# Tethered Shooting with 5D III & Microsoft Pro 3



## 360_6pack (Sep 2, 2014)

Hi all
I am looking for a setup to do tethered shooting for Architecture/Property interior & exterior shoots & was thinking of using the new SP3.
Has anyone any experience with the SP3 for shooting or post production in LR5 and if so could you please share with me the specs of your SP3 and your thoughts on it's suitability including screen colour accuracy.
The SP3 was only released in Australia Monday so its just showing up in stores now.
Any thoughts appreciated.
Michael


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## FEBS (Sep 2, 2014)

I don't have the Surface Pro 3. But my main job daily is developing modified software for the SME based on the Microsoft Dynamics platform. 

All the models of the Surface Pro, here available in Belgium, have 4Gb internal memory with the exception for version the 512Gb i7 version which has 8Gb internal memory.

I would never advice you to run LR on only 4Gb memory. I use a HP elitebook 8770w, dual i7 QM with 24Gb internal memory and 2 internal SSD harddisks. Does this laptop run smoothly? Mostly yes, but not that I never have to wait.

So the only advice I can give you is to think first again if you really want the Surface Pro as your post processing unit? If you decide to go on with the Surface Pro then please do take the 512Gb i7 with 8Gb internal memory. I know, its 1949€ over here, but only 4 Gb for LR is not enough !!

For shooting, even the basic version might be OK. But post processing asks for more power.


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## josephandrews222 (Sep 2, 2014)

FEBS said:


> I don't have the Surface Pro 3. But my main job daily is developing modified software for the SME based on the Microsoft Dynamics platform.
> 
> All the models of the Surface Pro, here available in Belgium, have 4Gb internal memory with the exception for version the 512Gb i7 version which has 8Gb internal memory.
> 
> ...



...very good...and very useful advice.

Thanks.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Sep 2, 2014)

360_6pack said:


> Hi all
> I am looking for a setup to do tethered shooting for Architecture/Property interior & exterior shoots & was thinking of using the new SP3.
> Has anyone any experience with the SP3 for shooting or post production in LR5 and if so could you please share with me the specs of your SP3 and your thoughts on it's suitability including screen colour accuracy.
> The SP3 was only released in Australia Monday so its just showing up in stores now.
> ...



The issue is the small screen, its tough to do serious editing on a 12 inch screen. The screen has good color and contrast which helps. The 8GB i7 models can easily handle Lightroom 5, but I prefer 16 GB or more.

One of the active CR members uses one, search the forum, since he has already commented.


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## markko (Sep 2, 2014)

360_6pack said:


> Hi all
> I am looking for a setup to do tethered shooting for Architecture/Property interior & exterior shoots & was thinking of using the new SP3.
> Has anyone any experience with the SP3 for shooting or post production in LR5 and if so could you please share with me the specs of your SP3 and your thoughts on it's suitability including screen colour accuracy.
> The SP3 was only released in Australia Monday so its just showing up in stores now.
> ...



I use the SP2 with i5 and 8GB of RAM as my working machine and happily use Photoshop CC and Premiere CC; as these run fine for me, I think LR5 would also run fine.

I agree with FEBS that 8GB RAM is really useful/required, but the i7 model is not the only one with 8GB. There is also an i5 model with 8GB RAM and 256 SSD, selling for 1,319 euro (here in the Netherlands).

The SP2 screen is even smaller than the SP3, but if you're close enough to the screen it's really OK to work with.


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## tolusina (Sep 2, 2014)

I edit on a pretty powerful desktop with a calibrated, wide gamut monitor, profiled printer/paper/ink and so forth. I've not found anything reasonably comparable and reasonably portable, my sometimes limited imagination prevents me from even considering any comprehensive post processing/editing in the field. 
I suppose if I was heading off on a Safari, I'd find an acceptable compromise solution.

Meanwhile, I'm quite satisfied, delighted actually, tethering with a (far less expensive than an SP3) 10" ASUS Android tablet using DSLR Controller. 
Chainfire, the DSLR controller developer has released an Alpha build of DSLR Controller AFMA though I've not yet tried it.

