# UK pricing leaks for the Canon EOS R5 and Canon EOS R6



## Canon Rumors Guy (Jul 8, 2020)

> Pricing on the Canon EOS R5 and Canon EOS R6 has been tough to nail down with 100% certainty, but it does look like the rumored pricing from earlier is going to hold true.
> According to UK retailers, pricing will be as follows:
> 
> Canon EOS R6 Body £2499
> ...



Continue reading...


----------



## joestopper (Jul 8, 2020)

Canon Rumors Guy said:


> Continue reading...




Seems all info leaking.
R6 said to be shipped end of August according to Nkishita. Not bad!


----------



## Maximilian (Jul 8, 2020)

Seems the UK wants to be first 

This would be 4.662 € at the actual exchange rate. 
So pointing towards 4.599 € in the EU.


----------



## Graphic.Artifacts (Jul 8, 2020)

How does that usually translate to US$? The R5 seems to be on the upper end of the rumored range.


----------



## joestopper (Jul 8, 2020)

Graphic.Artifacts said:


> How does that usually translate to US$? The R5 seems to be on the upper end of the rumored range.



I bet it is not more than $3999.


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

Isn't it usually a 1:1 between GBP asking price and USD asking price?

- A


----------



## PeterParker (Jul 8, 2020)

So, according to my *incredibly rudimentary 10 second online number crunching*, this would price it at about £3,500 before VAT (at 20% currently). Not sure if that means $3,500 for pre-tax US pricing? Would certainly be nice!

edit - Not suggesting that £3,500 and $3,500 are equivalent prices, mind you, only that the absolute numerical values between pre-tax US prices and pre-VAT UK prices are often identical with internationally marketed products. Here's hoping!


----------



## Chris.Chapterten (Jul 8, 2020)

Damn, this pricing is not going to look pretty for those of us in Australia


----------



## Lance vdv (Jul 8, 2020)

Graphic.Artifacts said:


> How does that usually translate to US$? The R5 seems to be on the upper end of the rumored range.


That translated to american is $ 5,286.72 !!!!!!!!!


----------



## Sharlin (Jul 8, 2020)

Lance vdv said:


> That translated to american is $ 5,286.72 !!!!!!!!!



At this point it really should be common knowledge that EU/UK prices include VAT, US prices don't


----------



## AlanF (Jul 8, 2020)

The R5/100-500mm combo will be £7098, even way above the £5,500-6000 I guestimated. I simply can't justify that when I am getting good results with my current gear. $3999 would be consistent with current US/UK prices for other gear.


----------



## bbb34 (Jul 8, 2020)

OMG, the next 20 pages will be about how to remove and apply VAT rates.


----------



## joestopper (Jul 8, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> Isn't it usually a 1:1 between GBP asking price and USD asking price?
> 
> - A



No.
Not only different taxation. But also different markets -> hard to calculate. But looking into past, US typically gets the best price.


----------



## slclick (Jul 8, 2020)

bbb34 said:


> OMG, the next 20 pages will be about how to remove and apply VAT rates.


As long as we don't regress into the 17 or so pages of the 
50 US State tax configurations with county and city permutations as well.


----------



## drama (Jul 8, 2020)

AlanF said:


> The R5/100-500mm combo will be £7098, even way above the £5,500-6000 I guestimated. I simply can't justify that when I am getting good results with my current gear. $3999 would be consistent with current US/UK prices for other gear.



Or you could just buy one now, and one later? I don't suppose the lenses are going anywhere, and EF/RF converter rings exist.


----------



## Lance vdv (Jul 8, 2020)

Sharlin said:


> At this point it really should be common knowledge that EU/UK prices include VAT, US prices don't


Well I'm from Africa so did not know that.....don't roll your eyes at me young lady!


----------



## Sharlin (Jul 8, 2020)

PeterParker said:


> So, according to my *incredibly rudimentary 10 second online number crunching*, this would price it at about £3,500 before VAT (at 20% currently). Not sure if that means $3,500 for pre-tax US pricing? Would certainly be nice!



No. £3500 pre-tax would naively convert to about $4400 pre-tax, but the US price will almost certainly not be that high due to Other Economic Differences. Definitely not as low as $3500 either.


----------



## T14 05 (Jul 8, 2020)

Chris.Chapterten said:


> Damn, this pricing is not going to look pretty for those of us in Australia


Blew out of my accepted price range :///


----------



## WriteLight (Jul 8, 2020)

slclick said:


> As long as we don't regress into the 17 or so pages of the
> 50 US State tax configurations with county and city permutations as well.


SO MUCH THIS.


----------



## preppyak (Jul 8, 2020)

PeterParker said:


> So, according to my *incredibly rudimentary 10 second online number crunching*, this would price it at about £3,500 before VAT (at 20% currently). Not sure if that means $3,500 for pre-tax US pricing? Would certainly be nice!


$3499 for the R5 and $2199 or $2299 would fit the traditional entry prices for basically every other camera in the range (EOS R debuted at $2299, the a7Riv debuted at $3499, the 5DIV debuted at $3499, the Z6 and Z7 hit around those price points)


----------



## fox40phil (Jul 8, 2020)

nice Corona prices ... let the cameras stay in the stores and wait for a fast fall until next year!


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

preppyak said:


> $3499 for the R5 and $2199 or $2299 would fit the traditional entry prices for basically every other camera in the range (EOS R debuted at $2299, the a7Riv debuted at $3499, the 5DIV debuted at $3499, the Z6 and Z7 hit around those price points)




Yes. That was why I guessed that price. This is a mirrorless 5D5 stills camera in my book (albeit with a 'ABOUT DAMN TIME, CANON' competitive spec bump).

But 8K being a first + first RF body with IBIS takes this into a different value proposition. I get why they are asking for more.

I was wrong. It happens.

- A


----------



## zonoskar (Jul 8, 2020)

So that's 2799 eur for the R6? Even more than the EOS-R at introduction.


----------



## joestopper (Jul 8, 2020)

Canon Rumors Guy said:


> fox40phil said:
> 
> 
> > nice Corona prices ... let the cameras stay in the stores and wait for a fast fall until next year!



R5/R6 wont 'stay in the store.'
They will sell even with a premium on top of MSRP ...


----------



## filmmakerken (Jul 8, 2020)

Since the EOS 1Dx Mark III is about $6499 and the EOS 5D Mark IV is about $2499 a price point between $3499 and $4499 for the R5 makes sense. 

I guess we'll see tomorrow.


----------



## drama (Jul 8, 2020)

zonoskar said:


> So that's 2799 eur for the R6? Even more than the EOS-R at introduction.


Umm... have you looked at the specs?


----------



## PeterParker (Jul 8, 2020)

Sharlin said:


> No. £3500 pre-tax would naively convert to about $4400 pre-tax, but the US price will almost certainly not be that high due to Other Economic Differences. Definitely not as low as $3500 either.



Forgive me, I didn't mean to suggest that £3,500 is equivalent to $3,500 in terms of exchange rate, only that pre-tax US prices are often the same in terms of absolute dollar amount when compared to pre-tax GBP. As another poster wrote, US frequently gets the "best" overall prices.


----------



## bergstrom (Jul 8, 2020)

can't wait to get the R6 in 2023!


----------



## padam (Jul 8, 2020)

1DX Mark III £6499
EOS R6 £2499

No RAW to CFExpress cards, and I expect to record UHD instead of Cinema 4K maybe 4k60p will be IPB compression only to UHS-II cards and those can't handle more, no 20fps mechanical shutter, durable body or everlasting battery (smart controller, top LCD, duh).

