# Is Facebook worth it?



## MrFotoFool (Sep 30, 2013)

I have never had an interest in joining Facebook, but finally decided to make a business (artist) page for my photography. During signup, it would not let me upload the profile photo (even though it was very small file and correct dimensions and file type). When I clicked skip (to see if I could go back) it said account disabled. I tried to reregister with a different email and it also said account disabled.

I questioned whether or not Facebook is worth doing, and since it seems they will not even let me sign up I guess not. They also do not have an email or phone for tech support, so my gut insinct is to avoid it entirely. My only reason for signing up was to add the icon on my website to try to improve search engine rankings.

Thoughts?


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## distant.star (Sep 30, 2013)

.
Is a cup of coffee in the morning worth it?

Is a plane ticket to Paris worth it?

Is a season ticket to the Dodgers worth it?

Seems like it depends on who you are and what you value and want.

As for FB, I have no idea what benefits it might provide. You're the only one who can really know or venture a judgement.


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## bleephotography (Sep 30, 2013)

MrFotoFool said:


> I have never had an interest in joining Facebook, but finally decided to make a business (artist) page for my photography. During signup, it would not let me upload the profile photo (even though it was very small file and correct dimensions and file type). When I clicked skip (to see if I could go back) it said account disabled. I tried to reregister with a different email and it also said account disabled.
> 
> I questioned whether or not Facebook is worth doing, and since it seems they will not even let me sign up I guess not. They also do not have an email or phone for tech support, so my gut insinct is to avoid it entirely. My only reason for signing up was to add the icon on my website to try to improve search engine rankings.
> 
> Thoughts?



If you're looking for increased exposure, either in search engine rankings or through networking, then yes it is worth it. It will take a little time and effort to build up your followers, but once you do you'll have another tool to showcase your work to potential clients. Besides, I know loads of people who have referred prospective clients to photographers they've used on Facebook. Perhaps you can find some troubleshooting here: https://www.facebook.com/help/


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## RGomezPhotos (Sep 30, 2013)

I've thought about this question quite a lot for my own business. It came down to this for me:

* Demographics

Who uses Facebook and are those who use it the people you want to show your work to? I think it's a HUGE benefit if you're a wedding photographer. Not so much if you are a commercial photographer. 

There are 300,000 people who like Annie Leibovitz's Facebook page. As big a commercial photographer you can get... She hasn't updated it since 2010!!! I also Like some fashion photographers who shoot for Vogue and Marie Claire.. Heck, some don't even have FB pages... 

Jasmine Star, a top wedding photographer, has 85,000 Likes on her Facebook page. She updates it several times a day.

When you figure out your demographic, the answer becomes clear.


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## wayno (Sep 30, 2013)

I've found it quite useful and I also enjoy the interactivity. I don't overdo posts but an image every 2-3 days is about my balance right now. I have sold quite a few prints through it so I'd say it's worthwhile.


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## eml58 (Sep 30, 2013)

It's an interesting question.

For myself personally, No, I have zero interest in FB, none, and I advise my Family to have the same perspective.

For Business ?? Maybe, what makes me even consider it may be useful isn't about FB as Google +

Check out a chap by the name of Trey Ratcliffe, Does HDR Photography, his Photography isn't exceptional I feel (not keen on HDR), but what amazes me is the chaps ability to be able to sell himself through Media sites such as Google + FB etc, this chap has 4 million Google + followers, and he's turned that into what appears to be a very successful Business.

So it would seem these Social Media sites are big business and an avenue for Both Business and Personal Promotion, My sone was telling me that Psy the guy that does the Gandam thing currently has 2 Billion views on You Tube, if that's not a sign the world is totally nuts I don't know what other proof is needed.


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## Hillsilly (Sep 30, 2013)

I occassionally come across people who will only search for businesses on Facebook. I know this because I'm not on Facebook. Consequently, people can't find my business there. Facebook is such a phenomena that people look at you like you are a freak if you not there. I have no idea how much revenue I've lost by not being there. Maybe its none. Maybe its lots.

Anyways, if you are serious about growing a business you've at least got to think about your online marketing. You've already got a website. Do you need to do more? Facebook, twitter and email marketing can be very cost effective ways to develop better client relationships and drive sales. But it does require effort to make it worthwhile. Is your time better spent on marketing activities or in doing something else?


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## LewisShermer (Sep 30, 2013)

It appears that you guys are "of an age"?

"I have zero interest in FB, none, and I advise my Family to have the same perspective."

