# 5DIII AF Point Issue (addendum..resolution)



## infared (Dec 20, 2014)

OK....I noticed this "issue" when testing my Sigma Art Lens (I won't go there right now..this is a totally different issue related to my 5DIII body only), and wondered if anyone else is experiencing this phenomenon. I experience the phenomenon with both my Sigma and my Canon L lenses, so I believe it is a camera-body issue not a lens issue. 

I have AF Point Display enabled in the Playback menu on my 5DIII. So when I focus on something with a particular focus point, the red focus point square will show when I view the image in playback mode. (when you zoom the image the FP disappears). See second image below to enable the feature on your camera.
So my playback focus points do not correlate with my shooting experience. On playback my focus points are ALWAYS shifted to the right from where the FP was in my VF at time of shutter actuation. I would say about 1/2 to 3/4 of a focus point shift to the right (see image below). This is a consistent shift. No variation.
When I shot the image below (don't laugh...I could only find a stuffed stationary model for the shoot!!! LOL! with bad lighting I might add..very cloudy here today), the FP is bullseyed on the eye. The eye was directly in the center of the FP box when shot.

Furthermore, when I use the "Show Focus Point" Plug-In for LR (actually this is where I noticed the phenomenon as I can view my images at 100% in LR and see where my focus point was when I shot the image), they are shifted exactly the same. I also get the same exact results in Canon DPP (latest version). 
I also have to thank *Dustin Abbott* for mentioning the LR plug-in in a recent lens review he did. It is a helpful little tool! I never noticed the shift as the FP are so small on the back LCD as my eyes are old an struggling. (Like the rest of me! :)


So I guess I wanted to open a discussion to see if anyone else is having this phenomenon....and what might be causing it. ..and of course I am wondering ...when I focus the camera are my focus points in the VF "lying" to me. Are the real points on the sensor actually all shifted slightly to the left???? 
Its a can of worms!!!!!!

Under my "model" I posted a pic of the menu screen where you enable the Focus Point to be seen in the playback image to help anyone set it who does not have it activated. (Its a helpful tool in the field!).

It doesn't make my camera useless....but it is a concern.


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## lintoni (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

I've not _noticed_ it with my 5D3, but will try to check tomorrow.

Looking at your image above, the complete focus array appears to be shifted to the right. DPP will show AF points, so you could double check with that to see if it's a problem with the Lightroom plugin.


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## neuroanatomist (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

This has been discussed previously - the transmissive LCD is apparently misaligned. The camera/computer just put the points up on a centered grid, the points in the VF are off.


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## infared (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*



lintoni said:


> I've not _noticed_ it with my 5D3, but will try to check tomorrow.
> 
> Looking at your image above, the complete focus array appears to be shifted to the right. DPP will show AF points, so you could double check with that to see if it's a problem with the Lightroom plugin.



As mentioned in my post, I get the same shift in the Canon DPP (latest version)


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## infared (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*



neuroanatomist said:


> This has been discussed previously - the transmissive LCD is apparently misaligned. The camera/computer just put the points up on a centered grid, the points in the VF are off.



Is that native to my camera or are all the bodies like that? Is there a fix?


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## neuroanatomist (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*



infared said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > This has been discussed previously - the transmissive LCD is apparently misaligned. The camera/computer just put the points up on a centered grid, the points in the VF are off.
> ...



It shouldn't be that way, and it needs to go to Canon to be fixed. Hopefully under warranty.


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## lintoni (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*



infared said:


> lintoni said:
> 
> 
> > I've not _noticed_ it with my 5D3, but will try to check tomorrow.
> ...


Apologies, missed that. Just checked my 5D3, and mine appears centered, so... ah, Neuro's just answered.


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## Viggo (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

Hmm, that's concerning news. Could it also be 1dx issue?

*edit* I just tried aiming at something I could easily see a shift and activated the show AF point and it's a little above where I aimed.. Can this explain why I always hit the eyebrow no matter how much I use the spot AF center in the eyes..?


