# 6D vs 5Diii today...



## LewisShermer (Dec 5, 2012)

So I'm going to town tonight to buy a new camera...

It's either going to be the 6D or 5Diii (body only)

which do I purchase? reading reviews from the last few days of people getting their hands on the 6D has got me stumped. It should be pretty clean cut and I should just go for the 5Diii but there are a few things holding me back.

I'm currently shooting with a 7D and 60D (until yesterday when I sold the 60D) 90% of my glass is EF so that's not an issue, what is an issue is the following:

pro 5Diii :

sharper images at higher iso (from what we've been presented with so far although the 6D handles noise a little better apparently)
better weather sealing/build
better button configuration on the back.
reputedly better focussing system (although I very rarely use any point apart from centre, I'm old school)
CF card for faster raw processing time

pro 6D :

Wifi (it may not seem much but linking straight to an ipad on location and using a mobile for remote shooting could come in real handy)
Cheaper
handles noise better at high iso (reportedly, but images are a little softer than 5Diii)

I shoot a hell of a lot of stuff, gigs, weddings, events and product. I'm always going to keep the 7D for sports/wildlife so fps isn't an issue for me, mainly the better high iso handling which is one of the only reasons for upgrading to full frame. I'm a firm believer in photographer > gear but I like a bit of technology and anything that makes life a little easier (and that points to the 6D).

Plus if I get a 6D I'll just get the piss ripped out of me by "pro's" tottering around with their 5Diii's 

any advice in the next 6 hours would be greatly appreciated


----------



## rpt (Dec 5, 2012)

LewisShermer said:


> So I'm going to town tonight to buy a new camera...
> 
> It's either going to be the 6D or 5Diii (body only)
> 
> ...


5D3.

Already in the field for a fair amount of time and issues are known. Firmware upgrades already tested in the field. So it is a known devil. It is a great camera. I have one an love it. I am sure you will too - and not because some Pro's are carrying it around 
Oh and f8 AF in Feb!


----------



## Dylan777 (Dec 5, 2012)

If budget is not an issue, 5D III is the way to go. Besides 61pts, 5D III has better center AF(dual-cross) much more precise for low light and tracking. 

I tried the 6D at the local camera, it doesn't feel right. It much smaller than my 5D III and feels like plastic. Did I mentioned, there is no joystick :-[


----------



## bbasiaga (Dec 5, 2012)

I have not seen or handled the 6d. It does look to have some pretty good features. That said, I do have the 5DIII and I can say that there is not a more versatile camera out there in its price class. Excellent high ISO, good FPS, enough MP for very many types of shooting. Very good deals can be had too.

-Brian


----------



## verysimplejason (Dec 5, 2012)

Depends on your needs. Just be reminded that there are a lot of lenses that you can get for $1K. If you really need the AF of 5D3 then by all means, go for it. If you think 6D AF is enough though, you can spend your 1K for some very good lens instead. For me, a Canon MPE-65 comes to mind.


----------



## schmidtfilme (Dec 5, 2012)

Clearly the 6D. Much cheaper, same picture, lighter, nicer body, plus the wifi and GPS comes in handy.


----------



## Jay Khaos (Dec 5, 2012)

It's not much cheaper.. at least not right now. Maybe if you're buying from a local shop thats still selling the mkiii for $3500....

Considering youre buying right now, you can get the 5DIII for only $400 more than the 6D... I think it's a clear winner. If it were still a $1500 price difference and you dont care about the more advanced AF, the answer might be different. 

If youre looking hard enough, you can find the 5DIII for $2500 or slightly more. Even less if youre willing to buy the kit and resell the 24-105. I'm surprised how many people seem to be still buying the 6D right now with the smallish price gap


----------



## Dylan777 (Dec 5, 2012)

schmidtfilme said:


> Clearly the 6D. Much cheaper, same picture, lighter, nicer body, plus the wifi and GPS comes in handy.



In which way?


----------



## Jay Khaos (Dec 5, 2012)

schmidtfilme said:


> Clearly the 6D. Much cheaper, same picture, lighter, nicer body, plus the wifi and GPS comes in handy.



