# so the EOS-Bull and T5i are announced this week... no 70D as it seems



## Canon-F1 (Mar 19, 2013)

who thinks we will see 3 new DSLR´s this week?

and who really thinks the T5i will have a new sensor? ;D ;D ;D ;D


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## Albi86 (Mar 19, 2013)

Canon lingers while the D7100 is already shipping...


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## RLPhoto (Mar 19, 2013)

Most Desired Vapor-Items.

1. 135mm F/1.8L IS USM
2. 14-24L F/2.8
3. New 50mm Designs.


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## Ewinter (Mar 19, 2013)

Jesus, quite griping. there's plenty of threads already moaning about canon's tactics.
And while canon take their time, they've produced some amazing cameras-the good stuff will come


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## Malte_P (Mar 19, 2013)

canon seem to think the rebels are so good they don´t need improvements.

i am suprised what a lame new 700D this is.

i hope the rumor is wrong.


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## jimmy156 (Mar 19, 2013)

The negativity and whining on this site are unbelievable.

Anyone would think that you were being forced to buy Canon gear at gunpoint, and that every camera they produce should appeal to you personally and blow the 1dx spec out of the water but cost £500.

Honestly, this is a great site with an active forum, but the bitching and whining is enough to put anyone off!


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## Canon-F1 (Mar 19, 2013)

Malte_P said:


> canon seem to think the rebels are so good they don´t need improvements.
> 
> i am suprised what a lame new 700D this is.



canon is now doing it the olympus way.

instead of innovations you get new creative or "ART" filters.


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## Canon-F1 (Mar 19, 2013)

jimmy156 said:


> The negativity and whining on this site are unbelievable.
> 
> Anyone would think that you were being forced to buy Canon gear at gunpoint, and that every camera they produce should appeal to you personally and blow the 1dx spec out of the water but cost £500.
> 
> Honestly, this is a great site with an active forum, but the bitching and whining is enough to put anyone off!



i would be happy if they are able to compete with nikon... and produce a noticeable better sensor every 4 years.

but thank you for your thoughts.


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## Drum (Mar 19, 2013)

personally I wouldn't be buying a rebel/xxxD however when you compare these Specs to the Competition they just seem so dated. new users won't always consider how good a camera is they look at the price and the headline specs, then make their decision, if they do investigate further and get as far as DXOMARK then we all know that both nikon cameras and lenses seem to get better scores on that site than their canon counterparts. Entry level cameras should be about getting new users using Canon.... not driving them towards the competition. 
(Just in case anyone is wondering I'll still stick with Canon......... till the next round of disappointment anyway!!)


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## brad-man (Mar 19, 2013)

jimmy156 said:


> The negativity and whining on this site are unbelievable.
> 
> Anyone would think that you were being forced to buy Canon gear at gunpoint, and that every camera they produce should appeal to you personally and blow the 1dx spec out of the water but cost £500.
> 
> Honestly, this is a great site with an active forum, but the bitching and whining is enough to put anyone off!



Didn't you get the memo?

Dialog with useful information: 15-25%
Dialog with bitching & whining: 100%


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## Ladislav (Mar 19, 2013)

My first disappointment was quickly replaced with satisfaction. I'm Rebel T4i user and I want to upgrade. I was about to buy 6D when I saw rumors about new APS-C cameras coming. So I waited. If 70D is announced this week I may wait even longer before it is available and before some reviews come out. Now if it will not be announced I can happily buy 6D next month without waiting for miracle. I'm quite happy with its specs and I believe it will be nice companion to my Tamron 24-70 VC and 70-300L.


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## ragmanjin (Mar 19, 2013)

Looks like 2013 won't be the year I come back to Canon...still waiting on something actually NEW, something actually versatile enough to be considered professional. Besides, I don't understand why any Rebel users have upgraded from the T2i in the last few years, as far as I know it was the last of the line to win any awards and most definitely the last to change any "game" whatsoever.
Hard as you try, Canon, there's still a tiny yet unquenchable hope in my heart that you'll come up with something good again someday. As it stands, personally, it'll be a race between you and Pentax to see who can up the resolution _and_ drop the AA filter in an APS-C camera first. Whoever it is will see me reinvest in the consumer DSLR market in a hurry and put away my medium format when I'm not on a paid job — or on a web-only or photojournalistic gig (hopefully it's soon, at 40 & 60MP my hard drives are filling up fast). We certainly don't need 60mp in a consumer camera, or even a full frame, but a filterless 20mp sounds about right; we are smart enough to use the moiré brush in Lightroom the rare times it's necessary.


