# What’s next for the Canon Cinema EOS line



## Canon Rumors Guy (Sep 23, 2021)

> Things have been relatively quiet in the Cinema EOS space from Canon, as they marketed the heck out of the Canon EOS R3 for the last many months.
> There was an expectation that Canon would make a big splash at NAB 2021, but that show has been cancelled and won’t return until April 23-27, 2022 in Las Vegas, Nevada. This change may have an impact on when Canon announces new Cinema EOS gear.
> What is coming for Cinema EOS
> Canon Cinema EOS C300S
> ...



Continue reading...


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## EOS 4 Life (Sep 23, 2021)

C300S and C700DR would be class leading.

C500S would hold up pretty well against the V-Raptor

It is going to get interesting if these specs are accurate


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## Kit. (Sep 23, 2021)

RF 14mm T/1.5?

Will there be a corresponding stills lens?


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## BroderLund (Sep 23, 2021)

Wonder if they will make a wide-angle cine lens for the C300S, given the crop sensor.


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## EOS 4 Life (Sep 23, 2021)

Kit. said:


> RF 14mm T/1.5?
> 
> Will there be a corresponding stills lens?


RF 14mm f/1.4 would not surprise me.
Although it might be a bit too chunky for most.


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## Canon Rumors Guy (Sep 23, 2021)

Kit. said:


> RF 14mm T/1.5?
> 
> Will there be a corresponding stills lens?


These prime lenses for the RF mount are built off of the current Sumire lenses.


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## Kit. (Sep 23, 2021)

Canon Rumors Guy said:


> These prime lenses for the RF mount are built off of the current Sumire lenses.


Then is should be T3.1, not T/1.5, I guess.


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## jvillain (Sep 23, 2021)

Wasn't there supposed to be some thing that slotted in below the C-70 coming that wasn't the R5C? It's good to see more BSI sensors. What does the S at the end of the name stand for?


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## EOS 4 Life (Sep 23, 2021)

Kit. said:


> Then is should be T3.1, not T/1.5, I guess.


That would be equivalent to 14mm f/2.8 which would be a great sized lens.
It would also make me consider the 15-35 f/2.8 over the 14-35 f/4


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## LJT (Sep 23, 2021)

What happened to the C50 due to be announced this year?


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## MythPlayer (Sep 23, 2021)

LJT said:


> What happened to the C50 due to be announced this year?


Maybe R5C=C50?


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## Tidy Media (Sep 24, 2021)

Wonder what ever happened to the c200 Mk II...


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## landon (Sep 24, 2021)

C90?


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## Dinesh262 (Sep 24, 2021)

What about replacement of Canon EOS RP?


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## Darecinema (Sep 24, 2021)

BroderLund said:


> Wonder if they will make a wide-angle cine lens for the C300S, given the crop sensor.


Do you mean anamorphic? If so, that would be a dream come true to have anamorphic Cine lenses from Canon, but to my knowledge they have never manufactured an anamorphic lens. Not sure why.


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## Rofocale (Sep 24, 2021)

I would dearly love ProRes RAW for my C70, but those specs on the new models look amazing. Any idea on estimated release dates?


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## EOS 4 Life (Sep 24, 2021)

BroderLund said:


> Wonder if they will make a wide-angle cine lens for the C300S, given the crop sensor.


If it has an RF-mount then it could just use the Canon focal reducer


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## esspy2 (Sep 24, 2021)

I am eagerly awaiting the arrival of the C50, especially if it comes in a box camera format.


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## Bahrd (Sep 24, 2021)

WDR sensor tech incompatible with DP AF?


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## cinemanimal (Sep 24, 2021)

Canon Cinema EOS C700DR has my interest. But only if the body is right. The old body was big and ugly. The c300/500 body isn't pro in my mind. I want a Box like Alexa Mini or red. I want Raw + Prores + DNX in ALL frame rates unlike the c700. Canon I know you can do it!!​


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## sanj (Sep 24, 2021)

cinemanimal said:


> Canon Cinema EOS C700DR has my interest. But only if the body is right. The old body was big and ugly. The c300/500 body isn't pro in my mind. I want a Box like Alexa Mini or red. I want Raw + Prores + DNX in ALL frame rates unlike the c700. Canon I know you can do it!!​


My ears hurt.


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## Del Paso (Sep 24, 2021)

cinemanimal said:


> Canon Cinema EOS C700DR has my interest. But only if the body is right. The old body was big and ugly. The c300/500 body isn't pro in my mind. I want a Box like Alexa Mini or red. I want Raw + Prores + DNX in ALL frame rates unlike the c700. Canon I know you can do it!!​


And I want a white chocolate ice-cream!


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## sanj (Sep 24, 2021)

This may seem dumb to many, and is perhaps a dumb question, but will these lenses autofocus like an RF lens does on R5? Thx


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## cinemanimal (Sep 24, 2021)

sanj said:


> My ears hurt.


Sorry! I feel like canon needed to hear that loud incase they were listening.


