# PowerShot G16 & S120 To Be Replaced in October [CR2]



## Canon Rumors Guy (Sep 22, 2015)

```
It’s likely we’re going to see some new high end PowerShot cameras in October of this year.</p>
<p>Both the PowerShot G16 and PowerShot S120 are slated to be replaced, detailed specs are not available at this time.</p>
<p>We’re told that the PowerShot G16 will feature an electronic viewfinder, which would be very much welcomed, as the optical viewfinder in the G series has been lacking in usability for quite some time.</p>
<p>More to come…</p>
```


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## expatinasia (Sep 22, 2015)

If Canon can duplicate the Sony RX100 Mark IV, or dare I say better it, keeping the super small form factor that makes the RX100 so attractive, then I will buy it.

Something as well engineered and small like that with a Canon menu system I recognise. Yes please!!

Frankly, Canon should be looking beyond the RX100 Mark IV and trying to compete with whatever the RX100 Mark V will offer when it comes out. But maybe that is asking too much.

Come on Canon!!


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## Mitch.Conner (Sep 22, 2015)

Interesting. I thought the G7x marked the end of the S9x/S1xx line of higher-end p&s cameras from Canon. I imagine the G7x will outperform any upcoming S series offering, in roughly the same size body, but I guess we'll see.


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## dolina (Sep 22, 2015)

Smartphones make more sense unless they jack up the size of the image sensor.


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## Proscribo (Sep 22, 2015)

Mitch.Conner said:


> Interesting. I thought the G7x marked the end of the S9x/S1xx line of higher-end p&s cameras from Canon. I imagine the G7x will outperform any upcoming S series offering, in roughly the same size body, but I guess we'll see.


Personally I don't think S120 replacement would have any bigger sensor, as it would make the camera bigger (and the size difference between s120 and g7x does make difference IMO).

G17 however... wilm be interesting to see what it will bring.


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## Adelino (Sep 22, 2015)

I am really really looking forward to the G17. Please Canon become a leader again (or at least do lag too far behind).


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## mrsfotografie (Sep 22, 2015)

I'm a bit surprised as I thought the G16 was the last of its kind. I bought one, also for that reason. It's rather archaic with its tiny sensor and the whole camera gives a bit of a nostalgic sensation. Is there really still a market for a G17?


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## Sporgon (Sep 22, 2015)

dolina said:


> Smartphones make more sense unless they jack up the size of the image sensor.



I disagree. The G16 offers much more flexibility for photography than a smart phone. I've just got a G16 and I'm finding it very good. The fine noise pattern at ISO 80 actually adds to the picture IMO. Here's one just shot at ISO 80


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## casperl (Sep 22, 2015)

My S100 will squeeze into any pants' pocket I throw at it without looking awkward, but the RX100 doesn't. So I am looking forward to see what Canon can offer with S120's replacement.


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## expatinasia (Sep 22, 2015)

casperl said:


> My S100 will squeeze into any pants' pocket I throw at it without looking awkward, but the RX100 doesn't. So I am looking forward to see what Canon can offer with S120's replacement.



That's some small pockets you have. You may want to get some new trousers rather than worry about how "awkward" those extra 13mm look!! Most of those extra 13mm are taken up by the superior 24–70 mm F1.8 - F2.8 ZEISS lens on the Sony, compared to Canon's 24–120 mm F2.0 - F5.9. The other specs of the RX 100 Mark IV definitely pack a massive punch by comparison to the S100.

RX100 Mark IV = 102 x 58 x 41 mm (298g). 1" 20MP BSI-CMOS Sensor 8.80 x 13.20 mm.
Canon S100 = 99 x 60 x 28 mm (198g). 1/1.7" 12MP CMOS Sensor 5.58 x 7.44 mm.

Regardless of all that, I really hope Canon will do something very, very special to compete (or beat) the RX100 Mark IV.


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## AvTvM (Sep 22, 2015)

expatinasia said:


> ...
> RX100 Mark IV = 102 x 58 x 41 mm (298g). 1" 20MP BSI-CMOS Sensor 8.80 x 13.20 mm.
> Canon S100 = 99 x 60 x 28 mm (198g). 1/1.7" 12MP CMOS Sensor 5.58 x 7.44 mm.
> 
> Regardless of all that, I really hope Canon will do something very, very special to compete (or beat) the RX100 Mark IV.



I would not hold my breath for that ... Canon was not even able to pull off a competitive G7X [1" sensor]. G16 is larger and heavier,despite dwarf-sensor [1/1.7"]. I fully expect Canon to bring G16/S-120 still using crappy tiny sensors. Of course they'll be DOA. Unfortunately, Canon only learns very slowly ... and the hard way.


