# grip gives fps boost on 5D3 to 6.7-6.9fps????????



## LetTheRightLensIn (Mar 20, 2012)

A crazy rumor from DPR. But one person says they heard it "somewhere" and another claims that he just went to a demo 3 days ago and the rep told him that the grip increases fps, to something probably about 6.7fps, maybe 6.9.

I'm not sure I buy it, but wow, that would be cool if so. It might also explain all those rumors that had all the 5D3 specs on target but then were off with the fps 6.9fps vs 6.0fps.

If it could do 7fps gripped that would be pretty awesome, you really have yourself a true action cam then (When you are doing serious sports you might grip the body anyway, but unlike 1 series you can then toss the grip for a nice sized camera for everything else). It'll still be awful for high dynamic range shooting at low ISO compared to the D800 but if it has better video, similar high iso, if the AF is awesome, an dif it can hit 7fps gripped it starts to make a bit more sense. It'll still be worse for ISO100-400 landscape stuff and for long reach wildlife stuff but it might be a nicer generalist action/sports/wedding/video cam perhaps.

Probably foolish to get my hopes up over this as it sounds a bit fanciful, but wow if that guy really did hear that from the rep and the rep really did know what he was talking about. There still seem to be a lot more reasons to doubt it though, but still.


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## CanineCandidsByL (Mar 20, 2012)

Not unheard of, and I'd like to believe it. Guess I'll hope for the best and expect the worst.


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## LetTheRightLensIn (Mar 20, 2012)

Considering that it is not listed in the grip description anywhere it seems very hard to believe.
Ah, almost certainly just another wild tale from someone hoping for more than we are getting.


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## candyman (Mar 20, 2012)

LetTheRightLensIn said:


> Considering that it is not listed in the grip description anywhere it seems very hard to believe.
> Ah, almost certainly just another wild tale from someone hoping for more than we are getting.




+1 
Probably due to the fact that the grip is being offered for 325 euro : 
It need to be sold


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## moreorless (Mar 20, 2012)

Could just be someone reffering to the pre released rumour of 6.9 FPS and jumping to conclusions.


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## vuilang (Mar 20, 2012)

so, A plus .7-.9fps would make you jump up&down?

but I doubt it's true since canon doesnt state it in description.


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## iso79 (Mar 20, 2012)

LOL. Canon isn't Nikon. They don't make you get a grip to get another .7-.9 FPS out of your camera.


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## nighstar (Mar 20, 2012)

this is news....?? oh. well, had i known that this spec wasn't out i would have confirmed it sooner...

at a Hands-on Prevew event that i attended last week for the 5D Mark III a Canon Australia rep did indeed state that the grip boosts the fps to 6.9. it's a fact, not a rumor. why it isn't in the specs anywhere is beyond me as i am sure the Canon rep knew what he was talking about as he had just returned from 5D Mark III training in Japan.


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## cps_user (Mar 20, 2012)

it is said by Chuck Westfall that the grip doesn't increase voltage, but just extends the duration and amount of photo's you can take. Don't know about fps, but it's a given fact that lenses won't focus faster (1-series batteries have a higher voltage and thus more power to drive AF motors in lenses)


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## smithy (Mar 20, 2012)

iso79 said:


> LOL. Canon isn't Nikon. They don't make you get a grip to get another .7-.9 FPS out of your camera.


Um, I have an EOS 1V film camera, and the battery grip is exactly how to get an extra 4-5 fps out of the camera.


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## pwp (Mar 20, 2012)

vuilang said:


> so, A plus .7-.9fps would make you jump up&down?



Any FPS increase gets my interest. Shooting action at 10 FPS on the Mk4 it frequently astounds me how much actually happens between each frame. At some events I also shoot with the still amazing 1D Mk2n which distinguishes itself with almost freaky AF performance. Its max FPS rate of 8 FPS delivers highly noticeably different results to the Mk4 when comparing action sequences.

Can anyone tell me how deep the buffer depth is when shooting continuous RAW with the 5DIII with a good fast CF card? This is one key area where the 1DX will comprehensively outstrip its less expensive sibling.

Paul Wright


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## PeterJ (Mar 20, 2012)

pwp said:


> Can anyone tell me how deep the buffer depth is when shooting continuous RAW with the 5DIII with a good fast CF card? This is one key area where the 1DX will comprehensively outstrip its less expensive sibling.


At the moment Canon specs list the following, so I guess in brackets is what you can expect with a faster card:

Maximum Burst
·JPEG Large/Fine: Approx. 65 shots (approx. 16270 shots)

·RAW: Approx. 13 shots (approx. 18 shots)

·RAW+JPEG Large/Fine: Approx. 7 shots (approx. 7 shots)

*Figures are based on Canon's testing standards (ISO 100 and Standard Picture Style) and a 8 GB card.

