# A bit more about the Canon EOS-1D X Mark III [CR2]



## Canon Rumors Guy (Oct 22, 2019)

> *Update 2:* Canon has officially announced the development of the Canon EOS-1D X Mark III. Some original rumors about the camera look to be incorrect. There will not be a new battery and the top-down LCD looks to be the same. What is interesting is the new AF-ON/Smart Controller button, we have seen it in a photo we’re unable to publish and the button area is a lot bigger than on previous cameras. The AF-ON/Smart Controller button is there in horizontal and vertical orientation.
> *Update:* Almost immediately after we posted this report, we were told by an anonymous source that Canon will address the EOS-1D X Mark III very soon. Is there a development announcement coming? We have *not confirmed* this with any known sources yet.
> A few weeks ago we reported the first rumored...




[url=https://www.canonrumors.com/a-bit-more-about-the-canon-eos-1d-x-mark-iii-cr2/]Continue reading...


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## amorse (Oct 22, 2019)

The battery will have a new feature or the 1DxIII will have a new feature?


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## Viggo (Oct 22, 2019)

Still 61-point? Hmm... I’m way too spoiled with R to be excited about that.


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## peters (Oct 22, 2019)

Sounds realistical to me


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## slclick (Oct 22, 2019)

Battery feature... going out on a limb here but maybe a charge indicator?


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## knight427 (Oct 22, 2019)

The battery will have a “feature” of an ID chip, which allows the camera to identify it. This very awesome consumer-friendly feature will unfortunately have the side effect of preventing third party batteries from being used in the camera. But don’t worry, the money you don’t save from buying third party batteries will allow Canon to charge even higher premiums on their batteries. It is win-win really, if you think about it, and you are Canon.

(this is pure speculation)


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## unfocused (Oct 22, 2019)

knight427 said:


> The battery will have a “feature” of an ID chip, which allows the camera to identify it. This very awesome consumer-friendly feature will unfortunately have the side effect of preventing third party batteries from being used in the camera. But don’t worry, the money you don’t save from buying third party batteries will allow Canon to charge even higher premiums on their batteries. It is win-win really, if you think about it, and you are Canon.
> 
> (this is pure speculation)


Can't understand someone paying $6,000 for a camera and then trying to save a few bucks using an inferior third-party battery.

I just hope it has the same interchangeability as the LP-E6N. (Battery compatible with previous 1Dx series and camera can use older model batteries as well)


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## navastronia (Oct 22, 2019)

Sounds about right. This camera isn't going to blow anyone away, IMO.


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## edoorn (Oct 22, 2019)

Viggo said:


> Still 61-point? Hmm... I’m way too spoiled with R to be excited about that.


This exactly. I’m sure it’s going to be a very good camera for a specific target audience (for example the news agencies, sports photographers, etc), but we’re reaching the limits of what can be done with dslr’s. Mirrorless has a lot more upward potential.


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## peters (Oct 22, 2019)

unfocused said:


> Can't understand someone paying $6,000 for a camera and then trying to save a few bucks using an inferior third-party battery.
> 
> I just hope it has the same interchangeability as the LP-E6N. (Battery compatible with previous 1Dx series and camera can use older model batteries as well)


I have 2 original batteries for an insane 150€ markup each. And one third party 40€ battery.
One of the batteries has some problems where it causes camera shut downs and even jumps from 40% to zero. Fun fact... it is NOT the cheap battery...
Also, the battery life while shooting is in my experience similar and sometimes even worse than on my 5D IV (I use both together for wedding photography). 
Overall I must say I am very disapointed in the battery and reliabiliy of my 1D. The 5D feels somehow better field tested (not surprising, giving its selling numbers). Also, I never had any problem with any third party battery on my 5D.


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## Cochese (Oct 22, 2019)

To be fair, at the battery gag, if you cannot afford the price of an extra battery, you probably cannot afford the camera.


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## BeenThere (Oct 22, 2019)

amorse said:


> The battery will have a new feature or the 1DxIII will have a new feature?


New feature : It will last a long time.


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## amorse (Oct 22, 2019)

unfocused said:


> Can't understand someone paying $6,000 for a camera and then trying to save a few bucks using an inferior third-party battery.
> 
> I just hope it has the same interchangeability as the LP-E6N. (Battery compatible with previous 1Dx series and camera can use older model batteries as well)


I'm with you here. I had purchased some LP-E6's off brand a while ago and they were hot garbage. Held a charge for less than half the time of the Canon-manufactured battery which was years older. From then on it has been nothing Canon batteries, and no issues at all.


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## Xavitxaung (Oct 22, 2019)

The "new feature" is, different colors (red, yellow, green, fucsia...)... 

It could be nice to get a LP-E6N adapter.


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## sanj (Oct 22, 2019)

Some productions require 10+ batteries for a 3 camera set up. Just saying


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## knight427 (Oct 22, 2019)

unfocused said:


> Can't understand someone paying $6,000 for a camera and then trying to save a few bucks using an inferior third-party battery.



Let me help.

1) Less money is less money than more money, which leaves you with more money to spend on things that leave with you with less money.
2) Not everyone has had bad luck with third party batteries.


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## magarity (Oct 22, 2019)

It's interesting that opinions on third party batteries tend to be either 1) I bought one that had an issue, therefore all of them are bad and 2) I bought one and it works well, therefore all of them are OK.
I wish some "real" brand name would make third party camera batteries, like Everready or similar, instead of mystery Chinese brands.


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## Sharlin (Oct 22, 2019)

Viggo said:


> Still 61-point? Hmm... I’m way too spoiled with R to be excited about that.



Not likely that they’re going to spend R&D resources on a completely new PDAF sensor implementation at this point.


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## knight427 (Oct 22, 2019)

magarity said:


> It's interesting that opinions on third party batteries tend to be either 1) I bought one that had an issue, therefore all of them are bad and 2) I bought one and it works well, therefore all of them are OK.
> I wish some "real" brand name would make third party camera batteries, like Everready or similar, instead of mystery Chinese brands.



I see a lot of people with opinion 1. I don't believe I've ever come across anyone with opinion 2.


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## Stuart (Oct 22, 2019)

"Similar top-down LCD to the EOS R" Merging components in the EF and RF lines sound like a sensible approach. It might even help with model familiarity where one is the backup camera for the other.


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## flip314 (Oct 22, 2019)

magarity said:


> It's interesting that opinions on third party batteries tend to be either 1) I bought one that had an issue, therefore all of them are bad and 2) I bought one and it works well, therefore all of them are OK.
> I wish some "real" brand name would make third party camera batteries, like Everready or similar, instead of mystery Chinese brands.



A lot of Chinese batteries tend to be near-identical to name-brand batteries except for quality control. People underestimate the importance of QC, but manufacturing is only half the battle. Unless you're evaluating your quality to 1) improve your processes and 2) make sure defective products don't reach customers, you'll end up with wildly different reviews based on peoples' luck. Some people will have terrible experiences, and some will wonder what all the fuss is about.

So, if the knock-off battery is 1/3rd the price of the Canon, you are basically gambling that there's a 1 in 3 chance that the battery you get will perform as well, or you're willing to accept that it may perform 1/3rd as well. The extra price you pay to Canon is largely for the guarantee that you don't have to mess around, and you can just be pretty sure you're getting something good in the first place.


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## slclick (Oct 22, 2019)

edoorn said:


> This exactly. I’m sure it’s going to be a very good camera for a specific target audience (for example the news agencies, sports photographers, etc), but we’re reaching the limits of what can be done with dslr’s. Mirrorless has a lot more upward potential.


Is that like waiting for the flying cars that were once promised to us? Do you really have tangible data of how revolutionary ML is soon going to be over DSLRs? I cannot for the life of me think it's anything other than evolutionary. What did they say on Team Sky? Marginal Gains.


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## knight427 (Oct 22, 2019)

flip314 said:


> So, if the knock-off battery is 1/3rd the price of the Canon, you are basically gambling that there's a 1 in 3 chance that the battery you get will perform as well, or you're willing to accept that it may perform 1/3rd as well. The extra price you pay to Canon is largely for the guarantee that you don't have to mess around, and you can just be pretty sure you're getting something good in the first place.



Without evidence, I would guess that this divide is highly correlated to pro versus amateur. As a hobbyist, everything I do in photography is "messing around." Ideally I mess around figuring out how to make better photographs, but if I can save some money in exchange for a bit of risk of extra messing around on gear, then so be it. Obviously I'm going to do some homework to minimize this risk (again, more messing around b/c I'm not giving up pay to do all of this messing around).


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## jvillain (Oct 22, 2019)

If they are supposed to be shooting this thing at the Tokyo Olympics isn't it waaaaaay late for a development announcement? Kind of time for a release announcement isn't it?


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## bsbeamer (Oct 22, 2019)

Powering via USB in addition to the battery would be welcome across all (the higher-end) bodies. Not even talking about charging the internal battery during this. Using a battery adapter like Tether Tools or even Canon's own AC adapters should not be necessary. And when there's a major issue, you basically lose everything since the camera shuts down - no internal battery for "backup" purposes. USB power would solve this entirely if it could switch back to the internal.


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## wockawocka (Oct 22, 2019)

Unless much improved the top down lcd in my R sucks and isn't useful at all.


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## flip314 (Oct 22, 2019)

jvillain said:


> If they are supposed to be shooting this thing at the Tokyo Olympics isn't it waaaaaay late for a development announcement? Kind of time for a release announcement isn't it?



It's not like they've just started developing the thing, it's that they are disclosing a development that is already far underway. They want to announce an upcoming product without giving a firm date.


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## Canon1966 (Oct 22, 2019)

knight427 said:


> Let me help.
> 
> 1) Less money is less money than more money, which leaves you with more money to spend on things that leave with you with less money.
> 2) Not everyone has had bad luck with third party batteries.


In my honest opinion I would rather have an original battery or accessory. At the same time, I've never had an issue with the 3rd party batteries I received from B & H when I purchased a camera. I think it may be hit or miss with 3rd party batteries. Just my opinion. Again I'll take an original over a third party. : )


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## privatebydesign (Oct 22, 2019)

All 1 series batteries last a long time, they always have...



BeenThere said:


> New feature : It will last a long time.


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## bellorusso (Oct 22, 2019)

I just hope Canon will not be as cheap as before to put different kind of cards in the new camera. I hate to buy all kind of cards for million different devices. Especially, when one is slow and the other one is ok.

So stupid when camera brands combine cards systems. STUPID.


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## AJ (Oct 23, 2019)

Built-in USB charger? That would be handy shooting in remote locations.


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## PFloyd (Oct 23, 2019)

While I love to save money, and I'm sure 3rd party batteries can deliver similar performance to genuine Canon batteries, my biggest concern with using 3rd party batteries - at least in cameras still under warranty, is damaging the camera and voiding the warranty. I'm sure the chances of something like that happening are remote; nevertheless, is it worth taking that risk on your new $3K-6K camera in order to save $30 or $40?


