# Big Announcements Coming Next Week [CR3]



## Canon Rumors Guy (Jan 27, 2015)

```
<p class="p1">We’re told the embargo/NDA expires on Friday, February 6, 2015 for these upcoming products. These products would line up with the CP+ show in Japan next month.</p>
<ul>
<li class="p1">The two high megapixel cameras, with and without an AA filter. Resolution is said to be 53mp (though the pixel count is not CR3)</li>
<li class="p1">The EOS Rebel T6i/750D.</li>
<li class="p1">EF 11-24 f/4L</li>
<li class="p1">EOS M3 Camera</li>
<li class="p1">Various PowerShot cameras</li>
</ul>
<p>We weren’t given any specifications for any of the cameras, just that they’d be made public at the end of next week.</p>
<p>We don’t know the availability of the cameras, though we had heard March for the big megapixel bodies, which <a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/2015/01/50mp-cameras-coming-in-march-cr1/" target="_blank">we reported as the announcement date</a>. This could in fact be the availability date.</p>
<p><em>More to come…</em></p>
<p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">c</span>r</strong></p>
```


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## Don Haines (Jan 27, 2015)

A dual pixel EOS-M! I hope it is dual-pixel.... That would make it a very nice portable mirrorless camera... and if 
it was weather sealed like the Olympus micro 4/3s it would be perfect...


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jan 27, 2015)

Interesting, but I'm in doubt about my need for a high MP camera. A camera needs to have a attractive set of features before I upgrade.


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## DominoDude (Jan 27, 2015)

Oh yes! Let there be some serious meat on them bones...


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## Halfrack (Jan 27, 2015)

As much as I want to see 35mm FF at a higher pixel density, the technology that goes with it has to be spot on.

I'm not sure a 50MP Canon will shift my lust for the 645Z, but it'll be interesting to see what they have come up with


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## dolina (Jan 27, 2015)

I cannot wait to upgrade my 5D Mark II. ;D

750D is a given, there was even a leaked image awhile back from that Canon media center thing.

11-24mm f/4 would probably not have a bulge like a 14-24mm f/2.8 Nikon.

I wonder if Canon will come out with a APS-C or Full Frame PowerShot to compete with Sony, Leica, Fujifilm, Sigma, Ricoh & Nikon.

Not interested with EOS M system unless Canon comes out with a Speed Booster-like product.

NDA expires on Friday, February 6, 2015 for CP+ happening between Thursday, February 12 to Sunday, February 15, 2015


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## tron (Jan 27, 2015)

I am not interested in a 50+ Mp camera. But any news = good news because it means something is going on.

So I guess no more than a year for 5DMkIV (similar Mp, higher DR, less Low and High ISO noise, just hoping... )

Now the new lens is interesting...


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## LetTheRightLensIn (Jan 27, 2015)

Well, we finally find out whether Canon either can or cares to match Exmor and whether to live with a mish-mash of older Canon bodies plus new adapted Sony or go Nikon for some....

Hopefully it's not just the 7D2 sensor made FF size.

And whether Canon is smart enough and willing to change enough to give it a decent fps in a full-reach cropped mode (like Nikon) or will cripple it to static shots only....

And perhaps whether they punt or charge forward for video again or not....


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## sdfreeland (Jan 27, 2015)

dolina said:


> 11-24mm f/4 would probably not have a bulge like a 14-24mm f/2.8 Nikon.



The leaked images of what is thought to be the lens shows it has a bulb lens on the front. at 11mm I can't see how it could have a flat frontal lens.


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## Triggyman (Jan 27, 2015)

I'm very much interested for the next Rebel, and the M3. 

I need a smaller APS-C camera (Canon System) that's not too pricey but can produce better quality pictures than my SX50. 

If the Rebel and M3 are too expensive for its offered features, I can settle for the T5i, which will go down in price.

You see, we have our own reasons to be excited for what others think are not that exciting to them.


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## jebrady03 (Jan 27, 2015)

I'm still proceeding under the assumption that the "big megapixel" camera is actually a DPAF sensor where the megapixel count of images will be half that of the number of photosites. So, I'm expecting a 26-ish mp camera. Which would be fine with me, I don't need and truthfully can't handle (processing) over 50 megapixels.


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## dolina (Jan 27, 2015)

sdfreeland said:


> dolina said:
> 
> 
> > 11-24mm f/4 would probably not have a bulge like a 14-24mm f/2.8 Nikon.
> ...


Good point so why make it f/4 then? Making it cheaper than Nikon seeming users will stop it down slower than f/4?


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 27, 2015)

jebrady03 said:


> I'm still proceeding under the assumption that the "big megapixel" camera is actually a DPAF sensor where the megapixel count of images will be half that of the number of photosites. So, I'm expecting a 26-ish mp camera. Which would be fine with me, I don't need and truthfully can't handle (processing) over 50 megapixels.



Is the 70D specified as a 40 MP camera?


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## LetTheRightLensIn (Jan 27, 2015)

sdfreeland said:


> dolina said:
> 
> 
> > 11-24mm f/4 would probably not have a bulge like a 14-24mm f/2.8 Nikon.
> ...



Yeah I can't imagine they hit 11mm without a bulge unless it take worse picks than literally using a coke bottle.


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## fotoray (Jan 27, 2015)

That's a lot of new and diverse stuff. Something for everybody!


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## ajfotofilmagem (Jan 27, 2015)

Triggyman said:


> I'm very much interested for the next Rebel, and the M3.
> I need a smaller APS-C camera (Canon System) that's not too pricey but can produce better quality pictures than my SX50.
> If the Rebel and M3 are too expensive for its offered features, I can settle for the T5i, which will go down in price.
> You see, we have our own reasons to be excited for what others think are not that exciting to them.


Yes, I'm excited about the new products, but 50 megapixel is not for me, and 11-24mm is not for my bank account. :-\

Just the fact that silence those who grumble the absence of a competitor for D810 already makes me happy. ;D


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## Dylan777 (Jan 27, 2015)

Um...let's see:

•The two high megapixel cameras, with and without an AA filter. Resolution is said to be 53mp (though the pixel count is not CR3)

•The EOS Rebel T6i/750D.

•EF 11-24 f/4L   

•EOS M3 Camera

•Various PowerShot cameras


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## jebrady03 (Jan 27, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> jebrady03 said:
> 
> 
> > I'm still proceeding under the assumption that the "big megapixel" camera is actually a DPAF sensor where the megapixel count of images will be half that of the number of photosites. So, I'm expecting a 26-ish mp camera. Which would be fine with me, I don't need and truthfully can't handle (processing) over 50 megapixels.
> ...



No. But the talk prior to it being released was that there was a 40-something mp APSC camera coming. So, I'm just going under the assumption that this talk is exactly the same scenario. Talk of high mp that actually turns out to be high photodiode.


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## 3kramd5 (Jan 27, 2015)

jebrady03 said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > jebrady03 said:
> ...


I doubt it. Canon has spent significant dollars developing and producing new leases with pretty spectacular performance (so much so that, on average, the 5D3 out resolves the D800, even though it has 14 million fewer pixels). I have long suspected that they were doing that in part to prepare for a higher-resolution body (rather than doing it in the other order).


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## brad-man (Jan 27, 2015)

I look forward to seeing what Canon brings to the table for the M3. The 70D sensor coupled with better AF and some fast primes would be most welcome. An optional EVF would also be intriguing.


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## fish_shooter (Jan 27, 2015)

[/quote]
Good point so why make it f/4 then? Making it cheaper than Nikon seeming users will stop it down slower than f/4?
[/quote]

To minimize lens aberrations as well as cost. Still, it will be an expensive lens. 11mm is quite a bit wider than 14mm so more challenging to design and build without a lot of aberrations.


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## fish_shooter (Jan 27, 2015)

Don Haines said:


> A dual pixel EOS-M! I hope it is dual-pixel.... That would make it a very nice portable mirrorless camera... and if
> it was weather sealed like the Olympus micro 4/3s it would be perfect...



I agree on the desire for weather sealing but since I don't see any on my EOS-M kit lens and am not aware of any on the other M lenses I suspect the die is cast for no sealing on the EOS-M line.


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## TommyLee (Jan 27, 2015)

I really wish I could see some CA, coma and distortion figures..on this 11-24 baby......
before I sell my car....ha!

my 14L II is fairly undistorted...plenty of (correctable) CA......love it

but I *would *like .... a lens that can see behind me.. 11 mm??...yikes if it gives straight lines

I will take it if it passes muster... I will order as it is announced and test myself...if needed

///////////


off topic

can any SMALL mirrorless canon.... like coming soon....from canon please....
........use the existing lenses?....for my 5d3.....

is this ever gonna be workable...or are the distances ...dealbreakers?....

love to have a small camera that uses some of these nice lenses........ someday
thanks for putting up with such a silly question....if someone has info
I just dont know...

Tom


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## mclaren777 (Jan 27, 2015)

Every time I get excited about a replacement for the 5D3, I'm always disappointed by these high-MP rumors.

It's easy to fall into the bigger=better trap, but I don't want to deal with files that are roughly 9000x6000.

And before anyone brings up the mRAW/sRAW debate, it's not a viable option for what I do.


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## Don Haines (Jan 27, 2015)

fish_shooter said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > A dual pixel EOS-M! I hope it is dual-pixel.... That would make it a very nice portable mirrorless camera... and if
> ...



I kind of doubt they would do it either... but if they did, I would be first on the pre-order list... A EOS-M3 would hopefully mean some new lenses were coming..


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## TommyLee (Jan 27, 2015)

mclaren777

whats the problem...just get belt like a bandito...is that a bandoleer?.....loaded with SSDs...
for your laptop

like the battery belts....

...

yes it is getting out of hand...
but a bit fun to watch

Tom


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## Machaon (Jan 27, 2015)

tron said:


> I am not interested in a 50+ Mp camera. But any news = good news because it means something is going on.
> 
> So I guess no more than a year for 5DMkIV (similar Mp, higher DR, less Low and High ISO noise, just hoping... )
> 
> Now the new lens is interesting...



Yes, the 11-24 mm is very interesting, subject to its sharpness and distortions. At the rumoured price, it would have to be pretty bloody impressive.

What I really hope is that the distinction between the "high resolution" 5Ds and the 5D Mark IV is made much clearer. I'd like to see some sort of product roadmap so we know what the Mark IV really is and when it might be expected. However, I suspect that goes against every instinct of Canon's marketing department.

Even though I'm not interested in 50+ MP myself, it will be fun to see how such a beast performs in the arena! _Morituri te salutant!_


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## Don Haines (Jan 27, 2015)

mclaren777 said:


> Every time I get excited about a replacement for the 5D3, I'm always disappointed by these high-MP rumors.
> 
> It's easy to fall into the bigger=better trap, but I don't want to deal with files that are roughly 9000x6000.
> 
> And before anyone brings up the mRAW/sRAW debate, it's not a viable option for what I do.


Don't worry, you can always get a Cray XK7 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cray_XK7) to run photoshop on 

History note - The original CRAY-1 supercomputer, launched in 1976, ran at 80Mflops. A cell phone typically runs at 1Gflop... some at 2Gflops or 25 times the speed of a Cray-1


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## Lee Jay (Jan 27, 2015)

fotoray said:


> That's a lot of new and diverse stuff. Something for everybody!



Guessing not for me.

I'm interested in a dual-pixel (and updated) version of the 5DIII or 6D, and this doesn't sound like it (maybe, though - 5DIV?). I'm not remotely interested in a $3,000 11-24 or an any-price M3 or 750D.


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## Chaitanya (Jan 27, 2015)

excited to see the new Eos XxxD, although wouldnt mind to see announcement of Ef 60mm macro along with it.


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## bholliman (Jan 27, 2015)

I'm interested to see what Canon announces. I shoot a lot of landscape, but don't see myself buying a high megapixel camera. My next camera body will probably be the 5DIV - after its been out long enough for the price to start dropping, so a ways off. 

Curious to see what the M3 will be like. Hopefully DPAF and faster AF. I might look at one of those as a 2nd body if the price is reasonable.


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## Jamesy (Jan 27, 2015)

brad-man said:


> I look forward to seeing what Canon brings to the table for the M3. The 70D sensor coupled with better AF and some fast primes would be most welcome. An optional EVF would also be intriguing.


My sentiment exactly.


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## benperrin (Jan 27, 2015)

Can't wait. My bank account isn't going to be happy though. Been waiting for a high mp camera to replace my 5d2. I'm gonna wait to see if the a7r II is worth it though. Hoping that Canon knocks this one out of the park.


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## tyger11 (Jan 27, 2015)

Triggyman said:


> I'm very much interested for the next Rebel, and the M3.
> 
> I need a smaller APS-C camera (Canon System) that's not too pricey but can produce better quality pictures than my SX50.



If that's all you're looking for, the current M and M2 already fit the bill, and will be way less expensive than any new M3 would be.


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## PureClassA (Jan 27, 2015)

Jiminy F'ng Crickets, there's a lot of bitching and moaning on here about cameras and lenses that aren't even out yet. Ok, sheesh!! Everyone who shoots landscapes can go to the Sony side of the room!! Wonderful Cameras for DR and resolve. Everyone else go to the Canon side of the room if you prefer vastly superior speed and AF performance for indoor and outdoor sports and wildlife, and a more accurate color palette for portraiture right off the sensor.

Ok done!

Honestly I'd be interested in BOTH a new high res 5 body AND a new 1 series if the 1 series jumps significantly enough over the current model for my needs. I'll wait to see if I even need to cry in my beer AFTER they get announced and reviewed if I don't just preorder them both immediately.

I like Sony. I like Nikon. I'm not going to be a jackass Canon fanboy and crap on the competition.


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## privatebydesign (Jan 27, 2015)

dilbert said:


> LetTheRightLensIn said:
> 
> 
> > Well, we finally find out whether Canon either can or cares to match Exmor and whether to live with a mish-mash of older Canon bodies plus new adapted Sony or go Nikon for some....
> ...


No.


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## silat shooters (Jan 27, 2015)

I'm excited about the news of high meg camera body or bodies. I've always been an early adopter but finances have been tight so will have to sit this one out for awhile which may be a good thing, as I'm sure I'll need to update my computer as well. Truth is the resolution of the 5D Mark III never left me feeling like I need more. 

But I would love to see small high quality full frame DSLR that focuses in the arena with the 7D Mark II, NOT the 6D. But once you have used Cross-Type focusing sensors on the thirds, you never want to go back.


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## HaroldC3 (Jan 27, 2015)

I won't believe anything about a new M until I see it.


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## slclick (Jan 27, 2015)

Have fun with the new gear guys, I have (I hope) over 100k clicks or more left on my Mk3. Funny thing, I bet it'll still work when the new models come out!


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## LukasS (Jan 27, 2015)

Canon Rumors said:


> <ul>
> <li class="p1">The two high megapixel cameras, with and without an AA filter. Resolution is said to be 53mp (though the pixel count is not CR3)</li>
> <li class="p1">EOS M3 Camera</li>
> </ul>


I hope these will have some significant upgrades. Can't wait to replace my 5D and EM-5 hopefully it will be new 5D and new M .


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## vrpanorama (Jan 27, 2015)

Sony just announced today the next generation of big MP and yes it is a 50mb version. Now this is interesting are we going to see a sony sensor in a canon? More than half of my community of friends has switch to sony lately and I have been waiting this version for 18 months now!


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## Lee Jay (Jan 27, 2015)

vrpanorama said:


> Sony just announced today the next generation of big MP and yes it is a 50mb version. Now this is interesting are we going to see a sony sensor in a canon?



