# Companies that process RAW files



## aa_angus (Sep 28, 2016)

Hello,

I am a Melbourne (Australia) based wedding photographer. 
I shoot between 30-60 weddings per year. I shoot between 1500-3000 images per wedding.

Do any of you have experience paying overseas companies to process you raw files? Are there any companies who are priced reasonable who you would recommend? 

I would really appreciate any help or advice here, as I'm currently drowning in Lightroom.

Thanks very much!


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## neuroanatomist (Sep 28, 2016)

*Re: Companies that prices RAW files*

*Companies that prices RAW files*

You might want to edit your title...


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## aa_angus (Sep 29, 2016)

*Re: Companies that prices RAW files*



neuroanatomist said:


> *Companies that prices RAW files*
> 
> You might want to edit your title...



Thanks. I love auto correct.


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## pwp (Sep 29, 2016)

If business is that good get an assistant who can take some of the load. Contact the photography dept at RMIT in Melbourne and see what sort of response you get. A good final year student could have dazzling Lr & Ps skills, and value the opportunity to process files for an established wedding shooter.

Outsourcing? The bottleneck getting your RAWS processed off-shore in say, India, would be the vast data volume/upload delivering your RAW files to them. 

-pw


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## aa_angus (Sep 29, 2016)

pwp said:


> If business is that good get an assistant who can take some of the load. Contact the photography dept at RMIT in Melbourne and see what sort of response you get. A good final year student could have dazzling Lr & Ps skills, and value the opportunity to process files for an established wedding shooter.
> 
> Outsourcing? The bottleneck getting your RAWS processed off-shore in say, India, would be the vast data volume/upload delivering your RAW files to them.
> 
> -pw




Smart previews are apparently much smaller to send


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## Valvebounce (Sep 30, 2016)

Hi aa Angus. 
First I don't use Lightroom, so I'm not sure I understand this correctly but don't you need the raws to process them, surely if you only send smart previews then if they make adjustments you will still need the computer time at your end to process the changes in to jpegs or whatever you export?
Also isn't editing your shots very subjective, how will any third party know what you want a shot to look like?
To me this looks like a 6 and half a dozen situation, you are going to have to send and receive all the files, check the edits, make adjustments to someone else's work and then still tie up your computer to process the changes, how will this lighten your load?

Cheers, Graham. 





aa_angus said:


> Smart previews are apparently much smaller to send


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## aa_angus (Sep 30, 2016)

dilbert said:


> aa_angus said:
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> ...



That's true actually. I'm currently in the process of sampling a selection of companies. You can talk with them, and send examples of your current editing which they can get an idea of how you like your final images to look. So far this seems like a lifesaver! However the real test will be how the final images from a job look, and how much (if any) time I will have to spend tweaking the edits prior to export. 


You can send a Lightroom catalogue + smart edits for a total of 42.6MB, so that part is quick and painless. Its true that I will still have to use my computer to export the files - but I find this quick and easy on my iMac 5K. Plus, I won't need to use the computer much since all my editing will be taken care of 

I will delete this thread shortly as it's in the wrong thread, and it seems I have found a solution to my initial question. Thanks


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## d (Sep 30, 2016)

comment removed by mod


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## LDS (Sep 30, 2016)

Valvebounce said:


> First I don't use Lightroom, so I'm not sure I understand this correctly but don't you need the raws to process them, surely if you only send smart previews then if they make adjustments you will still need the computer time at your end to process the changes in to jpegs or whatever you export?



LR allows for working on smart previews and then apply the changes made to the original images. Because LR doesn't alter the original images but keeps a record of changes made, how it works is almost simple. Smart previews are "good enough" previews to work on, and which allows applying changes to the originals.

Once the changes are applied, exporting in the final format is quite trivial.


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## LDS (Sep 30, 2016)

Did you automate your post-processing workflow enough, or do you spend time to process each image separately? LR allows for storing/copying settings/edits and apply them quickly on many images at a time, even during import - and this is one of the advantages over tools that allow only to process one image at a time.

Some images may need ad-hoc post processing, but many should allow to be processed in a batch, when well shoot under the same conditions.

Anyway, a lot depends on what is your style, how many edits you apply on average to each photo (and which), and what your customers expect.

Relying on an outsourced service means you have to properly instruct them to ensure they match your requirements, and ensure their work quality is constant.


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## WillT (Oct 1, 2016)

I have not used them yet, but I must admit the idea is appealing. At least to all the basic work. These are the companies that were recommenced on another forum. 

