# Is a 46mp Canon EOS-1 on the Way? [CR1]



## Canon Rumors Guy (Sep 10, 2012)

```
<div name="googleone_share_1" style="position:relative;z-index:5;float: right; /*margin: 70px 0 0 0;*/ top:70px; right:120px; width:0;"><g:plusone size="tall" count="1" href="http://www.canonrumors.com/?p=11159"></g:plusone></div><div class="tweetmeme_button" style="float: right; margin:0 0 70px 70px;"><a class="tm_button" rel="&style=normal&b=2" href="http://www.canonrumors.com/?p=11159"></a></div>
<strong>Development Announcement?


</strong>I’m told it’s possible we’ll see an “in development” announcement sometime in 2012 for a large megapixel DSLR  from Canon. I have heard both 39mp and 46mp prototype(s) are out in the field.</p>
<p>In development announcements seem to be getting more popular with Canon and their high end products. As we’ve seen from the EOS-1D C and EF 200-400 f/4L IS 1.4X, it seems to allow them a lot of latitude in testing and helps with public relations. It also stops sites like this speculating on arrival of new products. :)</p>
<p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">c</span>r</strong></p>
```


----------



## adhocphotographer (Sep 10, 2012)

ANY news is better than none!  Bring it on! Will be interesting how well it will do vs the d800... really canon will have no excuse not to seriously out do it !


----------



## Lee Jay (Sep 10, 2012)

An EOS-1? When are they going to stop building these bodies with the grip permanently built-in? I'll never, ever buy one until they go back to how the 1V was built with a high-end removable grip.

If it looks like any of the 1-series digitals, I'm not interested.


----------



## SpareImp (Sep 10, 2012)

If it's in the 1-series, it will probably be twice the price of the D800, right? That's not really a direct competitor. I wonder when/if they'll release a comperable camera. A 5D3 with 46mp.


----------



## Louis (Sep 10, 2012)

I wonder if this NEW camera will have NEW sensor technology...............I very much doubt it.


----------



## hyles (Sep 10, 2012)

It doesn't sound to be a cheap FF. Hope Canon will announce first a cheap FF, a sort of 5DIIn, then it can even produce 100mp camera, there will allways be someone interested in, but for my needs it is better a cheap FF... otherway i'll get a 5DII.
Diego


----------



## neuroanatomist (Sep 10, 2012)

Lee Jay said:


> An EOS-1? When are they going to stop building these bodies with the grip permanently built-in?



Never, I hope. 

Put a removable grip on a body. Hold the body in one hand, the grip in the other. Move your hands. Feel the flex? Now...put an AS-type plate or L-bracket on the bottom of the grip, mount it on a solid tripod. That flex translates to vibration, and vibration costs sharpness. Oh, just remove the grip? Very inconvenient, for me. 

Love the integrated grip of the digital 1-series bodies!


----------



## Lawliet (Sep 10, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> Oh, just remove the grip? Very inconvenient, for me.



They could make it at least easily removable, w/o involving the battery compartment and perhaps using dedicated clamps.
But a 1series body has its strong poins...
And don't skimp on the metering, sync speed and all that analog stuff that seperates 1Dx and 5D3!


----------



## M.ST (Sep 10, 2012)

Don´t expect a high megapixel camera (FF) from Canon in the price range of a D800E.


----------



## pakosouthpark (Sep 10, 2012)

sure some lads will be happy with this news! but definitely canon should focus on the cheap FF first!


----------



## xps (Sep 10, 2012)

SpareImp said:


> If it's in the 1-series, it will probably be twice the price of the D800, right? That's not really a direct competitor. I wonder when/if they'll release a comperable camera. A 5D3 with 46mp.



+1
6000€+ for this Camera, when you can get an D800 for 2600€??? 
In my opinion, if Canon does not launch an cheaper model around 2500-3000€ with 35+MP, they will loose a lot of photographers.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Sep 10, 2012)

xps said:


> In my opinion, if Canon does not launch an cheaper model around 2500-3000€ with 35+MP, they will loose a lot of photographers.



Are they 'losing a lot of photographers' to the D800 now? :


----------



## Bob Howland (Sep 10, 2012)

SpareImp said:


> If it's in the 1-series, it will probably be twice the price of the D800, right? That's not really a direct competitor. I wonder when/if they'll release a comperable camera. A 5D3 with 46mp.



Soon, if they're smart, and charge $4500 for it. How many landscape and studio photographers need the ruggedness of a 1Dx body, especially if the alternative is buying two cameras with the same sensor but in a 5D3 body, for the same or lower total cost?


----------



## SwampYankee (Sep 10, 2012)

pakosouthpark said:


> sure some lads will be happy with this news! but definitely canon should focus on the cheap FF first!



