# Canon 5D MK3 or 6D Replacements... when?



## hamada (Apr 4, 2013)

first, this is not a troll post. 

let me explain, im not rich but i spend all my spare money on photography and travel.
right now i have saved enough money to make the jump to fullframe.

but im not sure if right now is the best time.

i fear that if/when canon updates their sensor manufacturing (im sure they will soon), replacements of the current cameras will come faster then usual. 

and of course i want the best for my hard earned money.

im pretty happy with my 7D right now.
thought for landscape work there is this lust for FF. 
i would love to have a canon camera like the D800E.
something around 30-32MP from canon with great DR and clean shadows you can push without introducing so much noise.

i can not switch to nikon, i could not afford it and i did not like the nikon handling.
as i said im not rich but over they years i have collected pretty good canon equipment.
always in mind that i may switch to FF, i bought good quality lenses (only EF-S i have is the 10-22mm). 

i know nobody here knows what canons plans or is doing in the future.
but what do you think?

does this camera generation will last as long as their predecessor generations?
in case of the 5D MK2 that was 4 years. 
i would not want to wait that long.. but when a new generation is out in 12 month i *could* wait.


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## Pitbullo (Apr 4, 2013)

It is said that the Canon big MP camera is to be announced this year. I bet it is gonna be very pricy, and since you are happy with you 7D for now, I´d continue to save up money, so you´d have the cash when they release the camera.


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## hamada (Apr 4, 2013)

Pitbullo said:


> It is said that the Canon big MP camera is to be announced this year. I bet it is gonna be very pricy, and since you are happy with you 7D for now, I´d continue to save up money, so you´d have the cash when they release the camera.



nah.. i don´t think i will spend over 6000 euro on a camera.

the canon big MP camera that is rumored is out of my league.
i don´t want a brick 1 series body.  and 40+ MP is also more then i want. 
28-32 MP would be great for my needs and my epson printer.

nikons D800(E) would be fine from the price.

a 5D MK4 with a new sensor, better DR and around 30MP for 3000 euro that is my dream camera.


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## siegsAR (Apr 4, 2013)

I know you're not trolling.  It sometimes passes my mind too, what you're asking. Specially when's the 6D replacement gonna arrive. ;D

4 years maybe? Wished I knew.


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## Rienzphotoz (Apr 4, 2013)

hamada said:


> i would not want to wait that long.. but when a new generation is out in 12 month i *could* wait.


There will be no replacements for 5D MK III or the 6D "in 12 months".
By the way, 5D MK III already has an *AWESOME* sensor.


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## RLPhoto (Apr 4, 2013)

The 5D3 is not limiting me in anyway. I can print huge, it's fast, it's accurate, it's feels great to operate. It could indeed be my camera for the next 10 years if canon fixes minor issues with firmware.


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## Nishi Drew (Apr 4, 2013)

Rienzphotoz said:


> hamada said:
> 
> 
> > i would not want to wait that long.. but when a new generation is out in 12 month i *could* wait.
> ...



I would go as far to say the 5D Mark II has an awesome sensor, especially in comparison to what the 7D spits out even at ISO 400 in daylight. But in this day and age with ISO and DR and all the Mark II lags behind even the lower level competition. Of course, in comes the 5DIII, but is the sensor that better over the Mark II? Well, for ISO, and the brief upgrade in DR and bits yes, while even with the much needed AF, quick response and awesome sealing the price isn't right for what it is today. And considering video hasn't improved much, and some would say degraded with the soft image it produces (although, sharpening is possible, and no more moire at least).

So to the point that I too feel the same way, wait it out for Canon to get back on their feet with real improvements, or get what's available now and use it until that day comes. It's been a year for the MkIII, and if all goes the same then there's 3 more years, that's a whole lot of photos captured in the uber dark, and of the fast action kind. While how's it with the 6D, it's not even a semi-pro camera, and it might get the XXD treatment and have a MKII of that released winter of 2014. Although, if Canon is still Canon today then the "6DMKII" will just have the same sensor anyways


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## hamada (Apr 4, 2013)

there is no question that the 6D or 5D MK3 sensor would be more then sufficient for me. 
i mean gallery prints and landscape books are produced with worse cameras.

the problem i have is more about an "investment concern".
even when it´s good enough... i would feel bad when i see a much better FF camera (sensor) next year and i can´t afford it then (because i spend my spare money on a 6D or 5D MK3 today).
i know it sounds weird... but i bet many feel that way. 

i started with photography a few years back and i always felt the urge to go fullframe.
but i always said to myself "_wait for the next generation of sensors and buy good glass today_".
now after all this waiting i was a bit dissapointed to see that the image quality has not much increased from the 5D MK2.

i can´t shell out a few thousand dollars a year for new camera stuff, like some other people here. i spend a lot of my money for travelling.

but i sense the overall opinion is there will be no new canon FF camera (i can afford) before the end of 2014?!