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## Darecinema (Sep 24, 2021)

sanj said:


> This may seem dumb to many, and is perhaps a dumb question, but will these lenses autofocus like an RF lens does on R5? Thx


Not at all. Cinema lenses are manual focus lenses with extremely long focus throws allowing for precision focus adjustments with minimal focus breathing. Usually the are operated with a follow focus and an assistant cameraman for focus (1st AC). There are motorized follow focus wheels but to my knowledge no one has devised a way to tap into the autofocus information to drive these motors using the touch screen tap to focus function. That however would be sweeeeeeet.


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## Darecinema (Sep 24, 2021)

Del Paso said:


> And I want a white chocolate ice-cream!


You do realize there are many many chocolate ice creams that are white in color and also varieties of white chocolate ice cream flavors that are also white in color. Not criticizing, just saying if that will bring joy to your life, definitely go get some of that yumminess.


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## Del Paso (Sep 24, 2021)

Darecinema said:


> You do realize there are many many chocolate ice creams that are white in color and also varieties of white chocolate ice cream flavors that are also white in color. Not criticizing, just saying if that will bring joy to your life, definitely go get some of that yumminess.


I'll never forget the one I had in San Francisco a few years ago. Divine...


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## steve oakley (Sep 24, 2021)

Darecinema said:


> Not at all. Cinema lenses are manual focus lenses with extremely long focus throws allowing for precision focus adjustments with minimal focus breathing. Usually the are operated with a follow focus and an assistant cameraman for focus (1st AC). There are motorized follow focus wheels but to my knowledge no one has devised a way to tap into the autofocus information to drive these motors using the touch screen tap to focus function. That however would be sweeeeeeet.


trying to to tie a follow focus motor to a ultrasonic rangefinder has been done with varying degress of sucess. maybe good enough for T2.8 ot 4.0 with S35mm film, but not good enough for 4K+ and wide open. There is zero reason we can't have focus motors in cine lenses. Sure they would have to be a lot bigger to move the mass, take some power, but so what. those are pretty simple engineering problems to solve.

the real problem, which even a millenial at a show a few weeks ago gave me gave me was " we use manual focus in film" coppng a serious attitude I must be some rube after I said when are you going to put AF focus motors inside this well know cinelens brand. She didn't even stop to realize i've been literally shooting longer than she's been alive. when a I'm not even that old DP could see value in AF this harkens to perception and attitude rather than practical application. Remember film vs digital arguements ? especially the ones about how digital could never replace film ? um, ya right, we know how that turned out and AF in cine lenses is exactly the same arguement and mentality all over again. can we skip the middle part and just get AF motors in cine lenses and be done with it ? or at least external FF motors designed to do that job and talk with the camera bodies via generic standard protocol so everybody's gear plays together like MIDI ? sigh !


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## jvillain (Sep 24, 2021)

Tidy Media said:


> Wonder what ever happened to the c200 Mk II...


My expectation is the C100 and 200 fall out of the line up. No one wants to pay cinema camera prices for an HD camera these days especially when DSLRs are 8K and you can get a 12K Ursa for about the price of what a new C-100 would cost. Ya ya ya some one will pipe up about all they need is a 640x480 B&W camera but an HD only camera is really niche unless it does 1500 fps or has a DR of 20 stops.


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## jvillain (Sep 24, 2021)

steve oakley said:


> trying to to tie a follow focus motor to a ultrasonic rangefinder has been done with varying degress of sucess. maybe good enough for T2.8 ot 4.0 with S35mm film, but not good enough for 4K+ and wide open. There is zero reason we can't have focus motors in cine lenses. Sure they would have to be a lot bigger to move the mass, take some power, but so what. those are pretty simple engineering problems to solve.
> 
> the real problem, which even a millenial at a show a few weeks ago gave me gave me was " we use manual focus in film" coppng a serious attitude I must be some rube after I said when are you going to put AF focus motors inside this well know cinelens brand. She didn't even stop to realize i've been literally shooting longer than she's been alive. when a I'm not even that old DP could see value in AF this harkens to perception and attitude rather than practical application. Remember film vs digital arguements ? especially the ones about how digital could never replace film ? um, ya right, we know how that turned out and AF in cine lenses is exactly the same arguement and mentality all over again. can we skip the middle part and just get AF motors in cine lenses and be done with it ? or at least external FF motors designed to do that job and talk with the camera bodies via generic standard protocol so everybody's gear plays together like MIDI ? sigh !


Autofocus usually means fly by wire which is an issue if you do want to do autofocus. For me autofocus would be great as it would be for people doing doc stuff. But for people doing long form drama etc they are going to want to get their focus pulls just right and not leave it up to the focus ferry.


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## tooyoung225 (Sep 24, 2021)

interesting there is no mention of the c50, c90, or C200mkii in this… c50 is suppose to be a box camera, c90 is supposed to be a FF sensor, and both with RF mounts. Since that is where it appears things are headed, I'm surprised there has been no mention of those. I feel like there is also a big need for a Raw capable cinema camera in the sub 10k space (enter c200mkii). Definitely has me curious as to what Canon has up their sleeves...


