# Canon updates EOS R5 8K and autofocus information



## Canon Rumors Guy (Mar 13, 2020)

> Canon has updated some 8K video and autofocus specifications for the Canon EOS R5.
> *8K video*
> 
> 30fps,
> ...



Continue reading...


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## DBounce (Mar 13, 2020)

That’s exactly the way to do it. I expect Canon also will bring no less than 10 bit 422 with this 8K beast. Add to that 4K 10 bit 422 @ 120fps with AF and you have the full package.


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## Go Wild (Mar 13, 2020)

Just bring it ooonnnn Canon!!!


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## drama (Mar 13, 2020)

_*Cries in Tony Northrup*_


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## Besisika (Mar 13, 2020)

Oh dear!


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## Mark3794 (Mar 13, 2020)

Well i was sure about full frame 8k and dpaf, animal af is a nice addition.
At least this will stop all the people screaming "CROP 8k cripple hammer canon is *******"


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## ordinaryfilmmaker (Mar 13, 2020)

So now I am only concerned about price. Looks very similar to 1DX mark III, but it is not the R1. Sure the full specs may tell a different story. I hope it is priced at the 5D level or it is going to be very expensive as the Canadian dollar keeps sliding on health and market concerns


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## Chaitanya (Mar 13, 2020)

Those are some juicy bits that will make videographers drool. I can see a lot of 5D users jumping ship. 
Edit: as long as its not using Mjpeg.


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## SereneSpeed (Mar 13, 2020)

These features are beyond my requirements. I doubt I’ll use 8k anytime in the next few years. But, yay Canon! Release the beast!

When the market started shrinking and a sizeable group started using the word ‘*******’ when describing Canon, I remember thinking ‘but they’re making solid business decisions’...

This is good solid business from Canon. I’ll be the first to admit, I’m sure it’s reactive, not proactive, but that’s okay with me. Bring on the camera!


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## cootwijk (Mar 13, 2020)

I’m still wondering what the R5 will cost. I hope it will be in budget.


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## kingrobertii (Mar 13, 2020)

*mother of god*


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## Graphic.Artifacts (Mar 13, 2020)

My MacBook Pro is going to melt into a little silver puddle trying to process that video. I doubt I’ll even be able to play it back. Let alone edit. Hopefully there are also some good 4K recording options.


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## Go Wild (Mar 13, 2020)

Thing is almost nobody want those 8k! Or better, almost nobody will use it! But it´s not the 8k itself! It´s Canon dominating! It´s Canon saying yes we can do it and we are the best! AND I FREAKING LOVE IT in a brand! Of course most of us will not use it but will be great to have! Also that means better 4k files and better overall video specs! And that´s the juice! For me is more important 4k120fps than the 8k. 

I am loving this camera already! From a wildlife photographer and videographer this camera is reaching everything we desire!I will definitely preorder this one and for the first time in my life I will preorder something! It´s just a pain to wait for it...And hopefully we can have a reasonable number of cameras in July or sooner, why not!  Canon, my birthday is on 23rd June, this would be a hell of a present! 

BTW, today i started building my R sistem. I bought a EOS R and a RF35mm. My firsts of the RF and R sistem! Happy!


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## Fran Decatta (Mar 13, 2020)

This looks awesome! glad to see Canon fighting this way. Defenitely the R5 will be a camera highly focused on videographers (the ones who still with canon, deserves it!) I hope the R6 or any other body lacks more of video features and get focus on still photography


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## Viggo (Mar 13, 2020)

Canon’s biggest successes, for me at least, are when they go all in. Like they did with the 350d, the 5d2, 7d, 1dx, 5d4, and now the R5. Same with lenses, all RF-L’s, 35 L II, 135 f2, 24-70 L II, 200 f1.8, 50 f1.0 etc etc etc... 

This might be the biggest “all in” of them all.. I predict a MASSIVE success...


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## ordinaryfilmmaker (Mar 13, 2020)

cootwijk said:


> I’m still wondering what the R5 will cost. I hope it will be in budget.



Depends on how far over budget. I can always save a little longer if I get that more capability and further future proof. I am just concerned over currency fluctuations.


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## Joules (Mar 13, 2020)

Viggo said:


> This might be the biggest “all in” of them all.. I predict a MASSIVE success...


Agreed.

I read some YouTube comments and it's hilarious. There's still some people out there who seemingly didn't read or understand any of the material that was released. Almost as if they just mindlessly keep beating the old 'Canon is *******' drum for the sake of it  

For the slow guys: Canon has dominated the ILC market without being leading in specs for a long time. This R5 leaves a ton of other bodies in the dust on a number of specs. And you can see the hype that's created. Hype! For a Canon camera! Has there ever been such a thing? 

There’s no need for everybody to get excited, but acting as if this was a boring Camera release and they should do better is beyo d silly.


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## bellorusso (Mar 13, 2020)

It too a decade for Canon to get us excited. I am excited, Canon. Release this beast already! ))


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## Jemlnlx (Mar 13, 2020)

Out in the wild? Though no more specs that what is listed above.


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## 12Broncos (Mar 13, 2020)

Can we just get an official announcement and specs list?


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## ordinaryfilmmaker (Mar 13, 2020)

Joules said:


> Agreed.
> 
> I read some YouTube comments and it's hilarious. There's still some people out there who seemingly didn't read or understand any of the material that was released. Almost as if they just mindlessly keep beating the old 'Canon is *******' drum for the sake of it
> 
> ...



I was the first to report the new information about the 8K and autofocus just after midnight. Not all of us are out of touch. My video might still be hilarious as I was punch drunk tired and should have been in bed


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## ordinaryfilmmaker (Mar 13, 2020)

bellorusso said:


> It too a decade for Canon to get us excited. I am excited, Canon. Release this beast already! ))



I can't wait to see it myself, but if they drag it out a little longer, it is good for my channel views.


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## Jemlnlx (Mar 13, 2020)

Really curious as to how they will price it? The specs alone seem to justify a $5k price point. I think pricing it at a 5D level ($3500) would make it a steal. 

Though I also wonder if the Coronavirus delays would influence the price...


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## Viggo (Mar 13, 2020)

Jemlnlx said:


> Really curious as to how they will price it? The specs alone seem to justify a $5k price point. I think pricing it at a 5D level ($3500) would make it a steal.
> 
> Though I also wonder if the Coronavirus delays would influence the price...


A few statements from Canon officials puts this camera in the 5d segment, “not just for working professionals”, so it will for sure be priced below $3999. My guess is 3899.


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## Wickedkayaker (Mar 13, 2020)

So Wex has it:


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## thibaut (Mar 13, 2020)

Yesssss Canon is back ! 
Do we have an idea on the dynamic range and price of this beauty ?


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## Deleted member 68328 (Mar 13, 2020)

Any new information about GPS?


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## henrikolsen (Mar 13, 2020)

Now please give us a proper raw based histogram. And 4K120.


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## NorskHest (Mar 13, 2020)

Graphic.Artifacts said:


> My MacBook Pro is going to melt into a little silver puddle trying to process that video. I doubt I’ll even be able to play it back. Let alone edit. Hopefully there are also some good 4K recording options.


If it is motion jpeg you will be able to edit but if it is a h.265 it might melt and die. It’s funny how people bitched about motion jpeg because it actuality is a awesome codec and far easier on your system compared to all these high efficiency codecs


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## jedy (Mar 13, 2020)

DBounce said:


> That’s exactly the way to do it. I expect Canon also will bring no less than 10 bit 422 with this 8K beast. Add to that 4K 10 bit 422 @ 120fps with AF and you have the full package.


Nope. 8K 30fps.


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## Drcampbellicu (Mar 13, 2020)

Canon Rumors Guy said:


> Continue reading...



The cripple hammer is dead
Long live cabin mirrorless 

Absolutely awesome!!!


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## canonnews (Mar 13, 2020)

EIGHT FREAKING KAY™ with DPAF.

I never dreamt that Canon would pull that off. That's just an insane amount of data.

That paper ripping sound you hear is the A7S III specification sheet.


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## Joaquim (Mar 13, 2020)

Just saw this on another site. That has got to be the best implementation of port flap design and port spacing on a body with a vari-angle screen.(as far as mic/headphones) The HDMI port is probably going to be a mini and still in the way of the screen, but then obviously if one is using the HDMI port, it's probably going to a bigger monitor anyway. Something I hope Fuji can emulate to an extent with the X-H2.

Source: https://www.digitalcameraworld.com/...l-deliver-uncropped-8k-and-advanced-animal-af


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## Pixel (Mar 13, 2020)

Eat your heart out, Matt Granger.


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## Architect1776 (Mar 13, 2020)

Canon Rumors Guy said:


> Continue reading...



Canon is *******. They forgot to have 24p, 60p etc.P and 16K quad AF and double size of full sensor and tracking of what you might want after the fack.
They are just so *******, no innovation.


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## Joaquim (Mar 13, 2020)

NorskHest said:


> If it is motion jpeg you will be able to edit but if it is a h.265 it might melt and die. It’s funny how people bitched about motion jpeg because it actuality is a awesome codec and far easier on your system compared to all these high efficiency codecs


Yeah that's a great point. Makes me wonder too. Space savings can result in horrendous post workflow during edit if one's computer isn't capable, for mere motals like me. Storage space can be bought. But not time.


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## mariosk1gr (Mar 13, 2020)

Viggo said:


> A few statements from Canon officials puts this camera in the 5d segment, “not just for working professionals”, so it will for sure be priced below $3999. My guess is 3899.


I think the same that this camera is a 4000$ camera. Excellent price for these specs!


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## Trout Bum (Mar 13, 2020)

“Release the Kraken!!”


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## IcyBergs (Mar 13, 2020)

Does it take stills?


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## MORphoto.net (Mar 13, 2020)

Crazy pants!! So awesome, but I’m really hoping the actual R6 specs will be just as impressive, without the 8k obviously. I don’t need or want that many megapixels, but I want all the awesomeness!


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## mariosk1gr (Mar 13, 2020)

Pixel said:


> Eat your heart out, Matt Granger.


We don't need to be so bad with him! He needs a Canon hug... that's all!


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## unfocused (Mar 13, 2020)

Canon is doing an excellent job of building anticipation for this camera. Their marketing department deserves a bonus. By the time this thing is announced there will be tons of people gleefully paying the early adopter premium and pre-ordering sight unseen. Maybe it will bring down the cost of the 1Dx III a bit once the supply chain returns to normal. (Wishful thinking on my part.)


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## WhereDoWeGoFrmHere (Mar 13, 2020)

Scrap the 8K and give me those specs on 20-24mp R6 and I'm a very very happy person!


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## slclick (Mar 13, 2020)

As someone who has been immediately impacted by work shortages due to the current health crisis and cancellation of events globally, I wonder how this new body's release will go over for some. Unless the section of the economy which affects us rebounds sooner than not, I'll continue looking forward to a late adopter stance if not refurb. Especially as these video specs roll in and as a stills only shooter, it looks to be higher priced initially than I first surmised.


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## Cochese (Mar 13, 2020)

This is looking like an amazing camera. I'm saving my dollars and expecting to be waiting at least one firmware before correct operation of at least one feature.


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## melgross (Mar 13, 2020)

It seems that this will surprise some people.


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## Pape (Mar 13, 2020)

GRRR i thought i can ignore this camera ,but bird eye focus ,dunno anymore


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## herein2020 (Mar 13, 2020)

Joaquim said:


> Yeah that's a great point. Makes me wonder too. Space savings can result in horrendous post workflow during edit if one's computer isn't capable, for mere motals like me. Storage space can be bought. But not time.


Actually MJPEG is a horrendous codec from a storage standpoint and is the sole reason why I consider my 5DIV's 4K to be completely unusable. You can't film a 4hr fashion show using MJPEG or pretty much anything of importance with it. If they put that codec in the R5 it will be the sole reason I do not get it.

The 8K codec needs to be H.264 or H.265 and stored in an MOV (preferred) or MP4 container. MJPEG is long dead. To edit something beyond your computer's capabilities simply get a faster computer or use proxy files. I am a 100% hybrid shooter (50% video and 50% photography) and even with all of the fantastic specs I still worry this will not be a sufficient B cam due to the following reasons:

Dual card recording - just because it has dual card slots does not mean it will write video to both slots. This is a critical requirement for me or the camera is a no go as a b cam for the work I do. I will even settle for dual card recording up to 4K and CFAST only for 8K.

XLR Audio Module - For run and gun scenarios where I need XLR audio, Canon has not said anything about offering an XLR module for this camera. I currently use a GH5 for those scenarios and it does both (dual card video recording and has an XLR module)

Recording Limit - No word yet on if this is still a problem. In 2020 the EOS R still has a recording limit which is completely logic defying to me.

I would love to come back to the Canon family for video; my dream setup is a C200 Mark II A camera and an R5 hybrid run and gun b cam for gimbal and photography work. I would even get the R6 as a C camera (timelapses, 3rd POV, handheld POV, etc) if Canon finally puts away their cripple hammer.

I absolutely love Canon's color science and would love to consolidate my entire setup around them, but if this is another disappointing year I'll probably go all in on the S1, S1H and EVA1 instead. It's ironic...Panasonic can already do everything I want for video but my Canon lenses, Canon color science, and Canon auto focus is the only reason I have kept waiting for 3yrs on Canon to add the missing pieces.


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## davo (Mar 13, 2020)

MORphoto.net said:


> Crazy pants!! So awesome, but I’m really hoping the actual R6 specs will be just as impressive, without the 8k obviously. I don’t need or want that many megapixels, but I want all the awesomeness!


Yes my dream is the R6 is a less video, great low light version of the R5. Same body.


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## davo (Mar 13, 2020)

WhereDoWeGoFrmHere said:


> Scrap the 8K and give me those specs on 20-24mp R6 and I'm a very very happy person!


Yes yes yes


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## sanj (Mar 13, 2020)

Go Wild said:


> Thing is almost nobody want those 8k! Or better, almost nobody will use it! But it´s not the 8k itself! It´s Canon dominating! It´s Canon saying yes we can do it and we are the best! AND I FREAKING LOVE IT in a brand! Of course most of us will not use it but will be great to have! Also that means better 4k files and better overall video specs! And that´s the juice! For me is more important 4k120fps than the 8k.
> 
> I am loving this camera already! From a wildlife photographer and videographer this camera is reaching everything we desire!I will definitely preorder this one and for the first time in my life I will preorder something! It´s just a pain to wait for it...And hopefully we can have a reasonable number of cameras in July or sooner, why not!  Canon, my birthday is on 23rd June, this would be a hell of a present!
> 
> BTW, today i started building my R sistem. I bought a EOS R and a RF35mm. My firsts of the RF and R sistem! Happy!


I will use 8k.


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## londonxt (Mar 13, 2020)

Viggo said:


> Canon’s biggest successes, for me at least, are when they go all in. Like they did with the 350d, the 5d2, 7d, 1dx, 5d4, and now the R5. Same with lenses, all RF-L’s, 35 L II, 135 f2, 24-70 L II, 200 f1.8, 50 f1.0 etc etc etc...
> 
> This might be the biggest “all in” of them all.. I predict a MASSIVE success...



The original 5D too


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## jeffa4444 (Mar 13, 2020)

12Broncos said:


> Can we just get an official announcement and specs list?


The Wex video is pretty much official because they actually show a camera and would have had Canon UK divulge those newly announced features.


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## londonxt (Mar 13, 2020)

Shame they didnt just call it "Beast AF"


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## sanj (Mar 13, 2020)

So. It seems like me canceling my 1dx3 pre-order may have been a good decision. Let's wait 1 more month for full specs to be out. Then I will compare both cameras and see.


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## herein2020 (Mar 13, 2020)

Go Wild said:


> Thing is almost nobody want those 8k! Or better, almost nobody will use it! But it´s not the 8k itself! It´s Canon dominating! It´s Canon saying yes we can do it and we are the best! AND I FREAKING LOVE IT in a brand! Of course most of us will not use it but will be great to have! Also that means better 4k files and better overall video specs! And that´s the juice! For me is more important 4k120fps than the 8k.
> 
> I am loving this camera already! From a wildlife photographer and videographer this camera is reaching everything we desire!I will definitely preorder this one and for the first time in my life I will preorder something! It´s just a pain to wait for it...And hopefully we can have a reasonable number of cameras in July or sooner, why not!  Canon, my birthday is on 23rd June, this would be a hell of a present!
> 
> BTW, today i started building my R sistem. I bought a EOS R and a RF35mm. My firsts of the RF and R sistem! Happy!


I would absolutely use 8K. Not very often, but shooting in 8K and delivering in 1080P would provide some incredible pan, crop, recomposition options. You could add dolly, slider, and gimbal motion to your footage without ever leaving a tripod.


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## unfocused (Mar 13, 2020)

slclick said:


> As someone who has been immediately impacted by work shortages due to the current health crisis and cancellation of events globally, I wonder how this new body's release will go over for some. Unless the section of the economy which affects us rebounds sooner than not, I'll continue looking forward to a late adopter stance if not refurb. Especially as these video specs roll in and as a stills only shooter, it looks to be higher priced initially than I first surmised.


Just judging by the reaction on this forum, I suspect there are quite a few photography consumers who are insulated from all but the most extreme economic downturns. That's one advantage that camera manufacturers now have. They lost the average consumer to cell phone cameras and are concentrating on enthusiasts with disposable income. Smaller, but much more profitable market. If the current health crisis proves to be short-lived, demand will not be impacted significantly. If it is not, well...then all bets are off. 

I consider myself very fortunate as a semi-retiree. My income is stable and likely to remain fairly so. The income I receive from part-time work is helpful, but not essential for my survival. I am very aware, though, that I am luckier than most and am sympathetic to those who aren't as fortunate. That said, I am with you on being a late adopter. I have equipment that meets my needs right now and know that I could continue indefinitely using that equipment.


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## Jasonmc89 (Mar 13, 2020)

Holy shit balls


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## chasingrealness (Mar 13, 2020)

Is this where we find out it has a 12MP camera sensor for stills? Too good to be true! 

The cripple hammer must have been left behind in one of the factories that they shut down due to corona virus concerns...


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## djack41 (Mar 13, 2020)

Wonder how Canon is addressing overheating?


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## Del Paso (Mar 13, 2020)

The professional Canon bashers might soon be out of job.
Good riddance!


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## Joules (Mar 13, 2020)

djack41 said:


> Wonder how Canon is addressing overheating?


If their hardware is efficient enough, there is nothing that will overheat.

The 1DX III does 5.5K only in RAW, skipping the processing that would be required to compress the video. That's the same trick Magic Lantern used way back when.

I think there's a good chance the R5 will also only do 8K RAW.


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## MORphoto.net (Mar 13, 2020)

davo said:


> Yes my dream is the R6 is a less video, great low light version of the R5. Same body.


Totally! And I would not be sad if the sensor is from the 1DX Mark III


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## DemoBkk (Mar 13, 2020)

Canon’s going Plaid with these specs! Hopefully it stays cool otherwise you’ll need the WiFi to operate because the buttons are too small for oven mitts.


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## davo (Mar 13, 2020)

MORphoto.net said:


> Totally! And I would not be sad if the sensor is from the 1DX Mark III


Agreed.. 20 something is plenty for me if I can get much better lowlight performance than my 5DIii


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## sanj (Mar 13, 2020)

Will 8k be RAW?


