# EOS R first impressions - post your hands-on impressions here



## BRunner (Sep 12, 2018)

Yesterday I attended a local Canon EOS R presentation.

If you are interested, here are my first impressions, I won't repeat usual things covered elsewhere. I'm heavy manual focus lenses user (Zeiss ZE serie), so I focused on some niche details. For about 3 years I use first A7 as my travel camera next to my 1DsIII and 1DIV. For small lenses I actually prefer the first generation Sony bodies, over II and III.

On the positive side:

I've been told (by Canon representative), that the updated firmware with Eye-AF with Servo AF and silent shutter in burst mode will be released in February 2019
the ergonomics of body is superb, much better than newer Sony bodies, especially with big lenses. Even with the mighty RF 1.2/50L and adapted 1.4/35L and 1.4/85L, it feels very comfortable in my hand (I'm used to 1D bodies). There is enough place too for my little finger on the body grip. There is enough space between lens and fingers too.
to me the body aesthetics refers to original EOS 600 series, it was even indirectly emphasized in few slides
there is basically no EFV blackout with silent shutter
the EF-R adapter is built very well, no wobbling and no play between body and lens. EF lenses feel really like native lenses.
control ring on adapter is really nice idea and...wait for it... INNOVATIVE 
AF with my old 1.4/35L was fast, snappy and always spot on at f/1.4, same with 1.4/85L and RF 1.2/50
the button customization looks endless in comparison to my 1D bodies
For MF lenses use:

focus peaking is much finer and looks usable even at wide apertures in comparison to Sony implementation
the focus assist is GENIUS! I was able to focus with Planar 1.4/85ZE wide open precisely on eye WITHOUT zooming in! And the focus was always spot on. Well I call this ...wait for it... INNOVATIVE 
it is now possible to map the zoom function to any button (it was not possible with EOS M and M3 - only via touch scrreen), I have no experience with newer Ms)
On the negative side:

the battery grip is ...umm... just another Canon non-1D battery grip, they could do better
AF point selection with thumb on touch screen doesn't work very well. It's nice with small body (I tested it on M50 at same event), but on bigger R I can't reach the display with thumb without removing my index finger from shutter button and losing grip  And I don't have small hands, I'm perfectly fine with 1D bodies....
^^^^Canon, can I please get the prototype where instead of the F-word touch strip is plain old joystick? The strip operation was little clumsy and I have bad feeling, that in real world use, there will be lot of accidental "touches". But it's a perfect place for joystick!
the On/Off only wheel on left side is little waste of space, it could do something more useful...
Neutral:

as I don't do VLOGging and video, I'm not sure about the swivel screen... It's nice, that it allows more angles, but for most use (shots from low perspective) the tilting screen is faster to operate and "safer" because you just "clamp" the screen back to body.
I forgot:

test sensor flares - this is the biggest flaw of first A7
try to setup AF point selection with FOCUS button tap + scroll wheels - like on my 1DIV
Well overall I'm pleased, I was looking for some time to upgrade my 1DsIII, but the 5D path was not for me, as I was spoiled by ease of use of my Zeiss ZE lenses with mirrorless A7. Looks like R will be my next camera


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## bod (Sep 12, 2018)

Thanks for posting your first impressions. I also use MF lenses frequently and have been waiting for Canon to produce a mirrorless body with good ergonomics for EF/ZE sized lenses and an EVF with strong MF capabilities. Your comments are both helpful and encouraging therefore.

What does the touch strip do? I assume you can assign different functions to it? If you have accidental problems with it as you suggest can you disable it?

Thanks


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## BRunner (Sep 12, 2018)

Yes, the touch strip function is user defined, on one camera there was slide ISO selection, on other AF mode. And "end points" of strip can be assigned as any other buttons. But the ISO "scrooling" was very slow with strip. Unfortunately I hadn't enough time to explore all the fine settings of camera controls. But you could surely keep the strip without assigned function to prevent accidental changes. Or there is the Lock button on top of camera.

On the other side, I have the accidental problems with EOS M, when the camera is hanging on my neck and screen touches my body. The strip is located on "safer" place.


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## AlanF (Sep 12, 2018)

How fast was the AF?


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## BRunner (Sep 12, 2018)

AlanF said:


> How fast was the AF?


Hard to evaluate, the presentation was indoor with artificial lighting only and part of the room was dark, but the AF didn't hunt and I think that it was limited by speed of lens motors more than by body itself.


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## vaotix (Sep 12, 2018)

Did you get to test any 3rd party AF lenses with the adapter? Curious how the performance of my 3rd party Sigma lenses will be compared to Canon EF glass on this new body.


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## BRunner (Sep 12, 2018)

vaotix said:


> Did you get to test any 3rd party AF lenses with the adapter? Curious how the performance of my 3rd party Sigma lenses will be compared to Canon EF glass on this new body.


Unfortunately not, but there was a question about compatibility with 3rd party lenses. Officially Canon doesn't care, of course, but the Canon guy told us, that on another presentation someone tested 1.4/35 ART without any obvious troubles.


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## vaotix (Sep 12, 2018)

BRunner said:


> Unfortunately not, but there was a question about compatibility with 3rd party lenses. Officially Canon doesn't care, of course, but the Canon guy told us, that on another presentation someone tested 1.4/35 ART without any obvious troubles.



If this is the case, I'll buy an R asap. But I need to see verification from a reviewer first probably. Thanks for the info.


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## BRunner (Sep 13, 2018)

BRunner said:


> .............
> I forgot:
> 
> try to setup AF point selection with FOCUS button tap + scroll wheels - like on my 1DIV
> ............


Well, according manual, the AF point position is possible to select with wheels


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## bod (Oct 4, 2018)

I got to use an EOS R yesterday for a short walk around with a group of photographers (Thanks Canon Australia for doing this). The lens used was the new RF 24-105 Zoom. In the time I had with the camera I concentrated on aspects that are important to me (Ergonomics and the EVF for MF):

*Grip and handling* – Great. I found the body a really good size and comfortable to hold (my existing bodies are the 6D and 7DII). The grip is nice and deep and much better to get my fingers around – much better for me than the smaller grip on the M series. The camera felt nicely balanced with the kit zoom lens.

*Controls* – The layout feels pretty familiar to me as a Canon user and I found the dials easy to change settings with when shooting. I like the added functionality of the multi-function bar and the lens control ring and agree with the OP that this is innovative. I shoot mainly in Manual mode so the ability to also control ISO using the lens control ring is great (also can use multi-function bar to control ISO but I did not customise this to test it).I really like the joy stick on the 7DII which I will miss but I did not spend enough time using the EOS R options for adjusting the AF point to really comment on this – when I needed to move the focus point the touch screen worked.

*MF - Focus Peaking in EVF* – I agree with the OP that the focus peaking works well.

*MF – Focus guides in EVF* – Wow do I like this feature! Having not only an in focus green light but markers which help you judge how close to focus you are and whether you are currently focused closer or further away are great and another really innovative feature. Just as with focus assist on the DSLR the green light remains on for small rotational movements of the focus ring but the added feedback in the EVF is very helpful for judging fine focus. Note also that the size of the focus spot can be adjusted from “normal” to “small” to assist in fine focusing.

*MF – Zoom in EVF* – I could not test this as my interest is in finding out how it works with an EF lens/adaptor attached. I assume that the implementation is similar to that in the M5. The “AF + MF” function as found in the M5 where half pressing the shutter button initiates a magnified image after AF (to allow fine adjustment of focus) will likely only work with an RF lens. From reading the manual it is possible to magnify the image in the EVF with any lens by pressing the "magnify" and "info" buttons. 

Overall I was impressed. I was told that the EOS R will be in stores in Sydney next week. Hopefully the local hire companies will add them to their inventory and I can then hire the EOS R for a day and spend more time using it later this month.


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## bbb34 (Oct 4, 2018)

What is the touch and feel of the manual focus ring on the RF lenses?
Is there any noticeable lag between the ring and the optics?


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## vitalsax (Oct 10, 2018)

I've got my camera today and i discovered that it has:

No stabilization in camera stabilization. OK, so when using one of the 3 adapters to use your existing Canon glass, if the lens doesn’t have IS then you have zero access to IS. Compatibility factor just took a hit here.
One SD card slot.
No joy stick to set AF. 
No continuous shooting in silent at launch – however we’re told it will be addressed in future firmware update.
You can shoot 8 FPS in one shot, the only issue is ….that is in one shot…in continuous IAF to 5 frames upto 47 raw files in a row. 
Video: Not Full Frame 4K video. The 4K is cropped.
I Should Have Known Better that something was not right because it was not back-ordered at all


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## bod (Oct 10, 2018)

bbb34 said:


> What is the touch and feel of the manual focus ring on the RF lenses?
> Is there any noticeable lag between the ring and the optics?


 This is a good question. I am not interested in getting the 24-105 RF zoom so did not examine this carefully when I used the EOS R body but used the time I had to focus on the aspects I noted in my earlier post.
I own the 40 pancake and whilst it is a good lens optically I find manual focus of the pancake a pain so always use it in AF. With the RF lens I did not notice any similar issues when using manual focus but will look at this more carefully the next time I get the opportunity.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 10, 2018)

vitalsax said:


> I've got my camera today and i discovered that it has:
> 
> No stabilization in camera stabilization. OK, so when using one of the 3 adapters to use your existing Canon glass, if the lens doesn’t have IS then you have zero access to IS. Compatibility factor just took a hit here.
> One SD card slot.
> ...


This has been known and discussed since it was announced. Did you really buy the camera without reading about it first?


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## Maximilian (Oct 10, 2018)

Thank you all for your first impressions.
It looks like Canon has made a more than decent job in setting a base in this new mirrorless system. 
Now I really impatiently wait for the more professional camera body/ies and how and how fast Canon will expand their RF lens lineup.
Exiting times.


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## Pooshoes (Oct 10, 2018)

I picked up my EOS R last night and had a chance to take it on a walk an do a little still and video testing. I found that the video quality is on par with the 5DIV but I found that using the digital stabilization, while amazing in combination with the RF 24-105 lens IS, It had a softening effect and really caused jitter while filming and walking. 4K was also good but seemed soft with digital IS on. Skip digital IS if you want sharper video, but otherwise it allows you to handhold at 105mm and look like a tripod. I'm going to experiment with the sharpening settings and Noise reduction settings to see if they make a difference in sharpness. I expect the best thing to do is turn all of the correction algorithms off for maximum detail.

The ergonomics are perfect, I had no problems using the camera and didn't find any quirks that bothered me about the controls. I did have to go into the menu and turn on focus point selection using the screen and had to make a settings adjustment to speed up moving selection around the screen so it was more like a touch pad. I didn't find any problem reaching the screen with my thumb with my finger on the shutter. 

IQ of the EOS R is on par with the 5D IV. I'd say if you are in the market for a canon camera, skip a new 5DIV. Buy a used one or an EOS R, both will get you a solid imaging and video camera. 

Autofocus is fantastic, perhaps better than the 5DIV. Never searching for the subject and picks them back up after they go behind an obstacle. Eye AF is excellent, studio shooters will like this with some of that big glass. 

The size of these new mirrorless bodies is amazing regardless of manufacture. Such a compact powerhouse. 

While using the new lens ring, I did notice a slight lag from turning the (aperture) ring on the lens and it reporting which aperture I landed on in the viewfinder. 

The touchbar is useful, it really is like another dial but with the advantage of having 2 buttons to program.

The strap it came with was a bit narrower than the 5DIV strap. I want to get a 3rd party one anyway. 

I absolutely can't wait until we get some more RF glass. I've started selling some of my EF glass now... 

Let me know if you have any questions!


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## Refurb7 (Oct 11, 2018)

vitalsax said:


> I've got my camera today and i discovered that it has:
> 
> No stabilization in camera stabilization. OK, so when using one of the 3 adapters to use your existing Canon glass, if the lens doesn’t have IS then you have zero access to IS. Compatibility factor just took a hit here.
> One SD card slot.
> ...


Such a strange post. Petty sure I saw the exact same post on another forum. You are posting the same text on various forums? 

In essense, this says you pre-ordered the camera without knowing anything about it. All of these details have been widely publicized and discussed for about a month.


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## aa_angus (Oct 12, 2018)

After a 2 day delay in receiving my EOS R..I have spent half a day shooting with it. And, well..I am absolutely blown away. It is *more* than I had hoped for.
It's intuitive like all Canons - the fact I now feel completely confident shooting with it after just half a day speaks for itself.

The touch bar: *wow*. I heard people saying they were hitting it accidentally while shooting. Nope, this didn't happen once with me. Not only is it amazing while shooting (I have it set to scroll through AF point selection methods), it makes reviewing photos way easier/quicker too.

This is where it gets interesting, and completely surpassed my expectations. I was shooting motorbikes screaming down a hill near my place. AI servo, continuous focus. It did not feel slow at all. 3 frames/sec is just not true. If I had to guess, I would have said that it shoots more frames per second than my 5DIV's. That's what it felt like to me. I bought a new SanDisk 300mb/s card with the camera, so maybe that has something to do with it. But AF speed and frames per second are *not* an issue with this camera (unless you're shooting the Olympics for a major publication..and even then it would absolutely cut it).

The screen is a ripper. So nice to shoot and review with. I think there's more going on with the sensor than the 5DIV too. Not by heaps, but this feels more accomplished in low light.

People saying they cannot reach the screen for AF point selection with their thumb...what? How? Set it to top right corner of the screen and you're good to go. I don't have massive hands, but had zero issues "reaching" the screen". You can fine tune the crap out of how you want this to work.

Apart from having to learn to shoot with a new system (which took half a day), I don't have anything bad to report yet. If you are on the edge, you will simply not regret buying this camera. I'm shooting with the control ring adapter and my EF lenses. I don't have any RF lenses, nor will I for a long time. I have, however, just listed one of my 5DIV's for sale. I will sell the other one as soon as the next "R" camera is released. This new system destroys the old one.


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## aa_angus (Oct 12, 2018)

The AF speed is boss hog. You won't be limited in that area, no matter what you're shooting.


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## Maximilian (Oct 12, 2018)

Thanks for your impression aa_angus.



aa_angus said:


> ... AI servo, continuous focus. It did not feel slow at all. 3 frames/sec is just not true.


Technical data says "up to 5 fps with continuous AF."


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## Act444 (Oct 14, 2018)

FINALLY can report back after fiddling with a demo model in-store for about a half-hour or so...keep in mind these are first impressions only and NOT necessarily final thoughts or review comments...

Mixed feelings about the camera overall. There are some things I agree with the early reviewers about, such as the camera feeling good in the hand, but there are others I disagree with, mainly the EVF - a lot of people were saying it's really good, and perhaps it is by EVF standards - don't have enough experience with them personally - but it *still* does not compare to a good old optical viewfinder in my honest opinion. That being said, however, I did appreciate the "live" exposure preview and depth-of-field preview you get with EVFs.

My first thoughts among actually seeing it. It is somewhat larger than I had hoped. Still smaller than a 5D but not a small camera by any means. It looks to be close to the size (footprint) of an 80D, with a thinner body but similar-size grip. The positive is that the camera felt comfortable to hold (with the 24-105) and use, even though my hands are on the large side.

I found out within seconds of shooting my first shots with it that there is a learning curve to using this camera, even being a long-time Canon shooter of their DSLRs and M-series cameras. I'm used to being able to pick up a new Canon camera, dial in settings and run off, but I had to figure things out on this one. As for the touch-bar, I have to put myself in the camp that doesn't care for it much. Like I said, I have larger hands and I found I was accidentally activating it when gripping it normally. In addition to that, I found it to be a bit laggy...which brings me to the shooting experience with the R. I found the touch-and-drag AF point function to be laggy as well...and when switched to "absolute" mode, not only was it laggy, but jumpy as well. However, shooting with the screen in "live view" mode, it's great. Screen is really nice, with a good refresh rate - silent mode is awesome, touch is responsive just like on the M cameras. The viewfinder shooting experience is not as good currently, but I think it may be something that may be able to be improved with future firmware updates.