Same dev has a WiFi adapter gizmo if you'd like to go that route, some fabrication and assembly required.

There's also Helicon Remote for Android with similar functionality from the same folks that offer Helicon Focus for PC and MAC, I just now see they also offer Helicon Remote for PC and MAC as well as Android. 

I'm delighted enough with DSLR Controller that I've not been tempted by Helicon Remote though I'm quite pleased with Helicon Focus for Macro Focus stacking.

edit....... One quirk, maybe it's a 'feature' I've found with DSLR Controller, the program displays an error on connection if you've set to Back Button Focus.
Since so many of my starting settings when tethered differ from my handheld preferences, I've set one of my custom shooting mode settings to full manual, live view with exposure simulation, shutter button controlled focus, works a treat.


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## LJ3Jim (Sep 2, 2014)

360_6pack said:


> Hi all
> I am looking for a setup to do tethered shooting for Architecture/Property interior & exterior shoots & was thinking of using the new SP3.
> Has anyone any experience with the SP3 for shooting or post production in LR5 and if so could you please share with me the specs of your SP3 and your thoughts on it's suitability including screen colour accuracy.
> The SP3 was only released in Australia Monday so its just showing up in stores now.
> ...



I tried a Surface Pro 3 for a couple of weeks this summer. Although the machine runs well (including LR5), I found a number of drawbacks.

1. The kickstand and keyboard don't offer enough flexibility for positioning the machine. Anytime you need to reposition the machine (which could happen often when shooting), you have to fiddle with both. It was a nuisance, but not necessarily a killer.

2. The screen itself was fine with its color, but I did use a Spyder calibrator to get it there. The screen is glossy, whereas my main monitor at home is non-glare. I prefer non-glare.

3. The 2160x1440 display was a problem. In order to use the machine, you must use screen scaling to make items visible. 125% or 150% is needed. Unfortunately, that has a huge impact on apps like LR. The reason for this is a little complicated. Software apps request the screen size from Windows so that they know how to size themselves. When the SP3 uses scaling, the size of the screen as reported to the apps gets smaller. I think I was using 125% scaling, and the reported screen size was something like 1750x1100. So LR scales your photos down to a size that will fit on the reduced resolution, and then Windows scales everything up to the native 2160x1440 resolution. The net result of this is that you can't see a true 1:1 view of your photos. That was the killer for me.

The machine that I found (and love) is a Lenovo ThinkPad Yoga. It's i7, 8GB, 256GB SSD. It has a 12.5" 1920x1080 screen with a non-glare finish. 12.5" is big enough so that I don't need scaling. Thus I'm always using the native resolution of the machine. The Yoga line flips the keyboard around for tablet mode. It's like the Surfaces do, but the keyboard is real. I do use the machine both at home and in the field. It works well for me.

Regards, Jim


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## jrista (Sep 2, 2014)

I have used my original Surface Pro for tethered shooting for some time. It is actually not nearly as bad as anyone has indicated. 

First things first, you have to set the DPI scaling in LR itself, if you want to use LR. You can set 150% or 200%. I don't know why Adobe does not use the Windows OS scaling, rather annoying that it does not, but once you set the scaling, it sticks, so it's not a big deal.

Second, make sure you get and use the stylus. The original Surface Pro came with a stylus, and it is VERY easy to use, and make controlling the sliders and whatnot in LR a breeze. This also goes for Photoshop. 

Third, when it comes to live view tethered shooting, you actually need to use the Canon utility for that. LR does not do live view, however it does let you control the camera from the tablet. I like using the Canon utility, as it basically makes your camera more like a view or field camera with large ground glass.

So long as you get and use the stylus, and fix the DPI in LR, in general the Surface Pro 3 should make for an awesome tablet to control your camera.


