# I am tired of my 7D markII



## Go Wild (Jun 28, 2016)

As the tittle sais....i am completely tired of the 7D markII. I´m done...

Explaining: 


I am shooting wildlife since 2008, from those years i have been using some eos bodys like 350D, 40D, 5D markII and recently 5D markIII and 7D markII. Yes, unfortunatly i am not a rich guy and never could get a 1D body....But work is being good, and i am able now to get the best lenses and good bodys, i always prefer to get the best lenses than to splash the money in a body. 

So i get the 5d markIII because i also make some weddings and comercial services, but i needed a body more suitable for wildlife. When the 7d markII was announced i got that feeling it was the perfect camera for me. Great shuuter speed, great AF and a 20MP with good ISO behaviour looks like stellar to me! I could get finally a good wildlife body without having to buy the expensive 1D X.

I will jump all the story to the end. I am now using the 7D markII for 1,5 years and i got tired of getting soft photos and out of focus photos. 
From the first days i put in me the problem. I suposed it was me the problem and i needed to use the so called "learning curve" beacuse the AF sistem ws very complex. Yes, maybe it was my mistake and somehow i was loosing the capability of focusing right.

But no....after all this time, after i tryed everything, no. My learning curve teached me that this is a camera problem! In the same situations, with same lenses, i get stellar sharp photos with the 5d markIII, then i change to the 7D markII and they are soft. And no, of course i am not comparing a fullframe with a APS-C, i mean REAL soft!!
but the most ridiculous, is that i discover a huge inconsistance in this camera! With the same settings, with the same subjects sometimes i get a sharp photo (but yet still not totally clean), and then without any change the photos get soft. 
This happens with every lens i use. 16-35 F4 IS L, 50mm F1.8 STM, Tamron 90mm F2.8, Tamron 150-600, Canon 500mm F4 IS L.

I tryed to AFMA to get better results, i have lost a huge amount of time getting the lenses in the best spot of AFMA, i find in every lenses a need to afma but even so, i gained a little bit more detail but still, the focus continued to be inconsistant and i continue to get, from my perspective, bad photos.

And i am tired! I got back from a trip to the polar region, i have made a job with polar bears. 75% of the photos i get with the 7D markII are just non usable! 98% of the photos i have made with the 5D markIII are just PERFECT! WTF Canon???!!

I exclude the possibility that i am making anything wrong because i have just tryed everything with this camera! So i am tired, angry and tired of her! I don´t exclude the fact that my camera could have a problem. It was one of the firsts, i bought her as soon as she got out, but this is really making me getting tired of Canon...Specially, when you have friends that use Nikon, and you see better photos in sharpness and detail issues taking with a Nikon D7100 than with the 7D markII. And i have tryed the Nikon D500 and i got really satisfied with the camera in first impressions....But of course i don´t want to change, i have everything from canon and i really am a fan of canon....But this camera is killing me....

The problem is that i don´t have any body unless i go for the 1D series that could give me "settings" of the 7D markII. 

I am considering to send camera to Canon Portugal (i am from Portugal), but i find a lot of articles in internet with the same complain about the camera, and when they sent the camera, it just returns equal.....

If someone have some sugestion regarding to the camera i really apreciate, otherwise i am just thinking in selling this camera and try to buy a 1D markIV in second hand.... 

ps - sorry about any error in english...


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## neuroanatomist (Jun 28, 2016)

What did Canon Service say when you contacted them?


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## Go Wild (Jun 28, 2016)

neuroanatomist said:


> What did Canon Service say when you contacted them?



Hello Neuro! 

Well, i am going to contact them´s now. I haven´t done that because i always suposed that the problem was me....And i am really reluctant in contact Canon because i couldn´t find any comentary that said that after sending the camera back the problem was solved....

I am really sad because the camera is a good camera in buffer, speed, etc....but this is really a huge pain....I can´t trust the camera and this cannot happen....


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## neuroanatomist (Jun 28, 2016)

One other thing to look for – when the pics are soft, are they sharp anywhere? I'm getting at, is the focus off or is the whole image soft?


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## Go Wild (Jun 28, 2016)

neuroanatomist said:


> One other thing to look for – when the pics are soft, are they sharp anywhere? I'm getting at, is the focus off or is the whole image soft?



Yes, i got the 2 situations, sometimes the sharp point appears in a zone out of the AF point selected, and other situations the image just get soft. 

Let me put here 2 examples: 

In both examples i got AF in back button and used the center point expanded. Both situations also AI SERVO was used

in example 1: 

this photos were taken with 1/3200 F7.1 - Paralel movement to the camera, and slow movement of the animal. Camera placed in sturdy tripod and without movement. Easy shot! The results are this: 







same photo with crop: 





same photo with bigger crop:






Now lets see an example of the 5D markIII. Same settings, same situation, altough in this the bear was more quiet, but in the other it was moving really slow. 






with crop:






with bigger crop:


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## Go Wild (Jun 28, 2016)

Another example here: 

Same situation, the bear was stationary, i was stationary. Camera in tripod. Settings Iso 100 1/2000 F8. Paralel movement, easy shot. 

Results: 







crop:





crop2:


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## takesome1 (Jun 28, 2016)

I have sent my 7D II in twice to Canon. Once with the lens to match them up. Both times they say they did something but it comes back the same way.

The AF system has never worked properly, I only used mine on the 500mm.
I think there may be bad copies of the 7D II and it sounds like you and I may have gotten one of them.

When the camera does hit focus the pictures are great though.

Since I bought the 5DsR and its AF systems accuracy and precision is on par with the 1D bodies I have had. I do not use the 7D II for stills anymore, just video.

I own a 1D IV and if I were shooting action and needed speed I would use it over the 7D II. 

So I guess the story here is I gave up on the 7D II. It sounds like you are about to as well.


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## Shift7 (Jun 28, 2016)

Both 7D2 samples is with 1.4X converter ... So maybe it is an issue. By the way, what are your 7D2 2 first digits of serial number? I also have one, but never was happy with it, so most time it spends in bookshelf ...


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## Go Wild (Jun 28, 2016)

Shift7 said:


> Both 7D2 samples is with 1.4X converter ... So maybe it is an issue. By the way, what are your 7D2 2 first digits of serial number? I also have one, but never was happy with it, so most time it spends in bookshelf ...



Hello, yes they were with the 1.4x extender, but without the extender it´s the same thing....

From left to right, my serial begins with 03


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## unfocused (Jun 28, 2016)

I don't have any answers other than to send it to Canon with samples, explanation and comparison of the shots between the two cameras.

In the meantime, if you want to salvage some of the soft shots, here is my advice:

In Photoshop: make a duplicate layer of your final image. Change the blending mode to hard light. Go to filters and choose "Other" then "High Pass" adjust it to about 2-5 pixels, whatever looks best. High Pass increases edge contrast, and can do amazing things to help an image look sharper. It does have a tendency to increase noise though, so be careful. But, I have salvaged many images this way. It is especially useful on fur, feathers and eyes.


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## Go Wild (Jun 28, 2016)

takesome1 said:


> I have sent my 7D II in twice to Canon. Once with the lens to match them up. Both times they say they did something but it comes back the same way.
> 
> The AF system has never worked properly, I only used mine on the 500mm.
> I think there may be bad copies of the 7D II and it sounds like you and I may have gotten one of them.
> ...



Your story is quite like mine. Yes, the camera already gave me good shots, but most of the times, especially when the subject is more than 20 meters, just can´t get a clean shot...I am really disappointed with Canon, because we are talking about a 1300€ camera, it´s not a entry level one....is a semi-pro one! And you just can´t rely on a camera that fails in moments you just can´t fail...
Well, i don´t know what i´m going to do...next step is to contact Canon and let´s see what they do...then i don´t know...I don´t have financial possibility to buy another camera more expensive, i just bought 3 months ago the new 500mm F4. 



unfocused said:


> I don't have any answers other than to send it to Canon with samples, explanation and comparison of the shots between the two cameras.
> 
> In the meantime, if you want to salvage some of the soft shots, here is my advice:
> 
> In Photoshop: make a duplicate layer of your final image. Change the blending mode to hard light. Go to filters and choose "Other" then "High Pass" adjust it to about 2-5 pixels, whatever looks best. High Pass increases edge contrast, and can do amazing things to help an image look sharper. It does have a tendency to increase noise though, so be careful. But, I have salvaged many images this way. It is especially useful on fur, feathers and eyes.



Thank you unfocused! Fortunatly i did a lot of shots with the 5D and i still could do some 35% of good shots with the 7D, but i will try your advice.


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## Shift7 (Jun 28, 2016)

Mine serial number starts 04.... So I believe that older cameras had this issue, any other happy/unhappy users please write your serial number first digits


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## AlanF (Jun 28, 2016)

There are parallel threads about soft 7DIIs going on, so it must be real. I have an early model with serial number beginning 033. By chance I have been comparing telephoto lenses on it this morning with them on the 5DS R using charts, the results of which bear out my experience of using the 7DII in the real world for 18 months.

My 7DII hardly differs from the 5DS R with the 100-400mm II and also the Sigma 150-600mm C at 400 mm and 600mm, with really sharp results of both lenses on both bodies. But, my 300mm f/2.8 II + 2xTC III on the 7DII is soft, whereas it is sharp on the 5D R.

So, in my case, it seems that the 7DII doesn't work well with some lenses.


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## tron (Jun 28, 2016)

Shift7 said:


> Mine serial number starts 04.... So I believe that older cameras had this issue, any other happy/unhappy users please write your serial number first digits


Mine starts with 07. I am not sure I have such issues but it is lazy when trying to focus on birds in flight using 65 AF points and I am not 100% sure about perfect focus points alignment...

But when it is ... "lazy" the results are soft (since it does not focuses and I have to retry...)


