# Newbie need help to pick a used camera please



## ezpop (May 31, 2014)

I used to borrow a T3i from my brother. Now I have saved up some money to buy a camera body for myself. I dont wanna use a rebel body coz my friends are all semi-pro bodies user. They look great and are more sturdy in their built.

For the money I have, I can afford a 50D, 60D or a 7D body.

Locally in Toronto, I can grab a 50D for $400, a 60D for $550 or a 7D for $750. 

I made some inquiries responding to some CL ads and got some exciting responses. 

1. A 2 years old 7D with under 10k actuation with original everything for $750. It comes with a 16gb Cf card as well. I like the built, the speed and the badge. That's my no.1 choice.

2. A 6 months old 60D with may be 4k actuation with 2 years extended warranty. No card but come with an additional third party battery. Seller told me he bought it during last boxing sale for $800 plus tax with 18 200 kit lens but now will keep the lens and sell the body for lowest $530 to me. The good point is the like new condition and warranty. But it is not the 7D and no AFMA if I need it.

3. A 50D with 14k, seems well used. Asking $450. Obviously, it's least attractive to me. 

My camera will be mainly for landscape and portrait shooting. Little chance to do sports and wildlife etc at this moment. I may start learning to shoot video as well. I have access to some nice lenses. Family members are generous to share. I will buy a few primes later. 

Then. Which camera body should I buy? Which one will hold better value? I don't want a T4i, T5i or an old FF 5D and I can't afford 
A 70D. My choice seems limited. I guess I will go for one of the above.

Help me with my choice please.


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## ajfotofilmagem (May 31, 2014)

If you do not want to shoot sports and wildlife then 60D looks better for the price. If the budget allows, 70D has significant improvements, makes fast and accurate focus in live view, and will continue updated for several years


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## greger (May 31, 2014)

Get the 7D. I think it is the best option and value. You may not want to shoot sports now, but if you change your mind
The 7D has 3 C (custom settings) that save time and the other cameras lack. 7D may not be the best choice for video.
I use C1 for BIF, C2 for flash and C3 for landscape. You could set one C mode for video. Good Luck.


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## Deleted member 91053 (May 31, 2014)

You want a used camera at sensible money for landscape and portraits yet you rule out the 5D?
I have owned a few crop cameras (both 1.6 and 1.3 (1D4) and, for this sort of work my 5D was my preferred camera. It might be old but the images are excellent - made my 50D look a bit poor to say the least. Now that I use the 1DX my 5D is semi retired but the images are far from shabby and certainly better than anything I got on APSC cameras.
From my experience I would take a 5D over any of the cameras you are considering for landscape and portrait. The only thing wrong with the 5D (IMO) is the lack of liver view for macro work - but then you don't mention that as a consideration.


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## sagittariansrock (Jun 1, 2014)

johnf3f said:


> You want a used camera at sensible money for landscape and portraits yet you rule out the 5D?
> I have owned a few crop cameras (both 1.6 and 1.3 (1D4) and, for this sort of work my 5D was my preferred camera. It might be old but the images are excellent - made my 50D look a bit poor to say the least. Now that I use the 1DX my 5D is semi retired but the images are far from shabby and certainly better than anything I got on APSC cameras.
> From my experience I would take a 5D over any of the cameras you are considering for landscape and portrait. The only thing wrong with the 5D (IMO) is the lack of liver view for macro work - but then you don't mention that as a consideration.



I had started writing a response on the same lines, especially after my recent good experience buying and using a 5D, but then I saw (s)he wants to learn video. That might be the reason to discount it.


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## East Wind Photography (Jun 1, 2014)

ezpop said:


> I used to borrow a T3i from my brother. Now I have saved up some money to buy a camera body for myself. I dont wanna use a rebel body coz my friends are all semi-pro bodies user. They look great and are more sturdy in their built.
> 
> For the money I have, I can afford a 50D, 60D or a 7D body.
> 
> ...



Of those three i would choose the 7d. It is the best choice ofmthe three and will suit you well when you switch to video. The 7d build and firmware is much more capable than the other consumer models. The 7d may come down in price later this year when the 7d mark ii is announced. If you dont need it right away then wait a bit and see. Otherwise just buy it and enjoy shooting.


