# Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 USM Replacement Finally Coming? [CR1]



## Canon Rumors Guy (Jan 30, 2017)

```
We’re told that an EF 50mm f/1.4 nano USM lens is finally in active development. Most of the Canon world has been waiting for a replacement to the 25 year old EF 50mm f/1.4. The rumors of replacement have flown since the beginning of this site. We usually ignore most of the 50mm rumors, but this one has some legitimacy to it.</p>
<p>The new lens will not have IS and will use the nano USM motor we’re told.</p>
<p>If this lens does come in 2017, we’re told the announcement would be late into Q4. So it looks like this will be a lens that will ship in 2018.</p>
<p><em>More to come…</em></p>
<p><strong>*Correction*

</strong><em>The post should have said “Nano” instead of “Micro” when describing the USM motor.</em></p>
<span id="pty_trigger"></span>
```


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## Famateur (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*



Canon Rumors said:


> We’re told that an EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM lens is finally in active development. Most of the Canon world has been waiting for a replacement to the 25 year old EF 50mm f/1.4. The rumors of replacement have flown since the beginning of this site. We usually ignore most of the 50mm rumors, but this one has some legitimacy to it we just felt like tormenting ahsanford a little today.</p>
> <p>The new lens will not have IS and will use the Micro USM motor we’re told.</p>
> <p>If this lens does come in 2017, we’re told the announcement would be late into Q4. So it looks like this will be a lens that will ship in 2018.</p>
> <p><em>More to come…</em></p>
> <span id="pty_trigger"></span>



There -- fixed it for ya.


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## rs (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*

Someone's going to be happy...


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## chmteacher (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*



rs said:


> Someone's going to be happy...



Not Ahsanford, no IS. 
If this turns out to be true it's pretty disappointing the native lens maker can't incorporate IS. This is 2017 right? We landed on the moon 47.5 years ago and can't meet this technological feat? Wow...


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*

In the sincere hope that this helps *ahsanford* to get through this.







;D


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## rrcphoto (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*

in active development could mean years away from release.


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## msowsun (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*

I would expect this new lens to be named *EF 50mm f/1.4 USM II* since it has the same overall specs as the original.


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## NorbR (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*

Surely it should be *Nano* USM, right?
There's no way a newly released lens would use the same crappy Micro USM as the old 50/1.4 or the old 70-300 ...


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## rfdesigner (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*



Canon Rumors said:


> We’re told that an EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM lens is finally in active development



anything other than *RING USM *will mean I won't touch it with a rented barge pole.

Sigma shares look a sure buy at the moment.


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## ahsanford (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*

As you all know, I want a very specific refresh here, just like the 24/28/35 IS refresh lenses. I'm not devastated by this news, but it certainly could be better. No IS was something I've been riffing on for some time as something I could live with. But the AF and int/ext focusing design decisions are critical, IMHO. 

The #1 problem with the 50 f1.4 USM is that micro USM + external focusing leads to:

[list type=decimal]
[*]The AF hunts, plain and simple


[*]With external focusing, the front element sticks out a varying amount and fairly modest pressure (bumping into something in your bag, for instance) can reposition it and potentially damage the lens.
[/list]

All that said, I still shoot with it today because the 50L's focus shift + inexplicably inconsistent AF drives me nuts and the non-L is actually sharper unless you are only shooting wide open.

But I find the CR1 generous at best as I cannot recall the last time a micro USM lens was released (please post, thx), and since that time Nano USM and STM have both come to the table. Nano USM seems a far better fit for this lens than its ancient Micro USM. That said, having a look at my super tiny Ring USM 28mm f/2.8 IS USM, I'm hard pressed to understand why it can't happen in a small 50mm prime.

The only good news about this rumor, if true:


Canon is indeed working on it.


Still f/1.4, something we all should be glad to see.


Micro-USM might be interpreted as a commitment to keeping the lens small, which I'd welcome.

But if we find out it's just the same old focusing of my current EF 50 f/1.4 USM, or worse, if they go with STM, it's DOA to me.

- A


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## hubie (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*

Ok, i bought the 70-200 f/4 last year (great lens, no remorse) and 50 f/1.4 just recently... wtf :
The 50 could be sharper at f/1.4 and could focus more reliably ...


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## cayenne (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*

If you're not going to go for the Canon 50mm f/1.2...would your next best choice then be the Sigma 50 1.4 ART lens?

Would you take the Sigma 50 1.4 over the Canon 50 1.4?

cayenne


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## slclick (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*

I cannot imagine any lens from Canon would have the old micro usm included. It is after all CR1.


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## PepeSilvia (Jan 30, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*

Glad I stopped waiting for this and bought the 35 IS in the refurb sale a couple weeks back. I wonder if this is pointing to IS coming to the 50mm L refresh instead, with the 85mm f/1.4L IS rumors. So a cheaper 50 1.4, and an L that adds IS and weather sealing, like the 100 macros, though the price difference between those is much smaller.


