# 3D (Again) & 5D Mark III (CR1)



## Canon Rumors Guy (Jun 14, 2011)

```
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<strong>From an outside source</strong>

According to information received by [<strong><a href="http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/cameras/Canon_3d.html">NL</a></strong>], early 2012 will bring a new model full frame DSLR to the Canon lineup. The likely name will be the 3D. It will bring about new sensor technology for the EOS system.</p>
<p>The 5D Mark III wouldnâ€™t make an appearance on the scene until summer 2012. It will feature a modified version of the upcoming 1Ds Mark IV sensor.</p>
<p><strong>CRâ€™s Take

</strong>As mentioned over at NL, the 3D rumormill comes and goes and has done so for a long time. Although, this does go along with the <a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/2011/05/the-future-of-the-1ds-5d-lines-cr2/">idea of a split in the 5D line and the amalgamation of the 1D/1Ds</a>.</p>
<p>I wouldnâ€™t discount this one completely, but Iâ€™d have some sea salt handy.</p>
<p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">c</span>r</strong>
```


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## Tastino0 (Jun 14, 2011)

I don't understand. Why 5D Mark II body is off of sock everywhere in the world?
I should hope this rumors is not true and an announce will come early..


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## minestrone (Jun 14, 2011)

This is usually when things get exciting. The closer we get to the release date the more info starts flowing through and I start checking NL and CR about twice a day haha. I did the same thing when I was waiting for the 5D Mark II. About a year before it was release I was online looking at specs and dreaming everyday. 

Even when the 5D MIII comes out I think I'll still be shooting with my MII at least 50% of the time. I love that camera. 

Hopefully we'll see some improved AF and better video. I really hope they don't split up one for photography and one for video. I'd end up buying both and go broke (car & house payments hinder me from going medium format and red one lol).


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## Martin (Jun 14, 2011)

Tastino

Not everyherw in the world...Ive just ordered the camera and have to wait 2 days, no problem with stocks in my country.


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## steven63 (Jun 14, 2011)

ARG!  I'm developing a new line of work to supplement my portrait/wedding side and I would really like a full frame sensor for this (inside cramped quarters) so that I can cover as much real estate as possible and I wanted to wait for the miii. Looks like I might have to bite the bullet and pay the inflated mii price


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## dg28 (Jun 14, 2011)

I would be amazed if Canon call their next full-frame camera a 3D - that name is too closely associated with, well 3D - you know three dimensional. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Canon took their model names off in an altogether different direction - possibly dropping the 'D' part altogether.


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## EYEONE (Jun 14, 2011)

Hopefully if there is a 3D it is a full frame, low MP type camera to compete with the Nikon D3s in the high ISO area. Though naming it "3D" implies that it will be more costly than the 5D Mark III and thus out of my range.


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## gene_can_sing (Jun 14, 2011)

Summer 2012 for the 5D3? It's barely summer of 2011! Has Canon just decided to stop releasing anything new? They're just moving at a glacial pace at this point. Ridiculous.


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## EYEONE (Jun 14, 2011)

gene_can_sing said:


> Summer 2012 for the 5D3? It's barely summer of 2011! Has Canon just decided to stop releasing anything new? They're just moving at a glacial pace at this point. Ridiculous.



Just a rumor, friend.


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## neuroanatomist (Jun 14, 2011)

dg28 said:


> I wouldn't be at all surprised if Canon took their model names off in an altogether different direction - possibly dropping the 'D' part altogether.



So the new camera would be an EOS 3? Why does that name seem familiar??


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## unfocused (Jun 14, 2011)

> I wouldnâ€™t discount this one completely



I would.


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## gene_can_sing (Jun 14, 2011)

EYEONE said:


> gene_can_sing said:
> 
> 
> > Summer 2012 for the 5D3? It's barely summer of 2011! Has Canon just decided to stop releasing anything new? They're just moving at a glacial pace at this point. Ridiculous.
> ...



Yeah, you're right Eyeone. Nobody knows for sure, probably not even Canon at this point. I guess for us video guys who bought too many Canon lenses, we're a lot more desperate than the stills guys, because as a stills camera, the 5D2 is very good, but as a video camera, we really need some up-grades.

But dang.... it needs to come out soon.


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## fotoray (Jun 14, 2011)

gene_can_sing said:


> Summer 2012 for the 5D3? It's barely summer of 2011! Has Canon just decided to stop releasing anything new? They're just moving at a glacial pace at this point. Ridiculous.



Don't forget about the earthquake! I'd rather they regained full operating capacity than hurry and maybe deliver products with lots of problems.