AF experience - no significant issues with speed, seemed pretty quick, at least with the 24-105 stock lens - accuracy I found to be average, no better than a DSLR at least (disappointing). But maybe I just need to test it more first. Servo tracking, I need to test it more extensively to be sure but I wasn't very impressed during my quick test. Then again, adjustments may have been needed, so final judgment reserved there.

Image quality (with 24-105) - OK. Images I found to be a bit softer than I'm used to seeing from this class of camera, and even compared to the 5D4. But that may be more indicative of the lens (and its lack of sharpness at 105mm f4) than anything else. More testing needed, particularly with a better lens like the RF 50 1.2.

Misc:

- You cannot (at least that I know of) set the camera to operate like a DSLR, i.e., you use the viewfinder to take the shot with the screen off, and use the screen ONLY to view the image and have it switch off again. So you're either stuck with the camera in "permanent live view mode", or you must disable the screen and view EVERYTHING (including menus) through the viewfinder.

- In silent shooting mode, a couple notes. First, a white box appears to let the photographer know a pic has been taken and recorded. It is TRULY silent - meaning no sounds from the camera body at all. However, it does not take much movement at all to introduce distortion (rolling shutter effect). Shooting during slow panning is enough! Someone standing relatively still, perhaps moving only slightly, it works really well though. And, as we all know, only single-shot mode works.

- Don't know what Canon was thinking when they removed the click wheel in the back around the Q/SET button. The 6D2 has one...even my M6 has one...therefore, _another_ adjustment of "muscle memory" required if shooting this camera along with a 5D or 6D or M5/M6. I usually have that set to aperture (in M mode).

I still think the camera, and the RF series in general, has great potential. It's clear that this is where the future lies. But as it stands, I would not replace a 5D4 with this...or a 5D3 for that matter. IMHO, the speed/responsiveness is just not there yet. A few somewhat puzzling decisions (e.g., lack of mode dial, reduction in buttons), and lag-time on switching AF points, slow down the operation of the camera compared to a 5D series and therefore if I need to get the shot, I'd still rather have a 5D in hand than an R. All that said, however, I'm still considering one as a travel camera/situations where speed isn't critical. In this case the R would complement rather than replace existing cameras. Some of the issues I pointed out may be able to be pinned down/worked around with more time with the camera, while others will need to be fixed in EOS R version 2.0 (or a new firmware release).


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## Adelino (Oct 15, 2018)

vitalsax said:


> I've got my camera today and i discovered that it has:
> 
> No stabilization in camera stabilization. OK, so when using one of the 3 adapters to use your existing Canon glass, if the lens doesn’t have IS then you have zero access to IS. Compatibility factor just took a hit here.
> One SD card slot.
> ...



You ordered something that costs > 2K and knew so little about it? Even basic specs?


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 15, 2018)

What I like:

-Seems to focus at least as well as a 5DIV in low light.
-EF adapter seems to work almost flawlessly, except the camera got a little glitchy once with a 50mm 1.0L on it. But, you know, nobody cares about that lens any more.
-The touch and drag autofocus point selection I think could be very useful with some practice.
-The shutter closes when you turn off the camera. YES, Canon, this is how it should work. Why everyone else leaves the sensor wide open and susceptible to dust during lens changes baffles me.
-It's a minor thing, but the knurled metal dials feel so much more solid and seem easier to grip onto and turn than the soft rubber ones ever did.

What I'm a little unsure of:

-Battery life is definitely not what you get from a DSLR. But, admittedly, my first time using the camera, I was probably messing around in the menus way more than I would normally.
-Is it just me, or is the single point autofocus point on a 5DIV smaller and more precise than the one on the EOS R? However, I noticed that there was a setting to change the size of the one on the EOS R to "small," and I think it's about as small as the point on a 5DIV now.

What I don't like:

-The way the camera forces using the rear display for live view shooting on you. I want to only use the display for menus and photo review, not shooting. However it doesn't seem like there's any way to shut off the display, to not use it for live view shooting. The only things close I found were to either set the viewfinder to display toggling to manual, which is cumbersome, or to set up a button dedicated to turning off the display, or setting it to a 15 second timeout. However when you do put the display to sleep, it seems like it takes a little longer for the EVF to turn back on when you bring the camera up to your face. What I want is something like a 0 second timeout on the display when shooting. ie, the display just shuts off when shooting, but it will still turn on to review photos or go through menus, as it would on a DSLR, and without putting the whole camera into a sort of sleep mode the way it seems to now.
-Does anyone else notice that when taking a photo, the EVF seems to flash brightly? This is using the conventional shutter. It's weird and disorienting.
-The electronic level in the EVF is very obtrusive and there doesn't seem to be a way to move it or make it smaller. I want one that's more subtle, like the viewfinder level in the 5DIV. It's small and up at the top of the frame... It's there when I need it, but easily ignored when I don't. However it is nice that the one on the EOS R is lit up since it's an EVF. The one of the 5DIV is completely invisible in low light.


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## Viggo (Oct 15, 2018)

The reason it flashes bright is because it focuses wide open, so if you’re shooting at f4 and focus it jumps to a wider aperture for focus, but keep the DOF preview as much as possible. I like that, because other mirrorless focus stopped down, which I hate intensely


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## koenkooi (Oct 15, 2018)

Viggo said:


> The reason it flashes bright is because it focuses wide open, so if you’re shooting at f4 and focus it jumps to a wider aperture for focus, but keep the DOF preview as much as possible. I like that, because other mirrorless focus stopped down, which I hate intensely



I've seen a few mentions that it will focus stopped-down up to F5.6 and open up for focussing if you have set an aperture smaller than F5.6. The manual doesn't seem to mention the "Focus wide open" feature at all nor contain any mention of F5.6, besides the Av explanation pictures, so can anyone with an EOS R check if the focus is always at maximum aperture or up to F5.6?


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## Viggo (Oct 15, 2018)

koenkooi said:


> I've seen a few mentions that it will focus stopped-down up to F5.6 and open up for focussing if you have set an aperture smaller than F5.6. The manual doesn't seem to mention the "Focus wide open" feature at all nor contain any mention of F5.6, besides the Av explanation pictures, so can anyone with an EOS R check if the focus is always at maximum aperture or up to F5.6?


I think I’ve read wide open or “wide enough”.

I hardly ever shoot smaller than f2.0 ...


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 15, 2018)

Viggo said:


> The reason it flashes bright is because it focuses wide open, so if you’re shooting at f4 and focus it jumps to a wider aperture for focus, but keep the DOF preview as much as possible. I like that, because other mirrorless focus stopped down, which I hate intensely


No, this is when shooting wide open, so your explanation doesn't make sense in this case. It's also right when taking the photo, not when focusing.

Does no one else see a bright flash in the EVF right when taking a photo?


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## caMARYnon (Oct 15, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> No, this is when shooting wide open, so your explanation doesn't make sense in this case. It's also right when taking the photo, not when focusing.
> 
> Does no one else see a bright flash in the EVF right when taking a photo?


nope


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## Act444 (Oct 15, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> -Is it just me, or is the single point autofocus point on a 5DIV smaller and more precise than the one on the EOS R? However, I noticed that there was a setting to change the size of the one on the EOS R to "small," and I think it's about as small as the point on a 5DIV now.



No, it’s not just you - normal AF point on the R is identical to the AF point in Live View on the 5D4, which is larger than a conventional DSLR viewfinder AF point. In fact, that was one of the first things I did upon testing out the R; change the AF point size to small.


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## Fred Strobel (Oct 15, 2018)

I used it this weekend. I really liked it, but I think I need to practice a little with it. I used the multistrip to set to change autofocus method and did find that I would hit it, so I set it to lock with the lock button on top. I kind of like the FV mode, however sometimes I would accidentally reset to auto everything and when you change shutter to auto and start changing back to manual on it, it starts at 30 seconds and it has a long way to go back to a value I would actually use. I have C1 and C2 modes as FV with particular shutter speed s (1/2000 and 1/100) making easy to go to those by pressing mode and selecting those modes. I had some problems with flash because I was not used to using flash on mirrorless I was unsure if the flash actually fired. I gave up on it quickly. It did after I looked at the file when I got home and looked at the files. I have now set up C3 mode for flash. I will need to test this out. One thing I really like is that on the 6D, it was a chore to switch to video having to change settings switch the video setting on camera than when done switch everything back. On this camera, you can press the record button on top. It takes a video and stops when you hit it again and goes back to photos settings. This is convenient for a person like me who might want a quick video clip but shoots mostly stills. Below are two images. The bottom uses Yougnou Flash


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 15, 2018)

Act444 said:


> No, it’s not just you - normal AF point on the R is identical to the AF point in Live View on the 5D4, which is larger than a conventional DSLR viewfinder AF point. In fact, that was one of the first things I did upon testing out the R; change the AF point size to small.


Yeah, I was relieved to find the setting to shrink its size. Even the "small" point seems to be a little larger than a DSLR point, especially with the DSLR point set to small. Really wish I could go even smaller with the EOS R single point. That's why I'm setting it to a single point, I want to be able to focus on one thing precisely.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 16, 2018)

Both the 5D MK IV (liveview) and the R allow a smaller AF point to be set.


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 16, 2018)

Yes, but the "small" focus points on the EOS R still seem larger and less precise than the points in the viewfinder of a 5DIV.

Anyway, I used the EOS R again last night. I'm really torn. It definitely seems to be able to focus better in low light than the 5DIV. But the EVF still adds a level of being disconnected from what's going on in front of me that really hinders getting a good shot in a dynamic and fast moving situation.

The EVF seems to lag a little bit when focusing. And every third time or so that I half-press the shutter button, the EVF bogs down and gets very laggy. It's almost like sometimes the camera can't focus and keep a smooth feed going to the EVF at the same time. This also seems to be when that bright flash I talked about happens. Like if I half-press the shutter button multiple times in a row, all of a sudden the EVF flashes bright and gets very laggy. It's weird and it makes me wish for an OVF.

However, the freedom to move the AF point anywhere on the screen is nice. It will take some getting used to, but I think it could be a real benefit.

So I really don't know how I feel about this camera. In some ways it lets me do more than my 5DIV, in other ways it feels like it gets in the way of being able to get a good shot.


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## Viggo (Oct 16, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> Yes, but the "small" focus points on the EOS R still seem larger and less precise than the points in the viewfinder of a 5DIV.
> 
> Anyway, I used the EOS R again last night. I'm really torn. It definitely seems to be able to focus better in low light than the 5DIV. But the EVF still adds a level of being disconnected from what's going on in front of me that really hinders getting a good shot in a dynamic and fast moving situation.
> 
> ...


Have you tried all the different EVF settings? There is a setting to make it faster for action and a way to slow it down to save battery.


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 16, 2018)

Yes, this is with the power saving mode off.

Let me be clear, this is not just "oh the EVF is a little laggy all the time," this is like something happens within the camera, usually focusing, and the EVF just completely bogs down for a second, like the camera just can't keep up with whatever it's doing and also keep a smooth feed going to the EVF.


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## vaotix (Oct 16, 2018)

So I finally got my lens adapter and am now able to adapt my EF lenses. I shot a few test shots last night and plan to take the camera out today after work to really get a feel for it. But so far I'm loving it. Just some minor nitpicks I have with it. The camera is super customizable (more than I ever thought I'd see from Canon), but the lack of some options on some dials is annoying. Why can't I make the dial around the mode button be an exposure comp dial? You can set the control ring on the lens/adapter to exposure comp but not the dial? Seems silly. Currently, I have the Fn bar set to ISO, the control ring set to aperture, and the top dial set to shutter speed. Not sure what to do with the last one because all the options it gives me are redundant.

Anyway, these are minor nitpicks. I can't complain too much. Image quality is a huge step up from my crop 80D. The camera feels incredible in the hand. And the EVF is fantastic so far.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 16, 2018)

Viggo said:


> Have you tried all the different EVF settings? There is a setting to make it faster for action and a way to slow it down to save battery.


I have not tried the EVF settings. I seldom photograph action photos where I have to track, so one shot works for that, and the EVF is not really a factor so far. I do low light photography, so I will want to see how good AF is, but my 5D MK UV focused ok, so the R should be as good or better. I have lots of things going on right now (and always, it seems), so I hope to try my 100-400L. I'm pretty sure my 70-200 MK II will be fine.

I'm thinking that the camera may do well for macro shots, so I want to try handheld shots there as well.


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## Act444 (Oct 16, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> Yes, but the "small" focus points on the EOS R still seem larger and less precise than the points in the viewfinder of a 5DIV.
> 
> Anyway, I used the EOS R again last night. I'm really torn. It definitely seems to be able to focus better in low light than the 5DIV. But the EVF still adds a level of being disconnected from what's going on in front of me that really hinders getting a good shot in a dynamic and fast moving situation.
> 
> ...



I feel like that has happened to me before with the M-series cameras...the screen can get laggy in low-light, especially when using a flash...and there is also significant shutter lag. That being said, it sounds like what you are describing with the flashing EVF is probably a bug (or “phenomenon” as Canon calls it). 

I’d be curious to get your thoughts on general low-light AF performance. Not in tracking fast subjects, but more in a social-type setting with posed portraits/candid shots.


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## Viggo (Oct 16, 2018)

Didn’t notice any lag or flashing so far.

But can someone comment on the low light AF? I’ve tried with the 85 L IS with the standard adapter in it’s not even close to locking in low light... I had to expand the AF area to zone, nothing else would lock. And it was only in my kitchen, nowhere near -6, -4, -2 ev at all...


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## snappy604 (Oct 16, 2018)

insightful posts guys.. and thanks. I think it firmly puts me on the camp of wait and see (maybe the new firmware fixes things). Most of the symptoms seem like either it can't process the sheer volume of data or it was too rushed. Shows potential for new bodies though!


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## Jethro (Oct 16, 2018)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> I'm thinking that the camera may do well for macro shots, so I want to try handheld shots there as well.


I'm very interested in this - please let us know when you have formed a view.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 17, 2018)

I went outside into bright sunlight for a few minutes and, with glasses on, could not see the image on the LCD nor the EVF. I have a different eye shade that works better for glasses, but did not expect a total inability to see the EVF. I have since increased brightness of the EVF, but I have yet to dig out my alternate eyepiece.

I think the issue is both light reflection off of my photo gray glasses which are new to me, and darken a lot in bright light combined with the dimmer viewfinder. I'll try my other non photo gray glasses first.


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## Talys (Oct 17, 2018)

Viggo said:


> Didn’t notice any lag or flashing so far.
> 
> But can someone comment on the low light AF? I’ve tried with the 85 L IS with the standard adapter in it’s not even close to locking in low light... I had to expand the AF area to zone, nothing else would lock. And it was only in my kitchen, nowhere near -6, -4, -2 ev at all...


Is there any AF Flash illuminator love with the R? Will it work with standard illuminators (where there's a red pattern on the target), or is it hopeless, like Sony cameras?


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## Viggo (Oct 17, 2018)

Talys said:


> Is there any AF Flash illuminator love with the R? Will it work with standard illuminators (where there's a red pattern on the target), or is it hopeless, like Sony cameras?


Indeed it is a red light thing and it worked. I was so surprised when it lit up, didn’t know it had one and I hardly ever use One Shot, lol.


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## Viggo (Oct 17, 2018)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> I went outside into bright sunlight for a few minutes and, with glasses on, could not see the image on the LCD nor the EVF. I have a different eye shade that works better for glasses, but did not expect a total inability to see the EVF. I have since increased brightness of the EVF, but I have yet to dig out my alternate eyepiece.
> 
> I think the issue is both light reflection off of my photo gray glasses which are new to me, and darken a lot in bright light combined with the dimmer viewfinder. I'll try my other non photo gray glasses first.


You don’t by any chance have polarized sunglasses ?


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## Larsskv (Oct 17, 2018)

Can anyone elaborate on the AF, when coupled with a wide open large aperture lens, when your subject is moving?