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## Canon Rumors Guy (Jan 30, 2017)

I updated the post with a correction. I'm sorry for the confusion.


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## NancyP (Jan 30, 2017)

We shall see. Sharp at f/1.4, please.


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## slclick (Jan 30, 2017)

Now we can start passing around the popcorn...


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## Camerajah (Jan 30, 2017)

If its not RING USM I aint playing-already have the original,they better make a 1.4L USM since there at it.


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## drnedel (Jan 30, 2017)

Can somebody help me here to read between the lines? Most complaints I heard about the 50mm 1.4 were about image quality (IQ), less about the focussing.

Will the optical formula of the new lens be upgraded (and hence IQ be improved)? The way this CR reads, one gets the impression that Canon will only fiddle with the focusing system, but except for this keep the lens design (which is clearly outdated).

I loved the CR about an 58mm Canon lens patent, but it seems this is just a dream of mine ...


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jan 31, 2017)

The optical formula for 50mm lenses has not changed for for over 100 years. The double gauss lens was invented in the 1800's, and has not changed a lot since.

It seems unlikely to me that the formula will change significantly for a consumer grade lens. It would be necessary to add more elements and design complexity to make more than minor tweaks to the optical design. That would push it into the "L" domain.

Expect the nano usm, better lens coatings, cheaper manufacturing processes, and, of course, a higher price.


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## Crosswind (Jan 31, 2017)

NancyP said:


> We shall see. Sharp at f/1.4, please.



There is definitely a reason why the Sigma 50 A for example is so big and heavy. I don't know if this same performance wide open is possible with such a small lens design. 

I'd rather prefer an "OK to good performance" wide open, if Canon keeps the size/weight about the same as the 35 IS, maybe 100g heavier (because 1.4, but w/o IS). 

I believe it was one of the smartest decisions from "stupid Canon" to offer several lightweight and small but still high performing lenses from 24 to 35mm. No other manufacturer has something comparable in their lens portfolio. That's one thing that sets Canon apart from other companies. I'd be glad to see them continuing this path and add a 50, with or without IS. (and hopefully a modern EF 20mm and 100mm someday too)


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## Crosswind (Jan 31, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*





ahsanford said:


> [*]With external focusing, the front element sticks out a varying amount and fairly modest pressure (bumping into something in your bag, for instance) can reposition it and potentially damage the lens.




The same would be true for the 50 STM, because the front element can stick out quite a bit when you set focus. Now if I would store it like that, I can imagine that it is easily possible to damage the focusing motor.

But "stupid Canon" developed a simple and smart solution; everytime I shut off the camera, it will also quickly move the lens tube back inside, so that it doesn't stick out and there won't be any issues at all when storing it in your bag. I believe this should also be possible with nanoUSM. So I wouldn't worry about that in future iterations of the 50 1.4 lens. 

So if it will have internal focusing like the 35IS, then good, if not, it won't be that dramatic at all. Agree?


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## IglooEater (Jan 31, 2017)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> The optical formula for 50mm lenses has not changed for for over 100 years. The double gauss lens was invented in the 1800's, and has not changed a lot since.



I think you'll find the Sigma 50mm Art is a reverse telephoto design. (Retrofocal)


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## tron (Jan 31, 2017)

OK CR1 -> CR0 for small values of ... 1 and large values of ... 0 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D


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## Chaitanya (Jan 31, 2017)

So where is replacement for 50mm macro? Also that old not so good 50mm f1.4 has been the reason why Sigma 50mm A has been selling quite nicely amongst Canon shooter who dont want to shell for ok 50mm f1.2 and dont want plastic fantastic 50mm Stm.


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## drmikeinpdx (Jan 31, 2017)

Too bad you didn't post an image of an old, beat to heck, copy of the 50. It would have told the story better than the pristine product photo.


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## ashmadux (Jan 31, 2017)

MOTHER OF MERCY

That said, I hope they do better than the ghost-heavy 35mm f2. Rakish, busy oof/bokeh, and sharp but not too sexy look to the images it makes. It is no L.

However, I have been impressed with the output of my stalwart 50 1.4 for years now (better images than the newer 35 IS), especially on my 5d3. It's my most beloved lens right now, and for all its imperfections, it delivers fantastic images. i have even used my 70-200 wayyyyyyyy less because 2.8 on my 50 is just golden, zooming with my feet.

Lets see what canon does here. Unfortunately, most of their "long overdue" bodies have been a disappointment (7d2, blech)...so fingers are super crossed.

Lord knows how they will hack the 6d2 to not compete with the 5d4....i dont think it will be pretty.


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## Etienne (Jan 31, 2017)

IS on the 24, the 28, and the 35, but no IS on any of the the 50s? 
Anyway, by the time this comes out, Sony's A7r iii and A7s iii will be long in the tooth I'll be replacing them with a Sony A9 mark ii ... all of which will have 5-AXIS IBIS and on-sensor phase-detect AF.


