# Body for Wedding Photography



## bvphotography (May 13, 2014)

For a main body for wedding photography, should I take the leap and buy a 5d mark3 or would a 6d be plenty of camera? Why?


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## Don Haines (May 13, 2014)

bvphotography said:


> For a main body for wedding photography, should I take the leap and buy a 5d mark3 or would a 6d be plenty of camera? Why?



5D3.

The 6D may be a bit better than the 5D3 on the center focus point, but many times you are focusing on something to the side..... a white dress makes a nasty target for AF.......


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## bvphotography (May 13, 2014)

That makes sense. I do like using primes with very wide apertures so focus with centre point and recompose could leave me with too many soft images whereas if I can select a focal point over the eye I should have a much higher keeper rate.


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## tolusina (May 13, 2014)

bvphotography said:


> ...... I do like using primes with very wide apertures........


6D allows for optional focusing screens. The Eg-S "_provides easier manual focusing through your viewfinder on subjects in low light when using lenses with a wide aperture between f/1.8 to f/2.8._ "
That might be just the ticket, especially at the reception.



 .


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## mackguyver (May 13, 2014)

tolusina said:


> bvphotography said:
> 
> 
> > ...... I do like using primes with very wide apertures........
> ...


I would agree - when I used to cover a lot of events, mostly in dark theaters or at night outdoors, I used the 5DII with that screen and it made it easy to focus my f/1.4 primes.


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## bvphotography (May 13, 2014)

So you would just let the camera auto focus and get close and then you can see if it needs tweaking and if it does then just adjust the focus manually until sharp? Does this only work with the centre point? If so then I don't think it will help much since once I recompose the centre focus point won't necessarily be the area I want in focus, it could be another area of the screen.


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## mackguyver (May 13, 2014)

bvphotography said:


> So you would just let the camera auto focus and get close and then you can see if it needs tweaking and if it does then just adjust the focus manually until sharp? Does this only work with the centre point? If so then I don't think it will help much since once I recompose the centre focus point won't necessarily be the area I want in focus, it could be another area of the screen.


I found that center point AF on the 5DII worked pretty well for focus/recompose until the light got really low, then I would do exactly that. I would try the AF and if it failed, I'd manually focus, or as happened most of the time, it would focus, but not accurately, so I'd tweak it manually. The 6D is supposed to have excellent center point AF even in very low light, so it might negate the need to manually focus entirely. The focus screen in the 5DIII is grainy crap in comparison to the Eg-S.


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## bvphotography (May 13, 2014)

The problem that I have is not that the 6d doesn't focus accurately, the centre point is very accurate. The problem I have is that when using an aperture of 1.4-1.8 that the depth of field is so shallow that when you recompose, the small change to the focal plane is just enough to cause the eyes to become soft.


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## bdunbar79 (May 13, 2014)

Best wedding camera on the market right now, hands-down, is the 5D Mark III. Focus and recompose is the worst idea ever and with the 5D3's AF system, you don't need to worry about that crap. The outer AF points are stellar. If I were going to be doing weddings I would have two of them.


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## mackguyver (May 13, 2014)

bvphotography said:


> The problem that I have is not that the 6d doesn't focus accurately, the centre point is very accurate. The problem I have is that when using an aperture of 1.4-1.8 that the depth of field is so shallow that when you recompose, the small change to the focal plane is just enough to cause the eyes to become soft.


That is where the Eg-S screen allows you to "touch up" the focus because you can actually see the DOF at f/1.8+ versus ~f/2.8+ for the normal screen. It's not as easy with the 24-28-35-50mm lengths, but with the 85 & 135 it works wonders. Beyond that, it's best to use the outer points for AF.


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## Khalai (May 13, 2014)

bdunbar79 said:


> Best wedding camera on the market right now, hands-down, is the 5D Mark III. Focus and recompose is the worst idea ever and with the 5D3's AF system, you don't need to worry about that crap. The outer AF points are stellar. If I were going to be doing weddings I would have two of them.



Not to doubt about 5D3 AF for a second but people seem to be really underestimating 6D outer AF points. They are actually quite reliable under moderate light, assuming a good contrast edge (but you need edge even with 1Dx AF points anyway). I was able to use my 6D with rather dated 50/1.4 USM with outer points quite well even at low light scenarios (ISO 3200+, 1/50-1/100s and f/1.6-f/2). The centre point is another chapter entirely, that beast locks on anything with some photons on it


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## Eldar (May 13, 2014)

Most is said, but a good argument for the 5DIII is the silent mode. I don´t know if the 6D has it. 

The shutter explosion from a 1DX during the church ceremony may cause a heart attack, whereas the 5DIII silent mode is really silent.


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## NYCPHOTO (May 13, 2014)

My main Camera is a 5D3 with a 6D for as my second/backup.

And I have to say....I truly see them that way.

If i had to do a job with just the 6D, it would be fine.
But I truly prefer working with my 5D3 for so many reasons.