I think they will address the advanced amateur market first. The 60D and the 7D are much in need of a refresh and as the 7D is 3 years old the regular product life cycle would mean there is something in the works. As for the high MP camera here? If true this is the answer to the Nikon D-800E. Canon can sit and let Nikon take over the landscape and nature markets. I think challenging the 800E is not something that can be done quickly so unless Canon had something in the works all along this may be announced as a work in progress. What ever it is I'm sure I won't be bale to afford it buy I guess I will buy a lottery ticket. One can dream


----------



## DB (Sep 10, 2012)

The Nikon D800 with it's 36MP sensor produces 75MB RAW files, so a 46MP sensor would result in files sizes of around 100 megabytes per shot, so a 1-2 second burst could fill 1 Gigabyte of your CF card! A longer series of rapid burst could theoretically fill an entire 16Gb memory card. Not to mention increased storage costs/problems.

I'd prefer a 24MP to 27MP cheaper FF body for now (so I could upgrade from a 7D)


----------



## Bob Howland (Sep 10, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> xps said:
> 
> 
> > In my opinion, if Canon does not launch an cheaper model around 2500-3000€ with 35+MP, they will loose a lot of photographers.
> ...



Yes


----------



## SwampYankee (Sep 10, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> xps said:
> 
> 
> > In my opinion, if Canon does not launch an cheaper model around 2500-3000€ with 35+MP, they will loose a lot of photographers.
> ...


No, not yet, but if you were new to the pro market it's a tough choice between the D800 and the 5D3. I guess one lends itself to the wedding market and the other to the landscape market but if I was starting from scratch the Nikon is a compelling camera


----------



## Lawliet (Sep 10, 2012)

xps said:


> they will loose a lot of photographers.



A few gearheads maybe - those MPs have little effect for most jobs; good lenses, technique or a phase one IQ180+leaf shutter have more impact.


----------



## bkorcel (Sep 10, 2012)

Well that means some complete redesigns of their L glass as there will be no benefit to having 46MP if the lenses cannot resolve enough to take advantage of it. Unfortunately that means probably a 5000.00 price tag for a revised 24-70 L lens.


----------



## Lee Jay (Sep 10, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> Lee Jay said:
> 
> 
> > An EOS-1? When are they going to stop building these bodies with the grip permanently built-in?
> ...



With a regular grip, yes. With a grip like on the 1V, no.


----------



## aldvan (Sep 10, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> Lee Jay said:
> 
> 
> > An EOS-1? When are they going to stop building these bodies with the grip permanently built-in?
> ...



I fully agree. When you need a main battle tank you don't want a truck with the addition of some armoured plates. An integrated full body is something very different from a battery grip. I have a 1Ds MkIII and a 5D MkII. When I need something totally reliable and balanced without compromise I haven't any doubt and go for the 1Ds.


----------



## Cali_PH (Sep 10, 2012)

Bob Howland said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > xps said:
> ...



I don't know how many they've lost so far, but if this rumor turns out to be true, I'm guessing they'll lose a few more.

I'm a landscape guy, and often end up chatting with other landscape shooters in the field, for example waiting at a spot waiting for sunset. I've had about half a dozen people in the last few months tell me they were seriously interested in getting the D800, but were first waiting to see what Canon came up with. Plus I've seen the same comments from other landscape people on forums. 

If this EOS-1 is the only high MP camera announced any time soon, and if it's priced as high as some of us suspect, it'd be interesting to see how many actually switch. I sure some will, especially to use with Nikon's 14-24. But some will change their mind once they factor in having to buy Nikon glass and accessories. Obviously I'm simplifying things, as there's a bunch of other factors that like ergonomics, which lenses these individuals have vs. Nikon equivalents etc.

Although it's looking like the 'Canon glass is cheaper' argument isn't as valid anymore for the top new lenses, given the latest prices (e.g., 24-70 II). It'll be interesting to see what older L-glass performs well with that kind of resolution; I've read arguments on both sides, but don't have the technical background to know which side is true.


----------



## RLPhoto (Sep 10, 2012)

46MP? Almost an 8000 x 6000 Pixel size? That's crazy for 35mm.

http://web.forret.com/tools/megapixel.asp?width=7935&height=5800

Look at the estimated sizes for the files.


----------



## motorhead (Sep 10, 2012)

As long as they realise this needs to beat, not just match, the Nikon D800E, then its on my wish list. Hopefully this will be the updated 1Ds I've been waiting for, with world class DR, mind blowing resolution, and none of the irritating banding issues or pattern noise problems besetting all the existing bodies.

Interesting how long its taken Canon to respond to Nikons D800E, when they must have known about it a long time before the average joe did, gagging orders or no gagging orders.


----------



## Cannon Man (Sep 10, 2012)

motorhead said:


> As long as they realise this needs to beat, not just match, the Nikon D800E, then its on my wish list. Hopefully this will be the updated 1Ds I've been waiting for, with world class DR, mind blowing resolution, and none of the irritating banding issues or pattern noise problems besetting all the existing bodies.
> 
> Interesting how long its taken Canon to respond to Nikons D800E, when they must have known about it a long time before the average joe did, gagging orders or no gagging orders.