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## tolusina (Sep 2, 2014)

jrista said:


> ....
> Third, when it comes to live view tethered shooting, you actually need to use the Canon utility for that. LR does not do live view, however it does let you control the camera from the tablet. I like using the Canon utility, as it basically makes your camera more like a view or field camera with large ground glass........


Just as I was posting above, I tried LR + tether for the first time, though my stupid was in action when I couldn't figure out how to switch on live view, d'oh...

The Canon Utility interface is about as rudimentary as the Canon EOS Remote app for Android. Sorry, I've now seen and used DSLR Controller, can't go back to either of those Canon apps. 
I liked DSLR Controller so much on my phones, I bought a tablet primarily to run just that app. Sure I do a few other things on the tablet now that I have it, but I wouldn't have it but for DSLR Controller.





.


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## jrista (Sep 2, 2014)

Another option for live view shooting is to use BackyardEOS. It's actually intended for astrophotography, but it is very feature rich, and even includes a very powerful, fine grained manual focus control feature which would be awesome for landscapes. I have that on both my tablet and laptop, never thought to use it for landscapes before...but it would be freaking awesome. Just for the full screen live view and focus control...but you can also program sequences (that's really what it's for, astro imaging sequencing), which would make doing multi-frame and even multi-ISO bracketing really easy.

You can get the basic version for $30, which is all you would need. The $50 version has a bunch of features only necessary for astrophotography, like drift alignment. Probably the best tool on the market for tablet-tethered live view control of an EOS DSLR.


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## tolusina (Sep 2, 2014)

tolusina said:


> ......
> 
> The Canon Utility interface is about as rudimentary as the Canon EOS Remote app for Android. Sorry, I've now seen and used DSLR Controller, can't go back to either of those Canon apps....


I have to retract that comparison between the Canon apps. I just tried the PC version of the EOS Utility again after a long time, there is a lot more there than in EOS Remote.
I'm still sticking by DLSR Controller though, it's just pretty much awesomely excellent.


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## LJ3Jim (Sep 2, 2014)

jrista said:


> Second, make sure you get and use the stylus. The original Surface Pro came with a stylus, and it is VERY easy to use, and make controlling the sliders and whatnot in LR a breeze. This also goes for Photoshop.



Agreed. Not all ThinkPad Yogas come with a stylus, but mine did. It is worth getting. I think all of the Surface Pro 3s come with one.


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## jrista (Sep 2, 2014)

LJ3Jim said:


> jrista said:
> 
> 
> > Second, make sure you get and use the stylus. The original Surface Pro came with a stylus, and it is VERY easy to use, and make controlling the sliders and whatnot in LR a breeze. This also goes for Photoshop.
> ...



I know the previous two Surface Pros came with one, however, I think the Stylus is now an extra device for the Pro 3. It's a LOT better stylus than the really simple, plastic one I got...but it is highly recommended. It just makes using desktop mode so much vastly easier than trying to use a mouse or the touch pad...it's well worth the cost, IMO. (Not to mention the fact that the new one is fully pressure sensitive and multi modal and all that.)


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## LDS (Sep 2, 2014)

360_6pack said:


> Hi allI am looking for a setup to do tethered shooting for Architecture/Property interior & exterior shoots & was thinking of using the new SP3.


I've been using a Surface 2 Pro (i5, 8GB RAM, 256GB SSD) for months, it works flawlessly for tethered shooting using the EOS Utility (using a 5m USB cable, hope to test soon with a WFT E7), and it is adequate for LR5 use on the field, although my final processing is performed on a desktop system and larger monitor. You can always connect the Surface to an external monitor, if you need it.
Its screen can be calibrated, but of course is not a wide gamut monitor, and take into account setting a fixed brightness can reduce how long a charge lasts.
You can find some supports to clamp the tablet to something or put it on a tripod, but don't know what is available yet for the larger SP3.
For tethered shooting I use it without the keyboard, just touch/pen or the Bluetooth mouse, while LR is faster to use with the keyboard docked, yet basic processing can be easily performed with the stylus, which is of course very handy for local adjustments.


