# What metering do you use (and how does it work anyway)?



## Marsu42 (Dec 10, 2014)

Currently, I'm not 100% happy with my 6d's metering, it seems to be a bit more dodgy than my old 60d... *but* that's because I don't use it properly as there's no metering mode I'd like. So please, no 6d vs. 5d3, dynamic range or Nikon vs. Canon discussion in this thread.

* What I *would* like is a dumb matrix metering, ignoring the af points and preventing clipping to an extent of my choice. Actually exactly what Magic Lantern's auto-ettr does, but that works only in live view

* What I *do* use is eval with center & recompose, but I am mostly too much in a wildlife-hurry or too lazy to use ae lock. The result is that in high contrast scenes (like with the sky in the picture) the exposure is kind of hit-and-miss, and my only way out is either press the ae lock on every metering or use full m.

So I'm really wondering about switching to another "bread and butter" metering mode, thus the question: How do you do it? What do you use?


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## AmselAdans (Dec 10, 2014)

For people, who shoot RAW and intend to post-process their photos, the actual question is:
_Is (exact) metering important at all?_

For myself (only a half-baked amateur), I shoot, check the histogram and preview for blown highlights and then basically rely on a manual ETTR, which I fix (or at least try...) in post.

Without getting into a sensor debate (which will come inevitably), I think _minor_ exposure compensation in post (let's say up to -1 EV) won't hurt image quality too much, nevermind which sensor is used. So for myself, metering or the metering chip or its accuarcy are negligible.
Journalists with short amounts of time, however, will heavily rely on exact metering.


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## Eldar (Dec 10, 2014)

If you want to utilize available DR, you have to expose correctly. I always thought the histogram on the camera was for RAW, so I used that a lot, but learned that it is the jpeg histogram they show. Very dissapointing, so I rely a bit less on that now, even though it is a lot better than nothing.

When possible, on my 1DX and the newly arrived 7DII, I link it to AF. On my 5DIII, which does not support this, I use AE-lock and recompose. But I also use a separate light meter (Sekonic L-478D), when time permits, especially in my newly ramped up artificial light shooting. I find that by using the Sekonic quite a bit, I am much better at assessing available light and how it tricks the in-camera meter, in order to make the proper exposure compensation by myself.


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## JoFT (Dec 10, 2014)

May favorite: classic handheld incident metering. put the camera on M like Master Mode ;-)

I use TTL only for fast changing light conditions....

Checkout the webinars from sekonic.com.... very inspiring....


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## Marsu42 (Dec 10, 2014)

Eldar said:


> I always thought the histogram on the camera was for RAW, so I used that a lot, but learned that it is the jpeg histogram they show. Very dissapointing, so I rely a bit less on that now, even though it is a lot better than nothing.



Simply use Magic Lantern, it has a raw histogram - but that doesn't help you in changing lighting if you only have one shot in some split seconds. Usually I resort to center composition and partial metering, but this cuts away a lot of resolution (my 6d doesn't have af-linked spot).



AmselAdans said:


> Is (exact) metering important at all? For myself (only a half-baked amateur), I shoot, check the histogram and preview for blown highlights and then basically rely on a manual ETTR, which I fix (or at least try...) in post.



Problem with *wildlife* the subject/scnene will be long gone. Plus with your "shoot first, expose later" method, you're burning through your shutter cycles in no time, and my old 60d just broke down with 160k.



AmselAdans said:


> Without getting into a sensor debate (which will come inevitably), I think _minor_ exposure compensation in post (let's say up to -1 EV) won't hurt image quality too much



Unfortunately it does if you're operating at your sensor's high iso dr limit (which is a wash w/ all brands). If you're shooting *movement in high contrast* and the exposure is hit for six, the only way out of clipping is to "go dreamy" or dump the shot.


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## drmikeinpdx (Dec 10, 2014)

Good discussion, I like the "go dreamy" comment! LOL

Add me to the list of photographers who doesn't much like the in-camera light metering. I had a spot meter back in my Ansel Adams period about 30 years ago, which was fun, but the photography I do now does not allow time for that.

I gave up on the histogram a long time ago. Thanks for the tip about Magic Lantern using a RAW histogram.

For my professional work, where I can take a few seconds to compose and expose, I usually shoot on manual and just look at the LCD screen. I've done it so much that I've developed a pretty good eye.

When doing scenic or travel shots, I often use a three shot exposure bracket burst. When I get the images into Lightroom, I can choose the best exposure or combine them using Photomatix Pro for HDR.