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## canonnews (Mar 13, 2020)

Joules said:


> If their hardware is efficient enough, there is nothing that will overheat.
> 
> The 1DX III does 5.5K only in RAW, skipping the processing that would be required to compress the video. That's the same trick Magic Lantern used way back when.
> 
> I think there's a good chance the R5 will also only do 8K RAW.



h.265,etc allows canon to use a reduced bit depth read from the sensor moreso than RAW - so it depends on where they are having the issues with performance and heat.


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## njohnson (Mar 13, 2020)

So does it alter the strategy now of competitors who release dedicated cameras focused on video and photography such as Sony with the A7S and A7R? Or are there video features that the R5 would potentially be lacking against dedicated video-focused cameras like the A7R?


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## jedy (Mar 13, 2020)

If this camera is anywhere near as good as Canon would have us believe, I could see it working well for high end video, semi-professional - forget YouTube, that would be a waste of the specs. The only real downside to the R system is it’s relative newness and lack of RF cine lenses. RF photography lenses might be optically superb but there’s always a compromise using photography lenses with video (other than the advantage of autofocus for the times autofocus might be more practical). The Xeen lenses from Samyang/Rokinon would be a great set of ‘budget’ cine lenses to pair with this camera. I hope someone does an adapted EF cine lens test as and when this gets released.


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## raistmaj (Mar 13, 2020)

ok, if this is really true, the camera is insane.


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## Starting out EOS R (Mar 13, 2020)

ordinaryfilmmaker said:


> So now I am only concerned about price. Looks very similar to 1DX mark III, but it is not the R1. Sure the full specs may tell a different story. I hope it is priced at the 5D level or it is going to be very expensive as the Canadian dollar keeps sliding on health and market concerns


Completely agree, I thought it would be around the £/$3500 area but I'm not sure now as this a pretty hefty step up from the R and the 5D and close to the 1DX MKlll specs


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## jedy (Mar 13, 2020)

njohnson said:


> So does it alter the strategy now of competitors who release dedicated cameras focused on video and photography such as Sony with the A7S and A7R? Or are there video features that the R5 would potentially be lacking against dedicated video-focused cameras like the A7R?


All I can think of, if Sony release an A7SIII with stunning 4K video that’s more than good enough for the majority of potential buyers, people are bound to complain and say 4K isn’t good enough because Canon offers 8K. It could very easily turn into an unnecessary spec war also with Panasonic also joining the ‘fight’. I personally don’t see anything above 4K as essential right now because 2.5K is still the majority standard on the internet and streaming services. I suppose Canon jumping ahead is a good thing rather than their poor, playing catch-up 4K offering on the 5DIV.


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## Graphic.Artifacts (Mar 13, 2020)

herein2020 said:


> Actually MJPEG is a horrendous codec from a storage standpoint and is the sole reason why I consider my 5DIV's 4K to be completely unusable. You can't film a 4hr fashion show using MJPEG or pretty much anything of importance with it. If they put that codec in the R5 it will be the sole reason I do not get it.
> 
> The 8K codec needs to be H.264 or H.265 and stored in an MOV (preferred) or MP4 container. MJPEG is long dead. To edit something beyond your computer's capabilities simply get a faster computer or use proxy files. I am a 100% hybrid shooter (50% video and 50% photography) and even with all of the fantastic specs I still worry this will not be a sufficient B cam due to the following reasons:
> 
> ...


I think you can safely anticipate that the quality of the video will be excellent. As good or better than anything in the hybrid space. 
I don’t think you should anticipate that it will be a practical production camera for video. It’s still just a compact mirror less and that is just not how Canon does things. As least they never have. I expect that they’ll still say production should be done on their cinema cameras.


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## unfocused (Mar 13, 2020)

Del Paso said:


> The professional Canon bashers might soon be out of job...



I have complete confidence in their ability to find something wrong with any Canon.


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## davo (Mar 13, 2020)

sanj said:


> Will 8k be RAW?


It almost has to be to avoid overheating doesn't it??!!


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## davo (Mar 13, 2020)

I do notice the release note says autofocus in all 8k modes. That means multiple 8k modes are present.


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## KeithBreazeal (Mar 13, 2020)




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## jvillain (Mar 13, 2020)

DBounce said:


> That’s exactly the way to do it. I expect Canon also will bring no less than 10 bit 422 with this 8K beast. Add to that 4K 10 bit 422 @ 120fps with AF and you have the full package.


The only way that would be doable is with external recording unless it is dual CFexpress slots which I think has already been ruled out. But I don't think there is a HDMI standard that supports 8K 10 422 currently. I could be wrong.



henrikolsen said:


> Now please give us a proper raw based histogram. And 4K120.


It is way past time for wave forms. I agree 4K 120 would be very, very welcome.



NorskHest said:


> If it is motion jpeg you will be able to edit but if it is a h.265 it might melt and die. It’s funny how people bitched about motion jpeg because it actuality is a awesome codec and far easier on your system compared to all these high efficiency codecs



MJpeg is beyond dead. It wasn't particularly good when we were shooting 8bit HD and is hopeless where the world is now. The key to h.265 is having the encoding/decoding done on the graphics card rather than the CPU. Most modern laptops with GPUs will support that. What you will save in storage alone will pay for upgrading your laptop. If you have a desktop it may be a case of just updating your graphics card.

Bottom line. This is a declaration of war.


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## Go Wild (Mar 13, 2020)

herein2020 said:


> I would absolutely use 8K. Not very often, but shooting in 8K and delivering in 1080P would provide some incredible pan, crop, recomposition options. You could add dolly, slider, and gimbal motion to your footage without ever leaving a tripod.





sanj said:


> I will use 8k.




Glad I wrote "almost nobody!"   

Yes of course, if we have the tools we will use it! I just wrote that because i really don´t know how many PC´s will take over that 8k footage and i am almost certain that we will need to wait some time to get proper support from Final cut or Premiere. Before that it will be painfull to use 8k like the 5.5k from1dx3 is being. After that yes, if its more easy to use it...we will use it for sure!!! .

Also the file sizes. You will definitely have to consider really good if you use 8k or 4k. I assume those 8k files are going to be....massive!!! If in 5.5k you can record 3 minutes in 64gb card...i guess in 8k you will record 1 minute! If you have a long project thats insane and you might well record in 4k and only some special scenes in 8k. I record in external record so it is a bit more easy cause I use 1tb ssd´s but even so....you will need huge data storage. 

Saying this....I DO believe I will record also in 8k at least some shots! And like I said it before, it´s a HUGE step from Canon witch I praise a lot! But there are a lot things to consider before hitting that record button in 8k and that´s why i wrote that! I don´t believe that most of filmmakers with long term or even medium term projects will embrace 8k. For some few shots....maybe...for hole project...I will not for sure!


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## deleteme (Mar 13, 2020)

ordinaryfilmmaker said:


> So now I am only concerned about price. Looks very similar to 1DX mark III, but it is not the R1. Sure the full specs may tell a different story. I hope it is priced at the 5D level or it is going to be very expensive as the Canadian dollar keeps sliding on health and market concerns


Don't worry. You will be able to pick a slightly used one up from a brand hopper as soon as Sony or Nikon intro a body with a rumored spec infinitesimally better than the R5.
As for performance, on paper it seems to be all one might need for sports at anything less than 10/10 jobs. Even then it is miles better than what we had three years ago.


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## Quackator (Mar 13, 2020)

jvillain said:


> Bottom line. This is a declaration of war.



No. It is a takeover notice.


----------



## deleteme (Mar 13, 2020)

slclick said:


> As someone who has been immediately impacted by work shortages due to the current health crisis and cancellation of events globally, I wonder how this new body's release will go over for some. Unless the section of the economy which affects us rebounds sooner than not, I'll continue looking forward to a late adopter stance if not refurb. Especially as these video specs roll in and as a stills only shooter, it looks to be higher priced initially than I first surmised.


This is a real issue for what comes after the current crisis. Pros in the event/wedding/corporate space are hurting with many that will go bust.
What will drive initial sales is the usual group of amateurs with good paying jobs and retirees. Pros will be wary of letting go of cash for the time being.
Near death experiences taught me long ago to buy only when necessary.
My bank will not take a camera in lieu of a mortgage payment


----------



## Deleted member 381342 (Mar 13, 2020)

Go Wild said:


> Glad I wrote "almost nobody!"
> 
> Yes of course, if we have the tools we will use it! I just wrote that because i really don´t know how many PC´s will take over that 8k footage and i am almost certain that we will need to wait some time to get proper support from Final cut or Premiere. Before that it will be painfull to use 8k like the 5.5k from1dx3 is being. After that yes, if its more easy to use it...we will use it for sure!!! .



You can edit multiple streams of 8k today on a Mac Pro with a afterburner card Finalcut.


----------



## iheartcanon (Mar 13, 2020)

Now I just need to time the selling of my 5DmarkIV to get the best price while trying not to pay the absolute premium price on the R5


----------



## Go Wild (Mar 13, 2020)

Codebunny said:


> You can edit multiple streams of 8k today on a Mac Pro with a afterburner card Finalcut.


Good to know! Thanks!!  
Never tried anything above 4k.


----------



## davidhfe (Mar 13, 2020)

NorskHest said:


> If it is motion jpeg you will be able to edit but if it is a h.265 it might melt and die. It’s funny how people bitched about motion jpeg because it actuality is a awesome codec and far easier on your system compared to all these high efficiency codecs



This was not my experience. On my 2014 iMac, I can't play back 4K MJPEG smoothly. However, transcoded to ProRes or H265 was no problem. Really need to replace this iMac, though. 2020 is an expensive year.


----------



## TMACIOSZEK (Mar 13, 2020)

My credit card is standing by.


----------



## TMACIOSZEK (Mar 13, 2020)

SereneSpeed said:


> These features are beyond my requirements. I doubt I’ll use 8k anytime in the next few years. But, yay Canon! Release the beast!
> 
> When the market started shrinking and a sizeable group started using the word ‘*******’ when describing Canon, I remember thinking ‘but they’re making solid business decisions’...
> 
> This is good solid business from Canon. I’ll be the first to admit, I’m sure it’s reactive, not proactive, but that’s okay with me. Bring on the camera!


I agree... I don't need 8K video, but the larger mp's and ibis make it very enticing, and hey, the enhanced video stuff is gravy.


----------



## Architect1776 (Mar 13, 2020)

mariosk1gr said:


> I think the same that this camera is a 4000$ camera. Excellent price for these specs!



I believe Canon needs to keep it at $3,500 USD. They can easily do that if they carry over to the R6 body and other internal features crippled, just a bit. And make the awesome non-8K R6 at about 36 mp and sell it for $2,000-$2,100 USD. and yes, 4K at all the speeds in demand at full sensor.
This will absolutely blow everybody's mind and both will sell very well.


----------



## FramerMCB (Mar 13, 2020)

thibaut said:


> Yesssss Canon is back !
> Do we have an idea on the dynamic range and price of this beauty ?


Easily 19.3 stops of Dynamic Range. ;-)

I've posted before - it's going to be somewhere between $3,699 and $3,999USD. And I would say probably closer to $3,799 or $3,899USD.


----------



## FramerMCB (Mar 13, 2020)

IcyBergs said:


> Does it take stills?


Sure - 16mp frame captures from the video footage...


----------



## dwarven (Mar 13, 2020)

Graphic.Artifacts said:


> My MacBook Pro is going to melt into a little silver puddle trying to process that video. I doubt I’ll even be able to play it back. Let alone edit. Hopefully there are also some good 4K recording options.



Yeah, you're going to want a custom PC rig if you're going to work with 8k. Ryzen 9 3950x, PCIe M.2 SSD, probably 32GB RAM etc..


----------



## dba101 (Mar 13, 2020)

herein2020 said:


> Actually MJPEG is a horrendous codec from a storage standpoint and is the sole reason why I consider my 5DIV's 4K to be completely unusable. You can't film a 4hr fashion show using MJPEG or pretty much anything of importance with it. If they put that codec in the R5 it will be the sole reason I do not get it.
> 
> The 8K codec needs to be H.264 or H.265 and stored in an MOV (preferred) or MP4 container. MJPEG is long dead. To edit something beyond your computer's capabilities simply get a faster computer or use proxy files. I am a 100% hybrid shooter (50% video and 50% photography) and even with all of the fantastic specs I still worry this will not be a sufficient B cam due to the following reasons:
> 
> ...



Not sure how many 4 hr fashion shows there are.


----------



## Deleted member 381342 (Mar 13, 2020)

dwarven said:


> Yeah, you're going to want a custom PC rig if you're going to work with 8k. Ryzen 9 3950x, PCIe M.2 SSD, probably 32GB RAM etc..



That is way under spec. Right now it is the domain of the Mac pro or a workstation pc with some serious grunt behind it. I would be considering 300+ GB RAM and a something like a quadro or the Apple afterburner. Of course over the next 5 years, 8k will become something your phone can edit.


----------



## AEWest (Mar 13, 2020)

I am just excited about this news item generally. For once in a long while it is not terrible news about quarantine this or cancellation that. We will get through the bad stuff soon!


----------



## KeithBreazeal (Mar 13, 2020)

iheartcanon said:


> Now I just need to time the selling of my 5DmarkIV to get the best price while trying not to pay the absolute premium price on the R5


I already have a buyer for my 5DS.  Keeping the 5D IV.


----------



## Joules (Mar 13, 2020)

Codebunny said:


> That is way under spec. Right now it is the domain of the Mac pro or a workstation pc with some serious grunt behind it. I would be considering 300+ GB RAM and a something like a quadro or the Apple afterburner. Of course over the next 5 years, 8k will become something your phone can edit.


Can Premiere even use more than 32 Threads now? If not, a what even is out there that beats the 3950X? RAM is something you can easily get for a PC aswell. The Afterburner card only does decoding, right? If Canon's 8K is RAW, that won't help at all. And on the GPU side, it's not like Apple went with the best option anyway.

The base model Mac Pro is all but serious grunt. I haven't edited any 4K myself, let alone 8K. But is it reasonable to suggest a 3950X is not a suitable option?


----------



## mcfrlnd (Mar 13, 2020)

*Aggressive Canon **>** overly confident Canon*


----------



## Canon1966 (Mar 13, 2020)

cootwijk said:


> I’m still wondering what the R5 will cost. I hope it will be in budget.


Probably around $3500 my guess if its a Mirrorless 5D equivalent.


----------



## mcfrlnd (Mar 13, 2020)

Canon1966 said:


> Probably around $3500 my guess if its a Mirrorless 5D equivalent.


Same sentiment...$3200-3500.


----------



## Canon1966 (Mar 13, 2020)

Wickedkayaker said:


> So Wex has it:
> 
> It looks very comfortable to hold...Canon has the best ergonomics IMO.


----------



## Canon1966 (Mar 13, 2020)

KeithBreazeal said:


> View attachment 189147


That's hysterical! Very good!


----------



## Bert63 (Mar 13, 2020)

iheartcanon said:


> Now I just need to time the selling of my 5DmarkIV to get the best price while trying not to pay the absolute premium price on the R5



Keep it!

Right now I carry an EOS-R and a 5D4 and they're really a great set - they compliment each other.


----------



## Bert63 (Mar 13, 2020)

Please. Canon. I'm sold. Details are nice, how 'bout the price!


----------



## Canon1966 (Mar 13, 2020)

Bert63 said:


> Please. Canon. I'm sold. Details are nice, how 'bout the price!



I'm sold as well. July see seems so far away...then the reviews and critics...I hope Canon takes back it's crown.


----------



## Deleted member 381342 (Mar 13, 2020)

Joules said:


> Can Premiere even use more than 32 Threads now? If not, a what even is out there that beats the 3950X? RAM is something you can easily get for a PC aswell. The Afterburner card only does decoding, right? If Canon's 8K is RAW, that won't help at all. And on the GPU side, it's not like Apple went with the best option anyway.
> 
> The base model Mac Pro is all but serious grunt. I haven't edited any 4K myself, let alone 8K. But is it reasonable to suggest a 3950X is not a suitable option?



The R5 might output ProRes Raw, or you'll use your 48+ thread CPU to convert the Canon format to ProRes Raw so It is easier to work with and in the domain of the Afterburner to offload the editing away from the GPU's and CPU's

I don't think anyone using a Mac Pro for serious work will be using the base model. We are talking about 24 core models with 2-4 GPU's and a Afterburner card or a Windows workstation with similar specs using Eypc or Xeon. And I would hope Premiere can use 32 or more threads by now. 

Anyhoo, right now doing serious 8k editing is still the domain of a workstation with lots of RAM. It's not to say a Ryzen or even a laptop can't do it, its just not going to be ideal. Give it 5 years and it'll be something that a phone can do without fuss.


----------



## slclick (Mar 13, 2020)

KeithBreazeal said:


> I already have a buyer for my 5DS.  Keeping the 5D IV.


Used Canon gear is not getting what it used to.

11/2019- Mint 5D3, $1230 from Keh.com.
2/2020- Same camera, $770

Glass is a little different, especially the L series, holds it's own pretty well. However not like in the 00's.


----------



## Jonathan Thill (Mar 13, 2020)

ordinaryfilmmaker said:


> So now I am only concerned about price. Looks very similar to 1DX mark III, but it is not the R1. Sure the full specs may tell a different story. I hope it is priced at the 5D level or it is going to be very expensive as the Canadian dollar keeps sliding on health and market concerns



It will likely be new 5D Money in Canada, I am betting on 5 to 5.5K Canadian so I put the money aside. Just waiting for a per order. Markets are crazy, great deals to be had atm.


----------



## Act444 (Mar 13, 2020)

Nice, but will wait for hands-on reviews before getting excited. This is nothing more than a slick marketing campaign at the moment (but I will admit it is a good one)


----------



## B77 (Mar 13, 2020)

Viggo said:


> A few statements from Canon officials puts this camera in the 5d segment, “not just for working professionals”, so it will for sure be priced below $3999. My guess is 3899.



We all hope Canon has realized they have to stop throwing overpriced stuff out and trying to sell it to people (EOS R ...ahem...). Yeah, few professionals will buy it in $3.000+ range, but meanwhile Sony, BlackMagic, Panasonic, etc. have stolen their entire customer base with $1.000-$2.000 cameras with better or similar video capabilities.
Don't get me wrong, I own 7D and love it, but if Canon prices this thing above $2.500 I am buying competitor's camera as well. Hell, blackmagic has 4K 60fps for $1.300, sounds like one hell of a deal for some good quality footage.


----------



## Bert63 (Mar 13, 2020)

B77 said:


> We all hope Canon has realized they have to stop throwing overpriced stuff out and trying to sell it to people (EOS R ...ahem...). Yeah, few professionals will buy it in $3.000+ range, but meanwhile Sony, BlackMagic, Panasonic, etc. have stolen their entire customer base with $1.000-$2.000 cameras with better or similar video capabilities.
> Don't get me wrong, I own 7D and love it, but if Canon prices this thing above $2.500 I am buying competitor's camera as well. Hell, blackmagic has 4K 60fps for $1.300, sounds like one hell of a deal for some good quality footage.



You may as well buy the competitor's gear today because your $2.5K wish is never going to happen.

EOS-R isn't overpriced in my opinion. $1,799 gives you fantastic photos and all the Canon lenses out there.

Blackmagic? That's funny.

"Sony, BlackMagic, Panasonic, etc. have stolen their entire customer base "

You're a funny guy.