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## sanj (Sep 25, 2021)

Darecinema said:


> Not at all. Cinema lenses are manual focus lenses with extremely long focus throws allowing for precision focus adjustments with minimal focus breathing. Usually the are operated with a follow focus and an assistant cameraman for focus (1st AC). There are motorized follow focus wheels but to my knowledge no one has devised a way to tap into the autofocus information to drive these motors using the touch screen tap to focus function. That however would be sweeeeeeet.


Since these cameras are RF mount and have dual pixel focus, I could use my RF lenses and get 'tap' focus? I am considering these cameras for minimum crew documentaries. For my features, commercials etc I would use Alexa or Red. Thx.


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## Darecinema (Sep 25, 2021)

sanj said:


> Since these cameras are RF mount and have dual pixel focus, I could use my RF lenses and get 'tap' focus? I am considering these cameras for minimum crew documentaries. For my features, commercials etc I would use Alexa or Red. Thx.


Hey Sanj, which cameras are you referring to? I can tell you that the C70 does an amazing job on autofocus with the RF lenses as does the R5, just make sure you adjust your tap to focus speed in the menu (and if you are shooting slo mo don't forget to adjust accordingly or the pull will be waaaayyyy to slow at 120fps) The C70 is currently the only Canon cinema body that RF lenses work on unfortunately. Can't wait for the new line-up honestly. Looking forward to a Full Frame C500 with RF mount but in the meantime I just keep making money with my C70, R5, RP, C300II.


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## Darecinema (Sep 25, 2021)

steve oakley said:


> trying to to tie a follow focus motor to a ultrasonic rangefinder has been done with varying degress of sucess. maybe good enough for T2.8 ot 4.0 with S35mm film, but not good enough for 4K+ and wide open. There is zero reason we can't have focus motors in cine lenses. Sure they would have to be a lot bigger to move the mass, take some power, but so what. those are pretty simple engineering problems to solve.
> 
> the real problem, which even a millenial at a show a few weeks ago gave me gave me was " we use manual focus in film" coppng a serious attitude I must be some rube after I said when are you going to put AF focus motors inside this well know cinelens brand. She didn't even stop to realize i've been literally shooting longer than she's been alive. when a I'm not even that old DP could see value in AF this harkens to perception and attitude rather than practical application. Remember film vs digital arguements ? especially the ones about how digital could never replace film ? um, ya right, we know how that turned out and AF in cine lenses is exactly the same arguement and mentality all over again. can we skip the middle part and just get AF motors in cine lenses and be done with it ? or at least external FF motors designed to do that job and talk with the camera bodies via generic standard protocol so everybody's gear plays together like MIDI ? sigh !


Yeah, I love the ability to have autofocus and I can tell you that this new breed of autofocus cameras pull off shots that are pretty much impossible with a human 1st AC. My 1st AC loooovvess the abilty to use Autofocus on some of our shoots. That being said, it's not real to me that they are going to build the focus motors into the cinema lenses themselves, but someone will come along with the "perfect" motor system (one to rule them all) and will solve this problem. I tried the Red Rock system a while back with the laser rangefinder but was a bit too finicky and ended up going back to the old fashioned ways of doing it. However I do a massive quantity of reality, corporate and doc work and the C300s (I,II andI III) and now the C70 are my go-tos and whatever optical differences there may be between the Cinema glass and the RF/EF glass are completely overshadowed by the money saved being able to be a single operator and the frustration saved with the autofocus systems. The next generation of guerilla film makers will drive the need for some innovator to get us that cinema lens focus system, but it's going to be external. At least that's where I'd place my money.


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## sanj (Sep 25, 2021)

Darecinema said:


> Hey Sanj, which cameras are you referring to? I can tell you that the C70 does an amazing job on autofocus with the RF lenses as does the R5, just make sure you adjust your tap to focus speed in the menu (and if you are shooting slo mo don't forget to adjust accordingly or the pull will be waaaayyyy to slow at 120fps) The C70 is currently the only Canon cinema body that RF lenses work on unfortunately. Can't wait for the new line-up honestly. Looking forward to a Full Frame C500 with RF mount but in the meantime I just keep making money with my C70, R5, RP, C300II.


I am talking about the cameras mentioned in this thread. I have the R5 and the autofocus works just fine!


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## sanj (Sep 25, 2021)

This makes me ask: Will these cinema lenses look better, or significantly better, than the autofocus RF lenses in a documentary situation?