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## ashmadux (Jan 31, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*



PepeSilvia said:


> Glad I stopped waiting for this and bought the 35 IS in the refurb sale a couple weeks back. I wonder if this is pointing to IS coming to the 50mm L refresh instead, with the 85mm f/1.4L IS rumors. So a cheaper 50 1.4, and an L that adds IS and weather sealing, like the 100 macros, though the price difference between those is much smaller.



I did the same in October. I was impressed when i rented it for behind the scene, but not so much since. Broken on arrival, canon fixed it up nicely, but the bokeh is pretty crap. The ef-M 22/f2 kind of embarrasses this lens with its rendering, and it's bokeh is better than many EF lenses.

Have you noticed the ghosting at all? it is HORRIBLE. Ive never seen such an effect on another lens.


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## Etienne (Jan 31, 2017)

ashmadux said:


> MOTHER OF MERCY
> 
> That said, I hope they do better than the ghost-heavy 35mm f2. Rakish, busy oof/bokeh, and sharp but not too sexy look to the images it makes. It is no L.
> 
> ...



I have all three of these lenses. The 50 f/1.4 is a dog until it's stopped to 2.8 at least, and not really great until f/5.6.
"Ghost-heavy 35 f/2 IS" ... you must live at Hogwarts. 
And the 70-200 f/2.8L IS II easily beats the 50 f/1.4 at f/2.8 in every respect, unless you dropped it on its head when it was a baby.


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## slclick (Jan 31, 2017)

Etienne said:


> ashmadux said:
> 
> 
> > MOTHER OF MERCY
> ...



He's got to be pulling our leg


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## ahsanford (Jan 31, 2017)

Etienne said:


> ashmadux said:
> 
> 
> > MOTHER OF MERCY
> ...



He said Ghost-heavy 35 f/2... _not the 35 f/2 IS_. Perhaps he was (correctly) pooping on the old pre-IS version, which was like the nifty fifty 50 f/1.8 II... minus the charm.

- A


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## ahsanford (Jan 31, 2017)

Canon Rumors said:


> I updated the post with a correction. I'm sorry for the confusion.



Ok, now we're talking.

Two questions:

1) *How fast to focus is Nano USM vs. Micro USM vs. Ring USM? *LensTip measures focusing speed, but it doesn't have either of the two nano USM lenses tested. What might we expect here on a 50? Faster than the micro USM? Slower adjustments but less hunting?

2) *Does Nano USM mean the lens will be internal focusing? * I believe the two Nano USM lenses to date are both internal focusing (the recent 18-135 IS and 70-300 non-L IS lenses), but the two features -- nano USM and internal focusing could be unrelated. Thoughts?

- A


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## douglaurent (Jan 31, 2017)

Who would have thought that World War III is more likely to happen sooner than the 50/1.4 II?
At least World War III will include an element with the initials IS.
One could wonder why japanese decision makers have problems making major obvious decisions after decades, when one american decision maker alone can come up with major decisions (although dumb) on a daily basis.


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## DJL329 (Jan 31, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> Canon Rumors said:
> 
> 
> > I updated the post with a correction. I'm sorry for the confusion.
> ...



An article from Canon regarding Nano USM:

"*AF speed during still-image shooting rivals what users have come to expect from high-end lenses with Canon’s powerful ring-type USMs.* It’s brisk and nearly instantaneous — an almost perfect match for the new AF system in the EOS 80D. Most users will doubtless agree that it’s a clear step forward from what we’ve come to expect in affordable lens focus, whether we’re referring to the previous Micro USM focus motors used in many such lenses, or the recent STM versions."

http://learn.usa.canon.com/resources/articles/2016/eos-80D/eos80d-nano-usm.shtml

This Digital Picture page contains a video comparison of the focus speeds of the Nano and STM versions of the EF-S 18-135 IS lens:

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/News/News-Post.aspx?News=17726


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## jd7 (Jan 31, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> Canon Rumors said:
> 
> 
> > I updated the post with a correction. I'm sorry for the confusion.
> ...



I briefly played with a 70-300 IS II the other day. I was just in a shop so I wasn't able to give it a real work out, but for what it is worth the AF seemed pretty snappy to me, even when going from close to far focus distance or vice versa. I'm not saying it matches the 70-200 2.8L II, but it was quick enough I don't think I'd notice it for most purposes. It was far faster than my old 40 STM pancake (although I think maybe the 40 pancake is slow even compared to other STM lenses?).

I don't know the answer to your second question, but in this day and age I would be surprised to see Canon release a 50 1.4 which didn't focus internally.

If the rumour is correct, maybe we're looking at 50 1.8 STM -> 50 1.4 nano USM (50 1.4 II?) -> 50 1.4L IS (if the 50L goes the same was as the anticipated 85L IS). If so, I reckon that would allow the new 50 1.4 to stay around the same price as the current 50 1.4, which would give Canon three distinct price points. They would have nothing competing directly with the 50 1.4 Art (I'm assuming a nano USM lens would have size and optics closer to the current Canon 50 1.4 than to the Art), but nothing unusual about that. And I wonder if that would point to the 85 1.8 being replaced with an 85 1.8 nano-USM too?? (Yes, I know, not much basis for any of this - just speculating.)