I believe you have to sign up as a real person before you sign up as a business. Facebook is a very helpful tool indeed. If you recall, when the first telephones came out, everyone said "why bother using a telephone, what use is it? I have zero interest in a telephone, none, and I advise my Family to have the same perspective". Look how that worked out.

A printer I knew refused to take up the use of Email as he "Had zero interest in Email, none, and advised his family to have the same perspective"

Remember when the TV came out? Who'd have thought that a box in the corner of the room would have so much impact on the world?

Now that internet has come out... someone developed a tool for mass communication so you can show off your pictures to a mass audience and deal with them directly. I wonder what happened to that printer that refused to deal with clients via Email? Possibly the same as the commercial photographers that refused to take up digital when everyone started to sell online...

Maybe I'll get to the age where 665,000,000 users on a social media network everyday are wrong and not worth getting in touch with for business purposes? Until then, it is prudent business advise to get involved.


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## LewisShermer (Sep 30, 2013)

The fact that you're actually discussing this almost a decade since facebook was developed...


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## whothafunk (Sep 30, 2013)

as my friend says: "Facebook is crap... and a great tool for self promotion.".


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## Coolhandchuck (Sep 30, 2013)

Just because I don't like to put my life out on Facebook for everyone to see, doesn't mean I wouldn't want my business out there for everyone to see. Most people of a certain age, are known to say unwarranted things about Facabook as a whole. They didn't grow up with a calculator, let alone computer in the house. It's a great tool to help my hobby/profession, much like a speed-square or barrel sander or photoshop. It's all in how you use those tools to your benefit that matters.


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## nebugeater (Sep 30, 2013)

On thing I beleive that makes Facebook different than many other social media outlets is the demographics. It is not the 20 and 30 yr olds where the user base ends. There are many users on the site that use it often and use it well and they are in their retierment years.


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## eml58 (Sep 30, 2013)

LewisShermer said:


> It appears that you guys are "of an age"?



Perhaps, at least Old enough to know better than to misquote someone else when attempting to formulate an Argument.

Maybe concentrate on some Original viewpoint in your next Post on the Subject, if your stuck for a viewpoint, try misquoting one of those 665,000,000 users on FB that you feel are worth getting in touch with, I'm sure one of them will be Happy to help you out.

And No, your Wrong, FB have a section for Business where the Account is formed in the Business Name, see what happens when we use selective quoting ?? No ?? Not surprised.


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## surapon (Sep 30, 2013)

RGomezPhotos said:


> I've thought about this question quite a lot for my own business. It came down to this for me:
> 
> * Demographics
> 
> ...



+ 1 for me too.

Just for my Love HOBBY/ Photography, I have friends around the world, who like my Photos. But The big Plus = I get to meet the Friends/ Relative since I did not see them for 60 years.
Here is my FB

https://www.facebook.com/surapon01

Surapon


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## LewisShermer (Sep 30, 2013)

eml58 said:


> LewisShermer said:
> 
> 
> > It appears that you guys are "of an age"?
> ...



*you're

I can't quite fathom your argument. My viewpoint is very much of the 'keep up with technology & trends or lose it to those who are willing to keep up with technology & trends'. Are you arguing against that?


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## Alrik89 (Sep 30, 2013)

How many people do you know, that get their jobs via Facebook? 
How can you be found on Facebook, due to the fact, that there are tons of other photographers doing basically the same stuff.
If you want to leave your digital business card, then build up an own webside. It makes much more sense and is much more individual than a facebook page. Meeting with a potential customer: "Hey, check out my website" is way better than "Hey, check out my facebook page".

And by the way: you lose all rights over the stuff you post on facebook. 
That includes images...


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## scottkinfw (Sep 30, 2013)

I don't quite know what to make of your comment ,"It appears that you guys are "of an age"?". I can't really tell of what your age is either by your pic. Not sure if I should be offended, as my years pile up.  In any event, I have come to appreciate the wisdom that does tend to (but is not assuredly guaranteed to come) with age. Wisdom such as not to be arrogant, impetuous, and to not have hubris, but that is a topic for people not as wise as us, to be sure.

My feeling on fb is that there is a lot of "I'm having eggs for breakfast" type of garbage, no doubt. However, it does present with marketing opportunities if done properly, and aggressively. I have a fb page for business, and I don't follow my own wisdom. I treat it more like a hobby. Why? I don't care for it much, but then, if I don't pay some attention to it, or I don't have it, others will, and I need to stay relevant in the digital world of marketing. 