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## Jan Jasinski (Mar 19, 2013)

Freelancer said:


> that means i can stop visiting this website every few hours to check for news.
> two crap cameras to be announced on friday.
> 
> canon again dissapoints while new nikon cameras continue to have an wow effect.


+1
I'm waiting to upgrade my Rebel XS as it's seriously limiting me in every aspect except for weight 
The 7D isn't worth it for me because of the terrible ISO performance. 
If Canon doesn't release a 70D or 7D2 that are really outstanding with close (but not as good) ISO performance as the 6D, 5D3 & 1DX and updated sensors i'll just have to invest into a 17-40L and 6D or move to the dark side.
Sure i'm whinning but myself & many others who are eager to upgrade their bodies are dissapointed to see 2 new camera's that were never even mentioned and don't look in any way amazing. I wouldn't upgrade from a Rebel XS to a T5i because I wouldn't consider it being a big "upgrade" .

Canon surely wants to aim for the starters that buy Rebels but there is just as much if not more market in the xxD or xD lines.

Fingers crossed.


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## wickidwombat (Mar 19, 2013)

RLPhoto said:


> Most Desired Vapor-Items.
> 
> 1. 135mm F/1.8L IS USM
> 2. 14-24L F/2.8
> 3. New 50mm Designs.



i'd ad a 300f4L IS II to that list


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## RS2021 (Mar 19, 2013)

Let's be fair... Canon released _three_ major full frame upgrades in the past 12 month cycle...3 actually before the end of the year 2012...1DX, 5D3, and 6D....

So now they are releasing a few for the average consumer aka non-fanboys... come on now boys...seriously... How many bodies more can Canon release in quick succession? If you were them, wouldn't you want to pace yourself? 

How can they possibly keep on releasing major updated bodies and lenses every two weeks because forum members expect something new to chew on and dissect? hmm?


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## RS2021 (Mar 19, 2013)

I can't comment on the 6D, I don't own it...but the 1DX is a significant improvement over my 1DsIII. I did not own the 5D2, so can't comment on a direct comparison, but I am very happy with the 5D3, and folks who have upgraded from 5D2 seem to be overall happy. 

I fail to see an overwhelming discontent among the users. Just my 2c.


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## fonts (Mar 19, 2013)

Freelancer said:


> RS2021 said:
> 
> 
> > Let's be fair... Canon released _three_ major full frame upgrades in the past 12 month cycle...3 actually before the end of the year 2012...1DX, 5D3, and 6D....
> ...



You need to relax. Keep in mind that the 1DX is the BEST camera of its class. The 5D M3 takes from the 1DX and has the BEST AF in its class. 

You're complaining for low ISO IQ when low ISO wasn't the one that needed improvement, it was high ISO and Canon again is the BEST in that area. Relax a bit, seriously.

Oh plus the 6D has the BEST low light AF.....


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## Canon-F1 (Mar 19, 2013)

RS2021 said:


> I can't comment on the 6D, I don't own it...but the 1DX is a significant improvement over my 1DsIII. I did not own the 5D2, so can't comment on a direct comparison, but I am very happy with the 5D3, and folks who have upgraded from 5D2 seem to be overall happy.
> 
> I fail to see an overwhelming discontent among the users. Just my 2c.



you mean those who stick with the 5D MK3.

i have bought a 5D MK3 on amazon, tested it for a week, returned it.

it offered me not nearly enough for the money i had to invest.
i shoot sports too but the 7D is my weapon of choice for sport.

i saw no reason to buy the 5D MK3 and replace my 5D MK2 for landscape work.


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## Canon-F1 (Mar 19, 2013)

fonts said:


> You're complaining for low ISO IQ when low ISO wasn't the one that needed improvement, it was high ISO and Canon again is the BEST in that area. Relax a bit, seriously.





well you don´t know what i want or need, so much is certain.
i don´t care about HIGH ISO.

when i look at the D800 and it´s LOW ISO performance i tell you that is where canon needs to improve. or do you love canons ugly shadow banding for example? 




> Oh plus the 6D has the BEST low light AF.....



yeah well that´s open to discussion.
it may has the most sensitive central cross point. that´s pretty much it.

does not help shit when you want to track a subject in low light.


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## fonts (Mar 19, 2013)

Canon-F1 said:


> fonts said:
> 
> 
> > You're complaining for low ISO IQ when low ISO wasn't the one that needed improvement, it was high ISO and Canon again is the BEST in that area. Relax a bit, seriously.
> ...