----------



## AdmiralFwiffo (Mar 13, 2020)

Am I the only one wondering _where_ Canon said this? None of the articles or rumor sites have links to the primary source. Did they update the specs on some site somewhere? Was there a press release? News conference? Kissogram? Seance? Did they just call all the news sites to whisper sweet nothings?


----------



## Viggo (Mar 13, 2020)

AdmiralFwiffo said:


> Am I the only one wondering _where_ Canon said this? None of the articles or rumor sites have links to the primary source. Did they update the specs on some site somewhere? Was there a press release? News conference? Kissogram? Seance? Did they just call all the news sites to whisper sweet nothings?


Here you go


----------



## trounds (Mar 13, 2020)

Click...ordered, I wish! 
Will be ordereing on release date. Can't wait.


----------



## AEWest (Mar 13, 2020)

Question to sports photographers: would it not be better to film clips of action at 8K 30fps (at say 40mp) and do a frame grab rather than a 1dx3 at 20mp at 16 fps for stills?


----------



## Czardoom (Mar 13, 2020)

B77 said:


> We all hope Canon has realized they have to stop throwing overpriced stuff out and trying to sell it to people (EOS R ...ahem...). Yeah, few professionals will buy it in $3.000+ range, but meanwhile Sony, BlackMagic, Panasonic, etc. have stolen their entire customer base with $1.000-$2.000 cameras with better or similar video capabilities.
> Don't get me wrong, I own 7D and love it, but if Canon prices this thing above $2.500 I am buying competitor's camera as well. Hell, blackmagic has 4K 60fps for $1.300, sounds like one hell of a deal for some good quality footage.



If you judge a camera on some sort of spec checklist, then you can believe that Canon products are overpriced. If you have owned various brands, then you might come to the realization that price should be judged on more than a spec list. I own the R and so far it is worth the full price I paid. At one time I owned A Sony A7 II. Luckily I was able to return it. if someone had given me one for free, I wouldn't have used it over my Canon 6D or even my Olympus E-M1. Lots of specs. Lots of crappy specs. Quality costs a bit more.


----------



## sanj (Mar 13, 2020)

Act444 said:


> Nice, but will wait for hands-on reviews before getting excited. This is nothing more than a slick marketing campaign at the moment (but I will admit it is a good one)


Which campaign?


----------



## sanj (Mar 13, 2020)

AEWest said:


> Question to sports photographers: would it not be better to film clips of action at 8K 30fps (at say 40mp) and do a frame grab rather than a 1dx3 at 20mp at 16 fps for stills?


Only if you have a shutter at 1/1000 or such to freeze the action.


----------



## Sharlin (Mar 13, 2020)

davo said:


> I do notice the release note says autofocus in all 8k modes. That means multiple 8k modes are present.



Well, at least 25p and 30p.That's already "multiple", technically, but no doubt there'll be 24p as well. It's probable that there will also be separate 16:9 and 17:9 (DCI) modes for each frame rate as well, à la 1DX3.


----------



## dtaylor (Mar 13, 2020)

Graphic.Artifacts said:


> My MacBook Pro is going to melt into a little silver puddle trying to process that video. I doubt I’ll even be able to play it back. Let alone edit. Hopefully there are also some good 4K recording options.



I have little doubt the 4k is good. And you can always build a Hackintosh for video editing.


----------



## dtaylor (Mar 13, 2020)

IcyBergs said:


> Does it take stills?



Of course. You pull them from the 8k video.


----------



## Profit007 (Mar 13, 2020)

canonnews said:


> I never dreamt that Canon would pull that off. That's just an insane amount of data.



You swore black and blue it was impossible for the 1Dx3 to offer Raw (ie no processing required, just write the data as is) *5k and DPAF*. 
Strange that the semi-pro camera can fully process 8k, and still AF....? 

Please explain.


----------



## joestopper (Mar 13, 2020)

B77 said:


> We all hope Canon has realized they have to stop throwing overpriced stuff out and trying to sell it to people (EOS R ...ahem...). Yeah, few professionals will buy it in $3.000+ range, but meanwhile Sony, BlackMagic, Panasonic, etc. have stolen their entire customer base with $1.000-$2.000 cameras with better or similar video capabilities.
> Don't get me wrong, I own 7D and love it, but if Canon prices this thing above $2.500 I am buying competitor's camera as well. Hell, blackmagic has 4K 60fps for $1.300, sounds like one hell of a deal for some good quality footage.



This entire market is changing: While in the past they made money with volume, now they need to make money through price (with far lower volume).
It is wrong to assume that competition with smart phones leads to lower DSLM/DSLR prices as latter go upscale in capabilities to clearly distinguish. To my mind the only strategy to guarantee a future existence of DSLM/DSLR.


----------



## slclick (Mar 14, 2020)

Can you imagine having to buy a new computer because your new camera body has too high of processing demands for video? Glad I shoot stills only.


----------



## kten (Mar 14, 2020)

slclick said:


> Can you imagine having to buy a new computer because your new camera body has too high of processing demands for video? Glad I shoot stills only.


Sometimes vid folks make a bigger deal of it when you don't absolutely need to buy a machine capable of direct workflow, you can just use proxies. Of course having enough power to not need to and getting faster transcoding to boot means more power is better. Just is good alternative (plus other reasons for those with the power) for those who compromise a proper workstation for portability of a laptop or for aesthetics ; some rigs are made to look nicer but can't handle thermals from running under full load thus throttle like a certain company that look good on paper specs but fall short in real life performance compared to equal spec but better cooled alternatives that don't come in white.


----------



## xanbarksdale (Mar 14, 2020)

I can’t help but laugh at the people who still think this is going to be $3299...


----------



## xanbarksdale (Mar 14, 2020)

AEWest said:


> Question to sports photographers: would it not be better to film clips of action at 8K 30fps (at say 40mp) and do a frame grab rather than a 1dx3 at 20mp at 16 fps for stills?



No because you need a higher shutter speed.


----------



## slclick (Mar 14, 2020)

kten said:


> Sometimes vid folks make a bigger deal of it when you don't absolutely need to buy a machine capable of direct workflow, you can just use proxies. Of course having enough power to not need to and getting faster transcoding to boot means more power is better. Just is good alternative (plus other reasons for those with the power) for those who compromise a proper workstation for portability of a laptop or for aesthetics ; some rigs are made to look nicer but can't handle thermals from running under full load thus throttle like a certain company that look good on paper specs but fall short in real life performance compared to equal spec but better cooled alternatives that don't come in white.


I stopped at vid folks but thanks  (I just can't do the video mumbo jumbo)


----------



## djack41 (Mar 14, 2020)

Viggo said:


> A few statements from Canon officials puts this camera in the 5d segment, “not just for working professionals”, so it will for sure be priced below $3999. My guess is 3899.


My guess is 3898. lol


----------



## navastronia (Mar 14, 2020)

slclick said:


> Can you imagine having to buy a new computer because your new camera body has too high of processing demands for video? Glad I shoot stills only.



This . . . happens to video producers all the time  I've had to do major upgrades twice in the last 6 years due to video files I was working on being too beefy for my machine.


----------



## usern4cr (Mar 14, 2020)

yoms said:


> Any new information about GPS?


I would also *really* like to have GPS in this camera. If it is missing, and is provided in another of their R cameras shortly after that then I would wait for the one with GPS.


----------



## PureClassA (Mar 14, 2020)

DPAF in 8K modes. Well holy dog poop. That means it should be in all 4K modes too. I wonder if perhaps the DX3 gets a firmware boost? Assuming the same CPU is being used. Digic X . This is huge. Still way more MP than I want, but Im hoping we see much of this in the R6 but without the 8K obviously


----------



## Danglin52 (Mar 14, 2020)

If they can do 8k @ 30 FPS with full DPAF, the camera should have the processing power to deliver incredible stills performance. I am hoping the camera will be a solid performer for wildlife. I sold my 5dIV but decided to keep my 1dx II until I knew the full R5 spec. I definitely see an R5 in my future. If they can do birds, we should see support for additional animals in the future.


----------



## sanj (Mar 14, 2020)

navastronia said:


> This . . . happens to video producers all the time  I've had to do major upgrades twice in the last 6 years due to video files I was working on being too beefy for my machine.


Next time it may be wise to buy the best in the market to save money by buying frequently. And old machines work just fine if you use low res to edit. Simple.


----------



## sanj (Mar 14, 2020)

usern4cr said:


> I would also *really* like to have GPS in this camera. If it is missing, and is provided in another of their R cameras shortly after that then I would wait for the one with GPS.


I never learned to use GPS in a camera. How does this help? Honest question!


----------



## sanj (Mar 14, 2020)

xanbarksdale said:


> No because you need a higher shutter speed.


Which video has.


----------



## navastronia (Mar 14, 2020)

sanj said:


> Next time it may be wise to buy the best in the market to save money by buying frequently. And old machines work just fine if you use low res to edit. Simple.



I don't remember asking for your advice, but sure, you can save yourself some trouble (and additional resources) by employing offline editing, though even this strategy will only get you so far, since you will still eventually have to do your main renders, which will then be problematic if your footage (bitrate + size) and post processing needs far oustrip your RAM and video card.

I always bought what I needed for a job and used it for years, going for the best possible price/performance ratio. Simple!


----------



## canonnews (Mar 14, 2020)

sanj said:


> Which video has.


not usually.


----------



## David_E (Mar 14, 2020)

sanj said:


> _I never learned to use GPS in a camera. How does this help? Honest question!_


It’s not really a matter of learning _how_ to use it. You just turn it on in the menus and geographic info will be in your metadata. It’s a question of _why_ to use GPS. Some don’t need it, and some are a bit paranoid about using it. In the case of my macro-nature photos—mostly arthropods and various wild flora _in situ_—location data is mandatory because my photos are of no use to scientific or educational institutions without information on the location of the organism. In the case of my RP, which lacks built-in GPS, I make an iPhone photo at the scene and copy the coordinates to the scientific image In Lightroom Classic. Sometimes the Lr Maps feature provides sufficient accuracy.


----------



## kten (Mar 14, 2020)

navastronia said:


> I don't remember asking for your advice, but sure, you can save yourself some trouble (and additional resources) by employing offline editing, though even this strategy will only get you so far, since you will still eventually have to do your main renders, which will then be problematic if your footage (bitrate + size) and post processing needs far oustrip your RAM and video card.
> 
> I always bought what I needed for a job and used it for years, going for the best possible price/performance ratio. Simple!


I took it to mean more buy once cry once for as high end as you'll ever see yourself potentially needing which I'd side with personally but it doesn't always work for folks and isn't always money well spent. Best bang for buck (for current market performance) can date pretty quick and generally you'll chase incremental upgrades with that which can work well for some not for others. Fwiw I get 6 years out of my rigs capable of heavy lifting without any problems or need for upgrades but they tend to be built around highest end desktop (not always flagship enthusiast bleeding edge but the normal consumer hedt) going on mid range for a dedicated workstation. Works out cheaper for me than a best bang for buck with upgrades as required but I'm able to predict what kind of heavy lifting I'll be doing for next x many years and can budget for it. Not everyone can and thus it could be wasteful. Sounds like going higher end may suit your need if you constantly run into that issue but I'm sure you know that since you know your own circumstances better than a stranger thus I don't intend it as teach you to suck eggs more just make a point worth considering perhaps.

edit: fwiw I have seen some really bad future proof plans and editing hardware situations at a very large global content creators studio though so everyone makes mistakes in their plans so none of us are immune to it. They are large corp so probably write the cost off (not that I see any of the bean countersside of things) but led to a lot of money over given amount of time for rigs they are not quite as capable as same money spent correctly imho. Also some of the staff workflows were not exactly the best way of doing things for the job efficiency nor performance wise. This was kinda sore point when questioned as not that many really knew enough to change it and it was accepted as a fault of the job when really it was users doing things in a not ideal way. Those who did flag it including me just abandoned trying to help since it was taking on other peoples headaches for no real benefit and it sort of worked and people were happy with sorta worked to the extent rocking the boat and retraining staff just wasn't worth the better way pursuit. As usual we all make mistakes, ymmv so it all depends on many factors and sometimes good enough works for people.


----------



## davo (Mar 14, 2020)

xanbarksdale said:


> I can’t help but laugh at the people who still think this is going to be $3299...


Canon and reps have stated the R5 is aimed towards 5D users so it should be below 4K if that is the case


----------



## Bert63 (Mar 14, 2020)

xanbarksdale said:


> I can’t help but laugh at the people who still think this is going to be $3299...



I don't laugh at anyone for having an opinion when there aren't facts available to prove them wrong.


----------



## herein2020 (Mar 14, 2020)

AEWest said:


> Question to sports photographers: would it not be better to film clips of action at 8K 30fps (at say 40mp) and do a frame grab rather than a 1dx3 at 20mp at 16 fps for stills?



No, video is compressed using a video codec (i.e. H.264 or H.265) which throws away far more information than the JPG codec. Also as others have mentioned the shutter speed will be so low that there will be too much motion blur. I suppose you could do a screen capture from a RAW video capture, but that's a very unlikely scenario and still would not be the same quality as a JPG.



dba101 said:


> Not sure how many 4 hr fashion shows there are.



Plenty of events including fashion shows that I shoot can be well over 4hrs. That's not to say it is 4hrs of continuous filming, but filming getting ready, BTS, model interviews, producer interviews, b roll, audience, sponsors, etc. can quickly add up to hours of footage. The context was that MJPEG is a horrible codec for more than anything but a few seconds of video if that. I wouldn't even shoot b roll with MJPEG.


Go Wild said:


> Glad I wrote "almost nobody!"
> 
> Yes of course, if we have the tools we will use it! I just wrote that because i really don´t know how many PC´s will take over that 8k footage and i am almost certain that we will need to wait some time to get proper support from Final cut or Premiere. Before that it will be painfull to use 8k like the 5.5k from1dx3 is being. After that yes, if its more easy to use it...we will use it for sure!!! .
> 
> ...



I really don't think 8K 4:2:0 8bit LongGOP shot at 30FPS using an H.265 codec will be that much bigger than 4K 4:2:0 8 bit 60FPS LongGOP shot using an H.264 codec. If the data rate is around 200Mb/s for the 8K that's only double the data rate for 4K LongGOP. The 5.5K you referenced is RAW footage which of course will be massive.

I do agree that 8K will be a niche case. I can see using it to give you more focal length in post or some scenarios where you have to keep the camera on a tripod but want to introduce movement into the frame. I've done this plenty of times using 4K or timelapse footage. With that being said, if the footage really is barely larger than 4K 60FPS footage and proxy workflow works well or a simple upgrade of my video card can handle the footage, then 8K might become my new 4K.


----------



## navastronia (Mar 14, 2020)

kten said:


> I took it to mean more buy once cry once for as high end as you'll ever see yourself potentially needing which I'd side with personally but it doesn't always work for folks and isn't always money well spent. Best bang for buck (for current market performance) can date pretty quick and generally you'll chase incremental upgrades with that which can work well for some not for others. Fwiw I get 6 years out of my rigs capable of heavy lifting without any problems or need for upgrades but they tend to be built around highest end desktop (not always flagship enthusiast bleeding edge but the normal consumer hedt) going on mid range for a dedicated workstation. Works out cheaper for me than a best bang for buck with upgrades as required but I'm able to predict what kind of heavy lifting I'll be doing for next x many years and can budget for it. Not everyone can and thus it could be wasteful. Sounds like going higher end may suit your need if you constantly run into that issue but I'm sure you know that since you know your own circumstances better than a stranger thus I don't intend it as teach you to suck eggs more just make a point worth considering perhaps.
> 
> edit: fwiw I have seen some really bad future proof plans and editing hardware situations at a very large global content creators studio though so everyone makes mistakes in their plans so none of us are immune to it. They are large corp so probably write the cost off (not that I see any of the bean countersside of things) but led to a lot of money over given amount of time for rigs they are not quite as capable as same money spent correctly imho. Also some of the staff workflows were not exactly the best way of doing things for the job efficiency nor performance wise. This was kinda sore point when questioned as not that many really knew enough to change it and it was accepted as a fault of the job when really it was users doing things in a not ideal way. Those who did flag it including me just abandoned trying to help since it was taking on other peoples headaches for no real benefit and it sort of worked and people were happy with sorta worked to the extent rocking the boat and retraining staff just wasn't worth the better way pursuit. As usual we all make mistakes, ymmv so it all depends on many factors and sometimes good enough works for people.



To be honest, I didn't really mean anything with my first post, which started this leg of the discussion, aside from that sometimes, you _do_ actually need to upgrade because modern video formats are much more demanding than those from 5 years ago. It happens!

My story:

I built an extreme-budget machine in mid-2012, which I then upgraded with a decent video card and a better processor in 2013 to handle DSLR 1080p video editing and very light post-processing work (upgrade 1). Then in 2015, I dumped a bunch of money into it to add additional RAM and a much better video card, along with SSDs, in order to complete a project editing 4K footage from a GH4 (upgrade 2), which was much more demanding than the video I worked with previously. This build has lasted me all the way to today, and I know from experience that my machine now chokes on modern, high-bitrate 60p 4K footage like that the X-T3. That's OK! I'm not doing much video work right now, and if I get some soon, I'm due for a major overhaul anyway, given I'm still on an AM3+ board


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Mar 14, 2020)

The new numbering system aligns the DSLR and the Mirrorless bodies, R6 is similar in features and price point to 6D, R5 matches 5D and so on. They will likely use the same sensors assuming both go to market. I think that and R1 will replace the 1DX 3.

The real question is what will happen to camera supplies and sales for the rest of the year? No public events, weddings may not have a lot of attendees, wildlife should still do fine, and the R5 might be a good wildlife body.

I photograph a event for the local high school every may. Schools here just closed for a month and most likely until fall. I delivered a photobook today from last May, and am working on January 2020 soon. The long delay is due to having students select from 1500 photos and place them in a 34 -38 page photobook. I create it from the selected photos, print and bind it.


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## M. D. Vaden of Oregon (Mar 14, 2020)

djack41 said:


> My guess is 3898. lol



I'll step out on a limb, guessing closer to $3500.00

Reason being, I think Canon can make up the difference through the RF lens sales if they don't discount that glass.


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## Antono Refa (Mar 14, 2020)

jedy said:


> All I can think of, if Sony release an A7SIII with stunning 4K video that’s more than good enough for the majority of potential buyers, people are bound to complain and say 4K isn’t good enough because Canon offers 8K. It could very easily turn into an unnecessary spec war also with Panasonic also joining the ‘fight’.



The spec war started years ago, with smartphones cameras now having dozens of MP.


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## koenkooi (Mar 14, 2020)

Codebunny said:


> You can edit multiple streams of 8k today on a Mac Pro with a afterburner card Finalcut.


The afterburner only does prores variants for the time being.


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## Joules (Mar 14, 2020)

Profit007 said:


> You swore black and blue it was impossible for the 1Dx3 to offer Raw (ie no processing required, just write the data as is) *5k and DPAF*.
> Strange that the semi-pro camera can fully process 8k, and still AF....?
> 
> Please explain.


The fact is that the 1DX III does not have DPAF available in 5.5K 60p. Pointing that out is not the same as saying it can't be done. But it seemed so.

5.5K at 60p is a tiny bit less data than 8K at 30p. So if the flagship DSLR can't handle AF when dealing with such loads, why would anybody assume a slightly lower mirrorless body (cheaper, less space to dissipate heat, ...) can handle it?