LewisShermer said:


> eml58 said:
> 
> 
> > LewisShermer said:
> ...


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## ECRoyce (Sep 30, 2013)

eml58 said:


> LewisShermer said:
> 
> 
> > It appears that you guys are "of an age"?
> ...


If you would have elaborated more on why you seemingly hate Facebook so much and actively attempt to encourage your opinion be shared by others, he may not have had to jump to a conclusion based solely on the information and opinion you had previously shared in your first post.

however, you should realize that you are misquoting (at least misnaming people) and jumping to your own conclusions in your own posts, so I'd suggest to live and let live.


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## unfocused (Sep 30, 2013)

Interesting discussion. I've generally used my Facebook page for personal photos, rather than for portfolio images (with some exceptions) but after seeing what Wayne has done, I may need to rethink this. A few years ago, blogging was all the rage, but I wonder now if Facebook isn't a more effective medium for some of the things that we used to use blogs for. 

Need to do some serious thinking about this.

As far as the "certain age" comment goes, I wonder if Louis realizes that the single largest demographic for Facebook is women over 40.


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## ECRoyce (Sep 30, 2013)

scottkinfw said:


> My feeling on fb is that there is a lot of "I'm having eggs for breakfast" type of garbage, no doubt. However, it does present with marketing opportunities if done properly, and aggressively. I have a fb page for business, and I don't follow my own wisdom. I treat it more like a hobby. Why? I don't care for it much, but then, if I don't pay some attention to it, or I don't have it, others will, and I need to stay relevant in the digital world of marketing.


You absolutely do not want to get on Twitter then (at least not follow anyone's personal feeds). hahaha.

The good news, is you only have to pay attention to what you want. Social media does tend to have quite a cost of time spent vs benefit of leads and clients at the upstart in my experience. However, when people approach you and expressly ask if you have a Facebook page they can look at, that should give you some indication of a potential customer's desire for you to have one. 

And yes, you can always say 'no, but you can look at this other page I have'. The benefit of using social media pages is that if they choose to follow you, they will get periodic streams of your info/work they might not otherwise see if they just went to your website once.


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## cayenne (Sep 30, 2013)

MrFotoFool said:


> I have never had an interest in joining Facebook, but finally decided to make a business (artist) page for my photography. During signup, it would not let me upload the profile photo (even though it was very small file and correct dimensions and file type). When I clicked skip (to see if I could go back) it said account disabled. I tried to reregister with a different email and it also said account disabled.
> 
> I questioned whether or not Facebook is worth doing, and since it seems they will not even let me sign up I guess not. They also do not have an email or phone for tech support, so my gut insinct is to avoid it entirely. My only reason for signing up was to add the icon on my website to try to improve search engine rankings.
> 
> Thoughts?



I have avoided FB and Twitter and the like like the plague for years. I often wonder if I'm the last hold out...


But I have serious privacy concerns about FB especially. In my line of work (my day job) I have to be able to pass security tests, etc...so, I find it best *NOT *to have all my personal info out there and connections to others that can easily be searched and used by corporate or government types.

That being said, for business.....I might consider setting one up. It *is* often touted as a great way to reach your customer base. If my photography/videography business actually really starts generating something and I try to move more into that, then I will consider having a FB account only for my business, but will do everything I possibly can to keep it divorced from my personal information and personal life.

I've felt this way for a long time....I do a lot of database design and information gathering, organization and analysis type work and I KNOW what can be done with the aggregation of a lot of small bits of data into a large picture when it is put together. 

This is what I've been concerned about long before the recent NSA revelations....

Anyway, personally, I do NOT do FB or those types of social media. All of my friends that I want to keep in touch with, I keep in touch with by phone call, personal visits, email....even the odd card via snail mail.

But unless for possible business needs, I would touch social media with a 10-ft pole.

As Monty Python demonstrated, sometimes it best _"Not to Be Seen..."_

Monty Python "How Not To Be Seen"




cayenne


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## sanj (Sep 30, 2013)

Certainly worth it.