For now, I use the 1DXII to take pictures of my 8 month old daughter moving around, for the most part coupled with the 24LII, 35LII and 50L. I use single point AF in servo mode. It is a challenge to have her eyes in focus when using large aperture, and I guess my keeper rate is maybe 1-2 out of 10. Do you think I can expect a better keeper rate with the EOS R?


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## vjlex (Oct 17, 2018)

I got to play around with a store copy of the EOS R today, but wasn't too impressed. Granted, 5 to 10 minutes of flipping through the menus and taking a couple shots isn't enough to assess this camera fairly, but it wasn't love at first shot or anything. It felt like a pared down 5D Mark IV (and really that's what it is, I guess)

One thing I couldn't figure out- turning the control ring by itself had no effect. It required that I half-press the shutter button to use it (I set it for controlling ISO). Is that how it's supposed to work? It kind of defeats the purpose for me if I have to simultaneously press another button to use the control ring. Is there a setting to change that?

Also, I didn't really like the EVF. It's the second Canon EVF I've tried, and the second one I've disliked. I think I probably am just not a fan of EVF. Staring at them makes me feel kinda dizzy. If I end up going FF MILC at some point, I'll probably stick to the LCD/live view for composing my shots.


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## vjlex (Oct 17, 2018)

vaotix said:


> Why can't I make the dial around the mode button be an exposure comp dial? You can set the control ring on the lens/adapter to exposure comp but not the dial? Seems silly.



Hmm, I only played with it for a few minutes, but at least on the copy I used, the default function of the mode button was exposure compensation.


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## Viggo (Oct 17, 2018)

shunsai said:


> Hmm, I only played with it for a few minutes, but at least on the copy I used, the default function of the mode button was exposure compensation.


Yup, mine too!


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## Viggo (Oct 17, 2018)

I haven’t tried any fast tracking, but AF is so much better than the 1dx for everything slow moving, I get sharpness every time I never got with the 1dx2. Very happy it just works... will be trying some low light soccer shooting this evening, it’s dark, artificial lights (outside), light rain and fast moving subjects, it will answer a few questions I’m sure.


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## briangus (Oct 17, 2018)

So far mines has not seen daylight or anything below 1600
Quite impressed with low level handling and the output.

Was shooting both R and 5D4 at a gig on Sunday and when I switched to the 5D4 I thought I had left the lens cap on.
Shot some 4K video on both and the R looks much better, again in very low light levels.
Also none of those 4GB lumps to stitch together, just a single file which seemed to output faster in FCPX


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## Larsskv (Oct 17, 2018)

Viggo said:


> I haven’t tried any fast tracking, but AF is so much better than the 1dx for everything slow moving, I get sharpness every time I never got with the 1dx2. Very happy it just works... will be trying some low light soccer shooting this evening, it’s dark, artificial lights (outside), light rain and fast moving subjects, it will answer a few questions I’m sure.



I consider replacing my 1DXII for the EOS R. As much as I love the 1DXII, it is an expensive camera that for me doesn't offer too much over my 5DIV. I don't shoot much action and I don't need many fps. In many situations, I find the 5DIV to suit my needs better.

What I hope to get with the EOS R is larger AF area coverage, and more precise AF-servo when using large aperture lenses. 

I would love to get your input on how you think the 1DXII and EOS R compares when shooting kids moving indoors, when trying to get their eyes in focus, at f1.4-f2. Thanks!


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## Viggo (Oct 17, 2018)

Larsskv said:


> I consider replacing my 1DXII for the EOS R. As much as I love the 1DXII, it is an expensive camera that for me doesn't offer too much over my 5DIV. I don't shoot much action and I don't need many fps. In many situations, I find the 5DIV to suit my needs better.
> 
> What I hope to get with the EOS R is larger AF area coverage, and more precise AF-servo when using large aperture lenses.
> 
> I would love to get your input on how you think the 1DXII and EOS R compares when shooting kids moving indoors, when trying to get their eyes in focus, at f1.4-f2. Thanks!


I tried some of that just now and it works, quite simply. I have loads and loads of shots in focus that would have been “almost” with the 1dx2. I love this camera already, seriously. I find that shooting priority and 5 fps yields more shots in focus than with the 1dx2 with tracking priority and 14 fps.... I use the single point or zone and it finds faces and everything looks great.

Battery info : 300 shots , 84% left. And I’ve been playing a lot with it too.


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## Larsskv (Oct 17, 2018)

Viggo said:


> I tried some of that just now and it works, quite simply. I have loads and loads of shots in focus that would have been “almost” with the 1dx2. I love this camera already, seriously. I find that shooting priority and 5 fps yields more shots in focus than with the 1dx2 with tracking priority and 14 fps.... I use the single point or zone and it finds faces and everything looks great.
> 
> Battery info : 300 shots , 84% left. And I’ve been playing a lot with it too.



Thank you very much! You just made Canon a sale.


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## caMARYnon (Oct 17, 2018)

Brian posted his EOS R review: "I have a lot to say about this camera and most of it is very positive."
https://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Canon-EOS-R.aspx


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 17, 2018)

Viggo said:


> You don’t by any chance have polarized sunglasses ?


No polarization. They do play havoc with LCD displays. 

I thought I'd mention it in case someone else saw it as well. I have no issue with the viewfinder except in the bright sunlight, yesterday was a beautiful fall day and very bright.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 17, 2018)

Jethro said:


> I'm very interested in this - please let us know when you have formed a view.


I tried my 50mm Macro and 100L with the camera briefly, snapping a hand held shot of a couple of flowers that have not yet been frozen this fall. It seemed to AF very well at relatively close distances. I also tried a 55mm Nikkor AI macro with adapter and focus peaking. That was no go, the focus peaking is just not precise enough, or I am moving slightly so I'll need a tripod to check that.

This is the 50mm f/2.5.







100mm L


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## Act444 (Oct 17, 2018)

caMARYnon said:


> Brian posted his EOS R review: "I have a lot to say about this camera and most of it is very positive."
> https://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Canon-EOS-R.aspx



Thanks for sharing. Interesting note, which might help explain why the images I took the other day appeared so soft: he compared the R and 5D4 side by side with the 200 f2 IS and the 5D4 image appears a bit crisper. I noticed this with the Nikon comparisons as well; looks like the Z7 output *may* be a bit softer than its D850 counterpart even though they are both 45MP and neither has an AA filter...

Hmm...I admit, I do not like soft output. The 5D4 output is already a bit softer than I would like...I have to do noticeably more USM tweaking with the 5D4 and M6 than I did with prior cameras. If the R is even softer than that......excitement tempered further. but still, it looks like folks are getting awesome results when using the RF 50 1.2 with it. Clearly we haven’t begun to see the real potential of that lens!


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## vaotix (Oct 17, 2018)

shunsai said:


> Hmm, I only played with it for a few minutes, but at least on the copy I used, the default function of the mode button was exposure compensation.



I'll have to take another look. But I could have sworn it wasn't an option.


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## Viggo (Oct 17, 2018)

Act444 said:


> Thanks for sharing. Interesting note, which might help explain why the images I took the other day appeared so soft: he compared the R and 5D4 side by side with the 200 f2 IS and the 5D4 image appears a bit crisper. I noticed this with the Nikon comparisons as well; looks like the Z7 output *may* be a bit softer than its D850 counterpart even though they are both 45MP and neither has an AA filter...
> 
> Hmm...I admit, I do not like soft output. The 5D4 output is already a bit softer than I would like...I have to do noticeably more USM tweaking with the 5D4 and M6 than I did with prior cameras. If the R is even softer than that......excitement tempered further. but still, it looks like folks are getting awesome results when using the RF 50 1.2 with it. Clearly we haven’t begun to see the real potential of that lens!


Did you not read WHY it was soft? It has nothing to do with the raw files


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## Viggo (Oct 17, 2018)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> I tried my 50mm Macro and 100L with the camera briefly, snapping a hand held shot of a couple of flowers that have not yet been frozen this fall. It seemed to AF very well at relatively close distances. I also tried a 55mm Nikkor AI macro with adapter and focus peaking. That was no go, the focus peaking is just not precise enough, or I am moving slightly so I'll need a tripod to check that.
> 
> This is the 50mm f/2.5.
> 
> ...


Did you try the focus-assist from the Cine-cameras? I found to be insanely precise with the 85 f1.4 L.


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## Act444 (Oct 18, 2018)

Viggo said:


> Did you not read WHY it was soft? It has nothing to do with the raw files



This? Yes:



> Unsurprisingly, the Canon EOS R vs. 5D Mark IV comparison shows the two cameras about equal with an important note. That note is that the 5D Mark IV's image is slightly sharper. While it immediately looks like the 5D IV is delivering better image quality, that is not necessarily the case.
> 
> We have long been using a low Canon Digital Photo Professional sharpness setting of "1" (on a 1-10 scale) for lens testing as sharpening quickly masks differences between lenses. While it seems that increasing the sharpness of an image is a cheap fix to poor lens quality, that sharpening quickly becomes destructive to details, ruining the fine image quality you were seeking in the first place. Camera manufacturers know that you like sharp images and they crank up the default sharpness in attempt to make you happy. Nearly always, that setting is at a very destructive level. Fortunately, you can adjust the sharpness level to your taste.
> 
> There is a long pipeline between the imaging sensor and the final image file and not all cameras utilize identical hardware and software (most often, they do not). More specifically to the point, the amount of sharpening showing in a final JPG image processed using the same settings is not always the same. And, that is the case here.



I didn't mention it in my above rant, but I did notice that there doesn't necessarily seem to be (noticeably) less detail per se, it is just, for whatever reason, softer. It still translates to more time necessary to adjust many shots to taste in post.

Update: I typically use 4/3/3 USM in DPP to get in-focus 5D4 and M6 shots to taste, as well as lower the NR by about 1 level. After some tweaking, looks like I find I favor a 6/3/3 USM for the EOS R (and leaving NR on default setting). Reminds me of my old 7D, where I used 6/4/4 as the default. As a reference, for the high-res 5DSR I stick to the default 3/4/4 setting, and with the 85 1.4 IS I find myself sometimes even turning it down to 2/4/4 or 1.5/4/4.

Anyway, one thing's for sure: the sensor may have the same amount of MP as the 5D4 but the processing algorithm of the two cameras is _very_ different


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## dak723 (Oct 18, 2018)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> No polarization. They do play havoc with LCD displays.
> 
> I thought I'd mention it in case someone else saw it as well. I have no issue with the viewfinder except in the bright sunlight, yesterday was a beautiful fall day and very bright.



While not an expert on EVF's by any means, I would say this is a common occurance with EVFs. In bright sunlight from certain angles, you have to shde the EVF with your hand or you just can't see much. I think this is common with all brands.

So while the mirrorless crusaders (which I am not one despite owning only mirrorless) there are still advantages to the OVF. For that reason, DSLRs are almost certainly not going away soon - or maybe ever.


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## dak723 (Oct 18, 2018)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> I tried my 50mm Macro and 100L with the camera briefly, snapping a hand held shot of a couple of flowers that have not yet been frozen this fall. It seemed to AF very well at relatively close distances. I also tried a 55mm Nikkor AI macro with adapter and focus peaking. That was no go, the focus peaking is just not precise enough, or I am moving slightly so I'll need a tripod to check that.



Focus peaking - in my limited experience with some of the earlier Sony FF models - is more of a gimmick than a useful tool when it comes to any sort of macro or narrow DOF work. It works for landcapes or when the DOF is very wide. It basically says - yes, your photo is in focus, not this part or that part is in focus. No where near precise for that, in my opinion. I have read that it can vary widely by brand and may have improved over the years. It will be interesting to see if the Canon focus peaking is better than most.


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## vjlex (Oct 18, 2018)

shunsai said:


> I got to play around with a store copy of the EOS R today, but wasn't too impressed. Granted, 5 to 10 minutes of flipping through the menus and taking a couple shots isn't enough to assess this camera fairly, but it wasn't love at first shot or anything. It felt like a pared down 5D Mark IV (and really that's what it is, I guess)
> 
> One thing I couldn't figure out- turning the control ring by itself had no effect. It required that I half-press the shutter button to use it (I set it for controlling ISO). Is that how it's supposed to work? It kind of defeats the purpose for me if I have to simultaneously press another button to use the control ring. Is there a setting to change that?
> 
> Also, I didn't really like the EVF. It's the second Canon EVF I've tried, and the second one I've disliked. I think I probably am just not a fan of EVF. Staring at them makes me feel kinda dizzy. If I end up going FF MILC at some point, I'll probably stick to the LCD/live view for composing my shots.



I just played around with it a little more on my lunch break. I found the aforementioned setting to utilize the control ring without having to simultaneously press the exposure button. It's in the same custom menu, just a different option.

Also, I played around a little more with the AF and touch focus. Gotta admit, it is lovely. Fast and accurate. I'm even getting somewhat used to the EVF, although I still personally prefer the LCD.

The camera is growing on me. Although I still probably will wait for a more pro-oriented version of the camera to be announced, I feel a lot more comfortable now with getting an R.


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## vjlex (Oct 18, 2018)

vaotix said:


> I'll have to take another look. But I could have sworn it wasn't an option.



To lend credence to your problem, I tried today again and at first turning the mode dial had no effect. I searched for a setting in the menus and couldn't find any option for the mode dial. But then after exiting the menus and trying the mode dial again, its exposure compensation function started working again. Kinda weird.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 18, 2018)

I did some more playing around with my new toy today, I tried out my old Tokina 17mm f/3.5 prime, its very old but a nice lens, and it seemed to work very well on my R, a tough test of Tokina's reverse engineering from long long ago.

Then, I tried a generic L plate that I had bought for my SL-2 for just a few $ on Amazon. While not a custom fit, it did fit, and I could connect cables to it and open the LCD out fully, but not face the front. 

I then connected the camera to the pc in my studio, updated the Canon software, and having had the foresight to buy a USB C cable that would plug into the USB 3 ports on my PC, it tethered and operated remotely very well. I captured several images of my products to upload to my store. 

Finally, the check I had been dreading, using my Case Relay to power the camera from a USB power source or a USB battery. The camera worked very well with it and showed a 100% battery charge while it was connected to a standard 2.2 amp USB Charger.

So far, everything I've tried has worked as well or better than my 5D MK IV, but my MK IV is overkill, I don't use a lot of its capabilities.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 18, 2018)

Viggo said:


> Did you try the focus-assist from the Cine-cameras? I found to be insanely precise with the 85 f1.4 L.


I could not get focus assist to work with the lens, I turned it on earlier with a EF lens mounted, and it worked fine, so its possible that some setting is blocking it. Most likely, I was moving slightly after focusing, even though I tried to stay absolutely still. When the lens is manually stopped down, the peaking shows a depth of field, so its difficult to get the exact spot in focus, opening the lens to focus then closing it down and taking the shot all the while trying not to move is a issue for me. 

I did have the camera mounted to my light table today, but did not think of trying again with the micro lens to verify that moving was the issue. It works so well with the DPAF and touch to focus that I will be using that for most cases. I do have a bellows adapter that I can use for really precise macro stacking shots and a fully manual lens. It tilts as well to change the focus plane.


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## Viggo (Oct 18, 2018)

Just wanted to do a quick update. 

I tried shooting kids soccer last night with brutal artificial light, anti-Flickr ON, mixed with sunset and dark surroundings. Exit f1.4 (85 L) 1/1000s iso 8000-12800 and single point with 4 point expansion. And used release priority and 5 fps. I couldn’t be happier, I can’t post shots as I haven’t an ideal converter method yet, and it’s all other people’s kids, so you’re gonna have to trust me. It was incredible , I’m blown away! I shot perhaps 300 shots and it didn’t miss focus more than 3-4 times, and I’m guessing that was my fault also. I can’t believe how good this AF system is, it’s everything I counted on the 1dx2 to be when I bought it, but wasn’t for me. 

You heard it here first, I love mirrorless


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## vaotix (Oct 18, 2018)

shunsai said:


> To lend credence to your problem, I tried today again and at first turning the mode dial had no effect. I searched for a setting in the menus and couldn't find any option for the mode dial. But then after exiting the menus and trying the mode dial again, its exposure compensation function started working again. Kinda weird.