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## Sparky (Oct 23, 2019)

unfocused said:


> Can't understand someone paying $6,000 for a camera and then trying to save a few bucks using an inferior third-party battery.
> 
> I just hope it has the same interchangeability as the LP-E6N. (Battery compatible with previous 1Dx series and camera can use older model batteries as well)





edoorn said:


> This exactly. I’m sure it’s going to be a very good camera for a specific target audience (for example the news agencies, sports photographers, etc), but we’re reaching the limits of what can be done with dslr’s. Mirrorless has a lot more upward potential.


I have the 1DXii and 61 points is fine. I thought I wanted more (I have the R as well), but actually when you want to scroll across the AF area to get from one side to the other, having a lot more points might either slow the process down or make it harder to select the exact point you want quickly. Either way, I am


peters said:


> I have 2 original batteries for an insane 150€ markup each. And one third party 40€ battery.
> One of the batteries has some problems where it causes camera shut downs and even jumps from 40% to zero. Fun fact... it is NOT the cheap battery...
> Also, the battery life while shooting is in my experience similar and sometimes even worse than on my 5D IV (I use both together for wedding photography).
> Overall I must say I am very disapointed in the battery and reliabiliy of my 1D. The 5D feels somehow better field tested (not surprising, giving its selling numbers). Also, I never had any problem with any third party battery on my 5D.


That’s odd. I have shot 10 hour weddings with a 1DXii and 5D4. The 1DX often has about 50% battery left and the 5D4 uses about a battery and a half. I am a pretty heavy shooter too. I can’t say I have ever had reason to complain about the battery on the 1D camera, it’s always been excellent and I have never had to use the spare battery that I pack with the kit.


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## Mr Majestyk (Oct 23, 2019)

Already looking like tweaked 1DXII AF, which will leave Canon even further behind Nikon and Sony, not promising at all.


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## HarryFilm (Oct 23, 2019)

magarity said:


> It's interesting that opinions on third party batteries tend to be either 1) I bought one that had an issue, therefore all of them are bad and 2) I bought one and it works well, therefore all of them are OK.
> I wish some "real" brand name would make third party camera batteries, like Everready or similar, instead of mystery Chinese brands.




If you want REAL power to your camera, get an adapter or make on yourself (our engineers did that for the 1DxMk2's! which use NP-1b camcorder battery types used on the BIG TV NEWS CAMCORDERS.

see below:









IDX System Technology NP-L7S NP-Style Lithium-Ion Battery


Buy IDX System Technology NP-L7S NP-Style Lithium-Ion Battery featuring 14.6 VDC @ 68Wh, LED Status Indicator. Review IDX System Technology null




www.bhphotovideo.com





Our engineer made a box adapter that has TWO of the NP-1b's with lower and upper screw holes so we can still put the 1d's/5d's on tripods but we can easily slide out (i.e. Hot Swap) one battery while the camera draws from the other.

You just need to solder in some power supply circuits to make sure the power supply is correct for the 1Dx2 when you plug in the power adapter that uses a blank LP-e19 as the connection between the 1Dx2 and the under-camera NP-1b battery box. We 3D printed the under-camera case out of ABS plastic so it is TOUGH as nails and waterproof! We also had to modify a blank LP-e19 (Li-Ion cells taken out!) to run a ruggedized and braided double-shielded power cable to the camera!

Canon LP-E19 batteries are 10.8 Volts at 2.75 Amps so total wattage available for draw is only 29.7 watts for about 1200 photos, so using the TWO NP-1b's in series gives you about 4x the runtime when run in the real world or about 4800 photos using our custom-designed system!

At 65+ Watts for each NP-1b battery, the the 130 watts of total available power draw makes for runtimes that are utterly STUNNING!!! ....AND.... the extra weight of the batteries actually make the cameras more stable in hand so I get more of the "Keeper Shots". I have really big hands so all the extra weight doesn't bother me.

There are also versions of the NP-1b that are 95 Watts but at $400+ US they are a tad expensive but you do get 7500 photos (i.e. 2 NP-1b x 95 watts each) in the real world on the 1Dx2! Using the cheaper 70 watt NP-1b ($210 US!) is our sweet spot in terms of total power and runtime availability vs cost.

.


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## TexPhoto (Oct 23, 2019)

The positive energy here is contagious! I can't wait for this camera!


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## Mr Majestyk (Oct 23, 2019)

kraats said:


> Mirrorless is not there yet. I am still trying to get used to the focussing an tracking system. Of is not as nearly as good as the 1dx or the 5d IV. Try to get birds or even kids with the r. It is hard .... to catch a sharp picture with all that mouvement.


You mean Canon mirrorless is not there yet. Try the A9 AF it's much better than 1DX and 5D4 and I know I've owned both for many years. EOS R is pretty sad effort on the AF front, don't let that cloud your judgement. I think even M6 II will be a big improvement for you.


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## SUNDOG04 (Oct 23, 2019)

I had a problem with the third party battery that came (as an extra) with my 6D. I charged it for a trip, then it disappeared before the trip, and never did find it. No issues like that with my Canon batteries.


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## Jethro (Oct 23, 2019)

HarryFilm said:


> If you want REAL power to your camera, get an adapter or make on yourself (our engineers did that for the 1DxMk2's! which use NP-1b camcorder battery types used on the BIG TV NEWS CAMCORDERS.
> 
> see below:
> 
> ...


All of that and voiding your camera warranty at the same time - the benefits never end!


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## Ozarker (Oct 23, 2019)

kraats said:


> Mirrorless is not there yet. I am still trying to get used to the focussing an tracking system. Of is not as nearly as good as the 1dx or the 5d IV. Try to get birds or even kids with the r. It is hard .... to catch a sharp picture with all that mouvement.


Strange. I get all kinds of sharp photos chasing a 2.5 year old around that is camera shy. Many, many more than I ever did with my 5D Mark III. I turned continuous focus on and use eye-AF. Voila! Even get the little pores the eyelashes emanate from and can see myself clearly in his brown eyes.









EOS R For Birds In Flight — Tim Boyer Photography







www.timboyerphotography.com


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## Ozarker (Oct 23, 2019)

Mr Majestyk said:


> EOS R is pretty sad effort on the AF front...


Absolutely not true.


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## Pape (Oct 23, 2019)

i think they add fidged spinner to camera so you can recharge battery with it when waiting shooting time


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## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2019)

I have to say, I kind of thought the 1DX2's release as a little disappointing in terms of how much progress had been made in the 4 years since the 1DX came out. I owned both, and I liked the II better, of course, but I waited a few years to upgrade, once the prices had almost halved on a used unit. 

Back when the II came out, I had an expectation - long since disabused - that the lack of relative progress would mean a sooner upgrade to the III, and when it came, it would have disproportionately improved features. Lots of us here on this forum thought that. 

I hold out hope that the III will indeed be remarkable, but I can't find one of us here who actually expects that anymore. I think our expectations are that it'll be akin to the 6D to 6D2 upgrade. Throw some megapixels on there; maybe a few new whistles. The years are no longer correlating to the progress; one would hope because behind the scenes there is much development on the R system.

The thing that continues to give us hope is that they must have something quite bodacious on the way, otherwise, why bet the company on a bunch of never-done-before R lenses without a pro body equal to them. But, the thing is, we know that's not going to be the 1DX3. The 1DX3 is most likely going to be sort of like the delta between the Sony A9 and the A92 that's being released in a couple weeks. It's just some frills for the Olympics, and likely indicates the body in development that they'd hoped to be able to announce in Q3 2019 is just not far enough along to release. 

Canon spent a bajillion dollars to be an honest-to-goodness official sponsor of the Olympics ($40-200 million), and there's a product manager somewhere in Integrated Design Department 232 who had to tell the bosses that the be-all mirrorless camera they were hoping to launch to the world when everyone came to Japan won't be ready. 

Meanwhile, down the hall, the guy who did something so utterly terrible that he was reassigned to the B team tinkering with the 1D body just in case the company needed a plan B is suddenly asked what he's been doing for the past 18 months. We're about to find out the answer to that question. I think the majority of us are expecting there was a lot of solitaire and resume burnishing and not a whole lot of let's-fit-eye-AF-in-this-thing-ing.


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## sanj (Oct 23, 2019)

A new 1dx. And all we can discuss is the battery.


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## navastronia (Oct 23, 2019)

[email protected] said:


> Canon spent a bajillion dollars to be an honest-to-goodness official sponsor of the Olympics ($40-200 million), and there's a product manager somewhere in Integrated Design Department 232 who had to tell the bosses that the be-all mirrorless camera they were hoping to launch to the world when everyone came to Japan won't be ready.
> 
> Meanwhile, down the hall, the guy who did something so utterly terrible that he was reassigned to the B team tinkering with the 1D body just in case the company needed a plan B is suddenly asked what he's been doing for the past 18 months. We're about to find out the answer to that question. I think the majority of us are expecting there was a lot of solitaire and resume burnishing and not a whole lot of let's-fit-eye-AF-in-this-thing-ing.



Honestly, this is great writing. There's a lot of Canon moaning and groaning around these parts, but not nearly enough fan fiction


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## edoorn (Oct 23, 2019)

kraats said:


> Mirrorless is not there yet. I am still trying to get used to the focussing an tracking system. Of is not as nearly as good as the 1dx or the 5d IV. Try to get birds or even kids with the r. It is hard .... to catch a sharp picture with all that mouvement.



It is with the R, but the A9 shows this can work even better in many cases than a dslr. And that’s just the beginning; that’s what I mean with upward potential.




slclick said:


> Is that like waiting for the flying cars that were once promised to us? Do you really have tangible data of how revolutionary ML is soon going to be over DSLRs? I cannot for the life of me think it's anything other than evolutionary. What did they say on Team Sky? Marginal Gains.



I never said ML is revolutionary. Like many new technology, it’s evolutionary but we all see where we are going, and that also (finally) includes Canon. Even reps from Canon I speak to say this is the spearhead now for future developments.

That said, to keep it on topic, I’m confident the 1dx iii will be a great camera that delivers. I do think the live view options might see the biggest upgrades though. And then you’d wish for an evf to make optimal use of that 

who knows next Thursday we already might hear more


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## Mr Majestyk (Oct 23, 2019)

CanonFanBoy said:


> Absolutely not true.


No it's true, sure if you are just shooting landscapes or using eye-AF on slow moving people probably fine. I'm talking fast action, where it's limited to 2-3fps with tracking, not the BS 8fps with focus locked. That's what's sad!