I would think it would beat the D800E, canon has been holding back for a reason.

This would be the long waited 1Ds replacement.


----------



## Cannon Man (Sep 10, 2012)

DB said:


> The Nikon D800 with it's 36MP sensor produces 75MB RAW files, so a 46MP sensor would result in files sizes of around 100 megabytes per shot, so a 1-2 second burst could fill 1 Gigabyte of your CF card! A longer series of rapid burst could theoretically fill an entire 16Gb memory card. Not to mention increased storage costs/problems.
> 
> I'd prefer a 24MP to 27MP cheaper FF body for now (so I could upgrade from a 7D)



Anything between 26-40mp and i'm happy, though i would prefer 26-30mp


----------



## DzPhotography (Sep 10, 2012)

Again, do,'t need it, so not very interested. Need high ISO performance way more than high MP... :


----------



## adamfilip (Sep 10, 2012)

I hope they never stop making them with Built in Grips.. thats the reason I havent bought a 5D, I hate add on grips.




Lee Jay said:


> An EOS-1? When are they going to stop building these bodies with the grip permanently built-in? I'll never, ever buy one until they go back to how the 1V was built with a high-end removable grip.
> 
> If it looks like any of the 1-series digitals, I'm not interested.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Sep 10, 2012)

Bob Howland said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > xps said:
> ...



P
Can you please post a link to the sales figures/reports/ranking that back up that claim?


----------



## Bob Howland (Sep 10, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> Bob Howland said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...



Why? You post sales figures that they're not. That is the clear implication of your question.


----------



## RLPhoto (Sep 10, 2012)

Bob Howland said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > Bob Howland said:
> ...



Innocent until proven guilty. :-X


----------



## Mt Spokane Photography (Sep 10, 2012)

DB said:


> The Nikon D800 with it's 36MP sensor produces 75MB RAW files, so a 46MP sensor would result in files sizes of around 100 megabytes per shot, so a 1-2 second burst could fill 1 Gigabyte of your CF card! A longer series of rapid burst could theoretically fill an entire 16Gb memory card. Not to mention increased storage costs/problems.
> 
> I'd prefer a 24MP to 27MP cheaper FF body for now (so I could upgrade from a 7D)


I took well over 1000 raw NEF images with my D800 before reselling it, many at very high ISO's like 12800. The largest file is 52,300 MB, and most of them are in the mid 40mb range.
I wonder why your files are running 75 MB? You must have a exceptionally noisey sensor.

However, when a raw file is uncompressed for editing, it can be three times the size of the raw. When applying NR or other complex PP edits, it seems to take forever. It is slow and painful.
I really wonder what it would be like to edit 1000+ images from a 46mp camera? Very painful is my thought.


----------



## mws (Sep 10, 2012)

Why are people so hung up on file size on big megapixel cameras? If you really need this sort of thing (think billboards, sides of buildings), you are already using files that big from MF cameras or scanned MF film. Some of Canon's newer glass clearly has the resolving power for this, it will be interested to see where it goes. 

Is this a new sensor, or just a higher MP variant of their existing technology? Personally I'd like to see Canon put their R/D into DR and not MP.


----------



## Bob Howland (Sep 10, 2012)

mws said:


> Is this a new sensor, or just a higher MP variant of their existing technology? Personally I'd like to see Canon put their R/D into DR and not MP.



So would I. The irony of my postings is that I'm not particularly interested in 46MP. I have a 5D3 (and a 7D) which is giving me excellent images. I'm set for a couple years.


----------



## xps (Sep 10, 2012)

Over all, you all are right. There are many factors that work together - resulting in an good or not so good picture.

But in our society, we are used to own always the newest and the best things. 
So, when I join my photoclub, then the semi-professionals are claiming the lower resolution of the 5DIII. Many of them do studio-photography or something in the surrounding area of that. The noise is much much. (The funny thing is, that there is an big variation of the picture quality - even using the same lenses and flashlight)

Some of them are more interested in sport-photography. They say, that the Mk3 is good. But the 800 is good too...

So, in my opinion Canon has to react. Not only in the 6000€ area, but in the 2500€ area too.


----------



## simonxu11 (Sep 10, 2012)

Development annoucement ?? The 200-400 was announced in Feb last year and we haven't seen it on the market. 
So good luck to all the people who are waiting for this, I hope you can get it before Nikon release their second-gen high mp dslr.
Be patient ;D


----------



## unfocused (Sep 10, 2012)

Why can't anyone actually read Craig's posts, instead of just skimming the attention grabber headline and jumping to conclusions? Nothing in the post about an EOS-1 style body. Nothing.



> ...if you were new to the pro market it's a tough choice between the D800 and the 5D3. I guess one lends itself to the wedding market and the other to the landscape market ...



You hit the nail on the head. Now ask yourself this: what do you think the ratio of professional wedding photographers is to professional landscape photographers – 1,000 to 1? 10,000 to 1? How many professional wedding photographers are there in your city? Now compare that to the number of persons who actually earn a living in landscape photography.