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## BPLOL (Apr 4, 2013)

Take a look:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Canon_DSLR_cameras

It helps you to understand and guess the time frame.

I believe the 6DII will not see the light of day until the end of 2015. A 5DIV, I believe, end of 2014.

I mean, the next step for Canon, from what I see, is for a big FF MP camera that will cost a fortune, and APS-C models. A new, affordable FF camera, like the 6D: not so soon. The 6D doesn´t look like a yearly Rebel (I imagine that if Canon released a new 6D every year, prices would drop very, very fast).


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## pdirestajr (Apr 4, 2013)

All modern cameras are pretty amazing. If you can't get adequate results from current gear, or even an "old" 5D mkII, I think there are bigger issues that more megapixels and a little more shadow detail can cure.

People have been successfully creating photographic images for generations. There will always be advancements in technology.


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## hamada (Apr 4, 2013)

pdirestajr said:


> All modern cameras are pretty amazing. If you can't get adequate results from current gear, or even an "old" 5D mkII, I think there are bigger issues that more megapixels and a little more shadow detail can cure.
> 
> People have been successfully creating photographic images for generations. There will always be advancements in technology.



please read my postings again so you understand what they are about... this doesn´t help me a bit.

an analogy i read here on this forum:

i need a car to get to work.
i can buy a volkswagen for 19000 euro and it does the job perfectly fine.
still, who would buy a volkswagen when he can get a way better mercedes for the same money?

with all this talk about the outdated canon manufacturing and a switch to a smaller litho process soon, i just fear it´s a bad time to buy a canon FF camera right now. 

thoughts i have, maybe things will change much faster at the end of 2013 and in 2014.


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## docsmith (Apr 4, 2013)

First, the most direct answer would be that I can see two scenarios for replacements:

Scenario 1, by far the most likely: The 5DIII and 6D will be replaced on an increasely slower replacement schedule with increasingly smaller improvements as the technology is maturing. Earliest, 2015 (3 year), most likely, 2016 (4 yr), possible, 2017-2018.

Scenario 2, less likely IMO: Canon releases the advanced sensor technology with the 7D II and the large MP camera body. They feel that they can not have their flagship cameras (1Dx and 5DIII) without this technology, so they release the 1DxN and the 5DIIIN in 2014.

But addressing you situation, now is the perfect time to buy. The camera bodies have been released for a year, the prices have dropped as all the early adopters bought their cameras. I am also a hobbiest and just went from the 7D to the 5DIII in February. I was very concerned that I wouldn't be able to see much of a difference as I was very happy with the 7D. I can report that the difference is significant and very noticable. It isn't the increase you see going from a point and shoot to the 7D, but it is significant in terms of high ISO performance, better AF, increased resolution and some other minor improvements in IQ. More specifically:


ISO 100-400, in good light, the competition is close in terms of IQ. But my keeper rate, even in good light, with the 5DIII is significantly higher than with the 7D. The AF is so much better.

ISO 400-800: you start seeing improvements with the 5DIII IQ

Above ISO 800: Forget it, the 5DIII IQ is so much better. I am using it up to ISO 12,800 if you don't crop the image much. 

 Low light AF: the 5DIII is significantly better. I was recently shooting birds from forest trail. Limited light but there was still light. I alternated between my 5DIII and 7D with my 100-400L. I had 1 keeper out of 15 shoots with the 7D and ~9 keepers out of 12 shots with the 5DIII


AF General: The 5DIII is just more accurate, especially if you are trying to focus on something specific within clutter (say a bird in a bush). The 5DIII stays on the subject better where the 7D bounces from the subject to clutter so much more. 
 
Overall, IQ: Better colors, more color depth, and the noise is a much finer grain that it is easily taken care of in post. 
 