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## idigi (Jun 14, 2011)

dg28 said:


> I would be amazed if Canon call their next full-frame camera a 3D - that name is too closely associated with, well 3D - you know three dimensional.


It doesn't matter what it is associated with. Remember rumors before 1D Mark IV came out? 4 is a bad number in Japan, there are no 4th floors, 4 sounds like death, Canon will skip labeling its flagship camera with number 4, etc. So what?


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## simplexityphoto (Jun 14, 2011)

I am still surpised that no one has commented on the 40mm 1.4L that is attached to the "3D" in the picture. granted it looks like a cheap "fake" but it would make me wonder is that is a hint that the future "3D" is though to be a 1.3 crop.


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## motorhead (Jun 14, 2011)

simplexityphoto said:


> I am still surpised that no one has commented on the 40mm 1.4L that is attached to the "3D" in the picture. granted it looks like a cheap "fake" but it would make me wonder is that is a hint that the future "3D" is though to be a 1.3 crop.



Given that this is only a rumour, surely we have to assume that both the lens and camera images have been created in photoshop or similar. As the owner of a film Eos 3 which Waaaay outperforms it's digital offspring, I'd dearly love to have a FF digital version with the exact same feature set as the original. However it seems highly unlikely for many years yet.


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## neuroanatomist (Jun 14, 2011)

motorhead said:


> As the owner of a film Eos 3 which Waaaay outperforms it's digital offspring, I'd dearly love to have a FF digital version with the exact same feature set as the original.



Including eye-controlled AF?


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## WarStreet (Jun 14, 2011)

EYEONE said:


> Hopefully if there is a 3D it is a full frame, low MP type camera to compete with the Nikon D3s in the high ISO area. Though naming it "3D" implies that it will be more costly than the 5D Mark III and thus out of my range.



If they release 2 different entry level FF cameras, it makes sense to split them as higher res/slower and lower res/faster. Maybe they will name them both 5DIII, but they might append a letter for the faster camera. As you say, the faster camera would cost more, but must be priced lower enough from the 1D which would reflect the specs difference between these cameras. Don't know if it makes sense for Canon to go with 2 flagship FF cameras and 2 entry level FF cameras with res/speed difference. 

If it makes you feel better, after checking a bunch of data on DXOmark, I roughly estimated that the 5DIII with about 26mp - 28mp, should have DXOmark values (their base data, not their indexes) very similar to the current D3S. I really think it is possible to achieve this, especially if you consider the estimated release date. Again, this is a rough guess.


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## motorhead (Jun 14, 2011)

neuroanatomist said:


> motorhead said:
> 
> 
> > As the owner of a film Eos 3 which Waaaay outperforms it's digital offspring, I'd dearly love to have a FF digital version with the exact same feature set as the original.
> ...



Absolutely, I have always loved the feature. And provided I "reteach" the camera regularly it continues to perform, AF'ing faster and more reliably than any digital upstart I've played with. 

I am very aware that it is troublesome for those with "oriental eyes" as for whatever reason it plays up for these ethnic groups, but for us northern european's its fine. As I've said, it did/does need teaching and that takes time and patience which might explain why some decided not to bother.

The downside is simply that it's a film camera and trying to get a good reliable lab for colour slide film is getting ever more difficult in my area.


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## max (Jun 14, 2011)

neuroanatomist said:


> dg28 said:
> 
> 
> > I wouldn't be at all surprised if Canon took their model names off in an altogether different direction - possibly dropping the 'D' part altogether.
> ...


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## bvukich (Jun 14, 2011)

Make the 3D with the sensor & AF from the merged 1D line, no video, 5D size body, and a <$3500 price tag, and I'd take one.


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## bp (Jun 14, 2011)

I can't take any rumor seriously that projects a camera called a 3D... unless its actually a 3d camera with two lenses. would be like releasing a camcorder, with "HD" in the name, that only shoots standard definition


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## awinphoto (Jun 14, 2011)

bvukich said:


> Make the 3D with the sensor & AF from the merged 1D line, no video, 5D size body, and a <$3500 price tag, and I'd take one.



Good luck finding canon release a camera like that with your budget


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## terryh2c (Jun 15, 2011)

I've been saving for the 5D MkII update, but by summer 2012 I will have saved enough for a Bugatti Veyron. Surely the current 'out of stock' status of the Mk II can't continue - does Canon really not care THAT much for sales?


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## neuroanatomist (Jun 15, 2011)

terryh2c said:


> I've been saving for the 5D MkII update, but by summer 2012 I will have saved enough for a Bugatti Veyron. Surely the current 'out of stock' status of the Mk II can't continue - does Canon really not care THAT much for sales?