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## timmy_650 (Jun 1, 2014)

The Price for the 60D is kinda high. I would rather rate for a canon sale if you want a 60D. I would rather have a t5i than the 60D. My problem with the 50D, 60D, 7D for what you want you can get them same or worse image quality from a t2i. I do like the build of a semi pro body too (I have a 1D, 40D, t2i, 6D) 
From your choices I would vote the 7D it is a great camera but I would also vote a 5D


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## Menace (Jun 1, 2014)

Get the 7D - I loved mine


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## scaptic (Jun 1, 2014)

I’m guessing you don’t own any lenses yet? Even if you can borrow all the lenses you want, you should own the lens you plan to use most. 

Leave enough room in the budget to buy a nice lens along with the camera. If going for the 60D instead of the 7D means you have more to spend on a better lens, that would be my first choice. 

For landscapes and portraits, a 60D will do just as well. True: it doesn’t have AFMA, but that’s mainly a question of testing the lens before you buy them. And if you shoot landscapes, you should be using liveview anyway (no need for AFMA).


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## lholmes549 (Jun 1, 2014)

From your list of choices I would go with the 60d. I have owned the 7D but if you aren't shooting sports or wildlife then I don't see any reason to choose the 7D over the 60d. AFMA probably won't be as important as you think it will, especially if you're starting out borrowing different lenses from people. I always think an articulated screen would be good for low level landscape work, but have never used one.
As another poster said, I am unsure of why you ruled the 5D out? If you're seriously thinking about video then fair enough, but for portraits and landscapes it would be by far the best choice of camera within your budget. It may not have all the bells and whistles by today's standards but the IQ will be easily better than that from your other choices.


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## Deleted member 91053 (Jun 1, 2014)

sagittariansrock said:


> johnf3f said:
> 
> 
> > You want a used camera at sensible money for landscape and portraits yet you rule out the 5D?
> ...



OOPS! I missed that!


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## ezpop (Jun 1, 2014)

I appreciate you guys inputing valuable opinion. 

I did not incude 5D here not just because it has no video feature, it's a bit too old for the money. Spending only $500 to $600 on a FF sensor seems fine but I have to worry about the money I possibly have to spend on repairing a may be 7 to 8 years old electronic equipment. Repairing cost easily reaches $300.

I also agree to some of you recommending 7D. It's best all round amongst the cropped sensor Canon Dslr within the price range. However, if I have to find a newer one, it will cost over $850. I have just received an offer for a 3 1/2 years old 7D with 30k actuation for $700. May consider but want to wait for one better than it.

$530 may seem a bit on the high side for a 60D ( really? ) but it's only a few months old with low shutter count. I have checked with CL and EBay and I found the price offered to be quite reasonable. I think if I take this one, shoot with it for about 2 years, I may still be able to resell it for $350 to 400. Then, my spending on this comparatively newer body will be very low - $10 or less per month. Moreover, it has a 2 years warranty on it and the cost of repair is 0 for the period. The general comment in reviews about this model is that is a downgrade to 50D that make it less popular. 

Still struggling. 7D or 60D. Or may be I could buy the 70D with my credit card and pay the balance by instalments. (stop thinking about it, hate to have collection agencies calling again)

Btw, have you guys ever bought a 3 years old camera? Kind of scary having to consider buying a camera that old.:-!:-!:-!

I will have a 50 1.8 and 28-105 USM II to start with. Given to me by family. I can borrow a 70 300, UW or a few L lens if I need to use them so I'm fine with lenses for the time being. Also, I can used over 10 vintage mf lenses with adaptors - people seem to have abandoned them completely.

Cheers.


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## wickidwombat (Jun 1, 2014)

ezpop said:


> I appreciate you guys inputing valuable opinion.
> 
> I did not incude 5D here not just because it has no video feature, it's a bit too old for the money. Spending only $500 to $600 on a FF sensor seems fine but I have to worry about the money I possibly have to spend on repairing a may be 7 to 8 years old electronic equipment. Repairing cost easily reaches $300.
> 
> ...



look around see if you can find a 5Dmk2 in your price range since you have full frame lenses! i'm sure there will be something close.