Canon targeted the 5DIII to a very specific professional market. It is about the only large professional photography market remaining. It is a market that is highly competitive and the practitioners cannot afford to let their competitor down the street gain a technological edge. As with almost everything in life, it's not the best technology that wins...it is the best technology that meets a market need that wins. 

In contrast the D800 is a very nice high resolution camera, but there is no large, clearly defined professional audience. Right now the D800 is selling very well to meet pent up demand from Nikon shooters. But once that demand is met, will they be able to sustain the market? Not so sure. On the other hand, eventually almost every wedding photographer in the world will end up buying a 5DIII because they need to edge that its high ISO performance gives them when shooting. (Unless of course they go for the 1D-X, with even better high ISO performance.)


----------



## Mt Spokane Photography (Sep 10, 2012)

mws said:


> Is this a new sensor, or just a higher MP variant of their existing technology? Personally I'd like to see Canon put their R/D into DR and not MP.


I suspect it is silicone based just like all other s3nsors. What new technology is out there that works better?


----------



## cliffwang (Sep 10, 2012)

xps said:


> +1
> 6000€+ for this Camera, when you can get an D800 for 2600€???
> In my opinion, if Canon does not launch an cheaper model around 2500-3000€ with 35+MP, they will loose a lot of photographers.


I don't think Canon will have any 35+ MP camera for that price range. If so, how can Canon adjust the prices for all DSLR lines? Actually Canon is smart to have 46MP camera, so you don't have to compare EOS-1 with D800 because their MP are very different. Now Canon can ask 7000+ for this camera, and the price will also not impact other Canon cameras.


----------



## xps (Sep 10, 2012)

cliffwang said:


> xps said:
> 
> 
> > +1
> ...



Indeed.
Nikon did an good job, placing this Camera in the 2500-3000€ region.

Maybe the pressure on the market leds Canon build an counterpart to the 800E in the same price area


----------



## bdunbar79 (Sep 10, 2012)

If there is a high MP camera introduced by Canon, and I'm sure there will be, if you want it priced where the D800 is, it will have just as poor of ISO performance. It will have to, otherwise it'll be priced way above the 5D3. You'll get what you pay for; more MP's for much higher noise at higher ISO values. I absolutely must have high ISO performance so this camera won't be for me.


----------



## cliffwang (Sep 10, 2012)

xps said:


> cliffwang said:
> 
> 
> > xps said:
> ...


I hope we will see that. However, I have kind feeling about Canon for recently its pricing of its products. Canon is not going to do the competition with Nikon directly. It will try to not have very similar product to avoid the price competition.


----------



## Lawliet (Sep 10, 2012)

DzPhotography said:


> Need high ISO performance way more than high MP... :



Thats what the 1Dx is for - at the time a new Canon will appear on the shelfs I'll have a few Pro-B4 making high ISO a consideration far behind DR/low iso noise. 8)


----------



## unfocused (Sep 10, 2012)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> mws said:
> 
> 
> > Is this a new sensor, or just a higher MP variant of their existing technology? Personally I'd like to see Canon put their R/D into DR and not MP.
> ...



Fuji has talked about (not produced) a sensor that merges silicon with organic silver-halide (as in film) technology. Early claims were that APS-C size sensors would outperform full frame sensors. Obviously it is not ready for the marketplace yet, but I suspect that the next breakthrough in sensor technology will be something none of us were expecting.


----------



## lola (Sep 10, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> xps said:
> 
> 
> > In my opinion, if Canon does not launch an cheaper model around 2500-3000€ with 35+MP, they will loose a lot of photographers.
> ...



I'm sure there's a reasonable number of photographers who are able to recognize the image quality of D800.


----------



## charlesa (Sep 10, 2012)

I do not believe it is doable, not at the D800 price point, and not without a new sensor. And Canon is not losing sleep over losing customers to Nikon over the D800.


----------



## KitsVancouver (Sep 10, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> Lee Jay said:
> 
> 
> > An EOS-1? When are they going to stop building these bodies with the grip permanently built-in?
> ...



Agreed. My biggest and possibly only complaint with battery grips is the flex that exists between the body and grip when doing tripod work.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Sep 10, 2012)

Bob Howland said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > Bob Howland said:
> ...



Sorry, but my sentence ended in a question mark. Yours did not. Which one is a statement?

My point is that claims of 'outselling' or 'users switching in droves' are bogus - regardless of which way people claim the advantage - AFAIK, there are no data to support either claim. Thus the :

I'll thank you to not put words in my mouth, though...


----------



## neuroanatomist (Sep 10, 2012)

lola said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > xps said:
> ...



Sure, and I'm among them. But I didn't switch... Where are Nikon's versions of a high quality 80/100-400, 28-300, and anything like my MP-E 65?

The 14-24 is certainly a nice lens - but 36 MP is hard on that lens' corner performance.


