# Canon officially announces the PowerShot G5 X Mark II and PowerShot G7 X Mark III



## Canon Rumors Guy (Jul 9, 2019)

> Press release:
> The PowerShot G7 X III and the PowerShot G5 X Mark II are the New Powerhouse Cameras for Visual Creators and Advanced Amateurs
> *MELVILLE, N.Y., July 8, 2019* – Ansel Adams, one of the greatest landscape photographers once said, “You don’t take a photograph, you make it.” Never have truer words been spoken as digital photography has evolved and storytelling is shared through multiple mediums. Providing visual storytellers more options to bring their imaginative visions to life, Canon U.S.A., Inc., a leader in digital imaging solutions, introduces the PowerShot G7 X III and the PowerShot G5 X Mark II cameras. Successors to the PowerShot G7 X II and PowerShot G5 X respectively, these new cameras usher in a plethora of new and innovative functionalities. Depending on the model, new innovative features include live-streaming available with YouTube* (via wireless connection), a pop-up electrical viewfinder (EVF) and 4K video shooting...



Continue reading...


----------



## Art-A (Jul 9, 2019)

Oh Gods!
Toy OsmoPocket shoots 4Kр60 /p50 video.
Shame - Canon!


----------



## slclick (Jul 9, 2019)

Art-A said:


> Oh Gods!
> Toy OsmoPocket shoots 4Kр60 /p50 video.
> Shame - Canon!


Is there some sort of '1st 4k whining' award people try to get around here?


----------



## Maximilian (Jul 9, 2019)

Always the same:
Canon releases something/anything and it doesn't take 3 posts till someone is complaining.

To be the first:

Canon is *******! Yet again!


----------



## mbike999 (Jul 9, 2019)

slclick said:


> Is there some sort of '1st 4k whining' award people try to get around here?


Yep, it's the prestigious "Armchair Videographer and Photographer Award"! Given to spec sheet enthusiasts the world round!


----------



## Sparky (Jul 9, 2019)

Hey! I wanted to be the first to complain..!


----------



## OremLK (Jul 9, 2019)

G5X II looks fantastic, much better than I expected. I'll definitely wait to see reviews of the new lens before buying, though.


----------



## slclick (Jul 9, 2019)

mbike999 said:


> Yep, it's the prestigious "Armchair Videographer and Photographer Award"! Given to spec sheet enthusiasts the world round!


Please leave photographers out of this mess!


----------



## Del Paso (Jul 9, 2019)

Sparky said:


> Hey! I wanted to be the first to complain..!


Sorry for you, but genuine whining trolls are faster than a lightning, no chance ever to beat them!


----------



## slclick (Jul 9, 2019)

In all seriousness, I have my eye on the G5 and the first price drops. It might be the travel camera and backup to my Canon FF bodies my M5 never was (not pocketable, still bringing the same gear and accessories, just smaller, button layout a crowded mess for large hands)


----------



## Chaitanya (Jul 9, 2019)

Wierd compromises between 2 cameras, also sony is holding back sensors for its clients.


----------



## hoodlum (Jul 9, 2019)

Chaitanya said:


> Wierd compromises between 2 cameras, also sony is holding back sensors for its clients.



These are the first non-Sony 1" cameras where Sony allowed use of their stacked sensor. I guess that means that the next RX camera (coming this month) will contain a new Sony sensor. This is likely why Canon continues with their own sensors and DPAF even if the sensor tech is behind Sony.


----------



## RayValdez360 (Jul 9, 2019)

hoodlum said:


> These are the first non-Sony 1" cameras where Sony allowed use of their stacked sensor. I guess that means that the next RX camera (coming this month) will contain a new Sony sensor. This is likely why Canon continues with their own sensors and DPAF even if the sensor tech is behind Sony.


but nikon seemed to get good sensors from them for the full frame. and the medium format sensors seem nice too.


----------



## Art-A (Jul 9, 2019)

slclick said:


> Is there some sort of '1st 4k whining' award people try to get around here?


I waited a long time for the G5X Mark II or the G7X Mark III in the hope that the camera would shoot 4Kp50/p60 video.
Any praise Canon, I regard as an excuse for the company's helplessness in the 21st century of technology!


----------



## Kit. (Jul 9, 2019)

Art-A said:


> I waited a long time for the G5X Mark II or the G7X Mark III in the hope that the camera would shoot 4Kp50/p60 video.


Why?


----------



## kaitlyn2004 (Jul 9, 2019)

Can someone confirm the differences besides I see the g5 goes to 120mm?

Also, isn't it extremely weird that they added a mic input, talk about vlogging, but have nowhere to mount a mic? No shoe or 1/4-20 at the top? Gonna have to get funky adapters/cages making the camera larger and heavier


----------



## Kit. (Jul 9, 2019)

kaitlyn2004 said:


> Can someone confirm the differences besides I see the g5 goes to 120mm?


G5 likely has better quality lens. G5 has EVF but no mic port.

The cameras are positioned differently, so I wouldn't be surprised by odd but intended differences in firmware.



kaitlyn2004 said:


> Also, isn't it extremely weird that they added a mic input, talk about vlogging, but have nowhere to mount a mic? No shoe or 1/4-20 at the top? Gonna have to get funky adapters/cages making the camera larger and heavier


There is 1/4" at the bottom, of course.


----------



## Chaitanya (Jul 9, 2019)

hoodlum said:


> These are the first non-Sony 1" cameras where Sony allowed use of their stacked sensor. I guess that means that the next RX camera (coming this month) will contain a new Sony sensor. This is likely why Canon continues with their own sensors and DPAF even if the sensor tech is behind Sony.


Both Rx100 mk V and Rx10 mk IV had sensors with on chip pdaf. These sensors look like ones from Rx100 mk IV. Even Panasonic doesnt have access to those on chip pdaf sensors from sony.


----------



## OremLK (Jul 9, 2019)

kaitlyn2004 said:


> Can someone confirm the differences besides I see the g5 goes to 120mm?
> 
> Also, isn't it extremely weird that they added a mic input, talk about vlogging, but have nowhere to mount a mic? No shoe or 1/4-20 at the top? Gonna have to get funky adapters/cages making the camera larger and heavier



What's the point of having a pocketable camera if you're just going to stick a huge boom mic on top? Plus it would block the selfie screen for vlogging use.

There are still good uses for having a mic jack. A cage fixes the problem when you don't need the pocketability. Alternatively, you could handhold a small microphone (for non-vlogging use), use a lavalier mic, or mount the mic on a separate stand in the studio.


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 9, 2019)

OremLK said:


> What's the point of having a pocketable camera if you're just going to stick a huge boom mic on top? Plus it would block the selfie screen for vlogging use.


That's probably largely responsible for why it doesn't have a hot (or cold) shoe.


----------



## MiJax (Jul 9, 2019)

I'm not terribly interested in a compact, but I like what this sensor tech means moving forward on the last couple of DSLRs and new RF bodies. Better late than never.


----------



## -pekr- (Jul 9, 2019)

MiJax said:


> I'm not terribly interested in a compact, but I like what this sensor tech means moving forward on the last couple of DSLRs and new RF bodies. Better late than never.



What? This is Sony sensor and hence imo no chance to appear in Canon's DSLR or MILC bodies? Well, otoh one never knows, maybe Canon will give up and switch to Sony sensors on all fronts ...


----------



## JuanMa (Jul 9, 2019)

The integrated EVF cracked me up, this camera will be mine.


----------



## ysyoo87 (Jul 9, 2019)

Can anyone explain for ne the major difference between g5x and g7x? Guess only evf on 5gx is main difference? Is g5x simoly superior or is there any advantage w g7x?


----------



## javisan23 (Jul 9, 2019)

I think it is clear that the G7X III is marketed for vloggers. However, if the intention is that the G5 is for people who just want to take pictures, I don't think the details released provide a clear differentiation on the "pictures" front.

Major differences between the G5 and G7 are $150, lack of mic port on G5, and lack of EVF on G7. 

I'm not a vlogger, and I'm solely interested in picture image quality. Does any one have any idea if both models will produce pictures with the same, or very very similar image quality? 

At the end, this will drive my purchase decision. If the pictures on the G5 will not be significantly better than on the G7, then I might as well buy the G7 and save $150. I don't think I will ever need the EVF, as I have been using a smartphone to take pictures exclusively for over 7 years and never once have I thought "gee, I could use an EVF".


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 9, 2019)

ysyoo87 said:


> Can anyone explain for ne the major difference between g5x and g7x? Guess only evf on 5gx is main difference? Is g5x simoly superior or is there any advantage w g7x?


They have different lenses. One is a 4.2x, the other is a 5x. There's the EVF and the mic jack too.


----------



## ysyoo87 (Jul 9, 2019)

so sum it up the difference

g7x - mic jack, no evf
g5x - evf, no mic jack, further zoom

other than the zoom range, is there a difference in the quality of the lens itself?


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 9, 2019)

ysyoo87 said:


> other than the zoom range, is there a difference in the quality of the lens itself?


We'll have to wait for reviews to know.


----------



## hoodlum (Jul 9, 2019)

ysyoo87 said:


> so sum it up the difference
> 
> g7x - mic jack, no evf, *Youtube streaming*
> g5x - evf, no mic jack, further zoom
> ...



Added one more


----------



## Kit. (Jul 9, 2019)

One of the weird differences in specs published by Canon is BT 4.2 on G7X, but BT 4.1 on G5X. Also, the flash on G5X seems to be just a little more powerful.


----------



## LensFungus (Jul 9, 2019)

RayValdez360 said:


> but nikon seemed to get good sensors from them for the full frame. and the medium format sensors seem nice too.


That was in the past. There was some content on the Sonyalpharumors page that Sony likes the idea of keeping certain high quality stuff like sensors for themselves and give it only after a certain period of time to other companies aka the competition.


----------



## hoodlum (Jul 9, 2019)

RayValdez360 said:


> but nikon seemed to get good sensors from them for the full frame. and the medium format sensors seem nice too.



The Sony A9 came out over 2 years ago with a Stacked CMOS sensor. We have not seen any other FF camera with a Stacked sensor since then, so Sony is definitely holding back on new sensor tech. The Stacked sensor allows for faster sensor readout like we are seeing now with the new Canon G5/7X. 

You will very soon see stacked FF sensor for Nikon but Sony will also release their new GS (Global Shutter) sensor in the A9ii at the same time. The same GS sensor will show up in the new RX camera coming next week. So Sony will always have a 1 gen sensor advantage.


----------



## jamesfrmphilyy (Jul 10, 2019)

javisan23 said:


> I think it is clear that the G7X III is marketed for vloggers. However, if the intention is that the G5 is for people who just want to take pictures, I don't think the details released provide a clear differentiation on the "pictures" front.
> 
> Major differences between the G5 and G7 are $150, lack of mic port on G5, and lack of EVF on G7.
> 
> ...


same sensor, same processor........


----------



## jamesfrmphilyy (Jul 10, 2019)

does anybody know about blackout ? my G7X II blacks out when i shoot high FPS.

when the III shoots high FPS will i be able to track my subject a la SONY A9 or will i be blacked out ?


----------



## slclick (Jul 10, 2019)

The G5 has touch and drag AF, which if as good as or better than the M5 will be why it''s a notch above the G7 and I would take a guess that the lens will be of a higher level, perhaps in regards to corner sharpness, distortion across the focal lengths and vignetting.Of course that's just being hopeful. However, a camera is much more than it's sensor and that seems to be all anyone is yammering about. Sounds like spec sheet warriors and not photographers. Is it that video folks are far more wrapped up in certain details than stills shooters and therefore are usually chiming in with Canon complaints? I'd hate to be in that camp.


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

javisan23 said:


> I think it is clear that the G7X III is marketed for vloggers.


That might a tough sell once they see the footage from the camera. I suppose it's a slight upgrade from the quality of the Mk II, but the Mk III footage is rather soft and unimpressive. It's a joke compared to the RX 100 VA and VI.


----------



## ysyoo87 (Jul 10, 2019)

this or a6400 just for video?


----------



## slclick (Jul 10, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> That might a tough sell once they see the footage from the camera. I suppose it's a slight upgrade from the quality of the Mk II, but the Mk III footage is rather soft and unimpressive. It's a joke compared to the RX 100 VA and VI.


Are there examples already?


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

slclick said:


> Are there examples already?


Yes, Canon Japan released some footage and several people/sites/stores who got pre-pro models posted footage from it also. I was really geeked about the G7X Mk III as an upgrade to my RX100 Mk II. Primarily for stills, but hoping to shoot a little video with it also. After seeing the video footage from the camera I just can't see giving any consideration to it as a usable video camera. I've seen sharper & better looking 720p footage.

From another thread:


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

The others:


----------



## slclick (Jul 10, 2019)

I'm so glad I don't do video, I cannot imagine looking at footage and making statements about resolution numbers like that. No thanks. There can be amazing art in stills no matter DR, sharpness or peripheral illumination (that's vignetting, kids) The photographer is the artist regardless of the camera model... in video it's more of a marriage of fine gear, editing and talent. Although I must say, getting it right in camera is becoming a lost art as well and so many articles are written these days as to how even trying is snobbery. Yes, Light Stalking, I'm talking about you.


----------



## Kit. (Jul 10, 2019)

jamesfrmphilyy said:


> same sensor, same processor........


And same photographer.

But the lens is different.


----------



## Kit. (Jul 10, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> That might a tough sell once they see the footage from the camera. I suppose it's a slight upgrade from the quality of the Mk II, but the Mk III footage is rather soft and unimpressive. It's a joke compared to the RX 100 VA and VI.


Sharpening by default is not strong enough to your taste?


----------



## max_sr (Jul 10, 2019)

OremLK said:


> What's the point of having a pocketable camera if you're just going to stick a huge boom mic on top? Plus it would block the selfie screen for vlogging use.
> 
> There are still good uses for having a mic jack. A cage fixes the problem when you don't need the pocketability. Alternatively, you could handhold a small microphone (for non-vlogging use), use a lavalier mic, or mount the mic on a separate stand in the studio.



The old G5X formfactor would have supported that with hotshoe and flip out screen. Two steps forward, one and a half steps back. Seems to be the Canon strategy for the camera department.


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

Kit. said:


> Sharpening by default is not strong enough to your taste?


Your comment seems rather strange to me. You think the footage is sharp and that my criticisms are a matter of taste? I can't see it being sharp enough for anyone's taste in their target market. Good 720p footage scaled to UHD is sharper than the "4k" footage from the new Canons. The "4k" timelapse is passable (still not where it should be though), the other clips are not.


----------



## BillB (Jul 10, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> Your comment seems rather strange to me. You think the footage is sharp and that my criticisms are a matter of taste? It can't see it being sharp enough for anyone's taste in their target market. Good 720p footage scaled to UHD is sharper than the "4k" footage from the new Canons. The "4k" timelapse is passable (still not where it should be though), the other clips are not.


Well, if you don't like the default sharpness setting, you might try adjusting the sharpness setting before you start trashing the camera on the internet.


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

BillB said:


> Well, if you don't like the default sharpness setting, you might try adjusting the sharpness setting before you start trashing the camera on the internet.


Well, I don't have the camera. I can only look at the footage Canon and the people Canon have chosen to give the pre-production cameras to have posted. If Canon isn't smart enough to put their best foot forward that's on them.


----------



## BillB (Jul 10, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> Well, I don't have the camera. I can only look at the footage Canon and the people Canon have chosen to give the pre-production cameras to have posted. If Canon isn't smart enough to put their best foot forward that's on them.


Be that as it may, you still don't know anything about whether adjusting the sharpness will improve the image to acceptable standards, your standards or anybody else's.


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

BillB said:


> Be that as it may, you still don't know anything about whether adjusting the sharpness will improve the image to acceptable standards, your standards or anybody else's.


Be that as it may, do you even know that there's an in camera adjustment for the sharpness of video footage?


----------



## javisan23 (Jul 10, 2019)

__





Frame It Right In Tricky Light with PowerShot G5 X Mark II






snapshot.canon-asia.com





If you scroll down to the *Creative Tools* section, you'll see that it appears that sharpness may be adjusted through the settings, at least for stills.


----------



## Kit. (Jul 10, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> Your comment seems rather strange to me. You think the footage is sharp and that my criticisms are a matter of taste?


I haven't seen _the footage_. You, as I guess, neither.


----------



## YuengLinger (Jul 10, 2019)

BillB said:


> Be that as it may, you still don't know anything about whether adjusting the sharpness will improve the image to acceptable standards, your standards or anybody else's.


This forum would be a ghost town if people only posted facts. Canon*RUMORS*! Commenting on what is essentially promo footage is fair enough. 

Most customers no longer have the option to go into a shop and try camera gear. Those days are long gone.


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

Kit. said:


> I haven't seen _the footage_. You, as I guess, neither.


Whats _the footage_? Is that a new movie that's coming out?


----------



## Kit. (Jul 10, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> Whats _the footage_? Is that a new movie that's coming out?


_The footage_ is the data straight out of the camera. Not auto-recompressed ABR stream from Youtube.


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

Kit. said:


> _The footage_ is the data straight out of the camera. Not auto-recompressed ABR stream from Youtube.


Yes, because YouTube only blurs up Canon footage because Sony is paying them to. Comparing it to Sony RX100 Mk VA & VI footage that's also on YouTube is not a level playing field.


----------



## Kit. (Jul 10, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> Yes, because YouTube only blurs up Canon footage because Sony is paying them to. Comparing it to Sony RX100 Mk VA & VI footage that's also on YouTube is not a level playing field.


Like this one?






Yeah, looks "sharp"... with very ugly sharpening artifacts leading to very ugly skin rendition.


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

Kit. said:


> Like this one?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Sorry, that's an auto-recompressed ABR stream from Youtube, not _the footage_. Can't comment.


----------



## Kit. (Jul 10, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> Sorry, that's an auto-recompressed ABR stream from Youtube, not _the footage_. Can't comment.


Exactly.


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

Kit. said:


> Exactly.


That loud whooshing sound you heard was the sarcasm going right over your head.

If you want to put your head in the sand and pretend that the G7X Mk III and the G5X Mk II will have good video quality be my guest, but all indications are that they don't.


----------



## stevelee (Jul 10, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> Yes, because YouTube only blurs up Canon footage because Sony is paying them to. Comparing it to Sony RX100 Mk VA & VI footage that's also on YouTube is not a level playing field.


I've never sent any Sony footage to YouTube, so I can't compare. But I do know how my YouTube postings look compared to the video I sent them. YouTube is a very handy way to post video, and handy to recipients since they adjust the resolution choice to fit the transmission speed. But it is a terrible way to demonstrate video quality. 4K video even coming into my 300mbs internet feed is not anywhere near the quality of 720p video played directly on my computer.

I doubt there is a default YouTube setting of "let's crap this up because it was shot on a Canon."


----------



## javisan23 (Jul 10, 2019)

The video quality shown on the B&H Photo video on YouTube yesterday looked terrible. My iPhone performs better than that. 

However, the 4K video and stills taken on the G5X on the YouTube video below (foreign language) looks good in my opinion. At least good enough for my taste.


----------



## Kit. (Jul 10, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> That loud whooshing sound you heard was the sarcasm going right over your head.
> 
> If you want to put your head in the sand and pretend that the G7X Mk III and the G5X Mk II will have good video quality be my guest, but all indications are that they don't.


So, you cannot show RX100 4K streams _without_ ugly oversharpening artifacts when viewed on the actual 4K monitor?


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

Kit. said:


> So, you cannot show RX100 4K streams _without_ ugly oversharpening artifacts when viewed on the actual 4K monitor?


I can't? I didn't realize there was a challenge afoot.

The Dpreview video still test target doesn't show that the RX100 is oversharpening 4K video.


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

stevelee said:


> ...But it is a terrible way to demonstrate video quality. 4K video even coming into my 300mbs internet feed is not anywhere near the quality of 720p video played directly on my computer.


What 720p video do you have that looks better than good 300mbit/sec HEVC encoded "4K" (UHD)? This I have got to see.