Also, it surprised me, but I need to post process my images less with the 5DIII than with the 7D. I am simply making fewer adjustments and the image is responding to those adjustments better.

In short, I recommend you make the jump.


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## hamada (Apr 4, 2013)

docsmith said:


> Scenario 1, by far the most likely: The 5DIII and 6D will be replaced on an increasely slower replacement schedule with increasingly smaller improvements as the technology is maturing. Earliest, 2015 (3 year), most likely, 2016 (4 yr), possible, 2017-2018.



if that is the case, then i would buy a canon FF camera without hesitation.


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## Dylan777 (Apr 4, 2013)

I don't know how much MP is required for landscape. The photo below was taken with 5D III and cropped nearly 80%. The IQ is still good for my ave Joe's taste  

*THIS IS ME*: I don't like waiting game...buy what you need now.


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## hamada (Apr 4, 2013)

Dylan777 said:


> I don't know how much MP is required for landscape. The photo below was taken with 5D III and cropped nearly 80%. For my ave Joe's taste, I'm still happy with the result.



the more the better.. 
i have an epson 3880 printer.

for best prints at 360 PPI and A2 size i could use 8500x5900 pixel.

i know, i know, with bigger prints you can get away with less resolution.
but why? 
photographer tend to view (inspect) prints from 15-20cm anyway, no matter how big the print is. 

for my taste around 30MP would be great. it´s still an acceptable filesize (in megabytes).


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## Krob78 (Apr 4, 2013)

hamada said:


> pdirestajr said:
> 
> 
> > All modern cameras are pretty amazing. If you can't get adequate results from current gear, or even an "old" 5D mkII, I think there are bigger issues that more megapixels and a little more shadow detail can cure.
> ...


[i can buy a volkswagen for 19000 euro and it does the job perfectly fine.
still, who would buy a volkswagen when he can get a way better mercedes for the same money?]

Where can you buy a Mercedes for the price of a Volkswagen?. Make the jump and don't look back. In a few years you can start the process all over again!


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## docsmith (Apr 4, 2013)

hamada said:


> docsmith said:
> 
> 
> > Scenario 1, by far the most likely: The 5DIII and 6D will be replaced on an increasely slower replacement schedule with increasingly smaller improvements as the technology is maturing. Earliest, 2015 (3 year), most likely, 2016 (4 yr), possible, 2017-2018.
> ...



If it helps, toward the bottom of the link is a timeline as to when Canon released DSLRs. The 5D series was already ~4 yrs between releases, which would put the 5DIV release in 2016. 

http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/rumours.html

Now, will the 7DII be released this year or the 3D, 4D, or 1DXS...maybe, who knows. I just know I can't buy cameras that aren't available and that Canon has shown that they are willing to set higher prices to get as much as they can from early adapters. So, if if the 7DII is released this year, I probably wouldn't be buying it until next year, which is why I bought the 5DIII in February.


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## hamada (Apr 4, 2013)

docsmith said:


> hamada said:
> 
> 
> > docsmith said:
> ...



yes i know that. 

but with all this talk about the smaller manufacturing process, i wonder if it will take so long this time?

and if they switch to a new process, will canon first use it for the flagship models only or use it for all cameras to write down the investment faster?

well so much uncertainty. 

i guess what i really need is encouragement that i do the right thing with my money.


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## Krob78 (Apr 4, 2013)

docsmith said:


> hamada said:
> 
> 
> > docsmith said:
> ...


Indeed, that's why I waited till end of December for mine! Seems like a common sense approach...


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## Krob78 (Apr 4, 2013)

hamada said:


> docsmith said:
> 
> 
> > hamada said:
> ...


Seems like a good choice to me. The consensus here is that the production schedule is not likely to change anytime soon... The offerings that are presently available are excellent in so many ways! If you wait, then not long after that wait, there will be a new "next best" and even greater. There are a lot of photographers still shooting with 30d, 40d, 50d's and are as happy as ever with their images and their gear. It's all about controlling the drooling beast within! That's the hard part, the want over the need... for some of us it's a never ending quest and challenge! 
All the best!


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## docsmith (Apr 4, 2013)

hamada said:


> i guess what i really need is encouragement that i do the right thing with my money.



.....all I can tell you is that there is an improvement going from the 7D to the 5DIII. As I am just a hobbiest, it has caused some heartache as to if that was the best use of my money. But there is enough of an improvement, flipping through photos my wife even commented that the 5DIII pictures looked better than those from the 7D in low light.