I hope not.


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## benperrin (Jan 27, 2015)

vrpanorama said:


> Sony just announced today the next generation of big MP and yes it is a 50mb version. Now this is interesting are we going to see a sony sensor in a canon? More than half of my community of friends has switch to sony lately and I have been waiting this version for 18 months now!



Where have they announced this? All I've seen is rumours of an announcement.


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## 3kramd5 (Jan 27, 2015)

Lee Jay said:


> vrpanorama said:
> 
> 
> > Sony just announced today the next generation of big MP and yes it is a 50mb version. Now this is interesting are we going to see a sony sensor in a canon?
> ...



If it meant that Sony was the only game in town, I'd agree. But Toshiba, Aptina, Samsung, etc. are producing viable sensors, so if Canon has decided it isn't worth keeping the line going, I couldn't care less.


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## adhocphotographer (Jan 27, 2015)

Hmmm...

The lens is interesting, but not so much for me.. especially at that price! 

A new FF camera would be great, but I want more speed less MP. 50+MP is miles too much for me. But lets see what else it has...

A FF subdued version of the 7D MK II (like the 5DIII was for the 7D) is what i'm looking for... a good all rounder!

Lets see though!


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## erjlphoto (Jan 27, 2015)

Canon Rumors said:


> <p class="p1">...
> <li class="p1">The two high megapixel cameras, with and without an AA filter. Resolution is said to be 53mp (though the pixel count is not CR3)</li>



Alas, hopefully....the Sony the "One and Only" zealots can choke on this new Canon sensor!!!

Then again, maybe not ;D


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## Lee Jay (Jan 27, 2015)

3kramd5 said:


> Lee Jay said:
> 
> 
> > vrpanorama said:
> ...



None of them make a dual pixel sensor that I know of.


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## Maiaibing (Jan 27, 2015)

CP+ announcement and March availability = what I have been expecting (& hoping) all along. So from a biased point of view I have to say it sounds both great and likely. If Canon gets the specs right I'll even preorder mine.

Better than X-mas...


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## PureClassA (Jan 27, 2015)

Maiaibing said:


> CP+ announcement and March availability = what I have been expecting (& hoping) all along. So from a biased point of view I have to say it sounds both great and likely. If Canon gets the specs right I'll even preorder mine.
> 
> Better than X-mas...



Amen!!!


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## 9VIII (Jan 27, 2015)

A 4K screen is probably going to look almost as good as a full resolution print with a 20 megapixel body. 
In 10 years or so when we have 8K televisions, you'll be glad that people were using 50 megapixel cameras to take pictures.


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## Famateur (Jan 27, 2015)

I'm excited by the CR3 of the upcoming announcement. This makes sense, given that 5DIII prices have been getting pretty low, both grey market and authorized bundles/rebates. The 6D bundles have been looking good, too.

I won't be in the market for any of these new bodies, but I'm hoping it pushes the prices of the current generation down even further...

I'm expecting a scaled-up 7DII sensor...gasp...and that wouldn't disappoint me. :-X

Can't wait to see what Canon does!


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## EchoLocation (Jan 27, 2015)

is the m3 going to be sold in the US? if not, I will definitely not be purchasing it as it seems like a bad sign for the system as a whole.
If it isn't released in the US, I'd see it as a stop gap to continue the M line until they decide to make a more viable FF/APS-C mirrorless system in the future.


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## K-amps (Jan 27, 2015)

Don't care who makes the 50mp sensor as long as it does not have ugly banding in the shadows. I'd be ok with 22mp without the OLPF if it was ISO invariant like some of the newer sensors. I am tied to the Canon system, I like it, I love their lenses.... but am sick of having them use 6 year old sensors in their FF line.... when every Tom, Dick and Harry has shown us what is possible with their redesigns. Why is Canon taking this lying down. This is not something you brush under the carpet, almost every tech discussion around Camera bodies involves the DReaded topic.... it's not going away boys.... Canon may be happy with their Rebel sales, but causing angst to their loyal enthusiasts is not very Business Savvy since the pros and enthusiasts are what boost their operating margins more.

I don't shoot video, DPAF is not an innovation that get me very excited. Am looking forward to leaf or Global shutters, AF that locks on the eyes for portraits, AE linked to AF point... and non-Bayer sensors; I don't care if it comes in a 1D body.... please give us stills shooters something to be excited about....


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## drmikeinpdx (Jan 27, 2015)

Nothing of any great interest for me, but it might be fun to see what they do in the mirrorless product line. I really want to try a mirrorless as my next serious camera; if I could use my Canon lenses without an adapter, that would be something to consider, possibly.


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## JimKarczewski (Jan 27, 2015)

I'd love the 11-24 but not for that price. MAYBE if it was a 2.8, otherwise I'd just go the road most people do wanting a superwide shooting landscapes and pick up a Nikon 14-24 which you can buy new for $2k and used for about $1600. Why would I pay $3k for an f4 lens? Just doesn't make sense to me.


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## Hannes (Jan 27, 2015)

JimKarczewski said:


> I'd love the 11-24 but not for that price. MAYBE if it was a 2.8, otherwise I'd just go the road most people do wanting a superwide shooting landscapes and pick up a Nikon 14-24 which you can buy new for $2k and used for about $1600. Why would I pay $3k for an f4 lens? Just doesn't make sense to me.



Because you get 11mm which is much wider than 14?


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## Diltiazem (Jan 27, 2015)

There is a catch.

*(though the pixel count is not CR3)*


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## Maiaibing (Jan 27, 2015)

K-amps said:


> Am looking forward to leaf or Global shutters, AF that locks on the eyes for portraits, AE linked to AF point...



I expect a lot of such upgrades will be on the new 5DIV (or whatever the name will be). During the last 3 years the competition has really moved here - Canon less so. However, Canon can do a lot more with a high end body than they did with 70D/7DII. 

Have to believe they are going all out to regain the high ground.


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## Maiaibing (Jan 27, 2015)

Diltiazem said:


> There is a catch.
> *(though the pixel count is not CR3)*



Not really. Its high mpix = at the very, very least 36 mpix. Cannot believe Canon would continue to talk about their customer's need & want of a new "high mpix" camera "soon" and turn up with 28 mpix in two different bodies!


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## Tugela (Jan 27, 2015)

Perhaps they are going to release the new revolutionary full frame one pixel camera for the highest ISO performance in the land.


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## AvTvM (Jan 27, 2015)

Tugela said:


> Perhaps they are going to release the new revolutionary full frame one pixel camera for the highest ISO performance in the land.



hehe ... and 99 stops of DR ;D


Unfortunately, Canon seems to be mostly out of tune with what I would like to buy from them. :

Of all these rumored new products only the EOS-M3 is of any - potential - interest to me. IF it is fully competitive with Sony A6000 [or upcoming Sony A7000!] on all counts and not more expensive. So, better sensor, top-notch EVF, WiFi and RT-flash commander built-in and really decent AF-performance ... don't care what Canon will use ... DPAF, CD-AF, Hybrid on-senor PD+CD-AF or anything else ... it just needs to hit fast, precisely and be tracking-capable, including young kids.  
I'd definitely buy such an EOS "M3 Pro"... since I already own all those small, sharp, cheap, carry anywhere EF-M lenses. 

DSLRs .. not really interested. Not interested in yet another Rebel [750D] nor in 6-year old APS-C sensor tech running @10+ fps [7D II] nor in new 50 MP sensor [rumored new FF bodies] nor in a 11-24 f/4 lens @ € 3,000 or more. If at all, I'd be interested in a 5D IV that is a true D810 competitor ... a universal beast with 28-36 MP sensor with lots of DR, low noise at all ISOs, including clean ISO 6400, no banding, 6 fps ... at current 5D III prices. 

But I'd be really interested in a Canon FF MILC system, fully competitive with the [upcoming] Sony "A7R II / A9". 28-36 MP FF sensor, really good AF system, and Canon user interface and non-compressed or "cooked" RAWs ... plus a range of compact, good, non-expensive native Canon mirrorless lenses [similar to the EF-M lenses, but for FF] plus adapter for existing EF glass. 

Well, so far Canon does not seem to have gotten my message yet.


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## Synkka (Jan 27, 2015)

Looks very interesting. While I am probably not in the market for any of these featured products, their release will be quite interesting as it gives a good indication of where Canon see the market going.
The 11-24 I find very interesting as this i think is Canon's strongest aspect, really pushing lens design.


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## Ivan Muller (Jan 27, 2015)

I have been very keen to get a new 7D but maybe I will wait a while to see these new offerings first! M3 could be the one if it has a evf and 7d2 sensor.....


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## NorbR (Jan 27, 2015)

Interesting ... 

Not necessarily things that will make me break the bank, although I'll take a long hard look at the M3 if it turns out to bring new features to the M line. But I'm definitely interested to hear about all of those, especially the big MP cameras. 

What surprises me the most is the idea that all these announcements would come together ... Is it common for Canon to release several major products like these all together? Because these all do feel like major announcements, first high MP cameras, first rectilinear lens to 11mm, the Rebel which is always their biggest seller, the M3 ... arguably lower profile, but still an important step for the future of the line. It feels like each of those would make a big enough splash if they were announced on their own, I'd be somewhat surprised to see them all announced together (or close to each other) at the risk of stealing each other's thunder ...


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## rs (Jan 27, 2015)

dilbert said:


> I'm not going to buy a new DSLR from Canon (or Sony!) - regardless of how good the sample images are - until it's been tested and evaluated by DxO.



Sony make DSLR's?


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## JohanCruyff (Jan 27, 2015)

Lee Jay said:


> fotoray said:
> 
> 
> > That's a lot of new and diverse stuff. Something for everybody!
> ...


 
+1
I can't justify spending as much as 3K for a new body, but 6DII could be right for me.
The good news is that:
- 5DIII was announced on 2 March 2012
- 6D was announced on 12 September 2012
So maybe we can expect to see a new set of Canon's Full Frame in six months, including 6D.

PS 1DX was announced on 18 October 2011, but that's another story.


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## wunderpink (Jan 27, 2015)

Since canon eventually introduced a proper auto ISO function for M and Av in the 7D II we can expect the new FF bodies will also get it. Nikon already had it in the D800.

With the 5D III and 6D Canon at least introduced "minimum shutter speed in Av + auto ISO". This is a simple but very powerful feature not existing in older FF bodies. Before this function was availible, the shutter speed choosen by the camera was 1/focal length. This deprecated rule is just not valid for high megapixel cameras like the 5D II.

However I do not understand why they didn't allow the user to alternatively set the factor between focal length and shutter speed. This is so useful for zoom lenses and non-moving subjects. They also did not implement exposure compensation in M with auto ISO. This would just make so much sense. I always envied the Nikon shooters for having both features implemented nicely in the D800 . Now the 7D II has it! So I hope the "5D whatever" will also have it.

I my opinion the "auto ISO + min shutter speed in Av" feature is so powerful that it would really make sense to enable the user to set the min shutter speed via a dial on the camera (similar to setting the iso value). This would be easy to implement but would give big improvement for many photographers.


----------



## pedro (Jan 27, 2015)

tron said:


> I am not interested in a 50+ Mp camera. But any news = good news because it means something is going on.
> 
> *So I guess no more than a year for 5DMkIV (similar Mp, higher DR, less Low and High ISO noise, just hoping... )*
> 
> Now the new lens is interesting...



*Plus one on that,* although my 5DIII still rocks. Hope Canon remain with more or less the same MP count plus innovative sensor tech noise wise. I will keep to the 5DIII for quite some time anyway, but it will be good to know about any improvements high ISO IQ wise.


----------



## 1Zach1 (Jan 27, 2015)

Well here is to hoping the M3 is a similar size to the current M but with updated internals including an intervalometer and an EVF.


----------



## Invertalon (Jan 27, 2015)

I will be so happy Canon will release some high MP bodies so people can stop talking about the resolution of the D800 so much...  ;D

Not sure how interested I will be, it highly depends on the low light ability (high ISO). I would take sub-30 over 50+ MP any day, IF that meant cleaner high ISO. So we will see how Canon does with it!

I am guessing if they do release two bodies, one will be a replacement for the current 5D3 with lower MP, higher FPS, etc... With another 5D model for studio/landscape... 50+ MP, Low FPS, no AA filter due to the 50+ MP, etc.. 

Just my guess!

And about the 11-24, I really would love it but the price will be hard to swallow at anything around $3K. It needs to be priced no higher than $2500ish, dropping to $2K or less after a few months... Especially for f/4. Yeah I know it can do 11mm, but still.


----------



## Lee Jay (Jan 27, 2015)

dilbert said:


> People are going to argue black and blue that I'm wrong for doing this, but I'm not going to buy a new DSLR from Canon (or Sony!) - regardless of how good the sample images are - until it's been tested and evaluated by DxO.
> 
> Why?
> 
> ...



I've recently found many of their measurements to be self inconsistent (different QE at different ISOs) and thus clearly wrong. Some of them are different by a factor of two! Unless you're going to analyze their data very carefully, I'd just ignore them.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Jan 27, 2015)

Maiaibing said:


> Have to believe they are going all out to *regain* the high ground.



Regain? They haven't lost it.


----------



## Don Haines (Jan 27, 2015)

AvTvM said:


> Tugela said:
> 
> 
> > Perhaps they are going to release the new revolutionary full frame one pixel camera for the highest ISO performance in the land.
> ...



actually, it would only be 38 stops of DR


----------



## neuroanatomist (Jan 27, 2015)

The M3 could be interesting for me, depends on the specs. Possibly the 11-24/4 at some point, too.


----------



## Don Haines (Jan 27, 2015)

JohanCruyff said:


> I can't justify spending as much as 3K for a new body, but 6DII could be right for me.
> The good news is that:
> - 5DIII was announced on 2 March 2012
> - 6D was announced on 12 September 2012
> ...


The speculation is that they are shutting down the 500nm fabrication line. For that to happen, they will have to replace the entire FF lineup and most of the rebels... It could very well mean that this is the tip of the iceberg....


----------



## Lee Jay (Jan 27, 2015)

dilbert said:


> Lee Jay said:
> 
> 
> > dilbert said:
> ...



No need. It can't change. To change it would require changing the physical structure of the sensor.


----------



## StudentOfLight (Jan 27, 2015)

Don Haines said:


> AvTvM said:
> 
> 
> > Tugela said:
> ...


It must have a really good anti-aliasing filter.

To be honest, on the dynamic range issue, I think 38 stops is far more workable than 99. If you take a picture with 99 stops of dynamic range it would be hard to see anything but grey,especially when you only have one pixel.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Jan 27, 2015)

Lee Jay said:


> dilbert said:
> 
> 
> > And have you run your own tests to show that the QE is the same at all ISOs for those very same cameras?
> ...



Trying to explain technical facts to dilbert?


----------



## PLIV1974 (Jan 27, 2015)

Just saw an announcement that Sony may launch an A7 also with around 50mp, sometime ago there was rumors that CANON could use Sony sensors, so i am wondering if CANON is not going to Sony sensors. 

This would be a change, because they developped the dual pixels technology, but would they be able to have such technology in a 50MP sensor that they don't produce? Is it feasible?

The Sony sensors are performing well in Nikon and Sony DSLR, so personally i don't care if it happens to be true...

I would love to know how frames/sec, this new 5D will be able to shoot, this is my main interrest for bird watching, otherwise i will stick to my 7DMk2.


----------



## Triggyman (Jan 27, 2015)

tyger11 said:


> Triggyman said:
> 
> 
> > I'm very much interested for the next Rebel, and the M3.
> ...



