# A camera for backpacking into the wilderness...



## jrda2 (Jan 24, 2013)

On my past day hikes (up to 15 miles with elevation change) I have taken my 5D mark II with 2 lenses and ND filters to capture landscapes. This year I am excited to take my young son on a multi-day backing trip to cover 30-35 miles. Because of his age, I will be carrying most of the camping gear, food, etc. I do not think I will have room for my current set up, so I am looking for advice for the best next-best option to my dSLR. My budget is about $1500, and I have looked into the Canon G1X, Fuji X-E1 with 18-55mm kit lens, Sony RX100, Sony Nex with ? lens, etc. I have also considered taking my 5D mark II with only the 50mm f/1.4 attached, but I am worried about only having one focal length. My priority is high image quality for stills/ landscapes.

I would appreciate any advice or experience from a similar situation. I have attached one of my pics, so you can see what i like to shoot.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jan 24, 2013)

I'd take your 5D MK II and a 40mm f/2.8. That combination is small and reasonably light. Save your $$$ for a future camera upgrade. Small format sensors will lack the detail you want for landscapes.


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## JPAZ (Jan 24, 2013)

I know it is not FF, but my wife caries a Sony NEX-7 and an 18-55 + 55-210. She fits her whole "kit" into a small fanny type pack. It is remarkably light and the IQ is awfully good. The downside is how quickly it can goe through a battery. With "chimping turned off" and care, she got through a 14 day trek up to 14K feet with temps below freezing at nite on 3 batteries. 

This is not a replacement for your DSLR but it is really lightweight, small and reasonable.

JP


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## jrda2 (Jan 24, 2013)

Sorry, I will try the attachment again. Thanks for the replies so far.

How does the quality of the 40mm compare to the 50mm f/1.4?


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## Halfrack (Jan 24, 2013)

You may be overlooking a major idea. Since you're carrying everything in a traditional backpack, utilize your kid as the camera carrier. That way the camera is in front of you with easy access (easier to get into his pack than into yours). Age, weight and height all matter so this idea may not work. Camera, water bottle and a few snacks and all your precious cargo is in one place.


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## 1982chris911 (Jan 24, 2013)

I would either get a 17-40mm f4 L or a 24-70mm F4 IS for your trip as only lens, depending on what focal range you prefer. These both are not too large and give you a wider range of possible applications than only taking a 50mm lens with you . if you need f2.8 also you should consider the 40mm f2.8 which is about the same size as a lenscap only a bit thicker.


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## Lloyd (Jan 24, 2013)

For backpacking I have gone the ultralight route and picked up the Gossamer Gear 2012 Mariposa backpack. What led me to this pack is that it has a large volume for an ultralight pack and most importantly, the hip belt slides through a sleeve so that it can be replaced with a Think Tank Pro Speed Belt. (I also attached some Velcro to the belt so that it attaches better to the Velcro inside the sleeve of the pack) The Pro Speed Belt is padded and comfortable and it allows you to use the Think Tank holsters, including their lighter weight Skin series holsters and pouches, to hold your camera and accessories. The light weight pack and my other light weight items help offset the weight of the camera. While you will spend money on backpacking gear, you could outfit yourself and your boy with a lot of ultralight camping gear for much less than your $1,500.00 budget. The only other issue with this approach is whether a Mariposa is large enough for the both of you. Whether it is big enough may depend on where you are going. If it is cold you will need a lot more clothes and heavier sleeping bags.

One significant caveat to this approach is that all you may really need is a very small inexpensive portable camera, with video and extra batteries, that you can stick in your shirt pocket and pull out at a moment’s notice. As an older guy, I have come to realize that the countryside is likely to be there for a long time, but the experience of traveling with your family is fleeting. My suggestion is to not worry too much about capturing the surroundings in all the glory your dslr can provide, but to focus on getting a bunch of shots of your son and the both of you together. I am willing to bet that 15 years from now you would much rather have a lot of shots of your son than the landscape. A compact camera of a lesser quality than your dslr will likely meet these needs just as well and may be more readily available to capture the moment. 

You may be an experienced backpacker so this will not be news to you, but if you are not, don’t weigh yourself down too much. You don’t want to feel like a pack mule and not enjoy these fleeting moments. However, if you are willing to accept the weight of your dslr, the Think Tank holster system allows you to access your camera almost as quick as pulling out a compact camera. Plus, you don't have to accept the limitations of a compact.

There is also a whole forum section devoted to backpacking with kids which can be found at http://forums.backpacker.com/cgi-bin/forums/ikonboard.cgi?act=SF;f=993107219 

Have a great trip.


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## TrumpetPower! (Jan 24, 2013)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> I'd take your 5D MK II and a 40mm f/2.8. That combination is small and reasonably light. Save your $$$ for a future camera upgrade. Small format sensors will lack the detail you want for landscapes.



This. Thread over.

The 5DII with the Shorty McForty is barely larger than a high-end P&S. Image quality is superlative...there might only be one or two lenses at that focal length that offer better image quality -- though, of course, there are many that are faster. And if you can't do good landscape photography with a normal lens, you can't do good landscape photography.

(No, I wouldn't voluntarily give up my TS-E 24 II, but any place where there's a great shot to be had with that lens, there's also something worth shooting with a normal lens.)

Cheers,

b&


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 24, 2013)

*Lloyd* makes some very good points. I hike with scouts on both short trips and long expeditions. Weight is always a concern. Being comfortable, safe and well hydrated is more important than camera equipment, esp if you are with your family. I really wanted to take my DSLR + 16-35/2.8L, etc to last summer's 10 day trek to Philmont. I opted instead for my small P&S Canon rugged D20. I hung it off my shoulder strap with a super magnet and took over 1000 pictures with three batteries. The pictures were not DSLR quality but I had a great time and I didn't have to spend a lot of mental and physical energy managing all the photo equipment.

I can't stress enough that unless you are a seasoned veteran hiker and you know exactly what you are doing and what to expect, I would NOT take a lot of photo gear on your trip. You run the risk of being miserable. And since I am not a landscape photographer, I really have to question the need for a lot of landscape pictures. Take pictures of your family and all your activities together. As *Lloyd* says, the landscape isn't going anywhere but these moments only happen once and then they are gone!