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## ksuweh (Apr 4, 2013)

BPLOL said:


> Take a look:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Canon_DSLR_cameras
> (I imagine that if Canon released a new 6D every year, prices would drop very, very fast).



BPLOL hit this one on the head! This is the main reason that you see such a long wait between each version of a model. It is very costly to develop new technologies & incorporate new features into a product that is up to the standards for manufacturing. Canon makes sure that it can get every penny that it can. That is why Canon does come out with new features but they put them on a new model & not a new version of an existing model. If they com out with feature "X" & you just HAVE to have it then you can get that feature ONLY if you buy camera model "F", even if you already have camera model "E". Then two years down the road when camera model "E version II" comes out with feature "X" you will buy that one also. Simply put Canon is going to sting it out so that they are more profitable, & they are masters at it! They aren't going to speed up their development process & at the same time become less profitable...... it just isn't going to happen. Buy, the 5DIII & enjoy it until there is a new model or new version or a current model that you just can't live without.


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## Krob78 (Apr 4, 2013)

docsmith said:


> hamada said:
> 
> 
> > i guess what i really need is encouragement that i do the right thing with my money.
> ...


The low light, noise issue was the only reason I purchased the 5d3. I loved everything about my 7d except the noise in the shadows and low light work at weddings etc. It's not that the images weren't usable, for 95% of them were, it's that it caused me a lot of frustration and a lot of extra time in post processing. It was aggrevating.

I still have my 7d and although it doesn't get used as much as it onced did, I still love it and still pull it out for sports days and still often like to have it with my when I'm birding... I enjoy having both. The 5d3 solved my low light wedding and portraiture issues with processing and does take some extremely nice wildlife images, the 7d still crushes it for me on sports days... the 8ps does make a difference for me in sports...


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## Skirball (Apr 4, 2013)

hamada said:


> docsmith said:
> 
> 
> > hamada said:
> ...



Who's to say? I think it's a safe bet the 5D3 won't be updated for awhile. Many on here consider the 6D to be a Rebel, so lets say they fast track it a bit and worst case scenario that they update it late 2014. Would that change your decision? Besides, if they're giving it the Rebel treatment they won't change much anyway. 1.5 - 2 years is a lot of time that you could be using your new camera. Don't get stuck in the loop of waiting for new technology, that never ends. They've released 3 new FF cameras in the last year, I don't think you'll get a bigger lull than this. If you're sticking with Canon and want a FF, I'd say now is exactly the time to buy.


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## sdsr (Apr 4, 2013)

1. No matter when you buy a camera, it's a near certainty that something even better will be released later.
2. But it seems reasonable to believe that the closer you are to the most recent FF releases, the further you are from the next one. 
3. So unless there's some reason to believe that Canon will change its schedule other than wishful thinking, now seems a good time to buy one. 
4. (And unless you need to photograph things moving about fairly rapidly, I would have thought a 6D was sufficient - the images it creates are at least as good as (some say slightly better than) the 5DIII's.) 
5. On the other hand, if you're patient you may want to wait until later in the year in case the 7DII contains miraculous advances that somehow make it more attractive than a 6D or 5DIII
6. A used/refurbished 5DII is better than what you currently have and it doesn't seem likely that their price will go down much within a year or so; so you could buy one now and, when the 7DII comes out, buy whichever of the 7DII, 6D or 5DIII seems more appealing at the time. 
7. Meanwhile, if this is an option wherever you are, you could rent a 6D and/or 5DIII, compare them to each other and what you presently have, and ponder whether they have any shortcomings that matter to you and that seem likely to be addressed by an upgrade. You could also throw in a D600 to the mix and discover whether potentially superior shadow recovery is something you would ever benefit from (you may conclude, as I did, that any differences in that regard between a 6D and D600 are trivial).


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## hamada (Apr 4, 2013)

ok... that helps me making a decision.  

one more question about the 5D MK3 and 6D.
one thing im not very happy with is the default skin colors out of my 7D.
they are to redish. 

and while im pretty good with photoshop it´s annoying that i have to adjust the skintones.
i have a 300 euro olympus M43 that delivers much better skintones out of camera.

are the skintones better with the 6D and 5D MK3?
what are your experiences?


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## docsmith (Apr 4, 2013)

Skin tones are better on the 5DIII compared to the 7D. 