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## Pieces Of E (Sep 30, 2013)

It is my understanding that once you upload your hard earned images to facebook, they become property of facebook. Also, if you upload some nice large hi-res copies of your images, then your new 'friends' can just "Right-Click, Save As" to their computer and now they don't need you anymore, much less are they even gonna think about BUYING the image they just stole. Just thinkin' here.... :


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## cayenne (Sep 30, 2013)

Pieces Of E said:


> It is my understanding that once you upload your hard earned images to facebook, they become property of facebook. Also, if you upload some nice large hi-res copies of your images, then your new 'friends' can just "Right-Click, Save As" to their computer and now they don't need you anymore, much less are they even gonna think about BUYING the image they just stole. Just thinkin' here.... :



I've been watching a lot of marketing talk lately from sources like creativelive...and most do say to have a Business presence on FB, *BUT*....don't post high-res, non-watermarked images there.

And that the main thing you use the FB account for, is to drive customers/clients from there to *YOUR *own website and blogs. You aren't using FB primarily for a website or business, but as basically a big _link _to send them to your own sites where you do have more control.


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## distant.star (Sep 30, 2013)

unfocused said:


> As far as the "certain age" comment goes, I wonder if Louis realizes that the single largest demographic for Facebook is women over 40.



A columnist for a paper I once edited dubbed this "the menopause brigade." In a time long before politically correct BS, of course.

That writer went on to get a Ph.D. in psychology and made a fine living for many years from the members of his "brigade."


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## Triggyman (Sep 30, 2013)

Also one thing about Facebook I can say is I think it's better not to mix your personal profile with your business. 

My best friend since childhood bought a DSLR less than a year ago and made it a business doing gigs (events, cosplay). In fairness to him, he was already interested in photography for years but could not afford the gear. 

Against my advice, he didn't create a separate profile for his business and don't be motivated with Likes. He posts too much of his work in FB. He posts a lot everyday and it's getting too out of hand so I took him off my news feed (yes, it's becoming very annoying). He gets the likes and comments (which by the way, his main motivation for posting) but from what I see all from people I don't know and barely from his real friends and relatives. 

Someone said to resist the urge to post everyday, and I understand why.


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## westr70 (Sep 30, 2013)

[/quote]

I've been watching a lot of marketing talk lately from sources like creativelive...and most do say to have a Business presence on FB, *BUT*....don't post high-res, non-watermarked images there.

And that the main thing you use the FB account for, is to drive customers/clients from there to *YOUR *own website and blogs. You aren't using FB primarily for a website or business, but as basically a big _link _to send them to your own sites where you do have more control.
[/quote]

I agree with the above. I use fb to get the experience of feedback and at least 50 percent of these people are strangers. I have a FB for just my photography. You can see what resonates and what doesn't. It has been a positive move for myself.


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## celliottuk (Sep 30, 2013)

The idea of Marketing is to make you and your products known to potential purchasors. The problem with that glimpse of the obvious is that you don't know where your potential purchasors are, you also don't know how they like to be contacted or touched, so, you have to employ multiple touch mechanisms.
There none of the following will make you a millionaire overnight
Web-site
Facebook
Twitter
Speaking/lecturing slots
Blogs
Direct mail
Advertising
because some people use Twitter to stay connected, some read newspapers, some are e-mail junkies and so on.
Therefore the most sensible advice is to pick 2 or 3 from the list and do them very well. They should be consistent in terms of messaging, and above all, current and relevant.
Think about your own activities. Where do you get your information from? If you met someone at a party who was selling something you wanted, how would you check them out? That alone might give you some guidance.

I do a lot of live event photography, and having a FB presence is crucial as "Faster" is commonly more important than "Better"-nobody reads yeasterday's newspaper, and my shots have a "Sell by Date" measured in hours or, at best days

The last thing to say is that there is nothing that is an overnight "Fix". Just as in the old days, a photographer would show a portfolio of work going back over a number of years, you have to, in effect do the same in new media-posting one great shot on FB won't do it-after all you might be a "one shot wonder", people want to see depth and breadth of achievement.


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## RGF (Oct 1, 2013)

FB is a great tool but their policies are very harsch. ASMP had piece on how they can use any image posted on their site, however they want without giving credit or royalties. Not for me.

Yes use them to network and make contacts but don't put your good stuff there - provide a link


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## eml58 (Oct 1, 2013)

ECRoyce said:


> If you would have elaborated more on why you seemingly hate Facebook so much and actively attempt to encourage your opinion be shared by others, he may not have had to jump to a conclusion based solely on the information and opinion you had previously shared in your first post.



I'll give it a Go.

My first Post split comments between my view of FB from a Personal perspective, and a Business perspective, comments were an attempt to answer the original Question, is FB worth it (Generally that was the thrust of the question posed).