I can only get the dial to change exposure comp when half pressing the shutter button. There's no option to customize this functionality, as far as I can tell. And the dial customization options in the menu only seems to let you change what it does in M mode. It's kinda odd and a little unclear.


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## Viggo (Oct 18, 2018)

vaotix said:


> I can only get the dial to change exposure comp when half pressing the shutter button. There's no option to customize this functionality, as far as I can tell. And the dial customization options in the menu only seems to let you change what it does in M mode. It's kinda odd and a little unclear.


It isn’t unclear, the EC is only possible to adjust when the Metering is active


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## SereneSpeed (Oct 19, 2018)

QUESTIONS FOR OTHER USERS:

1 - Please tell me I'm doing something wrong... Is there a way to "touch and drag AF' while metering? If I half press the the shutter release, the AF point stops moving.

2 - Why is so much tied to metering? I can't change ISO with the mode dial unless the camera is metering?

OBSERVATIONS:

1 - Sigma Art 50 and 85 are 100% perfect on the R. Razor sharp, fast, and sure footed.

2 - The AF is better than the 5Div - It's scary good.

3 - The Mode dial is in a horrible place for me. My thumb has to reach up and over the hump in the right and I rub the hump while turning the dial. Very un-canon-like...

4 - This is nowhere close to a 5Div in build or ergonomics. That said, for what I just paid, I've gotten at least the same value.

5 - I went from a T3i to a 5D3 with absolutely no hiccups. Using the 5Div was exactly like using the 5D3. This camera is like switching from a PC to a Mac. It does the same things, but it's slightly different in almost every way. I'd complain here, but It hasn't been long enough to give it a fair chance.

6 - Cannot see using the M-Fn bar. Not good use of space. Again, this seems un-canon-like

7 - This camera sees in the dark. It AF's in darkness I can not see in. And it AF's perfectly. At ISO 40,000 1/100th 1.4 the camera focuses accurately. I can't use images with ISO that high. That's the new limiting factor for me. ISO, not AF...

8 - Why oh why can't we have Zebras or Highlight Alert in the EVF?

9 - The EVF is really tough to setup so it's close to the Histogram. I've never complained about dynamic range before, but I will now. I want an EVF with more dynamic range. Detecting blown highlights will take some getting used to. But,

10 - Having an Histogram in the EVF is pretty special.

Okay, that's it after only a couple hours in hand.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 19, 2018)

I managed to spend some time with my R snapping photos to learn how well it does, I even tried a old 35-80mm basic Canon lens with it, and it surprised me by how well it worked, AF was slow, of course, and at 80mm, the IQ was poor, but it focused accurately with no hunting.

Then, I had two Pentax M42 lenses at hand and I have several adaopters for them. I had wanted to try a 50mm f/1.4 that came my way for free, the front element was scratched up, and it was well used, but everything seemed to work. I was surprised and impressed with the brilliant colors and general IQ. I did try using the focus peaking with it, but it did not achieve critical focus, so I used the 5X setting and focused manually. That did a great job. Then, I tried a 2nf Pentax lens, a 50mm f/2. I was not as impressed with it, but it did do a good job.

Finally, I pulled out my 600mm Sigma mirror lens, thinking that focus peaking would make it a joy to use. Wrong again, I thought I had it nailed with the numerous different things I shot, but not one photo was well focused. I did not try the 5X magnification, I might yet do that.

I tried the 55mm Nikkor again using focus peaking for a close shot of the Sigma Mirror lens and it worked well. The camera was solidly attached to my light table. I compared it with a tethered manual focus using 10 X on my PC. It wasn't as good, but close.

I have dozens of various manual lenses, I may try some of my Olympus OM lenses as well.


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## koenkooi (Oct 19, 2018)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> [..]
> Then, I had two Pentax M42 lenses at hand and I have several adaopters for them. I had wanted to try a 50mm f/1.4 that came my way for free, the front element was scratched up, and it was well used, but everything seemed to work. I was surprised and impressed with the brilliant colors and general IQ. I did try using the focus peaking with it, but it did not achieve critical focus, so I used the 5X setting and focused manually. [..]



Does the new focus assist moving arrows thing work with those lenses? That would use DPAF for focus and should be a lot better than peaking.


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## sfwrtr (Oct 19, 2018)

Talys said:


> Is there any AF Flash illuminator love with the R? Will it work with standard illuminators (where there's a red pattern on the target), or is it hopeless, like Sony cameras?


I have the same lens as the poster. The EOS R has a yellow illuminator that lights as needed; the trick is it has a range of about 13 feet. I've captured images in a dim room at f/1.2 and got spot on results. I use the magnifier feature to show the focus point, and it just doesn't miss. I was thinking of selling my EF 85mm because I couldn't get it to focus handheld with my 5D MIII, but on the EOS R, it work great. Here's a silly unprocessed JPEG with full camera EXIF. Click to view or download; be my guest.


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## sfwrtr (Oct 19, 2018)

i've been using my EOS R with an EF 85L F/1.2, an EF 24-105, and EF 40mm f/2.8 STM for a few days now. The auto-focus is amazing and _fast_. I use both the drag feature on the view screen and the AF button and the D-Pad to move the AF point around. I can't believe any reviewer that says they need the numbin. Setting an AF point is so much faster than it was on my 5D Mark III.

The ability to magnify the focus point _in the viewfinder_ is a bonus.

I can actually walk around with my 85mm at f/1.2 and capture images handheld. Shooting with the Dual Pixel feature enabled looks to allow me to correct small discrepancies like just missing the eye. I've only tried it on flowers, but I was able use DPP to move the focus on a rosebud (taken handheld at f/2.5) to the tip of the rosette from slightly down the petal, so I can see that will prove useful (see below).

The shot to shot speed is great even with Dual Pixel enabled. (I did buy the Sony XD II 400r400w card.) I am not a sports photographer, so take with an appropriate grain of salt. I wonder if I'll ever need my 5D ever again. I'm writing up my impressions in detail on a blog at Canon EOS R Review.


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 19, 2018)

Larsskv said:


> Can anyone elaborate on the AF, when coupled with a wide open large aperture lens, when your subject is moving?
> 
> For now, I use the 1DXII to take pictures of my 8 month old daughter moving around, for the most part coupled with the 24LII, 35LII and 50L. I use single point AF in servo mode. It is a challenge to have her eyes in focus when using large aperture, and I guess my keeper rate is maybe 1-2 out of 10. Do you think I can expect a better keeper rate with the EOS R?


I briefly used single point servo AF with the EOS R and the 50 1.2L at f1.2. It seemed to do more or less ok, but honestly even my 5D IV never did particularly well with this. It's just a very difficult situation to focus in.


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## bhf3737 (Oct 19, 2018)

So far, for architecture, still life and macro photography the EOS R seems to be a very good match. The focus guide is excellent and precise with macro lenses MPE-65 and 100L (set to manual focus) and of course the TSE-24 (for architecture). I found focus guide more precise than the focus peaking. But haven't been able to change the size of the focus area when using the focus guide.
One missing feature so far is the lack of ability to use optical remote control RC-6 with this camera. The manual says that the Bluetooth remote controller BR-E1 should work, though.


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## Viggo (Oct 19, 2018)

I took a bunch of dark shots at every subject and place I could, converted to dng and pushed them +5.00 stops in Lr, there is NO BANDING.....Absolutely no banding.

Then... then I took a few shots with flash (Bron monolight) of my daughter against a black wall, pushed the black wall up and it showed the same green banding Tony showed at +1.65 stops. Anyone know why it happens with flash, but not at all with any other shot?


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## SereneSpeed (Oct 20, 2018)

The EOS R has two types of silent shooting settings.

A 'Silent Shutter' and 'Silent LV Shoot'. 'Silent LV Shoot' is set to 'mode 1' as default.

I just discovered that that is what's causing the banding with flash! I was wracking my brain!

Set that to "Silent LV Shoot.' to disable and the banding goes away.

However, At 1/8000th with a Canon EX600RT and 'Silent LV Shoot' set to 'Disable' you will get a line of blown out highlight at the bottom of your image. It looks like the exact opposite of exceeding your x-sync. At 1/4000th, nothing.





Viggo said:


> I took a bunch of dark shots at every subject and place I could, converted to dng and pushed them +5.00 stops in Lr, there is NO BANDING.....Absolutely no banding.
> 
> Then... then I took a few shots with flash (Bron monolight) of my daughter against a black wall, pushed the black wall up and it showed the same green banding Tony showed at +1.65 stops. Anyone know why it happens with flash, but not at all with any other shot?



Viggo, I'm dying to know what your 'Silent LV Shoot' was set to? And if it wasn't set to disable... I wonder if Tony was using the default setting of 'Mode 1' when he got the banding... ?

I cannot remember where, but in one of the threads here, someone mentioned banding under a type of LED of fluorescent tube. I wonder if that had anything to do with 'Silent LV Shoot."?


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## SereneSpeed (Oct 20, 2018)

Oh and as good and Canon's owner's manuals usually are, I need someone to help me understand just what they are saying in the section about 'Silent LV Shoot.'

I get that the shutter sounds different, but what is the purpose and what are they saying with their (vague to me) explanations?


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 20, 2018)

SereneSpeed said:


> Oh and as good and Canon's owner's manuals usually are, I need someone to help me understand just what they are saying in the section about 'Silent LV Shoot.'
> 
> I get that the shutter sounds different, but what is the purpose and what are they saying with their (vague to me) explanations?


I believe it has a electronic first curtain but the shutter closes when you release the shutter button. The shutter stays open in the full silent mode which can cause the banding under certain pulsating lighting, because the sensor readout is sequential and is going on with the shutter open.


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## SereneSpeed (Oct 20, 2018)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> I believe it has a electronic first curtain but the shutter closes when you release the shutter button. The shutter stays open in the full silent mode which can cause the banding under certain pulsating lighting, because the sensor readout is sequential and is going on with the shutter open.



Just to be clear - I'm not talking about forgoing the mechanical shutter to use the electronic shutter. I'm talking about the three distinct settings for the mechanical shutter.

"Silent Live View Shooting" (p150) vs. "Silent Shooting" (p151). I understand silent shooting with just the electronic shutter. And I understand how the sequential readout causes rolling shutter and banding.

Where I am unclear is what is happening in 'Mode 1' and 'Disable' of 'Silent Live View Shooting'. The first of which causes banding in images shot with Canon Speedlights in HSS mode and the latter, which causes a blown highlight on the bottom of the image at 1/8000th (using HSS Canon Speedlights).

I have not tested 'Mode 2'. Yet.


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## Viggo (Oct 20, 2018)

SereneSpeed said:


> The EOS R has two types of silent shooting settings.
> 
> A 'Silent Shutter' and 'Silent LV Shoot'. 'Silent LV Shoot' is set to 'mode 1' as default.
> 
> ...


Yes, I also used Mode 1 default, I’m charging my flash now, but will try it as soon as possible! Thanks for the added info.


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## Viggo (Oct 20, 2018)

Electronic shutter can’t be used with flash, so that leaves Mode 2 as the only option to possibly get rid of the banding? I haven’t tried yet, has anyone?


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## Viggo (Oct 20, 2018)

The other day I got a red (perhaps) circle I could move around and choose which subject to track, but I can’t get it back, does anyone know where and how to find it?


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 20, 2018)

Did it look like this?



In all honesty, I think I saw that too once. I think it was when I had it set to face detection AF.


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## Viggo (Oct 20, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> Did it look like this?
> View attachment 181100
> 
> 
> In all honesty, I think I saw that too once. I think it was when I had it set to face detection AF.


Yeah, and I tried setting it to face detect, but it wouldn't come back...


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## Viggo (Oct 20, 2018)

BTW, I tried "mode 2" silent shooting with flash, and the banding is basically the same. So that means they HAVE to fix it. I use flash a lot, and this isn't acceptable...

Furthermore, just by placing the trigger in the hotshoe without having the flash on, it's also banding, perhaps not as bad. And having the trigger in the hotshoe turned off, shows even slightly less banding. Interference?


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## dak723 (Oct 20, 2018)

Viggo said:


> BTW, I tried "mode 2" silent shooting with flash, and the banding is basically the same. So that means they HAVE to fix it. I use flash a lot, and this isn't acceptable...
> 
> Furthermore, just by placing the trigger in the hotshoe without having the flash on, it's also banding, perhaps not as bad. And having the trigger in the hotshoe turned off, shows even slightly less banding. Interference?



Has anyone actually contacted Canon support? Perhaps they know - and if not, will be informed about the issue.


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## Viggo (Oct 20, 2018)

dak723 said:


> Has anyone actually contacted Canon support? Perhaps they know - and if not, will be informed about the issue.


I could do it, but to be very honest, I don’t think it will get past messenger on fb, it’s impossible to get in touch with Canon, at least the people that actually know what I’m talking about and don’t dismiss it as “whatever”.

Tried also to deactivate silent shooting completely, also tried with anti-flickering off, didn’t make a difference. Anything in the hot shoe = bad banding, remove it and you remove the problem. +5 stops and +100 shadow from a very dark shots gets you noise, but absolutely no banding....


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## Act444 (Oct 21, 2018)

Wow, sounds bad. Is this an isolated issue or a fundamental flaw with the camera?


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## SereneSpeed (Oct 21, 2018)

As I wrote above, you can get rid of banding with flash. Just set 'Silent LV shoot.' to 'Disable'.

The only issue (I'm aware of) with having it set to 'Disable' is at 1/8000th, using a Canon EX600RT speedlight - you get a highlight strip on the bottom of the image. This does not happen with Godox speedlights.

If you want to use flash without banding, set 'Silent LV Shoot.' to 'Disable'.


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## RGF (Oct 21, 2018)

I have just started to use the R along with my 1Dx M2. The R is similar in some ways but different enough that it is not a slam dunk. It will take me some time to learn the new camera. Hoping that my ring adapter comes soon - I plan on putting ISO on that dial.

More as I gain additional experience


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## Viggo (Oct 21, 2018)

SereneSpeed said:


> As I wrote above, you can get rid of banding with flash. Just set 'Silent LV shoot.' to 'Disable'.
> 
> The only issue (I'm aware of) with having it set to 'Disable' is at 1/8000th, using a Canon EX600RT speedlight - you get a highlight strip on the bottom of the image. This does not happen with Godox speedlights.
> 
> If you want to use flash without banding, set 'Silent LV Shoot.' to 'Disable'.


Didn’t work for me I’m afraid....


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## Viggo (Oct 21, 2018)

Well, well, I just pulled out a VERY old basic, basic "eBay" trigger for flash, and tried, the banding is gone, or at least ver much reduced to almost nothing... I'm confident this is solvable with firmware, it must be interference when using different triggers.


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 22, 2018)

I'm still very impressed by this camera's ability to focus in low light. It locks on in situations where I don't think the 5DIV would even have a chance. I was able to focus on peoples' very dark faces with direct lights behind them. It was a situation where I couldn't even physically see them with my eyes because of the harsh backlighting, and the camera still got focus. I think it might have taken two half-presses of the shutter to coax it into getting focus, but still, amazing.

The other thing I like is that it doesn't seem to struggle with getting focus the way the 5DIV does. Sometimes in very low light the 5DIV will just kind of twitch the lens back and forth for a couple seconds trying to lock in focus. The EOS R either immediately gets focus, or the focus point pretty much immediately turns orange/red, indicating that it can't get focus. It's much more decisive about the way it focuses in low light than the 5DIV.


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## Act444 (Oct 22, 2018)

I had a second play with the camera this past weekend. I will admit it is growing on me, but there are still elements of the camera that make it slower to operate than a 5D4. Mostly it is the lack of dedicated buttons for functions like drive mode, WB, etc. And like I said earlier, the EVF experience (to me) can’t quite match the OVF one in terms of fluidity, even with its inherent advantages. One function I did like, though, was the ability to customize the M Fn button to quickly switch to custom mode. Definitely give them props there. The eye detection feature I messed around with, mostly with mixed results. It seemed to do an ok job following a face in camera store lighting, although I found it lagged behind by about a half-second or so. Sometimes it would jump faces or not recognize a face at all, particularly if it was a profile. I feel that the simplest way to shoot with this camera is in live view mode with the screen...