Same picture in a fully lit studio setting maybe.. It has worse low light, and less advanced AF which [theoretically, anyway..] leads to more grain and blur. Nicer body if you prefer plastic over magnesium (6D is partially plastic to accomodate the wifi and GPS antennae). GPS and wifi are cool, but also possible on any camera with external attachments if you don't want to sacrifice build quality.

Just playing devils advocate...


----------



## verysimplejason (Dec 5, 2012)

Dylan777 said:


> schmidtfilme said:
> 
> 
> > Clearly the 6D. Much cheaper, same picture, lighter, nicer body, plus the wifi and GPS comes in handy.
> ...



I think he's referring to 6D being smaller, a purely subjective trait. 5D3 is bigger and more robust.


----------



## RustyTheGeek (Dec 5, 2012)

There's going to be lots of opinions both ways.

First, let's assume that the OP is planning to buy the camera in 6 hours at the local store he's going to since that is what he said. So that rules out the $2499 deals online we've seen where many folks haven't received the camera yet two weeks later. (And I sorta fall into that category since I got mine on a $2899 deal about 6 weeks ago.) This makes the price difference likely around $1000 for the sake of argument.

I agree with the 6D folks. Why? Why not? Spend $1000 less first and use the camera for 3-6 months. If it satisfies you, you're good. If you're still not sure, buy the 5D3, compare them and sell the one you don't want. Since I got my 5D3, I'm planning on getting the 6D myself and compare them later after the holidays slow down. Then I very well may sell my 5D3 if I can. Either way, I'll know for myself. I'm still not 100% convinced the 5D3 is worth another $1000. These are both great cameras. Don't buy more than you need. Impress the other pros that are ripping the piss out of you with a cool lens!

Some of the minor things to consider would be CF cards vs SD cards. The 7D uses CF but the 6D doesn't. (The 5D3 uses both.) They both use the same battery. Since you are a center focus point shooter (like me), the AF is not as big of an issue and likely low light is the main thing that matters. Since you have the 7D for fps, you're good there. Both cameras shoot 3 fps in silent mode which is what often matters to me. Will the WiFi/GPS matter to you? I'm intrigued by the WiFi for wireless tethering and file backup on the fly to a phone or tablet. The GPS probably not so much but you never know since I shoot so much scout camping, etc. I wouldn't worry as much about durability as I would about ergonomics for your hand and how comfortable you feel using the controls. Make sure you go through the menus and see if anything totally throws you or is missing.

I would go online and skim both manuals before you go to the store so you'll already know what to expect.

Good luck and let us know what you decide!!


----------



## LewisShermer (Dec 5, 2012)

Thanks folks, some differing opinions there, all valid.

the prices locally (body only) are:

5Diii - £2339
6D - £1789

a difference of £550 which could go towards some nice 2nd hand glass if I opt for the 6D

the shots I'm really getting it for are the dark church wedding ones. high up windows, dark walls, high ceilings, no flash/bounce where iso has to be 1600/3200/6400 even with my 50mm 1.4

I know there are cheaper ones online, digitalrev.com has the 5Diii in at £1900 and procamerashop.co.uk has it for a staggering £1898 but I'm very sceptical about their origins as they all seem to be in the far east and I like the idea of having a local shop for communication if there are any problems or everything goes wrong.


----------



## RLPhoto (Dec 5, 2012)

5d II w/ 60D ergos = 6D

Ehhhhh....


----------



## RustyTheGeek (Dec 5, 2012)

RLPhoto said:


> 5d II w/ 60D ergos = 6D
> 
> Ehhhhh....


I'm not so sure the 6D is THAT bad (jury is still out on actual 6D performance) but I agree that the 60D ergos are totally different from the 5D series. I still have to adjust to the 60D when I use it, it's much different from the 5D series. So he will have that to consider when he goes from 7D to 6D and back.

If you don't need the GPS/WiFi and money isn't an issue, get the 5D3, it's a better match in many ways to the 7D. Feel, CF cards, batteries, menus, etc. However, if the 6D features and the price are significant, get the 6D, buy some UHS-1 SD cards and see how it goes.