Lmao...SO GET THE D800! 
Canon is still improving, and just cause they don't improve in what YOU want doesn't mean jack to the companies standing in innovation.


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## Canon-F1 (Mar 20, 2013)

fonts said:


> Lmao...SO GET THE D800!
> Canon is still improving, and just cause they don't improve in what YOU want doesn't mean jack to the companies standing in innovation.



well many have, for the reason i stated. 

but i have 15000+ euro worth of canon glass.. i can´t just switch.

and it´s a shame i have to explain that to every brand loyal fanboy with a 1100D and a kit lens.
when i had not such a massive investment in canon .. i would have switched to a D800E a long time ago.


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## Skirball (Mar 20, 2013)

Jan Jasinski said:


> If Canon doesn't release a 70D or 7D2 that are really outstanding with close (but not as good) ISO performance as the 6D, 5D3 & 1DX and updated sensors i'll just have to invest into a 17-40L and 6D or move to the dark side.



You're really expecting the 70D, or even 7D2 for that matter, to have close to the same ISO performance as the latest model FF cameras?


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## neuroanatomist (Mar 20, 2013)

Freelancer said:


> every time someone mentions the D800 is the better landscape camera some people here behave like kids.



No it's not. My dad's camera can beat up your dad's camera anyway. 

Seriously, though...anyone with some common sense should acknowledge that, at least from the standpoint of sensor-based IQ. But it's a tool, that's all. If I need to drive in a nail, the best screwdriver in the world isn't going to help me much.


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## RS2021 (Mar 20, 2013)

Skirball said:


> Jan Jasinski said:
> 
> 
> > If Canon doesn't release a 70D or 7D2 that are really outstanding with close (but not as good) ISO performance as the 6D, 5D3 & 1DX and updated sensors i'll just have to invest into a 17-40L and 6D or move to the dark side.
> ...



He may be closer to the mark than you think... 
Perhaps _not _ the 70D...but I fully expect future 7D2 to rival high ISO of not just 5D3, may be even the 1DX... it will jive well with the intended use of a cropped high speed camera. The price will probably reflect that.


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## wickidwombat (Mar 20, 2013)

RS2021 said:


> Skirball said:
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> 
> > Jan Jasinski said:
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if thats true i can't wait top see what the next gen FF sensors deliver


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## RS2021 (Mar 20, 2013)

Wiki, you need to correct your post...you entered your text in the middle of my words


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## wickidwombat (Mar 20, 2013)

RS2021 said:


> Wiki, you need to correct your post...you entered your text in the middle of my words



woops 

fixed :-[


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## RS2021 (Mar 20, 2013)

wickidwombat said:


> RS2021 said:
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> 
> > Wiki, you need to correct your post...you entered your text in the middle of my words
> ...



Hehe...tnx...it just flows better that way ;D


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Mar 20, 2013)

Since CR posted no 70D this weeks a few days ago, I'd say it isn't coming. The two Rebels will likely have the new hybrid sensor that first appeared in the T4i.

If the 70D is a minor upgrade to the 60D, I'd have no interest in it either. Without AFMA, I'd probably skip a camera unless it was for manual focus.

For the likely price of a 7D MK II, I'd prefer a 1D MK IV.


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## Hobby Shooter (Mar 20, 2013)

Freelancer said:


> brad-man said:
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> > jimmy156 said:
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Ha ha, that's funny, expecially since many people's definition of a Canon fanboy is someone who's fed up with hearing small a minority on this forum that D800 is sooooooooooooo goooooooood. If so, then I am happy to be called a fanboy.

Seriously, about this launch. If I was in the market for a 70D or a 7D2 I might be a bit disappointed, but I am set for gear for quite some time now. I might admit to being a bit surprised that they haven't gotten those out earlier. On the other hand, it's like someone said here, Canon have launched three FF bodies quite recently and it's quite much even for a large company like Canon. It'll be fun to see the 7D2 and 70D when they eventually come.


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## KarstenReis (Mar 20, 2013)

This was posted on Canon Rumors Twitter about 3 hours ago. Maybe we might see the 70D soon. Easter isn't too far away.
https://twitter.com/canonrumorsguy/status/314133618815553536


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## Don Haines (Mar 20, 2013)

RS2021 said:


> Let's be fair... Canon released _three_ major full frame upgrades in the past 12 month cycle...3 actually before the end of the year 2012...1DX, 5D3, and 6D....
> 
> So now they are releasing a few for the average consumer aka non-fanboys... come on now boys...seriously... How many bodies more can Canon release in quick succession? If you were them, wouldn't you want to pace yourself?
> 
> How can they possibly keep on releasing major updated bodies and lenses every two weeks because forum members expect something new to chew on and dissect? hmm?


