# Suggestions on where I can post an image for feedback



## KKCFamilyman (Jun 1, 2013)

I would like to get feedback on some of my images for in camera and pp critisim both good and bad. Any suggestions?


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## gferdinandsen (Jun 1, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> I would like to get feedback on some of my images for in camera and pp critisim both good and bad. Any suggestions?



http://www.photo.net They allow you to post up to 4 pictures a day for ratings and critique's.


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## JBeckwith (Jun 1, 2013)

This may not be the answer you were looking for, but post them here.

From the short time I've been around this site I've seen that most people here are honest and knowledgeable and can give you some decent critiques.


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## sandymandy (Jun 1, 2013)

1x.com forums. i think any community site which is not too frequently visited every day (e.g. youtube, facewbook) and where the average forum post is not some uniteresting smalltalk is viable. just avoid the spammers-only and pros-only extreme ends.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jun 1, 2013)

This is one for my kids last day of school and would like criticism and feedback. Thanks in advance.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jun 1, 2013)

Even with the small size, I see what looks like redeye. Did you use a on camera flash?


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## KKCFamilyman (Jun 1, 2013)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> Even with the small size, I see what looks like redeye. Did you use a on camera flash?



Yes since it was early before their last day of school. If I had not they would have been underexposed or over and the background blown out. There was harsh sun coming from the right side. Again looking for feedback to learn how to overcome these obstacles. I just was not happy with the picture.


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## neuroanatomist (Jun 1, 2013)

The lighting is somewhat flat, but also inconsistently directional. The sun being on the right means she has some directional lighting, but he's in her shadow, lit mostly by direct on-axis flash. What bothers me the most is that because of her shadow on him, they appear somewhat lit from opposite sides, with shadows on the sides of their faces that are facing each other - that's incongruous. 

A solution would have been to get the flash off camera, ideally in a softbox, placed camera-right at an angle to the subjects. That would have maintained directionality of light, but added fill from front-right. A second light at low power or a half-gold reflector at camera left could have been used to slightly fill in the shadows opposite the main light and sun.


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## eml58 (Jun 2, 2013)

neuroanatomist said:


> The lighting is somewhat flat, but also inconsistently directional. The sun being on the right means she has some directional lighting, but he's in her shadow, lit mostly by direct on-axis flash. What bothers me the most is that because of her shadow on him, they appear somewhat lit from opposite sides, with shadows on the sides of their faces that are facing each other - that's incongruous.
> 
> A solution would have been to get the flash off camera, ideally in a softbox, placed camera-right at an angle to the subjects. That would have maintained directionality of light, but added fill from front-right. A second light at low power or a half-gold reflector at camera left could have been used to slightly fill in the shadows opposite the main light and sun.



And for a shot like this Nuero's advice is as much as you probably need, your clearly working with a pair of Professional Models.

Getting the Flash Off Camera is the first step, look for someone to Hold the Flash as Nuero suggested, off to the right (several companies produce Flash Brackets, I use the Ring Flash Brackets from RRS with an extension).

Check out Lastolite for soft boxes, and Westcott for Reflectors, you can get soft Boxes to fit just the flash head & Reflectors come in pretty well any size you want.

When setting up for portraits, always give a moment to look behind the Models, Background is So important, Look for a soft dreamy background (If you Can), that with say an f stop of 5.6 will render your Models in Focus, but drop your background out of focus, check for Trees growing out of your Models heads, bright & shinning patches of light reflected, Yellow Buses etc, try to keep the background where possible uniform so it doesn't distract from the main subject, your lovely children.


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## dirtcastle (Jun 2, 2013)

If you want to use a more photojournalistic approach (as opposed to a strobist approach), you've got three choices:

1. Bring your subjects to the light.
2. Bring the light to your subjects.
3. Use both available light and strobe light.

In this case, your subjects are in the shade and your strobe lighting is insufficient.

For a quick fix, I would move the subjects into the sun (or position them facing a big reflection). Don't use the flash as your primary key light, use it for shadow fill (if at all). Position your subjects against a background that will allow you to get the proper exposure, and reduce blown-out highlights. Or, better yet, against a dark background that will allow you to use pretty much any exposure you want.

Then take your shot into post and lower highlights and raise shadows.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jun 2, 2013)

Thanks for the comments. Yeah this was bring camera out after 4 mile run snap some shots then go to work. I did nit even get to edit them till the evening. I went for the bus as a background since it was the last day of school and this was taken on my front lawn. I will have to work on my lighting and technique. Thanks for the direction. I was using the 600ex. I think i may grab another and a ste3 and play with that setup. A few minutes positioning thise would not have been that hard. Thanks nuero for pointing out aspects I never saw. Wish they had a forum for critic here. So much to learn.


