# Third party batteries deliberately crippled in 7Dmk2?



## LSeries (May 8, 2016)

I have a Hähnel 3rd party battery that I have used with 70D without any problems. It has worked just like the original Canon batteries. However, now that I inserted the Hähnel in my 7Dmk2 I got a message "No battery information available. Do you still want to use this battery? Ok / Cancel" (the message was in Finnish so this might not be the exact translation). I chose "Ok" and it worked, but the battery indicator was showing an empty battery even though I had just charged it. Wtf? Can it be that this is intentional behaviour implemented in 7Dmk2 which is newer than 70D?


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## pwp (May 8, 2016)

I put a pair of Wasabi's in my gripped 7DII and got a weird phenomena where the camera would take over 5 seconds to wake up. That's an eternity, and meant lost shots. I thought it was my camera but it was suggested here on CR that it might be the batteries. They were 100% right, there's zero problem with the genuine batteries, and slow to wake up with the Wasabi's. Stay with genuine!

-pw


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## CSD (May 8, 2016)

Been like this for a while on Canon cameras, mainly down to two reasons:

1) It's to help monitor the life of the battery
2) More importantly to help cut out counterfeit batteries.

Another reason is that third party batteries may cause unintended consequences such as weird lock ups, unresponsive power up and so on. Most of the problems I've seen have been due to the voltage fluctuation. This doesn't affect all third parties but it's the risk you take. That and third party batteries, in my experience, generally have a shorter lifespan.


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## LSeries (May 8, 2016)

CSD said:


> Been like this for a while on Canon cameras, mainly down to two reasons:
> 
> 1) It's to help monitor the life of the battery
> 2) More importantly to help cut out counterfeit batteries.
> ...



Yeah...that's understandable, but it still doesn't feel right that my high-quality 3rd party battery works perfectly in my other camera while the other camera tells me a lie about missing battery information. Actually I wouldn't be surprised if the battery cells itself came from the same Chinese factory


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## brad-man (May 8, 2016)

I have been using Wasabi and STK LP-E6 batteries with full functionality for years. Having said that, my most recent camera is the 6D.



pwp said:


> I put a pair of Wasabi's in my gripped 7DII and got a weird phenomena where the camera would take over 5 seconds to wake up. That's an eternity, and meant lost shots. I thought it was my camera but it was suggested here on CR that it might be the batteries. They were 100% right, there's zero problem with the genuine batteries, and slow to wake up with the Wasabi's. Stay with genuine!
> 
> -pw



Did the Wasabis have full functionality other than the slow wake up?


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## 2n10 (May 8, 2016)

The message you received is common for 3rd party batteries.

My 3rd party batteries functions fine in my 7DII. The charge is reported and no slow to wake issues either.


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## Don Haines (May 8, 2016)

If they were deliberately targeting third party batteries, you would expect every model of camera produced after the decision to do the same.

Doing so would have very negative consequences in the marketplace.....what comes next, does not work with third party lenses? ? They would never start down that path because if people were locked in they would jump to Nikon.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (May 8, 2016)

Canon cameras try to recognize counterfeit batteries and give you a message on the screen. If you know its a 3rd party battery that you trust, you can keep using it. If the battery says Canon on it, and you get the message, it may be counterfeit, and should be returned to wherever you bought it.

Read up on the Nikon D500. It shuts down when a third party battery is used. Users that have had decent quality name brand third party batteries are out of luck until someone figures out how to reverse engineer them.


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## YuengLinger (May 8, 2016)

Don Haines said:


> If they were deliberately targeting third party batteries, you would expect every model of camera produced after the decision to do the same.
> 
> Doing so would have very negative consequences in the marketplace.....what comes next, does not work with third party lenses? ? They would never start down that path because if people were locked in they would jump to Nikon.



I think you are wrong and Canon has an unstated but clear policy of discouraging use of third party batteries.

Canon chargers acquired with camera bodies in the past couple of years will not charge third party batteries at all. The little indicator light flashes very fast and the battery remains uncharged. Fortunately I have an older charger from a 60D that will charge any brand.

When I put a third party into my 5D3 (and this started happening after a firmware update, not when first purchased) the battery will work but never show less than 100%. Same brands did show level going down with use before the firmware update.

I don't think many customers do more than grumble about the issue. We are all a bit word down by the big corporations at this point, some to the point of utter submission, and not just as consumers.

