# What Will The EOS 5D Mark IV Bring to the Table?



## Canon Rumors Guy (Jan 31, 2016)

```
With the specifications of the EOS-1D X Mark II being made public, the obvious next question is what can we expect to see in the EOS 5D Mark IV, which is coming in 2016.</p>
<p>The EOS 5D Mark III followed the EOS-1D X quite closely in on paper specifications. Below is a prediction based of what we think we could see inside the next 5D.</p>
<ul>
<li>28mp</li>
<li>9fps</li>
<li>DIGIC 6+ (They won’t launch DIGIC 7 so closely to a flagship camera)</li>
<li>61 point AF</li>
<li>CFast & SD</li>
<li>Touchscreen</li>
<li>Built-in GPS & Wifi</li>
<li>Lighter weight</li>
</ul>
<p>The biggest question will be in regards to 4K video capture. It appears that on the EOS-1D X Mark II, you will be able to record 4K video to the CFast 2.0 slot. Will Canon put a CFast 2.0 slot in the 5D Mark IV along with the SD card slot and do away with CF? I don’t see them taking the SD card slot out of the camera in favor of dual slots for CF and CFast. Everyone we’ve spoken to has said 4K recording will not be part of the EOS 5D Mark III direct replacement camera, but that can obviously change.</p>
<p>A video oriented version of the 5D such as a 5D C? It’s possible and has been long rumored, but nothing reported can be considered reliable at this point.</p>
<span id="pty_trigger"></span>
```


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## Big_Ant_TV_Media (Jan 31, 2016)

22-28mp
7-8 fps since 5d3 is 6fps "CANT BE 9fps you'd be in 7d2 10fps territory" 
(7-8 would be great for sports/action shooters like me)
65 af points like the 7d2
touchscreen with anti flare and smudge
anti flicker 1 or 2.0 (same or newer version) like the 7d2
gps if not wifi 1 of the 2 if not neither
more robust body even better weather sealing
DPAF TECH & STM only stm dpaf lens are combo efs lenses eg: 24-105stm 55-250mm and 50mm1.8 stm
1080-4K VIDEO "MILLIONS OF PHOTOGS AROUND THE WORLD ARE BETTING NO 4K"


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## DSLR (Jan 31, 2016)

9 fps would be nice but I think that's a bit ambitious ~ maybe 7fps in ff and higher in cropped mode? don't see 28mp either. Probably more in the 24 range.


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## whothafunk (Jan 31, 2016)

1DX Mark II specs made public? All i've seen are still speculation topics about it with question mark at the end.


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## unfocused (Jan 31, 2016)

I'm curious if this is based on leaks/rumors or just speculation. CR? Rating please.

If just speculation, then I would say I doubt some of it.

9fps would be nice, but I expect it to be closer to 8fps (sufficiently slower as to not challenge either the 1DX series or the 7D)

Like the 1DX, high ISO performance is more important than higher resolution, so I would prefer and predict something in the 24mp range.

Some autofocus improvement. Possibly mirroring the 7DII, but that might be optimistic. It can't be as good as the 1Dx II, but should be better than the current 5DIII, so it needs better tracking.

I seriously doubt it will have a Cfast slot. I expect it to retain the same SD/CF configuration. As the 1DX II shows, Canon is not ready to abandon CF cards yet and the CFast is a good differentiation for the 1D series. 

Touchscreen and WiFi would be great.


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## Mac Duderson (Jan 31, 2016)

Noooooo!!! 28mp!!  If people want high mp those bodies are already out there. I have 30TB of drives for work already and don't need bigger files. Frick Canon keep it down in low 20mp's. I hate all this magapixel war stuff again.


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## Hill Benson (Jan 31, 2016)

Built in GPS and Wi-fi - I hope they don't include these if they have to compromise build quality. 

4k video - Considering the impact the 5DII had on cinematographers I have my fingers crossed that 4k will make it to the 5DmkIV
Antiflicker - yes please!
Metering on the selected focus point would be a nice touch but I think that would be entering too much 1D territory


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## pwp (Jan 31, 2016)

That spec list looks probable, possible and altogether likely. While I voted for twin Cfast in the 1DX2 thread, I sure wouldn't hope for a Cfast/SD match-up. Twin CF or twin Cfast, but not another mash-up please!

Do what Nikon has done, and offer the choice.

-pw


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## JMZawodny (Jan 31, 2016)

I'm on the fence. I've been shooting the 5D2 and 7D2. The rumored specs of the 1Dx2 are likely sufficient to get me to upgrade, however, I plan to wait until I have definitive info on the 5D4 as well as real user reviews of the 1Dx2. So, what will the 5D4 have to offer to garner my interest? When I need the fps, I have the 7D2, so 7fps out of the 5D4 will do. I regularly shoot ISO 6400 on the 5D2, but I'd really like to shoot at ISO 12800 with the same level of noise. That seems like a reasonable request. I do expect both the 1Dx2 and 5D4 to offer a significant improvement in DR by incorporating on-chip ADC. I like my AF points to light up red, that is why I was never really interested in the 5D3. I have little interest in 4k video unless it comes with a high quality codec, so the 5D4 can live down to my expectations and I won't care too much. The spec I care most about is AF performance. If the 1Dx2 is the only camera that offers a respectable spread of AF points that work at f/8, that alone will make the decision for me. Given how the AF of the 1 series cameras are always a step above the other Canon offerings, I do not expect this to change and I'll most probably end up with the 1Dx2. I am prepared to be surprised, however.


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## pwp (Jan 31, 2016)

JMZawodny said:


> ...I like my AF points to light up red, that is why I was never really interested in the 5D3.



OMG yes please. The 5DIII & 7DII AF point blackout drives me crazy. I lose shots all the time searching for the AF point. When you shoot for spontaneity the illuminated current AF point is pure gold. 

-pw


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## jebrady03 (Feb 1, 2016)

I'd like to see a 5Dc so that people will stop calling the 5D that.


