# Stuck filter on Zeiss 15 :( - help needed



## niels123 (Jul 21, 2015)

I don't want to damage my shiny Zeiss 15, but a polarizer is heavily stuck on it. I think it gently hit something with the front of the filter because it looks it's not straight on the lens. I never use force when screwing filters on a lens...

Any suggestions to fix it? It's really stuck and pliers are not an option. Also the wrench tool doesn't fit because of the fixed lens hood. I tried to remove it by using the 'outside' teeth of two wrench tools (on both sides between the parts of the hood), but there is no movement at all 

Here's two photos:

http://s29.postimg.org/tat57fl3b/IMG_9634.jpg
http://s29.postimg.org/cbk6s69vr/IMG_9635.jpg


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## Don Haines (Jul 21, 2015)

niels123 said:


> I don't want to damage my shiny Zeiss 15, but a polarizer is heavily stuck on it. I think it gently hit something with the front of the filter because it looks it's not straight on the lens. I never use force when screwing filters on a lens...
> 
> Any suggestions to fix it? It's really stuck and pliers are not an option. Also the wrench tool doesn't fit because of the fixed lens hood. I tried to remove it by using the 'outside' teeth of two wrench tools (on both sides between the parts of the hood), but there is no movement at all
> 
> ...



it looks like it is cross-threaded.....

do you have any way to cool the polarizing filter without cooling the lens? If you can cool it, the metal will shrink a very tiny amount and that might be enough to make a difference.


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## niels123 (Jul 21, 2015)

Don Haines said:


> niels123 said:
> 
> 
> > I don't want to damage my shiny Zeiss 15, but a polarizer is heavily stuck on it. I think it gently hit something with the front of the filter because it looks it's not straight on the lens. I never use force when screwing filters on a lens...
> ...



I have a freezer with cooling elements and access to liquid nitrogen. I'm afraid though, that liquid nitrogen will cause the filter glass to break and cooling the filter without cooling the lens is difficult. Also, heating the lens (hood) is tricky because heat is not good for the lenses itself...


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## arthurbikemad (Jul 21, 2015)

What a nightmare!

It looks like the filter was a turn or two out then the bump has knocked one side in cross threading the filter, it's hard enough unscrewing a dust filled filter, all I can advise is applying presure evenly around the whole ring as gripping one side often distorts and locks the threads making it hard to unscrew, I find using a flat hand to press and turn without gripping the sides is best to unscrew hard to move filters, what with the hood it makes it harder!


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## niels123 (Jul 21, 2015)

arthurbikemad said:


> What a nightmare!
> 
> It looks like the filter was a turn or two out then the bump has knocked one side in cross threading the filter, it's hard enough unscrewing a dust filled filter, all I can advise is applying presure evenly around the whole ring as gripping one side often distorts and locks the threads making it hard to unscrew, I find using a flat hand to press and turn without gripping the sides is best to unscrew hard to move filters, what with the hood it makes it harder!



I know. The problem is that it is a very thin polarizer. If you just use a flat hand, press and turn then you only turn the front part of the filter itself.


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 21, 2015)

arthurbikemad said:


> What a nightmare!



+1

Because it's a CPL, the spanner wrench type of filter remover (rubber or metal) won't work, either. 

Can you fit a rubber band around the filter, inside the fixed hood, then twist the slack part of the band to tighten it around the filter, and use that as a lever?


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## niels123 (Jul 21, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> arthurbikemad said:
> 
> 
> > What a nightmare!
> ...



I tried, but the as soon as you apply tension, the band simply 'lifts' instead of nicely tightening around the filter.

How much change to you give cooling and how much cooling would still be safe for the filter?


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## arthurbikemad (Jul 21, 2015)

The band is a good idea, if it slips what about a thin strip of leather, used like a oil filter wrench?


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## niels123 (Jul 21, 2015)

arthurbikemad said:


> The band is a good idea, if it slips what about a thin strip of leather, used like a oil filter wrench?



Sounds like its definitely worth to try. I don't have it, so I need to purchase something first.


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## NWPhil (Jul 21, 2015)

you better take it to a good camera repair store right away.
- be prepared to loose the filter

not sure which brand it is, but worst case scenario, you would be to remove the filter glass - probably cracking it, which represents a challenge by itself.
Then, protect the lens body and shade as best as possible and with some wide mouth pliers - like this one's:
http://www.irwin.com/tools/pliers-adjustable-wrenches/groovelock-pliers, squeeze the filter out of the rim. That would preserve the lens threads or what's left of them
I was able to remove a stuck thread stuck filter on my departed ef 80-200mm. The filter was already without glass, so I applied some gaffer tape around the rim, and then was just a matter of brute force, while making sure that only the filter rim was being squeezed. The filter eventually pop-out after made look like a 8 and getting the tape out

I would not have enough @@ to do this on the Zeiss....


