# Eos6D at 25000iso...image quality reality check!



## Ivan Muller (Sep 25, 2014)

With the launch of the 7d2 most of us have been somewhat disappointed that our beloved brand Canon didn't introduce a higher megapixel sensor to rival that of the competition.....but you know what we have right now still works pretty well...

I have the cheaper 6D that I use daily for my professional work and also for my private photography. This cameras high iso quality has just blown me over. Of course I have not compared it to the competition but the image quality of this camera has never let me down professionally. Personally I would like a few more pixels at 100 iso.

Enclosed a 25000 iso shot of my daughters school play. First image as it appears in LR without any tweaking also a 100% crop of the same image to show noise etc. the first two images are at LR default settings which include some sharpening.

Last image is after Raw processing via DXO optics pro 9 using the 'prime noise reduction tool' and then in LR I added a bit of 'grain' afterwards to my own taste. No sharpening for the DXO image. for me a high iso image shouldnt be devoid of noise, hence the added grain which also helps to improve the 'look' of sharpness. Actually sharpening the image didn't really improve it much so I left it as is - something I have noticed before with high iso images...

What I see here is that I could open the shadows quite a bit (contrary to conventional wisdom)and also that there was still quite a lot of detail left in the highlights. Also that the noise reduction software is really very very good and that its just really a matter of taste how much more or less one wants to reduce the noise. I have made quite large prints, A3 to A2, of these 25000 iso images and the image quality is just superb! Of course one cant use 25ooo iso images on every subject matter but with lighting conditions like in the sample image here it works just well!

I am not saying its the best or better than Nikon, Sony, Fuji etc...I really couldn't care, just that its pretty good for my requirements and in fact, for an old timer like me that grew up with film and large view cameras ...I just cant believe how good and easy we have it today!

These images are not an illustration of absolute image quality but just to show how good our existing technology is and what can be achieved with a few tweaks in software... 

More of my high iso images can be seen here: http://thelazytravelphotographer.blogspot.com/2014/03/eos-6d-review-part-3-homage-to-tri-x.html


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## Quasimodo (Sep 25, 2014)

Ivan Muller said:


> With the launch of the 7d2 most of us have been somewhat disappointed that our beloved brand Canon didn't introduce a higher megapixel sensor to rival that of the competition.....but you know what we have right now still works pretty well...
> 
> I have the cheaper 6D that I use daily for my professional work and also for my private photography. This cameras high iso quality has just blown me over. Of course I have not compared it to the competition but the image quality of this camera has never let me down professionally. Personally I would like a few more pixels at 100 iso.
> 
> ...



It might be my eyes or screen, or both, but I think the first crop looks sharper than the one through DxO optics. Looking at her closest eye.

All in all I don't mind the noise it produces either


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## Ivan Muller (Sep 25, 2014)

Yes its because it is...just saw now that the sharpening was at default in LR for the first twoimages whereas in DXO I turned it off...you have sharp eyes


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## Quasimodo (Sep 25, 2014)

Ivan Muller said:


> Yes its because it is...just saw now that the sharpening was at default in LR for the first twoimages whereas in DXO I turned it off...you have sharp eyes



Thank you, you made my day  LOL


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## TeT (Sep 25, 2014)

DxO optics 9 is so easy. Easy is key for me....


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## Ivan Muller (Sep 25, 2014)

I like it when I need to eliminate very high iso noise, but for general stuff LR works even easier for me....


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## Ivan Muller (Sep 25, 2014)

Here is something from the Eos M..same sensor as old 7d for all practical purposes. 1600 iso at f4 on the 22f2. Definitely not in the 6d's league, but pretty usable me thinks....especially when I think what I paid for it!


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## MichaelHodges (Sep 25, 2014)

The 6D is equipped with Canon's best sensor, so no surprises there.


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## AcutancePhotography (Sep 25, 2014)

Ivan Muller said:


> I have the cheaper 6D that I use daily for my professional work and also for my private photography. This cameras high iso quality has just blown me over.



Wow that is some pretty good low light imagery. 

Sometimes you gotta work with the lighting you have and it appears that the 6D can handle it.