Here in the US, at least, the major retailers sell out as soon as they get new stock in. That would seem to indicate that the 5DII is still a strong seller, meaning less incentive for Canon to update the line.

Enjoy the new wheels...


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## distant.star (Jun 15, 2011)

Wow. With that much money, you could buy enough Canon stock to have influence with management.




terryh2c said:


> I've been saving for the 5D MkII update, but by summer 2012 I will have saved enough for a Bugatti Veyron. Surely the current 'out of stock' status of the Mk II can't continue - does Canon really not care THAT much for sales?


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## liberace (Jun 15, 2011)

bp said:


> I can't take any rumor seriously that projects a camera called a 3D... unless its actually a 3d camera with two lenses. would be like releasing a camcorder, with "HD" in the name, that only shoots standard definition



x 2. The whole talk of a 3D model drives me insane.


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## zerotiu (Jun 15, 2011)

ugh, 3d - 5d3 what d again? Just release new full frame camera with 7d+5d2 features and I think we are all happy 

* you can't deny this :


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## Gcon (Jun 15, 2011)

The more I think about it, the more I think the 3D is going to happen. People are screaming out for a full-frame 7D equivalent - rugged, compact, weather sealed, with better AF. (OK I am - hopefully others are too!). An outdoor/landscape shooter's dream, for those who can't afford or don't want medium-format digital.

If they made the 5DIII like that it would do two things:
1) push the price right up for that model
2) cannibalize sales from the 1D line

So the market is ripe now for a model that sits in-between the 5D and the 1D lines. There's a big hole in their lineup that they currently aren't filling.

The 5DIII will be the cheapest full-frame offering. The new version will bring more megapixels and better AF from the 7D but not much else, except for perhaps newer video-specific features. It will compete aggressively on price.

The 3D will basically be a full-frame 7D. It won't have integrated vertical grip. It might even borrow some other features from the 1D line but not enough to cannibalize it, but will be a price premium above the 5DmarkIII line, the same way the 7D is at a premium above the 60D. Shutter speeds will definitely be held back as this is a 1D feature - expect a single Digic V for the 3D.

The 1D and 1Ds series will merge together into a fast-shooting, fully-featured, top of the line model - everything we have now but with more Megapixels and the updated interface from dual Digic V. What Canon will do with this camera is enable a toggle to go into 1.3x crop mode, discarding the outer-most pixels which will allow a faster shutter speed, so you'll have a 1D and 1Ds all in one.

Thus we'll end up with a nice matrix of cameras:
Rebel / 60D / 7D for crop sensor
5DmarkIII / 3D / 1DmarkV for full frame

I'll be going for the 3D for sure - maybe upgrade both of my 5DII's to them. Bring it Canon!


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## NotABunny (Jun 15, 2011)

> 2012 will bring a new model full frame DSLR to the Canon lineup. The likely name will be the 3D. It will bring about new sensor technology for the EOS system. The 5D Mark III wouldnâ€™t make an appearance on the scene until summer 2012. It will feature a modified version of the upcoming 1Ds Mark IV sensor.



This guy (/ group) who constantly makes up rumors about a EOS 3D for so many years really has a fetish. Please, some creativity!

For example, call it a 2D! It's gonna shoot 2D images anyway... right? Or let's go fractal (since it shoots moving images), call a 2.5D!


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## adhocphotographer (Jun 15, 2011)

Just to throw in something i noticed earlier today re the 3D...

Was looking at some Wildlife photo winners on the Dailymail website (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2001152/Wildlife-photography-award-winners-Gorilla-makes-friends-duckling.html?ITO=1490) and noticed that the Youth Photographer winner (Eric Coomes) took his shot of a polar bear with a "Canon 3D; 28-300mm L IS lens at 235mm; 1/1600 sec at /13; ISO 500; hand-held"

Make of that what you will, might be a typo, but then again, might not!


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## pooklin (Jun 15, 2011)

adhocphotographer said:


> Just to throw in something i noticed earlier today re the 3D...
> 
> Was looking at some Wildlife photo winners on the Dailymail website (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2001152/Wildlife-photography-award-winners-Gorilla-makes-friends-duckling.html?ITO=1490) and noticed that the Youth Photographer winner (Eric Coomes) took his shot of a polar bear with a "Canon 3D; 28-300mm L IS lens at 235mm; 1/1600 sec at /13; ISO 500; hand-held"
> 
> Make of that what you will, might be a typo, but then again, might not!




