# Which FF body should I rent?



## mehaue (Jan 9, 2016)

Hi folks!

I do read a lot of your comments and really hope that you can make a suggestion based upon your own experience. I know all the specs of the camera, but that doesn't mean anything, I would like to hear true first hand suggestions from experienced shooters like you. Thanks for that.

I'm heading out for a two week rainforest experience in southern america. I own a 7D MkII, 100mm L IS Macro, 100-400mm IS Mk2, 50mm f1.4 and a 10-20mm Sigma f4-5.6 (and a couple of flashes (ringflash, EX-600RT)

I seriously consider renting a fullframe body + landscape lens (16-35mm f4??) as I'm not very happy with the Sigma 10-20mm. But it would also be awesome to maybe us the FF with the 100-400mm when I don't need that much reach but better IQ for example.

Now please, feel free to make suggestions and tell me which camera I should rent and why. I tend to the 5DSR, but the pixel count is very high and I'm not sure how good this camera is compared to the 7D Mk2 regarding high ISO. I tend to flash the birds with the 100-400 + 600RT flash because I want to keep the ISO low on the 7D Mk2, but maybe I do not need to flash with a FF and can crank up the possible shadows in post?

Thank you guys for your help and cheers
Martin


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## Halfrack (Jan 9, 2016)

For high ISO's, the 1Dx is the best, with the 6D behind it. The 5DsR is no better than your 7DII, maybe even worse at high ISO. If you go the 5DsR route, you should consider renting a 70-200 f2.8 IS II to go with it, plus it's own flash. Crop in rather than give up a stop or two of light.


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## wsmith96 (Jan 9, 2016)

Hmm.. going into a rainforest, I would recommend either a 5D Mk III or 6D for that along with a 16-35 F4L. Not sure how "off the path" you are going, but if you are, then I would opt for the 5D Mk III for ruggedness. 

Also, have you tried the Canon 10-22? I've got one and it's not bad for landscape.


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## Random Orbits (Jan 10, 2016)

How much processing do you want to do and what is is minimum required frame rate?

The pixel density between the 7DII and the 5DS are similar, so if you're technique is good enough for the 7DII, then it will be good enough for the 5DS. The 7DII will have a better frame rate, but there is no longer a reach advantage with the 7DII with a high density FF sensor like the 5DS.

The 5DIII will do better at the pixel level, but if you normalize the 5DS to the 5DIII resolution, then others have reported that the 5DS is better than the 5DIII/6D for noise, but that is a lot of work with the attendant larger files, etc. Personally, I'd choose the 5DS, but if you don't want to do all that processing, then the 5DIII is still a good choice.


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## Valvebounce (Jan 10, 2016)

Hi Martin. 
Can't help with the rented camera, but the quoted part of your message caught my attention. 
I'm currently reading the Glenn Bartley Flash Simplified ebook, there is a part in there about shutter speeds and ISO's with the flash, and the whole thing is very relevant to rain forest settings. 
I bought the trio of books on the offer from this site last week. 

http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=28679.msg566051#msg566051

Video Simplified: A Guide for Nature Photographers $15 (Reg $20) | Photography Simplified Series $50 (Reg $65)
(the links are copy protected (at least I can't copy them as live links on an idevice) click on the link above to the page)

Glenn is a contributor on here and has some beautiful images posted here using the 7DII. 
Glenn also runs photography workshops to various places including the rain forest. 
I have no connection to Glenn other than I am finding his books very interesting, I started with his 7DII AF guide! 
You can click on the books and view sample pages. 
I hope this helps you to some extent. 

Cheers, Graham. 



MartinH said:


> Hi folks!
> I tend to flash the birds with the 100-400 + 600RT flash because I want to keep the ISO low on the 7D Mk2, but maybe I do not need to flash with a FF and can crank up the possible shadows in post?
> 
> Thank you guys for your help and cheers
> Martin


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## mehaue (Jan 10, 2016)

Thanks for all your input!

Postprocessing is more than welcome. I might not find the time or processing power during our trip but I will have loads of them once I'm back home, so big RAW files are not an issue at all.

Now I tend between the Canon 6D and the 5DsR. Does anyone know a source where I'm able to download RAW files from both cameras and play around with them in Lightroom? Ideally from the same scene, taken with both cameras.

@Halfrack
I really like your idea about having a 5DsR with a 70-200mm f2.8, get a shallow DOF and crop in post, but I don't think my camera bag can handle an additional big white as I'm already struggling to fit everything in a 10kb backpack for carry-on baggage purpose.


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## mehaue (Jan 19, 2016)

So now, I have another player in the game... the famous 1D X.
I'm curious if you think it would make sense renting such a beast. I heard it's a great landscape camera due to the low mega pixel count and also a high ISO monster.... better than the 5D3.

I would like to hear your recommendations, it seems that I'm just looking for a "specced" out camera....