The opinion that the R5 would not be able to use AF in 8K was perfectly reasonable. The fact that Canon obviously withheld some functionality from the 1DX III for the moment and is going all out with the R5 is just crazy awesome.

Also, this suggests the 20 FPS stills mode could also have AF. That's just a brutal spec and completely smacks everything in the face.

For reference, the holy grail of speed, the A7 R IV only handles 76 % of that throughput. We'll still have to wait and see. It sounds too good to be true.


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## canonnews (Mar 14, 2020)

Profit007 said:


> You swore black and blue it was impossible for the 1Dx3 to offer Raw (ie no processing required, just write the data as is) *5k and DPAF*.
> Strange that the semi-pro camera can fully process 8k, and still AF....?
> 
> Please explain.


I'd like to see where I sore black and blue about it.

I certainly would have mentioned that it's an incredibly large amount of data to process - which it is.

However, it really depends on the codec of the 8K30p. 5.5k60p is 12 bit data from my recollection. From my recollection as well, h.265 or h.264 does not require 12 bit data, but more like 8 or 10 bit data from the sensor. If that's the case the sensor is running far faster on the R5 which could have something to do with it. 4 to 8 times faster. So alot less sensor heat doing 8k h.265 or h.264 data.

As it stands, I'm happy to be proven wrong and the camera does something better than I imagined. I would rather publish realistic goals on a rumor and be pleasantly surprised instead of saying it will do it all including the kitchen sink and come up wanting later on. Setting realistic expectations I think is better.


----------



## drama (Mar 14, 2020)

I do enjoy everyone willing a $3.5k price into existence with confidence: "Oh, Canon _must_ keep it around that mark if they want the 5D crowd".

Thought experiment: They have just teased an unreal warhorse of a camera. Everyone (including them, it seems) is very excited about it. If it lives up to the hype on launch in reviews, what's the price you leave the conversation at? It sure as hell isn't 3.5k. I'd say if they launch this anywhere under 5k it will fly off the shelves. Canon have never knowingly underpriced themselves. I'm expecting this to come in around 4-4.5k, which would be much closer to Canon's traditional "ouch, that's expensive but I really want it, so screw it" price.


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## phunguyen (Mar 14, 2020)

B77 said:


> We all hope Canon has realized they have to stop throwing overpriced stuff out and trying to sell it to people (EOS R ...ahem...). Yeah, few professionals will buy it in $3.000+ range, but meanwhile Sony, BlackMagic, Panasonic, etc. have stolen their entire customer base with $1.000-$2.000 cameras with better or similar video capabilities.
> Don't get me wrong, I own 7D and love it, but if Canon prices this thing above $2.500 I am buying competitor's camera as well. Hell, blackmagic has 4K 60fps for $1.300, sounds like one hell of a deal for some good quality footage.


$2500 ??? How the hell you think that price is possible ? Even the Blackmagic 6K with super35 sensor ( no autofocus, no stills, have to add a lot accessories to work with) is $2500, or the a7riv with crappy video capability is $3500. Beside insane 8K video, if R5 have at least 4K 60fps with AF, the price must be at least $3000, but high chance is $3500-$4000, and it will sell like hotcakes.


----------



## SecureGSM (Mar 14, 2020)

B77 said:


> We all hope Canon has realized they have to stop throwing overpriced stuff out and trying to sell it to people (EOS R ...ahem...). Yeah, few professionals will buy it in $3.000+ range, but meanwhile Sony, BlackMagic, Panasonic, etc. have stolen their entire customer base with $1.000-$2.000 cameras with better or similar video capabilities.
> Don't get me wrong, I own 7D and love it, but if Canon prices this thing above $2.500 I am buying competitor's camera as well. Hell, blackmagic has 4K 60fps for $1.300, sounds like one hell of a deal for some good quality footage.


Just don't bet your house on it. Promise?


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## SecureGSM (Mar 14, 2020)

M. D. Vaden of Oregon said:


> I'll step out on a limb, guessing closer to $3500.00
> 
> Reason being, I think Canon can make up the difference through the RF lens sales if they don't discount that glass.


Canon cannot make up the difference in a restricted (shrinking market) by offering rock bottom price from the get go... number of sales is the limit. therefore it is a specs war, not a price war. More value for money instead of less money for the same value. hope it makes sense.


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## Quackator (Mar 14, 2020)

sanj said:


> Which campaign?



You are bathing your fingers in it right now.


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## Quackator (Mar 14, 2020)

xanbarksdale said:


> No because you need a higher shutter speed.



It is at your discretion which shutter speed you shoot those 30fps at.

You can always go shorter, you just can't go longer than one over framerate.


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## SecureGSM (Mar 14, 2020)

Quackator said:


> It is at your discretion which shutter speed you shoot those 30fps at.
> 
> You can always go shorter, you just can't go longer than one over framerate.


Are you saying that a rolling shutter is not an issue with frame grabs? there are also other limitations.


----------



## Profit007 (Mar 14, 2020)

Joules said:


> The fact is that the 1DX III does not have DPAF available in 5.5K 60p. Pointing that out is not the same as saying it can't be done. But it seemed so.
> 
> 5.5K at 60p is a tiny bit less data than 8K at 30p. So if the flagship DSLR can't handle AF when dealing with such loads, why would anybody assume a slightly lower mirrorless body (cheaper, less space to dissipate heat, ...) can handle it?
> 
> The fact that Canon obviously withheld some functionality from the 1DX III for the moment and is going all out with the R5 is just crazy awesome.



Firstly, since when does the 1Dx3 offer 5.5k @60p???

Secondly, many of us were saying that Canon crippled the 1Dx3 by removing DPAF were it counted most. Mr Canon News claimed it was due to technical limitations, that it wasn't possible.

Those of us more familiar with Canon pro products (including Cinema cameras) knew the truth. Now it's plain for all to see.

In reality the 1Dx3 will create much better video than the R5, which is part of why Canon was willing to 'give away cheaply' high spec DPAF in the R5, but not in the 1Dx3.
Enthusiasts want lots of pixels, pros want good pixels. The camera with the best video pixels was video crippled.

I like the Canon News website, especially now that he's spending more time hunting for interesting patients, but we all need to have our eyes open that Canon is still being Canon. I'm a fan, but not an eyes closed fanboy.


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## Profit007 (Mar 14, 2020)

B77 said:


> We all hope Canon has realized they have to stop throwing overpriced stuff out and trying to sell it to people (EOS R ...ahem...). Yeah, few professionals will buy it in $3.000+ range


'Professional' means we earn our living (ie a full time wage) with a camera in our hand. Few actual 'professionals' using Canon buy anything less than a '5' series camera, unless it's as a backup or disposable B cam.
To say professionals won't spend $3k on a camera is complete nonsense. Any 'professional' who can't afford a $3k camera needs to get a haircut and a real job. (Or maybe these days, a beard trim and a real job.)
Meanwhile, all power to the enthusiasts and no disrespect meant to them.


----------



## BillB (Mar 14, 2020)

xanbarksdale said:


> I can’t help but laugh at the people who still think this is going to be $3299...


People are free to hope what they want and share their hopes as they please. We have to find humor where we can, and Canon Rumors is often enough a good place to find it.


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## Profit007 (Mar 14, 2020)

canonnews said:


> I'd like to see where I sore black and blue about it.


Do I need to link to the threads?


canonnews said:


> However, it really depends on the codec of the 8K30p. 5.5k60p is 12 bit data from my recollection. From my recollection as well, h.265 or h.264 does not require 12 bit data, but more like 8 or 10 bit data from the sensor. If that's the case the sensor is running far faster on the R5 which could have something to do with it. 4 to 8 times faster. So alot less sensor heat doing 8k h.265 or h.264 data.



This is very confusing. When did the 1Dx3 gain 5.5k @60fps? 

As posted above:
In reality the 1Dx3 will create much better video than the R5, which is part of why Canon was willing to 'give away cheaply' high spec DPAF in the R5, but not in the 1Dx3.
Enthusiasts want lots of pixels, pros want good pixels. The camera with the best video pixels was video crippled.


----------



## Joules (Mar 14, 2020)

Profit007 said:


> Firstly, since when does the 1Dx3 offer 5.5k @60p???


It does so since it was released. I may misinterpret your tone, but it sounds as if you are saying me or Canonnews are ill informed. To prevail yourself from the same fate, I attached the 1DX III video specs, also found here 



Profit007 said:


> Mr Canon News claimed it was due to technical limitations, that it wasn't possible.
> 
> Those of us more familiar with Canon pro products (including Cinema cameras) knew the truth. Now it's plain for all to see.


Enlighten me please, as I am not sure what exactly is plain to see.

Currently, we do not know all the details about the R5 video specs. And neither do we know if the 1DX III will gain more features with firmware updates later on.

What we do know seems to suggest the R5 could have a capability the 1DX III lacks. Emphasis on could.

So could you please tell me what it is that's plain to see? 



Profit007 said:


> In reality the 1Dx3 will create much better video than the R5, which is part of why Canon was willing to 'give away cheaply' high spec DPAF in the R5, but not in the 1Dx3.
> Enthusiasts want lots of pixels, pros want good pixels. The camera with the best video pixels was video crippled.


We have no sound information to claim the 1DX III will have better video quality. If the R5 8K turns out to also be 12-bit RAW, downsampling that to the 1DX III 5.5K or 4K should yield a higher quality.

It is also possible it won't be RAW, or won't be 12-bit. In which case your statement is correct. I'm not saying you're wrong, but you write as if you have some facts at hand. And in terms of facts we really won't have enough to make a judgment about which camera is better until Canon releases more. Am I missing something?


----------



## Quackator (Mar 14, 2020)

SecureGSM said:


> Are you saying that a rolling shutter is not an issue with frame grabs?



Rolling shutter doesn't care if you are shooting video or still with EFCS.
If EFCS with your camera delivers satisfactory results, it will be the 
same for those frame grabs.


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## DBounce (Mar 14, 2020)

jedy said:


> Nope. 8K 30fps.


Nope what? I said all along that the reports about this camera shooting 8K @ 30p were correct. But that said in the statement Canon also made clear this is not the only 8K frame rate; so it is almost certain that 8K @ 24p will also be available.


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## DBounce (Mar 14, 2020)

djack41 said:


> Wonder how Canon is addressing overheating?


What overheating? This is a new camera, with new sensor and processor. There have been no reports of anyone actually even powering an R5 up, much less recording anything with one. Yet you are assuming there will be a problem with overheating.


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## koenkooi (Mar 14, 2020)

Profit007 said:


> Firstly, since when does the 1Dx3 offer 5.5k @60p???
> [..]



Since launch, see page 953 of the english user guide. "RAW (59.94p/50.00p) Approx. 2600 Mbps"


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## koenkooi (Mar 14, 2020)

Joules said:


> The fact is that the 1DX III does not have DPAF available in 5.5K 60p. Pointing that out is not the same as saying it can't be done. But it seemed so.
> 
> 5.5K at 60p is a tiny bit less data than 8K at 30p. So if the flagship DSLR can't handle AF when dealing with such loads, why would anybody assume a slightly lower mirrorless body (cheaper, less space to dissipate heat, ...) can handle it?
> [..]



I don't think the restriction is pure bandwidth, but more a latency type of thing. The 1dx3 has DPAF in full sensor RAW modes up to 30Hz, it can't do it at 60Hz. The R5 also has DPAF up to 30Hz in full sensor mode.
That leads me to believe that a full sensor readout with 12 bits or more per pixel can't support DPAF at 60Hz. The 1dx3 can do 4k60 using the full sensor with DPAF because that's only 10-bit.


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## koenkooi (Mar 14, 2020)

canonnews said:


> [..]
> However, it really depends on the codec of the 8K30p. 5.5k60p is 12 bit data from my recollection. From my recollection as well, h.265 or h.264 does not require 12 bit data, but more like 8 or 10 bit data from the sensor. If that's the case the sensor is running far faster on the R5 which could have something to do with it. 4 to 8 times faster. So alot less sensor heat doing 8k h.265 or h.264 data.[..]



I don't think sensor heat is the bottleneck for 8k compression, it's more likely the Digic X. For RAW video the Digic doesn't really have to do anything, the sensor can basically dump the data straight to the card, no processing needed. The h.26x family trades file size for complexity, so you'll need a lot of processing to encode it. The Digic likely has dedicated hardware for all codecs, but even with that, I predict it will generate quite some heat for high resolution h.265.


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## usern4cr (Mar 14, 2020)

sanj said:


> I never learned to use GPS in a camera. How does this help? Honest question!


The main thing I want GPS to do is mark (in Exif data) the location where the camera was when the picture was taken, so that later I can look it up and find a name for the place, etc. If the camera was able to tell me where I was in real-time then that would be even better (but I don't expect this).

If it also had a compass (even with crude resolution) then I'd know in what direction the picture was taken (but I don't expect this, either).

I know the Olympus EM1X could do this, but I am focused on Canon FF mirrorless with their top level lenses now.


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## koenkooi (Mar 14, 2020)

usern4cr said:


> The main thing I want GPS to do is mark (in Exif data) the location where the camera was when the picture was taken, so that later I can look it up and find a name for the place, etc. If the camera was able to tell me where I was in real-time then that would be even better (but I don't expect this).
> 
> If it also had a compass (even with crude resolution) then I'd know in what direction the picture was taken (but I don't expect this, either).
> [..]



The GP-E2 has a built-in electronic compass, but Canon explicitly doesn't use it on the R and RP  I'm having decent success with using Camera Connect on my phone and having my RP and M6II use that over bluetooth. I still keep a separate tracklog in case something doesn't work.


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## drama (Mar 14, 2020)

Just watched the Tony Northrup response. He's now on the "well, it'll be a terrible codec like motion JPG or something". He has such a hateboner for Canon. If it turns out to be 10bit H265, can we do a public shaming?


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## usern4cr (Mar 14, 2020)

koenkooi said:


> The GP-E2 has a built-in electronic compass, but Canon explicitly doesn't use it on the R and RP  I'm having decent success with using Camera Connect on my phone and having my RP and M6II use that over bluetooth. I still keep a separate tracklog in case something doesn't work.


I could use my phone navigation and make notes somehow to align to photo #s, but I find that too much trouble to do (that's just me). To date, I've never had any phone to camera wireless connection work robustly so I've given up on that. If Canon could make it work robustly with the R5 at a reasonable distance then I'd probably be very happy using it.


----------



## AEWest (Mar 14, 2020)

DBounce said:


> What overheating? This is a new camera, with new sensor and processor. There have been no reports of anyone actually even powering an R5 up, much less recording anything with one. Yet you are assuming there will be a problem with overheating.



Perhaps the problem of potential overheating has been overcome with a stacked sensor. Here is a link to an article outlining Canon's patent for a stacked sensor back in 2017 and how it will reduce overheating.








Stacked Sensors Could Mean Faster Autofocus, Canon Patent Suggests | Digital Trends


Stacked sensors mean fast cameras -- but Canon thinks they can get even faster with an updated design for autofocus.




www.digitaltrends.com


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## usern4cr (Mar 14, 2020)

drama said:


> Just watched the Tony Northrup response. He's now on the "well, it'll be a terrible codec like motion JPG or something". He has such a hateboner for Canon. If it turns out to be 10bit H265, can we do a public shaming?


I've never found Tony to hate Canon, or any other brand. He calls things as he sees them like most of us do. We all make predictions and who can totally accurately predict the future? His praise of Canon RF lenses is one of the reasons I became interested in their system and am eagerly awaiting a better mirrorless body to match their great lenses. Of all the reviewers I see online, I'd have to say Tony & Chelsea are among the best there are.


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## y2kunals (Mar 14, 2020)

First people were crying Canon ain't offering enough - now I see people complaining that they'll never use 8k so what's the point lmao


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## SecureGSM (Mar 14, 2020)

Quackator said:


> Rolling shutter doesn't care if you are shooting video or still with EFCS.
> If EFCS with your camera delivers satisfactory results, it will be the
> same for those frame grabs.


obviously, therefore you shoot stills with a mechanical shutter instead. it was a rhetorical question


----------



## slclick (Mar 14, 2020)

Y


usern4cr said:


> I've never found Tony to hate Canon, or any other brand. He calls things as he sees them like most of us do. We all make predictions and who can totally accurately predict the future? His praise of Canon RF lenses is one of the reasons I became interested in their system and am eagerly awaiting a better mirrorless body to match their great lenses. Of all the reviewers I see online, I'd have to say Tony & Chelsea are among the best there are.


You might want to read Bryan Carnathan at TDP.


----------



## mpmark (Mar 14, 2020)

Profit007 said:


> Firstly, since when does the 1Dx3 offer 5.5k @60p???



I strongly suggest you reread the specs bud.


----------



## Memdroid (Mar 14, 2020)

Looking at these new photos and videos of the R5 I am now positive that the screen is bigger than the R.
It definitely has more height, maybe for an improved/additional bar so the controls won't obscure the image as much.


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## Bert63 (Mar 14, 2020)

M. D. Vaden of Oregon said:


> I'll step out on a limb, guessing closer to $3500.00
> 
> Reason being, I think Canon can make up the difference through the RF lens sales if they don't discount that glass.



I like the way you think. I'm hoping you're close.

Unfortunately this time it's been a long enough wait that my poor mental resistance has feebly crumbled into dust and I'll and I'll buy it no matter what it costs. If my track record holds true I'm fated to be an early adopter - warts and all.


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## BeenThere (Mar 14, 2020)

Bert63 said:


> I like the way you think. I'm hoping you're close.
> 
> Unfortunately this time it's been a long enough wait that my poor mental resistance has feebly crumbled into dust and I'll and I'll buy it no matter what it costs. If my track record holds true I'm fated to be an early adopter - warts and all.


Sad lack of self control.


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## Viggo (Mar 14, 2020)

I can’t wait to check the AF on this body. This amount of processing power should be able to track and recognize subjects like nothing else.


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## privatebydesign (Mar 14, 2020)

sanj said:


> I never learned to use GPS in a camera. How does this help? Honest question!


I was the same, until I got it. Absolutely love the feature as it is yet another way of searching for images, the Map panel in Lightroom makes it a very useful addition and I wouldn't be interested in a main camera that doesn't have it.


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## Sidepod (Mar 14, 2020)

so what kind of ibis can we expect? does Canon even have 5-axis ibis tech? i never read 5-axis so far ...


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## usern4cr (Mar 14, 2020)

slclick said:


> Y
> 
> You might want to read Bryan Carnathan at TDP.


Thanks for your suggestion! I just went to digitalPicture.com and read the very detailed review of the RF 70-200 2.8. That, and the tear down at lensRentals (previously seen), are the best I've seen for this lens so far. It's going to be hard to decide whether to get this or the upcoming RF 70-135 f2 lens, as there are very big advantages & disadvantages of each relative to the other. And one could consider their RF 85mm f1.2 DS for the ultimate in smooth background portraits. Man, how nice is it to have those kinds of choices!


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## [email protected] (Mar 14, 2020)

Starting out EOS R said:


> Completely agree, I thought it would be around the £/$3500 area but I'm not sure now as this a pretty hefty step up from the R and the 5D and close to the 1DX MKlll specs



guessing $4495 with initial package that includes a 64gb card and grip; or a kit lens package for $4995.


----------



## navastronia (Mar 14, 2020)

slclick said:


> Y
> 
> You might want to read Bryan Carnathan at TDP.



no kidding, Bryan is great.