*Figures in parentheses apply to an UDMA mode 7, 128 GB card based on Canon's testing standards.


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## briansquibb (Mar 20, 2012)

The extra .9 fps is hardly a deal maker


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## iso79 (Mar 20, 2012)

smithy said:


> iso79 said:
> 
> 
> > LOL. Canon isn't Nikon. They don't make you get a grip to get another .7-.9 FPS out of your camera.
> ...



Yeah but it comes with the body!


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## JR (Mar 20, 2012)

briansquibb said:


> The extra .9 fps is hardly a deal maker



This is certainly good news is it proves to be true, but I agree with Brian it is not a deal maker for sure. Am starting to think Canon is doing a good job at keeping its rep in the dark (aka source of this rumor) - lol


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## BillyBean (Mar 20, 2012)

I have to admit that despite the apparently sound source - the Canon rep - I am struggling to believe this. Sure, the EOS 3 (which I love) gains a speed boost from its grip, and I can say from experience this is several frames per second. But you have to remember that this is physically moving film at a very fast rate of knots, which simply does not happen in a DSLR. The EOS 3 grip appears to have some sort of augmentation motor inside it - I've not dissected the thing, but there is a drive shaft that comes up from the grip and engages the film sprocket under the main body. In contrast, in a DSLR, the limiting factor is largely moving and processing data, so unless the grip has additional processing power, which seems pretty unlikely, I don't see how it could improve the FPS. The only thing I can think of, other than an additional processor, is that Canon have artificially limited the frames per second in the main body until it detects that the grip is attached, whereupon the limit is removed. Which even for Canon, seems somewhat convoluted and manipulative...


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## neuroanatomist (Mar 20, 2012)

BillyBean said:


> The only thing I can think of...is that Canon have artificially limited the frames per second in the main body until it detects that the grip is attached, whereupon the limit is removed. Which even for Canon, seems somewhat convoluted and manipulative...



Well, they might be taking a page from Nikon's old playbook book (perhaps the page just after "more MPs aren't better"), since that's exactly what Nikon does - artifically limit the fps in the body until a grip is detected. There's a menu hack for Nikon (setting up a flash bracketing series with no flash attached) that allows you to get the higher fps on a non-gripped body that's normally only achieved with a grip attached.


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## candyman (Mar 20, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> ................. There's a menu hack for Nikon (setting up a flash bracketing series with no flash attached) that allows you to get the higher fps on a non-gripped body that's normally only achieved with a grip attached.




Really? I did know about that.
Do such hacks exist for Canon camera's like 7D? Is it the firmware? 


EDIT: just thinking.....it IS possible to crank out more GHZ from your computers processor. So why not fps of a camera. Just, what will it do to the other chips and circuits?


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## neuroanatomist (Mar 20, 2012)

You can't exceed the design specification of the mirror assembly, which is the main limiting factor. With film SLRs, the other factor was the film winding motor, where more power meant faster. With digital, the mirror is the real limit, and Nikon just throttles their speed without the grip, whereas Canon has not done that (yet, at least). I'd think if the grip gave a higher frame rate on the 5DIII, Canon would have included that in the specs.


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## BillyBean (Mar 20, 2012)

Ooops - I forgot about the mirror. Yep, that would limit things nicely... I wonder when we all go mirrorless and get an EF lens mount mirrorless solution? Can't be far off...


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## Vertvorb (Mar 20, 2012)

The 6.9fps rumour that was so "black and white" had to of come from somewhere. Perhaps a prototype had it and they removed it for general release for some reason or another? Would be awesome if the grip did give the boost, i'm definately going to keep my fingers crossed.


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## Arkarch (Mar 20, 2012)

candyman said:


> Do such hacks exist for Canon camera's like 7D? Is it the firmware?



Magic Lantern may eventually be available for the 5DmIII. I am sure they are working on it. Who knows if they can up it. If Canon artificially downgraded the max FPS, it may be for reliability or durability. But maybe the grip gives them enough current to maintain a higher FPS?

For the 7D - its a multi-processor camera and while Magic Lantern tried, my understanding is that it is technically beyond their scope (and I fully understand that challenge). Info is somewhere on their website.


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## WarStreet (Mar 20, 2012)

The .9 fps increase represent 15% improvement. 15% more photos to choice from that 1 - 2 second action. 15 % better odds. We have seen lot of applauses from users for a lower percentage improvement in resolution in a 10 year old replacement lens. At least an unexpected positive news, and I will be happy with that if it is true. Is it possible that canon did not mention anything about it due to inconsistency?


