# Patent: LCD for Image Review While Using An EVF



## Canon Rumors Guy (Jul 21, 2018)

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Canon News has uncovered a patent showing functionality for LCD review with EVF equipped ILCs.</p>
<p>We have been told in the past that Canon is working on a EVF DSLR, which makes some sense to us if the EVF is as good as what we see on the Leica SL. As Canon News points out, the patent images show a DSLR and not an EOS M camera.</p>
<p><strong>From <a href="https://www.canonnews.com/canon-patent-application-lcd-for-image-review-while-using-an-evf">Canon News</a> about Japan Patent Application 2018-113532:</strong></p>
<blockquote><p>This patent is interesting.  It discusses how to do image review and also live operation with an EVF based camera and the back LCD panel, but most interesting, is the camera suggested in the patent application.  It’s a DSLR shaped camera, and not an M designed camera.  While Canon could use any looking camera for it’s patents, usually the image of the camera, guides their intent.  In other words, I would not have expected this to be an DSLR, if they were not looking at EVF’s in DSLR form factors, but would have shown an M5 or M6 camera, it’s not as if Canon doesn’t have those images floating around. <a href="https://www.canonnews.com/canon-patent-application-lcd-for-image-review-while-using-an-evf">Read more….</a></p></blockquote>
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## zim (Jul 21, 2018)

Maybe one of the rumoured new mirrorless will be an DM50 with EF mount.... oh wait


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## pliiats (Jul 22, 2018)

This image kind of looks like a full EF mount body with the sensor really close to the mount...

So I wonder, could the rumored cool solution regarding EF lenses be that the whole sensor assembly can move back and forth? So it is closer to the mount when used with a short back focus lens and back at the old EF distance with an EF lens? 

With on-sensor autofocus and IBIS, enough precision in the movement should not be too hard to achieve and it could automatically move based on which native lens is mounted. 
Opens up the door to adapted FD lenses as well, perhaps there would be a setting in the menus for the proper sensor distance. In the best case they could even have a manual mode that would allow to adapt virtually any lens with a shorter-than-EF flange focal distance.

However, what I do not know is whether there would be any lens size benefit in this kind of setup.
Are short back focus lenses smaller by design (in which case the shifting sensor would make sense) or is all the benefit only in having a thinner overall body-sensor-mount-lens package (in which case this theory would be harder to justify)?


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## mb66energy (Jul 22, 2018)

The confirmation / image display after shutter release with the M50 is sometimes a little bit annoying because you cannot see the scene - e.g. while taking photographs of seagulls. But I do not understand how redirecting the confirmation / image display on the tft display should help. If I have my eye close to the EVF I cannot see the tft back display.

I think think it would be much better to add a second display to the left and make the viewfinder field wider: Central EVF display for current view and left display for image review / menu display / extendet view finder info.
And if the tech is progressing make just one OLED chip with 3:1 ratio to support this and 16:9 or cinemascope formats 

@pliiats: I see the same, a wider mount than EF-M and a shorter flange distance compared to EF. So more flexibility for lens design / use of old / specialty lenses.
Maybe the sensor is 10mm thick because it's a stacked design doing AF-calculations, jpg, raw conversion etc. on (sensor) chip ? - Don' take the last remark to serious!

EDIT / ADD:
Just checked my M50: If you take a photo through the EVF and put the camera in front of you to view the back display the camera switches the view of the taken image onto the back display - and if you look through the EVF again you will see the image there which is good if you cannot see the back display well in bright light.
For M50 users: I have enabled the automatic toggling between EVF and back display - you can also choose one display system permanently in the menus.

Located besides the EVF entrance is a small window for a distance sensor, maybe a small LIDAR to check the distance between objects and the EVF.


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## bitm2007 (Jul 22, 2018)

pliiats said:


> This image kind of looks like a full EF mount body with the sensor really close to the mount...
> 
> So I wonder, could the rumored cool solution regarding EF lenses be that the whole sensor assembly can move back and forth? So it is closer to the mount when used with a short back focus lens and back at the old EF distance with an EF lens?



The body looks deep enough to take EF lenses, and if it can take EF-S and FF-M lenses as well it would be a great solution for anybody who is currently heavyily invested in any of Canon's existing lens ranges. A new mount would be a big turn off for me, long term I probably end up switching to Nikon or Sony if they are still ahead on the DR and innovation fronts.

Any ideas why the trash, zoom, play buttons etc are position under the LCD panel ? Those locations look awkward for a moderately sized body to me.


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## SecureGSM (Jul 22, 2018)

5D level body (joystick, button layout) with a tilty-flippy screen, hence buttons were repositioned. there is a hinge to the left of the screen.

I am more interested to know what the switch located on the bottom of the body under those buttons is for? To lock / unlock hinged screen? 



bitm2007 said:


> ....Any ideas why the trash, zoom, play buttons etc are position under the LCD panel ? Those locations look awkward for a moderately sized body to me.


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## Meatcurry (Jul 22, 2018)

SecureGSM said:


> 5D level body (joystick, button layout) with a tilty-flippy screen, hence buttons were repositioned. there is a hinge to the left of the screen.
> 
> I am more interested to know what the switch located on the bottom of the body under those buttons is for? To lock / unlock hinged screen?
> 
> ...


Its a 50D from the olden times, also I don't see an articulating screen?