As a stills shooter (don’t use or care for video much), I see the flip screen and the silent shooting mode as the R’s two biggest advantages over a 5D body (at least from my experience). I guess it’s a little smaller too, but it’s still a substantial camera, particularly with the 24-105. Everything else, I feel the 5D is just easier to operate and “get the shot” with. The R, at least with this model, I feel that accommodations were made for video folks somewhat at the expense of still photographers.


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 22, 2018)

Yeah, the EVF is silky smooth when you're just composing a shot, but it seems to get a little laggy when taking a photo or sometimes even just focusing. This does make it a little harder to get shots than with the nice old school reliability of an OVF.


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## SereneSpeed (Oct 22, 2018)

I think it's only fair that I report back on my AF selection bickering... I've found some settings that made a lot of difference -when enabled together.

'Touch and drag AF' active touch area is set to full screen - this gets rid of the horrible lag you get when you use part of the screen (when set to 'relative').

'Touch and drag AF' positioning method is set to relative - with absolute, I needed to release (a suitable) grip on the camera while moving the AF point to the left.

'Touch control' is set to sensitive - anything less than sensitive and I found the AF point movement to be inconsistent.


I will reiterate one thing from my first posts about this camera - Mirrorless is very different. There is a learning curve. One perfect example; I am used to selecting the AF point closest to my subject, based on composition and then adjusting the camera/lens to line the AF point up perfectly. That action is/was muscle memory. It is very strange when using mirrorless to be able to move the AF point to an EXACT position. I often forget that I can move it to 95%+ accuracy and then shift the camera/lens. My mind wants me to get the AF point positioning JUST right - without moving. Which is a waste of time.

The camera has grown on me. I cannot believe the AF accuracy. WYSIWYG is incredible, but the histogram on top of that makes for precise exposures.

When the pro version comes out, I'm going to have a horrible time deciding what to with my EOS R. My plan was to sell it and keep my 5D4 to be backup for a pro version of the EOS R. But the two systems are so different, I'm not sure I'm going to want a DSLR around anymore. My future is definitely mirrorless. But, for now, my professional work is still on my 5D4.


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## Act444 (Oct 22, 2018)

SereneSpeed said:


> 'Touch and drag AF' active touch area is set to full screen - this gets rid of the horrible lag you get when you use part of the screen (when set to 'relative').
> 
> 'Touch and drag AF' positioning method is set to relative - with absolute, I needed to release (a suitable) grip on the camera while moving the AF point to the left.



The main issue I had with “absolute” positioning was that I would make an adjustment to the AF point - say, move it to the lower left portion of the screen. But when I then tap the right portion of the screen to begin dragging it back, it “jumps” to that area. Which is fine if by design. Also, you have to complete the AF move with one swipe or it will “jump” back. I think I prefer relative, but they really need to address the lag issue when using it. Also, the ability to control speed of movement, much like a computer mouse on a monitor, would be nice.


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 23, 2018)

Act444 said:


> The main issue I had with “absolute” positioning was that I would make an adjustment to the AF point - say, move it to the lower left portion of the screen. But when I then tap the right portion of the screen to begin dragging it back, it “jumps” to that area. Which is fine if by design.


Um yes, I'm quite sure that what you're describing is by design. "Absolute" means absolute. Meaning, if you touch whatever area of the screen within the area you have activated, the point will go exactly to that point. Seems pretty straightforward to me. Yes it has the potential to be very jumpy, but it also has the potential to allow for very quick movements of the AF point. I've been using bottom right and absolute, but it's a little hard to master. I do wish there was a relative setting that had adjustable speed. Relative just moves a little too slow for my taste.


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## Viggo (Oct 23, 2018)

I had a chance to play with the RF50 Today, all I can say is, no it isn’t heavy it’s a feather compared to the 85 L IS, and so insanely sharp it’s crazy! Fantastic AF, it locks dead on no matter what you point it at and the IQ is out of this world at 1.2. I honestly felt the very high price is cheap for what you get. I’m buying!


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 23, 2018)

I tried setting the touch and drag AF to "whole panel" and "relative" last night. I actually think I like this better than absolute. I wanted to be able to master setting it to lower left and absolute, but I think the AF point is just a little too jumpy when set to this. It's hard to tap the exact spot you want the AF point to go to on the screen just by feel while you're looking through the viewfinder.

I don't know why you would set the active part of the screen to anything other than the whole screen when you are using the relative setting, unless perhaps you are accidentally touching a certain part of the screen and moving the AF point inadvertently.

Also, I ended up getting 585 photos on one battery, along with recording about a one minute video through the viewfinder. It ran down to 2% capacity at that point, and I decided to charge it. I'm pretty happy with that based on the fact that I'm still messing around in settings and menus a whole lot since the camera is still new to me. This was with a genuine Canon LP-E6N battery, but not even the new one that came with the camera. It does seem to me like using the silent shutter saves some battery.


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## Viggo (Oct 23, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> I tried setting the touch and drag AF to "whole panel" and "relative" last night. I actually think I like this better than absolute. I wanted to be able to master setting it to lower left and absolute, but I think the AF point is just a little too jumpy when set to this. It's hard to tap the exact spot you want the AF point to go to on the screen just by feel while you're looking through the viewfinder.
> 
> I don't know why you would set the active part of the screen to anything other than the whole screen when you are using the relative setting, unless perhaps you are accidentally touching a certain part of the screen and moving the AF point inadvertently.
> 
> Also, I ended up getting 585 photos on one battery, along with recording about a one minute video through the viewfinder. It ran down to 2% capacity at that point, and I decided to charge it. I'm pretty happy with that based on the fact that I'm still messing around in settings and menus a whole lot since the camera is still new to me. This was with a genuine Canon LP-E6N battery, but not even the new one that came with the camera. It does seem to me like using the silent shutter saves some battery.


I guess this is why Canon have all the different touch’n drag options, as I couldn’t use the whole screen.

Last charge I got 887 pictures, hardly one burst. Very happy with it after all.


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## Viggo (Oct 23, 2018)

BTW, I've discovered that enabling any type of silent mode leaves my images soft and it looks just like motion blur, turned off and used the, non default, mechanical shutter and the rpoblem went away... weird...


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 23, 2018)

Really? I've been using the completely silent shutter pretty frequently, and haven't noticed an issue. The banding I saw before only showed up under one very specific set of LED stage lights.

Also, why does using the full screen for touch and drag AF not work well for you? Do you have it set to absolute? If you have it set to absolute, I can understand it, as it's hard to move the point all the way across the screen with your thumb. But as far as I can tell, limiting the area of the screen that's active when you have it set to relative doesn't seem to affect the speed or sensitivity of moving the AF point around, it just makes part of the screen not active anymore, which in my experience gets frustrating because sometimes you'll be dragging the point across the screen, and then you'll reach the edge of the active area, and the point just stops. This wouldn't happen with absolute since if you reach the edge of the active part of the screen with absolute, the AF point should already be right at that edge of the frame.


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## Viggo (Oct 23, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> Really? I've been using the completely silent shutter pretty frequently, and haven't noticed an issue. The banding I saw before only showed up under one very specific set of LED stage lights.
> 
> Also, why does using the full screen for touch and drag AF not work well for you? Do you have it set to absolute? If you have it set to absolute, I can understand it, as it's hard to move the point all the way across the screen with your thumb. But as far as I can tell, limiting the area of the screen that's active when you have it set to relative doesn't seem to affect the speed or sensitivity of moving the AF point around, it just makes part of the screen not active anymore, which in my experience gets frustrating because sometimes you'll be dragging the point across the screen, and then you'll reach the edge of the active area, and the point just stops. This wouldn't happen with absolute since if you reach the edge of the active part of the screen with absolute, the AF point should already be right at that edge of the frame.


Yeah, top right and absolute, it works smooth and reminds me of using a joystick and it's fast er and easier for me.

Here's two quick examples, but it showed in pretty much any shot in varying degree... The first one is at 1/3200s


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 23, 2018)

I have never gotten top right absolute to work for me because my right thumb doesn't quite reach to the middle of the screen without moving my whole hand away from the natural position holding the camera. So with top right absolute I can never move the AF point to the left side of the frame, at least smoothly and quickly.

Those photos do look awful. Are those 100% crops? I don't think I've had any issues like that when using the silent shutter.


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## Viggo (Oct 23, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> I have never gotten top right absolute to work for me because my right thumb doesn't quite reach to the middle of the screen without moving my whole hand away from the natural position holding the camera. So with top right absolute I can never move the AF point to the left side of the frame, at least smoothly and quickly.
> 
> Those photos do look awful. Are those 100% crops? I don't think I've had any issues like that when using the silent shutter.



Yeah, the soccer shot was in the worst lightning conditions ever for sports, but illustrates what happens to the non moving parts of an image shot with fast speeds. The other one was typical and was very frustrating, but, it all went away when using only the mechanical shutter, which works great for me. I have no use for being very silent, but for those who do, it’s worth testing at least ..


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 24, 2018)

Viggo said:


> Yeah, the soccer shot was in the worst lightning conditions ever for sports, but illustrates what happens to the non moving parts of an image shot with fast speeds. The other one was typical and was very frustrating, but, it all went away when using only the mechanical shutter, which works great for me. I have no use for being very silent, but for those who do, it’s worth testing at least ..



I agree, movement with the silent shutter is going to cause big issues. There are lots of warnings in the manual on pages 150 and 151 as well as in other places, but the best way to learn is by testing to see just what the limits are to get a image that is acceptable. 

Fast shutter speeds and small apertures are said to be a issue as well.

That would be my setting of choice for a bird at close range with silent shutter, since depth of field is needed, and a fast shutter speed freezes tiny movements.


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## Viggo (Oct 24, 2018)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> I agree, movement with the silent shutter is going to cause big issues. There are lots of warnings in the manual on pages 150 and 151 as well as in other places, but the best way to learn is by testing to see just what the limits are to get a image that is acceptable.
> 
> Fast shutter speeds and small apertures are said to be a issue as well.
> 
> That would be my setting of choice for a bird at close range with silent shutter, since depth of field is needed, and a fast shutter speed freezes tiny movements.


Absolutely, the thing that threw me off was that I wasn’t paying all that much attention to that part of setting my camera up, but rather buttons and touch screen and getting used to the interface. And I didn’t know how the camera would sound like without a mirror so missed that setting. I question why it’s set like that as a Default, iit ruined a good few images for me, but lesson learned


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## Act444 (Oct 25, 2018)

I did take a few shots with a store-model R with full mechanical shutter and found it no quieter than a (modern) DSLR TBH...(didn’t have a memory card at the time though)

I wasn’t even aware that it was using a form of “silent” mode as default. And although I did note some softness issues in my shots, I didn’t make the connection to the silent shutter mechanism. I don’t know if that was what was causing it - I just assumed the camera had generally softer output. Hmm...

Silent shooting IMHO is one of the top selling points of MILC - if it’s true that there is that kind of a compromise in image quality by setting it.......? (FTR, I never found an IQ difference between “silent” and normal mode on a 5D - just speed and FPS).


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 25, 2018)

Act444 said:


> I did take a few shots with a store-model R with full mechanical shutter and found it no quieter than a (modern) DSLR TBH...(didn’t have a memory card at the time though)
> 
> I wasn’t even aware that it was using a form of “silent” mode as default. And although I did note some softness issues in my shots, I didn’t make the connection to the silent shutter mechanism. I don’t know if that was what was causing it - I just assumed the camera had generally softer output. Hmm...
> 
> Silent shooting IMHO is one of the top selling points of MILC - if it’s true that there is that kind of a compromise in image quality by setting it.......? (FTR, I never found an IQ difference between “silent” and normal mode on a 5D - just speed and FPS).



A mirrorless camera always starts with the shutter open, you would not see a image otherwise. The shutter closes after the image is captured. Its much quieter than a mirror clacking up, shutter opening and closing, and mirror clacking down.

Silent shooting does not close the shutter between shots, and since readout is done by scanning the sensor, not all at once, it is susceptible to any movement of the camera or the subject, a form of rolling shutter that happens in video.

So far, there is no practical global shutter for FF DSLR's, there are many technical hurdles.

Once those hurdles are overcome, mirrorless cameras can take a big leap forward, it might be practical, for example to take two very fast frames of a scene with two different subjects or areas in focus and stack them. Cameras try to do that now, but its not very good, and motion limits the technique. With global shutters, we will see a whole host of new things, but when?


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## Viggo (Oct 25, 2018)

The EOS R with mechanical shutter is much quieter than the 1dx2 in normal shooting mode. I have only had perfect sharp shots after I switched to mechanical shutter and I’m not going back, lol.

I certainly wouldn’t trust it at a wedding, where it might be useful, and come home to find out the shots are blurry. If someone takes offense to me using a non-silent shutter, they are welcome to tell me, and I can tell them I care thismuch.


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## dtgphoto (Oct 25, 2018)

Got mine today.

Ergonomics: Great feel to it .. nice grip for XL hands. Keep going for playback button on bottom left a la 5D but I'll get used to that.

Autofocus: lightening quick. Quicker than my 5D IV and it is pure witchcraft how dark this can still nail the focus in. I swear it could even focus in Hollister

Screen af drag.. set to Top right / relative and it is so intuitive.. brilliant. Much better than the joystick.

MF bar .. set to iso but with disabled initially set. Works well but I will probably change this.

Other buttons allocated to things that I find useful like one shot / servo toggling, af zone toggling and iso again

Viewfinder is bright and clear albeit different to optical... so nice having histogram in there though and actually seeing the exposure. That is amazing. For a first gen mirrorless ... well done Canon this line is going to be even more incredible once the wrinkles ironed out


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## Act444 (Oct 25, 2018)

Viggo said:


> The EOS R with mechanical shutter is much quieter than the 1dx2 in normal shooting mode.



The 5D4 is as well...


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## dak723 (Oct 25, 2018)

dtgphoto said:


> Got mine today.
> 
> Ergonomics: Great feel to it .. nice grip for XL hands. Keep going for playback button on bottom left a la 5D but I'll get used to that.
> 
> ...




Rented one for the past three days. I shoot stills (not action) and I agree with all your points. I have small hands, but ergonomics were excellent, AF performance excellent. Screen touch and drag is nice - not as good as on the M50, but since the sensor is bigger with many more AF points, that is to be expected. I set up MF bar to disable swiping, but enabled each end - so, in essence, it gives me two buttons. With small hands, I never accidentally triggered the bar. EVF clear and bright.

For my use, I found no wrinkles to iron out.


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## sfwrtr (Oct 26, 2018)

After a weekend of trying all my EF lens and working the camera hard, I'm now extremely happy with how you select AF point (and the AF in general). The AF Point button enables the d-pad to select AF points much like the AF Point button on my 5D Mark III enabled the nubbin to do so. But the buttons on the d-pad repeat rapidly, and address two magnitudes more AF points. The implementation is great. Add that to being able to drag the AF point around with you thumb on the touch screen (fully configureable) while looking through the viewfinder, you have a winner.

I've discussed more on my blog where I've discussed what I've learned using the camera. https://eosrreview.wordpress.com/2018/10/26/the-nubbin-conundrum/


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## Act444 (Oct 26, 2018)

I don’t have an issue with the drag-and-drop AF point selection method; I just think it needs refinement. Give the user more control over speed, and get rid of the lag in response time. It has tremendous potential but it all has to be fluid. 

This may even be doable by firmware if the processing power exists in-camera. Kind of like how they sped up the AF with the original M...


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## sfwrtr (Oct 26, 2018)

dtgphoto said:


> Got mine today.
> Viewfinder is bright and clear albeit different to optical... so nice having histogram in there though and actually seeing the exposure. That is amazing.