----------



## bvukich (Sep 10, 2012)

Bob Howland said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > Bob Howland said:
> ...



The burden of proof is on the claimant.

Unless you're just talking out of your rear lens cap, which I suspect is the case.


----------



## Aglet (Sep 10, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> lola said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...



Just put my new 14-24mm on the d800 this weekend for a few test shots in the countryside.
Certainly does have some CA in the borders and corners but that cleans up pretty well with one click on the checkbox in Photoshop's ACR front end.
That lens is pretty good, tho not perfect. 14mm made for some pretty wide pastoral scenes tho. Looking forward to what else I can do with it.

as for Canon losing customers...
They didn't get any money from me this year. Instead I bought 4 Nikon bodies, included the 800 and the 800e, a few new high end lenses and a pile of cheaper ones.

IF Canon had just ONE FF body with as good base ISO noise performance as any of the current Nikons I would have bought it, maybe even two of them. 
As it stands, more of my creative and outdoor work is going to the other camp but I wish it weren't, as I still prefer many things about using Canon gear; the appearance of the images their bodies produce, many of the fine lenses they have.

What they announce in the next few months, whether delivery is soon or in 2013, will determine what equipment will dominate my toolbox.
If they can't kill the read/banding noise even more than in the 1Dx then I'll be selling some of the Canon gear that's been outperformed by the new competition.
Invariably that means I'll be buying more from the other guys. Plenty of enthusiasts, landscapers and other non-hi-iso types will likely consider doing the same. We're not all married to our brand of tools and toys.


----------



## lola (Sep 10, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> lola said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...



"Switching" is too radical a term I think...
For example, a colleague of mine decided to wait for Canon and bought nothing for the moment.
Another colleague of mine got pissed with all the drama and went MF.
I did not switch either, but I've said what the hell and got myself a D800, a 70/200 and a 60 macro. Now I don't care whether Canon or Nikon releases the camera for my taste/need 'cos I'll be investing in both systems .

The way I see it, these three example photographers are customers lost to Canon since they didn't buy Canon gear for some reason or the other.


----------



## Stone (Sep 10, 2012)

There's been no evidence of a mass exodus to the dark side due to the D800, there's always far more talk of switching, than actual switching. Going with Canon or Nikon is buying into a system, the camera body having the shortest lifespan in that system. Lenses and accessories remain current far longer than camera bodies and generally are far more expensive to replace. Alot of people scream they're gonna switch until they do the math, admittedly some do end up changing brands, most do not.

No different than when Nikon shooters were complaining about the how inadequate 12.1 MP was on the D700 compared to the 5DII, they were screaming mass exodus but nothing happened then either. Wash, rinse, repeat....


----------



## wickidwombat (Sep 11, 2012)

Nikon make good cameras and lenses, Canon make good cameras and lenses however
anyone that can't take a good photo with a 5Dmk3 and thinks a D800 will help them is in for a nasty shock

blah blah 12 inches behind the camera and all that jazz


----------



## XanuFoto (Sep 11, 2012)

Canon and Nikon will always stay in business because they are the two biggest companies. Occasionally a few people will switch brands. That's a given. Alot of people made a huge fuss that they would switch to d800. Some did and most did not. And life goes on. Let's just make great pictures and that you can do with any decent dslr on the market at the moment.


----------



## c.d.embrey (Sep 11, 2012)

Lee Jay said:


> An EOS-1? When are they going to stop building these bodies with the grip permanently built-in? I'll never, ever buy one until they go back to how the 1V was built with a high-end removable grip.
> 
> If it looks like any of the 1-series digitals, I'm not interested.



I agree 100%!! For me, a grippless camera and a prime lens makes more sense for what I do. 

Gripped cameras are the Red Porsches of the camera world  I don't need to impress people with either the size of my lens or my camera body


----------



## wickidwombat (Sep 11, 2012)

c.d.embrey said:


> Lee Jay said:
> 
> 
> > An EOS-1? When are they going to stop building these bodies with the grip permanently built-in? I'll never, ever buy one until they go back to how the 1V was built with a high-end removable grip.
> ...


I'm so jumping on this wagon, bulky body is the major reason i don't want a 1Dx I would love an APS-H sensor in a 5Dmk3 body too


----------



## tnargs (Sep 11, 2012)

Stone said:


> There's been no evidence of a mass exodus to the dark side due to the D800, there's always far more talk of switching, than actual switching. ....



Makes one wonder whether they are in competition, or just coexistence? If it is _so hard _ to win some sales from the other company....


----------



## Mt Spokane Photography (Sep 11, 2012)

tnargs said:


> Stone said:
> 
> 
> > There's been no evidence of a mass exodus to the dark side due to the D800, there's always far more talk of switching, than actual switching. ....
> ...


Yes, it is hard. Nikon had to take trade-ins of Canon Cameras and lenses a few years back in order to get a big sale with a major wire service. Having huge numbers of dollars invested in lenses, flashes, not to mention bodies is not a trivial thing.
Of course, switching from a $150 point and shoot might not cost as much, but its still going to be painful to someone who squeezed his budget for that $150.