----------



## joestopper (Mar 14, 2020)

Canon Rumors Guy said:


> Continue reading...



The interesting part


drama said:


> I do enjoy everyone willing a $3.5k price into existence with confidence: "Oh, Canon _must_ keep it around that mark if they want the 5D crowd".
> 
> Thought experiment: They have just teased an unreal warhorse of a camera. Everyone (including them, it seems) is very excited about it. If it lives up to the hype on launch in reviews, what's the price you leave the conversation at? It sure as hell isn't 3.5k. I'd say if they launch this anywhere under 5k it will fly off the shelves. Canon have never knowingly underpriced themselves. I'm expecting this to come in around 4-4.5k, which would be much closer to Canon's traditional "ouch, that's expensive but I really want it, so screw it" price.



Likely fact is that Canon has not decided the price yet. They will explore various scenarios from high volume at relatively low price tag to rather low volume with quite high price tag. And then they will calculate which of such scenario will bring the best ROI (its even likely the will follow discussion in forums like this to see what potential buyers think and where their limit is).
My guess is that many potential buyers are in even with a high price tag given all the new features ... 
And for those who dont want to spend that much: R and RP will further drop in price. As already the case, the entrance to FF is at levels never seen before (which is a smart move from Canon as all manufacturers building on APS-C or MFT will be in trouble).


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## AEWest (Mar 14, 2020)

I always read the product release statement to see if there are any other clues as to future products. One thing that I got out of the Canon Australia news release is that it seems more than ever to me that the R5 is indeed the replacement to the 5D, not just the mirrorless version. Here is the quote, talking about the 5 series rather than 5D...

"Our EOS 5-Series was developed fifteen years ago to make full-frame cameras accessible to consumers, not just professional shooters. Today, that purpose remains steadfast as we continue achieving the ‘impossible’ to deliver the hybrid needs of content creators who are demanding uncompromised performance to generate more still and motion visual content than ever before."

I may be reading too much into the statement (only time, or Canon, will tell) but that's what these forums are for!


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## joestopper (Mar 14, 2020)

privatebydesign said:


> I was the same, until I got it. Absolutely love the feature as it is yet another way of searching for images, the Map panel in Lightroom makes it a very useful addition and I wouldn't be interested in a main camera that doesn't have it.



The problem with GPS modules is the power consumption i.e. it drains the battery. With low CIPA rating of DSLMs wirh GPS it would get worse. A smarter way is via BlueTooth (newest BT is low power) of a phone with GPS.


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## max (Mar 14, 2020)

Since this was announced and now... my exchange rate has dropped 25%... So this is going to be prohibited for me 
It looks so awesome. I was going to change my entire 5d3 system to this.


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## unfocused (Mar 14, 2020)

AEWest said:


> I always read the product release statement to see if there are any other clues as to future products. One thing that I got out of the Canon Australia news release is that it seems more than ever to me that the R5 is indeed the replacement to the 5D, not just the mirrorless version. Here is the quote, talking about the 5 series rather than 5D...
> 
> "Our EOS 5-Series was developed fifteen years ago to make full-frame cameras accessible to consumers, not just professional shooters. Today, that purpose remains steadfast as we continue achieving the ‘impossible’ to deliver the hybrid needs of content creators who are demanding uncompromised performance to generate more still and motion visual content than ever before."
> 
> I may be reading too much into the statement (only time, or Canon, will tell) but that's what these forums are for!


You definitely are.


----------



## dwarven (Mar 14, 2020)

AEWest said:


> I always read the product release statement to see if there are any other clues as to future products. One thing that I got out of the Canon Australia news release is that it seems more than ever to me that the R5 is indeed the replacement to the 5D, not just the mirrorless version. Here is the quote, talking about the 5 series rather than 5D...
> 
> "Our EOS 5-Series was developed fifteen years ago to make full-frame cameras accessible to consumers, not just professional shooters. Today, that purpose remains steadfast as we continue achieving the ‘impossible’ to deliver the hybrid needs of content creators who are demanding uncompromised performance to generate more still and motion visual content than ever before."
> 
> I may be reading too much into the statement (only time, or Canon, will tell) but that's what these forums are for!



If the 5DIV isn't the last in the lineup, the 5DV certainly will be.


----------



## slclick (Mar 14, 2020)

max said:


> Since this was announced and now... my exchange rate has dropped 25%... So this is going to be prohibited for me
> It looks so awesome. I was going to change my entire 5d3 system to this.


See my above post. The best time to act would have been last summer. Now I'm resigned to my 5D3 being a backup/alternative body for when optimal IQ isn't needed i.e. Lensbaby, ICM, extra long exposures....

That is unless I don't buy an R5. That is the easiest proposal. My gear is fine. (Except I'm jonesing for a travel cam like a X100V)


----------



## TAF (Mar 14, 2020)

Viggo said:


> A few statements from Canon officials puts this camera in the 5d segment, “not just for working professionals”, so it will for sure be priced below $3999. My guess is 3899.



I can imagine the internal debate at Canon now - one side of the table is saying that for each month of delay, they can charge a little more since people have more time to save, and the other side of the table is saying that due to the adverse effect of the Wuhan virus on the economy, each month delay means they have to charge a little less since people haven't been earning.

Who's correct?

And remember, the camera is priced in Yen, so the exchange rate instability has to be considered.


----------



## Viggo (Mar 14, 2020)

TAF said:


> And remember, the camera is priced in Yen, so the exchange rate instability has to be considered.



And this is what worries me, our currency has plummeted to a record low, the last time it was so low was in 1981... and the 1dx3 was nearly $2500 more expensive than the 1dx2 event though in USD they were the same...


----------



## TAF (Mar 14, 2020)

slclick said:


> See my above post. The best time to act would have been last summer. Now I'm resigned to my 5D3 being a backup/alternative body for when optimal IQ isn't needed i.e. Lensbaby, ICM, extra long exposures....
> 
> That is unless I don't buy an R5. That is the easiest proposal. My gear is fine. (Except I'm jonesing for a travel cam like a X100V)



I've concluded I will be making my 5D3 into a full spectrum camera, since the trade-in value is looking to be too low to be worthwhile.

And I've always wanted to experiment in that area.


----------



## Bangrossi (Mar 14, 2020)

The only thing I don't like is the top plate button layout. I wish canon make it similar to 5d4. Everything else is perfect


----------



## venusFivePhotoStudio (Mar 14, 2020)

Now I have a reason not to day of Coronavirus. I have to live to buy the R5!


----------



## Bert63 (Mar 14, 2020)

BeenThere said:


> Sad lack of self control.



My photo appears alongside the phrase 'impulse buyer' in Websters.


----------



## Jack Douglas (Mar 14, 2020)

usern4cr said:


> I've never found Tony to hate Canon, or any other brand. He calls things as he sees them like most of us do. We all make predictions and who can totally accurately predict the future? His praise of Canon RF lenses is one of the reasons I became interested in their system and am eagerly awaiting a better mirrorless body to match their great lenses. Of all the reviewers I see online, I'd have to say Tony & Chelsea are among the best there are.


Wow, I must have seen the wrong videos! The early R5 video was ... I'm speechless. I really don't care and don't generally view Tony but ... I was hungering for anything R5, so shame on me.

Jack


----------



## dwarven (Mar 14, 2020)

TAF said:


> I can imagine the internal debate at Canon now - one side of the table is saying that for each month of delay, they can charge a little more since people have more time to save, and the other side of the table is saying that due to the adverse effect of the Wuhan virus on the economy, each month delay means they have to charge a little less since people haven't been earning.
> 
> Who's correct?
> 
> And remember, the camera is priced in Yen, so the exchange rate instability has to be considered.



They'll most likely price it high and discount it accordingly.


----------



## Jack Douglas (Mar 14, 2020)

Viggo said:


> And this is what worries me, our currency has plummeted to a record low, the last time it was so low was in 1981... and the 1dx3 was nearly $2500 more expensive than the 1dx2 event though in USD they were the same...


Please say where "here" is so we have an idea how to relate to the comment.

Jack


----------



## Quarkcharmed (Mar 14, 2020)

joestopper said:


> The problem with GPS modules is the power consumption i.e. it drains the battery. With low CIPA rating of DSLMs wirh GPS it would get worse. A smarter way is via BlueTooth (newest BT is low power) of a phone with GPS.


So let's drain the phone and make the camera dependant on the phone connection and phone battery.
Also BT connection means 'send and receive' for camera, GPS is 'receive' only, I'm not sure if BT is less power hungry in this case.
In-camera GPS is easy to disable in case it drains too much.


----------



## Viggo (Mar 14, 2020)

Jack Douglas said:


> Please say where "here" is so we have an idea how to relate to the comment.
> 
> Jack


Norway


----------



## SecureGSM (Mar 14, 2020)

[email protected] said:


> guessing $4495 with initial package that includes a 64gb card and grip; or a kit lens package for $4995.


Good thinking. Kit lens package at $4995 makes an absolutely commercial sense (24-105/4). Thank you.


----------



## Viggo (Mar 14, 2020)

SecureGSM said:


> Good thinking. Kit lens package at $4995 makes an absolutely commercial sense (24-105/4). Thank you.


I think they also should do a kit-deal with the 24-70, I think a lot of people are interested in both the R5 and a serious standard zoom, and if we can save some by buying them together, I think a lot of people will. I think a lot of people have no interest in the 24-105 and lots of interest in the 24-70. I have always hated the only good deal is with a lens I don’t want..


----------



## joestopper (Mar 14, 2020)

Quarkcharmed said:


> So let's drain the phone and make the camera dependant on the phone connection and phone battery.
> Also BT connection means 'send and receive' for camera, GPS is 'receive' only, I'm not sure if BT is less power hungry in this case.
> In-camera GPS is easy to disable in case it drains too much.



A typical power consumption for GPS is 80mW while BT 4.0 is 10mW. The real difference is larger because of the protocol (power modes). And yes, it makes sense to use the battery of the phone instead of the camera.


----------



## SecureGSM (Mar 14, 2020)

Viggo said:


> I think they also should do a kit-deal with the 24-70, I think a lot of people are interested in both the R5 and a serious standard zoom, and if we can save some by buying them together, I think a lot of people will. I think a lot of people have no interest in the 24-105 and lots of interest in the 24-70. I have always hated the only good deal is with a lens I don’t want..


Correct. 24-70/2.8 lens kit at $5750 or AUD$9000-$9500.


----------



## Deleted member 381342 (Mar 15, 2020)

Viggo said:


> I think they also should do a kit-deal with the 24-70, I think a lot of people are interested in both the R5 and a serious standard zoom, and if we can save some by buying them together, I think a lot of people will. I think a lot of people have no interest in the 24-105 and lots of interest in the 24-70. I have always hated the only good deal is with a lens I don’t want..



A odd take on it perhaps. I think it wont be kitted with a f/2.8 lens as they might dwarf it a bit and make it look less appealing to the masses than this 'small' FF camera with a f/4 lens. Just purely on aesthetics. Also prior models unless I am mistaken have been kitted with a f/4 lens.


----------



## David the street guy (Mar 15, 2020)

David_E said:


> It’s not really a matter of learning _how_ to use it. You just turn it on in the menus and geographic info will be in your metadata. It’s a question of _why_ to use GPS. Some don’t need it, and some are a bit paranoid about using it. In the case of my macro-nature photos—mostly arthropods and various wild flora _in situ_—location data is mandatory because my photos are of no use to scientific or educational institutions without information on the location of the organism. In the case of my RP, which lacks built-in GPS, I make an iPhone photo at the scene and copy the coordinates to the scientific image In Lightroom Classic. Sometimes the Lr Maps feature provides sufficient accuracy.



I would love to have GPS on my RP, but, unlike you, I have no real good reason to want it. I guess I just like to look at the map in Lightroom to find pictures I'm not really looking for. And it's fun.

When I know I'm going to be moving around while shooting (walking in a forest, a city, anywhere), I bring with me my Garmin training watch and I simply turn it on. I then use the «relevé d'itinéraire» and «balisage automatique» in Lightroom (sorry, I don't know what it's called in English, I guess you're going to hate that and think I'm a dumb illiterate). Boom! All my photos are geotagged!

It's a good and easy way to have GPS without draining the camera's battery.


----------



## privatebydesign (Mar 15, 2020)

joestopper said:


> The problem with GPS modules is the power consumption i.e. it drains the battery. With low CIPA rating of DSLMs wirh GPS it would get worse. A smarter way is via BlueTooth (newest BT is low power) of a phone with GPS.


Well I've tried that and found it really clunky, on the other hand with the 1DX MkII with the GPS set to Mode 2 I really don't see a difference in battery drain.


----------



## canonnews (Mar 15, 2020)

koenkooi said:


> I don't think sensor heat is the bottleneck for 8k compression, it's more likely the Digic X. For RAW video the Digic doesn't really have to do anything, the sensor can basically dump the data straight to the card, no processing needed. The h.26x family trades file size for complexity, so you'll need a lot of processing to encode it. The Digic likely has dedicated hardware for all codecs, but even with that, I predict it will generate quite some heat for high resolution h.265.



it's a bit of both. consider that canon put heat conducting strips on sensors before. but also .. pipelining 12Gb/sec of data is harder than pipelining 10Gb/sec.

It really depends on the efficiency of the encoders. Also h.265 from my recollection is supposed to be easier to encode than h.264.

at this point we don't know what's going on .. smiles. but we do know for whatever reason 5.5K60P does not offer DPAF yet 8k30p does. both have the same pixel/sec transfer rates.


----------



## canonnews (Mar 15, 2020)

TAF said:


> I've concluded I will be making my 5D3 into a full spectrum camera, since the trade-in value is looking to be too low to be worthwhile.
> 
> And I've always wanted to experiment in that area.


you'll love it. however to be honest, you'll have less struggle with a mirrorless camera as a full spectrum camera than a DSLR.


----------



## xanbarksdale (Mar 15, 2020)

SecureGSM said:


> Correct. 24-70/2.8 lens kit at $5750 or AUD$9000-$9500.



Not even close. The lens itself is $2300...the body will be $4500 or more.


----------



## analoggrotto (Mar 15, 2020)

Canon is hyping this up like a Chris Nolan flick. Just trying to keep the vibe alive while global conditions disrupt production rollout plans. 

There's folks on DPR hoping that this wipes out Canon, Nikon, Olympus. So sad.


----------



## Quarkcharmed (Mar 15, 2020)

joestopper said:


> A typical power consumption for GPS is 80mW while BT 4.0 is 10mW. The real difference is larger because of the protocol (power modes). And yes, it makes sense to use the battery of the phone instead of the camera.


What is important here is watts-hour though, Wh. In-camera GPS only gets enabled once in a few minutes while BT connection may be waking up much more frequently. Overall comparison will hugely depend on how often you have your GPS activated. In 5DIV, the GPS update interval can be set to up to 5 minutes.

And no, I don't want to have a camera-on-phone dependency through a permanent BT connection. It's an additional weak link. I prefer to have an in-camera GPS with an option to disable it.

But at the same time, while GPS is highly desirable, it's not a deal-breaker to me.


----------



## joestopper (Mar 15, 2020)

Quarkcharmed said:


> What is important here is watts-hour though, Wh. In-camera GPS only gets enabled once in a few minutes while BT connection may be waking up much more frequently. Overall comparison will hugely depend on how often you have your GPS activated. In 5DIV, the GPS update interval can be set to up to 5 minutes.
> 
> And no, I don't want to have a camera-on-phone dependency through a permanent BT connection. It's an additional weak link. I prefer to have an in-camera GPS with an option to disable it.
> 
> But at the same time, while GPS is highly desirable, it's not a deal-breaker to me.



If moving then after 5 minutes the location can be quite different. If GPS is not activated more frequently the value of having it in-camera is questionable.
Anyway, I rather have a camera-phone dependency for GPS than a drained camera battery when I want to take that shot ...


----------



## Quarkcharmed (Mar 15, 2020)

joestopper said:


> If moving then after 5 minutes the location can be quite different. If GPS is not activated more frequently the value of having it in-camera is questionable.
> Anyway, I rather have a camera-phone dependency for GPS than a drained camera battery when I want to take that shot ...


If you enable frequent GPS updates on phone, you drain phone battery quickly and get increased chances of getting both phone battery flat and GPS out. And you still get an increased power consumption in camera via BT.


----------



## Quarkcharmed (Mar 15, 2020)

Actually it looks like this thread is wearing off. It's time to talk about the dynamic range, is anyone up to a good DR talk?


----------



## telemaque (Mar 15, 2020)

herein2020 said:


> Actually MJPEG is a horrendous codec from a storage standpoint and is the sole reason why I consider my 5DIV's 4K to be completely unusable. You can't film a 4hr fashion show using MJPEG or pretty much anything of importance with it. If they put that codec in the R5 it will be the sole reason I do not get it.
> 
> The 8K codec needs to be H.264 or H.265 and stored in an MOV (preferred) or MP4 container. MJPEG is long dead. To edit something beyond your computer's capabilities simply get a faster computer or use proxy files. I am a 100% hybrid shooter (50% video and 50% photography) and even with all of the fantastic specs I still worry this will not be a sufficient B cam due to the following reasons:
> 
> ...



If XLR entry is a must for you, there are other options that you can use with any other DSLR or Mirroless body. 
TASCAM DR-70D is the one I own and it is a very good quality option. Less expensive than the Lumix add-on for microphone.

In Tascam brandname you have cheaper and more expensive options, depending your budget and your needs.
Tascam DR60D is cheaper, and Tascam DR 701 is more expensive with 6 XLR entries.








Tascam DR-70D | Enregistreur audio stéréo pour appareils reflex numériques (DSLR)


Enregistreur audio stéréo pour appareils reflex numériques (DSLR)




www.tascam.eu





I do also own ZOOM H4N PRO, that is a fabulous tool, that can be used for recording concerts, conferences etc.
It is a professional tool, that can also be used with a DSLR with 2 XLR Entries.
Zoom is also offering a bunch of other options depending your budget and needs. Up to 8 XLR entries...








Zoom H4n Pro


Enregistreur portable MP3 / Wave Résolution jusqu'à 24 bits / 96 kHz, Formats d'enregistrement: WAV, MP3 et le format BWF, Micros stéréo intégrés, peuvent être positionnés à 90° ou 120°, SPL max: 140 dB, Seuil de bruit amélioré (-120 dBu EIN), 2...




www.thomann.de





Both Tascam and Zoom tools can be used for pure audio projects without a camera. 
The Lumix add-on can not.

Let's not forget that many brandnames have developped excellent microphones with a 3.5mm jack dedicated to DSLR camera that are producing excellent quality of sound.
I own the Audiotechnica AT8024 producing an impressive good quality of sound.
Equivalent or even better than my XLR RODE NTG2... incredible but real.








MICRO AUDIOTECHNICA AT8024


Microphone mono et stéréo à condensateur court avec prise mini jack pour appareils DSLR




www.trm.fr





Other 3.5mm jack microphones I do not own but their reputation is very good: Sennheiser MKE400, Rode VideoMic Pro+ etc.

Like you I am looking at the R5 with a videographer angle. However, for me the presence of XLR entry is not important.
Because of all the options I have just listed.
What will be key for me is the image quality of the video. 
I hope much sharper than what Canon had produced up to now.

I will not buy an R5 for stills images. I am very pleased with my 6D and 60D on stills.

Let's wait for the first official footages...


