# EOS R related announcements coming for CP+ [CR2]



## Canon Rumors Guy (Jan 5, 2020)

> Lost in all of the Canon EOS-1D X Mark III interest is the fact that CP+ begins next month and that it will be a major show for Canon announcements.
> We have been told that Canon will introduce a new EOS R camera ahead of the show in February, along with 2 new RF mount lenses.
> It’s expected Canon will announce a high megapixel addition to the EOS R lineup, a camera that has been rumored for quite some time.
> The same source said the EOS R Mark II is coming in 2020, but the exact time we’d see an announcement was unknown to them.
> We will be getting at least one new prime and one new zoom lens announced for the RF mount and I wouldn’t be surprised if we see another round of development announcements for RF mount lenses and maybe cameras.



Continue reading...


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## Aussie shooter (Jan 5, 2020)

I wonder of they would release both the hi res R and an R2 at the same time? Not really a regular canon move but it would be a bold move if they did it


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## Joules (Jan 5, 2020)

Aussie shooter said:


> I wonder of they would release both the hi res R and an R2 at the same time? Not really a regular canon move but it would be a bold move if they did it


Last time we heard about the R II it was assumed to be coming alongside the 5D V more towards the end of the year. As this is the body everybody is screaming about since the R was released without two card slots, I feel like it makes sense to launch it later when all remaining corners are ground off with insights from the high res R release.


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## Aussie shooter (Jan 5, 2020)

Joules said:


> Last time we heard about the R II it was assumed to be coming alongside the 5D V more towards the end of the year. As this is the body everybody is screaming about since the R was released without two card slots, I feel like it makes sense to launch it later when all remaining corners are ground off with insights from the high res R release.


Chances are you are correct. I doubt they would come at the same time. I just though that if they could pull it off without the rumour mill spoiling the surprise then it would be quite the coup. It could claw back some of the negative press they receive from the yootoobers.


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## Jim Corbett (Jan 5, 2020)

Please, god, let it be BSI sensor this time.


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## Joules (Jan 5, 2020)

Aussie shooter said:


> It could claw back some of the negative press they receive from the yootoobers.


The M6 II was perceived really well from what I saw among the YouTube and general online reviews. I still suspect that the high res R will take everything that's great about that camera and combine it with some 5D level features. It's obviously just spectaculation in my part. But to me it would make the camera very interesting and it would explain to me why there's no 7D III.


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## jeliel (Jan 5, 2020)

Maybe also a RP MKII ?


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## LesC (Jan 5, 2020)

If an EOS R MKII is coming, is there any point to a 5D MKV as well?


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## LensFungus (Jan 5, 2020)

Joules said:


> The M6 II was perceived really well [...]. I still suspect that the high res R will take everything that's great about that camera


The price?


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## edoorn (Jan 5, 2020)

LesC said:


> If an EOS R MKII is coming, is there any point to a 5D MKV as well?


possibly 2 camera's, at the same time?


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## Tremotino (Jan 5, 2020)

Yeeesss!! I'm waiting so hard for the Eos R mkII


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## Joules (Jan 5, 2020)

Tremotino said:


> Yeeesss!! I'm waiting so hard for the Eos R mkII


The high resolution R that this rumor concerns is not the R successor though. It is rumored to be a mirrorless replacement of the 5DS cameras.


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## twoheadedboy (Jan 5, 2020)

LesC said:


> If an EOS R MKII is coming, is there any point to a 5D MKV as well?



Yeah I'd say for EF system people who are getting one more pro camera, they will get one more "do everything" camera at least. Doubt they would get another high MP body, I think they want to emphasize the quality of the RF glass so will funnel those people to the "February" body.

Personally I'm conflicted. I would like a better body than my R ASAP but I don't know that I want to deal with the particulars of a 5DS-like body...30 MP is "enough" though I would take 40 - 50, and I shoot a lot of low light, and the R is as slow in terms of FPS as I would want. If this new camera will be 80 MP it would be great if there is a lower-resolution uncompressed raw format.


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## mclaren777 (Jan 5, 2020)

Please let the zoom lens be a 14-28mm f/2!


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## bellorusso (Jan 5, 2020)

2020 is the last year for DSLR. I guess, it's time for Canon to move on. Can't wait for 5D kind of mirrorless camera.


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## snappy604 (Jan 5, 2020)

Think of all the great things you could do against the empire with an R2....


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## Tremotino (Jan 5, 2020)

Joules said:


> The high resolution R that this rumor concerns is not the R successor though. It is rumored to be a mirrorless replacement of the 5DS cameras.



Soo what? 
I'm still waiting so hard for the Eos R mkII


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## scyrene (Jan 5, 2020)

Jim Corbett said:


> Please, god, let it be BSI sensor this time.



I thought that made little practical difference for FF sensors? I've certainly seen technically-minded people say that...


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## Trey T (Jan 5, 2020)

LesC said:


> If an EOS R MKII is coming, is there any point to a 5D MKV as well?


Conceptually, 5D has the same architecture as the 1D. E.g. they both have the large thumb wheel. The EOS R has similar architecture as the 90D, tiny thumb wheel. There’s gonna be a lot of milking during this transition from EF to R.


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## Nelu (Jan 5, 2020)

LesC said:


> If an EOS R MKII is coming, is there any point to a 5D MKV as well?


At the moment there's no full-frame Canon mirrorless camera with a usable EVF for fast action (they both have terrible blackout) so yes, there's a reason for a new camera that has a higher resolution than the coming 1DX Mark III, an OVF and a faster AF and burst rate.


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## Adelino (Jan 5, 2020)

edoorn said:


> possibly 2 camera's, at the same time?


Like the 90D and the M6.


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## Jim Corbett (Jan 5, 2020)

scyrene said:


> I thought that made little practical difference for FF sensors? I've certainly seen technically-minded people say that...