----------



## tnargs (Sep 11, 2012)

Canon Rumors said:


> ....In development announcements seem to be getting more popular with Canon and their high end products. ....



Do you think that this trend to 'in development' announcements is restricted to relatively new products? Ones that won't necessarily affect sales of existing Canon products?


----------



## Lee Jay (Sep 11, 2012)

wickidwombat said:


> I'm so jumping on this wagon, bulky body is the major reason i don't want a 1Dx I would love an APS-H sensor in a 5Dmk3 body too



I think most of those whining about the flex of an add-on grip are only familiar with the current ones, which indeed have some flex, but haven't tried the one I posted. It was quite solid - as solid as a current 1D body, I'd say. And it wouldn't be hard at all to make it even stiffer than it was way back then.


----------



## jrista (Sep 11, 2012)

bkorcel said:


> Well that means some complete redesigns of their L glass as there will be no benefit to having 46MP if the lenses cannot resolve enough to take advantage of it. Unfortunately that means probably a 5000.00 price tag for a revised 24-70 L lens.



Sorry, thats a load of crap. The Canon 7D 18mp APS-C sensor has a 4.3 micron pixel pitch, which is slightly smaller than a 46mp FF sensor would have. Canon lenses resolve plenty of detail for the Canon 7D, particularly the new lenses released in the last few years (which offer STELLAR IQ at WIDE apertures, pushing 200lp/mm or more.) Lenses will NOT be a problem with a 46mp FF sensor.


----------



## jrista (Sep 11, 2012)

RLPhoto said:


> 46MP? Almost an 8000 x 6000 Pixel size? That's crazy for 35mm.
> 
> http://web.forret.com/tools/megapixel.asp?width=7935&height=5800
> 
> Look at the estimated sizes for the files.



That would depend on whether those pixels are better than a current Canon pixel. If Canon can improve IQ on a per-pixel basis, like the D800 with its Sony Exmor sensor has done, then no...thats not crazy for 35mm. Its the same pixel pitch as the Canon 7D...so its not exactly that much new ground for Canon. Hell, they already produced a prototype 120mp APS-H sensor with a reasonable readout rate, so I really don't think 46mp is crazy or even unreasonable in 35mm format.


----------



## jrista (Sep 11, 2012)

Bob Howland said:


> mws said:
> 
> 
> > Is this a new sensor, or just a higher MP variant of their existing technology? Personally I'd like to see Canon put their R/D into DR and not MP.
> ...



Its been demonstrated that you can have both MP and IQ...with the D800 and D3200. Why should we ask for less from Canon? They have a ton of patents up their sleeve, including a layered (foveon-esque) sensor design. I think Canon can do more than one thing or the other...they should start competing, on all fronts, and give their customers quality at every level.


----------



## jrista (Sep 11, 2012)

charlesa said:


> I do not believe it is doable, not at the D800 price point, and not without a new sensor. And Canon is not losing sleep over losing customers to Nikon over the D800.



I think its highly speculative to think Canon is losing enough customers to matter to the D800. Keep in mind, despite its great sensor, the D800 (and D4, for that matter) have had quite a few problems of their own, from a very yellow-green LCD, to RAW images that mirrored that yellow-green hue, CF card compatibility problems, tethered shooting issues, a couple AF issues (that has caused many a D800 owner quite a lot of problems requiring multiple returns to Nikon support), and on top of all of that, Nikon throughout it all has often denied, even in the face of mass evidence by the online community, that the problems were even real...and demonstrated they have vastly inferior support to Canon, making their customers jump through a myriad of hoops and hoopla just to get some necessary service.

Sorry...I don't think Canon has anything to lose sleep over. The only edge the D800 has is ISO 100/200 DR and some extra megapixels, and it seems the extra megapixels deal won't be much of an edge for long. DR is important, but I would take Canon's "crappy" sensor tech and their stellar customer support over Nikon any day.


----------



## Meh (Sep 11, 2012)

bvukich said:


> Bob Howland said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...



I second that!


----------



## Meh (Sep 11, 2012)

@jrista very well said as always.

There is no utopia in any one set of design parameters.


----------



## RGomezPhotos (Sep 11, 2012)

I hope this is a medium-format camera. It's really the next step in technology with Full-Frame cameras becoming much more affordable and common.


----------



## paulrossjones (Sep 11, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> Bob Howland said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...




i did a quick telly up of all the professional advertising photographers i know (im friends with quite a few), and i would say half have changed to or about change to nikon.

i would too, but im not a fan of nikon lenses, and am waiting eagerly for a better sensored higher res camera than my very disappointing 5dmk3. 

paul


----------



## jrista (Sep 11, 2012)

Meh said:


> @jrista very well said as always.



Thanks. 



Meh said:


> There is no utopia in any one set of design parameters.