If the above turned out to be correct, interesting that at the wider focal lengths Canon would have mid-range with IS (eg 35 2 IS) and L without IS (35L II), but at normal/longer focal lengths it would have mid-range without IS and L with IS.

On a side note, I have to say I liked the feel of the 70-300 IS II when I used it. Not built like an L of course, but I thought it felt good in use. Just a shame the optics don't seem to be so fantastic, although I'm waiting for more reviews before I completely give up on it.


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## Antono Refa (Jan 31, 2017)

IglooEater said:


> Mt Spokane Photography said:
> 
> 
> > The optical formula for 50mm lenses has not changed for for over 100 years. The double gauss lens was invented in the 1800's, and has not changed a lot since.
> ...



And at the same price bracket as the EF 35mm f/2 IS USM.


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## pj1974 (Jan 31, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> Canon Rumors said:
> 
> 
> > I updated the post with a correction. I'm sorry for the confusion.
> ...



Fairly soon after the 80D and 18-135mm nanoUSM were available here in Australia, I went to a few local photography stores to 'test' / get a feel for them. I must say I was very impressed with the AF speed of the 18-135mm nanoUSM. It really snapped into focus quickly, both in 'medium level' (interior shop) light, and (more understandably) in brighter outdoors conditions.

In fact, one of the Canon reps / sales persons noticed I was testing the AF speed and he said 'It focuses really fast, doesn't it?'. I agreed, saying I was impressed with that. He indicated that there was an optimisation between the new 18-135mm nanoUSM and the 80D (in terms of algorithm). Some weeks later I read something similar (it was a statement from Canon somewhere, and not an opinion piece / guess). 8)

In one store I also compared the AF speed of the 18-135mm nanoUSM on a 80D vs a 35mm f/1.4 II. The 18-135mm was noticeably quicker and also felt more confident. 

While I have held and briefly used a 70-300mm nanoUSM, I have not 'tested' its AF speed in the same way as I have tested the 18-135mm nanoUSM.

I do not have a strong opinion of the optical quality of either of these nanoUSM lenses yet... but a number of reviews (pro and uses) indicate the 18-135mm STM is actually sharper than the nanoUSM version.

For the record, I would LOVE Canon to produce a 50mm f/1.6 IS USM (or nanoUSM), with a 58mm filter, weighing about 250gr. One can... "dream" :

Kind regards

PJ


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## ahsanford (Jan 31, 2017)

douglaurent said:


> One could wonder why japanese decision makers have problems making major obvious decisions after decades, when one american decision maker alone can come up with major decisions (although dumb) on a daily basis.



I'd so love to go there... but we shouldn't go there.

I cherish this place as a sanctuary from what everyone else is talking about on social media right now, so let's please stick to this lens rumor, thanks. 

- A


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## Quackator (Jan 31, 2017)

Surpass the Sigma ART, or I'll keep my money.

Absence of CA wide open is nothing Canon's 50mm lenses are famous for.


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## captainkanji (Jan 31, 2017)

The 50 1.4 is my most used lens. It's probably too little too late. I'd most likely upgrade to the Sigma. I wasn't thrilled with the build quality and IQ wider than f2. It has served me well though, barely.


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## ahsanford (Jan 31, 2017)

Quackator said:


> Surpass the Sigma ART, or I'll keep my money.
> 
> Absence of CA wide open is nothing Canon's 50mm lenses are famous for.



You realize that this 50 f/1.4 is in a different class of lens than the Art, right? The future 50mm Canon lineup will be:

50mm f/1.8 STM -- the only sort-of-like-price competition here is Yongnuo.

50mm f/1.4 USM II (this thread's rumored lens) -- you could argue the Tamron 45mm f/1.8 VC is in this bucket

50mm f/1.?L USM -- a new L that likely will be a big retrofocal design / huge pickle jar; this will compete against the Arts and Otuses.

If you want an Art-killer, the lens in this rumor will not be it.

- A


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## Maximilian (Jan 31, 2017)

I only believe it, when I see it. 
Way too many rumors on the 50 mm lenses and way too many being < [CR3] (no blame on CR here).


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## NorbR (Jan 31, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> 1) *How fast to focus is Nano USM vs. Micro USM vs. Ring USM? *LensTip measures focusing speed, but it doesn't have either of the two nano USM lenses tested. What might we expect here on a 50? Faster than the micro USM? Slower adjustments but less hunting?



Just to join the chorus, I was very, very impressed by the Nano USM, the one time I got a chance to try it (an 18-135mm on an 80D).

Speed is definitely impressive. It felt almost instantaneous, at all focal lengths of the zoom, focusing from very close to infinity. Faster than any of my current lenses on any of my current cameras. I don't know how that generalizes to other implementations of Nano USM, and to use on other cameras, though ...