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## AcutancePhotography (Dec 10, 2014)

JoFT said:


> May favorite: classic handheld incident metering. put the camera on M like Master Mode ;-)
> 
> I use TTL only for fast changing light conditions....
> 
> Checkout the webinars from sekonic.com.... very inspiring....



I still have my Sekonic. Don't use it as often as I used to, but still have not thrown it away either.


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## Dylan777 (Dec 10, 2014)

On my 1DX, I only have spot and eval on. Eval is what I use most of the time.

Q: you always put shooting info(text) on your photos? Why?


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## Marsu42 (Dec 10, 2014)

Dylan777 said:


> Q: you always put shooting info(text) on your photos? Why?



Someone requested that people posting shots share the shot information so we can learn from each other, so being Mr. Nice Guy print it onto the side. Vice versa, if someone thinks my settings are off and I could do better for this scene, he can comment it.

The caption & copyright line are simply there in case the metadata gets lost.


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## c.d.embrey (Dec 10, 2014)

*I do several things, and none of them are listed in your poll. *

1. I use a hand-held incident meter.

2. I use an Expo Disc http://www.expoimaging.com/ This turns your camera into an incident meter and does color balance too.

3. I set the camera to *"P" for professional.* You'd be amazed at how smart your camera is at setting exposure (and fill flash)  I do this for walk-around and even some paid work.


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## Marsu42 (Dec 10, 2014)

c.d.embrey said:


> *I do several things, and none of them are listed in your poll. *
> 1. I use a hand-held incident meter.
> 2. I use an Expo Disc



Both result in you shooting in m mode, that doesn't mean you need to use the in-camera metering (I admit this was not a poll item open to interpretation). Otherwise further options might include... :->

4. I call upon the holy trinity to send me a divine message what expo to use
5. I shoot only with the lens cap on, defaulting to 1 second at f1.0, then raise the shadows in post



Jackson_Bill said:


> For wildlife photography with my 7D, I use evaluative metering and use the quick control dial to compensate based on the conditions/scene. I find that to be a fairly quick way to adjust.



Me too, it's just that the 6d is more erratic than my 60d so it's difficult to predict an ec :-\



Jackson_Bill said:


> In your survey, I didn't see a simple "Evaluative" option. Doesn't the 7D use all the focus points (the scene) in evaluative metering unless you hit the AE lock?



That's 4c - eval with af point(s). I don't know how 7d-type af systems go on figuring out which af point is more important.


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## c.d.embrey (Dec 10, 2014)

Marsu42 said:


> c.d.embrey said:
> 
> 
> > *I do several things, and none of them are listed in your poll. *
> ...



The question was *"What metering do you use (and how does it work anyway)?"* Not *What in-camera-metering-only...*

BTW using *"P" for Professional* is a lot like your #4. *"I call upon the holy trinity to send me a divine message what expo to use"*


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## surapon (Dec 10, 2014)

Marsu42 said:


> Currently, I'm not 100% happy with my 6d's metering, it seems to be a bit more dodgy than my old 60d... *but* that's because I don't use it properly as there's no metering mode I'd like. So please, no 6d vs. 5d3, dynamic range or Nikon vs. Canon discussion in this thread.
> 
> * What I *would* like is a dumb matrix metering, ignoring the af points and preventing clipping to an extent of my choice. Actually exactly what Magic Lantern's auto-ettr does, but that works only in live view
> 
> ...



Dear Friend, Mr. Marsu 42.
Well, I am happy about all of my Canon, Olympus and P&S Nikon cameras of the great ability of in the camera Light Meter ( So many Type of Light Meters in the Camera Body , Start from Best Spot Meter ---To Average Type Meter = Some time the Eyes and Brain of Camera still in High school Level, Not Graduated School in The University YET ), Past two months, I go to the local Community Collage night school for " The Advance Studio Lights Class for the PRO", Yes, I must buy the Sekonic Light Meter to use in this Class too. Yes, I love this Light Meter in junction with Studio Lights, and Save a lot of times to get the corrected Exposure of a great Portraoit Photos. BUT, It waste my time to use in out door shooting---I just use The Camera Brain to do the right Expusure for me = 98% of all times, But 2 % of my Shooting, I must under exposure or Over Exposure , Just for my Taste.
Hear the Link that We already talk about my need for Light Meter in the Class :

http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=23261.0

Enjoy.
Surapon


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## Besisika (Dec 10, 2014)

AmselAdans said:


> For people, who shoot RAW and intend to post-process their photos, the actual question is:
> _Is (exact) metering important at all?_
> 
> For myself (only a half-baked amateur), I shoot, check the histogram and preview for blown highlights and then basically rely on a manual ETTR, which I fix (or at least try...) in post.
> ...