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## FEBS (Jun 28, 2016)

Shift7 said:


> Mine serial number starts 04.... So I believe that older cameras had this issue, any other happy/unhappy users please write your serial number first digits



Mine starts with 013 and I have about the same issues as OP. Already thought many times that I'm spoiled by using FF, but I hear that other have the same issues. I will need to test with a colleague owner of 7Dii to find out if I will keep this body.


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## takesome1 (Jun 28, 2016)

AlanF said:


> There are parallel threads about soft 7DIIs going on, so it must be real. I have an early model with serial number beginning 033. By chance I have been comparing telephoto lenses on it this morning with them on the 5DS R using charts, the results of which bear out my experience of using the 7DII in the real world for 18 months.
> 
> My 7DII hardly differs from the 5DS R with the 100-400mm II and also the Sigma 150-600mm C at 400 mm and 600mm, with really sharp results of both lenses on both bodies. But, my 300mm f/2.8 II + 2xTC III on the 7DII is soft, whereas it is sharp on the 5D R.
> 
> So, in my case, it seems that the 7DII doesn't work well with some lenses.



I haven't monitored the current threads, but there were problems with a few bodies that were soft and it was a problem that once repaired was great.

As you say there is almost no difference between a 5Ds R cropped shot and and a 7D II if it is in focus. Mine has always produced sharp images when in focus, but the AF system has not been as accurate or precise as other bodies I have.

It is hard to determine from Go Wild's photos which it may be. Is the snow in front of or behind the bear in focus or out of focus, hard to say. If he had a picture of a grizzly bear and a grassy field it would be easier to tell.


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## Mancubus (Jun 28, 2016)

I've had EXACTLY the same problem with my 7D2. Bought mine as soon as it came out, to replace a 70D that sometimes would get out of focus photos (and was miles better than the 7D2).

Tried everything, blamed myself, blamed the lens, spent many hours fiddling with the AF adjustments...

Sent the camera to repair (was still in warranty) and it came back exactly the same way, technician report said it was working fine. All my shots still had exactly the same kind of softness you showed on the polar bear. 

Bought myself a 5D3, the shop took my 7D2 as part of the payment, and I've never looked back. Piece of junk, extremely disappointed with it and with Canon for not fixing it. Unfortunately there is no alternative brand. 

The 5D3 is great, rarely misses.

I won't make the same mistake with the 5D4, I plan to buy it, but will wait at least 6 months after the initial release and keep a close watch on the reports.


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## Go Wild (Jun 28, 2016)

Mancubus said:


> I've had EXACTLY the same problem with my 7D2. Bought mine as soon as it came out, to replace a 70D that sometimes would get out of focus photos (and was miles better than the 7D2).
> 
> Tried everything, blamed myself, blamed the lens, spent many hours fiddling with the AF adjustments...
> 
> ...



Well, for me it is clear that this camera have an issue. If no one complains the problem could be in the users. But there are a lot of users with same history....and this is not normal! And i cannot accept that a 1300€ camera have this tipe of behaviour, and honestly i am very disappointed with Canon because of this. Why do I need the so called "better AF sistem in the market" if simply get´s me loosing shots after shots....One thing is for sure... I will send it for Canon to see what they say....and if the camera continues the same i wont look back...I will sell it and after that, don´t know...I have no real substitute for this in the price tag and that´s what makes me more angry....this camera was just what i needed....Damn.


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## haggie (Jun 28, 2016)

Just a thought from someone that does not own a 7D Mark II:

Perhaps it makes sense to not only compare the serial numbers but the firmware version in particular. 
Perhaps Canon changed something there that gave the improvement over what might before have been a problem?


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## pvalpha (Jun 28, 2016)

Go Wild - I had a similar problem to yours. No amount of AFMA or work with various lenses I had would solve it. Focus was never consistent, and even when it was, there was an "unsharpness" to the image. Taking pictures at f7.1+ and any shutter speed over 1/1250 sec showed a sort of "vibration" in the image when pixel peeping. Almost like various objects had an after-glow that just would render the image unsharp. Focus was dead on (there was literally no where else in the focal plane that was as sharp as the focus point). But the image was still unsharp. 

I believe my problem was the shutter frame and mirror assembly. 

I was only a few weeks after purchase, so I took it back to the camera retailer and traded for a new copy. The problem vanished with the old copy of the body. For most of that time I was thinking I was the problem. I wasn't. 

The problems were gone until about 3 months ago. I started noticing my BiF images were getting some of the blurriness your shots show. I had recently bought a 70-200 F2.8L IS II, as I wanted to get a rugged lens for taking candid pictures of my dog's in motion. I have been noticing an ever increasing number of unsharp images in situations where the system should never be unsharp. A few were missed focus, and that's on me. But the others... not a chance. There are some pictures where nothing is in "focus" the way I know this lens can hit focus. 

I have a feeling that my current 7D2 copy is starting to show signs of the same problem reappearing. And that's getting to be more than a trifle annoying. I'm probably going to go down to the store again, as I have an extended warranty, and see what they can do for me. Which sucks because I want this camera, not a 5D3. I suppose I could sell everything and go in for the D500... but there are certain things I don't like about Nikon systems. :/ Its frustrating.


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## jaredvs (Jun 28, 2016)

You are in luck sir!!! I am in need of a 7d MkII that someone is tired of!!! Feel free to contact me for my shipping address! I will pay for shipping, and that is about it 8) !


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## Go Wild (Jun 28, 2016)

jaredvs said:


> You are in luck sir!!! I am in need of a 7d MkII that someone is tired of!!! Feel free to contact me for my shipping address! I will pay for shipping, and that is about it 8) !



Please send me 1200€ to my bank account and i will be EXTREMELY HAPPY to sent it for you!  That´s the cost of shipping!


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## Ryananthony (Jun 28, 2016)

I've been recently considering updating my 7d to a 7d2. After reading this thread, I am leaning to a used 1dx and keeping the 5d3 as a backup/ body for the lady. Just seems like too much hassle to get things right.


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## AdamBotond (Jun 28, 2016)

That issue with AF inconsistency seems to be very real. I had been considering getting a 7DII soon, so I rented one for the last weekend and gave it a tryout in wildlife enviroment I'm familiar with, so I could have a fair comparison with my 6D that I have been using for years. Guess what. Despite number of AF points in 6d, lacking of more than one cross type af point, focus-and-recompose technique, I found 6D far more reliable and consistent. It did not become obvious until pixel peeping, and most can say there is no visible difference between the two for most uses. But it is what it is. Decide yourself. 

Long story short, there is a local lake where I usually go to photograph pond turtles every month. Animals taken shots of were practically stationary, high shutter speed used with the same 400 5.6 L lens. As you can see, on the 6D- despite of focus and recompose- head is tack sharp, even at 100%. On the 7D II, thanks to wide spread coverage, af was dead on the head, however it is out of focus, seems blurry, which first made think it was a slight motion blur. But it wasn't. I shot a sequence of 8 shots (back-focus button on, iTR enabled) and most of them looked even worse. Reflection of the head looks in focus, instead. 

Rutting season is on the horizon, and my plan was to get a better wildlife performer camera, but based on these experiences I will think twice about buying a 7D II.


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## picturefan (Jun 28, 2016)

Mancubus said:


> I've had EXACTLY the same problem with my 7D2. ... All my shots still had exactly the same kind of softness you showed on the polar bear.



I still have exaxtly the same prob, call it "haze". Guess that it is softness, not oof, as it appears in liveview, which shouldn`t be affected with the af-problems. Can you prove this?


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## picturefan (Jun 28, 2016)

AlanF said:


> There are parallel threads about soft 7DIIs going on, so it must be real. I have an early model with serial number beginning 033. By chance I have been comparing telephoto lenses on it this morning with them on the 5DS R using charts, the results of which bear out my experience of using the 7DII in the real world for 18 months.
> 
> My 7DII hardly differs from the 5DS R with the 100-400mm II and also the Sigma 150-600mm C at 400 mm and 600mm, with really sharp results of both lenses on both bodies. But, my 300mm f/2.8 II + 2xTC III on the 7DII is soft, whereas it is sharp on the 5D R.
> 
> So, in my case, it seems that the 7DII doesn't work well with some lenses.




Very interesting, so we have two people starting a thread with same problems. As it looks, many agree and find out that they also suffer from same softness. When I get the OP here right, it is not only a af-problem, it is having soft pics most of the time with telephot-lens, like the polar bear example.
Is it a "batch-problem"? My serial-nr. starts with 06, but, when I bought, it was Firmware 1.02 (in Nov. 2015).


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## monsieur_elegante (Jun 28, 2016)

picturefan said:


> AlanF said:
> 
> 
> > There are parallel threads about soft 7DIIs going on, so it must be real. I have an early model with serial number beginning 033. By chance I have been comparing telephoto lenses on it this morning with them on the 5DS R using charts, the results of which bear out my experience of using the 7DII in the real world for 18 months.
> ...



As I posted on the post started by picturefan, my 7DII has the exact same problem. When it hits, it's really sharp. The problem is the inconsistency, especially with telephoto lenses (I noticed it on the EF-s 55-250, EF 100-400 II, as well as Sigma 150-600 C). 

The inconsistency problem seems to go away at closer distances (near MFD), which I don't know how to explain. At MFD, I almost always get sharp pictures (on the rare occasions where I don't, it's clear user error). Anyone else notice this with their 7DII?

Sent mine in twice (second time with sample pictures), both times Canon returned it with this note: "AF assembly was misaligned. Electrical adjustments were carried out and full function confirmed." I noticed no discernible improvement after both times it was serviced.

My serial# also starts with 06


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## j-nord (Jun 28, 2016)

These have been an eye opening couple threads on the 7DII issues. Where has everyone been hiding? This has definitely convinced me NOT to pick up a 7Dii off the used market, too great a risk of getting a lemon. Maybe if there is a large enough sampling, we can determine what are safe (relatively) serial numbers to seek out. I never thought I'd appreciate the 1-point AF system on the 6D!