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## Mr Majestyk (Oct 23, 2019)

[email protected] said:


> I have to say, I kind of thought the 1DX2's release as a little disappointing in terms of how much progress had been made in the 4 years since the 1DX came out. I owned both, and I liked the II better, of course, but I waited a few years to upgrade, once the prices had almost halved on a used unit.
> 
> Back when the II came out, I had an expectation - long since disabused - that the lack of relative progress would mean a sooner upgrade to the III, and when it came, it would have disproportionately improved features. Lots of us here on this forum thought that.
> 
> ...



Canon probably had 1DXIII specs locked in in 2017, didn't even anticipate the A9, hadn't had a chance to see how good D5 was either, still thought they'd be top dog in AF and did the standard evolution upgrade. By early 2018 they should have been worried enough to do all new AF.


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## Ozarker (Oct 23, 2019)

Mr Majestyk said:


> No it's true, sure if you are just shooting landscapes or using eye-AF on slow moving people probably fine. I'm talking fast action, where it's limited to 2-3fps with tracking, not the BS 8fps with focus locked. That's what's sad!


Your 2-3 frames/sec is incorrect. I track a fast moving toddler all day. BTW: Just watch the videos above of bigds in flight and American pro footbal use. Question: Have you actually used the camera? And I don't mean for a few minutes in the shop. It's 5fps in servo, so I have no idea where you get your numbers, my friend. It is a $2k USD FF camera. Comparing to an A9 is ludicrous.


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## Viggo (Oct 23, 2019)

CanonFanBoy said:


> Your 2-3 frames/sec is incorrect. I track a fast moving toddler all day. BTW: Just watch the videos above of bigds in flight and American pro footbal use. Question: Have you actually used the camera? And I don't mean for a few minutes in the shop. It's 5fps in servo, so I have no idea where you get your numbers, my friend. It is a $2k USD FF camera. Comparing to an A9 is ludicrous.


He’s talking about 3 fps in tracking priority mode and 8 fps in AF/AE locked mode. Conveniently leaving out the mode most of us use, 5 fps with release priority. And let me elaborate, with ANY 1d and 5d I owned, and I have had them all, there was abysmal hit rate with release priority, reviewers saying things like, “why would you want to use release priority and just have more shots oof.”

That has changed completely with the R, release priority does no longer mean it releases the shutter with oof shots, it’s seriously good and much better than the DSLR’s was in Focus Priority mode.
I did my usual focus test just a few days ago with the kids on the swings, my 1dx2 had a really hard time with tracking them, but better than the 1dx, which was a crapshoot. The R however was tested in very low light, the kids now swing MUCH bigger and the eye af did not let go. Very impressed !

Repeating lies doesn’t make them true...


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## unfocused (Oct 23, 2019)

navastronia said:


> Honestly, this is great writing. There's a lot of Canon moaning and groaning around these parts, but not nearly enough fan fiction


Emphasis on *Fiction*.


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## Mistral75 (Oct 23, 2019)

Nokishita Camera just published a tweet about the registration of DS126771, a yet to be announced camera, by certification authorities. Wi-Fi (IEEE 802.11b/g/n) and Bluetooth 4.1 Battery is LP-E19, that of the EOS 1D X Mark II if I'm not mistaken.







Source:

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1186914500999442432


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## degos (Oct 23, 2019)

Cochese said:


> To be fair, at the battery gag, if you cannot afford the price of an extra battery, you probably cannot afford the camera.



So what if the Canon-branded* battery cost $2000? $3000? $6000? Would you say the same? Where do you draw the boundary? 

I buy third-party batteries so that I spend the money I saved on actually going to places to take photos.

* they're not made by Canon, incidentally


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## expatinasia (Oct 23, 2019)

Considering that rumours thus far suggest two new card slots - which could mean spending a lot of money to buy a minimum of two new cards (especially if you shoot video and need large amounts of storage), I would be amazed if the Canon 1DX Mark III could not take Mark I and Mark II's batteries even if there is a slight dent in performance, because would just add further to the cost. 

I love the fact that I can use my CF cards and my Mark I batteries in the 1DX Mark II.


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## masterpix (Oct 23, 2019)

Canon Rumors Guy said:


> Continue reading...



Similar top down like the R? The LCD pannel had (on the 1Dx and 7D as otehr models) all the information needed, it would be a shame to reduce the given information to the level of the R top down LCD screen. Unless they are planning to menu the top down LCD screen and by that allow a lot more information to be given in it.


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## peters (Oct 23, 2019)

Sparky said:


> That’s odd. I have shot 10 hour weddings with a 1DXii and 5D4. The 1DX often has about 50% battery left and the 5D4 uses about a battery and a half. I am a pretty heavy shooter too. I can’t say I have ever had reason to complain about the battery on the 1D camera, it’s always been excellent and I have never had to use the spare battery that I pack with the kit.


Jeah, I am suspecting that there is something wrong with my 1D. I am sure that one of the batteries is faulty, which I will investigate and return in the next month. 
Maybe there is something wrong with the camera as well, hard to tell.
On a wedding I shoot about 1000-1500 images per camera. Usualy I use the 5D4 as my main camera and I shooting 2000 on that an 1000 on the 1D. And strangely enough, the 5D is pretty much all the time at the same battery level as the 1D - though I would expect a way better performance on the 1D. 
Well, maybe the battery replacement will solve this mystery :-D


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## Daner (Oct 23, 2019)

kraats said:


> Mirrorless is not there yet. I am still trying to get used to the focussing an tracking system. Of is not as nearly as good as the 1dx or the 5d IV. Try to get birds or even kids with the r. It is hard .... to catch a sharp picture with all that mouvement.



I'm finding it to be significantly easier with the new firmware, at least for casual portrait work. Missing my 5D Mk IV less and less...


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## edoorn (Oct 23, 2019)

Mistral75 said:


> Nokishita Camera just published a tweet about the registration of DS126771, a yet to be announced camera, by certification authorities. Wi-Fi (IEEE 802.11b/g/n) and Bluetooth 4.1 Battery is LP-E19, that of the EOS 1D X Mark II if I'm not mistaken.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



wifi? thats a new thing for the 1dx right?


----------



## Cat_Interceptor (Oct 23, 2019)

Mr Majestyk said:


> No it's true, sure if you are just shooting landscapes or using eye-AF on slow moving people probably fine. I'm talking fast action, where it's limited to 2-3fps with tracking, not the BS 8fps with focus locked. That's what's sad!



My M6 mk II is being used for sports and track at 11fps. The 14fps isnt great true but you back it off to 10-11fps H+Tracking and it DOES track. And tracks well. It in fact hands down beats my 7D mk II and my 1D mk IV - it is in my limited time owning it only really beaten by the 1D X mk II. So if I can get my camera to track with limited time with it - it'll only get better as I learn it - then your statement has to be wrong. 

People really need to use the M6 mk II to understand that if Canon have managed to make a consumer level mirrorless work better than all but their highest end D-SLR, there's the pointer for the real mirrorless future. 

And if we are talking about the R well..... the new firmware is a hell of a lot better. But if you are trying to make a blanket statement about Canon Mirrorless... sorry, but Canon has a camera right now that proves the naysayers wrong.


----------



## analoggrotto (Oct 23, 2019)

InFoLiThIuM! LoL!


----------



## TMHKR (Oct 23, 2019)

There's a difference between "third-party battery" and "knock-off battery".

Third-party batteries are for example Patona, Jupio, Hähnel, etc. replacement batteries, all with built-in chips.
Knock-off batteries are "Canon-branded" fake batteries that you find dirt-cheap on eBay.


----------



## Quarkcharmed (Oct 23, 2019)

Long time ago I only had one LPE6 battery, charged it before an important trip and took it, but forgot the charger. A small camera store in a town on the way to my destination had neither original Canon batteries, nor chargers, but they had a no-name replacement for LPE6. It was 2/3-charged and I bought it so that I had one and a half batteries on the trip.

I then used this battery for a few months and it worked fine, but then started deteriorating rapidly, it was lasting less and less after each charge until I wasn't able to charge it at all. I'd never buy such a replacement again.


----------



## Viggo (Oct 23, 2019)

Quarkcharmed said:


> Long time ago I only had one LPE6 battery, charged it before an important trip and took it, but forgot the charger. A small camera store in a town on the way to my destination had neither original Canon batteries, nor chargers, but they had a no-name replacement for LPE6. It was 2/3-charged and I bought it so that I had one and a half batteries on the trip.
> 
> I then used this battery for a few months and it worked fine, but then started deteriorating rapidly, it was lasting less and less after each charge until I wasn't able to charge it at all. I'd never buy such a replacement again.


My experience also, and with Godox batteries. They last a very long time on each charge, then after a few months they go rapidly down hill and dies.


----------



## rbielefeld (Oct 23, 2019)

kraats said:


> Mirrorless is not there yet. I am still trying to get used to the focussing an tracking system. Of is not as nearly as good as the 1dx or the 5d IV. Try to get birds or even kids with the r. It is hard .... to catch a sharp picture with all that mouvement.


I would disagree with the "mirrorless" is not there yet with regards to focusing and tracking. I do agree with the getting birds with the "r" is hard. There are mirrorless cameras that have AF and tracking that are as good or better than the 1DxII and 5DIV, they just are not made by Canon. I am pretty sure Canon, at some point within the next two years, will match the best that other manufacturers have out there now. The question is will the other companies have something even better out by the time Canon brings out the high fps pro mirrorless it is working on. Time will tell.


----------



## arbitrage (Oct 23, 2019)

Mistral75 said:


> Nokishita Camera just published a tweet about the registration of DS126771, a yet to be announced camera, by certification authorities. Wi-Fi (IEEE 802.11b/g/n) and Bluetooth 4.1 Battery is LP-E19, that of the EOS 1D X Mark II if I'm not mistaken.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



This may cast some doubt on the rumour of a new battery with new features. And there in cast some doubt on the entire rumour. But like the 1DXII and 1DX, the camera may be backwards compatible and I have no idea what the requirements are for these overseas certification bodies in regards to listing the battery? These are usually wifi/bluetooth certifications if I'm not mistaken.


----------



## edoorn (Oct 23, 2019)

Here's a wild guess: development announcement tomorrow (or Friday) along with official release of those 85 and 70-200 rf lenses. I might be crazy; I might be right


----------



## Architect1776 (Oct 23, 2019)

knight427 said:


> Let me help.
> 
> 1) Less money is less money than more money, which leaves you with more money to spend on things that leave with you with less money.
> 2) Not everyone has had bad luck with third party batteries.



I purchased 2 canon batteries and 4 off brand batteries for my 10D. All still work but the off bran only last 1/2 to 1/3 the time the Canon batteries at this time. 
So longevity has favored Canon for me. That said I have never had any problems with any of them and the off brand were some real cheap ones from Radio Shack. Yes, the 10D is still used, mainly as my fun on the beach camera.


----------



## slclick (Oct 23, 2019)

Mr Majestyk said:


> No it's true, sure if you are just shooting landscapes or using eye-AF on slow moving people probably fine. I'm talking fast action, where it's limited to 2-3fps with tracking, not the BS 8fps with focus locked. That's what's sad!