Yep I had the M for a month and it fit my needs (did not like its color though, it was white). I gave it to my cousin because she liked it very much. It was the $299 kit with the flash and 16-55.


----------



## PurMar (Jan 27, 2015)

After skipping 5D M3 I have been waiting long time to replace my aging 5DM2. I hope Canon does something great given lately I have been rather disappointed. I have been in the Canon camp for 20+ years and never considered looking elsewhere. Though with increasing competition there are some good choices. I may even consider Sony - a company I very much disliked just a few years ago. 
I hope that the recent blocking of Magic Lantern on 5D M3 is to disable ML extra features that may be available on the (hopefully) soon to be announced cameras, forcing users to update. 
While I don't really care for 50mp images (I see a little need for that plus not sure how my computer would handle that) I do want 4K, some kind of wireless transfer, better shots in low light (have you seen the Sony made video (on vimeo) shot at moonlight?), and many other features. 
Fingers crossed...


----------



## 3kramd5 (Jan 27, 2015)

Lee Jay said:


> 3kramd5 said:
> 
> 
> > Lee Jay said:
> ...



Fair enough.

Personally, in a camera like this, I'd put higher priority on the noise and signal chain characteristics than whether it can do phase detect with the sensor (particularly since I would likely often pair it with MF lenses)


----------



## Jack Douglas (Jan 27, 2015)

wunderpink said:


> Since canon eventually introduced a proper auto ISO function for M and Av in the 7D II we can expect the new FF bodies will also get it. Nikon already had it in the D800.
> 
> With the 5D III and 6D Canon at least introduced "minimum shutter speed in Av + auto ISO". This is a simple but very powerful feature not existing in older FF bodies. Before this function was availible, the shutter speed choosen by the camera was 1/focal length. This deprecated rule is just not valid for high megapixel cameras like the 5D II.
> 
> ...



Agreed.

Jack


----------



## lw (Jan 27, 2015)

NorbR said:


> What surprises me the most is the idea that all these announcements would come together ... Is it common for Canon to release several major products like these all together? Because these all do feel like major announcements, first high MP cameras, first rectilinear lens to 11mm, the Rebel which is always their biggest seller, the M3 ... arguably lower profile, but still an important step for the future of the line. It feels like each of those would make a big enough splash if they were announced on their own, I'd be somewhat surprised to see them all announced together (or close to each other) at the risk of stealing each other's thunder ...



Perhaps they are not separate announcements.

Perhaps it is a 53mp M3 with a 11-24 F4 kit lens ;D


----------



## Luds34 (Jan 27, 2015)

Lot of exciting stuff coming out. I think the only thing I might be personally interested in is the M3. Fingers crossed that it is a bit more high end, more like a Fuji X series. EVF and faster focus would go a long way in making it more of an enthusiast's camera.

No interest personally, but very interested to see the new Rebel as those leaked images showed Canon making a big departure from their current Rebel design which has been the same for many years.

High MP, again mostly interested just to see the new tech.

I echo a few others here that I believe we will see a new 5D and/or 6D yet this calendar year as well. I'm expecting a new 20 something MP sensor and will be very curious to see the performance increase there. I'd be interested in a new 6D if they removed some of the crippling features of the current one (slow flash sync, poor focus system, 1/4000 max shutter, etc).


----------



## mackguyver (Jan 27, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> The M3 could be interesting for me, depends on the specs. Possibly the 11-24/4 at some point, too.


I agree about the M3, especially if it's like this one:
http://www.dcfever.com/trading/view.php?itemID=2778059
It would be a great match for my imported 11-22, but I wonder if it will even be sold in the US:

The 11-24 f/4 is on my purchase list for the year.


----------



## Don Haines (Jan 27, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> Lee Jay said:
> 
> 
> > dilbert said:
> ...


Is this like the lenses that change their optical properties when you move them between crop and FF?


----------



## Dylan777 (Jan 27, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> The M3 could be interesting for me, depends on the specs. Possibly the 11-24/4 at some point, too.



To me, M3 needs decent AF speed, EVF and of course few more native small primes. 

The *MOST* important factor for Canon to gain ground in mirrorless world is EF adapter to mirrorless. If they can come up with adapter with decent AF speed, better than current ones on the market, I think that will give Sony, Fuji etc... good run.


----------



## Don Haines (Jan 27, 2015)

mackguyver said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > The M3 could be interesting for me, depends on the specs. Possibly the 11-24/4 at some point, too.
> ...


I need a decent camera that is easy to take in the kayak.... the M3, particularly like in the link and with an 18-200 M zoom would be hard to pass up....


----------



## Dylan777 (Jan 27, 2015)

mackguyver said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > The M3 could be interesting for me, depends on the specs. Possibly the 11-24/4 at some point, too.
> ...



Wow....looks good


----------



## raptor3x (Jan 27, 2015)

Don Haines said:


> mackguyver said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...



I would have thought weather sealing would be a huge requirement for kayaking. It seems like an E-M1 or E-M5 would be the obvious choice for that role.


----------



## bcflood (Jan 27, 2015)

I am curious if there will be two Rebels, like previously predicted, or just one. I rather liked the idea of a "Rebel Plus" that had some fancier features on it but was still cheaper than a 70D. Guess all will be revealed next week! ;D


----------



## Bob Howland (Jan 27, 2015)

Dylan777 said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > The M3 could be interesting for me, depends on the specs. Possibly the 11-24/4 at some point, too.
> ...


You want primes, the next poster wants an 18-200, presumably native, and I'd like a tiny native 15-85. Which do you think is going to come first? I'm not sure but my guess is the primes come last. In the age of extremely high quality zooms, prime lenses are so esoteric that they are positively elitist.

I agree that an EF-to-M adaptor plus a speed booster are essential. Otherwise, Canon can't leverage their large lens lineups and, if MILCs replace DSLRs in the next 5 years or so, Canon will find themselves years behind Sony, Fuji, Panasonic, Olympus and Samsung. Canon can't afford to take that risk.


----------



## mackguyver (Jan 27, 2015)

Bob Howland said:


> In the age of extremely high quality zooms, prime lenses are so esoteric that they are positively elitist.


Yes, the 50 f/1.8 is certainly an elitist and esoteric lens ;D


----------



## Dylan777 (Jan 27, 2015)

Bob Howland said:


> Dylan777 said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...



I agree with you about today zoom lenses.

However, fast(f2ish) and compact primes are always welcome for those low light shots. Not only that, it keeps the mirrorless system as compact as possible.


----------



## PureClassA (Jan 27, 2015)

Well, I always pop the cork on a bottle of Champagne when I attach the Sigma 50.... so there


----------



## lw (Jan 27, 2015)

Dylan777 said:


> The *MOST* important factor for Canon to gain ground in mirrorless world is EF adapter to mirrorless. If they can come up with adapter with decent AF speed, better than current ones on the market, I think that will give Sony, Fuji etc... good run.



Enlighten me on why they need an (EF adaptor to mirrorless) "adaptor to mirrorless with decent AF speed"?

In what way does the current EF-EOS M Mount Adaptor affect "AF speed"? And how would you improve it? 

Or are you talking about some other adaptor?


----------



## domg13 (Jan 27, 2015)

What ever happened to the rumor of new high-resolution lenses to go along with the new high-MP cameras? Are these not expected to also be announced next week?


----------



## wsmith96 (Jan 27, 2015)

mackguyver said:


> Bob Howland said:
> 
> 
> > In the age of extremely high quality zooms, prime lenses are so esoteric that they are positively elitist.
> ...


I always look down at zoom users when I use my 50 1.8 : : : : (pay no attention to my signature)

;D


----------



## neuroanatomist (Jan 27, 2015)

domg13 said:


> What ever happened to the rumor of new high-resolution lenses to go along with the new high-MP cameras? Are these not expected to also be announced next week?



Perhaps you missed the 70-200 II, 24-70 II, etc.?

Lens resolution isn't going to be a limiting factor in most cases. Technique will be limiting for some, until they realize it takes some changes to maximize the output from a higher MP sensor.


----------



## Perio (Jan 27, 2015)

I'm sure whatever Canon releases will be of a great quality, and specs will at least match best offerings from Nikon and Sony. I just hope that Canon makes the price more comparable to that of Nikon and Sony offerings. Otherwise, unfortunately I won't be able to pay premium for a new Canon body  Please please Canon, don't announce a $3500-4000 high-MP camera.


----------



## wsmith96 (Jan 27, 2015)

Do any of you think that there is a change of a 6D style camera with the 70D focus system and maybe an articulated screen this year?


----------



## jeffa4444 (Jan 27, 2015)

Seeing as were speculating and given both the 5dMKIII and 6d were launched in the same year six months apart could well be their replacements that are coming.
Aside from high MP, wider DR and more detailed colorimagery would be a boon. One aimed at Sports / Wildlife / Fashion the other aimed at Travel / Landscape, both rugged & weather sealed. 

61 point or more AF for the Sports / Wildlife / Fashion all cross type, 35 or more for Travel / Landscape again all cross-type. The travel camera would be smaller & lighter but like the Sport camera have two card slots and they would both use the same batteries. For the first time Canon should offer tiltable screens at least (similar to Olympus OM-D E-M5), both should have wi-fi and the travel camera GPS.


----------



## gsealy (Jan 27, 2015)

Perio said:


> I'm sure whatever Canon releases will be of a great quality, and specs will at least match best offerings from Nikon and Sony. I just hope that Canon makes the price more comparable to that of Nikon and Sony offerings. Otherwise, unfortunately I won't be able to pay premium for a new Canon body  Please please Canon, don't announce a $3500-4000 high-MP camera.


My guess is that is exactly what we are going to get, somewhere around $4K.


----------



## Dylan777 (Jan 27, 2015)

lw said:


> Dylan777 said:
> 
> 
> > The *MOST* important factor for Canon to gain ground in mirrorless world is EF adapter to mirrorless. If they can come up with adapter with decent AF speed, better than current ones on the market, I think that will give Sony, Fuji etc... good run.
> ...



EF-M lenses were designed to mount to EOS-M directly, no adaptor needed. 

For Canon shooters, standard EF and *L* lenses are as good as gold. These lenses can still be used with EOS-M system with an adaptor, however, AF speed becomes slower.

“how would you improve it?” - I leave that to Canon.


----------



## PureClassA (Jan 27, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> domg13 said:
> 
> 
> > What ever happened to the rumor of new high-resolution lenses to go along with the new high-MP cameras? Are these not expected to also be announced next week?
> ...



Don't forget the 16-35 f4 and though not quite as superb, the new 100-400 is no slouch. Don't they all have "8k Digital Ready" on the side to designate their internal 50MP glass which bypass the camera's sensor altogether anyway?  Can we put this "There's no glass" issue to bed already? Show me the Nikon made glass that fully resolves 36MP on a D810.


----------



## domg13 (Jan 27, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> domg13 said:
> 
> 
> > What ever happened to the rumor of new high-resolution lenses to go along with the new high-MP cameras? Are these not expected to also be announced next week?
> ...



I agree lens resolution isn't going to be a limiting factor. I'm just wondering about this quote and if there will be any mention of it next week:

"We are extending interchangeable lens groups. We want to add one line to our EF lenses…I can’t say any more than this."


----------



## Luds34 (Jan 27, 2015)

Dylan777 said:


> Bob Howland said:
> 
> 
> > Dylan777 said:
> ...



Agree. IF one of the advantages to mirrorless is size, good primes (including a few key pancakes are key). Take a look at an of the FF Sony's. Once you pop on a good size zoom the size advantage over a DSLR has been negated.

I like the idea of a big camera, DSLR ergonomics for the days/time I want to be a photographer. I like the idea of a compact mirrorless system for all the other times I'm doing something non photography dedicated, but want to be able to capture shots, moments, experiences as they present themselves.


----------



## Luds34 (Jan 27, 2015)

wsmith96 said:


> Do any of you think that there is a change of a 6D style camera with the 70D focus system and maybe an articulated screen this year?



I don't know if there is... but put me in the camp that is hoping for one.


----------



## PureClassA (Jan 27, 2015)

jeffa4444 said:


> Seeing as were speculating and given both the 5dMKIII and 6d were launched in the same year six months apart could well be their replacements that are coming.
> Aside from high MP, wider DR and more detailed colorimagery would be a boon. One aimed at Sports / Wildlife / Fashion the other aimed at Travel / Landscape, both rugged & weather sealed.
> 
> 61 point or more AF for the Sports / Wildlife / Fashion all cross type, 35 or more for Travel / Landscape again all cross-type. The travel camera would be smaller & lighter but like the Sport camera have two card slots and they would both use the same batteries. For the first time Canon should offer tiltable screens at least (similar to Olympus OM-D E-M5), both should have wi-fi and the travel camera GPS.



5 series will be your pixel monster for portraiture and landscapes etc... They aren't going to also make it make into a 1 series for speed. There will be a new 1 series for that this year I'm betting. That's the oldest of the 3 FF bodies. The 6D being the youngest I would assume will get a modest step in MP if any, but more importantly add more and better AF (maybe 20 something cross and a few dual cross) and perhaps an extra FPS. Not sure they put DPAF in it. I'm thinking the new 6D becomes (more or less) the feature set of the current 5D3 because not everyone wants 50MP. I'd be just fine if they left the sensor alone and improved a few other issues.


----------



## unfocused (Jan 27, 2015)

dilbert said:


> People are going to argue black and blue that I'm wrong for doing this, but I'm not going to buy a new DSLR from Canon (or Sony!) - regardless of how good the sample images are - until it's been tested and evaluated by DxO.
> 
> Why?
> 
> ...



This makes perfect sense *if* the criteria you seek in a camera is exactly the criteria DxO measures and you assign exactly the same relative weight to that criteria that DxO does. 

This is true with any test. Tests can objectively measure specific criteria, but the determination of which criteria to measure and how to assign meaning to that measure varies wildly, always requires subjective judgement and does not necessarily reflect an individual's needs.

That you have found a testing lab that measures exactly what you consider to be the most important factors is great for you. Many others don't feel that way. Rather, many feel that the criteria DxO uses to select what measurements it takes do not reflect their needs, desires or even experience.


----------



## NYCPHOTO (Jan 27, 2015)

I just got a reconditioned 16-35 f4 thru canon and sent it back....wanting to compare and contrast the quality of the 11-24 and tamron 15-30 before committing to any of them.

BTW - I have a older canon 17-35 f2.8 and while the 16-35 was definitely sharper...I was more wowed by the IS of the 16-35...had me shooting sharp at 1/5 sec handheld.


----------



## rrcphoto (Jan 27, 2015)

Perio said:


> I'm sure whatever Canon releases will be of a great quality, and specs will at least match best offerings from Nikon and Sony. I just hope that Canon makes the price more comparable to that of Nikon and Sony offerings. Otherwise, unfortunately I won't be able to pay premium for a new Canon body  Please please Canon, don't announce a $3500-4000 high-MP camera.



D810 is 3300 USD - i doubt it will come any cheaper than that. the good news with the declining Yen, canon has more flexibility (I hope).


----------



## PureClassA (Jan 27, 2015)

NYCPHOTO said:


> I just got a reconditioned 16-35 f4 thru canon and sent it back....wanting to compare and contrast the quality of the 11-24 and tamron 15-30 before committing to any of them.
> 
> BTW - I have a older canon 17-35 f2.8 and while the 16-35 was definitely sharper...I was more wowed by the IS of the 16-35...had me shooting sharp at 1/5 sec handheld.