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## monsieur_elegante (Jun 28, 2016)

AdamBotond said:


> That issue with AF inconsistency seems to be very real. I had been considering getting a 7DII soon, so I rented one for the last weekend and gave it a tryout in wildlife enviroment I'm familiar with, so I could have a fair comparison with my 6D that I have been using for years. Guess what. Despite number of AF points in 6d, lacking of more than one cross type af point, focus-and-recompose technique, I found 6D far more reliable and consistent. It did not become obvious until pixel peeping, and most can say there is no visible difference between the two for most uses. But it is what it is. Decide yourself.
> 
> Long story short, there is a local lake where I usually go to photograph pond turtles every month. Animals taken shots of were practically stationary, high shutter speed used with the same 400 5.6 L lens. As you can see, on the 6D- despite of focus and recompose- head is tack sharp, even at 100%. On the 7D II, thanks to wide spread coverage, af was dead on the head, however it is out of focus, seems blurry, which first made think it was a slight motion blur. But it wasn't. I shot a sequence of 8 shots (back-focus button on, iTR enabled) and most of them looked even worse. Reflection of the head looks in focus, instead.
> 
> Rutting season is on the horizon, and my plan was to get a better wildlife performer camera, but based on these experiences I will think twice about buying a 7D II.



This is exactly my conclusion comparing my 6D with my 7DII as well. 6D's AF is lacking in many ways (lack of AF point coverage, really slow AI servo, etc), but when it says it acquired focus, it really acquired focus. When the 7DII says it acquired focus, I simply don't know...

I really don't want to give up on my 7DII -- it provides functionality that's otherwise only available with the 1D series and, more importantly, I *know* it's capable of great IQ and sharpness (as seen here with the sample pic I posted in the other thread). But the inconsistency is prevalent and frustrating enough to make me want to give up on it as well.


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## picturefan (Jun 28, 2016)

AdamBotond said:


> That issue with AF inconsistency seems to be very real. I had been considering getting a 7DII soon, so I rented one for the last weekend and gave it a tryout in wildlife enviroment I'm familiar with, so I could have a fair comparison with my 6D that I have been using for years. Guess what. Despite number of AF points in 6d, lacking of more than one cross type af point, focus-and-recompose technique, I found 6D far more reliable and consistent. It did not become obvious until pixel peeping, and most can say there is no visible difference between the two for most uses. But it is what it is. Decide yourself.
> 
> Long story short, there is a local lake where I usually go to photograph pond turtles every month. Animals taken shots of were practically stationary, high shutter speed used with the same 400 5.6 L lens. As you can see, on the 6D- despite of focus and recompose- head is tack sharp, even at 100%. On the 7D II, thanks to wide spread coverage, af was dead on the head, however it is out of focus, seems blurry, which first made think it was a slight motion blur. But it wasn't. I shot a sequence of 8 shots (back-focus button on, iTR enabled) and most of them looked even worse. Reflection of the head looks in focus, instead.
> 
> Rutting season is on the horizon, and my plan was to get a better wildlife performer camera, but based on these experiences I will think twice about buying a 7D II.



When comparing your last picture (7DII crop) to the peaches or the bullfinch pictures in the other thread (http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=30160.30), I´ll guess that it is the same issue. AF really locked on spot, but soft results. I tested this with static objects (peaches) to find out any difference between af, mf, liveview. But the difference was little.
But what are the conclusions?


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## Deleted member 91053 (Jun 28, 2016)

Interested in the comments/experiences here.
I bought my 7D2 as a backup last December, as it is a backup I haven't spent much time playing with the AF settings. I have tried a couple of different Case settings - but it doesn't seem to make much difference. Currently I am playing with AF case 5 (in Manual with Auto ISO) normally single point or expanded. I just point, shoot and generally get very good images. I am lucky enough to have some nice glass but in good light the AF and IQ are FAR from shabby compared to my 1DX. Naturally in adverse conditions the 1DX scores, as you would expect.
Overall I am very impressed by the 7D2, especially for the price, but I have only used 5 or 6 of them - so there may be exceptions?
I am sorry that some of you are having problems - hence my interest.


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## JMZawodny (Jun 29, 2016)

I've been using my 7D2 (serial number beginning with 022 bought new) for quite some time now. At first I thought it was soft or inconsistent, fears fed by fuel of discontent found here on this forum. However, after finding the AF scenario suited to my subjects and AFMA-ing all of lenses (especially the longer ones), I find the AF to be very accurate and reliable. I certainly refined my technique a bit along the way. Perhaps I'm lucky and ended up with a good body. I don't know. I do know that I had to work on the settings before I got consistently acceptable results. Most of the time I use it as a backup with a L zoom of some sort paired with long prime on a FF body. Some of the complaints posted to this thread are with using 3rd party lenses and some of the issue may be that tiny pixels will expose the weaknesses in optics and/or 3rd party implementations of the Canon AF protocols.

I do hope you find a solution and get to enjoy the 7D2.


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## Go Wild (Jun 29, 2016)

JMZawodny said:


> I've been using my 7D2 (serial number beginning with 022 bought new) for quite some time now. At first I thought it was soft or inconsistent, fears fed by fuel of discontent found here on this forum. However, after finding the AF scenario suited to my subjects and AFMA-ing all of lenses (especially the longer ones), I find the AF to be very accurate and reliable. I certainly refined my technique a bit along the way. Perhaps I'm lucky and ended up with a good body. I don't know. I do know that I had to work on the settings before I got consistently acceptable results. Most of the time I use it as a backup with a L zoom of some sort paired with long prime on a FF body. Some of the complaints posted to this thread are with using 3rd party lenses and some of the issue may be that tiny pixels will expose the weaknesses in optics and/or 3rd party implementations of the Canon AF protocols.
> 
> I do hope you find a solution and get to enjoy the 7D2.



Hello JMZ 

Believe me, my wishes where that like you i could find a solution to this...But honestly i think i have tried everything...I got crazy with afma´s, with settings, with AF variables....come on...I don´t see this in any other cameras! This is insane! I am hoping that somehow i can fix the problem, but i think i will never take a shot with this camera without shaking heart and praying that the photo could be sharp... 

Honestly i do think this is about some kind of construction issue or whatever because i already seen good photos taken with this camera. And i also got some good photos with her. But is just a shot in the dark! and i just cannot accept this in a combo of aproximatly 10.000€ 7D markII and 500mm F4 IS L. This combo should work perfectly. Like it works perfectly in my 5D3. 

There are a lot of reports of the same problem around the internet, so honestly....this is not a problem of learning how the machine works....i do really think something is wrong with multiple bodys of the 7D markII. 

Well, i will continue digging, trying to find a solution here, but honestly and again...i am tired of sending photos of great moments to the trash, just because they are soft when they shouldn´t be...


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## Act444 (Jun 29, 2016)

I no longer have my 7D2, but for record-keeping purposes, according to RAW files taken with that camera, FWIW its serial number began with 022. Had similar issues compared to what everyone else is describing. Hit rate during certain performers at an ice show was as low as 15% (that's an all-time record, not even Rebels are that bad!!). Yet, during others, it was as high as 60-75%. Average seemed around ~40%, a step down from my previous camera. After some time wrestling with settings, etc. I determined it wasn't me but the camera...there were times where results were decent (daylight, close to MFD), but at the end of the day I just couldn't deal with that kind of inconsistency any more.


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## weixing (Jun 29, 2016)

Hi,
My 7D2 serial number start with 028 brought new. I don't think I had the problem... if lighting is good and subject is not too small, the AF is usually quite accurate... 

Anyway, I found that for non-moving or very slow moving subject especially if the subject is small (same size as focus point or smaller), the initial focusing using AI servo is sometime not very accurate... I found using single-shot for initial focusing then switch to AI servo give better result... I configure the back AF button as AI servo AF and "*" button as single-shot AF, so I can switch between them as needed.

Have a nice day.


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## Travelintrevor (Jun 29, 2016)

Go Wild said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > One other thing to look for – when the pics are soft, are they sharp anywhere? I'm getting at, is the focus off or is the whole image soft?
> ...



Not sure if this was mentioned, but at f8, you are past DLA. DLA is f/6.6 on the 7D MK II. Crop sensors can't be stopped down the same as a FF or you will see diffraction kick in. Your case may be diffraction or missed focus or maybe both. 

DLA: http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Canon-EOS-7D-Mark-II.aspx


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## Travelintrevor (Jun 29, 2016)

AdamBotond said:


> That issue with AF inconsistency seems to be very real. I had been considering getting a 7DII soon, so I rented one for the last weekend and gave it a tryout in wildlife enviroment I'm familiar with, so I could have a fair comparison with my 6D that I have been using for years. Guess what. Despite number of AF points in 6d, lacking of more than one cross type af point, focus-and-recompose technique, I found 6D far more reliable and consistent. It did not become obvious until pixel peeping, and most can say there is no visible difference between the two for most uses. But it is what it is. Decide yourself.
> 
> Long story short, there is a local lake where I usually go to photograph pond turtles every month. Animals taken shots of were practically stationary, high shutter speed used with the same 400 5.6 L lens. As you can see, on the 6D- despite of focus and recompose- head is tack sharp, even at 100%. On the 7D II, thanks to wide spread coverage, af was dead on the head, however it is out of focus, seems blurry, which first made think it was a slight motion blur. But it wasn't. I shot a sequence of 8 shots (back-focus button on, iTR enabled) and most of them looked even worse. Reflection of the head looks in focus, instead.
> 
> Rutting season is on the horizon, and my plan was to get a better wildlife performer camera, but based on these experiences I will think twice about buying a 7D II.



