# Wide Angle on a Budget



## eagles03 (Nov 29, 2012)

I have a need for a wide angle lens for my 7d. Preferably something fast, 2.8 or better.

I had a 24-70mm f/2.8L I, as well as a 17-35mm f/2.8L (yes, 17-not 16). I sold both because I didn't use them, and picked up a 50mm f/1.2L to upgrade my f/1.4 for portraits.

I would like to use this lens for indoor candid uses primarily, hence f/2.8 or faster. I have a budget of ~$600, but I am in no rush to spend that much. I don't do a lot of landscape, but occasionally I will dabble in it, as well as the sporadic attempts at astrophotography (too much light pollution where I am). I like to shoot wildlife (on a budget), so I have no desire to go ff at the moment, so I wouldn't be buying a lens with that in mind.

I wasn't a huge fan of the 17-35mm because it just wasn't all that good on my 7d. I didn't get anything calibrated, and didn't do any AFMA, so maybe having a better copy would have been fine, but I couldn't justify it at the time.

I have considered the 28mm f/1.8, but I'm not sure if that would be the best idea for me.

Thoughts?


----------



## pdirestajr (Nov 29, 2012)

What do you consider "wide angle" on your 7D?

Samyang 14mm f2.8 is probably the fastest/ widest/ cheapest. But since you mentioned AF calibration, I'm not sure if MF is a deal breaker.

Don't think you are gonna get a wide-angle F/2.8 "or faster" for below 600.

Rent the 24mm f/1.4II and you'll save up for it!


----------



## Drizzt321 (Nov 29, 2012)

You'll be hard pressed to find any super-wide in f/2.8 that inexpensive. Only thing that comes to mind is the Samyang/Ronkinon 14mm f/2.8, however it's a manual lens, so no AF, and I think you have a manual aperture ring as well. Otherwise, if you want AF, it's get an older lens cheap if you can find one, or save up your money and find a used 16-35 v1 or v2. From what I've read I wouldn't bother with the v1, but it is significantly more expensive.


----------



## Promature (Nov 29, 2012)

I know it's not f2.8, but consider getting the EF-S 10-22 f3.5-4.5. When dealing with wide angle, losing one stop is not a huge deal. A used or refurbished version should be less than your budget.


----------



## barracuda (Nov 29, 2012)

The EF-S 15-85mm f/3.5-5.6 IS is available (and in stock) at the Canon refurbished site for $512 with the 20% off sale:

http://shop.usa.canon.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_10051_10051_269486_-1

I know it's not 2.8, but it's something to consider that's within your budget. Otherwise, a refurbished EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS can be had for less than $1k.


----------



## Policar (Nov 29, 2012)

Promature said:


> I know it's not f2.8, but consider getting the EF-S 10-22 f3.5-4.5. When dealing with wide angle, losing one stop is not a huge deal. A used or refurbished version should be less than your budget.



The 11-16mm Tokina is a little worse in terms of IQ (due to some chromatic aberration, which can be fixed in post) but it's f2.8 through the zoom range and build quality is great. It's an excellent lens. Very excellent for the money.

28mm is not very wide on the 7D, fwiw. That said, for landscapes it is my favorite focal length on APS-C. I don't like the distorted look for most landscapes. I prefer tilt/shift lenses but they are expensive.

The 17-55mm f2.8 IS is awesome in general.


----------



## SJTstudios (Nov 29, 2012)

Policar said:


> Promature said:
> 
> 
> > I know it's not f2.8, but consider getting the EF-S 10-22 f3.5-4.5. When dealing with wide angle, losing one stop is not a huge deal. A used or refurbished version should be less than your budget.
> ...



+100 ;D, only I'd maybe look at the sigma 17-50 2.8 os instead of the canon.

I use the 28 1.8 on my rebel, it is really nice and sharp, it just isn't wide enough, it makes a good semi-wide, for candids though. 

Tokina actually just released an 11-16 2.8 ii, it looks a lot better, so I'd use that.

Or even look at the canon 20mm 2.8 or canon/sigma 15mm 2.8


----------



## eagles03 (Nov 30, 2012)

Thanks everyone for your responses!

I am purposefully not trying any lenses that are outside my budget, because then I will end up spending way more than I have. For now, photography is just a hobby, so I can't justify spending too much.... yet...


----------



## chops411 (Nov 30, 2012)

I got the Sigma 10-20 F3.5 for $250 off of craigslist and I'm very happy with it.


----------



## pwp (Nov 30, 2012)

Promature said:


> I know it's not f2.8, but consider getting the EF-S 10-22 f3.5-4.5. When dealing with wide angle, losing one stop is not a huge deal. A used or refurbished version should be less than your budget.



I wouldn't be too stuck on an f/2.8 lens, particularly if you're on a tight budget. The EF-S 10-22 f3.5-4.5 is Gold Standard and if you ever want to on-sell, it will hold its value better than just about anything else mentioned so far.

-PW


----------



## Promature (Nov 30, 2012)

> I wouldn't be too stuck on an f/2.8 lens, particularly if you're on a tight budget. The EF-S 10-22 f3.5-4.5 is Gold Standard and if you ever want to on-sell, it will hold its value better than just about anything else mentioned so far.
> 
> -PW



Glad someone else agrees with me. It's also in his budget if he buys it used or refurbished (see reply above).