My short comment (that was taken out of context & therefore misquoted), was that "Personally" I don't have time for FB or most Social Media sites, my concern here is about the Security aspect of Peoples Personal Information when shared on FB, the opportunity that presents itself for uncaring and hurtful content that can filter back to an individual that has inadvertently left themselves open to malicious comment.

Hence my one liner re not Personally liking FB (or other social media sites) and in particular not for my Children, who seem to be the ones that suffer the most from idiots on the Web. At no point did I state or intimate that I "Hated" FB, or any other Social Media outlet.

The second part of my Original Post was wether or not from a Business perspective FB was worth the effort, I'm pretty sure when re reading my Post that my view was Positive to the business aspect of FB/Google + etc, in fact I own 50% of a Live-aboard Dive Boat Business in Indonesia and our Management operates a FB account for both Boats, I'm not convinced it adds to the bottom line, but as someone else has mentioned in earlier Posts on this thread, better to be in the mix and hope to reap some benefit, than sit outside and have no opportunity to benefit. But as a Marketing Tool I feel it has Potential, it's just not easy to determine concrete benefits, but it costs zero, so it's worth the effort.

The comment by an earlier poster regards "Of an Age" is derogatory, it assumes anyone that's not a member of the Younger Brigade isn't up to seeing Modern concepts like Social Media sites, it's a choice thing, not a smarts thing, I choose to continue to speak to friends and Family, directly when ever I possibly can, on the phone or on Skype when they're to far away, or by email & sms when required, I don't choose to have my personal information and views aired to the WWW on a daily basis.

I make a small exception for CR, not so much in this type of Thread, more on the Photography side.

And I wasn't trying to have my opinion shared by others, I don't care if my opinion on Social Media is shared by others, I was attempting to offer opinion on the Original Posters question, is FB worth the effort ?? and I resent being misquoted or having a partial line of my comments used as fuel for someone else's rant.

Much like I'm doing here .


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## MrFotoFool (Oct 1, 2013)

I sincerely appreciate all those who took the time to respond. Except for the slight derailment into some personal attacks, overall helpful.

I know enough already not to post high res images and to have everything watermarked, so I am not concerned about theft so much.

But I still have the problem that it would not even let me set up an account. Someone at work today told me you have to have a personal page first and I see one of the replies to this thread says the same thing. I wonder if this is really true? It did not seem like a requirement when registering. After all, if you are a large corporation, who is the personal profile you would link to?


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## verysimplejason (Oct 1, 2013)

MrFotoFool said:


> I sincerely appreciate all those who took the time to respond. Except for the slight derailment into some personal attacks, overall helpful.
> 
> I know enough already not to post high res images and to have everything watermarked, so I am not concerned about theft so much.
> 
> But I still have the problem that it would not even let me set up an account. Someone at work today told me you have to have a personal page first and I see one of the replies to this thread says the same thing. I wonder if this is really true? It did not seem like a requirement when registering. After all, if you are a large corporation, who is the personal profile you would link to?



The moderator/admin of your business page should have at least a "personal" page. You may opt not to put anything there. Just treat it just like an admin user you can use to edit or change your database or portal.


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## LewisShermer (Oct 1, 2013)

Yes, I should have elaborated on the personal page... A personal page is required to set up and manage/admin your business page as that's a separate entity. If you got someone else to set up the page for you and they dealt with what went up on there then that's how you avoid having to sign up for yourself. Seems like a lot of effort to go through for something so simple though.

I live by one rule: If you don't want the internet to know, don't tell the internet.

If you don't want them to know where you live, don't tell them. If you don't want them to know what you get up to, don't tell them. If you don't want them to "steal" some image, don't upload it. (although out of 665,000,000 users, why they'd steal yours and what they'd use it for is beyond me).

This is the thing I don't get, why can't people censor themselves and what they put onto the internet? It really is as simple as that.


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## LewisShermer (Oct 1, 2013)

And as for "of an age"... There is a particular age in all folk where they just switch off to accepting that new things happen in life and they might have to learn new things. My grandparents still have a VCR as they refuse to learn how to use a DVD player/sky+, they begrudgingly got a new TV for the digital change over as they didn't want more than 5 channels. The guy that I first assisted photography wise gave up because he refused to go digital when all our clients requested digital images. crazily though, he had me scanning all the negatives/transparencies...

of an age = that point in life where you refuse to accept that things move on... (like the photography business model)


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## Alrik89 (Oct 1, 2013)

LewisShermer said:


> And as for "of an age"... There is a particular age in all folk where they just switch off to accepting that new things happen in life and they might have to learn new things. My grandparents still have a VCR as they refuse to learn how to use a DVD player/sky+, they begrudgingly got a new TV for the digital change over as they didn't want more than 5 channels. The guy that I first assisted photography wise gave up because he refused to go digital when all our clients requested digital images. crazily though, he had me scanning all the negatives/transparencies...
> 
> of an age = that point in life where you refuse to accept that things move on... (like the photography business model)



And what has Facebook to do with "photography business model"? I am still waiting for arguments, why it is inevitable to use Facebook. 
Yes, Facebook is new (barely, it exists since nearly 10 years!) - but it is far away from being THE business solution for photographers. I think, many people overestimate the impacts of getting some attention at a social network. A lot of photographers get in touch via Facebook to market their tutorials, their courses or their books - but barely their photos. And what happen: they get in touch with other photographers/amateurs, which want to learn a lot of stuff. Where are the customers?


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## LewisShermer (Oct 1, 2013)

Alrik89 said:


> LewisShermer said:
> 
> 
> > And as for "of an age"... There is a particular age in all folk where they just switch off to accepting that new things happen in life and they might have to learn new things. My grandparents still have a VCR as they refuse to learn how to use a DVD player/sky+, they begrudgingly got a new TV for the digital change over as they didn't want more than 5 channels. The guy that I first assisted photography wise gave up because he refused to go digital when all our clients requested digital images. crazily though, he had me scanning all the negatives/transparencies...
> ...



The way that the business model has changed since the advent of social networking and easily transferable big data... Re-prints and printed albums are a lot less commonplace as most couples are internet/facebook/social network savvy. As they will inevitably upload their wedding shots and albums, I find it helpful to optimise the images for them and I will build their online album if they wish. This is built into the price of the overall wedding. The prints and physical album are then left as an option. Also, on facebook, how many more people are going to get to see your wedding photo's than if just an album was printed and put in someone's loft? I don't actually advertise my services as I don't have the time with having a full time commercial photography job for a company but I get loads of work just from referrals.


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## Alrik89 (Oct 1, 2013)

LewisShermer said:


> Also, on facebook, how many more people are going to get to see your wedding photo's than if just an album was printed and put in someone's loft?



I think you underestimate the magic of print - and its reach. 
In my opinion, the couples still want to share a special moment like their wedding personally. So they won't dare to satisfy their photo-hungry friends with a lame album in the internet. They invite all their friends to their house and take a look at the photos together - even if 90% of these guys are facebook addicts. 

But to answer your question: 
If the couple has 75 friends on their wedding and 75 friends on facebook - well, i think the amount of the people who will see the album and who will see the photos on facebook is basically the same. 

And finally: what will leave a bigger impact at potential customers a.k.a. future wedding couples? 
a) a facebook album
b) a nice printed photo album

It's not hard to find the answer.


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## LewisShermer (Oct 1, 2013)

Alrik89 said:


> LewisShermer said:
> 
> 
> > Also, on facebook, how many more people are going to get to see your wedding photo's than if just an album was printed and put in someone's loft?
> ...



There are arguments for both. I'm willing to wager that the younger generation will opt for option a


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## cayenne (Oct 1, 2013)

LewisShermer said:


> Alrik89 said:
> 
> 
> > LewisShermer said:
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While you certainly want to help accommodate them posting to social media (maybe as part of a package), sure, but I hope you aren't selling exclusively to online uses.....you aren't gonna be making big money off of just selling to post to social medial.

You make your money with the physical albums, wall art...etc.

At least that's my opinion. 

C


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## bleephotography (Oct 1, 2013)

Alrik89 said:


> LewisShermer said:
> 
> 
> > Also, on facebook, how many more people are going to get to see your wedding photo's than if just an album was printed and put in someone's loft?
> ...



Unlikely. I know many people who have hundreds or even thousands of "friends" on FB and I can guarantee you that the photos posted their will reach more people than the photos seen in their printed album after the wedding. Personally, if I had to choose only one, I'd rather have a printed album simply because it has more meaning to me than digital files (barring the obvious convenience and longevity of the latter), much like how I'd rather have an actual book in my hands than a Kindle. But the discussion isn't about which one is better, which is almost always a relative notion. Why limit yourself to one or the other when both have their own merits and purposes? One doesn't create a business page on FB to make money directly, it is merely a tool for networking and as is generally conceded it can be a very effective tool indeed if done correctly.