You really should not compare the two scenarios. The 7D MK II shot only has the head sticking out of the water but the 6D test shot is a stationary turtle on a log. Shoot like subject and then compare.


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## AlanF (Jun 29, 2016)

DLA is not a sharp cut-off value. There is a slow loss of resolution as the f-number increases, and there is hardly any discernible deterioration in resolution on going from f/5.6 to f/8. Indeed, many lenses give sharper results at f/8 on the 7D II (or 5DS R) than at f/5.6.


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## Aglet (Jun 29, 2016)

I only kept my pre-order 7d2 for about 24 hours and returned it so can't add much to the conversation other than:
AF performance was so poor (super slow) with original 100-400 L it was pointless to use it. My older bodies AF'd better and my original 7D was stellar in AF performance in comparison no matter what mode I used it in.
7D2 was my last-straw-disappointment from Canon.


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## AdamBotond (Jun 29, 2016)

Travelintrevor said:


> You really should not compare the two scenarios. The 7D MK II shot only has the head sticking out of the water but the 6D test shot is a stationary turtle on a log. Shoot like subject and then compare.



Nope. I consider both scenarios stationary. Actually, when I photographed the turtle on a log with the 6D the wind was slightly blowing, so the log was slowely spinning in one way. Did not make any difference due to fast shutter speed. However, the turtles head on top of the water shot by 7D II was practically motionless and as you could have read I shot a sequence of 8 shots, back button af on, iTR on, high speed, af on the head... all of them was oof like that or even worse.


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## allpet (Jun 29, 2016)

I bought a 7d2 a year ago. Serial number starts with 055. No problems. Even no problems with my Sigma lenses. My Sigma 85 1.4 even got better. Tracked a train coming at me with 70 km/h from 100 meters until it filled the frame with a Sigma 50-150 2.8 OS HSM at 50mm with no problem. Use my Sigmas for indoor sports in bad light with no problem. My Sigma 18-35 1.8 has no problem at MFD or other distance. My Sigma 18-35 can AF in very dim light something like ISO 12800, 1/60 s. and f1.8. Yes, my Sigmas don't AF as well as fx a Canon 17-55 2.8 IS USM, but they are no worse than on my 7D.


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## Bennymiata (Jun 29, 2016)

Those shots look a lot like vibration, but not from shaking the camera, but perhaps some sort of internal vibration.
This vibration could be a harmonic vibration somewhere in the camera (even the sensor) triggered by certain shutter speeds.
It could also be coming from the mirror actuator, and seeing as this is new item and not tested in the field for years and years (as sprung mirrors are), perhaps there is some binding or jerking that is causing the problem and this problem may have been fixed in later versions.


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## Otara (Jun 29, 2016)

My take is we're talking 2 polar bear pictures roughly the same size, one APS-C, the other FF - in fact the FF shot is actually bigger. Which has to mean the FF is much closer than the crop if its the same lens? Edit
:700mm vs 500mm, so a crop with 1.4 vs a ff with no 1.4 and closer.

Secondly the FF is an improvement but still doesnt look all that sharp to me either given it should be a very straightforward pic with a very good lens. My impression is whatever is going on is influenced by subject distance and increased in effect by crop vs FF rather than crop alone.

Wind, moisture/condensation in/on the lens, not sure what. But something else is going on as well I suspect.


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## Go Wild (Jun 29, 2016)

Otara said:


> My take is we're talking 2 polar bear pictures roughly the same size, one APS-C, the other FF - in fact the FF shot is actually bigger. Which has to mean the FF is much closer than the crop if its the same lens? Edit
> :700mm vs 500mm, so a crop with 1.4 vs a ff with no 1.4 and closer.
> 
> Secondly the FF is an improvement but still doesnt look all that sharp to me either given it should be a very straightforward pic with a very good lens. My impression is whatever is going on is influenced by subject distance and increased in effect by crop vs FF rather than crop alone.
> ...



Yes, that is correct! Most of the times the feeling that i have is that the photos miss sharpness because motion blur or some kind of vibration. However, in all the situations I shoot with tripod and shutter speed above 1/2000 so motion blur is almost a non problem to considerate. I do get that feeling that something inside the camera is making that vibration and creating this problem!




Otara said:


> My take is we're talking 2 polar bear pictures roughly the same size, one APS-C, the other FF - in fact the FF shot is actually bigger. Which has to mean the FF is much closer than the crop if its the same lens? Edit
> :700mm vs 500mm, so a crop with 1.4 vs a ff with no 1.4 and closer.
> 
> Secondly the FF is an improvement but still doesnt look all that sharp to me either given it should be a very straightforward pic with a very good lens. My impression is whatever is going on is influenced by subject distance and increased in effect by crop vs FF rather than crop alone.
> ...



Hello Otara in the FF shot i was closer to the bear than in the apsc shot. Yes, of course the image quality on the FF will be better in all situations. But that´s not the point here...if you see the photos taken with the aps-c we cannot even consider image quality because they simply doesn´t look sharp at all...And i got closer photos with the aps-c with the same problem. 
But let´s forget the bears, i have this problem with this camera for over a year...I lost a big amount of photos because of this...In all the situations the keepers ratio is about 20%/25% Sometimes between 20 or 25 photos i get 2 good ones. But even those 2 good ones they are not sharp enough at least to my standards... I never noticed that the AF was slow, for me that problem never came and honestly i don´t think that the problem is in the AF sistem. I do think that the problem is somekind of internal vibration that makes the photo get that motino blur. If i see this photos without knowing the used settings my diagnostic would be "slow shutterspeed"!!
So in my opinion the problem is that, something internal is making that problem. If i got time this afternoon i will make some tests to see if i get any difference


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## AlanF (Jun 29, 2016)

I tested my 7DII systematically with my telephoto lenses for shutter shock/mirror slap. There is feedback between some lenses and vibration at about 1/80 - 1/160s (it was different between my 2 copies of the 100-400mm II). Above 1/250s there was no vibration in the standard mode and the silent mode was fine at the slow speed speeds. So, I use silent mode as standard for both the 7DII and 5DS R unless I am at faster speeds and want to follow rapid action.

The Nikon 810 and other models have terrible vibration problems with lenses like the 300mm f/4 which cannot be fixed. The vibration problems are not confined to "mirror slappers". Olympus and Panasonic mirrorless have problems and require the electronic shutter at slower speeds and that includes the Panasonic G8 flagship. Panasonic has redesigned its shutter for the G80/85.


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## Otara (Jun 29, 2016)

Yeah Im not saying you dont have problems, more that the examples arent great evidence of it being the camera.

As I said the odd thing for me is that the FF shot seems to have problems too, just not as extreme. I think its important to compare similar distances with the same lens, rather than what you're showing.


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## Vincwat (Jun 29, 2016)

Hi GoWild,

I had the same problems. I used it with the Sigma 150-600S. On the 5Dmk3 it was perfect. On the 7Dmk2 it was crap. I compared it with a 600D same lens, the image was better on the 600D. I have been told to AFMA, I did, I have been told it is because of camera shake... I don't buy that for all the images. Even on a tripod with fixes subjects the images were soft. I sold the camera and bought one of the last 1dx in stock (at a very good price) when the Mark2 was released. Problem solved.

Vincent


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## pvalpha (Jun 29, 2016)

@Go Wild - A long shot but what version of the firmware are you running? The current version of the firmware for the 7D2 is 1.0.5 -- if you are significantly below that (1.0.2) then there have been a few improvements over the last year that might help some of the situations encountered. I'd contact canon or read their website to see if any of the lenses you use are covered by the firmware update. If nothing else works, as a last resort you can update the firmware to the latest version or request it if you send your camera in for service if you are uncomfortable doing it yourself. 

I had not realized 1.0.5 had been released, and I updated just to make sure - it isn't likely to solve the problem I am currently having, but it should cause no harm either.


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## Go Wild (Jun 29, 2016)

pvalpha said:


> @Go Wild - A long shot but what version of the firmware are you running? The current version of the firmware for the 7D2 is 1.0.5 -- if you are significantly below that (1.0.2) then there have been a few improvements over the last year that might help some of the situations encountered. I'd contact canon or read their website to see if any of the lenses you use are covered by the firmware update. If nothing else works, as a last resort you can update the firmware to the latest version or request it if you send your camera in for service if you are uncomfortable doing it yourself.
> 
> I had not realized 1.0.5 had been released, and I updated just to make sure - it isn't likely to solve the problem I am currently having, but it should cause no harm either.





Vincwat said:


> Hi GoWild,
> 
> I had the same problems. I used it with the Sigma 150-600S. On the 5Dmk3 it was perfect. On the 7Dmk2 it was crap. I compared it with a 600D same lens, the image was better on the 600D. I have been told to AFMA, I did, I have been told it is because of camera shake... I don't buy that for all the images. Even on a tripod with fixes subjects the images were soft. I sold the camera and bought one of the last 1dx in stock (at a very good price) when the Mark2 was released. Problem solved.
> 
> Vincent





Otara said:


> Yeah Im not saying you dont have problems, more that the examples arent great evidence of it being the camera.
> 
> As I said the odd thing for me is that the FF shot seems to have problems too, just not as extreme. I think its important to compare similar distances with the same lens, rather than what you're showing.




Hello Otara, Vincent and pvalpha

Well Otara, thats the doubtd that have pursuited me for all this year...Is it me? Is it my mistakes? I don´t find any issue in the 5D3 photo, the crop you see is a huge crop! So it is normal that the photo shows some degradation of quality. But the sharp is there, definitly and without doubts we have a sharp photo. And this don´t happen with the 7D2 photos, they are inquestionable soft or even, they seem OOF. And that´s the point....If you see some vibration on the 7d2 but the photo was clearly well focused....well...it was ok, but it is not what happens and it happens all the time in every situations, so it is not an isolated case.... 