They are different cameras obviously, but for most of the same features with the new mount and IBIS thrown in for good measure, it really looks like a bargain.


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

zonoskar said:


> So that's 2799 eur for the R6? Even more than the EOS-R at introduction.




I think R5 is a logical '5-series camera' with a similar market of user, with the mad asterisk of 8K.

But the R6 is a new animal to me. Any analogies that this is a 6-series camera (that even I asserted at first) seem out of place in light of these specs. It's not top-top pro everything, but it's a solid notch above the R for everything other than the megapickles.

Compared to the R (from a stills perspective alone):

Thumbwheel to  all over that control bar​IBIS​20 fps​The 1DX3 sensor (reportedly)​The R5's AF setup (which we presume will march right past the R's setup)​Surely snappier eye AF in a next-gen product​
So... yeah. That price seems right to me.

- A


----------



## koenkooi (Jul 8, 2020)

AlanF said:


> The R5/100-500mm combo will be £7098, even way above the £5,500-6000 I guestimated. I simply can't justify that when I am getting good results with my current gear. $3999 would be consistent with current US/UK prices for other gear.



I had a €7000 budget for R5+100-500, which would seem to be a bit optimistic. So I scrapped the 100-500 and ordered a 180mm macro yesterday, that leaves room to buy extra batteries, CFe cards and possibly a grip.
And it gives me a target for next years budget: the RF100-500 + 1.4x. Hopefully that ends gear purchases for the next decade or so.


----------



## Graphic.Artifacts (Jul 8, 2020)

Given the spread in the UK prices, if the R5 comes in at under $4000 the R6 could be very well priced. Maybe $1999 when all the launch mania cools off.


----------



## Whowe (Jul 8, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> I think R5 is a logical '5-series camera' with a similar market of user, with the mad asterisk of 8K.
> 
> But the R6 is a new animal to me. Any analogies that this is a 6-series camera (that even I asserted at first) seem out of place in light of these specs. It's not top-top pro everything, but it's a solid notch above the R for everything other than the megapickles.
> 
> ...


You can add:

Dual Card slots
12 fps mechanical
joystick


----------



## neurorx (Jul 8, 2020)

koenkooi said:


> I had a €7000 budget for R5+100-500, which would seem to be a bit optimistic. So I scrapped the 100-500 and ordered a 180mm macro yesterday, that leaves room to buy extra batteries, CFe cards and possibly a grip.
> And it gives me a target for next years budget: the RF100-500 + 1.4x. Hopefully that ends gear purchases for the next decade or so.


I am curious what the 5.6-7.1 focal length limits are vs the 100-400 4.5-5.6.


----------



## PureClassA (Jul 8, 2020)

If the R6 hit's around $2299 USD and the rumored video specs pan out, I'll grab the R6 and another Atomos Ninja V and still be $1000 or so under the R5... which will will be put towards the R1 in 2021


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

PureClassA said:


> If the R6 hit's around $2299 USD and the rumored video specs pan out, I'll grab the R6 and another Atomos Ninja V and still be $1000 or so under the R5... which will will be put towards the R1 in 2021




R1 can't be that far off now, can it? A year or two ago, the only wildcards were how well/responsive the DPAF / EVF would be and how much data they could push, and both have been soundly spoken to between the liveview of the 1DX3 and these R5 specs. A truly top-drawer EVF performer hasn't surfaced yet, in fairness, but surely they've been working on that.

One would think all Canon has to do now is make a hard call on [high-res + 8K like the R5] or [low-res + ~6K like the 1DX3] and park it in a 1-series body. It's go time.

- A


----------



## RunAndGun (Jul 8, 2020)

My money(no pun intended) is on ~$3499 US for the R5 and they will quickly roll into a back-order situation with the initial supply/allotment selling out in “pre-orders”, despite the current world situation.


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

RunAndGun said:


> My money(no pun intended) is on ~$3499 US for the R5 and they will quickly roll into a back-order situation with the initial supply/allotment selling out in “pre-orders”, despite the current world situation.




May happen anyway at 4199 US. Never underestimate the power of a first.

I'm just curious if a Sony A7S III or A7 IV development teaser drops just to take the sting out of what is shaping up to be a monster R5 / R6 rollout.

- A


----------



## PureClassA (Jul 8, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> R1 can't be that far off now, can it? A year or two ago, the only wildcards were how well/responsive the DPAF / EVF would be and how much data they could push, and both have been soundly spoken to between the liveview of the 1DX3 and these R5 specs. A truly top-drawer EVF performer hasn't surfaced yet, in fairness, but surely they've been working on that.
> 
> One would think all Canon has to do now is make a hard call on [high-res + 8K like the R5] or [low-res + ~6K like the 1DX3] and park it in a 1-series body. It's go time.
> 
> - A


Yeah but remember, Canon unleashes those beasts in time with the Olympics. Which are in Japan this time... and got pushed to 2021. And they just dropped the DX3 within the last 6 months. So I'm betting R1X announcement early next year with delivery around may/june 2021 just before the games start.


----------



## padam (Jul 8, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> One would think all Canon has to do now is make a hard call on [high-res + 8K like the R5] or [low-res + ~6K like the 1DX3] and park it in a 1-series body. It's go time.


It's pretty logical that they are going to prioritise sensor speed (also helps with the AF processing) over pixel count. So a stacked sensor is a possibility (it can be more MP if the technology is there of course, but I don't think it is) It could go well beyond 20fps.
But because it is the beginning of the next generation, I wouldn't expect it so soon, maybe after they have some fast telephotos to go with it.


----------



## Graphic.Artifacts (Jul 8, 2020)

PureClassA said:


> If the R6 hit's around $2299 USD and the rumored video specs pan out, I'll grab the R6 and another Atomos Ninja V and still be $1000 or so under the R5... which will will be put towards the R1 in 2021


CFExpress cards alone will set you back more than a Ninja V. Atomos had the V’s on sale until a few days ago. I should have picked one up but I wanted to see how this played out.


----------



## tomri (Jul 8, 2020)

£5398 for a 20mpix camera with an f7.1 tele zoom lens?

Seems like the R5 is what the R should have been; and the R6 is toned down a bit (no top LCD, 30% lower resolution) *but* at the same price the R was originally released at.

I think I will be getting a Leica instead


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

PureClassA said:


> Yeah but remember, Canon unleashes those beasts in time with the Olympics. Which are in Japan this time... and got pushed to 2021. And they just dropped the DX3 within the last 6 months. So I'm betting R1X announcement early next year with delivery around may/june 2021 just before the games start.




There's going to come a point where they drop same-spec'd DSLR and mirrorless bodies simultaneously. I just can't tell what product line / level they will do that with.

- A


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

padam said:


> It's pretty logical that they are going to prioritise sensor speed (also helps with the AF processing) over pixel count. So a stacked sensor is a possibility (it can be more MP if the technology is there of course, but I don't think it is)
> But because it is the beginning of the next generation, I wouldn't expect it so soon, maybe after they have some fast telephotos to go with it.




Sure, but it used to be a tradeoff of how to best manage throughput, and speed always triumphed over res for that userbase. I get it.

But DIGIC X seems to change the game a bit. 45 x 20 throughput is cake _and _eating it too. I'm not saying photojournos and sports sideline guys want 45 MP files (surely they don't), but they could honestly jam the R5 internals into a 1-series feature set body and delight other users (namely the old 1Ds crowd).

- A


----------



## cerealito (Jul 8, 2020)

can I expect a eos R price cut after this ?