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## Ivan Muller (Sep 25, 2014)

The scary things is that I really cant claim any 'superior' technique...the camera did it all, I just pointed the lens in the general direction I thought would be best!


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## tolusina (Sep 25, 2014)

Ivan Muller said:


>


Ivan,
I really like this photo.
While obviously staged, what is staged tells me a story. Whether I've got the story right or not, I don't know, not sure I care.
The lighting, the costumes, the beautiful women but especially the body language and facial expressions speak to me the most.
---
Anyway, The story I see, a bride is marching through an honor guard of sisters and cousins. The look on the bride's face indicates she's emotionally overwhelmed by the ceremony, the future. What is she getting herself into? No matter, she's going through with it. 
Facing us on camera left, this sister/cousin is just happy for her kin, anxious for the bride to pass her post, maybe an encouraging word will pass her lips.
Facing us next from camera left, she's at military attention, she's taking it all very seriously.
Facing us on camera right with hand on hip, she disapproves for one reason or another, maybe an issue about the groom, maybe she's upset she hasn't yet had her turn at matrimony, still, she's there and participating, they are all family after all.

Thanks Ivan,
Ron

ps..... grain, sharpness, dr, all irrelevant when an image is good enough to story tell.


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## Marsu42 (Sep 25, 2014)

Ivan Muller said:


> Enclosed a 25000 iso shot of my daughters school play.



Iso 2500 as an intermediate step is awkward, for best iq try to use full "analog" sensor iso stops (100, 200, 400, 800, 1600, 3200, ...). All other values are derivatives and only modified digitally, as a result you're simply losing dynamic range without gaining image quality. Reminds me of the times when I shot iso 1250 with my 60d, doh.


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## Ivan Muller (Sep 25, 2014)

Marsu42 said:


> Ivan Muller said:
> 
> 
> > Enclosed a 25000 iso shot of my daughters school play.
> ...



You are right of course. But, this is a 25 000 iso shot not 2500 iso. Actually it should be 25600 iso, its the 'max' setting of the Eos6d before turning on the even higher so settings, which I haven't even looked at nor used!

What most often happens is that I set the camera on auto iso and then I think these strange iso's get picked automatically by the camera.....


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## Ivan Muller (Sep 25, 2014)

Thanks Ron! I agree re sharpness grain etc..it doesn't really matter if the image is strong...and when I look back at a lot of my 'old' film images now they all look a lot 'softer' than my modern digital imagery.


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## Marsu42 (Sep 25, 2014)

Ivan Muller said:


> You are right of course. But, this is a 25 000 iso shot not 2500 iso. Actually it should be 25600 iso, its the 'max' setting of the Eos6d before turning on the even higher so settings, which I haven't even looked at nor used!



Meh, I mis-read that because shooting with iso 25k is outside my imagination  ... but in that case, I can contribute another smarta** comment: The max. analog iso of the 6d is 3200 (5d3: 6400), so if you shoot raw you can simply use this and underexpose - otherwise you're again just reducing the dynamic range.


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## Sabaki (Sep 27, 2014)

Marsu42 said:


> Ivan Muller said:
> 
> 
> > You are right of course. But, this is a 25 000 iso shot not 2500 iso. Actually it should be 25600 iso, its the 'max' setting of the Eos6d before turning on the even higher so settings, which I haven't even looked at nor used!
> ...



Thanks for the education here Marsu42, I didn't know this.

Explain further for me, as I've only ever used a 500D. What does ISO 50 bring to the table and as per your comments, is it analogue? Tell me more about the penalties of using "non analogue" ISO please?


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## weixing (Sep 27, 2014)

Marsu42 said:


> Ivan Muller said:
> 
> 
> > You are right of course. But, this is a 25 000 iso shot not 2500 iso. Actually it should be 25600 iso, its the 'max' setting of the Eos6d before turning on the even higher so settings, which I haven't even looked at nor used!
> ...


Hi,
Hmm... Where did you get this info from?? 

Have a nice day.