And little things like on start up it will tell you if your lens is in manual mode and you get wavy red lines if the manual focus peaking is on, or you can magnify the selected AF live in the viewfinder. Or there's my current favorite - the blinking GPS indicator to tell me that I need to run the Canon Connect app on my phone so the camera can embed GPS info. (Beats putting on the GP-E2 which I often found had a dead battery because I didn't turn it off.) The info load is amazing and useful. Be sure to turn on the feature to rotate the info in the viewfinder when you rotate the camera to portrait orientation. Breathtaking 



dtgphoto said:


> For a first gen mirrorless ... well done Canon this line is going to be even more incredible once the wrinkles ironed out



Mostly, I think the wrinkles are in our brain, like those pictures of fighter pilots enduring 10 gees of acceleration. I was skeptical at first. I customized the buttons, etc, but backed stuff off other than putting the depth-of-field option on the AF ON button and ISO on the EF adapter ring. I did create two My Menus. The interface is pretty solid once you stop thinking 5D and think EOS R. I had to spend time doing that, but, whoa! 

(My EOS R blog: https://eosrreview.wordpress.com/)


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## Alejandro (Oct 26, 2018)

¿How is the -6 EV AF working? Did any of you guys tested that?


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## SereneSpeed (Oct 27, 2018)

Alejandro said:


> ¿How is the -6 EV AF working? Did any of you guys tested that?



The EOS R sees in the dark. It's ability to autofocus in a dark scene is much better than my 5D4. It does get hung up when there is no contrast, like a lot of cameras, but if it has something to grab, it will do it in near darkness.


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 27, 2018)

Ok, this camera is just infuriating in really low light. It's so frustrating because it's shown that it can achieve focus in situations when the 5D4 would not be able to, but the EVF gets extremely laggy and slow in low light. Sometimes when I half-press the shutter to focus in low light, the whole EVF display feed just bogs down. I hate this. Combine that with a rather unpredictable moment after taking a photo when the EVF freezes for a second, and it _really_ gets in the way of taking photos in a dynamic, moving situation in low light.


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## SereneSpeed (Oct 27, 2018)

Kit Lens Jockey said:


> Ok, this camera is just infuriating in really low light. It's so frustrating because it's shown that it can achieve focus in situations when the 5D4 would not be able to, but the EVF gets extremely laggy and slow in low light. Sometimes when I half-press the shutter to focus in low light, the whole EVF display feed just bogs down. I hate this. Combine that with a rather unpredictable moment after taking a photo when the EVF freezes for a second, and it _really_ gets in the way of taking photos in a dynamic, moving situation in low light.


Interesting. I've only used it for low light portraiture and I've never noticed this. But, admittedly, I'm not moving fast at all. I'm usually trying my best to hold the camera still so I can get an image without motion blur.


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## Kit Lens Jockey (Oct 27, 2018)

SereneSpeed said:


> Interesting. I've only used it for low light portraiture and I've never noticed this. But, admittedly, I'm not moving fast at all. I'm usually trying my best to hold the camera still so I can get an image without motion blur.


How low light? I'm talking about like 1/100sec, f1.2, ISO 10,000 or higher. It's like the camera spends too much processing power trying to simulate the exposure at high ISOs or something. It's bizarre.


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## SereneSpeed (Oct 28, 2018)

1/200th f1.4 ISO 40,000 when I was testing. Without any problems except noise.

1/100th f1.4 ISO 6,400 with a client.

I just tested it and got what you are talking about. But, that was at 1/15th f1.4 ISO 12,800 - 40,000. If I bumped shutter up to 1/50th it went away. If I dropped ISO to 10,000 it went away. If I shot low-key (proper exposure for my subject) it went away. Only when I tried to boost the entire scene to appear SUPER bright, did I see what you are talking about.

... I just tested it again to try it with an expose similar to yours. At 1/80th f1.4 ISO10,000, no issue. In fact, no issue at 1/80th f1.4 ISO 32,000. But at ISO 40,000 I definitely begin to see it.

I will not be shooting exposures like that without a tripod and a handful of open shutter time.

Funny enough, if my shutter speed is higher, the problem is less pronounced. Even when adding ISO to compensate for the shutter speed. Perhaps this has to do with the sensor readout being slower than the EVF FPS?


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 28, 2018)

I took my R with its 50mm f.2.5 lens into a dark room. At first, I could see nothing, it seemed totally dark, but with the AF assist light, the camera focused quickly. Then, the EVF became bright and it looked like daylight even though the ISO was 40,000. I used AV and set the aperture to various values, even f/8, but it focused every time but took a while at f/8. As my eyes adjusted, I could see the drop that I was focusing on, so there was light in the room, but not much. I did not bother to process the images, I was just curious about the ability to autofocus and was surprised by how strong that AF light was on the camera. It made a orange-red circle on the backdrop which allowed it to AF. I think it was too dark to focus without it, but I may disable the assist light and see if it focuses and note the exposure.

I don't know if the camera focuses with the aperture wide open and then stops down, I should find out.


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## Viggo (Oct 28, 2018)

I’m out shooting soccer in the cold and the “AF point smashed into the bottom of the screen” is ruining everything for me, they need to effin fix this yesterday!


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## koenkooi (Oct 28, 2018)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> [..]
> I don't know if the camera focuses with the aperture wide open and then stops down, I should find out.



From what I have read so far, it will narrow the aperture when taking the actual picture, but focus with a wider aperture. I'm unsure if that means "wide open" or "use set aperture if it's below 4.5, otherwise open up". If it's the latter, that would mean the focus shift issues with F1.2/1.4 lenses wouldn't be an issue any longer.


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## dak723 (Oct 28, 2018)

Viggo said:


> I’m out shooting soccer in the cold and the “AF point smashed into the bottom of the screen” is ruining everything for me, they need to effin fix this yesterday!



Is it possible that you saved your custom mode with the AF point all the way to edge of the screen, so that was saved along with your other custom settings? Or that you inadvertently swipe the screen after you are done shooting and the AF is dragged to the edge and remembered by the camera the next time you turn it on? Just guessing.


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## Viggo (Oct 28, 2018)

dak723 said:


> Is it possible that you saved your custom mode with the AF point all the way to edge of the screen, so that was saved along with your other custom settings? Or that you inadvertently swipe the screen after you are done shooting and the AF is dragged to the edge and remembered by the camera the next time you turn it on? Just guessing.


I'm shooting in normal Av, and I've tried finding "registered AF point" like I had on the 1dx2, but can't find it... And it's not always, and sometimes it's not in the corner, but center bottom. It also happenp while I was just holding the camera , it turned off, turned on via halfpress shutter, and it had moved to the bottom... I don't get it....


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## snappy604 (Oct 28, 2018)

Viggo said:


> I'm shooting in normal Av, and I've tried finding "registered AF point" like I had on the 1dx2, but can't find it... And it's not always, and sometimes it's not in the corner, but center bottom. It also happenp while I was just holding the camera , it turned off, turned on via halfpress shutter, and it had moved to the bottom... I don't get it....



Any chance the cold is causing minor condensation (from cheek? Breath?) and conducting the signal accidentally to a diff location? How were you focusing at time?


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## JoFT (Oct 28, 2018)

vitalsax said:


> I've got my camera today and i discovered that it has:
> 
> No stabilization in camera stabilization. OK, so when using one of the 3 adapters to use your existing Canon glass, if the lens doesn’t have IS then you have zero access to IS. Compatibility factor just took a hit here.
> One SD card slot.
> ...



No 2nd SD card slot needed due wifi backup for instant sharing
No joystick needed because touch and drag on the touchscreen is much quicker


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## Viggo (Oct 28, 2018)

snappy604 said:


> Any chance the cold is causing minor condensation (from cheek? Breath?) and conducting the signal accidentally to a diff location? How were you focusing at time?



I shoot with my right eye and use Top Right screen for touch'n drag so I don't think so.. at least that's not what happen ehen I just held the camera. But I'll make sure to keep the screen very dry and clean next time to see if it happens anyway... Hmm, just thought of it, it happened indoors also....


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## RodS (Oct 29, 2018)

Just received the Canon R with the adapter (no ring) rental. Here are some observations on different lenses.

Canon EF 24-70, EFS 10-22, EFS 18-135, EF 100-400 (first gen) all work great, such as fast autofocus.

Canon EF 100-400 (first gen) with extender EF 2x II has extremely slow autofocus. I don’t know if the model two lens or an extender 2x model III would correct the autofocus. It does work, but don’t expect to focus on anything moving quickly.

Tamron 150-600 (version 1) works but no autofocus.

Tamron 18-400 Di II unusable, extreme vignettingy.

Even though I have a couple of non-canon lens issues, I’m very impressed with the camera especially the sharpness at lower shutter speeds while handheld.


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## Act444 (Oct 29, 2018)

Question for R owners: is there something similar to the “Register/recall shooting function” on the 5D cameras? Where you can hold down a button and instantly recall a particular shooting setting, including registered AF point? Also, I need to check if it’s possible to register AF points at all on this camera...


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## SereneSpeed (Oct 30, 2018)

JoFT said:


> No 2nd SD card slot needed due wifi backup for instant sharing



Until WiFi backup includes a redundant backup of RAW files, it's not a backup...


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## JoFT (Oct 30, 2018)

SereneSpeed said:


> Until WiFi backup includes a redundant backup of RAW files, it's not a backup...


In most of the cameras the 2nd card slot is slower. Typically people store there jpg... and this backup is given...


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## Fred Strobel (Oct 30, 2018)

Act444 said:


> Question for R owners: is there something similar to the “Register/recall shooting function” on the 5D cameras? Where you can hold down a button and instantly recall a particular shooting setting, including registered AF point? Also, I need to check if it’s possible to register AF points at all on this camera...


There are three custom settings for photos and three for movies, but I am not sure if they store the af point. They do store the af method (size of the af area). ( just check and it seems to be returning the auto focus to the same place on the custom function.)


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## SereneSpeed (Oct 30, 2018)

JoFT said:


> In most of the cameras the 2nd card slot is slower. Typically people store there jpg... and this backup is given...



"Typically" - based on what? I've read that on the internet, but never observed it in person.

I don't know anybody who uses both card slots and doesn't shoot RAW to both. Now, that's limited to the photographers I know...

And again:


JoFT said:


> No 2nd SD card slot needed due wifi backup for instant sharing



Yes, a second card slot is needed for backup. Or, Canon needs to allow redundant RAW transfer. Backups should not be confused with "instant sharing". JPEGs are not 'backup' for any photographer I know who is concerned about backing up images.


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## Act444 (Oct 30, 2018)

So last night I played around with the R RAW files a bit more and noticed something...

I feel like the files process very differently from the 5D4. Even though both cameras are soft (IMO) at default settings - the R perhaps a bit more so - at least based off the pool of shots I’ve analyzed with the 24-105, I feel the R files take sharpening adjustments better than the 5D4 files do, with fewer artifacts produced, particularly in OOF areas. This leads to an overall “cleaner” output which I mostly enjoyed from my old 5D3 as well as my 5DSR (with 85 1.4). I almost always sharpen 5D4 files and especially once I turn NR down (to recover some detail) the images can get blotchy sometimes, particularly at high ISOs. The R files seem to be a bit more resistant to this phenomenon, but probably needs more testing and with different lenses and ISO settings for me to be confident in these findings. Note that this is full-size RAW I’m speaking of - have not tried CRAW yet.

Very encouraging development, would like to dig into this further...Nevermind. I think the R files do take sharpening better than 5D4 files - but R files are softer OOC, which contributes to this. Breaking point seems to be similar, but on R files this may be at a setting of 8 or 9 instead of 5 or 6 on the 5D4.


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## dak723 (Oct 31, 2018)

SereneSpeed said:


> "Typically" - based on what? I've read that on the internet, but never observed it in person.
> 
> I don't know anybody who uses both card slots and doesn't shoot RAW to both. Now, that's limited to the photographers I know...
> 
> ...



I have two cards on my Olympus. One records RAW, the other JPG. I am concerned about backing up my images. Now you know at least one photographer who doesn't need RAW backup.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 31, 2018)

I record jpegs to the 2nd card as well. They are for emergency backups, and I've never had to use one since I started with a dual card 1D MK II many many years ago I use a large card so I may swap out the CF card when full, my SD card is big enough to hold all the backup jpegs for a shoot of thousands of images. I have heard of people saving raw images to both cards, but they quickly learn that they can't do a high FPS when doing it that way.

Its fine for people to use that second card as they want, some use it as a extended memory, when card 1 is full, then the camera switches to card 2. There is no right or wrong, just the work flow that a person prefers.


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## GMCPhotographics (Oct 31, 2018)

JoFT said:


> In most of the cameras the 2nd card slot is slower. Typically people store there jpg... and this backup is given...


But if you do that, the RAW / JPEG buffer is limited to the throughput of the slowest card. Which means less continuous shooting until the buffer is cleared and the cards are written to. My 5DIII's buffer drops to about 5 frames if I write anything to the SD card. I belive the mk4 is similar in this regard. Great...it's got 2 card slots...oh bugger...I loose half my buffer if I use them both....


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## JoFT (Oct 31, 2018)

GMCPhotographics said:


> But if you do that, the RAW / JPEG buffer is limited to the throughput of the slowest card. Which means less continuous shooting until the buffer is cleared and the cards are written to. My 5DIII's buffer drops to about 5 frames if I write anything to the SD card. I belive the mk4 is similar in this regard. Great...it's got 2 card slots...oh bugger...I loose half my buffer if I use them both....


And my experience was even worse: If you want to do backup for video - that doesn't work either...


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## GMCPhotographics (Nov 1, 2018)

JoFT said:


> And my experience was even worse: If you want to do backup for video - that doesn't work either...


For me as a stills photographer...I can't see any real world value in a 2nd slot other than extra card capacity. But soon as the 2nd card is engaged...the buffer drops and the write speed to the card is a lot slower. Hey ho...
My primary photographic needs are Versatility first. Which is why I'm currently using a pair of 5DIII's. One of my cams is up for replacement next year...so it'll be a tough choice between a heavily discounted mk4 vs a "new to the market premium" Eos R. The AF on the 5D series is already sufficient. But the low light abilities of the Eos R are very useful. For low light weddings...it'll be a boon shooting first dances in Winter. I've already shot available light in cathedral crypts by candle light...with a pair of MkII's...so it's a marginal benefit when I've already got my fast primes. The other point of interest for me is the ability to use rear filters on EF lenses like a 11-24L, 8-15L fisheye and TS-e17L. That's a massive benefit where serous landscapes are concerned. In fact that one feature might swing this camera for me...in landscape work. But it depends how good the camera is in more general use....and for Wildlife. I regularly use my 5DIII's with a 400mm f2.8 LIS...and I can capture Puffins in flight with it...so I'll need to see how well the R does in that regard. I also don't like to have different cameras for different roles, which is why I never went 1D series. I like a pair of identical cameras with the same User Interface. So for me an Eos R will need to excel in all of my photographic needs...not just one or two. What I love about the 5D series...is that it's just SO versatile...it can shoot anything.


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## GMCPhotographics (Nov 4, 2018)

Yesterday I went to Wex in Norwich, who have several copies of the Eos 5 on display. I spent around 20 mins playing with the camera using some of my lenses and the new RF 24-105. My initial thoughts where..."this feels like a posh digicam". I was shocked how different the UI was and how far removed from the Canon DSLR interface it was. Actually it felt like I was picking up a camera from a different brand...it was THAT far removed. The EVF was a lot better than I thought it would be. It had a lot more contrast than the usual glass viewfinder...and it showed exactly what was going to be shot with the simulated exposure. It also showed the real dof...most DSLR viewfinders are DOF limited to around f3.2-4 due to micro lenses on the viewfinder screen. But, under florescent shop lighting...it seemed to flicker a bit and I would get eye strain if I used it a lot. The rear LCD screen was nice and it's the first touch screen swivel unit I've used...I like that feature a lot. The sensor and IQ look great...and the WB and metering look excellent. BUT....I hated the camera...the eye controlled AF was very hit and miss. It often swapped eyes and wouldn't stick to what I wanted. The face AF tracking was fine at f4...but pretty awful at f1.4 (35L). When fitting an EF lens to the body using the adapter, there wasn't any movement or slop in the mounts...but it did make my lenses feel excessively large on the camera. My 135L felt huge and more obtrusive than on my Current 5DIII...which I didn't expect.
So in conclusion...my buying decision...is that while this new camera offers a lot of new features and ideas....it's still a very immature product. At the moment, my purchasing decisions will be in the 5D line. But I might buy a 2nd hand Eos 5 to play with in about a year, but at the moment...it's not the camera for me, which is a pity and surprise. I really wanted this camera to appeal to me more.


