# Rebel T4i/650D Information [CR1]



## Canon Rumors Guy (Mar 19, 2012)

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<strong>The next Rebel


</strong>Information regarding the next Rebel is quite scattered. Though we have confirmed a new 18-135 lens with a silent autofocus motor as the new feature of the lens.</p>
<p>Since talking about that lens, there’s been a lot of speculation as to whether or not the Rebel would receive a new autofocus feature for video recording. I cannot confirm or deny that, but for a camera that is more consumer aimed, it would be a welcomed feature to those wanting to shoot video.</p>
<p>There has also been a few suggestions the next Rebel will have a touchscreen and built in WiFi. Niether feature can be confirmed at this time either.</p>
<p>Other unconfirmed specs show the camera to be 18.1mp and running DIGIC 5, which should improve noise performance and overall image quality. I’m told we won’t see a new APS-C sensor until the 60D and 7D replacements are addressed.</p>
<p>I think we’re going to see T4i/650D info and an announcement after the 5D Mark III begins shipping across the globe this week (Asia and Europe have seen some shipments arrive). It’s possible a new Rebel could arrive before NAB next month in Las Vegas.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.amazon.fr/Canon-Eos-650d-pour-Nuls/dp/275404017X" target="_blank">EOS 650D book appears on Amazon</a>?</p>
<p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">c</span>r</strong></p>
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## Tijn (Mar 19, 2012)

No sensor upgrade until the 60D/7D replacement has been addressed? Wow. So they'd be sticking with 4-year-old sensor technology, re-using the same sensor used in the 550D, 600D, 60D and 7D for the "new" 650D? Haahahahahaha!!, erm, ahum. That'd be very surprising to me.


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## ctmike (Mar 19, 2012)

Then I hope they get to announcing 60D and 7D successors real quick.


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## phemark (Mar 19, 2012)

Im waiting for 650D announcement until i decide on my first DSLR: if it is going to have a new sensor, ill probably get it, if not, i will most likely take used 550d (cheapest one with the same sensor) and a good lens.


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## dstppy (Mar 19, 2012)

phemark said:


> Im waiting for 650D announcement until i decide on my first DSLR: if it is going to have a new sensor, ill probably get it, if not, i will most likely take used 550d (cheapest one with the same sensor) and a good lens.



Well, it depends on price though. If it's reasonably priced (around the same as the launch of the T3i), Digic V should be a bump that is well worth getting it at launch.

Honestly, I hope this means we'll be seeing a new 60D/7D or merged line sooner rather than later.


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## EOBeav (Mar 19, 2012)

It's amazing how the specs of a Rebel have gone up over the last few iterations. No one should be ashamed to shoot with one, especially if you put some decent glass in front of it. Yes, it has the "consumer" label attached to it, but it won't hold you back from producing good images. Within the upper ISO limits, of course. 

I wouldn't be surprised if this is announced before the next xxD/7D replacement. More people seem to be jumping into the world of DSLR photography than ever before, and this a Rebel is the logical place to start.


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## DzPhotography (Mar 19, 2012)

Tijn said:


> No sensor upgrade until the 60D/7D replacement has been addressed? Wow. So they'd be sticking with 4-year-old sensor technology, re-using the same sensor used in the 550D, 600D, 60D and 7D for the "new" 650D? Haahahahahaha!!, erm, ahum. That'd be very surprising to me.


seems completely logical to me... : they will not use rebel line to introduce a new sensor...


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## traveller (Mar 19, 2012)

phemark said:


> Im waiting for 650D announcement until i decide on my first DSLR: if it is going to have a new sensor, ill probably get it, if not, i will most likely take used 550d (cheapest one with the same sensor) and a good lens.



I wouldn't bother waiting, no new camera will compensate you for the shots that you will miss in the meantime. If we were all expecting the 650D to be a quantum leap in performance, then you might have a reason to hold off buying, but generally Canon do not introduce their latest technology on the 'Rebel' bodies. Buy a body now that appeals to you, be that Canon, Nikon, Sony or whatever. 