My point is that either way you will likely enjoy the camera and the other body is always there to buy locally if you want to switch later. And since both are available, why not save $1000 while you're using/evaluating? Unless all the stuff you shoot requires the extras the 5D3 gives you and you feel your work will suffer without it that is... At the end of the day, you have to be happy with your decision every time you pick it up and use it. Can't wait to hear what you decide!


----------



## Mendolera (Dec 5, 2012)

Here is one of those im not really helping but thinking out loud posts 

Coming from a 60D...

I dont think you can go wrong with either one of them honestly. Lets just assume $1000 difference for the sake of argument. 

Warranty clarification aside, I got mine for $2499 (US Model) and no tax so it would have only been a $200 difference for me as a NY'er (Amazon, BH etc). So it was probably the biggest reason I went with the 5D3. 

The 6D had everything I long desired for FF, low ISO performance, AFMA etc. I didnt know if the AF would be a big deal for me until I started playing around with it.

I was experimenting tracking one of the blades of one of our ceiling fans last night at a low rpm setting using wide open aperture on my 50mm and was impressed of its ability to lock and be in focus. Probably not an ideal test but lighting was average so its an definitive improvement for me from the 60D. Plus I have an 18 month year old who wont sit down for anything...

Didnt check to see if the 6D had HDR and multi exposure built in, but actually dont find the multi-expose as gimmicky as I would have though.t

Like I said $1K more dont know thats hard when you can grab a 100L or 135L with change


----------



## sdsr (Dec 5, 2012)

People have been commenting on the relative merits of photos taken with the 6D vs 5Diii, but as far as I can tell there are no comparisons available of photos taken with the two cameras via RAW and processed through the same software. (Is there even software available yet to process 6D RAW files?) If all we can consider are camera-generated JPEGs, that doesn't tell us much, does it, even if the two cameras have similar/same JPEG settings (unless, of course, one doesn't shoot RAW).

If I'm wrong about this, and there are such comparisons available, could someone point me in the right direction? (I'm wondering whether to add one or the other to my 5DII.)

Thanks!


----------



## Helevitia (Dec 5, 2012)

I think if you HAVE to buy today, it should be the 5D3 for the simple fact that not enough is known about the 6D yet. If you could wait a month, you will have a better idea. Can you wait a month?

Do you need 1/8000 and 1/250 for flash? Though you did say you were keeping your 7D.

From what you use the camera for, it sounds like the 5D3 might be the better option anyway. If you can afford it and think you'll make your money back fairly quickly, than it seems you'll be happier with the 5D3 in the long run. The only downside would be the possible new scenarios with WIFI, which is starting to sound more and more like a feature that professionals will use and want. I think somebody else pointed out that you could add this? Not sure though.

One other thing I thought of, it sounds like you already have your lenses. Do you need another one?

I'm an amateur, so it's an easy decision for me, 6D 

EDIT: Something else I noticed. The 6D is rated for 100K shots, 5D3 is rated at 150K shots.


----------



## iaind (Dec 5, 2012)

No question. Go for 5DIII. 
It easily outperforms the 6D and is only £100+ dearer for a new grey market body.


----------



## cayenne (Dec 5, 2012)

I'd go 5D3 (well, I already did a few months back...)....

But from what it sounds like, if you can afford it, get the 5D3, it isn't *that* much more $$.
The 6D sounds like it would make for an excellent 2nd camera tho...for taking out on a shoot?

C


----------



## lintoni (Dec 5, 2012)

6 hours have been and gone, the suspense of wondering what the OP decided on is killing me!


----------



## funkboy (Dec 5, 2012)

weeel, for me other than the price being below the psychological & financial $2K barrier, for me the main advantage of the 6D is *size*. Weight on my wrists (sensitive from decades of typing & mousing), bulk in my bag, and size intimidating people when I'm shooting in places where a big flashy camera will draw too much attention, or at least make your subject look away.


----------



## dlleno (Dec 5, 2012)

fyi just to compare numbers I asked Canon product support what EV the 6D's "other" focus points were sensitive to, and the answer came back "2 stops more". that means -1EV "everywhere else" and -3EV in the center. that information seems to contradict what I've seen elswhere can anyone confirm and reveal sources of different information?