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## sanj (Sep 25, 2021)

Darecinema said:


> Yeah, I love the ability to have autofocus and I can tell you that this new breed of autofocus cameras pull off shots that are pretty much impossible with a human 1st AC. My 1st AC loooovvess the abilty to use Autofocus on some of our shoots. That being said, it's not real to me that they are going to build the focus motors into the cinema lenses themselves, but someone will come along with the "perfect" motor system (one to rule them all) and will solve this problem. I tried the Red Rock system a while back with the laser rangefinder but was a bit too finicky and ended up going back to the old fashioned ways of doing it. However I do a massive quantity of reality, corporate and doc work and the C300s (I,II andI III) and now the C70 are my go-tos and whatever optical differences there may be between the Cinema glass and the RF/EF glass are completely overshadowed by the money saved being able to be a single operator and the frustration saved with the autofocus systems. The next generation of guerilla film makers will drive the need for some innovator to get us that cinema lens focus system, but it's going to be external. At least that's where I'd place my money.


I agree with your comment. Have you ever compared the 8k 12 bit video of R5 to C300's? I would love to know if you can see a difference in the IQ. Thank you.


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## Tidy Media (Sep 25, 2021)

jvillain said:


> My expectation is the C100 and 200 fall out of the line up. No one wants to pay cinema camera prices for an HD camera these days especially when DSLRs are 8K and you can get a 12K Ursa for about the price of what a new C-100 would cost. Ya ya ya some one will pipe up about all they need is a 640x480 B&W camera but an HD only camera is really niche unless it does 1500 fps or has a DR of 20 stops.


The C200 is a 4K camera...


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## Bob Howland (Sep 25, 2021)

sanj said:


> This may seem dumb to many, and is perhaps a dumb question, but will these lenses autofocus like an RF lens does on R5


It's not as dumb as you think. Camcorders, such as the recently-announced Canon XF605, have built in autofocus lenses. They may not be good enough to do a feature film with, but they're pretty good.


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## Antono Refa (Sep 25, 2021)

Canon Rumors Guy said:


> These prime lenses for the RF mount are built off of the current Sumire lenses.


The Sumire 14mm lens is T3.1.

The T1.5 might be a typo. Then again, maybe cine lenses are expensive enough for Canon to make a profitable 14mm f/1.4, while stills lenses aren't.


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## cpreston (Sep 25, 2021)

The primary component for AF on the Canon cameras is the lens providing aperture and focal length data. I can get by with out AF and rarely use continuous AF, but I need to the manual focus guides from the DPAF for critical focus. As far as I know, the only cinema lenses that work with DPAF are Canon's and Sigma's.


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## capa150 (Sep 25, 2021)

Maybe chip shortages? C50 is the only Canon I would have any interest in. C300/500 out of my price range for sure. And the mirrorless still cameras ... not my thing.


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## MythPlayer (Sep 26, 2021)

Antono Refa said:


> The Sumire 14mm lens is T3.1.
> 
> The T1.5 might be a typo. Then again, maybe cine lenses are expensive enough for Canon to make a profitable 14mm f/1.4, while stills lenses aren't.


canon cinema prime lens have no 18mm\100mm lens，And 135mm lens is T2.2 
Maybe there is "CN-E L" lens line for RF-mount


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## tooyoung225 (Sep 26, 2021)

capa150 said:


> Maybe chip shortages? C50 is the only Canon I would have any interest in. C300/500 out of my price range for sure. And the mirrorless still cameras ... not my thing.


thats kind of what im thinking. I'm really only interested in the c50 or a c200mkii…otherwise, I'll probably just pick up another c70. Canon's mirrorless stills cams aren't my thing either, for video at least. We love them for photo, but I want to stick to the cinema line for video.


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## tjphoto (Sep 26, 2021)

Will the new canon cine lenses have autofocus motors ?


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## sanj (Sep 26, 2021)

tjphoto said:


> Will the new canon cine lenses have autofocus motors ?


Read the thread, it is unlikely.


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## HarryFilm (Sep 26, 2021)

steve oakley said:


> trying to to tie a follow focus motor to a ultrasonic rangefinder has been done with varying degress of sucess. maybe good enough for T2.8 ot 4.0 with S35mm film, but not good enough for 4K+ and wide open. There is zero reason we can't have focus motors in cine lenses. Sure they would have to be a lot bigger to move the mass, take some power, but so what. those are pretty simple engineering problems to solve.
> 
> the real problem, which even a millenial at a show a few weeks ago gave me gave me was " we use manual focus in film" coppng a serious attitude I must be some rube after I said when are you going to put AF focus motors inside this well know cinelens brand. She didn't even stop to realize i've been literally shooting longer than she's been alive. when a I'm not even that old DP could see value in AF this harkens to perception and attitude rather than practical application. Remember film vs digital arguements ? especially the ones about how digital could never replace film ? um, ya right, we know how that turned out and AF in cine lenses is exactly the same arguement and mentality all over again. can we skip the middle part and just get AF motors in cine lenses and be done with it ? or at least external FF motors designed to do that job and talk with the camera bodies via generic standard protocol so everybody's gear plays together like MIDI ? sigh !