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## smithy (Mar 20, 2012)

iso79 said:


> smithy said:
> 
> 
> > iso79 said:
> ...


Unfortunately not - the grip only came with the 1V-HS model. I've been looking for a grip for my 1V for ages, but nobody sells them anymore. It doesn't really matter now, since I'm looking at replacing all of my bodies with the 5D Mark III.


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## MARKOE PHOTOE (Mar 20, 2012)

Don't believe everything you hear....I met a photographer one day while shooting surfers in Santa Cruz Ca. He was shooting with a 7D and 400 2.8 lens, a nice combo. He claims he sent his 7D to Canon and they 'converted' it to shoot 12 fps. Of course, I was amazed so I called Canon and asked them, 'Not possible' they said. This guy was full of it.


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## psolberg (Mar 20, 2012)

no. they would have said so. they have to protect the 1DX


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## LetTheRightLensIn (Mar 20, 2012)

iso79 said:


> LOL. Canon isn't Nikon. They don't make you get a grip to get another .7-.9 FPS out of your camera.



Well it wouldn't be anything to LOL over. If you got an extra frame, you got an extra frame and that can mean the difference between 1 good frame from a sequence vs. 2 or 1 vs. none.


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## LetTheRightLensIn (Mar 20, 2012)

Vertvorb said:


> The 6.9fps rumour that was so "black and white" had to of come from somewhere. Perhaps a prototype had it and they removed it for general release for some reason or another? Would be awesome if the grip did give the boost, i'm definately going to keep my fingers crossed.



yeah maybe that was just an alternate pro-type, a real shame if they went with the 6.0fps one in the end, especially for $3500 and zero improvements to the sensor, at all, for low ISO shooting.

it's totally foolish but I still hold out hope that one rep was correct, although it's easy to think of hundreds of reasons why it makes sense for it to not be true hah


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## LetTheRightLensIn (Mar 20, 2012)

psolberg said:


> no. they would have said so. they have to protect the 1DX



unless they are waiting to trumpet the spec until all the 1DX pre-orders and have shipped and they are too late to return and are protecting 1Dx that way ;D

i doubt it though, just wishful thinking most likely


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## WillShootPhotos (Jun 1, 2012)

*Nope - 6.0 fps with and without the grip... some grip review notes too...*

I received my grip about a week back and just yesterday did a test to see if there was any fps boost when shooting with the grip vs without... 

5D Mark III, genuine canon LP-E6 batteries, fully charged. Canon BG-E11 grip.

I recorded the sound of the shooting, pulled the audio over to my PC, looked at the wave form in a sound editor and lo and behold - the same frame rate both gripped and without grip.

All that said - I will report that the new grip is great. When mounted, the 5D3 is taller than my 1D4. The "portrait" section of the grip feels larger (I've not actually measured it) than the portrait section of the 1D4 too.

Nice to have the second joystick, but the positioning is a touch different than on the main grip. To put the second joystick in the same relative position, it would need to be about at the location of the large wheel "lock" switch. So they had to move inboard a bit to keep it actually on the grip. I'm still reflexively reaching my thumb over to the "main" joystick, but slowly re-training myself... 







The construction is super solid feeling, I like the new door setup that mimics the 1D series battery insertion/sealing. 

I'll be doing a post about the grip soon - along with the huge advantage of using udma 7 cards in both the 5D3 and the 1D4...

Let me know if there are other questions about the grip...

- Will


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## awinphoto (Jun 1, 2012)

nighstar said:


> this is news....?? oh. well, had i known that this spec wasn't out i would have confirmed it sooner...
> 
> at a Hands-on Prevew event that i attended last week for the 5D Mark III a Canon Australia rep did indeed state that the grip boosts the fps to 6.9. it's a fact, not a rumor. why it isn't in the specs anywhere is beyond me as i am sure the Canon rep knew what he was talking about as he had just returned from 5D Mark III training in Japan.



I think it's called being a good used car salesman... smells fishy to me


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## moreorless (Jun 1, 2012)

My guess is the rumour originally surfaced to explain the difference between the rumoured 7fps and the actual 6fps.

Has anyone actually timed the 5D mk3? perhaps its somewhat faster than 6fps but Canon were unwilling to over estimate and label it at 7fps?


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## WillShootPhotos (Jun 1, 2012)

moreorless said:


> My guess is the rumour originally surfaced to explain the difference between the rumoured 7fps and the actual 6fps.
> 
> Has anyone actually timed the 5D mk3? perhaps its somewhat faster than 6fps but Canon were unwilling to over estimate and label it at 7fps?