If you're buying the R for fast tracking action/ BIF and not getting what you desire it's your fault. Wrong tool. You don't do surgery with linemans pliers. Once again, the One camera to rule them all BS.


----------



## Quarkcharmed (Oct 23, 2019)

edoorn said:


> Here's a wild guess: development announcement tomorrow along with official release of those 85 and 70-200 rf lenses. I might be crazy; I might be right


isn't it something unusual for Canon to make concrete development announcements?


----------



## criscokkat (Oct 23, 2019)

I wonder what the "new feature" on the battery itself is? Only two things come to mind: 
1) Some sort of indicator for the level, and maybe a smart chip allowing rapid charging to 80%
2) A built in USB-C charging port.


----------



## privatebydesign (Oct 23, 2019)

As another unfounded but common sense clue, underwater housing manufacturers often get long run in times for body dimensions and button placement. AquaTech recently released an updated surf housing for the end of life1DX MkII, to me that points to the 1DX MkIII body being very similar to the previous bodies as although the Evo design will allow different camera configurations it is 20% smaller than the older Delphin , so there is less room for differences.


arbitrage said:


> This may cast some doubt on the rumour of a new battery with new features. And there in cast some doubt on the entire rumour. But like the 1DXII and 1DX, the camera may be backwards compatible and I have no idea what the requirements are for these overseas certification bodies in regards to listing the battery? These are usually wifi/bluetooth certifications if I'm not mistaken.


----------



## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 23, 2019)

Cochese said:


> To be fair, at the battery gag, if you cannot afford the price of an extra battery, you probably cannot afford the camera.


This is completely absurd. I could afford to buy _several_ 1DX MkIIs right now if I really wanted to. You know why? Because I have a very deeply entrenched habit of *not* spending excess money where I don't really have to.

I buy third party batteries, and at the price they cost, I can get way more of them for the same price than if I bought Canon batteries. So even if the life is not quite as good as Canon, I'm still getting more battery capacity for the money.

This trope of "well if you can afford the camera you should be able to afford the Canon batteries" sounds just like some elitist nonsense to me. None of us have unlimited resources. And even though I could buy hundreds and hundreds of official Canon batteries if I wanted to, I choose not to buy any. Because then I can put those monetary resources to use elsewhere... Towards other cameras, lenses, or even a plane ticket so I can go actually use my gear somewhere.


----------



## privatebydesign (Oct 23, 2019)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> This is completely absurd. I could afford to buy _several_ 1DX MkIIs right now if I really wanted to. You know why? Because I have a very deeply entrenched habit of *not* spending excess money where I don't really have to.
> 
> I buy third party batteries, and at the price they cost, I can get way more of them for the same price than if I bought Canon batteries. So even if the life is not quite as good as Canon, I'm still getting more battery capacity for the money.
> 
> This trope of "well if you can afford the camera you should be able to afford the Canon batteries" sounds just like some elitist nonsense to me. None of us have unlimited resources. And even though I could buy hundreds and hundreds of official Canon batteries if I wanted to, I choose not to buy any. Because then I can put those monetary resources to use elsewhere... Towards other cameras, lenses, or even a plane ticket so I can go actually use my gear somewhere.


For me, as a long time 1 series owner and user, I’d only buy 1st party batteries for my 1 series cameras, not because I have money to burn or because I am some big shot (I’m not) for me it is the same equation as insurance, if something goes wrong what is the cost to me? If by saving $60 or $80 I put $5,000 at risk of damage that doesn’t seem like a good risk/loss sum to me. On the other hand I’ll happily stick anything in my M series cameras because one, the images are not as important, and two, I save $60 x 3 or 4 and risk a comparatively modest $500.

Now the risk of damage might be small but you can bet your life that Canon won’t cover anything if they believe there was an off brand battery in the bricked 1 series, to me that isn’t a good risk reward balance.


----------



## Ozarker (Oct 23, 2019)

kraats said:


> What lens do you use for portrait? 5d IV is way better then 5d III imo. I had both


RF 85mm f/1.2L and RF 28-70 f/2L


----------



## Warrenl (Oct 23, 2019)

slclick said:


> Is that like waiting for the flying cars that were once promised to us? Do you really have tangible data of how revolutionary ML is soon going to be over DSLRs? I cannot for the life of me think it's anything other than evolutionary. What did they say on Team Sky? Marginal Gains.



Actually flying cars are closer than you think - 2023..... https://www.uber.com/ca/en/elevate/


----------



## slclick (Oct 23, 2019)

Warrenl said:


> Actually flying cars are closer than you think - 2023..... https://www.uber.com/ca/en/elevate/


Even more astonishing is that it's late 2019 and Sony cannot even make a rugged and weather resistant FF camera body with decent ergonomics. Canon was doing that in the 80's.


----------



## uri.raz (Oct 23, 2019)

magarity said:


> It's interesting that opinions on third party batteries tend to be either 1) I bought one that had an issue, therefore all of them are bad and 2) I bought one and it works well, therefore all of them are OK.
> I wish some "real" brand name would make third party camera batteries, like Everready or similar, instead of mystery Chinese brands.



Duracell does. Its LP-E6 replacement got mixed reviews on Amazon UK.


----------



## Sparky (Oct 23, 2019)

Daner said:


> I'm finding it to be significantly easier with the new firmware, at least for casual portrait work. Missing my 5D Mk IV less and less...


I am the opposite way round, I primarily use the 1DX with an 85L 1.4 on it and an R (was 5D4) as the second body. I shoot pretty much the same number of images across a wedding (no point being frugal, eh!). My first 1DXii did have a faulty sensor, but as I bought it new it was replaced the same day I identified the issue. It only occurred a couple of times every couple hundred shots, but obviously enough to be an issue. Canon’s are usually very reliable and my local Pro dealer have only had that and another one returned faulty across the 1DX and 1DXii lines. I’ve had a lot of Canon cameras and that has been the only one with an issue. Could you get it tested? Would the Pro programme cover a replacement whilst it is being checked over?


----------



## Franklyok (Oct 23, 2019)

Xavitxaung said:


> It could be nice to get a LP-E6N adapter.



This is true. Canon could save a few cobalt cave men lives from africa.


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## amorse (Oct 23, 2019)

Thinking a bit more about this, I find it odd that Canon would create a new battery for the 1DXIII when the LP-E19 was released with the 1DXII. I wonder if that new battery feature is something really interesting or if the 1DXIII is going to be notably more power hungry than its predecessor...

I guess Canon have released a number of new batteries which have backwards compatibility in the past as minor upgrades (i.e. LP-E6 vs LP-E6N), but it seems like Canon tries to get as many years and models out of a battery as possible. I mean, the LP-E6 went into the 5D II in 2008, and only got a refresh to the N variant in 2016 with the 5DIV 8 years later. It just seems unusual to refresh a battery in one model, then refresh it again in the next model without a good reason to do so. Maybe the 1DXIII is going to have a pretty good reason for an early refresh of the battery...


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## peters (Oct 23, 2019)

I realy hope the bigger and brighter monitor story is true. 
I use the 1D quite some times for video and I must say, a bigger screen (without the need to attach an annoying screen with a cable and extra battery) would be a VERY welcomed addon


----------



## Warrenl (Oct 23, 2019)

peters said:


> Jeah, I am suspecting that there is something wrong with my 1D. I am sure that one of the batteries is faulty, which I will investigate and return in the next month.
> Maybe there is something wrong with the camera as well, hard to tell.
> On a wedding I shoot about 1000-1500 images per camera. Usualy I use the 5D4 as my main camera and I shooting 2000 on that an 1000 on the 1D. And strangely enough, the 5D is pretty much all the time at the same battery level as the 1D - though I would expect a way better performance on the 1D.
> Well, maybe the battery replacement will solve this mystery :-D



Even on my 8 year old original 1DX batteries I get over 300 images, but generally over 4500 images per battery.


----------



## peters (Oct 23, 2019)

amorse said:


> Thinking a bit more about this, I find it odd that Canon would create a new battery for the 1DXIII when the LP-E19 was released with the 1DXII. I wonder if that new battery feature is something really interesting or if the 1DXIII is going to be notably more power hungry than its predecessor...
> 
> I guess Canon have released a number of new batteries which have backwards compatibility in the past as minor upgrades (i.e. LP-E6 vs LP-E6N), but it seems like Canon tries to get as many years and models out of a battery as possible. I mean, the LP-E6 went into the 5D II in 2008, and only got a refresh to the N variant in 2016 with the 5DIV 8 years later. It just seems unusual to refresh a battery in one model, then refresh it again in the next model without a good reason to do so. Maybe the 1DXIII is going to have a pretty good reason for an early refresh of the battery...


If 6k is true, I think that the 1DX III is indeed going to be quite power hungry in video mode. 
I also would hate it, if it wasnt backward compatible. 150€ for a current battery is allready quite some pain in the ass


----------



## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 23, 2019)

privatebydesign said:


> For me, as a long time 1 series owner and user, I’d only buy 1st party batteries for my 1 series cameras, not because I have money to burn or because I am some big shot (I’m not) for me it is the same equation as insurance, if something goes wrong what is the cost to me? If by saving $60 or $80 I put $5,000 at risk of damage that doesn’t seem like a good risk/loss sum to me. On the other hand I’ll happily stick anything in my M series cameras because one, the images are not as important, and two, I save $60 x 3 or 4 and risk a comparatively modest $500.
> 
> Now the risk of damage might be small but you can bet your life that Canon won’t cover anything if they believe there was an off brand battery in the bricked 1 series, to me that isn’t a good risk reward balance.


Your hypothetical of putting $5000 at risk by saving $60 or $80 does not seem to at all take into account the actual _risk_ of this happening. And that's an important part of the equation if you're going to start talking about cost and risk. Has there ever actually been evidence that a third party battery permanently damaged a camera? How many times in the history of the tens of thousands of third party batteries sold? Is it even more than you can count on one hand? Even if it is saving $60 or $80 to put a $5000 camera at risk, I'd take my chances based on the low risk of that damage happening.

And regardless, as others have said, there are pretty reputable third party batteries, and then there's the absolute junk. I'd be willing to bet that any battery that has actually damaged a camera was some absolute bottom of the barrel junk.


----------



## peters (Oct 23, 2019)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> Your hypothetical of putting $5000 at risk by saving $60 or $80 does not seem to at all take into account the actual _risk_ of this happening. And that's an important part of the equation if you're going to start talking about cost and risk. Has there ever actually been evidence that a third party battery permanently damaged a camera? How many times in the history of the tens of thousands of third party batteries sold? Is it even more than you can count on one hand? Even if it is saving $60 or $80 to put a $5000 camera at risk, I'd take my chances based on the low risk of that damage happening.
> 
> And regardless, as others have said, there are pretty reputable third party batteries, and then there's the absolute junk. I'd be willing to bet that any battery that has actually damaged a camera was some absolute bottom of the barrel junk.