It's a typo, it's Canon 30D
http://naturesbeststudents.org/gallery/5th-competition/great-shake/


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## jouster (Jun 15, 2011)

Two things are definite:

1. Canon will not release a camera called 3D, unless it shoots 3d pics. It would be insane to do so. Many have pointed this out, and they are right.
2. Despite the fervent wishes of some, every Canon DSLR released in the future will support video.


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## Justin (Jun 15, 2011)

I think this is right, but it doesn't matter what they call it. The camera needs to emerge, whether it emerges as a 5D successor and both 5Ds co-exist, or it comes out as a 3D, 2D, 4D, or whatever and coexists with the 5D2 for awhile, until perhaps a 5D3 upgrade emerges, or doesn't. 

This is the next hot seller for Canon. They just have to figure out their strategy. This fall please. It's time. 



jouster said:


> Two things are definite:
> 
> 1. Canon will not release a camera called 3D, unless it shoots 3d pics. It would be insane to do so. Many have pointed this out, and they are right.
> 2. Despite the fervent wishes of some, every Canon DSLR released in the future will support video.


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## Justin (Jun 15, 2011)

neuroanatomist said:


> terryh2c said:
> 
> 
> > I've been saving for the 5D MkII update, but by summer 2012 I will have saved enough for a Bugatti Veyron. Surely the current 'out of stock' status of the Mk II can't continue - does Canon really not care THAT much for sales?
> ...



Less incentive to upupdate the line, perhaps, but doesn't mean that a higher model wouldn't sneak above it.


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## Stone (Jun 15, 2011)

FF
24 MP
30+ pt af
8 fps
dual digic V
dual card slots
weather sealed

~$3.5K - $4K and I'd buy 2

It could be more sports/wildlife oriented than the new 5D which could remain the slow, entry level FF that people expect. That leaves plenty of features left over for a flagship 1 series body with 10fps, integrated grip, 1.3 crop mode and a gazillion megapixels.....


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## adhocphotographer (Jun 15, 2011)

pooklin said:


> It's a typo, it's Canon 30D
> http://naturesbeststudents.org/gallery/5th-competition/great-shake/



Makes more sense!


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## Zazula (Jun 15, 2011)

simplexityphoto said:


> I am still surpised that no one has commented on the 40mm 1.4L that is attached to the "3D" in the picture. granted it looks like a cheap "fake" but it would make me wonder is that is a hint that the future "3D" is though to be a 1.3 crop.


Actually that was the first thing I noticed â€” but it's a 40mm 1.2L, not 1.4.


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## dr croubie (Jun 15, 2011)

jouster said:


> 1. Canon will not release a camera called 3D, unless it shoots 3d pics. It would be insane to do so. Many have pointed this out, and they are right.



yes, yes they are right. It's a bit far fetched, but can't we dream of a DSLR 3D(imensional) camera?

Nothing like those old Soviet 3d cameras on 120 film, that would be nice but way too bulky. Maybe if we buy two, we can join them together, get 2 exactly the same prime lenses and take 3D photos? (even using zooms would be possible, get them both 'about right' and let software line up the details and crop to the right area)

ok, so the market for this would be tiny, or would it? i would definitely file it under one of those expensive advertising stunts of top-end products that inspire lower-end sales. Sigh, dreams...


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## keith_cooper (Jun 15, 2011)

I can't believe that -anyone- prepared to pay several thousand dollars for an EOS 3D DSLR would seriously expect it to be a '3D' camera and then be surprised to find it wasn't.

Then again there are plenty of people about with more money than sense


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## Admin US West (Jun 16, 2011)

keith_cooper said:


> I can't believe that -anyone- prepared to pay several thousand dollars for an EOS 3D DSLR would seriously expect it to be a '3D' camera and then be surprised to find it wasn't.
> 
> Then again there are plenty of people about with more money than sense



Hello Keith, welcome to Canon rumors. Many of us (or at least me) follow your blog at Northlight Rumors, and particularly admire your experience and expertise with printing.


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## c.d.embrey (Jun 16, 2011)

motorhead said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > Including eye-controlled AF?
> ...



I'm a French-English-German mix, and I *HATE* eye-control. I didn't buy an EOS 3, when new, because of eye-control. I didn't buy an Elan 7ne, because of eye-control, instead I got an Elan 7n (no eye-control).

Just because you like something, don't make the mistake that everyone likes it.


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## c.d.embrey (Jun 16, 2011)

The Canon 3D is real, but Nikon sells it under the name *D700*. Full Frame, low mega-pixel, 51 focus points (15 cross-sensors) and good high ISO performance.