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## hmatthes (Feb 1, 2016)

If we look at "applications", most of us gravitate to one body of another based upon our primary subject interest.
1D.. = The top of the line, "does everything better", cost be damned machine whose specs exceed lesser cameras.
5D.. = Image quality above all else. AF needs to be very close to 1D, DR likewise. All else is nice, not necessary.
6D.. = FF compromise that can do everything more than adequately but with excellent DR
7D.. = Performance above everything else. Highest frame rate, fastest AF selection, images that can be cropped.
##D = The best blend of the above for prosumers. Most features, fewest pinnacles compared to above.
###D= Amazing quantity of features that may never be realized, great Green Zone and icons for situations
I went from several great film bodies (remember A2e eye-control?) to the 20D and never looked back.
Now with the 70D I have nearly everything in a body that lends itself to fast, intuitive field work and GREAT IMAGES!
Wanting to move to FF for superior ISO performance and RAW image creation, I'll wait for the 5D4 so as not to lose DPAF, WiFi, gain GPS, gain DR etc. The 70D can remain my video camera with all the STM glass.
Canon, I'd be glad to test one for you!!! ;D


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## roxics (Feb 1, 2016)

It would be great if it had a CFast 2 slot as I'm sure that would help drive the price of that media down. But I'm skeptical of that happening. Even so you don't need CFast to shoot 4k, depending on the way you encode that 4K. CFast would certainly help if it's higher bitrate 4K and the Magic Lantern guys would probably love it, which would be nice, but again it's not something I would count on. 

At this point I'd be happy with a nice clean 4K image, using the full sensor width(unlike Nikon or Panasonic which crop) and recorded at 100Mbps to SD or CF card at frame rates up to 30fps.


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## wtlloyd (Feb 1, 2016)

Yep. Enjoy that cloud sandwich. I'll wait for the meat and potatoes to be served.




whothafunk said:


> 1DX Mark II specs made public? All i've seen are still speculation topics about it with question mark at the end.


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## Zv (Feb 1, 2016)

unfocused said:


> I'm curious if this is based on leaks/rumors or just speculation. CR? Rating please.
> 
> If just speculation, then I would say I doubt some of it.
> 
> ...



+1 My thoughts exactly!


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## Jack Douglas (Feb 1, 2016)

pwp said:


> JMZawodny said:
> 
> 
> > ...I like my AF points to light up red, that is why I was never really interested in the 5D3.
> ...



Neuro says this is no longer possible with the present tech change from the 1D IV. Has he ever been wrong?  

Jack


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## JMZawodny (Feb 1, 2016)

Jack Douglas said:


> pwp said:
> 
> 
> > JMZawodny said:
> ...



It is not like it is Rocket Science.

Not even a neurosurgeon https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THNPmhBl-8I


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## mclaren777 (Feb 1, 2016)

I'll buy two 5D4s at launch if it has the following two features...

1. A sensor that is ISO-invariant
2. AF sensitivity of at least -3 EV

That's all Canon needs to do to please me.


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## scottkinfw (Feb 1, 2016)

better AF, modest iso bump, modest iq, modest bump in fps, modes improvement in shadows. The rest is gravy.

For me, focusing is most important.

sek


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## privatebydesign (Feb 1, 2016)

dilbert said:


> btw, if you look at the prices of Canon's last pro 1-series film camera, the EOS 1V, it makes you want to cry when you see 1DX/1Ds pricing.



I paid a touch over $2,000 for each of my two 1VHS's when new, at the time Vevia cost me $1 per frame after film and processing costs, it didn't take long for my 1 series digital cameras to be considerably cheaper to run........ 

I've got around 200,000 images from my main 1Ds MkIII and it cost me a touch over $4,000.


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## Antono Refa (Feb 1, 2016)

BigAntTVProductions said:


> DPAF TECH & STM only stm dpaf lens are combo efs lenses eg: 24-105stm 55-250mm and 50mm1.8 stm
> 1080-4K VIDEO "MILLIONS OF PHOTOGS AROUND THE WORLD ARE BETTING NO 4K"



At the moment there are three FF lenses with STM:

* EF 40mm f/2.8 STM

* EF 50mm f/1.8 STM

* EF 24-105mm f/3.5-5.6 IS STM

Those are EF lenses, not EF. The 50mm is FF normal lens, and the 24-105mm has the same focal range as the 5D's kit lens, and makes little sense on APS-C.


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## tpatana (Feb 1, 2016)

If 1DX2 is not good enough, I'll probably wait for this announcement and then decide between 5D4 and 5DsR.


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## Sabaki (Feb 1, 2016)

I'd be happy with near similar specs but would like the following:

- Cleaner base ISO
- Better DR
- Dedicated processor for ITR


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## In-The-Dark (Feb 1, 2016)

AF point-linked Spot metering would be awesome!


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## HighLowISO (Feb 1, 2016)

Sounds like lots of speculation still. 

I'm definitely in the camp any 5D mkIV (if that's what they call it) will not launch without something that Canon feels comfortable calling 4K video. This falls into the basics these days.

I was right that Canon would not release the 1DmkII without WiFi support (even if it is a dongle of sorts) and I think 4K on a 5DmkIV is essentially the same type of basic requirement at this level. Canon not only released basic WiFi they went all out an offered a comprehensive solution even if they could not get it built-in.

I see 4K much the same for the 5D series. It's needed and it's needed NOW! Seems like a given, but OK people make mistakes so we'll have to wait to see. If the 5Ds was selling better I doubt we'd see it in 2016, but I think maybe there will at least be an announcement later in the year.

I hope that they will maintain CF card support, but that's mostly because I don't need CFast. ...but if it's critical for their 4K support I hope they make dual CFast, and drop the SD card on this series...

That's my speculation... worth less than 2cents, but you didn't even pay that.


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## dolina (Feb 1, 2016)

TBH the 5Ds should have had CFast. 1066x is toooooooo slow.