----------



## koenkooi (Jul 8, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> There's going to come a point where they drop same-spec'd DSLR and mirrorless bodies simultaneously. I just can't tell what product line / level they will do that with.



Like they did with the 90D and M6II?


----------



## padam (Jul 8, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> Sure, but it used to be a tradeoff of how to best manage throughput, and speed always triumphed over res for that userbase. I get it.
> 
> But DIGIC X seems to change the game a bit. 45 x 20 throughput is cake _and _eating it too. I'm not saying photojournos and sports sideline guys want 45 MP files (surely they don't), but they could honestly jam the R5 internals into a 1-series feature set body and delight other users (namely the old 1Ds crowd).
> 
> - A


No, I think the won't care with that at all (really not the time to have too many separate camera models), the R5 is enough as-is, or a 5D Mark V is likely to come too to have a more durable body with that sensor.

They could have done this a long time with DSLRs, the Nikon D3X was the last camera like that, 2008, never to be seen again.

They might re-use the R5 body for a high megapixel sensor (R3?), since the RF lenses are very high resolving, that seems like a more logical thing to do.


----------



## zonoskar (Jul 8, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> But the R6 is a new animal to me. Any analogies that this is a 6-series camera (that even I asserted at first) seem out of place in light of these specs. It's not top-top pro everything, but it's a solid notch above the R for everything other than the megapickles.
> 
> Compared to the R (from a stills perspective alone):
> 
> ...


Yeah I get that, but the R6 is rumored to have less build quality than the R5. So at 2800 euro, I hope these build quality concessions are not in the weather sealing department (which I fear they are).


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

koenkooi said:


> Like they did with the 90D and M6II?




Did I totally miss they were on the same date? I think I did. Thx.

- A


----------



## PureClassA (Jul 8, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> There's going to come a point where they drop same-spec'd DSLR and mirrorless bodies simultaneously. I just can't tell what product line / level they will do that with.
> 
> - A



I dunno. Canon seems to be angling towards a slow phase out of DSLR. I think the DX3 might be the last of it's kind, but I think there would still be a 5D5 and THAT would be the last DSLR pro body. Canon is investing heavily in RF glass designs and they need users moving into that ecosystem. Would Canon really bother with a 1DX4 in 3 years at the 2024 Games? Seems like that ship would have long sailed by then.

What is key to develop for the R1X though is Zero latency on the EVF. That is critical to 1DX users. Matter of fact, I dont think they put out an R1X until they have that latency to as close to zero a physically possible. Part of that I suppose would be a new blazing fast Digic Chip that may be purely dedicated to the EVF and AF (similar to the 1DX and 1dx2 - minus the EVF of course). I'd guess the R1X would hang around 24-30MP and have some new insane top speed of 25fps in 14bit RAW shooting. (Right now the 20fps electronic shutter on the DX3 is 12bit RAW, not 14 like the 16fps Mechanical shutter)


----------



## WriteLight (Jul 8, 2020)

cerealito said:


> can I expect a eos R price cut after this ?


They will be dropping the price to $1499.


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

padam said:


> They might re-use the R5 body for high megapixel sensor, that seems like a more logical thing to do.




My point: some folks want high res and a 1-series feature set rather than have to choose between the two. Landscapers (and possibly some wildlifers) come to mind. The R1 or some variant of it could try to do that.

At that price point, anything is possible. Heck, if we can get a dedicated astro model or have two 5DS models _just because of the AA filter_ anything is possible.

- A


----------



## .jan (Jul 8, 2020)

Maximilian said:


> Seems the UK wants to be first
> 
> This would be 4.662 € at the actual exchange rate.
> So pointing towards 4.599 € in the EU.


Maybe. Maybe not. RF glass is currently almost a 1:1 conversion. Although the 4.599 also hints at only a inflation adjustment when compared to the 5D IV introduction price back in 2016. Doesn't seem too far off either way.

More Interesting pricing on the R6 actually, hints at both R and RP remaining in the market for some time longer.


----------



## mikebg (Jul 8, 2020)

Pricewise: I bought a 5DIV not that long after release for £3600 including VAT. That was in September 2016. So £4200 including VAT is pretty much in line with that, 4 years later (and with a much weaker £)


----------



## .jan (Jul 8, 2020)

joestopper said:


> No.
> Not only different taxation. But also different markets -> hard to calculate. But looking into past, US typically gets the best price.


True, but usually not good enough to get one on vacation and pay the import tariff when returning to the EU. While slipping an iPhone through customs might seem worth the risk for some, a $4k+ camera will be suspicious, especially if carried without the appropriate charger for the home market.


----------



## padam (Jul 8, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> My point: some folks want high res and a 1-series feature set rather than have to choose between the two. Landscapers (and possibly some wildlifers) come to mind. The R1 or some variant of it could try to do that.
> 
> At that price point, anything is possible. Heck, if we can get a dedicated astro model or have two 5DS models _just because of the AA filter_ anything is possible.
> 
> - A


As I wrote, the Nikon D3X proves that there aren't enough of them to present a business case for it, so it would be a bad idea for them to do it.
The 5DsR is a pretty durable camera on its own to be honest.
Adding in the battery grip or covering the camera for heavy rain is really not that bad as opposed to carrying a big camera at all times.

If there are speed and AF drive benefits, then yes, it is worth having that huge battery inside the camera, that's the main point of the D6 and 1DX III.

It will increase from the 20MP anyway, I just don't see them increasing it too much.


----------



## mangobutter (Jul 8, 2020)

Here's my guess:

R6 $2399
R5 $3799

Lets see if this ages well. lol!


----------



## chrisgibbs (Jul 8, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> Isn't it usually a 1:1 between GBP asking price and USD asking price?
> 
> - A



Minus the UK's 22% VAT.


----------



## koenkooi (Jul 8, 2020)

chrisgibbs said:


> Minus the UK's 22% VAT.



I think he meant GBP4000 translates to USD4000. The exchange rate differences and VAT cancel each other out.


----------



## Gazwas (Jul 8, 2020)

So any leaks on the cost of the WiFi grip Mr Canon Rumours Guy?


----------



## Joel C (Jul 8, 2020)

Looks like the R6 will be approx 2299$ here in the US. Can I order it already?! 

C'mon now! This wait has been intense.


----------



## PureClassA (Jul 8, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> My point: some folks want high res and a 1-series feature set rather than have to choose between the two. Landscapers (and possibly some wildlifers) come to mind. The R1 or some variant of it could try to do that.
> 
> At that price point, anything is possible. Heck, if we can get a dedicated astro model or have two 5DS models _just because of the AA filter_ anything is possible.
> 
> - A


I would imagine had there been a big enough segment for a camera like that, Canon would have made it by now. A "high-Res" R5 body is a given at this point, like the 5DS and 5DSR. Everything the same except for the sensor. (And as IF 45-50MP on the R5 isn't High-Res enough....) But I digress. Unless there is some reliable method of flipping a switch and getting back the top speed out of a dumbed-down (fps) high res senor, I dont see it happening. The LAST thing I would want in a 1RX would be a 45+ MP sensor, and no one shooting pro sports and journalism would either. At least not in THAT camera. A lot of them might carry a R5 as a second rig, but high speed, high accuracy, and 20-25MP is the ideal combo for most of those guys, including myself when duty calls. It's the main thing keeping me AWAY from the R5. 45MP for general shooting is WAY too much. 30MP on my EOS R is pushing my top end. If I'm going to shoot portraiture (far fewer frames shot than sports or action where I'm holding the shutter button down for 2-3 seconds on bursts) that i want more resolve, I'll grab the 5DSR. But even in the campaign photography I frequently do, I still use my DX2 because 20MP is more than ample for rendering images to be printed on ten thousand large mail pieces and slapped up on websites and social media. Using the R5 for that sort of work would yield no improvements in the end results and would consume more than double the memory space to do it (not to mention slow the editing down when you're culling hundreds or thousands of images)

This is why I keep going back to the R6. The video feature set (as currently rumored) fills all the major gaps in my arsenal, particularly Full Frame 4K capture with 10bit 422 out Log. Plus the 20MP makes it perfect for general use as well and would compliment my EOS R perfectly for video and very nicely for stills.