I would also say if you don't mind bulky look for a nice second hand 1Dmk3 they are only 10MP but the IQ is still better than all of canons crop sensor cameras and can be had pretty cheap and they are pro build with all the bells and whistles
In still use mine

but I think if it had to come down to the choice of a cheaper 60D or a 7D i would go with the cheaper 60D and buy the new 10-18 STM lens to go with it since you want to do lanscapes you will need a good wide angle and it looks like an awesome bang for buck on a crop and will fit nicely with the lenses you have


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## brad-man (Jun 1, 2014)

ezpop said:


> I appreciate you guys inputing valuable opinion.
> 
> I did not incude 5D here not just because it has no video feature, it's a bit too old for the money. Spending only $500 to $600 on a FF sensor seems fine but I have to worry about the money I possibly have to spend on repairing a may be 7 to 8 years old electronic equipment. Repairing cost easily reaches $300.
> 
> ...



I hate to argue with the OP right off the bat, but I think you would be better served by getting a refurbished Rebel T4i and with the money saved, pick up one or two of Canon's STM lenses. The T4i will meet or beat those other cameras in all aspects relating to IQ. The rebels are built plenty tough, and don't discount the functionality of an excellent articulating touch screen. The new STM lenses are all very good for stills and video. The EF-S 18-135mm IS STM is reputed to be an excellent "single lens solution" and can be had for $320 (USA model) from a reputable dealer on ebay....and now back to help-full suggestions...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/151185358474?item=151185358474&lgeo=1&vectorid=229466


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## truejahmal (Jun 1, 2014)

you might want to keep a eye on canon usa they have a refurb section that has sales. Also bhphoto has a used section with a great return policy. they have a 7d for 749$ and free shipping, if you live outside of new york thats also no tax. they have great prices.


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## sama (Jun 1, 2014)

brad-man said:


> ezpop said:
> 
> 
> > I appreciate you guys inputing valuable opinion.
> ...




See snapshot for 60D and T4i comparison. Is T4i a better camera in all aspects, I doubt it. 

I would go for the six months old 60D with warranty. Bring someone who knows how to inspect a used camera with you. Otherwise, search for a checklist online and If there is no obvious damage and scratches on the camera and if it is fully functional, it's a good choice. 

7D may be better, but it's about 60% more expensive - $500 vs $800. The single digit badge may be a symbol of "semi-pro"but do you really need the more sophisticated AF system and mag alloy body in normal use ??Save the $300 for a nice STM lens (but it's it compatible with 60D ?? I don't know) Anyway, your 50 1.8 and 28 105 USM II are good to start with.

Nice people are sharing their experience here. It's only you yourself who know your own need and budget. 

Buy the one you can afford and like and start shooting right away.

Happy shooting.


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## sagittariansrock (Jun 2, 2014)

If you actually go through the points you will realize most of them are either theoretical (IQ, DR, color depth, noise), or marginal (viewfinder, shutter lag, fps) or can be easily remedied (battery life- get extra batteries, max speed- get ND filters). The weather sealing of the 60D is not sufficient, so I don't see how shooting in the rain with a 50% weather sealed camera is any better than a 20% weather sealed one.
T2i is actually a pretty good suggestion. Touch screen and video AF (STM) are great tools since the OP is interested in video. The weight and higher max ISO can also be helpful.

OP, I have just recently bought an 8-year old 5D. It works great (knock on wood). If you buy used from reputable sellers on FredMiranda, or even better, guaranteed used ones from KEH (they offer a 6-month warranty) then you don't have to worry about spending $$$ for repairs.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jun 2, 2014)

ezpop said:


> I used to borrow a T3i from my brother. Now I have saved up some money to buy a camera body for myself. I dont wanna use a rebel body coz my friends are all semi-pro bodies user. They look great and are more sturdy in their built.
> 
> For the money I have, I can afford a 50D, 60D or a 7D body.
> 
> ...


 
Bodies do not hold their value. They all drop in value with time, and much faster than lenses.
A new person buying used is a target for scammers, because they can't tell if a camera is good or bad. Sellers will lie about warranties. Warranties are generally not transferrable, those that are charge a fee.

I'd hate to see you spend your cash on a camera and later find out it has issues. Many issues do not show up right away, but a few can be found by careful testing.

In the US, you can get a 70D for about $734 net right now, but you need to put up $1584 and then wait for rebates, sell the free printer and the lens. If someone can help you out, its a good deal. Its listed on the CR front page.
Here is how I compute it.
$1584 up front
Free Pixma Pro 100 printer with paper ($150 Resale value)
$400 rebate
Free 18-135mm STM lens - Resale value $300

Free SD card and case, keep them, they are not worth reselling.