If it weren't, Nikon wouldn't have used it in D850.
It has practical difference when the pixels are smaller. Improves the high ISO noise. The rumors are RmkII would be high-res. Ergo, I hope for BSI.
---








Future Canon sensor technology - an overview


Over the past week, we’ve seen a few sensor rumors floating around, so we thought it would be a good idea to summarize what exactly Canon may bring us in the future in terms of sensors and what Canon is doing. While the photography world hangs on Sony Electronics’ latest announcements on...



www.canonnews.com


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## Drcampbellicu (Jan 5, 2020)

Aussie shooter said:


> I wonder of they would release both the hi res R and an R2 at the same time? Not really a regular canon move but it would be a bold move if they did it



The original R was rushed and not competitive with Sony. Looking forward to the new R being better than a Sony.


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## mistaspeedy (Jan 5, 2020)

Just when I buy the EOSR, they announce a replacement, lol. My luck.


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## Del Paso (Jan 5, 2020)

mistaspeedy said:


> Just when I buy the EOSR, they announce a replacement, lol. My luck.


No need to worry, enjoy your camera, it deserves it!


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## Aussie shooter (Jan 5, 2020)

Drcampbellicu said:


> The original R was rushed and not competitive with Sony. Looking forward to the new R being better than a Sony.



I disagree. While it did not match the sony in specs I held the EosR, Nikon Z6 and sony a7r3 when they were all available at my local shop. The Eos R was good in the hand, The Nikon was not too far behind and the Sony was no better than a doorstop. No amount of incredible specs could have ever made me use one. Admittedly it looks as though Sony are finally addressing that issue with the A7r4, but with the firmware upgrades that have come out for the EOS R and the lenses canon are pumping out the RF system still looks to be better. I would say without a doubt the as far as an ecosystem goes Canon will be better than Sony but I doubt they will ever beat them in the spec sheet war. So it all depends on what you consider important.


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## Drcampbellicu (Jan 5, 2020)

there will always be someone who lives canon that thinks everything they make is best

but the broad reviews don’t lie
The R was not good at launch.
Canon’s impressive firmware update made it competitive but not a leader. The price drops gave it more value. But it’s not a mirrorless 5D Mark. That’s why the new R is needed. The old R was a rush to get something out there in mirrorless.



Aussie shooter said:


> I disagree. While it did not match the sony in specs I held the EosR, Nikon Z6 and sony a7r3 when they were all available at my local shop. The Eos R was good in the hand, The Nikon was not too far behind and the Sony was no better than a doorstop. No amount of incredible specs could have ever made me use one. Admittedly it looks as though Sony are finally addressing that issue with the A7r4, but with the firmware upgrades that have come out for the EOS R and the lenses canon are pumping out the RF system still looks to be better. I would say without a doubt the as far as an ecosystem goes Canon will be better than Sony but I doubt they will ever beat them in the spec sheet war. So it all depends on what you consider important.


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## Aussie shooter (Jan 5, 2020)

Drcampbellicu said:


> there will always be someone who lives canon that thinks everything they make is best
> 
> but the broad reviews don’t lie
> The R was not good at launch.
> Canon’s impressive firmware update made it competitive but not a leader. The price drops gave it more value. But it’s not a mirrorless 5D Mark. That’s why the new R is needed. The old R was a rush to get something out there in mirrorless.


Like I said. it is about what you consider important. The size of the spec sheet matters for some. Not for me. For me as a wildlife shooter who often has the camera in hand for 10-12 hours straight(on one battery I might add) the Sony have so far been the most unpleasant design I could imagine. You literally could not have paid me to use them. And yes, while the original R was not a finished product so to speak it is now and it has a lens lineup that already craps all over Sony for quality and due to Sonys poor descision at the start of their journey(the decision to use a small mount) will only continue to leave Sonys lenses in the dust.. I have no doubt that the next R will be much closer to what many of us would consider a 'professional' level camera as will the hi res R that will come out soon. And it is glaringly obvious if you look at releases like the 90d and m62 that Sony no longer has a massive lead in the tech specs and that canon have caught up enough in that area(and will continue to do so, most likely remaining just behind for the forseeable future), that the lenses will be the deciding factor into the future. I am definitely going to stick with the system that I know will be superior down the track due to the constraints of physics and optics.


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## twoheadedboy (Jan 6, 2020)

Aussie shooter said:


> Like I said. it is about what you consider important. The size of the spec sheet matters for some. Not for me. For me as a wildlife shooter who often has the camera in hand for 10-12 hours straight(on one battery I might add) the Sony have so far been the most unpleasant design I could imagine. You literally could not have paid me to use them.



I have never shot Sony but I have seen this sentiment echoed "across the plains" from people who actually shoot in the field for art and commerce, not just test charts in a studio and pixel-peep because the tech is cool.


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## brad-man (Jan 6, 2020)

I picked up an R + 24-105 + 35 during the recent price drop and am quite pleased with all of them. I have my 5DIV and 2.8 EF zooms, so I'm looking for another fast non-L prime. A 16 or a 50 would do nicely. I'm not too picky...


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## Bennymiata (Jan 6, 2020)

I'm very happy with my R and I doubt I will go out chasing a new version for a couple of years.
I was handed an A7R2 a couple of years ago at an event I was shooting, and within an hour I wanted to chuck it in the bin. It hurt my hand and my fingers kept getting caught between the grip and the lens.
The R is a far better camera than the specs and many pros that have tried them reckon it's really good and many have switched.
It's not a camera for high speed sports, but for weddings, events and most other photographic and video, it's a great camera.


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## Drcampbellicu (Jan 6, 2020)

I shoot wildlife and find it odd when anyone on the internet is bragging about the R for this purpose 

it’s like drag racing with a corolla

Anons new lens system is promising but our conversation was about the R.
There’s a reason why a new one will be out shortly. The current R is a good cheap general camera. Nothing more unless a canon troll wants to make up something



Aussie shooter said:


> Like I said. it is about what you consider important. The size of the spec sheet matters for some. Not for me. For me as a wildlife shooter who often has the camera in hand for 10-12 hours straight(on one battery I might add) the Sony have so far been the most unpleasant design I could imagine. You literally could not have paid me to use them. And yes, while the original R was not a finished product so to speak it is now and it has a lens lineup that already craps all over Sony for quality and due to Sonys poor descision at the start of their journey(the decision to use a small mount) will only continue to leave Sonys lenses in the dust.. I have no doubt that the next R will be much closer to what many of us would consider a 'professional' level camera as will the hi res R that will come out soon. And it is glaringly obvious if you look at releases like the 90d and m62 that Sony no longer has a massive lead in the tech specs and that canon have caught up enough in that area(and will continue to do so, most likely remaining just behind for the forseeable future), that the lenses will be the deciding factor into the future. I am definitely going to stick with the system that I know will be superior down the track due to the constraints of physics and optics.