Exactly!
2012 was the year of FF, it looks like 2013 will be the year af APS-C, so count on new FF in 2014.


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## Don Haines (Mar 20, 2013)

neuroanatomist said:


> Freelancer said:
> 
> 
> > every time someone mentions the D800 is the better landscape camera some people here behave like kids.
> ...



Yeah.... well my Dad's camera is a very old and solid film (gasp!) NIKON (GASP!!!!!)

..... and my sweatheart's camera ( well one of the cameras...) is an 8X10.... but then, what did Ansel Adams know about landscape photography anyway?

....and a #2 robertson screwdriver (square head) makes a great nail countersink....


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## iP337 (Mar 20, 2013)

This has been the most useless thread I've ever read... lol


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## sagittariansrock (Mar 20, 2013)

Don Haines said:


> RS2021 said:
> 
> 
> > Let's be fair... Canon released _three_ major full frame upgrades in the past 12 month cycle...3 actually before the end of the year 2012...1DX, 5D3, and 6D....
> ...



I am pretty sure there will be at least one, more likely two, APS-C bodies that will address high ISO performance released in 2013. Just not this March, but soon. I'd keep checking back without holding my breath. And I got the excellent 7D to keep me company till then.
And the Sigma 30mm/1.4. Yum!


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## Skirball (Mar 20, 2013)

RS2021 said:


> Skirball said:
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> > Jan Jasinski said:
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So you think that Canon just released 3 new FF cameras using older sensor technology, saving the latest and greatest for a crop sensor to release a year later? Presuming it has the latest in AF to match its predecessor, don't you think that would steer a lot of the potential market away from the more expensive FF lines?


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## Canon-F1 (Mar 20, 2013)

Skirball said:


> So you think that Canon just released 3 new FF cameras using older sensor technology, saving the latest and greatest for a crop sensor to release a year later? Presuming it has the latest in AF to match its predecessor, don't you think that would steer a lot of the potential market away from the more expensive FF lines?



i start to think the 7D MK2 will be a beefed up 7D in all regards except the sensor.
i would even *bet* it will have the same sensor technology as current APS-C cameras.
maybe 22 MP... but same old sensor tech.

then in 2014 we will see a high megapixel FF camera that will have a complete new sensor design.
for 8000$ of course. after that the new sensor design will be put into the other canon cams.

so until late 2014 early 2015 we are stuck with the senors we have.


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## Don Haines (Mar 20, 2013)

Skirball said:


> RS2021 said:
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Someone has to be first.... when the new technology is ready the will start to use it in ALL new releases. And besides, follow the money.... the lower down you go in the camera line, the greater the sales. Canon makes much more money off of the Rebels than the pro cameras... from a financial perspective it may be more important to upgrade them first.... Also, for fabrication reasons, I can see the smaller sensors being manufactured first.

And with the pressures facing p/s cameras from the cell phone crowd, I can see the EOS-B being FAR more important to Canon than any of the pro or enthusiast models.


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## Skirball (Mar 20, 2013)

Canon-F1 said:


> Skirball said:
> 
> 
> > So you think that Canon just released 3 new FF cameras using older sensor technology, saving the latest and greatest for a crop sensor to release a year later? Presuming it has the latest in AF to match its predecessor, don't you think that would steer a lot of the potential market away from the more expensive FF lines?
> ...



More MP is fine and all, and I see the point in a crop sensor, but that's not going to help ISO. They'd need radically new sensor technology to get a crop sensor camera to match the performance of a FF. Not saying that can't happen, just that it'd be a bold slap in the face for Canon to release three new FF only to follow up with a crop a year later with this new technology.


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## Albi86 (Mar 20, 2013)

Skirball said:


> More MP is fine and all, and I see the point in a crop sensor, but that's not going to help ISO. They'd need radically new sensor technology to get a crop sensor camera to match the performance of a FF. Not saying that can't happen, just that it'd be a bold slap in the face for Canon to release three new FF only to follow up with a crop a year later with this new technology.



Unless they want to push people to buy *both*. However, I don't think it's going to be a real threat for the FF line. As someone suggested, it's likely to be the pinnacle of APS-C performance and have a very poisonous price tag. However, it remains to be seen if the new sensor is going to appear at some stage.