----------



## DBounce (Mar 15, 2020)

Joules said:


> The fact is that the 1DX III does not have DPAF available in 5.5K 60p. Pointing that out is not the same as saying it can't be done. But it seemed so.
> 
> 5.5K at 60p is a tiny bit less data than 8K at 30p. So if the flagship DSLR can't handle AF when dealing with such loads, why would anybody assume a slightly lower mirrorless body (cheaper, less space to dissipate heat, ...) can handle it?


 Who said it’s cheaper? I’m pretty certain the price has not been disclosed.


----------



## Pape (Mar 15, 2020)

venusFivePhotoStudio said:


> Now I have a reason not to day of Coronavirus. I have to live to buy the R5!


Maybe manfrotto makes monopod with breathing machine for those who get serious lung damages


----------



## drob (Mar 15, 2020)

Will Canon update the R and RP autofocus too for animal AF?


----------



## Bahrd (Mar 15, 2020)

Quarkcharmed said:


> Actually it looks like this thread is wearing off. It's time to talk about the dynamic range, is anyone up to a good DR talk?


Now? When I have just found a dynamic range of GPS problem much more compelling?


----------



## Starting out EOS R (Mar 15, 2020)

[email protected] said:


> guessing $4495 with initial package that includes a 64gb card and grip; or a kit lens package for $4995.


I've given up trying to guess as there are so many guesses out there ranging from £3000 / $3000 to £6000 / $6000. If we ignore that this may be a 5d mkIV replacement along with the 5D MKIV price and look at it just on the specs alone, the price could be up to £/$ 6000 as it's similar spec to the 1DX mklll. 

However, although Tony & Chelsea Northrop are sometimes a little annoying, their video from 2018 was interesting about canon playing the waiting game, made a lot of sense, allowing Sony etc to develop the tech from scratch, which is hugely expensive and then reverse engineering it with new elements to take a giant leap forward without the massive initial development costs. Could this mean the price is a little more reasonable?? Who knows?

We will find out in due course I suppose, just frustrating they don't just come out with it with a caveat on potential delivery dates, instead of drip feeding and creating hype but then thats what marketing is all about.


----------



## Starting out EOS R (Mar 15, 2020)

[email protected] said:


> guessing $4495 with initial package that includes a 64gb card and grip; or a kit lens package for $4995.


I could live with $4995 if it came with the RF70-200MM 2.8L LOL. Fat chance of that though..


----------



## navastronia (Mar 15, 2020)

drob said:


> Will Canon update the R and RP autofocus too for animal AF?



That's a great question. I'm going to guess "no," and that they will claim that it's a hardware issue. I'm not complaining, mind you, since I think the R and RP's autofocus is already pretty great, but something tells me we won't see their AF updated to match the R5's.


----------



## djack41 (Mar 15, 2020)

FramerMCB said:


> Easily 19.3 stops of Dynamic Range. ;-)
> 
> I've posted before - it's going to be somewhere between $3,699 and $3,999USD. And I would say probably closer to $3,799 or $3,899USD.


Been on your Ouija Board again?


----------



## Kit. (Mar 15, 2020)

Quackator said:


> Rolling shutter doesn't care if you are shooting video or still with EFCS.
> If EFCS with your camera delivers satisfactory results, it will be the
> same for those frame grabs.


"Electronic first curtain" is just rolling reset, a very lightweight operation that can definitely be done with the speed of the mechanical shutter.

In order to see "frame grabs" magnitude of rolling shutter in stills, one should use fully-electronic shutter.


----------



## Joules (Mar 15, 2020)

Quarkcharmed said:


> Actually it looks like this thread is wearing off. It's time to talk about the dynamic range, is anyone up to a good DR talk?


But you like to talk about Pixel DR, don't you? And we don't even know the exact resolution yet


----------



## Joules (Mar 15, 2020)

DBounce said:


> Who said it’s cheaper? I’m pretty certain the price has not been disclosed.


Canon's statement mentioned that the 5 series is aimed at a broader audience and not just professionals. If that is not meant to say it is cheaper than a 1DX III, I don't know what it means.


----------



## Quarkcharmed (Mar 15, 2020)

Joules said:


> But you like to talk about Pixel DR, don't you? And we don't even know the exact resolution yet


Exactly. Because the resolution isn't known yet, we can only talk about per-pixel DR.


----------



## motofotog (Mar 15, 2020)

Curious on what will be the specs of R6? or will Canon not bring R6 at all?


----------



## Ozarker (Mar 15, 2020)

I am very curious as to where all the "new account" bashers have run off to. It is as though they have evaporated.

Anyway, this camera promises to be quite the beast. *sigh* I need more glass first. Just one more lens ought to do it.


----------



## BeenThere (Mar 15, 2020)

TAF said:


> I've concluded I will be making my 5D3 into a full spectrum camera, since the trade-in value is looking to be too low to be worthwhile.
> 
> And I've always wanted to experiment in that area.


I had an infrared conversion on my old 5D2 after upgrading to the 5D3. Love the IR effect and false color that can be achieved.


----------



## Cat_Interceptor (Mar 15, 2020)

Well I guess with Canon confirming major details of the R5 - and even in someways going beyond the leaks like confirming the 8K 30fps and bird AF - that pretty much says that the big CR3 that set this all off is indeed almost completely correct. 

Pretty staggering Canon have leapfrogged everyone


----------



## BeenThere (Mar 15, 2020)

Cat_Interceptor said:


> Well I guess with Canon confirming major details of the R5 - and even in someways going beyond the leaks like confirming the 8K 30fps and bird AF - that pretty much says that the big CR3 that set this all off is indeed almost completely correct.
> 
> Pretty staggering Canon have leapfrogged everyone


Indeed! It would be entirely fitting for the official Canon R5 announcement to occur in Calaveras County.


----------



## Drcampbellicu (Mar 15, 2020)

I agree
Things are changing 
Remember the L glass doesn’t have a bright future. I’m going to start selling my big whites this spring

It also looks like a recession is coming 
I’ve got a bunch of trips that may get cancelled this year. Service jobs are also drying up. I suspect that demand for many things will decrease



slclick said:


> Used Canon gear is not getting what it used to.
> 
> 11/2019- Mint 5D3, $1230 from Keh.com.
> 2/2020- Same camera, $770
> ...


----------



## Jack Douglas (Mar 15, 2020)

Starting out EOS R said:


> I've given up trying to guess as there are so many guesses out there ranging from £3000 / $3000 to £6000 / $6000. If we ignore that this may be a 5d mkIV replacement along with the 5D MKIV price and look at it just on the specs alone, the price could be up to £/$ 6000 as it's similar spec to the 1DX mklll.
> 
> However, although Tony & Chelsea Northrop are sometimes a little annoying, their video from 2018 was interesting about canon playing the waiting game, made a lot of sense, allowing Sony etc to develop the tech from scratch, which is hugely expensive and then reverse engineering it with new elements to take a giant leap forward without the massive initial development costs. Could this mean the price is a little more reasonable?? Who knows?
> 
> We will find out in due course I suppose, just frustrating they don't just come out with it with a caveat on potential delivery dates, instead of drip feeding and creating hype but then thats what marketing is all about.


It's the drip feeding that you don't like that keeps the hype going. 

Jack


----------



## canonnews (Mar 15, 2020)

Starting out EOS R said:


> I've given up trying to guess as there are so many guesses out there ranging from £3000 / $3000 to £6000 / $6000. If we ignore that this may be a 5d mkIV replacement along with the 5D MKIV price and look at it just on the specs alone, the price could be up to £/$ 6000 as it's similar spec to the 1DX mklll.
> 
> However, although Tony & Chelsea Northrop are sometimes a little annoying, their video from 2018 was interesting about canon playing the waiting game, made a lot of sense, allowing Sony etc to develop the tech from scratch, which is hugely expensive and then reverse engineering it with new elements to take a giant leap forward without the massive initial development costs. Could this mean the price is a little more reasonable?? Who knows?
> 
> We will find out in due course I suppose, just frustrating they don't just come out with it with a caveat on potential delivery dates, instead of drip feeding and creating hype but then thats what marketing is all about.


it didn't really make sense. It was all waiting for IBIS, DIGIC X and whatever magic they tossed into their sensors.

You can see a pretty natural and common sense progression in Canon's development.
The exception perhaps being the jump they took this time. but it takes YEARS of R&D and pull of an R5. It's not as if they said we're going to hold onto this, it simply was not ready. 

Further proof is all the patent applications that were filed for IBIS that didn't even publish for the tech in the R5 until last year.

it's not as if canon did all this 5+ years ago and sat on it. the patent applications are still processing for IBIS and most likely alot of other stuff that went into the 1DX Mark III and R5.


----------



## slclick (Mar 15, 2020)

canonnews said:


> it didn't really make sense. It was all waiting for IBIS, DIGIC X and whatever magic they tossed into their sensors.
> 
> You can see a pretty natural and common sense progression in Canon's development.
> The exception perhaps being the jump they took this time. but it takes YEARS of R&D and pull of an R5. It's not as if they said we're going to hold onto this, it simply was not ready.
> ...


Yes. I have to chuckle every time someone chimes in after a competitor announces a breakthrough spec and says Canon needs to react. No clue.


----------



## herein2020 (Mar 15, 2020)

telemaque said:


> If XLR entry is a must for you, there are other options that you can use with any other DSLR or Mirroless body.
> TASCAM DR-70D is the one I own and it is a very good quality option. Less expensive than the Lumix add-on for microphone.
> 
> In Tascam brandname you have cheaper and more expensive options, depending your budget and your needs.
> ...


Oh I agree, there are plenty of XLR options for DSLR or MILC out there, but I prefer native whenever possible. For example the Panasonic module does not require yet another battery to be charged, handles, cages, packing cases, etc were all designed to accommodate the module, it outputs straight to the internal video track etc. Events get absolutely hectic for me when I am covering the event using both photography and video; customers expect it all and then some these days. Everything in my kit has to work flawlessly every single time so I will always pick a native vendor offering over a 3rd party if at all possible. I don't really care about price as much as I care about simplicity and reliability. The Panasonic XLR module doesn't even have a power switch or LCD screen...perfect in my book.

That's why I like the concept of the R5 so much; right now I show up to events with two completely different camera systems, gimbals, tripods, video tripods, audio capture setup etc. With the R5 as my hybrid B cam I could cover the event with photography and b-roll video, lock down the C200 for the main event's A cam on a tripod, use the R5 as a second POV, gimbal work, and for photography, and record interviews using the XLR module if I don't want to move the C200.

For me personally I don't even care if the video quality is better than my current 5DIV. The 5DIV shoots fantastic video my only gripes are single card recording, useless 4K codec, and no XLR module. Interestingly Canon did make an XLR module for the XC15 so it is not without precedent.


----------



## y2kunals (Mar 15, 2020)

Dynamic Range and Colour Depth are the HUGE ones. You can have all the frame rates and megapixels in the world, but it doesn't mean anything if the RAW file is dirt compared to Sony and Nikon. Still waiting to see if Dxo Mark puts out some numbers for the 1Dx3. Canon is still not using BSI sensors from what I understand, but I do remember a few months ago them claiming they're made leaps in sensor DR. There are no real examples to measure this yet on the 1Dx3 as far as I know. I would imagine the R5 will measure up somewhere close to, or a bit higher than the 1Dx3 (crossing fingers it's closer to Sony and Nikon). 

Note - Even Panasonic is turning to Sony for sensors now. If Canon hasn't gotten their s*** together to be honest I could care less about how many fps this thing shoots. I want quality not quantity.


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## Quackator (Mar 15, 2020)

herein2020 said:


> Interestingly Canon did make an XLR module for the XC15 so it is not without precedent.



The patent for a modular grip is out. Who says this won't be able 
to swap ethernet, battery pack, xlr ports?


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## herein2020 (Mar 15, 2020)

y2kunals said:


> Dynamic Range and Colour Depth are the HUGE ones. You can have all the frame rates and megapixels in the world, but it doesn't mean anything if the RAW file is dirt compared to Sony and Nikon. Still waiting to see if Dxo Mark puts out some numbers for the 1Dx3. Canon is still not using BSI sensors from what I understand, but I do remember a few months ago them claiming they're made leaps in sensor DR. There are no real examples to measure this yet on the 1Dx3 as far as I know. I would imagine the R5 will measure up somewhere close to, or a bit higher than the 1Dx3 (crossing fingers it's closer to Sony and Nikon).
> 
> Note - Even Panasonic is turning to Sony for sensors now. If Canon hasn't gotten their s*** together to be honest I could care less about how many fps this thing shoots. I want quality not quantity.



I used to stress over things like that too...not anymore. I have never had a single customer say they are unhappy with a project because the cameras I used did not have enough dynamic range and I definitely couldn't care less how it stacks up to Sony or Nikon. I really think DR at this point is just another spec that pixel peepers stress over that have very little meaning in the real world.

In my opinion and in my personal experience pretty much any modern camera from any of the major camera makers has all the DR you will ever need. Especially if you are familiar with ETTR, color grading, and when possible; properly lighting a scene.

For photography the only times I have wished that I had more DR was for real estate photography and even then if you learn how to properly light the space in front of you or use tricks like flambient it is no longer an issue.

To me reliability, simplicity, lenses, color science and accessories are all way more important than DR. The average viewer will view your next Internet YouTube blockbuster at a 640x480 resolution on their cell phone...do you really think they will notice there is a tinge more blue in the sky and a smidge more detail in the shadows while they watch your latest cat video?


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## Starting out EOS R (Mar 15, 2020)

Jack Douglas said:


> It's the drip feeding that you don't like that keeps the hype going.
> 
> Jack


Im a sucker for a conspiracy theory. I doubt we will ever know how any company truly plans out a long term development plan as there are way too many factors, currency fluctuations, availability of the right people with the right knowledge, shareholder pressure for short term gains etc etc.

Its all a little trivial compared to the big things happening in the world, like COVID-19, famines, Civil wars but it's a little bit of fun speculating.


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## Bahrd (Mar 15, 2020)

Cat_Interceptor said:


> [...] that pretty much says that the big CR3 that set this all off is indeed almost completely correct.



Man, it took me a while to realize you had been referring to the rumor credibility scale and not to the latest Canon's RAW format...


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## Ozarker (Mar 15, 2020)

y2kunals said:


> Dynamic Range and Colour Depth are the HUGE ones. You can have all the frame rates and megapixels in the world, but it doesn't mean anything if the RAW file is dirt compared to Sony and Nikon. Still waiting to see if Dxo Mark puts out some numbers for the 1Dx3. Canon is still not using BSI sensors from what I understand, but I do remember a few months ago them claiming they're made leaps in sensor DR. There are no real examples to measure this yet on the 1Dx3 as far as I know. I would imagine the R5 will measure up somewhere close to, or a bit higher than the 1Dx3 (crossing fingers it's closer to Sony and Nikon).
> 
> Note - Even Panasonic is turning to Sony for sensors now. If Canon hasn't gotten their s*** together to be honest I could care less about how many fps this thing shoots. I want quality not quantity.


Glad you could care less. Things would be hopeless if you couldn't care less. Your DR worries are way overblown anyway. There have been endless discussions here about DR. The truth is that all the modern FF cameras by Sony, Nikon, Canon, Fuji, etc., do a very good job at DR. 3...2...1...


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## Jack Douglas (Mar 15, 2020)

y2kunals said:


> Dynamic Range and Colour Depth are the HUGE ones. You can have all the frame rates and megapixels in the world, but it doesn't mean anything if the RAW file is dirt compared to Sony and Nikon. Still waiting to see if Dxo Mark puts out some numbers for the 1Dx3. Canon is still not using BSI sensors from what I understand, but I do remember a few months ago them claiming they're made leaps in sensor DR. There are no real examples to measure this yet on the 1Dx3 as far as I know. I would imagine the R5 will measure up somewhere close to, or a bit higher than the 1Dx3 (crossing fingers it's closer to Sony and Nikon).
> 
> Note - Even Panasonic is turning to Sony for sensors now. If Canon hasn't gotten their s*** together to be honest I could care less about how many fps this thing shoots. I want quality not quantity.





CanonFanBoy said:


> Glad you could care less. Things would be hopeless if you couldn't care less. Your DR worries are way overblown anyway. There have been endless discussions here about DR. The truth is that all the modern FF cameras by Sony, Nikon, Canon, Fuji, etc., do a very good job at DR. 3...2...1...


y2kunals <-- "raw file is dirt"; honestly he/she didn't even rate a reply or even my 2 cents at this moment. The previous post in response to DR said it all. Thankfully we aren't getting much of this anymore. 

However, I can't believe any camera could fully live up to the expectations created with the R5 hype but then again we've been jaded by previous "let-downs" so I'll remain optimistic.

Jack


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## AdmiralFwiffo (Mar 15, 2020)

Canon could keep it under $4k if it's a loss leader. I'm sure the margin on the glass is pretty nice.


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## unfocused (Mar 15, 2020)

AdmiralFwiffo said:


> Canon could keep it under $4k if it's a loss leader. I'm sure the margin on the glass is pretty nice.


They could. But why should they? Just to be nice?


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## slclick (Mar 15, 2020)

unfocused said:


> They could. But why should they? Just to be nice?


No, but perhaps to sell more RF glass. Get them in the door....


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## Grimbald (Mar 15, 2020)

I don't think it will be overly expensiv, likely under $4500, or even $3999. The reason for me is quite simple: It has never been easier to switch your camera manufacturer and there is alot of money to make in the long run with RF lenses. Since the world shifts away from mirrors to mirrorless, for many consumers who have had Canon for years, it's easier and more tempting to switch to a competitor (Sony) than ever. Canon, which just released a new mount and lens system will make much more money over the course of 2+ years if the get more people to buy the R5 and then consequently RF glass. If they price the R5 high, they might make more money in this fiscal year but risk to loose customers to Sony, which will then help Sony to make more money in the following years due to lens sales and accessories. Canon has also desigend the RF system with some smart goodies, like the IS - IS connection with the sensor or the additional ring system, something that will challenge Tamron and Sigma and likely give them a more painful disadvantage over "nativ" lenses. This certainly was somethign that Canon bother towards the end of the EF era, where Sigma and Tamron really steped their game up and were hurting their income in the lens section. 

Overall, I expect Canon to go all in with the R5, as it will be their attempt to bind people to their system for the next years to come and make money in the long run. I see a lot of thought in their strategy, especially compared to Nikon.


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## AdmiralFwiffo (Mar 15, 2020)

unfocused said:


> They could. But why should they? Just to be nice?


The same reason anyone sells a loss leader, to bring people into the store. Or in this case, bring people into the Canon system (or to keep them there.)


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## AEWest (Mar 15, 2020)

unfocused said:


> They could. But why should they? Just to be nice?


To grab market share. In a shrinking market that is ultra important. It is like musical chairs - someone will be left without a chair (ie. exiting the market) and Canon doesn't want it to be them.


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## deleteme (Mar 15, 2020)

y2kunals said:


> Dynamic Range and Colour Depth are the HUGE ones. You can have all the frame rates and megapixels in the world, but it doesn't mean anything if the RAW file is dirt compared to Sony and Nikon. Still waiting to see if Dxo Mark puts out some numbers for the 1Dx3. Canon is still not using BSI sensors from what I understand, but I do remember a few months ago them claiming they're made leaps in sensor DR. There are no real examples to measure this yet on the 1Dx3 as far as I know. I would imagine the R5 will measure up somewhere close to, or a bit higher than the 1Dx3 (crossing fingers it's closer to Sony and Nikon).
> 
> Note - Even Panasonic is turning to Sony for sensors now. If Canon hasn't gotten their s*** together to be honest I could care less about how many fps this thing shoots. I want quality not quantity.