The Image Salon 
FotoFafa 
RDFL

I am currently considering The Image Salon


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## rfdesigner (Oct 1, 2016)

aa_angus said:


> Hello,
> 
> I am a Melbourne (Australia) based wedding photographer.
> I shoot between 30-60 weddings per year. I shoot between 1500-3000 images per wedding.
> ...



processing is only one activity you could outsource/employ someone else.

Decide what you think is "core" and what isn't, core stuff should be done under your controll. Outsource for the stuff that is handle turning and just gets in your way and/or the areas you really aren't so good at (no one's perfect)

Processing... how much can you automate?.. is it worth investing in a mega-processing machine. I like the idea of getting in a grad, they could help as an assistant/2nd camera during a shoot and you get them to do the bulk of the basic processing leaving the stuff you really care about and you keep control so they learn what you want and things get better over time.

FYI I ran a small bussiness in another field for a time.


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## Pookie (Oct 1, 2016)

Comment Removed by Mod


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## aa_angus (Oct 2, 2016)

rfdesigner said:


> aa_angus said:
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> 
> > Hello,
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lol none of you seem to understand, I'm trying to spend LESS time editing, not ramp things up. 
One day some of you may run businesses. Of those few who do, some of your businesses will be successful. Now, unfortunately, one of the drawbacks of owning a successful business is that there is a lot of work to do. When the amount of work is too great for one person, it's time to start outsourcing some of the load. I don't expect you simpletons to understand this concept, so don't hurt your brains trying xx


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## d (Oct 2, 2016)

Comment Removed by Mod


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## Valvebounce (Oct 2, 2016)

Hi aa angus. 
I run a business, (cars, not photography) one of my priorities is to help the economy which is supporting me in various ways, one way I see to do that would be to employ local help if I needed it, same country if local is not available, then overseas as a last resort. 
I passionately hate the race to the bottom caused by cheap, cheaper than that and the quality that follows. And yes I do have to buy parts sourced from abroad, typically China these days, but it better be up to quality or you get it back. 
I wish you the best but if I found you were outsourcing abroad I wouldn't use you, cheaper or not unless you were the last resort. 

Cheers, Graham. 



d said:


> aa_angus said:
> 
> 
> > lol none of you seem to understand, I'm trying to spend LESS time editing, not ramp things up.
> ...


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## rfdesigner (Oct 2, 2016)

aa_angus said:


> rfdesigner said:
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nice! :


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## Alex_M (Oct 2, 2016)

That was not a nice thing to say, *aa_angus*.

let me go ahead and apologise on your behalf. I am also living in Melbounre for 20 years now and feel obliged to assure the forum that Melbournians are in general very polite and nice people... Not sure what just happened here..


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## Mikehit (Oct 2, 2016)

Very common problem - OP asks a question, some questions and comments are posed such that the OP takes it as a personal slight about their methods which they believe to be as good as they can be, so gets irritated and posts (shall we say) intemperate responses. 

If people only ever directly answered the question, no more and no less, fora would be pretty boring places to be IMO. 

Given it is their livelihood I would think the OP would take time and think 'I wonder why they said that...' and ask for more details so see if the workload _is_ as efficient as it could be.


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## old-pr-pix (Oct 2, 2016)

In an effort to salvage something from this thread... I have no direct experience photographically using off-shore support; but, I can relate experiences attempting to use outsourced engineering design (CAD/CAM) support between US and India. For engineering there are definite standards and right vs. wrong solutions -- I find it difficult imagine how one would establish quality/style standards for something as subjective as photo PP. Don't underestimate the difficulties of communicating via email -- language and time zones can make real-time communications questionable. The "sales" contact may be fine, but the person actually assigned to work on your account may not be so easy to communicate with - and may change daily. Once settled-in with a workable supplier watch out they don't further sub-contract to an even lower cost (less reliable, less controllable, etc.) source without your knowledge. Suddenly you may get a batch of "crap" and wonder what happened. Or an important project simply gets "lost" in all the exchanges. Of course, they always expect to be paid - even if you are totally dissatisfied with their output. That brings other stresses to resolve.

IMO - as suggested above - hiring a local "assistant" makes the most sense. Someone you can coach daily and guide into matching your style and quality expectations. They may also serve as a workable "second shooter." That can give you a path to grow your business further. Eventually perhaps reaching a point where you can select which events you want to cover and delegate the others to reliable assistants.

Best of luck whatever you decide to do.


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## Orangutan (Oct 2, 2016)

aa_angus said:


> none of you seem to understand, I'm trying to spend LESS time editing



No, we get that. But editing is a significant part of what shows in your portfolio, the basis on which you've been hired. 