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## LDS (Sep 2, 2014)

jrista said:


> It's a LOT better stylus than the really simple, plastic one I got...but it is highly recommended. It just makes using desktop mode so much vastly easier than trying to use a mouse or the touch pad...it's well worth the cost, IMO. (Not to mention the fact that the new one is fully pressure sensitive and multi modal and all that.)


Wacom makes better styluses that works with the SP2 (which uses a Wacom digitizer, I got one and feels much better) but doesn't work with the SP3 which uses a different technology. The SP2 stylus is passive and doesn't require batteries. The SP3 one is Bluetooth unit and requires batteries.


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## sanjosedave (Sep 2, 2014)

I'm looking for a tethered, Live View solution for macro imaging. 

Does Live View work with both DSLR controller and LR 5.x, tethered (realize different OSes)

If the BackyardEOS does crazy fine grain focusing, then, I would lean towards Win8.x


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## Ruined (Sep 2, 2014)

Hi,
Just a heads up - the Surface Pro 2 in my opinion is a lot better for photography and video than the Surface Pro 3. The Surface Pro 3 throttles like crazy and I think the SP2 would just be a lot better suited for field work - FYI.


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## Halfrack (Sep 2, 2014)

Give CaptureOne Pro a shot - it's not the library manager that LR is, but the work flow is really nice for tethered shooting.

http://help.phaseone.com/en/CO7/Capture/Tethered-Shooting.aspx


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## jrista (Sep 2, 2014)

Ruined said:


> Hi,
> Just a heads up - the Surface Pro 2 in my opinion is a lot better for photography and video than the Surface Pro 3. The Surface Pro 3 throttles like crazy and I think the SP2 would just be a lot better suited for field work - FYI.



You control this with the standard Windows power plans. The default plan on the SP3 is probably aggressively power-saving. Switch it to a less aggressive plan (Balanced should do it), or the high performance plan. Just keep in mind, if you limit the power saving, your battery life will suffer.


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## 360_6pack (Sep 3, 2014)

Hi All
Thank you all for your advice. 

I should have made it clear I would only be using LR for in field quick looking & adjusting or when I'm away from home, the final editing etc would be done on my desktop at home.
It would appear that the SP3 would achieve my objective better than a small laptop as the laptop would be larger and not have a better screen resolution.

Michael


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## josephandrews222 (Sep 3, 2014)

jrista said:


> Ruined said:
> 
> 
> > Hi,
> ...



no snark intended: Are you certain that you can control throttling on the SP3 via changes in the power plan?


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## jrista (Sep 4, 2014)

josephandrews222 said:


> jrista said:
> 
> 
> > Ruined said:
> ...



It's a Microsoft device running a Microsoft operating system. If you could NOT, I would be extremely surprised. Microsoft knows how their own stuff works, if they botched that, then they deserve to lose sales. Every other device, both Microsoft or third party, that I have that runs Windows, supports power plans in exactly that way. This isn't some new feature...it's been around for years...since Vista at least (and in some form in XP before that.) I'd find it highly unusual if the SP3 did not.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Sep 4, 2014)

tolusina said:


> tolusina said:
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> 
> > ......
> ...



I was wondering what Canon version you were using, Canon utilities is pretty comprehensive. I also use Breeze DSLR Pro for remote. Lightroom tethering is not really worth the bother.


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## tolusina (Sep 4, 2014)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> ....I was wondering what Canon version you were using.....


EOS Utility Version 2.12.2.1, it's what was in the box with my 6D.

Seriously, if one has an Android device with USB host support (which includes most current models) and a somewhat recent Canon, the DSLR Controller app is only USD $8.00, a USB host cable adapter/dongle/thingy can be had for USD $3.00 to USD $20.00, it's very inexpensive to try.
Plus, once a USB host adapter is in hand, a plethora of USB devices become plug and play on your Android, things like thumb drives, card readers, external drives, keyboards, mice, mostly whatever.