Have you considered the Cotton Carrier?


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## DianeK (Jan 25, 2013)

Sony RX100
Diane


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## bholliman (Jan 25, 2013)

I agree with Lloyd and Rusty's comments about the quality of time spent with your son being the top priority. Be sure to take plenty of shots of him and the two of you together.

My son and I (occasionally my wife as well) have done a lot of extended day-hikes in the National Parks as well as some some 2 and 3 day hikes. My son is old enough (14 now) to haul his share of the gear however.

Personally, I'm spoiled enough to always want my DLSR with me these days, even if it means extra weight. On one 2-day hike last summer, I just took my Canon S100 P&S. While I appreciated the lack of weight, the quality of the landscape pictures was definitely underwhelming. I ended up with dozen or so good pictures of my son in various locations and a few with both of us, but most of the pure landscape shorts were disappointing.

So, I've decided to stick with one of my DSLR's when hiking somewhere with great scenery going forward. Last summer/fall it was my 7D and EF-S 15-85mm. Now that I have a 6D and 50 1.4 (acquired in December/January) I'll be tempted to try that combination. Although, as the OP pointed out, there will be times when not having more flexibility in focal lengths will be limiting. If I owned a 40mm that would be very tempting as a light weight option as well, as others have suggested (with the same single focal length caveat).

Last November, I made the mistake of taking my 7D, 15-85mm, 35mm 1.4 and 70-200 2.8 II in a backpack on a long day hike with lots of elevation change in Big Bend N.P. I got some great shots from the 70-200, but it felt like it weighed 40 lbs by the time we got back to the trailhead! :-[ Not sure why I brought the 35mm, I only used it a few times and its not a small lens either.


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## bholliman (Jan 25, 2013)

jrda2 said:


> Sorry, I will try the attachment again. Thanks for the replies so far.



Nice shot! Where was it taken?


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## TrumpetPower! (Jan 25, 2013)

Lloyd, Rusty, bholliman...that's why the recommendation for the 5DII + Shorty McForty. You get all the IQ awesomeness you're used to from a top-end full-frame DSLR and L glass* in a package a few cc bigger and a few grams heavier than a P&S.

Plus, jrda2 already has the 5DII and the Shorty McForty is cheaper than any of the P&S cameras being recommended.

Cheers,

b&

--
* No, the Shorty McForty doesn't have the red ring, but it's optically in the same class as any of the L zooms, including the latest-and-greatest.


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## jrda2 (Jan 25, 2013)

The picture was taken in the Purcell Mountains of British Columbia - a beautiful range extending down into northern Idaho.

Thanks for all the great advice - It sounds like the 40mm will be a good option....and do not worry, my son will be in plenty of the pics. I can just hear him now...."oh come on Dad, do I have to be in another picture?!"

Just curious - no one out there thinks the G1X is a good option compared to the 5DII with a 40mm - the main benefit being you get some different focal lengths with the zoom lens of the G1X. I have read that the IQ of the G1X is comparable to the 7D.


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## TrumpetPower! (Jan 25, 2013)

jrda2 said:


> The picture was taken in the Purcell Mountains of British Columbia - a beautiful range extending down into northern Idaho.
> 
> Thanks for all the great advice - It sounds like the 40mm will be a good option....and do not worry, my son will be in plenty of the pics. I can just hear him now...."oh come on Dad, do I have to be in another picture?!"
> 
> Just curious - no one out there thinks the G1X is a good option compared to the 5DII with a 40mm - the main benefit being you get some different focal lengths with the zoom lens of the G1X. I have read that the IQ of the G1X is comparable to the 7D.



The G1X should be a good camera and a reasonable option for you. As you note, you have a range of focal lengths with it, and it might or might not be something easier to hand to the family. You might or might not worry so much about it being abused or lost.

Personally, I'd reach for the 5DII with the Shorty McForty, but that's just me. You should be able to do good stuff with either.

One thing's for sure: even though I'm sure the G1X is an excellent camera with superlative image quality, the 5DII with the Shorty McForty will have significantly superior image quality. However, unless your printer doesn't fit on a desktop, that's largely a moot point.

b&


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## EdB (Jan 25, 2013)

Nothing beats the Sigma Merrills for lightweight and image quality. Is it slow and clunky? You bet but who needs speed for landscapes? For a thousand bucks you get a camera that arguably beats FF and take the other 500 and buy batteries and memory cause your going to need it.


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## bholliman (Jan 25, 2013)

jrda2 said:


> ....and do not worry, my son will be in plenty of the pics. I can just hear him now...."oh come on Dad, do I have to be in another picture?!"


Hate to think how many times I've heard that...  But my son seems to enjoy looking at the pictures later.



jrda2 said:


> Just curious - no one out there thinks the G1X is a good option compared to the 5DII with a 40mm - the main benefit being you get some different focal lengths with the zoom lens of the G1X. I have read that the IQ of the G1X is comparable to the 7D.



The G1X has a nice sized sensor and really good IQ, should be a good, light weight option. Smaller and lighter than your 5D2+40mm or 50mm and its gives you much greater focal length flexibility with only a minor hit in IQ (although I think TrumpetPower will disagree with me on this point). I don't know much about the non-Canon options you listed, but I'm sure others will offer input.

Edit: Size and weight of Canon options:
5D2+40mm = 6x4x3", 33.2 oz.
5D2+50 1.4 = 6x4x4.5", 38.8 oz.
G1X = 4.6x3.2x2.5, 17.3 oz.


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## aroo (Jan 25, 2013)

Do people on this thread tend toward weather sealed camera systems for long backpacking trips? I'm thinking about this same question right now for a trip this summer.

I've had great luck with weather in the past and photographed landscapes extensively with S60 and S70 powershots, which are old and huge. A few years agoI bought a rebel, 18-55, nifty fifty, and 55-250. It's very light and versatile, you could get similar for under a thousand dollars today. I imagine it's a tall step down in IQ from a full frame camera, but the functionality is there and today's lenses have video focusing.