As for accuracy, I can't really tell, I would need more than a half hour with one camera. All I can say is that the focusing felt very decisive. No hunting, not even the minor split-second fine adjustment hunting before confirmation. 

Bottom line, I'm personally very happy to hear that it will have Nano USM, looking forward to seeing it in action. 

(Of course if you're into manual focusing, you're probably not as happy. If I'm not mistaken, Nano USM means focus by wire, unfortunately.)


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## uri.raz (Jan 31, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> Quackator said:
> 
> 
> > Surpass the Sigma ART, or I'll keep my money.
> ...



Canon has 16-35mm, 24mm, 28mm, 35mm, and 100mm lenses with IS, and Tamron has 45mm f/1.8 & 85mm f/1.8 with VC. It would be strange if Canon wouldn't make 50mm & 85mm primes with IS.


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## Hector1970 (Jan 31, 2017)

I had the 50 1.4 for many years. I really enjoyed it. I thought it produced beautiful images. Yes not very sharp at 1.4 but okay sharp wise. It gave a particular type of image, it made people and scenes look good. I replaced it with a 50 1.2 which I also like. It also gives a certain look. I'm not impacted by the focus breathing issue. I find it not an issue in real life shooting. Maybe if you are shooting focus targets you can see an impact. I'd be very surprised Canon bring out a 50 1.4 without IS.


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## GammyKnee (Jan 31, 2017)

douglaurent said:


> Who would have thought that World War III is more likely to happen sooner than the 50/1.4 II?
> At least World War III will include an element with the initials IS.
> One could wonder why japanese decision makers have problems making major obvious decisions after decades, when one american decision maker alone can come up with major decisions (although dumb) on a daily basis.



Priceless ;D


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## pokerz (Jan 31, 2017)

Nano USM with LCD display please


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## ahsanford (Jan 31, 2017)

uri.raz said:


> Canon has 16-35mm, 24mm, 28mm, 35mm, and 100mm lenses with IS, and Tamron has 45mm f/1.8 & 85mm f/1.8 with VC. It would be strange if Canon wouldn't make 50mm & 85mm primes with IS.



As has been pointed out a few times elsewhere, I agree with you, but you just amalgamated a host of different types and timeframes of lenses into one 'Canon will probably do X' sort of statement -- L, zoom, macro, non-L, etc.

See the chart below. Recall the 24/slow 28/35 were their own little standalone non-L family of lenses, and yes, they all got updated to get IS. But there is another family of non-L primes, the 20/fast 28/50/85/100 that had USM of some sort. Canon has not yet replaced a single one of those. I, too, think they should get IS, but this rumor would imply otherwise.

- A


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## Hector1970 (Jan 31, 2017)

pokerz said:


> Nano USM with LCD display please


What would you do with an LCD display on a lens?
What would it display?
Would it measure focal length accurately if it were a zoom?
I assume in this case the LCD would tell you aperture / shutter speed - anything else?


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## JonAustin (Jan 31, 2017)

Good grief. Why won't Canon simply produce a 50mm f/1.x IS prime with true Ring USM and be done with it already? I know, they have market research and development pipelines & priorities and revenue / profit optimization objectives and all that, but this seems like such a no-brainer.


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## Antono Refa (Jan 31, 2017)

Hector1970 said:


> What would you do with an LCD display on a lens?
> What would it display?
> Would it measure focal length accurately if it were a zoom?
> I assume in this case the LCD would tell you aperture / shutter speed - anything else?



See here.


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 31, 2017)

Antono Refa said:


> Hector1970 said:
> 
> 
> > What would you do with an LCD display on a lens?
> ...



So on a prime lens, without IS, it would show...just what a physical distance window already shows. Except if you're shooting in the cold, when the LCD stops working. Useful. :


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## ahsanford (Jan 31, 2017)

JonAustin said:


> Good grief. Why won't Canon simply produce a 50mm f/1.x IS prime with true Ring USM and be done with it already? I know, they have market research and development pipelines & priorities and revenue / profit optimization objectives and all that, but this seems like such a no-brainer.



I do not know. 

One can certainly speculate, though. There's a legitimate shout that a 50 f/1.4 IS USM -- with modern/reliable/no surprises AF as solid as the 24/28/35 IS refreshes -- would steal L business. A non-L IS refresh won't win awards for IQ or compete with the Arts and Otuses, but a new non-L would mop the floor with the 50L for resolution. That plus a modern/reliable/fast AF setup might tempt some photographers normally swimming in L waters to have a look.

Think of it as someone opting for a very nicely spec'd brand new Toyota to replace their aging but luxurious Lexus.

- A


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## Antono Refa (Jan 31, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> Antono Refa said:
> 
> 
> > Hector1970 said:
> ...