Bliss will only come with the *last camera ever to be made!*


----------



## RomanRacela (Sep 11, 2012)

xps said:


> SpareImp said:
> 
> 
> > If it's in the 1-series, it will probably be twice the price of the D800, right? That's not really a direct competitor. I wonder when/if they'll release a comperable camera. A 5D3 with 46mp.
> ...



My friend just bought a Nikon D800 to replace his 5D Mk2. I'm thinking of doing the switch too. I wish the 5D Mk3 had at least 35MP.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Sep 11, 2012)

jrista said:


> Meh said:
> 
> 
> > There is no utopia in any one set of design parameters.
> ...



Naaah. Even then, people will complain.


----------



## meli (Sep 11, 2012)

jrista said:


> I think its highly speculative to think Canon is losing enough customers to matter to the D800. Keep in mind, despite its great sensor, the D800 (and D4, for that matter) have had quite a few problems of their own, from a very yellow-green LCD, to RAW images that mirrored that yellow-green hue, CF card compatibility problems, tethered shooting issues, a couple AF issues (that has caused many a D800 owner quite a lot of problems requiring multiple returns to Nikon support), and on top of all of that, Nikon throughout it all has often denied, even in the face of mass evidence by the online community, that the problems were even real...and demonstrated they have vastly inferior support to Canon, making their customers jump through a myriad of hoops and hoopla just to get some necessary service.
> 
> Sorry...I don't think Canon has anything to lose sleep over. The only edge the D800 has is ISO 100/200 DR and some extra megapixels, and it seems the extra megapixels deal won't be much of an edge for long. DR is important, but I would take Canon's "crappy" sensor tech and their stellar customer support over Nikon any day.



out of the 4 people i know that shopped D800s, 2 were Canonnites since the film days; one of' em started selling gear, the other, yours truly, is comfortable staying in both camps ;D
We're not talking about rebels here, in this price bracket each lost client means 5k euros

as for this:


jrista said:


> ...Nikon throughout it all has often denied, even in the face of mass evidence by the online community, that the problems were even real...and demonstrated they have vastly inferior support to Canon, making their customers jump through a myriad of hoops and hoopla just to get some necessary service...


set back the clock to 2007, swap brands and its just starts smelling like 1d3 autofocus & Canon's "superior support"


----------



## Sith Zombie (Sep 11, 2012)

Don't get too excited everyone! I heard a rumor that the sensor in the camera will be 2 of the 18mp sensors just stuck together with a bit of black tape


----------



## Lawliet (Sep 11, 2012)

paulrossjones said:


> i did a quick telly up of all the professional advertising photographers i know (im friends with quite a few), and i would say half have changed to or about change to nikon.



Why to Nikon instead of just going MF...
My clients don't care about C or N - either 35mm does the job or a serious step forward is called for.


----------



## jrista (Sep 11, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> jrista said:
> 
> 
> > Meh said:
> ...



Hah! Yeah, your probably right.


----------



## Mt Spokane Photography (Sep 11, 2012)

tnargs said:


> Canon Rumors said:
> 
> 
> > ....In development announcements seem to be getting more popular with Canon and their high end products. ....
> ...


Development of the new super teles was combined with stopping production of the existing ones such that they were not generally available for well over a year. That certainly hit Canon sales as well as their bottom line. Same with the announcement of the 24-70mm MK II.


----------



## Meh (Sep 11, 2012)

Sith Zombie said:


> Don't get too excited everyone! I heard a rumor that the sensor in the camera will be 2 of the 18mp sensors just stuck together with a bit of black tape



See now that's a funny comment... love it!


----------



## Meh (Sep 11, 2012)

paulrossjones said:


> i did a quick telly up of all the professional advertising photographers i know (im friends with quite a few), and i would say half have changed to or about change to nikon.
> 
> i would too, but im not a fan of nikon lenses, and am waiting eagerly for a better sensored higher res camera than my very disappointing 5dmk3.
> 
> paul



Everyone is always "about to change"... what percentage actually did change? Not just giving you a hard time... it's a good point. Advertising photographers really do have value in the higher resolution and there's a few on this forum that are also "about to change to MF if Canon doesn't put out a higher res body soon". Their reason being that price has come down on MF digital backs to make the leap but they will stay with Canon for cost, ergonomics, lenses, etc. IF a higher res body comes out.


----------



## bdunbar79 (Sep 11, 2012)

RGomezPhotos said:


> I hope this is a medium-format camera. It's really the next step in technology with Full-Frame cameras becoming much more affordable and common.



Although I'd like to see that as well, I'm 99.9% sure it won't be a medium-format camera. Not nearly enough market demand.


----------



## RuneL (Sep 12, 2012)

paulrossjones said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > Bob Howland said:
> ...



I just did a quick tally too, amongst the photogs I know 3 use Nikon, the rest, a bunch of 15 I guess use Canon. None have switched to nikon and the commercial/advertising photogs I know shoot mainly DMF. So yeah, so much for on the fly statistics.