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## ronderick (Jun 16, 2011)

Wow... here comes the 3D rumor again... ;D

I remember we were taking about the possible upper-tier 5D model a long while back, and used '3D' as a theoretical name (7D-5D-3D). Though at that time we see the 3D as the one with the edge in video capacity while 7D has the speed and 5D with the resolution...

Well, unless the plan is to get the Fujifilm camera designed for taking 3D photos (or the Panasonic lens with the function), I don't think the user who's going to fork out 2.5K+ for that camera would make the mistake w/o doing basic homework first. 

Assuming there's going to be a 3D-line, the question now would be whether it's going to be a video-oriented camera or a more feature-packed version of the 5D series.


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## Gcon (Jun 16, 2011)

Stone said:


> FF
> 24 MP
> 30+ pt af
> 8 fps
> ...



I'm with you on this one buddy!


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## Heidrun (Jun 16, 2011)

Gcon said:


> Stone said:
> 
> 
> > FF
> ...




I hope that if and when the 3d comes on the market that it is more like the 1Ds series. Need no more than about 3 frames per second. about 30 mp. no mirror. good performance at iso 12800 good resolution and weatherproof


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## motorhead (Jun 16, 2011)

c.d.embrey said:


> motorhead said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...



I'd never dream of trying to force others. We are all individuals with our own unique set of requirements. But I was asked the question so gave an honest response.

I would love to know why you hate eye-control with such a passion (about the same as me with video!). You are aware that the cameras needed to be taught how the users iris works and the more training the camera got, the better it became? My Eos3 took some weeks when I first had it, with regular retraining as my eyesight changes with time.


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## Stone (Jun 16, 2011)

Heidrun said:


> Gcon said:
> 
> 
> > Stone said:
> ...



With the exception of no mirror, you're probably describing the 5D replacement. It will more than likely be close to 30MP, still shooting around 3fps and with Nikon's current bodies having a pretty good lead when it comes to high ISO, I expect any and all Canon's FF bodies will have a relatively clean ISO 12800 this time around.

So you will more than likely get what you're asking for and then some, those of us that want FF AND the ability to shoot things that move are the ones on the edge of our seats right now praying that Canon is finally ready to step up....


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## gene_can_sing (Jun 16, 2011)

To me, the 3D name implies that it's a video skewed DSLR (just in name, and not in the sense that it will be a 3 Dimensional camera).

That would be the smartest thing Canon could do. Make the 3D like the Full Frame Nikon D700. Limit it to 12 megapixels, which is about the max to co-exist with good video. Have better high ISO. Make it the performer camera, and leave the megapixel war to the other Full frames.

12 Megapixels is still a huge image. At 300 DPI, you can make a 40" by 26.6" print, which is still pretty huge. For me being a video guy, that's far more than adequate.

And of course, make it a great video camera. 4:2:2 in camera with RAW to recorder option. Flip Screen. 3x Crop Mode. Electronic EVF and mirror-less so it could take PL mount (something I doubt would happen).

The 3D should be the Full Frame video camera, while the 5D3 is for stills guys. That way both camps can be happy. 

With DSLR video, you cannot make both camps happy, so it should be split. Flip screens, EVFs/mirrorless are things that many stills guys hate, but video guys like. It's time for a divorce. Everyone will be happier.


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## awinphoto (Jun 16, 2011)

gene_can_sing said:


> 12 Megapixels is still a huge image. At 300 DPI, you can make a 40" by 26.6" print, which is still pretty huge. For me being a video guy, that's far more than adequate.



on the 7d at 18 MP it can natively print at 300 DPI you can print 17.5" x11.5" To get a 40" print, on a 7D, you have to interpolate the print over 2x to get 300dpi 40". I cringe at thinking what a 12MP would have to be upsampled to to reach 40" 

Since I always show my math (5184 pixels / 300 dpi = 17.28" L and 3456 pixels / 300 dpi = 11.52). Basically in essence you would get as good print results printing at 150 dpi to get than upsampling and have photoshop guess at the pixel information.


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## bikersbeard (Jun 16, 2011)

reading on other sites etc, is more MP needed ?

it seems nikon with the D3 / D3s / D700 with 12MP has got it right with the high ISO, no ?

at the moment im been to a few photo workshops and all these pro's are shooting with nikons for this reason, and a few have jumped ship.

some where saying that canons glass cant bring out the best of the 21MP sensor nevermind a higher MP


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## dr croubie (Jun 16, 2011)

bikersbeard said:


> some where saying that canons glass cant bring out the best of the 21MP sensor nevermind a higher MP



Some lenses can get the best of a 40-50mp+ sensor, but some start to show their squidgyness at above 8mp.