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## ahsanford (Jan 31, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> So on a prime lens, without IS, it would show...just what a physical distance window already shows. Except if you're shooting in the cold, when the LCD stops working. Useful. :



It could also give you emotional support:

_"That shot looks nice."
"You can do it!"
"Today is the day you give up chimping. I believe in you."_

Or Canon marketing hypnosis:

_"You like focus by wire. It's amazing. Precise mechanical things are for doodooheads."
"f/4 is the new f/2.8 -- high ISO ftw, amirite?"
"Cropped 4K is like an Instagram filter for your video. No one will know how you shot this. Nice."
"So a Nikon 1 walks into the cantina in Mos Eisley: "Feel the force? I can hardly sensor!""_

- A


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## neuroanatomist (Jan 31, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > So on a prime lens, without IS, it would show...just what a physical distance window already shows. Except if you're shooting in the cold, when the LCD stops working. Useful. :
> ...



How innovative. 

I was thinking more like...

"Subject Distance: 8 ft. Approx. DoF: 8 in."

But I like the idea of meaningless platitudes better...


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jan 31, 2017)

IglooEater said:


> Mt Spokane Photography said:
> 
> 
> > The optical formula for 50mm lenses has not changed for for over 100 years. The double gauss lens was invented in the 1800's, and has not changed a lot since.
> ...



That is exactly what I said, to improve performance, you must add more elements and move into the much higher priced "L" category. The Sigma Art is not a low cost consumer grade lens.


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## jeffa4444 (Jan 31, 2017)

Optically & mechanically the two lenses Canon has to pay homage too are the Zeiss 55mm f1.4 Otus and the Sigma 50mm f1.4 Art. Clearly Canon will not be putting a 50mm f1.4 lens out at the Otus price point but this lens proves lens designs can be improved and is the very best full frame 50mm available. The Sigma 50mm 1.4 Art shows just how much Canon has neglected its 50mm f1.4 offering and they should at least match its optical abilities (something they have not done with their new 24-105mm f4L II even though its better than the previous lens regarding CAs). 
For a company of Canon size a new 50mm f1.4 is long overdue lets hope its worth the wait.


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## ahsanford (Jan 31, 2017)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> IglooEater said:
> 
> 
> > Mt Spokane Photography said:
> ...



I still don't get why people don't get this. There is a Double Gauss 50mm IQ level and a Big Pickle Jar Retrofocus 50mm IQ level. (Throw prices out for a moment, Sigma will spoil any comparison there.)

I see the 50L scaling up in size something fierce to go after the best wide open IQ. But this new EF 50 f/1.4 USM II isn't about that -- I expect the lens to remain double gauss and quite small.

- A


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## Puka (Jan 31, 2017)

Thank you Sigma for your Art Lenses. 
Because of your Art lenses Canon ans Nikon and others are making upgrades to their 25 or more, years old lenses; It's too much isn't it? But Sigma oblige them to upgrade!


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## rfdesigner (Jan 31, 2017)

Canon Rumors said:


> I updated the post with a correction. I'm sorry for the confusion.



hmmmm... ninny-USM lovely

Question for the experts:

When you use the dock and go through ALL the calibration steps.. how good is the focussing? (especially for portraiture)


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## slclick (Jan 31, 2017)

rfdesigner said:


> Canon Rumors said:
> 
> 
> > I updated the post with a correction. I'm sorry for the confusion.
> ...



Are you asking Sigma 50 Art owners? Mine didn't need any calibration, either through the dock or in the 5D3 AFMA. It's not as speedy as any of my L glass but it's no slouch. If it hunts, it's a fast hunt.


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## rfdesigner (Jan 31, 2017)

slclick said:


> rfdesigner said:
> 
> 
> > Canon Rumors said:
> ...



Yes I was looking for ART owners, thanks very much. The net is often filled with the most voiciferous 0.1%, which are usually the disgruntled ones.


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## ahsanford (Jan 31, 2017)

rfdesigner said:


> Yes I was looking for ART owners, thanks very much. The net is often filled with the most voiciferous 0.1%, which are usually the disgruntled ones.



You're right, the reviewers are a bit disgruntled with that one.

- A


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## grainier (Feb 1, 2017)

Lies, of course.


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## slclick (Feb 1, 2017)

Look I know the Sigma Art 50mm is a big lens for that particular focal length. But beyond that this glass has no issues. NONE. Sure, Sigma could have made it bigger, or more expensive but then said lens would be manual focus and then the real issue wouldn't be the lens but the fact that the 5D3 has no interchangeable focus screen. THAT is a much bigger problem then this 50mm lens thing everyone is always going off about (it's just such a ho hum focal length)


*Edited as I stayed after class to raise my grade in forum school


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## ahsanford (Feb 1, 2017)

slclick said:


> Look I know *it*'s a big lens for 50mm. But beyond that *it* has no issues. NONE. *it* could even be bigger, or more expensive but then *it* would be manual focus and then the real issue wouldn't be the lens but the fact that the 5D3 has no interchangeable focus screen. THAT is a much bigger problem then this 50mm lens thing everyone is always going off about (it's just such a ho hum focal length)



For goodness sake, *pronouns!!!*

If you are referring to the Sigma Art, it's a terrific tool but it's far from perfect. It has two pronounced drawbacks and one lesser one. 