Video example, tonight I have to film a recital and will be using 2 cameras. EOS R with the 24-70mm RF L, shooting wide at 24mm with the 1.75x crop gives me a perfect framing of the stage 35 feet away. Then the 1DX2 with the 70-2002.8L with the 1.3x 4K crop for tighter follow shots and closeups (but I have to record 4k internally unfortunately with the DX2)

Ideally, what would I have with the R6 is a FF readout for true, wide to normal range shots, and then use the EOS R with it's massive crop factor plus a zoom for super reach 4K filming. The only thing the R5 has going for it as of this moment based on the rumors we have is the 4K120 ability the R6 won't have. But I'd rather wait for the R1X to get that, as rarely as I might actually use it. 8K is a cute novelty, but so incredibly impractical right now. RAW mode is too cumbersome a workflow for what I do and also relatively unnecessary for me.


----------



## Graphic.Artifacts (Jul 8, 2020)

tomri said:


> £5398 for a 20mpix camera with an f7.1 tele zoom lens?
> 
> Seems like the R5 is what the R should have been; and the R6 is toned down a bit (no top LCD, 30% lower resolution) *but* at the same price the R was originally released at.
> 
> I think I will be getting a Leica instead


Good plan! When you are comcerned about getting value for your €£¥$ the first name that comes to mind is always Leica!


----------



## XL+ (Jul 8, 2020)

So, my last week posted rumor of €4699 in Austria could come true. This is not the price-tag, I´ve expected.
Saving a little bit in Germany, as the VAT is temporarilly reduced from 19 to 16%. €120 will be 1/4th of the grip price - as rumored in another thread.

For 4699 bugs, this body has to be superior in image quality, speed and rolling shutter. 8k will not be my intention to use. The 256GB card will be full in a few minutes.


----------



## AEWest (Jul 8, 2020)

Graphic.Artifacts said:


> Good plan! When you are comcerned about getting value for your €£¥$ the first name that comes to mind is always Leica!


Hopefully it will even shoot in colour!


----------



## Jstnelson (Jul 8, 2020)

Anyone know if new Canon cameras are typically available for preorder on Amazon? I know the R5 will be on Adorama and BHphoto but, now that they all charge taxes, I'd like to take advantage of 5% cashback on my Amazon Prime card


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

koenkooi said:


> I think he meant GBP4000 translates to USD4000. The exchange rate differences and VAT cancel each other out.




^ This. I thought that was generally the trend regardless of conversion, VAT, etc. We Americans tend to get hooked up.

- A


----------



## wockawocka (Jul 8, 2020)

So that's £2200 for the R5 on grey import and £1499 for the R6.

(Probably)


----------



## RBSfphoto (Jul 8, 2020)

tomri said:


> £5398 for a 20mpix camera with an f7.1 tele zoom lens?
> 
> Seems like the R5 is what the R should have been; and the R6 is toned down a bit (no top LCD, 30% lower resolution) *but* at the same price the R was originally released at.
> 
> I think I will be getting a Leica instead


I love the SL2 for a lot of reasons and I have both M and Q cameras but the focus on the SL2 lags behind the even my current R by a lot. And in the US a SL2 with a wide to medium zoom and a medium to longish lens plus extra batteries is going to run almost 20K. Unless you are being sarcastic


----------



## privatebydesign (Jul 8, 2020)

koenkooi said:


> I think he meant GBP4000 translates to USD4000. The exchange rate differences and VAT cancel each other out.


There is also duty, cameras incur zero duty into the USA whereas the UK levies around 5% on cameras. So the UK price has an included 25% tax & duty levy on it over and above the USA prices.


----------



## cayenne (Jul 8, 2020)

Graphic.Artifacts said:


> CFExpress cards alone will set you back more than a Ninja V. Atomos had the V’s on sale until a few days ago. I should have picked one up but I wanted to see how this played out.



Damn....I was going to pick one up too, but now is back to $599 at both B&H and Adorama.

What was the sale price again? I'll keep a lookout next time they go on sale.

TIA,
Cayenne


----------



## David_E (Jul 8, 2020)

Graphic.Artifacts said:


> How does that usually translate to US$? The R5 seems to be on the upper end of the rumored range.


"Hey Siri, how much is 4,199 pounds sterling in U.S. dollars?"

"The answer is $5,285.09."


----------



## Max TT (Jul 8, 2020)

Geez I do hope they offer the R6 with the 24-105L f4 as a kit option as well.


----------



## David_E (Jul 8, 2020)

joestopper said:


> _R5/R6 wont 'stay in the store.'
> They will sell even with a premium on top of MSRP ..._


No way will Adorama or B&H add a premium to the MSRP. They have too much invested in customer satisfaction.


----------



## DBounce (Jul 8, 2020)

PureClassA said:


> If the R6 hit's around $2299 USD and the rumored video specs pan out, I'll grab the R6 and another Atomos Ninja V and still be $1000 or so under the R5... which will will be put towards the R1 in 2021


What “rumored” video specs? I think Canon has listed the video specs on their website. The only rumors were speculation around overheating and time limits.


----------



## goldenhusky (Jul 8, 2020)

I think the R5 is going to be a $4k + tax body in the US. I will have to wait for some deals to show up. I was thinking $3800 + tax max.


----------



## Max TT (Jul 8, 2020)

bergstrom said:


> can't wait to get the R6 in 2023!


Looks like thanksgiving ‍


----------



## Graphic.Artifacts (Jul 8, 2020)

cayenne said:


> Damn....I was going to pick one up too, but now is back to $599 at both B&H and Adorama.
> 
> What was the sale price again? I'll keep a lookout next time they go on sale.
> 
> ...


$499. I seem to recall them being at least $699 at some point so I guess $599 isn’t bad.


----------



## Max TT (Jul 8, 2020)

Graphic.Artifacts said:


> $499. I seem to recall them being at least $699 at some point so I guess $599 isn’t bad.


The thing is with Atmos Ninja, you need to account for all the other accessories that are needed for it to work as you intend.


----------



## londonxt (Jul 8, 2020)

preppyak said:


> $3499 for the R5 and $2199 or $2299 would fit the traditional entry prices for basically every other camera in the range (EOS R debuted at $2299, the a7Riv debuted at $3499, the 5DIV debuted at $3499, the Z6 and Z7 hit around those price points)



Not so sure, surely its all about the increase compared to the model before? The 5D has been taking inflation-busting leaps in the entry price each time, UK inc VAT:

5D Mk II £2300
5D Mk III £3000
5D Mk IV £3500
R5 £4199
R5 Mk II????


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

londonxt said:


> Not so sure. The 5D has been taking inflation-busting leaps in the entry price each time, UK inc VAT:
> 
> 5D Mk II £2300
> 5D Mk III £3000
> ...




It was a different trend in the US: 

5D2 $2699
5D3 $3499
5D4 $3299

- A


----------



## unfocused (Jul 8, 2020)

About the R1: First, remember this is a unicorn at this point. No one knows when and if it will materialize. 