As for lenses, the Sigma 50mm 1.4 Art comes to mind immediately...


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## LSeries (May 8, 2016)

YuengLinger said:


> Canon chargers acquired with camera bodies in the past couple of years will not charge third party batteries at all. The little indicator light flashes very fast and the battery remains uncharged. Fortunately I have an older charger from a 60D that will charge any brand.



That cannot be the whole truth. I just tried that the charger that came with 7Dmk2 DO charge my Hähnel battery just fine. It's just the body that whines about it.

I also think that (at least in theory) there could be differences between different markets. For example, on my original LP-E6 Canon battery there's a small print "EUROPE ONLY".


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## weixing (May 8, 2016)

YuengLinger said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > If they were deliberately targeting third party batteries, you would expect every model of camera produced after the decision to do the same.
> ...


Hi,
My third party battery will work on my 7DMKII.

Since some third party battery will work and some don't and old Canon battery will work on both old and new Canon camera, I guess may be the issue is that the reverse engineering by third party manufacturer is not 100% correct or the protocol is not fully decoded. For example, if Canon battery always report A, B, C, D and E to the Canon camera, but older Canon camera will accept the battery if A and B are reported, so third party manufacturer thought they decode it correctly. But when new Canon camera required the battery to report A, B and C before accept the battery, then that third party battery will failed to work.

Anyway, if your third party battery will not work on Canon camera, you should go after the third party battery manufacturer and not Canon. Remember Canon never indicate any third party battery as compatible, it's the third party manufacturer claim that their battery is compatible... use at your own risk and if it cannot use on newer camera, I think you can't blame Canon.

Have a nice day.


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## LSeries (May 8, 2016)

weixing said:


> Hi,
> My third party battery will work on my 7DMKII.
> 
> Since some third party battery will work and some don't and old Canon battery will work on both old and new Canon camera, I guess may be the issue is that the reverse engineering by third party manufacturer is not 100% correct or the protocol is not fully decoded. For example, if Canon battery always report A, B, C, D and E to the Canon camera, but older Canon camera will accept the battery if A and B are reported, so third party manufacturer thought they decode it correctly. But when new Canon camera required the battery to report A, B and C before accept the battery, then that third party battery will failed to work.



That's very likely exactly what's happening here...at least it would explain a big part of this mess


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## pwp (May 9, 2016)

brad-man said:


> I have been using Wasabi and STK LP-E6 batteries with full functionality for years. Having said that, my most recent camera is the 6D.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



With the Wasabi's there was full functionality except for the slow wake up, but just in my 7DII. 
They're perfectly fine in my 5DIII. I find that completely weird. 

-pw


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## Valvebounce (May 9, 2016)

Hi YuengLinger. 
I have to take issue with your blanket statement, had you said will not charge *some* third party batteries at all you would have been quite correct. I wrote quite a detailed post regarding this topic, http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=28735.msg567563#msg567563
I can't recall the brand of battery I'm using in my 7DII, but they are relatively cheap (though not the cheapest) from eBay, they charge on my Canon charger and report capacity and shutter count etc in the battery menu, including registering unique serial numbers and showing which side of the grip they are in. 
Also I have had no issues with slow wake up, it is the same as the OEM battery, almost instant on. 

Cheers, Graham. 



YuengLinger said:


> *Canon chargers acquired with camera bodies in the past couple of years will not charge third party batteries at all.* The little indicator light flashes very fast and the battery remains uncharged.


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## YuengLinger (May 9, 2016)

Valvebounce said:


> Hi YuengLinger.
> I have to take issue with your blanket statement, had you said will not charge *some* third party batteries at all you would have been quite correct. I wrote quite a detailed post regarding this topic, http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=28735.msg567563#msg567563
> I can't recall the brand of battery I'm using in my 7DII, but they are relatively cheap (though not the cheapest) from eBay, they charge on my Canon charger and report capacity and shutter count etc in the battery menu, including registering unique serial numbers and showing which side of the grip they are in.
> Also I have had no issues with slow wake up, it is the same as the OEM battery, almost instant on.
> ...



You are right Graham. I think that Canon and the third party companies work against each other, with more recent batteries working until a firmware update defeats them. So I am sure it is the same with the chargers, which, of course, don't get firmware updates once in the hands of the customer.