Hello Vincent, well it seems that it´s the only solution to make this problem disappear...but makes me sad because of 2 things...1st i really like the camera...aps-c, 10fps, good buffer and of course the price! And then the 2nd is the aps-c factor wich helps a lot working with wildlife....
If i have the money i woud not think twice, i sold this one and buy another camera, maybe the 1Dx even loosing the crop factor...but at this time i just can´t afford a new camera....

Pvalpha, i was running the 1.0.2 version and i upgraded to 1.0.5 i will test it but i don´t think this is the problem because the improvements they have made was nothing to do with my problems with the camera...But i will test this way and then i let you know the results...


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## xps (Jun 29, 2016)

My 7DII suffers from the same problem. AF suchs in more than 50% of my bird shots. As my 5DIII is NACA 7, I rented one. and the AF works super fine on my 600mm & 1.4x combo. And on my 100-400 II as well. Even my 6D gets more Hits" and sharp pictures. Sent my 7DII two times to Canon Service with a lot of RAW files. But they just adjusted the AF, nothing else. Told me, the cam performs fine and the rejects are not extraordinary out of focus (but they were out of focus  )
Colleagues of mine (1DX owner), say, the Cam is not working well. One their shots, also more than 50% are not sharp or the image is visibly out of focus (layer of sharpness varies). A neverending story....

So, I am looking for an new body. Maybe 80D (to bridge the time until the 5DIV appears), or an 5DSR.


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## takesome1 (Jun 29, 2016)

Go Wild said:


> _ loosing the crop factor..._



You are not losing as much as you might think, maybe 20% of your ability to crop or an additional 20% distance.
20% is optimistic, from everything I have tested it would probably be closer to a 15% advantage.

If you are going to compare the 5D III pictures to the 7D II you should do it with the same lens from exactly the same distance. It is the only way to be fair.

One thing that misleads people is that the 7D II pictures have less room to crop than a FF body. That is because they are already cropped. So when you are posting a 100% crop from a 7D II and a 100% crop from a FF body it is not a fair comparison. The fair comparison is the same picture cropped to the exact same framing.

To your issue a simple test is what you need to do.

Since you say it only happens at pictures at farther distances find a subject, perferably with enough texture in the photo that you can determine where the AF area is once you take a picture. Choose like an object in a grassy field that you can look at the grass afterwards to see if any is in focus. Then do this with your camera on a sturdy tripod:

1, Rack your lens af one way or the other and shoot a shot in AI Servo single point.
2, Rack the af lens again and in single shot, single point do another shot.
3, Take a shoot in live view, turn AF off and use MF, in live view zoom the lcd in to the maximum and manually focus your lens. Have the camera set to timer, 10 seconds. Once you are focused take the shot, get your hands off the camera while it counts down.

Rinse and Repeat a few times.

Picture #3 should be sharp and in focus. 1 and 2 may be but if your in the grassy field there should be some grass somewhere that is in focus. 

Picture #3 in focus and 1 and 2 not. It is an AF issue and there are several alternatives for this. One is sending the lens and body to Canon to balance and adjust.
Picture #3 not in focus, send the body to Canon you got problems.


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## xps (Jun 29, 2016)

takesome1 said:


> Go Wild said:
> 
> 
> > _ loosing the crop factor..._
> ...



Thanks for your advice, Mr. takesome1. My own 7DII suffers not from an AF issue at stationary objects, but when objects are moving. Then the sharpness level varies. Sometimes a point in front of the object is sharp, sometimes one behind it. and the third or fourth shot is ok. And this problem to simulate is a little bit difficult for me


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## neuroanatomist (Jun 29, 2016)

xps said:


> My own 7DII suffers not from an AF issue at stationary objects, but when objects are moving. Then the sharpness level varies. Sometimes a point in front of the object is sharp, sometimes one behind it. and the third or fourth shot is ok. And this problem to simulate is a little bit difficult for me



That sounds like something that could be corrected by altering/customizing the AF tracking settings.


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## xps (Jun 29, 2016)

neuroanatomist said:


> xps said:
> 
> 
> > My own 7DII suffers not from an AF issue at stationary objects, but when objects are moving. Then the sharpness level varies. Sometimes a point in front of the object is sharp, sometimes one behind it. and the third or fourth shot is ok. And this problem to simulate is a little bit difficult for me
> ...



Mr. Neuro, thanks. But I tried nearly everything in the menu to correct this. AFMA has been performed by Canon, I tried several combinations of AF customizations...
Some of my frieds think, there is an inconsistance of the AF system. Something like an floating AF point/AF layer/AF sharpneslevel in AI servo. 
It is just frustrating. 
Canon helpdesk told me to buy an 5D or 1D series. I know, that this will solve a lot. But I like the crop for birds. I am hesitant, if a 5DSR would be an good choice. Or waiting for the 5DIV (with just 24MP? and no better DR and IQ?) 
I do not want to buy an1D series body, as I have to spend some money for daily life too - even I am an retiree


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## jaredvs (Jun 29, 2016)

Go Wild said:


> jaredvs said:
> 
> 
> > You are in luck sir!!! I am in need of a 7d MkII that someone is tired of!!! Feel free to contact me for my shipping address! I will pay for shipping, and that is about it 8) !
> ...



Well played sir!


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## picturefan (Jun 29, 2016)

takesome1 said:


> Go Wild said:
> 
> 
> > _ loosing the crop factor..._
> ...



Thank you, takesome.
This is the testing method I have been using also.
#3 is what happens when I done it. #1 and 2 are only showing small differences. afma should be the solution.
But what is your conclusion? When sending to Canon what would they do? Sure they will not test the same way...


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## takesome1 (Jun 30, 2016)

picturefan said:


> takesome1 said:
> 
> 
> > Go Wild said:
> ...



If you are not getting sharp pictures when it is in MF it is not a AF issue.

I would send it to Canon and tell them the images are soft even in MF and ask them to check the camera itself out and the AF as well.
If you had it less than a year it is under warranty and no charge.

You could also send the lens, if you bought either in the last year they do not charge to adjust the AF of the two together.


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## Mancubus (Jun 30, 2016)

All these issues would have been "ok" if Canon admitted that some 7D2's are faulty. 

I personally believe that there is some vibration in the sensor which causes photos in focus to not be sharp even at very high shutter speeds. 

What Canon should have done was evaluate the first cameras reporting this issue and then publicly announce a mass recall for certain serial numbers and also make sure that all Canon service centres around the world were aware of the situation.

It is utter bull**it that faulty cameras are being returned without a solution or even acknowledgement of the problem. What the hell are those technicians doing? Taking a quick look on the camera screen? Any idiot with half a brain can take a photo, look at 100% in a computer screen and see if the image is sharp.


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## Go Wild (Jun 30, 2016)

Mancubus said:


> All these issues would have been "ok" if Canon admitted that some 7D2's are faulty.
> 
> I personally believe that there is some vibration in the sensor which causes photos in focus to not be sharp even at very high shutter speeds.
> 
> ...



+1 

I totally agree with you in every point you wrote. My suspicious is the same as yours, there is some problem with vibration. If canon tryed to fix the problem that was no sign of weakness, but instead, would make very, very pleasant the guys that splashes money year after year in this brand. 
Instead...they prefer to believe that nothing happens and the fault is on the photographers, those poor guys that they don´t know how to use a semi-pro camera.....Unbelievable!


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## weixing (Jun 30, 2016)

Go Wild said:


> Mancubus said:
> 
> 
> > All these issues would have been "ok" if Canon admitted that some 7D2's are faulty.
> ...


Hi,
If you can recreate the soft image under specific setting, then you'll have a case. 

By the way, does it happen to all the lens you use on it??

Have a nice day.


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## Mikehit (Jun 30, 2016)

Mancubus said:


> What Canon should have done was evaluate the first cameras reporting this issue and then publicly announce a mass recall for certain serial numbers and also make sure that all Canon service centres around the world were aware of the situation.



You are making the assumption there is a fault.

When Canon finds a reproducible problem they seem to be usually pretty quick in acknowledging it and fixing it. I think it was the 1D3 that had AF problems on release and they resolved it pretty quickly. 

There are many cases where doctors prescribe aspirin (acetominophen) for no other reason than to keep hypochondriacs happy. I am fairly sure the big manufacturers 'fix' non-existent problems for no other reason than customer relations.


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## Kerry B (Jun 30, 2016)

Interesting thread. Recently took the plunge and bought the 7dii and have to say I am more than happy with the results. Never liked the original 7d and exchanged for the 5diii which I still have. This is my workhorse camera body but needed something better suited for wildlife hence the purchase of the 7dii.
Having been used to the autofocus system on the 5diii the new 7dii is similar and I find that in most situations focus is spot on.
Image quality is very good and whilst not scientific I have posted two images taken with both camera bodies and the new 100-400ii Canon lens. The 5diii image has been cropped to make it similar in size to the 7dii image.


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## Larsskv (Jun 30, 2016)

I just read this insightful analysis of the differences and similarities of the AF systems in the 7DII, 5DIII and 1DX:

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Comparisons/Canon-EOS-7D-II-1D-X-5D-III-AF-Comparison.aspx


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## Go Wild (Jul 1, 2016)

I am not saying that this is a bad camera, i do believe the ones that got good copies don´t complain, because the camera is a good camera. However, i am not getting that results from it! And yes, sometimes, and i mean reaally sometimes it gives me a great shot. The problem of the camera is the inconsistency of focus and just get 1 good shot in a 10 photos and sometimes not even one shot....it´s just unpredictable! 