Everything about the R5 and the 1DxIII says to me that Canon is in no hurry to release a 1 series mirrorless. Is there even a market for one? 

Once again I link to this article: https://www.canon-europe.com/pro/stories/future-of-dslrs/

If the R5 is as good as promised, it will suffice for quite some time for those who want to shoot action with a mirrorless. I suspect Canon did not hold back on the R5 but instead pushed it to the limits of currently available mirrorless technology. We will have to wait until it is released and we start seeing reviews, but if it comes close to what has been promised, it could leave very little for an R1 to offer. 

Expect the 5DV in 2021 and the R1 in 2022. Canon could put the 1Dx on a four-year summer Olympics cycle and the R1 on a four-year winter Olympics cycle.


----------



## PureClassA (Jul 8, 2020)

DBounce said:


> What “rumored” video specs? I think Canon has listed the video specs on their website. The only rumors were speculation around overheating and time limits.


I'm aware of the R5 specs Canon posted but not any official post of the R6.


----------



## padam (Jul 8, 2020)

wockawocka said:


> So that's £2200 for the R5 on grey import and £1499 for the R6.
> 
> (Probably)


lol no way, the 1DX III is £5099 over £6499, so expect a 20% decrease in price, e.g. £3299 for the R5 and £1999 for the R6, although they will probably milk early buyers somewhat and go over that (especially in the case of the R6, which will probably be in higher demand)
Maybe better deals will be available at year's end.


----------



## Baron_Karza (Jul 8, 2020)

bergstrom said:


> can't wait to get the R6 in 2023!



By then, you'll be thinking "can't wait to get the R6II in 2026"


----------



## londonxt (Jul 8, 2020)

My only hope now lies in the UK Chancellor... 
his Post Covid VAT reduction of 75% in the hospitality sector plus half-price restaurant voucher schemes extended to Japanese cameras... maybe
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-53268594


----------



## David_E (Jul 8, 2020)

goldenhusky said:


> I think the R5 is going to be a $4k + tax body in the US. I will have to wait for some deals to show up. I was thinking $3800 + tax max.


The headline for this article reads:

_Canon EOS R5 body £4199_
That converts to $5293. *If* that number is accurate, you’ll wait a long time for $3800!


----------



## WelshTony (Jul 8, 2020)

Does that price include the ef-eos r lens adapter, or will that be extra? There is also the cost of the CFExpress cards to add on top!!


----------



## HenAyr (Jul 8, 2020)

David_E said:


> The headline for this article reads:
> 
> _Canon EOS R5 body £4199_
> That converts to $5293. *If* that number is accurate, you’ll wait a long time for $3800!


You forget the £4199 includes UK VAT @ 20%


----------



## Graphic.Artifacts (Jul 8, 2020)

David_E said:


> The headline for this article reads:
> 
> _Canon EOS R5 body £4199_
> That converts to $5293. *If* that number is accurate, you’ll wait a long time for $3800!


Not sure you understand the finer points of international pricing. We can all convert pounds to dollars. That’s not the relevant issue.


----------



## privatebydesign (Jul 8, 2020)

David_E said:


> The headline for this article reads:
> 
> _Canon EOS R5 body £4199_
> That converts to $5293. *If* that number is accurate, you’ll wait a long time for $3800!


And if you take the 25% tax and duty included in the UK price and not in the USA price you get £3,359, or $4,142. You see it all works out. And don't forget there has already been a comment from Canon that it is sub $4,000.


----------



## tomri (Jul 8, 2020)

RBSfphoto said:


> I love the SL2 for a lot of reasons and I have both M and Q cameras but the focus on the SL2 lags behind the even my current R by a lot. And in the US a SL2 with a wide to medium zoom and a medium to longish lens plus extra batteries is going to run almost 20K. Unless you are being sarcastic


Was only thinking how much fun I could have for 5k and up. Don‘t really need any of the features, but an M10 would be a lot of fun....especially for its lack of features ;-)


----------



## Viggo (Jul 8, 2020)

I just did some “to over here” calculation, and in Norway with the currency really plummeting it’s going to be the same as the 1dx at release. Or to put in a horrifying conversion for you US citizens. Because of the exchange rate the R5 is going to be $1900 more than it would’ve been in 2015. Just because of the currency. The difference in dollar for the 1dx and 1dx3 was zero dollars, for us, buying a 1dx3 now we’ll pay $3200 MORE at the same us price for both, for a total of $8780 for a new 1dx3. It’s insane.

So where I could afford a 1-series earlier, I can now barley afford a 5-series.


----------



## wockawocka (Jul 8, 2020)

padam said:


> lol no way, the 1DX III is £5099 over £6499, so expect a 20% decrease in price, e.g. £3299 for the R5 and £1999 for the R6, although they will probably milk early buyers somewhat and go over that (especially in the case of the R6, which will probably be in higher demand)
> Maybe better deals will be available at year's end.



The 5D4 on launch was around £3399 but E-infin were selling it at £2600 off the bat (Edit - about 6 weeks after launch).

Also the current RRP of the EOS R through WEX is £1999 with E-infin charging it out at £1350.

Sure, £2200 may be a little low but I think your 20% guesstimate is considerably reserved.


----------



## The Fat Fish (Jul 8, 2020)

£2499 is a lot for a 20mp camera. If it was 26-32mp, that would be great.


----------



## koch1948 (Jul 8, 2020)

unfocused said:


> About the R1: First, remember this is a unicorn at this point. No one knows when and if it will materialize.
> 
> Everything about the R5 and the 1DxIII says to me that Canon is in no hurry to release a 1 series mirrorless. Is there even a market for one?
> 
> ...


The expected shipping date of 2022 for delivery of the EOS R1 is a good guess. However, I would think the EOS 5D Mark IV and the EOS-1D X Mark III are the final native camera bodies for EF lenses.


----------



## tomri (Jul 8, 2020)

Graphic.Artifacts said:


> Good plan! When you are comcerned about getting value for your €£¥$ the first name that comes to mind is always Leica!


Just noticed that Japanese camera makers are catching up with the traditionally insane prices of our German manufacturers... ;-) Apples to pears, of course, but similar level of fun for hobbyists.


----------



## Max TT (Jul 8, 2020)

We are enthusiastic about these new offerings from Canon, but generally I don't know much people with equivalent bodies like the EOS R or 5D mk III or 5D mk IV who are eager to switch in this economic environment.

Alot of working photographers have been on the sideline for months during covid 19. Event photography has basically crashed completely where I am from. AD work and commercial work, several jobs cancelled.

I think those who have equipment thats doing the job already are going to be slow to convert or upgrade. And those who shoot other brands like Sony / Nikon who don't have a Canon eco syetem of EF lenses to soften the blow definitely won't anytime soon.

I don't think the demand will be robust! Not as we would have expected Pre covid 19. 

The only reason I have intention to purchase is because my current camera body is over 10 years old. I have been saving since November of 2019 to finally upgrade and even I may wait a couple months for Thanksgiving to see if the prices come down a bit, because right now work isn't exactly overwhelming anyone.


----------



## BakaBokeh (Jul 8, 2020)

Jstnelson said:


> Anyone know if new Canon cameras are typically available for preorder on Amazon? I know the R5 will be on Adorama and BHphoto but, now that they all charge taxes, I'd like to take advantage of 5% cashback on my Amazon Prime card



I don't know if it's same day, but I think they do. The last thing I pre-ordered on Amazon was the RF 70-200. Not sure about the bodies. Regardless, I'll be doing the same. That 5% cashback will wipe out sales tax and some change for me. So if the camera is $4K, that's $200 dollars back.