As for comparing with the 5D3 I note that all the focus points are -2EV, which means that 5D wins handily for any focus point other than the center. moreoever, given the std deviation numbers posted elsewhere, even at the center point the 5D3 will nail focus a greater percentage of the time , in acceptable lighty of course (granted, not at -3EV).

if I were making the same decision today I would choose 5D3 simply because if I'm shooting anything that moves, in low light, i'm gonna appreciate all those non-center -2EV focus points, not to mention the tracking capabilities and fps. ALso -- I for one am tired of being locked into that center point AF "focus then frame" technique where I know that my center AF point is more sensitive -- which ultimately means I don't use the other ones because the center is more trustworthy. And if I'm shooting under low light conditions, its not likely to be inside a coal mine during a power outage, so the difference between -3EV and -2EV just doesn't seem like a practical wahoo to me (corner case advantage, to be sure, but what scenarious would really make me say "o dern I missed the shot because my center AF point was only -2EV) Ergo I would opt for the greater percentage of keepers in lighting situations that occur most often.


----------



## RustyTheGeek (Dec 5, 2012)

dlleno said:


> ... the difference between -3EV and -2EV just doesn't seem like a *practical wahoo* to me ...



I just had to comment on _'practical wahoo'_, that's funny! ;D I love learning new technical terms...


----------



## dlleno (Dec 6, 2012)

well, we have to lighten things up once in a while! For perspective, consider that the 5D3 can focus at all AF points in the amount of light requiring a 30 second exposure at f/2.8 (iso 100), or EV -2, while the 6D would trip and fall at that level except in the center where it can acheive AF if the light is low enough to require a 60 sec shutter. How many shots would you loose if the center point could not acheive focus for the longer exposure example? probably important to some and not for others. 

Conversely, "off center" the 6D requires EV -1 (15 sec exposure) while all 61 AF points of the 5D3 do the snoopy dance down to EV -2. How many shots would you loose if the "off center" points required EV -1 instead of -2? 

oh, and don't forget that the exposure meter itself requires a lot more light than the AF system does, to meet its rated performance and accuracy. Both the 6D and the 5D3 metering systems require +1 EV


----------



## MayaTlab (Dec 6, 2012)

The one thing that makes the 5D III stellar for shooting events / weddings / reportage i.e. "people in action" stuff, is not just its AF system, but the controls associated to it, and especially the following things :
- The ability to register an AF point (that includes the automatic selection mode), and then bring it up with the AF-on, exposure lock of DOF buttons.
- The ability to go from One shot to AI servo with the DOF preview button
- Custom modes.

Just as an illustration : 
In my C3 mode, I use 9 points extended af mode when pressing the shutter button, but automatic selection when pressing the AF-on button. At anytime, I can switch between One shot or AI servo if the subject starts to move, either in manual point selection or automatic selection. The exposure lock button is used as AF stop (if an object blocks the subject view for example). So it's like having two AF point selection modes quickly available, either in One shot or AI servo modes.
In my C1 mode, instead of switching between One shot and AI servo, the DOF preview button serves as a second registered AF mode, so it's like I'm having three AF point selection mode quickly available at the same time : spot AF, extended AF, automatic selection AF.

This is massively powerful for shooting living things, which tend to be, by nature, quite unpredictable subjects. Since I see you're shooting events and weddings, that could be very beneficial.

You'll also benefit from having a second card slot, although unfortunately the SD card slot doesn't support fast cards (why Canon ? WHY ?). 

On the other hand, from the files I've been playing with in Capture One, I find the 6D sensor slightly superior at higher ISOs, and at least as good at low ISOs as the 1DX, that is to say, again, superior to the 5DIII.


----------



## LewisShermer (Dec 6, 2012)

I went for the.........


5Diii


I went down to the shop, had a play with both. the 6D with the controls set out as they are feels kinda like going back to the 500D. also the menu system is a lot lot nicer on the 5Diii. I know both those things are pretty superficial but I'm sure I'll reap the benefits of going for the 5. I'm going to have to stay in for a few weekends now...


----------



## Hillsilly (Dec 6, 2012)

LewisShermer said:


> Plus if I get a 6D I'll just get the piss ripped out of me by "pro's" tottering around with their 5Diii's



Congratulations on your purchase! I'm sure you'll be very happy with it.

