# Batteries for Canon EX 600 RT...



## victorwol (Aug 31, 2012)

Hi! Which batteries are you using for your flashes? I used to use regular Energizer NiMH with a 15 minutes charger, they give a good 500 something fires with the 580 EXII, but the problem is they need to be charged the very same day you are going to use it. They lose they charge in just a few days. On the other hand, the Eneloop hold they charge for really long time but takes like a whole night to charge. 

Wonder what are you all using....


----------



## Brendon (Sep 2, 2012)

I use the Eneloops exclusively now. I have a mix of the new and old Eneloops (white vs blue) and find them much easier to work with because they do hold their charge well. As long as they haven't been sitting around for months I don't worry about charging the night before an event. 

My understanding about the 15 min chargers is that they quickly decrease the battery capacities because of the heat that is generated during the charge. If you don't need to charge dozens of batteries right before an event, the long charge isn't really a big deal.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Sep 2, 2012)

Sanyo eneloops in all my flashes, including the 600EX-RT. Since they hold their charge so long when not in use, I just keep a couple extra charges sets of 4 on hand, so I never have to wait for a charge to use them.


----------



## Click (Sep 2, 2012)

+1 Sanyo Eneloops in all my flashes (600EX-RT)


----------



## victorwol (Sep 2, 2012)

I ordered to test some Powerex that are 2700mAh. I hope they are as good as they say they are. Ordered some Eneloop too.


----------



## kaihp (Sep 2, 2012)

I got 4 Eneloops and 4 GP 2700 mAh NiMH, and I don't trust the GPs at all. I'm ready to chuck the GP's and get more Eneloops.

Speaking of Eneloops, have anyone used Eneloops in LED based flashlights like the Mini Maglite Pro+ LED or XL200?

(apologies for the thread highjack)


----------



## Michael_pfh (Sep 2, 2012)

I am using Sanyo eneloops in my EX 600 RT


----------



## agierke (Sep 2, 2012)

i have heard good things about the Eneloops. looking to pick some up myself.

i was using PowerEx's but they didnt hold their charge long enough. got tired of charging up 16 to 24 batteries the night before. they also dont have a long lifespan if you use and recharge them frequently. 

i switched to Maha's Imedion batteries and have been very happy with them. they perform much like the Eneloops, hold a charge for a long time and their lifespan is much longer. my powerexs are pretty much dead after about 2 or 3 years of use but my Imedions are still going strong.


----------



## pwp (Sep 2, 2012)

victorwol said:


> I ordered to test some Powerex that are 2700mAh. I hope they are as good as they say they are. Ordered some Eneloop too.



My business is highly reliant on strong AA cell performance. Eneloops are getting plenty of positive responses, but all my real world testing sent me to PowerEx. Their cells and the top-end smart charger won the contest here.

Both are good which ever you choose, but straight from acronym land there's that wise proviso: YMMV.

-PW


----------



## agierke (Sep 2, 2012)

+1 to Maha having a phenomenal charging system. with 3 different methods of charging and an LCD status screen, the charger itself will improve the performance and extend the life of your batteries.


----------



## Mt Spokane Photography (Sep 2, 2012)

Are you using one of those 15 minute energizer chargers? It likely ruined your batteries.
Get a good charger and good batteries. Neither is cheap, but you spent a lot of money on the flash so power it with something worthwhile.
A professional battery charger will charge your batteries quickly and safely.
http://www.thomasdistributing.com/AA-and-AAA-Battery-Chargers_c_963.html

http://www.thomasdistributing.com/MAHA-MH-C801D-AA--AAA-Battery-ChargerbrDELUXE-8-Cell-Professional-Battery-Charger-w-Full-LCD-Display_p_2559.html


----------



## Rienzphotoz (Sep 2, 2012)

victorwol said:


> Hi! Which batteries are you using for your flashes? I used to use regular Energizer NiMH with a 15 minutes charger, they give a good 500 something fires with the 580 EXII, but the problem is they need to be charged the very same day you are going to use it. They lose they charge in just a few days. On the other hand, the Eneloop hold they charge for really long time but takes like a whole night to charge.
> 
> Wonder what are you all using....