+1: Same here!


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## DominoDude (Dec 10, 2014)

Spot and evaluative metering plus some degree of exposure compensation are the ones I use most. There are days that I am perfectly happy with how my 7D meter a scene, and there are days when it just leaves me confuzzled.
Certain scenes - like sunsets - I want to do fully manual.
Experimented some with ML's ETTR module, but I'm not sure I get what I expect from it all the time. Most likely that is due to a lack of understanding/experience of ML's mysterious ways on my side of the viewfinder...


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## rfdesigner (Dec 10, 2014)

In bright lights I either use evaluative or spot and over-expose by two stops to simulate ETTR.

In dark conditions I go manual, stop at around ISO800, widest aperture, slowest I can go yet still stop subject movement. (readout noise in electrons at ISO800 is much the same as at 1600 or 3200, but I get much more headroom for bright spots of light)

And for astro I use a CCD!


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## mackguyver (Dec 10, 2014)

Evaluative with exposure compensation unless I'm shooting people or high DR photos. Then I use spot most often. Sometimes I ignore metering altogether and just use M mode and the histogram until I'm happy


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## tdrive (Dec 10, 2014)

I have to agree with Marsu42. I just sold my 6D because of the sheer frustration of the metering system having also come from a 60D which seemed to be fine. Having that AF point so strongly linked to the metering makes it too unpredictable for quick shots. For landscape shots where you have time to play with exposure, it' not a problem, but for say a wedding or something with high contrast, all i can say is thank god for raw files. I have tried the Magic Lantern software and it is awesome for things like bracketed shots, but too slow for the metering part because it utilizes live view.


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## Tinky (Dec 11, 2014)

none of the above.

I shoot manually, usually with a bias on 1 over focal length or faster for shutter (unless doing something specific that requires very shallow dof or a dragged shutter for deliberate blur) trying to keep my iso as low as I can for intended dof.

If i have an effect in mind I would sooner add optical filtration than change aperture or iso..

The camera is always set to evaluative mode, not linked to any af points, I might refer to the ev scale, but compensate by subject matter... that is let dark subjects be under, let bright subjects be over...

The way I work theres always time for a test shot


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## e17paul (Dec 11, 2014)

My Olympus OM-10 meters better than my 6D. That's fortunate because there are no second chances with film.


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## Ryan85 (Dec 11, 2014)

I use evaluate metering with ae lock if I'm not shooting in manual. I need to test the others out though.


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## Ryan85 (Dec 11, 2014)

mackguyver said:


> Evaluative with exposure compensation unless I'm shooting people or high DR photos. Then I use spot most often. Sometimes I ignore metering altogether and just use M mode and the histogram until I'm happy



+1 good advice


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## BozillaNZ (Dec 11, 2014)

Center weighted because I don't want the AF point to influence my choice of exposure. I will always dial in +/- EC before the exposure, judged by the zone distribution of the scene I want to photograph. So no right choice for my in the topic since I am not trying to be "lucky" but try to dial in the actual exposure.


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## Lawliet (Dec 12, 2014)

About 90% of the time the external meter, either as incidence meter or as a less klutzy/strobe capable version of the multispot metering in the 1-series.


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## tayassu (Dec 12, 2014)

I normally rely on the great metering system of my 7D and let it choose how to meter... 
In very difficult situations I use spot metering with AE lock. 
This combo has worked very well in the past and hopefully it will stay like this until 150k actuations... :


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## Mr Bean (Dec 12, 2014)

mackguyver said:


> Evaluative with exposure compensation unless I'm shooting people or high DR photos. Then I use spot most often. Sometimes I ignore metering altogether and just use M mode and the histogram until I'm happy


This. If the scene looks fairly well balanced, then I just shoot with what the camera says (+ a 1/3 ETTR - which is my default). If the scene looks tricky, then I usually have an idea in my head of what exposure compensation to use and adjust accordingly, checking the histogram after the first shot. I flip between evaluative and spot metering, depending on the situation.


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## mackguyver (Dec 12, 2014)

Marsu42 aka Meinungsforschering-Zwei-und-Vierzig: I just looked at the poll again and noticed option 5 - manual exposure. I'm not sure that should really be there as the camera is still using the metering mode (Eval, partial, spot, or center-weighted) to determine the exposure level seen in the viewfinder indicator. I'm guessing you meant this in regards to people who ignore the EV level indicator and use a handheld meter, the Sunny-16 rule/Zone etc., or the histogram.


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## Marsu42 (Dec 12, 2014)

mackguyver said:


> I'm guessing you meant this in regards to people who ignore the EV level indicator and use a handheld meter, the Sunny-16 rule/Zone etc., or the histogram.