Recently I've had a 7D on some hikes where I was glad to have an L lens because it rained and snowed while I was photographing landscapes.

So with a 5D2, does a 40mm have enough weather sealing for a long trip?


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## bholliman (Jan 25, 2013)

aroo said:


> Do people on this thread tend toward weather sealed camera systems for long backpacking trips? I'm thinking about this same question right now for a trip this summer.
> 
> I've had great luck with weather in the past and photographed landscapes extensively with S60 and S70 powershots, which are old and huge. A few years agoI bought a rebel, 18-55, nifty fifty, and 55-250. It's very light and versatile, you could get similar for under a thousand dollars today. I imagine it's a tall step down in IQ from a full frame camera, but the functionality is there and today's lenses have video focusing.
> 
> ...



I've taken my 7D a several hikes when we have been rained on. 7D's are supposed to be pretty well sealed, but I'm reluctant to give it a good test.  I keep the camera and lens(es) inside a sealed plastic bag in a weather resistant backpack when it looks like wet weather is moving in and just take them out briefly for shots of rainbows or whatever when its raining. 

When there is a good chance for rain on a long hike, I will leave my EF-S 15-85mm lens in the tent/cabin since I don't know how well sealed it is (and don't want to find out the hard way). I'll take the 24-105L instead which I know is weather sealed, even if it means giving up some focal length at the wide end on the APS-C body.


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## sanj (Jan 25, 2013)

Lovely replies in this thread. 

It shows that people on this forum can be warm and helpful when they feel like it.


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 25, 2013)

I considered the G1X for hiking but when you consider the high price for what it is and then actually pick one up and hold it, you will likely blow off the G1X due to value concerns and the sheer weight of the thing. And buying any other 4/3 or other system means a LOT of money for this purpose.

I can't get away from the fact that when hiking, you will have to deal with dirt, moisture, humidity, impacts, etc. To mitigate disaster, you will have to manage/pack/cushion/make space for the camera, lenses, etc more than in other settings. In short, take the 5D2 + 40mm/2.8 if you must but store/protect them in your pack while hiking. Don't worry about them. Keep a P&S like the rugged D20 on your pack shoulder strap within easy reach with a carabiner or something for all the spontaneous shots while you're on the trail with the family and being active.

When stopped for long periods or when you are camped then pull out the DSLR and enjoy the higher quality. It's up to you how much you take but just remember the proper priority order.... you are backpacking with the family and taking pictures. You aren't on a paid photo shoot with the family tagging along for fun. One is secondary to the other. Don't forget which one is which!


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## jabbott (Jan 25, 2013)

Last November I hiked 129 miles over two weeks in Nepal to the base camp of Mount Everest, and I brought a 5D3, 17-40 f/4L and 70-200 f/4L IS with me in a Lowepro Photo Sport 200 pack. The gear worked great, was weather-sealed and provided excellent image quality with a manageable weight (5 lbs). My pack was only about 20 pounds fully loaded though, which I'm guessing is considerably less than yours if you are hiking self-supported. If I had to carry much more weight, I would definitely slim down by getting rid of the 70-200 first. That would bring it down to 3.3 lbs. The Shorty 40 looks nice but when I'm hiking I tend to shoot wider than 40mm... I gravitate towards the 17mm end of the 17-40. I would likely just bring the 17-40 as the single lens and be done with it. I have been considering the Fuji X100s as well, but not for hiking due to the longer focal length. That's just my preference however...

I have one recommendation for carrying photo gear while hiking... the Op/Tech reporter/backpack straps (available here: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/485766-REG/OP_TECH_USA_1301652_System_Connectors_Reporter_Backpack_Set_of.html) work amazingly well. They allow you to keep the camera in front of you while hiking, with the weight distributed along your backpack straps instead of your neck like a traditional strap. For long distance hikes it's a lifesaver. I had to get the System Connector Extensions (regular length, not extra long) to work well with the Photo Sport 200 pack. I used these on the Everest Base Camp hike and in retrospect I can't imagine doing that hike (or any hike now) without them. These might allow you to still bring your 5D2 with you.

In case you are interested, here is a link to my Nepal photos... the first set are from Kathmandu where I had the 50mm with me, but after that it was 17-40 and 70-200 only:
https://picasaweb.google.com/101523717119396165775/2012NepalTrip02


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## aroo (Jan 25, 2013)

jabbott said:


> In case you are interested, here is a link to my Nepal photos... the first set are from Kathmandu where I had the 50mm with me, but after that it was 17-40 and 70-200 only:
> https://picasaweb.google.com/101523717119396165775/2012NepalTrip02



Wow awesome! It'll take a while to get through all these great images. Is that the 70-200 w/o IS?


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## jabbott (Jan 25, 2013)

aroo said:


> jabbott said:
> 
> 
> > In case you are interested, here is a link to my Nepal photos... the first set are from Kathmandu where I had the 50mm with me, but after that it was 17-40 and 70-200 only:
> ...



It was the 70-200 f/4L IS. I just modified my earlier post to mention that. Whoops!  I should also mention that I geotagged the photos so from the right side of the PicasaWeb page you can view them on a Google Map or in Google Earth. Viewing them with Google Earth works well because you can see the terrain we hiked.


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 25, 2013)

Sorry in advance for the length. Hopefully you will find some value from the following info, take it or leave it...

Since it appears this thread is leaning toward taking the DSLR and having it out and available the entire time, not just during stops, I experimented with and tested using the *Cotton Carrier* for hiking with the DSLR. It works well because of several reasons. It doesn't swing. It doesn't bounce. It doesn't hang out, swing or hit the ground if you lean over. It also provides the nice counter weight in front. It isn't attached to your main pack so when you need to remove your main pack, it doesn't go with it. This is a big issue because if you are removing a 40-70 lb backpack, once you start the process of removing it, it's likely going where you planned to put it, with or without the camera going along for the ride and into the dirt. It's bad enough forgetting to disconnect the pack chest strap and strangling yourself but if there's a camera involved, then you are really having to deal with unexpected issues and you could possibly pull a muscle or something trying to deal with a heavy pack and protect a camera as you are in the middle of the removal process.