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## meywd (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

Centered here as well on my 5D III, although handheld camera shake can move it a bit


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## Viggo (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

I'm only on my phone now so forgive the picture, but hopefully is good enough to see. I placed the center point Dead center on the OK-button. But it is a tad over. Is it to concerned about? Thanks


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## neuroanatomist (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*



Viggo said:


> Hmm, that's concerning news. Could it also be 1dx issue?
> 
> *edit* I just tried aiming at something I could easily see a shift and activated the show AF point and it's a little above where I aimed.. Can this explain why I always hit the eyebrow no matter how much I use the spot AF center in the eyes..?



Mine is dead on.


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## Viggo (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

Man, I can't catch a break... I use my 1dx very carefully, yet I have had so many issues and problems that I'm at the point where I want to throw it to the wall and be effin done with it.... I thought the idea with 1-series is to always be able to trust them. It's not like it's old and o should expect it... God [email protected] it...

Thanks for the info Neuro, at least I know about this.


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## infared (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*



neuroanatomist said:


> infared said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...



Thanks Neuro...thanks for the info. No....  I am not under warrantee...I was one of the fools who had to have the camera when it was released and paid $3500 for the body, too!!!  I bought my body in 2012.
I just booked a repair with Canon Services....the facility is 23 miles from my house...so I am going to call them Monday and see if I can drop it off. I REALLY don't want to send it out into the middle of all the Christmas shipping. 
Since you know EVERYTHING else, do you have any idea what it will cost to do the repair????
Thanks for all the info.


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## neuroanatomist (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

@ Viggo – that sucks. :'( Add it to your list of things to check when you get your 1D X MkII.  

@ infared – sorry, no idea. Taking it in may have another benefit, I recall from another thread the poster had difficulty getting Canon Service to understand the problem (IIRC, they shipped it back as 'no problem found'), so explaining it in person may help.


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## caMARYnon (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

I checked my mark 3 and I noticed the same issue, focus points shifted up and left. Not that much as infrared about half on both direction. 
The spyder's little square was centered ...


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## Viggo (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

Had a coffee and thought about it. And I'm choosing to ignore this, as it seems it's too small a shift to really make the focus shift and miss. But if I hit something above where I aim, I can tilt the camera a tad or activate the spot AF. It's either that or a padded cell ;D


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## meywd (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

well, i put mine on a tripod and there is a tiny shift to the right, i think its only about 1/4-1/3


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## infared (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*



neuroanatomist said:


> @ Viggo – that sucks. :'( Add it to your list of things to check when you get your 1D X MkII.
> 
> @ infared – sorry, no idea. Taking it in may have another benefit, I recall from another thread the poster had difficulty getting Canon Service to understand the problem (IIRC, they shipped it back as 'no problem found'), so explaining it in person may help.



I will bring pictures, too. ...and pray that I get a good tech!!
Thanks again!


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## Jeremy (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

I just did a test and mine appears off a bit as well. However, I did a test where I focused on the extreme top-left corner of a square and fired 3 times. Each time it locked focus properly on the corner of the square and NOT on the wall behind it. When I looked at the playback, the highlighted area was on the wall, not on the square. So I think this may be a playback issue, NOT a focus issue.


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## neuroanatomist (Dec 21, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*



Jeremy said:


> I just did a test and mine appears off a bit as well. However, I did a test where I focused on the extreme top-left corner of a square and fired 3 times. Each time it locked focus properly on the corner of the square and NOT on the wall behind it. When I looked at the playback, the highlighted area was on the wall, not on the square. So I think this may be a playback issue, NOT a focus issue.



It's a misalignment issue. But...misalignment of what? Ideally, the transmissive LCD, the AF sensor, and the image sensor should all be aligned. If the transmissive LCD and AF sensor are in sync but the image sensor isn't, focus point placement for the shot will be correct but the AF point playback display will be off. If the AF sensor and image sensor are in sync but the transmissive LCD isn't, both focus point placement for the shot and the playback display will be off. 

I expect careful testing could determine which was off. It's worth noting that the actual area of the AF point on the AF sensor is larger than the little box in the viewfinder. Spot AF uses a smaller area of the AF point, but even that is slightly larger than the box in the VF (the main box, not the smaller inset box that indicates Spot AF).