The last year canon have anounced a lot of updates of their long primes and zoom, 300&400 f2.8, 500&600 f4, the 70-200 f2.8is, and the 200-400 f4 1.4x whatever it's called.
The image quality of those, according to canon's MTF charts at least, will be stunning (i hope in real life too).
I reckon they will keep up with sensor resolutions to be released in the future until the next lens update, which could be up to 10 years from now...

(ok, now we need an update on the wide-angle side of things in 2011, only 7 months left...)


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## gene_can_sing (Jun 16, 2011)

> Since I always show my math (5184 pixels / 300 dpi = 17.28" L and 3456 pixels / 300 dpi = 11.52). Basically in essence you would get as good print results printing at 150 dpi to get than upsampling and have photoshop guess at the pixel information.



Oppssss. I could be wrong. Sorry if I am. I've never been a print photo guy, but always video. When we refer to a 2K image, it means roughly 2000 pixels by 1000 pixels. So I just assumed that 12 megapixels = 12K image in video, which would be about 12000 pixels across, which = 40 inches at 300 DPI.

But like I said, I'm probably not correct.

But yeah, please split the 5D / 3D into a video DSLR and a stills DSLR. It's the best thing that could happen. Video is moving so fast these days, Canon needs a split video full frame model they can update more frequently to keep up with Sony and Panasonic who are starting to kick Canon's rear end really bad. Canon needs to act soon.


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## autochrome (Jun 16, 2011)

Perhaps someone can clear a couple of doubts. At Northlight Images, more precisely on the Canon 3D topic, there's a mention to a new sensor for 3D, and this:



> # 29th Lots of comment received about yesterday's 3D info, including a reminder of Canon's 3 colour sensor patent from last year. This from our 7D rumours page:
> # A multi level *'Foveon style'* sensor patent from Canon from Jan 2009 USP 20090008735
> # "...proposes a photo-detection method that uses a two-dimensionally laminated image sensor in which a pixel has a multilayer structure and the three colors of RGB are detected at different depths utilizing differences in the absorption coefficients of Si. In this two-dimensionally laminated image sensor, a high S/N ratio can be expected because photo detectors having a spectroscopic function are arranged and loss of light due to the presence of a color filter does not occur"
> # More Canon patents to trawl through at LP. You can get full PDFs of some patents by entering the patent number at http://www.pat2pdf.org/


http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/cameras/Canon_3d.html

I'm just wondering about the way Canon introduces new technology. If this turns out to be true, a completely new sensor, as in not an evolution of existing sensors, then perhaps it would make more sense in introducing this in another camera. It would also justify the high prices - new technology, expensive, not a high yield or a high yield but not enough orders to push the price down - this would put the new sensor technology camera at a higher price point than the for instance, 5D. At the same time, both the 5D Mk.III and the new 1D would share an evolution from the existing sensor technology, the article here at CR mentions the 5D sharing the same sensor with the merged 1D camera range. It would be risky to place a bet on an entirely new technology on your cash cow - the 5D, and the "brand representatives", the 1D. Canon would have a high end FF, the 1D, an "entry level", the 5D, with an improvement over existing and proven technology, while the 3D would introduce the first attempt(s) at a radical shift in sensor technology without having to sacrifice their existing cameras range and infuriating a lot of customers that have certain expectations from their material.
Then again, the 3D might be just vapourware, or part of an elaborate confuse-a-cat campaign.


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## dr croubie (Jun 16, 2011)

a) i've just shared a bottle of wine.
b) i'm not the best at reading patents.
c) i didn't read the text anyway

but d) that diagram, using 3-level-sensors only sensitive to one colour each, looks suspiciously like a Sigma DP1 sensor. It would certainly make a good marketing spin: "The 3D, with 3-Layer sensor!"

<edit> and e), now that i read the text it says foveon-type anyway... but more power to the company that tries something new. will it give up more dynamic range? i'm sure most people are tired of megapixel wars and would rather more dr than mp in the next round...</edit>

Cool if Canon can pull one off, from what i hear they give better res than a regular sensor for the same MP, i just hope Sigma don't give them a bad name with their $10k joke...


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## Lawliet (Jun 17, 2011)

motorhead said:


> I would love to know why you hate eye-control with such a passion (about the same as me with video!). You are aware that the cameras needed to be taught how the users iris works and the more training the camera got, the better it became?