Just how much of an improvement are you looking for?
Canon's later sensors have closed the gap to a point of falling short in only the most abusive situations.
I think Canon will pleasantly surprise us with their new sensor/s. 
I shoot architecture and have very extreme brightness ranges to work with and the biggest challenge I have is masking more than the ability of the file to hold up.


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## deleteme (Mar 15, 2020)

AdmiralFwiffo said:


> Canon could keep it under $4k if it's a loss leader. I'm sure the margin on the glass is pretty nice.


I think that their margin is good at $4k but I really have no idea. However, they have a very desirable product that would tempt a lot of early adopters at a premium price with a small reduction coming later.
IMO the camera will be in hot demand for quite some time if it delivers what they are implying.


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## BillB (Mar 15, 2020)

AdmiralFwiffo said:


> Canon could keep it under $4k if it's a loss leader. I'm sure the margin on the glass is pretty nice.


The rumored R5 specs are pretty impressive for a loss leader, and even $4k is a lot of money for many of us. Maybe the mysterious R6 will turn out to be a lower priced option that competes on price to attract buyers.


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## SteveC (Mar 15, 2020)

BillB said:


> The rumored R5 specs are pretty impressive for a loss leader, and even $4k is a lot of money for many of us. Maybe the mysterious R6 will turn out to be a lower priced option that competes on price to attract buyers.



That's pretty much what I'm thinking. It will have lower resolution (fewer megapixels) and likely, a lower frame rate and certainly less video capability (because of the lower resolution, it won't be able to do 8K in any way). It will likely be a lot less expensive too.

I'll be caught between my desire for "economical" and my desire for "resolution," unfortunately. (I really don't need high frame rate and super-high-res video--my videos are very casual.) I doubt any of the upcoming Rs will be 45MP-ish without the stuff that comes with video at those resolutions (I include frame rate in that; it's something you can do if you can do video), so I will have to make a compromise.


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## Otara (Mar 15, 2020)

I torn between wanting it to be a $500 loss leader and being so expensive I cant even think about getting it.

Its a lottery because we have no idea which way they'll go. The general predictions have been towards more expensive as the market contracts and our Oz dollar just went down the toilet anyhow, so if its less than a small house here Ill be amazed.


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## unfocused (Mar 15, 2020)

slclick said:


> No, but perhaps to sell more RF glass. Get them in the door....





AEWest said:


> To grab market share. In a shrinking market that is ultra important. It is like musical chairs - someone will be left without a chair (ie. exiting the market) and Canon doesn't want it to be them.





AdmiralFwiffo said:


> The same reason anyone sells a loss leader, to bring people into the store. Or in this case, bring people into the Canon system (or to keep them there.)



All just wishful thinking.

No reason to think Canon needs any incentive to sell more RF glass, or is having any problem grabbing market share, bringing people into the Canon system or holding on to existing customers. 

They already have a bargain full frame body in the RP. In addition we don't know where they will price the R6 or what they will do with R pricing. They may price the R5 aggressively, but anyone who thinks it will be a "loss leader" is doing some serious hallucinogens.


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## AdmiralFwiffo (Mar 15, 2020)

I'm not taking the idea that seriously, I just think it's possible.

I wish we knew more about the R6. My needs would be met without pro features like 8k, high frame rates, or dual card slots. With any luck, my card will fail and the world will be spared from having to see my terrible photos.

I want just _a bit_ more than the R, so the R6 might be in the sweet spot.


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## David - Sydney (Mar 15, 2020)

Has no one noticed that it was announced on Friday-13th?


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## AEWest (Mar 16, 2020)

David - Sydney said:


> Has no one noticed that it was announced on Friday-13th?


At least it wasn't April 1st.


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## deleteme (Mar 16, 2020)

I have read a lot about the camera here and elsewhere. 
Even if this falls short of its most ambitious aspirations, it still delivers far more than what my current gear offers and would help my business.
That being said, I won't rush to buy as business is slow at the moment and may not pick up quickly.
When I feel flush I hope they have some sales.


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## Jack Douglas (Mar 16, 2020)

Normalnorm said:


> Just how much of an improvement are you looking for?
> Canon's later sensors have closed the gap to a point of falling short in only the most abusive situations.
> I think Canon will pleasantly surprise us with their new sensor/s.
> I shoot architecture and have very extreme brightness ranges to work with and the biggest challenge I have is masking more than the ability of the file to hold up.


"the RAW file is dirt compared to Sony and Nikon". When you read something like this you know it's not worth responding to.

Jack


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## Pape (Mar 16, 2020)

What if they gave for testers right cameras but with wrong sensor?
R6 testers used camera with 1dx3 sensor.
R5 testers used camera with R6 sensor.
Rs testers used R5 with Rs sticker on it.
Seriously 45mpixel sounds few when 108mpix phones.
Sounds like R5 tries be best on everything ,why wouldnt they be on megapixels too?


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## Ozarker (Mar 16, 2020)

Don't know why there is all this talk about Canon maybe selling the R5 as a loss leader. First of all, none of you will ever know the margin on the product. Second, it makes far more sense that an RP or R is used for such a purpose *IF* Canon makes a practice of such a policy. It is a useless and frivolous discussion point.


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## Ozarker (Mar 16, 2020)

Pape said:


> What if they gave for testers right cameras but with wrong sensor?
> R6 testers used camera with 1dx3 sensor.
> R5 testers used camera with R6 sensor.
> Rs testers used R5 with Rs sticker on it.
> ...


Why would you compare phone sensors to FF sensors?


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## Pape (Mar 16, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> Why would you compare phone sensors to FF sensors?


why not ,they are cameras too ? main competitor of canon.
well i guess you bit right ,they got 4 lense and 4 sensor i guess?
Anyway samsung got now high megapixel crown and its commercial value . when talking about under 10k cameras


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## Talys (Mar 16, 2020)

Pape said:


> why not ,they are cameras too ? main competitor of canon.
> well i guess you bit right ,they got 4 lense and 4 sensor i guess?
> Anyway samsung got now high megapixel crown and its commercial value . when talking about under 10k cameras


Because a high density sensor behind a tiny lens serves a different purpose than a giant sensor behind a giant array of optics.

Otherwise, the world cup would be filmed and photographed, broadcast and published on Galaxy smartphones.


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## Viggo (Mar 16, 2020)

Talys said:


> Because a high density sensor behind a tiny lens serves a different purpose than a giant sensor behind a giant array of optics.
> 
> Otherwise, the world cup would be filmed and photographed, broadcast and published on Galaxy smartphones.


The need for 108mp in a phone is questionable at best. We speak of $3000 lenses that may or may not resolve above 60mp, how can a plastic dot resolve 108?


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## djack41 (Mar 16, 2020)

Viggo said:


> The need for 108mp in a phone is questionable at best. We speak of $3000 lenses that may or may not resolve above 60mp, how can a plastic dot resolve 108?


Computational photography. It is where we mayl see big leaps.


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## AlanF (Mar 16, 2020)

Viggo said:


> The need for 108mp in a phone is questionable at best. We speak of $3000 lenses that may or may not resolve above 60mp, how can a plastic dot resolve 108?


The diffraction limited aperture for the 0.8µ pixels is f/1.23 so in theory an f/1.2 lens could be sufficient. The lenses on the phones I think are f/1.7-8. Here is a lensrental article on resolving very high resolutions https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2019/10/more-ultra-high-resolution-mtf-experiments/


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## Architect1776 (Mar 16, 2020)

ordinaryfilmmaker said:


> So now I am only concerned about price. Looks very similar to 1DX mark III, but it is not the R1. Sure the full specs may tell a different story. I hope it is priced at the 5D level or it is going to be very expensive as the Canadian dollar keeps sliding on health and market concerns



I agree, it has to come in at the $3,500. max USD price and better yet $3,399 USD. No real reason they cannot do this either.


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## unfocused (Mar 16, 2020)

ordinaryfilmmaker said:


> So now I am only concerned about price. Looks very similar to 1DX mark III, but it is not the R1...



Some thoughts about this.

What we don't know and cannot know until the camera is actually in people's hands is how well it performs in comparison to a DSLR. The eye autofocus sounds very intriguing, but will it work as well as people hope? It's one thing to be able to select the eye as the focus point, it is quite another to be able to lock on that eye and follow it consistently, whether it is a basketball player on the court (should we ever see another basketball player on the court again  ) or a bird flying by.

Given the challenges that are unique to electronic viewfinders I will be very (pleasantly) surprised if the reaction and speed of the autofocus can match that of a DSLR. (Just trying to be realistic).

The R1 is, at this point, only a rumor. It is probably at least a year away and maybe longer. I think it will only come if Canon can address the unique challenges presented by electronic viewfinders, as they will not want to release a product with a "1" designation that doesn't live up to expectations.


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## ordinaryfilmmaker (Mar 16, 2020)

unfocused said:


> Some thoughts about this.
> 
> What we don't know and cannot know until the camera is actually in people's hands is how well it performs in comparison to a DSLR. They eye autofocus sounds very intriguing, but will it work as well as people hope? It's one thing to be able to select the eye as the focus point, it is quite another to be able to lock on that eye and follow it consistently, whether it is a basketball player on the court (should we ever see another basketball player on the court again  ) or a bird flying by.
> 
> ...



I agree with everything twith the exception of the R1. The R1 is pure speculation. There are no current rumours on this. When I was talking about the R1, it is a placeholder that I expect to be filled  I don't want to be spreading rumours without merit.


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## AEWest (Mar 16, 2020)

I expect that the R5 won't be released until at least Sept. I hope I'm wrong. 

With all the cancelled events such as weddings and concerts, now is not the time for introduction of a new and pricey camera. Photographers just like everyone else will hunker down.

Canon will want to make a big splash with cameras flying off shelves and life returning to normal with delayed events coming back. That will be the time to introduce it, not this Spring.

Silver lining: it appears China is starting to get back to normal with stores and business reopening.


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## FramerMCB (Mar 16, 2020)

Viggo said:


> Norway


Lucky you - at least from a landscape location perspective (among other reasons)! Sorry about your exchange-rate issues, that can be a real bear I'm sure.


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## FramerMCB (Mar 16, 2020)

Architect1776 said:


> I agree, it has to come in at the $3,500. max USD price and better yet $3,399 USD. No real reason they cannot do this either.


As I've stated before, I find a price-point of $3,399 USD or even $3,500 USD to be not realistic. I think it will be more like $3,899 or $3,999 USD and 2 kit versions offered, one with the RF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS at $4,899 or $4,999 USD and one with the RF 24-70mm f/2.8L IS at $5,399 USD and both kits to offer 1 64GB Sandisk Extreme Pro SD UHS II card. And maybe, for $225 USD more, 1 128GB CF Express Card. (Postulating heavy here about the 2-slot formats...)


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## FramerMCB (Mar 16, 2020)

djack41 said:


> Been on your Ouija Board again?


No. Just a round with smoking a 'little' peyote...


----------



## Architect1776 (Mar 16, 2020)

FramerMCB said:


> As I've stated before, I find a price-point of $3,399 USD or even $3,500 USD to be not realistic. I think it will be more like $3,899 or $3,999 USD and 2 kit versions offered, one with the RF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS at $4,899 or $4,999 USD and one with the RF 24-70mm f/2.8L IS at $5,399 USD and both kits to offer 1 64GB Sandisk Extreme Pro SD UHS II card. And maybe, for $225 USD more, 1 128GB CF Express Card. (Postulating heavy here about the 2-slot formats...)



I am sure you have stated what you say you have.


----------



## FramerMCB (Mar 16, 2020)

Architect1776 said:


> I am sure you have stated what you say you have.


Once...


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## Viggo (Mar 16, 2020)

I wonder what the AF differences will be between the R6 and R5. If it’s the same I can’t see a reason why I would get the R5 over the R6, but if it’s 5d4 vs 6d2 difference it’s a no brainer... choices,


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## Starting out EOS R (Mar 16, 2020)

Viggo said:


> I wonder what the AF differences will be between the R6 and R5. If it’s the same I can’t see a reason why I would get the R5 over the R6, but if it’s 5d4 vs 6d2 difference it’s a no brainer... choices,


It's all if's but's and maybe's at the moment lol. Canon will be rubbing their hands at all the speculation building up.


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## Dexter75 (Mar 16, 2020)

FramerMCB said:


> As I've stated before, I find a price-point of $3,399 USD or even $3,500 USD to be not realistic. I think it will be more like $3,899 or $3,999 USD and 2 kit versions offered, one with the RF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS at $4,899 or $4,999 USD and one with the RF 24-70mm f/2.8L IS at $5,399 USD and both kits to offer 1 64GB Sandisk Extreme Pro SD UHS II card. And maybe, for $225 USD more, 1 128GB CF Express Card. (Postulating heavy here about the 2-slot formats...)



$4,449 body only easy, I wouldn’t be surprised to see it at $4,999 body


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## Jonathan Thill (Mar 16, 2020)

Dexter75 said:


> $4,449 body only easy, I wouldn’t be surprised to see it at $4,999 body



$7000 Canadian body only and 8-8.5k in a kit, no way no how. 

There is nothing in Canon's past or current road map that points to a 5D style Camera for 7K body only. It will be TOPS $3999.99USD or they will sell so few it will not be worth making.

I'm going to get it either way just think that Canon will not shoot themselves in the foot with stupid pricing. If it does have stupid pricing hopefully they will add it to CPS pricing unlike the 5D line.


----------



## deleteme (Mar 16, 2020)

Jack Douglas said:


> "the RAW file is dirt compared to Sony and Nikon". When you read something like this you know it's not worth responding to.
> 
> Jack


Yes.
I suppose the notion of discourse is truly dead.


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## joestopper (Mar 17, 2020)

Starting out EOS R said:


> It's all if's but's and maybe's at the moment lol. Canon will be rubbing their hands at all the speculation building up.



Yes and they will get valuable input from threads like this as they will factor in our comments to judge how high they can go ...


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## xanbarksdale (Mar 17, 2020)

Dexter75 said:


> $4,449 body only easy, I wouldn’t be surprised to see it at $4,999 body



FINALLY! I’ve found someone else who has some sense! Those are realistic, and sensible numbers based on what this body offers.

It’s not comparable to a 5D...this is for VIDEO shooters.


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## AEWest (Mar 17, 2020)

xanbarksdale said:


> FINALLY! I’ve found someone else who has some sense! Those are realistic, and sensible numbers based on what this body offers.
> 
> It’s not comparable to a 5D...this is for VIDEO shooters.


I disagree that it is for video shooters only. Due to the shrinking camera market I believe Canon wanted to create the ultimate jack of all trades camera that would grab a big share of both stills and video market. 

Many previously stills only photographers are now required to be adept at video (eg weddings, events) and so need an effective one camera solution for both. These people are in the market for something smaller, quieter and more cost effective than a 1dx3. So I do expect it to be in the $3,700 range.


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## xanbarksdale (Mar 17, 2020)

AEWest said:


> I disagree that it is for video shooters only. Due to the shrinking camera market I believe Canon wanted to create the ultimate jack of all trades camera that would grab a big share of both stills and video market.
> 
> Many previously stills only photographers are now required to be adept at video (eg weddings, events) and so need an effective one camera solution for both. These people are in the market for something smaller, quieter and more cost effective than a 1dx3. So I do expect it to be in the $3,700 range.



It’s not for video shooters ONLY, it’s for video shooters PRIMARILY. This is aimed at the high end video market...it’s doing things that the 1DX3 and Cinema cameras can’t and will be priced accordingly.


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## AEWest (Mar 17, 2020)

xanbarksdale said:


> It’s not for video shooters ONLY, it’s for video shooters PRIMARILY. This is aimed at the high end video market...it’s doing things that the 1DX3 and Cinema cameras can’t and will be priced accordingly.


Based on Canon Australia's press release, it is a continuation of the 5 series which since the Mark 2 was a true hybrid video and stills camera. I expect it to work well at both and be priced to compete as an event camera (5D territory). If someone is primarily interested in video, that is what the c series is for.


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## Chris.Chapterten (Mar 17, 2020)

I highly doubt it will be over US$4000. If it was shooting 8k RAW then maybe it could justify a higher price than that, but I just don't see canon offering 8k in anything other then 8bit. I would love to be wrong though!


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## Yasko (Mar 17, 2020)

Fran Decatta said:


> This looks awesome! glad to see Canon fighting this way. Defenitely the R5 will be a camera highly focused on videographers (the ones who still with canon, deserves it!) I hope the R6 or any other body lacks more of video features and get focus on still photography



40+ MÜ, IBIS, EF-R lenses? Where is the focus on still images lacking behind? Or do you mean you pay too much for video when you don‘t need that? 

Stay safe and healthy you all!


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## PerKr (Mar 17, 2020)

Think I need to head over to the Sony forums now to see how they have reacted to this. That's really the best part of it, all the Sony fanboys going crazy. And I'm a Sony fan myself. Or rather, I'm an A-mount fan who would have been an E-mount fan had it not been for those fanboys.


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## SecureGSM (Mar 17, 2020)

xanbarksdale said:


> FINALLY! I’ve found someone else who has some sense! Those are realistic, and sensible numbers based on what this body offers.
> 
> It’s not comparable to a 5D...this is for VIDEO shooters.


All right ... 5 series mirrorless body that is not comparable to a 5 series DSLR body, is for video shooters... Like a C (cinema) product rage? But is R family and 5 series instead.


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## Fran Decatta (Mar 17, 2020)

Yasko said:


> 40+ MÜ, IBIS, EF-R lenses? Where is the focus on still images lacking behind? Or do you mean you pay too much for video when you don‘t need that?
> 
> Stay safe and healthy you all!




Of course, is also a great camera for stills, is a monster camera that may work for everything (photographers and videographers) but may be isn't the best choice for who doesn't need any video features. I don't mean that is a bad camera, just that want similar still photography features without having to pay 4000€ for a body. Is just that may be isn't the body that I need, but merely because will be a waste of specs in my hands, in video field


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## 12Broncos (Mar 17, 2020)

Thanks to the 'Rona' we're going to wait ninety months for an official announcement now.


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## BillB (Mar 18, 2020)

Fran Decatta said:


> Of course, is also a great camera for stills, is a monster camera that may work for everything (photographers and videographers) but may be isn't the best choice for who doesn't need any video features. I don't mean that is a bad camera, just that want similar still photography features without having to pay 4000€ for a body. Is just that may be isn't the body that I need, but merely because will be a waste of specs in my hands, in video field


A camera that is ruggedly built and suitable for action/wildlife photography is going to be pretty pricey whether or not it has great video specs. If you don't need rugged and you don't care about action/wildlife photography, I think the Canon R is a pretty good deal.


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## Fran Decatta (Mar 18, 2020)

BillB said:


> A camera that is ruggedly built and suitable for action/wildlife photography is going to be pretty pricey whether or not it has great video specs. If you don't need rugged and you don't care about action/wildlife photography, I think the Canon R is a pretty good deal.