----------



## padam (Jul 8, 2020)

wockawocka said:


> The 5D4 on launch was around £3399 but E-infin were selling it at £2400 off the bat. I should know, I was there.
> 
> Also the current RRP of the EOS R through WEX is £1999 with E-infin charging it out at £1350.
> 
> Sure, £2200 may be a little low but I think your 20% guesstimate is considerably reserved.


That was 2016, very different circumstances.
The shipping cost is much higher now, the currency is much weaker, and also the cameras are better specced from the start.
In the present situation, it should be compared with a 2020 camera (like the 1DX III), or you can look at the A9II as well for a fairly recent example, the current saving is also 22% on that one.
The R5 and R6 are probably going to be much more popular than the 5D IV (6D II), which mainly appealed towards 5D III (6D) users who would still upgrade to a DSLR body.
So I don't expect them to price it low at all, they don't need to.
If the cameras are good, they are just going to sell all the stock they import and people need to wait for the next one (usually they are not honest about stock and allow orders to go to negative balance in case someone does a return within 14 days, they will send that one to a new buyer...yes your grey market camera might not be completely new as the boxes are not sealed).


----------



## Graphic.Artifacts (Jul 8, 2020)

tomri said:


> Just noticed that Japanese camera makers are catching up with the traditionally insane prices of our German manufacturers... ;-) Apples to pears, of course, but similar level of fun for hobbyists.


Sorry but I couldn't resist.  I agree that all Camera prices are probably outrunning demand. It will be interesting to see how many $4000 R5’s Canon can actually sell.


----------



## bbasiaga (Jul 8, 2020)

David_E said:


> No way will Adorama or B&H add a premium to the MSRP. They have too much invested in customer satisfaction.


But you'll see people pre order a bunch, then sell on Ebay at a premium as stocks run out. It's happened before. 

Don't give in to them folks! The reason you need to use them in the first place is they bought what they won't use so they could get extra money out of you. 



-Brian


----------



## Tangent (Jul 8, 2020)

6 pages of wrangling about how the prices will shake out, and here I am still wondering if that foot on the 800 f11 is designed to work as an arca plate...


----------



## privatebydesign (Jul 8, 2020)

Tangent said:


> 6 pages of wrangling about how the prices will shake out, and here I am still wondering if that foot on the 800 f11 is designed to work as an arca plate...


No it won't. To me it looks like the socket on the bottom of the genuine Canon EF/EF-m adapter and the 100-400 MkII, it takes a screw in foot with anti rotation locking detents.


----------



## AlanF (Jul 8, 2020)

drama said:


> Or you could just buy one now, and one later? I don't suppose the lenses are going anywhere, and EF/RF converter rings exist.


If I bought the 100-500mm, I wouldn't have an R body to put it on.
And I wouldn't want the R5 just to use with my EF-100-400mm II and an adaptor as I can use that lens well enough with my 5DSR or 5DIV. And I didn't write I couldn't afford both, I wrote I couldn't justify the purchase.


----------



## tomri (Jul 8, 2020)

Graphic.Artifacts said:


> Sorry but I couldn't resist.  I agree that all Camera prices are probably outrunning demand. It will be interesting to see how many $4000 R5’s Canon can actually sell.


Let‘s wait 24hrs until we know the German price. It will likely be closer to the equiv. of USD5k including tax. ;-)


----------



## herein2020 (Jul 8, 2020)

I did some quick comparison of the 1DX III UK pricing to the 1DX III US pricing to try to figure out what the current correlation is: 
£6,499
$6,499

So at least for the moment it does seem like an exact 1:1 price correlation. Which would put the EOS R6 at $2499 USD and the EOS R5 at $4199 USD. Of course Canon has promised that the R5 will be below $4000 USD so I think they may drop it for the US to $3999 USD or they may just say they misspoke and indeed sell the first few for $4199 USD.

BTW these were the exact prices that I estimated they would be back when everyone was saying the R6 was a 6D replacement and that the R5 couldn't possibly be priced over $3500.00


----------



## mpmark (Jul 8, 2020)

So here are the launch prices for the 5DIV
UK $3599 - US $3499

and Now if its $4129 in UK, it surely will be $3999 USD, $500 more then the 5Div launch price,

This does make sense cause its really quite a step up on a 5D line where the upgrades are quite substancial from the previous model releases.

Expect $3999 USD and possibly $4499 Canadian
How many people still want Canon to take their money?


----------



## drama (Jul 8, 2020)

Me. But I also want to watch their livestream of image porn to really sell it to me.


----------



## RBSfphoto (Jul 8, 2020)

tomri said:


> Was only thinking how much fun I could have for 5k and up. Don‘t really need any of the features, but an M10 would be a lot of fun....especially for its lack of features ;-)


buy a used Q I have to be honest, I have a lot of cameras ( I do this for a living) several fujis, 3 full canon kits , a phase 1 back and my favorite camera to shoot is the least practical for most things and that is the Q but the shooting experience is just so simple nothing to get in the way of thinking about the picture. Buy one and you won't regret it. that said for work I mostly use the canons


----------



## Graphic.Artifacts (Jul 8, 2020)

McKinnon will be rolling low and slow with some 4K120p.


----------



## Jonathan Thill (Jul 8, 2020)

mpmark said:


> So here are the launch prices for the 5DIV
> UK $3599 - US $3499
> 
> and Now if its $4129 in UK, it surely will be $3999 USD, $500 more then the 5Div launch price,
> ...



If it does work out to be $4499CDN I will be happy as that is cheaper than the $5500 after taxes I have budgeted.


----------



## TomR (Jul 8, 2020)

Ramage said:


> If it does work out to be $4499CDN I will be happy as that is cheaper than the $5500 after taxes I have budgeted.



That must be a typo, I think he means 5499 Canadian which is about 4000usd after conversion


----------



## Mike the cat (Jul 8, 2020)

The real decider here for me is going to be the AF tracking performance.

I love my EOS R and the AF is great, but I found it really lacking with action/moving subjects such as BiF and even running dogs. 

The Sony A7RIV has been tempting as I know it has everything I want, but I just like my R too damn much and I'm invested in Canon glass. I have high hopes and I eagerly await the YouTube reviews that hopefully roll out after the announcement.


----------



## kvaugh (Jul 8, 2020)

One of Ireland's main camera dealers (Bermingham cameras) has it advertised this evening at €4849.00 (vat inclusive). That would equal €3943 less VAT and I don't think there is a duty on cameras. Converting to dollars that would equal $4467 USD! That don't tally with the leak of less than $4000.


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

Let there be dollars:
​_North American prices__ for new Canon products will be $3899 for the R5 body, $2499 for the R6 body, $699 for the RF600mm, $899 for the RF800mm, $599 for the RF85mm macro and $2699 for the RF100-500mm. _​
- A


----------



## Bert63 (Jul 8, 2020)

Here's a picture of me taken with my EOS-R putting my wallet back on the shelf waiting for the price cuts down the road.

Maybe the 100-500 after the reviews are in.

The prices on the f/11 600 / 800mm lead me to believe they are a entry-level novelty and not something I'd be interested in. If it isn't at least as good as the 100-400L II with the 1.4 then count me out.


----------



## mpmark (Jul 8, 2020)

Ramage said:


> If it does work out to be $4499CDN I will be happy as that is cheaper than the $5500 after taxes I have budgeted.



Yeah, I care for the CAD price as well, its expensive but worth it I believe. I'm skeptical to to spend that much though without hearing the reviews on DR, ISO and image quality so hoping the reviews follow real soon.