Net Cost of camera body: $734.

I did this with a G1X and resold all the stuff, and my net cost was $150. The trick is to put up the cash up front, and to sell all the valuable stuff. The rebate is a Amex Card, so its not cash. No problem for me, I used it at Costco for my regular purchases.

I think that getting the rebate in Canada is a show stopper.


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## sama (Jun 2, 2014)

sagittariansrock said:


> If you actually go through the points you will realize most of them are either theoretical (IQ, DR, color depth, noise), or marginal (viewfinder, shutter lag, fps) or can be easily remedied (battery life- get extra batteries, max speed- get ND filters). The weather sealing of the 60D is not sufficient, so I don't see how shooting in the rain with a 50% weather sealed camera is any better than a 20% weather sealed one.
> T2i is actually a pretty good suggestion. Touch screen and video AF (STM) are great tools since the OP is interested in video. The weight and higher max ISO can also be helpful.
> 
> OP, I have just recently bought an 8-year old 5D. It works great (knock on wood). If you buy used from reputable sellers on FredMiranda, or even better, guaranteed used ones from KEH (they offer a 6-month warranty) then you don't have to worry about spending $$$ for repairs.



The OP specifically indicate that he/she wants a body other than Rebel. Whilst T2i/T3i are capable cameras, they don't match his criteria of choice. T4i has a similar 18MP sensor with touch screen etc, it is also in the Rebel category I believe and it is about the price of the 60D mentioned. The OP's list of choice i.e. 7D and 60D definitely has better construction than the Rebel bodies. Other recommendations are of course providing him/her different thoughts. 

Buying from reputable sellers in Canada is definitely more expensive than from private sale. If the OP can find one used from private sale with transferable warranty, it is a good alternative too. Btw, for local private sale, the buyer don't to pay the 13% HST (sales tax) thus reducing the cost of purchase. Buying from US based companies is not worth the hassle, shipping and custom charges and return shipping added up to the cost and trouble.

I would further suggest the OP to continue using his bro's T3i if practical and save some more money for a 70D which may possibly have a lower price tag soon (Back to school and Boxing sales) or a FF 5D2 used which is also an excellent choice.

Sharing experience here is really a joy. I am learning from here everyday.


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## timmy_650 (Jun 2, 2014)

ezpop said:


> Btw, have you guys ever bought a 3 years old camera? Kind of scary having to consider buying a camera that old.:-!:-!:-!



I got a 1D like 2 years ago so that was like 10 years old and I have love it and didn't have problems. I also got a 40D a few months ago and I wasn't worried at all. But I watched ebay for awhile and found one that was cheap ($200) It was a bit of a risk bc there was like no information but it turn out well low shutter count.


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## nc0b (Jun 2, 2014)

For landscape and portraiture I would strongly recommend full frame, thus the 5D. Image quality is wonderful as earlier stated, buy my main reason is how my lenses work. For your purposes, assuming video isn't the driving factor, I rarely use my crop bodies compared to full frame (FF). I started with the original Rebel, and when it quit working after 8 years bought a 60D, which I shot today, so I am not knocking the 60D. I have a 5D, 40D, 60D and 6D, one crop and one full frame at each home. If I am doing general shooting, I always go for the FF since I prefer the standard effective focal length. A portrait with an 85mm and FF is better for me than the 136mm equivalent on my crop bodies. For birds in flight (BIF) I will usually go with my 6D rather than the 60D, depending on the size of the bird. If shooting raptors with a 400mm f/5.6 handheld, I will go for the FF. Smaller birds, then the crop body is likely better. My zooms are 24-105mm f/4 IS, 70-200mm f4 IS and f/2.8 IS II, and usually the FF is preferable to the 1.6X focal length crop factor for general shooting on a vacation, hiking or just walking around a park. Wherever I am, I can grab a FF or crop, but it always comes down to how I want the lens to play, not image quality. When I am on a vacation in the car, I take everything, and have at least three bodies with mounted lenses to be ready for whatever pops up. Neither of my FF have built-in flash, so if I need on-camera flash the choice is obvious.


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## Richard8971 (Jun 2, 2014)

I am going to suggest a slightly different camera body. Grab a 40D. You can find very lightly used bodies for $200-300 and the fps is fast and the image quality is fantastic. You cannot really tell the images apart from the 40D and 50D and viewing them normally, they are hard to tell apart from the 7D. 