Still, it is clear to me that Canon, as a business practice, tries to make using third party batteries difficult, but doesn't obsess about it like, say, Adobe does about pirating... :


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## Valvebounce (May 9, 2016)

Hi YuengLinger. 
I'm sure you are correct, and it is after all in Canons best interest to make it difficult and annoying enough for us to buy OEM. From their perspective every 3rd party battery (lens, grip, etc) sold is a financial hit for them. 

Cheers, Graham. 



YuengLinger said:


> Valvebounce said:
> 
> 
> > Hi YuengLinger.
> ...


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## pwp (May 9, 2016)

My pair of Wasabi's charge perfectly in my 5DIII and 7DII chargers. The bugs seem very random.

-pw


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## Otara (May 9, 2016)

Ditto with my 80D, 7D2 chargers and cameras, wasabi's. No obvious problems, charge and work fine.

The easiest explanation is more variation in the 3rd parties, so more glitches. Its too random to be simply deliberate policy.


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## YuengLinger (May 9, 2016)

If the batteries which work are older, say more than three years old, that suggests random glitches.

If the batteries were bought after the 80D and 7DII were released, that suggests that the battery makers adapt to new firmware in bodies and chargers.

I know that stores such as B&H offer third party batteries as recommended accessories, and I assume they are confident that those batteries offered work with the camera with which they are paired.

And, who knows, it could be that the battery makers, in a secret lab somewhere in Asia, are so quick at adapting that Canon is giving up.


But many of us clearly remember third party batteries stopped working after a firmware update of the 5DIII about two years ago--and that was no glitch.

Another possibility--if Cannon needs customers to update firmware to fix body bugs that could harm the brand, and customers are afraid to update because third party batteries will get locked out (or lose functionality), then somebody might have made a decision that it's not worth harassing us. Pure speculation.


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## Otara (May 9, 2016)

Wasabi batteries were bought before the 80D was out. Ill test some more but I dont think Ive seen any problems, I have so many chargers and batteries now, that Im sometimes not sure what IM charging with what. There has been the occasional need to turn my 80D off and on and it didnt occur to me to consider what battery I had at the time, might have been the Wasabis.

To me it seems more like they dont worry if they occasionally disable 3rd party stuff with whatever updates they do, but they only occasionally deliberately aim to do so, whether its lenses, flashes, batteries etc.


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## Glasslugger (May 9, 2016)

I don't blame Canon for doing this.

I purchased 2 "high capacity", 7.2V 2100mAh LP-E6 compatible batteries that were chipped and would charge in the 5D2 charger but the 7D charger would charge them intermittently - sometimes & sometimes not. I purchased these to take images of the Aurora Borealis in March 2013. The night time temp was -22C and being an Aussie with no polar temp experience, and probably a long time before being back again, I wanted to ensure I had enough battery power for the 5D2. The Canon batteries worked a charm but both Chinese made compatible batteries failed. Disappointing to say the least but the 2 Canon batteries worked on through the night & I never needed more than 2 batteries.

On my return the eBay seller replaced the 2 batteries without question, but subsequent use showed I only ever got 175-185 shots on these "high capacity" batteries whereas on genuine batteries, 550-600 per charge on my 7D. I weighed these on a digital scale & they were 50g each. Canon LP-E6 were 66g each. Now Lithium is a very light metal & not cheap so draw your conclusions about the actual capacity. Buyer beware, especially on eBay where the seller is not educated or does not have the test equipment to confirm the manufacturers claims. The harsh environment in northern Sweden was a killer but in Australia with 0 to 40C heat extremes, no issues, they work to this day but limited no of shots. I don't bother to use as extra stuff to carry & a short life.

GL


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## Keith_Reeder (May 14, 2016)

LSeries said:


> Can it be that this is intentional behaviour implemented in 7Dmk2



Why does _everything_ have to be a conspiracy theory? It Just means that _that_ battery isn't recognised by the 7D Mk II.

I've got some aftermarket batteries that my 7D Mk II sees just like a Canon battery - and one that it doesn't see.


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## Don Haines (May 14, 2016)

Keith_Reeder said:


> LSeries said:
> 
> 
> > Can it be that this is intentional behaviour implemented in 7Dmk2
> ...


Because it is easier to believe in a complex plot that nobody except you knows about, than it is to believe that when a third party supplier of aftermarket components makes a coding mistake or otherwise fails to meet specifications, that Canon does not immediately do a bios update in the affected cameras to disable features so that the improperly designed third party device could work.....


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