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## CTJohn (Sep 27, 2014)

Marsu42 said:


> Ivan Muller said:
> 
> 
> > You are right of course. But, this is a 25 000 iso shot not 2500 iso. Actually it should be 25600 iso, its the 'max' setting of the Eos6d before turning on the even higher so settings, which I haven't even looked at nor used!
> ...


Non-techie here. Can you explain that? I've been using my 6D with an ISO limit of 6400 and pretty happy with the results. Are you saying I would get better results limiting at 3200 and bumping exposure in Lightroom?

Thanks.


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## davidcl0nel (Sep 27, 2014)

CTJohn said:


> Non-techie here. Can you explain that? I've been using my 6D with an ISO limit of 6400 and pretty happy with the results. Are you saying I would get better results limiting at 3200 and bumping exposure in Lightroom?
> 
> Thanks.



No, that is afterwards the native ISO. ISO25600 for 5D3, for 6D i don't know.
ISO50.000 and ISO100.000 is the same as a -1 or -2 aperture pic, which you enhance in lightroom.


(and so it is ISO 125, ISO 160 and ISO 250 the same... with +-1/3 of the next native step.


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## Keith_Reeder (Sep 27, 2014)

Ivan Muller said:


> most of us have been somewhat disappointed that our beloved brand Canon didn't introduce a higher megapixel sensor to rival that of the competition...



"Most" of us?

What do you base that speculation on?


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## candyman (Sep 27, 2014)

Keith_Reeder said:


> Ivan Muller said:
> 
> 
> > most of us have been somewhat disappointed that our beloved brand Canon didn't introduce a higher megapixel sensor to rival that of the competition...
> ...


+1


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## rpt (Sep 27, 2014)

candyman said:


> Keith_Reeder said:
> 
> 
> > Ivan Muller said:
> ...


I think he was talking about the trinity.
"I, Me and Myself""


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## Marsu42 (Sep 27, 2014)

CTJohn said:


> Non-techie here. Can you explain that? I've been using my 6D with an ISO limit of 6400 and pretty happy with the results. Are you saying I would get better results limiting at 3200 and bumping exposure in Lightroom?



Not unless you're needing the bit of dynamic range you're loosing on iso3200->6400. Canon does a very good job at 6400 on the 6d, I use it myself when in a pinch - but when in doubt don't hesitate to simply underexpose 3200. But everything >6400 is simply a waste if you're shooting raw stills.

More tech explanations can be found in the Magic Lantern forum, they discovered this when developing their mini_iso module that tweaks the various amplifier stages of the image processing chain.



Sabaki said:


> What does ISO 50 bring to the table and as per your comments, is it analogue?



No, iso 50 (for the cameras that have it, i.e. not 6d) is simply iso 100 overexposed - check the dynamic range curve, magically iso 50 has one stop less than iso 100 . Iso 50 is very useful though for fast lenses because you don't need to use a nd filter if your shutter speed is maxed out.



Sabaki said:


> Tell me more about the penalties of using "non analogue" ISO please?



If you're digitial iso, you're simply under/overexposing in-camera. The result is that the histogram only gets shifted left or right, and the side part gets chopped off (i.e. you're loosing dynamic range). The noise level & color fidelity is the same as the base "analog" iso that's actually set on the sensor.

Intermediate iso steps are nice for video, jpeg, timelapses, whatever - but not for shooting raw stills, in the best case you're gaining nothing, in the worst case you're throwing away image data.


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## Ivan Muller (Sep 28, 2014)

Keith_Reeder said:


> Ivan Muller said:
> 
> 
> > most of us have been somewhat disappointed that our beloved brand Canon didn't introduce a higher megapixel sensor to rival that of the competition...
> ...



Almost every rumor, review, discussion and reply I have read so far on the web, here and elsewhere laments the fact that Canon has not brought out a higher megapixel camera to rival the A7r and 800/e/810 and improve dynamic range, as it is perceived by many to be lacking in competitive shadow noise.....Keith I am sure you would probably disagree with that but that is MY impression ....


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## Ivan Muller (Sep 28, 2014)

rpt said:


> candyman said:
> 
> 
> > Keith_Reeder said:
> ...


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