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## Aussie shooter (Jan 6, 2020)

Drcampbellicu said:


> I shoot wildlife and find it odd when anyone on the internet is bragging about the R for this purpose
> 
> it’s like drag racing with a corolla
> 
> ...


You misread my comment I think. I was most definitely not praising the R as a wildlife camera. At this point I would not use ANY mirrorless as a wildlife camera because the EVF's are just not on a par with an OVF for that purpose. I was more referring to the better ergonomics of the eosR.


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## mpb001 (Jan 6, 2020)

Hopefully, one of the things that will differentiate the RII body from a 5DV besides being mirrorless is that the RII will ger IBIS?


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## addola (Jan 6, 2020)

Aussie shooter said:


> At this point I would not use ANY mirrorless as a wildlife camera because the EVF's are just not on a par with an OVF for that purpose.


Not speaking from experience, but doesn't the Sonys (like A9II, I think) perform well for that purpose and even with Animal eye-detect AF?


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## Aussie shooter (Jan 6, 2020)

addola said:


> Not speaking from experience, but doesn't the Sonys (like A9II, I think) perform well for that purpose and even with Animal eye-detect AF?


I am not referring to AF capability. That is no longer an issue with mirrorless. I am referring to staring through an EVF for long periods while waiting for something to happen. If you don't actually shoot wildlife seriously then you would probably be quite shocked at just how much time one can have their eye glued to the viwfinder


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## mccasi (Jan 6, 2020)

Logical deductions:
1. The EOS Rs will be released early, the R2 will be released much later, that year to not canibalise the novelty cycle
2. Canon will have 1 big bang lens ala 28-70mm F2 and 70-200mm F2.8, I'm also hoping for the 14-28mm F2 and if so, I will buy it
3. the other lens will be less niche, maybe a 24mm or 35mm F1.2L
4. most likely other lens, a 50mm non-L F1.8 will likely not be released with the Rs, just not the theme

my speculations:
- Canon exec's have consistently said the next R will have IBIS, the rumors aren't consistent yet about IBIS in the Rs, but IMHO, a high MP body is barely useful without IS, they must include it, even if their tech is 1 gen behind (e.g. 3-4 stops or making weird noises)
- the Rs will have HEIF... and that means there will be a 10bit, down-sampled 30-50MP format available. RAW and CRAW will have native resolution and APS-C crop. only HEIF and JPEG will come downsampled:
--> I am currently mainly a CRAW shooter, but I will migrate to HEIF as it combines the best attributes of CRAW and JPEG and makes the 75MP usable for everything (canon colors, 10bit dynamic range, small files, native phone support)

completely open questions:
- what about RF Tilt-shift lenses?
- Rs body, will it have a permanent battery grip? the L-bracket landscape shooters will mind, but how else will you balance the heavy ultra-pro RF lenses well? if not, will i thave a different battery grip (as the Rs will be thicker due to IBIS imho)


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## Ozarker (Jan 6, 2020)

The new body does not concern me. I am wondering what the new lenses will be. Will they both be "L"? Maybe a fast 135mm prime (f/1.8 or f/1.8?) and fast 70- xxx zoom (f/2?)? I'm tapped out for cash for the next year or more, so no rush. Still, I would like to see either of those.


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## Ozarker (Jan 6, 2020)

mccasi said:


> my speculations:
> - Canon exec's have consistently said the next R will have IBIS...


I have never seen a statement by Canon Executive about this on the *next* R. I might have missed it. I have seen plenty of speculation on this forum by members. I hope they are correct.


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## Del Paso (Jan 6, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> The new body does not concern me. I am wondering what the new lenses will be. Will they both be "L"? Maybe a fast 135mm prime (f/1.8 or f/1.8?) and fast 70- xxx zoom (f/2?)? I'm tapped out for cash for the next year or more, so no rush. Still, I would like to see either of those.


Being out of $ can be a huge advantage, it forces you to wait, which often means benefitting from a future price decrease, cashback or any kind of promotion...once you're solvent again.
This is what I tell myself for consolation, since I'm presently broke.


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## koenkooi (Jan 6, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> I have never seen a statement by Canon Executive about this on the *next* R. I might have missed it. I have seen plenty of speculation on this forum by members. I hope they are correct.



Canon has been on the record in multiple interviews saying things like "Of course we're looking at IBIS", as well as the now infamous slide during a presentation:



But as you say, that's not "next", but "future".


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## Ozarker (Jan 6, 2020)

Del Paso said:


> Being out of $ can be a huge advantage, it forces you to wait, which often means benefitting from a future price decrease, cashback or any kind of promotion...once you're solvent again.
> This is what I tell myself for consolation, since I'm presently broke.


R/RF have caused me a real GAS problem that exceeds my ability to satisfy my irrational desire.  Just a week before buying the R I told my wife I am prefectly happy with EF. I was obviously lying to her and myself. Then I lied to myself again: I am perfectly happy with my EF glass and the RF 24-105mm f/4L. Lies, lies, lies!!!


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## mccasi (Jan 6, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> The new body does not concern me. I am wondering what the new lenses will be. Will they both be "L"? Maybe a fast 135mm prime (f/1.8 or f/1.8?) and fast 70- xxx zoom (f/2?)? I'm tapped out for cash for the next year or more, so no rush. Still, I would like to see either of those.


though 135mm is not out of the picture, I believe with both the 70-200mm and 85mm 1.2L portrait photographers have gotten a lot of love. Rs will also be for architecture and landscape, don't think they care for 135mm.