EDIT---I know this is common, but I often look through flickr groups when making a decision about a lens or camera. Here is one dedicated exclusively to the 5DIII
http://www.flickr.com/groups/canoneos5dmarkiii/


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## lee (Apr 4, 2013)

I think a higher mega pixel will be coming soon however it will cost a lot of money. I am sure it will be geared towards the pro for studio work with great DR and color tones. my guess is that it will be in the 4k-8k range.


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## hsbn (Apr 4, 2013)

hamada said:


> ok... that helps me making a decision.
> 
> one more question about the 5D MK3 and 6D.
> one thing im not very happy with is the default skin colors out of my 7D.
> ...


With Photoshop/Lightroom you can change your camera profile to get the "correct" skin tone. Search Colorcheck passport or Custom DNG profile. I never have any skin tone problem with Canon. Doesn't mean to offense, but from what you are saying I think you should spend more time to learn more about photography than chasing gears. I was in the same situation at you, always hold out for the best. But now, I'm more confident with my techniques and knowledge. I can proudly say throw me any camera I can make good pictures. What's the point of printing big but crappy photo right? There is always something better. If Canon release something "better" within a year, they can release something better than better in the next year, and a year after. Do you want to wait forever? Or do you want to get out and enjoy photographing the world? Just my 2 cents.


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## hamada (Apr 4, 2013)

hsbn said:


> With Photoshop/Lightroom you can change your camera profile to get the "correct" skin tone. Search Colorcheck passport or Custom DNG profile. I never have any skin tone problem with Canon.



yeah i know. 
still i would want to have as correct colors as possible out of camera.
and it´s well known that canon has a little RED issue.
there are even jokes about the CANON RED... not for nothing. 



> Doesn't mean to offense, but from what you are saying I think you should spend more time to learn more about photography than chasing gears. I was in the same situation at you, always hold out for the best. But now, I'm more confident with my techniques and knowledge.



again, as i wrote to the other guy, you have not carefully read or understand (maybe my bad english) my postings.
i have no problems using a 5Dc or 5D MK2 .. but i would not want to *buy* one when i know i can get even better stuff soon for the same (or nearly the same) money.

that´s what my post is all about.


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## Chuck Alaimo (Apr 4, 2013)

I'd say don't wait. The 5d3 and 6d fit niches that won't go away, the niche canon will seek to fill with more MP and DR is such a different niche that I don't see them rushing to replace the current offerings. 

And seeing what they are doing, we will see a few new FF bodies, my guess is big mp in 1d style will be announced this year but not available till next year. And a smaller 5dish one will be announced and released in early 2014. Both will most likely have features studio and landscapers will lust for, and us wedding shooters will be looking out for the new thing for us in 2015 (more likely 2016). I don't work for canon so this is just guessing, but it sounds like a logical path.

So I'd say snag what you need now, if d800e is the way, sell off your canon stuff and replace it. Or, fill the FF needs with a 6d, 5d3 or 5d2.


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## Chuck Alaimo (Apr 4, 2013)

on a side note....using a new process for sensors and other improvements that may make their way into the big MP body, and how that would force canon to replace the 5d3 and 1dx sooner - just look at the 5d2 and the 7d. The 7d left a lot of 5d2 users saying WTF because of the differences in AF. Did canon leap to relase and improved 5d2? nope. They waited and released what they had planned to release on the schedule they had created. 

Also, re: big MP, I really feel that these new bodies will be very medium formatish and be built with that in mind --- Hasselbad's only go to ISO 1600 and have a burst rate of - 1 frame / 1.1 seconds. A high res sensor with great DR built for studio and landscape will probably fit this model, though be a bit less stringent in ISO and burst rate.


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## Krob78 (Apr 5, 2013)

Chuck Alaimo said:


> on a side note....using a new process for sensors and other improvements that may make their way into the big MP body, and how that would force canon to replace the 5d3 and 1dx sooner - just look at the 5d2 and the 7d. The 7d left a lot of 5d2 users saying WTF because of the differences in AF. Did canon leap to release and improved 5d2? nope. They waited and released what they had planned to release on the schedule they had created.
> Also, re: big MP, I really feel that these new bodies will be very medium formatish and be built with that in mind --- Hasselbad's only go to ISO 1600 and have a burst rate of - 1 frame / 1.1 seconds. A high res sensor with great DR built for studio and landscape will probably fit this model, though be a bit less stringent in ISO and burst rate.