Let me put you another example: 

In this situation, i was shooting in a sturdy tripod, in a confortable position, no fast movements, the reindeer was walking and eating but in a slow movement. I got enough light, i was shooting at 1/2000 F4 no teleconverter. The animal was close to me, the photos are without cropping. I was not interested in getting the whole body in focus so i choose F4 to give me only the head in focus. 
I shot 10 frames. only the 3rd one was in focus and even that one is not good. So please tell me....in this scenario, is it my fault?? And is it my fault that it happens every, every, every time the same in lots of different situations?? And is it normal that when i shoot with other cameras nothing of this happens??? So sorry....1 year is enought.....i am not blaiming myself anymore!! 

Examples: 

1 . original image, third one taken in 10 photos. Just some correction in luminosity. 







2 - Same image cropped 







Now another one representative of the another 9 photos taken. They are like this. 

3 - Original photo






4 - Cropped photo







if i don´t see the setting i would say that this is motion blur due to slow shutter speed. The problem is....that the shutter speed was 1/2000!!!


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## Go Wild (Jul 1, 2016)

And i put one more, again slow movement, good light, 1/2000 shutterspeed....again around 10 shots, not even 1 got good! 

I only going to put the cropped image: 


1 - This is the better one even not good: 






2 - This is the following one, just 0,2 secs after and the other 8 ones also like this:


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## Don Haines (Jul 1, 2016)

Go Wild said:


> I am not saying that this is a bad camera, i do believe the ones that got good copies don´t complain, because the camera is a good camera. However, i am not getting that results from it! And yes, sometimes, and i mean reaally sometimes it gives me a great shot. The problem of the camera is the inconsistency of focus and just get 1 good shot in a 10 photos and sometimes not even one shot....it´s just unpredictable!


What lens were you using?
What were your AF settings?


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## monsieur_elegante (Jul 1, 2016)

Go Wild said:


> I am not saying that this is a bad camera, i do believe the ones that got good copies don´t complain, because the camera is a good camera. However, i am not getting that results from it! And yes, sometimes, and i mean reaally sometimes it gives me a great shot. The problem of the camera is the inconsistency of focus and just get 1 good shot in a 10 photos and sometimes not even one shot....it´s just unpredictable!
> 
> Let me put you another example:
> 
> ...



@Go Wild, this is exactly consistent with my experience with my 7DII. 9 out of 10 (roughly speaking) pictures would end up like #4 from your post. On the rare occasion where it nails it, it looks great (sharp and great IQ)...but it's just too rare.

I blamed myself for the longest time too -- but after using it for over a year (and comparing it to my 6D), I'm certain there's something wrong with it. Sent it to Canon twice, both times Canon said they found a misaligned AF sensor and made "electrical adjustments." Right now I'm contemplating whether to send it in one last time, or to simply give up...


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## pvalpha (Jul 1, 2016)

@Go Wild - Did the firmware update do anything for you? My 7DII is performing better for me since. I am using the 70-200 2.8L IS II. I get fairly consistent sharpness from that. Its when I put on the TC 2x III that things get a bit disappointing. Except today - it nailed focus every time. Granted there was still some minor issue with the TC IQ, but at least the focus wasn't crap. I might even be able to do AFMA and get the last few points of inconsistency hammered out. 

I am definitely hoping that the 7D series sees an update next year. I think they have to in order to address the gap between the D500 and the 7DII. I will sell off mine and go for that instead.


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## Mikehit (Jul 1, 2016)

Go Wild said:


> And i put one more, again slow movement, good light, 1/2000 shutterspeed....again around 10 shots, not even 1 got good!
> 
> I only going to put the cropped image:
> 
> ...



If you look at the soil, in almost every case it seems the grass is in focus in front of the reindeer. This suggests a front focus problem.


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## Larsskv (Jul 1, 2016)

Mikehit said:


> If you look at the soil, in almost every case it seems the grass is in focus in front of the reindeer. This suggests a front focus problem.



+1


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 1, 2016)

Larsskv said:


> Mikehit said:
> 
> 
> > If you look at the soil, in almost every case it seems the grass is in focus in front of the reindeer. This suggests a front focus problem.
> ...



AFMA. The rare shots that are in focus as far as Go Wild is concerned are actually misses as far as the camera is concerned.


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## whothafunk (Jul 1, 2016)

I'm not satisfied with my 7D2 also. Like others, mine too suffers from focus inconsistency. Sometimes it just nails everything I throw at it (top division soccer, volleyball, basketball,..), and sometimes a standing horse will be out of focus even in burst. The "firmware" didn't do anything for me.

I'm just gutted and hate it, especially since I bought a 1DX.


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## Go Wild (Jul 1, 2016)

Larsskv said:


> Mikehit said:
> 
> 
> > If you look at the soil, in almost every case it seems the grass is in focus in front of the reindeer. This suggests a front focus problem.
> ...





neuroanatomist said:


> Larsskv said:
> 
> 
> > Mikehit said:
> ...





Mikehit said:


> Go Wild said:
> 
> 
> > And i put one more, again slow movement, good light, 1/2000 shutterspeed....again around 10 shots, not even 1 got good!
> ...



Yes i look at it, and yes, i have considered so many times that was a AFMA problem. I have lost hundreds of hours in AFMA and i do think it can also be a problem of AFMA. 

However....2 considerations. If you see the soil, not even the soil is sharp! If it was simply a problem of AFMA and the focus hit another point, that point should be sharp. And it just don´t happens at all, not in this example, and not also in every situations. 

I use a 500mm F4 IS L II with the 7D MKII and i tryed everything. The afma that gave me better results was +3 but no even that solve the problem so i tried with everyones....+5 (seems like this one is the better with the teleconverter), +7, +1, +2 and so on....With Tamron lenses well.....it´s the hell on heart! With tamron 90mmF2.8 VC i got a AFMA of +18 and even so, at distances bigger than 20 meters it just give me auful images!! This is because i sometimes use this lens in weddings. 

This is just insane and of course get´s you mad when you splash about 10.000 euros in a combo! This never happen to me with previous Canon bodys, and i use the previous lens Canon 500mm F4 series 1 with Canon 5d markII and canon 5d markIII... 
Well...i just wish i could afford a 1D series body. In the meantime, i am going to try once again to do an AFMA to see if i get more consistan results and i will send the camera to Canon to see what they say. 
However, i do think the camera have some shaking problem inside, you can see in the polar bears photos, the reflexions in the snow, the light is "dancing" like it was a slow shutterspeed. 

In resume....i am sad and i have lost a huge amount of time trying to put this camera working, and most important....i have lost a huge amount of photos...photos that i wont be able to do at least for some years....And this is hard to accept.....


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## ykn123 (Jul 1, 2016)

I had a 7DMII for a short little while (a few months, bought it as a 1DX backup camera). I was never really happy with it - it's a great camera in terms of ergonomics and i had some good shots - however i never had 100% tack sharp shots. I sold it and bought a second 1-DX and never looked back. 
I'm not blaming the 7DMii in general , maybe i had a bad model, maybe Canonservice would have it fixed for me (well, the posts here suggest that this would not be the case) - but i could not trust the camera. It ended up me thinking on whether i should really use the camera for a job or not and that is not working (for me). I pick up the 1DXs or my 5DM3 any time and get the results i want.


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## zim (Jul 1, 2016)

Larsskv said:


> Mikehit said:
> 
> 
> > If you look at the soil, in almost every case it seems the grass is in focus in front of the reindeer. This suggests a front focus problem.
> ...



Honestly I don't see any part of those examples in focus, would be better to see the original raw files though.

@ go wild was IS on or off? Wondering if there is something faulty between camera and lens rather than AF as such


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## Act444 (Jul 1, 2016)

That's exactly the way I felt - _not being able to trust the camera_. That is NEVER a good feeling to have, EVER.

Although my issue was more with AF consistency rather than having the image be completely un-sharp. But this seems to be a bigger(?) issue than I previously imagined...lots of folks coming out of the woodwork... 

Canon has not yet acknowledged any issue, though, which has me wondering why...


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## Go Wild (Jul 1, 2016)

zim said:


> Larsskv said:
> 
> 
> > Mikehit said:
> ...



Hello Zim, in fact they are not in focus. Didn´t make anything with the photos, only compression to jpeg and some adjust in light in the first one to see better the focus area. 

I´ve tried everything....with IS on, Is off, with IS in modes 1, 2 and 3....and the results are always the same....And this happens with all the lenses I use so the problem is definitly in the camera. All the lenses in Canon 5D markIII just act marvelous! 500mm F4 IS II L performs amazing in 5D3!!! 

Well, i thank you all for your advices and concern...i am going to send it to Canon and let´s see what they say...I think i have no other option unless to wait for some new model because ther is no alternative to this camera in Canon. I look now to the 80D let´s see the first reviews to see if somehow it can be a solution. Or i just pray i have some significant job with good profit to see if i can get a used 1Dx or something..... 



Act444 said:


> That's exactly the way I felt - _not being able to trust the camera_. That is NEVER a good feeling to have, EVER.
> 
> Although my issue was more with AF consistency rather than having the image be completely un-sharp. But this seems to be a bigger(?) issue than I previously imagined...lots of folks coming out of the woodwork...
> 
> Canon has not yet acknowledged any issue, though, which has me wondering why...



Hello Act444 

Yes, mine gives me this results and I cannot figure why.... My complains are mostly about inconsistancy and this blurried images like slow shutterspeed efect or shaking camera....sometimes it looks like front focus, but that don´t justify the soft images and the problem that sometimes nothing gets in focus, even in absolutely easy shots...

And the BIG problem here is what you say...I cannot work properly if i can´t trust the camera...All the situations i pray only for a good shot and this can´t happen....


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## Valvebounce (Jul 1, 2016)

Hi Act444. 
My thoughts on why canon is not reacting is that of all the cameras sold it is a small percentage of owners that notice this problem, and an even smaller number that go on to complain (to Canon rather than each other). Of the complainers, some are seen at each service centre, the service centres possibly don't report to any regional location, particularly as they are only seeing small numbers. Then I bet the service centres in UK don't talk to USA etc. 
How can Canon HQ know when the problem is most often passed off as needing adjustments. 