Not that I'm overly persuaded by peer pressure, but I've been considering the 6D vs 5Diii, too. Its a tough call. Realistically, I'd be happy with either. I'm leaning towards the 5Diii as it seems to be a camera that I'd be happy to own for a very long time. Whereas if I went with the 6D, it will only be because its cheaper. I'd probably always regret not buying a 5Diii and would worry about what I'm missing out on. Wifi, GPS etc will be handy but aren't deal makers for me. For me, the question is $800 vs 3 to 4 years increased happiness.

But then, I'm in no rush. Maybe I'll sit back and wait for the sub $1000 FF that everyone's talking about.


----------



## tron (Dec 6, 2012)

Good choice! Congratulations. I believe 5D3 will serve you for many years.


----------



## RS2021 (Dec 6, 2012)

LewisShermer said:


> I went for the.........
> 
> 
> 5Diii



Smart call. 

6D is a stop-gap body from Canon when you strip away the noise and iso babble among some. At best it may tie 5d3 here... Canon is not in the business of selling better performers for less money. Also, we should expect more frequent updates for the 6D than the 1 and 5 series as the market moves to more FF load and competition on the lower end; perhaps similar to the T3i or 10 series (gasp, I know!). I am not knocking the 6D here, it (and its successors) may well emerge as stable, competent entry ff bodies for the canon line.

But near term, once you move out of the narrow box of iso claims for the 6D with limited data from few sources, the higher end FF bodies simply offer more on AF, build, and other pro-friendly features. If you are entering the digital FF arena and you can afford them, they offer more room to grow, whatever your level of expertise. They will also hold their value once they settle into their market-bearable target price. 

Congrats!!


----------



## dlleno (Dec 6, 2012)

Ray2021 said:


> ... noise and iso babble among some.
> ...narrow box of iso claims for the 6D with limited data from few sources.


 good to see I'm not the only one with such a perspective. I wouldn't call it babble necessarily, cuz its necessary dialog and part of the discovery/vetting process, but I do agree that the theoretical merits of the 6D have been stressed over the practical. That said, I suspect the 6D will fill an important gap in the price/performance lineup and represents a brilliant marketing move on Canon's part. It may even become a proving ground for features that may end up in the higher end bodies. The Wifi features themselves pack a lot of wahoo and are very well received. 


> the higher end FF bodies simply offer more on AF, build, and other pro-friendly features. If you are entering the digital FF arena and you can afford them, they offer more room to grow, whatever your level of expertise. They will also hold their value once they settle into their market-bearable target price.



+1. moreover, without seeing some actual photos where the 6D "gets the shot" and the 5D3 does not, the -3EV center AF point isn't so much about improving upon the 5D3. It may be a preview of a 5D4 with a boatload of AF points all at -3EV or lower [/quote]


----------



## rpt (Dec 6, 2012)

LewisShermer said:


> I went for the.........
> 
> 
> 5Diii


Great! However, you forgot to add the *"TaDaaaaaaa!"* between the first and second text line! 
So do it again from the top! 

I am sure you will have fun! Remember, the hole in your wallet will mend.


----------



## RustyTheGeek (Dec 9, 2012)

rpt said:


> LewisShermer said:
> 
> 
> > I went for the.........
> ...



No, actually all those dots are supposed to be.......... (DrumRoll!) 

And I think you will love your decision. Do us all a favor, test out the low light focus for us. See if it focus locks quickly in a dimly lit room with and without AF assist. (With and without a flash attached and/or powered on.)

Since some folks have had horrible problems with low light focus and others haven't had any problems at all, which camp do you fall into? If you have problems, you'll know it immediately. Then just return the camera and get another until the problem is gone. That's what I had to do, return my new 5D3 and get an exchange. The 2nd 5D3 works fine.


----------



## skitron (Dec 9, 2012)

LewisShermer said:


> I went for the.........
> 
> 
> 5Diii



LOL, so did I after getting a 6D and it not being my cup of tea.