Right, good point there  ... this option is there to basically cover "everything else" that doesn't rely too much or not at all on the camera's metering. That's because the intention of the thread is to find the best metering mode when in a hurry w/o even time for ae lock.

And in full M mode even looking at the camera's metering, you still have to think more when bringing the little green pointer to the center line. . Btw esp. on the 6d this procedure is a pita: In comparison to the 5d2 (same on 60d) the green info line below the frame is very small and very hard to read when in bright ambient.

Because you noticed, you're getting the "Schlaubi Schlumpf" (smart smurf) award of the thread :-> ... I don't know know if these popular comics have made their way over the great lake to marvel's superhero country.


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## Sporgon (Dec 12, 2014)

c.d.embrey said:


> *I do several things, and none of them are listed in your poll. *
> 
> 1. I use a hand-held incident meter.



Yep, so do I, at least quite frequently. Assuming that you are not compensating for something like strong highlight or strong shadow you can't beat nailing the exposure onto the sensor in the correct place if you want maximum IQ. The whole ETTR thing is mostly a myth brought about by people shooting zero data ( lens caps on for instance ) and then analysing it at 200% which has zero relevance to a normal picture.


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## mackguyver (Dec 12, 2014)

Marsu42 said:


> mackguyver said:
> 
> 
> > I'm guessing you meant this in regards to people who ignore the EV level indicator and use a handheld meter, the Sunny-16 rule/Zone etc., or the histogram.
> ...


The comics haven't made their way to the US, but I remember them from my time in Europe. Thanks for the funny memory. Also, I understand and I'm so happy to see that Canon is moving the indicator to the side in the 7DII. I love it there in my 1D X and hope that's the future direction for all x0D and above bodies.


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## Lawliet (Dec 12, 2014)

Marsu42 said:


> That's because the intention of the thread is to find the best metering mode when in a hurry w/o even time for ae lock.



For anything that's just unpredictable or fast moving, but not totally surprising: Premetering, keep track of the various illumination levels in your environment.


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## dgatwood (Dec 16, 2014)

I shot a few hundred shots at a friend's stage event the other day, and... the camera's metering didn't fare too well, to say the least. The meter was consistently pegged so hard to the left that I stopped even bothering to look at it.

Initially, I tried to use exposure compensation in evaluative mode, to see if that would be usable on the 6D. Unfortunately, that was too inconsistent, and even with the exposure compensation cranked to the left as far as it would go, shots were still occasionally blown out, so I gave up and used full manual mode, with chimping on every single shot. I would have killed for a usable Tv mode, because manually switching ISO settings and exposure times depending on whether I wanted to get motion blur or not is kind of a pain in the backside... but Tv just wasn't to be.

The problem is that when doing stage photography, all of the autofocus points are likely to be in focus, because you're shooting at or beyond infinity the whole time. So Canon's evaluative metering tries to take into account the spot metering values for every single focus point, thus dutifully providing amazing contrast on the flat black stage background, while simultaneously ensuring that every single face is consistently blown out beyond recognition. This is clearly not desirable behavior.

By now, I would have expected the evaluative metering system to recognize that, "Hey, there's no significant contrast near any of the in-focus areas except for the chosen AF point, and that spot is going to be *massively* blown out if I meter it this way," and then adjust its expectations (and its light meter readings) accordingly. Unfortunately, Canon's AF system doesn't do this.

Of course, the problem is made worse by the lack of a spot-focus-follows-manually-chosen-AF-point mode, of course, but even if I had that, I'd still probably be swearing at it a lot. There simply has to be a more sensible way to meter scenes like this.

Alternatively, give us a sensor with massively larger full well capacity—say 24 stops of dynamic range at high ISO—and I'll stop caring about the metering so much. I'm not holding my breath for that one, though, as it probably won't happen until we get a proper global electronic shutter and can sum multiple successive samplings to produce the final image....


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## meywd (Dec 16, 2014)

well most of the time its manual with eval, i shoot and check, over/under expose then shoot and check, until i am satisfied, i do that for the first shots then keep it until i see a change in the light - close to sunset/sunrise - however for birds i read spot is better than eval so I spot and crop, yes no recompose as i am reach limited anyway and will crop so why the bother, i only learned about ML AETTR recently so still don't know if it will be good for me, but with dual ISO i think its better to underexpose and PP.


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## Viggo (Dec 16, 2014)

80% of the time it's "spot-linked AF", but sometimes when things move very fast and has a very contrasty color/brightness to the surroundings, I found evaluative works better in those cases. My camera is also preset with a +7/8 offset permanently.


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