My second piece of advice, if you think that photography will be anything more than a passing interest, is to buy the next level up in the range (of whichever brand you decide upon). I made the mistake with my first DSLR (a 450D) and within a year wished that I'd gone for a 40D or D90 instead. It isn't a big difference in price compared to the improved ergonomics and performance that you get in return. O.K. if you're really skint I can see the reasoning for an 'entry-level' model, but I'd still be tempted to recommend a second hand, higher spec model from the previous generation in most cases (I wouldn't go too old though -30Ds and D80s are a bit on the dated side now).


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## phemark (Mar 19, 2012)

traveller said:


> phemark said:
> 
> 
> > Im waiting for 650D announcement until i decide on my first DSLR: if it is going to have a new sensor, ill probably get it, if not, i will most likely take used 550d (cheapest one with the same sensor) and a good lens.
> ...



Thanks for your thoughs.

I thought about that too, but the most important thing to me in a camera is (will be) the IQ. I dont need lots of fps or weather sealing (although all of it, together with better AF would be nice, and i like buying the newest gadgets). And as 7d, 60d, 600d,550d all have the same sensor, they will (should?) give the same IQ given the same lenses and conditions. Id rather invest in better lenses (as everyone is telling that to newbies - i am starting to believe it  )

I even though of used 5d mark2, as they should be getting cheaper now, but its a little expensive with decent lens (and buying 4year old piece of electronics havent settled down with me yet..  And 5dm2 as a first DSLR seems a bit too high (?) (I've been reading books/magazines/internet for about 3 months now, getting to know how photography works - manual setting of my girlfriend's bridge camera doesnt seem strange to me anymore  )

The actual deadline for me when to get camera is middle of June, because then i will have a trip to Spain, and i would really want to take my new camera with me.


How would you invest ~1000 pounds if you wanted to get camera+lens+all the accesories (bag, cards, tripod etc.) (think UK prices too  )? (or at very least, just camera+lens)


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## Wahoowa (Mar 19, 2012)

phemark said:


> traveller said:
> 
> 
> > phemark said:
> ...



Even though the sensors in the T3i, 60D and 7D are very similar, those cameras are still much different in term of camera controls. This is similar to the old film era that they had different selections for the bodies. I've used T1i, T2i (both belonged to my wife), 60D, 7D, 5D, 5D Mark II, 1Ds Mark III and 1D Mark IV and I can tell you that the sensor is not the only thing that makes the differences.

Since you mention that you'll go to Spain in June, my best suggestion is for you to get a new body about a month before your trip. Since this will be your first DSLR, you will want to get yourself familiar with the body first. You wouldn't want to waste any opportunity because you don't use it to its full potential.

Say, if the end of May is your deadline, I don't see much point in the wait. I mean, unless T4i is released with a new great sensor, why wait? The new T4i will be about $800 at first launch and it could be more expensive if it follows the same trend as the recent Canon releases. I would get a used 60D now for a much lower price.

And, yes, a good lens will go a long way. For the starter, I'd suggest the 15-85 IS over the kit 18-55 IS.


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## grongi (Mar 19, 2012)

phemark said:


> traveller said:
> 
> 
> > phemark said:
> ...



Hi, I'm also thinking about getting a new body and I think I'll go for the 600d as video is the thing that I want to use it for the most. I don't know how much of a price drop there will be if there's going to be a new camera announced in the next couple of weeks on that specific model, but if you can wait for it, atleast I would. I'm by no means a proffessional and I also wonder how much of a diffrence there 'll be between those two cameras considering actual image quality etc. I wouldn't also care that much about getting a super high end model, of course if you can find a "reasonably" priced one used,then get it but as a beginner myself I think you'll be better of useing your camera fully, which actually reminds me of this saying: "The best camera is the one you have with you". The most important thing is to enjoy what you're doing, invest in lenses or something and again as I see it concentrate on takeing pictures rather than losing yourself within a shitload of specs. 

-Cheers


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## sootzzs (Mar 19, 2012)

I am also preparing to buy my new dSLR. And as much as I already want to have one I think that it worth to wait a week or two even just to see the prices for 600d and 60d go a bit down. Isn't it? 