----------



## rpt (Nov 30, 2012)

Check out the 20 mm 2.8 or the 15 mm fisheye. Both Canon. Both in your price range. Both 2.8. Both can be considered "wide" on a 7D. I have no experience of these lenses. Maybe someone who has them can share...


----------



## verysimplejason (Nov 30, 2012)

Tokina 11-16 and the Canon 10-22 are your best choices. If you want faster and sharper, it's the tokina for you. If you want a good overall lens, the Canon 10-22 is for you. You can also consider the Sigma and Tamron counterparts but those two for me provide the best IQ and best bang for the buck lenses.


----------



## sagittariansrock (Nov 30, 2012)

SJTstudios said:


> Policar said:
> 
> 
> > Promature said:
> ...




I tried the Tokina before going for the 10-22. I don't think the 11-16 was sharper- the 10-22 is extremely sharp. The decider for me was the full-time manual, low distortion at the wider end, and greater range. I love the 10-22...

The new Tokina comes with additional coatings- technically that cannot reduce chromatic aberration, and that is the only change. The benefits of the Tokina to me would be the larger and constant aperture, very nice build quality, and the smooth zoom and focus rings. Two videographer friends of mine both love the lens.


----------



## chunnamlaw (Nov 30, 2012)

I would also recommend the Samyang 14mm f2.8 if its wide enough for you. I also have a 7D and I've been using the Samyang 14mm alot lately. Its really sharp for the price and my only complain is the distortion (which is expected for such a wide lens)

At the 14mm focal length its very easy to zone focus so the lack of AF wont be much of an issue.


----------



## JPAZ (Nov 30, 2012)

Another testimonial for the EF-s 10-22. This was my "go to" for existing light interiors when I had a crop body. Now on FF, I hope my 17-40 does as well. 

Also consider the Rokinon 14mm f2.8 if you think you really want a faster lens. There are many "brands" of this lens that are all the same. I got the Pro-optic from Adorama 'cause it was about $40 cheaper.


----------



## Policar (Nov 30, 2012)

chunnamlaw said:


> I would also recommend the Samyang 14mm f2.8 if its wide enough for you. I also have a 7D and I've been using the Samyang 14mm alot lately. Its really sharp for the price and my only complain is the distortion (which is expected for such a wide lens)
> 
> At the 14mm focal length its very easy to zone focus so the lack of AF wont be much of an issue.



Amazing performance for the money if you don't mind MF, but the distortion is much worse than it should be. The 14mm f2.8 L II has almost no distortion. Even the 17-40mm f4 L has much less. It's really, really bad and needs correction in post more often than not.


----------



## picturesbyme (Nov 30, 2012)

I would check these out in a store from a friend or by renting them: 
*Tokina 11-16 2.8*
*Canon 17-55 2.8 *, 10-22, 15-85, 
*Tokina 16-28 2.8*
I used to have the 16-28. Never had a prob with its sharpness or speed. That can be used on FF later... and the approx 26mm isn't that bad.


----------



## verysimplejason (Nov 30, 2012)

picturesbyme said:


> I would check these out in a store from a friend or by renting them:
> *Tokina 11-16 2.8*
> *Canon 17-55 2.8 *, 10-22, 15-85,
> *Tokina 16-28 2.8*
> I used to have the 16-28. Never had a prob with its sharpness or speed. That can be used on FF later... and the approx 26mm isn't that bad.



16-28 is good. I'll only warn you that it can't use filters (though there are special/expensive way of doing it). Filters are very important for landscape photography.


----------



## picturesbyme (Nov 30, 2012)

verysimplejason said:


> picturesbyme said:
> 
> 
> > I would check these out in a store from a friend or by renting them:
> ...



True, the front element is nice and curvy  however since CS5 I barely used a filter.. save for NDs a couple times.. but I see that could be a prob. The other thing is the AF switch... a bit different and not everyone likes it... still its a good lens.


----------



## symmar22 (Nov 30, 2012)

rpt said:


> Check out the 20 mm 2.8 or the 15 mm fisheye. Both Canon. Both in your price range. Both 2.8. Both can be considered "wide" on a 7D. I have no experience of these lenses. Maybe someone who has them can share...



I have the 15mm fisheye and though it's probably the best fisheye on the market for full frame, I would not recommend it on a crop sensor : you'll end with a 24mm equivalent with tons of distortion. The 20mm is probably not a very good solution either, some people hate it, some like it, but it's an old and big lens that'll give you only a 32mm equivalent, not very wide.

The only crop sensors I had were Nikons, but when I had to find a wide angle, I came to the conclusion that a dedicated crop sensor lens is the way to go. I had the 12-24mm f4, and it was an excellent lens.

Crop sensors are as good with tele lenses as they are problematic with wide angles. One of the important reasons for using full frame sensors is precisely when you need a choice of wide angles.

I would suggest you stick with the Canon 10-22mm or the Tokina 11-16mm that has an excellent reputation. You will have a real wide angle zoom, with much more flexibility than a fixed one. Even the Samyang 14mm would give you "only" a fixed 22mm with manual focus, compared to the equivalent 16mm of the Canon zoom. 


My guess is the Canon would be bright enough with increased ISO (you can get a sharp picture with 1/15s), otherwise the Tokina is the way to go, IQ and built quality is excellent.

Edit : not that I am a big fan of Ken Rockwell, but you should nevertheless have a look at his review of the Tokina 11-16mm f2.8.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/tokina/11-16mm.htm


----------