It is simply a huge lens -- it's the same size/weight as a 24-70 f/2.8L II! For a guy like me that brings 1-2 lenses with me in a smaller bag most often, this is the difference between not bringing a second lens along or having to schlep a larger bag. That's a big deal for me but perhaps not for you.

Second, the inexplicably inconsistent AF has been reported by reviewers I trust, TDP, LensTip in particular. It's not a show stopper depending on what you shoot. An occasional whiff with the AF is not a major issue for a studio / portraiture person as they can proof as they work and spot misses as they go and reshoot. But if you are working a wedding reception, capturing a family event, etc. an AF that whiffs could completely miss a moment, miss a memory, etc. That's a huge deal for me. If I have to chimp each time I'm shooting wider than f/2, the lens is not for me.

And finally, I'm not aware that it is formally weather sealed (whatever manufacturers define that as) so much as it's well built and generally resists dust/moisture. That's good enough for me, but if you live in the Pacific Northwest, shoot coastlines, etc. you may be a bit pickier on this front.

That said, optically it's one of the great bang-for-the-buck value propositions out there. This thing punches it weight with anything.

- A


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## slclick (Feb 1, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> slclick said:
> 
> 
> > Look I know *it*'s a big lens for 50mm. But beyond that *it* has no issues. NONE. *it* could even be bigger, or more expensive but then *it* would be manual focus and then the real issue wouldn't be the lens but the fact that the 5D3 has no interchangeable focus screen. THAT is a much bigger problem then this 50mm lens thing everyone is always going off about (it's just such a ho hum focal length)
> ...



Sorry School Marm, I redid the post and hope I can raise my grade to stay on the Yearbook Club.


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## FramerMCB (Feb 1, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> Canon Rumors said:
> 
> 
> > I updated the post with a correction. I'm sorry for the confusion.
> ...


Perhaps you should take a look at and read the 75-300mm f4-5.6 teardown review that Roger (& Aaron) over at LensRentals just did. This lens has the newer Nano motor and looks to me like the focusing assembly inside this lens moves without changing the length of the lens...slides internally (I think). Although Roger and team could answer this precisely. However, I don't know if this lens focus-shifts between focal settings... i.e. infinity at 70mm is different than infinity at 300mm, or 200mm, or...you get the picture (no pun intended).


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## riker (Feb 1, 2017)

*Re: Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 Micro USM Finally Coming? [CR1]*



chmteacher said:


> rs said:
> 
> 
> > Someone's going to be happy...
> ...



I'm happy.
Don't want IS. I want small size, lightweight, perfect IQ (resolution!), quick and precise AF. No more. Don't even care about vignetting. Good CA is a plus.


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## ahsanford (Feb 1, 2017)

FramerMCB said:


> Perhaps you should take a look at and read the 75-300mm f4-5.6 teardown review that Roger (& Aaron) over at LensRentals just did. This lens has the newer Nano motor and looks to me like the focusing assembly inside this lens moves without changing the length of the lens...slides internally (I think). Although Roger and team could answer this precisely. However, I don't know if this lens focus-shifts between focal settings... i.e. infinity at 70mm is different than infinity at 300mm, or 200mm, or...you get the picture (no pun intended).



Yes, thanks, I saw those. I believe internal vs. external focusing is a design decision made by Canon that is independent of the focusing mechanism. So far, there are two nano USM lenses and both are internally focusing, which is a good sign, but it's no guarantee of things to come.

EF 50mm f/1.4 USM II (with Nano USM) would be focus by wire, and it will lack IS. But so long as its still faster than STM and it switches to an internal focusing design, I'd buy that on day one for $599. Yes, the Tamron 45mm f/1.8 VC may be sharp and have IS, but that lens is 'Art big' and I simply trust Canon AF more for large aperture work.

But were they to offer the _perfect_ lens -- one that I think many in this forum have been asking for, a remake in the vein of the 24/28/35 IS refresh lenses -- I'd be over the moon. For an EF 50mm f/1.4 IS USM (with Ring USM), internal focusing, compact size, IS, solid build quality and L-like hood attachment, etc. I'd go $999 on that in a heartbeat. That would be the small all-purpose workhorse prime I've do not have today.

- A


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## Maximilian (Feb 2, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> But were they to offer the _perfect_ lens -- one that I think many in this forum have been asking for, a remake in the vein of the 24/28/35 IS refresh lenses -- I'd be over the moon. For an EF 50mm f/1.4 IS USM (with Ring USM), internal focusing, compact size, IS, solid build quality and L-like hood attachment, etc. I'd go $999 on that in a heartbeat. That would be the small all-purpose workhorse prime I've do not have today.


Hypothetic Question:
There is a rumor about a EF 50mm f/1.4 L IS USM (supposedly ring USM).
If this was slightly more expensive than your $999 - say $1199 (quite unlikely, I know),
- would you only buy it if it was small?
- wouldn't you buy it because of size, if its size was comparable to the Sigma Art?
- or wouldn't you buy it because it was too expensive?