Agreed Chuck, I don't think they have any intention of changing their marketing strategy or production schedules at all. I wouldn't if I was them, they have a working model in place that seems to keep them in good position with regard to market share...


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## pgsdeepak (Apr 5, 2013)

I was in a similar situation recently and made the jump from 40D to 5D Mark III. I dont have a lot of money either and I dont make money from photos. So I wanted a camera which I can use for a long time and I did not want to regret when new models come in. This was my thought process

1. Just because another superior model come in a year or two, waiting did not make sense. Wait means, I will have to miss a valuable year or two taking photos with my existing camera (which is still excellent, but not nearly as good as a 5D MIII). Then I would miss those good photos which would have been excellent if I take with a 5D MIII (or 6D in some cases)
2. 5D MIII has excellent IQ and features which is on par with or better than some of the best cameras out there for the price. So the chance of feeling bad due to a newer camera release was minor for me.
3. if a new model comes in a year or two, it will take another 8-12 months for the price to drop. if you buy it just after release, you will still keep thinking whether you spent a whole lot more than you actually should have. If you wait, then you are waiting for 2 - 2.5 years. precious time wasted
4. By the time you buy, rumors of new sensor, new features and new technology would already be in place, so the thought process and dilemma continues.
5. If I buy Nikon 800E, I will have to change all my lens, buy a better computer (to process those huge files, you will need a lot of processing power. Even 5DIII raw images drags photoshop on a 2012 Macbook pro with i5 Pentium processor). More money on hard drives, new lens, expense, expense and more expense and for some reason I dont like Nikon, (may be because I never used anything other than canon from Point and Shoot onwards.)

So forget about future releases and buy the camera you really want and start taking photos with it. If you think about new releases, the iPhone and Samsung Galaxy fans will never be able to buy a phone as they release a new model with more cool features every year!!!


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## bdunbar79 (Apr 5, 2013)

Honestly, if I didn't have a FF camera right now, and I wanted one and could afford one, I'd probably go with a 6D if I were just a general purpose photog or I shot a variety of things professionally. I think going with a better sensor over the 5D2 is smart.


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## J.R. (Apr 5, 2013)

hamada said:


> i know nobody here knows what canons plans or is doing in the future.
> but what do you think?
> 
> does this camera generation will last as long as their predecessor generations?
> ...



Not a chance in hell that anyone knows what Canon's plans are. Canon seems clueless themselves 

There is no point waiting or hoping for an update to an existing camera. The 7D users are waiting for the 7D Mark II for over the past year and a half and there is no clue when the Mark II will be released and with what specifics. 

The best camera you can shoot with is the one that is available today, not a year or so down the road. The 5D3 is an awesome camera and is _likely _to fulfill whatever your shooting requirements are. If you shoot landscapes primarily, a 6D will give you similar / slightly better IQ than a 5D3 for a lot less $$$ while sacrificing some of the features of the 5D3 (which I don't think you need shooting landscapes).


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## heavybarrel (Apr 5, 2013)

hamada said:


> hsbn said:
> 
> 
> > With Photoshop/Lightroom you can change your camera profile to get the "correct" skin tone. Search Colorcheck passport or Custom DNG profile. I never have any skin tone problem with Canon.
> ...


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## hamada (Apr 5, 2013)

heavybarrel said:


> Actually, hamada, I think that guy made a really nice point about just buying the 5DII. A used II is already quite cheap and I don't think it will go down all that much more if/when a 5D4 were announced. That way, you can enjoy the FF experience for a few more years and then SELL IT when a new one is announced and you won't lose too much money. I'm not sure why you think a used 5DII will be similar money to a new 5D4 but that is just not true.



i only wanted to make clear my post is not about image quality concerns... just "purchase value". 

i think i will go for the 6D and keep my 7D.

the other option would be to sell the 7D and go for a 5D MK3.
but i think i am more flexible when i keep the 7D.


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## J.R. (Apr 5, 2013)

hamada said:


> heavybarrel said:
> 
> 
> > Actually, hamada, I think that guy made a really nice point about just buying the 5DII. A used II is already quite cheap and I don't think it will go down all that much more if/when a 5D4 were announced. That way, you can enjoy the FF experience for a few more years and then SELL IT when a new one is announced and you won't lose too much money. I'm not sure why you think a used 5DII will be similar money to a new 5D4 but that is just not true.
> ...