Also, depending on where you are hiking, sudden weather like rain could be an issue and so you should have something handy to cover the DSLR regardless of how you keep it attached. Ditto for when you are drinking, eating, or whatever. And if it's hot, you will be sweating and that can drip on the camera. The Cotton Carrier comes with some kind of cover thing as an option I think.

I'm not timid by any means taking a DSLR into the outdoors. I pretty much assume, expect and am braced for a potential loss or damage event on every trip. But I do my best to think ahead and use a system that hopefully prevents most common forms of damage or abuse.

Perhaps consider a hiking/pack umbrella. They make a few that are very light, flexible and durable that you can attach to your pack straps and will not require your hands. This allows you to stay dry underneath in light or non-windy rain or snow. (Horizontal monsoons, not so much!) I considered and briefly tested this also for taking DSLR pictures on the go. The umbrella also helps keep you from sweating your a$$ off from wearing rain gear for hours during misty and drizzly conditions while you hike. The links below show two different products and the youtube video gives a decent idea of what using one would be like.

http://www.euroschirm.com/schirm/Swing_handsfree/index.cgi?session=7ia8cnFV4uTpH&sprache_land=usa
http://www.golite.com/Chrome-Dome-Trekking-Umbrella-P928.aspx
GoLite Umbrella Review

I spent months trying out different methods of using the DSLR and hiking. IMHO, it's not the weight or even the risk to the equipment that bothers me. It's the logistics of keeping up with it, packing/unpacking it, making room for it along with the other stuff. Things like ultralight stools, a pillow and camp shoes are a godsend on a long expedition style hike. Everything contributes to the list of stuff you have to manage and carry but they are servicing the primary purpose of the activity, hiking and maintaining your body as it endures the challenges you demand of it. Don't forget, you have to carry enough food and water for whatever duration necessary. And you also said you are carrying for the family too. I don't think you will be able to use any kind of ultralight pack. They are all designed for 35 lbs or less. You will likely need something like a Kelty RedCloud 90 or 110! For this reason, I like the P&S rugged cam for totally carefree hiking and then the DSLR to satisfy my IQ needs while stopped. At that point, take the 40/2.8 or my favorite, the 16-35/2.8. (The 17-40 would also be great but only f4.) Maybe a 28/1.8 or other fast but light prime for very low light like campfires. Consider the *LensCoat DSLR Cover* for keeping the DSLR protected in the pack and put that in a heavy duty ziplock. http://tinyurl.com/b8n7n8r

FLASH - You are using a FF body so you will need fill flash. Yes, you will. Get a *Sunpak RD2000* with the *StoFen Diffuser* made for it. Put some foil in the diffuser to direct the light more forward. Gaffer tape the diffuser to the flash. Aim the flash up at an angle for better results indoors, in shadows, etc but remove the diffuser in total bright sun. Use *Energizer Lithium AAs* for long life and very low weight. Expect about two days from each pair assuming you run the flash about 1-2 stops down like I do. 

Last thing - Trekking Poles. Get Aluminum so they bend instead of snap/shatter like carbon fiber does. *Leki* has some (*Aergon*) that you can install their 1/4-20 bolt inside of the hand grip. Or get a trekmount to fit on any pole which is what I did. http://www.trekmount.com/ But of course, what will you do with the trekking poles when you want to grab the camera to take pictures? Again, grabbing the P&S on my left shoulder strap while still moving on the trail one handed is easier then having to stop the group, remove the poles and lean them somewhere (where they fall over anyway) and use two hands to manage the DSLR. I actually rigged up two super magnets high up on my pack to hold the trekking poles so I never had to deal with them when I took pictures and no one else had to be bothered helping me.

In conclusion, I would like to implore you to do some "shakedown hikes" where you try out several different methods and ideas before you go on the actual trip. And I don't mean walk up and down the street. I mean hike up and down hills in similar conditions/weather and go for at least 3-4 miles. You need to know how it feels after you are tired and you need to be sure your feet/boots can handle the extra weight, etc. Anyone can hike for 3 miles no problem. But once you hit 5 miles, you start to discover where the problems are. Blisters on feet, wear points on hips or other areas and you start to ever so slightly question why you brought something or other. You might decide that DSLR in front of you is an annoyance and not worth the trouble. That's why I have a weatherproof P&S hanging on a supermagnet while on the trail. No fuss, it can get wet, dropped, used one handed, etc with zero worry or annoyance.

Good luck and have a great time with your family!! *That's JOB 1!*


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## AprilForever (Jan 25, 2013)

5D mk II and 40mm. Add 70-200 f4 non IS. And, for UWA, 17-40? This would work smashingly.

Or, a 7D, a 15-85, and you could be very good to go. Add in a 70-200 f4 non IS. Put that 40mm lens in there too. Know, however, that you will be seeing a different view between the two cameras. Canon just doesn't do equivalence... yet... 

Alternately, for both, the 70-300 L also.


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 25, 2013)

No offence to anyone posting to this thread but I think you are going to find that avid hikers are going to urge you to go minimal while the photographers without much hiking experience are going to offer advice about all the lenses you should take. I would NOT take more than two lenses and even then I think you are pushing your luck due to the situation you are in, having to carry gear for more than one night for more than just yourself. Keep in mind that *jabbott* mentioned that he only carried 20 pounds. I'm guessing half of that was photo gear and the other half was snacks, water and weather gear. He obviously had sherpas or porters or whatever you want to call them. That sounds like a BLAST!! All the fun, none of the weight!!

I really hope you have a great time but I also hope you do your due diligence and test hike everything ahead of time. Please let us know what you learn as you prepare, what you finally decide and keep tossing out those questions!!