I took several night shots in Disney a few months ago with the 16-35 and swore even with IS tehre was no freakin way I got it clean.... I was stunned when I got them into lightroom. Amazing piece of glass that one is.. Too bad it won't resolve on a 50MP sensor : (pure sarcasm)


----------



## rrcphoto (Jan 27, 2015)

domg13 said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > domg13 said:
> ...



could be one of the following though;

- APO full frame primes (20,24, 28,35,50,85,100)
- EF-S "L" grade worthy lens lineup (for the 7DII and high end APS-C bodies)
- EF STM consumer grade full frame lineup

I'm leaning to the cheaper EF STM lineup personally.


----------



## Don Haines (Jan 27, 2015)

Dylan777 said:


> lw said:
> 
> 
> > Dylan777 said:
> ...


I think DPAF would allow significant improvements in speed... Of course, the 1 series cameras have a higher battery voltage and as long as the EOS-M sticks to 7.2V, even with the best of AF systems on an EOS-M, the 1 Series at 11.1 volts allows 2.4 times the power to the AF motors (some lenses) and that gives much quicker movement of the elements.


----------



## nostrovia (Jan 27, 2015)

wsmith96 said:


> Do any of you think that there is a change of a 6D style camera with the 70D focus system and maybe an articulated screen this year?



That is what I am holding out hope for! I really like my 70D, but would love a FF companion.


----------



## npherno (Jan 27, 2015)

Perio said:


> I'm sure whatever Canon releases will be of a great quality, and specs will at least match best offerings from Nikon and Sony. I just hope that Canon makes the price more comparable to that of Nikon and Sony offerings. Otherwise, unfortunately I won't be able to pay premium for a new Canon body  Please please Canon, don't announce a $3500-4000 high-MP camera.



I'm also quite sure we wont be getting a bargain like they pulled off with the 7dII. At $4000, at this point in time, I expect to be wowed. Anything less I don't think will silence the Canon critics.

I also think that despite native Sony lens prices, the relatively inexpensive A7/A7II series delivers serious bang for the buck, IMO. This new camera from Canon will be telling to many people.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Jan 27, 2015)

Dylan777 said:


> EF-M lenses were designed to mount to EOS-M directly, no adaptor needed.
> 
> For Canon shooters, standard EF and *L* lenses are as good as gold. These lenses can still be used with EOS-M system with an adaptor, however, AF speed becomes slower.



The EOS M doesn't have a dedicated PDAF sensor, and it doesn't focus as fast as a dSLR. Compare AF speed with live view vs. PDAF on your dSLR (using Live AF, not Quick AF which uses the PDAF sensor...and note that it's even called Quick AF to differentiate it!) - that's why the M is slower. Even the 70D with on-CMOS DPAF focuses faster using the dedicated PDAF sensor. 

AFAIK, the adapter has nothing to do with it. The native M lenses are also all STM, which is slower than USM. When I mount a fast-focusing L-series lens with ring USM (24-70 II, 70-200 II) on the EOS M via the Canon adapter, it focuses faster than my M22/2 or M18-55...have you had a different experience?


----------



## Famateur (Jan 27, 2015)

wsmith96 said:


> Do any of you think that there is a change of a 6D style camera with the 70D focus system and maybe an articulated screen this year?



I hope! If Canon released a full frame version of the 70D as the 6DII, I'd be doing the happy dance...


----------



## mackguyver (Jan 27, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> Dylan777 said:
> 
> 
> > EF-M lenses were designed to mount to EOS-M directly, no adaptor needed.
> ...


I don't have the adapter, but I know that Sony's adapter which costs a lot more, has PDAF built into it, which is pretty cool. I think I read some review that says it works quite well, though not as fast as a dedicated DSLR.


----------



## Bob Howland (Jan 27, 2015)

Luds34 said:


> I like the idea of a compact mirrorless system for all the other times I'm doing something non photography dedicated, but want to be able to capture shots, moments, experiences as they present themselves.



+1. After buying my 5D3, my G10 no longer is good enough for that purpose, especially above ISO400. I've taken to using my 5D3 with the battery pack removed (Try that with a 1Dx.), latest model 28-300 Tamron zoom and 270EX, but that's still too heavy.


----------



## CaptureWhatYouSee (Jan 27, 2015)

jeffa4444 said:


> Seeing as were speculating and given both the 5dMKIII and 6d were launched in the same year six months apart could well be their replacements that are coming.
> Aside from high MP, wider DR and more detailed colorimagery would be a boon. One aimed at Sports / Wildlife / Fashion the other aimed at Travel / Landscape, both rugged & weather sealed.
> 
> 61 point or more AF for the Sports / Wildlife / Fashion all cross type, 35 or more for Travel / Landscape again all cross-type. The travel camera would be smaller & lighter but like the Sport camera have two card slots and they would both use the same batteries. For the first time Canon should offer tiltable screens at least (similar to Olympus OM-D E-M5), both should have wi-fi and the travel camera GPS.



Prescient. I hope.


----------



## Dylan777 (Jan 27, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> Dylan777 said:
> 
> 
> > EF-M lenses were designed to mount to EOS-M directly, no adaptor needed.
> ...



Yes, with 70-200 f2.8 IS II without going from 70 to 200. Bare m22 on seems to be much quicker.


----------



## dcm (Jan 27, 2015)

lw said:


> Dylan777 said:
> 
> 
> > The *MOST* important factor for Canon to gain ground in mirrorless world is EF adapter to mirrorless. If they can come up with adapter with decent AF speed, better than current ones on the market, I think that will give Sony, Fuji etc... good run.
> ...



I think it's more about the M than the adapter. 

Seem to remember previous discussions on AF speed point to a few contributing factors: sensor, algorithm and the battery voltage. Higher battery voltage increases AF motor speeds so even with the same focus algorithm and sensor, the 1DX will always focus significantly faster than the others while the 5D/6D might focus slightly faster than the Rebels or M.

1DX - lp-e4n 11.1v 2450mAH
5D/6D/... - lp-e6 7.4v 1800mAH
Rebel - lp-e8 7.2v 1120mAH
M/SL1 - lp-e12 7.2v 875mAH

In my experience the M Live View focusing is faster than Live View on my other bodies (6D/550D), but that may not hold for the newest bodies with DPAF. Live View/contrast detect may still be no match for phase detect, but on an M that's all you have. Still, it would be nice to have a faster AF on the M in genral.


----------



## rrcphoto (Jan 27, 2015)

dcm said:


> lw said:
> 
> 
> > Dylan777 said:
> ...



someone in the ML land commented that the M has a higher LV framerate than other canon DLSR's - suggesting that may be the reason it's increased in speed.

I find the M on single point, one shot AF to be perfectly fine. AI servo is horrid and it's pretty painful with the 22mm EF-M

11-22mm is pretty much instantaneous though.


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 27, 2015)

Dylan777 said:


> Yes, with 70-200 f2.8 IS II without going from 70 to 200. Bare m22 on seems to be much quicker.



Interesting. The M22/2 is rather slow; for me the M18-55 is faster, the adapted 24-70/2.8 II is faster still.


----------



## IgotGASbadDude (Jan 27, 2015)

Bob Howland said:


> +1. I've taken to using my 5D3 with the battery pack removed (Try that with a 1Dx.)



This is exactly why I have acquired both 8) It was either that, or take a hacksaw to the 1dx :


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## lw (Jan 27, 2015)

Dylan777 said:


> lw said:
> 
> 
> > Dylan777 said:
> ...



The _adaptor _doesn't make AF slower though does it?
It is the EOS M body that has slower AF. All the adaptor does is pass through the signals, doesn't it? It is just electrical contacts.
I can already put my EF and EF-S lenses on my EOS M. I don't need a new adaptor for that.
What I need is a new EOS M AF system that focuses them quicker. 

I will repeat, in what way does the current EF-EOS M Mount Adaptor affect "AF speed"? (I am actually interested to know, as I am not aware of it. Not keen on having to buy another adaptor as well as a new M!)


----------



## mackguyver (Jan 27, 2015)

IgotGASbadDude said:


> Bob Howland said:
> 
> 
> > +1. I've taken to using my 5D3 with the battery pack removed (Try that with a 1Dx.)
> ...


+1 and why I sold my battery grip when I bought the 1D X. No regrets.


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## jeffa4444 (Jan 27, 2015)

If we see a 50+ MP sensor in a Canon professional camera it will be interesting to see how older lenses still in manufacture hold-up. Higher resolution lenses properly corrected for chromatic abberations & color fringing will be expensive to make, so expensive that for many they will not be affordable its not just the glass but the mechanical tolerance to make that glass work optimally all the time.


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## Luds34 (Jan 27, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> Dylan777 said:
> 
> 
> > EF-M lenses were designed to mount to EOS-M directly, no adaptor needed.
> ...



This has been my experience with the M as well. I don't feel the adapter makes anything slower. It's all canon hardware, electronics, should be virtually the same experience.

I've mounted The EF-S 60mm the most, but have used EF 28mm f/1.8, 85 f/1.8, and a handful others on rare occasion. The lens USM focus system responds/moves just as fast as mounted to my DSLRs. However, locking focus is not always achieved as quickly, but that is attributed to the "T4i Live View" sensor and not to the lens/adapter, etc.

In short, the lenses respond just as quickly, the M is just slower to lock focus camera vs the dedicated PD systems in the DSLR.

Side note agreement, the STM in the 22mm pancake is slow. Even the EF-M 18-55 is noticeably faster.


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 27, 2015)

IgotGASbadDude said:


> Bob Howland said:
> 
> 
> > +1. I've taken to using my 5D3 with the battery pack removed (Try that with a 1Dx.)
> ...



For me, if the 1D X is too big, so is a non-gripped body. That's where the EOS M comes in, it has a great sensor size to camera size ratio, and it serves as a backup camera for travel.


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## Dylan777 (Jan 27, 2015)

lw said:


> Dylan777 said:
> 
> 
> > lw said:
> ...



We all know current EOS-M AF speed is not the best in mirrorless world, so, let's skip that for moment.

The EF-M lens adapter kit not only provides electrical contact, it also provide proper fitting between the EF and EF-S lenses to the eos-m.

I've tried 70-200 f2.8 IS II + adapter on eos-m Vs native 22mm. AF speed is not the same. Why? I can't tell you.

Neuro confirmed his adapter + L lenses is faster then native 22mm. Maybe, other members can give their feedbacks.


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## Luds34 (Jan 27, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> Dylan777 said:
> 
> 
> > Yes, with 70-200 f2.8 IS II without going from 70 to 200. Bare m22 on seems to be much quicker.
> ...



Following up to my earlier comment... now that it is mentioned, I seem to recall mounting a 70-200 f/4 to the M and it performed deliberately slow. The USM ran at like quarter speed or something. I panicked at first thinking something was wrong with the lens. I may try this again tonight.


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## lw (Jan 27, 2015)

Dylan777 said:


> I've tried 70-200 f2.8 IS II + adapter on eos-m Vs native 22mm. AF speed is not the same. Why? I can't tell you.
> 
> Neuro confirmed his adapter + L lenses is faster then native 22mm. Maybe, other members can give their feedbacks.



Hardly a valid comparison though as it is two different lenses. It doesn't demonstrate that the adaptor makes a difference....

The fastest focusing lens I have used by far on my M is the EF-S 55-250mm IS STM - via the adaptor - it is faster focusing than any native EF-M lens hence demonstrating the adaptor has no impact I can see. My belief is because it is able to house a bigger STM motor than the EF-M lenses, and the M is optimised for STM lenses. It is faster than my EF 70-200 f2.8 IS II. Nothing to do with the adaptor AFAICS.

So, I can't see any reason that a new adaptor is needed for the M


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## c.d.embrey (Jan 27, 2015)

Less than NO interest in High Megapixel or Full Frame cameras. Same goes for Zoomz!

But I would be buy a less *"Hello-Kitty"* more Prosumer *EOS M3*  A 70D style flippy screen would be nice, but not necessary.

I'm converting my NEX 5n into a sorta view camera using a Tilt & Shift adapter and a Flip-up Screen Shade. I'll use a 60mm f/2.8 Micro Nikkor (= 90mm FF). If the M3 turns out to be a real camera, there are T&S adapters for M-mount and Flip-up Screen Shades already available. BTW that Nikon 60mm becomes 96mm(FF) with a Canon 1.6 crop. If the M3 is an Asia only *Kitty-Kamera*, then I'll take a look at the upcoming Sony a7000. BTW2 All New Sony pro/prosumer cameras now tether to Capture One


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## Lee Jay (Jan 27, 2015)

jeffa4444 said:


> If we see a 50+ MP sensor in a Canon professional camera it will be interesting to see how older lenses still in manufacture hold-up. Higher resolution lenses properly corrected for chromatic abberations & color fringing will be expensive to make, so expensive that for many they will not be affordable its not just the glass but the mechanical tolerance to make that glass work optimally all the time.



This is no more pixel density than the 70D, and even an 18-135STM holds up quite well on that camera. So, any lens with quality equal to or better than a relatively cheap but decent consumer hyperzoom will hold up just fine. Now, the 18-135 is an EF-s so that makes it easier to design and cheaper, but the same thing should hold for lenses like the 24-105STM. Lenses like the 16-35IS, 24-70II, 70-200II, 100-400II and basically all the L-primes and decent consumer primes (24/28/35/85/100) will be just great.


----------



## surapon (Jan 27, 2015)

lw said:


> Dylan777 said:
> 
> 
> > lw said:
> ...



Dear Friend Mr. lw.
My EF-EOS M Lens adaptor By Canon never slow AF speed for all of my 19 Canon EF- Lenses, and Tamron + Sigma Lenses----Electrical connection are super fast, not matter 2 inches distant or 10 feet distant. Yes, That are my Observation since I have EOS-M more than 1.5 years ago.
Yes, I will buy EOS-M III, And EOS 50+ MP. when they on the Market.
Have a great work Week.
Surapon


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## Bghead8che (Jan 27, 2015)

Is the new "50 MP" camera going to be in the price range of the D810 and 5D3 ($3-4K) or more in the $6K plus range? 

-Brian


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## ajfotofilmagem (Jan 27, 2015)

Bghead8che said:


> Is the new "50 MP" camera going to be in the price range of the D810 and 5D3 ($3-4K) or more in the $6K plus range?
> -Brian


No one can say for sure. But the market demand is higher in a kind of body 5D, to compete with Nikon D810, possibly costing up to $ 4000.


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## PureClassA (Jan 27, 2015)

Bghead8che said:


> Is the new "50 MP" camera going to be in the price range of the D810 and 5D3 ($3-4K) or more in the $6K plus range?
> 
> -Brian



Find out next Friday, but my money is on $3999.95. The 5D3 has been getting some relatively sharp drops lately.


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## PureClassA (Jan 27, 2015)

MSRP Map would work out nicely:

6D $1899
5D3 $2899
5D Extreme $3899 -3999
1Dx2 $6499 (complete guess)


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## RGF (Jan 27, 2015)

jeffa4444 said:


> If we see a 50+ MP sensor in a Canon professional camera it will be interesting to see how older lenses still in manufacture hold-up. Higher resolution lenses properly corrected for chromatic abberations & color fringing will be expensive to make, so expensive that for many they will not be affordable its not just the glass but the mechanical tolerance to make that glass work optimally all the time.



Canon will need to improve their lens. Some are there or nearly there though I suspect that a 50 MP sensor will show the weakness in many of their lenses, even the newer better quality lenses.

Canon, IMO, will continue to make their own lenses rather than work with a company like Zeiss. Canon suffers from NIH (Not Invented Here) syndrome - in part good so they can differentiate themselves but also at times to their customers disadvantage.