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## Viggo (Nov 4, 2018)

I have no issues with face tracking at all, I even tried with my daughter on a swing yesterday where I know for a fact the 1dx2 struggles horribly.. I had more keepers with face tracking, and no issues with single point either, in 5 minutes that I had with the 1d in a whole summer lol. Shot with 5fps, but took just one at the time, and with the 85 f1.4 L. It’s just so nice to not have to shoot 14 fps just to make sure I at least have something, the R is what I always wanted in an AF-system..


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## Larsskv (Nov 4, 2018)

Viggo said:


> I have no issues with face tracking at all, I even tried with my daughter on a swing yesterday where I know for a fact the 1dx2 struggles horribly.. I had more keepers with face tracking, and no issues with single point either, in 5 minutes that I had with the 1d in a whole summer lol. Shot with 5fps, but took just one at the time, and with the 85 f1.4 L. It’s just so nice to not have to shoot 14 fps just to make sure I at least have something, the R is what I always wanted in an AF-system..



Same here! Face tracking in AI Servo works amazingly well. There is no doubt I get more keepers of my child moving around with the EOS R than the 1DXII, and it is soo much easier, since I don’t need to concentrate on having the AF point on her eye, while framing and getting the best moment. 

I do prefer the optical viewfinder, especially when I am out in daylight, and I do prefer the overall feel, use and handling of the 5DIV and 1DXII. At the same time, I am convinced that the EOS R is way better in getting the shot, in perfect focus, especially when coupled with large aperture primes.


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## Act444 (Nov 5, 2018)

How are you guys setting up servo on the R? When I tested it I was getting extremely mixed (ok, mediocre) results.


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## Viggo (Nov 5, 2018)

Act444 said:


> How are you guys setting up servo on the R? When I tested it I was getting extremely mixed (ok, mediocre) results.


I do what I always do, place the tracking settings as their own option in My Menu so I have easy access to them. I then remove all zone AF options and keep single point, with 4 and 8 expansion and perhaps the face tracking to test it when the shots doesn’t really matter.

The R is the first camera ever, where I can use Release priority and don’t miss any shots, so I haven’t bothered with focus priority and get my excellent focused 5 fps.

Oh! And most important, disable silent LV shooting and use normal mechanical shutter.


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## Act444 (Nov 6, 2018)

Viggo said:


> I do what I always do, place the tracking settings as their own option in My Menu so I have easy access to them. I then remove all zone AF options and keep single point, with 4 and 8 expansion and perhaps the face tracking to test it when the shots doesn’t really matter.
> 
> The R is the first camera ever, where I can use Release priority and don’t miss any shots, so I haven’t bothered with focus priority and get my excellent focused 5 fps.
> 
> *Oh! And most important, disable silent LV shooting and use normal mechanical shutter.*



Aha! I'll try to remember to disable that the next time I have a chance to get hands on with an R. (Although it shouldn't affect anything beyond perhaps the banding issues in low light?)


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## killswitch (Nov 6, 2018)

I finally had the chance to test out the new EOS R at a local BestBuy for half an hour. I currently own the 5D3 and using a borrowed 5D4 for last couple of days. I also had 60D before all of this and always thought fllppy-screen is a great feature (often under-rated) for landscape, and situations that require high or low angles without breaking the back. I missed it on the 5D on every shoot. I have also used Nikon D7000 and D810. Here's my initial impression of EOS R and questions

*Great*
1. Grip and build quality - Having held all the camera bodes mentioned above, I was not sure what to expect. I had the chance to feel 5D4, 6DII, A7RIII, A7III side by side. Definitely a lot lighter and pfft, easily the best grip than any of Sony's. Super comfy and felt like a baby 6DII.

2. AF Tracking - Pretty smooth and fluid, although I feel 5D4 tracks faster, and perhaps the refresh rate on the EVF makes it appear to have a very slight lag? I dont know. But it tracked subject well.

3. EVF Information Display - Simple and intuitive. Everything felt elegant and not cluttered with excessive text or icons.

4. RF 24-105 F4 L w/ body - Felt solid and fairly compact. I hope the can manage to make the RF 24-70 F2.8 IS similar in size. Wishful thinking.

5. Control ring - felt great but I think one will need to get used to it as it is on the far end of the lens barrel so a slight adjustment on how you hold the lens + camera with your left palm.

6. AF tracking + selection with Flippy screen - Pretty nice, but I feel it can be faster.

*The Bad or Could Be Better*
1. AF selection using touch screen - Unless I am doing this wrong, there is no way to select the far left AF points even if you position the "AF window" to the top right corner of the screen. My thumb just could not reach far left region of the "top right" AF window section. The only way is to use the Relative mode so you can swipe multiple times to pan the AF point around. With Absolute mode it is not possible unless you let go of the grip a bit to stretch the thumb all the way whether it is using the whole screen or the "top right" corner. Also for extreme cold weather I dont see anyway this is usable, I aint taking my gloves off. D-pad is the only option left =(

2. AF-ON button should be where the M-FN bar is. It is cramped to the right corner too much.

3. No wheel, instead a dial on the top. When reviewing photo your thumb will naturally position where the wheel is on 5D4. On the EOS R I have to let go of the grip in order for the thumb to reach the top dial. Assuming you grip the body such that the screen facing up towards you and you looking down at it when reviewing photo after taking the shot.

4. M-FN Bar is cool but I feel a subtle tactile feedback would make it nice.

5. On/Off switch - Probably the worse design decision and waste of precious real-estate. 

Overall I would sell my 5D3 and get this but I am in no hurry and want to see what they do with the next 2 that is supposedly due next year. Seeing bundled prices and discounts already, so hopefully near Black Friday and Xmas it will heat up even more. I feel Canon got it mostly right. If they can match the AF (Eye + Face) tracking speed with SERVO, I will buy it right away. They will need 2 generations or so to sort out the ergonomics and button layout, it is just a matter of time.

Please feel free to correct me as I may be wrong in my assessment in some aspects as I merely intended to get a general feel of the handling and how my hand naturally tried to place or move around using the camera.


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## jolyonralph (Nov 6, 2018)

I've been using my R for 4 days now and I have to say I'm impressed.

Good things are that the autofocus performance both with the R 24-105 and with adapted lenses (16-35 f/4 and 70-200 f/2.8 IS II) is superb. 

The body is smaller than I was expecting, only fractionally larger than the A7RII, but grip is good. I can shoot single handedly with the 70-200 attached, which is harder on the A7RII. 

The viewfinder is superb. I've been using it at night and today on the beach in full sunshine. It performed perfectly both times, you forget you're using an EVF. 

I've got two batteries, but so far I haven't needed to change the battery during the day. Your usage may be higher than mine of course.

The EF-RF adaptor is weather sealed, which is great.

The best thing though is the write speed to card. I am using a 64GB Sandisk UHS-II card rated at 300mb/s and the buffer clear time is absolutely astonishing. I don't ever want go back to expensive CF or CFast cards when UHS-II is now much cheaper (and of course you can use slower SD cards if necessary and they're ridiculously cheap. 

If you have an R and haven't got a UHS-II card yet, I suggest you invest, you won't be disappointed.

The control arrangement is fine. I am happy with the new mode switch arrangement, and it makes sense when switching between video and still modes. I haven't used the swipe bar thing yet, but I'm sure I will given time. 


Negatives:

My biggest gripe is a tiny but irritating one. The rear caps for the RF lenses can only be fitted on at one orientation, so you have to align the mark on the cap with the red dot on the lens. This is very frustrating if you're trying to change lenses quickly.

It doesn't seem that the face/eye detection is as reliable yet as on the Sony. I need to wait until I can get all the raw files into Lightroom and see how well it actually did, but there were many times I thought it should have locked on and it didn't appear to. 

Other than that, I can't really fault the camera. It does everything well.

I'd like one with two slots, with higher resolution, with IBIS and no AA filter. But that will come, I'm sure. In the meantime, this is going to take over as my primary camera.


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## Viggo (Nov 6, 2018)

Act444 said:


> Aha! I'll try to remember to disable that the next time I have a chance to get hands on with an R. (Although it shouldn't affect anything beyond perhaps the banding issues in low light?)


No, it affects the ability to freeze action. With any silent LV or silent mode enabled I couldn’t get sharp shots with any movement, including camera shake, no matter the shutter speed. I hated the output of the camera until I actually disabled anything silent. It now works properly. Never saw any banding except with flash use, which is still there no matter what I do. I spoke to Broncolor and the plainly said they had no intention of fixing it, gee, thanks, Bron


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## SereneSpeed (Nov 6, 2018)

Viggo said:


> No, it affects the ability to freeze action. With any silent LV or silent mode enabled I couldn’t get sharp shots with any movement, including camera shake, no matter the shutter speed. I hated the output of the camera until I actually disabled anything silent. It now works properly. Never saw any banding except with flash use, which is still there no matter what I do. I spoke to Broncolor and the plainly said they had no intention of fixing it, gee, thanks, Bron



I forgot that you had banding even with silent mechanical shutter disabled. Have you tried with any other flash to confirm it's just bronclolor?

I found out last week that ETTL with Youngnuo yn600rt's on camera is useless. But with the yn-e3-rt, they work fine. Strange.

With the Godox v860iic the eTTL is prefect for about 90% of the images and then shoots lowest power for no discernible reason for the other 10%.

The joys of early adoption.

Glad you got the softness issue sorted out.


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## Viggo (Nov 6, 2018)

SereneSpeed said:


> I forgot that you had banding even with silent mechanical shutter disabled. Have you tried with any other flash to confirm it's just bronclolor?
> 
> I found out last week that ETTL with Youngnuo yn600rt's on camera is useless. But with the yn-e3-rt, they work fine. Strange.
> 
> ...


Thanks 

I haven’t tried with any other flash, but I have tried other triggers and the result is the same, and the Northrup’s also mentioned this issue, not sure what they use for studiolight...

Hopefully Canon can adress it in a firmware upgrade. Otherwise I just need to be extremely careful ( I usually am) to get everything spot on in camera when using flash...


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## Viggo (Nov 11, 2018)

Just found a better way to set up my Touch Bar.

I have Kelvin adjustment with sliding. And touch right I have the Histogram and touch left I have the Level. That works so much better than using the info button to toggle histogram and level in the viewfinder.


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## Don Haines (Nov 11, 2018)

Viggo said:


> Just found a better way to set up my Touch Bar.
> 
> I have Kelvin adjustment with sliding. And touch right I have the Histogram and touch left I have the Level. That works so much better than using the info button to toggle histogram and level in the viewfinder.


Personally, I think the inclusion of the slider is brilliant, also, the addition of the extra control on the lens adapter adds functionality to all that legacy gear out there....


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## dak723 (Nov 11, 2018)

Don Haines said:


> Personally, I think the inclusion of the slider is brilliant, also, the addition of the extra control on the lens adapter adds functionality to all that legacy gear out there....



Agree that the control ring (on adapter or new lens) is a great idea. I sure wish Canon was innovative though.


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## killswitch (Nov 12, 2018)

1. Can anybody here elaborate under what circumstances we end up with banding in the photos? Is it the similar kind of banding that 5D3 has? 

2. Also, anybody had the chance to compare the image quality vs a 5D4 in terms of shadow detail and ISO performance. I think I have seen one on DPR, but a real-world samples would be nice. I like the noise on the 5D4, much better than my 5D3. Wonder how R does on that regard.

3. Are old flash units like the 580 and 430 EX from Canon work with the R seamlessly? I suppose I will have to make sure the remote triggers are compatible for off-camera shooting.


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## Viggo (Nov 12, 2018)

killswitch said:


> 1. Can anybody here elaborate under what circumstances we end up with banding in the photos? Is it the similar kind of banding that 5D3 has?
> 
> 2. Also, anybody had the chance to compare the image quality vs a 5D4 in terms of shadow detail and ISO performance. I think I have seen one on DPR, but a real-world samples would be nice. I like the noise on the 5D4, much better than my 5D3. Wonder how R does on that regard.
> 
> 3. Are old flash units like the 580 and 430 EX from Canon work with the R seamlessly? I suppose I will have to make sure the remote triggers are compatible for off-camera shooting.


Banding for me, like the one Northrups reported early on, happens ONLY with flash use. Less with small, very cheap basic triggers and severe with my Broncolor RFS 2.2.


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## jjct (Nov 12, 2018)

I'm still experimenting with my EOS R, but I see banding in very high contrast scenes in which the shadows are lifted by 3+ stops. Enabling Dual Pixel seems to solve or nearly solve the problem at low iso (100-400) and mitigate it at 800 and higher iso. Oddly, though, the results with Dual Pixel are not always consistent. Still, even with the banding, the EOS R noise performance in high contrast scenes is better than the 6D or 5DSR. Also odd is that the problem seems more pronounced indoors - with or without lights - than outdoors. Perhaps it's just less noticeable because the outdoor scenes are more irregular in terms of texture and lighting. For astro landscapes, the EOS R shows hints of Canon's tell-tale magenta blotches, but it is significantly better than the 6D or 5DSR.

I have been shooting a 5DSR for landscape and general photography, and a Pentax K-1 for astro landscapes and some general work. As I said , the 5DSR shows more noise than the EOS R, but gotta love the extra megapixels. For astro landscapes, the 36mp Pentax has a little less noise than the EOS r, but it is easily corrected. The EOS R focuses better in the dark and than the Pentax, and like Canons in general it has better color out of the camera. Considering the other advantages of the EOS R, I'm leaning toward replacing the Pentax with the EOS R.


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## jjct (Nov 12, 2018)

I just wanted to add that I called Canon CPS to ask about the banding, and they said they have had no reports about the issue.


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## Viggo (Nov 12, 2018)

jjct said:


> I just wanted to add that I called Canon CPS to ask about the banding, and they said they have had no reports about the issue.


That’s crazy... or maybe with that specific one it can be the case.


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## jjct (Nov 12, 2018)

Viggo said:


> That’s crazy... or maybe with that specific one it can be the case.


He said it happens a lot. There'll be critiques online, but nobody reports issues directly to Canon. Who knows?


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## dak723 (Nov 12, 2018)

jjct said:


> He said it happens a lot. There'll be critiques online, but nobody reports issues directly to Canon. Who knows?



There have been at least a couple folks here who urge people to comment directly to Canon, but those urging are usually ignored. Some folks here seem to think that Canon spends their time reading forums such as this one. I guess they don't. Please report issues directly to Canon.


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## killswitch (Nov 13, 2018)

Where can one send report of issues with camera bodies or lenses? Is there an official customer feedback forum from Canon one needs to sign up? Or is it the usual Canon Support Contact email platform?


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## jd7 (Nov 14, 2018)

Viggo said:


> Just found a better way to set up my Touch Bar.
> 
> I have Kelvin adjustment with sliding. And touch right I have the Histogram and touch left I have the Level. That works so much better than using the info button to toggle histogram and level in the viewfinder.


I'll be very interested to hear whether, over time, people find ways to make good use of the touch bar. It doesn't seem to have been well received so far - and of course it's possible it just wasn't a great idea by Canon - but I cannot imagine Canon included it without having given it a lot of thought hard and done plenty of research/testing on whether user's were likely to find it useful. Maybe it's just a matter of time for people to get used to it and work out the best way to set it up for them?