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## shift_excpectations (Feb 1, 2016)

Hello everybody, as most of you, I'm really interested in the "new" 5D, but is there any more precise time for the release?


> With the specifications of the EOS-1D X Mark II being made public, the obvious next question is what can we expect to see in the EOS 5D Mark IV, which is coming in 2016.


Spring 2016? Late autumn? What do you think or does somebody already know the time WHEN?

I expect 7-8 fps, do neither need 4k for video nor 28mpx  or WIFI.
What I'd like to have is a touch screen, USB3.0 but most important more DR (in the range of Nikons D800), better ISO performance at 100-400 and an enhanced AF system coming closer and closer to the "old" 1DX.


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## Maximilian (Feb 1, 2016)

Hmm... 
This spec looks not so much tempting to me. 

I don't care about more MP, 4K, I don't know if I'd need 9 FPS, I wouldn't want CFast + SD as I'd had to buy new Cards (use CF now), don't know what the new AF system would bring and the other things... so-so.

Only thing that would make me move: Much (!!!) better RAW OOC IQ at higher ISO. 

Otherwise I can save my money for glas and wait what a 5D5 (or wht it's named) could bring...


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## tahoetoeknee (Feb 1, 2016)

What do you think the release price will be?


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## Shomiyato (Feb 1, 2016)

I feel canon should leave the 5 series as the "S" studio models. And maybe push the 6 series closer to a more "average" full frame line. Unless they decided to leave the 6 series relatively simple and bring back the eos 3 to the digital age, which was far more advanced than the eos 5 of the time. So for full frame you would have...

1d: best all around, critical photography application.

3d: best application for general use. Slower fps. Excellent IQ, focus system not as complex as 1 series. (24-36 MP)

5d: studio only use system, high MP count. High IQ at lower ISO settings. (40-50 MP)

6d: budget version of 3 series / all other ff. Image quality rival that of the 3 series if not, equal to. More "newer" technology to lure people on the fence looking for the "what's hot" option. (18-24 MP)

A three camera option , minus the top line 1 series, I believe would definitely be very competitive move for canon instead of flooding the market with a single line that covers many possible options. Could be a better option from a production pov to make the same body for different models however, ala Sony a7 line. Who knows just throwing my 2 cents out there.


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## Diko (Feb 1, 2016)

BigAntTVProductions said:


> ....
> 7-8 fps since 5d3 is 6fps "CANT BE 9fps you'd be in 7d2 10fps territory"
> (7-8 would be great for sports/action shooters like me)....



Why not? Please note: The best seller is NOT the flagship. ;-)

Another posts again compares the 7d2 to the 5d4... Why!?!?

The one is with smaller CROP. OK - good for sport but if they have the power why not more FPS. It will always stay away from monstrous 14 or 16 fps of 1dx2.

Though I have to admit that the rumors ARE really a little overkill compared to the official 1Dx2 specs. There's no room for a distinguished gap between the *1D* and *5D* series.



dilbert said:


> DIGIC 4 was launched in the 50D first, before the 5DII.
> 
> So here's a thought...
> 
> The 80D launches first with DIGIC 7 and the 5DIV after that, also with DIGIC 7.



Good point there.



mclaren777 said:


> ...1. A sensor that is ISO-invariant....



What do you mean by that?



dolina said:


> TBH the 5Ds should have had CFast. 1066x is toooooooo slow.


+1




Shomiyato said:


> ...
> 
> 1d: best all around, critical photography application.
> 
> ...



That is OUTRAGEOUS! You are troll, right? ;-)

IMO "high-pixel-low-ISO" medium-format-like idea of yours is out of the question. And you know why? Because *SONY* and *Pentax* had already created a medium format ISO 200*K* monster for some time.

Nobody needs a low-ISO high-pixel FF body. The market has what to offer already. 

Low ISO is not the problem for higher pixel body and the market wouldn't recognize it. After all if you shoot studio you would go MF not FF. And there the competition is gorgeous. And probably CANON's digits show that the expensive MF sensor will not bring them that much of profit. 


As for 6D from what I have heard they will put more features and make it more expensive yet away from the 5d Seriers zone.

-----

I personally need high ISO (at least 51*K* in the native range) and 28-36 MP (range) in a solid body.


A wi-fi is a bonus, but ONLY if it's in a solid body. Remeber - _CR stated that Canon has already dealt with that problem_.





In that same article is stated:
"_...a configuration in which the wireless communication unit is arranged on the inclined surface (Dach surface) of the pentaprism such that the accessory shoe does not disturb a radio wave upon wireless communication._"


IMO the innovation for this generation of CANON cameras will be DUAL PIXEL AF (remember - the original 1Dx doesn't have it) and Movie Servo AF. No more no less.

If Movie Servo AF is that much cool and usable IMO they will split and 5DC will have it. And 5Dm4 - will NOT. 
Both will have 4k.

The reason: cause everyone already have it. They can't stay behind. 

But if actually the Movie Servo AF is not that awesome - they'll make only 5D mark 4.


Please excuse me if I didn't verbalized it correctly.

*Touchscreen* - would be nice for a swift (predefined) focus zone selection, but ONLY if there is a an oldschool slide lock. Otherwise *we all* be unpleasantly amazed of our nose's opinion where what the right setting should be.

A _*USB 3.0*_ is mandatory and _*USB C*_ is a vivid dream of mine ;-)


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## BrunoMatos (Feb 1, 2016)

10 fps please, make it a fullframe 7d2!


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## vscd (Feb 1, 2016)

PLEASE NO Touch- or TILTScreen! Keep that for toys. But otherwise some 1DX Mark II specs could drop down into the 5D M4


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## Diko (Feb 1, 2016)

vscd said:


> PLEASE NO Touch- or TILTScreen! Keep that for toys. But otherwise some 1DX Mark II specs could drop down into the 5D M4


No touch - I understand. But why against tilt?