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## nvsravank (Jan 27, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> Jiminy F'ng Crickets, there's a lot of bitching and moaning on here about cameras and lenses that aren't even out yet. Ok, sheesh!! Everyone who shoots landscapes can go to the Sony side of the room!! Wonderful Cameras for DR and resolve. Everyone else go to the Canon side of the room if you prefer vastly superior speed and AF performance for indoor and outdoor sports and wildlife, and a more accurate color palette for portraiture right off the sensor.
> 
> Ok done!
> 
> ...



Ok you know that you are on the site called canonRUMORS right? 

What fun is it if we dont bitch and moan about canon not doing what we want them to do.

How can we spend those countless hours between photos shoots when all we can think of is how the equipment is the reason for the failure of that one photo from the last shot that could have been better if only we had that particular feature in our camera / lens?

What fun is it if we cannot complain about every feature that Sony / Nikon has that canon does not and then complain about it? Come on we are so invested in lens that we cant switch!!!


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## mackguyver (Jan 27, 2015)

We also need this place to dream up insanely unrealistic specs and then be disappointed by them when the new model(s) don't have them. The 5DIII was the biggest piece of crap when it first came out because it didn't have 40+ MP and 20 stops of DR, etc. . The new models will also suck. Well until we actually start using them.

It's all good fun, of course!


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## PureClassA (Jan 27, 2015)

mackguyver said:


> We also need this place to dream up insanely unrealistic specs and then be disappointed by them when the new model(s) don't have them. The 5DIII was the biggest piece of crap when it first came out because it didn't have 40+ MP and 20 stops of DR, etc. . The new models will also suck. Well until we actually start using them.
> 
> It's all good fun, of course!



Oh I laugh at the bitching and moaning. It has some terrific late night entertainment value. And yes it CAN be valuable if done constructively...


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## chrisnosleep (Jan 27, 2015)

Is there some reason that this new high MP camera couldn't be the next of the 1D's? Or is there some details I'm not aware of?


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## lintoni (Jan 27, 2015)

chrisnosleep said:


> Is there some reason that this new high MP camera couldn't be the next of the 1D's? Or is there some details I'm not aware of?


An earlier post by Canon Rumors suggested that the high MP body would not be a 1D series body.


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## ajfotofilmagem (Jan 27, 2015)

chrisnosleep said:


> Is there some reason that this new high MP camera couldn't be the next of the 1D's? Or is there some details I'm not aware of?


It could be a direct replacement for the Canon 1DS Mark iii, but not a substitute 1DX. In this case there would be a new 1DX (Mark ii?), With up to 20 megapixel and 14 frames per second in addition to the 50 megapixel model with a maximum of 6 shots per second.


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## dcm (Jan 27, 2015)

Looking forward to these announcements and subsequent reviews.


M3 is a given unless they really botch it. That's ahead of my normal 3 year cycle on bodies and computers, but expected given it was new technology. I'm getting by fine with the current M so I could wait another year if there is no major improvement. Wonder if any new lenses will accompany it. 
The 11-24 looks like a nice bookend to the new 100-400 in a similar price range ($2K+). I just might pull the trigger if its performance is anything like the new 100-400.
Next FF body upgrade was planned for the end of 2015. Was originally thinking a 1DX, but the new high megapixel bodies might be an interesting alternative. My daughter will be happy to keep the loan/hand me down 6D.
Rebels and Powershots are no longer of interest. My wife seems to use her iPhone much more than her Powershot these days and won't touch a DSLR.


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## NancyP (Jan 27, 2015)

At the rate I get around to upgrading my operating system, upgrading Lightroom (to LR5), it may well be early March by the time I get around to buying a camera. Or not. I am anxious to use the 7D2 AF system - honestly I have no idea what a sophisticated AF system can do, having used only the 60D and 6D (and 6D is used largely with manual focus, anyway). A high-MP full frame camera would have to have more dynamic range to be really worthwhile to me. I am finding that the 20 MP of the 6D is pretty reasonable for my needs, I just would like "better" pixels. My cameras are better than I am, anyway. My most needed and important upgrade is my brain. Current purchases are flash triggers, lighting modifiers, stands, books, software, courses.


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## nonac (Jan 27, 2015)

Excellent. I'm attending a Canon Destination workshop from Feb 26-Mar 1, maybe they will have these new toys for us to check out.


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## Skirball (Jan 27, 2015)

NancyP said:


> At the rate I get around to upgrading my operating system, upgrading Lightroom (to LR5), it may well be early March...



LR6 should be released in March. Just sayin...


----------



## fxk (Jan 27, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> jebrady03 said:
> 
> 
> > I'm still proceeding under the assumption that the "big megapixel" camera is actually a DPAF sensor where the megapixel count of images will be half that of the number of photosites. So, I'm expecting a 26-ish mp camera. Which would be fine with me, I don't need and truthfully can't handle (processing) over 50 megapixels.
> ...



Like Foveon - 51mp - three layers 17mp each...


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## 3kramd5 (Jan 28, 2015)

fxk said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > jebrady03 said:
> ...



Hardly relevant to how Canon specifies cameras with multiple diodes per pixel location.


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## tcmatthews (Jan 28, 2015)

Luds34 said:


> wsmith96 said:
> 
> 
> > Do any of you think that there is a change of a 6D style camera with the 70D focus system and maybe an articulated screen this year?
> ...



I agree put me down for that as well.


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## LetTheRightLensIn (Jan 28, 2015)

unfocused said:


> This makes perfect sense *if* the criteria you seek in a camera is exactly the criteria DxO measures and you assign exactly the same relative weight to that criteria that DxO does.



???
Or simply just look at the various data points you care about, take various things into consideration and take from it what you need.




> That you have found a testing lab that measures exactly what you consider to be the most important factors is great for you. Many others don't feel that way. Rather, many feel that the criteria DxO uses to select what measurements it takes do not reflect their needs, desires or even experience.



all he said is that he wanted to use their scores to compare a few sensor metrics


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## gsealy (Jan 28, 2015)

It will be interesting to see what Canon does with video on this camera. If this is a 5DIII replacement then it could likely be priced around $4K. BUT will it shoot 4K video? I am thinking it will not because then it would undercut the planned C300 release that has 4K and priced much higher. We know already that the C100, which is priced around $5K doesn' t have it. However, if this more like a new 1D camera and priced around $10K then we could see 4K video as a feature. Didn't Canon just reduce the 1DC price? So maybe this is what it will be -- a new 1D something camera.


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## PureClassA (Jan 28, 2015)

gsealy said:



> It will be interesting to see what Canon does with video on this camera. If this is a 5DIII replacement then it could likely be priced around $4K. BUT will it shoot 4K video? I am thinking it will not because then it would undercut the planned C300 release that has 4K and priced much higher. We know already that the C100, which is priced around $5K doesn' t have it. However, if this more like a new 1D camera and priced around $10K then we could see 4K video as a feature. Didn't Canon just reduce the 1DC price? So maybe this is what it will be -- a new 1D something camera.



The Sony FS7 is $8000 and is not being undercut by the $2500 Sony A7s. However, for some reason I DO sometimes think Canon is under such silly impressions. If the new 5 body does NOT have internal 4k capability of any sort, it's going to be perceived as a big fail, and I frankly couldn't blame reviewers for seeing it as such given everyone else going that direction or ALREADY there.


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## pianoplayer88key (Jan 28, 2015)

I'm actually hoping that one of the Powershots is the Panasonic FZ-1000 killer. 

My next interchangeable-lens camera will be my first. I like the idea of full frame, but don't like Canon's current offerings in that arena, and can't even afford a 6D body right now. (I expect I could swing $800-1000 in a couple months for the above-mentioned wished-for powershot, though.) Also I don't want to have to get all new lenses when I'd upgrade from crop sensor to full frame. (If only there was something like a 16-300mm F/3.5-5.6 lens that was usable on FF...)


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## WeekendWarrior (Jan 28, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> gsealy said:
> 
> 
> > It will be interesting to see what Canon does with video on this camera. If this is a 5DIII replacement then it could likely be priced around $4K. BUT will it shoot 4K video? I am thinking it will not because then it would undercut the planned C300 release that has 4K and priced much higher. We know already that the C100, which is priced around $5K doesn' t have it. However, if this more like a new 1D camera and priced around $10K then we could see 4K video as a feature. Didn't Canon just reduce the 1DC price? So maybe this is what it will be -- a new 1D something camera.
> ...



+100


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## FEBS (Jan 28, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> The Sony FS7 is $8000 and is not being undercut by the $2500 Sony A7s. However, for some reason I DO sometimes think Canon is under such silly impressions. *If the new 5 body does NOT have internal 4k capability of any sort, it's going to be perceived as a big fail*, and I frankly couldn't blame reviewers for seeing it as such given everyone else going that direction or ALREADY there.



By who? By all the people that want video on their camera. So that's purely personal. I'm not interested at all in video, so for me that would never be the reason of a fail. I see the same remarks for every new model coming over here. Simply because people want to use a camera in another way as the manufacturer did create it. No, I don't want a body that must do all (video, high speed, ...). I like the fact that cameras are dedicated to a specific area of use. That doesn't way to say that you can also use for other ways, but they are really not intended as general purpose tools which deliver the max of specification in all areas. Forget that, will never happen.


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## PureClassA (Jan 28, 2015)

The camera won't be a fail. The lack of THAT feature will be a major fail based on competitive market forces. I'm a still shooter too. I believe in a camera for that. It won't be a fail for ME. But I know perceptions. My point was I don't think Canon will let that slide and thinking it will somehow inhibit their C300 is just not right. If anything, the could stand to ditch the C100 but that won't happen. All that said, there is no reason that Canon who friggin pioneered DSLR video can't put 4k into their 5 body. As a feature, given Canon's recent history in DSLR video....its a fail if they dont


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## viendongshop (Jan 28, 2015)

*Canon EF 11-24mm f/4L lens Coming Soon*

According to the latest rumors surfaced over the Canon will soon announce the Canon EF 11-24mm f/4L lens, the expected date of arrival is CP+ show 2015.


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## kurcobolja (Jan 28, 2015)

For me personally expectation is high, as if they do not deliver serious upgrade in DR, IQ and 4K video I will most probably start selling my Canon gear as for few months I am shooting with Sony A7R and I am blown with quality of end results.


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## vscd (Jan 28, 2015)

> By who? By all the people that want video on their camera. So that's purely personal. I'm not interested at all in video, so for me that would never be the reason of a fail. I see the same remarks for every new model coming over here. Simply because people want to use a camera in another way as the manufacturer did create it. No, I don't want a body that must do all (video, high speed, ...). I like the fact that cameras are dedicated to a specific area of use. That doesn't way to say that you can also use for other ways, but they are really not intended as general purpose tools which deliver the max of specification in all areas. Forget that, will never happen.



I second that. Maybe it's because I'm coming from the programmers side and there is one written rule in Unix, since the 60ies: * "One Job - One Tool!"*. If you make a specific Tool, in this case for photography, make it right and to the point. Don't try to make an univeral-swiss-armyknife because it will do a lot of things but nothing really right, because it has to overcome compromises... everytime.

If they'd include 4k it would be nice, but just for capturing 8MP-Photos @25/50/60 Frames. If they don't... I don't care. This is optional, also a swift screen (I hate those!) or an EVF. Canon should make a good sensor and useable ergonomics, paired with weathersealing and batterylife.


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## Sportsgal501 (Jan 28, 2015)

The new Rebel has peeked my interest. ....


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## Khnnielsen (Jan 28, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> The camera won't be a fail. The lack of THAT feature will be a major fail based on competitive market forces. I'm a still shooter too. I believe in a camera for that. It won't be a fail for ME. But I know perceptions. My point was I don't think Canon will let that slide and thinking it will somehow inhibit their C300 is just not right. If anything, the could stand to ditch the C100 but that won't happen. All that said, there is no reason that Canon who friggin pioneered DSLR video can't put 4k into their 5 body. As a feature, given Canon's recent history in DSLR video....its a fail if they dont



You seem to be under the assumption, that Canon really care about video in the DSLR realm. They unintentionally started the DSLR video trend, but they have done nothing to sustain it. If they so far have been unwilling to put even basic video features in a DSLR type body(zebras, peaking etc.) then 4k video seem unlikely.


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## vscd (Jan 28, 2015)

> You seem to be under the assumption, that Canon really care about video in the DSLR realm. They unintentionally started the DSLR video trend, but they have done nothing to sustain it. If they so far have been unwilling to put even basic video features in a DSLR type body(zebras, peaking etc.) then 4k video seem unlikely.



Right and more importantly, they would canibalize thir own existing products (e.g. C300).


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## AcutancePhotography (Jan 28, 2015)

In the past, we had cameras that took still shots and cameras that took video and they were separate specialized equipment that did their individual task as well as the existing technology enabled.

As different technologies matured, it became possible to combine still cameras and video cameras into the same box. This is where we are presently.

Given the increasing specialization in emerging technologies, will there come a time where it will be no longer technologically desirable to have a combination of still and video in the same body, but to have, once again, separate specialized still and video cameras? Each optimizing the appropriate technology and design for the different task.

As previously posted, trying to do all things for all people often results in doing less for all people. There is a reason Ferrari does not make pick up trucks. ;D

Well one guy did 

http://truckyeah.jalopnik.com/the-worlds-one-only-ferrari-pickup-truck-is-really-qu-1580580991 LoL

Maybe I am wrong. :-[ ;D
I am sure that in the future that still cameras will still have "some" video capability. But if high specialization in video capability is desired, would that not need a specialized separate body?


----------



## Rahul (Jan 28, 2015)

AcutancePhotography said:


> if high specialization in video capability is desired, would that not need a specialized separate body?



I agree with most of your post but the above statement ... wouldn't that hold true even today? High specialization video is done using much more sophisticated cameras and lenses that are insanely expensive. The gear is more often than not rented by Pros and hardly ever purchased for individual use.


----------



## Speedster (Jan 28, 2015)

FEBS said:


> PureClassA said:
> 
> 
> > The Sony FS7 is $8000 and is not being undercut by the $2500 Sony A7s. However, for some reason I DO sometimes think Canon is under such silly impressions. *If the new 5 body does NOT have internal 4k capability of any sort, it's going to be perceived as a big fail*, and I frankly couldn't blame reviewers for seeing it as such given everyone else going that direction or ALREADY there.
> ...



I very much agree with this. While 4k would be nice, it's way down my list of priorities. I think I've used video recording only three times while using my 7D and never on my 5DIII. Different horses for different courses though.


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## daniela (Jan 28, 2015)

Rumors from Japan: There is an discussion between Sony-fans and Canon-fans about the coming high MP cameras. A lot of war between them. On thing appeared often: Price of the Alpha 7R successor is rumored about 2500€ (range 2100-2800€), the Canon price will be definitively much higher, some say double the price of the Sony body. But no one expects an high-fps body there.

The 750D will be an big step upward, but the rumors do not see an exeptional rise in IQ, more in MP. Price tag about 900-1000€, but only a few people mentioned the price.

If the high MP Canon body is priced at this height, I hope the specifications of the body will be "prime" too. 

Let us see, if my Japanese friends do know more, or if they are just rumoring too...

G
Daniela
from the sunny and deep blue skied Tyrol


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## Lee Jay (Jan 28, 2015)

AcutancePhotography said:


> As previously posted, trying to do all things for all people often results in doing less for all people. There is a reason Ferrari does not make pick up trucks. ;D



Bad example.