----------



## stevelee (Jul 10, 2019)

The preview videos are helpful to my thinking about what I might want to get, if any. Right now I'm in the process of going through the 950+ pictures I made recently in Denmark and Sweden with my G7X II. The results are so pleasing that I must consider whether there are any reasons to upgrade this camera for my purposes. So far I've shot 6,370 pictures with the camera, and have had very few moments where I wished it had or did something different. For travel, the 24mm equivalent is not quite wide enough for everything, so I do take some shots intended to be stitched together. That works well enough that I prefer it to using the panorama mode on my iPhone, which does work rather well for some types of shots, say a 180º pan of a town square. I see that on the trip I shot exactly one video. Outside the modern art museum in Stockholm there is a fountain that is part of the exhibit of fanciful sculptures. I shot 28 seconds of 1080p at 29.whatever fps. It looks great. I'll probably run it through Compressor and embed it on the web page for that part of the trip, maybe at 720p, perhaps with a link to the original.

So with these cameras coming out in August and with my leaving for another European jaunt in October, several considerations come to mind: Do I buy anything before October, or content myself with the II for that trip? If so, do I get the new 5 or the 7? (I've already looked at the competing Sonys and decided they did not suit my purposes, especially the new model with the longer and much slower lens.) My annual video project comes up in June, so video considerations will suggest a spring purchase, maybe when there might be some attractive prices. The 4K will be nice for editing purposes. My iMac and FCP X have no trouble at all dealing with that, and the extra resolution can come in handy for cropping, etc.

I watched the Czech preview above in full screen on my 5K iMac, and it didn't look bad at all.

So briefly, there is the G5X II. Is it really close enough in size to the G7X that it would be handy enough? The latter fits my pants or jacket pockets just fine. Would I use the flip up viewfinder? In October, 2016, I shot a Blue Angels practice show in Pensacola. I couldn't see a thing in the screen in the bright sun, so I just aimed the camera in the general direction of the planes, and it turned out pretty well. I was more intent on seeing it in person than in shooting video anyway. Maybe with the viewfinder, I'd have looked through it and missed seeing the show. I can't really think of anything since then where the viewfinder might have helped. But then I don't shoot a lot of video anyway. The slightly longer lens might be nice, especially since it seems to be as fast as the G7X II. If reviews suggest that it is an even better lens, that could be enough to steer me to the 5.

As for the G7X III, it still is minutely smaller, and so a bit handier. Vlogging or live YouTube feeds are not considerations of mine. I don't miss having a mike jack. My annual video project involves pick-up basketball games, so the audio consists of squeaks from the shoes and bounces of the ball. No one cares about the audio fidelity. The in-camera mike did fine on the video in a review above.

I've never in my life shot 24fps video, so I'm very unlikely to miss that in either camera. I think several cameras that I own can do that anyway, if the urge ever strikes me. I guess I shot 18fps on Super-8 back in my youth.

So maybe for me it comes down to if and when 4K capability will be useful to have, and whether the new lens on the G5X II has an improvement in image quality.


----------



## stevelee (Jul 10, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> What 720p video do you have that looks better than good 300mbit/sec HEVC encoded "4K" (UHD)? This I have got to see.


i wouldn't call video that has been mangled through YouTube's processes to be "good 300mbit/sec HEVC encoded "4K" (UHD)." And just because I have that maximum internet speed coming into the house does not mean that is the bitrate I get from YouTube. Even in theory, is typical 4K streaming providing as much information as local 720p? I don't know. I do know that OTA 1080i or 720p (comparable information) can look really good on my TV compared to the more compressed cable feed of the same local channels. 1080p Blu-Ray discs look better than either, but I don't know how their compression levels compare. Maybe you can help me with some of the figures and the math.


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

I have a trip overseas in the fall and I was really hoping the G7X MkIII would be the camera upgrade I was after, but $750 or $900 (G5X MkII) for a camera that looks to have very weak video capability is a really tough sell in my mind. Maybe I should just get a cheap closeout G7X MkII or just use the RX100 MkII (I already have) and not worry about video, or hope Sony rolls out an interesting RX100 MkVII shortly.


----------



## OremLK (Jul 10, 2019)

max_sr said:


> The old G5X formfactor would have supported that with hotshoe and flip out screen. Two steps forward, one and a half steps back. Seems to be the Canon strategy for the camera department.



I actually prefer it in this form factor. I don't like fully articulating screens, they're more awkward to use and increase the profile of the camera. I just want to be able to tilt the screen.



Stereodude said:


> That loud whooshing sound you heard was the sarcasm going right over your head.
> 
> If you want to put your head in the sand and pretend that the G7X Mk III and the G5X Mk II will have good video quality be my guest, but all indications are that they don't.



I'm sure the uncropped 4k coming off the full width of the Sony sensor will be fine. On a camera like this, it doesn't have to be high-end production-quality footage, it just has to be good enough for non-professional YouTubers and such.


----------



## stevelee (Jul 10, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> I have a trip overseas in the fall and I was really hoping the G7X MkIII would be the camera upgrade I was after, but $750 or $900 (G5X MkII) for a camera that looks to have very weak video capability is a really tough sell in my mind. Maybe I should just get a cheap closeout G7X MkII or just use the RX100 MkII (I already have) and not worry about video, or hope Sony rolls out an interesting RX100 MkVII shortly.


If I were primarily concerned with shooting video, or even substantially so, I don't know what I would buy. My priorities are obviously quite different from yours.

FWIW, just in case you find it helpful to see, I've uploaded the original out-of-camera fountain video I shot in Stockholm: original video.


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 10, 2019)

stevelee said:


> i wouldn't call video that has been mangled through YouTube's processes to be "good 300mbit/sec HEVC encoded "4K" (UHD)." And just because I have that maximum internet speed coming into the house does not mean that is the bitrate I get from YouTube. Even in theory, is typical 4K streaming providing as much information as local 720p? I don't know. I do know that OTA 1080i or 720p (comparable information) can look really good on my TV compared to the more compressed cable feed of the same local channels. 1080p Blu-Ray discs look better than either, but I don't know how their compression levels compare. Maybe you can help me with some of the figures and the math.


I didn't realize you were limiting your comment to YouTube when referencing 300mbit 4K content. 100mbit/sec HEVC can look fantastic. UHD Blu-ray demonstrates this easily.

ATSC OTA HDTV is no more than ~20mbit/sec MPEG-2. Usually less these days because all the stations want to have 2 or more SD sub channels that take bitrate away from the main HD channel. You can get visually similar quality to OTA HD with AVC/H.264 with 5-6mbit/sec. Blu-ray is a big step up from ATSC OTA HDTV as it should be given the codecs and bitrates.



OremLK said:


> I'm sure the uncropped 4k coming off the full width of the Sony sensor will be fine. On a camera like this, it doesn't have to be high-end production-quality footage, it just has to be good enough for non-professional YouTubers and such.


Fine for what though? I think people might notice that their phone shoots better looking "4k" video. If you lower the bar far enough you'll inevitably fall into the "I'm just going to use my phone" to vlog camp. That works fine too.



stevelee said:


> If I were primarily concerned with shooting video, or even substantially so, I don't know what I would buy. My priorities are obviously quite different from yours.


I've always been a stills shooter when travelling. I'd like to expand into shooting some video, but I'm not going to do it if doesn't look good and 2 cameras or a camera and a camcorder isn't happening.



> FWIW, just in case you find it helpful to see, I've uploaded the original out-of-camera fountain video I shot in Stockholm: original video.


I'll check it out.


----------



## OremLK (Jul 10, 2019)

Why on earth would you assume that the footage will look worse than smartphone footage? On the basis of one YouTube video shot on non-final firmware using god-knows what settings?


----------



## stevelee (Jul 10, 2019)

I maintain a disc subscription with Netflix rather than watching the same content by streaming because of the superior picture and discrete 5.1 surround sound. That is in spite of the fact that I watch a 46" 1080p set from 12 or so feet away, which suggests that I shouldn't be able to see that much difference.

My real OTA comparison was with the cable transmission of the same channel, suggesting that compression can make a visible difference, which should be no surprise.

I shoot video to include an occasional short clip on a relevant web page. I find the G7X II to be more than adequate for that purpose. My basketball pick-up footage is posted on YouTube because my audience doesn't care about the quality of the video. They are just thankful to see how the incoming freshmen play, how the returning players look, and to watch the pros who are home from Europe, and see how all of them interact. Occasionally others will wander in. The Curry brothers played one night a few years back when Steph was already a pro and Seth was still at Duke. Last summer, several of the Hornets played one night. It is really good for the younger guys to face stronger competition that they will see from almost all of the college players they will face in the regular season. I got nothing but thanks from fans around the country even when I was shooting just 640x480. It bugs me that I can't adequately color correct the wonky arena lighting. One year I tried shooting a white piece of paper to set a custom white balance. That did no better than my tinkering in FCP X. But that's just me.


----------



## blackcoffee17 (Jul 10, 2019)

No mic jack on the G5 X? Typical Canon. So one has to choose between longer and probably better lens and EVF or mic jack for better audio. NIce.


----------



## jamesfrmphilyy (Jul 11, 2019)

ysyoo87 said:


> other than the zoom range, is there a difference in the quality of the lens itself?


no.....


----------



## stevelee (Jul 11, 2019)

jamesfrmphilyy said:


> no.....


Do you have anything to base that on? You've used both cameras? You've read detailed reviews with tests that lead to that conclusion?

Perhaps that's true, and maybe even the way to bet, but does anyone outside of Canon have real data to show it?


----------



## jamesfrmphilyy (Jul 11, 2019)

stevelee said:


> Do you have anything to base that on?


nope.


----------



## slclick (Jul 11, 2019)

jamesfrmphilyy said:


> nope.


Then why say it? Because you are positive Canon will disappoint you again? Seriously, just don't reply.


----------



## neuroanatomist (Jul 11, 2019)

slclick said:


> Then why say it? Because you are positive Canon will disappoint you again? Seriously, just don't reply.


‘Round these parts, we calls them trolls.


----------



## slclick (Jul 11, 2019)

blackcoffee17 said:


> No mic jack on the G5 X? Typical Canon. So one has to choose between longer and probably better lens and EVF or mic jack for better audio. NIce.


Isn't every camera/body purchase that way? Nothing new here and why are you surprised? I do not expect to live long enough to see anyone make the perfect camera for just ME.


----------



## jamesfrmphilyy (Jul 11, 2019)

neuroanatomist said:


> ‘Round these parts, we calls them trolls.


FWIW - I been buying and using canon for about 30 years. I kinda know the drill.
IMO - you folk are way too deep in your feelings over a $1k camera.

exhale......peace


----------



## neuroanatomist (Jul 11, 2019)

jamesfrmphilyy said:


> FWIW - I been buying and using canon for about 30 years. I kinda know the drill.
> IMO - you folk are way too deep in your feelings over a $1k camera.
> 
> exhale......peace


Personally, I couldn’t care less about the G-series, but if your ‘drill’ is responding to questions with answers for which you have no factual basis, you’re trolling. Your use of Canon gear doesn’t preclude that.


----------



## Kit. (Jul 11, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> I can't? I didn't realize there was a challenge afoot.
> 
> The Dpreview video still test target doesn't show that the RX100 is oversharpening 4K video.


Are you vision-challenged or do you believe those white-halos-around-dark-halos are all-natural?


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 11, 2019)

Kit. said:


> Are you vision-challenged or do you believe those white-halos-around-dark-halos are all-natural?
> 
> View attachment 185610


No, I'm not vision challenged.

Can you give me an example of a camera that that has clean 4k output without "sharpening"? What's your benchmark/reference for doing it right? They all have some visual artifacts. I haven't seen one that looks perfect yet. Most are worse than the RX 100 VA and VI.


----------



## blackcoffee17 (Jul 11, 2019)

slclick said:


> Isn't every camera/body purchase that way? Nothing new here and why are you surprised? I do not expect to live long enough to see anyone make the perfect camera for just ME.



Yes, but this is idiotic. There is no reason why the G5 cannot have a mic jack, other than product segmentation of the bad kind. The camera already costs more than the G7 so why remove that? 

So again there is not a single Canon compact with EVF and mic jack but we have two cameras close to $1000.


----------



## PVCC (Jul 12, 2019)

Two things I really don't like of the new G7X III (and G5X II):

1- No 24p at any resolution
2- *No .MP4 file format option*, only .MOV instead (why Canon?! Update your mind alongside the hardware!)

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but a brand new camera "aimed to vloggers" which *does not record in .MP4 video format???*
w** ...!!


----------



## javisan23 (Jul 12, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Two things I really don't like of the new G7X III (and G5X II):
> 
> 1- No 24p at any resolution
> 2- *No .MP4 file format option*, only .MOV instead (why Canon?! Update your mind alongside the hardware!)
> ...



Where are you seeing that? The official specs lists MP4. 



https://downloads.canon.com/nw/camera/products/powershot/g7-x-mark-iii/specifications/powershot-g7-x-mark-iii-specifications-sheet.pdf


----------



## PVCC (Jul 12, 2019)

javisan23 said:


> Where are you seeing that? The official specs lists MP4.
> 
> 
> 
> https://downloads.canon.com/nw/camera/products/powershot/g7-x-mark-iii/specifications/powershot-g7-x-mark-iii-specifications-sheet.pdf



Oh, wonderful!!

An european Canon site only listed .mov files!


----------



## Sergio Smorovoz (Jul 12, 2019)

Colleagues, I am lonely noticed that the Canon G7X MIII does not have DPAF (Dual Pixel AF)? Maybe this is not a problem for you at all?


----------



## javisan23 (Jul 12, 2019)

Sergio Smorovoz said:


> Colleagues, I am lonely noticed that the Canon G7X MIII does not have DPAF (Dual Pixel AF)? Maybe this is not a problem for you at all?



That is correct. Neither does the G5X mark II. 

Not sure if it has been mentioned here, but on other sites many people are fuming. This will be the largest CON on both camera models. However, given the price difference between this and the RX100s, many people might look over it.


----------



## slclick (Jul 12, 2019)

This is the most furor over point and shoots since the dawn of photography!


----------



## stevelee (Jul 12, 2019)

Sergio Smorovoz said:


> Colleagues, I am lonely noticed that the Canon G7X MIII does not have DPAF (Dual Pixel AF)? Maybe this is not a problem for you at all?


I've never had a focus problem with the G7X II, so I doubt it would bother me with the III. While in terms of field of view, the lens is "equivalent" to 24mm to 100mm, optically, the lens is still 8.8-36.8mm, so depth of field is going to be rather deep even at the long end and wide open. At the short end, everything from 4 feet to ∞ is going to be in focus wide open. 

If you're one of the photographers who like portraits where one eye is in focus and the other eye, nose, and ears are blurry, this is not the camera for you.


----------



## Sergio Smorovoz (Jul 14, 2019)

stevelee said:


> If you're one of the photographers who like portraits where one eye is in focus and the other eye, nose, and ears are blurry, this is not the camera for you.


I use 5D MIV + 135 f/2L for photography. 
DPAF (Dual Pixel AF) is necessary for video.


----------



## stevelee (Jul 14, 2019)

Sergio Smorovoz said:


> I use 5D MIV + 135 f/2L for photography.
> DPAF (Dual Pixel AF) is necessary for video.


Most of the video I shoot with the G7X II is done with manual focus. The lens has enough depth of field at middle distances that I can just set the focus on the hyperlocal distance or in the middle of the range where the action will be, and everything is clear (and there is no danger of focus hunting during the action). For example, when shooting basketball pick-up games from the stands, I just prefocus on the rim, and everything will be clear. 

And, no, I wouldn't (and couldn't) do that on a FF camera with a 135mm lens at f/2. Optically the zoom level I'm using is really about 15 or 18mm for the basketball, so very different optically, even if the field of view is like 40 or 50mm would be on a FF.


----------



## PVCC (Jul 15, 2019)

Sergio Smorovoz said:


> Colleagues, I am lonely noticed that the Canon G7X MIII does not have DPAF (Dual Pixel AF)? Maybe this is not a problem for you at all?



Yes, you're right. I also noticed it.

The DPAF is the best way for video, smooth puuling focus without "hunt".

The Previews posted around told the Contrast Detection does a great job, but don't specify if that's also so good for video...

Will have to wait and see.
If you do video manually with a 5D + 135 f/2 you're a hero (unless you use a large external monitor with Peaking enabled)!

I own a Panasonic G7 (and I think it has contrast detection AF) and do great job pulling focus with Panasonic lenses.

So I expect the G7X III will perform fine.

BTW, checking prices I don't see that much difference vs. the RX100's, especially the Mark 4, so I don't think it is really a decision point.

In Europe the G7X III will probably cost nearer the RX100 VA which is a great camera (short zoom though), so less difference there too.

PS: I was checking many cameras IQs at a comparison page at DPREVIEW.com where you can select up to 4 to compare at same time.
Great tool!!!
Although you must take into account the Lens used (indicated hovering the "i" on each camera's image) for each to get a fair idea.

I love my G7, it offers Parking, Zebras, and lot of advanced features that I still discovered lately. Amazing how Panasonic implemented so much for the MFT vs . Cannon for so expensive EOS DSLRs... (5D4 for instance)
It's really a shame Canon don't do it over so many years of requests (due to "protect EOS Cinema cameras or a "around" mind of CEOs..., or both, cause Sony and Panasonic do since several years on all cameras, and they also have Cine/Video cams..As result of that unbelievable "crippling" result on Magic Lantern (and previously CHDK) started to develope.
But even so amazing efforts and achievements, it's always better and handier to officially have the features in-camera...
Sad by that Canon's SO conservative way of thinking, discarding so many customers requests..

We still have to unofficially "REMAP" Hot/Dead Pixels (and not always work) on Canons!! That's unbelievable in decades of digital cameras.
(My Panasonic G7 offers a specific feature in the menu, never had a bad pixel...)


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 29, 2019)

PVCC said:


> So I expect the G7X III will perform fine.


It's not looking all that promising.

Overheating:





questionable AF performance:





Edit:
Scratch that, it has pretty bad AF performance:


----------



## stevelee (Jul 29, 2019)

Be sure to send $18 plus $3 for postage and handling to Count Floyd.


----------



## PVCC (Jul 30, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> It's not looking all that promising.
> 
> Overheating:
> 
> ...



Hi!!

Thanks a lot for the links, very helpful to know!

I'm not vlogger, so the standard AF with the ability to touch the screen to focus a subject will work fine for me.

*Related to overheating*: I didn't understand clearly enough.

With G7X III (in specs) you can record up to 10 minutes in 4K (which I will probably never do so long continuously)

My spoken English is not so good, so I couldn't understand *HOW MUCH you can record 4K in real world until you get STOPPED by overheating?*

It will also depends on ambient temperature, and especially if you were using the camera several minutes before for other purposes (Stills or FullHD video), right?
(As happens with lot of cameras without "active" cooling)

I suppose that filming in FullHD and taking Stills will not heat up the G7X III camera so much, since 4K processing is lot more demanding.

*I'll really appreciate clarifications on the overheating matter*, which is the most important in my case. 

PS: The other they while shooting with my Panasonic G7 I found myself using the EVF much easier than the LCD, something I'll miss on the G7X III, but I suspect the IQ of the 24-100mm zoom on the G7X III is better than longer one on G5X II (only suspect, optical rule) and I can't spend so much in a pocketable camera, probably with smaller EVF than my G7 (wich is already small), and without Mic in..

Thank you!!


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 30, 2019)

PVCC said:


> I'm not vlogger, so the standard AF with the ability to touch the screen to focus a subject will work fine for me.


I'm not sure that it actually works. It failed miserably in the tests (3rd video). You could see it hunting for focus on a static shot with nothing moving in the frame.



> *Related to overheating*: I didn't understand clearly enough.
> 
> With G7X III (in specs) you can record up to 10 minutes in 4K (which I will probably never do so long continuously)
> 
> ...


I'm not exactly sure. According to her comments Amy had the camera overheat shooting a mix of 1080p50 and 2160p25. She didn't say how much recording she had done over what length of time. I expect it's very dependent on ambient temperature, if you're in sunlight, etc. and if you're shooting back to back clips. Based on what I've seen in the first reviews and the samples posted by owners I'd be thinking long and hard before I bought a G7X Mk III with the intention of shooting video with it. It doesn't seem to do very well at it.


----------



## stevelee (Jul 30, 2019)

I couldn't get the overheating one to play, just the Dr. Tongue ones.