----------



## brad-man (Jul 8, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> Let there be dollars:
> ​_North American prices__ for new Canon products will be $3899 for the R5 body, $2499 for the R6 body, $699 for the RF600mm, $899 for the RF800mm, $599 for the RF85mm macro and $2699 for the RF100-500mm. _​
> - A


What do I win?

R5 Price Guess

The forum is messed up. IIRC, this reply _was_ in a thread started by Sanj about the R5 price.
Edit: Found the original: 
R5 Price Guess


----------



## herein2020 (Jul 8, 2020)

RBSfphoto said:


> buy a used Q I have to be honest, I have a lot of cameras ( I do this for a living) several fujis, 3 full canon kits , a phase 1 back and my favorite camera to shoot is the least practical for most things and that is the Q but the shooting experience is just so simple nothing to get in the way of thinking about the picture. Buy one and you won't regret it. that said for work I mostly use the canons



I have never understood owning a lot of bodies, they get outdated too fast. I own very specific bodies for specific uses with little overlap. When I need more I just rent them and add the rental fee to the clients invoice. 

If I get the R6 it will be to replace the GH5, and I will get rid of the GH5. The only way I will get the R5 is if I somehow get sold on using an OVF for photography at which point it will replace my 5D4.


----------



## unfocused (Jul 8, 2020)

koch1948 said:


> ...However, I would think the EOS 5D Mark IV and the EOS-1D X Mark III are the final native camera bodies for EF lenses.


A much discussed topic and it could be years before there is a definitive answer. There are many photographers who prefer the DLSR format. Some because it is superior for certain applications like birds and sports. Others simply because they like it better. I don't see Canon walking away from half the market. I think they will continue to make new models so long as there is a demand for them and I don't see that demand disappearing anytime soon. Only time will tell, but my money is on a long and productive life for both DSLRs and Mirrorless.


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

brad-man said:


> What do I win?
> 
> R5 Price Guess




You get a Like, but it's a *strong *Like.

- A


----------



## ahsanford (Jul 8, 2020)

unfocused said:


> A much discussed topic and it could be years before there is a definitive answer. There are many photographers who prefer the DLSR format. Some because it is superior for certain applications like birds and sports. Others simply because they like it better. I don't see Canon walking away from half the market. I think they will continue to make new models so long as there is a demand for them and I don't see that demand disappearing anytime soon. Only time will tell, but my money is on a long and productive life for both DSLRs and Mirrorless.




100% there will be a 5D5 and 1DX4 (maybe not those exact names, but pro / tough SLRs), but after that we'll see.

1-series will give up the mirror last, that's for sure.

- A


----------



## herein2020 (Jul 8, 2020)

brad-man said:


> What do I win?
> 
> R5 Price Guess
> 
> ...





You might have to share that award.


----------



## unfocused (Jul 8, 2020)

brad-man said:


> What do I win?
> 
> R5 Price Guess
> 
> ...


You win the chance to pre-order the R5.


----------



## brad-man (Jul 8, 2020)

unfocused said:


> You win the chance to pre-order the R5.


Actually, I don't really need an R5. I think I'm going to wait for the hi rez R. I don't need that either, but damn I really want one...


----------



## RBSfphoto (Jul 9, 2020)

herein2020 said:


> I have never understood owning a lot of bodies, they get outdated too fast. I own very specific bodies for specific uses with little overlap. When I need more I just rent them and add the rental fee to the clients invoice.
> 
> If I get the R6 it will be to replace the GH5, and I will get rid of the GH5. The only way I will get the R5 is if I somehow get sold on using an OVF for photography at which point it will replace my 5D4.


In the past I would have agreed with you regarding owning a lot of bodies , for me it came about by accident. My rule of thumb is that equipment needed to pay for itself within one year or I rented. I have owned the phase 180 for a few years I used to do a lot of studio catalog and that was the workhorse. With a 5ds and a mkIV for the rest of the studio stuff bought the EOSR cause my MarkIV was stolen. I bought a fuji xt-2 for travel for something small and light ,then I got a huge job that required 3 4k cameras and it was cheaper to buy an xt-3 then to rent. The leica q was just a want not a need. The m10 is another story but it was gifted to me, and then before you know it I have a closet full of cameras


----------



## slclick (Jul 9, 2020)

unfocused said:


> You win the chance to pre-order the R5.


You win the right to put 'WINNER' in the left hand profile pane next to your avatar. Enjoy!


----------



## kimster (Jul 9, 2020)

How does pre-ordering work please? Will Adorama, B&H et al launch pre-orders after the Canon presentation? I am on the west coast USA.


----------



## Treyarnon (Jul 9, 2020)

Sorry, the R5 looks nice and all, but £4200 is FAR to much. Canon, you have lost the plot.

Canon PLEASE. Take the R5 -> hit it with the cripple hammer a few times. We don't all need 8k, or 20 fps -> and get the camera around £1000 cheaper. 
Just give us an '5D' level mirrorless camera.

I don't particularly want a Sony - but the A7R3 (essentially an R5 with poor ergonomics) is £2500, and the A74 is £3200. £4200 is just a joke.


----------



## Lance vdv (Jul 9, 2020)

Sooooo what was the surprise?


----------



## cayenne (Jul 9, 2020)

Max C said:


> The thing is with Atmos Ninja, you need to account for all the other accessories that are needed for it to work as you intend.



Yeah, looking over it, I'd need batteries a charger and the SSD.

I'm trying to figure out whether the Angelbird thing is worth it, or just put up with a little more bulk and do the regular SSD thing.

Hey, what is the little thing called to mount the Ninja to your hotshot....? What's the name of such an adapter I see on all the videos?

TIA,

cayenne


----------



## AlanF (Jul 9, 2020)

Have you seen the prices for the TCs: RF 2xTC = £699; 1.4xTC = £559. That's a lot of money for a simple lens of 7 elements in 4 groups or 9 in 5 with no IS or focussing adding to the cost. Compare those with just £749 for the RF 600mm f/11.


----------



## Michael Clark (Jul 9, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> R1 can't be that far off now, can it? A year or two ago, the only wildcards were how well/responsive the DPAF / EVF would be and how much data they could push, and both have been soundly spoken to between the liveview of the 1DX3 and these R5 specs. A truly top-drawer EVF performer hasn't surfaced yet, in fairness, but surely they've been working on that.
> 
> One would think all Canon has to do now is make a hard call on [high-res + 8K like the R5] or [low-res + ~6K like the 1DX3] and park it in a 1-series body. It's go time.
> 
> - A



A lot might depend on how long the production lines need to run at full capacity to keep up with demand for the R5. Or what quantities of common parts can be supplied by vendors at what rate per week/month.


----------



## Michael Clark (Jul 9, 2020)

PureClassA said:


> Yeah but remember, Canon unleashes those beasts in time with the Olympics. Which are in Japan this time... and got pushed to 2021. And they just dropped the DX3 within the last 6 months. So I'm betting R1X announcement early next year with delivery around may/june 2021 just before the games start.



That may be their planning strategy, but I'd be very surprised if the Olympiad is held in 2021. SARS-CoV-2 isn't going away any time soon. The various national federations for different sports will need several months prior to the games themselves for preliminary qualifying events.


----------



## Michael Clark (Jul 9, 2020)

privatebydesign said:


> There is also duty, cameras incur zero duty into the USA whereas the UK levies around 5% on cameras. So the UK price has an included 25% tax & duty levy on it over and above the USA prices.



Increased warranty support due to consumer protection laws there also add to the price.


