# Patent: Canon EF 135 f/2L w/Apodization Filters



## Canon Rumors Guy (Dec 26, 2016)

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Canon has filed a patent for an EF 135mm f/2L optical formula with apodization filters.</p>
<p>From <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apodization" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Wikipedia</a> (Via <a href="http://www.the-digital-picture.com/News/News-Post.aspx?News=19701">TDP</a>):</p>
<blockquote><p><b>Apodization</b> is an optical filtering technique, and its literal translation is “removing the foot”. It is the technical term for changing the shape of a mathematical function, an electrical signal, an optical transmission or a mechanical structure. In optics, it is primarily used to remove Airy disks caused by diffraction around an intensity peak, improving the focus.</p></blockquote>
<p>Patent publication number 2016-218444 (Google Translate)</p>
<ul>
<li>Release date 2016.12.22</li>
<li>Application date 2015.5.20</li>
<li>Focal length 130.98</li>
<li>F number 2.06</li>
<li>Field of View 9.38</li>
<li>Image height 21.64</li>
<li>Lens total length 159.05</li>
<li>BF 53.99</li>
<li>Even when there is vignetting, a good blurred image at all angle of view</li>
</ul>
<p>We have not heard anything regarding a new EF 135mm f/2L lens coming in 2017, but we’ll obviously let you know if we do.</p>
<span id="pty_trigger"></span>
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## Jopa (Dec 26, 2016)

Most likely it will be similar to the Zeiss 135 APO / Milvus 135, which is one of the best lenses ever made (IMHO  ), but with AF of course. Exciting times lie ahead!


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## JMZawodny (Dec 26, 2016)

Apodization alters the distribution of energy to put light that would fall far away from the central peak back into the central peak - at the expense of a slight increase in the width of the central peak. This does more for contrast than anything else, but it also slightly reduces the resolution. Now for an f/2 lens the spot size is very small and the loss in resolution will likely go unnoticed. It should have visible impact at smaller apertures. I also think this may be directed at producing improvements to the bokeh. I'll be very interested in this lens if it ever comes to market.


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## neuroanatomist (Dec 26, 2016)

Jopa said:


> Most likely it will be similar to the Zeiss 135 APO / Milvus 135, which is one of the best lenses ever made (IMHO  ), but with AF of course. Exciting times lie ahead!



Just to clarify (and I'm not suggesting that you're saying this), the Zeiss APO designation indicates the lens is apochromatic (minimal chromatic aberration), not that it incorporates an apodization filter.


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## slclick (Dec 26, 2016)

More magical? This would be the only way I'd sell my 135L.


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## Jopa (Dec 26, 2016)

neuroanatomist said:


> Jopa said:
> 
> 
> > Most likely it will be similar to the Zeiss 135 APO / Milvus 135, which is one of the best lenses ever made (IMHO  ), but with AF of course. Exciting times lie ahead!
> ...



Oh, I just read what my brain wanted to read  yes, I did confuse apodisation with apochromatic...


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## Maiaibing (Dec 26, 2016)

Yes! Yes! Yes! Will Canon give us the ultimate bokeh lens like the Minolta/SONY 135mm STF?!?! Only this time around as an AF lens? That would be sensational great news! Have not seen Apodization filters used anywhere else than in the STF lens.


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## Boyer U. Klum-Cey (Dec 26, 2016)

Does "Apodization" have an effect on reactions between/among of green, red, and possibly, gold kryptonite?  

Thanks for all the good advice! My resolution for 2017 is to "master" all the Canon stuff that I already have, eh?

Thanks again, a productive, continuous learning New Year to All!


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## rs (Dec 26, 2016)

Maiaibing said:


> Yes! Yes! Yes! Will Canon give us the ultimate bokeh lens like the Minolta/SONY 135mm STF?!?! Only this time around as an AF lens? That would be sensational great news! Have not seen Apodization filters used anywhere else than in the STF lens.



Fuji call it an APD filter:

http://www.fujifilm.com/products/digital_cameras/x/fujinon_lens_xf56mmf12_r_apd/


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## Maiaibing (Dec 26, 2016)

rs said:


> Maiaibing said:
> 
> 
> > Yes! Yes! Yes! Will Canon give us the ultimate bokeh lens like the Minolta/SONY 135mm STF?!?! Only this time around as an AF lens? That would be sensational great news! Have not seen Apodization filters used anywhere else than in the STF lens.
> ...


Thanks. New to me that Fuji also has this kind of lens - and its AF too! Have you used it yourself? I'd guess the effect is most noticible on a medium tele like the 134mm STF.

Later: Looked at the shots in the Flickr pool and bokeh is very nice indeed. Price is very reasonable too. Fuji shooters should flock to this lens.