----------



## PVCC (Jul 30, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> I'm not sure that it actually works. It failed miserably in the tests (3rd video). You could see it hunting for focus on a static shot with nothing moving in the frame.
> 
> 
> I'm not exactly sure. According to her comments Amy had the camera overheat shooting a mix of 1080p50 and 2160p25. She didn't say how much recording she had done over what length of time. I expect it's very dependent on ambient temperature, if you're in sunlight, etc. and if you're shooting back to back clips. Based on what I've seen in the first reviews and the samples posted by owners I'd be thinking long and hard before I bought a G7X Mk III with the intention of shooting video with it. It doesn't seem to do very well at it.



Thank you very much for your comments!! Much appreciated!

I couldn't understand very well what Amy said. You're clarifications help me a lot 

About the "Auto focus problem", I think there are two factors playing here:

1- in the last review, he said he set AF to "Face detection" (something that lot of people like, and will use, but not me)
2- He, and Amy, were holding the camera very close when walking (I don't know at what focal length) That may be a cause for AF hunting or out of focus if it was reaching the minimum focus distance.

- Gordon's video didn't have that problem at all when he was walking handholding it, he probably held the camera with his arms fully extended.
Although on his specific Face AF test the Sony is a mile away ahead, no doubt Sony is leader in this point (I still remember the spot of A7r IV).

Sony is improving some features much faster than Canon indeed. In fact it's the king of mirrorless cameras, sensors and auto focus processing technology.

Cheers!


----------



## PVCC (Jul 30, 2019)

Does anyone know if you can output to external HDMI monitor WHILE recording video at FullHD and 4K and have the LCD Touchscreen enabled at same time?

So you could tap the LCD screen to focus then frame and check everything in external larger monitor

That would be VERY useful...

Thanks!


----------



## Stereodude (Jul 30, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Thank you very much for your comments!! Much appreciated!
> 
> I couldn't understand very well what Amy said. You're clarifications help me a lot
> 
> ...


You can see it hunting in Gordon's VLOG test video too, just not to the same extent as the problems are demonstrated in the others. What AF mode are you planning to use?

From watching other videos on YouTube they are definitely not too close (closer than the minimum focus distance).

Here's a close focus comparison of the G7X III, G5X II, & RX100 VII (at 7:55) where you can see how close they can focus:


----------



## PVCC (Jul 30, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> You can see it hunting in Gordon's VLOG test video too, just not to the same extent as the problems are demonstrated in the others. What AF mode are you planning to use?
> 
> From watching other videos on YouTube they are definitely not too close (closer than the minimum focus distance).
> 
> Here's a close focus comparison of the G7X III, G5X II, & RX100 VII (at 7:55) where you can see how close they can focus:



Hey,

Thanks!

I always use Small square area AF mode (contrast detection in this case, since it doesn't have DualPixelAF technology), to touch the subject and focus (or even hal-release the shutter to focus). I almost never use Face Detection (maybe I'd do if I had a Sony).

When using to pull focus, from one subject to another, I touch over them alternatively.

It seems the G7X III's AF is not good enough for face detection, according to these previews.

But I really don't think it'll be so bad in contrast area mode, even less if you can disable AF Servo (which I usually do to avoid "hunting")

Thanks once again, comments are always welcome and helpful!


----------



## powershot2012 (Aug 1, 2019)

And the comes the RX100 VII and soon to be announced VIIA...

AF is one of the most important things in a camera and looks like both of the Canon’s are yesterday’s technology.

For as long as both of these cameras were developed, there is no excuse why they are not more advanced with DPAF.


----------



## Stereodude (Aug 2, 2019)

powershot2012 said:


> And the comes the RX100 VII and soon to be announced VIIA...


VIIA? Why would there be an A version of the VII that's going to be announced soon when the VII isn't shipping yet? Do you mean another update to the V? Like a VB?



> For as long as both of these cameras were developed, there is no excuse why they are not more advanced with DPAF.


Sure there is. Some possibilities:

1) Sony wouldn't sell them a 1" sensor with DPAF
2) Sony wanted too much money for a 1" sensor with DPAF
3) Canon didn't want to develop their own 20MP 1" sensor with DPAF
4) Canon didn't want to give the new Powershot G series cameras that good of AF to protect other models in their camera lineup from cannibalization.

I'm not saying they're necessarily good excuses, but there are definitely excuses.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 2, 2019)

The RX100 VA was really an exceptional unusual upgrade made by Sony to the RX 100 V, but not likely to happen often. Furthermore, it wasn't officially announced as a new model, it was very quietly.

The AF on the G7X III is "old", completely agree. No excuses to Canon.

The "problem" is probably Canon used a Sony sensor which doesn't have DualPixelAF technology, so Canon could only offer contrast detection + some kind of image processing in real time to offer face detection and servo.

Canon is running behind Sony in many areas, sensors and AF technology, no doubt.

Fortunately to me, I barely use Servo and almost never Face detection (at least so far).

EXTERNAL Monitor: I think G7X III will not display on external monitor WHILE recording video.. that's something *I'll really miss* due to the advantages it would mean (AF Touchscreen, and better/larger image framing).
Hope I'm wrong!! But I didn't find anybody testing that, nor the User Manual...


----------



## Stereodude (Aug 2, 2019)

Canon has 1" 4K sensors with DPAF in their video cameras. I think they're making them in house. Ironically the Sony 1" sensor video cameras lack DPAF.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 2, 2019)

I don’t recall ever having a focus problem with my G7X II so I have trouble understanding the obsession with advanced focusing techniques in a camera with a lens that zooms between 8mm and 37ish. The worst case depth of field is at 37mm and f/2.8. Agonizing over focusing on left eye vs. right eye strains the laws of optics.

I will admit that I have managed to make some out-of-focus shots with the camera. A few weeks ago in Stockholm I rode in a glass ride on a rainy day to the top of the Skyview globe. I wasn’t paying attention to shooting pictures, but just enjoying the ride and the view. So I left the autofocus on. The camera focused beautifully on the raindrops on the glass rather than on the buildings below. Paying attention, I would have set manual focus on infinity, or at least anything beyond hyperfocal distance. I fail to see how I can blame the little camera for that.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 2, 2019)

Also I should have put the camera nearer the glass. The little lenses formed by the drops would have degraded the image, but I would likely have got something usable.

And I probably shouldn’t have confused the issue by bringing this up, even in a moment of full disclosure. It distracts from my point about the optics of the focal lengths and apertures involved with this camera and its successor.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 2, 2019)

QUESTION:

Does anyone know if you can manually focus WHILE recording video using the ring around the lens?

Because that would be very important to me and I never had a GxX before.

I'm planning to make my own detachable "EVF" attaching an optical element to the LCD screen. I already made s for DSLRs and it's great to see larger frame, and in sunlight when otherwise you can barely see the screen.

Cheers


----------



## neuroanatomist (Aug 2, 2019)

PVCC said:


> I'm planning to make my own detachable "EVF" attaching an optical element to the LCD screen. I already made s for DSLRs and it's great to see larger frame, and in sunlight when otherwise you can barely see the screen.


Or you could buy a Hoodman Loupe...


----------



## stevelee (Aug 2, 2019)

PVCC said:


> QUESTION:
> 
> Does anyone know if you can manually focus WHILE recording video using the ring around the lens?
> 
> Because that would be very important to me and I never had a GxX before.



I have no idea, and I can't tell from the manual. It just tells how to lock the focus to what you have set manually rather than letting autofocus take over automatically during the video.

Because of the depth of field, manual focus is tricky using just the screen. You need to magnify the image or use focus peaking. Unless you use a tripod, twisting the ring is likely to jiggle the camera too much for video, since the camera has so little mass. Maybe with practice one could master the technique. Normally you would focus using the little wheel on the back, so that would jiggle the camera less. The front ring can control zooming. Smooth zooms during videos take some practice, too.

I've used manual focus just as a set-and-forget video setting when shooting things more than 20 feet away. I focus on something near the middle of the range I want in focus, knowing that everything else will be covered by the DOF. If things are 50 feet away or more, I know the hyperlocal distance will take care of it, so I focus somewhere about there. For closeups, the autofocus is more than adequate. You are never going to get the effect you can get with an 85mm f/1.2 on FF.

I'm trying to imagine what effect I might would want to get by refocusing during shooting video with this camera. No real-life-for-me scenario comes to mind, since if I wanted selective focus in video, I'd use my DSLR, and in traveling with just the little camera, I can't think of anything I'd want to do like that.

But say that I did. If I can't refocus during shooting, I know that the camera can. So, say, I wanted to have the shot begin with the background in focus and then go to focus upon a nearby subject, I'd manually focus on the background and then let autofocus take over and focus on the subject.

For other situations, face detection, servo autofocus, and one-touch autofocus should suffice. It may be a matter of thinking through what you want to do and accomplishing it the way the camera wants to do it rather than trying to make the camera do it your way.

Sorry I can't give you a real answer. I did try looking in the manual. The nature of the camera is such that even if it works, it could be tricky to pull off in a useful fashion. It probably says something that in using the camera for almost three years, it has never occurred to me to try to do something like that. Given the nature of the beasties, I would think this would not change from the II to the III.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 2, 2019)

neuroanatomist said:


> Or you could buy a Hoodman Loupe...



Mine is much better


----------



## PVCC (Aug 2, 2019)

stevelee said:


> I have no idea, and I can't tell from the manual. It just tells how to lock the focus to what you have set manually rather than letting autofocus take over automatically during the video.
> 
> Because of the depth of field, manual focus is tricky using just the screen. You need to magnify the image or use focus peaking. Unless you use a tripod, twisting the ring is likely to jiggle the camera too much for video, since the camera has so little mass. Maybe with practice one could master the technique. Normally you would focus using the little wheel on the back, so that would jiggle the camera less. The front ring can control zooming. Smooth zooms during videos take some practice, too.
> 
> ...



Hey,

Thanks for the time to reply. Much appreciated.

I got a bit confused.

Yes, the one-touch AF is what I usually do to refocus, but if I cover the screen with a "loupe" device I'll have to manage with rings and buttons.

Besides the shacking problem, which I understand, you can manually focus with the rear wheel, right?

- I did understand you can zoom in/out with the ring around the lens, but I didn't clearly understand if you can use ttat ring to manual focus?

Also, on the G7X III Canon removed the switch, so the lens ring is always "clicky", right? (Why Canon removes things that are good... seems "expert" to make people upset)

Thanks!


----------



## stevelee (Aug 2, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Yes, the one-touch AF is what I usually do to refocus, but if I cover the screen with a "loupe" device I'll have to manage with rings and buttons.
> 
> Besides the shacking problem, which I understand, you can manually focus with the rear wheel, right?
> 
> ...



The small wheel is the default way to focus manually. You can set the front ring to control most things, including focus. If it is always clicky, I can't see the utility in using it to focus. Clicking makes sense for zooming, since it normally zooms in discrete steps. The zoom lever on top is quick and clumsy, so handy for stills and virtually useless while shooting video. In some modes, the ring defaults to controlling ISO. In M mode, the ring sets the aperture, and the dial sets the shutter speed. The camera allows a lot of customization for buttons and wheels. The camera is capable of doing all sorts of things that I would never use it for, unless I were stranded on a desert island with it and without a computer or another camera. And, of course, I had a way to charge the battery and an unlimited supply of memory cards.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 2, 2019)

stevelee said:


> The small wheel is the default way to focus manually. You can set the front ring to control most things, including focus. If it is always clicky, I can't see the utility in using it to focus. Clicking makes sense for zooming, since it normally zooms in discrete steps. The zoom lever on top is quick and clumsy, so handy for stills and virtually useless while shooting video. In some modes, the ring defaults to controlling ISO. In M mode, the ring sets the aperture, and the dial sets the shutter speed. The camera allows a lot of customization for buttons and wheels. The camera is capable of doing all sorts of things that I would never use it for, unless I were stranded on a desert island with it and without a computer or another camera. And, of course, I had a way to charge the battery and an unlimited supply of memory cards.



Haha, thanks a lot. Now I got it.

Makes me more upset that Canon removed the unclick switch for the ring... :$#!&

With the lonely island you made me remember a foldable solar panel I purchased to charge smartphones (very good under summer sunlight indeed, works like a wall outlet), so that would be not a problem since the G7X III can be charged by USB (good one for that)
Problem remains on enough stock of memory cards lol 

Thanks a lot once again!


----------



## Stereodude (Aug 13, 2019)

This one made me laugh.






It's noticeably worse than every other camera he compared it to, but "it's not that bad"??? Exactly how much worse does it need to be to qualify as "that bad"?


----------



## stevelee (Aug 13, 2019)

None of these demos tell me anything useful, other than bringing back nostalgia for SCTV. 

My recent ratio suggests that I shoot one video for every 900 stills with the II. I did use autofocus for that 28-second video of a fountain at a modern art museum. I reduced it to 540p for embedding on a web page. http://www.stevelee.name/scandinavia2019/sweden/stockholm2/MVI_6362.mp4 

Normally I use manual focus for video, especially with that camera, given its significant depth of field in decent light. The exception would be the kind of quick travel clip like the above linked one. Any camera that can't focus on that, I would consider to be defective.

What I need are tests for autofocus in still shots that demonstrate some deficiency or difficulty that might exceed what I experience with the II.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 13, 2019)

EDIT: The last minute telling that tapping the screen AF almost instantly, and the conclusion of the above review exactly tells what I wrote before this edit.
Good one for this guy, even comparing so different cameras, but concrete on the point to clear the silly AF buzz.
___

I honestly think most of these "reviews" (I can't consider all of them as that) are not really serious or well made. They're making lot of silly buzz about the AF...

I am very demanding with Canon and very critic on many of their decisions, but I know they're not stupid (at least on basic things like that)

The G7X III will focus without problem for stills and video in one-touch AF mode. Older cameras already do.

On continuous or servo or face detection mode, well, it will depend on subject, light, etc.

It will NOT compare to Sony RX 100 VA and above.

But for this camera I don't expect the AF performance if a DSLR or A7r IV in any way.

For those who really need AF performance, then Sony RX 100 VA and above will probably be a better choice (remember that not all of them have Touchscreen)

For me, Manual focus on video + one-touch AF (tapping the zone on the screen) for Stills and Video is perfectly enough for this pocketable camera.

And the IQ of full res images seems to be quite good, something that I do care a lot.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 13, 2019)

stevelee said:


> What I need are tests for autofocus in still shots that demonstrate some deficiency or difficulty that might exceed what I experience with the II.



What EXACT AF problem (and the corresponding settings and modes) are you experiencing with the G7X II?
I didn't understand
Thanks!


----------



## Stereodude (Aug 13, 2019)

PVCC said:


> I honestly think most of these "reviews" (I can't consider all of them as that) are not really serious or well made. They're making lot of silly buzz about the AF...


I disagree. It's not silly buzz. The AF in video is substandard compared to other cameras in the same class. It would have been in the bottom tier 4 years ago and the rest of the field has improved substantially. The poor AF performance is immediately obvious when you watch any footage shot with it unless it was specifically edited to hide it or shot not relying on AF.



> I am very demanding with Canon and very critic on many of their decisions, but I know they're not stupid (at least on basic things like that)


I don't think most buyers are going to share your sentiments if they care about video performance.

Edit: Why would someone be buying a III if they don't care about video? They can probably get the same stills performance from the II for less money.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 13, 2019)

PVCC said:


> What EXACT AF problem (and the corresponding settings and modes) are you experiencing with the G7X II?
> I didn't understand
> Thanks!


I have no autofocus problems with the G7X II. I am considering buying the III or the G5X II. If their autofocus for stills is somehow worse, then I'd like some test that demonstrates the problem. People popping in and out of videos or doing Dr. Tongue imitations don't show me anything relevant to a way in which I am going to use the camera.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 13, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> I disagree. It's not silly buzz. The AF in video is substandard compared to other cameras in the same class. It would have been in the bottom tier 4 years ago and the rest of the field has improved substantially. The poor AF performance is immediately obvious when you watch any footage shot with it unless it was specifically edited to hide it or shot not relying on AF.
> 
> 
> I don't think most buyers are going to share your sentiments if they care about video performance.
> ...



But so far I didn't see any AF problem for video.
The performance of FACE DETECTION AF is not on par with Sony, completely agree (remember that it's also more expensive), but that's not the only way to record video at all.

It seems people and reviewers only consider Face Detection AF!
(I know it's advertised for vloggers but it seems that everyone test it as if the only purpose was to film themselves, and moving around the frame, which in real world is not that often)

I do care about video indeed, the 4K without crop is a strong point to me to buy it.

But I don't rely only on Face Detection to evaluate AF performance on video. 

Face detection AF is not good as the Sony RX VI, but it doesn't mean that all AF is bad as many are spreading out.

*Again, I remark the last minute of the previous reviewer.*


----------



## Stereodude (Aug 14, 2019)

PVCC said:


> But so far I didn't see any AF problem for video.
> The performance of FACE DETECTION AF is not on par with Sony, completely agree (remember that it's also more expensive), but that's not the only way to record video at all.
> 
> It seems people and reviewers only consider Face Detection AF!
> ...


Well, here you go. You can clearly see (at least if you watch it on a 2160p display at full res) with side by side footage that the Mk III AF is inferior to the Mk II even in non-face tracking use. You can also see the Mk II shoots sharper 1080p footage. This is most apparent when he moves outside.






Start at 11:24


----------



## stevelee (Aug 14, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> Well, here you go. You can clearly see (at least if you watch it on a 2160p display at full res) with side by side footage that the Mk III AF is inferior to the Mk II even in non-face tracking use. You can also see the Mk II shoots sharper 1080p footage. This is most apparent when he moves outside.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks. I watched the whole video full screen on my 5K monitor. Of perhaps the most interest to me was his report on bitrates. I wonder whether there is much to be gained at 4K over 1080p at the same bitrate, given the greater compression.

Also, the difference in exposure and color was greater than I would have expected. The fur of course looks sharper when the whites are not blown out. I would expect that most if not all of the differences come from the new sensor.

The differences are subtle enough that I definitely would not regret getting the III. And in any event, I plan to keep the II. I've kept my S120, but have not had occasion to use it since I got the II. I took it along as a backup on a 5300-mile driving trip when my II was new. When I buy the III or the 5 Mark II or one of the Sonys, it will be time to pass the S120 along to a friend who has been taking good photos with my old S95.

My annual video project comes in June, so I might want something with 4K then, for editing flexibility. My fall European trip starts in October. So my decision will be whether I buy something, and if so what and when. Nothing I shoot in June lasts for ten minutes, but I could have the II in my pocket in case I run into heat issues. And both cameras are small enough to have in the little bag I put under the seat on the plane, if I have a new camera before the fall trip.

So I'll keep looking for tests that seem to have some relevance to my situation. I'll watch more of this guy's videos as he uses the III.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 14, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> Well, here you go. You can clearly see (at least if you watch it on a 2160p display at full res) with side by side footage that the Mk III AF is inferior to the Mk II even in non-face tracking use. You can also see the Mk II shoots sharper 1080p footage. This is most apparent when he moves outside.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks!
Good tests.

It seems the continuous / servo AF performance of the G7X III is a bit below the G7X II, weird.

But for a one touch AF it works fine. So it's good for me.

I downloaded original FullHD and 4K files from Cameralabs, and they're good to me too. Maybe a subtle difference with other similar cameras, but not a problem.

One thing took my attention: according to Cameralabs the G5X II has a bit sharper still image than G7X III, which I didn't expect due to the fact the zoom is larger and that usually means lower IQ performance. Weird too.

Reading the User manual, tells the lens ring cannot be used to zoom WHILE recording video.

What Canon moves 1 step forward usually moves 2 backwards.. No 24p, no clickless ring, somewhat weak AF... 

S****


----------



## PVCC (Aug 14, 2019)

After seeing the stills IQ of the G5X II are bit sharper, having the longer zoom and EVF, I wonder if it could be a better long-term purchase...

No Mic-in, but if it happens to need good audio and I use a Digital Audio Recorder like Zoom H1n or H2n, would it be a real problem (besides replacing the audio track in post)? Hmm...


----------



## stevelee (Aug 14, 2019)

PVCC said:


> After seeing the stills IQ of the G5X II are bit sharper, having the longer zoom and EVF, I wonder if it could be a better long-term purchase...
> 
> No Mic-in, but if it happens to need good audio and I use a Digital Audio Recorder like Zoom H1n or H2n, would it be a real problem (besides replacing the audio track in post)? Hmm...