Um, yes - two posts earlier in this thread: http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=4512.msg129235#msg129235

6.0 sec on the nose for both gripped and un-gripped.

The discussions I'd seen about the 7.0 fps (well - reported 6.8 fps w/ grip) were all credited back to various stories about having discussions with the ever ambiguous "Canon Rep" saying that the 6.0 was boosted to 6.9 with the grip... 

The spec has pretty much always been reported (well - excluding rumors and speculation) as 6fps by canon in all their press releases, etc.

- Will


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## LetTheRightLensIn (Jun 2, 2012)

WillShootPhotos said:


> moreorless said:
> 
> 
> > My guess is the rumour originally surfaced to explain the difference between the rumoured 7fps and the actual 6fps.
> ...



Speaking of rumors. For ages, some have claimed that only a large 1 series battery provides enough current to drive supre-tele AF at maximum speed. Others claimed that the difference was simply because the non 1 series bodies had slow AF chips and processing. Has anyone compared how fast a 5D3 can drive super-tele AF vs a 1D4/1D3/1DX? Another wild rumor was that the new grip cost more because they added the option to drive the batteries in parallel or that it would take optional 1 series battery pack. It's already been disproven (the 5D3 grip only allows the batteries to run in series and it won't accept any special batter packs). But I wonder, if they had allowed for that, if it would have sped up AF speed at all.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jun 2, 2012)

If the batteries in the grip are in parallel, then the internal resistance would be lower, and under a high current drain, the voltage would be a little higher. If the FPS is dependent only on the battery voltage, you might see a small increase. Li-On batteries do have a internal resistance that is relatively high, so the voltage drops during high current output.

So its possible, and, thats probably why Nikon is able to get a higher FPS with dual batteries installed in the grip.


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## neuroanatomist (Jun 2, 2012)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> So its possible, and, thats probably why Nikon is able to get a higher FPS with dual batteries installed in the grip.



Except that apparently, with a trick/hack involving auto-bracketing, Nikon bodies can achieve that higher frame rate without the grip installed.


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## LetTheRightLensIn (Jun 2, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> Mt Spokane Photography said:
> 
> 
> > So its possible, and, thats probably why Nikon is able to get a higher FPS with dual batteries installed in the grip.
> ...



Supposedly it only works when the battery is near full charge. Just what I read in one post. No idea if it's true.

I still wonder if the 1 series drives AF motors more quickly due to the big power pack thing is true or just some tall tale passed down. Anybody have say a 300 2.8 IS or 400 2.8 IS and a 5D3 and a 1D3/1D4/1DX around?


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## Kernuak (Jun 2, 2012)

For what it's worth, when I went to the 5D MkIII demo back in March, the UK CPS rep said that the AF is quicker on 1 series cameras due to the higher voltage from the battery, but I haven't tested it either (I don't have either cameras ).


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## neuroanatomist (Jun 2, 2012)

Kernuak said:


> For what it's worth, when I went to the 5D MkIII demo back in March, the UK CPS rep said that the AF is quicker on 1 series cameras due to the higher voltage from the battery, but I haven't tested it either (I don't have either cameras ).



Chuck Westfall has stated that, as well.


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## LetTheRightLensIn (Jun 2, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> Kernuak said:
> 
> 
> > For what it's worth, when I went to the 5D MkIII demo back in March, the UK CPS rep said that the AF is quicker on 1 series cameras due to the higher voltage from the battery, but I haven't tested it either (I don't have either cameras ).
> ...



In that case then why don't they make more intelligent grips like Nikon does? Why not a flip switch to toggle between in series and in parallel, or if that still won't work with basic batteries, then why not allow it to also take the full 1 series power pack as I believe the Nikon grips do? With the past non 1 series the AF logic chips may have been too slow to take much advantage anyway, but now that we have the same AF logic chips and logic in the 5 series why not make the more expensive 5D3 grip deliver something more than it just being a portrait mode grip?


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## Marsu42 (Jun 6, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> Kernuak said:
> 
> 
> > For what it's worth, when I went to the 5D MkIII demo back in March, the UK CPS rep said that the AF is quicker on 1 series cameras due to the higher voltage from the battery, but I haven't tested it either (I don't have either cameras ).
> ...



So people can now overclock their 5d3? Does water cooling help  ?


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## Viggo (Jun 6, 2012)

Batteries in a Canon grip are used one after the other, not together. So it doesn't matter if you have one or two batteries in the grip (for fps). If they were used parallell you could pull out a higher current and lens drives and such would at least be faster, but they don't. They make you pay for the 1-series for that


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