---

That's just age talking! In my case I have doing Cinematography/Camera-Ops since 1987 usually with Betacam SP, ArriFlex-35/ArriFlex-65 FILM cameras and Hi-Def prototypes of 1125 line Saticon HD tube cameras and the first progressive scan 1080p HD DigiBetas so I understand your irritation at "Newbies". I should note we were ALL newbies once who thought we KNEW EVERYTHING and YOU (i.e. the OLD FOGIE!) knows NOTHING !!!

In terms of autofocus, modern GLASS lens of superb-quality are DAMN HEAVY and it will take us moving to scientific-grade All-Acrylic lenses in order to reduce the weight enough that putting high-end autofocus becomes monetarily practical.

We CAN do full autofocus on a T1.5 of Leica/Leitz Summicron-C lens BUT at what outrageous cost! It's already $260,000 for a full set of these:






SUMMICRON-C | Leitz Cine


Premium prime lenses designed for larger sensors on film and television productions.




www.leitz-cine.com





How far do we have to go to reduce the weight enough at a reasonable cost on heavy Glass lenses?

WE MUST GO high-refractive-index all-Acrylic lens elements in order to get practical AND COST EFFECTIVE auto-everything cinema lenses and pro-level still photo lenses!

if you want to find out THE FUTURE OF IMAGING, then read the following forum posts and attached documents.
It's a taste of what is to come! All this NEW technology, our parent Aerospace company has NOW MADE FULLY OPEN SOURCE and FREE TO USE, so it it's up to Canon, Sony, Fuji, Blackmagic, GoPro, Pentax, Olympus, etc. to use OUR FREE TECHNOLOGY to build into their cameras.

2K/4K/8K/16K+ Multi-Spectral Sensor System and Multi-Sensor rotating and linear image sensor block:
Fully free and open source under GPL-3 licence terms:





16K Resolution Camera Leak – Free and Open Source Worldwide Public Disclosure under GPL-3 licence terms - PART 1 !!!


16K Resolution Camera Leak – Free and Open Source Worldwide Public Disclosure under GPL-3 licence terms - PART 1 !!! Free and Open Source Design and Device Disclosure under GPL-3 Licence terms for all described software and hardware systems and devices as of Monday, August 23, 2021 as...




www.canonrumors.com





The test cameras are in prototype stage and will be outlined here on CanonRumors.

The High Refractive-Index all-Acrylic lens prototype sets which have auto-focus ability
AND which are T/0.9 are also in prototype stages and will be open sourced too!

AND for the win, we've got short-lens-barrel up-to-9600mm equivalent ZOOM LENSES too
that have active optically-based AND software-based REAL-TIME heat-shimmer and atmospheric
distortion removal technology which will ALL be fully free and open source under GPL-3 licence terms!!!

So YES!, you did hear it here FIRST!



V


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## sanj (Sep 26, 2021)

tooyoung225 said:


> thats kind of what im thinking. I'm really only interested in the c50 or a c200mkii…otherwise, I'll probably just pick up another c70. Canon's mirrorless stills cams aren't my thing either, for video at least. We love them for photo, but I want to stick to the cinema line for video.


What do you find lacking in Canon's mirrorless still cameras for video, please?


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## unfocused (Sep 26, 2021)

HarryFilm said:


> That's just age talking! In my case ...you did hear it here FIRST!


Thank you Harry! I have been a bit depressed because I see little on the horizon in the next year or so that is likely to be of interest to many of the people on this forum, which will in turn translate into redundant posts on the same two to three topics by they same four or five self-appointed experts. 

I used to be annoyed by your posts, always promising some super camera that transcends physics. But, I've come to appreciate the particular brand of insanity that you so ably represent. It's almost an art form and I actually do enjoy following your antics. I hope you will provide a little sunshine over the coming dark months.


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## HarryFilm (Sep 26, 2021)

unfocused said:


> Thank you Harry! I have been a bit depressed because I see little on the horizon in the next year or so that is likely to be of interest to many of the people on this forum, which will in turn translate into redundant posts on the same two to three topics by they same four or five self-appointed experts.
> 
> I used to be annoyed by your posts, always promising some super camera that transcends physics. But, I've come to appreciate the particular brand of insanity that you so ably represent. It's almost an art form and I actually do enjoy following your antics. I hope you will provide a little sunshine over the coming dark months.


Due to the current pandemic, I can QUITE ASSURE YOU that I am even MORE INSANE than ever before! 

All that calcium uptake inhibition on CA2+ receptors has REALLY affected my brain and my sensibility so THAT means more crazy good stuff for you to read!

NOW THEN ... if you read MORE of my PDF and JPEG imagery, you will find my insanity has a VERY pointed end-game which is to create a legally defensible MAKE PRIOR ART declaration that the Aerospace concern that is our parent company, can TRULY ENSURE that no shenanigans can be envisioned or completed by the BIG electronics and optics companies (including Canon, Sony and Fuji!) to stop or slow down progress in modern-day imaging systems!