I would also like to ask the owners of 60d: do you really think it is worth to spend extra $$ (in my case it will be extra 375$) on 60d compared to 600d? I know that most people will say "invest in glass instead". But 375$ is not that much to invest in glass (I don't have more right now) and also I prefer to buy three moderate lenses (18-55 IS, 55-250IS and 50f1.8 II) for ~400$ and cover a lot of range and possibilities to learn and understand which L lens I'll need in the future. I love different kinds of photography and will need this kind of lens for it (which will cost fortune in good glass). Do you think is the right way to think for a complete beginner? 
I love traveling in quite harsh environments (forests, mountains, etc...) and afraid that the 600d wan't be able to withstand it for long (though 60d don't have weatherseeling, it build better(??)). Also I'm afraid to outgrow 600d too fast. 
And lastly (sorry for such amount of questions, it is my first post ), is 600d worth the 120$ markup over 550d? I understand the sensor is the same and I don't care to much about video. I'm quite concerned about the screen in 600d breaking on me in one of this trips. 

Thanks alot! 
Roman.


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## akiskev (Mar 19, 2012)

As Michael Reichmann said on his Canon G1X review...
_Over the past few years Canon has increasingly become the Toyota of the camera industry. By this I mean – the biggest, but also the most conservative. Like Toyota, Canon makes quality products and it competes successfully in almost every segment that it chooses to. But, like Toyota its products usually fail to excite._


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## Marsu42 (Mar 19, 2012)

Tijn said:


> No sensor upgrade until the 60D/7D replacement has been addressed? Wow. So they'd be sticking with 4-year-old sensor technology, re-using the same sensor used in the 550D, 600D, 60D and 7D for the "new" 650D? Haahahahahaha!!, erm, ahum. That'd be very surprising to me.



Imho, this has been clear from day one - Canon always introduces really useful "hard" features (af, sensor) in their top models, and then let them trickle down. They would cannibalize their sales if they did it differently. And apart from that, for an entry-level model the current 18mp sensor is more than good enough if shooting at or under iso 800.


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## facedodge (Mar 19, 2012)

get a 5d classic or 5dii... That way you won't have a bunch of crop lenses to sell like me when you finally go FF.


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## idimoe (Mar 19, 2012)

Tijn said:


> No sensor upgrade until the 60D/7D replacement has been addressed? Wow. So they'd be sticking with 4-year-old sensor technology, re-using the same sensor used in the 550D, 600D, 60D and 7D for the "new" 650D? Haahahahahaha!!, erm, ahum. That'd be very surprising to me.



This. Even if they do upgrade the sensor, I've been looking more at more at the 60D/7D/D7000/D300 replacements that may come later this year. Yes, I can wait until Photokina. Someone take my money already!


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## neuroanatomist (Mar 19, 2012)

Marsu42 said:


> Imho, this has been clear from day one - Canon always introduces really useful "hard" features (af, sensor) in their top models, and then let them trickle down.



Digic processors are "soft" features, then?


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## Tijn (Mar 19, 2012)

Marsu42 said:


> Imho, this has been clear from day one - Canon always introduces really useful "hard" features (af, sensor) in their top models, and then let them trickle down. They would cannibalize their sales if they did it differently.


As far as I know, the sensors between at least the 350D and 500D had been upgrades each time (increasing megapixels for one). And I don't believe that each and every one of those was a clone from a "higher" body. Also, it's never happened that they used the same exact sensor for 5 different bodies over a 3-4 year timespan.


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## vaust (Mar 19, 2012)

Keep the rumors coming.. it's the one am waiting for all day, hopefully soon before summer.


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## peederj (Mar 19, 2012)

I'm thinking Canon will use this Rebel to hold off the mirrorless advance. So I think it will be positioned against the GH2 and NX7 and will have more rather than fewer bells and whistles than the 5D3. I think it will quite likely have the same number of pixels in the new sensor as the 5D3 does, so they can use the same demosaicing system for the video and thus negate the GH2 advantages there. It will have a touchscreen and Wifi may also be built-in.

I think Canon may well take a "give away razors and sell blades" approach and hope to make profits on glass with the Rebel line. The crucial thing is keeping people loyal and recruiting new enthusiasts. They don't want people collecting other mounts.


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## revo2seven (Mar 19, 2012)

too many too choose from have got a chance to purchase a 7D now here comes the T4i/650D dang..ohh canon lower the price of the 7D it will make a lot of people happy


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## Marsu42 (Mar 19, 2012)

Tijn said:


> As far as I know, the sensors between at least the 350D and 500D had been upgrades each time (increasing megapixels for one).