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## Silverstream (Feb 1, 2016)

I also want a reticulated 3.2" screen, touchscreen, USB3. I had a camera with touchscreen and it is very handy and fast for image review. Clients find it easy and intuitive to operate as well.

Reticulated screen is important for me as an event wedding shooter as it is not infrequent for me to have to go high with the camera for crowd shots or for those moments when I don't want to get on the floor for those type shots.

USB3 would be great for whenever tethered. It would seriously speed up the shoot and review process.


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## gmrza (Feb 1, 2016)

pwp said:


> That spec list looks probable, possible and altogether likely. While I voted for twin Cfast in the 1DX2 thread, I sure wouldn't hope for a Cfast/SD match-up. Twin CF or twin Cfast, but not another mash-up please!
> 
> Do what Nikon has done, and offer the choice.
> 
> -pw



It's a difficult one for Canon to get right. Lots of people will have big investments in CF cards. Anyone who doesn't specifically need the speed CFast will be bummed if the 5DIV does not support CF. A CFast/CF mix may be the best compromise, as a lot of 5DIII users haev much larger investments in CF than SD cards. CFast cards are still quite expensive, so many users will want to ramp up slowly.
For a user who wants to separate RAW and JPG files onto separate cards, the CF/CFast mix may still work as a 32GB CFast card would be more than sufficient to hold JPGs while using existing existing CF cards for RAW. As the cost of CFast drops, the user can then swap to using CFast as primary storage and CF for JPG backups.

I don't think Canon can afford not to introduce CFastm but at the same time, Canon needs to think about existing users who have lots of CF cards.


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## dolina (Feb 2, 2016)

Just surpass the specifications of the following bodies or equal the 2016 bodies at a $2,500 price point. 

2016 - Nikon D500
2015 - Leica M Typ 262
2015 - Leica SL Type 601
2015 - Sony a7S II
2015 - Sony a7R II
2015 - Leica M Mono Typ 246
2015 - Nikon D810A
2015 - Canon 5Ds


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## tron (Feb 2, 2016)

Canon Rumors said:


> With the specifications of the EOS-1D X Mark II being made public, the obvious next question is what can we expect to see in the EOS 5D Mark IV, which is coming in 2016.</p>
> <p>The EOS 5D Mark III followed the EOS-1D X quite closely in on paper specifications. Below is a prediction based of what we think we could see inside the next 5D.</p>
> <ul>
> <li>28mp</li>
> ...


My opinion:
1.I think CFAST and SD is a strange combination. A more down to earth approach is to keep the CF/SD combination only this time with better SD controller (even 7D2 is much better than 5D3 on this matter).
2. 9 fps would put it to sports category (assuming AF system is fast). Remember a few years ago the norm fps for sports was around 10.
3. 4K no opinion (or interest here) but if it were to have 4K that would be limited to 30fps.
4. 28Mp: I would prefer a smaller number say 24 but since it will most probably be a general purpose FF camera they will try to strike a balance between 1DxII and 5Ds5. I personally prefer it to be a low light freak...
5. 61 point AF OK, we all hope/want to be the same as the one in 1DxII but how about AF speed (just like 1Dx vs 5D3).

Now, where is my 5D4? ;D


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## David the street guy (Feb 2, 2016)

BrunoMatos said:


> 10 fps please, make it a fullframe 7d2!



I like that idea!

I'm about to buy a new camera, and I expect the 5D Mark IV to be it, but only if the specs are right: what I'm looking for is just that, a full frame 7D2 with great sensitivity in low light situations, an amazing autofocus and a tough magnesium alloy body fully weatherized. 

Does anyone know (or believe he/she might know…) when something like that can be expected?


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## brad-man (Feb 2, 2016)

David the street guy said:


> BrunoMatos said:
> 
> 
> > 10 fps please, make it a fullframe 7d2!
> ...



see this thread:
http://www.canonrumors.com/announcing-the-canon-eos-1d-x-mark-ii/


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## jarrodeu (Feb 2, 2016)

Mac Duderson said:


> Noooooo!!! 28mp!!  If people want high mp those bodies are already out there. I have 30TB of drives for work already and don't need bigger files. Frick Canon keep it down in low 20mp's. I hate all this magapixel war stuff again.


 A 33% increase in resolution for a camera that was launched over 7 years ago (5DMKII). Why is this such a shock?

Jarrod


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## tcmatthews (Feb 2, 2016)

I would like to see

32mp dual pixel autofocus sensor and keep current ISO capabilities
C-fast/SD UHS-II
Fully articulated Screen
4k recording
Upgraded autofocus system
lighter due to new build materials
Built in GPS
Built in Wifi
6-8 fps

Personally I would like a parallel release of a smaller 5D C compact smaller version of the 5D camera. I much prefer the size of the 6D to the 5D/7D cameras. I think that I am not the only one who would prefer a more compact full featured Canon Camera. If it does not have 32mp and an articulating screen I will loose all interest and wait for the 6d II. I thought that CF should have been dropped when the 5D III was announced. It is functionally obsolete and past time it is abandoned.


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## Don Haines (Feb 2, 2016)

tcmatthews said:


> I thought that CF should have been dropped when the 5D III was announced. It is functionally obsolete and past time it is abandoned.


That's guaranteed to be a controversial statement..... but I think you are right.

If you want speed, go for Cfast.... if you want convenience and compatibility (at a darn fast speed) go SD card with UHS-2 interface. CF kind of falls in the middle.


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## ranplett (Feb 2, 2016)

I'll play along, since I'm really jonesing for an upgrade to my 5D mkII. Just imagine how sweet that's gonna be.

+ between 24 and 30mp is sufficient. 24mp seems a little low in a world of 36, 41, and 51mp DSLRs these days.

+ 9 fps would be AWESOME for HDR shooters to help lessen ghosting. If the 5Ds is capable of 5 fps at 51mp, shouldn't a ~28mp cam be able to capture 9 fps?

+ I'll take as much DR as I can get, thanks.

+ 4K. It's 2016. I'd love a high res. video feature that I never use. But it will be so nice to have!