The super-camera is not only SUPER but it actually EXISTS! So we will announce it in the next few weeks along with the all-Acrylic T0.9 prime lenses and all the short-barrel super-zoom lenses we have available!

The MUCH LARGER INNOVATION though, is that MASSIVE 575 TeraFLOPs of computing horsepower contained within our DESIGNED BY CANADIANS (in a secret offshore location!) BUT MANUFACTURED IN CANADA 128-bits Wide combined 60 GHz clock speed Fully ITAR-free GaAs CPU/GPU/DSP that I helped design the GPU portion of (i.e. accelerated 2D-XY/3D-ZYZ SOBEL/CANNY edge detection hardware and Wu-based Line and Curve draw algorithms with environment-aware alpha channel, drop shadows and glows!) The Tape-Out layout of the Superchip we have NO PROBLEM WITH completely Free and Open Sourcing under GPL-3 licence terms!

THAT innovation could actually CAUSE the END of Intel, AMD, ARM, Qualcomm and IBM !!!

We have MORE THAN TWO BILLION of those superchips currently stocked in our secretive and very-hidden Vancouver, Canada warehouse and we could obliterate the ENTIRE processor chip market IN MERE DAYS by doing a $222 USD full online-retail release (YES! You saw that correctly --- 575 TeraFLOPS at 128 bits wide for TWO HUNDRED AND TWENTY TWO U.S. DOLLARS !!!!!) --- Our manufacturing cost is almost nothing due to complete automation using Multi-Electron-Beam Etching and A.I.-based visual and electrical Quality Assurance of EVERY chip, so we are STILL making enormous bank!

AND AFTER ALL THAT .... We STILL have that super-fancy 148,000 lbs (67,131 kg) Dark Black Triangle hovering silently in our YVR hangar which we can ALSO show and release to the public! It's power production system and GWASER (Gravity Wave Amplification by Stimulated Emission of Radiation)-based propulsion system WILL KNOCK YOUR SOCKS OFF !!!!

We'll just hover it silently over English Bay for a few hours and then SHOOT IT PAST the ISS way on up to GeoSync orbit in a mere 5.5 seconds FLAT with NO INJURY to our crew and let YOU THE PEOPLE WATCH some LIVE-VIEW 128k by 128k imagery from 22,000 miles up as we distribute FREE AND OPEN SOURCE UNDER GPL-3 LICENCE TERMS all of the POWER PRODUCTION AND PROPULSION DESIGNS and MANUFACTURING TECHNOLOGIES world-wide !!! I think THAT will finally OBLITERATE the Oil and Gas industry 10x over!

AND HECK YEAH !!!! You have SEEN the rotating and linear-slide multi-image-sensor block designs and the multi-spectral, band-specific-photosite image sensing system HERE on this website --- We very much CAN do what we say because we actually DO HAVE all that OTHER TECHNOLOGY READY for worldwide disclosure and distribution!

AND YES! You heard it here FIRST!

V


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## navastronia (Sep 26, 2021)

sanj said:


> This makes me ask: Will these cinema lenses look better, or significantly better, than the autofocus RF lenses in a documentary situation?



Cinema lenses will always look better than stills lenses if you know what to look for, but mainly, it's about features and handling.


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## Nelu (Sep 27, 2021)

Canon Rumors Guy said:


> Continue reading...


You know, this is actually funny.
Here is a post 100% about video features and in three days there are 50 comments.
When the R5 came out you’d see a new article about it and 300 comments following, quite a few of them complaining about variouts video features some folks didn’t like…What gives ?


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## unfocused (Sep 27, 2021)

Nelu said:


> You know, this is actually funny.
> Here is a post 100% about video features and in three days there are 50 comments.
> When the R5 came out you’d see a new article about it and 300 comments following, quite a few of them complaining about variouts video features some folks didn’t like…What gives ?


The Cinema EOS line is targeted at professional video production. Aside from @sanj there are almost no professional video people on this forum at the level that requires the Cinema EOS line. Most of the people on this forum are either hybrid shooters (both video and stills) or stills only shooters. Thus, there is not much interest among most forum participants in the Cinema EOS line.


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## Jethro (Sep 27, 2021)

It actually is good to see Harry back ...


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## tooyoung225 (Sep 27, 2021)

sanj said:


> What do you find lacking in Canon's mirrorless still cameras for video, please?


For starters, simple things like internal ND’s, XLR audio inputs (with phantom power), and recording limits. And don’t get me started with the overheating issues. They’re great cameras for photo, which is why we have them, but they fall short for our needs in the video department.


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## sanj (Sep 27, 2021)

navastronia said:


> Cinema lenses will always look better than stills lenses if you know what to look for, but mainly, it's about features and handling.


I understand. I conclude that for most documentary work the RF lenses will work fine. I can reduce the expense of a focus puller from the budget and that will be an important factor. The RF 50/85 1.2 work great. I will wait for the 25/35 1.2.