You got me - I should have left out the history lesson, because I'm only watching Canon dslr releases since 2009. But *because* there was no new sensor in the aps-c segment for a long time, they won't release a new one in the cheap model.

I guess at least now Canon marketing will (or would be well advised to do so) to release from top to bottom and only introduce new amateur features like the new 60d/600d screen and now maybe video af & touch screen in the lower segment.


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## dichiaras (Mar 19, 2012)

I guess will save a few hundred $$ by buying the 550D which has the same old sensor of the "new" camera. That's ridiculous: can you imagine Apple putting the same processor in a Mac for FOUR years in a row?
Canon's managers are simply bozos: Steve Jobs would have fired them all at once.

If I didn't have already four lenses and wasn't a simple consumer I would switch immediately to the Nikon D5100.

PS Fortunately karma is gone. 

PPS -1 for Canon.


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## daveswan (Mar 19, 2012)

With the same old sensor and digic V (Not V+ note) I doubt the video will be any better than the 550D, and certainly not up to the 5DIII, let alone a hacked GH2 at probably less money.

Bummer I really don't want to be doing with smaller-than-C sensors.


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## wickidwombat (Mar 19, 2012)

Wierd, with it staying 18MP sony is going to eat canons lunch
I'm not a MP fan just a realist
but in real life hopefully they have fully re-worked that sensor to
- clean up the low iso noise
- sharpen up the raw images a bit get it closer to the 1D4 sensor IQ
- and give it a bit cleaner high iso

also strange if it gets built in wifi when the pro models need to forfeit their first born to get that as a great big add on hanging off the side of the camera.

touchscreen totally useless on a camera IMO

unless the sensor is something special and its got at least the current 60D AF then the outgoing 600D is going to be a screaming good buy for anyone looking to buy a rebel


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## WoodysGamertag (Mar 20, 2012)

Autofocus and wifi would be awesome. I wonder if it's possible to add autofocus to the 5D via firmware?


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## Danack (Mar 20, 2012)

phemark said:


> The actual deadline for me when to get camera is middle of June, because then i will have a trip to Spain, and i would really want to take my new camera with me.



That makes the deadline more like the end of May so that you have a couple of weeks to get used to your new camera, so you don't miss any shots when on your trip.


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## Seamus (Mar 20, 2012)

Wow, so many decisions made on a CR1...


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## Sunnystate (Mar 20, 2012)

The upside is that, I just was able to spent some "Canon" money and got myself very nice brand new Sig Sauer 1911 Fastback- still almost enough money left for Nikon D800  
Now looks like there is no need to upgrade my Rebel also, how about a new bicycle? 
Maybe there is an upside to the plain stupidity and greed out of control?


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## ttl020520 (Mar 20, 2012)

Hope to get it before May


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## ThuiQuaDayNe (Mar 20, 2012)

daveswan said:


> With the same old sensor and digic V (Not V+ note) I doubt the video will be any better than the 550D, and certainly not up to the 5DIII, let alone a hacked GH2 at probably less money.
> 
> Bummer I really don't want to be doing with smaller-than-C sensors.



I am waiting for 5D2 price to come down as well as waiting for this line specs. The T4i specs and performance will give me a glimpse of what will be of 70D/7D2. 

I agree with you, even with a new sensor and Digic 5, the video quality will not be the same level as a hacked GH1/GH2.


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## c.d.embrey (Mar 21, 2012)

Marsu42 said:


> Imho, this has been clear from day one - Canon always introduces really useful "hard" features (af, sensor) in their top models, and then let them trickle down. They would cannibalize their sales if they did it differently...



Then how do you explain the *10.1 Mp 40D* released in Sept 2007, followed by the *12.i Mp Rebel XSi* in March 2008 ???


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## Marsu42 (Mar 21, 2012)

c.d.embrey said:


> Then how do you explain the *10.1 Mp 40D* released in Sept 2007, followed by the *12.i Mp Rebel XSi* in March 2008 ???



Please see my post above stating that I corrected myself concerning the eos body history. However, I would guess that Canon marketing might have learned from the 40d-xsi 10mp-12mp and since there are so many eos bodies around now will discriminate between them in a more strategic way...


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## dichiaras (Mar 29, 2012)

So, still no news here?
It's since CP+ that we are supposed to see the new rebel: I hope that they are working on a better sensor rather than a flipping screen this time.


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