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## ranplett (Dec 26, 2016)

I'm not sure what to make of patents and how long it takes to reach the market, but I really, really want this lens to have IS. I've missed a lot of shots that I think IS would compensate for. And if the 85 1.4 is getting IS, than I can't see why the 135mm shouldn't.

At any rate, even if it doesn't come with IS, the 85mm 1.4 IS should open up options. I've just always prefered 135mm over 85mm.


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## bokehmon22 (Dec 26, 2016)

I just got the 85 1.4 Art and love the shots coming from it. Looking forward to adding Tamron 115 1.4 or this 135 f2.


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## slclick (Dec 27, 2016)

bokehmon22 said:


> I just got the 85 1.4 Art and love the shots coming from it. Looking forward to adding Tamron 115 1.4 or this 135 f2.


Tammy 115? Is that from a patent or do you have some actual release info?


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## bvukich (Dec 27, 2016)

slclick said:


> bokehmon22 said:
> 
> 
> > I just got the 85 1.4 Art and love the shots coming from it. Looking forward to adding Tamron 115 1.4 or this 135 f2.
> ...



http://www.canonrumors.com/patent-tamron-115mm-f1-4-vc/


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## entoman (Dec 27, 2016)

Couldn't help laughing at the patent description ;D

So this lens not only promisies to give us "*vignetting*"  but also guarantees that we'll get a "*good blurred image* :-\ at all angle of view". Lovers of fuzzy pics and dark corners will snap up this lens instantly!

Seriously, I'm not quite sure what Canon are trying to say here - a realistic translation would appear to be "good bokeh despite heavy vignetting".


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## neuroanatomist (Dec 27, 2016)

entoman said:


> Couldn't help laughing at the patent description ;D
> 
> So this lens not only promisies to give us "*vignetting*"  but also guarantees that we'll get a "*good blurred image* :-\ at all angle of view". Lovers of fuzzy pics and dark corners will snap up this lens instantly!
> 
> Seriously, I'm not quite sure what Canon are trying to say here - a realistic translation would appear to be "good bokeh despite heavy vignetting".



Canon is saying it in Japanese, where I'm sure it makes perfect sense. Perhaps instead of laughing, you might consider going to Google Translate (which was used to generate the English text above), and suggest a better translation for that phrase. Better yet, learn Japanese so you can properly translate all of Canon's patents better than Google. Laughing is probably easier, though.


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## gruhl28 (Dec 27, 2016)

neuroanatomist said:


> entoman said:
> 
> 
> > Couldn't help laughing at the patent description ;D
> ...



I think he was laughing at the translation, not at Canon.


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## Maximilian (Dec 27, 2016)

> Apodization


I really had to look this after. Never heard it before ???



> Even when there is vignetting, a good blurred image at all angle of view</li>


Give me a few example pictures to have a better imagination of what this means to the IQ.
My imaginative power is not good enough for this


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## Mistral75 (Dec 27, 2016)

This is not the first time Canon are showing an interest in lenses with an apodisation element. There is a 2012 patent (2012-128151) illustrated by six examples, five of which are 135mm f/2.8 lenses and one a 180mm f/3.5.

The 2016-218444 patent is illustrated by six examples too: not only two 135mm f/2 but also a 24mm f/1.4, a 35mm f/1.4 and two 50mm f/2.

In the 2016 patent, there are two apodisation elements, one on each side of the aperture, instead of one in the existing lenses (Minolta / Sony 135mm f/2.8 STF, Fujinon 56mm f/1.2 APD and Venus Optics Laowa STF 105mm f/2) and in the examples in the 2012 patent.

A last consideration: phase-detection autofocus cannot be used in conjunction with an apodisation element (contrast-detection autofocus can).


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## JMZawodny (Dec 27, 2016)

Maximilian said:


> > Apodization
> 
> 
> I really had to look this after. Never heard it before ???
> ...



Some lenses produce almond shaped out of focus highlights towards the edges and corners of the frame. This should help keep those round.


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## Andrew Davies Photography (Dec 27, 2016)

I love this lens and the shots it can produce I have not found with any other , the only downside for me is that really struggles to focus in low light sometimes - anyone else find this ? Its also a fairly heavy so adding IS to it would for me be a negative as it would have to add more weight ..




Wedding Photographer North East & Yorkshire Northumberland & Wedding Photographer Cumbria


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## Maiaibing (Dec 27, 2016)

Maximilian said:


> Give me a few example pictures to have a better imagination of what this means to the IQ.
> My imaginative power is not good enough for this



Great visualisation - and a lot of samples here: http://www.dyxum.com/columns/articles/lenses/sal-135f28/sony-af-135-stf-sal-135f28_review.asp. Bokeh is simply the best money can buy.


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## Maiaibing (Dec 27, 2016)

Mistral75 said:


> A last consideration: phase-detection autofocus cannot be used in conjunction with an apodisation element (contrast-detection autofocus can).