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## sanj (Sep 27, 2021)

tooyoung225 said:


> For starters, simple things like internal ND’s, XLR audio inputs (with phantom power), and recording limits. And don’t get me started with the overheating issues. They’re great cameras for photo, which is why we have them, but they fall short for our needs in the video department.


I was mainly interested in IQ issues. The simple things you mention above, do not mean much to me personally.


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## EOS 4 Life (Sep 27, 2021)

Bahrd said:


> WDR sensor tech incompatible with DP AF?


Why would it be?


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## EOS 4 Life (Sep 27, 2021)

cinemanimal said:


> Canon Cinema EOS C700DR has my interest. But only if the body is right. The old body was big and ugly. The c300/500 body isn't pro in my mind. I want a Box like Alexa Mini or red. I want Raw + Prores + DNX in ALL frame rates unlike the c700. Canon I know you can do it!!​


The entire point of the C700 was that components can be upgraded without replacing the entire thing.
Big and ugly makes sense for what it is.
RED did find a way to be modular while still being small so maybe Canon can adopt some of that.


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## EOS 4 Life (Sep 27, 2021)

Darecinema said:


> Not at all. Cinema lenses are manual focus lenses with extremely long focus throws allowing for precision focus adjustments with minimal focus breathing. Usually the are operated with a follow focus and an assistant cameraman for focus (1st AC). There are motorized follow focus wheels but to my knowledge no one has devised a way to tap into the autofocus information to drive these motors using the touch screen tap to focus function. That however would be sweeeeeeet.


Canon has cinema lenses with autofocus.


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## Bahrd (Sep 27, 2021)

EOS 4 Life said:


> Why would it be?


I do not know. The global shutter version of the sensor in the current C700 has no DP AF either. So I assume it could still be [a] technological barrier.


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## EOS 4 Life (Sep 27, 2021)

jvillain said:


> My expectation is the C100 and 200 fall out of the line up. No one wants to pay cinema camera prices for an HD camera these days especially when DSLRs are 8K and you can get a 12K Ursa for about the price of what a new C-100 would cost. Ya ya ya some one will pipe up about all they need is a 640x480 B&W camera but an HD only camera is really niche unless it does 1500 fps or has a DR of 20 stops.


Who says a new C100 camera has to be Full HD and we have no idea what would be in a C200 Mark II.
A C200 II would have to sit between the C70 and the C300 III.
There is not a huge feature gap but there is a large price gap between the two.


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## EOS 4 Life (Sep 27, 2021)

sanj said:


> Since these cameras are RF mount and have dual pixel focus, I could use my RF lenses and get 'tap' focus? I am considering these cameras for minimum crew documentaries. For my features, commercials etc I would use Alexa or Red. Thx.


Right now they are hypothetical.
I am sure that would all be demonstrated for us.


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## EOS 4 Life (Sep 27, 2021)

sanj said:


> This makes me ask: Will these cinema lenses look better, or significantly better, than the autofocus RF lenses in a documentary situation?


Canon makes a lot of compromises with photo lenses for lightness that they do not have to make with cine lenses.
*There are some Canon cine lenses that are converted photo lenses.


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## EOS 4 Life (Sep 27, 2021)

Antono Refa said:


> The Sumire 14mm lens is T3.1.
> 
> The T1.5 might be a typo. Then again, maybe cine lenses are expensive enough for Canon to make a profitable 14mm f/1.4, while stills lenses aren't.


Was it really necessary for Canon to list out the focal lengths and the T-stops?
The name pretty much spells it out.
CN-E14mm T3.1 FP X


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## tooyoung225 (Sep 27, 2021)

sanj said:


> I was mainly interested in IQ issues. The simple things you mention above, do not mean much to me personally.


Ah, well I have no gripes with the Image Quality in those camera. That paired with Canon color science is great. But as a primarily run and gun videographer, those "simple" things are pretty important to me.


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## Tremotino (Sep 27, 2021)

HarryFilm said:


> ---
> 
> That's just age talking! In my case I have doing Cinematography/Camera-Ops since 1987 usually with Betacam SP, ArriFlex-35/ArriFlex-65 FILM cameras and Hi-Def prototypes of 1125 line Saticon HD tube cameras and the first progressive scan 1080p HD DigiBetas so I understand your irritation at "Newbies". I should note we were ALL newbies once who thought we KNEW EVERYTHING and YOU (i.e. the OLD FOGIE!) knows NOTHING !!!
> 
> ...


Hi HarryFilm,
I was reading your post without reading your name and after some sentences I though this is a HarryFilm-style post and it was you. Nice to heare from you! Quite some time you were away. Interesting forum link with interesting documents. 
Where do you get all this informations? 
I honestly thought you where a sports photographer, but after reading your post about "dendrite-growth" in Lithium Ion I'm not so sure anymore.


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## HarryFilm (Sep 28, 2021)

Tremotino said:


> Hi HarryFilm,
> I was reading your post without reading your name and after some sentences I though this is a HarryFilm-style post and it was you. Nice to heare from you! Quite some time you were away. Interesting forum link with interesting documents.
> Where do you get all this informations?
> I honestly thought you where a sports photographer, but after reading your post about "dendrite-growth" in Lithium Ion I'm not so sure anymore.