Why do you want to keep the 7D? Why not to sell the 7D and get the 5D3 which is better than both the 7D and the 6D put together ... unless you absolutely need to have 2 cameras.

I hope that you are not buying into the 1.6 crop factor magnification myth as a reason for retaining the 7D.


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## J.R. (Apr 5, 2013)

Freelancer said:


> J.R. said:
> 
> 
> > Why do you want to keep the 7D? Why not to sell the 7D and get the 5D3 which is better than both the 7D and the 6D put together ... unless you absolutely need to have 2 cameras.
> ...



+1 .... It matters but ONLY if you print large. I missed the post regarding the A2 printer


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## cocopop05 (Apr 5, 2013)

All I can say is that Canon have very long lifecycles on their full frame cameras and high end cameras. And they appear to be getting longer. The 7D is almost 3.5 years old.

If you do not mind waiting another 2-3 years for the 5DMIII and 6D replacements, then wait.

Personally, that is an eternity for me and I would buy now. Actually I did, in September 2012 - 5DMIII.


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## azezal (Apr 5, 2013)

I say buy a 6d/5d2 for now and start saving for the 2015 5d mark IV


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## nicku (Apr 5, 2013)

I hope to see the 6D replacement soon.


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## tomscott (Apr 5, 2013)

I would say get the 5DMKIII I moved from the 40D & 7D, the leap is huge.

Its a shame the 5DMKIII got such a bad reception when it was announced just because of price. I was blown away with it when it was announced, I couldn't have told Canon to create a more perfect camera for me. Its basically a full frame 40D with awesome IQ and noise performance with the best AF system Canon has to offer!

Dont be scare-mongered into believing that Canon cameras cant keep up. The banding and shadow issues are a non issue for 90% of shooting and if you know how to use a camera you wont run into these problems. It is more useful when you make a mess of an image and it needs some ridiculous recovery. Low light performance and noise is very very similar in real world application, 11.7EV is nothing to be sniffed at its more than enough range, 22mp is enough to create extremely detailed prints natively at A2 with no upscaling. The amount of people printing at A2 regularly I would say is quite small outside the professional realm.

In the 4 months I have been shooting with the 5DMKIII I have never come across the issue claimed by many, possibly because I expose my pictures properly. 6400ISO is a joy to use, its like 1000ISO on the 7D, a lifesaver. I shot these at 12800ISO recently as a test and they look fantastic, no banding very little noise and with minimal processing or effort.




BMW F30 3 Series interior by tom_scott88, on Flickr




BMW F30 3 Series interior, light console by tom_scott88, on Flickr




BMW F30 3 Series interior, centre console climate control by tom_scott88, on Flickr




BMW F30 3 Series interior, multifunction steering wheel by tom_scott88, on Flickr




BMW F30 3 Series interior, iDrive screen by tom_scott88, on Flickr

This is my thread:
http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=13209.0

Couple of good articles recently on the forum that are worth looking at

http://www.arthurdomagala.com/blog/2012/04/dynamic-range-canon-dslrs-and-shadow-noise-dealing-with-it/

http://www.dxomark.com/index.php/Publications/DxOMark-Reviews/Which-lenses-should-you-choose-for-your-Canon-EOS-5D-Mark-III/Canon-EOS-5D-Mark-III-vs.-Nikon-D800-Competition-is-closer-than-expected

The 5DMKIII is IMO one of the best cameras ever made for professionals. The IQ is stunning, its incredibly sharp, fantastic features, and the addition of the EF line up, there isnt really anything else I would want in the 5DMKIII. They have sold like hotcakes and most pros I know own them or want one. I dont know anyone who has switched to Nikon because of it mostly amateurs who dont use their cameras commercially.

But the D800 is a fantastic camera and it is cheaper but the files are just ridiculously large, you would not only have to invest in a new camera and lens system you would have to invest in a high end machine to edit them! Without even thinking about storage. If landscape is your thing I would say ye go for it the D800 is made for it, but the 5DMKIII is the best all round FF camera on the market and as the thread above suggests the sharpness is very close between them and much easier to get across the board with the Canon lenses.