I’m inclined to agree with you after seeing the stills. I don’t need the mike input for my travel camera. I’m not going to do live streaming, so the pluses on the 7 don’t matter to me. I have no idea whether or how much I’d use the popup viewfinder, OTOH.

But two things give me pause about making a choice this soon. First, I don’t shoot JPEGs. Is the apparent sharpness advantage due to the new lens, or is some of it due to better JPEG processing in camera? I’d like to see if the difference is apparent in Raw files. Having a slightly longer zoom without losing lens speed or quality would be a plus.

The other, and perhaps more important, issue is size. This 5 is more pocketable than the one before. If it is close enough in size to the 7, that would likely seal the deal for me. A few millimeters could be the straw that breaks the camel. If they have both in stock locally, and the 5 passes the size test, it could become an impulse purchase.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 14, 2019)

stevelee said:


> I’m inclined to agree with you after seeing the stills. I don’t need the mike input for my travel camera. I’m not going to do live streaming, so the pluses on the 7 don’t matter to me. I have no idea whether or how much I’d use the popup viewfinder, OTOH.
> 
> But two things give me pause about making a choice this soon. First, I don’t shoot JPEGs. Is the apparent sharpness advantage due to the new lens, or is some of it due to better JPEG processing in camera? I’d like to see if the difference is apparent in Raw files. Having a slightly longer zoom without losing lens speed or quality would be a plus.
> 
> The other, and perhaps more important, issue is size. This 5 is more pocketable than the one before. If it is close enough in size to the 7, that would likely seal the deal for me. A few millimeters could be the straw that breaks the camel. If they have both in stock locally, and the 5 passes the size test, it could become an impulse purchase.



The G5X II and G7X III use same Digic 8 processor, so I think the image processing is probably the same.

If you check the original G5X which has the same Optics but older processor than the G7X mk 2, the IQ was noticeable lower (to my surprise) - DPReview has a great page to compare cameras -

The EVF becomes handy in sunlight or strong light conditions when you can't see the LCD. Besides that I never used it due to be so small and the advantage of a LCD touchscreen.

I wonder if everything else would be the same as G7X III. (AF "low performance", 4K integrating after a while).

I'll never stream nor do vlogging either. But may film for serious purpose, which in that case external audio recording is often the way.

I was decided for the G7X III, but now I hesitate if it would be worth spending $200 more or not in a camera that I expect to use for years.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 14, 2019)

Yes, for me the difference in money is a minor consideration, given that I will use it for years, and the money is a drop in the bucket compared with the cost of the trips I will take during those years where I will use the camera.

My 6D2 has a mic input, so I’d use it if I ever need to do that. The audio on my annual video project involves the ambient sounds of basketball shoes squeaking on an arena floor and the bouncing of balls, so fidelity is not an issue. Traveling, I might shoot short clips on occasion, and the sound is just ambient.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 15, 2019)

stevelee said:


> I’m inclined to agree with you after seeing the stills. I don’t need the mike input for my travel camera. I’m not going to do live streaming, so the pluses on the 7 don’t matter to me. I have no idea whether or how much I’d use the popup viewfinder, OTOH.
> 
> But two things give me pause about making a choice this soon. First, I don’t shoot JPEGs. Is the apparent sharpness advantage due to the new lens, or is some of it due to better JPEG processing in camera? I’d like to see if the difference is apparent in Raw files. Having a slightly longer zoom without losing lens speed or quality would be a plus.
> 
> The other, and perhaps more important, issue is size. This 5 is more pocketable than the one before. If it is close enough in size to the 7, that would likely seal the deal for me. A few millimeters could be the straw that breaks the camel. If they have both in stock locally, and the 5 passes the size test, it could become an impulse purchase.



I found that DPReview has posted a Sample pictures gallery of G5X II, in JPG and RAW formats, so you can download the original files.

Please, if you compare G5X II vs. G7X III RAW files, share with us your findings.

I can only check the JPGs so far...

Thanks!!


----------



## stevelee (Aug 15, 2019)

Will I be able to open the Raw files in Photoshop or anything yet?

I saw on the web that a Best Buy in my area has both the 7 III and the 5 II in stock for me to see, though they have just one of the latter to show and none to sell. I was tempted to drive down there late this afternoon.


----------



## Kit. (Aug 15, 2019)

stevelee said:


> Will I be able to open the Raw files in Photoshop or anything yet?


With the Adobe Camera Raw from the latest CC update, yes. Or at least I was.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 15, 2019)

Kit. said:


> With the Adobe Camera Raw from the latest CC update, yes. Or at least I was.



What do you think of the RAW files compared to JPGs?

Does the G5X II seem to deliver a bit sharper images than the G7X III in the RAW too? 
And *along the whole focal length?*

Thanks!


----------



## Kit. (Aug 15, 2019)

PVCC said:


> What do you think of the RAW files compared to JPGs?
> 
> Does the G5X II seem to deliver a bit sharper images than the G7X III in the RAW too?
> And *along the whole focal length?*


Sorry, I am waiting for someone else to do the tests before I choose the camera to buy. I am not in hurry. I've just downloaded a dpreview raw file and checked that I can open it in Photoshop.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 16, 2019)

I was checking the GX5 II Sample pictures right out of the camera from DPReview and got impressed with the IQ especially regarding Sharpness.

Even at wide open or 1 stop down, the stills are very sharp along the focal range.

No noticeable Chromatic aberration (obviously corrected by the CPU).

I wish the full frame Zoom L lenses have a performance like that!

I didn't check the G7X III Sample pictures yet, don't know if it's available nor if they will be so solid performing. But will do later.

According to Cameralabs the G5X II is a bit sharper, so if it's evident in the Sample pictures too, when checking the G7X III's, then I think I'll miss the muc-in in order to get the best possible IQ pictures... (didn't want to spend $200 more than the G7X III, but I'll take it as long term investment)


----------



## Stereodude (Aug 16, 2019)

The G5X II looks to have a much better quality lens than the G7X III.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 16, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> The G5X II looks to have a much better quality lens than the G7X III.



In the video he mentions many things, but not exactly that the G5X II has a much better lens.
Why do you say that? I didn't understand

I said I was impressed because all images I checked are very sharp, and I expected the longer zoom range of the G5X II would deliver softer images at the corners.

Besides that, the G5X II can also focus to closer distance, so when using at ~120mm this is very good.

I'll compare to the G7X II, and also check the AF on the G5X II (vs. the low performing G7X III), but now I think I'll go for the G5X II, since I want the best possible IQ from this little cam. 

The 4K (original files downloaded from Cameralabs) on both look good to me, but if G5X II is bit sharper, then probably 4K is also bit sharper, or maybe not noticeable difference.

Grrr... I didn't want to spend $200 more but I think I will regret if I don't

At this point Gordon from Cameralabs deserves much more than a coffee!!


----------



## Stereodude (Aug 16, 2019)

PVCC said:


> In the video he mentions many things, but not exactly that the G5X II has a much better lens.
> Why do you say that? I didn't understand


The multiple crop comparisons at 11:40 in the video definitely favor the G5X II significantly.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 16, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> The multiple crop comparisons at 11:40 in the video definitely favor the G5X II significantly.



Yes, he posted the still crops on his site, which is much better to compare than on the video.

Remember that his crops comparison are for ~24mm only.

So I went and download original JPGs from DPReview at different focal lengths and got pleased with the G5X II results, plus the 20cm closest focus distance, giving a stronger macro.

Well, I'll try to get G7X III original JPGs at different focal lengths, but I'm almost with the G5X II.

I wish it had a Muc-in just in case for some pro footage made easier.

Canon could have kept the declick button and allow to focus and zoom with lens ring WHILE recording. I don't understand why to remove something so handy that doesn't bother anyone nor imply sacrificing any new feature, that makes me really upset with Canon's product managers (as always...)


----------



## stevelee (Aug 17, 2019)

When I was out and about today, I headed over to Best Buy. Unfortunately, not only did they have a G5X II that I could handle and look at, they also even had one in stock that I could buy then and there. The demo model was next to a G7X II, so I could compare sizes easily. The difference was not noticeable. Any pocket one will fit, the other one should, too. They also had the G7X III in stock, but I didn't notice whether they had one for display on the counter.

A clerk came over and to his credit, he asked me if I had looked at the Sonys. I told him I had, and gave him the reasons I have mentioned around here before that neither version seemed a good fit for what I take when traveling. We went over the pros and cons of the G7X II and III vs. the G5X II. I decided that since I was fairly sure I was going to buy the 5 eventually, through the miracle of plastic, I saw no reason to wait.

I tried out a few things this afternoon. I made this video, using default settings, other than changing between 4K and 1080p. Since they use the same bitrate, there shouldn't be a lot of difference. The color difference may have more to do with change of light. I assume that what FCP X did was upsample the 1080p to 4K. I ran it through Compressor for posting. You can watch the short video here. I first tried out the camera with video of my ceiling fan, before I figured out how to put it in 4K mode. You have to have the dial set for video before it will let you choose 4K. If you shoot in any other mode, I will go by whatever you last chose among the others. Here is the unexpurgated, straight-out-of-the-camera 4K version of "As the Ceiling Fan Turns." Again, everything was set on auto.

I also took some quick stills at 120mm equivalent on the 5 and 100mm equivalent on the 7. Here are 100% crops near center and at the corner of each:


----------



## stevelee (Aug 17, 2019)

The pictures from the 5 are clearly superior I think, but this all may be rather meaningless. Anyway, I have the camera, it seems to work OK. Sorry I couldn't get the bird to cooperate and stay for both shots, and I don't have a cape and brandy snifter for the Dr. Tongue segment.

Also the stills were shot in Raw. I did no edit in ACR, but allowed the lens profiles to be applied. I saved the JPEGs at the Very High quality setting for posting here.

I don't know how the autofocus was applied in the videos. I haven't worked my way around the settings, and just used defaults, I think. Menus are similar to what I'm used to, but not identical. I think there is a grid but no level on the 5, but the level seems to appear and disappear unexpectedly on the 7 for me. Since I haven't figured the level on the old camera out after almost 3 years, there should be no surprised that I can't find it on the new, if it is there somewhere.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 17, 2019)

stevelee said:


> When I was out and about today, I headed over to Best Buy. Unfortunately, not only did they have a G5X II that I could handle and look at, they also even had one in stock that I could buy then and there. The demo model was next to a G7X II, so I could compare sizes easily. The difference was not noticeable. Any pocket one will fit, the other one should, too. They also had the G7X III in stock, but I didn't notice whether they had one for display on the counter.
> 
> A clerk came over and to his credit, he asked me if I had looked at the Sonys. I told him I had, and gave him the reasons I have mentioned around here before that neither version seemed a good fit for what I take when traveling. We went over the pros and cons of the G7X II and III vs. the G5X II. I decided that since I was fairly sure I was going to buy the 5 eventually, through the miracle of plastic, I saw no reason to wait.
> 
> ...



Thanks!

So you bought the G5X II!

Is it me or the crops shows much better Sharpness on the G5X II than GX7 II (the one you have, if I understand it right)?

I'll check the 4K video right out of the cam.

Please, let us know what you think about the EVF

Thanks one again


----------



## stevelee (Aug 17, 2019)

Also, I should comment on the popup viewfinder. When I first tried it in the store, the view was terrible. Even before the salesman appeared, I had discovered the little lever for the diopter setting. Here at home on mine, it seems too tiny and fussy to set accurately. So the viewfinder view is not great, at least not on mine so far. It is adequate for composition and will be welcome out in bright sunlight. But I would never try to focus through it, as I would the OVF on my DSLRs.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 17, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Is it me or the crops shows much better Sharpness on the G5X II than GX7 II (the one you have, if I understand it right)?
> 
> I'll check the 4K video right out of the cam.
> 
> ...


Funny. I was posting the viewfinder comment when you posted your message to me.

Yes, in these particular pictures, the 5 shots look a lot better than the ones from my 7 that I have been pleased with for almost 3 years. My guess is that the 7 picture was not as well focused, which may tell us something. But if at the long end the 5 is anything like that much better in real-life situations, then it was worth the purchase for the lens improvement alone.

And I'm keeping the 7. I may take it along on trips for a while, since both cameras are small enough not to be a problem in the little under-the-seat bag I carry on planes and trains. They use the same battery, so that's a convenience. I'll pass the S120 along to a friend now.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 17, 2019)

stevelee said:


> When I was out and about today, I headed over to Best Buy. Unfortunately, not only did they have a G5X II that I could handle and look at, they also even had one in stock that I could buy then and there. The demo model was next to a G7X II, so I could compare sizes easily. The difference was not noticeable. Any pocket one will fit, the other one should, too. They also had the G7X III in stock, but I didn't notice whether they had one for display on the counter.
> 
> A clerk came over and to his credit, he asked me if I had looked at the Sonys. I told him I had, and gave him the reasons I have mentioned around here before that neither version seemed a good fit for what I take when traveling. We went over the pros and cons of the G7X II and III vs. the G5X II. I decided that since I was fairly sure I was going to buy the 5 eventually, through the miracle of plastic, I saw no reason to wait.
> 
> ...



Hi,

Thanks a lot!

The 4K video looks very good to me, it's about 880MB/minute. Enough bitrate for very good footage, even pro work.

Yes, I use the EVF in my Panasonic G7 when I cannot see the screen to compose, but if I set to focus on a square and half release the Shutter, it doesn't fail, so it's handy in some conditions.
I don't know how big or small is the image in the G5X II' EVF though...

Yes, it has digital level. Check below:

You can download the Advanced User Guide and related stuff like software here:

https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/...shoot/advanced-cameras/powershot-g5-x-mark-ii

I'm carefully checking the User Guide.
I recall the G7X III can take 30" stills, but the G5X II seems to take up to 15", not sure yet.

I like to know the camera before buying, the mnanual in .PDF makes it easier to me


----------



## PVCC (Aug 17, 2019)

stevelee said:


> Also, I should comment on the popup viewfinder. When I first tried it in the store, the view was terrible. Even before the salesman appeared, I had discovered the little lever for the diopter setting. Here at home on mine, it seems too tiny and fussy to set accurately. So the viewfinder view is not great, at least not on mine so far. It is adequate for composition and will be welcome out in bright sunlight. But I would never try to focus through it, as I would the OVF on my DSLRs.



Hi,

Please, could you check and confirm the following on your new *G5X II*?

This is a simple test but I can't find any info about it, so I really appreciate if you can do it.

It's VERY important in case I need to use External Monitor for video recording (for some pro work I need to frame on larger display than the 3" camera screen).

If you connect your FullHD/4K TV via HDMI to the camera:

1- Does the camera *display the image on the TV* WHILE Recording video at FullHD at 30p?

2- And WHILE recording video in 4K at 30p?

I suppose you should set the cam to Video recording mode.
Maybe in other modes like "M" it behaves differently? Would be worth trying too.

Thank you very much in advance!


----------



## stevelee (Aug 17, 2019)

PVCC said:


> You can download the Advanced User Guide and related stuff like software here:
> 
> https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/...shoot/advanced-cameras/powershot-g5-x-mark-ii
> 
> ...


Yes, I had already downloaded the manual. The only reference to the level I have found is on page 263 where it says the level is not displayed when in the (AF smiley couple of squares) mode for autofocus. So far I haven't seen anything that says how to turn it on or see it otherwise.

In TV mode it will take exposures up to 30 seconds. In M mode, you can also do 30 seconds. If you turn the little wheel one more click, it will also do Bulb.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 17, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Hi,
> 
> Please, could you check and confirm the following on your new *G5X II*?
> 
> ...


I don't recall having a mini HTML to HTML cable, or whatever I would need to hook the camera to the TV. If I happen to think for somewhere in the house there might be one, and I in fact find one, I'll try that out for you. I can't think of any device I have that might have come with one, and I know I haven't bought one separately. It would seem I have about every other kind of cable known to man except for USB-C, but not really.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 17, 2019)

stevelee said:


> I don't recall having a mini HTML to HTML cable, or whatever I would need to hook the camera to the TV. If I happen to think for somewhere in the house there might be one, and I in fact find one, I'll try that out for you. I can't think of any device I have that might have come with one, and I know I haven't bought one separately. It would seem I have about every other kind of cable known to man except for USB-C, but not really.



I finally found some info on the manual regarding HDMI output.

It seems that it can record video while showing image via HDMI output, but the camera screen will turn off... so no touchscreen AF chances... 

On the "clean" HDMI output the camera cannot record videos, sadly

Well, at least I suppose I could use an external monitor for framing, but changing focus would only be possible manually, it seems.. (another reason to miss the declicked ring to focus.. grrr...)

PS: After having the exceptional bad luck of buying a brand new 5D3 years ago that "fried" after few minutes when connected to a TV via HDMI (I had the great luck, thanks to a friend, of having the chance to ship to Canon Service and they replaced the mainboard, all under warranty) I now always check the camera works fine after connecting some minutes via HDMI...
No more risks or surprises, since I live outside USA and all returns are impossible from here.

Page 172 of User Guide:


----------



## stevelee (Aug 17, 2019)

I see that I typed "HTML" for "HDMI." That was likely the product of guilt. I should have been working on a web site instead of taking time to respond to your message.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 17, 2019)

stevelee said:


> I see that I typed "HTML" for "HDMI." That was likely the product of guilt. I should have been working on a web site instead of taking time to respond to your message.



Your kindness and time is more than appreciated!!

You're the only one here with the G5X II so far 

I was going to order the G7X III to use for many years, now I'll go for the G5X II, so every bit of help is very big! 

To me it's LOT of money with no financial possibilities.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 17, 2019)

It is a lot of money for a little camera. In the light of day today, it seems even more obvious that I made the right choice (for me) in getting the 5.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 19, 2019)

I copied the electronic manual to iCloud and opened it up on the iPad. I read pretty much all of it (semidozing through boring details about things I never use). It was nice to read it from the comfort of an easy chair rather than at the computer. I didn’t see any more about the level than the comment about when you can’t see it.

The good news is that I then took the camera and turned off facial recognition. I hit the info button several times, and lo and behold, the electronic level appeared. I would have used it Friday in setting up my test video, and may never use it again. But now, at least for the moment, I know how to invoke it.

While I was looking through various menus, I turned on focus peaking. I hardly ever used manual focus on the 7, other than for video, and may have little occasion to use it on the 5, but I do plan to try focus peaking out. The depth of field of the little lens is so great that even magnified, it is hard to focus by eye. It will be interesting to see whether and how it might work in the viewfinder. I wonder whether using it for initial focus for video works and works well enough to incorporate it into my flow.

For my brief touristy clips, autofocus has worked fine on the 7. For my annual basketball pickup videos, I’ve used manual focus. Even with a 6D2 and STM lens, I have found it better just to focus on the rim of the basket and leave it, rather than tracking a player’s face. There is plenty of DOF, given focal length and distances involved, and no risk of focus fishing around during the shoot. That of course is even more the case with the much smaller lens of the 7 or 5. I usually use whatever is my new toy for shooting the video, including the 4K on the iPhone 6S when it was new. It worked rather well even without a zoom lens, since I could crop in FCP X and still have good quality for a 1080p or 720p reduction. This year, the new toy didn’t get released in time for the video, and I was boarding a plane for Copenhagen at the time when the first game was played.


----------



## Stereodude (Aug 19, 2019)

The less than stellar reviews just keep on coming:






The fact that apparently this is the best Canon could do with a 3.5 year product development cycle doesn't give me the warm and fuzzies.

A few more days and we should find out how the RX100 VII actually works from buyers not people sucking up to Sony in exchange for free gear and trips.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 19, 2019)

stevelee said:


> I copied the electronic manual to iCloud and opened it up on the iPad. I read pretty much all of it (semidozing through boring details about things I never use). It was nice to read it from the comfort of an easy chair rather than at the computer. I didn’t see any more about the level than the comment about when you can’t see it.
> 
> The good news is that I then took the camera and turned off facial recognition. I hit the info button several times, and lo and behold, the electronic level appeared. I would have used it Friday in setting up my test video, and may never use it again. But now, at least for the moment, I know how to invoke it.
> 
> ...



Great!

I was just going to digest you to press INFO button until digital level appears, since it's a common way to do it un done cameras. (My Panasonic G7 does it)

I kept thinking why you said that on daylight the G5X II was the good choice. It was because the EVF?

Thank you!


----------



## stevelee (Aug 19, 2019)

I haven’t used the EVF except for the few minutes I was trying to get the diopter adjusted. I will probably find it of value in bright light once I can see clearly through it. “In light of day” was a figure of speech meaning that I still felt the same way the next day after sleeping.