> one of the drawbacks of owning a successful business is that there is a lot of work to do.


How much time do you spend processing 3,000-6,000 wedding photos now? How much time do other photographers spend on comparable work? If it's less than what you're spending, then maybe you need to improve your workflow before you outsource a good portion of the basis on which you're hired.


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## TAW (Oct 2, 2016)

I would like to second pwp's suggestion of inquiring locally and working with a student. I run a business (nothing to do with photography) and we bring on an intern every few years. It has been an extremely rewarding experience for us and them... Here is how I approach interns:

1) Try to give them flexible work so they can vary their hours based on school, homework, finals...
2) School comes first - this is as much about giving them experience to move from being a student into the working world. Getting that first experience can be really challenging and when a student does find it, it can really set them apart.
3) Pay them fairly. Some can be so excited about working and getting experience, they are willing to work for free which I think is crazy. Hopefully that helps them learn to treat people fairly as the grow. 
4) If they do something really good and you really make bank, share... Offer to pay some of their tuition...
5) Make sure to give them honest feedback (including investing a little time) so they can really develop and grow. 

I wish you the best in your business!
tom


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## Orangutan (Oct 2, 2016)

TAW said:


> I would like to second pwp's suggestion of inquiring locally and working with a student. I run a business (nothing to do with photography) and we bring on an intern every few years. It has been an extremely rewarding experience for us and them... Here is how I approach interns:
> 
> 1) Try to give them flexible work so they can vary their hours based on school, homework, finals...
> 2) School comes first - this is as much about giving them experience to move from being a student into the working world. Getting that first experience can be really challenging and when a student does find it, it can really set them apart.
> ...



+100

We need more employers like you in the world.


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## Lurker (Oct 2, 2016)

I can't answer your question, I have no experience in the area. I'm at the other end of the spectrum. An amature that gets out a few times a year and shoots hundreds of images at most. Then life takes over and leaves little or no time for post processing. Your questions raise several for me.

Do you do any culling of images? Are you putting all 1500-3000 images into Lightroom? How many images do you actually show to the client? Have you tried other workflow software like Breeze Systems Downloader Pro and BreezeBrowser, Photo Mechanic or FastRawViewer? Some videos advocate culling 90-95% of your images before putting anything into LR. Some suggest rejecting all images and saving only the ones you like. Lots of good tutorials on YouTube, or the software sites, from working pros. 

One big complaint about LR is how slow it is at ingesting images. All the above software render images very fast and support culling images very quickly. I believe all support XMP data too which is then imported into LR.

I recently added FastRawViewer to my workflow. It was about $15, the other 2 options run about $150. As a pro the $150 might not bother you but it was too much for me.


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## Orangutan (Oct 2, 2016)

Lurker said:


> One big complaint about LR is how slow it is at ingesting images.



This is a myth: Lightroom imports images pretty quickly so long as you make two processing selections: (1) choose "add" rather than "move" so the images are imported in-place rather than moved to LR's catalog folder; (2) set "build previews" to "minimal." On my old/slow computer I can import 800+ photos in about 3 minutes for the first cull. You then generate larger previews before processing.


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## Jack Douglas (Oct 2, 2016)

My wee bit of insight unrelated to the OP question. Anyone posting should consider that there will be comments from left field and have a thick enough skin to receive some (borderline) insulting comments. That in no way implies that I condone impolite comments. 

And, just a little effort should be put into framing a question so that it provokes the appropriate responses otherwise it's "ask a stupid question and get a stupid answer".

I applaud those who provide insightful input in spite of the negative aspects associated with a post because it then ends up still providing valuable information that one can glean. I don't have a lot of spare time to burn and use CR as a learning tool, seldom frequenting other sites and I have learned a lot even from threads that go off track. Actually the odd borderline comment can be quite humorous, come to think of it.

It sure would be nice if there was filter automation that would remove the clueless commentary from a thread. 

Jack


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## takesome1 (Oct 2, 2016)

comment removed by mod


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## romanr74 (Oct 2, 2016)

i'm honestly a bit puzzled by that question. i would believe that in wedding photography post is at least as important for the final result as the shooting itself is. to me the outsourcing of post thus sounds like a no-go. am i being naive here? is this a common thing?


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## privatebydesign (Oct 2, 2016)

Jesus Christ guys! How many pro wedding photographers did their own processing back in the film days? Virtually none. How many drew this kind of bullS___ for it? Not one single one of them.

There are many pro photographers that outsource processing, if your gift/skill/strength is in other areas of your business you'd be a fool to not outsource it. And it can be surprisingly reasonably priced.