But the D800 is slow for most other application and the file sizes are excessive for use and would need to be downsized in most cases. Fantastic for cropping, but where is the skill theres no point in composing lol! But if the best is all that will do then its a great camera but its not without its problems too. The IQ of a camera is important but the features and use of it are of equal importance, which is where the 5D is better IMO.

The 6D I wasn't sold on, the cameras performance is fantastic on par with the 5DMKIII in some cases better but if you are using primes wide open with only one cross point right in the middle focusing and recomposing will lead to focus shift. Would have been another perfect camera for a lot of people if they had put the 7D AF in it, in fact I would have bought one to go with my 5DMKIII instead I will get a second 5D.

I think coming from the 7D you will be blown away. I was pretty disappointed with the 7D not for its features or even high ISO performance but its IQ where it counts at 100-400 where I shoot primarily. The 5D is so clean here its amazing. You can play a waiting game for as long as you want but I don't see another 5D for 18-24 months. If you are really worried about DR then just bracket, then you will realise you don't need to.

Hope this helps


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## gjeb (Apr 5, 2013)

I registered just so i can reply to this topic. Hah!!! http://canonrumors.com/forum/Smileys/default/grin.gif

I too am using a 7d and heavily invested in L glass. Earlier this year, I bought a Nikon D600 but returned it - dust and oil after just 300 shots. The IQ and DR is definitely their but their manufacturing QA is definitely not. 

My gut feeling is that Canon will need to move faster to answer Nikon's IQ and DR advancement in order to not lose out on new users and system switchers. How much faster, I do not know, but they will need to do something sooner than later.

So right now, I am just waiting and saving. Just my gut feeling (nothing else) Canon will surprise us soon!!!


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## M.ST (Apr 5, 2013)

There will be no 5D Mark III or 6D replacement in the nex two years.

But there will be a FF over the 5D Mark III.


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## smithy (Apr 5, 2013)

Save yourself some pain and buy a 5D3 now. Otherwise you'll chew your fingernails off every time Canon makes an announcement for the next 2-3 years.


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## hamada (Apr 5, 2013)

ok ok im sold!! 

i think i will buy the 6D next week.

im not so much into sports photography.
90% i do is landscape, macro and portraits.

i looked at the 5D MK3 AF system (camera manual) and i have to say i would not use it to it ´s full potential anyway. it´s to complicated for what i need... or lets say it has to many options to fiddel around with i would never us.

with the 7D i used the center AF point most of the time.
except when i shoot portraits with my 100mm f2.0 and 50mm f1.4.

i think the 6D with the 7D AF would be perfect for me.
or when all 11 AF points would be cross focus points.
but i think i can live with the 6D AF system.

i would love to shot birds but my longest lens is a 70-200mm.
makes no real fun with such a short lens i noticed.
don´t know if it makes sense to buy a 5D MK3 yet just for the possibility that i will buy a 400mm lens some day.  

the 5D MK3 is 1000 euro more and i need to buy a standard zoom too.
so for a kit that means 2500 vs 3500 euro....3500 euro is too much money for me.

thanks for all your advices!


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## tomscott (Apr 5, 2013)

The 7D is as good if not better for sports and birding for larger prints with the crop factor and pixel density apart from high ISO which you may need (400mm F5.6 or 100-400mm F4.5-5.6 are the easiest way to get into the long end but are fairly slow lenses ISO is a god send) to get the same field of view you need to crop and as previously said the density is more useful for large prints. If you buy the 6D and keep the 7D you will be pretty much set for a good compromise.

Its a good combo, and gives you a second camera as a backup. Thing is the 5DMKIII is a joy to use and is best of both worlds. I would take the 5DMKIII but it is slightly more expensive but really is very underrated cant say that enough.


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## dickgrafixstop (Apr 18, 2013)

No digital camera is an investment. They are all rapidly depreciating expenses. Determine if you really can't do
what you like with your current gear and if the answer is "no", then go buy something that will. Whatever you choose, there will be a better choice in six months.


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## Malte_P (Apr 18, 2013)

dickgrafixstop said:


> No digital camera is an investment. They are all rapidly depreciating expenses. Determine if you really can't do
> what you like with your current gear and if the answer is "no", then go buy something that will. Whatever you choose, there will be a better choice in six months.



he does not see that camera as investment... not as an investment that grows.
but he wants to spend/invest his money for the right stuff.

as most people do who work for their money. 


so it´s absolutely fine to aks if there will be a better option in the "near" future.


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