I know several people who still use the 40D (myself included) and I know you won't be disappointed. Invest instead in better glass so that once you have figured out where you want to go with photography you have the glass you need without wasting a bunch of money on a body. 

I have owned 2 40D's and they are great cameras. 

D


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## ezpop (Jun 2, 2014)

Richard8971 said:


> I am going to suggest a slightly different camera body. Grab a 40D. You can find very lightly used bodies for $200-300 and the fps is fast and the image quality is fantastic. You cannot really tell the images apart from the 40D and 50D and viewing them normally, they are hard to tell apart from the 7D.
> 
> I know several people who still use the 40D (myself included) and I know you won't be disappointed. Invest instead in better glass so that once you have figured out where you want to go with photography you have the glass you need without wasting a bunch of money on a body.
> 
> ...



That' a new idea. I heard quite some people mentioning positively about this body. Great built, not bad iQ, low, low cost. I can still use my bro's t3i for video if I need to. Search on the local ads, find some 10k to 20k SC no scratch etc etc for $250 or less. May start to search and buy one and shoot for a few months till big sales on in a few months and then decide which one to buy and replace. 
Finally...... thanks guys for all your suggestions. Really appreciate.


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## sagittariansrock (Jun 2, 2014)

ezpop said:


> Richard8971 said:
> 
> 
> > I am going to suggest a slightly different camera body. Grab a 40D. You can find very lightly used bodies for $200-300 and the fps is fast and the image quality is fantastic. You cannot really tell the images apart from the 40D and 50D and viewing them normally, they are hard to tell apart from the 7D.
> ...



If you are thinking 40D then you should definitely think 5Dc. The difference in FF vs APS-C is quite significant for your usages. 
Here's an inexpensive, guaranteed option::
http://www.keh.com/camera/Canon-Digital-Camera-Bodies/1/sku-DC029990897980?r=FE
They have 40D as well:
http://www.keh.com/camera/Canon-Digital-Camera-Bodies/1/sku-DC029991024110?r=FE


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## nc0b (Jun 2, 2014)

Nothing wrong with a 40D, as per my previous post, I own a 40D and also bought one for my daughter-in-law. Have a Canon grip on both my 40D and 5D Classic (5Dc). If you do go with a crop, don't buy a lot of EF-S lenses because it is likely you will want FF in the long run. I have one crop lens, the fine 15-85mm f4/5.6, which has a nice zoom range and takes nice pictures. Only problem is it is slow, and in low light it forces me to push my 40D to ISO 1600 or 3200. The 40D is kind of noisy at ISO 3200. You can use a 32 GB Compact Flash card in both the 40D and 5Dc, so that is no limitation. If you go with a 5Dc, get one with a serial number that starts with 2 or 3, not 0 or 1. They improved the rear LCD screen with the later production models. Also it is unlikely the mirror will fall out on the later production units. I assume Canon will still fix for no charge a mirror failure on a 5Dc. I paid $900 for a 5Dc 2 years ago, but now they can be had for $500. A 40D for $300 or less should be no problem. As others said, buy good glass that you can keep for years longer than your first body purchase. Again consider the equivalent zoom range when you decide between FF or crop.


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## nc0b (Jun 2, 2014)

You said if you bought a 40D you could use it for a while and then sell it! Bad idea. You always need a spare body. Imagine going on a trip with a few lenses and one body and it breaks or you drop it. As people say, the camera you have with you is better than the camera on the shelf at home. A spare body, even if it is in your motel, is better than the $200 you might get for it a year from now.


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## sdsr (Jun 2, 2014)

sama said:


> The OP specifically indicate that he/she wants a body other than Rebel. Whilst T2i/T3i are capable cameras, they don't match his criteria of choice.



True, but the reasons ezpop gave for wanting a more advanced APS-C than Rebel are that they look better and are "more sturdy", and maybe he also wants AFMA. But unless he really needs AFMA (and maybe he does - I have no idea), really cares what it looks like, and would really benefit from the difference in sturdiness; and since he plans to take landscapes and portraits - it's far from obvious that a Rebel won't meet his actual criteria. A recent Rebel, including the SL1, will likely have better image quality than a 7D or the others he mentions, especially at higher ISOs.