Having the manual on the iPad means that I will have it with me when I travel. I also have the 6D2 and the G7X II manuals on the tablet. So it was more than for just reading it now in comfort.

It is funny that the manual gives no clue about the level except to say when you can’t see it. When I was first setting the camera up, I couldn’t find a way to set 4K video. I was able to get the answer to that from the manual: you have to have the mode dial set to the movie icon before you can turn on 4K, and you have to have there to shoot it.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 19, 2019)

stevelee said:


> I haven’t used the EVF except for the few minutes I was trying to get the diopter adjusted. I will probably find it of value in bright light once I can see clearly through it. “In light of day” was a figure of speech meaning that I still felt the same way the next day after sleeping.
> 
> Having the manual on the iPad means that I will have it with me when I travel. I also have the 6D2 and the G7X II manuals on the tablet. So it was more than for just reading it now in comfort.
> 
> It is funny that the manual gives no clue about the level except to say when you can’t see it. When I was first setting the camera up, I couldn’t find a way to set 4K video. I was able to get the answer to that from the manual: you have to have the mode dial set to the movie icon before you can turn on 4K, and you have to have there to shoot it.



Thank you very much for your explanations. I didn't know that expression in English, so I got confused.

I also have the PDF manuals of my cameras with me, really handy 

Thanks!!


----------



## PVCC (Aug 19, 2019)

Stereodude said:


> The less than stellar reviews just keep on coming:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Very interesting to see how was the G7X II vs. G7X III AF performance, and his comment that before recording AF is faster than while recording.
Also interesting to see the IS working (very well in my opinion)

We know that Sony's AF will perform amazingly great, so I even prefer not to see it... 

I didn't want to spend so much on a pocketable camera but for daily (at day and night) street shooting (I take pictures a lot, so far with my phone cause to be Descret is key point on many aspects) the G5X II seems the right choice to me

-> Maybe the G5X II' AF is a bit faster in non-face detection mode?
Would be great! 

Also interesting another explanation if why too shoot at 24p

Although the "cinematic" look involves more than 24p vs 30p (Sutter speed 180° rule is essential, the colors palette and lighting, to mention the most important ones) 

Of course, I'd love if Canon implements 24p along with the security patch via Firmware update.

When people/customers COMPLAIN A LOT over internet, there's more chance they do it (not often but already happened)
Hope they improve AF too, for the G5X II also!

Finally, for the surprise of most, companies like that do check internet chatters and get feedback of them.
Even more probably nowadays from YouTube reviews and the reactions of people.

So "making buzz" is not as useless as one may think, at all..

Even more, users can send feedback and complaints to Canon via email and phone call. But people are usually lazy for that, so the "bad review buzz" is likely more effective


----------



## Stereodude (Aug 19, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Of course, I'd love if Canon implements 24p along with the security patch via Firmware update.
> 
> When people/customers COMPLAIN A LOT over internet, there's more chance they do it (not often but already happened)
> Hope they improve AF too, for the G5X II also!
> ...


There are a few people out there spreading the story that Canon is going to fix the AF via a firmware update based on some ambiguous tweets by Canon. I expect that is unlikely. They had 3.5 years from the Mk II to develop the III. The general concept that the camera can fixed with new firmware seems to presume that the G7X III was rushed to market and/or that Canon didn't realize how bad the AF performance actually was. If a 3.5 year product cycle = rushing they're in worse shape than anyone imagines, and the AF is so flagrantly poor while shooting video it's unfathomable that they didn't know prior to the release. This isn't like an AF issue that only happens under some odd circumstance their internal testing didn't find. They must have thought it was good enough.

I would be also be shocked if 24p was added by a firmware update. It's been omitted by intention thanks to the Canon cripple hammer. Adding it back with a firmware update would basically be an admission of such. They didn't put it back in any other cameras that had it missing.

Perhaps I'm underestimating Canon though. Maybe the bad AF while shooting video is an intentional crippling also. Maybe they just overdid the severity of crippling (misjudging the market) and they will issue a firmware update or a series of progressive firmware updates gradually improving the AF while shooting video to make it just good enough to stop the negative buzz while making sure it's not so good as to compete with their more expensive products.

However, all is not lost. There's a good lesson in here. This highlights that you can't trust "reviews" (marketing buzz) from "influencers" who get gear their gear for free and get taken on what amount to free vacations. Not a single "influencer" who was provided a camera by Canon before the release bothered to highlight or even mention the dismal AF performance while shooting video. Only one or two of them even mentioned the overheating issue. If they're willing to hide the issues with the G7X III and tell everyone how great and awesome it is, it says a lot about their honesty and credibility. The ones who went on the trip, got a camera, and chose to keep quiet rather than publishing a less than favorable "review" aren't much better either.

As it stands now I'm likely to get the RX100 VII even though I think it's quite expensive. There's just no competition to it if you want a pocketable camera with all those features. I get the impression that Sony is at least trying to put as many features into it for the high price rather than Canon who tries to take as many features out for the price. However, I'm not buying one until I see reviews/impressions from actual buyers in case we're being similarly misled by the "influencers" on it.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 19, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Although the "cinematic" look involves more than 24p vs 30p (Sutter speed 180° rule is essential, the colors palette and lighting, to mention the most important ones)



You can get filters that add grain and scratches.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 19, 2019)

I honestly Don't Know for sure If some of the reviewers get Gear for free.

I know they get gear to test but to also return. Other than that I'd be assuming, and I don't like to do it.

What I do know is not to trust on "Explorers of light" (renowned photographers who use Canon gear) "reviews" or marketing spots. I already watched some and Canon suffered a marketing shame/disaster later because the firmware had a bug (5D2 when started to record audio manually, if I recall it right) and they had to remove the firmware download...

I personally reported that bug on internet and CR reported my blog post... 

- Anyway, the more reviewers of ALL kinds telling the AF is poor, the better. Because we all might benefit, who knows...

Improving and even adding a feature by firmware is almost always possible, except when there's hardware limitation. Maybe the AF can be a bit improved, I don't know but I feel if the G7X II was better, then the G7X III with a more powerful processor can do it at least the same, considering there's another sensor with different technical aspects.

24p can be implemented, for sure. It's rare, but there was occasion when Canon implemented features via firmware "by popular demand" (5D2). Of course, it was different situation and different camera (and price), but let's hope YouTube gets full of complaints making lot of buzz, we'll get more chances for improvements.

I still have to check the YouTube reviews of G5X II, since most are for G7X III

So far here only *Stevelee* can let us know


----------



## PVCC (Aug 20, 2019)

stevelee said:


> You can get filters that add grain and scratches.



That's a whole diferent thing!

The cinematic look is other than the "old film" look. 

It's related to the "dreamy" look, with different motion perception, different colors and lighting, etc.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 21, 2019)

I'm still trying to get the point of shooting in 24p if it is to make it look cinematic, but not like movies.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 21, 2019)

I found this.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 21, 2019)

Apparently the autofocus on the original G5X was not that swift, according to this review.


----------



## stevelee (Aug 21, 2019)

I did find a disadvantage of the G5X Mark II: only one time zone. In the time zone setting on the 3 II, there is a home time zone and a travel zone. On the new 5, you pick one zone and that’s it. On the 3 I am used to setting the destination time before I leave home, and then just hit the plane icon when I get there.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 21, 2019)

stevelee said:


> I'm still trying to get the point of shooting in 24p if it is to make it look cinematic, but not like movies.



As far as I understand English, cinematic refers to movie-look, especially when shot on real film


----------



## stevelee (Aug 22, 2019)

PVCC said:


> As far as I understand English, cinematic refers to movie-look, especially when shot on real film


Yes, that’s what I would have thought the English would mean, too.


----------



## PVCC (Aug 24, 2019)

stevelee said:


> Apparently the autofocus on the original G5X was not that swift, according to this review.



Very interesting comments on the blog post. Most of them actually match what I think (regarding photography, not loosing the opportunity when you don't carry your heavy gear, the colors of Canon shots vs. the Sony RX's, etc) and also what I saw on pictures. Good one indeed.


----------



## stevelee (Sep 1, 2019)

The college here was playing Georgetown in football yesterday. The G5X II is not the camera that anyone would choose for sports photography, but I decided to take it along, more to help me learn to use the camera in real situations than to test it. It was almost 90 degrees in the shade, and I'm sure much worse than that out on the field and in the stands. Normally we play our first month's games at night, but Georgetown didn't want to spend the night here, so the game was set for 1 pm. I'm invited to a gridiron club area in the end zone for barbecue and drinks and can stay in that area if I wish. Yesterday, I stayed there where there were tents for shade and free liquids. I ventured out into the sun to watch certain plays, and a few of those times I shot some video.

I had not done anything to prepare the camera settings, so when I started shooting, I found that I needed to move into the shade so I could read menus. Some autofocus modes don't permit you to set the video for 4K, and if you switch to one of those, it reverts to 1080p. I should have just put the camera into manual focus and left it. Much of the action I shot was at the other end of the field, roughly 100 yards away, so anything past the hyperfocal setting would have made everything in focus anyway, especially given the short actual focal length of the lens even zoomed in (44mm), and the lens stopped down for the bright sun. But instead I used the autofocus that works with 4K. I did find the autofocus to be somewhat sluggish a couple of times, more so than I would expect with my G7X II.

With the sun almost directly overhead, the screen was about useless. I still haven't managed to get the EVF in good focus. The diopter setting is too fussy, so I go too far one way or another. Maybe I just have a bad one. I didn't have much trouble getting the EVF focused on the one I messed with at the store. Maybe I was just luckier then. I could see well enough through it yesterday to frame the image. (OK, so now I just went to the camera and tried just putting the lever in the middle rather than trying to set it by eye, and the viewfinder is much clearer now.) My other problem with the set up was that I would accidentally touch the screen somewhere in the corner between clips sometimes, so when I went back to shooting, it was trying to focus on the ground near me, and doing a pretty good job with that. So the biggest problems had to do with the inexperience with it of the photographer, who has also not figured out the optimal settings to get what I want. I should have known enough already to preset menu items before venturing into the blazing sun.

When I shoot 4K in real life it will almost always be to give me options for cropping, zooming, and panning in post to produce 1080p or even smaller to embed on a web page (960 x 540 works well). And so I edited some of these clips in FCP X using magnification up to 200%. (Shouldn't that be like a 100% crop at 1080p?) The original clips from the camera look really sharp, at least after the focus kicked in, when viewed on my 5K monitor. I sent a one-minute 4K .mov file to YouTube, and after they mangled and compressed it, it looked like this: 



 Although they are the visitors, Georgetown is wearing white. They have possession of the ball on the first few clips seen across the field. The score was tied at 20-all at the end of the third quarter. The play near me shows Davidson's winning touchdown, but you can't tell much given the official and the players in the way of my view. I end with the extra point.

I don't know how much about the camera you can tell from the YouTube post. Maybe some of my description of the experience can be of interest. This is not the camera you want to buy to shoot sporting events, but you knew that. And it doesn't have 48p, so you are not going to be asked to shoot _The Hobbit, Part IV: The Next Generation_ or the like with it.


----------



## PVCC (Sep 2, 2019)

stevelee said:


> The college here was playing Georgetown in football yesterday. The G5X II is not the camera that anyone would choose for sports photography, but I decided to take it along, more to help me learn to use the camera in real situations than to test it. It was almost 90 degrees in the shade, and I'm sure much worse than that out on the field and in the stands. Normally we play our first month's games at night, but Georgetown didn't want to spend the night here, so the game was set for 1 pm. I'm invited to a gridiron club area in the end zone for barbecue and drinks and can stay in that area if I wish. Yesterday, I stayed there where there were tents for shade and free liquids. I ventured out into the sun to watch certain plays, and a few of those times I shot some video.
> 
> I had not done anything to prepare the camera settings, so when I started shooting, I found that I needed to move into the shade so I could read menus. Some autofocus modes don't permit you to set the video for 4K, and if you switch to one of those, it reverts to 1080p. I should have just put the camera into manual focus and left it. Much of the action I shot was at the other end of the field, roughly 100 yards away, so anything past the hyperfocal setting would have made everything in focus anyway, especially given the short actual focal length of the lens even zoomed in (44mm), and the lens stopped down for the bright sun. But instead I used the autofocus that works with 4K. I did find the autofocus to be somewhat sluggish a couple of times, more so than I would expect with my G7X II.
> 
> ...



Hey!

Thanks a lot for taking the time to wire your past!

I'll download the YT clip at the maximum possible resolution.

I know that under direct sun light the LCD is almost impossible to see, that happens with most cameras. The EVF is very handy in that situations (and the only ones where I use it in my Panasonic G7 M4/3)
So I expect it will help for that.

Yes, knowing the proper mode settings and already have done them help A LOT. I usually do and save them in Custom (C) mode so if I have to change something I know I can go to another mode and get back to C and everything will be as I did set.

According to specs the EVF vision will be smaller than what I get on my G7 (which is already small), but hopefully I can still find it helpful for such situations..!!

And yes, I'd never choose it for sports, but good to see the camera in real world!

*What cares most to me in this little gem is the IQ that I can get on stills and "no-action-type" video* (Or if so, just manually focusing). 

So after buying it (I'll get it in my hands in some months), I will do what I do with all my lenses: *test it at all focal lengths at different apertures*, so I can check the IQ very detaily.

For testing I mount it on tripod, and shoot a buildings area 50-100 meters away, so I get a great frame full of details at center and corners.

It's very useful to know the strong and weak points of your arsenal 

Thanks a lot once again!


----------



## PVCC (Sep 2, 2019)

stevelee said:


> The college here was playing Georgetown in football yesterday. The G5X II is not the camera that anyone would choose for sports photography, but I decided to take it along, more to help me learn to use the camera in real situations than to test it. It was almost 90 degrees in the shade, and I'm sure much worse than that out on the field and in the stands. Normally we play our first month's games at night, but Georgetown didn't want to spend the night here, so the game was set for 1 pm. I'm invited to a gridiron club area in the end zone for barbecue and drinks and can stay in that area if I wish. Yesterday, I stayed there where there were tents for shade and free liquids. I ventured out into the sun to watch certain plays, and a few of those times I shot some video.
> 
> I had not done anything to prepare the camera settings, so when I started shooting, I found that I needed to move into the shade so I could read menus. Some autofocus modes don't permit you to set the video for 4K, and if you switch to one of those, it reverts to 1080p. I should have just put the camera into manual focus and left it. Much of the action I shot was at the other end of the field, roughly 100 yards away, so anything past the hyperfocal setting would have made everything in focus anyway, especially given the short actual focal length of the lens even zoomed in (44mm), and the lens stopped down for the bright sun. But instead I used the autofocus that works with 4K. I did find the autofocus to be somewhat sluggish a couple of times, more so than I would expect with my G7X II.
> 
> ...



Hey,

After checking your video that I downloaded at UHD I see it has lot of details, *no rolling shutter* (amazing, compared to my beloved 5D4) and you even Zoomed in sometimes very nicely!!

And no crop factor, so you can get 24mm - 120mm focal length

That's all awesome to me. I think I'll only miss the Mic-in.. specially considering so good video capabilities

For occasions I'll carry a Zoom H1n that pairs the compact & pocketable concept.

I even saw the hot air waves over the grass, hot summer day indeed!!!

- QUESTIONS (will be very much appreciated if you can give details):

1- Did you suffer any kind of overheating, especially considering the hot day temperatures?

2- Approximately how long were your 4K clips or continuous 4K recording?

3- it seems you managed Zooming very well. Did you simply use the Zoom lever around the release button?

Thank you very much!!


----------



## stevelee (Sep 2, 2019)

American football is played in short bursts followed by a lot of standing around. So no clip I shot was longer than 30 seconds. The camera had plenty of time to recover, so even out in bright sunlight on a 90º day (33º C) the camera did not have much chance to overheat (unlike the photographer). Even back under the tent, a woman collapsed. Fortunately, there are many medical doctors among Davidson alumni, so one who was nearby revived her and was asking her protocol-type questions by the time the medics stationed at the game came over.

But back to the camera. I did not do any zooming during shooting. The zoom does not work during a shot, as far as I know. All the zooming you see was done in software. That still speaks well of the camera in that there is enough resolution to blow the picture to twice its size.


----------



## PVCC (Sep 2, 2019)

stevelee said:


> American football is played in short bursts followed by a lot of standing around. So no clip I shot was longer than 30 seconds. The camera had plenty of time to recover, so even out in bright sunlight on a 90º day (33º C) the camera did not have much chance to overheat (unlike the photographer). Even back under the tent, a woman collapsed. Fortunately, there are many medical doctors among Davidson alumni, so one who was nearby revived her and was asking her protocol-type questions by the time the medics stationed at the game came over.
> 
> But back to the camera. I did not do any zooming during shooting. The zoom does not work during a shot, as far as I know. All the zooming you see was done in software. That still speaks well of the camera in that there is enough resolution to blow the picture to twice its size.



Thank you!

Hot day indeed..

- About zooming while recording: yes, it's possible!

Gordon at Cameralabs did it when testing and reviewing the G5X II. And it's clearly done manually because the camera shakes on the zooming operation. He did it moving the zoom lever around the shutter button.

However, the ring around the lens won't zoom "while recording", according to the user guide (sadly, and I don't see any technical reason why Canon disabled it, even when it zooms in presets)

If the Zoom-in was made in post, then the image quality is even better.
Maybe the Sony RX 100 Vxx has even better 4K resolution, but I'm completely fine with what I've seen so far.

"Not good 4K video", as some people said, seems to be really false to me.

I'm going to do 2 things when I get it:

1- buy a filter adapter, so I can attach UV, Polarizers and ND filters

2- implement some kind of "loupe" to attach and see the screen in very beight situations.
I have many, so I just have to adapt one for the G5X II


----------



## stevelee (Sep 2, 2019)

Thanks. So it's just zooming with the ring that doesn't work during recording? As I said, I'm learning how to use the camera, even though I've been using a very similar camera for nearly three years. Part of my experience with the G7X II is that zooming with the little lever is clumsy enough while shooting and the camera light enough that any video shot during the zoom is almost surely unusable and gets cut out. Once it lands on the new focal length, it is fine, so it is still good to know I can keep the camera running while I reframe the shot. This is just my travel camera, so if I'm using a tripod and wanting to have usable optical zooming during video, I'll use my DSLR. That said, I take many more pictures with the travel camera than with the DSLR, so it is worth it to me to get the best camera for my purposes that will also fit in my pocket. On my trip to Denmark and Sweden, I shot over 900 stills and just one video, which came on the last full day I was there. So video is not that great a concern for me. However, if I learn how to shoot video better with this camera, I will perhaps shoot more of it. There is another football game here Saturday, so perhaps I will take the camera along for more practice.

You do know the camera has a built-in ND filter? There's not really that much use for a UV filter with digital cameras, so I understand, except to protect the lens. I almost always used one when shooting color film, and I have one that will fit some of my lenses, but I never bother with it. I think I bought it out of habit when I got my first Rebel. Polarizers are great. I have a 77mm one that fits several of my lenses, I think, but I don't use it that often. Moving the "Highlights" slider toward the left in Camera Raw takes care of darkening the sky enough for me most of the time. I realize there are many other uses for the filter, and I have it when I need it on the lenses it will fit.

Now that I have finally focused the viewfinder, I don't think I'll want a loupe. I've got along without one on my previous viewfinderless cameras, and I use touching the screen to pick focus spots.

As for 4K quality, when I consider that the YouTube video represents footage blown up 110% to 200% and then mangled through YouTube's compressions, it looks surprisingly good viewed full screen on my 5K screen from less than two feet away. 

If you like, I can in a day or two post a small excerpt from my original 4K footage for your perusal. As I've said, I shoot 4K video mainly to have more to work with when editing. I have both Final Cut Pro X and Premiere, so good editing tools are at hand, and the computer has no problem keeping up with the 4K.

That does raise the issue of when I might still use 1080p. That works in modes and at speeds that are not supported in 4K.