I agree. Especialy because my only battery problem so far with the 1D was with a ORIGINAL battery.
Also, I think I had like 1 problem with a third party battery with my 5D IV. The problem was just that the battery died sooner than expected. But there I tend to by original batteries. 
I NEVER heard from anyone with a damaged camera due to a failing battery. 
But some people have problems with 3rd party batteries, where the battery indicator is jumping around (from 40 to 0 or someting). At weddings I only use original 5D batteries.


----------



## bhf3737 (Oct 23, 2019)

kraats said:


> Yes I saw someone using that [EOS-R] and try to get sharp bird pics. He was really struggling


I am afraid your observation is misleading. I am using R for birds pictures and have got some very good results without added struggle, specially with the new firmware 1.4. And I am not the only one. Need proof? see the "Show your birds portraits" thread.


----------



## edoorn (Oct 23, 2019)

Quarkcharmed said:


> isn't it something unusual for Canon to make concrete development announcements?



yeah it would certainly be a deviation, but who knows they feel it's the time to do it because Nikon and Sony already have their cards on the table for the next big sports event (olympics '20)


----------



## Larsskv (Oct 23, 2019)

kraats said:


> Mirrorless is not there yet. I am still trying to get used to the focussing an tracking system. Of is not as nearly as good as the 1dx or the 5d IV. Try to get birds or even kids with the r. It is hard .... to catch a sharp picture with all that mouvement.


My experience, coming from the 1DXII to the R, is that shooting kids moving erratically around with large apertures (f1.2-f2), the R gives me way more keepers/in focus images, and that experience was with the first EOS R firmware. The R has improved considerably with the newest firmware. 

For some types of action photography, like birds in flight, a DSLR may hold an edge, and the optical viewfinder will probably be better as well. For most people and shooting scenarios though, the AF in the R outperforms every DSLR ever made.

I use the R and the 5DIV every week, and when using the 5DIV I am constantly bothered by slightly out of focus images.The constraints that comes from having to using the focus points is also bothering me a bit.


----------



## Tremotino (Oct 23, 2019)

bsbeamer said:


> Powering via USB in addition to the battery would be welcome across all (the higher-end) bodies. Not even talking about charging the internal battery during this. Using a battery adapter like Tether Tools or even Canon's own AC adapters should not be necessary. And when there's a major issue, you basically lose everything since the camera shuts down - no internal battery for "backup" purposes. USB power would solve this entirely if it could switch back to the internal.



simply use this charger:




__





canon battery charger usb nitecore ucn1 - Google Shopping






www.google.de




much better than canon ac charger
I can charge my batteries on the go with a usb powerbank if needed


----------



## [email protected] (Oct 23, 2019)

amorse said:


> The battery will have a new feature or the 1DxIII will have a new feature?


Shame it's going to be different battery than MK 1 and Mk 2 and be interesting to see if Canon does a dual release - 1DX MK 3 and EOS R Pro


----------



## unfocused (Oct 23, 2019)

[email protected] said:


> Shame it's going to be different battery than MK 1 and Mk 2 and be interesting to see if Canon does a dual release - 1DX MK 3 and EOS R Pro


A new battery does not make it incompatible, as in the LP-E6N vs. LP-E6.


----------



## unfocused (Oct 23, 2019)

Maybe the "new feature" will be a two-battery charger that actually charges two batteries at once.


----------



## edoorn (Oct 23, 2019)

the 1d charger already is dual isn’t it? Or does that just charge one at a time?


----------



## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 23, 2019)

magarity said:


> It's interesting that opinions on third party batteries tend to be either 1) I bought one that had an issue, therefore all of them are bad and 2) I bought one and it works well, therefore all of them are OK.
> I wish some "real" brand name would make third party camera batteries, like Everready or similar, instead of mystery Chinese brands.


Virtually all the battery cells come from China, South Korea, and Japan. The USA also has some big manufacturers (Tesla), but they produce far fewer cells in terms of quantity. Distribution of cells is controlled. Reputable manufacturers will not sell cells to a company unless they are considered a reliable manufacturer who agrees to use approved battery protection circuitry. Assembly and production of the final battery is mostly done in China using cells from the big cell manufacturers. There are 

Unfortunately, cheating in China is a problem, cells are bought and sold on the black market. Those so called good companies have been caught using junk cells, and employees have stolen and sold good cells on the black market.

That's why Chinese batteries are so hit and miss. Its a risk even when buying from a good Chinese company because of those who cheat the company they work for can result in bad batteries hitting the market.

Some of the big companies can afford to have inspectors in the plants, and trace the components to approved sources. Still, there is a huge financial reward for cheating, so people can be bribed and paperwork altered.


----------



## privatebydesign (Oct 23, 2019)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> Your hypothetical of putting $5000 at risk by saving $60 or $80 does not seem to at all take into account the actual _risk_ of this happening. And that's an important part of the equation if you're going to start talking about cost and risk. Has there ever actually been evidence that a third party battery permanently damaged a camera? How many times in the history of the tens of thousands of third party batteries sold? Is it even more than you can count on one hand? Even if it is saving $60 or $80 to put a $5000 camera at risk, I'd take my chances based on the low risk of that damage happening.
> 
> And regardless, as others have said, there are pretty reputable third party batteries, and then there's the absolute junk. I'd be willing to bet that any battery that has actually damaged a camera was some absolute bottom of the barrel junk.


From personal experience using third party batteries in a 1D, I'd never do it again. They ran way hotter than the Canon batteries and didn't last anywhere near as long. Don't get me wrong I don't care what anybody else does with their cameras, I was just relaying my personal feeling and now experience. I consider the chance of third party battery malfunction to be higher than high quality card failure, that's why I'll always use Canon batteries in my 1 series and one card in the CFast slot and nothing in the CF slot, but that's me...


----------



## Viggo (Oct 23, 2019)

edoorn said:


> the 1d charger already is dual isn’t it? Or does that just charge one at a time?


One at the time..


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## mpmark (Oct 23, 2019)

slclick said:


> Battery feature... going out on a limb here but maybe a charge indicator?



Good guess!, I agree


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## mpmark (Oct 23, 2019)

edoorn said:


> This exactly. I’m sure it’s going to be a very good camera for a specific target audience (for example the news agencies, sports photographers, etc), but we’re reaching the limits of what can be done with dslr’s. Mirrorless has a lot more upward potential.



I really dont get how you need more then 61 AF points, I do perfectly fine with all photography and dont use even half of them. What is the fixation with more is always better always. This doesn't bug me one bit. In fact any more af points would just clutter my life shooting.
I dont care to see a bees nest in the evf.


----------



## edoorn (Oct 23, 2019)

Not so much the amount you can select, but the amount the camera can use for tracking. Also, the spread of those points in the frame which hits a limit on dslr’s.


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## Viggo (Oct 23, 2019)

mpmark said:


> I really dont get how you need more then 61 AF points, I do perfectly fine with all photography and dont use even half of them. What is the fixation with more is always better always. This doesn't bug me one bit. In fact any more af points would just clutter my life shooting.
> I dont care to see a bees nest in the evf.


I constantly cut off feet with the 61 point from the 1dx when doing tight’ish vertical shots.
If you haven’t tried something like the R system you have no idea how great the freedom of composition is. I can include and exclude and place whatever I want wherever I want and move an AF point EXACTLY where I want. No cropping needed, it’s like the difference between walking with your shoelaces tied together and not..


----------



## ed35 (Oct 23, 2019)

Not keen on yet another new battery type.


----------



## Cochese (Oct 23, 2019)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> This is completely absurd. I could afford to buy _several_ 1DX MkIIs right now if I really wanted to. You know why? Because I have a very deeply entrenched habit of *not* spending excess money where I don't really have to.
> 
> I buy third party batteries, and at the price they cost, I can get way more of them for the same price than if I bought Canon batteries. So even if the life is not quite as good as Canon, I'm still getting more battery capacity for the money.
> 
> This trope of "well if you can afford the camera you should be able to afford the Canon batteries" sounds just like some elitist nonsense to me. None of us have unlimited resources. And even though I could buy hundreds and hundreds of official Canon batteries if I wanted to, I choose not to buy any. Because then I can put those monetary resources to use elsewhere... Towards other cameras, lenses, or even a plane ticket so I can go actually use my gear somewhere.


Right, "I could afford to buy _several_ 1DX MkIIs right now if I really wanted to" If you can truly afford it, it's not going to be a huge issue to buy a few extra batteries. 
If you're talking about putting it on a credit card (which at that point, I too, can "afford" about ten of them), than you can't actually afford the camera. Having credit isn't the same as being able to afford something.


----------



## Daner (Oct 23, 2019)

kraats said:


> I have even sold my 5d IV. My eos r is just not as good as my 5d IV was. I don't use AF a lot so I don't really mind. Waiting for the eos r pro .....



If you don't use AF a lot, the enhancements in AF made available by the R would be lost on you. I thought I would miss the joystick, but touch and drag combined with eye AF has improved my keeper rate. I also appreciate the lighter weight, and the fact that the RF 24-105 is significantly better than the EF 24-105. Looking forward to the 15-35, and the smaller, lighter RF 70-200 as well.


----------



## Kit. (Oct 23, 2019)

Cochese said:


> If you're talking about putting it on a credit card


Well, some people _do_ have savings accounts.


----------



## SecureGSM (Oct 23, 2019)

criscokkat said:


> I wonder what the "new feature" on the battery itself is? Only two things come to mind:
> 1) Some sort of indicator for the level, and maybe a smart chip allowing rapid charging to 80%
> 2) A built in USB-C charging port.


3) Cease / disable the camera AF ability when a non genuine battery in use is detected. Allow manual focusing modes only with shutter speed restricted to B mode exclusively.


----------



## arbitrage (Oct 24, 2019)

Nokishita just tweeted an hour ago that they have found an unpublished article on a famous overseas news site about 1DXIII.
This is the same thing they found a day before the A9II was announced.
Very likely Canon is including something about the 1DXIII in the upcoming announcement.


----------



## bhf3737 (Oct 24, 2019)

kraats said:


> Which settings do you use for birds?


EOS R Setting: Image Review (off); Continuous AF (on); AF Tracking Sensitivity (0 or +1); Acc./Decl. Tracking (+2); AF Point Switch (-2); Lens Drive when Focus Impossible (off); One Shot AF Priority (Focus); Highlight Alert (on); AF Point Display (on).