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## mccasi (Jan 6, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> R/RF have caused me a real GAS problem that exceeds my ability to satisfy my irrational desire.  Just a week before buying the R I told my wife I am prefectly happy with EF. I was obviously lying to her and myself. Then I lied to myself again: I am perfectly happy with my EF glass and the RF 24-105mm f/4L. Lies, lies, lies!!!


for me the RF 28-70mm has cured GAS quite a bit, shot 90% of my images with it - don't need overlapping primes.
But I want a wide/astro combination lens, 14mm Samyang is not flexible enough, 14-28mm F2 I would carry around.


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## mccasi (Jan 6, 2020)

koenkooi said:


> But as you say, that's not "next", but "future".


meant to say future, non-the-less under the heading speculation, Rs needs IBIS. Ask 5DS/5DSR owners with a mere 50MP trying hand-held


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## Ozarker (Jan 6, 2020)

mccasi said:


> though 135mm is not out of the picture, I believe with both the 70-200mm and 85mm 1.2L portrait photographers have gotten a lot of love. Rs will also be for architecture and landscape, don't think they care for 135mm.


You might be correct, however, since portrait photography is by far the biggest sector I am expecting to see another fast portrait lens very soon. Faster than f/2.8. A 135mm could fill that void, which is still there despite the 70-200. 135mm on the 70-200 is nothing like that of a 135mm f/2 or faster. If not right away, then later in the year.

Then again, it might just be two more non-L RF lenses. Doubt it.

EDIT: Don't underestimate the desire by some portrait photographers to have a high resolution camera.


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## Maz0327 (Jan 6, 2020)

Tremotino said:


> Soo what?
> I'm still waiting so hard for the Eos R mkII


You and me both. I was going for the R but since hearing rumors of the mkii im gonna wait. I'm sooo tempte dto grab the R right now though coming from a Nikon d7100 -_-


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## StoicalEtcher (Jan 6, 2020)

Drcampbellicu said:


> The original R was rushed and not competitive with Sony. Looking forward to the new R being better than a Sony.


Not sure I buy that it was "rushed" - given it comes on the back of an all new mount and an apparently very good range of new lenses (I say 'apparently', as I don't yet have an R). 

Could it have been even better? Might it not be the best FF mirrorless at the point of its release? Well, arguably not. But it feels unfair to say it was "rushed". 

Having said that, I share your confidence that the next iteration will be even better  

Just my 2c.


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## gbc (Jan 6, 2020)

Nelu said:


> At the moment there's no full-frame Canon mirrorless camera with a usable EVF for fast action (they both have terrible blackout) so yes, there's a reason for a new camera that has a higher resolution than the coming 1DX Mark III, an OVF and a faster AF and burst rate.


At first, the blackout on the R during fast action was a real turn off for me. But now that I've used it alongside my 5dIV for a year and a half, I've come to realize how dependent I've become on the EVF, to the point where I blow a lot of exposures now when I'm shooting with the 5D. I had no plans to get rid of the 5D and if I had take one camera on an important shoot that'd be the one, but if there's a more pro-level R coming with even the slightest improvement in the blackout situation, I think I'll take that over the lack of EVF in a new 5D model now. Sure, the EVF has made me a little lazier in thinking about my exposure settings, but that's the way things are going and they're not going back. I think I'm all-in on the R going forward.


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## Nelu (Jan 6, 2020)

gbc said:


> At first, the blackout on the R during fast action was a real turn off for me. But now that I've used it alongside my 5dIV for a year and a half, I've come to realize how dependent I've become on the EVF, to the point where I blow a lot of exposures now when I'm shooting with the 5D. I had no plans to get rid of the 5D and if I had take one camera on an important shoot that'd be the one, but if there's a more pro-level R coming with even the slightest improvement in the blackout situation, I think I'll take that over the lack of EVF in a new 5D model now. Sure, the EVF has made me a little lazier in thinking about my exposure settings, but that's the way things are going and they're not going back. I think I'm all-in on the R going forward.


No matter what people say, I have a lot of respect for the EOS-R and I also tend to use it more than my 5D Mark IV now but for fast lateral motion photos the blackout is bad. It is very easy to lose sight of the target, especially for small, fast birds. Otherwise, I think it's fine for any kind of sports or even wildlife photography. I had no issues shooting large or slower birds neither, so for most of the time it works great for me.
In addition to this, it requires no AFMA and I can adjust the EVF diopter so that I can playback photos, change settings or browse menus without reading glasses; you can't beat that!


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## Random Orbits (Jan 6, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> R/RF have caused me a real GAS problem that exceeds my ability to satisfy my irrational desire.  Just a week before buying the R I told my wife I am prefectly happy with EF. I was obviously lying to her and myself. Then I lied to myself again: I am perfectly happy with my EF glass and the RF 24-105mm f/4L. Lies, lies, lies!!!



Do you find that your RF lenses tend to go to face/eye detect mode much more often than adapted EF lenses? If so, I wonder if this is due to the increased bandwith communication between the RF lend body...


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## Ozarker (Jan 6, 2020)

Random Orbits said:


> Do you find that your RF lenses tend to go to face/eye detect mode much more often than adapted EF lenses? If so, I wonder if this is due to the increased bandwith communication between the RF lend body...


I have no idea. I udsed the EF 70-200 f/2.8L IS II for about an hour before deciding to sell all my EF gear and the RF 24-105. I never compared.


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## Random Orbits (Jan 6, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> I have no idea. I udsed the EF 70-200 f/2.8L IS II for about an hour before deciding to sell all my EF gear and the RF 24-105. I never compared.



OK, thanks!


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## gbc (Jan 6, 2020)

Nelu said:


> No matter what people say, I have a lot of respect for the EOS-R and I also tend to use it more than my 5D Mark IV now but for fast lateral motion photos the blackout is bad. It is very easy to lose sight of the target, especially for small, fast birds. Otherwise, I think it's fine for any kind of sports or even wildlife photography. I had no issues shooting large or slower birds neither, so for most of the time it works great for me.
> In addition to this, it requires no AFMA and I can adjust the EVF diopter so that I can playback photos, change settings or browse menus without reading glasses; you can't beat that!