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## noncho (Sep 22, 2015)

There were some rumors about super bright 24-168 or 24-200 equiv. lens for camera like G17. 
In such case - I'm interested


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## JohanCruyff (Sep 22, 2015)

Smartphones are cannibalizing the point-and-shoot market.
Producers are trying to explore new niches, namely the 1"sensor one.
I don't think Canon will be able to sell at a premium price an enthusiast point-and-shoot with a small sensor: I predict that G7X and G3X will survive the smartphone era, GXX and SXXX will not.

Of course I could be wrong. :


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## rrcphoto (Sep 22, 2015)

Canon Rumors said:


> It’s likely we’re going to see some new high end PowerShot cameras in October of this year.</p>
> <p>Both the PowerShot G16 and PowerShot S120 are slated to be replaced, detailed specs are not available at this time.</p>
> <p>We’re told that the PowerShot G16 will feature an electronic viewfinder, which would be very much welcomed, as the optical viewfinder in the G series has been lacking in usability for quite some time.</p>
> <p>More to come…</p>



makes sense .. both are in need of a refresh.

it will be interesting to see what happens to the G17 - I suspect it will take it's place in the other G series cameras now and have a similar styling, form factor and use the external EVF. will it stay with a small sensor or move up to 1"? will canon drop the G1X series and just make it back to the Gxx series?

I suspect where canon ultimately wants to go is the G series cameras with different lenses and perhaps slightly different form factor, sharing similar parts to the same ecosystem. (G7X, G3X, G1X, Gxx?) is there a place for the G1X and the Gxx?

if you include the M in there which is basically an ILC G series powershot anyways, you have a pretty nice small G series lineup from compact to superzoom, to ILC, all sharing the same ecosystem and ergonomics.

In a way if this is what canon is thinking - I happen to really like where it would go and the options.

for example, I wouldn't be surprised of the G7XII has a hotshoe for the EVF.

The G17 wouldn't surprise me if it takes it's functionality from the EOS-M3 / G3X styling and form factor.

not sure why anyone would think either would be an RX100 "competitor" that clearly is in the domain of the G7X (oops typo.. didn't meant the 3 there) series - doing it anywhere else would be kind of stupid.


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## rrcphoto (Sep 22, 2015)

JohanCruyff said:


> Smartphones are cannibalizing the point-and-shoot market.
> Producers are trying to explore new niches, namely the 1"sensor one.
> I don't think Canon will be able to sell at a premium price an enthusiast point-and-shoot with a small sensor: I predict that G7X and G3X will survive the smartphone era, GXX and SXXX will not.
> 
> Of course I could be wrong. :


depends on the optics.

a smaller sensor allows canon to do special things with the optics that you couldn't necessarily do with a 1" sensor and keep the size reasonable.


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## scrup (Sep 22, 2015)

JohanCruyff said:


> Smartphones are cannibalizing the point-and-shoot market.
> Producers are trying to explore new niches, namely the 1"sensor one.
> I don't think Canon will be able to sell at a premium price an enthusiast point-and-shoot with a small sensor: I predict that G7X and G3X will survive the smartphone era, GXX and SXXX will not.
> 
> Of course I could be wrong. :



Small sensor cameras are dead to the enthusiast. Canon will still sell these alone based on brand or first time camera owners. There are not many but there are still some out there. Most people I know would rather put the money to a better smart phone or buy a ILC.



Canon should really partner with a cell phone manufacture and provide the optics and sensors.


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## Quasimodo (Sep 22, 2015)

I am reluctantly expecting something as they anounce these two new models.. maybe. As things stands right now I am looking for a low-weight camera that I can keep in my jacket pocket (or large pant pockets) when I do not want to drag my 1Dx around. The only camera that has gotten me exited in the past years is the Fuji x100T, and I am now keeping my money for their new model Fuji x100U (?) which I expect them to tell us about early next year (as I do not want to buy the end of life cycle T model). Sony A7000 is also rumored to be around the corner, so I really hope that Canon can announce something that gets me exited and back on track


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## Mitch.Conner (Sep 23, 2015)

Proscribo said:


> Mitch.Conner said:
> 
> 
> > Interesting. I thought the G7x marked the end of the S9x/S1xx line of higher-end p&s cameras from Canon. I imagine the G7x will outperform any upcoming S series offering, in roughly the same size body, but I guess we'll see.
> ...