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 25, 2013)

Sorry to dominate this thread but as I re-read your original post, it occurs to me that this is just you and your son, no other adults, correct? Since your son isn't carrying a lot of weight, he must be young. So this means everything revolves around you. I gotta admit that this is worrisome due to safety concerns. You are carrying a lot of weight. How far from civilization will you be? If you get hurt, turn an ankle or whatever, what is your emergency plan? Will you be in cell phone range and how will they get to you if you can't walk out? I don't want your wonderful father-son experience to become a nightmare. Make sure someone knows your itinerary and you have check-in times. I realize you are probably experienced enough to already know this but I'd rather say it rather than assume. You'd be amazed at how little some people plan a trip they think will be all roses and discover the harsh reality of the outdoors later. Don't be one of them! Day hikes are completely different from multi-day trips. COMPLETELY DIFFERENT!! Different gear, different planning and different mindset!


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## RLPhoto (Jan 25, 2013)

G1x or G15 for long, multi-day trekks for weight and whatever you want for day hikes.


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## JPAZ (Jan 25, 2013)

jabbott said:


> I have one recommendation for carrying photo gear while hiking... the Op/Tech reporter/backpack straps (available here: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/485766-REG/OP_TECH_USA_1301652_System_Connectors_Reporter_Backpack_Set_of.html) work amazingly well. They allow you to keep the camera in front of you while hiking, with the weight distributed along your backpack straps instead of your neck like a traditional strap.



+1 on this. A recommendation, though. The Op-tech straps are almost perfect but the clips on the end to your backpack straps can open. I got very small carabiners that I also fasten at this end as insurance.

My setup is an F-Stop Loka pack with the reporter straps holding my ThinkTank holster. I keep the camera in the holster for protection but it is right on my chest for easy access. 

I also heartily agree on the umbrella. I do use hiking poles but my camera is in my holster (and there is a raincover with this holster) while a small folded umbrella is hanging within easy reach.

Did a 14 day trek in Northern Nepal with this setup. BUT, frankly, my wife was much happier with her NEX-7 in a little fanny-type pack at her waist........Everything is a trade-off.

JP


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## jabbott (Jan 25, 2013)

JPAZ said:


> +1 on this. A recommendation, though. The Op-tech straps are almost perfect but the clips on the end to your backpack straps can open. I got very small carabiners that I also fasten at this end as insurance.


Glad to see there are some other Nepal trekkers on this forum.  I wanted to mention that some folks have made velcro strips that fasten around the quick-disconnects for the Op/Tech straps in order to prevent them from opening inadvertently. The manufacturer also sells this but it costs more than it should considering it's just a few velcro strips.


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## jabbott (Jan 25, 2013)

RustyTheGeek said:


> Keep in mind that *jabbott* mentioned that he only carried 20 pounds. I'm guessing half of that was photo gear and the other half was snacks, water and weather gear. He obviously had sherpas or porters or whatever you want to call them. That sounds like a BLAST!! All the fun, none of the weight!!


It was a blast! About 1/4 was camera gear and 3/4 was snacks, water, poles, iPad and weather gear. Yes, we had porters carrying our duffel bags with changes of clothes, sleeping bag, etc. I've done countless day hikes in the Rocky Mountains with a similar setup (without iPad and without the porters) and it works very well. For multi-day hikes though where I would have to bring extra food, stove, etc., it would be tough to decide what to bring in terms of camera gear. Maybe that's what Canon made the EOS M for?


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 25, 2013)

*jabbott*, you are obviously living the life!!  And it appears you've got some experience in various types of excursions.

In terms of what the OP is faced with, forgetting photography per se for a moment, what is your opinion concerning what he should do in this situation? As I mentally add up what he needs to take to make this a nice trip for himself and his son, the weight just keeps going up, up, up with no one to help him carry it! I don't see much room for the camera stuff. IMHO, his best option is to just stick with a simple P&S + the necessary batteries, etc. I prefer the rugged D20 for no worries but I would also say that a G15 or S110 would work great as long as he could keep it clean, dry and not drop it. Also perhaps the SX50 that is discussed in another thread although he probably doesn't need that much zoom. I'm trying to avoid the other mini camera "systems" because they cost $1000's of dollars. I'm attempting to suggest options that require spending less than $500 for another "hiking camera" since he is willing/able to take his 5D2 on other shorter trips anyway. Most of the small "systems" are fragile too.

And finally, if a small P&S is taken, that leaves more room/weight allowance for some lightweight extension accessories that would make it easy to include both father & son in a lot of great portraits!

*Consider both of these items to get the camera out in front of both of them and have a nice landscape shot with them in the foreground...

http://www.adorama.com/TRTPZS.html - Tamrac Zipshot,TR406,Compact, Ultra-Light Aluminum Tripod with Ball Head
http://www.adorama.com/TPXSP1.html - XShot Pocket Telescopic Camera Extender*


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## jrda2 (Jan 25, 2013)

RustyTheGeek said:


> Sorry to dominate this thread but as I re-read your original post, it occurs to me that this is just you and your son, no other adults, correct? Since your son isn't carrying a lot of weight, he must be young. So this means everything revolves around you. I gotta admit that this is worrisome due to safety concerns. You are carrying a lot of weight. How far from civilization will you be? If you get hurt, turn an ankle or whatever, what is your emergency plan? Will you be in cell phone range and how will they get to you if you can't walk out? I don't want your wonderful father-son experience to become a nightmare. Make sure someone knows your itinerary and you have check-in times. I realize you are probably experienced enough to already know this but I'd rather say it rather than assume. You'd be amazed at how little some people plan a trip they think will be all roses and discover the harsh reality of the outdoors later. Don't be one of them! Day hikes are completely different from multi-day trips. COMPLETELY DIFFERENT!! Different gear, different planning and different mindset!



Thanks again for all the great replies in this thread....

It will be me and my 10yr old son. The hike will be remote, but it is regularly travelled by others - we should not be completely alone. I am a very experienced hiker (usually hike 200-300 miles per hiking season and snowshoe in the winter, and always use poles - saved my wrists on many occasions), but this will be the first time I have taken my son on an extended trip like this. He already hikes with me, but up until now only on day hikes. This past season he had no trouble on a 13 mile single day trip. My main concern was controlling camera weight (while trying to preserve IQ as much as possible) since I will be carrying most of the gear. My son will have a water pack and carry some of his own food, but I want to limit his pack weight so that he enjoys the trip. After reading the advice, I am leaning toward taking my 5DII with one lens. I think I will check into the Cotton Carrier too.