It kind of just occurred to me while thinking about the blackout and also how I seem to be taking way more photos than in years past... I think the way I'm getting around the blackout in fast motion scenarios is just by holding down the shutter button and taking like 25 frames of a shot I probably would've taken 5 of with the 5D. Because the moment I let up on the shutter, the blackout happens for second and it's way too long. With a really fast/large memory card, I've been able to just spray shots and hope I catch the action I want while monitoring it in the EVF.


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## YuengLinger (Jan 6, 2020)

gbc said:


> It kind of just occurred to me while thinking about the blackout and also how I seem to be taking way more photos than in years past... I think the way I'm getting around the blackout in fast motion scenarios is just by holding down the shutter button and taking like 25 frames of a shot I probably would've taken 5 of with the 5D. Because the moment I let up on the shutter, the blackout happens for second and it's way too long. With a really fast/large memory card, I've been able to just spray shots and hope I catch the action I want while monitoring it in the EVF.



25 frames? Whoa! By then any action subject I've encountered is way out of the frame, and so is my composition. I cannot overstate how great the R is for portrait work, but for moving subjects that need to be kept within the frame, yikes. Plus there really isn't enough burst rate to cherry-pick a good selection of facial expression + body position.


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## Quirkz (Jan 7, 2020)

Drcampbellicu said:


> The current R is a good cheap general camera. Nothing more unless a canon troll wants to make up something



not quite - 
It's a *great* cheap general camera


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## gouldopfl (Jan 7, 2020)

Jim Corbett said:


> Please, god, let it be BSI sensor this time.


Seriously why? Just about every lens used for Canon have stabilization built in. Is it really going to make you a better photographer? All my lenses have 4-5 stops of stabilization. I certainly won't be jumping out there for new glass at this point


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## Ozarker (Jan 7, 2020)

gouldopfl said:


> Seriously why? Just about every lens used for Canon have stabilization built in.


Not true. I had the EF 35mm f/1.4 II and the EF 24-70 f/2.8L II and neither had image stabilization. None of my RF lenses have it. Many Canon lenses don't have it.

Anyway, BSI has nothing to do with IS of any form that I am aware of. BSI = Back-side Illuminated sensor..


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## gouldopfl (Jan 7, 2020)

brad-man said:


> I picked up an R + 24-105 + 35 during the recent price drop and am quite pleased with all of them. I have my 5DIV and 2.8 EF zooms, so I'm looking for another fast non-L prime. A 16 or a 50 would do nicely. I'm not too picky...


I have a couple of Canon L glass but purchased a complete line of Tamron SP G2 lenses last year. They are every bit as capable as any f/2.8 glass that Canon makes. I bought the 35mm f/1.4 and it is awesome. I've got a canon 50mm 1.4 and it is ok. Build quality is cheap. As I find I need faster glass than 2.8 then I will consider rf mounts. Canon is making their money now because once Sigma Art and Tamron announce their RF mount glass and it compares like it does to EF, Canon will be forced to drop prices. Also until they come out with some consumer lenses, why would the consumer move to a newer rf mount camera.


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## Ozarker (Jan 7, 2020)

gouldopfl said:


> Also until they come out with some consumer lenses, why would the consumer move to a newer rf mount camera.


Because some of us consumers like "L" glass too.  We are a larger group than the professionals.


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## tron (Jan 7, 2020)

I just bought an EOS R kit due to Black Friday offers. I also added a RF 35 1.8 and I just ordered a 15-35 2.8L IS.

It is good enough and this includes the use of EF lenses through the adaptor. I recently took pictures of my niece using the EOS R and the EF 85mm 1.4L IS with the adaptor and Eye focus was excellent.


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## tron (Jan 7, 2020)

Next stop RF24-70 2.8L IS or RF 50mm 1.2L. I haven't decided yet.


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## MadScotsman (Jan 7, 2020)

tron said:


> Next stop RF24-70 2.8L IS or RF 50mm 1.2L. I haven't decided yet.



What? No love for the RF 70-200mm 2.8L IS USM?


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## Fast351 (Jan 7, 2020)

The only reason I haven't bought the R is the framerate. I shoot a 70D now and I'm really excited to go to mirrorless for DPAF and FF (I have a lot of EF L glass) but to go from 7 FPS which is already too slow to 5 FPS is a deal breaker. I'd rather see a 24MP camera capable of 8 FPS than a 30MP camera at 5 FPS. Fingers crossed that they fix this in the R MK2.


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## tron (Jan 7, 2020)

MadScotsman said:


> What? No love for the RF 70-200mm 2.8L IS USM?


My EF70-200 2.8L IS II does not get a lot of use, so...

PS. And it has IS already...


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## gbc (Jan 7, 2020)

YuengLinger said:


> 25 frames? Whoa! By then any action subject I've encountered is way out of the frame, and so is my composition. I cannot overstate how great the R is for portrait work, but for moving subjects that need to be kept within the frame, yikes. Plus there really isn't enough burst rate to cherry-pick a good selection of facial expression + body position.


I shoot a lot of concerts so I get a lot of situations where people are running back and forth for 10 minutes straight. I just track them for 5-6 seconds at a time. And so far the R has almost never let me down.


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## Nelu (Jan 7, 2020)

tron said:


> Next stop RF24-70 2.8L IS or RF 50mm 1.2L. I haven't decided yet.


Why would you get the RF 24-70mm when the RF 24-105 f/4 is such an excellent lens? Just curious...


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## tron (Jan 7, 2020)

Nelu said:


> Why would you get the RF 24-70mm when the RF 24-105 f/4 is such an excellent lens? Just curious...


That's why I haven't decided yet. I have been abroad twice in the last 2 years and I took pictures in museums and churches in low light. I had the 16-35 2.8L IIII and the 24-105L IS (ver 1).

I would benefit from both IS on 16-35 2.8 and from a combination of better IS with 1 more stop than the 24-105.