+ a few nice inclusions would be wifi (could have used that about 100x), really capable face detection / eye focus, and a lighter body because holding a camera for 12 hours can weigh you down.

+ By far my MOST sought after upgrade would be a 135mm f2 IS L.


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## tpatana (Feb 2, 2016)

BigAntTVProductions said:


> tpatana said:
> 
> 
> > If 1DX2 is not good enough, I'll probably wait for this announcement and then decide between 5D4 and 5DsR.
> ...



Not sure completely what you say there, but I currently have 1DX, and recently sold my 5D3. So if 1DX2 is good enough compared to 1DX, I'll get one. If not, I'll get 5D4 or 5DsR instead for studio oriented shoots, and keep the 1DX for sports.


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## Sayan (Feb 2, 2016)

8fps for sure not more than tht 
remember 1dx have 12fps and 5dmk3 just half of tht 6fps .. so 7fps or may be 8fps bt no 9fps ;D


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## Ryananthony (Feb 2, 2016)

-1 Stop higher iso usage and banding improvement 
-Spot metering linked to af
-8 FPS
-Either wifi,nfc, or bluetooth
-Don't limit write times to SD and also UHS-II compatible or two CF
-Adjust Kelvins without going to q menu
-Exposure comp in manual with auto iso
-Lit AF points

Oh wait, was this not a wishlist?

I think we will see. 

-1 stop higher iso usage and banding improvement  1/2 stop higher iso usage.
-Spot metering linked to af
-8 Frames 6-7 FPS
-Either wifi,nfc, or bluetooth
-Don't limit write times to SD and also UHS-II compatible or two CF 1 CF 1 SD(not UHS-II)
-Adjust kelvins without going to q menu
-Exposure comp in manual with auto iso
-Lit AF points
-24MP
-4K very similar or the same as 1DXII


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## Diko (Feb 2, 2016)

ranplett said:


> I'll play along, since I'm really jonesing for an upgrade to my 5D mkII. Just imagine how sweet that's gonna be.
> + between 24 and 30mp is sufficient. 24mp seems a little low in a world of 36, 41, and 51mp DSLRs these days.
> + 9 fps would be AWESOME for HDR shooters to help lessen ghosting. If the 5Ds is capable of 5 fps at 51mp, shouldn't a ~28mp cam be able to capture 9 fps?...


+1 seems quite logical to me.



ranplett said:


> ... + a few nice inclusions would be wifi (could have used that about 100x), really capable face detection / eye focus, and a lighter body because holding a camera for 12 hours can weigh you down.



+1 -> AC wifi means with 1Dx2 about 1 RAW/s wich is awesome for tethering! But I highly doubt. You see: they launched a proprietary wi-fi accessory that costs over $500. :-(


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## Sporgon (Feb 2, 2016)

On chip ADC by the looks of it.......

Goodbye trolls, hello shadows )


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## drjlo (Feb 2, 2016)

Sporgon said:


> On chip ADC by the looks of it.......



On-chip ADC with noise and DR performance in line with 1Dx II sample photos would be most welcomed !


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## bmwzimmer (Feb 3, 2016)

I'd like to see a smaller body similar to the current 6D. There's plenty of real estate there to maintain all the current buttons and wouldn't mind removing one or two now that more than likely we'll have a touch screen.


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## JMZawodny (Feb 3, 2016)

JMZawodny said:


> I'm on the fence. I've been shooting the 5D2 and 7D2. The rumored specs of the 1Dx2 are likely sufficient to get me to upgrade, however, I plan to wait until I have definitive info on the 5D4 as well as real user reviews of the 1Dx2. So, what will the 5D4 have to offer to garner my interest? When I need the fps, I have the 7D2, so 7fps out of the 5D4 will do. I regularly shoot ISO 6400 on the 5D2, but I'd really like to shoot at ISO 12800 with the same level of noise. That seems like a reasonable request. I do expect both the 1Dx2 and 5D4 to offer a significant improvement in DR by incorporating on-chip ADC. I like my AF points to light up red, that is why I was never really interested in the 5D3. I have little interest in 4k video unless it comes with a high quality codec, so the 5D4 can live down to my expectations and I won't care too much. The spec I care most about is AF performance. If the 1Dx2 is the only camera that offers a respectable spread of AF points that work at f/8, that alone will make the decision for me. Given how the AF of the 1 series cameras are always a step above the other Canon offerings, I do not expect this to change and I'll most probably end up with the 1Dx2. I am prepared to be surprised, however.



Now that the 1Dx2 specs are out and some initial preview reports are trickling in, I'll refine my original 5D4 predictions.

- 28mp sensor
- High ISO performance 0.5 to 1 full stop less than 1Dx2 (still pretty fantastic though)
- A single Digic 6+
- Resulting in 7fps max
- Proper support for UDMA7 and fast XQD - NO CFast
- No 4k video - better FullHD codec up to 60fps with DPAF
- AF will be 1Dx2-like except only a small cluster of points will support AF at f/8.
- Flippy touch screen LCD
- LP-E6N Battery

So in short, a significant upgrade.


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## Efka76 (Feb 3, 2016)

My predictions are the following:

1) 24-28 MP (I would be really surprised if I see 36 MP).
2) 1-2 fps more than current 5DIII. In reality I think it will be 1 fps more. Canon definitely does not want to go to 7DII fps area 
3) Built in GPS (this is simple feature which is not hard to include)
4) 4k (however, with some restrictions). If there is 4k, then CFast will be included as well. 
5) Better AF - 65 focus points as in 7DII. What it would be really good to have wider spread of these points as in 1Dx
6) Better noise reduction, native iso still 25,600 (I do not think that Canon will match 1DxII specs in 5D4)
7) Anti-flickering, DPAF
8) Better weather sealing which will be similar to 7DII.