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 25, 2013)

Sounds great *jrda2*! I think CC also has a smaller item that attaches to the pack shoulder strap now but I haven't used it and it may not work as well for a large DSLR. Hard to say. It might be the greatest thing ever.

For me, Photography and Hiking sort of collide. They are two loves that tend to conflict a bit. Photography wants IQ and heavy lenses and cameras + tons of extra stuff while Hiking wants light weight, less stuff and simplicity. It's a hell of a balancing act!!

Only you can decide what your son will handle, tolerate and enjoy but it sounds like you should load him down with all the camera gear!!  And his water+food!  And the tent!  And all your snacks!!! ??? Come on, son!! Buck up!! It's only another 3 miles to camp! This is fun!!

Of course I'm kidding but I hope you share some pictures of the excursion. It does sound like it will be a lot of great fun and memories. Are you and your son involved with Boy Scouts at all? Shameless Plug -> Scouts is a great experience for young men!!


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 25, 2013)

Depending on what pictures you want out of the 5DII, I would lean toward something like the *16-35* or *17-40* as a single lens solution. Anything longer would be hard to use if you wanted to turn the camera around and get portraits or get big wide vistas. The *16-35* also has the added benefit of working in lower light. I have the version 1 of the *16-35* and it works great for me on both FF and Crop. Next I guess would be the *24-105* but after that, you are looking at higher weight and bulk concerns. Another idea might be a *Tamron* zoom with VC. Those lenses are a bit of a compromise on IQ but they are lighter and provide a more versatile zoom range. I have a *28-300 Tamron* superzoom and it works OK for most daytime pictures that I use for scout slide shows, etc. I've also used the *18-270* on crop bodies with similar satisfaction. Those Tamron lenses are not weather sealed in the slightest however so keep that in mind with regard to dust and moisture.

I'm looking forward to hearing how things progress for you on this!


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## TrumpetPower! (Jan 25, 2013)

jrda2 said:


> After reading the advice, I am leaning toward taking my 5DII with one lens.



That's the route I'd lean towards as well, but with a caveat / twist.

No matter what, I'd make sure I had the Shorty McForty. If nothing else, use it as the body cap for the 5DII. And, yes -- the lens really is (almost) as small and lightweight as the body cap.

You can then also think about taking a second lens. Which lens? Your favorite, whichever that is. I'd go for the TS-E 24 II, probably, but good arguments could be made for any of the zooms. The 17-40 or 16-35 for landscapes; the 24-105 for most anything that you might stumble upon; the 70-200 f/4L if you're into critters. Or maybe even something like the 100 macro, giving you both macro ability and a short telephoto in one lens.

When making a decision which lens for a second, don't forget that you've got the normal-to-slightly-wide range perfectly covered with the Shorty McForty. That lens and camera combination is so perfect for snapshots it's not even funny. Put the camera in green square mode and turn on live view and hand it to somebody and they probably won't even realize they've got anything particularly special in their hands -- and, yet, it's arguably the reigning low light image quality champion and will give you better results around the campfire than just about anything else.

Cheers,

b&


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 25, 2013)

I think *TrumpetPower* is on to something and he has inspired me to use my Shorty-McForty more in the future. For the past several years, I have used the prime *28/1.8* in the same manner as *Trumpet* proposes the 40 be used for. A great go-to lens for good snapshots that is wonderful in low light and plenty wide for most things. 40mm for me is starting to get a bit long. I prefer 35 and below for a single lens solution but that's just me. I lean towards the wide (wild) side!


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## strikerwy (Jan 25, 2013)

I tend to be a fanatic when it comes to backpacking and camera gear. There's NO WAY I'm going into a pristine, alpine location on what may be a once in a lifetime visit, without carrying the necessary equipment to thoroughly capture the vistas with the highest quality. I want NO REGRETS once I return home. That mentality does come at a physical price as my personal pack is always right at #60 for a week long trip. That usually translates into #40 for pack and hiking equipment/supplies and #20 of photo gear which includes my 7D, 24-105, 10-22, Sigma 50-500, Gitzo mountaineer carbon fiber tripod and a variety of filters, cards, remotes and filters.

I have found the Lowepro zoom AW chest packs to be the best for such an approach. I can keep my camera with 50-500 on my chest for quick access, I can keep quite a quantity of the other gear in the same pack, I can wear it around my neck, or using the previously mentioned straps, I can attach it to the packframe for less weight on my neck. This also provides a completely waterproof option as the AW series packs have a built in rain hood.

Many won't carry such a load, but the images I have brought home with me as a result of carrying top quality gear more then make up for the physical discomfort, and I'll continue doing such until I am physically unable.

I'd still carry the 5D III and as much lens as physically possible, especially if you are planning to use the images for anything more then viewing.

As Cotton Carier owner, I'd recommend the Toploader AW packs above the CC for the protection and also the extra room for other equipment.


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 25, 2013)

Great post *strikerwy*! Man, why didn't _*I*_ pose this question a year ago?  So much good info and responses!!

Anyway, I think a fundamental consideration with regard to the gear carried is what type of group you are with, what is appropriate and acceptable to impose on that group. In my case, I am with Boy Scouts and Adult Scouters. I'm never on a photography trip or surrounded by other photographers. I have a mixed set of obligations and responsibilities and most of the people around me are either less experienced hikers or tasked with other priorities so my photography is all up to me. Plus, I need to set a good example for others by making safe and sane choices with my gear and think of the group. I don't feel comfortable asking for assistance and no one around me really relates to the photography addiction I am afflicted with. In fact, some probably think I'm nuts. And a select few are even irritated by it if it ever causes any problems or distractions. Fortunately I've been doing it for years so most everyone is glad I do it and they are supportive. But if I ever end up needing help with shedding weight on a hike because I don't feel well, pull a muscle or something, I don't want others judging me based on the fact that I am carrying 10+ extra pounds of needless (to them) camera gear that now they are having to help carry. Plus, I feel like I am imposing regardless of what the weight consists of. A group of photographer hikers would understand but a group of "normal" adults focused on surviving the hike themselves and supporting the boys might find it a bit selfish on my part.