----------



## PVCC (Sep 3, 2019)

stevelee said:


> Thanks. So it's just zooming with the ring that doesn't work during recording? As I said, I'm learning how to use the camera, even though I've been using a very similar camera for nearly three years. Part of my experience with the G7X II is that zooming with the little lever is clumsy enough while shooting and the camera light enough that any video shot during the zoom is almost surely unusable and gets cut out. Once it lands on the new focal length, it is fine, so it is still good to know I can keep the camera running while I reframe the shot. This is just my travel camera, so if I'm using a tripod and wanting to have usable optical zooming during video, I'll use my DSLR. That said, I take many more pictures with the travel camera than with the DSLR, so it is worth it to me to get the best camera for my purposes that will also fit in my pocket. On my trip to Denmark and Sweden, I shot over 900 stills and just one video, which came on the last full day I was there. So video is not that great a concern for me. However, if I learn how to shoot video better with this camera, I will perhaps shoot more of it. There is another football game here Saturday, so perhaps I will take the camera along for more practice.
> 
> You do know the camera has a built-in ND filter? There's not really that much use for a UV filter with digital cameras, so I understand, except to protect the lens. I almost always used one when shooting color film, and I have one that will fit some of my lenses, but I never bother with it. I think I bought it out of habit when I got my first Rebel. Polarizers are great. I have a 77mm one that fits several of my lenses, I think, but I don't use it that often. Moving the "Highlights" slider toward the left in Camera Raw takes care of darkening the sky enough for me most of the time. I realize there are many other uses for the filter, and I have it when I need it on the lenses it will fit.
> 
> ...



Yes, Canon tells on the user guide that Zooming with the lens ring is not possible when recording (unfortunately, as I said I see no technical reason why it wouldn't be possible).
But you can use the zooming lever around the shutter button at any time.

Yes, I'd use UV to protect the lens, especially in dónde situations like shooting near the sea (easier to clean the filter rather than the lens, and more protection for lens interior too).

Yes, I know the built-in ND, a great option that Sony didn't put in the latest RX. But sometimes in daylight I may want even less light, so I can use some ND filters I already have. CPL filters also useful to reduce reflections on windows and water (sometimes dramatically!)

- There's a filter adapter for the G7X II, but I dont know if it would work on the G5X II because I don't know if both cameras have the same diameter in the final end of the zoom lens.

-- Could you please measure the inner and external diameter of the final piece of the lens when it is extended (camera powered on) on your G7X II and G5X II??
That would be great info.

I sent you a private message!

Thank you!


----------



## stevelee (Sep 3, 2019)

I saw the message, and will reply when I do the measuring, probably later today.


----------



## stevelee (Sep 4, 2019)

Within the rough limits of my measurements, the lens housings appear to be identical in size. The outer diameter is 4 cm. Inside around the lens is a rounded rectangle which may be a little different. I need to remeasure to be sure, assuming that is the other measurement you want.


----------



## PVCC (Sep 4, 2019)

stevelee said:


> Within the rough limits of my measurements, the lens housings appear to be identical in size. The outer diameter is 4 cm. Inside around the lens is a rounded rectangle which may be a little different. I need to remeasure to be sure, assuming that is the other measurement you want.



So both, the G7X II and G5X II have *4cm outer diameter on the lens housing* (the most extended "tube", *where Cacon printed the zoom range and maximum aperture*)?

If so, that is very good. If the inner diameter is the same in both cameras, or almost the same, then the filter adapter for the G7X II should also work on G5X II...

I'll wait your measurements. Thank you VERY MUCH for taking the time to do this!


----------



## stevelee (Sep 4, 2019)

PVCC said:


> So both, the G7X II and G5X II have *4cm outer diameter on the lens housing* (the most extended "tube", *where Cacon printed the zoom range and maximum aperture*)?


Yes.

Do you set the camera so that it never turns itself off? I would expect the automatic retraction of the lens would not be good for the lens mechanism or the attachment if that happened.


----------



## PVCC (Sep 5, 2019)

stevelee said:


> Yes.
> 
> Do you set the camera so that it never turns itself off? I would expect the automatic retraction of the lens would not be good for the lens mechanism or the attachment if that happened.



I carefully check the images of the filter dialog snd it seems the lens can retract and close without problems because the adapter is glued over the part of the lens where is printed the lens focal lenght & max aperture. 
And that part of the lens is not covered for the lens "protection curtains" that close when you turn the camera off.

So IF the INNER diameter of the most extended part of lens of both G7X II & G5X II is the same, since the external on both is 4cm, then the adapter should wourk..

Could you please check the inner diameter?

If you can attach a picture of the G5X II when turned off, showing that part of the lens, to see if it remains at same level or over the lens ring/housing, that should be great too.

I checked online pictures but couldn't tell with certainty if the lens border is "over" or "below" the lens ring when the camera is turned off and facing upfacing up.

Sorry if my explanation sounds a bit confusing, I don't know the exact words in English to do it better


----------



## stevelee (Sep 5, 2019)

I'll try to do this in the next day or two. I have a lot going on.

The area you are talking about retracts into being flush with the ring around the lens. There is less than a millimeter clearance, it looks like, around that portion, once retracted. The inner rectangle is covered by the built-in lens cap that covers the whole circle around it. I can't imagine any sort of attachment that you could leave on with the lens retracted. By default, the lens will retract on its own after a minute of not being used. The G5X II and the G7X II work the same in this regard.


----------



## stevelee (Sep 5, 2019)

The rounded rectangle of both models is close to 21 x 28mm.

Turned off the G5X II looks like this:


----------



## PVCC (Sep 6, 2019)

stevelee said:


> The rounded rectangle of both models is close to 21 x 28mm.
> 
> Turned off the G5X II looks like this:
> View attachment 186356



Hi!

Great info and picture!

- I'm sorry to ask, if you can take the same picture of the G7X II?

- And also I have this doubt: the printed brand and lens focal info look bigger on the G7X II (from pictures I found on internet).
Are those *front lens borders circles still the same width/size*?
That would help a lot to compare if the recessed lens is about the same amount on both cameras.

On the G5X II picture, it looks like the lens is a bit more inside than the ring border.

The filter adapter has a bit raised space to keep the filter ring over the whole camera lens housing, so the G7X II can be turned off without inconvenience

If it's too bothering, don't worry and don't do it (I know you already took lot of time to do this, and I really thank you for that!)


----------



## stevelee (Sep 6, 2019)

It appears that the ring might be as much as 1.5mm narrower on the G5X II:


----------



## PVCC (Sep 6, 2019)

stevelee said:


> It appears that the ring might be as much as 1.5mm narrower on the G5X II:
> 
> View attachment 186389



*Great comparison!!*
Thank you so much, it was imposible to get a picture like that on internet...

I think the filter adapter should work on the G5X II, so far I didn't find any other option.

You've been so kind and helpful.
Thank you very much once again!


----------



## stevelee (Sep 6, 2019)

And here are the cameras turned on, and with the lenses extended, but not zoomed in:


----------



## PVCC (Sep 9, 2019)

stevelee said:


> And here are the cameras turned on, and with the lenses extended, but not zoomed in:
> 
> View attachment 186392


Thank you!

I think I'll take the risk buying that another if I don't find another option to attach filters.

Hopefully it won't make any vignette since the inner diameter is 1.5mm narrower on the G5X II

I also hope the lens recessed when camera G5XII is turned "off" is the same as G7X II and enough to allow the adapter to be just over the lens ring.


----------



## PVCC (Sep 10, 2019)

stevelee said:


> And here are the cameras turned on, and with the lenses extended, but not zoomed in:
> 
> View attachment 186392


Hey!

One question: Does G5X II have some internal memory or you MUST insert a SD Card to take pictures?


----------



## stevelee (Sep 11, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Hey!
> 
> One question: Does G5X II have some internal memory or you MUST insert a SD Card to take pictures?


There is no storage other than the SD card. The store had the 128 GB card on sale for only $10 more than the 64 GB card, so that's what I bought. I've been using a 64 GB card in the G7X II and haven't come close to filling it up on recent trips. I normally reformat the card in the camera after I transfer pictures to the computer. On a 12-day trip this summer, I took 900+ Raw pictures and one short video, and didn't come close to filling up the card. I haven't erased those pictures from the 64 GB card, and the camera says I can still shoot another 1100 Raw shots or 82 minutes of video in the remaining space.

All that said, perhaps one should not put all the eggs in one basket. So a lot of folks would rather carry several smaller cards than one 64 or 128 GB SD card. 

Also, some older cards may not work in the camera. On an extensive trip right after I got the G7X II, I also took my S120 along, in case there was a problem with the new camera or I might want to take the slightly smaller S120 out some days. (I still didn't know whether I preferred the new camera in all circumstances.) It turns out that I never used it. When I filled up the memory card in the G7X II, I decided to take the 32GB card out of the S120. It was older, but rated a 10 in speed and works fine in the S120. The G7X II wouldn't recognize it at all and wouldn't format it, so I put it back in the S120 and got the spare 4 GB card out to use, and then bought another card (the 64 GB that I've been using since) when I got to a town.


----------



## PVCC (Sep 11, 2019)

stevelee said:


> There is no storage other than the SD card. The store had the 128 GB card on sale for only $10 more than the 64 GB card, so that's what I bought. I've been using a 64 GB card in the G7X II and haven't come close to filling it up on recent trips. I normally reformat the card in the camera after I transfer pictures to the computer. On a 12-day trip this summer, I took 900+ Raw pictures and one short video, and didn't come close to filling up the card. I haven't erased those pictures from the 64 GB card, and the camera says I can still shoot another 1100 Raw shots or 82 minutes of video in the remaining space.
> 
> All that said, perhaps one should not put all the eggs in one basket. So a lot of folks would rather carry several smaller cards than one 64 or 128 GB SD card.
> 
> Also, some older cards may not work in the camera. On an extensive trip right after I got the G7X II, I also took my S120 along, in case there was a problem with the new camera or I might want to take the slightly smaller S120 out some days. (I still didn't know whether I preferred the new camera in all circumstances.) It turns out that I never used it. When I filled up the memory card in the G7X II, I decided to take the 32GB card out of the S120. It was older, but rated a 10 in speed and works fine in the S120. The G7X II wouldn't recognize it at all and wouldn't format it, so I put it back in the S120 and got the spare 4 GB card out to use, and then bought another card (the 64 GB that I've been using since) when I got to a town.



Thank you!

Yes, it's always good to carry a spare card. I usually do it, especially when traveling (better to be on the safe side), but I didn't know if the G5X II has a bit of internal memory, just in case.

Thanks a lot!


----------



## stevelee (Oct 13, 2019)

I’m traveling with the G5X II. It is taking a little more effort to get used to than I expected, given that I’m used to the G7. Somehow it seems to reset to the mode of using the screen as a shutter button, so I get pictures of my feet and of the floor. I’ll write more of my experience as I get more adjusted. So far the pictures I take on purpose look good.


----------



## PVCC (Oct 13, 2019)

stevelee said:


> I’m traveling with the G5X II. It is taking a little more effort to get used to than I expected, given that I’m used to the G7. Somehow it seems to reset to the mode of using the screen as a shutter button, so I get pictures of my feet and of the floor. I’ll write more of my experience as I get more adjusted. So far the pictures I take on purpose look good.



Thanks for the feedback.

It's weird. Maybe some settings not adjusted properly?


----------



## stevelee (Oct 14, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Thanks for the feedback.
> 
> It's weird. Maybe some settings not adjusted properly?


More than likely.


----------



## stevelee (Oct 16, 2019)

In the week I have used the G5 on the trip, I have taken 1081 pictures including the ones of my feet and the floor. I leave it set on the page where the menu button takes me directly to the page to turn off the touch shutter “feature.” It doesn’t happen that often, now that I know what is happening.

I was waiting outside the Uffizi Gallery. As I sat, the camera fell out of my jacket pocket on to the pavement. The battery door came open, but the camera seems to be no worse for wear, even cosmetically.


----------



## PVCC (Oct 16, 2019)

stevelee said:


> In the week I have used the G5 on the trip, I have taken 1081 pictures including the ones of my feet and the floor. I leave it set on the page where the menu button takes me directly to the page to turn off the touch shutter “feature.” It doesn’t happen that often, now that I know what is happening.
> 
> I was waiting outside the Uffizi Gallery. As I sat, the camera fell out of my jacket pocket on to the pavement. The battery door came open, but the camera seems to be no worse for wear, even cosmetically.



Ugh..!!
I will have a pouch and slim strap or lanyard. I hope mine never fall out

BTW, did you use the flash? If yes, what is your opinion about it and how long can be the range?

Thanks!


----------



## stevelee (Oct 16, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Ugh..!!
> I will have a pouch and slim strap or lanyard. I hope mine never fall out
> 
> BTW, did you use the flash? If yes, what is your opinion about it and how long can be the range?
> ...


I’ve never tried the flash or thought I needed it. Also, I am touring in places where flash is not allowed. I did try out the flash one time on the G7 just to see how its spring would let you do bounce. I assume this flash works the same way.
With a f/1.8 lens, image stabilization, decent high ISO IQ, natural light is almost always more than adequate. As for fill-in flash, the “shadows“ slider in ACR almost always works well for that.


----------



## stevelee (Oct 16, 2019)

One thing to watch, this camera, like my old one, has an exposure compensation dial around and below the mode dial. I like that, but it makes it easy to turn the dial by accident. I did that yesterday and made a few over-exposed shots before I noticed it. They’ll probably be fine in post anyway, and we’re not of anything too important to me.


----------



## Kit. (Oct 16, 2019)

Doesn't it bother you that the camera is thicker than G7X? I'd say G7X is about the maximum thickness comfortable for a pocket camera, and G5X II is a bit too much.


----------



## stevelee (Oct 16, 2019)

Kit. said:


> Doesn't it bother you that the camera is thicker than G7X? I'd say G7X is about the maximum thickness comfortable for a pocket camera, and G5X II is a bit too much.


It still fits in my pants pocket. I haven’t noticed the difference in carrying it around for a week. YMMV. I had an S120 before, so I had to get used to the extra thickness of the G7. It also worked great in my jacket pocket yesterday until I sat down.

When I arrived in Rome on Tuesday last week, I took some pictures that afternoon. I later discovered that I had been using the G7X II, which I also brought along, so the difference was not so obvious. If the 5 still had the hump, I would have got the 7.


----------



## stevelee (Oct 23, 2019)

Now I have shot over 2000 pictures with the 5. Yesterday out in the sun on the Forum, I found the viewfinder quite useful.


----------



## stevelee (Oct 23, 2019)

Most of the time the autofocus works great. Since the little lens has a lot of depth of field, it shouldn’t be tricky. I find that tracking and facial recognition mode works best for me most of the time in this kind of shooting. In churches, it usually locks on Mary’s face. In landscapes it is sometimes fixated on something in the foreground and I can’t always change its mind easily. That probably says more about me than about the camera.

The slight extra zoom over the 7 comes in a little handier than I expected. All in all I am glad I bought it. When I have time, I may check settings on my 7 and set up the 5 more like it.


----------



## CANNOT (Oct 26, 2019)

I remember seeing the Canon Asia announcement (9th of July already)...




__





PowerShot G5 X Mark II & G7 X Mark III: Powered-Up Portability






snapshot.canon-asia.com




Mentioning:





Haven't heard about it since! That is until now...


----------



## stevelee (Oct 27, 2019)

In a spare moment out in the sun, I decided to review some recent shots. Never having had a camera with an EVR before, I decided to see whether I could see them through it. I was pleased to find that I can. The view is smaller than the screen, but it beats the screen when out in bright sun. The weather has been as beautiful these couple of days in Greece as it was in Italy. The sunset tonight in Athens was even more spectacular than from Fira yesterday, but I was on a bus, so I couldn’t get a good shot. The water still looked blue, and the line of orange reflection of the sun came all the way to shore. It was the kind of shot where you need to reduce saturation in Photoshop so people would believe you.


----------



## CANNOT (Oct 27, 2019)

I live at the beach, so catching stunning sunsets is a regular occurance. The G7 X Mark III gives a nice true to life touch when it comes to colors, much more so than my Huawei P30 Pro Leica setup.

The new V1.1.0 firmware update gives it a better C-AF now, though it's still not perfect. With a 24p firmware update coming as well, the G7 X Mark III is nicely on its way to redeem its PowerShot G-series vlogging cult status the original 2 managed to establish.

Do wish the G7 X Mark III would've gotten the G5 X Mark II's new lens (with an extra 20mm on the tele end, yet offering the same f/1.8-2.8 sensitivity, opposed to Sony RX100 Mark VI and VII that traded in sensitivity (now f/2.8-4.5 quickly falling off from wide) for range). I'm used to my P30 Pro now which has a wide angle, super wide angle, 5x optical and 10x hybrid which is remarkably flexible for such a small device. Tried zooming in to see a three-master sailing yacht more up close and the G7 X Mark III wasn't able to give me a more detailed look than my eyes provided, whilst my P30 Pro managed to give me more to go on for me to identify it as the 'Black Pearl' which apparently is regarded the largest sailing boat and won this year's 'sailing yacht of the year' award (so, wishing the G7 X Mark III had a bit more range, it's great for a vlogger who documents things from his/her perspective; just... I expected a little more flexibility to make it more suitable for a bit of filmmaking/photography). Makes you think if compact cameras perhaps need to follow the smartphone ways. Surely we've seen the Light L16 going about it in a similar fashion, but that was more a (2015 proof of) concept, than a device actual ready for mass market; but it started an importent trend and approach that's now ready for primetime. Though, multiple 1" sensors might be a bit of a fuss on a compact camera. Maybe it can have a revolver-style swap mechanism for the lenses and make the sensor stabilized opposed to the optics. Anyways...

FW US page: https://www.usa.canon.com/internet/...rshot-g7-x-mark-iii?subtab=downloads-firmware
FW EU page: https://www.canon-europe.com/suppor...es/powershot-g7-x-mark-iii.html?type=firmware
(Same file though)


----------



## stevelee (Nov 7, 2019)

I have got back to Rome, ready to leave for the airport. I have taken 3200 pictures with the G5X II during the trip.


----------



## PVCC (Nov 8, 2019)

Kit. said:


> Doesn't it bother you that the camera is thicker than G7X? I'd say G7X is about the maximum thickness comfortable for a pocket camera, and G5X II is a bit too much.



The difference is very small


----------



## Sporgon (Nov 10, 2019)

slclick said:


> In all seriousness, I have my eye on the G5 and the first price drops. It might be the travel camera and backup to my Canon FF bodies my M5 never was (not pocketable, still bringing the same gear and accessories, just smaller, button layout a crowded mess for large hands)


Sounds like you should try the G1X III ? As small as the G5X (Mark 1)


----------



## PVCC (Nov 10, 2019)

CANNOT said:


> I live at the beach, so catching stunning sunsets is a regular occurance. The G7 X Mark III gives a nice true to life touch when it comes to colors, much more so than my Huawei P30 Pro Leica setup.
> 
> The new V1.1.0 firmware update gives it a better C-AF now, though it's still not perfect. With a 24p firmware update coming as well, the G7 X Mark III is nicely on its way to redeem its PowerShot G-series vlogging cult status the original 2 managed to establish.
> 
> ...



Is it really coming a Firmware update for the G7X III to implement 24p?

I do hope it's also coming for the G5X III which is an excellent photo & video camera!!!
(No noticeable rolling shutter at 4K!!)


----------



## stevelee (Nov 11, 2019)

I got back from the trip to Italy and then a Mediterranean cruise on Friday. I took over 3200 pictures with the G5X II, and no video while I was away.


----------



## CANNOT (Nov 13, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Is it really coming a Firmware update for the G7X III to implement 24p?
> 
> I do hope it's also coming for the G5X III which is an excellent photo & video camera!!!
> (No noticeable rolling shutter at 4K!!)


Yup. No April Fools joke being played here.



> [..] introduce 24p (23.98fps) mode for video recording, via a series of future firmware updates for select models. Once downloaded, the free firmware updates will enable users to shoot 24p (23.98fps) in Full HD and 4K resolutions for the select models.
> 
> The first Canon models to benefit from the new 24p (23.98fps) firmware will be the recently launched EOS 90D and EOS RP in late October. The *Canon PowerShot G7 X Mark III and G5 X Mark II will follow by the end of December* and the EOS M6 Mark II update will be available during 2020.



https://www.canon.co.uk/press-centr...0/canon-confirm-24p-mode-for-video-recording/


----------



## stevelee (Nov 13, 2019)

CANNOT said:


> Yup. No April Fools joke being played here.
> 
> https://www.canon.co.uk/press-centr...0/canon-confirm-24p-mode-for-video-recording/



Since I’ve never had occasion to shoot 24p video, should I bother to install this update? Is there anything of value to me in the release, or does anybody know yet?