One feature I only noticed months after buying the 6D was that it had no pc port, making it impossible to put a flash on top of the camera and also plug a pocket wizard in for room lights. Fortunaly another member of the forum guided me to a TTL hotshoe with a pc port ( thank you Valvebounce ) 
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/765444-REG/Vello_HSA_PSC_PC_Top_Shoe.html
so now I have one less reason to prefer the 5D.

The one time I always grab the 6D is when I'm going out for fun. It's so much lighter and the images themselves at equal to the 5D3.

So, if you have the extra dollars...I'd to with the 5D3

Arnie


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## RLPhoto (May 14, 2014)

5D3


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## Click (May 14, 2014)

5D3


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## sagittariansrock (May 14, 2014)

mackguyver said:


> bvphotography said:
> 
> 
> > The problem that I have is not that the 6d doesn't focus accurately, the centre point is very accurate. The problem I have is that when using an aperture of 1.4-1.8 that the depth of field is so shallow that when you recompose, the small change to the focal plane is just enough to cause the eyes to become soft.
> ...



I am not a pro, but I would rather rely on spot-on AF than a good manual focusing screen when on a paid gig, even for a fast prime. Especially considering the AF capabilities of the 5DIII.


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## Maximilian (May 14, 2014)

Eldar said:


> Most is said, but a good argument for the 5DIII is the silent mode. I don´t know if the 6D has it.
> 
> The shutter explosion from a 1DX during the church ceremony may cause a heart attack, whereas the 5DIII silent mode is really silent.


Absolutely my opinion. I love the silent mode and use it almost every time except for high speed series.
The silent mode and the more flexible AF system (compared to the 6D) makes the 5DIII THE wedding camera.


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## Khalai (May 14, 2014)

Maximilian said:


> Eldar said:
> 
> 
> > Most is said, but a good argument for the 5DIII is the silent mode. I don´t know if the 6D has it.
> ...



6D has a silent mode, quite damped sound from my experience. But no doubt about 5D3 AF superiority (but for my uses, the AF difference was not worth the price difference).


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## Maximilian (May 14, 2014)

Khalai said:


> Maximilian said:
> 
> 
> > Eldar said:
> ...


Thank you for this information. 
I wasn't sure about this and did some skimming and pdf search through the manual, but couldn't find anything. :-[
Strage! Normally I don't miss such things. :-\


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## distant.star (May 14, 2014)

.
My belief is the main design impetus for the 5D3 was event and wedding photography. I think they made a perfect tool for such work. To overlook this would seem foolish to me.

Comparing the possibly slightly better center focus point of a 6D in some situations to the overall capabilities of the 5D3 is like comparing the taste of a single orange to the ownership of an entire orange grove.


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## Khalai (May 14, 2014)

Maximilian said:


> Khalai said:
> 
> 
> > Maximilian said:
> ...



It has single shot, burst mode, silent shot, silent burst, 2sec timer and 10sec timer modes. I use the silent shot quite often, it's a noticeable difference but there seems to be just a bit more VF blackout (noticeable only if you know about it really, nothing field-relevant IMHO).

As for the 5D3 as a perfect wedding camera - couldn't agree more, it has all the bells and whistles. 6D is a more of a casual/landscape/travel body (weight, GPS, WiFi, image quality equal if not a wee bit better than 5D3). But I would not hesitate to use it for wedding either. For many years, 5D2 was the go-to-camera for weddings so why not use 6D as well.


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## Maximilian (May 14, 2014)

distant.star said:


> .
> My belief is the main design impetus for the 5D3 was event and wedding photography. I think they made a perfect tool for such work. To overlook this would seem foolish to me.
> 
> Comparing the possibly slightly better center focus point of a 6D in some situations to the overall capabilities of the 5D3 is like comparing the taste of a single orange to the ownership of an entire orange grove.


agree 100%


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## Maximilian (May 14, 2014)

Khalai said:


> It has single shot, burst mode, ...
> just a bit more VF blackout (noticeable only if you know about it really, nothing field-relevant IMHO).


Yes, now I have looked it after more concentrated and found.
Of course the VF blackout must be a little bit longer. How could you achieve the noise reduction other than smothening and slowing down the motion cam of the mirror?
It's similar with the 5DIII.


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## Ruined (May 15, 2014)

distant.star said:


> .
> My belief is the main design impetus for the 5D3 was event and wedding photography. I think they made a perfect tool for such work. To overlook this would seem foolish to me.
> 
> Comparing the possibly slightly better center focus point of a 6D in some situations to the overall capabilities of the 5D3 is like comparing the taste of a single orange to the ownership of an entire orange grove.



It is a shame the 'orange grove' of the 5D3 does not allow for user changeable focus screens; for ultra thin DOF composition such as bride portraits, the Eg-S in the 6D is going to be superior to the 5D3's fixed stock screen - since with the 6D you can actually see what is truly in focus unlike the 5D3.

Regarding other aspects of AF capability, 5D3 is definitely better for run and gun, but you can do a lot with the 6D if you master its AF - 6D definitely can do the job, much like wedding photographers did the job with the 5D2 and 5D.