Although I really liked using Sanyo enveloop for over 2 years I changed to the newer Energizer batteries since the last 14 months bcoz where I live it is easier to find Energizer (and almost impossible to find eneloop) also the energizers are rated 2450 mAh vs my envelopes at 1800 mAh ... Over the past one year Energizer batteries have improved and they now hold their charge for 6 months ... I know people say the 15 minute chargers are not good as it is better to charge at a slower pace, but I still prefer to use the 15 minute charger as I find very convenient (plus it has a car charging adapter) ... I am not overly concerned if the batteries don't last for 1500 recharges or whatever ... If they last 500 charge cycles I am more than happy. But no matter how many rechargable batteries I have in my bag I always make sure to have a dozen Duracell or Energizer Alkaline batteries as my backup, if I don't get to use them, I just use them in the TV remotes, clocks and other electronics and buy another dozen of them to keep in my camera bag for backup.


----------



## prestonpalmer (Sep 2, 2012)

Eneloop XX they are 2500mah. awesome batteries.


----------



## Rienzphotoz (Sep 2, 2012)

prestonpalmer said:


> Eneloop XX they are 2500mah. awesome batteries.


That's true ... I've heard of them, although I'd like to buy them, they don't sell'em where I live and the shiping charges for ordering them from US to middle east is very expensive. I read in Joe McNally's blog that he uses some rechargable batteries called Powerex 2700mAh and he speaks very highly of them.


----------



## lethalfalcon (Sep 2, 2012)

I've been using Imedion batteries in my 580EX II for almost a year now. They hold their charge very well since they're low-self-discharge, so they won't die quickly if you keep them in your bag. They also have a pretty good life at 2400mAh. Couple that with a PowerEx charger to make sure they aren't cooked by those fast chargers and you should have a system that lasts quite some time. You'll probably still want to keep around a spare set, but I've gone over 800 shots on just one set (almost always less than full dumps, since I don't want to roast the 580EX II), and then I just switch out to the next, get home and put those 4 on the charger. If you're doing a long shoot, take 2 extra sets.

The other thing you can do is get a speedfire to run it off AC, or something like a quantum turbo to give yourself a much bigger battery. Those tend to be pretty good solutions, although they are more pricey. The upside to them is a faster recharge time on the flash. You still need to use internal batteries to power the rest of the flash's functionality.


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 2, 2012)

I use a 15-minute charger but also carry a pack of 4 lithium AA cells as an emergency. At about $15 for 4 with a shelf life of about 10 years and a 3000mA/Hr rating they're quite economical insurance if you're not normally using them.


----------



## Rienzphotoz (Sep 2, 2012)

PeterJ said:


> I use a 15-minute charger but also carry a pack of 4 lithium AA cells as an emergency. At about $15 for 4 with a shelf life of about 10 years and a 3000mA/Hr rating they're quite economical insurance if you're not normally using them.


Good point ... I dd not know they were 3000mAh


----------



## Marsu42 (Sep 2, 2012)

victorwol said:


> I ordered to test some Powerex that are 2700mAh. I hope they are as good as they say they are. Ordered some Eneloop too.



"Hope" is the correct word - the mAh rating is mostly marketing, good 2000 mAh batteries likely have more power than cheap 2500 mAh ones - or at least the "super batteries" will be below "standard" ones after a few charge cycles. That's because few people will measure how much power there is in their shiny new batteries and then return it to the store. So that's +1 for Eneloop, too, I also use them in my 600rt.


----------



## Rienzphotoz (Sep 2, 2012)

Marsu42 said:


> victorwol said:
> 
> 
> > I ordered to test some Powerex that are 2700mAh. I hope they are as good as they say they are. Ordered some Eneloop too.
> ...