I agree with you about the sensor size likely remaining the same. I tend to disagree about the size difference between the S90/95/100/110 and G7x being significant though. They're both pretty small.

I agree with others who believe that the P&S market (what's left of it) is really for high-end P&S models. A successor to the S110 would be (I think) the lowest end of the Canon high-end models. Still likely high-end enough to sell though, as it will probably take better photos than most phone cameras (my S95 still takes better photos than any smartphone camera I've tried so far, although I hear the latest from Samsung and Apple are very nice - and might break that trend).

I remember either a rumor or an Canon exec interview a while back talking about Canon focusing on only high end P&S cameras, and not bothering with the lower end models any longer. Then a few months later they released a bunch of low end P&S models and everybody was scratching their heads.


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## powershot2012 (Sep 23, 2015)

How funny, Spokan closes the previous G17 thread and now we have this. LMAO! 



Canon Rumors said:


> It’s likely we’re going to see some new high end PowerShot cameras in October of this year.</p>
> <p>Both the PowerShot G16 and PowerShot S120 are slated to be replaced, detailed specs are not available at this time.</p>
> <p>We’re told that the PowerShot G16 will feature an electronic viewfinder, which would be very much welcomed, as the optical viewfinder in the G series has been lacking in usability for quite some time.</p>
> <p>More to come…</p>


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## powershot2012 (Sep 23, 2015)

No wonder cause your S100 has a tiny sensor compared to the RX100 and the difference in IQ makes the S100 look bad, let alone it's slow performance.



casperl said:


> My S100 will squeeze into any pants' pocket I throw at it without looking awkward, but the RX100 doesn't. So I am looking forward to see what Canon can offer with S120's replacement.


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## expatinasia (Sep 23, 2015)

Quasimodo said:


> As things stands right now I am looking for a low-weight camera that I can keep in my jacket pocket (or large pant pockets) when I do not want to drag my 1Dx around.



My thoughts exactly. I have not looked at the Fuji X100T, but I have very nearly bought the Sony RX100 many times. But to have a truly pocketable (exact size of the RX100 Mark IV is fine) camera with top-end specs including RAW images, customisable buttons with similar layout to the 1D X, and a Canon menu system - yes please!

We can dream, but sadly I am not sure Canon are going to deliver. Time will tell and in the meantime I live in hope.


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## rrcphoto (Sep 23, 2015)

scrup said:


> JohanCruyff said:
> 
> 
> > Smartphones are cannibalizing the point-and-shoot market.
> ...


they always were really.

however an small optical zoom to 120mm is still better than a smartphone shooting the same picture at 24mm and digital zooming.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Sep 23, 2015)

expatinasia said:


> If Canon can duplicate the Sony RX100 Mark IV, or dare I say better it, keeping the super small form factor that makes the RX100 so attractive, then I will buy it.
> 
> Something as well engineered and small like that with a Canon menu system I recognise. Yes please!!
> 
> ...



You want a $950 G16?? Sony is raising prices with each new model, so the RX100 MK V might be $1200.


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## casperl (Sep 23, 2015)

expatinasia said:


> casperl said:
> 
> 
> > My S100 will squeeze into any pants' pocket I throw at it without looking awkward, but the RX100 doesn't. So I am looking forward to see what Canon can offer with S120's replacement.
> ...


There is difference between fits nicely and "my Zeiss Lens is happy to see you" fit


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## Solar Eagle (Sep 23, 2015)

AvTvM said:


> Canon was not even able to pull off a competitive G7X [1" sensor]. G16 is larger and heavier,despite dwarf-sensor [1/1.7"]. I fully expect Canon to bring G16/S-120 still using crappy tiny sensors. Of course they'll be DOA. Unfortunately, Canon only learns very slowly ... and the hard way.



You actually believe all that? You mad bro? lol

Canon is very smart. That's why they are the market leader, and can afford sit back and watch others cut trails and do market research for them. Sony can't afford to do that. Canon is the wise old sage. 

I was at best buy the other day and saw the RX100 IV for $950 and the G7X for $650. I'd call that quite competitive.


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## expatinasia (Sep 23, 2015)

Solar Eagle said:


> AvTvM said:
> 
> 
> > Canon was not even able to pull off a competitive G7X [1" sensor]. G16 is larger and heavier,despite dwarf-sensor [1/1.7"]. I fully expect Canon to bring G16/S-120 still using crappy tiny sensors. Of course they'll be DOA. Unfortunately, Canon only learns very slowly ... and the hard way.
> ...