Some people tend to look around in die viewfinder to check the exact composition.
For me EC worked fine. Unless I had just recently used a MF/LF camera, which made it rather troublesome. Imo its not the system, but the way the user thinks.


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## Justin (Jun 17, 2011)

awinphoto said:


> gene_can_sing said:
> 
> 
> > 12 Megapixels is still a huge image. At 300 DPI, you can make a 40" by 26.6" print, which is still pretty huge. For me being a video guy, that's far more than adequate.
> ...



Good. Thanks for your maths. Thankfully Canon understands this and makes cameras for people who want to (try to) make fine art prints. If you're a wedding photog then shoot mraw or jpeg and call it a day. I don't want to pay $3 or $5k or more for sensor density that is 6 years old.


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## hmmm (Jun 17, 2011)

autochrome said:


> Perhaps someone can clear a couple of doubts. At Northlight Images, more precisely on the Canon 3D topic, there's a mention to a new sensor for 3D, and this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




And Northlight has a nice timeline table: http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/cameras/Canon_5d3.html#timeline

From the timeline I'd say Canon has their ducks in a row -- announce the 1ds replacement (the oldest model) with the new sensor (and Digic V) this summer, announce the 5dmkII (the second oldest model) replacement(s) with the new sensor / Digic V this fall (perhaps for early 2012 shipping), then rollout 7D mkII, 70D, and 700D in sequence with the new sensor / Digic V technology, with the announcement chronology parallel to that of the 7D, 60D, and T3i/600D -- throughout 2012. That is also the order of incumbent model age. Highest profit margin models get the new technology first.

The opinion will be posted that the flagship never pioneers the new technology, but in this case I think it will. Canon needs to regain momentum in the sector, imho.


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## Rowbear (Jun 17, 2011)

That EOS 3D mockup on the front page also has an EF-40mm f/1.2 L 

Cute


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## motorhead (Jun 17, 2011)

Lawliet said:


> motorhead said:
> 
> 
> > I would love to know why you hate eye-control with such a passion (about the same as me with video!). You are aware that the cameras needed to be taught how the users iris works and the more training the camera got, the better it became?
> ...



Nothing in the eye-control system prevented me carefully viewing the composition and tweaking as required.


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## ystasino (Jun 17, 2011)

I want a state of the art AF system, with 4 fps and 25-28 MP.

The 5D was originally meant for portrait/wedding photographers and the 5DII added better noise control, video, somewhat better AF and a few more MP. But it is still a portrait/wedding photographer's camera. I want it to remain as such and do not want to pay for weather-proofing, dual card slots or 6-7 fps. Leave these specs for higher end cameras and give us a state-of-the-art AF system.


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## Joes Dad (Jun 17, 2011)

Apologies if this has been posted before - but did anyone notice that the 1Ds Mark III is no longer available in the Canon on-line camera store at all - as opposed to just being "out of stock" like many of Canon's other products?

http://shop.usa.canon.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/subCategory_10051_10051_-1_12164


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## neuroanatomist (Jun 18, 2011)

Joes Dad said:


> Apologies if this has been posted before - but did anyone notice that the 1Ds Mark III is no longer available in the Canon on-line camera store at all - as opposed to just being "out of stock" like many of Canon's other products?
> 
> http://shop.usa.canon.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/subCategory_10051_10051_-1_12164



I believe that someone pointed that out quite a while back.

But then, the 7D body only and 5DII body only are also missing from the list, although the kit versions are there. It may just mean no current stock and no idea when they will get more for Canon direct (I suspect large retailers like B&H and Adorama get priority).


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## dr croubie (Jun 19, 2011)

when even TDP is talking about the 1ds3 being out of stock, it's worth noticing (maybe he's got some info about the replacement and is being a bit cryptic about it, without breaking an NDA?)

my local shop doesn't even list the 1ds3 on the page any more.
the 1d4, 60d, and 1100d are in stock in 1 shop+web, 5d2 and 7d both out of stock everywhere, 600d only 1 shop, 550d both shops, 500d both shops+web.

(aside: every dutch employee gets a summer holiday bonus (8% of yearly income) paid in may. mine paid for my 70-300L (and i got the last one in the shop). maybe they're out of stock because people went on a spending spree?)

my guess at canon's manufacturing process is that they tool-up a line for one model at a time, build as many as they think they'll sell before the next run, then switch to another model.
If they sell more than they think, say, because of a recovery from recession, or if the time between runs is longer, say, due to an earthquake and power shortages, then they'll just run out before the next run, whether it's being replaced or not. (but yeah, if a replacement's coming, they just might not bother with a new run)


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## Heidrun (Jun 19, 2011)

ystasino said:


> I want a state of the art AF system, with 4 fps and 25-28 MP.
> 
> The 5D was originally meant for portrait/wedding photographers and the 5DII added better noise control, video, somewhat better AF and a few more MP. But it is still a portrait/wedding photographer's camera. I want it to remain as such and do not want to pay for weather-proofing, dual card slots or 6-7 fps. Leave these specs for higher end cameras and give us a state-of-the-art AF system.