Why is this?


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## entoman (Dec 28, 2016)

gruhl28 said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > entoman said:
> ...



Yes, I was laughing at the google translation, neuro unfortunately doesn't understand humour.


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## neuroanatomist (Dec 28, 2016)

entoman said:


> neuro unfortunately doesn't understand humour.



That's because you're spelling it wrong. 

Or maybe you need to borrow the big winky emoticon I use... 

Nevertheless, apologies for the misunderstanding.


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## slclick (Dec 28, 2016)

neuroanatomist said:


> entoman said:
> 
> 
> > neuro unfortunately doesn't understand humour.
> ...



This could easily segue into the Txx vs XXXD globalization naming scheme thread.


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## Maximilian (Dec 29, 2016)

Maiaibing said:


> Maximilian said:
> 
> 
> > Give me a few example pictures to have a better imagination of what this means to the IQ.
> ...


Thanks for pointing towards that review. 
Although a few days old (2007) and with old sensor tech (Konica Minolta 7D, 2004, 6 MP) quite impressing results.

I hope we can see something like that with latest lens tech performing on a 50 MP sensor soon.


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## Maiaibing (Dec 29, 2016)

Maximilian said:


> Thanks for pointing towards that review.
> Although a few days old (2007) and with old sensor tech (Konica Minolta 7D, 2004, 6 MP) quite impressing results.
> 
> I hope we can see something like that with latest lens tech performing on a 50 MP sensor soon.



Some more (and w/larger sensor) samples can be found here:
http://www.dyxum.com/dforum/sony-135mm-f28-t45-stf-sal135f28_topic11302_page1.html


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## RAW.hu (Dec 30, 2016)

Maximilian said:


> Give me a few example pictures to have a better imagination of what this means to the IQ.
> My imaginative power is not good enough for this


This was taken with Canon 40D and EF 70-200 f/4L IS @ f4.0: https://www.flickr.com/photos/rawhu/14019405114/

This was taken with Sony DSLR-A900 and 135 F2.8[T4.5] STF @ F4.5: https://www.flickr.com/photos/rawhu/14015730092/

The 135 STF absolutely destroys the 70-200 f/4L IS in terms of bokeh. The 70-200 produces onion rings, the backgound is busy, the bokeh is unpleasant. The 135 STF creates a creamy, dreamy, incredible bokeh.

Another picture with 135 STF: https://www.flickr.com/photos/rawhu/14015719712/


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## ExodistPhotography (Dec 30, 2016)

RAW.hu said:


> Maximilian said:
> 
> 
> > Give me a few example pictures to have a better imagination of what this means to the IQ.
> ...



If you want to make a comparison of bokeh quality you should shoot them both at the same apertures and distance from the subject. I personally thought the subjects in frame looked better on the 70-200 f/4 despite the background.


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## Maiaibing (Dec 30, 2016)

ExodistPhotography said:


> If you want to make a comparison of bokeh quality you should shoot them both at the same apertures and distance from the subject. I personally thought the subjects in frame looked better on the 70-200 f/4 despite the background.



Bokeh is a subjective impression of the out-of-focus rendering of a lens. So maybe a STF lens is not for you. However, most people tend to agree that a gradual Gaussian blur without harsh/double lines is the ideal bokeh pattern. Here the STF is superior - as can be seen in the two samples.

Still I agree with you that the lack of DOF makes the STF image less compelling and - even if I'm a sucker for bokeh - what's in focus will almost always count more than what's not. This could have been solved by shooting the STF @ f/4 or f/5 or by making a sandwich shot (which is what I would probably have done). 

One of the specific advantages with the STF is in fact its ability to maintain a great blur pattern as you increase the f-stops, while all other lenses take a more noticeable bokeh hit as soon as you stop down. The 135L being an example of this, so that the bokeh of the 135L @ f/4 cannot match the bokeh of the 70-200mm f/4 IS L shot wide open.


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## StudentOfLight (Dec 31, 2016)

Mistral75 said:


> This is not the first time Canon are showing an interest in lenses with an apodisation element. There is a 2012 patent (2012-128151) illustrated by six examples, five of which are 135mm f/2.8 lenses and one a 180mm f/3.5.
> 
> The 2016-218444 patent is illustrated by six examples too: not only two 135mm f/2 but also a 24mm f/1.4, a 35mm f/1.4 and two 50mm f/2.
> 
> ...


So do you suspect this would be for a hybrid/mirrorless camera where contrast detect is used?


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## Maiaibing (Feb 18, 2017)

StudentOfLight said:


> Mistral75 said:
> 
> 
> > This is not the first time Canon are showing an interest in lenses with an apodisation element. There is a 2012 patent (2012-128151) illustrated by six examples, five of which are 135mm f/2.8 lenses and one a 180mm f/3.5.
> ...