But I was also thinking that a 85 1.4L IS and a 35 2 IS would be even better solutions as 24-105 replacements so I am not 100% sure. Of course I would have to change lenses like crazy! Or have with me both EOS R and 5DMkIV.

On the other hand 15-35 and 24-70 overlap and make shooting interiors a more relaxing case.

Choices!


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## Lenscracker (Jan 7, 2020)

bellorusso said:


> 2020 is the last year for DSLR. I guess, it's time for Canon to move on. Can't wait for 5D kind of mirrorless camera.


 If Canon does not move on, and very soon, they will be washed away by the Sony Tsunami. Canon needs to retire a lot of their upper echelon managers who can't get their heads out of the glorious days of their film era. If they can't beat Sony at their own game Canon will end up selling printers and lenses for other brands.


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## Ozarker (Jan 7, 2020)

Fast351 said:


> The only reason I haven't bought the R is the framerate. I shoot a 70D now and I'm really excited to go to mirrorless for DPAF and FF (I have a lot of EF L glass) but to go from 7 FPS which is already too slow to 5 FPS is a deal breaker. I'd rather see a 24MP camera capable of 8 FPS than a 30MP camera at 5 FPS. Fingers crossed that they fix this in the R MK2.


I'd just about bet the R Mark II will have the new X processor found in the new 1DX Mark III... but tailored to the R. It will also have a brand new sensor. Something tells me there will not be a bump up on mega pixels. So better low light performance, faster fps, better EVF, maybe even better AF, better battery life. Good luck!


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## tron (Jan 7, 2020)

Fast351 said:


> The only reason I haven't bought the R is the framerate. I shoot a 70D now and I'm really excited to go to mirrorless for DPAF and FF (I have a lot of EF L glass) but to go from 7 FPS which is already too slow to 5 FPS is a deal breaker. I'd rather see a 24MP camera capable of 8 FPS than a 30MP camera at 5 FPS. Fingers crossed that they fix this in the R MK2.


The rates you mention are a little funny low. 5DMkIV has already 30mp at 7fps so at least the new R should have that.

A 5DMkV would have even higher (Mp or fps or both!) 

But since you obviously know that I assume you mentioned these low frames per second to be in sync with EOS R.


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## Ozarker (Jan 7, 2020)

Lenscracker said:


> If Canon does not move on, and very soon, they will be washed away by the Sony Tsunami. Canon needs to retire a lot of their upper echelon managers who can't get their heads out of the glorious days of their film era. If they can't beat Sony at their own game Canon will end up selling printers and lenses for other brands.


 You said Sony and Tsunami in the same sentence.


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## tron (Jan 7, 2020)

For now the only camera that has Tsunami speed is the 1DxIII


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## Ozarker (Jan 7, 2020)

tron said:


> For now the only camera that has Tsunami speed is the 1DxIII


Never stops either.


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## richperson (Jan 8, 2020)

YuengLinger said:


> 25 frames? Whoa! By then any action subject I've encountered is way out of the frame, and so is my composition. I cannot overstate how great the R is for portrait work, but for moving subjects that need to be kept within the frame, yikes. Plus there really isn't enough burst rate to cherry-pick a good selection of facial expression + body position.



I guess it depends on what you are shooting. For darkish theater, I have had no problem getting plenty of good shots out of burst. Sports are a little more particular. Football is okay, but you might miss that perfect moment in the catch, but the few times I used it for that (low light and needed full frame) I did get a usable shot. Basketball was reasonable too for the most part. Faster sports like volleyball is where you really need the higher fps, and the R ends up missing shots.


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## YuengLinger (Jan 8, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> I'd just about bet the R Mark II will have the new X processor found in the new 1DX Mark III... but tailored to the R. It will also have a brand new sensor. Something tells me there will not be a bump up on mega pixels. So better low light performance, faster fps, better EVF, maybe even better AF, better battery life. Good luck!


It would be so cool to see efforts put into low-light, even better AF, and speed rather than more megapixels. Great Canon offers a higher-res version as a niche product, but I'd rather try to get closer to my subject than keep squeezing more and more MP into a FF sensor.


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## tron (Jan 8, 2020)

YuengLinger said:


> It would be so cool to see efforts put into low-light, even better AF, and speed rather than more megapixels. Great Canon offers a higher-res version as a niche product, but I'd rather try to get closer to my subject than keep squeezing more and more MP into a FF sensor.


Regarding that I do hope you will be able to pursuade small birds to keep that in mind and behave accordingly


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## YuengLinger (Jan 8, 2020)

tron said:


> Regarding that I do hope you will be able to pursuade small birds to keep that in mind and behave accordingly


The smallest birds I deal with are Cornish hens, and they aren't moving at all.


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## richperson (Jan 8, 2020)

tron said:


> Regarding that I do hope you will be able to pursuade small birds to keep that in mind and behave accordingly



The only birds I ever plan to shoot are large: Ravens, Seahawks, Cardinals, Falcons and Eagles.


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## Fast351 (Jan 8, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> I'd just about bet the R Mark II will have the new X processor found in the new 1DX Mark III... but tailored to the R. It will also have a brand new sensor. Something tells me there will not be a bump up on mega pixels. So better low light performance, faster fps, better EVF, maybe even better AF, better battery life. Good luck!



From your lips to Canon's ears!


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## richperson (Jan 8, 2020)

As an R owner, my main wishes would be:

1) more fluid images in the EVF when shooting bursts;
2) consistent 8-10 fps in all AF conditions;
3) swap Touch Bar for same controls as 1DXiii, including AF-on sensor; (I'm not a bar hater, just like the 1DX layout better)
4) dual card slots;
5) same MP, fps, and AF, but with the head AF in the 1DXiii.


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## Ozarker (Jan 8, 2020)

YuengLinger said:


> It would be so cool to see efforts put into low-light, even better AF, and speed rather than more megapixels. Great Canon offers a higher-res version as a niche product, but I'd rather try to get closer to my subject than keep squeezing more and more MP into a FF sensor.


I think what I read about the new sensor on the 1DX Mark III was that it is a stop better in low light. I just assume the design type will trickle down.