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## Alrik89 (Oct 1, 2013)

bleephotography said:


> Alrik89 said:
> 
> 
> > LewisShermer said:
> ...



You have tons of friends on facebook, and they have tons of friends, too. Ask yourself: is it probably that these tons of people will see your post (or those of your friends) with your awesome pictures? Or is it probably that your post with your awesome pictures will simply be overlooked due to the fact that there are tons of posts from tons of people even if they are your friends?


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## cayenne (Oct 1, 2013)

bleephotography said:


> Alrik89 said:
> 
> 
> > LewisShermer said:
> ...



Yep, like I mentioned earlier in this thread, most pundits I've been reading and listening too, that do make BIG $$$ in photography, take advantage of social media, but their main tenets are:

1. Keep it business, not personal on the business social media site. (If you must have a personal one, keep it separate and often best not to associate it at all or link it to the business site )

2. Do not use the social site (FB for instance) as your primary site, don't post a ton of your biggest best images, instead, use it as a method to send them to links directly to your real website. Use FB and twitter to generate traffic directly to your main website and/or blog.

It can be a powerful tool....but keep it all business, and use it to drive traffic where you really want it.

Like I said, I don't have FB and other social media accounts, due to privacy and security concerns. If business picks up and maybe I move more in this direction, then I'll definitely consider setting up FB and twitter and Instagram...etc (whatever social media flavor of the month is)....but only with business/corporate credentials, and drive them to my website I own and control.

cayenne


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## bleephotography (Oct 1, 2013)

Alrik89 said:


> bleephotography said:
> 
> 
> > Alrik89 said:
> ...



Perhaps both. Usually it is my real friends (and family) who actually see, comment and share my posts, whereas those acquaintances who have many more friends than I will often, but not always, pass over. However, when you post a picture on FB, especially a good one, it immediately stands out from the rest of the monotonous fodder and will thus likely attract more attention.

In fact, just the other day I had a relative ask for photographer recommendations on FB and she received five different responses referring five different photographers and all five responses linked to all five photographers' FB pages, which had some images from their portfolio but also linked to their actual websites (which, as cayenne mentions, is proper utilization of social media from a business standpoint).


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## MrFotoFool (Oct 1, 2013)

Not sure if it matters, but perhaps I should clarify I am a fine art photographer and not a wedding or portrait photographer.

So, for those of you that are very familiar with Facebook's setup, let me ask this. If I create a personal page first (which I would not really use, but whatever), can I then create an artist page and not have the same problem of being unable to load the profile picture and getting the account disabled message? Also, does the profile picture have to be the same on my personal and business page? (I would think not, because certainly JC Penney does not have a photo of their IT person as their profile picture - they have their logo, which is what I want).


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## bleephotography (Oct 1, 2013)

MrFotoFool said:


> Not sure if it matters, but perhaps I should clarify I am a fine art photographer and not a wedding or portrait photographer.
> 
> So, for those of you that are very familiar with Facebook's setup, let me ask this. If I create a personal page first (which I would not really use, but whatever), can I then create an artist page and not have the same problem of being unable to load the profile picture and getting the account disabled message? Also, does the profile picture have to be the same on my personal and business page? (I would think not, because certainly JC Penney does not have a photo of their IT person as their profile picture - they have their logo, which is what I want).



Yes, that *should* resolve the problems you've been having and no, your profile pictures can be different


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## MrFotoFool (Oct 1, 2013)

bleephotography said:


> Yes, that *should* resolve the problems you've been having and no, your profile pictures can be different



Much thanks. Maybe I will give it another go. My next question is, should I use a different email than the one I already tried? Since the previous one is now listed as account disabled, I wonder if I would get the same message trying to create a personal profile with that same email?


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## bleephotography (Oct 2, 2013)

MrFotoFool said:


> bleephotography said:
> 
> 
> > Yes, that *should* resolve the problems you've been having and no, your profile pictures can be different
> ...



To be honest I'm not 100% sure, although it couldn't hurt and you can always change it after your new account is established.


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## dstppy (Oct 2, 2013)

_Is Facebook worth it?_

"what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world and forfeits his soul?" Matthew 16:26

Sorry, had to do it. I await my disciplinary beating.

;D ;D ;D


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## cayenne (Oct 2, 2013)

Hey...can anybody that uses FB for business needs, can you *confirm *or *dispel *the requirement to have a _PERSONAL _account on Facebook before you can open a business acct, and have to link them together??