5DIV is the main working horse of many photographers. Also, it is a more affordable camera comparing to 1dXII. So, Canon wants to keep its current customers and wants to force them to change 5DII and 5DIII into 5DIV. There is a question what features are very important to wedding photographers, which would force upgrade. In my opinion, it is cleaner images in higher ISO and higher DR. Anti-flickering might be useful feature as well.

Also, I notice a trend that some wedding photographers are switching to mirrorless cameras (e.g. Sony). This trend is not very threatening, however, after 3-5 years when mirrorless will have siginificant improvements (I hope) in AF, OVF areas, quite many photographers might consider mirrorless rather than DSLR. Currently, I really expect very good financial year for Canon after launch of new 5DIV (especially if pricing is reasonable).


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## gary samples (Feb 3, 2016)

JMZawodny said:


> JMZawodny said:
> 
> 
> > I'm on the fence. I've been shooting the 5D2 and 7D2. The rumored specs of the 1Dx2 are likely sufficient to get me to upgrade, however, I plan to wait until I have definitive info on the 5D4 as well as real user reviews of the 1Dx2. So, what will the 5D4 have to offer to garner my interest? When I need the fps, I have the 7D2, so 7fps out of the 5D4 will do. I regularly shoot ISO 6400 on the 5D2, but I'd really like to shoot at ISO 12800 with the same level of noise. That seems like a reasonable request. I do expect both the 1Dx2 and 5D4 to offer a significant improvement in DR by incorporating on-chip ADC. I like my AF points to light up red, that is why I was never really interested in the 5D3. I have little interest in 4k video unless it comes with a high quality codec, so the 5D4 can live down to my expectations and I won't care too much. The spec I care most about is AF performance. If the 1Dx2 is the only camera that offers a respectable spread of AF points that work at f/8, that alone will make the decision for me. Given how the AF of the 1 series cameras are always a step above the other Canon offerings, I do not expect this to change and I'll most probably end up with the 1Dx2. I am prepared to be surprised, however.
> ...


 +1


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## kaihp (Feb 3, 2016)

gary samples said:


> JMZawodny said:
> 
> 
> > Now that the 1Dx2 specs are out and some initial preview reports are trickling in, I'll refine my original 5D4 predictions.
> ...



-2 on the QXD card. I don't think it would make sense for Canon to switch to two different, incompatible and competing card types when moving (gradually) away from CF cards. So I'd say either SDXC-UHS & CF slots or SDXC-UHS & CFast slot. I doubt the latter.

- 8fps speed
- Sensor with integrated ADC, so the low shadow noise like in the 1Dx2. Should improve the high-ISO as well. I would prefer 24Mpix over 28Mpix, but that's just my preference.


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## Zv (Feb 3, 2016)

I'm really glad to see the 1DXII got touchscreen and DPAF. Hopefully this means now that the flagship model has it the 5D MKIV will get it. And if the 5 gets it the 6D MKII almost certainly will. I wonder if they'll add wifi though. That one seems to be harder to predict. I want to say yes it will based on nothing more than a coin toss! Resolution wise it makes sense to keep it lower than 30 but more than 22 (obviously) but since megapixels aren't what this camera is all about and the 5Ds takes care of that need, I predict a modest increase to around 24MP.


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## Sporgon (Feb 3, 2016)

bmwzimmer said:


> I'd like to see a smaller body similar to the current 6D. There's plenty of real estate there to maintain all the current buttons and wouldn't mind removing one or two now that more than likely we'll have a touch screen.


s

I know where you're coming from, but not on a camera designed to be used in anger. Once you're under pressure and you've got sweaty hands the larger size is an advantage ! Same with larger lenses. The 6D is great for smaller lenses but I find its unbalanced when you start attaching something like the 70-200 or 100-400 etc. personal preference of course.


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## Memdroid (Feb 3, 2016)

Sporgon said:


> bmwzimmer said:
> 
> 
> > I'd like to see a smaller body similar to the current 6D. There's plenty of real estate there to maintain all the current buttons and wouldn't mind removing one or two now that more than likely we'll have a touch screen.
> ...



+1
With that being said I honestly believe the the 6D range is where swivel screen belongs, and not the on the 5D series.

If the previous/current generation of 1D and 5D bodies are an indication. The next 5D is probably going to be toned down 1D with slightly more resolution. Hopefully with an integrated flash RT controller.


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## George D. (Feb 3, 2016)

28Mp just fine. Those who think it's too much please switch to 22Mp from the menu. 
Touch-screen, yes please (non-articulated)
9fps digic6+, maybe.
Plus some goodies from the 1DX2 (same AF?)
4K, who cares (brides can't tell the difference)

The real issue here is sensor IQ. How much better can you get (fm.Mk3)? What type? Stay tuned.


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## zim (Feb 3, 2016)

JMZawodny said:


> Now that the 1Dx2 specs are out and some initial preview reports are trickling in, I'll refine my original 5D4 predictions.
> 
> - 28mp sensor
> - High ISO performance 0.5 to 1 full stop less than 1Dx2 (still pretty fantastic though)
> ...



Agree completely and really hope that list is correct, I'd be a very happy camper


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## zim (Feb 3, 2016)

dilbert said:


> JMZawodny said:
> 
> 
> > ...
> ...



Ah didn't read that bit correctly so on re-reading CF + SD (UHS-II compatible)


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## StudentOfLight (Feb 3, 2016)

Full frame DPAF CMOS
25.6 MP
7.4 fps (5fps in "silent" continuous)
Same 61pt AF system as 1D-X Mark-II
Same touchscreen LCD as 1D-X Mark-II
Built-in GPS
8bit DCI 4K, 24/25/30p (Mjpeg)... clean HDMI out
Slot 1: CFast 2.0 ... this offers speed for 4K and good buffer performance
Slot 2: SD (U3/UHS-II) ... this offers cheap high capacity media for jpeg/mRAW/sRAW

I hope CFast is implemented in lower tier models as well. (e.g. 6D mark-II / 80D)
It would be nice if these models include 4K 60p bursts even if just for 1 or 2 seconds. These would be marketable features and the economies of scale (for card manufacturers) can help lower the cost of CFast. If they can forecast higher sales then they can reduce price at least for medium sized cards


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## docsmith (Feb 3, 2016)

First, XQD is a sony technology. I am skeptical that Canon will ever adopt it. 