Actually, I have TWO "edumacations" -- an actual Diploma in Broadcast Television Operations (Graphics Production) from SAIT (Southern Alberta Institute of Technology) and the other is various coursework in Computer Science (Specialty: Encryption and 3D Computer Graphics) AND "some" structural and mechanical engineering AND Oil and Gas Reservoir modelling and Directional Drilling Systems coding which I have used all over the place!

Due to a personal connection to one of the owners of a Canadian Aerospace company, I now have access to SIGNIFICANT technical resources and scientific personnel in exchange for ongoing computer systems design and administration tasks on my part.

The documents you have seen are INTENTIONALLY created in the manner as you see them in order to create a legally defensible trail of account and custody AND a legally defensible and very public "Prior Art" library against patents by large corporations on NEW imaging technology!

CanonRumors is my goto place for public announcements on all the new imaging tech you will be seeing soon!

Wait until you see the NEW camera announcements and the NEW high-refractive index all-Acrylic lenses announcements --- Those are biggies coming in the next few weeks! We may actually go into RETAIL production on the OPEN SOURCE lens designs since they are so good. The OPEN SOURCE camera design itself is to be used and modded by a very major corporate entity which you all know and love! (NOT Canon, Sony or Fuji!)

After that, we will introduce other imaging systems to brighten your rumor-mill day!

And FINALLY, our all-Canadian-designed-and-built version of the TR-3b Astra/Locust/Mares Canyon/Whatever-They-Call-it-Black-Budget-Program will be released as soon as we have certain patentable products in place.

AND YES! You heard it here FIRST!

Sooooooo, get ready for MORE INSANITY from HarryFilm!

P.S. I looooove the smell of rumours in the morning !!!!!!!

P.S.2. I also do ACTUAL Corporate Video Cinematography and Camera Work as part of my day job!

I currently use the production-ready version of our custom-in-house-built "Big Boss" 50.3 Megapixels at 120 fps 70mm Medium Format Sensor running at 16-bits RAW per RGBA channel Monster Machine as my main camera! It's about the size and weight of an Arriflex-65! AND YES I have used it on a Steadicam Rig! -- It's hard but doable because I am so big! 

V


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## chess227 (Oct 4, 2021)

Canon desperately needs a cinema camera around the $6,000 - $7000 price range that isn't the C70. That horrible body design on the C70 is the only reason I jumped ship to the Sony FX6 after being with Canon since the 5DMark II through the C200. If they'd come out with a camera with the same specs as the C70 that didn't have that stupid form factor and camera balance, I'd gladly switch back, but sadly it looks like they've just got high end Cinema cameras on the horizon.


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## clearlyed (Oct 10, 2021)

chess227 said:


> Canon desperately needs a cinema camera around the $6,000 - $7000 price range that isn't the C70. That horrible body design on the C70 is the only reason I jumped ship to the Sony FX6 after being with Canon since the 5DMark II through the C200. If they'd come out with a camera with the same specs as the C70 that didn't have that stupid form factor and camera balance, I'd gladly switch back, but sadly it looks like they've just got high end Cinema cameras on the horizon.


I couldn't agree more. I am literally waiting to purchase RF cinema cameras from Canon. I have money waiting in the bank. But clients are starting to expect more. If there is nothing by the end of the year I will be selling everything canon (I have built up RRF glass ready) and move to Sony. Its just too simple. I can buy 3 FX6's tomorrow and all the glass I need. I prefer canon and would like to use canon cameras but my gear needs updating and canon has nothing to offer right now. The C70 is not an option. Moving forward the industry is changing to full frame so investing in a a number of C70s is just like buying something that is already not what clients are asking for.


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## EOS 4 Life (Oct 10, 2021)

clearlyed said:


> I couldn't agree more. I am literally waiting to purchase RF cinema cameras from Canon. I have money waiting in the bank. But clients are starting to expect more. If there is nothing by the end of the year I will be selling everything canon (I have built up RRF glass ready) and move to Sony. Its just too simple. I can buy 3 FX6's tomorrow and all the glass I need. I prefer canon and would like to use canon cameras but my gear needs updating and canon has nothing to offer right now. The C70 is not an option. Moving forward the industry is changing to full frame so investing in a a number of C70s is just like buying something that is already not what clients are asking for.


Why does it need to be RF?


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## clearlyed (Oct 10, 2021)

EOS 4 Life said:


> Why does it need to be RF?


Because that’s where they are putting all their energy with glass. I can adapt ef to ef by not the other way. So if I buy ef body then i am locked into tonsuring lenses that will not be updating so any improvements will completely be lost. When they bring out an improved set of cone lenses that will be RF so what’s the point in buying an ef body. Cine bodies can be work horses for years and years so as canon is going through a change it will be very wise to buy the new mount.


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