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## chik0240 (Oct 24, 2019)

ok, I am tempted as a DSLR lover, and this might very well be the last flagship DSLR ever made so a part of collector item

But (sneaking at my wife) I likely never can afford that


----------



## Nelu (Oct 24, 2019)

bhf3737 said:


> EOS R Setting: Image Review (off); Continuous AF (on); AF Tracking Sensitivity (0 or +1); Acc./Decl. Tracking (+2); AF Point Switch (-2); Lens Drive when Focus Impossible (off); One Shot AF Priority (Focus); Highlight Alert (on); AF Point Display (on).


That's interesting!...
First, there's no such thing as "AF Point Switch" value of " -2". It can only be 0, +1 or +2.
Secondly, if you sett the AF Tracking Sensitivity to something on the plus side, the focus will jump onto any new subject coming into the frame. Really the opposite what you need when trying to keep the focus on birds.
Your setting for the "Acc/Decl Tracking" is correctly set to a value on the plus side, in order to be able to handle birds chaotic movements.

Other than that, "Continuous AF" set to "On" will only eat up your battery and it's not important for photos as it might be for videos.


----------



## bhf3737 (Oct 24, 2019)

Nelu said:


> That's interesting!...
> First, there's no such thing as "AF Point Switch" value of " -2". It can only be 0, +1 or +2.
> Secondly, if you sett the AF Tracking Sensitivity to something on the plus side, the focus will jump onto any new subject coming into the frame. Really the opposite what you need when trying to keep the focus on birds.
> Your setting for the "Acc/Decl Tracking" is correctly set to a value on the plus side, in order to be able to handle birds chaotic movements.
> ...


Thanks for correction. Yes, for "AF Point Switch" I meant minimum possible value which is zero.
And "AF Tracking Sensitivity" is usually zero, except for when there are multiple birds and I want to focus on a random one, let the camera decide.


----------



## deleteme (Oct 24, 2019)

amorse said:


> I'm with you here. I had purchased some LP-E6's off brand a while ago and they were hot garbage. Held a charge for less than half the time of the Canon-manufactured battery which was years older. From then on it has been nothing Canon batteries, and no issues at all.


Every third party battery I have purchased since the 10D has been complete garbage. Every time I hear "Well, some are rotten but these are different" I fall for it and buy several batteries and chargers and find that the new "much better" batteries are actually the same old crap in new boxes. Shame on me for falling for this scam so many times.


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 24, 2019)

amorse said:


> I'm with you here. I had purchased some LP-E6's off brand a while ago and they were hot garbage. Held a charge for less than half the time of the Canon-manufactured battery which was years older. From then on it has been nothing Canon batteries, and no issues at all.



You're buying the wrong third party batteries. Some of them _are _junk. Others are just as good, if not better than, the genuine Canon batteries. Try STK (Sterling Tek), they last more charge/recharge cycles than my Canon originals do.


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 24, 2019)

knight427 said:


> I see a lot of people with opinion 1. I don't believe I've ever come across anyone with opinion 2.



You need to get out more.


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 24, 2019)

jvillain said:


> If they are supposed to be shooting this thing at the Tokyo Olympics isn't it waaaaaay late for a development announcement? Kind of time for a release announcement isn't it?



The 1D X was officially announced on 18 October, 2011 and officially began shipping 20 June, 2012. Units bound for the 2012 Summer games were shipped ahead of the official June release date, which was moved back from an initially announced April release date due to supply chain issues.

The 1D X Mark II was officially announced February 1, 2016 and began shipping in April, 2016.


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 24, 2019)

PFloyd said:


> While I love to save money, and I'm sure 3rd party batteries can deliver similar performance to genuine Canon batteries, my biggest concern with using 3rd party batteries - at least in cameras still under warranty, is damaging the camera and voiding the warranty. I'm sure the chances of something like that happening are remote; nevertheless, is it worth taking that risk on your new $3K-6K camera in order to save $30 or $40?



My first DSLR was a Rebel XTi so I did not have $3K-6K invested at that time. I did learn that the cheapest third party NB-2LH batteries were junk but the NB-2LH batteries from reputable makers like Sterling Tek and Maximal Power were just as good and sometimes better than the originals supplied with the camera. That held true with the BP-511 batteries my 50D used and has held true with the LP-E6/LP-E6N batteries my 7D, 5D Mark II, 5D Mark III, 7D Mark II, and 5D Mark IV use.

The only LP-E6 battery I've had completely die was an original Canon LP-E6 that was less than three years old at the time. I've got third party LP -E6 batteries that are 7-8 years old and still work, though they do not hold as much charge as when they were new. But then again, my Canon LP-E6 batteries that are the same age don't last as long as they used to, either.


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 24, 2019)

CanonFanBoy said:


> Strange. I get all kinds of sharp photos chasing a 2.5 year old around that is camera shy. Many, many more than I ever did with my 5D Mark III. I turned continuous focus on and use eye-AF. Voila! Even get the little pores the eyelashes emanate from and can see myself clearly in his brown eyes.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That's the oldest looking two year old I've ever seen!


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 24, 2019)

[email protected] said:


> I have to say, I kind of thought the 1DX2's release as a little disappointing in terms of how much progress had been made in the 4 years since the 1DX came out. I owned both, and I liked the II better, of course, but I waited a few years to upgrade, once the prices had almost halved on a used unit.
> 
> Back when the II came out, I had an expectation - long since disabused - that the lack of relative progress would mean a sooner upgrade to the III, and when it came, it would have disproportionately improved features. Lots of us here on this forum thought that.
> 
> ...



You are imposing your view of American corporate culture on a Japanese company. You've obviously never done business with Japanese companies.


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 24, 2019)

amorse said:


> Thinking a bit more about this, I find it odd that Canon would create a new battery for the 1DXIII when the LP-E19 was released with the 1DXII. I wonder if that new battery feature is something really interesting or if the 1DXIII is going to be notably more power hungry than its predecessor...
> 
> I guess Canon have released a number of new batteries which have backwards compatibility in the past as minor upgrades (i.e. LP-E6 vs LP-E6N), but it seems like Canon tries to get as many years and models out of a battery as possible. I mean, the LP-E6 went into the 5D II in 2008, and only got a refresh to the N variant in 2016 with the 5DIV 8 years later. It just seems unusual to refresh a battery in one model, then refresh it again in the next model without a good reason to do so. Maybe the 1DXIII is going to have a pretty good reason for an early refresh of the battery...



The LP-E6N was introduced with the EOS 7D Mark II in 2014.


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 24, 2019)

Tremotino said:


> simply use this charger:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I don't think that charger will work with LP-E4N and LP-E19 batteries that the 1D X series use...


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 24, 2019)

unfocused said:


> A new battery does not make it incompatible, as in the LP-E6N vs. LP-E6.



More like as in the LP-E4N (1D X) and LP-E19 (1D X Mark II) that are backwards/forwards compatible. The older LP-E4n just has a slightly lower capacity rating.


----------



## BeenThere (Oct 24, 2019)

privatebydesign said:


> All 1 series batteries last a long time, they always have...


“Dramatically longer battery life”. ——- nailed it!


----------



## deleteme (Oct 25, 2019)

Michael Clark said:


> You're buying the wrong third party batteries. Some of them _are _junk. Others are just as good, if not better than, the genuine Canon batteries. Try STK (Sterling Tek), they last more charge/recharge cycles than my Canon originals do.


Nope, not going to fall for that "these are actually good" line. The manufacture of Li-ion batteries may be somewhat more common today but the reliable sources are OEM because they demand it. Independent packagers like Watson and Sterling Tek cannot and thus one will get burned sooner or later.


----------



## allanjay (Oct 26, 2019)

Doesn't look an impressive step forward by any stretch. More like - "oh, we have to release a new 1DX in 2020". It's a very good camera, of course, but there seems to be very little innovation over the past 4 years - compared to what happens elsewhere in technology, not the least in the mirrorless department. And that's for a product with a pricing that could buy you ~7 iPhone 11's (256 GB).


Modest bump in FPS from 14 to 16 mechanically. Who regularly shoots 20 fps in live view?
No improvements to silent shutter seemingly. The 5D Mark III from 2012 is still the best. Of course, there are mechanical reasons for this, but it would be exciting to see some novelty innovation in important aspects like this where the DSLR's are lagging behind terribly.
A new wildly expensive WFT unit (WFT-E9) - despite stating that WiFi is built into the camera? I can get WiFi in a tiny 100 USD phone. I should be able to send images to my tablet/phone/laptop instantly without needing to purchase a clumsy 400 USD device. How about mobile network/LTE support as a feature? Allowing it to be turned on/off to save battery of course. Connectivity features still seem to be 5-10 years outdated.
No innovations such as a switchable electronic/optical viewfinder to make use of the live view improvements.
Still way too poor focus coverage optically. Improvements mainly gone into live view.
Eye-AF? Intelligent subject tracking improvements?
No IBIS - okay, that's a lesser deal.
High ISO noise improvements? Not expecting much in that regard based on the press release, but that's important as well.
Has the new AF-On quick-select focus feature been properly tested? Not sure it's a big UX improvement to combine AF-On with focus point selection. Theoretically it should be an advantage, but it's highly critical that the button is well-functioning, so the main function - AF tracking - isn't compromised.


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 26, 2019)

allanjay said:


> Doesn't look an impressive step forward by any stretch. More like - "oh, we have to release a new 1DX in 2020". It's a very good camera, of course, but there seems to be very little innovation over the past 4 years - compared to what happens elsewhere in technology, not the least in the mirrorless department. And that's for a product with a pricing that could buy you ~7 iPhone 11's (256 GB).
> 
> 
> Modest bump in FPS from 14 to 16 mechanically. Who regularly shoots 20 fps in live view?
> ...




"Who regularly shoots 20 fps in live view?"

Someone at the Olympics with a remotely controlled tripod mounted camera pointed at the gymnastics vault horse or the finish line at the sprint races or at the World Series pointed at the batter's box, or...

"No improvements to silent shutter seemingly."

Do you have sound recordings of the shutter operation of the new 1D Mark III? How do you know this?

"A new wildly expensive WFT unit (WFT-E9)"

The external unit is only for extended longer range, if needed. The internal radio is fine for short distances, such as transmitting to a device on the photog's body. Did you even bother to read the entire press release before launching into your diatribe?

"Eye-AF? Intelligent subject tracking improvements?"

Have you not seen the substantial improvements in those areas with the updated firmware for the EOS R? Why wouldn't Canon also include that in the 1D X mark III?

"Has the new AF-On quick-select focus feature been properly tested? Not sure it's a big UX improvement to combine AF-On with focus point selection. Theoretically it should be an advantage, but it's highly critical that the button is well-functioning, so the main function - AF tracking - isn't compromised."

Again, what information do you have in this regard? Are you one of the pre-production testers of this camera?


----------



## Joules (Oct 26, 2019)

allanjay said:


> Doesn't look an impressive step forward by any stretch. More like - "oh, we have to release a new 1DX in 2020".


Did you read the development announcement? 



allanjay said:


> No improvements to silent shutter seemingly. The 5D Mark III from 2012 is still the best.