StudentOfLight said:


> Full frame DPAF CMOS
> 25.6 MP
> 7.4 fps (5fps in "silent" continuous)
> Same 61pt AF system as 1D-X Mark-II
> ...



There are some pretty good lists floating around. I think we should not forget that there are likely two more FF bodies coming in the next 12-16 months, the 5DIV and 6DII. So not everything needs to be dropped into the 5DIV. I am actually hopeful that the 6DII becomes an enthusiast/prosumer beast. 

Canon does a good job of tailoring their cameras to a core market. The 5DIII was wedding/event photographers. I hope that target market does not change, but it might. If that stays the same, I suspect a lot of the above specs are pretty close.

Video (not that I personally care, but many "wedding/event" shooters would):
I wonder if Canon thinks they need 4K or not? I can see 60 fps at 1080p being sufficient. 
If 4K, then CFast, if 1080p, CF.
Touchscreen and DPAF---both make sense as nice improvements
The 1DxII has 8-bit, but I wonder if we might see 10 bit video? 

Still photography:
1Dx II AF. EV -3 (maybe lower?). I hope to get the f/8 AF at all points, but that might not happen.
7-8 fps
24-26 MP

I think the flipscreen ends up in the 6DII and not the 5DIV.


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## paxfoto (Feb 5, 2016)

I have a 5D mk1 and 7D mk1. Quality video is more important than 4K. As a minimum it should have 1920 x 1080 at 60 fps. 

Since Panasonic GH4 have variable frame rate from 2 fps I would definitely like that in 5D or 6D.

This would push me off the fence:
- 24MP +
- 1920 x 1080 at 60 fps (120p would be nice)
- variable frame rate
- Articulated LCD (not that important)
- Integrated WIFI (important)

I really miss live view in my 5D mk1, and a 5D with WIFI and variable frame rate would make me run to the store.


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## 3kramd5 (Feb 6, 2016)

docsmith said:


> First, XQD is a sony technology.



XQD is a Compact Flash Assn technology. Sony is a member. So is Canon. So are Nikon, Fuji, Blackmagic, Leica, and a host of tech companies.


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## unfocused (Feb 6, 2016)

dilbert said:


> paxfoto said:
> 
> 
> > I have a 5D mk1 and 7D mk1. Quality video is more important than 4K. As a minimum it should have 1920 x 1080 at 60 fps.
> ...



No. Talent makes quality video. Lots of quality videos shot on iPhones and such. Lots of crap shot on pro cinema cameras. Just like stills. Talent trumps everything.


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## docsmith (Feb 7, 2016)

3kramd5 said:


> docsmith said:
> 
> 
> > First, XQD is a sony technology.
> ...



My mistake. I thought I had read that, but now I can't find it. It does look as if for awhile Sony was the only manufacturer, but now Lexar also makes them, could be that is what I saw. There are a few references that Lexar's support of XQD is shaky, but Lexar themselves say they are behind it. As I saw that Sandisk has said they are not developing XQD, but if Canon incorporated XQD maybe others (Sandisk, etc) would start manufacturing cards as well. 

That said, it seems like the split with Sony/Nikon going with XQD and Canon (and Arri, Blackmagic, and PhaseOne) going with CFast happened several years ago.


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## StudentOfLight (Feb 7, 2016)

dilbert said:


> JMZawodny said:
> 
> 
> > ...
> ...


I don't understand your "too much space" argument. Is it impossible for Canon to design a handgrip which is 2mm deeper to accommodate a slightly thicker card? I doubt anyone would notice such a tiny difference in dimensions.


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## dolina (Feb 7, 2016)

By 2020 I expect Canon to drop CF cards in favor for CFast and SDXC UHS-II cards.


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## kaihp (Feb 7, 2016)

dolina said:


> By 2020 I expect Canon to adopt CF cards in favor for CFast and SDXC UHS-II cards.


Adopting an older standard over a new standard? CF cards over CFast, seriously?


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## dolina (Feb 7, 2016)

kaihp said:


> dolina said:
> 
> 
> > By 2020 I expect Canon to adopt CF cards in favor for CFast and SDXC UHS-II cards.
> ...


I mean dropping.

For those worried about pricing I expect 256GB 3600x CFast cards to sell for $100 by 2020. Today it goes for $675.50.


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## tpatana (Feb 7, 2016)

StudentOfLight said:


> dilbert said:
> 
> 
> > JMZawodny said:
> ...



Cameras are not that bad I guess, but you should see the lengths phone makers go to shave off that 0.1mm.


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## mkabi (Feb 13, 2016)

dilbert said:


> If it is DIGIC 6+, it will be 4K capable.



You don't know that...
The 1DX2 has dual Digic 6+ (keyword is dual, meaning 2) and an additional Digic 6 (no plus).
Thats 3 processors. Thats how the 1DX was too, meaning it had 3 processors too.
Plus, it has a cooling system that no other camera has... 

Just cause the 5D4, might have a single Digic 6+ or Digic 7, doesn't mean its the same as a 1DX2 and offer 4K.
However, if they had at least two processors like the 5DS/5DSR, and a cooling system... then I will begin to believe.


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## 3kramd5 (Feb 14, 2016)

dilbert said:


> Nothing should be bigger than it absolutely needs to be.



That's an incomplete statement. It's missing the part which reads "to satisfy the requirements." If the requirements call for a thicker card, then the size associated with that card is what it needs to be. Same with packaging a 36X24 mm^2 sensor, or an optical VF, or a tripod mount, etc.

The requirements also likely include human factors, which may lead to a camera being larger than merely the packaging, power, and thermal envelope.