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## AvTvM (Dec 22, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*



neuroanatomist said:


> ... It's worth noting that the actual area of the AF point on the AF sensor is larger than the little box in the viewfinder. Spot AF uses a smaller area of the AF point, but even that is slightly larger than the box in the VF (the main box, not the smaller inset box that indicates Spot AF).



This is something I have been loathe of forever! Why camera makers don't show AF-markings in the viewfinder (or on LCD) that exactly correspond to the true size of the real AF-Sensors? Probably to cover up for all that misalignment inherent with the very design of mirrorslapper cameras. Moving mirrors and submirrors pl,us a number of separate planes ... AF-sensor, imaging-sensor, mattescreen, transmissive LCD, viewfinder image ... with a big fat prism (or a mirrored hollow space) in between. 

But even in mirrorless cameras, I find AF-field markings WAY smaller than the actual AF-sensor. e.g. in the EOS-M. It irks me all the time, since it contributes to the blasted thing focusing on contrasty fecnces in the background rather than on soft faces in the foreground. :


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## infared (Dec 22, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

OK....so I talked to the Canon repair facility near where I live this morning...I am going to drop by and drop my camera off this week. My Focus-Point shift is enough that it bothers me...I think I should have more precision than that, as photography is a very precise craft. The Canon website says it will take about one week for the repair....but whatever it is I will post the outcome here. I am curious as to how this gets resolved or will Canon just say...."Hey, you are in the slop-factor parameters" ....and not fix it. We shall see. Thanks again for all the input everyone! ;D


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## infared (Dec 30, 2014)

*Re: 5DIII AF Point Issue*

OK...I dropped my camera off last week on Wednesday (Christmas Eve) I think..and considering it was Christmas week...I am AMAZED to say that I picked up my camera today!!!! They were closed Thurs. and Friday...so that is like a TWO BUSINESS DAY turnaround....AMAZING    
OK...so I thought that this was weird..when I dropped the camera off...I paid in advance?????
$234.33.. Including tax. I don't think that is too bad...I have had the camera for almost 3 years, and it has been around the block. Canon cleaned the sensor, updated the firmware (I thought that I was up to date...but whatever)...and my focus point alignment issue seems to be rectified.
Just got back to my computer after my trip to Canon...and I had an email from one of the galleries I hang my work in and they have a check for me (to pay for the repairs!!!!! LOL!)...so it all firing today!!! YEAH!!!
That's all for now....


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## neuroanatomist (Dec 30, 2014)

That's great! Thanks for posting the follow up...


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## tpatana (Dec 30, 2014)

Stop scaring me!

Had to try mine. It was almost dead on. However, using the 24-105, if I turned off the IS, then the AF point always shifted ~1/5 upwards. Strange. Did about 10 both ways, IS-ON was ok, IS-OFF was slightly up always.

Btw., what's the FW they installed? Wouldn't be the first time the service uses pre-release of something that's coming out in public some time later.

If's it's different than what we have, you need to go through all menus to check if you can find any changes.


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## infared (Dec 31, 2014)

tpatana said:


> Stop scaring me!
> 
> Had to try mine. It was almost dead on. However, using the 24-105, if I turned off the IS, then the AF point always shifted ~1/5 upwards. Strange. Did about 10 both ways, IS-ON was ok, IS-OFF was slightly up always.
> 
> ...


Checked the firmware..it's just version 1.2.3, which is what is on the street now. I keep up on that...but the latest version had no benefits for me and my lenses...so I hadn't loaded it....so no happy surprises!


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## josephandrews222 (Jan 7, 2015)

tpatana said:


> Stop scaring me!
> 
> Had to try mine. It was almost dead on. However, using the 24-105, if I turned off the IS, then the AF point always shifted ~1/5 upwards. Strange. Did about 10 both ways, IS-ON was ok, IS-OFF was slightly up always.
> 
> ...



...tried mine as well (using the viewfinder and center-point, and live-view and center-point)...and ended up having to google 'parallax view' (not the movie!).

My 5dMkIII is perfect using live-view LCD center-point focus, but depending on the position of my eye at the viewfinder I could induce a bit of parallax which caused just a bit of off-set in the downward and left-hand direction. I wear prescription lenses and I suspect this contributes to the problem, too.

So I think it is worth testing this AF Point Issue using the LCD and live-view before sending your body off to Canon.


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