----------



## Kit. (Nov 13, 2019)

stevelee said:


> Since I’ve never had occasion to shoot 24p video, should I bother to install this update? Is there anything of value to me in the release, or does anybody know yet?


Have they already fixed the WiFi security hole? If not yet, it will likely be delivered in the same firmware update.


----------



## PVCC (Nov 13, 2019)

CANNOT said:


> Yup. No April Fools joke being played here.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.canon.co.uk/press-centr...0/canon-confirm-24p-mode-for-video-recording/



Oh, GREAT!!

I didn't see any official statement like that.

Really glad once again the "customers voice" (claims, bad reviews, comments on many Review sites, etc.) made impact and Canon includes what was "removed".

This reminds me the 5D2 case with the "Manual" settings for video mode..
That was epic.

BTW, by any chance you live in Estonia?


----------



## Jethro (Nov 13, 2019)

stevelee said:


> Since I’ve never had occasion to shoot 24p video, should I bother to install this update? Is there anything of value to me in the release, or does anybody know yet?


I haven't gone through the release in detail, but these firmware updates always include miscellaneous bug-fixes and minor enhancements etc, so its a good idea to do them if you have the chance.


----------



## CANNOT (Nov 16, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Oh, GREAT!!
> 
> I didn't see any official statement like that.
> 
> ...


Yup, I didn't expect that from 'Cripple Hammer' Canon. It was a clear marketing/segmentation move to conciously withhold certain things from certain cameras to boost sales in other areas. But wow, the shitstorm after the G7 X Mark III launch debackle was real. People were reviewing them left and right giving Canon bad notes on their C-AF, making use of stores' return policy. Not only was it not up to snuff compared to the competition, it was worse than its predecessor the G7 X Mark II. I don't think Canon foresaw that kind of pushback. They're used to blind consumers that buy their products no matter what. They had to pull a drastic save... and so a C-AF fix was issued (Panasonic has proven C-AF tweaks can make a camera go from awful to usable; but I like that Panasonic has individual settings for 'sensitivity' and 'speed' with like a parameter range from -3 to +3, so you kinda make your own algorithm hotspot)... as well as a 24p addition program for numerous products that had it omited. I hope they understand now that the way forward is to try and stay ahead of the Sonys, Panasonics and Fujifilms of this world that are really giving it their everything, holding nothing back. They can't just keep regurgitating old specs and only tweaking things slightly. They gotta keep innovating and pushing the limits. They've always been good at the basics... some models with frontfacing touchscreens, nice and easy interfaces, solid C-AF, pretty colors... but the C-AF now is worrysome... the competition has attractive looking colors now as well... etc.

Nope. From The Netherlands. Never set foot in Estonia before, unfortunately. Flew across many times though.


----------



## PVCC (Nov 16, 2019)

CANNOT said:


> Yup, I didn't expect that from 'Cripple Hammer' Canon. It was a clear marketing/segmentation move to conciously withhold certain things from certain cameras to boost sales in other areas. But wow, the shitstorm after the G7 X Mark III launch debackle was real. People were reviewing them left and right giving Canon bad notes on their C-AF, making use of stores' return policy. Not only was it not up to snuff compared to the competition, it was worse than its predecessor the G7 X Mark II. I don't think Canon foresaw that kind of pushback. They're used to blind consumers that buy their products no matter what. They had to pull a drastic save... and so a C-AF fix was issued (Panasonic has proven C-AF tweaks can make a camera go from awful to usable; but I like that Panasonic has individual settings for 'sensitivity' and 'speed' with like a parameter range from -3 to +3, so you kinda make your own algorithm hotspot)... as well as a 24p addition program for numerous products that had it omited. I hope they understand now that the way forward is to try and stay ahead of the Sonys, Panasonics and Fujifilms of this world that are really giving it their everything, holding nothing back. They can't just keep regurgitating old specs and only tweaking things slightly. They gotta keep innovating and pushing the limits. They've always been good at the basics... some models with frontfacing touchscreens, nice and easy interfaces, solid C-AF, pretty colors... but the C-AF now is worrysome... the competition has attractive looking colors now as well... etc.
> 
> Nope. From The Netherlands. Never set foot in Estonia before, unfortunately. Flew across many times though.



1,000% agree with you...
Let's hope Canon "learns" something from this.. (stone heads..)

If not, then the story should repeat, with the help of customers, reviewers, etc., to get un-crippled products.

Many nayers said it was impossible an update, nor Canon being "reading" this (or other) forums.

But in fact they do something of this kind. They do gather reactions from people and customers.

I already knew it as fact (source), and this step forward also shows that complains (and returns, as you said) CAN make an impact and change.

I love when a manufacturer delivers almost all possible potential to the user. Panasonic has done (Sony too), and that retrieves a bonus in sales & loyalty


----------



## Jethro (Nov 16, 2019)

Or to put it slightly differently (and more succinctly) Canon noted that a number of people buying these cameras wanted the 24p option, so they released a firmware fix giving it to them.


----------



## PVCC (Nov 16, 2019)

Jethro said:


> Or to put it slightly differently (and more succinctly) Canon noted that a number of people buying these cameras wanted the 24p option, so they released a firmware fix giving it to them.



Yes, but it's not that easy at all that a company improves the firmware of several cameras to make customers happier.

There must be a LOT of buzz/complains/bad reviews/etc. to achieve that.

Fortunately it happened, and Canon took the right decision. (Obviously, not only to make people happier, but to sale more & keep loyalty at some level)


----------



## Jethro (Nov 16, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Yes, but it's not that easy at all that a company improves the firmware of several cameras to make customers happier.
> 
> There must be a LOT of buzz/complains/bad reviews/etc. to achieve that.
> 
> Fortunately it happened, and Canon took the right decision. (Obviously, not only to make people happier, but to sale more & keep loyalty at some level)


Actually firmware updates seem to be a relatively regular occurrence with newer cameras, both to add new features (maybe developed after the initial release), to fix bugs etc and (yes) occasionally to add features that weren't included in the original menus. The best way to get them to do it seems to be to tell Canon Support directly - they seem to take more notice of that than endless threads in discussion sites.


----------



## PVCC (Nov 17, 2019)

Jethro said:


> Actually firmware updates seem to be a relatively regular occurrence with newer cameras, both to add new features (maybe developed after the initial release), to fix bugs etc and (yes) occasionally to add features that weren't included in the original menus. The best way to get them to do it seems to be to tell Canon Support directly - they seem to take more notice of that than endless threads in discussion sites.



No, it's not right that it's a "relatively regular occurrence". That might be the impression due to this particular but "abnormal" event.

Firmware updates are almost always only released to fix bugs ("phenomenons" on specific situations), "sometimes" (I remark it) to improve AF (LOT more common to improve sensitivity of central AF points on Optical Viewfinders of high-end DSLRs), to improve Compatibility with newer lenses, etc.

But VERY, VERY seldom to add a new feature.

This is especially true for Canon. I'm really old on this matter, and worked a lot about that. That's why I know it very well... Deeper than I ever expected.

I do hope Canon changes and opens mind, but it's a big Company (always seeking better sales and "protecting" different product segments).. and a VERY rigid managed one. (Don't confuse Canon USA with Canon Japan. ALL decisions are taken by Canon Japan)

This time we were VERY lucky indeed... Addition of 24p + improved AF on G7X III (I hope they also improve AF on G5X II)


----------



## stevelee (Nov 17, 2019)

I thought I posted this the other day, but it didn't show up here. As we left Venice just after sunset I took pictures from my stateroom balcony. This one was made at 1/20 sec at ISO 3200, handheld from a moving ship. I reduced noise in the sky a bit. I probably could have cut back on the highlights slider to reduce the flare from lights. It probably wouldn't blow up that great, but I still think it is a nice shot under the circumstances. I took another one that I might like a little better, but it was at ISO 6400, so a little noisier from the small sensor. I reduced the noise too much on the JPEG I did, so I'll probably go back and redo it.


----------



## PVCC (Nov 17, 2019)

stevelee said:


> I thought I posted this the other day, but it didn't show up here. As we left Venice just after sunset I took pictures from my stateroom balcony. This one was made at 1/20 sec at ISO 3200, handheld from a moving ship. I reduced noise in the sky a bit. I probably could have cut back on the highlights slider to reduce the flare from lights. It probably wouldn't blow up that great, but I still think it is a nice shot under the circumstances. I took another one that I might like a little better, but it was at ISO 6400, so a little noisier from the small sensor. I reduced the noise too much on the JPEG I did, so I'll probably go back and redo it.
> View attachment 187556


Great beautiful shot considering the situation!

I'm sure you could have lowered the shutter speed if you were on the ground, thanks to the image stabilization, hence decreasing ISO too.

The I.S. is a must have nowadays...

I have the Canon EF 24-70 2.8L II and still miss it a LOT to shoot handheld static subjects/landscapes in low light without needing to increase ISO, even when I have very good technique & use self-timer, etc


----------



## PVCC (Dec 26, 2019)

Hey!!

I finally got the G5X II camera 

I need to test it well, but the EVF seems very helpful (more than I expected) in sunlight situations where you can barely see the LCD

*IMPORTANT QUESTION*:

I tried to charge the Battery in the camera using the USB-C Port on the G5X II. But so far my cables didn't work...

Is the VERY expensive Canon USB-C Cable the ONLY way??
(I can't believe it... there must be a "normal"/not expensive USB-C Cable that works..)

Thanks!


----------



## stevelee (Dec 26, 2019)

PVCC said:


> Hey!!
> 
> I finally got the G5X II camera
> 
> ...


Congratulations! I hope you have as good results as I have with mine. The EVF really helps a lot in those situations. I'm still going through the 3200 pictures I shot in Europe. I've made it about halfway. There have been surprisingly few duds. There were three or four with bad focus, and then there were the pictures of the floor when somehow the touch screen shutter release was on when I thought it was off.

I've never tried charging the battery when it was in the camera. I made it through every day with enough charge until I got back to the hotel room or the ship.


----------



## PVCC (Dec 26, 2019)

stevelee said:


> Congratulations! I hope you have as good results as I have with mine. The EVF really helps a lot in those situations. I'm still going through the 3200 pictures I shot in Europe. I've made it about halfway. There have been surprisingly few duds. There were three or four with bad focus, and then there were the pictures of the floor when somehow the touch screen shutter release was on when I thought it was off.
> 
> I've never tried charging the battery when it was in the camera. I made it through every day with enough charge until I got back to the hotel room or the ship.



Hi!
Thanks for all your help, really appreciate, it was extremely helpful to me!

I'm setting "Favorite" custom menus, as I did on my DSLRs, and learning the features.

Still have to upgrade to the newer Firmware!! For 24p and supposed better AF (and a vulnerability patch)

*- About the USB-C port:* 
Not only is possible to charge the battery, which is really good if you are in the field and low battery, but you can also make the camera work without battery!

I did read it. The point is to find a proper power charger or maybe power bank to connect the cable. Someone told me is not only the USB-C cable.

So I'll keep trying. This feature can be really useful..
(I carry spare batteries anyway since they don't last too long, very small, but the option of charging/using via USB-C is very appealing to me)

I'll keep you informed if I find the proper way!

BTW, I also have to test the filter adapter, didn't have time yet, since G5X II came for Christmas 
I'll let you know about ut too.

Thanks a lot!


----------



## CANNOT (Dec 27, 2019)

@stevelee @PVCC You need a charger or powerbank that supports the *PD (Power Delivery) protocol*. Else it's not going to work.

I can recommend you the products of 'ROCK' on AliExpress and cables by UGreen. If you want to be ahead of your time, get this Baseus GaN charger.


----------



## PVCC (Dec 27, 2019)

CANNOT said:


> @stevelee @PVCC You need a charger or powerbank that supports the *PD (Power Delivery) protocol*. Else it's not going to work.
> 
> I can recommend you the products of 'ROCK' on AliExpress and cables by UGreen. If you want to be ahead of your time, get this Baseus GaN charger.



Hi CANNOT!!

Thanks a lot. I was expecting you would see my post and might help us, and fortunately you did! 

How can I know if a charger is PD comparible? It's always stated? I don't know what it means, nor didn't know it existed.

- I need to buy it at Amazon due to my country customs regulations, so will have to search for one.

- If I buy a charger supporting PD, then can I use my normal USB-C Cable? Or I do need a special cable too?

Thanks a lot!!


----------



## PVCC (Dec 27, 2019)

CANNOT said:


> @stevelee @PVCC You need a charger or powerbank that supports the *PD (Power Delivery) protocol*. Else it's not going to work.
> 
> I can recommend you the products of 'ROCK' on AliExpress and cables by UGreen. If you want to be ahead of your time, get this Baseus GaN charger.



Hi @CANNOT,

I found this at Amazon:



https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B07GWQ2GJC/



- Should it work to charge the G5X II using a "NORMAL" USB-C to USB-C cable?

- Since it has a USB-A port too, I suppose I could charge traditional devices via this port. What do you think? (It would solve the problem, avoiding to carry 2 chargers..)

Thanks a lot once again to all of you!


----------



## CANNOT (Dec 27, 2019)

@PVCC Yeah, Anker, RAVPower, Aukey etc are on Amazon as well and have USB-C PD chargers. Just make sure it says so. Enhanced compatibility with QC, FCP, AFC etc would be benificial if you have multiple different devices with different protocols as well. One USB-C ain't the other, there's different Amp ratings. My favourite one is the Meenova Ultra Type-C to Type-C USB 3.1 Gen-2 Cable 10Gbps, 100W PD (rated 5A), again on AliExpress however, but here as well on Amazon you'll find the likes of UGreen and Anker which provide solid 100W USB-C to USB-C (PD protocol via USB-C power socket output!) cables as well.


----------



## CANNOT (Dec 27, 2019)

So... having a quick glance... I'd personally get this charger:
- https://www.amazon.com/Charger-RAVPower-Adapter-Compatible-MacBook/dp/B07PLR7T1M/
with this cable:
- https://www.amazon.com/UGREEN-Delivery-Charging-Matebook-Chromebook/dp/B07V5MKXJ1/

But have a look around, maybe you can find something better.


----------



## Kit. (Dec 27, 2019)

PVCC said:


> https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B07GWQ2GJC/
> 
> 
> 
> ...


1. It _should_.

2. Based on similar Anker products, you should be able to charge your USB-C PD camera and your another USB (non-PD) device simultaneously.


----------



## PVCC (Dec 27, 2019)

CANNOT said:


> So... having a quick glance... I'd personally get this charger:
> - https://www.amazon.com/Charger-RAVPower-Adapter-Compatible-MacBook/dp/B07PLR7T1M/
> with this cable:
> - https://www.amazon.com/UGREEN-Delivery-Charging-Matebook-Chromebook/dp/B07V5MKXJ1/
> ...



@CANNOT,

Thanks!

So I also need a PD compatible USB-C Cable...

I need a charger to charge the G5X II AND my Samsung (micro USB) Smartphone

- If I buy the Anker I posted before ($11 cheaper than the Rawpower), *and the Cable you posted*, I could charge both devices? (Using a USB-A cable for my Samsung)

I'm "new" to this Power Delivery Feature/Protocol...

Thank you!


----------



## CANNOT (Dec 28, 2019)

Yup, it should.

Just, I always think in the future... so a high-Watt charger is obviously going to be more versatile and useful for you.


----------



## privatebydesign (Dec 28, 2019)

I have had very good experiences with various Hyperdrive products. I use this one a lot...








HyperJuice 87W/96W Dual USB-C/USB-A Charger — Dual USB-C PD3.0/QC4.0 + Dual USB-A QC3.0


The Hyper Juice 87W dual USB-C and USB-A charger has four ports and can quick-charge two USB-C devices and two USB-A devices simultaneously.




www.hypershop.com


----------



## PVCC (Dec 28, 2019)

privatebydesign said:


> I have had very good experiences with various Hyperdrive products. I use this one a lot...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It looks very nice, but I'm looking for something more in a budget..

I think I'll probably buy the Rawpower @CANNOT posted before or maybe an Amazon Basics charger with PD that I found.

I wonder if this cable would work (already have it) or should buy a new one..:



https://www.amazon.com/AmazonBasics-USB-Type-C-Charger-Cable/dp/B01GGKZ1VA/



- I need only 1 charger for the G5XII + any Smartphone I can carry (and Android tablet).

If I knew about Power Delivery feature, I'd have purchased all compatible cables before...


----------



## privatebydesign (Dec 28, 2019)

PVCC said:


> It looks very nice, but I'm looking for something more in a budget..
> 
> I think I'll probably buy the Rawpower @CANNOT posted before or maybe an Amazon Basics charger with PD that I found.
> 
> ...


Make sure any budget options have a huge number of positive reviews and few if any negative ones, the days of simple transformers as chargers are long gone and it can be easy to damage internal electrics of valuable devices using badly designed chargers.

I get on well with the linked one because it charges my laptop, iPad and phone, but it is bigger and more expensive than you need for two devices.

As for cables, wait until you are looking for Thunderbolt3 cables! They are $60 for a 2m cable and even then the functionality can be reduced, TB3 specs top out at a 1m cable!


----------



## PVCC (Dec 28, 2019)

I was checking the OEM Canon charger that came with my G5X II and this is unbelievable..

It outputs only 4.2V and *0.7A to the battery.*

So a normal USB-C charger should perfectly work, no need at all for high wattage to charge this very small battery... unless it charges in 1 minute 

Canon forces you to spend lot of money (~$120) on their USB Power Adapter PD-E1 (only 1 USB-C output and not handy/pocketable)

This kind of thing forces customer to buy another option, so annoying Canon...


----------



## CANNOT (Dec 29, 2019)

lol yeah the Kasey 'Cameraconspiracies' Stern Canon Cripple Hammer at work. Let's find something to annoy our customers with and makes them buy our other stuff... sigh.

Funny enough it was the Canon PowerShot SX1 IS that got me into video (one of the first cameras that did 1080p... and it was hackable with CHDK)... but following that, I never tried my luck with them ever again. xD I've had Nikon cameras... Olympus, but mainly Panasonic, since the GH2 onwards.

But a lot of the YouTube community swore by the Canon G7 X Mark II for vlogging and the idea of a little pocketable do-it-all with a bit more versatility than a smartphone appealed to me (I used to shoot with my Panasonic LX100 premium compact quite a bit, but my Huawei/Leica collab P20 Pro and then P30 Pro made me leave it at home) so I figured the G7 X Mark III might get me back on the Canon train. Off to a rough start. At least they addressed the C-AF with firmware, which helped... a little. The omited 24p got put back in again; should've been there from the start, but alas. Unfortunately Panasonic's successor to the LX100: the Mark II was a little lacklustre, very disappointed there and Sony... ugh, wouldn't spend a whole sum of money on one. Nikon should've gone through with that very promising looking DL line-up of premium compacts, such a shame. Hopefully some further firmware will fix the rest of the G7 X Mark III C-AF quirks. Panasonic has shown with their cameras that C-AF FW update fixes really can amount to significant improvement.


----------



## PVCC (Dec 31, 2019)

CANNOT said:


> lol yeah the Kasey 'Cameraconspiracies' Stern Canon Cripple Hammer at work. Let's find something to annoy our customers with and makes them buy our other stuff... sigh.
> 
> Funny enough it was the Canon PowerShot SX1 IS that got me into video (one of the first cameras that did 1080p... and it was hackable with CHDK)... but following that, I never tried my luck with them ever again. xD I've had Nikon cameras... Olympus, but mainly Panasonic, since the GH2 onwards.
> 
> But a lot of the YouTube community swore by the Canon G7 X Mark II for vlogging and the idea of a little pocketable do-it-all with a bit more versatility than a smartphone appealed to me (I used to shoot with my Panasonic LX100 premium compact quite a bit, but my Huawei/Leica collab P20 Pro and then P30 Pro made me leave it at home) so I figured the G7 X Mark III might get me back on the Canon train. Off to a rough start. At least they addressed the C-AF with firmware, which helped... a little. The omited 24p got put back in again; should've been there from the start, but alas. Unfortunately Panasonic's successor to the LX100: the Mark II was a little lacklustre, very disappointed there and Sony... ugh, wouldn't spend a whole sum of money on one. Nikon should've gone through with that very promising looking DL line-up of premium compacts, such a shame. Hopefully some further firmware will fix the rest of the G7 X Mark III C-AF quirks. Panasonic has shown with their cameras that C-AF FW update fixes really can amount to significant improvement.