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## bleephotography (Oct 2, 2013)

cayenne said:


> Hey...can anybody that uses FB for business needs, can you *confirm *or *dispel *the requirement to have a _PERSONAL _account on Facebook before you can open a business acct, and have to link them together??



Unfortunately, I do not have a business page but I can confirm that you do need a personal account/timeline in order to create one: https://www.facebook.com/help/217671661585622

_"Facebook Pages look similar to personal timelines, but they offer unique tools for connecting people to a topic you care about, like a business, brand, organization or celebrity. Pages are managed by admins who have personal timelines. Pages are not separate Facebook accounts and do not have separate login information from your timeline."_

You don't, however, have to post anything on your timeline or refer others to it from your business page for it can be a separate entity as far as the public is concerned. Hope this helps.


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## cayenne (Oct 2, 2013)

bleephotography said:


> cayenne said:
> 
> 
> > Hey...can anybody that uses FB for business needs, can you *confirm *or *dispel *the requirement to have a _PERSONAL _account on Facebook before you can open a business acct, and have to link them together??
> ...



That blows.

I don't want to really put any personally identifiable information into FB's computers. I wonder how good they are at checking or verifying that that new user "Fred Flintstone" isn't really a real person....?

Do you think listing hometown as Bedrock would be too much of a giveaway and be caught by their filters?


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## LewisShermer (Oct 3, 2013)

bloody hell, everyone is so damn paranoid... "They" are not out to get us. "They" couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery... as demonstrated by the (North) American government falling apart this week.


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## sanj (Oct 3, 2013)

LewisShermer said:


> bloody hell, everyone is so damn paranoid... "They" are not out to get us. "They" couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery... as demonstrated by the (North) American government falling apart this week.



Absolutely! I have been on facebook for a long time now and am still alive! Friend me: Sanjay F. Gupta....


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## dstppy (Oct 3, 2013)

LewisShermer said:


> bloody hell, everyone is so damn paranoid... "They" are not out to get us. "They" couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery... as demonstrated by the (North) American government falling apart this week.



Long ago, I was perfectly happy being paranoid. I knew it so I felt secure in the fact that it was probably just my imagination. Then a friend pointed out "Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean people AREN'T out to get you" 

Seriously though, I'm down on facebook/twitter for why most people use it and how it's used, not data wise. 

If you want to worry about someone, worry about google; they track you multiple ways (they have a huge hash with mac addresses against searches). I found 'my' search history in my google account and it had searches from machines that pre-dated the actual google account. At first I was laughing, thinking "what a dork" that I was looking up, then I got the creepiness about it. I turned it off and 'deleted' my data, but it's there.


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## cayenne (Oct 3, 2013)

LewisShermer said:


> bloody hell, everyone is so damn paranoid... "They" are not out to get us. "They" couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery... as demonstrated by the (North) American government falling apart this week.


Depends on your life needs.

It is not a great thing to have, if you need a security clearance, with much of that, it isn't so much YOU, but who you associate with, and with friends of friends of friends like people seem to gather on FB, you might get some bad apples that you didn't even directly link to, but it can hurt you.

Also, recent stories have come to light about credit ratings....they are going to social media, and looking to see how your friends are and if you have some deadbeat friends, they have it in their algorithms to lower your score with the assumption that you might be more of a credit risk if you associate with people that are credit risks.

I do databases, and information gathering for a living. Trust me, I *know* the value of aggregated data and what it can do to paint a picture for various uses on places, things and *people*.

Even if you're not concerned about govt. looking at this data....this information is being sold off to any corporation or private entity that has the money for whatever they want to do with it. 

I dunno...I just grew up valuing my privacy. I've been on the internet and the web since about '92, and even back then in its infancy, people's mantra was to not give out too much personal info and stay as anonymous as possible.

I know it is _almost _impossible to have full privacy today unless you live in a shack in the mountains cut off from everyone else. But, I'll be [email protected] if I'm going to voluntarily hand over everything there is to know about me to anyone or any company.

I'll put what I need out there for business, but I want to keep as much of my personal data off as many databases as I possibly can. 

That's my $0.02,

C


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## LewisShermer (Oct 3, 2013)

I post that much rubbish that anything worth anything to anyone gets lost in the matrix


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## wsgroves (Oct 3, 2013)

Not sure if its related to the OP but I do know that you should watch what you post on FB.
A lot of companies now will try to gain entrance and have a look at what you post, which can definitely have an effect on whether you get that new job or not.
My wife posts a lot (pix) but I rarely do.


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