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## Eldar (May 15, 2014)

You can install the Eg-S focusing screen in the 5DIII. It requires a bit more work and a steady hand. See the video at Vimeo:

5D Mark III - Focusing Screen for Manual Lenses on Vimeo


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## KKCFamilyman (May 18, 2014)

Pair of 5d3's. Af, better lcd if outdoor wedding for playback, joystick to move focus points faster, balances nicer with primes like 85 1.2 and 70-200 2.8, larger viewfinder. Just a few for me.


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## Ruined (May 19, 2014)

Eldar said:


> You can install the Eg-S focusing screen in the 5DIII. It requires a bit more work and a steady hand. See the video at Vimeo:



Even if you were to take apart the 5D3 and install the Eg-S screen (which is not intended to be done by an end user), the metering would be off as there is no option to change the metering to accommodate the Eg-S in the 5D3 firmware (unlike the 6D, for instance, which has the option in the firmware).


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## Eldar (May 19, 2014)

Ruined said:


> Eldar said:
> 
> 
> > You can install the Eg-S focusing screen in the 5DIII. It requires a bit more work and a steady hand. See the video at Vimeo:
> ...


I have just bought a second hand 5DIII and ordered the Eg-S focusing screen. It does not look difficult enough to do, not to try. I know the metering will be off, but I expect a fixed manual exposure compensation should do it. If it does not work, I´ll return the standard screen and give it to my wife. 
I have also ordered the Ec-S screen for my 1DX, but I don´t see that as a long term solution, due to its primary use with the long whites and extenders.


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## Andrew Davies Photography (May 19, 2014)

Hi , As a pro wedding tog i went through the same dilemna 6d v 5d3 but in the end all of the specs pointed to the 5d3 and i still use my 5d2s aswell.

Biggest points of 5D3 for me ( not sure on 6D ) but v 5D2

Silent shutter ( is not silent but very quiet )
Dual cards for instant back up - a no brainer
Locked dials so no accidental moving of modes like with the 5D2
Setting of Min Shutter Speed in AV mode
Better screen in sunlight
Better AF for moving shots if you need it

 Wedding Photographer Durham Darlington Teesside Newcastle York


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## Eldar (May 20, 2014)

Today I installed an Eg-S focusing screen in a 5DIII body. It was a very simple operation, even though the focusing screen is not a perfect match. Focusing with the Otus through the view finder, wide open, became a Lot easier. I was even surprised how well it worked also in dim light.

I have done comparisons between the two 5DIII bodies I have, the other with the standard focusing screen. With the Eg-S I got a 2/3 stop over exposure, which I compensated for. So the only consequence of using this focusing screen, as far as i can see, is that I cannot shoot manual with auto ISO, unless Canon provides the same option as they did with the 1DX.

Auto focus worked just fine.


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## mackguyver (May 20, 2014)

Eldar said:


> Today I installed an Eg-S focusing screen in a 5DIII body. It was a very simple operation, even though the focusing screen is not a perfect match. Focusing with the Otus through the view finder, wide open, became a Lot easier. I was even surprised how well it worked also in dim light.
> 
> I have done comparisons between the two 5DIII bodies I have, the other with the standard focusing screen. With the Eg-S I got a 2/3 stop over exposure, which I compensated for. So the only consequence of using this focusing screen, as far as i can see, is that I cannot shoot manual with auto ISO, unless Canon provides the same option as they did with the 1DX.
> 
> Auto focus worked just fine.


Eldar, thanks for sharing your experiences with the screen and I'm happy that you're having a better time focusing the Otus 55 now. As for the lack of auto ISO in Manual mode, I doubt that's as big of a deal with that lens as it would be with the 200-400 1.4x or 600.


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## Dylan777 (May 21, 2014)

mackguyver said:


> Eldar said:
> 
> 
> > Today I installed an Eg-S focusing screen in a 5DIII body. It was a very simple operation, even though the focusing screen is not a perfect match. Focusing with the Otus through the view finder, wide open, became a Lot easier. I was even surprised how well it worked also in dim light.
> ...



So you have to select ISO in M mode with 1D X? This is one the reason I didn't like about 5D II + AF of course.


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## Eldar (May 21, 2014)

Dylan777 said:


> mackguyver said:
> 
> 
> > Eldar said:
> ...


No, you can do auto ISO and you can also do exposure compensation (offset) in manual mode, with the 1DX. With the 5DIII you can do auto ISO, but you cannot do exposure compensation with auto ISO.


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## mackguyver (May 21, 2014)

Dylan777 said:


> So you have to select ISO in M mode with 1D X? This is one the reason I didn't like about 5D II + AF of course.


Eldar beat me to it, but here's my reply as well:

No, but in his case, he's using the unsupported screen and in the 5DIII he would have to set ISO manually in the 5DIII to add 2/3 EV. In the 1D X with the new firmware, you can set Auto ISO in Manual mode AND dial in +2/3 EV and the ISO will automatically adjust to keep the +2/3 EV, just like it would in Av of T mode. It's one of the cooler features of the new firmware and one that many of us have asked for for years. It's also one, along with the Auto ISO minimum shutter speed going above 1/250s that we all wish they would add to the 5DIII


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