Yes, several times I criticized Canon for crippling Cameras (and did spread that a lot)

But well, I'm really happy that the bad-reviews/complains/forum chat, etc. made them take the right way to improve Firmware of many cameras (90D, R, Rp, G7X III & G5X II) to implement what should have been there: 24p, and improving the AF on the latest G7X III & G5X II (besides the security patch)

Well, aside that, I'll buy the RawPower charger you posted & some cables, also a PD compatible Car charger. With that I'll be able to charge almost anything with just 1 charger 

Let's hope (and encourage if necessary) people keep complaining and posting bad reviews when something is not good. THAT increases the chance for Firmware update A LOT (the facts demonstrates it, especially since 2009 with the EOS 5D2)

Happy new year!!

Cheers!


----------



## stevelee (Jan 3, 2020)

Brain surgery was a success. I installed the firmware update tonight, and the patient lived. Something not mentioned earlier which I think was a change is that you can select 4K video when you have face, etc., autofocus set. I don't think you could do that with the previous version.

I can now shoot video at the magical 24fps rate, or at least at 23.98. I'm still a bit skeptical that it will make my videos shot with a 1" sensor capable of being projected in movie theaters. But then I haven't ever tried shooting at that rate. Question: before I submit my magnum opus to Sundance and Cannes, do I need to convert it to actual 24fps like real movies, or does the magic still happen and they will accept it at 23.98?

I note that that frame rate is available in both 4K and 1080p. I also downloaded the revised manual.


----------



## PVCC (Jan 3, 2020)

Great!

Good to know. I still have to do it.

- To your question:
24p, or in fact 23.98 fps in this case ( the EOS 5D4 has an option for "real cinema 24p"), has 2 main advantages:

1- Real-Film-Like looking (IF it is shot *correctly*, I mean it's not the only factor. Lighting is also a key factor, 1/48 or 2/50 shutter speed for the 180° rule, Color grading is also huge key factor, etc.)

2- since there are less frames per second and the bit rate is the same, each frame has bit higher image quality.

-- For Sundance you can send almost in any frame rate. They projects digital media in latest digital projectors.
Not sure about Cannes, probably the same.

They specify the type of media they accept.
No need to transfer to real film at that stage.
That's only needed for projecting on movies around the world (not all movies can project digital content even in USA)

Cheers Mr. Director!


----------



## stevelee (Jan 3, 2020)

I think there is software that will add scratches and film grain, too.

The firmware update was really quite easy and painless, at least working from a Mac and using a memory card for the transfer. The main thing that can go wrong is if your camera battery goes dead or somebody hits a button on the camera during the update and aborts the process partway through. So the moral is to charge the battery before you start, and set the camera down in a safe place and don't touch it until the screen goes blank, showing that the update is complete and the camera turned itself off. It seems like the process took 10 or 15 minutes. Maybe it was less. So it is not going to stress a charged battery.


----------



## PVCC (Jan 3, 2020)

stevelee said:


> I think there is software that will add scratches and film grain, too.
> 
> The firmware update was really quite easy and painless, at least working from a Mac and using a memory card for the transfer. The main thing that can go wrong is if your camera battery goes dead or somebody hits a button on the camera during the update and aborts the process partway through. So the moral is to charge the battery before you start, and set the camera down in a safe place and don't touch it until the screen goes blank, showing that the update is complete and the camera turned itself off. It seems like the process took 10 or 15 minutes. Maybe it was less. So it is not going to stress a charged battery.



Yes! There are many ways to add grain / scratches in case you want it to look as an old film. But with film-looking i didn't mean an "old film" looking 

Yes, Firmware update is quite easy but needs the care you said:
- 100% charged battery
- no touching the camera at all in the process

I updated mines many times without problems. Usually it's worth to get the improvements and fixes.

Some lenses even have Firmware updates that are done via the camera attached to the lens.

Cheers!


----------



## stevelee (Jan 4, 2020)

I threw in the scratches and grain comment partly in jest. I am amused and bemused by the whole “film look” thing. (If there were such a thing as “c-mused,” I’d probably be that, too.)

And if I wanted an old film look, I’d shoot black-and-white at 16 or 18 fps.


----------



## PVCC (Jan 4, 2020)

stevelee said:


> I threw in the scratches and grain comment partly in jest. I am amused and bemused by the whole “film look” thing. (If there were such a thing as “c-mused,” I’d probably be that, too.)
> 
> And if I wanted an old film look, I’d shoot black-and-white at 16 or 18 fps.



Lolll

B&W at 16fps looks nice!!

Years ago one of the 1st Canon Rebels shot at 20fps and almost everybody complained it wasn't useful for movie making, and they were right.

Canon sometimes releases annoying things

Well, let's enjoy the 24p and improved AF!!


----------



## stevelee (Jan 4, 2020)

I didn’t shoot any video in Europe, but I didn’t have focus problems at all in stills. In Italy of course I was shooting a lot church interiors and religious art in museums. The facial recognition seemed always to find Mary no matter who all were in the frame. I kept the red light beam turned off, so low light focus was more of a challenge presumably, but it almost always did fine.


----------



## PVCC (Jan 8, 2020)

Hi friends!

I updated the Firmware of my G5XII. 

Yesterday I was setting up the "Favorite" menu (most handy functions, a great idea from Canon since some years ago), and also testing some features I didn't know.

I was really impressed with some of them, which I don't even have in my 5D4 and I don't think there are available on other Canon DSLRs. Some are very simple, yet very handy.

I'll write more about the video recording (many options) later since i have to go out now

Cheers


----------



## stevelee (Jan 9, 2020)

I look forward to your telling us about your discoveries. 

I bought a car last month, and am still discovering features and running into things I don't understand. (The other day a green foot showed up like a warning light on the dash.) Yesterday the dealer's tech guy came by to sync the car to my garage door opener. He told me a few more things, and I asked some questions, like what is the little plastic loop thing that came with the owner's manual. He showed me a storage compartment to the left of the steering wheel that I didn't know was there. I thought that handle opened the hood. There are at least five ways to change radio stations. I'm not exactly a technophobe. I've had my own computers since 1980, when you needed to know a lot more than you do now, and had my own web site since 1996. I'm at least at the intermediate level using Photoshop, FCP X, etc. It makes me wonder how more tech-challenged folks fare with modern cars.

So with the camera, it is so neat that there can be new things to discover in a Powershot camera for someone who has used similar models for some years, and has used this one for thousands of stills so far. I did notice that after the update there were more video options and more were available in more autofocus modes.

Speaking of my web site, my trip pictures with this camera (except for the first few, when I had accidentally taken the G7X II along rather than the 5) starting on this page for Rome. Other cities are indexed on this temporary page. There are many more pages than you will want to look at, and I haven't even got to the cruise portion yet. But maybe a sampling could give an idea about the camera. Of course I cropped, straightened, and resized for the web in ACR and Photoshop. For cramped interiors and wide landscape vistas and long ceilings, I did some stitching. (I did miss my 16-35L.) I've been surprised how most of the time I prefer As Shot color balance to other options, as with my other Canon cameras.

One photo that might be of some interest is an HDR I did of a church that was closed and totally dark. The front door was open, but as I looked over the barrier at the ceiling, it was too dark for me to see anything. I held up the camera and took shots at normal auto exposure, and +1 and +3 stops. This is how ACR merged them:


----------



## PVCC (Jan 16, 2020)

stevelee said:


> I look forward to your telling us about your discoveries.
> 
> I bought a car last month, and am still discovering features and running into things I don't understand. (The other day a green foot showed up like a warning light on the dash.) Yesterday the dealer's tech guy came by to sync the car to my garage door opener. He told me a few more things, and I asked some questions, like what is the little plastic loop thing that came with the owner's manual. He showed me a storage compartment to the left of the steering wheel that I didn't know was there. I thought that handle opened the hood. There are at least five ways to change radio stations. I'm not exactly a technophobe. I've had my own computers since 1980, when you needed to know a lot more than you do now, and had my own web site since 1996. I'm at least at the intermediate level using Photoshop, FCP X, etc. It makes me wonder how more tech-challenged folks fare with modern cars.
> 
> ...




*EDITED* some parts & added comments at bottom
---

Wow... your car has lot of secret features 

Well, after bit more testing my GX5 II I found (brief list, sorry, lack of time)

- in VIDEO Mode (Video-cam icon, the only mode you can record 4K so far) you also have option to record HDR Video (at FullHD.. I initially thought it was 4K and said wooooaahh! But not..)

4K & FullHD is excellent, better than 5D4 in terms of Sharpness and anti-aliassing

Of course you can also record in Full Manual mode.

Press the button in center of wheel for options.

- You can Optically Zoom in/out very smoothly pressing the lever around release button

- you can also have Peaking, a must-have feature that the 5D4 SHOULD have... (so possible via Firmware...)

- You CAN change Shutter Speed WHILE recording video, even as low as 1/8!! The 5D4 cannot go so low.
Also Aperture and ISO.
Aperture changes are very smooth. ISO changes are not smooth (opposed to 5D4)

- Clicking wheel to Right Disable/Enable Servo AF/AF/MF while recording

- Same but Up does something I don't remember right now

- Pressing and holding the wheel Down for 1 second turns the LCD Brightness to Maximum (VERY handy). Repeating it, go back to previous Brightness adjusted level

- I noticed that LCD Brightness high or at max. Level shows somewhat "washed out" image, not "true" compared to viewing it on a computer.

Initially I was concerned because the IQ displayed on the camera's LCD didn't seem to be as sharp as some pictures I already watched on another screen.
So I took some tests pics, and realized the Camera LCD is not so good as a monitor, especially at high brightness level, because the pictures were very good when I checked them on the monitor.

- Best Sharpness seems to be achieved at *f/4* in most cases.

Weakest points are corners, as expected, but highly improved from wide open to f/4.

IMO It's remarkable the Sharpness of this Zoom lens, especially considering the fast aperture and long focal range.

It was a VERY important point to me, as pro photographer, before buying, and what I get is as expected compared with full-res pictures I got before.
I'm very happy with the performance.

F/8 or narrower is noticeable lees sharp than f/4. So if needed, it's much better to use the ND or speed up the shutter.

- There's an option to use ELECTRONIC SHUTTER when shooting ONE SHOT mode.
I don't know if there's a difference in IQ with mechanical shutter.
*I have to test it carefully.*
NOTE: My Panasonic M4/3 Lumix G7 DOES deliver a bit SHARPER image when using Electronic Shutter.

I didn't know that until I discovered it when checking DPReview image comparison Tool, and the confirmed it in my own G7 Camera...

-- IQ of Video is GREAT.
Small rolling shutter/jello effect at 4K and no crop (unless Electronic IS enabled) is incredible!!
Almost none jello at FullHD.

The 5D4 4K jello is AWFUL and it's sensor cropped.

With this little camera I can get 24mm - 120mm 4K Video without those issues.

-- It DOES HEAT UP on 4K.
I recorded max. Length time (8.4GB file!!) and some minutes later of doing things the G5X II Shut down due to overheating (warning icon appeared minutes earlier of shutting down). For faster cooling, I removed Battery AND SD Card (which was hot indeed) and left battery door open.

It's recommended you do NOT put camera on Video mode unless you will record. It seems to me that in that mode the G5X II heats up even if you are not recording (heats up faster when recording)

FullHD doesn't seem to have overheating problems.

-- SOME THINGS I MISS:

. Mic-in (already knew it)
. External Flash mount (idem) or at least a Sync port, cause the IQ is so good I could carry an external flash if needed (but built-in Flash works great for short range)
. Extended battery life (very short)
. Vari-angle articulated LCD, which I have on a 70D and prefer lot more than this tilt-only system

PS:

1. I Ordered 61W RawPower Charger & cable with Power Delivery feature, to be able to carry 1 charger-for-everything (USB-C + USB-A) ideal for travel, let's see how fast the battery is charged in-camera compared to external charger and if I can power the G5X2 directly from cable without battery

2. I'm using the Filter Adapter, to protect the lens. Peace of mind to me. It makes G5X2 thicker, not "so" pocketable, but anyway (I bought 3 carrying cases, finally the Large from Amazon was the right one).
I can also attach a CPL or ND Filter, although with CPL (thicker) at 24mm AND Macro the filter produces a bit Vignetting since it was designed for G7X II which is a bit smaller in lens diameter.
I purchased Hoya kit of Slim filters (good quality coated filters, always use them on big lenses too, unless using the Super-Multicoated versions)

ADDED ON EDIT:

I tested connecting an external monitor to G5X2 and it CAN display everything, even while recording at 4k!
The Camera LCD turns off, but if you ever need a bigger screen while recording, you have it.

My Panasonic G7 unfortunately does not display on external monitor when recording...

- Since it does work on the G5X2 while recording, *I'm trying to find a way to move the AF focus square while recording*, since the touchscreen LCD turns off.

-- If anybody knows how to move it, please let me know!

P.P.S: After all, this post wasn't brief, but I wanted to share my findings with you... 

Cheers!

(If you did read this on email notification, *read it here again, because I updated it*)


----------



## stevelee (Jan 16, 2020)

Thanks so much. I have saved those comments so I don't have to find this page for reference. I doubt that I will encounter a lot of those things, but they are good to know about. I don't shoot much video. If things go as in the past, I will have a little project in June. Shooting is mostly in bursts of a minute or two, so maybe I can do 4K without overheating.

I'm not surprised that f/4 is a sweet spot. The actual focal length of the little lens and the small size of the sensor would mean diffraction's ugly head is raised before stopping down much. The autoexposure seems to do a good job optimizing the settings.

As I continue going through my pictures from the trip, I am more and more impressed with how good this little camera is. (I'm also enjoying the car a lot.)


----------



## PVCC (Jan 16, 2020)

stevelee said:


> Thanks so much. I have saved those comments so I don't have to find this page for reference. I doubt that I will encounter a lot of those things, but they are good to know about. I don't shoot much video. If things go as in the past, I will have a little project in June. Shooting is mostly in bursts of a minute or two, so maybe I can do 4K without overheating.
> 
> I'm not surprised that f/4 is a sweet spot. The actual focal length of the little lens and the small size of the sensor would mean diffraction's ugly head is raised before stopping down much. The autoexposure seems to do a good job optimizing the settings.
> 
> As I continue going through my pictures from the trip, I am more and more impressed with how good this little camera is. (I'm also enjoying the car a lot.)



Oh, I forgot to say that in Video mode there's an option of Auto level, which compensates small tilts of the camera to the sides, similar to digital image stabilization but for leveling.

Yes, IQ is great, main reason I decided to get it and not carry a very expensive gear, also VERY discrete compared to a DSLR + Zoom lens, the tool I needed for daily carry in pocket or small case and urban photography

Drive safe!


----------



## PVCC (Jan 25, 2020)

Hey guys,

I want to share this with you. Good news!

I received the charger and cables, tested with the G5X II and *I can confirm*:

1- You CAN change the battery inside the camera via USB-C

2- You CAN turn ON and USE the camera WITHOUT any battery inside, powering the camera via USB-C

No need to buy the extremely expensive Canon power adapter.

The Key is, as @CANNOT told before, use a Charger and USB-C Cable *compatibles with "Power Delivery" (PD) standard.*

I'll also buy a Car charger (cigarette-type), I found many with USB-C Power Delivery Compatibility as well as USB-A to charge other devices.

This is GREAT because the battery life is considerably short (I always carry spare batts), so being able to charge in-camera is really handy.

Thanks to everybody once again!!

Have nice weekend!!

PS: I decided to buy a powerful 61W charger, future-proof as @CANNOT suggested. A bit heavy compared to my Samsung standard USB-C charger, but with it I can charge any mobile of any kind, plus the camera batteries.
I also have a LP-E6 USB charger, but in that case I'd very probably use the standard Canon wall charger


----------



## stevelee (Jan 25, 2020)

Thanks for the info. On my trip I shot thousands of pictures, but never near 200 in a given day. I never ran out of battery charge, and was always where I could recharge the battery at night. I didn't shoot any video. I didn't even bother to check whether the G7X II battery was the same so I could swap it, because I never needed to. I do know they use the same charger, so I took just one charger with me for both cameras. It turned out that I didn't need to use the other camera either. I picked it up by mistake from my bag when I arrived in Rome, so my first shots were made with that camera, which worked out fine anyway. Otherwise, it was along just to be a backup. With a new camera, besides allowing for things that might go wrong with a new camera, there was the chance I wouldn't like it as well or might not be enough used to it, and might want to revert to the familiar model. That didn't happen, of course, but having an extra little camera in my bag was not a problem.


----------



## PVCC (Jan 25, 2020)

stevelee said:


> Thanks for the info. On my trip I shot thousands of pictures, but never near 200 in a given day. I never ran out of battery charge, and was always where I could recharge the battery at night. I didn't shoot any video. I didn't even bother to check whether the G7X II battery was the same so I could swap it, because I never needed to. I do know they use the same charger, so I took just one charger with me for both cameras. It turned out that I didn't need to use the other camera either. I picked it up by mistake from my bag when I arrived in Rome, so my first shots were made with that camera, which worked out fine anyway. Otherwise, it was along just to be a backup. With a new camera, besides allowing for things that might go wrong with a new camera, there was the chance I wouldn't like it as well or might not be enough used to it, and might want to revert to the familiar model. That didn't happen, of course, but having an extra little camera in my bag was not a problem.


Hi!

I usually run out of battery because I'm still testing it a lot, trying to learn all the features, and setting it up to the best.

I saved C mode with my favorite settings, and as mentioned earlier, I made my Favorite menus, all ordered with my priorities, as I did on my 5D4, so to have all cameras with very similar menus.

I was just testing the lowest possible shutter speed I can use without blurring, and a function that takes several pics in a burst to combine and reduce noise.

So, after this learning & setting curve I'll probably use lot less the battery, unless I record many videos (which I'll probably do, since 24mm with IS is very useful for my needs)

Great little camera.

Oh, BTW, I have to download the Canon software to process RAW files, since I don't have latest Adobe Photoshop. I'll also try another software I own, maybe it can handle the .cr2 of the G5XII


----------



## stevelee (Jan 25, 2020)

The G5X II raw files are .cr3.


----------



## PVCC (Jan 26, 2020)

stevelee said:


> The G5X II raw files are .cr3.



In Picture quality:

You can choose between standard RAW .CR2 and "cRAW" .CR3 (Smaller, compressed raw, with - I'm almost sure - some loose of data)


----------



## stevelee (Jan 26, 2020)

PVCC said:


> In Picture quality:
> 
> You can choose between standard RAW .CR2 and "cRAW" .CR3 (Smaller, compressed raw, with - I'm almost sure - some loose of data)


I didn't know that. Since Photoshop deals with .CR3 files just fine, I don't need to change. With 64GB and 128GB cards, I don't see any point in risking data loss in Raw files.


----------



## PVCC (Feb 9, 2020)

stevelee said:


> I didn't know that. Since Photoshop deals with .CR3 files just fine, I don't need to change. With 64GB and 128GB cards, I don't see any point in risking data loss in Raw files.



*EDITED - See P.S.*
___

I want to rectify myself:

This camera RAW file extension is indeed .CR3

There's an option to save cRAW which I understand as compressed-RAW which is mentioned in page 104 of User Guide.

It says the RAW data is saved in "more compact" file size. No mention to loose some data or not.

My guess is it doesn't loose data, otherwise Canon should tell. (Although Nikon, if I recall it right, had, or has, some RAW format with some loose of info, but not 100% sure)

*EDITED - P.S.:*

I found this on Google, that explains a bit about the CR3 (new file format used by Canon Mirrorless cameras), and the "cRAW" (compressed RAW) option, which according to that post the cRAW does loose some data... 

It would be very good to research with care about this.

*Link:* https://expertphotography.com/cr3-file/

.


----------



## stevelee (Feb 10, 2020)

Thanks for checking on these things. There again I can’t see any need for me to shoot cRaw. But if the occasion comes up, I know it is a possibility.

These guys found just a slight loss in dynamic range: https://www.dpreview.com/articles/0483301097/quick-look-canons-new-compressed-raw-format


----------