It will do 20 FPS electronically shutter, so completely silent at insane speed. 



allanjay said:


> Still way too poor focus coverage optically. Improvements mainly gone into live view.
> 
> Eye-AF? Intelligent subject tracking improvements?


They have made a massive upgrade to the iTR sensor, going from less than half a Megapixel to over 10. I wouldn't make any negative statements about AF yet, especially since the hardware got such a boost and Canon claim it will be improved significantly. Eye AF should be a piece of cake since the 90D already handles face detection in the viewfinder. 



allanjay said:


> High ISO noise improvements? Not expecting much in that regard based on the press release, but that's important as well.


There's just not much space left for improvement.

Things like IBIS or hybrid viewfinder are likely not well suited for being introduced in a 1D. Seeing that you are already sceptical about the AF button change, image the issues if such features are not 100% robust in their first generation.


----------



## Kit. (Oct 26, 2019)

allanjay said:


> Doesn't look an impressive step forward by any stretch.


Have you used it?



allanjay said:


> Modest bump in FPS from 14 to 16 mechanically. Who regularly shoots 20 fps in live view?


There are lots of people regularly shooting 60 fps in live view.


----------



## allanjay (Oct 26, 2019)

Michael Clark said:


> "Who regularly shoots 20 fps in live view?"
> 
> Someone at the Olympics with a remotely controlled tripod mounted camera pointed at the gymnastics vault horse or the finish line at the sprint races or at the World Series pointed at the batter's box, or...


I doubt this modest change would cause people to start using the more battery-draining live view mode for remotes which they sometimes can't access for hours. I have never used live view for a remote - and can't recall seeing anyone else doing that - either in person or in a tv broadcast. The light from the screens might also not be popular with tv broadcasters if you have 10 of them close to a long jump sandpit for instance. Unless you can turn off the screen while still in live view technically speaking. But not sure if this is doable.



Michael Clark said:


> "No improvements to silent shutter seemingly."
> Do you have sound recordings of the shutter operation of the new 1D Mark III? How do you know this?


I don't know that, but seeing there is no mention of what could be potentially be a groundbreaking new feature for many sports shooters, I assume it sounds pretty much like the predecessors. Which is not surprising, of course. I'm just listing things that would be strong selling points. Esp. for shooters considering a switch to mirrorless.



Michael Clark said:


> The external unit is only for extended longer range, if needed. The internal radio is fine for short distances, such as transmitting to a device on the photog's body. Did you even bother to read the entire press release before launching into your diatribe?


I didn't read that from the press release. Are you sure you can transfer files from the built-in WiFi unit - and does it support both ad hoc (direct connection to another device) and infrastructure (connection to an Access Point)? I was excited to read this part, but they immediately go on to mention a new WFT device in relation to file transfers. It just doesn't seem very innovative for 2020 to still have to rely on a clunky 500-600 USD appendage. 



Michael Clark said:


> "Eye-AF? Intelligent subject tracking improvements?"
> 
> Have you not seen the substantial improvements in those areas with the updated firmware for the EOS R? Why wouldn't Canon also include that in the 1D X mark III?


I guess they might, but no real mention of this in the press release. AF improvements seemed mostly to be in live view mode.



Michael Clark said:


> "Has the new AF-On quick-select focus feature been properly tested? Not sure it's a big UX improvement to combine AF-On with focus point selection. Theoretically it should be an advantage, but it's highly critical that the button is well-functioning, so the main function - AF tracking - isn't compromised."
> 
> Again, what information do you have in this regard? Are you one of the pre-production testers of this camera?


No, and it is indeed an interesting new addition/potential improvement if it can be pulled off successfully. So I hope they know what they are doing as this is an essential working function.


----------



## Joules (Oct 26, 2019)

allanjay said:


> I don't know that, but seeing there is no mention of what could be potentially be a groundbreaking new feature for many sports shooters, I assume it sounds pretty much like the predecessors.


It is just a development announcement though, and they do mention the electronic shutter. So they have stated already that there is an actually silent shooting mode. Going into details for the sound of regular shooting seems like something too granular at this point for a pure development announcement. 



allanjay said:


> I guess they might, but no real mention of this in the press release. AF improvements seemed mostly to be in live view mode.


From the announcement: "The camera’s new autofocus algorithm will improve stability and tracking when using both the Optical Viewfinder and in Live View shooting mode"

I get the feeling that there is a lot of technological advances going on at Canon, seeing how they managed to polish so many things that Sony fans could nitpick previously. No more banding, really high throughput speed, uncropped video, more battery life thanks significantly higher efficiency, quick face and eye AF on all new models, and so on. When the next high end camera hits, the next iteration of all these small steps should result in a big overall upgrade.


----------



## Kit. (Oct 26, 2019)

allanjay said:


> I doubt this modest change would cause people to start using the more battery-draining live view mode for remotes which they sometimes can't access for hours. I have never used live view for a remote - and can't recall seeing anyone else doing that - either in person or in a tv broadcast. The light from the screens might also not be popular with tv broadcasters if you have 10 of them close to a long jump sandpit for instance. Unless you can turn off the screen while still in live view technically speaking.


You can have the camera connected to the mains and the live view streamed over Gigabit Ethernet to basically whatever you want. Just bear in mind that if you are on the other side of the planet from your camera, due to network delays you will need to start your 20fps burst a little earlier than normal.


----------



## allanjay (Oct 26, 2019)

Joules said:


> It will do 20 FPS electronically shutter, so completely silent at insane speed.


That is an improvement for sure. But you are still taking those shots looking at the rear LCD instead of through the optical viewfinder, which is not very practical in a lot of situations - for accuracy, handling and simply viewing the screen outside in bright daylight. That's where a hybrid viewfinder would have been a very interesting feature. But it could be argued such a feature would be unintuitive of course. Why not just make the switch to mirrorless in that case.



Joules said:


> They have made a massive upgrade to the iTR sensor, going from less than half a Megapixel to over 10. I wouldn't make any negative statements about AF yet, especially since the hardware got such a boost and Canon claim it will be improved significantly. Eye AF should be a piece of cake since the 90D already handles face detection in the viewfinder.


I will try and be optimistic about the AF improvements in terms of tracking. But I was hoping for some significant change in optical AF points coverage. One of the main DSLR limitations for me in that regard is the lack of wider coverage of AF points for composition.


----------



## allanjay (Oct 26, 2019)

Joules said:


> It is just a development announcement though, and they do mention the electronic shutter. So they have stated already that there is an actually silent shooting mode. Going into details for the sound of regular shooting seems like something too granular at this point for a pure development announcement.


It would still be groundbreaking if they had made significant improvements. This is already a critical issue for pros, and increasingly so. There was this recent story of press photographers with DSLR's getting kicked out of a political event, while the Sony A9 guy could stay...

Come to think of it, I doubt they would invest many resources pursuing this from a practical point of view, as the electronic shutter will always be superior to any mechanical tweak of the current shutter sound.


----------



## Kit. (Oct 26, 2019)

allanjay said:


> It would still be groundbreaking if they had made significant improvements. This is already a critical issue for pros, and increasingly so. There was this recent story of press photographers with DSLR's getting kicked out of a political event, while the Sony A9 guy could stay...


Was the story or the event sponsored by Sony, by the way?



allanjay said:


> Come to think of it, I doubt they would invest many resources pursuing this from a practical point of view, as the electronic shutter will always be superior to any mechanical tweak of the current shutter sound.


"The grapes are sour"?

I wonder... what caused you to register on this forum just to spread FUD about this particular camera?


----------



## StoicalEtcher (Oct 26, 2019)

Kit. said:


> Was the story or the event sponsored by Sony, by the way?


Almost certainly!


----------



## allanjay (Oct 26, 2019)

Kit. said:


> Was the story or the event sponsored by Sony, by the way?


It was a PetaPixel article quoting the Washington Post (paywalled article). The event was the recent NBC-sponsored Democratic debate.

Silent Sony a9 a ‘Great Advantage’ for Photographer at Democratic Debate


Kit. said:


> "The grapes are sour"?
> 
> I wonder... what caused you to register on this forum just to spread FUD about this particular camera?


I consciously try to refrain from injecting any kind of personal attacks or innuendo in my posts as it derails from the subject. We all have biases, preferences and interests, and it's impossible to know what motivates someone to participate here or in any other online platform.

If it matters - which I don't think it does - I'm a CPS Platinum member who doesn't own a single Sony or Nikon product. This particular camera is the pro DSLR flagship, announced at a time when mirrorless cameras are making substantial improvements.

If I misread, misunderstood or misrepresented the press release in expressing my concerns, you are of course fully entitled to correct me on that basis. Obviously, we don't have a full spec sheet yet, so there will be some degree of speculation before an actual production camera is out.


----------



## BillB (Oct 26, 2019)

Joules said:


> It is just a development announcement though, and they do mention the electronic shutter. So they have stated already that there is an actually silent shooting mode. Going into details for the sound of regular shooting seems like something too granular at this point for a pure development announcement.



The electronic shutter may be silent, but what about the mirror?


----------



## Kit. (Oct 26, 2019)

allanjay said:


> It was a PetaPixel article quoting the Washington Post (paywalled article). The event was the recent NBC-sponsored Democratic debate.
> 
> Silent Sony a9 a ‘Great Advantage’ for Photographer at Democratic Debate


That "opinion" piece in the Washington Post is not paywalled (at least to me) and tells a different story. While this article (and the preceding, linked blog post of the same author) about Doug Mills shooting Sony does look like a Sony ad, its message is not about "press photographers with DSLR's getting kicked out of a political event".

Neither the Petapixel itself presents the story in your terms.



allanjay said:


> I consciously try to refrain from injecting any kind of personal attacks or innuendo in my posts as it derails from the subject. We all have biases, preferences and interests, and it's impossible to know what motivates someone to participate here or in any other online platform.


Knowing the motivation simplifies communication. Too much time is being spent on discussing irrelevant matters because people have XY problems.



allanjay said:


> If it matters - which I don't think it does


You are right, it doesn't.



allanjay said:


> If I misread, misunderstood or misrepresented the press release in expressing my concerns, you are of course fully entitled to correct me on that basis. Obviously, we don't have a full spec sheet yet, so there will be some degree of speculation before an actual production camera is out.


I could theoretically spend hours on correcting all your misrepresentations, but I don't have time for it, so the key question: why does it matter to you? What are you trying to achieve and what would I need to help you with?


----------



## Cochese (Oct 27, 2019)

Kit. said:


> Well, some people _do_ have savings accounts.


That's the same as a checking account when it comes to affording something, no? It's money you have, not credit you can use. I just "purchased" a $13,000 embroidery machine, and didn't break my bank. Because I used Credit (with 60months, no interest), but it makes me money, so affording the extras that are required of it really isn't a big deal. Extra hoops can cost up to $700, depending. They aren't necessary, but if it's going to pay for itself, nbd. 
Same with batteries, compared to the $6k of the camera, is an extra $100 really a deal breaker? If you're a working pro, you'll probably pay that off pretty quick.


