot RAW in Av with AEB and process in Photomatix Pro. I have tried the HDR Backlight Control in scene mode on the 6D, but it only produces a single merged jpg image and that isn't generally what I am looking for so I don't use it. Maybe if I played with it more I might find something to like about it. 

There is no RAW support in the HDR Backlight scene mode that I tried. I don't remember trying the HDR mode in camera menu 4 which appears to be the method you use. I haven't tried using any HDR features of the Canon software (ImageBrowser or DPP), didn't know there were any but I already have other software for this purpose.

If I find some time I might look at HDR mode in camera menu 4 but I think it will lack the flexibility of post processing if it produces an in camera jpg as documented. I could only speak to the current version, not any changes that might have been made since the original firmware.


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