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## sagittariansrock (Mar 20, 2013)

Skirball said:


> RS2021 said:
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I do.
Two reasons:
1. Sensor tech is one of the fastest ones to evolve at the moment. If you invent something new, and wait until you can use it in your flagship models, competitors will bring out something better in the meantime and carve a slice out of your market share. So, whether or not they bring out newer FF upgrades sooner with the newer sensors, they will certainly bring it to the market as soon as they can. Since APS-Cs are due this year, I am sure they will have the new tech.
2. High ISO sensitivity is not a problem area for the current Canon FF sensors. True, it will be nice to have a better sensor, but that is not crippling 1Dx or 5DIII in any way (frankly, nothing really is). On the other hand, they are aware that their APS-Cs are lacking in (only) one department, high ISO performance. So doesn't it make sense for them to protect that Achilles heel and consolidate the APS-C market share?


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## Skirball (Mar 20, 2013)

sagittariansrock said:


> Skirball said:
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> > RS2021 said:
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People will always take better high ISO performance, always. Yes, the latest offerings are good, but that doesn't mean it can't be better. You're telling me that people wouldn't pounce on a camera with useable ISO at 51.2k? Of course they would. If you can create a crop sensor with markedly improved high ISO performance, then you can create a FF sensor with even better. Always.

But I agree, it could happen. As Don said above, they have to start somewhere. I admit my ignorance, I haven't been following the forefront of digital technology over the past 20 years, so I can't base my opinions off historical data. When was the last time that Canon released a crop sensor camera that matched the performance of their latest release of FF sensors?


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## sagittariansrock (Mar 20, 2013)

Skirball said:


> People will always take better high ISO performance, always. Yes, the latest offerings are good, but that doesn't mean it can't be better. You're telling me that people wouldn't pounce on a camera with useable ISO at 51.2k? Of course they would.



Agreed. Thus, I am sure Canon would pre-pone the release of updates to the 5DIII and 1Dx. But it is not as critically urgent as is an improvement of the APS-C sensor, which is already handicapped by the amount of light that is incident upon it.



Skirball said:


> If you can create a crop sensor with markedly improved high ISO performance, then you can create a FF sensor with even better. Always.



Of course. Laws of physics.




Skirball said:


> When was the last time that Canon released a crop sensor camera that matched the performance of their latest release of FF sensors?



And even this time, I doubt if the beefed-up APS-C will match the FF sensors of 2012. But I am sure they will be markedly better than the current crop (pun intended). Having said that, they never really came out with revolutionary sensor technology in APS-C sensors- they merely packed in more megapixels.


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## 9VIII (Mar 20, 2013)

If the T5i and 100B are all they have up their sleeves that would be pretty disappointing.

I'm not giving up hope though, it's not over until the announcements are made.


Given the recent trends and stated aims, it seems that Canon's current strategy is not to make super duper sensors, what they're doing is making larger sensors more economical. It's seems like a good strategy if your new tech is developing a little slow. APS-C is moving into high end compact territory, and with the 6D they have an economical full frame.
My next thought, continuing along those lines, is that since the 1DX now effectively does everything the 1D4 did, only in full frame, and non-sports shooters can get the 5D3 for a more upscale full frame, what do you do with the APS-H line? I think it would make sense from Canon's point of view to put that in the 7D2. You get something worse than the 1Dx but decisively better than what people already have, and it still just uses existing technology. It also makes sense in the naming scheme. 7D is already in the premium line, and APS-H would be suiting.
That does leave the 70D (the new upscale APS-C) in a bit of a sticky situation (why get one of those over a 7D?), but it's effectively the same situation as the 5D2 and 6D, so I don't think it's a move Canon would be opposed to making.


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## Canon-F1 (Mar 21, 2013)

well say goodbye to your dreams about a new improved sensor.

and the 70D will have the same sensor you can be sure.

so canon has improved the area of the hybrid focus but not it´s speed.

just WOW!!


and the 750D released in december will have .. guess what... MORE CREATIVE FILTERS!!!


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## cccp80 (Mar 23, 2013)

What I don't understand is why Canon can't release a 36 MP FF sensor???
FF matrix is more than twice the area of the APS-C sensor so even by using the same technology they introduced in 7D over 3 years ago, Canon can start putting out 36 MP full frames.
It seems like now even more than ever Canon needs to step up and show Nikon that we can do it too!


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