Outsourced processing companies can provide quick and consistent end product to your requirements and style while you are shooting another wedding, how many of you with your smart arsed comments can be in two places at once? Just talk through with the company what you want and maybe send them an image or three with your style and bang, you are done.

Now I don't shoot the volume needed to make outsourcing a requirement, but if I shot 3 weddings a week I'd absolutely look into it, there are many working pros of all levels, from the $1,000 to over $10,000 a shoot, outsourcing their processing. Again, if it's not an efficient use of your time you would be a bad business person to not outsource, and don't forget, taking on even a part time processor of your own has many far reaching implications and costs for a business that might or might not gel with a particular shooters business model.

Here are some interesting links, unfortunately I can''t give a personal recommendation as I haven't used any of them myself, but it should help.

http://www.mylavalu.com/
https://www.fotofafa.com/
http://theimagesalon.com/#welcome
http://www.photographersedit.com/
http://shootdotedit.com/

There is even an Au based one!

http://rdfl.com.au/


And some reasons why.

https://fstoppers.com/originals/wedding-photographers-get-your-life-back-outsourcing-your-editing-142235

http://jasminestar.com/editing-post-processing/


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## Orangutan (Oct 2, 2016)

unfocused said:


> The OP asked a fairly straightforward question about outsourcing Raw processing.



Often a seemingly straightforward question carries implicit questions or presumptions. In this case, the telling quote is:




> I would really appreciate any help or advice here, as I'm currently drowning in Lightroom.



The underlying problem is that the OP is having trouble keeping up with PP using LR, and is proposing one possible solution. There are many photographers who do that much work using LR, a product largely designed for precisely that purpose, so what could be going on with OP? I can think of several possibilities: (1) the OP wants more free time, and wants to do almost zero LR. (2) OP likes shooting, but not PP. (3) OP has a slow computer. (4) OP has weak LR skills, and would spend a lot less time if he leveled-up his LR skills.

Given the above quote, OP left the door open for us to interpret the underlying problem and propose solutions.


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## Orangutan (Oct 2, 2016)

privatebydesign said:


> Jesus Christ guys! How many pro wedding photographers did their own processing back in the film days?



"Film days" and digital are not the same. One big difference is "the customer:" in the film days, photographers made their money on prints, so they had motivation to choose a processor who would generate print-worthy results. With digital, especially low to mid price ranges, it's often a flat fee for digital files. There's no motivation for the photographer to choose a slightly better post-processor. You could argue that poor quality results will diminish the photographer's reputation in the long-run, but that's not a strong correlation. If I were hiring I'd want someone who was present to do the PP: getting a sense of the guests and their significance to the couple is essential for a compelling set. For example, if you have a less-than-perfect photo of great-aunt Tillie, normally a reserved lady, with a beer and a big smile, that could be a keeper despite the quality of the photo. An outsourced PP might delete it.

Outsourcing PP may give consistently-excellent technical quality, but will diminish the social quality because the PP doesn't have a sense for the spirit of the event.


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## Mikehit (Oct 2, 2016)

Surely PP can mean different things.

At it simplest the contractor does the grunt work:
- identify the duds and mark for deletion
- standardise white balance
- sharpening and noise reduction
If the photographer wants final control then they export all as jpeg (including the 'duds') and send back to the photographer who flicks through to check the general standard. This satisfies the 'gimme everything you shot' client. 

The photographer can then select the 40 shots (or whatever was agreed in the contract) to build the album then either process just those 40 themselves or start to talk to the contractor what style they want (giving them examples from previous shoots) and let them do that as well. I doubt it will be a bad job, but whether it is what the photographer wants to the nth degree is a different matter and can be discussed afterwards.


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## takesome1 (Oct 2, 2016)

comment removed by mod


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## pwp (Oct 3, 2016)

aa_angus said:


> lol none of you seem to understand, I'm trying to spend LESS time editing, not ramp things up.
> One day some of you may run businesses. Of those few who do, some of your businesses will be successful. Now, unfortunately, one of the drawbacks of owning a successful business is that there is a lot of work to do. When the amount of work is too great for one person, it's time to start outsourcing some of the load. I don't expect you simpletons to understand this concept, so don't hurt your brains trying xx


aa_angus, if you ask for some help it's not a great idea to flame the people who have responded. 

It's true and kind of obvious that the realities of running your own business will be outside the experience those who haven't been there, so just self-filter the responses that are not relevant to you. 

A reality of forums and lists like CR is that posters will not necessarily have read the whole thread in detail, most will have skimmed it at best and may just be responding the the most recent post. Be nice! 