This comment post is a bit off topic but my point is that no one should ever hike alone and when you hike with others, it's a team effort and so even if you plan to carry a bunch of photo weight on your own, it still impacts the group because that's weight you can't carry for others to help even out the group load of food, water, etc. Make sure the group is on board with what you decide to carry if you are carrying extra non-essentials. Nobody will question a P&S but when you carry a DSLR with a big lens, another lens, batteries, misc other stuff etc then others may start to have an opinion or object, if not to others at least to themselves. And they have a right to feel that way because all individual choices do impact the group as a whole.

Okay, the Hiking Etiquette PSA is now concluded.


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 25, 2013)

Part of the justification for my purchase of the *6D* was to have a lighter FF DSLR to perhaps take on hikes. Time will tell. But it was a nice justification to have on the list to buy the 6D and we all know how important those justifications are when we are trying to decide about purchasing more camera equipment!!


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## jabbott (Jan 25, 2013)

jrda2 said:


> Thanks again for all the great replies in this thread....
> 
> It will be me and my 10yr old son. The hike will be remote, but it is regularly travelled by others - we should not be completely alone. I am a very experienced hiker (usually hike 200-300 miles per hiking season and snowshoe in the winter, and always use poles - saved my wrists on many occasions), but this will be the first time I have taken my son on an extended trip like this. He already hikes with me, but up until now only on day hikes. This past season he had no trouble on a 13 mile single day trip. My main concern was controlling camera weight (while trying to preserve IQ as much as possible) since I will be carrying most of the gear. My son will have a water pack and carry some of his own food, but I want to limit his pack weight so that he enjoys the trip. After reading the advice, I am leaning toward taking my 5DII with one lens. I think I will check into the Cotton Carrier too.



Will you be hiking near water sources? If so, bringing a water filter such as the Katadyn Pocket or the Exstream would allow you to significantly reduce your pack weight and not have to worry as much about camera weight. Considering that one gallon of water weighs 8 pounds, that's a lot of other stuff you can bring. I've heard bad things about cheapy plastic filters but the Katadyn Pocket is used by humanitarian aid agencies and U.S. Army troops for reliable drinking water in remote places. There's also the Lifestraw which is an even lighter-weight option, and it seems to be highly regarded. I use the Katadyn Pocket but haven't tried the Lifestraw or Exstream personally.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jan 26, 2013)

jrda2 said:


> The picture was taken in the Purcell Mountains of British Columbia - a beautiful range extending down into northern Idaho.
> 
> Thanks for all the great advice - It sounds like the 40mm will be a good option....and do not worry, my son will be in plenty of the pics. I can just hear him now...."oh come on Dad, do I have to be in another picture?!"
> 
> Just curious - no one out there thinks the G1X is a good option compared to the 5DII with a 40mm - the main benefit being you get some different focal lengths with the zoom lens of the G1X. I have read that the IQ of the G1X is comparable to the 7D.


I have the G1X and its a good camera, but I would not want to use it for landscapes when I have a 5D and 40mm lens. The lens on the G1X is just OK, and not cloose to the quality of the 40mm f/2.8.
A FF sensor makes a huge difference too.


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## strikerwy (Jan 26, 2013)

For a variety of reasons including 10mm, the images attached here would not have been possible using anything less than a DSLR and good optics. I cannot imagine coming home having seen these views and having nothing to show for them, or only having cropped views of the same. It all makes it worth it to see these in print and on my walls!

The first image was shot at 500mm of a very distant peak just as a shaft of sun hit below a thunderstorm
The second image is wide open at 10mm
The 3rd image also touches 10mm


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## jrda2 (Jan 26, 2013)

Nice pics Tim. Is the second picture of Iceberg Lk, and what 500mm lens do you use?

Jabbott- I agree with your water filter rec.


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## jonsjons (Jan 26, 2013)

I too shoot primarily with a 5d Mark II, but I've gotten tired of carrying it on long hikes and/or having only one lens in order to keep weight down. My solution will be to pick up a Nikon d5200 and add a Sigma 8-16 with either an 18-55 or 18-105. I don't own any Ef-s lenses, so this seems to make just as much sense as buying a Rebel with Ef-s lenses. This should give me image quality comparable to what I get with my 5d2 while allowing both less weight and a lot more focal length flexibility than I'd get with the 5d2 and one lens.


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## Northstar (Jan 26, 2013)

samsung galaxy 8mp


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## strikerwy (Jan 26, 2013)

jrda2 said:


> Nice pics Tim. Is the second picture of Iceberg Lk, and what 500mm lens do you use?



It is indeed Iceberg Lake.

I use the sigma 50-500 OS.

I've always loved the lens as I've had 3 iterations of it. The extra reach over my 70-200 2.8 II is significant. I do miss 2.8, though, although the OS helps significantly in lower light.


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## Jesse (Jan 29, 2013)

Ditch the kid. Put the $1500 towards the 24mm TS-E L. Have a blast.


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## Northstar (Jan 29, 2013)

jabbott said:


> jrda2 said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks again for all the great replies in this thread....
> ...




Jabbot...I was about to write the exact same thing. I would also vote for bringing the Katadyn pocket filter along with a pack of purification tablets. This will "free up" several pounds for you to use elsewhere....as long as you know there are streams along the way. You still have to carry water, just not nearly as much.

To answer the OP's original question about just bringing a fifty...I personally think the 50 alone is fine....or you could pair it with a wider prime like the 28mm 2.8. Both very light, portable, and great IQ. 