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## Zeidora (Jul 21, 2015)

If you have a wide-opening plumber's wrench, you could to outside to outside of filter, an twist by 10-15 degrees per turn where the hood has an opening. A tiny amount of creeping oil (WD-40 in the US) may also help, spray on cotton swab, then rub cotton along visible threads. Cooling with ice also sounds good; I'd stay away from LN2.

Camera repair shop may be an even better option, particularly considering this is a $4K lens.


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## niels123 (Jul 21, 2015)

Zeidora said:


> If you have a wide-opening plumber's wrench, you could to outside to outside of filter, an twist by 10-15 degrees per turn where the hood has an opening. A tiny amount of creeping oil (WD-40 in the US) may also help, spray on cotton swab, then rub cotton along visible threads. Cooling with ice also sounds good; I'd stay away from LN2.
> 
> Camera repair shop may be an even better option, particularly considering this is a $4K lens.



I think Camera repair shops don't have experience with these lenses. If I'd go there and they get to remove the filter with the threads of the lens damaged, it will be very difficult to prove that they did this. Therefore, I will make a phone call to Zeiss directly when they are open again tomorrow. This will probably the most expensive filter removal ever for me...


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## Hector1970 (Jul 21, 2015)

Know the feeling. I dropped my 70-200mm on its head and dented the filter.
Still can't get it off.
A rubber band is a good start.
You can get a jam jar opener and try that (its a thick rubber thing)

If you really want to go risky.
Score the glass of the filter to break it and take the glass out.
Cover the glass on your lens
Hacksaw the edges of the filter and twist it inwards.
The filter comes off.
A High risk process.


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## Don Haines (Jul 22, 2015)

If you have a chunk of metal that would be the appropriate size to rest against the filter, throw the chunk in the freezer for a few hours and then use that to cool the filter.

I would not try heating the lens..... to much potential for disaster..... same for liquid nitrogen 

You just want a bit of cooling as anything extreme could be a shattering experience.


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## Don Haines (Jul 22, 2015)

niels123 said:


> Zeidora said:
> 
> 
> > If you have a wide-opening plumber's wrench, you could to outside to outside of filter, an twist by 10-15 degrees per turn where the hood has an opening. A tiny amount of creeping oil (WD-40 in the US) may also help, spray on cotton swab, then rub cotton along visible threads. Cooling with ice also sounds good; I'd stay away from LN2.
> ...



That is the safest course of action.....

Cross threaded devices are hard to deal with at the best of times.... the obstructions from the lens hood and the rotating outer element of the polarizing filter make it worse..

There is no shame in admitting that something is beyond your abilities and sending it off to the experts (Zeiss).... but there is lots of embarrassment in breaking an expensive lens.... Also note that Zeiss will be able to clean up the threading on the lens... if it isn't done you will continue to have filter problems in the future.


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## bluemoon (Jul 22, 2015)

if you still want to do it yourself, the filter seems to have a ring that's holding the glass in place. There are two notches on it and you might be able to turn and unscrew that ring. This should make the glass come out and let you butcher the outside ring as already described. A call to the filter manufacturer might get you the replacement part too.

On the other hand, anything but sending it to Zeiss is a gamble!

pierre


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## RGF (Jul 22, 2015)

There are flexible pad that are used to loosen jar lids. I have used these to loosen a filter. May give you enough extra grip to free the filter.

Good luck.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jul 22, 2015)

I'd suggest a nylon tie wrap. They have little plastic teeth on the inside that will give them a grip but will not damage the filter. Measure the OD of the filter to get the right length, they are available in the electrical section of Home Depot, Lowes, and even Harbor Freight. Don't worry if they also grip the front part of the filter, there are some teeth on the rear part that it will grab, the front can turn with it. Use the small knob and extra tie material to rotate it. You will only be able to turn it a partial turn, but if that loosens it, you can slip it off and toss it. You may have to use additional ones if a partial turn does not loosen it.

The issue may be clearance with the hood. 

I don't like those filter wrenches myself. I bought a adjustable filter removal tool at Micro Tools a few years back, and its great. It adjusts to fit pretty much any size filter securely and easily. They are now selling the ones I don't like. It is basically a strap wrench concept, but its 1/4 wide and works well. I've searched for more of them, but no luck.


As a final resort, send it to me, and I'll remove the filter and return it promptly. (I might keep the lens for my effort  )


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## arthurbikemad (Jul 22, 2015)

Great idea! Maybe a zip tie would work, if it slips use a rubber band too to help it grip. Hope you get it off.


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## niels123 (Jul 22, 2015)

Today I contacted Carl Zeiss Germany. They can try to remove the filter. If the lens thread is not damaged, it will cost about 100 euros. If the lens thread needs to be replaced, the replacement will cost an additional 250 euros.

The most surprising part (for me) is: if Zeiss damages the front element when removing the filter, I will have to pay for it. In my opinion, when I pay a company to fix something, they also have to pay for additional damage that they might make.


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## niels123 (Jul 29, 2015)

Yesterday, I have sent the lens to Zeiss. Better safe than sorry...


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