----------



## Nazareth (Dec 9, 2012)

The 6D is a tough camera to chose- on theo ne hand you have the crop sensor that offers more features for a bit less money- but is a crop sensor- on the other hand you have the 5D's which offer more but for more money (not sure hwat hte 5D2 is sellign for htese days, might be near the price of the 6D) The geotagging of hte 6D is nice- as is the wireless stuff- and from what I'm seeing, it appears to shoot good photos on par with 5D? but personally I think I'd go the 5D route (and pick up a 7D as secodnary camera both for reach with hte logner lenses, and for speed fps-- but in the end I went with hte 1DX as my primary and 7D as secondary- the way I figured it was that while the 1DX is 2x's the money it's also rated for 400,000 shutter actuations, is built like a sherman tank, is reaqlly weather sealed, has excellent low light (as does the 5D3) and is blazing fast and has a built in voice recorder, and since I love lsitenign to my own voice, I lsiten to recordings over aqnd over again because I can (just kidding)- I woudl however have liked it if it included geotagging-

I had briefly htought abotu savign my inheritance money and buying the 6D- but as rough o ncameras as I am, I figured I would need the toughness of the 1DX, and when the shutter does eventually go out, I can have it repalced reasonably and be hopefully set for aniother coupel of hundred thousand shots as the camera might be rugged enough that it's still in fairly good shape by then whereas the 5D3 might not be (I tend to trip a lot when otu in the woods walkign htrough tangled brush etc- and slippiong on rocks crossing streams etc- Of course though, I suppsoe you coudl get insurance for around $150 or so a year that woudl cover a replacement of the 5D3 shoudl somethign happen to it-


----------



## LewisShermer (Dec 9, 2012)

I did my first shoot with it yesterday, it's totally rad! It shoots like a dream. Image quality is amazing. Nothing low light though. Just a friend who needed a set doing for suicide girls... so full lighting set up. It reminded me of why i loved the 7D but it's so much more. even down to the dial on the back, the click is so soft yet satisfying.

do you think we'll be looking back in years to come with all new technology and think "how did we ever put up with the 5Diii???"?

It's bonkers just how amazing it is.

bonkers!!!


----------



## LewisShermer (Dec 9, 2012)

I quickly processed one image, stuck it on my blog. it's not 100% processed and scaled down so not zoomable for pixel-peeping but it looks pretty spot on to me. IQ and stuff anyway. maybe the quality of the photography/photographer isn't up to standard... 

here's the link anyway http://wentdownfighting.tumblr.com/


----------



## Nazareth (Dec 9, 2012)

lol yup- we'll probably look back and htink these new cameras today are dinos- and laugh at hte 'technology' that we thought was so innovative today- although, cameras have coem a very long way today compared to film days- makign hsots where film cameras could only dream of- very little noise- auto everythingg- etc etc etc- we really do have it good today- and even if we preferred the grains of old film, we can simulate it soemwhat today if we so choose- 

If you ever get a chance- try otu hte shutter button o nthe 1DX- it's so sensitive and smooth I have to be careful not to breath on it or it will fitre off a couple of rounds lol- Much different htan my 7d for sure- Can't beleive how much better my photos look from the 1DX- it's almsot liek you have to try really hard to take a bad photo- as opposed to tryign relly hard with hte 7d to take good photos=- Coupled with my 85 1.8 it's quite hard to take a bad photo- everything just really looks nice- I imagine hte 5D3 is the same too- perhaps even a bit better IQ wise- You've got a great camera there-


----------



## RustyTheGeek (Dec 9, 2012)

LewisShermer said:


> I quickly processed one image, stuck it on my blog. it's not 100% processed and scaled down so not zoomable for pixel-peeping but it looks pretty spot on to me. IQ and stuff anyway. maybe the quality of the photography/photographer isn't up to standard...
> 
> here's the link anyway http://wentdownfighting.tumblr.com/



That shot looks really great/fun/cute, etc. Thanks for sharing!


----------



## Dylan777 (Dec 10, 2012)

LewisShermer said:


> I went for the.........
> 
> 
> 5Diii



Congrats on your new toy 

I played with 6D for 2 days and decided not to have 6D as 2nd body. Maybe another 5D III or 1D X....if I get an approval from the boss at home ;D

6D reminded me why I jumped from 5D II to 5D III, AF system is not there :-\ :-\ :-\


----------