-pw


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## KrisK (Oct 3, 2016)

pwp said:


> aa_angus said:
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> 
> > lol none of you seem to understand, I'm trying to spend LESS time editing, not ramp things up.
> ...



I guess we have a Rashomon effect going on here.

As I read through this thread, I found myself increasingly irked at the handful of snarky, dismissive comments from what I gather are forum old timers, offering the equivalent of "get off my lawn." So when I hit the OPs "simpletons" line, I actually laughed a bit, thinking that, well, they kind of had that coming....

(Not everyone, of course. But I suspect folks who'd made sincere responses to the OPs question knew it wasn't directed at them.)


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## rfdesigner (Oct 3, 2016)

KrisK said:


> pwp said:
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> > aa_angus said:
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Actually his "simpletons" post was in direct response to mine. which was concidered and just suggesting other ways of attacking the problem of not having enogh hours in the day to deal with the amount of processing.

I have run a business and have had employees

He just hope he treats his customers at little better


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## rfdesigner (Oct 3, 2016)

dilbert said:


> KrisK said:
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> > pwp said:
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not necessarily.

There's a very long line of people willing to take your money in return for letting them talk. Far too many are utterly useless.


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## aa_angus (Oct 4, 2016)

Wow, first time I checked this thread in a while. I'm so surprised by some of the comments I read! Very few people in here seem to have a clue about the basics of business! I have everything sorted out now, turns out there are many wonderful options out there when it comes to outsourcing editing! I'm already getting my weekdays back, it's brilliant 

The turnaround time for clients has greatly improved, and I'm providing work for others. Really everybody involved is winning. So glad I went down this path rather than listening to the vast majority of you! xx


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## aa_angus (Oct 4, 2016)

romanr74 said:


> i'm honestly a bit puzzled by that question. i would believe that in wedding photography post is at least as important for the final result as the shooting itself is. to me the outsourcing of post thus sounds like a no-go. am i being naive here? is this a common thing?



You're being naive. There are literally thousands of businesses dedicated to processing wedding photographers raw files.


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## Mikehit (Oct 4, 2016)

Good to hear you've got it sorted to your satisfaction. Out of interest aa_angus are the contractors doing the full processing all the way to completing those for the final album or preparing the shots for you to do the final editing tweaks?


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## rfdesigner (Oct 4, 2016)

aa_angus said:


> Wow, first time I checked this thread in a while. I'm so surprised by some of the comments I read! Very few people in here seem to have a clue about the basics of business! I have everything sorted out now, turns out there are many wonderful options out there when it comes to outsourcing editing! I'm already getting my weekdays back, it's brilliant
> 
> The turnaround time for clients has greatly improved, and I'm providing work for others. Really everybody involved is winning. So glad I went down this path rather than listening to the vast majority of you! xx



please do come back after a month or two and let us know how it works out in the longer term.


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## aa_angus (Oct 6, 2016)

Mikehit said:


> Good to hear you've got it sorted to your satisfaction. Out of interest aa_angus are the contractors doing the full processing all the way to completing those for the final album or preparing the shots for you to do the final editing tweaks?



Good question. That's gotta be a first around here 
So far the jobs I've sent out have been edited to completion. That is of course, after I have given the all clear after viewing sample edits of each main lighting scenario. I closely inspect each catalogue, and so far none have required me to make touch ups.


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## aa_angus (Oct 6, 2016)

pwp said:


> takesome1 said:
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> > aa_angus said:
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lol, have fun sitting around waiting for people to post on these forums. I bet you're fat, single, ugly, and take horrible photos. Get a life xx


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## pwp (Oct 6, 2016)

aa_angus said:


> lol, have fun sitting around waiting for people to post on these forums. I bet you're fat, single, ugly, and take horrible photos. Get a life xx



Awww you're so sweet...and a brilliant judge of character! ;D

-pw


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## romanr74 (Oct 6, 2016)

aa_angus said:


> lol, have fun sitting around waiting for people to post on these forums. I bet you're fat, single, ugly, and take horrible photos. Get a life xx



What makes everyone believe you do not take horrible photos?


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## takesome1 (Oct 6, 2016)

comment removed by Mod.


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## paulcristian (Dec 31, 2016)

I've started offering graphic design services a few years ago and ended up doing photo retouching most of the time. And I love it. Needless to say most of the clients are photographers. 

They send photos for edit/retouch because they don't have enough time. And their clients expect the photos pretty quick after the shooting.

You can check my website

Removed by Mod - Members can sent a message if they want to know. This site is not for self advertisement.


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