Cheers, Graham. (Desperately trying to convince myself that my camera is not affected.) ???



Act444 said:


> That's exactly the way I felt - _not being able to trust the camera_. That is NEVER a good feeling to have, EVER.
> 
> Although my issue was more with AF consistency rather than having the image be completely un-sharp. But this seems to be a bigger(?) issue than I previously imagined...lots of folks coming out of the woodwork...
> 
> Canon has not yet acknowledged any issue, though, which has me wondering why...


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## Mikehit (Jul 1, 2016)

Valvebounce said:


> Hi Act444.
> My thoughts on why canon is not reacting is that of all the cameras sold it is a small percentage of owners that notice this problem, and an even smaller number that go on to complain (to Canon rather than each other). Of the complainers, some are seen at each service centre, the service centres possibly don't report to any regional location, particularly as they are only seeing small numbers. Then I bet the service centres in UK don't talk to USA etc.
> How can Canon HQ know when the problem is most often passed off as needing adjustments.
> 
> Cheers, Graham. (Desperately trying to convince myself that my camera is not affected.) ???



And that could well be at the core of it. 
Any manufacturing company will set their own quality limits both during manufacture and post-sale. If after-market problems are below that critical level they will be assessed at local level. Above that level they get escalated as a systemic problem. 
The 1D3 focus problems were dealt with quickly because it because obvious a high proportion of users were having problems. The 7D2 is selling in far greater numbers.


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## Mikehit (Jul 1, 2016)

Go Wild said:


> Larsskv said:
> 
> 
> > Mikehit said:
> ...



I disagree. The blades of grass in front of the reindeer's nose are much sharper than the reindeer itself. 
Where was the focus point and which focus mode were you using? 

When you try the AF on a tripod with a static subject in good light (something like a lamp post) what is the outcome, using single-point AF at the centre, with successive apertures ?


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 1, 2016)

Go Wild said:


> Yes i look at it, and yes, i have considered so many times that was a AFMA problem. I have lost hundreds of hours in AFMA and i do think it can also be a problem of AFMA.
> 
> However....2 considerations. If you see the soil, not even the soil is sharp! If it was simply a problem of AFMA and the focus hit another point, that point should be sharp. And it just don´t happens at all, not in this example, and not also in every situations.
> 
> I use a 500mm F4 IS L II with the 7D MKII and i tryed everything. The afma that gave me better results was +3 but no even that solve the problem so i tried with everyones....+5 (seems like this one is the better with the teleconverter), +7, +1, +2 and so on....With Tamron lenses well.....it´s the hell on heart! With tamron 90mmF2.8 VC i got a AFMA of +18 and even so, at distances bigger than 20 meters it just give me auful images!! This is because i sometimes use this lens in weddings.



Look at the grass in the foreground, at the extreme bottom of the screenshot below. Although your subject is not in sharp focus, the grass in front appears to be sharp. Certainly, it's sharper than the subject, which indicates that your DoF is in front of where you want it to be. It's even more evident in this image – you can clearly see that the that the focal plane is running in front of the subject (your crop of the image actually crops out the plane of sharp focus). The prior image that you call 'in focus' (#3 of the 10) is still front-focused, but the animal's head extends into the DoF (which at 500mm f/4 is pretty thin – I'd estimate less than 2 feet of DoF at the distance for that series). 

As Mikehit stated, you're lens is front-focusing. The fact that a positive AFMA seems to help is consistent with that. Based on your description of trying AFMA values, it seems more like you've just fiddled with a few settings rather than systematically determining the appropriate value (e.g. with Reikan FoCal or careful manual testing).


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## Larsskv (Jul 1, 2016)

zim said:


> Larsskv said:
> 
> 
> > Mikehit said:
> ...



I do believe part of the explanation is front focusing. Further, one should be aware that the smaller pixels on the 7DII is much more demanding on the lenses, than larger pixels, such as on a 5DIII.

Unfortunately, TDP does not have comparison pictures from both APS-C and FF for the original 500 f/4 L IS. However, I doubt it is much sharper than the 100-400 L II. This link provides a comparison between the 1DS III and the 7DII, both with the 100-400LII. It shows that you, with the same lens, cannot expect to have the same pixel level sharpness on a 7DII, as a 5DIII: 

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/ISO-12233-Sample-Crops.aspx?Lens=972&Camera=453&Sample=0&FLI=4&API=1&LensComp=972&CameraComp=963&SampleComp=0&FLIComp=4&APIComp=0


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## pvalpha (Jul 1, 2016)

I can say that whatever was in the 1.0.5 firmware patch solved my issues with the 70-200 f2.8L IS II + TC 2x III. Whether that reset some messed up setting in the AF system or otherwise altered something with the shutter timings that wasn't in the Patch Notes, the ghosting and missed focus seem to be pretty much gone at high shutter speeds. I still haven't caught any BiF but all my pictures except where I didn't wait for focus are tack sharp - even with f7.1, 1/2000s shutter speeds. I got 9 out of 10 shooting out in my back yard, where as before I was lucky if I got 1 out of ten. 

I hope Go Wild and others find some solution to their problems. I am really angry with myself for not noticing the firmware patch sooner. I lost a lot of good images and blew a lot of shutter count trying to find something that worked.


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## picturefan (Jul 2, 2016)

pvalpha said:


> I can say that whatever was in the 1.0.5 firmware patch solved my issues with the 70-200 f2.8L IS II + TC 2x III. Whether that reset some messed up setting in the AF system or otherwise altered something with the shutter timings that wasn't in the Patch Notes, the ghosting and missed focus seem to be pretty much gone at high shutter speeds. I still haven't caught any BiF but all my pictures except where I didn't wait for focus are tack sharp - even with f7.1, 1/2000s shutter speeds. I got 9 out of 10 shooting out in my back yard, where as before I was lucky if I got 1 out of ten.
> 
> I hope Go Wild and others find some solution to their problems. I am really angry with myself for not noticing the firmware patch sooner. I lost a lot of good images and blew a lot of shutter count trying to find something that worked.



Befor I did the update, had the same issues with 70-200, as it was descriped very often. But after the full update ceremony, as it was stated in the manuals, the issue remained. Pics did not get better, af-problems stayed on. It´s still the only lens with 7DII, that often just don´t focuse. Will "reboot" the system next and do it again, hoping for better results.


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## pvalpha (Jul 2, 2016)

picturefan said:


> Befor I did the update, had the same issues with 70-200, as it was descriped very often. But after the full update ceremony, as it was stated in the manuals, the issue remained. Pics did not get better, af-problems stayed on. It´s still the only lens with 7DII, that often just don´t focuse. Will "reboot" the system next and do it again, hoping for better results.


If its a physical problem with the lens, or the lens needs adjustment beyond the AFMA limits, you won't notice an improvement. :-\ I'm going to take my camera out and try to get some more pictures today see how it is holding up. It could just be something as simple as the Extender mountings being finicky and the last few days I've managed to get it mounted "correctly". Its just a heck of a coincidence that I update the firmware and the camera magically seems to be doing what it's supposed to do from my perspective. I don't believe in magic. 

If the camera is really stabilized, I should be able to do a focus calibration and get everything 100%. Something I wasn't able to do before. *crossing fingers*


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## picturefan (Jul 3, 2016)

pvalpha said:


> picturefan said:
> 
> 
> > Befor I did the update, had the same issues with 70-200, as it was descriped very often. But after the full update ceremony, as it was stated in the manuals, the issue remained. Pics did not get better, af-problems stayed on. It´s still the only lens with 7DII, that often just don´t focuse. Will "reboot" the system next and do it again, hoping for better results.
> ...



Good luck to you!
In this camera-lens combo, my af is often like locked, that is to say that I push the af-button (af-on), but there will be no reaction. Only with 70-200II. When trying this 5-10 times and chance the target in between, and then focus again on the first target, it will start focussing again. Why??


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## pvalpha (Jul 4, 2016)

picturefan said:


> Good luck to you!
> In this camera-lens combo, my af is often like locked, that is to say that I push the af-button (af-on), but there will be no reaction. Only with 70-200II. When trying this 5-10 times and chance the target in between, and then focus again on the first target, it will start focussing again. Why??


You are the opposite of me. I set the af-button to AF-OFF and have the AF on the shutter button. For a while I had done back button focus because so many recommended it. I found that the back button wasn't giving me enough positive feedback quickly enough to know I had pressed for focus. I found that I had to push the button hard enough that I had to grip the camera more tightly and that my muscles were actually more tense introducing a bucket load of shake into my shots. The button on the vertical grip was much, much better... but that's not what I'm using to get action shots. I don't think I've ever had my 70-200 not try to focus. It might not succeed but it always does try when I press the shutter button halfway.


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## Larsskv (Jul 4, 2016)

pvalpha said:


> picturefan said:
> 
> 
> > Good luck to you!
> ...



+1! I also prefer to have AF on the shutter button, and AF-OFF on the back button.


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## justaCanonuser (Jul 5, 2016)

Act444 said:


> That's exactly the way I felt - _not being able to trust the camera_. That is NEVER a good feeling to have, EVER.
> 
> Although my issue was more with AF consistency rather than having the image be completely un-sharp. But this seems to be a bigger(?) issue than I previously imagined...lots of folks coming out of the woodwork...
> 
> Canon has not yet acknowledged any issue, though, which has me wondering why...