You can't really compare the two though can you - at least not the whole package? The G7X does not even have a built in view finder and does not do nearly as much with regards to video (4K and slow mo etc.). Many say the AF performances on the RX is far superior too, as is the battery life.

I hope Canon gets it right with the new models.


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## AvTvM (Sep 23, 2015)

Solar Eagle said:


> Canon is very smart. That's why they are the market leader, and can afford sit back and watch others cut trails and do market research for them. Sony can't afford to do that. Canon is the wise old sage.
> 
> I was at best buy the other day and saw the RX100 IV for $950 and the G7X for $650. I'd call that quite competitive.



i bet Sony is selling many more RX100s than canon sells G7X, which is not even competitive against the Sony RX100 III. 

There is utter chaos in canon's "G"-lineup. g16, G1X II, G7X ... All of them similarly large and boxy. All of them without built-in EVF. And most importantly: all of them with sorry sub-par sensors.


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## dolina (Sep 23, 2015)

Sporgon said:


> I disagree. The G16 offers much more flexibility for photography than a smart phone. I've just got a G16 and I'm finding it very good. The fine noise pattern at ISO 80 actually adds to the picture IMO. Here's one just shot at ISO 80


Why not a larger sensor p&s like the 12MP 2/3" X-Trans CMOS II Sensor Fujifilm XQ2 that is $100 less?


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## powershot2012 (Sep 23, 2015)

Very true. Canon has an RX100 II competitor but is behind the competition at this point. 



expatinasia said:


> Solar Eagle said:
> 
> 
> > AvTvM said:
> ...


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## Hector1970 (Sep 23, 2015)

I have a G12 but haven't upgraded it to any of the following models as Canon didn't put effort into making it better. If you compare it to Sony which has poured bucket loads of technology into the RX system.
I'd love if this upgraded wowed me.
What would wow me is:
Small form size similar to the RX100 IV (I'd accept a little bit bigger but I want to be able to pocket it).
An electronic viewfinder (the optical one is so bad).
Keep an articulated screen that can fold back into the back protecting it.
A really good 1" sensor.
A good fast lens 24-105mm would do.
Some sort of reasonable FPS, at least 5 ideally 8 FPS.
I'd love super slow motion too. It's a gimmick but impressive.
Full HD recording would do me but continuous focussing would be nice.


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## rrcphoto (Sep 23, 2015)

AvTvM said:


> Solar Eagle said:
> 
> 
> > Canon is very smart. That's why they are the market leader, and can afford sit back and watch others cut trails and do market research for them. Sony can't afford to do that. Canon is the wise old sage.
> ...



lol .. all of them with sub par sensors and all large and boxy .. right okay.


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## rrcphoto (Sep 23, 2015)

Hector1970 said:


> A really good 1" sensor.
> A good fast lens 24-105mm would do.



so basically you want a G7x - which starts at f/1.8 and runs at 24-100mm.


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## Adelino (Sep 23, 2015)

rrcphoto said:


> Hector1970 said:
> 
> 
> > A really good 1" sensor.
> ...



Good call. Some people don't even bother researching the market.


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## AvTvM (Sep 23, 2015)

Adelino said:


> rrcphoto said:
> 
> 
> > Hector1970 said:
> ...



Not easy to weed through the chaos of canons' g1x, g1x ii, g7x, g16, powershot this, eos m that, mark 1, mark 2, mark 3, give us your money, dwarf-sensor suckers, multi-mega pixel, low dr, 100x megazoom, darklens chaos land.

One sony Rx100 IV to rule them .. all!


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## Sportsgal501 (Sep 23, 2015)

I hope it's a major update and not a trinket here and there.If so they should concentrate on more lenses for their Canon EOs M 3 or Canon SL2 .


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## Hector1970 (Sep 24, 2015)

Adelino said:


> rrcphoto said:
> 
> 
> > Hector1970 said:
> ...


A selective lifting of quotes.
If you bothered to check it doesn't have an electronic view finder and it needs a better 1" sensor.
It's poor in the corners.
Doesn't have a fully articulated screen.
At best a me too product and not pushing any boundaries.


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## powershot2012 (Sep 24, 2015)

Agree, G7X is definitely a "me too" camera and unfortunately Canon did not bring much new to the market with this model. G7X definitely has issues which is why it has not been too popular. Sony owns the compact pocket market and Canon needs something better than the RX100 IV if it has any chance to even stir some interest.





Hector1970 said:


> Adelino said:
> 
> 
> > rrcphoto said:
> ...


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## LDS (Oct 8, 2015)

Hector1970 said:


> it needs a better 1" sensor.



Isn't it a Sony sensor?


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