SONY shows the way: 100mm STF with image stabilisation AND autofucos using phase-detection. Come on Canon you can do it too!

https://www.dpreview.com/news/2820818690/sony-fe-100mm-f2-8-stf-bokeh-demystified


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## Jopa (Feb 19, 2017)

Maiaibing said:


> StudentOfLight said:
> 
> 
> > Mistral75 said:
> ...



It's T5.6! I only see it's used on a sunny day with strobes to stay within sync speed.


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## Maiaibing (Feb 20, 2017)

Jopa said:


> It's T5.6! I only see it's used on a sunny day with strobes to stay within sync speed.



LOL! You should try taking more pictures...


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## Jopa (Feb 20, 2017)

Maiaibing said:


> Jopa said:
> 
> 
> > It's T5.6! I only see it's used on a sunny day with strobes to stay within sync speed.
> ...



LOL! You too!


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## mackguyver (Feb 20, 2017)

Jopa said:


> Maiaibing said:
> 
> 
> > StudentOfLight said:
> ...


I saw that, too, and that's a steep price to pay for the soft bokeh. In Sony's case, you have sensor+lens stabilization, plus nice clean high ISO, but still...


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## moreorless (Feb 21, 2017)

That seems a bit of a strange one to me on a system that's still lacking a lot of core lenses.

Price wise as well your talking close to the Canon 85mm F/1.2 and not that far off of the new Nikon 105mm F/1.4, even ignoring the loss of T-stop your still talking a lot less basic DOF control.


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## pokerz (Mar 19, 2017)

Jopa said:


> Maiaibing said:
> 
> 
> > StudentOfLight said:
> ...


Have you ever used a real STF len?


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## Jopa (Mar 19, 2017)

pokerz said:


> Jopa said:
> 
> 
> > Maiaibing said:
> ...



Yes. The Sony 135 2.8 (4.5) STF. I never owned it though. Why?
Also, it's "lens" (singular)


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## C4RBON (Jun 9, 2017)

I didn't see it posted in this thread, but I just stumbled upon the "Venus Optics Laowa 105mm f/2 Smooth Trans Focus Lens for Canon EF" https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1247147-REG/venus_optics_ve10520c_laowa_105mm_f_2_smooth.html

It's got an apodization filter, is fully manual, and costs $700. Ken Rockwell has a review: http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/laowa/105mm.htm


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## Rowk (Jul 26, 2017)

Greetings everybody!
Wouldn't that Apodization Filter kill the magic of the 135L ?
When I look at Sony 135 STF images...somehow I think that the bokeh is missing character.
Yes it's blurry, but to me it looks kind of boring, sterile, unspectacular - I can't really explain that.
It's just unsharp, nothing more...same thing with Sigma's 135 Art.

While images from the Canon 135L show something that's enchanting me.
There's like a soft swirl in the bokeh that I really enjoy!
But it's certainly a matter of taste.

It's 2017 and I want a 135mm lens...but what to buy? For a 20 years old lens, the 135L is still pretty expensive.
I might be patient enough to wait for the new 135L and would appreciate IS on that focal length, but after reading this I'm afraid it won't only be sharper but also lose some of it's magic.


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## Khalai (Jul 26, 2017)

Rowk said:


> Greetings everybody!
> Wouldn't that Apodization Filter kill the magic of the 135L ?
> When I look at Sony 135 STF images...somehow I think that the bokeh is missing character.
> Yes it's blurry, but to me it looks kind of boring, sterile, unspectacular - I can't really explain that.
> ...



There is nothing wrong with current 135/2L lens. You can get it for a good price either new or even better preowned for under 600 €. IS would be handy, agreed, but not entirely necessary...


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## hmatthes (Jul 26, 2017)

Khalai said:


> There is nothing wrong with current 135/2L lens. You can get it for a good price either new or even better preowned for under 600 €. IS would be handy, agreed, but not entirely necessary...


CPS loaned me one and I am quite taken with the images it produces. Its too long for my practice but a wonderful, affordable, L lens.


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## Khalai (Jul 26, 2017)

hmatthes said:


> Khalai said:
> 
> 
> > There is nothing wrong with current 135/2L lens. You can get it for a good price either new or even better preowned for under 600 €. IS would be handy, agreed, but not entirely necessary...
> ...



I've been thinking about buying 135/2L for a long time, but with my 70-200/2.8L IS II, that would make a rather redundant setup. And I'm not giving up that white marvel anytime soon


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 26, 2017)

Khalai said:


> I've been thinking about buying 135/2L for a long time, but with my 70-200/2.8L IS II, that would make a rather redundant setup. And I'm not giving up that white marvel anytime soon



I had both for a while, but sold the 135/2L for that very reason.


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