Or he could try something entirely different; for instance, a Sony a6000 is inexpensive (its immediate predecessor is now much cheaper still) and, with suitable adapters, can be used for any Canon lens he already has and just about any other lens you care to mention. It's mirrorless, so AFMA simply isn't an issue, and the wide range of good, old manual focus lenses available extremely cheaply provides a rather different and perhaps even cooler way to learn photography - and in the looks and handling department they win hands down (well, to me, anyway). (Better sensor in many ways too, probably.) Just a - perhaps irrelevant - thought....


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## Valvebounce (Jun 2, 2014)

Hi Folks. 
I've told this before, we went to AZ on holiday, I packed and repacked my bag, taking out and putting back in my 300D, my spare body just replaced by my 40D. Every time I took the 300D out of the bag I said the new 40D won't break, well it did, error 99 which turned out to be shutter failure, half way through a wildlife park trip fortunately the last decision on packing was to take the 300D so I still got some pics even though I missed a lot because of the lower frame rate! Always have a backup plan! 

Cheers Graham.




nc0b said:


> You said if you bought a 40D you could use it for a while and then sell it! Bad idea. You always need a spare body. Imagine going on a trip with a few lenses and one body and it breaks or you drop it. As people say, the camera you have with you is better than the camera on the shelf at home. A spare body, even if it is in your motel, is better than the $200 you might get for it a year from now.


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## Valvebounce (Jun 2, 2014)

Hi Folks. 
Is there anyone that doesn't want AFMA? I know a few of you say that you need no AFMA on your lenses, but when you do get a lens which is not perfectly matched to your camera you will find it invaluable. 

Cheers Graham. 



sdsr said:


> But unless he really needs AFMA (and maybe he does - I have no idea),


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## sagittariansrock (Jun 2, 2014)

sdsr said:


> sama said:
> 
> 
> > The OP specifically indicate that he/she wants a body other than Rebel. Whilst T2i/T3i are capable cameras, they don't match his criteria of choice.
> ...



+1. The T4i can use the latest features with the RT speedlites, has touchscreen, STM, etc.
Plus, the 60D doesn't have AFMA.


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## Oneand0 (Jun 2, 2014)

Throwing my 2 cents in! Owning a full frame now, but shooting with the 7D for a while before that, I would not be afraid to get the 7D for landscape. Just make sure you get some decent wide angle glass for it. I have come away, and seen other landscape photographers come away with winners time and time again, even though it's not FF. Most of all shoot, and shoot as much as you can. Invest in good polarizer and ND too 

On a second thought you can get the 60D and come away with the same quality pictures I believe, as I have seen great landscapes with this model too. You will have some money left over for some of those filters, or lens. It's not so much the camera, but more the experience and clear glass that gets you the shots you are after. Have fun and respect mother nature when doing landscape work.

Mario
http://mariomarez.smugmug.com


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## East Wind Photography (Jun 2, 2014)

Valvebounce said:


> Hi Folks.
> Is there anyone that doesn't want AFMA? I know a few of you say that you need no AFMA on your lenses, but when you do get a lens which is not perfectly matched to your camera you will find it invaluable.
> 
> Cheers Graham.
> ...



particularly when you use your lenses wider than f8.


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## sagittariansrock (Jun 2, 2014)

Valvebounce said:


> Hi Folks.
> Is there anyone that doesn't want AFMA? I know a few of you say that you need no AFMA on your lenses, but when you do get a lens which is not perfectly matched to your camera you will find it invaluable.
> 
> Cheers Graham.
> ...




Not having AFMA is a major constraint. I had to sell an otherwise nice 50mm/1.4 for this reason.
However, since I wanted an FF backup and cannot justify a 5DII or 6D at this moment I can live with the inconvenience.
What did people do before AFMA?


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## verysimplejason (Jun 3, 2014)

Those 3 cameras you mentioned just have the same IQ as the T3i. I'd rather buy a 5D and a 24-105L lens. But since you want video, then starting with the 50D sounds a little bit better if you are really not into sports. You can invest the 300bucks into a good landscape/video lens such as the new 10-18mm IS. If you are buying APS-C, don't forget to buy also the kit lens 18-55 IS (STM if possible) as they are light and a good value for money. It also has a very good IQ. Good luck with whatever your decision will be.