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## Aussie shooter (Jan 9, 2020)

richperson said:


> As an R owner, my main wishes would be:
> 
> 1) more fluid images in the EVF when shooting bursts;
> 2) consistent 8-10 fps in all AF conditions;
> ...


Well. You wouldnt out the head af of the 1dx3 in an eos r. That is a dslr feature that is already bettered by the face and eye tracking of the mirrorless system. All the rest sounds good though


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## Joules (Jan 9, 2020)

Aussie shooter said:


> Well. You wouldnt out the head af of the 1dx3 in an eos r. That is a dslr feature that is already bettered by the face and eye tracking of the mirrorless system. All the rest sounds good though


Head AF is an extension of face AF that keeps the person in focus even when they face is obscured, be it because they turned around or because of a helmet. It is absolutely something you will want in upcoming releases if you want the best AF system available to Canon shooters.


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## Aussie shooter (Jan 9, 2020)

Joules said:


> Head AF is an extension of face AF that keeps the person in focus even when they face is obscured, be it because they turned around or because of a helmet. It is absolutely something you will want in upcoming releases if you want the best AF system available to Canon shooters.


I was referring more to the fact it is designed for a specialized focusing sensor rather than an on sensor focusing system as you would find in a mirrorless camera. So it simply wont be in a mirrorless because they dont have the same system. The concept on the other hand. Absolutely


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## Joules (Jan 9, 2020)

Aussie shooter said:


> I was referring more to the fact it is designed for a specialized focusing sensor rather than an on sensor focusing system as you would find in a mirrorless camera. So it simply wont be in a mirrorless because they dont have the same system. The concept on the other hand. Absolutely


It actually fully applies to both OVF and Liveview shooting in the 1DX III. And it's new AF pixel array is much closer to an image sensor based AF system than the traditional PDAF systems Canon uses. I quoted some relevant bits from the white paper in this post:






Canon officially announces the Canon EOS-1D X Mark III


It doesn't sound like they declared 20mp as a 'limitation' as such. They said it was 'sufficient' therefore Canon has decided to aim for that one stop of high ISO performance over an increase in MP as well as reducing the strength of the AA filter(which will effectively give a resolution bump...




www.canonrumors.com





I believe Canon will do their best to avoid developing new technologies, especially on the software side, that they can't share between mirrorless and DSLR bodies. The 1DX III may be the body that shows off these new features first, but it reads to me as if they tried to make the new technology behind it as applicable to future releases as possible.


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## Aussie shooter (Jan 9, 2020)

Joules said:


> It actually fully applies to both OVF and Liveview shooting in the 1DX III. And it's new AF pixel array is much closer to an image sensor based AF system than the traditional PDAF systems Canon uses. I quoted some relevant bits from the white paper in this post:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yep. I think i misunderstood initially and thought that particular aspect was only for the off sensor focusing. It is definitely a great addition to regular face and eye detect. Canon really do seem like they may have hit the ball out of the park on this one


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## Del Paso (Jan 9, 2020)

tron said:


> That's why I haven't decided yet. I have been abroad twice in the last 2 years and I took pictures in museums and churches in low light. I had the 16-35 2.8L IIII and the 24-105L IS (ver 1).
> 
> I would benefit from both IS on 16-35 2.8 and from a combination of better IS with 1 more stop than the 24-105.
> 
> ...


Since I can choose between all of your suggested options, I've decided for myself to mainly use (in cities, cathedrals etc...) the EF 35 f2 IS and the EF 85 f1,4 IS, and, as backup, a 24 mm or my 16-35 zoom.
The primes are measurably and visibly better !


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## Ozarker (Jan 9, 2020)

tron said:


> I just bought an EOS R kit due to Black Friday offers. I also added a RF 35 1.8 and I just ordered a 15-35 2.8L IS.
> 
> It is good enough and this includes the use of EF lenses through the adaptor. I recently took pictures of my niece using the EOS R and the EF 85mm 1.4L IS with the adaptor and Eye focus was excellent.


It is so good to read a happy experience now and then. I never had the EF 85mm f/1.4L IS. The one lens I wish I had not yet sold is my EF 135mm f/2L.


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## Del Paso (Jan 9, 2020)

richperson said:


> As an R owner, my main wishes would be:
> 
> 1) more fluid images in the EVF when shooting bursts;
> 2) consistent 8-10 fps in all AF conditions;
> ...


Couldn't agree more, if you also add a less obtrusive electronic level.


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## tron (Jan 9, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> It is so good to read a happy experience now and then. I never had the EF 85mm f/1.4L IS. The one lens I wish I had not yet sold is my EF 135mm f/2L.


Truth must be told. Although handling has room for improvent.

My 5D4 has better handling and I still love it of course.

I still have my 135L although I haven't used it for many years. I didn't have a heart to sell it. Now it will be able to focus perfectly but to tell the truth I haven't checked it with my 5DIV. It may focus perfectly with it too! The 85 1.4L seems fine with 5D4 by the way (and hugely better focuswise than 85 1.2L II).

I believe the two systems can coexist in our bags! 

P.S I have a UPS tracking number for 15-35 L IS and I just ordered 24-70 2.8L IS. Finally 2.8 wide and standard zooms with IS


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## tron (Jan 9, 2020)

I am afraid that I will not use much the 24-70 since the same happened to my 24-70 2.8 II but every now and then I shoot interiors and I take 16-35 2.8 III and 24-105 4L IS. My complaints are always that 24-70 does not have IS hence this choice. However If I could carry a little more equipment 85 1.4L IS and a 35 2 IS would take care of that issue (in the expense of continuous lens changes).


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## Kit. (Jan 9, 2020)

Aussie shooter said:


> Well. You wouldnt out the head af of the 1dx3 in an eos r. That is a dslr feature that is already bettered by the face and eye tracking of the mirrorless system.


Just for clarification:

Face AF is an old relatively simple technology based on searching for face-looking local patterns.

Head AF is a new technology based on predicting where the heads would most likely be based on the pixel information from the whole image (including the prospective heads themselves), pretrained on a huge database of head-containing images.