I totally agree, Act444. I use a 5D3 and a 7D2, too, and the 7D2 produces with all my tele lenses massive AF inconsistencies (mainly birding) - and yes, I carefully AFMAed every single lens like I did with my 5D3. I really have a lot of experience with using the 5D3's AF system, and birding is the most demanding application because bird's contours can be soft, contrasts low etc. I tried all the same but also different AF settings with my 7D2. Switching off iTr improved its performance a bit when shooting birds flying in a blue sky. Otherwise you can nearly forget about even trying that (it performs as badly as our old Nikon D300/S's with their crappy phase AF systems). The 7D2 never matches the reliability of the 5D3 I have grown to take for granted. So I end up with a lot of images, but 10 images/s don't help me if I get less in-focus hits than with my slower 5D3. Only in the Single Shot mode my 7D2 is quite reliable, but that's no setting for action. But it indicates that all the algorithms used for trying to keep a moving object in focus with phase AF are the real problem of this camera.

Recently I was in Iceland, and due to luggage weight restrictions I decided to leave my 7D2 at home, to be sure that I get the images I want when shooting birds. I didn't regret my decision.

It is a real pity because besides its lousy phase AF performance the 7D2 is such a nice camera for wildlife/birding... But I seriously consider selling my copy, I am deeply frustrated, too.


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## tron (Jul 6, 2016)

justaCanonuser said:


> Act444 said:
> 
> 
> > That's exactly the way I felt - _not being able to trust the camera_. That is NEVER a good feeling to have, EVER.
> ...


When did you buy it? Can you also tell us the first 2 digits of the serial number?


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## Act444 (Jul 7, 2016)

justaCanonuser said:


> Act444 said:
> 
> 
> > That's exactly the way I felt - _not being able to trust the camera_. That is NEVER a good feeling to have, EVER.
> ...



Thanks for your response. It's a pity because ergo-wise, I agree - it's really a great camera. 

Yes, it led me to giving it up and now I use the 5D3 for ALL my photography (except for travel and work where I've kept the M10). I don't regret it (yet).


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## justaCanonuser (Jul 7, 2016)

tron said:


> When did you buy it? Can you also tell us the first 2 digits of the serial number?



Sorry for my delayed reply, I was busy past days. I bought it about a year ago in Germany. First digits of S/N are 05.


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## tron (Jul 8, 2016)

justaCanonuser said:


> tron said:
> 
> 
> > When did you buy it? Can you also tell us the first 2 digits of the serial number?
> ...


Thanks, my 7DII serial starts with 07. It is not a disaster in focusing. I have taken very good photos with telephotos (birds). But I have some complaints: 

1. Sluggish AF response (when pressing the shutter button with 65 points activated (with just a telephoto 400 or 500mm and NO TC)
2. I am not sure 100% that AF points are aligned perfectly but I am not sure they are not. I know this is not
scientific observation since I suspect a user error too but let's say when using a 500mm with 1.4x (latest Canon) and 7DII the use of tripod helps a lot (for small birds that do not move a lot). Even so success rate is not close to 100%. It is between 50 and 80 (roughly estimated since I have already erased many oof photos).


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## justaCanonuser (Jul 8, 2016)

tron said:


> justaCanonuser said:
> 
> 
> > tron said:
> ...



Funny thing with my 7D2 is that it performs a tad better in Servo mode (and appropriate AF mode setting) when I attach Canon's 1.4x Mk III TC, using my vintage EF 4.5/500. The whole camera then reacts less nervously.


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## Larsskv (Jul 8, 2016)

tron said:


> 1. Sluggish AF response (when pressing the shutter button with 65 points activated (with just a telephoto 400 or 500mm and NO TC)



Have you activated the visible AF point in the 65 points activated mode? The auto setting shows no AF points, and let the camera choose for you. If you activate the af point you can decide where the camera should start to focus, and leave it to the camera to follow the selected subject automatically using the RGB metering system.

You can activate the AF point by going to the fourth tab in the AF menu, then select the next last option, and deselect auto.


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## tron (Jul 11, 2016)

Larsskv said:


> tron said:
> 
> 
> > 1. Sluggish AF response (when pressing the shutter button with 65 points activated (with just a telephoto 400 or 500mm and NO TC)
> ...


I had, I wasn't satisfied and I set it to auto. The reason: I wanted to be able to take photos of flying birds. In many cases they were flying so fast that I was trying to just put them on frame (7D2 with 400 or 500mm, the 400 was so much easier of course...). In many occasions I did not had the chance to put them say in the center so If I had a preselected point the camera would probably try to focus at the sky ...


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 11, 2016)

tron said:


> Larsskv said:
> 
> 
> > You can activate the AF point by going to the fourth tab in the AF menu, then select the next last option, and deselect auto.
> ...



The point of pre-selecting a point with 65-pt auto mode is tha you pick the starting point (doesn't have to be the center) then the AF system tracks the subject through the frame. The problem with letting the camera pick the starting point is if there's anything else in the frame, it'll pick the closest subject which may not be the one you want. If you're shooting birds against a blue sky, it should do ok.


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## tron (Jul 11, 2016)

neuroanatomist said:


> tron said:
> 
> 
> > Larsskv said:
> ...


Exactly! The closest object was the bird. However camera didn't seem to respond immediately (no blinking AF points) when a bird was targeted by some of the AF points (AF mode was AI Servo). So I was retrying by repressing the shutter button (I do not use back button focusing for the following reason: I use the AF button to switch immediately to 65 AF point from a different AF point selection. When in different AF point selection I need to use the joystick so my thumb has a different use!). One thing: I remember trying various combinations of priority (Focus vs Shooting) with not much of a difference but to tell the truth I had not made comparative shots. I was anxious to get the shot. When the bird covers many AF points I think immediate focusing must be possible.


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## justaCanonuser (Jul 12, 2016)

tron said:


> 1. Sluggish AF response (when pressing the shutter button with 65 points activated (with just a telephoto 400 or 500mm and NO TC)
> 2. I am not sure 100% that AF points are aligned perfectly but I am not sure they are not. I know this is not
> scientific observation since I suspect a user error too but let's say when using a 500mm with 1.4x (latest Canon) and 7DII the use of tripod helps a lot (for small birds that do not move a lot). Even so success rate is not close to 100%. It is between 50 and 80 (roughly estimated since I have already erased many oof photos).



I never use Auto selection with all AF points activated. I always select a smaller field with a few AF pts where I e.g. expect the bird's head to be. If the object is a bit more static I select only one AF pt, sometimes extended to then neighboring pts, and try to place it on the eye. 

When I got my 7D2 new I was really shocked to discover that in the AF servo mode, Case 1 or "stiffer" Case 2 selected, even the slightest movement of a relatively still sitting bird caused the camera to hunt so much that it blurred even easy-to-get images (as I wrote I AFMAed all my tele lenses carefully). Opposite to my 5D3 which then nails the bird's head and keeps steady on it in the AF servo mode, my 7D2 behaves really nervously with all my tele lenses. Later I discovered that the "single shot mode" works precisely, so it definitely is related with object tracking algorithms running in the 7D2's AF system - it is not a problem of a misaligned AF sensor or any other calibration flaw at least in my camera. 

Interestingly, shooting BIF against blue sky turned out to be a challenge, the 7D2 fails exactly in the same angles relatively to the axis pointing to the sun as the D300/D300S of our Nikon gear (also using a e.g. 500mm prime). This is an old problem of Nikon which is related to they way their color based object tracking systems works (don't know if they fixed it with the D500), according to our observation the polarization of the light may also influence the camera's tracking system - but how? No idea so far. Switching off "iTR" in the 7D2 solved those problems not completely, but definitely improved my camera's tracking precision in this particular setting. So, obviously, Canon "nikonized" the 7D2's AF system which is no good news for birders using Canon IMHO.


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## Mikehit (Jul 12, 2016)

justaCanonuser said:


> So, obviously, Canon "nikonized" the 7D2's AF system which is no good news for birders using Canon IMHO.



I don't think it is about 'Nikonizing' anything but about compromises and at least you have the option. 
There are various reports saying that you get better AF tracking accuracy by turning off iTR, reducing burst rate from 10fps to 7fps and other choices - which is not surprising really given that all of these add to processor power. Maybe reducing the the burs rate to 7fps improves the iTR performance (I don't know yet, as I haven't done that level of testing). 
The key difference between the 1Dx and the 7D2 is that the former has a processor totally dedicated to AF whereas in the 7D2 it is shared with other functions - so the lower load you put on the processor the better the AF performance.
Nor, IMO, is it about crippling potentially great functionality but it is about understanding how it performs in different situations. And it is a definite improvement over the original 7D and, given that it was significantly cheaper than the 5D3 or the 1Dx, is all I am really bothered about. 

As I say, at least I have the choice how I use the camera. How can that not be good thing for birders?


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## justaCanonuser (Jul 12, 2016)

Mikehit said:


> As I say, at least I have the choice how I use the camera. How can that not be good thing for birders?



Good for birders is the 5D3, according to my own extended experience with both cameras, despite full format and slower burst rate. Much better in-focus hit rate.


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## bichex (Jul 13, 2016)

I had a Canon 7D Mark II and initially was not happy with it, especially with performance servo AF . He used a 300 2.8 . On a trip to Chile, I stole all the photographic equipment and lost everything he had bought with great sacrifice in 8 years. After a few months , I could buy a new camera and buy again 7D Mark II with a 100-400 IS II . This new camera like the first bird has difficulty following moving towards the camera, for the rest, I think an excellent camera. The AF for stationary subjects is very accurate and the servo when objects move horizontally is very accurate . When the subject moves toward the camera, errs many pictures , but I'm still very happy with the camera and lens.
It is difficult to analyze the problems , but if you're so frustrated , it is likely that your camera has a problem , because in general it works very well , just not as good AF as initially promoted


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## bananaboat83 (Jul 18, 2016)

I have a 7D2, one of the early release batches back in October 2014. And since day 1 uhave had the 7d2, I have found it to overexpose when using zoom lens. Have upgraded firmware to latest and it still the same.


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