----------



## Michael Clark (Jul 9, 2020)

David_E said:


> No way will Adorama or B&H add a premium to the MSRP. They have too much invested in customer satisfaction.



Adorama and B&H won't get enough initial units to meet anywhere near total demand in the U.S. They'll both constantly be on backorder for months. Other smaller retailers will have bodies available - for a premium.


----------



## Michael Clark (Jul 9, 2020)

londonxt said:


> Not so sure, surely its all about the increase compared to the model before? The 5D has been taking inflation-busting leaps in the entry price each time, UK inc VAT:
> 
> 5D Mk II £2300
> 5D Mk III £3000
> ...



Over there they have. Over here (in the U.S.) the 5D Mark III debutted for $3,499 in 2012 and the 5D Mark IV debutted for $3,499 in 2016.


----------



## Michael Clark (Jul 9, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> It was a different trend in the US:
> 
> 5D2 $2699
> 5D3 $3499
> ...



The initial price in the U.S. for the 5D Mark IV was $3,499 USD. It stayed there for about 8 months, other than a short one week period in early Spring of 2017 when there was a $200 factory rebate. Smaller retailers were getting as much as $3,999 for them in the initial supply crunch.

The MSRP stayed at $3,499 until October of 2018, though there were factory rebates of between $200 and $400 in effect for most of the period between May 2017 and October 2018.


----------



## Michael Clark (Jul 9, 2020)

Max C said:


> We are enthusiastic about these new offerings from Canon, but generally I don't know much people with equivalent bodies like the EOS R or 5D mk III or 5D mk IV who are eager to switch in this economic environment.
> 
> Alot of working photographers have been on the sideline for months during covid 19. Event photography has basically crashed completely where I am from. AD work and commercial work, several jobs cancelled.
> 
> ...



The full time working professional photographer is becoming less and less relevant to Canon's marketing strategy as the number of full-time pro photographers, particularly staff photojournalists who were once the largest category by a fairly large margin, continues to plummet. Freelancers making pennies on the dollar compared to what they did as staff pjs can't afford to upgrade until their current gear breaks beyond repair.

The upper end camera and lens market is more and more being driven by well-heeled amateurs and enthusiasts, as well as "weekend warriors" shooting weddings, events, and even high level pro sports (what little has returned from the COVID shutdown).


----------



## Michael Clark (Jul 9, 2020)

privatebydesign said:


> No it won't. To me it looks like the socket on the bottom of the genuine Canon EF/EF-m adapter and the 100-400 MkII, it takes a screw in foot with anti rotation locking detents.
> 
> View attachment 191189



That design does allow for third parties to fairly easily make an Arca-Swiss foot for the lenses that use it. RRS will make a mint on such a foot.


----------



## Max TT (Jul 9, 2020)

Michael Clark said:


> The full time working professional photographer is becoming less and less relevant to Canon's marketing strategy as the number of full-time pro photographers, particularly staff photojournalists who were once the largest category by a fairly large margin, continues to plummet. Freelancers making pennies on the dollar compared to what they did as staff pjs can't afford to upgrade until their current gear breaks beyond repair.
> 
> The upper end camera and lens market is more and more being driven by well-heeled amateurs and enthusiasts, as well as "weekend warriors" shooting weddings, events, and even high level pro sports (what little has returned from the COVID shutdown).


It will be interesting to see how their sales are impacted in the immediate future. The demographic of the buyer is changing as you said, but I dont think these things are going to be flying off the shelves. Everyone has been impacted by the pandemic. Some will still be in a position to purchase, but some who would have jumped at this pre pandemic may hold back. I do think these new products will ultimately be a huge success. But it may get off to a rocky start in terms of overall sales, through no fault of its own.


----------



## AlanF (Jul 9, 2020)

Max C said:


> It will be interesting to see how their sales are impacted in the immediate future. The demographic of the buyer is changing as you said, but I dont think these things are going to be flying off the shelves. Everyone has been impacted by the pandemic. Some will still be in a position to purchase, but some who would have jumped at this pre pandemic may hold back. I do think these new products will ultimately be a huge success. But it may get off to a rocky start in terms of overall sales, through no fault of its own.


Used gear is flying off the shelves of the UK retailers, which might be an indication that people are counting their pennies.


----------



## Michael Clark (Jul 9, 2020)

ahsanford said:


> Let there be dollars:
> ​_North American prices__ for new Canon products will be $3899 for the R5 body, $2499 for the R6 body, $699 for the RF600mm, $899 for the RF800mm, $599 for the RF85mm macro and $2699 for the RF100-500mm. _​
> - A



Both bodies came in at $100 more than my prediction since early Spring that they would be introduced at $3,799 and $2,399.

The 85mm Macro is about what I expected, both pricewise and with 1:2 reproduction ratio, which leaves room for a much higher end 100mm or so 1:1 lens.

The 100-500mm is also about what I expected.

The real shockers for me are the LOW prices for the 600/800 f/11 lenses and that they will be officially compatible with the new RF extenders. I expected the collapsable barrels for storage, but I also expected them to go for about twice what they are going to cost (699/899 USD instead of 1499/1799 USD).


----------



## privatebydesign (Jul 9, 2020)

Michael Clark said:


> That design does allow for third parties to fairly easily make an Arca-Swiss foot for the lenses that use it. RRS will make a mint on such a foot.


Indeed, although RRS have gone off the boil a bit recently. The 1DX MkII L-bracket was a bad rehash of the 1DX version and the 1DX MkIII L-plate is simply a poor design and I did give them a heads up before they finished designing it. I’ll be getting the Kirk version when it comes time.


----------



## Michael Clark (Jul 9, 2020)

Bert63 said:


> Here's a picture of me taken with my EOS-R putting my wallet back on the shelf waiting for the price cuts down the road.
> 
> Maybe the 100-500 after the reviews are in.
> 
> The prices on the f/11 600 / 800mm lead me to believe they are a entry-level novelty and not something I'd be interested in. If it isn't at least as good as the 100-400L II with the 1.4 then count me out.



As many of us have been saying for quite a while, if you expected 600/800mm lenses with anywhere near the IQ of the 100-400mm II these lenses are not for you. These lenses have been created to pull long focal length APS-C Canon and Sony shooters, as well as 300-400mm Micro Four-Thirds shooters, into the full frame RF system at affordable prices.

An RP + 600mm f/11 combo should only cost around $1,400 USD as soon as they are available, and probably a little less after the dust has settled. That combo should perform comparably to an APS-C camera + 400/8 or Micro Four-Thirds camera + 300mm/5.6 in terms of angle of view, DoF, and image noise.


----------



## StoicalEtcher (Jul 9, 2020)

For those interested, Canon UK (maybe Europe wide too?) will be offering a 'free' EF-EosR adaptor to any CPS member who buys an R5 or R6, though details are clearly still to follow (see screen grab below):


----------



## Michael Clark (Jul 9, 2020)

herein2020 said:


> View attachment 191192
> 
> You might have to share that award.



It's like "The Price Is Right". If you go over, you don't win anything. You have to be the closest without going over to win.


----------



## Max TT (Jul 9, 2020)

Right now my country is open internally, but border is lock to F down. Thankfully our Govt did really well in moving early. But, I can't get the R6 until the border is reopened! 

It's way cheaper to fly to Miami or NYC, buy gear and return with it in luggage, than paying the ridiculous duties and vat if I have it shipped.

Until borders are open I am going to have a permanent sour look on my face lol 

Plan is 
R6
RF 24-105 L f4
RF 85 f2
+Accessories


----------