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## richperson (Jan 9, 2020)

Aussie shooter said:


> Well. You wouldnt out the head af of the 1dx3 in an eos r. That is a dslr feature that is already bettered by the face and eye tracking of the mirrorless system. All the rest sounds good though



#5 mean same as R, not 1DXiii. It would still be well behind the 1DX3 in high iso, FPS, and autofocus, but would be a lot more usable.


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## VICYASA (Jan 10, 2020)

When do you think, any of you... will they start announcing EOS r (mark2?) or upgrade to mirrorless current line?


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## Michael Clark (Jan 12, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> I think what I read about the new sensor on the 1DX Mark III was that it is a stop better in low light. I just assume the design type will trickle down.



Is the sensor actually a stop better, i.e. are the raw files a stop better? Or is the sensor + JPEG engine (particularly the noise reduction section) a stop better for in camera generated JPEGs?


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## Michael Clark (Jan 12, 2020)

Fast351 said:


> From your lips to Canon's ears!



For any camera appearing in 2020 or even early 2021, those decisions have long since been made.


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## Michael Clark (Jan 12, 2020)

Aussie shooter said:


> I was referring more to the fact it is designed for a specialized focusing sensor rather than an on sensor focusing system as you would find in a mirrorless camera. So it simply wont be in a mirrorless because they dont have the same system. The concept on the other hand. Absolutely



The new OVF based PDAF sensor in the 1D X Mark III *is *for all practical purposes, a miniature CMOS imaging sensor, rather than the typical line sensor of all previous Canon OVF based PDAF sensors.


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## Ozarker (Jan 12, 2020)

Michael Clark said:


> Is the sensor actually a stop better, i.e. are the raw files a stop better? Or is the sensor + JPEG engine (particularly the noise reduction section) a stop better for in camera generated JPEGs?


I have no idea.
*"2. Does Canon 1DX Mark III Have Better Image Quality than Canon 1DX Mark II ?*
Slightly better (Upto 1 stop). We are getting slightly better image quality in the new Canon 1DX Mark III camera due to the introduction new Dual-Digic 6 image processor inside the camera we are getting 1 stop more ISO range in extended mode compared to the Canon 1DX Mark II camera. Not only that Canon 1DX Mark III also features new image decoding algorithm and with the help of the that we may notice some betterment in the DR, performance of the camera."


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## Michael Clark (Jan 12, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> I have no idea.
> *"2. Does Canon 1DX Mark III Have Better Image Quality than Canon 1DX Mark II ?*
> Slightly better (Upto 1 stop). We are getting slightly better image quality in the new Canon 1DX Mark III camera due to the introduction new Dual-Digic 6 image processor inside the camera we are getting 1 stop more ISO range in extended mode compared to the Canon 1DX Mark II camera. Not only that Canon 1DX Mark III also features new image decoding algorithm and with the help of the that we may notice some betterment in the DR, performance of the camera."




Where did you find that mistake riddled quote?

The 1D X Mark II has dual DiG!C 6+ processors. The 1D X Mark III has a single DiG!C X processor with significantly more computing power than two DiG!C 6+ processors combined.

One stop improvement is much more than _"slightly better." _It's *double* the efficiency.

What does, _"... with the help of the that we may notice..."_ even mean?


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## Ozarker (Jan 12, 2020)

Michael Clark said:


> Where did you find that mistake riddled quote?
> 
> The 1D X Mark II has dual DiG!C 6+ processors. The 1D X Mark III has a single DiG!C X processor with significantly more computing power than two DiG!C 6+ processors combined.
> 
> ...


Hey, I just quouted a randon post. I leave the technical stuff to others. Cut and paste the text to google and you'll find it.


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## Ozarker (Jan 12, 2020)

Michael Clark said:


> Where did you find that mistake riddled quote?
> 
> The 1D X Mark II has dual DiG!C 6+ processors. The 1D X Mark III has a single DiG!C X processor with significantly more computing power than two DiG!C 6+ processors combined.
> 
> ...


Here: http://thenewcamera.com/canon-1dx-mark-iii-vs-canon-1dx-mark-ii/

From what I understand the DX III also has a digic 6 thrown in. Correction: "The camera is powered by Canon’s new Digic X processor, which allows for a native ISO range of 100-102,400 that can be expanded to 50-819,200. The new 191-point autofocus system in the viewfinder uses its own Digic 8 processor and is capable of tracking subjects’ heads and faces. So there you go. Digic X and Digic 8.


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## Michael Clark (Jan 12, 2020)

CanonFanBoy said:


> Here: http://thenewcamera.com/canon-1dx-mark-iii-vs-canon-1dx-mark-ii/
> 
> From what I understand the DX III also has a digic 6 thrown in. Correction: "The camera is powered by Canon’s new Digic X processor, which allows for a native ISO range of 100-102,400 that can be expanded to 50-819,200. The new 191-point autofocus system in the viewfinder uses its own Digic 8 processor and is capable of tracking subjects’ heads and faces. So there you go. Digic X and Digic 8.



The DiG!C 8 controls AF/metering in the 1D X Mark III in the same way that what was essentially a DiG!C 5 controlled AF/metering in the 1D X Mark II and 5D Mark IV.

For image processing, the 1D X Mark II used dual DiG!C 6+ processors. The 1D X mark III uses a single DiG!C X processor.


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## Ozarker (Jan 12, 2020)

Michael Clark said:


> The DiG!C 8 controls AF/metering in the 1D X Mark III in the same way that what was essentially a DiG!C 5 controlled AF/metering in the 1D X Mark II and 5D Mark IV.
> 
> For image processing, the 1D X Mark II used dual DiG!C 6+ processors. The 1D X mark III uses a single DiG!C X processor.


Not the point and really doesn't matter. More than 1 processor is used for the whole sheeeee bang. Would not the metering have to do, in part, with the total output ability? RE better DR? I don't know. Don't really care. Do you know? The point is better DR. How that is accomplished, ultimately, is pure speculation on anyone's part around these parts on the internet forum. I've said it before. I'll say it again: The tech side is not within my realm.


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