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## privatebydesign (Jun 2, 2013)

Don't buy anything else until you have got this book http://www.amazon.com/Speedliters-Handbook-Learning-Craft-Speedlites/dp/032171105X/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1370137769&sr=8-3&keywords=syl+arena It really explains the way Canon flashes work in the different shooting modes Tv, Av, P etc. There is a lot to a simple flash picture and unless you understand what the camera is telling the flash to do then you caan't help to gain control of it. The book had toms of other good info too but was written before the 600/RT system came out so they are not in there, but it is still the best Canon Speedlite book I have seen.

As for your picture, the thing I notice more than the crossed shadows is the overexposed background, this implies, depending on which mode you were in, you had EV compensation turned to a + value or you hit sync speed, something like that, I can't read the EXIF so I don't know what mode you were in. 

Had I been shooting it I would have had the camera in Manual mode with the flash in ETTL but turned off, I would have set the camera to 200iso and sync speed, then turned the aperture down (higher value) until the background was a touch underexposed, then turn the flash on. Done. If the subjects were a bit too hot turn FEC down, if too dark turn FEC up, but my experience with ETTL in this kind of situation is it would have nailed the subjects at FEC 0.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jun 2, 2013)

privatebydesign said:


> Don't buy anything else until you have got this book http://www.amazon.com/Speedliters-Handbook-Learning-Craft-Speedlites/dp/032171105X/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1370137769&sr=8-3&keywords=syl+arena It really explains the way Canon flashes work in the different shooting modes Tv, Av, P etc. There is a lot to a simple flash picture and unless you understand what the camera is telling the flash to do then you caan't help to gain control of it. The book had toms of other good info too but was written before the 600/RT system came out so they are not in there, but it is still the best Canon Speedlite book I have seen.
> 
> As for your picture, the thing I notice more than the crossed shadows is the overexposed background, this implies, depending on which mode you were in, you had EV compensation turned to a + value or you hit sync speed, something like that, I can't read the EXIF so I don't know what mode you were in.
> 
> Had I been shooting it I would have had the camera in Manual mode with the flash in ETTL but turned off, I would have set the camera to 200iso and sync speed, then turned the aperture down (higher value) until the background was a touch underexposed, then turn the flash on. Done. If the subjects were a bit too hot turn FEC down, if too dark turn FEC up, but my experience with ETTL in this kind of situation is it would have nailed the subjects at FEC 0.




Camera	Canon EOS 5D Mark III
Exposure	0.005 sec (1/200)
Aperture	f/7.1
Focal Length	90 mm
ISO Speed	160
Exposure Bias	0 EV
Flash	On, 
Exposure Program	Manual
Recommended Exposure Index	160
Max Aperture Value	2.8
Metering Mode	Partial
Exposure Mode	Manual
White Balance	Auto
Scene Capture Type	Standard
Lens Info	70-200mm f/?
Lens Model	EF70-200mm f/2.8L IS II USM


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## privatebydesign (Jun 2, 2013)

Thanks, so were both camera and flash in Manual, or just camera?

As you are at sync speed I'd have closed the aperture to f9 or so to darken the background more, or take iso down to 100 and f stop to f8. If you want much less dof then go into HSS as well as shorten your shutter speed and open the aperture, but at the same ratios to keep the background exposure constant, though lower than it you did.

If the flash is in manual then for this kind of thing I'd leave it in ETTL, it deals with subject distance way better and faster than we can. Again to adjust for subject illumination just change FEC.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jun 2, 2013)

privatebydesign said:


> Thanks, so were both camera and flash in Manual, or just camera?
> 
> As you are at sync speed I'd have closed the aperture to f9 or so to darken the background more, or take iso down to 100 and f stop to f8. If you want much less dof then go into HSS as well as shorten your shutter speed and open the aperture, but at the same ratios to keep the background exposure constant, though lower than it you did.
> 
> If the flash is in manual then for this kind of thing I'd leave it in ETTL, it deals with subject distance way better and faster than we can. Again to adjust for subject illumination just change FEC.



Just the camera. Flash was ettl


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## privatebydesign (Jun 2, 2013)

Ok well in that case I'd just underexpose the background more, so either close aperture, lower iso, or go to HSS and shorten shutter speed. 