As someone who shoots in Av much of the time (unless shooting with a flash), my thinking is aperture on the front dial, iso on the top dial, the buttons on the end of the bar for AF modes, and slide to cycle through viewfinder info settings such as histogram on/off (is that possible?). If not possible, perhaps slide for shutter time (for when I'm not in Av)?? Anyway, the control ring would be available for shutter time ... although I'm not sure about the idea of shutter time on the control ring ... seems like that might be odd but would need to test. Another option would be the "obvious" one of using the control ring for aperture, leaving the front dial for shutter time. Question is whether I would want a setting I change a lot to be on the control ring on the lens rather than the camera body. I doubt I would, but again I guess I would need to try it out to be sure.

Oh well, I should stop wasting time thinking about how I might set up a camera I don't own and am not planning to buy in the near future! (Still not sure if the EOS R is for me or not, but will probably keep an eye on price in the New Year.)

Edit: Exposure compensation is another function I'd want easy access to somehow. Maybe setting that for swipe on the touch bar would work?


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## Viggo (Nov 14, 2018)

jd7 said:


> I'll be very interested to hear whether, over time, people find ways to make good use of the touch bar. It doesn't seem to have been well received so far - and of course it's possible it just wasn't a great idea by Canon - but I cannot imagine Canon included it without having given it a lot of thought hard and done plenty of research/testing on whether user's were likely to find it useful. Maybe it's just a matter of time for people to get used to it and work out the best way to set it up for them?
> 
> As someone who shoots in Av much of the time (unless shooting with a flash), my thinking is aperture on the front dial, iso on the top dial, the buttons on the end of the bar for AF modes, and slide to cycle through viewfinder info settings such as histogram on/off (is that possible?). If not possible, perhaps slide for shutter time (for when I'm not in Av)?? Anyway, the control ring would be available for shutter time ... although I'm not sure about the idea of shutter time on the control ring ... seems like that might be odd but would need to test. Another option would be the "obvious" one of using the control ring for aperture, leaving the front dial for shutter time. Question is whether I would want a setting I change a lot to be on the control ring on the lens rather than the camera body. I doubt I would, but again I guess I would need to try it out to be sure.
> 
> ...


I really like the slide for Kelvin adjustment and tap each side for level and histogram, it’s much faster than info-toggle, and I can combine them however I like.

I use the top rear wheel for EC, on RF lenses I will be using the control ring for that, and perhaps iso on the rear wheel.

For AF modes I use direct selection with one of the buttons on the rear top right. 

I love having the same scroll through functions on the small
MF.n button top front, excellent idea and it’s what I loved about the 1dx2 also, so nice to see Canon implement it in the R.


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## jd7 (Nov 14, 2018)

Viggo said:


> I really like the slide for Kelvin adjustment and tap each side for level and histogram, it’s much faster than info-toggle, and I can combine them however I like.
> 
> I use the top rear wheel for EC, on RF lenses I will be using the control ring for that, and perhaps iso on the rear wheel.
> 
> ...



Now you say it, top rear wheel for EC makes sense. It could be EC when in Av mode, and shutter time when in M mode.

Anyway, it sounds like there certainly are a lot of ways you can set up the R if you want to play around with it.


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## londonxt (Dec 3, 2018)

I bit the bullet recently, had a trip to Japan planned and for a while I have been feeling not too enthusiastic about lugging my 5 series SLR and lens around with me, even for day trips in my town and for a few years now Ive been feeling it was having a negative impact on my photography, so have been eyeing mirrorless for a while but wasn't impressed with EVF offerings at the time and they all seemed a bit too dinky back in day.

I have a 5D MkIII after owning all previous 5 series but hesitated with the MkIV due to cost as I am not a professional, but was watching the price each month anyway. I guess the upgrade itch was there in the background. The EOS R was released at an attractive price point, I felt the EOS 5D range was starting to get a bit carried away after the original. The initial negative reaction to the EOS R specs, didnt impact me too much, I don't shoot video and in all my 10+ years I have not needed to use a backup memory card slot. I felt a bit more cautious about the lower spec weather sealing however. So overall it felt a good time to upgrade especially with the revolution of the RF mount. I bought the EOS R during my trip and plan to sell my 5 series and EF lenses to recoup the cost. I paired the EOS R with a 50mm 1.4 EF via Canon adapter and later the 35mm RF (it was released later in my holiday so had to buy both).

First thought when doing a trial in the shop (but had sort of made my mind up already so would have to be pretty bad to put me off) was the EVF was pretty and attractive but with a noticeable queasy lag when panning, I guessed the indoor low light was causing it (later discovered you can trade battery for EVF responsiveness). And wow the EVF displaying the preview really messes with your head, especially while walking! I turned that off eventually too.

Second thought, EVF start up lag... hmmm would have thought they would have ironed that out by now especially after hearing people describe it as instant. There is a lag once everything has gone to sleep to save power and you press the trigger and wait and the photo moment has gone. Probably the biggest disappointment at the moment as I like street photography. To compensate I found myself half-pressing the shutter release now and then while walking trying to pre-empt photos, not ideal. I did turn off power saving mode and set the sensor not to turn off but after an hour or two my camera turned into a small nuclear reactor. Haven't played around further but would be nice if there was a sweet spot that veered more to EVF alterness at the sacrifice for a touch more power but say have it sleep once it hits a certain temp. Maybe a firmware request?

Third thought, ouch the battery! Power consumption is in a different league to SLRs (which in turn were in a different league to my EOS 3 film camera!). I guess I hadnt put much thought into it as it took me completely by surprise and left me without power for a part of the day. I quickly bought a second battery (the new version for the EOS R - they can use USB-C charging via a PD spec'ed power bank for future). Two batteries saw me through each subsequent day but I had to get into a routine of daily charging which could be a problem in more remote adventures. Something I'm not sure about yet, I guess it is a wide-symptom of the electronic age. The battery pack would be one solution but I can't see getting more than a couple of days out of it and you end up with an SLR sized camera to boot. What would a solution be for a week trek say?

Forth thought, ergonomics... felt good in the hand, surprising weight to it too so I think saving on size is probably more the big impact. Button and options-wise.. hmm it took some getting used to, not like my transition from film then through the 5D series, I was particularly disturbed by the AF point selection and Exposure Compensation but eventually settled on absolute & top-right of the touch screen for AF points. However I can't reach the far left easily with my thumb (I like to jump to the extremes for rule of third compositions) so hope they make an even smaller area option! I would have liked to be able to turn off the back display and just have it active as a touch control of the AF as I am now paranoid about battery consumption! Came across the freaky AF point resetting to the bottom right/left corner a few times and thought it was my nose or something, relieved to hear it is a bug. That brings me onto to resetting the AF selection point to centre, really wish there was another option other than pressing the delete button, it is far too much of a thumb stretch and just doesnt feel seemless. Loved pressing in the joystick on the 5D to do that, maybe a touch and hold on the touch screen could do something similar in future?
I had hoped the touch bar thing would control Exposure Compensation as it was the most obvious thing when I looked at it, so for me it remains un-used. I find the back dial a bit awkward for exposure compensation and although my 35mm RF has the dial assigned for that I find it a bit strange to have a huge dial for jogging between + - 1~2 but as yet it doesnt feel natural to reach for the lens, especially as my EF lenses do not have the extra dial (i went for the basic adapter). Not fussed about the mode dial people have mentioned before, I tend to stick to AV mode and only need to change on specific occasions when I would be setting up other aspects of the camera anyway.

Fifth thought, mmm the photos do look good especially in the glowing EVF. I could sense a noticeable leap in DR from my MKIII and I didnt have to worry so much about trying to do HDR stuff (ie two RAW shots) as I could see I could push and pull easily. Back home and viewing on a 4K screen in Lightroom, the images are fantastic, loving the sharpness and noticeable detail increase and dynamic range. This is from the low range 50mm 1.4f EF with adapter and non-pro 35mm RF. Imagine what the other lenses are like! I do appreciate the larger pixel quantity as even if I rarely crop I love to zoom in on details and scan over photos, especially landscapes and city scenes, so I can imagine myself being tempted 3 years down the line upgrading in future if they bring out higher pixel models now they no longer have the problem with mirror vibrations.

Which brings me onto my Sixth thought, especially with the 35mm RF lens it makes for a great walk-around/travel camera, especially for packing into a bag, so it certainly ticks the main priority of the purchase. I threw on a Black Rapid "street" strap as the Canon strap was horrible and cut into my neck as there is still a fair weight to the camera, I`ll probably save my full-width Black Rapid I use on my 5D for when I buy a larger lens for the EOS R.

Last thought, hang on does the EOS R have exposure associated with AF point?! Obviously the world would be on fire if it really did, but I am pretty sure as I use the touch pad to move the focus point around, the exposure changes, or is that just the EVF adjusting its visibility based on focus point? Maybe Canon accidently forgot to disable that £xxxxx feature on my model


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## Viggo (Dec 4, 2018)

The AF point is ABSOLUTELY weighing in on evaluative metering, no question, it took some time to get used to, but now I really like the midway between evaluative average and spot linked to AF point.


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## jd7 (Dec 4, 2018)

londonxt said:


> I bit the bullet recently, had a trip to Japan planned and for a while I have been feeling not too enthusiastic about lugging my 5 series SLR and lens around with me, even for day trips in my town and for a few years now Ive been feeling it was having a negative impact on my photography, so have been eyeing mirrorless for a while but wasn't impressed with EVF offerings at the time and they all seemed a bit too dinky back in day.
> 
> I have a 5D MkIII after owning all previous 5 series but hesitated with the MkIV due to cost as I am not a professional, but was watching the price each month anyway. I guess the upgrade itch was there in the background. The EOS R was released at an attractive price point, I felt the EOS 5D range was starting to get a bit carried away after the original. The initial negative reaction to the EOS R specs, didnt impact me too much, I don't shoot video and in all my 10+ years I have not needed to use a backup memory card slot. I felt a bit more cautious about the lower spec weather sealing however. So overall it felt a good time to upgrade especially with the revolution of the RF mount. I bought the EOS R during my trip and plan to sell my 5 series and EF lenses to recoup the cost. I paired the EOS R with a 50mm 1.4 EF via Canon adapter and later the 35mm RF (it was released later in my holiday so had to buy both).
> 
> ...


Interesting comments Londonxt. I have been getting tempted by the EOS R but I haven't had much chance to play with one yet (only a few minutes here and there) and these sorts of comments make me think I might stick with my DSLR for now and see what the next generation R brings (whenever it might arrive). I don't care about video and I'm not especially bothered by only one card slot, but things like the EVF v OVF, battery life and ergonomics/usability are important to me.

What do you think of the RF 35/1.8 IS? Have you compared it to lenses such as EF 35L II or Sigma 35 Art at all?


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## londonxt (Dec 4, 2018)

jd7 said:


> Interesting comments Londonxt. I have been getting tempted by the EOS R but I haven't had much chance to play with one yet (only a few minutes here and there) and these sorts of comments make me think I might stick with my DSLR for now and see what the next generation R brings (whenever it might arrive). I don't care about video and I'm not especially bothered by only one card slot, but things like the EVF v OVF, battery life and ergonomics/usability are important to me.
> 
> What do you think of the RF 35/1.8 IS? Have you compared it to lenses such as EF 35L II or Sigma 35 Art at all?



Hi, I am afraid I haven't been able to compare with those lenses, but on my 5d ive been using the EF 24-70mm f2.8 MkII, EF 135mm 2f, Zeiss Milvus 50mm 1.4f and 40mm 2.8f pancake for a long time and the 35mm compares favourably in my view (stick my neck out and suggest sharper than the 24-70mm at 35), certainly better than the 40mm pancake but with similar portability (would love a native RF pancake)! Not that I have any charts to prove anything just going over my shots on Lightroom! Even the EF 50mm 1.4 with adapter, so much lighter and lovely sharpness, I`ll be more than happy to use that over the EF 24-70mm and Zeiss.

With regards to the EVF it became 2nd nature very quickly with no qualms in low light and outdoor scenarios as i don't do much quick panning shots, birds and people seemed to move across the view finder smoothly in most lighting conditions and you can sacrifice battery power for more EVF responsiveness if you need but I found I didnt need to. Love viewing photos in the EVF with all the information juxtaposed, very bright and clear and a good visibilty of DR so I stopped using the back screen for that. I turned off the auto-preview however as it is a bit disconcerting seeing your view of the world through the EVF suddenly freeze or change angle slightly when you take a shot! Was like a strange VR experiment. The EVF power up time after sleeping is definitely the big drawback for me as it frustrated me more than a few times and I missed shots. I havent played around with the Power Saving settings that much yet but while travelling I needed the power saving mode so left it as the default. Maybe after I bought the 2nd battery I could have disabled the power saving mode and for just casual street shooting nearer home i will be able to get away with it but I havent tested the impact on EVF startup times yet.

One thing I didnt mention but should is that the AF is pretty amazing when I think about it, because it covers the whole EVF and reacts so quickly even in low light (was doing a lot of dusk shooting) I sort of didnt notice it was there! The touch pad is vital here but the left side distance and centering default option currently left me frustrated as it stops it from being perfect (although it reminded me what a beautiful partnership it would have made with the much missed Eye Control Focus of the EOS 3). I played with the face focus briefly as its not something Ive really thought of using before but was impressed how it tracked the person and even objects, definitely a lot of potential there but its very new to me.


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## jd7 (Dec 5, 2018)

londonxt said:


> Hi, I am afraid I haven't been able to compare with those lenses, but on my 5d ive been using the EF 24-70mm f2.8 MkII, EF 135mm 2f, Zeiss Milvus 50mm 1.4f and 40mm 2.8f pancake for a long time and the 35mm compares favourably in my view (stick my neck out and suggest sharper than the 24-70mm at 35), certainly better than the 40mm pancake but with similar portability (would love a native RF pancake)! Not that I have any charts to prove anything just going over my shots on Lightroom! Even the EF 50mm 1.4 with adapter, so much lighter and lovely sharpness, I`ll be more than happy to use that over the EF 24-70mm and Zeiss.
> 
> With regards to the EVF it became 2nd nature very quickly with no qualms in low light and outdoor scenarios as i don't do much quick panning shots, birds and people seemed to move across the view finder smoothly in most lighting conditions and you can sacrifice battery power for more EVF responsiveness if you need but I found I didnt need to. Love viewing photos in the EVF with all the information juxtaposed, very bright and clear and a good visibilty of DR so I stopped using the back screen for that. I turned off the auto-preview however as it is a bit disconcerting seeing your view of the world through the EVF suddenly freeze or change angle slightly when you take a shot! Was like a strange VR experiment. The EVF power up time after sleeping is definitely the big drawback for me as it frustrated me more than a few times and I missed shots. I havent played around with the Power Saving settings that much yet but while travelling I needed the power saving mode so left it as the default. Maybe after I bought the 2nd battery I could have disabled the power saving mode and for just casual street shooting nearer home i will be able to get away with it but I havent tested the impact on EVF startup times yet.
> 
> One thing I didnt mention but should is that the AF is pretty amazing when I think about it, because it covers the whole EVF and reacts so quickly even in low light (was doing a lot of dusk shooting) I sort of didnt notice it was there! The touch pad is vital here but the left side distance and centering default option currently left me frustrated as it stops it from being perfect (although it reminded me what a beautiful partnership it would have made with the much missed Eye Control Focus of the EOS 3). I played with the face focus briefly as its not something Ive really thought of using before but was impressed how it tracked the person and even objects, definitely a lot of potential there but its very new to me.


Thanks Londonxt. It's primarily the reports about the AF accuracy (at least for stationary and slow moving subjects), plus the new RF mount and particularly the new RF 24-105 and perhaps the RF 35, that have really got me interested in the EOS R. The slighter smaller size and lighter weight of the EOS R are nice too - and the sensor would be a step up over my 6DII - but those things wouldn't be enough on their own to make me pay up for an R. As for the RF 35, I'm not sure I could give up my 35 Art (and I wouldn't keep two 35mm primes) even if I had an R, but I'll certainly be keeping an eye on RF 35 samples and reviews if I do go with an R at some point.


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