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## Sporgon (Jan 19, 2016)

With all that humidity in the South American Rainforests I'd be happy with the 7DII. Maybe think about renting a top notch wide and if you want wider angle of view stitch.


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## pj1974 (Jan 19, 2016)

I’m going to provide another perspective (I often do that!) A super brief summary of my own context… I started off with photography over 20 years, ago, got into digital in 1999. I currently own 2 x Canon DSLRs and several lenses, including the Sigma 10-20mm f/4-5.6. 

You listed your equipment as:
7DmkII
100mm L macro
100-400mm IS mkII
50mm f/1.4 and
Sigma 10-20mm f/4-5.6

I suggest there may (*may!) be another issue at stake. And that is that you may need to learn / re-learn getting the best from your current gear, in particular the UWA. The reason I say this, is that apart from the Sigma UWA, your next ‘widest’ lens is a Canon 50mm prime. That ‘gap’ between a 50mm and 10-20mm (you probably use your Sigma at 10mm a lot too) is HUGE. I am not having a go at your skills, but I do know how much practice UWA photography takes to get successful photos. The Sigma 10-20mm f/4-5.6 is not at all a bad lens… far from it. Many many people have taken thousands upon thousands (if not millions) of awesome photos with that, and lesser DSLR bodies than the 7DmkII. So, unless you have a dud/lemon Sigma 10-20mm… I want you to consider keeping your gear, and think of my advice in a new light.

Understanding perspective, composition, level horizons/horizontals and verticals, ‘stretching’ and distortion, etc impacts so much on UWA. In addition, the (possible) use of a tripod, filters etc – to get the most out of UWA is important. When I bought my Sigma 10-20mm f/4-5.6 I already knew I was in for a steep learning curve… this was despite already owning 4 other lenses covering 18mm-300mm (on a APS-C sensored DSLR). I am still learning.

A 35mm (aka ‘FF’) DSLR will provide you SOME benefits – e.g. a bit more latitude with respect to lower noise at high ISO (but don’t expect miracles, the 7DmkII is already very good). I would recommend the 16-35mm L f/4 IS as a great UWA / landscape lens for e.g a Canon 5DS, or 5Diii, 6D or 1DX. The image stabilisation is probably the largest advantage it gives over your Sigma. (I have recommended several people to buy Canon’s new EF-S 10-18mm STM IS, which has good IQ, and represents great value for money). Not to undermine the Sigma 10-20mm f/4-5.6, just saying that I think IS might be the only really big differentiator between many decent UWAs, unless someone needs bright glass (f/2.8 or more). The Canon 10-22mm (as someone recommended above) overall is no better than the Sigma 10-20mm (each has their stronger points).

I have travelled in many countries, using my Sigma UWA lenses and have been very happy… including rainforests (tropics and temperate climates. I currently own a Sigma 8-16mm for that bit extra wideness, and a slight improvement in IQ, though have always been very happy with my Sigma 10-20mm, and it often runs circles around many even L lenses when it comes to corner sharpness. This is the often understated advantage of APS-C DSLR bodies… how they can achieve better corner sharpness with UWA lenses optimised for APS-C, compared with what FF bodies can achieve, even with good lenses.

Graham/Valvebounce’s post above, to look up Glenn’s writings, and view his contributions (also those made with a 7DmkII) is sound advice. Additionally, as Sporgon wrote - consider the humidity could play issues with some bodies / lenses. I would also suggest that you can use your Sigma 10-20mm in MF (my Sigma 10-20mm had a very slight AF inconsistency at times, but knowing how AF works on a UWA, you can find and set focus to optimal focus very very easily with UWA). This can help you concentrate on composition more too. I have hundreds of ‘keepers’ with my Sigma 10-20mm on both my 350D and 7D – as single photos, as well as HDRs.

I sincerely hope that my post above, helps you – and may also be food for thought for others considering renting a FF on vacation, and/or going the FF/UWA route…. APS-C has a lot to offer!

Paul


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jan 20, 2016)

I'd definitely have a backup camera, and I'd pack some silica jell packs along to help keep the lenses and cameras dry and fungus free. The 1DX probably has the best resistance to moisture.

I'd be more concerned about moisture in a hot humid rainforest than IQ.


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## ishdakuteb (Jan 20, 2016)

have you ever considered to add another tool for wildlife photography, which is "better beamer, a flash output booster"?


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## monkey44 (Jan 20, 2016)

Just one reality comment here about renting. If you have a specific job and you need to rent, that one issue. if you rent with the idea you will buy another camera if it works well for your needs, then rent that one only.

If you think a 6D will do what you need, rent it. But if you just looking for a FF, and think you might buy a 5DM3 once you check out FF, then it makes sense to rent it. Otherwise, you need to rent both to make your decision. Just a thought.


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## mehaue (Mar 26, 2016)

As I have no chance to rent a 6D, I decided to head out in the field with only one body, my trusted 7DII.
Thanks for all your suggestions; I will keep you informed about the results from the trip.


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