Lamborghini makes farm tractors.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferruccio_Lamborghini#Legacy


----------



## dtheune (Jan 28, 2015)

vscd said:


> > By who? By all the people that want video on their camera. So that's purely personal. I'm not interested at all in video, so for me that would never be the reason of a fail. I see the same remarks for every new model coming over here. Simply because people want to use a camera in another way as the manufacturer did create it. No, I don't want a body that must do all (video, high speed, ...). I like the fact that cameras are dedicated to a specific area of use. That doesn't way to say that you can also use for other ways, but they are really not intended as general purpose tools which deliver the max of specification in all areas. Forget that, will never happen.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Do you own a cellular phone or a smart phone? Does it only make phone calls or do various tasks? Who's to say that a DSLR with Photo/Video is not ONE thing. Videography has it's roots in photography. There has been be a evolution in photography. Motion Pictures at it's best is Photography in Motion. I believe Canon is interested in selling cameras and other things they sell. Canon is clearly making video an important part of their commercial marketing strategy. If one person has only one wrench in his tool box and another, has a tool box with a screw driver and hammer, I would say, cool, you use what you want and I use what I want, but don't rain on my parade if I like having more tools at my discretion. Video is a feature of DSLR cameras, just like the phone is now a feature of a mobile device.


----------



## Chrisburger72 (Jan 28, 2015)

Sorry for the noob question, but what is the CR1, CR2, CR3? Is it something to do with the confidence level in the story? (That's all I could figure out....)

Thanks,

Chris


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## Lee Jay (Jan 28, 2015)

Chrisburger72 said:


> Sorry for the noob question, but what is the CR1, CR2, CR3? Is it something to do with the confidence level in the story? (That's all I could figure out....)



Yes. CR1 means it's most likely made up. CR2 has some confidence. CR3 means it has a good chance of being real.


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## gsealy (Jan 28, 2015)

Triggyman said:


> I'm very much interested for the next Rebel, and the M3.
> 
> I need a smaller APS-C camera (Canon System) that's not too pricey but can produce better quality pictures than my SX50.
> 
> ...



I have the Rebel t4i and I use it a lot. It's a great camera. The t5i is very close to it with a few upgrades. If you go that route you can purchase the t5i body refurbished from Canon for less than $600 (and sometimes lower). Having that you can spend money on EF L lenses, the combination of which will give you great pictures and support going forward with a FF camera in the future. Just a suggestion.


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## DominoDude (Jan 28, 2015)

vscd said:


> > By who? By all the people that want video on their camera. So that's purely personal. I'm not interested at all in video, so for me that would never be the reason of a fail. I see the same remarks for every new model coming over here. Simply because people want to use a camera in another way as the manufacturer did create it. No, I don't want a body that must do all (video, high speed, ...). I like the fact that cameras are dedicated to a specific area of use. That doesn't way to say that you can also use for other ways, but they are really not intended as general purpose tools which deliver the max of specification in all areas. Forget that, will never happen.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Sidestepping the thread briefly: Wouldn't Vi be a lot less popular in the *nix-world if that were true?

Besides that I fully understand and agree with your reasoning. Canon should primarily focus on making a sensor that leaves the competition (and forum trolls) speechless for a number of years. Most other things they already excel at.


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## crashpc (Jan 28, 2015)

Pissed myself right away...


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## actingnurse (Jan 28, 2015)

Until they step into 2012 and put 4k RAW video in the cameras... I don't care. Even GoPro has 4K footage now... Canon is turning into the Apple of the camera world.. forever playing "catch-up."

I sold my 5Dm3 last year and moved to RED cameras. i WISH they'd make a 4k RAW camera so I could pick one up for backup.


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## Lee Jay (Jan 28, 2015)

actingnurse said:


> Until they step into 2012 and put 4k RAW video in the cameras... I don't care. Even GoPro has 4K footage now... Canon is turning into the Apple of the camera world.. forever playing "catch-up."
> 
> I sold my 5Dm3 last year and moved to RED cameras. i WISH they'd make a 4k RAW camera so I could pick one up for backup.



GoPro's don't shoot raw, and RED cameras cost an order of magnitude more than a 5D-series camera once you include all the accessories that are required.


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## actingnurse (Jan 28, 2015)

Lee Jay said:


> actingnurse said:
> 
> 
> > Until they step into 2012 and put 4k RAW video in the cameras... I don't care. Even GoPro has 4K footage now... Canon is turning into the Apple of the camera world.. forever playing "catch-up."
> ...



Didn't say GoPro show RAW... i said they shoot 4k... Canon can't (or won't) even make that move.. BMCC, BMPCC, Sony, Go Pro... Hell I think iPhone will make it to 4k before Canon.


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## 3kramd5 (Jan 28, 2015)

actingnurse said:


> Lee Jay said:
> 
> 
> > actingnurse said:
> ...



http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/professional/products/professional_cameras/cinema_eos_cameras/eos_1d_c

http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/professional/products/professional_cameras/cinema_eos_cameras/eos_c500


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## sanj (Jan 28, 2015)

actingnurse said:


> Until they step into 2012 and put 4k RAW video in the cameras... I don't care. Even GoPro has 4K footage now... Canon is turning into the Apple of the camera world.. forever playing "catch-up."
> 
> I sold my 5Dm3 last year and moved to RED cameras. i WISH they'd make a 4k RAW camera so I could pick one up for backup.



You don't shoot stills right? 5d3 is a stills camera. A very nice stills camera.


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## AcutancePhotography (Jan 28, 2015)

Lee Jay said:


> AcutancePhotography said:
> 
> 
> > As previously posted, trying to do all things for all people often results in doing less for all people. There is a reason Ferrari does not make pick up trucks. ;D
> ...



Which is why I did not use Lamborghini as an example. ;D


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## actingnurse (Jan 28, 2015)

> http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/professional/products/professional_cameras/cinema_eos_cameras/eos_1d_c
> 
> http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/professional/products/professional_cameras/cinema_eos_cameras/eos_c500



And when you step into those two models, you're in the RED Scarlet price range (actually they're about 4 grand higher than the scarlet body, but when you add in the needed accessories, it's about the same)... and they still use the H.264 codec instead of RAW... so RED/Sony/etc. Wins. I was referring to namely the 5D and the other cameras in its class - 5D needs to at LEAST add 4k shooting. RAW would give them the edge again. it CAN be done if you're open to "rigging" with the Magic Lantern software.

I started out shooting stills. Don't get me wrong, its awesome at stills.... one of the best out there. My wife has a 6D so I just use hers for stills. I was just referring to video since there's such a huge DSLR video movement going on due to its relative affordability. All I'm saying is, when will they catch up?


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## 3kramd5 (Jan 28, 2015)

actingnurse said:


> > http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/professional/products/professional_cameras/cinema_eos_cameras/eos_1d_c
> >
> > http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/professional/products/professional_cameras/cinema_eos_cameras/eos_c500
> 
> ...



Which you previously showed to be within your budget. Canon makes 4K Raw cameras. What you want is an inexpensive Canon 4K rig. Assuming the thermal design of the rumored body is adequate, I don't see any reason Canon wouldn't enable it (as at that point it would be largely software).

Either way, the notion that an iPhone will record 4k before a Canon camera is demonstrably false. 



[If video were my thing and I had the budget, I'd go down the RED path too]


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## bmwzimmer (Jan 28, 2015)

Speedster said:


> FEBS said:
> 
> 
> > PureClassA said:
> ...



How about no video at all and sell it for $300-500 less


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## PureClassA (Jan 28, 2015)

bmwzimmer said:


> Speedster said:
> 
> 
> > FEBS said:
> ...



There are a lot of DSLR video/cinema shooters out there. Those with a 3k budget aren't likely going to Canon anymore with so many other, and better, options to do this. It would be a fail on Canon's part if they leave this market segment uncontested. GH4, A7s, etc... It will still be a top-flight still camera as it should be first and foremost, but to NOT include a now so common feature as 4k capability is going to be more widely regarded as a let down than not. And again, a $4000 camera is not going to cannibalize sales of a $15000 camera. Two different animals completely. Ask Sony if that's happening to them wit their $2500 Alpha, because the big FS7 is only about half the price of the C300 at $8000. Both the FS7 and the Alpha7s do 4K.


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## Lee Jay (Jan 28, 2015)

bmwzimmer said:


> Speedster said:
> 
> 
> > FEBS said:
> ...



More, actually, not less.


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## Don Haines (Jan 28, 2015)

3kramd5 said:


> actingnurse said:
> 
> 
> > > http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/professional/products/professional_cameras/cinema_eos_cameras/eos_1d_c
> ...


http://www.forbes.com/sites/paulmonckton/2015/01/13/4k-video-on-iphone-6/2/


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## Lee Jay (Jan 28, 2015)

Don Haines said:


> 3kramd5 said:
> 
> 
> > actingnurse said:
> ...



Do you believe it was announced before the C500 or 1Dc?


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## AvTvM (Jan 28, 2015)

I'd love to see a breakdown of how many DSLR buyers use their cameras for stills only, mainly stills+ occasional video, mainly video + occasional stills and purely video. I do not believe the latter 2 categories combined are more than 10% of all DSLR sales. 

I love the Canon concept of 1D-X and 1DC and the Sony approach with A7 / R / II vs. A7s ... make those who absolutely demand [4k] video in cameras pay more. Dual functionality = less than double price, but more than single price. Fair enough. 

I have never ever captured video with any of my video-enabled DSLRs and won't ever. Don't see any reason why I should have to put up with video buttons and video menus cluttering my stills cameras. And I am tired of all those video cheapskates who clamor for 4k video or even "4k RAW video" in every DSLR. 

There should be a clear split: single use cameras - stills and video - and dual-use cameras stills + [highend] video (out). It would become very evident very quickly, just how little true demand there is for "dual use cameras". 

If video users don't like Canon Cxxx or Sony FS7 type video cameras, then there is 1D-C and Alpha 7S and Panasonic GH4. But no need whatsoever for every single DSLR to be "high-end" vdieo capable at zero surcharge.


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## raptor3x (Jan 28, 2015)

Lee Jay said:


> Do you believe it was announced before the C500 or 1Dc?



I've never understood this tendency of people to criticize Canon for not being innovative for video when they were the first to market with 4K in a DSLR by either by almost two years going by the GH4 or almost 3 years and counting if you're strict about the DSLR part. Bringing the camera to a lower price point is almost purely a business decision, not a question of innovation.


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## PureClassA (Jan 28, 2015)

That's the problem. Canon has NOTHING competitive with the Panasonic GH4 and Sony Alphas when it comes to video. If you want 4k with Canon, it's almost $10k to get in with a 1DC. The Sony a7s is highly popular, mainly built for video, and Sony even recently stated that all the alphas have greatly exceeded their sales projections. Therefore, there IS a good demand for 4k capable cameras in that range with interchangeable lenses. 

If Canon wants to have nothing to compete, so be it, but to say there isn't a real market for it is folly. Even though built for stills, Canon would be unwise not to toss in 4k for new FF bodies. If they chose to leave it out for the 1 series, I'd get it. Different beast, and the 1DC is right next to it. But a new 6 or 5 body? Really should have it.


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## AvTvM (Jan 28, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> But a new 6 or 5 body? Really should have it.



no problem, really easy: Canon just should offer 2 versions ... 
A) "regular" stills-optimized 5D IV with 50 MP and no video out or HD-video at best @ 2999 
and 
B) a video-capable 5D IVs with 24 MP and internal 4k video capture (but not raw 4k out) @ 3,499 ... would be still competitive compared to 12 MP Sony A7s which requires use of an external recorder to capture 4k video [at significant additional cost]. Thanks to much larger 5D body internal 4k capture and heat dissipation should be no major issue. 

I'd really like to see sales statistics then.

I do not know, but my guess is, that Sony sales of A7s are max. 10% of combined A7 / R / II units.


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## Don Haines (Jan 28, 2015)

Lee Jay said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > 3kramd5 said:
> ...


certainly not  , but they did beat Canon to a sub $1000 device.... after all, my comment was about the part above bolded and in green, and neither the C500 or 1Dc is inexpensive..

and all that said, I would be willing to bet that the video from something like a 70D up-sampled to 4K would beat any video coming out of an iPhone.


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## PureClassA (Jan 28, 2015)

AvTvM said:


> PureClassA said:
> 
> 
> > But a new 6 or 5 body? Really should have it.
> ...



Yes. My only point was Canon needs SOMETHING with competitive 4k that isn't $10,000. I don't see why they can't/won't make something competitive with the Sony and Panasonic offerings when Canon itself was the DSLR video pioneer. I don't expect RAW output for $3-4k. But a real clean 8-10bit HDMI out would be lovely and on par with the competition. Add in Canon's superior color reproduction and the EF lens system... Look at all the effort they put into the 7D2 video AF system.


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## 3kramd5 (Jan 28, 2015)

Lee Jay said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > 3kramd5 said:
> ...



Even granting non-native functionality (not sure whether ML allowed for 4k on Canon EOS before this app came around for iOS), the C500 pre-dates the iphone6 by a couple years.

Silly discussion, but whatever


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## lo lite (Jan 28, 2015)

Canon Rumors said:


> We’re told the embargo/NDA expires on Friday, February 6, 2015 for these upcoming products. These products would line up with the CP+ show in Japan next month.



O.k., I know we're talking about rumors here but I wonder what that rumored 53MP Resolution will actually be. 8910x5940 or 8940x5960 or 8970 x 5980? Something even more odd? Why not just 54MP (9000x6000)?


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## AvTvM (Jan 29, 2015)

lo lite said:


> O.k., I know we're talking about rumors here but I wonder what that rumored 53MP Resolution will actually be. 8910x5940 or 8940x5960 or 8970 x 5980? Something even more odd? Why not just 54MP (9000x6000)?



9000x6000 ... will come first in a mid 2018 Apple iMac and/or a Dell monitor ... when evyery other company aorund brings 8k monitors, they'll have it at "9k". Just like their late 2014 "5k" devices. 8) 

"Super Hi Vision" / 8K TV broadcasts and displays @ 7.680 x 4.320  might be coming sooner than expected ... even as 13.3" monitors/tablets 8)
http://www.ibc.org/page.cfm/action=library/libID=2/libEntryID=266/listID=1

I can already see the first video-enthusiasts starting to clamor for "RAW 8k video-capability in any future (Canon) DSLR".  ;D


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## 9VIII (Jan 29, 2015)

AvTvM said:


> lo lite said:
> 
> 
> > O.k., I know we're talking about rumors here but I wonder what that rumored 53MP Resolution will actually be. 8910x5940 or 8940x5960 or 8970 x 5980? Something even more odd? Why not just 54MP (9000x6000)?
> ...



That would more likely be an 11K display, 5K is almost twice the pixel count of 4K (14MP vs. 8MP), where 9K would just be 25% more than 8K.

It really depends on the bandwidth of the connectors though, Displayport 1.3 tops out at either [email protected] or [email protected]
I supposed given that 8K is supposed to be a 120Hz specification, it would make sense that some manufacturers would try to make a 60Hz panel for whatever connector they happen to come up with that supports 8K. However, I really hope that everyone just switches to using a 120Hz refresh rate industry wide, it makes a big difference in motion quality and at that point we won't be hurting for resolution like we are now (yes, 1920x1080 is super jaggy and we've had equivalent resolutions on PC since the mid 90's).


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## Don Haines (Jan 29, 2015)

9VIII said:


> AvTvM said:
> 
> 
> > lo lite said:
> ...




In 1974 I had a 800x480 4096 colour graphics display. It took almost 30 years to double that resolution and now 8K screens are starting to appear as prototypes. This is a very quick jump in a relatively short time.... some believe that displays will plateau at 16K... whatever you believe, we are living in exciting times for digital imaging.