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## bitm2007 (Jul 22, 2018)

SecureGSM said:


> 5D level body (joystick, button layout) with a tilty-flippy screen, hence buttons were repositioned. there is a hinge to the left of the screen.
> 
> I am more interested to know what the switch located on the bottom of the body under those buttons is for? To lock / unlock hinged screen?
> 
> ...



An articulating screen on 5D style camera, that would be a first. If that's the case I think positioning the buttons on the right hand size of the body or a hinge at the bottom of the LCD screen would be preferable. If along the bottom, the thumb would need to be stretched over other buttons, which are likely to be pressed as a result.


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## denstore (Jul 22, 2018)

As has already been mentioned, the picture seems to be an old 50D. Buttons in the bottom side of the screen, the on off button, next to them and built in flash. It’s not a new camera.


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## Adelino (Jul 22, 2018)

[/quote]
Its a 50D from the olden times, also I don't see an articulating screen?
[/quote]

Olden times  I guess all things are relative.


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## mkabi (Jul 22, 2018)

Looks like 7D mark 3 to me.

Hopefully they are listening and utilize the space, please put built-in ND.


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## jolyonralph (Jul 22, 2018)

EOS 50D image.

Don't get so excited about patent clip-art people!


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## neonlight (Jul 22, 2018)

Wouldn't this be a potential FF mirrorless?


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## pj1974 (Jul 23, 2018)

I have a Canon M5, which I bought a few months ago. My main camera is the Canon 80D (which I have owned for over a year. I appreciate the M5 camera as a convenient smaller travel option. Have a bunch of lenses for both - including some L lenses, other quality glass - including EF, EF-S and EF-M. 

I mainly use the M5, it was for astro with the amazing Rokinon / Samyang 12mm f/2 - but that's another story. I also use it as a convenient landscape (e.g. day-trip / travel camera). I have not had an issue with the image taken, being displayed ('post-viewed') in the EVF. However when I have occasionally used it for 'action' photos, e.g. of my toddler daughter running around, the post-view image in the EVF would delay when I could take the next image. :-[

As well as the 2 seconds 'display time' - the camera seems to have an additional delay in switching from 'taken image' to 'live view' in the EVF. That is, in my experience, the M5's processor lags when switching (back) to 'EVF view' mode, OR 'live view mode. I realise this made operation of the M5 for 'action photos' all the more frustrating. So I turned the 'post-view' photo option off all together (neither in EVF or the main screen) and it is much more responsive. Though not quite the same speed as e.g. the 80D (or my 7D) using OVF, the M5 is much closer to that experience, when the post-view is turned off. Using Canon DSLRs (i.e. with OVF) are still the more seemless experience for fast moving subjects, imho. 

I do hope the next / new Canon mirrorless cameras (both APS-C and 35mm sensors) will have improved integration of post-view in EVF and 'ready to go to live EVF mode' (i.e. fully AF and exposure ready). I wonder if Canon can somehow have the 'live view' ready (though not displaying in the EVF - or the back screen for that matter), because when EVF is used, or live-view is used, there is a bit of time (around 0.5 to 1.5 seconds) when 
the scene adjusts to the right exposure level (and AF is ready to be used). I expect Canon is aware of this, and it appears the M50 is already an improvement (I briefly used one i store. I would require more testing to determine how much of an improvement has been made).

Looking forward to this changing space (and Canon's continuing innovation!) 8)

Regards,

PJ


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## okaro (Jul 23, 2018)

Just how can one get a patent for this? Sounds a very trivial thing.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jul 23, 2018)

okaro said:


> Just how can one get a patent for this? Sounds a very trivial thing.


A patent gives you protection from having others copy a design feature. You may consider it trivial, but some people like to use the image review feature and the warning message that optionally displays if the image turned out to be corrupted (You did read the patent ?). A lot of money and effort goes into developing and testing even small features, so manufacturers want to protect something that makes their product more usable.


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## pliiats (Jul 23, 2018)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> neonlight said:
> 
> 
> > Wouldn't this be a potential FF mirrorless?
> ...


Because it starts off on DSLRs and then quickly shifts to EVF cameras as opposed to a DSLR.
"In recent years, the digital cameras which are mounting the electronic view finder (EVF) on the eyepiece finder are increasing in number. In the camera which mounted EVF, since not only an object but various screens can be displayed in a finder, a setting variation etc. can be done easily, with an eyepiece carried out. "

and later the patent also uses the phrase "old optical finder (OVF)". 

This is not about DSLRs.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jul 24, 2018)

pliiats said:


> Mt Spokane Photography said:
> 
> 
> > neonlight said:
> ...


Good Points! I reread the patent, that bit about the DSLR was referring to historical viewfinders.
Here is the statement about the application. It certainly can apply to a mirrorless camera, or a hybrid. I've removed my previous posts.

"The present invention relates to imaging devices, such as a digital camera, and relates to the imaging device with which especially an electronic view finder and a back face display were provided."


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## tyger11 (Jul 26, 2018)

neonlight said:


> Wouldn't this be a potential FF mirrorless?



FF seems extremely unlikely for this; they only have one FF cine cam, and that's the FF version of the C700, their highest-end cine cam. Even APS-C would be pushing it, considering where the XC cams live in their pricing lineup. I wouldn't be shocked if it were APS-C, but I think it'll either be their 1.5" sensor patent from a while ago, or remain at 1". Assuming this is anything other than patent-blocking, like most of Canon's patents seem to be.


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