Well, im focused mainly in wedding photography. Of course, it has action, but 8 fps is enough for what i need. In the other hand, I need a double card slot, good dynamic range (R is enough in this case) but improve even more the AF, would be great. Let's see more news about the R6. I still seeing it some confusing body with those specs. Meanwhile, with the R im confortable working


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## Dexter75 (Mar 18, 2020)

AEWest said:


> I disagree that it is for video shooters only. Due to the shrinking camera market I believe Canon wanted to create the ultimate jack of all trades camera that would grab a big share of both stills and video market.
> 
> Many previously stills only photographers are now required to be adept at video (eg weddings, events) and so need an effective one camera solution for both. These people are in the market for something smaller, quieter and more cost effective than a 1dx3. So I do expect it to be in the $3,700 range.



So you think Canon is going to make a smaller, quieter, mirrorless 1DX III with twice as many megapixels and all the high end features the R5 has and they are going to charge HALF what the 1DX III costs?


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## AEWest (Mar 18, 2020)

Dexter75 said:


> So you think Canon is going to make a smaller, quieter, mirrorless 1DX III with twice as many megapixels and all the high end features the R5 has and they are going to charge HALF what the 1DX III costs?


Yes. If the R5 comes in at $6,500 in these tough economic times, it is dead on arrival. Remember that part of the reason Canon can charge so much for the 1dx3 is that the big companies like sports illustrated who are buying many bodies are less price sensitive than your average wedding photographer, and Canon knows it. Plus it is less expensive to build a mirrorless camera.


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## Dexter75 (Mar 18, 2020)

AEWest said:


> Yes. If the R5 comes in at $6,500 in these tough economic times, it is dead on arrival. Remember that part of the reason Canon can charge so much for the 1dx3 is that the big companies like sports illustrated who are buying many bodies are less price sensitive than your average wedding photographer, and Canon knows it. Plus it is less expensive to build a mirrorless camera.



Right, that’s why it will be $4,449-$4,999. Just as Canon charges a hefty premium for features no one else has in their RF lenses, they will charge a hefty premium for features no one else has in their cameras. The R5 is vastly superior to the 5DIV and anyone expecting 5DIV pricing is dreaming.


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## Jonathan Thill (Mar 18, 2020)

Dexter75 said:


> Right, that’s why it will be $4,449-$4,999. Just as Canon charges a hefty premium for features no one else has in their RF lenses, they will charge a hefty premium for features no one else has in their cameras. The R5 is vastly superior to the 5DIV and anyone expecting 5DIV pricing is dreaming.


Nope not going to happen, again that is $6500 CDN to $7000 CDN. Nothing in current or past road maps show this kind of pricing. Oh and RF glass is pretty much on par with EF new introduction pricing. Anyone expecting to pay 7K Canadian for 5D body is dreaming.

Time will tell who is right and who is wrong.


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## AEWest (Mar 18, 2020)

Dexter75 said:


> Right, that’s why it will be $4,449-$4,999. Just as Canon charges a hefty premium for features no one else has in their RF lenses, they will charge a hefty premium for features no one else has in their cameras. The R5 is vastly superior to the 5DIV and anyone expecting 5DIV pricing is dreaming.


Time will tell. Can't charge Leica type prices or no one will buy in these uncertain times. 5D2 was also revolutionary for it's time but was comparatively affordable. 

Canon needs to sell their high margin RF glass so need the R5 to be super successful in the market unlike the R. I fully expect that R5 purchasers will want several RF lenses for their kit so Canon will have to be realistic in pricing it.


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## Canon1966 (Mar 18, 2020)

cootwijk said:


> I’m still wondering what the R5 will cost. I hope it will be in budget.


I expect around $3500


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## dba101 (Mar 19, 2020)

Plenty of events including fashion shows that I shoot can be well over 4hrs. That's not to say it is 4hrs of continuous filming, but filming getting ready, BTS, model interviews, producer interviews, b roll, audience, sponsors, etc. can quickly add up to hours of footage. The context was that MJPEG is a horrible codec for more than anything but a few seconds of video if that. I wouldn't even shoot b roll with MJPEG.

Lets just say to get 4 hrs of footage from one show 45mins max then a few interviews and backstage stuff which in all reality is 20 mins at most you are not having 4 hrs of footage from that. Get real. 
I filmed more than a few Weddings on my camera and to say MJPEG is not worth even a few seconds is pure bs.
Fair enough you have yr opinion, but it reeks of a know it all mentality.


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## HSPIXMAKER (Mar 19, 2020)

Hello, after a few manipulations I found this on a French site...


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## Jonathan Thill (Mar 19, 2020)

odd no mention of a pre-order on the site https://www.missnumerique.com/canon-eos-r5-p-47578.html

Almost looks like they and others have no idea when to charge for this Camera that has not had a price released for it yet.


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## HSPIXMAKER (Mar 19, 2020)

Ramage said:


> odd no mention of a pre-order on the site https://www.missnumerique.com/canon-eos-r5-p-47578.html
> 
> Almost looks like they and others have no idea when to charge for this Camera that has not had a price released for it yet.



To see the price you must have an account then connect from a smartphone then add to my list and to finish add to cart


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## Jonathan Thill (Mar 19, 2020)

HSPIXMAKER said:


> To see the price you must have an account then connect from a smartphone then add to my list and to finish add to cart


Cool 12k Canadian for a Hybrid Camera... Seems likely

There was a picture from another site showing 9999 Euro so the good news is the price is coming down already


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## Chris.Chapterten (Mar 20, 2020)

I really hope the R5 is a little bit bigger than the R in the grip. Just handled the R for the first time today and found it a little small in the hand. For any R owners out there, how do you find shooting with the camera all day?


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## Viggo (Mar 20, 2020)

Chris.Chapterten said:


> I really hope the R5 is a little bit bigger than the R in the grip. Just handled the R for the first time today and found it a little small in the hand. For any R owners out there, how do you find shooting with the camera all day?


I find it great, a little weird balance with heavier lenses, and also would prefer a more 5-series size grip, but I also want as little weight as possible.


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## londonxt (Mar 20, 2020)

Chris.Chapterten said:


> I really hope the R5 is a little bit bigger than the R in the grip. Just handled the R for the first time today and found it a little small in the hand. For any R owners out there, how do you find shooting with the camera all day?



I found the size difference pretty invisible in terms of ergonomics, I enjoyed the difference for carrying around though. I have smallish hands but never found the 5D series uncomfortable either, the thumb stretch for moving the autofocus using the touch screen is a bit of a stretch for the far corners, wish you could callibrate like the old eye control focus. My only gripe for a days use is battery life lol If this R5 is dramatically improved in this regard I might be tempted, but a noticeable weight and size increase would defeat the object of why I migrated to mirrorless (L lenses not withstanding).


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## Ozarker (Mar 20, 2020)

londonxt said:


> ...the thumb stretch for moving the autofocus using the touch screen is a bit of a stretch for the far corners, wish you could callibrate like the old eye control focus.


You can program it to use one half of the screen or the other. You don't have to use the full screen.


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## stevelee (Mar 20, 2020)

davidhfe said:


> This was not my experience. On my 2014 iMac, I can't play back 4K MJPEG smoothly. However, transcoded to ProRes or H265 was no problem. Really need to replace this iMac, though. 2020 is an expensive year.


My 2014 iMac is a 5K model with an i7 and 32 MB of RAM and 1 GB SSD, so it is toward the top end for that day. It has never had any trouble playing anything I have thrown at it, and editing 4K in FCP X goes very smoothly and does playback while processing is going on in the background. FCP X does eat up temporarily most of the space on the SSD with caches and work files. Our computers are, as they say, long in the tooth. But if you want to put off upgrading, you might try adding memory if you have less than the maximum, and putting in an SSD if you don't have one or a hybrid drive. If you think you might end up buying a new computer anyway, you might understandably skip those steps. In December my car needed new tires, but was in otherwise good shape and had only 48,000 miles. I was afraid that I might buy a car this spring even after getting the tires, so I looked around a bit. When I found a car I liked, I bought it instead of the tires. You need to take psychological factors into account, in addition to technical and financial.


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## Chris.Chapterten (Mar 22, 2020)

londonxt said:


> I found the size difference pretty invisible in terms of ergonomics, I enjoyed the difference for carrying around though. I have smallish hands but never found the 5D series uncomfortable either, the thumb stretch for moving the autofocus using the touch screen is a bit of a stretch for the far corners, wish you could callibrate like the old eye control focus. My only gripe for a days use is battery life lol If this R5 is dramatically improved in this regard I might be tempted, but a noticeable weight and size increase would defeat the object of why I migrated to mirrorless (L lenses not withstanding).



Thanks for the response. I ended up going for an EOS R with RF 50mm 1.2 and RF 85mm 1.2 to replace my 5D IV. I'm still trying ro get used to the smaller size as I have quite large hands. But yes, I think given the size and weight of the L lenses any size and weight saving on the body almost seems a little pointless? An extra 200 grams or so really wouldn't bother me at all... maybe I'll just have to fork out for the battery grip!


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## Jack Douglas (Mar 22, 2020)

stevelee said:


> My 2014 iMac is a 5K model with an i7 and 32 MB of RAM and 1 GB SSD, so it is toward the top end for that day. It has never had any trouble playing anything I have thrown at it, and editing 4K in FCP X goes very smoothly and does playback while processing is going on in the background. FCP X does eat up temporarily most of the space on the SSD with caches and work files. Our computers are, as they say, long in the tooth. But if you want to put off upgrading, you might try adding memory if you have less than the maximum, and putting in an SSD if you don't have one or a hybrid drive. If you think you might end up buying a new computer anyway, you might understandably skip those steps. In December my car needed new tires, but was in otherwise good shape and had only 48,000 miles. I was afraid that I might buy a car this spring even after getting the tires, so I looked around a bit. When I found a car I liked, I bought it instead of the tires. You need to take psychological factors into account, in addition to technical and financial.



"When I found a car I liked, I bought it instead of the tires."

Obviously not a youngster starting out in the workforce.

Jack


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## stevelee (Mar 22, 2020)

Jack Douglas said:


> "When I found a car I liked, I bought it instead of the tires."
> 
> Obviously not a youngster starting out in the workforce.
> 
> Jack


Age was a definite factor in the decision. My old car did not have a backup camera. As I age, I will need all the help I can get. Also, no one can know how many more years I will be driving. It doesn’t make much sense to wait until a couple years before I die or otherwise quit driving to have a new car. And, yes, a fairly dependable pension feels more secure than employment income. Minuscule interest rates don’t encourage putting things off.

I may have told this here before. A few years back I splurged and got the 100-400 mm L II. I decided that for my October birthday I would buy me the 16-35 mm L. That summer, a high school classmate died quite unexpectedly. I went to his funeral on the south side of Charlotte. Driving back home, I decided that life was too unpredictable to wait for October, and I could afford the lens as well as I could later. There is an exit on the interstate near a Best Buy, so I took the exit and bought the lens. So I have been enjoying using two great lenses for the last 2+ years.


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## Jack Douglas (Mar 22, 2020)

stevelee said:


> Age was a definite factor in the decision. My old car did not have a backup camera. As I age, I will need all the help I can get. Also, no one can know how many more years I will be driving. It doesn’t make much sense to wait until a couple years before I die or otherwise quit driving to have a new car. And, yes, a fairly dependable pension feels more secure than employment income. Minuscule interest rates don’t encourage putting things off.
> 
> I may have told this here before. A few years back I splurged and got the 100-400 mm L II. I decided that for my October birthday I would buy me the 16-35 mm L. That summer, a high school classmate died quite unexpectedly. I went to his funeral on the south side of Charlotte. Driving back home, I decided that life was too unpredictable to wait for October, and I could afford the lens as well as I could later. There is an exit on the interstate near a Best Buy, so I took the exit and bought the lens. So I have been enjoying using two great lenses for the last 2+ years.



Sounds like me when my wife insisted I get the 1DX2 and 400 DO II. I said we can't afford it and what about you, but she twisted my arm. Thankfully we don't need a new vehicle because the camera gear purchase would interfere with that for sure. However, I don't have debt so that would be an option ... to avoid. 

And, yes, the thought of death has become all that much more real since I'm over 70 with COPD (asthma) and this virus isn't going away any time soon. And now I'm all GAS over the R5!  It helps take ones mind off viruses!

Jack


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## stevelee (Mar 22, 2020)

Jack Douglas said:


> And, yes, the thought of death has become all that much more real since I'm over 70 with COPD (asthma) and this virus isn't going away any time soon. And now I'm all GAS over the R5!  It helps take ones mind off viruses!


I needed to revise a charitable portion of my will. I got the new version signed Thursday, so now I can quit thinking about death for a while. My last camera purchase was the G5X II for my trip last fall. Now my need for a travel camera is in suspense. As we have pretty days during this time, I hope to get out and take pictures. That’s something we can do without getting near other people, even portraits with an 85 mm lens. I’ll use my DSLR for planned shooting, but I’ll probably just carry along the G5 when I go out for walks in the neighborhood.

GAS for me right now doesn’t include cameras or lenses. I might still rent a TS lens to play with for a week, and it is not impossible that the temptation to keep it might overwhelm me. Otherwise a new macro ring light, maybe fancier extension tubes, and a new tripod head could be on my radar. 

Since I got back from Dallas on the 12th and civilization as we know it suddenly collapsed, about the only responsibility I have had other than eating and sleeping has been to post cancellations for the non-profits for which I volunteer websites. So with the extra time, I have finished scanning in the slides I have located from my Eastern European trip in 2000 and made pages for all but the last stop, Prague. I’m still researching what some of the buildings are. I also wonder why I haven’t found pictures made around Wenceslas Square. So I may spend this afternoon going through trays of old slides. Even with strong Photoshop adjustments to color and contrast, they still look somewhat like old pictures. I’m not sure that is all bad. The green layer seems to fade the worst. After I get this done, I plan to import some of the pictures into Lightroom and make a book. I’ll have them print two copies so I can give one to the friend who traveled with me.

Then my next project will be to scan in color negatives from a 2001 trip to Seattle and then by train to Glacier National Park. VuScan seems to do well with compensating for the orange mask, in my limited experience.

I‘ve been meaning to undertake these two projects ever since I retired, but there were always more pictures to go through from more recent trips. It took me until March to deal with the 3200 pictures I took with the G5 in the fall trip.


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## Jack Douglas (Mar 22, 2020)

stevelee said:


> I needed to revise a charitable portion of my will. I got the new version signed Thursday, so now I can quit thinking about death for a while. My last camera purchase was the G5X II for my trip last fall. Now my need for a travel camera is in suspense. As we have pretty days during this time, I hope to get out and take pictures. That’s something we can do without getting near other people, even portraits with an 85 mm lens. I’ll use my DSLR for planned shooting, but I’ll probably just carry along the G5 when I go out for walks in the neighborhood.
> 
> GAS for me right now doesn’t include cameras or lenses. I might still rent a TS lens to play with for a week, and it is not impossible that the temptation to keep it might overwhelm me. Otherwise a new macro ring light, maybe fancier extension tubes, and a new tripod head could be on my radar.
> 
> ...


 And there are people who fear retirement because they will get bored; kind of sad isn't it. 

Jack


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## SteveC (Mar 22, 2020)

Jack Douglas said:


> And there are people who fear retirement because they will get bored; kind of sad isn't it.
> 
> Jack




I'm sure I won't be bored.

I'm just not sure I'll ever get to retire.


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## Jack Douglas (Mar 22, 2020)

SteveC said:


> I'm sure I won't be bored.
> 
> I'm just not sure I'll ever get to retire.


Of course some of us retire only by label not reality. Some of us create such a backlog of projects we never get our heads above water till we die, but at least we have fun in our busyness, immagining the day it's all finished.

Jack


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## stevelee (Mar 22, 2020)

Jack Douglas said:


> Of course some of us retire only by label not reality. Some of us create such a backlog of projects we never get our heads above water till we die, but at least we have fun in our busyness, immagining the day it's all finished.
> Jack


A few years back I said that to finish my retirement projects, I would need to live to age 132 and still be in fine shape mentally.


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## SecureGSM (Mar 23, 2020)

stevelee said:


> A few years back I said that to finish my retirement projects, I would need to live to age 132 and still be in fine shape mentally.


That was a few years back. Nowadays the number would have been upgraded to at least 150. So get along with this and start working out


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## stevelee (Mar 23, 2020)

SecureGSM said:


> That was a few years back. Nowadays the number would have been upgrade to at least 150. So get along with this and start working out


I did get the rest of my 2000 trip slides posted tonight (what I have found so far, anyway), so maybe I can reduce that by a week or so.


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## padam (Mar 24, 2020)

Introducing 8K video – Canon EOS R5 - Canon Europe


Discover how the pioneering Full Frame mirrorless Canon EOS R5’s 8K video capabilities will change the game for photographers and filmmakers, opening up dynamic new ways of telling stories.




www.canon-europe.com





I suppose some 8k samples will be unveiled at some point in the future.


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## Jack Douglas (Mar 24, 2020)

padam said:


> Introducing 8K video – Canon EOS R5 - Canon Europe
> 
> 
> Discover how the pioneering Full Frame mirrorless Canon EOS R5’s 8K video capabilities will change the game for photographers and filmmakers, opening up dynamic new ways of telling stories.
> ...


This article does a good job explaining why 8K may not be directly useful to some but still provides great benefits relative to panning and zooming when downsampling to 4K or HD, not to mention the much larger JPEG that can be extracted at 30 fps on the R5. Those who make light of 8K should read this.

Jack


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## BillB (Mar 24, 2020)

padam said:


> Introducing 8K video – Canon EOS R5 - Canon Europe
> 
> 
> Discover how the pioneering Full Frame mirrorless Canon EOS R5’s 8K video capabilities will change the game for photographers and filmmakers, opening up dynamic new ways of telling stories.
> ...



Here we have a Canon source describing the R5 as the flagship, at least for video. Other Canon sources have recently said that the R5 continues in the 5D tradition. Not sure what the message is, but it may be clearer when we see what the numbers are that come after the dollar sign.


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## Jack Douglas (Mar 24, 2020)

BillB said:


> Here we have a Canon source describing the R5 as the flagship, at least for video. Other Canon sources have recently said that the R5 continues in the 5D tradition. Not sure what the message is, but it may be clearer when we see what the numbers are that come after the dollar sign.


You're right on with this observation. I suspect higher than previous 5 series cameras.

Jack


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## SteveC (Mar 24, 2020)

BillB said:


> Here we have a Canon source describing the R5 as the flagship, at least for video. Other Canon sources have recently said that the R5 continues in the 5D tradition. Not sure what the message is, but it may be clearer when we see what the numbers are that come after the dollar sign.



What did they consider the "flagship camera, at least for video" before the RXs (X=some number) were announced? Was it something other than the 1? Did they even think in terms of a video flagship camera?

If we're to try to make comparisons between the new cameras and the old cameras to see what their positioning is in the lineup, we have to compare apples to apples.


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## padam (Mar 24, 2020)

Jack Douglas said:


> This article does a good job explaining why 8K may not be directly useful to some but still provides great benefits relative to panning and zooming when downsampling to 4K or HD, not to mention the much larger JPEG that can be extracted at 30 fps on the R5. Those who make light of 8K should read this.
> 
> Jack


Also explained here:





3 years later, now it is in a small mirrorless camera sitting on a more flexible platform equipped with a bigger sensor (with superior low-light) recording to standard memory cards with full AF and IBIS, silent operation, better reliability and support, etc.
Ok it is not 8k60fps REDCode RAW and they have moved on as well, and there may be some other limitations, but still pretty crazy.


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