That's true about any product, i.e. cheap stuff (even though rated at higher power) is no match to a lower rated good quality product. But not all high mAh batteries are marketing fluff, especially in the case of Powerex mAh 2700 ... someone like Joe McNally uses dozens of speedlites with Powerex 2700 mAh batteries ... I just saw a class on Kelby Traing called "Dancers in Flight with Beautiful Light" by Joe McNally where they show Joe's gear including the insane amount of his speedlites and the even more insane amount of Powerex batteries ... So I'm pretty confident that would be good. Having said that I totally agree with you about eneloop batteries, they are incredibly reliable and they never failed me once.


----------



## SDsc0rch (Sep 2, 2012)

this brings up a question i've had for a while now 

i use the eneloops for my flash (the white/blue ones - not the black XX 2500mah)

and a powerex mh-c9000 to recharge them - love it!

of its many features, it permits you to set the recharge rate

the documentation warns against giving the batteries too much juice during recharging (ie, re-charging too fast)

i always set it to 700 (out of 1000)

i'm curious... if you use a re-charger that allows you to set the recharge rate, what rate do you use??


----------



## Rienzphotoz (Sep 3, 2012)

SDsc0rch said:


> the documentation warns against giving the batteries too much juice during recharging (ie, re-charging too fast)
> 
> i always set it to 700 (out of 1000)
> 
> i'm curious... if you use a re-charger that allows you to set the recharge rate, what rate do you use??


What does the document warning say, I mean the consequences of recharging fast?
I ask bcoz for the past 3+ years I've been using energizer fast recharger (30 mins) to recharge my eneloop batteries, and I threw way the manual a long time ago.


----------



## Jimbo (Sep 3, 2012)

The maximum safe charge current for Sanyo Eneloop batteries without reducing service life is 1/2C, i.e. half the rated capacity in mA.
The maximum overall charge current according to the datasheets is 1C.
(1C does not mean 1 Coulomb, but 1 Capacity unit. This sometimes leads to confusion and frankly, I do not know why this unit was chosen.)

To sum it up:

For the white Eneloops (200mAh) recommended current ist btw 500 and 1000mA, max at 2000mA
for the black (XX) Eneloops (2500mAh) it is btw 500 and 1250mA, max at 2500mA.

Best results will be obtained with a modern electronically controlled fast charger that takes between 2 and 4 hours for a full charge cycle. 
Very fast chargers (btw 1 and 2 hours) slightly reduce service life. If you accept having to buy new cells at a slightly higher rate, that should not be a problem, though.
For Eneloops especially, I would stay away from chargers that take less than an hour for a full charge (i.e. current more than 1C). They waste your cells and it would be wiser to just get a set of backup cells stored away readily charged.
Those chargers are from the days before low self discharging cells like Eneloop when you had to hastily top up your constantly discharging cells before you left the house. That is a thing from the past.


----------



## Rienzphotoz (Sep 3, 2012)

Jimbo said:


> The maximum safe charge current for Sanyo Eneloop batteries without reducing service life is 1/2C, i.e. half the rated capacity in mA.
> The maximum overall charge current according to the datasheets is 1C.
> (1C does not mean 1 Coulomb, but 1 Capacity unit. This sometimes leads to confusion and frankly, I do not know why this unit was chosen.)
> 
> ...


Darn it, I'll have to get a new charger now ... oh well, since I've already messed with my eneloops charging them with a 30 minute charger for the last 3 years, I guess I'll just have to get new batteries and a new charger ... I'll wait for my current batteries to die and get new charger & batteries.


----------



## romanr74 (Sep 3, 2012)

What are the relevant parameters with Batteries? What's most important for good performance and fast recovery? I did some shooting on the weekend with my 600 RT, in programmed 5 second interwals: it first fired every second one, sometimes only every third. Is this what can be expected or do batteries make a relevant difference here?


----------



## DB (Sep 3, 2012)

Jimbo said:


> The maximum safe charge current for Sanyo Eneloop batteries without reducing service life is 1/2C, i.e. half the rated capacity in mA.
> The maximum overall charge current according to the datasheets is 1C.
> (1C does not mean 1 Coulomb, but 1 Capacity unit. This sometimes leads to confusion and frankly, I do not know why this unit was chosen.)
> 
> ...