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## Khufu (Jan 29, 2015)

Has anyone stopped to consider how disgusting humans look in 1080p close-ups and that 4K, 8K etc. are truly terrifying developments?...


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## privatebydesign (Jan 29, 2015)

Khufu said:


> Has anyone stopped to consider how disgusting humans look in 1080p close-ups and that 4K, 8K etc. are truly terrifying developments?...



Ha, 4K is only 8MP, now everybody _needs_ 50MP................


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## Don Haines (Jan 29, 2015)

Khufu said:


> Has anyone stopped to consider how disgusting humans look in 1080p close-ups and that 4K, 8K etc. are truly terrifying developments?...


I find it amazing how you can take a picture, and then pixel peep to see details you would never notice in the real world....


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## PureClassA (Jan 29, 2015)

I hate to tell you this Don, but I'm not sure that's a cat ;D Nice eyeball selfie though!!!


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## Kahuna (Jan 29, 2015)

Don Haines selfie appears to be the grim reaper


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 29, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> My only point was Canon needs SOMETHING with competitive 4k that isn't $10,000.



Why? Canon was the first to make a 4K dSLR, so clearly they have the technology. The fact that they haven't brought 4K down the lineup indicates they haven't seen it as a need so far. I suspect Canon knows more about their business than you do.


----------



## PureClassA (Jan 29, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> PureClassA said:
> 
> 
> > My only point was Canon needs SOMETHING with competitive 4k that isn't $10,000.
> ...



Yes they have it. That's the point. The last FF bodies released were 2013. 4k was widely a non-issue at that time. 2015 is a new day and quite the opposite is the case now. Point was that these NEW bodies should have it for this round for the next 2-3 year life cycle


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## Don Haines (Jan 29, 2015)

Kahuna said:


> Don Haines selfie appears to be the grim reaper


That's right! Don't mess with me or it's Death by Squirrel!


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 29, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > PureClassA said:
> ...



Giventhe current market penetration of 4K TVs (or lack thereof), I suspect it's still widely a non-issue.


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## K-amps (Jan 29, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> AvTvM said:
> 
> 
> > PureClassA said:
> ...



Untill the 1080p snapshot has the resolution and quality of a 1080x1920 pix still; why are we asking for 4k when we know it will be a mush anyway?


----------



## Don Haines (Jan 29, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> PureClassA said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...


I believe the market forecast for this year is for 4K TVs to outsell 2K TVs..... At my local best buy, the 4K section is now bigger than the 2K section. There is still not very much content, but people are buying them.....


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## dcm (Jan 29, 2015)

Don Haines said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > PureClassA said:
> ...



The original HD tvs did not take off until broadcast switched to HD due to limited content and high prices. It's become mainstream now and sets are available at 10% of the price when I got mine. Yes, I'm an early adopter. 

3D suffered from lack of content and the glasses problem - it never really caught on. I skipped the 3D craze, bought more camera equipment and upgraded my desktop/laptop. 

Now that the 3D fever has worn off, the manufacturers and retailers need something new to hawk so they have latched on to 4K. The early adopters for 4K are out there now, upgrading their 3D tvs. It's unclear that 4K can penetrate the mass market any time soon without readily available content to drive it and a network infrastructure to deliver it. Like DVD to HD, upscaling 2K to 4K can only go so far. We'll need another order of magnitude improvement in network pipes that are still struggling just to handle NetFlix HD traffic. Some form of physical media for storage and distribution might be nice, too.


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## Hjalmarg1 (Jan 29, 2015)

Canon Rumors said:


> <p class="p1"> <li class="p1">EF 11-24 f/4L</li>
> <li class="p1">EOS M3 Camera</li>
> </ul>


11-24mm f/4L has to impressively good for current photographers owning Canon UWA lenses to spend $2,000+ in this lens.
EOS M3: It has to have a decent and fast AF and good selection of lenses to get interest from mirrorless users. Other manufactures of mirrorless cameras are way ahead.
With respect to other announcements, I don't simply have any interest.


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## Khufu (Jan 29, 2015)

Don Haines said:


> Khufu said:
> 
> 
> > Has anyone stopped to consider how disgusting humans look in 1080p close-ups and that 4K, 8K etc. are truly terrifying developments?...
> ...


Can't even make out the colour of your eyes, Sir... Moar DR! Moar Pixels! Canon needs 1080K already!

Fun shot n' crop though, Don... But are these 4K enthusiasts hoping to zoom in to watch Spielberg in motion, directing Indiana from within the reflection in his eyes?

Over here the BBC in 576p is awesome - I fear the Americans and Japanese have simply spent too long suffering with 480i and now they're desperate to overcompensate


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## drob (Jan 29, 2015)

Just thought of something...
5DS (53 megapixel)=Nikon D810
5DIV = Nikon D750
6DII = Nikon D610

It's starting to make sense I think..thoughts?


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## ajfotofilmagem (Jan 29, 2015)

Khufu said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > Khufu said:
> ...


Some people (few) really need 4K. : But a huge number of people want to 4K to not feel inferior to have lower resolution. :-\

Small dick complex. :-[


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## AvTvM (Jan 29, 2015)

ajfotofilmagem said:


> Some people (few) really need 4K. : But a huge number of people want to 4K to not feel inferior to have lower resolution. :-\



if I recall correctly, the argument was 4k capture is "useful" despite the current scaricity of 4k-capable viewing devices ... "to get better looking/downsampled HD/2k/1080p video"? 

But I am certainly the last person to comment on video. Never captured one. But my next PC monitor will be 4k (minimum) and my next TV set as well.


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 29, 2015)

drob said:


> Just thought of something...
> 5DS (53 megapixel)=Nikon D810
> 5DIV = Nikon D750
> 6DII = Nikon D610
> ...



Or not. 

7DII = Nikon ??


----------



## Rahul (Jan 29, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> drob said:
> 
> 
> > Just thought of something...
> ...



Don't worry, Nikon will be releasing something competitive in the next few months, call it back for QA/QC problems and release yet another updated camera which will eventually come close to the 7DII in performance (not sales).


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## PureClassA (Jan 29, 2015)

It's about shooting, not necessarily the end display. Shooting in 4k and down-converting to 1080, while a more labor intensive process, yields better resolve in the end product than shooting at 1080 native. Furthermore, shooting in 4k affords you the ability to crop down to 25% of the image if desired and still retain full HD resolution. 4k also allows for future proofing your work when in the next few years, you'll see a lot more 4k media apart from just the movie theaters.

Look, I wasn't talking about the lack of it being a deal breaker on a new 5 body. Far, far from it. But when everyone else on the block has implemented what is now so common a feature, even with a $500 Go-Pro Hero 4, it would seem odd to deliver a new flagship product without it when Canon itself extols their prowess in television commercials right now as being "the company that brought Hollywood caliber HD to a DSLR" http://www.ispot.tv/ad/7pF2/canon-bring-it

All I'm saying is I'd be very surprised at this point if we don't see the next step in a new FF body. By the way, since everyone laments the "wax" on Canon HD, shooting in 4k and down sampling I'd bet would mitigate much of that effect.


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## privatebydesign (Jan 29, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> It's about shooting, not necessarily the end display.



That 'argument' is asinine. If anybody was to suggest you need to shoot with a medium format digital sized sensor to use a crop camera sensor area for your image, or shoot with a 100mm when you need a 400mm you would be, rightly, laughed at. 

Sure a little amount of 'cropping' space to straighten an image etc is nice, but 400% is crazy.


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## Lee Jay (Jan 29, 2015)

privatebydesign said:


> PureClassA said:
> 
> 
> > It's about shooting, not necessarily the end display.
> ...



400%? Where'd you get that number? From full-HD it's 100% (factor of 2). It's quite common for me to consume 40% in the process of post stabilization so 100% isn't crazy at all.


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## PureClassA (Jan 29, 2015)

4k is 4 times the resolution of HD, doubling both axis of the lines. Either way still missing the point. Lets take the 400mm lens example. I shoot with a 400mm lens in 4k and I can effectively get full 1080 with about four times the reach if I crop down, negating to some respects the need for a 1600mm lens. Furthermore, lets say I want to shoot something like people on a pretty landscape. I can do a single shot to get everything in frame AND I can crop down to a closer-up shot of one area or the people if desired when editing a project without having to make several separate shots if time or equipment or lighting conditions don't permit. Then I can take the full frame shot and down sample to the same 1080 timeline and get a better image than having shot in native 1080. There are LOADS of advantages to 4k shooting and DSLR video cinematography folk desire them. Canon STARTED this movement with the 5D2.


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## privatebydesign (Jan 29, 2015)

Lee Jay said:


> privatebydesign said:
> 
> 
> > PureClassA said:
> ...



Idiot*.

FHD 1920x1080 = 2,073,600, 4K 3840 x 2160 = 8,294,400

8,294,400/2,073,600 = 4. 

4K is 400% the size of FHD.

Crop cameras have a multiplication factor of 1.6 (for Canon) but a FF sensor is 2.56 times the size of a crop camera's. Or, twice as long and twice as tall, for four times the area. Now before we get into an argument about factors and multiplication, which I am not interested in doing with you, it takes four FHD sensors to make one 4K sensor, if you crop a 4K image to 25% it's area you get the resolution of a FHD 1080 image.

* that was the very first word you typed to me in your first reply to a post of mine in the forum.


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## privatebydesign (Jan 29, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> 4k is 4 times the resolution of HD, doubling both axis of the lines. Either way still missing the point. Lets take the 400mm lens example. I shoot with a 400mm lens in 4k and I can effectively get full 1080 with about four times the reach if I crop down, negating to some respects the need for a 1600mm lens. Furthermore, lets say I want to shoot something like people on a pretty landscape. I can do a single shot to get everything in frame AND I can crop down to a closer-up shot of one area or the people if desired when editing a project without having to make several separate shots if time or equipment or lighting conditions don't permit. Then I can take the full frame shot and down sample to the same 1080 timeline and get a better image than having shot in native 1080. There are LOADS of advantages to 4k shooting and DSLR video cinematography folk desire them. Canon STARTED this movement with the 5D2.



No you miss the point, 4K is only useful in and of itself if you are outputting 4K, though there is a good argument for shooting 5K if you want to output 4K.

Shooting more than 1080 makes a lot of sense to output to 1080, but saying you need 4K to get good 1080 output is just plain wrong. 2-3K gives lots of headroom to output 1080.


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## Lee Jay (Jan 29, 2015)

privatebydesign said:


> Lee Jay said:
> 
> 
> > privatebydesign said:
> ...



Cropping is a linear measure, not an areal one. This is true in both sensor sizes and in post processing software.

4k/2k = 2 = 100% increase or crop of 50% of the image.


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## Khnnielsen (Jan 29, 2015)

privatebydesign said:


> PureClassA said:
> 
> 
> > 4k is 4 times the resolution of HD, doubling both axis of the lines. Either way still missing the point. Lets take the 400mm lens example. I shoot with a 400mm lens in 4k and I can effectively get full 1080 with about four times the reach if I crop down, negating to some respects the need for a 1600mm lens. Furthermore, lets say I want to shoot something like people on a pretty landscape. I can do a single shot to get everything in frame AND I can crop down to a closer-up shot of one area or the people if desired when editing a project without having to make several separate shots if time or equipment or lighting conditions don't permit. Then I can take the full frame shot and down sample to the same 1080 timeline and get a better image than having shot in native 1080. There are LOADS of advantages to 4k shooting and DSLR video cinematography folk desire them. Canon STARTED this movement with the 5D2.
> ...



It makes a lot of sense to use 4k footage with a 1080p timeline in the real world of deadlines and thight shooting schedules.
Apart from the IQ boost, which downscaled 4k is supposed to give, then I also get more use out of my interview footage and b-roll, when I use 4k.

I especially like to reframe my interview-footage to reflect what the person is talking about.


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## Rahul (Jan 29, 2015)

@pbd - elephantine memory, I like that


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## Lawliet (Jan 29, 2015)

privatebydesign said:


> PureClassA said:
> 
> 
> > It's about shooting, not necessarily the end display.
> ...



Only to those unaware of the color subsampling the Bayer-pattern involves.
Some comp work done with CG footage makes the shortcomings of subsampled material even harder to ignore.


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## Jan (Jan 29, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> drob said:
> 
> 
> > Just thought of something...
> ...



7DII = Nikon D7200. To be released @ CP+.


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## Khufu (Jan 29, 2015)

Meh... I used to shoot tour videography on HDV cams at PAL DV 576p... and upscaled to 720p for the YouTubes!
Nobody gave a frick, I'll go as far as to say no-one noticed. I do think 576p is a pleasant upgrade/alternative to 480p but much beyond that is for the most part unnecessary. With sensors at APS-C or even m4/3, never mind FF, we're needing slow apertures or shooting exceptionally highly defined b/g and f/g, er, blur? Neato! 

If you want MOAR REACH you can try an M2, 600D, 70D, ML-ware etc for epic video crop.

Interviewing anybody ever at 1080p seems disturbing to me, I don't want to see anyone's studio make-up flakes and nose hairs... How about grabbing that Ultra-HD Soft Focus lens so we can record all the pleasant 8K footage we need?!

Seriously... Record clean audio and balance it well and you can film with an old shoe and people will love it. 

My HDR FX1000 has 3x 1/3" sensors with no more pixels than necessary, a body made for holding sans-stabilising and some nice Cine-type/Gama Curve profiles... Plenty is in focus, insane f/1.6 constant aperture on a 20x zoom - do people remember these things we used to call video cameras and expressions such as "right tool for the job"?

I know, I'm off on one again... People are fascinating though, aren't they?


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## dcm (Jan 29, 2015)

Khufu said:


> ...
> 
> I know, I'm off on one again... People are fascinating though, aren't they?



Our expectations are spoiled by our phones that now do so much. We expect everything else to have everything and be better than anything before. It's quite a challenge to keep up in this world. :


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## xps (Jan 29, 2015)

Jan said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > drob said:
> ...



http://nikonrumors.com/2014/12/15/nikon-d7200-rumored-specifications.aspx/

Here are the rumored Nikon D7200 specifications:

New 24MP APS-C sensor
Nikon D750 styled body with a tilting screen
Expeed 4 processor
MultiCAM 3500DX2 autofocus system
51 AF points
Built-in Wi-Fi
6fps
Buffer: 16 RAW+JPG
Video: 1080p @60 and 720p @120 (not sure about 4k)
Video aperture will be adjustable during live view
Expected announcement in the first few months of 2015


Read more on NikonRumors.com: http://nikonrumors.com/2014/12/15/nikon-d7200-rumored-specifications.aspx/#ixzz3QEpGfOcq


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## Maiaibing (Jan 29, 2015)

Good news from Canon (actually bad news about Canon DSLR sales - but good news for customers):
Will try to turn around their fledging DSLR business (slight drop again since last warning now down to 6.4 mio units) by "comprehensively" improving picture iq, operability and wifi/gps ("interconnectivity").

This sound very promissing when it comes to the new 5DIV(??) coming to a store near you soon.


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 29, 2015)

Jan said:


> 7DII = Nikon D7200. To be released @ CP+.



Based on the rumored specs, not even close (but no doubt it'll get a higher DxOMark BScore).


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## LetTheRightLensIn (Jan 30, 2015)

Wait, isn't friday a realllly weird day? I thought they always wanted to launch big news during the week?