Here is a rough edit of what my suggestion to lower the ambient exposure would do.


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## dirtcastle (Jun 2, 2013)

I made your kids look kinda tough.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jun 2, 2013)

privatebydesign said:


> Ok well in that case I'd just underexpose the background more, so either close aperture, lower iso, or go to HSS and shorten shutter speed.
> 
> Here is a rough edit of what my suggestion to lower the ambient exposure would do.



Thanks what did you do to the photo since I still have the raw and maybe I can salvage this shot.


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## privatebydesign (Jun 2, 2013)

I opened in Photoshop and copied the background layer twice. 

On the top layer I then did a quick selection of the background and made a layer mask of the selection, I then did a curves layer adjustment to that top masked layer to lower the background a bit.

On the middle layer I did a light dodge to the picture right of the girls head and backpack to take the sunlight that Neuro mentioned down a little.

Flattened and save for web. 

With the full sized file you could take some time to get a good selection and you'd have much more control over the exposure. I'd process the RAW file twice and then open them as layers to get the best result. Email me if you want some help.


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## P_R (Jun 2, 2013)

Hello.
I like your shot, thank you for posting it. The kids, school bags and bus tell a story and it is the one you want, their (first) school day. The colours are bright and again remind me of children at school as kids apparel/ toys etc tend to be bright and colourful, and your image reflects this. Nicely done!

But I'm undecided about the bus, mainly because it such a large background element in the image and effetively dominates the background. The grass around the base make me think the school is in a rural area and maybe this too is by design, but maybe the same image but with other kids or the school could also work? You probably have taken other shots on the same day, so if you posted those maybe you could get other feedback?

To your opening question, I like viewing and critiquing pictures taken by others because you can always learn from their composition, ideas, PP, editing and so on. And that can only help ones own skills.


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## leGreve (Jun 2, 2013)

Hey...

First a few tips how to handle that shot next time:

1. Like others have mentioned, take your subject out into the sun. Let them be lit from the side or traditional 45 degree sun.
If you let them be lit from behind, have them stand close to something that could maybe bounce the light back at them.
Or simply choose to let the background white out a bit by exposing a stop above "proper" exposure.

2. Flash, no matter what size or kind, does not belong on a camera... The light is not very flattering and flattens out the face. You'll sometimes see fashion guys do it though.... I attribute that to lazyness.

3. Use the surroundings. Have a quick look around and see what might be near by that you can use to your advantage. Sometimes trees can provide nice diffusion or scattered light that can soften the harsh light of the sun.


Photoshopping is a matter of taste, what I like might not be what others like. Anyways here's what I would consider a small *quick* fix:


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## Northstar (Jun 2, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> This is one for my kids last day of school and would like criticism and feedback. Thanks in advance.



I like the bus...it helps to tell the story of "last day of school and summer is here"...which evokes good memories for many.

I did a quick edit on my iPad using Snapseed, which is free and does a decent job. Snapseed has a tool that is called center brightness which allows you to darken and blur the perimeter of an images, while increasing the brightness of the center....all to varying degrees. I tried it on your image and here's the result.... cropped a bit.

My response to your question is a question...was the image you posted your final image? In other words, had you finished your PP work before posting this? 

Good luck KC


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## KKCFamilyman (Jun 2, 2013)

Northstar said:


> KKCFamilyman said:
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> > This is one for my kids last day of school and would like criticism and feedback. Thanks in advance.
> ...



Yeah i had but I have been processing so many images lately I did rush and do plan on reprocessing these. What about the colors? I often struggle with a cooler wb but often what appears as the light at that timeia too warm. What do you do to images like that?


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## Northstar (Jun 3, 2013)

KKCFamilyman said:


> Northstar said:
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> > KKCFamilyman said:
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Just take the image into LR or Aperture and work it. The wb and colors are ok, it's the faces and background that are problem areas. 

I only did three things to this edit: (5 minutes time again using my iPad)
1. Put some extra light on their faces
2. Slightly reduced some of the over exposed areas. 
3. Cropped out some noisy stuff on the left and right borders. ( like that brownish colored blurry ghost on the right)

My advice, master LR or Aperture....it will do wonders for your photography.


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## KKCFamilyman (Jun 3, 2013)

Northstar said:


> KKCFamilyman said:
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> > Northstar said:
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Thanks I know I need to learn more about my PP workflow. It's hard when your actively shooting to make time to learn software.


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