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## ajfotofilmagem (Jun 3, 2014)

verysimplejason said:


> Those 3 cameras you mentioned just have the same IQ as the T3i. I'd rather buy a 5D and a 24-105L lens. But since you want video, then starting with the 50D sounds a little bit better if you are really not into sports. You can invest the 300bucks into a good landscape/video lens such as the new 10-18mm IS. If you are buying APS-C, don't forget to buy also the kit lens 18-55 IS (STM if possible) as they are light and a good value for money. It also has a very good IQ. Good luck with whatever your decision will be.


You forgot that 50D does not have video recording?  :-X


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## sagittariansrock (Jun 3, 2014)

ajfotofilmagem said:


> verysimplejason said:
> 
> 
> > Those 3 cameras you mentioned just have the same IQ as the T3i. I'd rather buy a 5D and a 24-105L lens. But since you want video, then starting with the 50D sounds a little bit better if you are really not into sports. You can invest the 300bucks into a good landscape/video lens such as the new 10-18mm IS. If you are buying APS-C, don't forget to buy also the kit lens 18-55 IS (STM if possible) as they are light and a good value for money. It also has a very good IQ. Good luck with whatever your decision will be.
> ...



I thought the same thing (I owned a 50D) but it seems you can now record (RAW) video on a 50D with Magic Lantern.
That sounds pretty magical to me!


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## michi (Jun 3, 2014)

I have seen used 5D Mark II's on Craigslist for around US$1,000. Honestly, that sounds like the best body for you. Full frame for portraits, has MFA, video and you already have two EF mount lenses that you can use. Spend the little extra cash and get that still amazing camera. I have both the 5DII and a 7D and I hardly use the 7D anymore.


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## sagittariansrock (Jun 3, 2014)

michi said:


> I have seen used 5D Mark II's on Craigslist for around US$1,000. Honestly, that sounds like the best body for you. Full frame for portraits, has MFA, video and you already have two EF mount lenses that you can use. Spend the little extra cash and get that still amazing camera. I have both the 5DII and a 7D and I hardly use the 7D anymore.



Really? I don't see anything below ~ $ 1300 either on CL or on FM.com. I wonder how this body still commands such prices with the 6D often available for similar prices.


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## unxpectederror (Jun 3, 2014)

If your looking to shoot landscapes your looking at the completely wrong system.. I own Pro and Semi Pro DSLR from both Canon and Nikon.

my recommendations for a camera in your price range would be a refurbished D7100. the reason for this is simple, it has more pixels and it has a much larger dynamic range then any thing canon offers. It also lacks a AA filter which allows for more detail. the dynamic range is worlds better on Nikon cameras. I own a D7100 as a back up body. I bought it nikon refurbished for $850 at the end of last year. Its massively better than the 7D i used to own. that thing was horrible for landscapes as the dynamic range was very limited and you couldn't push the shadows at all with out seeing noise and vertical lines... 

if you cant afford the D7100 the D7000 is also a nice camera which offers a huge improvement in dynamic range over the 7D at the cost of only 2mp 16vs 18 of the 7D. not a huge factor in my book.. the run around the $600 mark these days used. also both the d7100 and d7000 are superior in low light to the APSC canon bodies by about a full stop.


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## sagittariansrock (Jun 3, 2014)

unxpectederror said:


> If your looking to shoot landscapes your looking at the completely wrong system.. I own Pro and Semi Pro DSLR from both Canon and Nikon.
> 
> my recommendations for a camera in your price range would be a refurbished D7100. the reason for this is simple, it has more pixels and it has a much larger dynamic range then any thing canon offers. It also lacks a AA filter which allows for more detail. the dynamic range is worlds better on Nikon cameras. I own a D7100 as a back up body. I bought it nikon refurbished for $850 at the end of last year. Its massively better than the 7D i used to own. that thing was horrible for landscapes as the dynamic range was very limited and you couldn't push the shadows at all with out seeing noise and vertical lines...
> 
> if you cant afford the D7100 the D7000 is also a nice camera which offers a huge improvement in dynamic range over the 7D at the cost of only 2mp 16vs 18 of the 7D. not a huge factor in my book.. the run around the $600 mark these days used. also both the d7100 and d7000 are superior in low light to the APSC canon bodies by about a full stop.



You probably missed the part where the OP mentions having access to Canon lenses which he can use... 

I am surprised that someone who has used both systems has such strong feelings against one system. 
Would you mind sharing some of your 7D landscape images where the 'horrible' limitation in DR was exposed, just for everyone's edification? Thanks.