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## Durvile (Jan 30, 2015)

Popphoto magazine made a mistake on its february issue, probably showing photos of the next issue. Seems like the next Canon bodies. Sorry for my english!
Att
Durvile


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## IsaacImage (Jan 30, 2015)

Durvile said:


> Popphoto magazine made a mistake on its february issue, probably showing photos of the next issue. Seems like the next Canon bodies. Sorry for my english!
> Att
> Durvile



Looks pretty real


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## 3kramd5 (Jan 30, 2015)

Durvile said:


> Popphoto magazine made a mistake on its february issue, probably showing photos of the next issue. Seems like the next Canon bodies. Sorry for my english!
> Att
> Durvile



When will we see the first thread entitled "buy 5DSR now or wait for 5DSR-x"


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## IsaacImage (Jan 30, 2015)

3kramd5 said:


> Durvile said:
> 
> 
> > Popphoto magazine made a mistake on its february issue, probably showing photos of the next issue. Seems like the next Canon bodies. Sorry for my english!
> ...



or "Which one is better for Weddings" ? ~


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## AvTvM (Jan 30, 2015)

Photo and specs here: 
http://photorumors.com/2015/01/30/this-is-the-new-50mp-canon-eos-5ds-eos-5ds-r-full-frame-dslr-camera/
Via http://digicame-info.com/2015/01/eos-5ds-eos-5ds-r.html

50.6MP full frame CMOS sensor
There will be also a EOS 5DS R version that will be without low-pass filter
Magnesium alloy body, dust and water sealed
Dual processor DIGIC6
Regular sensitivity: ISO 100-6400
Continuous shooting 5 frames / sec.
High precision 61 AF points
EOS iTR AF
150,000 pixel RGB + IR photometry sensor
New "fine detail" picture style
1.3x and 1.6x crop modes
Customizable "Quick Control Screen"
Time-lapse movie
Interval Timer
Bulb timer
The official announcement will be next week
Via Digicame-info



Read more on PhotoRumors.com: http://photorumors.com/2015/01/30/this-is-the-new-50mp-canon-eos-5ds-eos-5ds-r-full-frame-dslr-camera/#ixzz3QHjqpcWx


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## Tabor Warren Photography (Jan 30, 2015)

So in two recent photo leaks, one has gold letters and the other has silver. My two cents, I hope it's silver. The listed specs sound good to me though!

-Tabor


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## Quackator (Jan 30, 2015)

So..... no multilayer RGB imager, no global shutter, less high 
ISO performance, no GPS, no Wifi, no flash radio controller 
built in...... 

Not exactly what I had hoped for.


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## Maiaibing (Jan 30, 2015)

AvTvM said:


> Photo and specs here:
> http://photorumors.com/2015/01/30/this-is-the-new-50mp-canon-eos-5ds-eos-5ds-r-full-frame-dslr-camera/
> Via http://digicame-info.com/2015/01/eos-5ds-eos-5ds-r.html
> 
> Regular sensitivity: ISO 100-6400



Wow. Had never seen anything remotely like this coming when it comes to iso range. The rest sounds somewhat promising but it would be a surefire deal killer for me... It seems too crazy to be true. :'(

Does this mean H-range will tick in already @ >6.400 iso or is it an indication that up to iso 6400 its going to be great and acceptable up to maybe 12.800?? Grasping for a straw here.


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## lintoni (Jan 30, 2015)

Quackator said:


> So..... no multilayer RGB imager, no global shutter, less high
> ISO performance, no GPS, no Wifi, no flash radio controller
> built in......
> 
> Not exactly what I had hoped for.


Congratulations on getting the first whinge in!


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## AvTvM (Jan 30, 2015)

the "gold lettering" shown on the photo at http://digicame-info.com/2015/01/eos-5ds-eos-5ds-r.html also looks somewhat strange to me. But Maybe it is reserved for the japanese/asian version of the 5Ds.  

Native ISO range of 100-6400 (only) also sounds "weird". 

But - it is a rumor, no announcement. ;D


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## scott_m (Jan 30, 2015)

100-6400 should be no problem if the sensor is "ISO-less" - just shoot it at whatever you like and push the [email protected] out of the file in post, right? 

But 5fps sounds good for something like this. I wonder 2 things: what the RAW buffer is like, and if it goes any faster/longer in either of the crop modes. 1.3 = ~30Mp and 1.6 = ~19.8Mp.

Either way it sounds like a worthwhile thing but I can't see myself upgrading from the 5DIII.


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 30, 2015)

AvTvM said:


> Regular sensitivity: ISO 100-6400



Blah.


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## torger (Jan 30, 2015)

It's supposed to be a medium format killer, don't you think? In that case ISO6400 is plenty. Still seems as an unlikely upper limit coming from Canon, but maybe they want to sell the lower megapixel cameras for high ISO work.


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## Maiaibing (Jan 30, 2015)

scott_m said:


> But 5fps sounds good for something like this. I wonder 2 things: what the RAW buffer is like, and if it goes any faster/longer in either of the crop modes. 1.3 = ~30Mp and 1.6 = ~19.8Mp.



This is what I expected as a minimum but it is good news in more than one way. I expect it can do 8 fps @ 30 mpix and 10 fps @ 19.8 mpix. If so that would be a serious fps upgrade from the relatively slow 5DIII into 7DII fast shooting territory - and still with somewhat more mpix than the 5DIII.

Overall the 1.3 and 1.6 crop modes will add a lot of flexibility to the camera by offering real fast shutter speeds. I could easily see myself often go for a compromise 8 fps @ 30 mpix for action shots.


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 30, 2015)

Maiaibing said:


> scott_m said:
> 
> 
> > But 5fps sounds good for something like this. I wonder 2 things: what the RAW buffer is like, and if it goes any faster/longer in either of the crop modes. 1.3 = ~30Mp and 1.6 = ~19.8Mp.
> ...



For 8-10 fps, they'd have to give it a 1-series type mirror/shutter assembly. I think it's more likely the crop modes will get you fewer MP...and that's it.


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## Maiaibing (Jan 30, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> Maiaibing said:
> 
> 
> > scott_m said:
> ...



Hope not. That would make it more a marketing gimmick than a truly useful feature. Nikon 810 does 7 fps in crop mode. We'll see.


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## Maiaibing (Jan 30, 2015)

dilbert said:


> Not if you're birding, unless you want lots more filler around the subject (bird).
> 
> Think of it as "extra reach" modes



I would prefer to crop myself if this is the case. But of course others may see it differently.


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## 1Zach1 (Jan 30, 2015)

So with the 5Ds/R and 11-24L specs being leaked, does this mean no M3?


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## crashpc (Jan 30, 2015)

No AA filter, as I get aliasing artifacts with AA filter anyway. So I could get some resolution at least....


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## vscd (Jan 30, 2015)

The BEST thing on this rumour? *The 5D Mark 3 will get cheaper real soon! *


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## whatta (Jan 30, 2015)

Chaitanya said:


> excited to see the new Eos XxxD, although wouldnt mind to see announcement of Ef 60mm macro along with it.



Full frame macro lens to be announced with a rebel?


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## whatta (Feb 2, 2015)

lw said:


> NorbR said:
> 
> 
> > What surprises me the most is the idea that all these announcements would come together ... Is it common for Canon to release several major products like these all together? Because these all do feel like major announcements, first high MP cameras, first rectilinear lens to 11mm, the Rebel which is always their biggest seller, the M3 ... arguably lower profile, but still an important step for the future of the line. It feels like each of those would make a big enough splash if they were announced on their own, I'd be somewhat surprised to see them all announced together (or close to each other) at the risk of stealing each other's thunder ...
> ...



haha, very funny


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## whatta (Feb 2, 2015)

bcflood said:


> I am curious if there will be two Rebels, like previously predicted, or just one. I rather liked the idea of a "Rebel Plus" that had some fancier features on it but was still cheaper than a 70D. Guess all will be revealed next week! ;D



hopefully 750d + SL2.


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## mackguyver (Feb 2, 2015)

I wish we knew more about pricing. I'm trying to decide what to do - I'd really like to order the 11-24 f/4 AND the 5DS R, but I don't know if that's doable. I wonder if the 5DS(R) will be around 5DIII prices or will move up into the $4k US range.


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## PureClassA (Feb 2, 2015)

mackguyver said:


> I wish we knew more about pricing. I'm trying to decide what to do - I'd really like to order the 11-24 f/4 AND the 5DS R, but I don't know if that's doable. I wonder if the 5DS(R) will be around 5DIII prices or will move up into the $4k US range.



It'll be sniffing $4k but hoping for closer to $3500. If I was Canon I'd be leery about breaking that $4k cap considering their competition, and they have shown us some very surprising things lately price-wise. We still don't have anything concrete on the 11-24 yet do we?


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## mackguyver (Feb 2, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> mackguyver said:
> 
> 
> > I wish we knew more about pricing. I'm trying to decide what to do - I'd really like to order the 11-24 f/4 AND the 5DS R, but I don't know if that's doable. I wonder if the 5DS(R) will be around 5DIII prices or will move up into the $4k US range.
> ...


No, I think the latest was somewhere around $2,800-3,000. I'm definitely leaning towards the lens (1st) as more pixels is more of a want than a need, and I've been lusting over the lens since it was first rumored. OTOH, I can still sell my 5DIII and put that towards the camera, so I'm hoping to buy both.


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## Tugela (Feb 2, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> mackguyver said:
> 
> 
> > I wish we knew more about pricing. I'm trying to decide what to do - I'd really like to order the 11-24 f/4 AND the 5DS R, but I don't know if that's doable. I wonder if the 5DS(R) will be around 5DIII prices or will move up into the $4k US range.
> ...



Since the camera is presumably aimed at "professionals", we should expect Canon's version of professional pricing, so likely over 5k.

Canon does not appear to be paying any attention to what the competition are doing in recent years, so don't expect pricing to compete now.


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## PureClassA (Feb 2, 2015)

Tugela said:


> PureClassA said:
> 
> 
> > mackguyver said:
> ...



Explain the 7D2 and the new 100-400mkII then? Explain the 16-35 f4? Explain the 5D3 at $3500 which is aimed squarely at the very heart of professional photographers? The 1DX is as well , but it's a different beast altogether.

PS - Notice the big rebates and drops on the 5D3 recently? At BH post rebate it's $2799. you think Canon is dumping money down this cuz the 5DS is gonna be $5000+? No. Were that the case, they would leave the 5D3 alone. The price drops and rebates are to make room in the $3500-4000 range for the new bodies. Read between the lines.


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## PureClassA (Feb 2, 2015)

And I know how much everyone here adores Ken Rockwell, but my money is on him when he's calling $3799 for the 5DS (also says release March 17th)

http://kenrockwell.com/canon/5ds.htm


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## DRR (Feb 2, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> And I know how much everyone here adores Ken Rockwell, but my money is on him when he's calling $3799 for the 5DS (also says release March 17th)
> 
> http://kenrockwell.com/canon/5ds.htm



I bet he's right. $3500-$4000. He just picked an easy number right in the middle to minimize how "off" he would be.

For launch, I don't think they need to price it any lower. It's the kind of thing where if you must have it, a few hundred, or even a thousand dollars, isn't going to stop you. You'll make up the difference after one job.

The 5D III is still a very capable general purpose FF camera, I don't think the 5Ds is a camera every wedding shooter will be itching to upgrade to right off the bat like the 5D III was.


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## PureClassA (Feb 2, 2015)

Durvile said:


> Popphoto magazine made a mistake on its february issue, probably showing photos of the next issue. Seems like the next Canon bodies. Sorry for my english!
> Att
> Durvile



Got a link to this page? Website or actual magazine itself??


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## jrista (Feb 3, 2015)

Hmm. A 53mp FF camera makes more sense to me than a 50.6mp camera. If it's 53mp, it's the same pixel size as the 7D II. If it's 50.6mp, it's got larger pixels than the 7D II. Seems logical (given how Canon seems to think) for them to reuse pixel technology. 


Anything is possible, though...


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## PureClassA (Feb 3, 2015)

Seems like 53MP is the total count with 50.6 as the usable area, according to rumor specs that is


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## StudentOfLight (Feb 3, 2015)

DRR said:


> PureClassA said:
> 
> 
> > And I know how much everyone here adores Ken Rockwell, but my money is on him when he's calling $3799 for the 5DS (also says release March 17th)
> ...


KR says: "12 channel parallel readout." That would be extremely disappointing for anyone hoping to get cleaner shadows in the low ISOs and more dynamic range. For me at least 65% of my photography is at ISO 100-200.


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## jeffa4444 (Feb 3, 2015)

If the new cameras come in at $ 3500 - 4000 then Canon will get limited sales. Globally full-frame cameras costing more than $ 2250 account for less than 1 - 2% of camera sales and whilst they may retain much better margins they will not offset declining sales of all other cameras. DSLRs are a mature market, cameras only released 12-18 months ago are already 33% less in many cases and disposable income in Europe in particular is still contrained. 

The Canon 5d MKIII moved up considerably in price from the Canon 5d MKII to push it further would be commercial suicide.


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## AvTvM (Feb 3, 2015)

jeffa4444 said:


> If the new cameras come in at $ 3500 - 4000 then Canon will get limited sales. Globally full-frame cameras costing more than $ 2250 account for less than 1 - 2% of camera sales and whilst they may retain much better margins they will not offset declining sales of all other cameras. DSLRs are a mature market, cameras only released 12-18 months ago are already 33% less in many cases and disposable income in Europe in particular is still contrained.
> The Canon 5d MKIII moved up considerably in price from the Canon 5d MKII to push it further would be commercial suicide.



+1


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## 3kramd5 (Feb 3, 2015)

StudentOfLight said:


> KR says: "12 channel parallel readout."



He also says 1080/60p, 7 FPS, ISO 100-16,000, and some other stuff that doesn't match any of the other rumor sites. Shrug, it's all guesswork at this point.


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## tron (Feb 3, 2015)

3kramd5 said:


> StudentOfLight said:
> 
> 
> > KR says: "12 channel parallel readout."
> ...


7fps (for full frame mode) would be nice but I do not believe it even for a dual digic 6!


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## PureClassA (Feb 3, 2015)

tron said:


> 3kramd5 said:
> 
> 
> > StudentOfLight said:
> ...



Isn't the original 7D strapped with dual Digic 4? That was 8FPS and 18.1MP The 7D2 is Dual Digic 6 and 20.2MP with 10FPS. Seems to me there's more headroom in those processors to allow a couple more FPS than 5 even with 50MP. I suspect it's more an issue with the shutter assembly than the CPU power. This of course is assuming the rumor specs are ACTUAL specs. the 5D3 only did 6FPS at 22MP with a single Digic 5+. They save the super high end shutters for the 1 series.


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## jrista (Feb 3, 2015)

PureClassA said:



> tron said:
> 
> 
> > 3kramd5 said:
> ...




There is more to slower frame rate than simply whether you have the bandwidth or not. The higher your operating frequency in an IC, the more noise. At a slower readout rate, you can run the ADC units slower, which will introduce less noise. This is actually one of the big reasons serious astrophotographers get CCD cameras...most have a "high speed" mode and a "high quality" mode. The high speed mode usually has a readout frequency for components of 8-10Mhz, while high quality mode drops that to 800khz-1mhz. The difference in read noise can be quite significant, resulting in stops more dynamic range.

For a "top IQ" camera, I am honestly a little surprised by the 5fps...but Canon is probably trying to stay competitive with the D810. Still, better 5fps for the 5Ds models, than 8-10fps. 

The increase in readout channels would also help there...as that divides up all the pixels to be read out among more ADC units, allowing each one to be reduced on operating frequency even more. Still, Exmor trounces Canon in this area...with column-parallel ADC. I still think Canon will have a problem with read noise...increasing parallelism from 8 to 12 is nothing.


----------