I agree totally with you that fast chargers will reduce recycle-life of AA cells, but the optimum recharging current is C/5 and not C/2 as you have stated above. All of my AA Sanyo Eneloops are rated at 1.2V 2000mAh, but take just 4 hours to fully recharge at 500mA. My charger goes higher, but I'd rather enjoy the full 1,500 cycles from these cells than say 700 to 800. It is better to just buy more of them than you actually need, thus keep spares (I have 36 AA Eneloops kept in neat 4-cell plastic containers) that fit any pocket in your DSLR bag.

What determines the optimum charging rate is resistance (Ohms) and unlike the Canon LP-E6 batteries (Battery = multiple Cells, so AA = 'Cell' and not 'Battery') which have quite low resistance, so can be charged faster using 1200mA standard charger, AA rechargeable cells have greater resistance, thus need longer to charge. Plus AA cells may be recharged from zero or near zero, whereas Li-Ion batteries perform better if they're topped up more frequently and is not advisable to let them go completely dead (laptops or DSLR batteries) as they may then stop accepting any charge whatsoever leading to quite costly replacement.


----------



## JohnnyWashngo (Sep 3, 2012)

I use a technoline charger similar to this one...

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Technoline-Intelligent-battery-charger-Version/dp/B003S4JQS2/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1346681260&sr=1-1

... for charging my eneloops. I tend to charge them very slowly which usually means it takes several hours to fully recharge them. That charger is also really good for reawakening 'dead' batteries. I have managed to get a good deal of life out of older batteries that I thought were for the recycle bin.

I have ditched all my old fast chargers now due to them being generally rubbish


----------



## SDsc0rch (Sep 3, 2012)

thx for such informative answers gentlemen  

rienz.. This is the charger I use 

http://www.amazon.com/Powerex-MH-C9000-PowerEx-WizardOne-Charger-Analyzer/dp/B000NLUSLM/ref=reg_hu-rd_add_1_dp

seems good to me - very full featured


----------



## tron (Sep 3, 2012)

SDsc0rch said:


> thx for such informative answers gentlemen
> 
> rienz.. This is the charger I use
> 
> ...


+1 It is this charger with Eneloop batteries for me too.


----------



## Jimbo (Sep 11, 2012)

Sorry for the use of the term batteries instead of cells, English ist not my native language and in colloquial German, the term _Batterie_ is (incorrectly) being used for single cells as well.

About the recommended charging current:

C/5 might be the theoretically best current, but I have seen quite a few chargers who miss the -deltaV drop at these currents because it is too smooth, thereby overcharging cells.
Overcharging is a lot more damaging to NiMH cells than any good ultra quick charger on the market wold ever be. Only a deep discharge (possibly even followed by a reverse of polarity) is worse.

Also, most people, including myself do not charge cells often enough to really worry about reaching the maximum cycle number. If you recharge your cells 4 times a week, 1500 cycles would mean a 7 year service life.
Most people will recharge their cells a lot less often, thereby reaching a multitude of that so I just don't see the point.

Given that even Sanyo's data sheets state a 1C charge, I still believe a 1/2C or 1/3C charge can be done without worrying.

PS: NiMH cells and Li-Ion cells/batteries like the LP-E6 cannot be compared. Their totally different chemistry leads to fundamental differences in the charging process.


----------



## tron (Sep 11, 2012)

I remember reading that the charging current for NiMh cells has to be over 1/2C (even by a little) for the chargers to stop charging correctly. I am sorry I am writing this by heart. I do not remember where I have read it (so please check for yourselves too).


----------



## PeterJ (Sep 12, 2012)

tron said:


> I remember reading that the charging current for NiMh cells has to be over 1/2C (even by a little) for the chargers to stop charging correctly. I am sorry I am writing this by heart. I do not remember where I have read it (so please check for yourselves too).


I think it would most likely depend on the design of the charger rather than being a fixed limit, most better ones have a timer as well to terminate the charge and monitor changes in voltage rather than a fixed limit. However I've had this situation with a cordless phone charger, when the batteries died I replaced with ones about triple the capacity and the charge cycle wouldn't stop.


----------