The DSLR Controller web site lists compatible cameras, their list of compatible Androids is woefully incomplete and somewhat wrong. I have it running on four devices, only one of them is listed.
Support is rather lame, it mostly consists of a single thread of hundreds of pages at xda. I've had no need of the xda thread though, what few answers I needed were all on the app's main web site.

I find a USB host adapter so handy, one stays in my phone's case. When I'm out and about with the camera, my camera accessory belt pouch carries the standard USB cable, phone is always available if I need to tether. If I've planned ahead to tether for a specific shot or if I'm tethering in a studio environment, I tether to tablet.
---
I looked briefly at the Breeze site, it's Windows only so not as portable as an Android solution, it's got some license restrictions, it's pricier than Android solutions, I'll pass on that one.
I do thank you for the lead though, it's always good to know more of what all is out there and available. Multi camera support looks real trick indeed but way beyond my current needs and wants.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Sep 4, 2014)

tolusina said:


> Mt Spokane Photography said:
> 
> 
> > ....I was wondering what Canon version you were using.....
> ...



Being more portable is certainly a advantage for some cases. I mostly tether in my studio, but I do have a Manfrotto clamp on tray that I place my Lenovo laptop on to run Focal. Its not ideal.

It would work with a tablet as well, its almost infinitely adjustable. That Lenovo Laptop has a horrible screen, no matter how I calibrate it, its inadequate for most anything. I spent most of a day looking at new laptops, including all the ones here. In the end, I gave up, none of them would work for me, but the ones mentioned are much much better than my old X200s.


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## tolusina (Sep 4, 2014)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> .... I spent most of a day looking at new laptops, including all the ones here. In the end, I gave up, none of them would work for me.....


I did the same searching for an optimal laptop, gave up, built a no compromise desktop instead.
I forgo editing until I'm back at my desktop.
---



sanjosedave said:


> I'm looking for a tethered, Live View solution for macro imaging.
> 
> Does Live View work with both DSLR controller....


Yes indeed, DSLR Controller does that very well. You can choose 5x or 10x magnification same as on camera but on a much larger screen.
Additionally, for macro use DSLR Controller can automate focus stepping to build your stacked shots for focus stacking on your editing machine.

Here's a stack captured using DSLR Controller, can't miss focus breathing in action......





And the final, assembled stack.......


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## Ruined (Sep 4, 2014)

jrista said:


> Ruined said:
> 
> 
> > Hi,
> ...



Can't be done with Surface Pro 3, two reasons:
1. Microsoft took traditional power plans out of Surface Pro 3. To get high performance back, you must enable Hyper-V which is incompatible with connected standby. Some have also reported the SP3 goes into thermal shutdown when this is attempted.

2. Even if you did step 1, it still throttles aggressively. Both in Windows and in Linux. It is in the firmware.

IMO Surface Pro 2 is a more reliable machine due to the throttling issues with SP3. Personally I don't believe the SP3 cooling design is adequate for Haswell.


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## janshim (Jun 28, 2015)

I found this thread with interest as I am considering the Surface Pro 3 after being epicly disappointed with the painfully slow transfers from Eye-Fi to iPad (JPEG set to Medium on 5D Mark III). Having used USB tethering to the laptop for years, love the transfer speed and near-immediate display of large JPEG images shot after shot. 

I played with the trial copy of DSLR Remote PRO by BreezeSys on the laptop and I liked it very much. Curious if the "throttling" problem reported here also applied to other programs, I contacted the author Chris Breeze and he had this to say,



> Hi Jan,
> 
> Our DSLR Remote Pro for Windows software doesn't have any "throttling" issues when run on a Surface Pro 3. I've run it on an i3 Surface Pro 3 and it works perfectly.
> 
> ...


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jun 28, 2015)

tolusina said:


> jrista said:
> 
> 
> > ....
> ...



I'm surprised that you have a issue with the Canon Utilities tethering interface for the surface pro 3. I find it to be excellent, it controls every function of the shot. It is not the limited tablet interface for Android or IOS, but has full blown control.


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