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## Viggo (Feb 2, 2017)

rfdesigner said:


> Canon Rumors said:
> 
> 
> > I updated the post with a correction. I'm sorry for the confusion.
> ...



Out of the three copies of the 50 Art and two copies of 35 Art on 6d and 1dx, calibrated with FoCal plus docking and real testing, exactly none of them were better than random at best. Never ever again


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## Alex_M (Feb 2, 2017)

that's what I said 6 months ago when I sold my entire collection of Sigma art and Sports lenses.. but then, 85 Art comes along with reliable AF and sharpness I cannot resist and.. I bought the lens, of course. Then a friend of mine decided to sell his Sigma 50 Art really cheaply and I could not resit. I bought that one too. Then, another friend of mine asked me to help with his Sigma 35 Art lens callibration on USB dock. I helped him out just to find out that the sharpness of his copy is virtually off the charts. super sharp... 3 days ago my friend called me and offered to purchase his lens at a bargain price. And, I could not resist, of course... so Sigma 35, 50, 85 Art so far.



Viggo said:


> Out of the three copies of the 50 Art and two copies of 35 Art on 6d and 1dx, calibrated with FoCal plus docking and real testing, exactly none of them were better than random at best. Never ever again


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## ahsanford (Feb 2, 2017)

Maximilian said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > But were they to offer the _perfect_ lens -- one that I think many in this forum have been asking for, a remake in the vein of the 24/28/35 IS refresh lenses -- I'd be over the moon. For an EF 50mm f/1.4 IS USM (with Ring USM), internal focusing, compact size, IS, solid build quality and L-like hood attachment, etc. I'd go $999 on that in a heartbeat. That would be the small all-purpose workhorse prime I've do not have today.
> ...



If there is a 50mm f/1.4L IS, it's $1699 or it doesn't exist. Possibly more if it's the huge retrofocus Otus/Art killer. Likely too big for me and I'd pass.

If it stays a focus-shifty non-planar field tool like the current 50L, I won't buy it at any price.

- A


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## Maximilian (Feb 2, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> Maximilian said:
> 
> 
> > ahsanford said:
> ...


Thanks for your reply. 
I know my price was not logical. 

So let's hope Canon will come close to what you desire because that'll be my goal, too. 
But honestly even with IS $999 would be too much for me.


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## Antono Refa (Feb 2, 2017)

JS5 said:


> Dear Canon...
> 
> How come it is taking so long ? You disappoint...



I can see it making sense, looking from the ecosystem point of view. Having 3rd party options, allows Canon to to make lenses the competitors don't have (EF 11-24mm f/4, TS-E 17mm, etc), have a more attractive ecosystem (= sell cameras), then come back and close the OEM lenses line (= sell the lenses).


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## ahsanford (Feb 2, 2017)

Antono Refa said:


> JS5 said:
> 
> 
> > Dear Canon...
> ...



Antono, sure, but you do that with *niche* lenses, like a fast prime for crop, a longer than 100/105mm macro lens, a strange zoom range like 120-300, an all-manual astro lens, etc.

For Canon to drag its feet _on a staple tool for all levels of photography_ -- a workhorse 50mm prime with fast and reliable AF -- is laughable. 

Could you imagine if Canon abandoned the 24-something zoom market, 70-200 zoom market, etc. and left it to rot for third parties to embarrass Canon like this? Heads would roll.

- A


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## Viggo (Feb 2, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> Antono Refa said:
> 
> 
> > JS5 said:
> ...



100% agreed. I think a 50 is one of, if not, THE most important lens to be on top of. How many 50 f1.8's have been sold as the "first after kit lens"? And people fall in love with that 50 either on full frame or crop, they see it's perhaps not the best and want to upgrade, but nowhere to go, except third party options. They should've released a solid upgrade to both the f1.4 and f1.2 L at the same time ... that way they don't have competing lenses and all are the same age and tech and will a natural upgrading ladder. Like they have with 70-200's for example.


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## Antono Refa (Feb 3, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> Antono Refa said:
> 
> 
> > JS5 said:
> ...



My thoughts are

* It's about money, which is why Canon invested in eight new 24-70mm & 70-200mm lenses since it released the 50mm f/1.4

* I have my doubts whether the 50mm f/1.4 is the staple tool / workhorse it used to be.


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## Proscribo (Feb 27, 2017)

I've hold it inside me so long... but now I can't take it anymore. Where is that new, shiny 50mm that focuses well and is decently sharp?! I'm kinda fine with my 50mm/1.4's poor(ish) sharpness, but the inconsistent AF drives me mad... basically I must use DPAF if I want to shoot anything under f/2.8 and it's a lot slower (harder to balance, too).

For a few times I have thought about buying the sigma art 50mm but then again I've understood that the AF is particularly inconsistent with that lens too.


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