----------



## RuneL (Sep 12, 2012)

Lee Jay said:


> wickidwombat said:
> 
> 
> > I'm so jumping on this wagon, bulky body is the major reason i don't want a 1Dx I would love an APS-H sensor in a 5Dmk3 body too
> ...



No matter how you cut it, a removable grip will be more brittle and apt to break than the current one being a part of the frame, also it will let in moisture and dust and shit. The 1D is a stupidly solid camera and I hope they never change the way they make it.


----------



## Nathan (Sep 12, 2012)

Really hope there is some truth to this rumor. Have been holding off purchasing a Hasselblad in the hope Canon would come out with a large MP camera. I waited and waited for the 1DS mk III sucessor only to find it was a lower resolution 1DX - very disappointing. Hurry up Canon - it is about time you stopped loosing business to the medium format segment of the market.


----------



## Bob Howland (Sep 12, 2012)

RuneL said:


> I just did a quick tally too, amongst the photogs I know 3 use Nikon, the rest, a bunch of 15 I guess use Canon. None have switched to nikon and the commercial/advertising photogs I know shoot mainly DMF. So yeah, so much for on the fly statistics.



What is "DMF", digital medium format?


----------



## aldvan (Sep 12, 2012)

c.d.embrey said:


> I agree 100%!! For me, a grippless camera and a prime lens makes more sense for what I do.
> 
> Gripped cameras are the Red Porsches of the camera world  I don't need to impress people with either the size of my lens or my camera body



The point, as always, is in those 'for me'...'for what I do'. For many other people gripped cameras are absolutely 'for me' and 'for what I do'. Very often people are focused on 'what they do' without considering 'what other people do'. We live in a very complex world and there are so many different 'what I do'. But the problem is that too often people seem annoyed to allow other people to have what they need for what they do, if that is different from 'what I do'. The same attitude against high megapixels... I can understand that in many fields, different from mine, high megapixels can be useless or disturbing, but 'for what I do', the amount of information in a picture is capital. I remember the recent time when 12 Mpx seemed simply an exaggeration. I'm very happy that the market offers a large range of different options different from my needs...

About red Porsches. As a serious Porsche driver, I find the example out of the target. You could better refer to the large tail on the turbos. For many people it can be just a bragging feature, but when you drive really fast the 400-500 pounds of downforce are exactly what you need purposefully...


----------



## RuneL (Sep 12, 2012)

Bob Howland said:


> RuneL said:
> 
> 
> > I just did a quick tally too, amongst the photogs I know 3 use Nikon, the rest, a bunch of 15 I guess use Canon. None have switched to nikon and the commercial/advertising photogs I know shoot mainly DMF. So yeah, so much for on the fly statistics.
> ...



YES, or MFD or whatever


----------



## well_dunno (Sep 12, 2012)

Rumor goes at NL that this will be a 1 series body_ "with the emphasis on resolution, dynamic range and a true challenge to digital MF. The camera is aimed at showing 'clear technical leadership'."_


http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/cameras/Canon_1D_Xs.html

Cheers!


----------



## bdunbar79 (Sep 12, 2012)

NL also highly predicted the release of the 1Ds Mark IV in the fall of 2011.


----------



## paulrossjones (Sep 13, 2012)

Meh said:


> paulrossjones said:
> 
> 
> > i did a quick telly up of all the professional advertising photographers i know (im friends with quite a few), and i would say half have changed to or about change to nikon.
> ...



I know eight photographers that have changed. 
a couple were old nikon lovers, but many had never owned a nikon digital camera before. the couple of architecture photographers I know that own canons for the 17TE lens (which is outstanding) haven't moved because of that, but one of them has been testing the d800 and is impressed- comparing it to his aptus 75s back with both res and latitude.
These guys tend to shoot medium format with alpas, but there are plent of situations they need to shoot architecture but cant get the full authority (think china), so if they had a high MP canon with the 17te they can sneak great quality shots without looking much different than a tourist. 

One guy I know who shoots a pile of very famous big billboard and displays changed from contax/phase to d800. 
Hes says is more important to shoot a higher volume than have a few more megapixels. the d800 apparently has enough to retire his medium format back

thats the real reason i want more megapixels- i want all the speed of a dslr and higher iso than my contax phase p65+ so i can retire that and make my life easier. unless you are a tripod/ static shooter, medium format is a pain in the ass to use. 

if you see on my site (www.paulrossjones.com), i shoot open a lot, and my clients often demand medium format files sizes, but i want to shoot the speed of a dslr. 

a high MP canon would solve this for me.

paul


----------



## jouster (Sep 14, 2012)

Nathan said:


> Really hope there is some truth to this rumor. Have been holding off purchasing a Hasselblad in the hope Canon would come out with a large MP camera. I waited and waited for the 1DS mk III sucessor only to find it was a lower resolution 1DX - very disappointing. Hurry up Canon - it is about time you stopped loosing business to the medium format segment of the market.



It still wont rival the Hassy, which you should just buy.


----------