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## verysimplejason (Jun 3, 2014)

ajfotofilmagem said:


> verysimplejason said:
> 
> 
> > Those 3 cameras you mentioned just have the same IQ as the T3i. I'd rather buy a 5D and a 24-105L lens. But since you want video, then starting with the 50D sounds a little bit better if you are really not into sports. You can invest the 300bucks into a good landscape/video lens such as the new 10-18mm IS. If you are buying APS-C, don't forget to buy also the kit lens 18-55 IS (STM if possible) as they are light and a good value for money. It also has a very good IQ. Good luck with whatever your decision will be.
> ...



It can have if you're willing to install ML but yes, you're right, not natively. I forgot about that because I'm thinking of my old 500D which I love so much. I wish I don't have to give that to my dad. I really miss it especially for macro work.


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## SoullessPolack (Jun 3, 2014)

unxpectederror said:


> If your looking to shoot landscapes your looking at the completely wrong system.. I own Pro and Semi Pro DSLR from both Canon and Nikon.
> 
> my recommendations for a camera in your price range would be a refurbished D7100. the reason for this is simple, it has more pixels and it has a much larger dynamic range then any thing canon offers. It also lacks a AA filter which allows for more detail. the dynamic range is worlds better on Nikon cameras. I own a D7100 as a back up body. I bought it nikon refurbished for $850 at the end of last year. Its massively better than the 7D i used to own. that thing was horrible for landscapes as the dynamic range was very limited and you couldn't push the shadows at all with out seeing noise and vertical lines...
> 
> if you cant afford the D7100 the D7000 is also a nice camera which offers a huge improvement in dynamic range over the 7D at the cost of only 2mp 16vs 18 of the 7D. not a huge factor in my book.. the run around the $600 mark these days used. also both the d7100 and d7000 are superior in low light to the APSC canon bodies by about a full stop.



As someone who has also owned both system, I can say that you're grossly overstating the difference. Perhaps you don't know how to properly recover shadows, but the difference in dynamic range between the two is minimal. If the dynamic range of the 7D was not enough, neither would be the D7100's. You would be bracketing both cameras at that point. As I said, the difference is marginal, and is only visible if you are looking hard for it. Any viewer of your photographs, and one who is purposely searching for shadow noise (and almost no one does that without prompting of some sort), will only find the difference after careful inspection.

OP, don't let these internet sensationalists with heavy biases sway your opinion. BOTH are great cameras, and the major determining factor should be which system you have lenses for.


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## sagittariansrock (Jun 3, 2014)

SoullessPolack said:


> unxpectederror said:
> 
> 
> > If your looking to shoot landscapes your looking at the completely wrong system.. I own Pro and Semi Pro DSLR from both Canon and Nikon.
> ...



Yeah, this balanced view is more usual for people who have used both systems.
Nikon and Canon are both great systems, and they trade blows in different areas. 
Having owned a 7D, I can say that ISO 1600 and above gets progressively difficult to use because of noise, and the files were inherently grainy, something I didn't notice with my 50D.


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## Hillsilly (Jun 3, 2014)

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the SL1. It's well priced and well specc'd. I know the OP doesn't like rebels, but it is a "cool" rebel and unless you're really into sports and/or wildlife or have some other special need, I don't see much point in spending money on anything else. After the rebate, you can get it for $447 with a Pixma Pro 100. Seriously, you'd go a second hand camera over that?

But if it was a choice of 50D vs 60D vs 7D, they're all fairly similar. I'd go the 60D and save some money.


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## sdsr (Jun 4, 2014)

unxpectederror said:


> If your looking to shoot landscapes your looking at the completely wrong system.. I own Pro and Semi Pro DSLR from both Canon and Nikon.
> 
> my recommendations for a camera in your price range would be a refurbished D7100. the reason for this is simple, it has more pixels and it has a much larger dynamic range then any thing canon offers. It also lacks a AA filter which allows for more detail. the dynamic range is worlds better on Nikon cameras.



Well yes (leaving aside the exaggerations), but if you're going to suggest looking "outside the box" it's worth noting that a Sony a6000 is cheaper, smaller, lighter, probably has better IQ, being mirrorless avoids the need for the tiresome AFMA routine and offers focus points over most of the sensor and, perhaps more important than any of that, you can easily (unless you need fast AF) use any Canon lenses on it -something the OP wants to do, after all, and which you can't do on a Nikon ....


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