Agree. State of the art AF on 5D. but i want weatherproof, best iso quaality both on high and low iso in the class. And also between 25-30 MP.


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## Blaze (Jun 20, 2011)

ystasino said:


> I want a state of the art AF system, with 4 fps and 25-28 MP.
> 
> The 5D was originally meant for portrait/wedding photographers and the 5DII added better noise control, video, somewhat better AF and a few more MP. But it is still a portrait/wedding photographer's camera. I want it to remain as such and do not want to pay for weather-proofing, dual card slots or 6-7 fps. Leave these specs for higher end cameras and give us a state-of-the-art AF system.



No dual card slots? I would think those would be great for wedding photographers. If one card goes bad, you didn't just lose hundreds of irreplaceable photos.


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## alipaulphotography (Jun 20, 2011)

- 19 point cross type 'sensitive' autofocus points
- Stop better dynamic range (more detail in highlights)
- Clean ISO6400
- Dual Card Slots
- 24MP
- Digic V
- 3.9 fps
- Announced August *fingers crossed*

Better joystick for selecting autofocus point would be handy too


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## zerotiu (Jun 20, 2011)

alipaulphotography said:


> - 19 point cross type 'sensitive' autofocus points
> - Stop better dynamic range (more detail in highlights)
> - Clean ISO6400
> - Dual Card Slots
> ...



oh, I want it to be announced in August too


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## neuroanatomist (Jun 20, 2011)

alipaulphotography said:


> - Announced August *fingers crossed*



Before the 1DsIV? You can cross your fingers, but I really wouldn't recommend holding your breath...


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## motorhead (Jun 20, 2011)

neuroanatomist said:


> alipaulphotography said:
> 
> 
> > - Announced August *fingers crossed*
> ...



I keep a personalised version of the Canon time line and have just modified the document, extending everything Canon is currently selling till at least the end of 2011. I've gone farther than that with the 5D2, extending that to the end of the first quarter of 2012.

It's not impossible that Canon might announce the replacement for the 1Ds3 and the 5D2 together. But given the importance of both I think they will give each their moment of glory, their seperate moments in the sun.


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## Heidrun (Jun 20, 2011)

Dont know why Canon is holding back. Digic V has come, and its stupid to sitt with something and wait until Nikon comes up with something better


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## ystasino (Jun 21, 2011)

Blaze said:


> ystasino said:
> 
> 
> > I want a state of the art AF system, with 4 fps and 25-28 MP.
> ...



The idea would be to offer a high quality FF camera that's sufficient for most, but not all. If you want elite features that are useful only rarely, however sensible they may be, you would have to pay a lot more.

This is how Canon has differentiated products all the way from the Digital Rebel vs 10D debate. The 10D offered a better body some more custom functions highlighted by the mirror lock up debacle which was software-suppressed in the Digital Rebel. Not sensible, but that was their marketing.

It would be great if we were able to customize cameras just like we customize PCs, but it's not happening yet.


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## dr croubie (Jun 21, 2011)

ystasino said:


> It would be great if we were able to customize cameras just like we customize PCs, but it's not happening yet.



You mean it's not happening *anymore* (or less than before).

Medium Format have had interchangeable lenses, focussing screens, viewfinders, film backs, digital backs, full meters, spot meters, you name it, pretty much since they started.
One i know of is Hasselblad ditched the ability to swap film/digital backs when they introduced the H3D (although apparently you can still use the waist-level finder).
Other MF companies still produce digital backs and bodies seperately, but the trend is still more towards integration.

afaik, 35mm has never had the same level of modularity.
ok, so angle finders are available, but they clip onto the back of your viewfinder, they don't replace the entire prism.
has any 35mm ever had a replaceable back? (granted, early DSLR digital backs tacked onto film cameras, and they're not made anymore either).
and replacing your ttl full metering prism with your spot metering prism disappeared with the berlin wall (now i just press a button and scroll a wheel to change, i can tell you what i prefer too)


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## neuroanatomist (Jun 21, 2011)

dr croubie said:


> afaik, 35mm has never had the same level of modularity.



Granted, it's not 35mm, but have you seen the Ricoh GXR?


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