----------



## Cochese (Oct 27, 2019)

Michael Clark said:


> You're buying the wrong third party batteries. Some of them _are _junk. Others are just as good, if not better than, the genuine Canon batteries. Try STK (Sterling Tek), they last more charge/recharge cycles than my Canon originals do.


I use a mix of third party and first in my 5DMIV and my t3i. For the t3i, the Wasabi Power brand of batteries are absolutely solid performers. They last as long as official on a charge, no problem. For about two years, anyway. They're definitely fading faster, but for $12 for two of them, I can't really complain. I usually only stock up on third parties when I know I'm going to be gone for a while and want to have a cache of extras on hand.


----------



## Kit. (Oct 27, 2019)

Cochese said:


> That's the same as a checking account when it comes to affording something, no? It's money you have, not credit you can use.


It's money you might have wanted to use for something else. Like a downpayment for your new home. Or paid education for your children. Or, if you are really cheap, even a photo tour to Serengeti.



Cochese said:


> I just "purchased" a $13,000 embroidery machine, and didn't break my bank. Because I used Credit (with 60months, no interest), but it makes me money, so affording the extras that are required of it really isn't a big deal. Extra hoops can cost up to $700, depending. They aren't necessary, but if it's going to pay for itself, nbd.
> Same with batteries, compared to the $6k of the camera, is an extra $100 really a deal breaker? If you're a working pro, you'll probably pay that off pretty quick.


How much do you think an average pro photographer earns?


----------



## privatebydesign (Oct 27, 2019)

Kit. said:


> How much do you think an average pro photographer earns?



In the USA if you aren't clearing, not grossing, $50,000 a year within 3-5 years of startup you should be looking at getting a real job and leaving the photography as a hobby or part time gig.


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 28, 2019)

allanjay said:


> I doubt this modest change would cause people to start using the more battery-draining live view mode for remotes which they sometimes can't access for hours. I have never used live view for a remote - and can't recall seeing anyone else doing that - either in person or in a tv broadcast. The light from the screens might also not be popular with tv broadcasters if you have 10 of them close to a long jump sandpit for instance. Unless you can turn off the screen while still in live view technically speaking. But not sure if this is doable.



It's easily doable. Anyone with the resources to have a remote camera inside the competition areas of a world class gymnastics meet also has access to electrical power at that location. AC couplers (instead of batteries) and outputting the video over LAN or HDMI cable allows the screen to be left off and the camera powered indefinitely.




allanjay said:


> I don't know that, but seeing there is no mention of what could be potentially be a groundbreaking new feature for many sports shooters, I assume it sounds pretty much like the predecessors. Which is not surprising, of course. I'm just listing things that would be strong selling points. Esp. for shooters considering a switch to mirrorless.



The press release does mention electronic shutter, which even a sceptic like yourself should surely assume is silent? How long do you want the press release to be in order to explicitly mention every single feature of a camera that will have a User's Manual that is 500-600 pages or more?




allanjay said:


> I didn't read that from the press release. Are you sure you can transfer files from the built-in WiFi unit - and does it support both ad hoc (direct connection to another device) and infrastructure (connection to an Access Point)? I was excited to read this part, but they immediately go on to mention a new WFT device in relation to file transfers. It just doesn't seem very innovative for 2020 to still have to rely on a clunky 500-600 USD appendage.




It may not have been in the actual press release. The video posted about 2 minutes after midnight EDT by B&H on the date of the announcement may have been where I first saw it. The external WiFi unit is for when longer radio range is needed. The internal WiFi radio is capable of all the same functions as the external unit. The difference is that the non-external antenna is more limited in range due to the camera's metal alloy body.



allanjay said:


> I guess they might, but no real mention of this in the press release. AF improvements seemed mostly to be in live view mode.



Again, how long do you want a press release announcement telling of a camera under development that is still a few months away from release to be?




allanjay said:


> No, and it is indeed an interesting new addition/potential improvement if it can be pulled off successfully. So I hope they know what they are doing as this is an essential working function.



So basically, you're assuming anything they are claiming to improve won't be an actual improvement because you hope it is the case so that you'll feel more secure in being a fan of another brand's products?


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 28, 2019)

BillB said:


> The electronic shutter may be silent, but what about the mirror?



I assume you've used current Canon DSLRs in Live View? The mirror stays locked up the entire time unless one has selected using the dedicated viewfinder PDAF system for AF instead of the using the default main imaging sensor based AF.


----------



## Joules (Oct 28, 2019)

Michael Clark said:


> I assume you've used current Canon DSLRs in Live View? The mirror stays locked up the entire time unless one has selected using the dedicated viewfinder PDAF system for AF instead of the using the default main imaging sensor based AF.


I think the comment's point was to show that the silence can only be achieved in LiveView, which is a limitation.


----------



## Viggo (Oct 28, 2019)

Joules said:


> I think the comment's point was to show that the silence can only be achieved in LiveView, which is a limitation.


Is it though? An optical VF can’t really be 100% silent when mechanic are involved. It’s the nature of a DSLR.


----------



## Joules (Oct 28, 2019)

Viggo said:


> Is it though? An optical VF can’t really be 100% silent when mechanic are involved. It’s the nature of a DSLR.


That's what I said, right? You can't have it silent unless you use LiveView.


----------



## Viggo (Oct 28, 2019)

Joules said:


> That's what I said, right? You can't have it silent unless you use LiveView.


Yeah, I just don’t think it’s a real limitation.


----------



## Michael Clark (Oct 29, 2019)

Joules said:


> I think the comment's point was to show that the silence can only be achieved in LiveView, which is a limitation.



The previous comment to which I was responded said nothing about Live View. It asked about the mirror.


----------



## Cochese (Oct 29, 2019)

Kit. said:


> It's money you might have wanted to use for something else. Like a downpayment for your new home. Or paid education for your children. Or, if you are really cheap, even a photo tour to Serengeti.
> 
> 
> How much do you think an average pro photographer earns?


According the internet, around $52k - $72k a year, depending on what they do, their location, and how many clients they can take on. Most of the working (commercial) professionals I know are more around the $55-$60k mark. The one I work with/ for earns closer to $70k and will likely make a lot more in the coming year due to scoring three new contracts for GM events. 
If we're talking the working wedding, senior, and/ or baby photographers (usually overlapping, but not always), I know and work with about a dozen or so (I'm the person they buy their prints from, framed, edited, etc...) and they all make around $30-$40k from the photography, and probably a little more from the prints, depending how they handle that part. It varies a lot. 
None of them are using a 1D level of camera, or even Nikon D[x] level camera. Just a whole lot of 5DII/ III/ IV, and D700/ D800/810/ 850. Buy the camera you can afford, that gets the job done that you need. Not a single one of them are require a 1Dx level camera. I do know a few photographers who sport a 1Dx and and 1DxII. They're not professionals by any means. Just wealthy folk who are really really really into birding.


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## Michael Clark (Oct 31, 2019)

Cochese said:


> According the internet, around $52k - $72k a year, depending on what they do, their location, and how many clients they can take on. Most of the working (commercial) professionals I know are more around the $55-$60k mark. The one I work with/ for earns closer to $70k and will likely make a lot more in the coming year due to scoring three new contracts for GM events.
> If we're talking the working wedding, senior, and/ or baby photographers (usually overlapping, but not always), I know and work with about a dozen or so (I'm the person they buy their prints from, framed, edited, etc...) and they all make around $30-$40k from the photography, and probably a little more from the prints, depending how they handle that part. It varies a lot.
> None of them are using a 1D level of camera, or even Nikon D[x] level camera. Just a whole lot of 5DII/ III/ IV, and D700/ D800/810/ 850. Buy the camera you can afford, that gets the job done that you need. Not a single one of them are require a 1Dx level camera. I do know a few photographers who sport a 1Dx and and 1DxII. They're not professionals by any means. Just wealthy folk who are really really really into birding.



How many salaried staff photographers do you know? I realize there are a lot fewer of them than just 5-10 years ago. Not many of them are making more than mid-five figures, and many do well to make the lower threshold of a mid-five figure salary. Of course, lots of them also do freelancing on the side...

According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the *average* annual *salary* of a *photographer* working in the United States was $36,580 as of May 2011. This is based on income actually reported to the IRS by people filing their tax return listing "photographer" as their primary occupation...

Yes, 2011 was eight years ago. While the cost of living has increased since then, the law of supply and demand has held full time photographer's compensation stagnant for the most part. The number of career staff photographers at media companies large and small has plummeted to near nothing.

Edit: OK, I found the most recent BLS numbers: In May, 2018 the average annual salary had increased to $42,770, but the median salary (the point at which half of the people make more and the other half make less) is only $34,000.

Here's zip recruiter's info as of 10/24/2019:




A good number of folks in the U.S. in 2019 who describe themselves as a "photographer" for their primary occupation work for places that do school photos, guest photos at tourist attractions, etc. Those folks rarely make more than 10-15 bucks an hour. Many of them are seasonal workers who work full time for 3-4 months in the fall and another 2-3 months in the spring (school photography companies) or only work full time during peak tourist season for their locale.

Then there is the whole issue of self-employed photographers reporting their gross income rather than their net income when discussing it with others or self-reporting to sites like GlassDoor. As this slrlounge article illustrates, net income for independent wedding photographers is usually somewhere around _half_ of gross after business expenses and taxes are subtracted.


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## HarryFilm (Nov 6, 2019)

Jethro said:


> All of that and voiding your camera warranty at the same time - the benefits never end!



We've voided the warranty of EVERY camera we've got because we customize so much ...BUT... when you're a company that has 40+ C700's and 40+ C300 mk2's and 60+ 1Dx2s and who knows how many 5D 2's/3's/4's, Canon will do whatever we want them to if they want to ensure we buy another 40+ C500 mk2s! or 60 more 1Dx3's! And ADD other few million dollars worth of L-series lenses!

.

When we say fix it! Canon Says When Do You Need it By? 

We haven't YET had a problem from Canon about getting our gear fixed/upgraded!

.


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## unfocused (Nov 6, 2019)

Michael Clark said:


> How many salaried staff photographers do you know? I realize there are a lot fewer of them than just 5-10 years ago. Not many of them are making more than mid-five figures, and many do well to make the lower threshold of a mid-five figure salary. Of course, lots of them also do freelancing on the side...
> 
> According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the *average* annual *salary* of a *photographer* working in the United States was $36,580 as of May 2011. This is based on income actually reported to the IRS by people filing their tax return listing "photographer" as their primary occupation...
> 
> ...


Thanks for the thorough research. Interesting to know. But, I've forgotten what the debate was about. I think it had something to do with batteries.


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