In case you haven't heard of the Katadyn.....

http://www.amazon.com/Katadyn-8013618-Pocket-Water-Microfilter/dp/B0007U00YE


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## charlesa (Jan 29, 2013)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> I'd take your 5D MK II and a 40mm f/2.8. That combination is small and reasonably light. Save your $$$ for a future camera upgrade. Small format sensors will lack the detail you want for landscapes.



Have to second Spokane on this one...


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 29, 2013)

OK, Wow. I looked at the Katadyn Water MicroFilter Link and OMG! Almost $400 list price and $275 on Amazon! Then I read a few of the lengthy and glowing 117 x 5 Star reviews. What a great filter! It's like the L Lens of Water Filters. One thing I couldn't figure out - is the pump single or dual stage? (Pumps on single or dual strokes.)


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## CanNotYet (Jan 30, 2013)

Eos-M? I might be wrong, but fast autofocus isn't that important when doing landscape, i guess? The 22 prime would get you far, and an adapter and 10-22? Hell, Eos-M body plus EF-M 22mm prime plus EF-M 18-55mm zoom plus the EOS M adapter weighs in at 29.1 oz together, leaving ample space for a 10-22 if you like, with much more flexibility. Put the 22 prime on and off you go!


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## Northstar (Jan 30, 2013)

RustyTheGeek said:


> OK, Wow. I looked at the Katadyn Water MicroFilter Link and OMG! Almost $400 list price and $275 on Amazon! Then I read a few of the lengthy and glowing 117 x 5 Star reviews. What a great filter! It's like the L Lens of Water Filters. One thing I couldn't figure out - is the pump single or dual stage? (Pumps on single or dual strokes.)



rusty...I have one in my "emergency" kit that I keep in the basement...just in case. but so far, it's just got me lots of "eye rolls" from my wife because she knows how much it cost.


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## RustyTheGeek (Jan 31, 2013)

Northstar said:


> RustyTheGeek said:
> 
> 
> > OK, Wow. I looked at the Katadyn Water MicroFilter Link and OMG! Almost $400 list price and $275 on Amazon! Then I read a few of the lengthy and glowing 117 x 5 Star reviews. What a great filter! It's like the L Lens of Water Filters. One thing I couldn't figure out - is the pump single or dual stage? (Pumps on single or dual strokes.)
> ...



Sounds like you are prepared! If there's an emergency here, I'll go to the storm room and crawl into my big safe with a few (pre-filtered) beers & Cheetos + an iPod and hope I never have to poop or pee ever again. Oh and maybe a camera to record the apocalypse afterward (until the battery dies) assuming there will be any way to ever access or use the digital images.


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## Don Haines (Feb 10, 2013)

Northstar said:


> RustyTheGeek said:
> 
> 
> > OK, Wow. I looked at the Katadyn Water MicroFilter Link and OMG! Almost $400 list price and $275 on Amazon! Then I read a few of the lengthy and glowing 117 x 5 Star reviews. What a great filter! It's like the L Lens of Water Filters. One thing I couldn't figure out - is the pump single or dual stage? (Pumps on single or dual strokes.)
> ...



Mine is 30 years old.... on the third filter element, and still going strong.... it sees about 30 days use per year.


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## Don Haines (Feb 10, 2013)

I wouldn't leave the poles at home.... if you are carying all the gear you may need them for balance... or saving the knees on the way downhill...

When I pack for summer trips it is:
Ultralight tent, ultralight down sleeping bag, 3/4 length thermarest...
rainjacket and pants, fleece pullover, spare socks and underwear.....
MSR stove and one pot, a cup, a spoon, and a pair of chopsticks. (I eat out of the pot)
Dehydrated food, water filter, and 3 litre camelback
assorted stuff like first aid kit, flashlight, etc etc.
60D camera with 18-200 lens, sometimes a 400f5.6 if conditions permit.

It is the food that is the big weight savings. I prepare my food at home and dehydrate it. While hiking all I have to do is boil water, drop in the food, stir it, and turn the stove off. Let it sit for 10 minutes, bring it back to a boil, and eat. You use a minimumum amount of fuel (more weight savings) cooking is quick and simple, no burnt mess on pots... and you don't need lots of kitchen utensils to prepare it... just a pair of chopsticks to stir with.


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## infared (Feb 10, 2013)

Don Haines said:


> I wouldn't leave the poles at home.... if you are carying all the gear you may need them for balance... or saving the knees on the way downhill...
> 
> When I pack for summer trips it is:
> Ultralight tent, ultralight down sleeping bag, 3/4 length thermarest...
> ...



WOW! A minimalist...like me!..I basically carry all the same camping gear except I skipp the pot and carry only one titanium cup..(eat out of the food packets),plus solar charger for my iPod mini. Lol!
I have a complete Canon kit...but that all stays at home especially when I go out for more than an overnight. I bring a Micro Four Thirds kit with me. ...not even my Olympus OMD (too heavy)...but my Panasonic GX1 (really light weight!), a viewfinder, with the best primes....there is nothing worse than being out on a three or four-nighter with too much weight on your back...no fun! I am anxiously awaiting a good quality long tele prime from Oly or Pany to bump the quality up on the long end a little...but everything in that kit is great and makes an incredibly great compromise to help save this old man's weary bones!


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## jabbott (Feb 11, 2013)

RustyTheGeek said:


> OK, Wow. I looked at the Katadyn Water MicroFilter Link and OMG! Almost $400 list price and $275 on Amazon! Then I read a few of the lengthy and glowing 117 x 5 Star reviews. What a great filter! It's like the L Lens of Water Filters. One thing I couldn't figure out - is the pump single or dual stage? (Pumps on single or dual strokes.)


Single. Keep in mind it doesn't filter viruses, so if you are traveling somewhere that has severely contaminated water, you'll want to use purification tablets (such as Micropur) as well.


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## Rienzphotoz (Feb 11, 2013)

How about Canon SX50 HS (24-1200mm zoom range, with very good image quality in good light) ... I've never used this camera but was thinking of getting one for hikes, Sink hole climbs etc ... seen some interesting reviews on youtube ... a canon rumors member (dilbert) had posted a convincing review from luminous landscape
http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=12154.msg230986#msg230986


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