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## sjprg (Feb 15, 2016)

Que, Say Ra, Say Ra.


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## mkabi (Feb 15, 2016)

dilbert said:


> mkabi said:
> 
> 
> > dilbert said:
> ...



It has a dedicated metering processor.

http://www.digitalcameraworld.com/2016/02/08/canon-eos-1d-x-mark-ii-vs-eos-1d-x-12-things-you-need-to-know/

So, in the mark 1 - the 1dx had dual 5+ and a digic 4. 
And, in the mark 2, it has dual 6+ and one digic 6.


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## j-nord (Mar 15, 2016)

If it isn't 7+ fps and 28+ mpix then this camera won't interest me at all. This camera is supposed to be very well rounded. If it cannot fill the gap between the 5Ds R and 7Dii for speed and mpix it's going to be an irrelevant upgrade path for a lot of people.


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## BLFPhoto (Mar 15, 2016)

As someone involved in industrial design, to include human factors engineering, I can assure you every millimeter of these cameras matters. 2mm may not matter to you, but there is competition for every bit of space claim. Card provisions are just one of many competing space claims. 




dilbert said:


> StudentOfLight said:
> 
> 
> > ...
> ...


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## ThePhotoBrewery (Mar 18, 2016)

In my opinion a new 5D model will have quite a few features taken from the 1DX Mark II simply as they did the same when the 5D III came out. 

I think the autofocus will be the same with dual pixel AF, illuminated AF points, Cfast + SD slots, touchscreen and resolution wise I would agree with what others have said and believe it will be 28MP. Maybe a little more (Maybe the 6D II will get 24MP). 

WiFi has always been a strong feature for me in my camera and worked really well. Therefore, WiFi would be on my personal wishlist for this camera. Touchscreen is nice but not really a need for me. 

I just hope they announce something soon. I am itching to try it out! 

All the best!


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## StudentOfLight (Mar 18, 2016)

dilbert said:


> StudentOfLight said:
> 
> 
> > ...
> ...


When talking mathematically then yes, as a mechanical engineer I care more about practicality. 

There is a joke that goes as follows: 
"A man and woman stand at opposite ends of a room that is 8m long. Every minute the gap between them is reduced by 50%. A mathematician says that the man and woman will never touch. An engineer OTOH says that after 15 minutes the man and woman are close enough for all practical purposes."

So the questions to ask are how different are the costs and how different is the weight?

The plastic spacers inside the camera would be the same. So the magnesium alloy shell would be the difference right. The die needs to be designed and manufactured. This will take the same amount of design-man-hours and would be cast from the same sized block and manufacturing that block would take the the same amount of time.

The difference in mass would be in the end product would be mostly magnesium alloy:
M = (MagAlloy density) x (added depth) x (wall thickness) x (length)
= (1800kg/m^3) x (0.002m) x (0.002m) x (0.142m)
= 0.001028kg
(roughly 1g)

How could we estimate the difference in material cost: 
$ = (MagAlloy price) x (MagAlloy density) x (added depth) x (wall thickness) x (length)
= ($17.9/kg) x (0.001028kg)
= $0.0184
(roughly 2c)

Just thought I'd add my 2c worth... LOL

p.s. You can nitpick my numbers if you want but the point is that there is no practical difference between adding 2mm to the depth of the hand-grip and the current size, it is close enough for all practical purposes to feel the same and cost the same.


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## Mitch.Conner (Mar 21, 2016)

StudentOfLight said:


> dilbert said:
> 
> 
> > StudentOfLight said:
> ...



Permission to steal that joke? I love it.


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## StudentOfLight (Mar 22, 2016)

Mitch.Conner said:


> StudentOfLight said:
> 
> 
> > dilbert said:
> ...


Sure Mitch. I heard that joke at an Infrared Thermography course I attended a few years back. I'm not sure of it's origins.


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## scottkinfw (Mar 22, 2016)

I for one am tired of the dearth of information/rumors about the 5DIV/X release. Come on, feed us some juicy details already.

Sek


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## vscd (Apr 2, 2016)

@Sek


> sek Cameras: 5D III, 5D II, EOS M Lenses: *24-70 2.8 II IS*, 24-105 f4L, 70-200 f4L IS, 70-200 f2.8L IS II, EF 300 f4L IS, EF 400 5.6L, 300 2.8 IS II, Samyang 14 mm 2.8 Flashes: 600EX-RT X 2, ST-E3-RT
> Plus lots of stuff that just didn't work for me



I'm curious about one of your lenses... and I hope you work @CanonDev


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## sidewinder3000 (Apr 7, 2016)

Without hyperbole, if the Canon 5D Mark IV (or a simultaneously released "c" variation) doesn't include 4K shooting and video autofocus, it will be DOA ON ARRIVAL and Canon will begin a long, slow decline into second class status. If the camera model that started the video DSLR revolution doesn't do stuff to _seriously beat back_ the massively increased competition in this area and go _out of it's way_ to reward Canon ecosystem loyalists who shoot video, there will be a massive outcry, a ton of Canon lenses being posted on eBay, and a huge number of users bolting to ecosystems that respect their users and don't rest their laurels on past accomplishemnts. 

Being part of an ecosystem is a huge leap of faith. The massive amount of money we've invested in Canon lenses and other gear should should represent a sacred trust for them. I hope they knock this next version it out of the park.


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## Diko (Aug 15, 2016)

Canon Rumors said:


> With the specifications of the EOS-1D X Mark II being made public, the obvious next question is what can we expect to see in the EOS 5D Mark IV, which is coming in 2016.</p>
> <p>The EOS 5D Mark III followed the EOS-1D X quite closely in on paper specifications. Below is a prediction based of what we think we could see inside the next 5D.</p>
> <ul>
> <li>28mp</li>
> ...



CFast gone, 4K here. But these 7 pages seems nice in refference to the big *5dm4 topic*


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## Jack Douglas (Aug 15, 2016)

An interesting re-read given what we kind of know today, for sure! 

Jack


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