# ALERT - TSA declares all cameras need to come out of your bag at security



## ahsanford (Jul 26, 2017)

Ouch: _ "The TSA just announced that all electronics larger than a cell phone need to be placed into a bin for separate screening."
_
https://petapixel.com/2017/07/26/tsa-requires-separate-screening-cameras-airports-now/

More, from TSA (see link inside of the PP link above):

_"The stronger security measures do not apply to passengers enrolled in TSA Pre✓® who are using TSA Pre✓® lanes. TSA also marked another milestone earlier this month with TSA Pre✓® now available at 200 airports nationwide. Travelers enrolled in TSA Pre✓® do not need to remove shoes, 3-1-1 liquids, laptops, electronics, light outerwear, or belts. The program allows TSA to focus resources on passengers who may pose a high risk to security while providing expedited screening to those travelers who have been identified as low-risk, trusted travelers."
_
Going out on a very short and sturdy limb here: TSA-Pre membership is about to skyrocket.

- A


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 26, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> _"The stronger security measures do not apply to passengers enrolled in TSA Pre✓® who are using TSA Pre✓® lanes._



Well, that works for me, at least. 




ahsanford said:


> Going out on a very short and sturdy limb here: TSA-Pre membership is about to skyrocket.



Not sure that too many people use anything other than their cell phone... 

For anyone considering signing up for Precheck who also travels internationally, I'd suggest looking at the Global Entry program. Makes it much easier coming back into the country (basically, you get to cut the lines), and it comes with automatic Precheck enrollment.


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## ahsanford (Jul 26, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > _"The stronger security measures do not apply to passengers enrolled in TSA Pre✓® who are using TSA Pre✓® lanes._
> ...



+1. Best $17/year spend a traveler could possibly make.

- A


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## stevelee (Jul 26, 2017)

My G7X II, the camera I travel with, might be small enough not to have to come out. But I have the Precheck anyway. Didn't help me flying home from Dublin, though. But I do feel like my $85 for five years was well spent. I usually fly just a few times a year, but I think of it as costing $17 a year, so easily worth it. 

Something that some of you might need to note is that after this fall, more states' drivers licenses will not be useful for ID. I'll start using my passport on domestic flights.


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## Don Haines (Jul 26, 2017)

I don't think I have ever had a flight when security did not ask this.......


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## Mikehit (Jul 26, 2017)

I have never been asked. 
One time when gong through security in UK I jokingly said 'do you want me to take out my camera? It is really a computer with a lens attached'.


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 26, 2017)

stevelee said:


> But I have the Precheck anyway. Didn't help me flying home from Dublin, though. But I do feel like my $85 for five years was well spent.



That's where Global Entry comes in, and at only $3 more per year (GE is $100 for 5 years), the time saves on even one international trip return is worth it, IMO (but I will point out that GE requires an interview with DHS, usually at an airport). When I fly back into Logan from an international trip, I'm invariably at the baggage carousels before the luggage even starts coming out, and the dedicated exit lane means I'm out of the airport as soon as I get my suitcase.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jul 27, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> Going out on a very short and sturdy limb here: TSA-Pre membership is about to skyrocket.
> 
> - A



They have billboards advertising it here in Spokane, so they do want it to skyrocket.


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## zim (Jul 27, 2017)

TBH I've never heard of 'precheck' I've also never understood why a camera doesn't have to come out as per computer equipment or how jam is a liquid. ???
So with precheck security is now just another money making exercise?


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## nonac (Jul 27, 2017)

I am so glad I have TSA pre-check through my clearance vetting for my day job!


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## gregorywood (Jul 27, 2017)

I have considered signing up for TSA Precheck many times but didn't think it worth the cost. 

As of 10 minutes ago, I have an appointment next Tuesday at one of their locations for fingerprinting and document review. Given the latest additional delays for cameras, I'm all in.


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## grainier (Jul 27, 2017)

I am so tired of government agencies who are incapable of doing anything abouth the illegal behavior and going after law-abiding citizens instead.


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## Jopa (Jul 27, 2017)

F TSA. $17 means nothing but that's not about money. I pay enough taxes.


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## Luds34 (Jul 27, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > ahsanford said:
> ...



Spend the extra 3 bucks a year and get Global Entry, best money I ever spent. I felt it paid for itself just the first time I came back through customs.


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## Luds34 (Jul 27, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> stevelee said:
> 
> 
> > But I have the Precheck anyway. Didn't help me flying home from Dublin, though. But I do feel like my $85 for five years was well spent.
> ...



Doh! You beat me to it.


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## Chaitanya (Jul 27, 2017)

grainier said:


> I am so tired of government agencies who are incapable of doing anything abouth the illegal behavior and going after law-abiding citizens instead.


Its the same story all over the world. Tape that those airport security guys use to cover terminals of batteries is horrible it leaves behind residue and it just ruins the trip sometimes.


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## AlanF (Jul 27, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> stevelee said:
> 
> 
> > But I have the Precheck anyway. Didn't help me flying home from Dublin, though. But I do feel like my $85 for five years was well spent.
> ...



Slowcoach - we cabin luggage only brigade are out way before then.


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## Joakim (Jul 27, 2017)

It is probably due to english not being my primary language, but when it states "take out of your carry-on" i read that as "needs to be in your checked-in luggage".

I have been taking all electronics, and anything with any metal on it, and arranging them in the trays for years. You have not been doing this in USA?


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## Mikehit (Jul 27, 2017)

Ni. It means you need to do the same thing as you do with the laptop - you take it out of your bag and place it in a tray to put it through the X-ray scanner. After that you can put it back in the bag and carry it into the cabin.


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## Khalai (Jul 27, 2017)

Mikehit said:


> Ni. It means you need to do the same thing as you do with the laptop - you take it out of your bag and place it in a tray to put it through the X-ray scanner. After that you can put it back in the bag and carry it into the cabin.



I've always done that with my camera gear for years anyway. For EU and non-EU flight alike. Usually, they are satisfied with open camera bag on a tray, never needed to unload body or lenses separately...


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## AlanF (Jul 27, 2017)

I have been taking my cameras and telephoto lenses in my carry-on luggage for years closed cases all over the world and have been asked to take them out or even open a case. The international regulations require just laptops and notepads, as well as toiletries to be in trays. It's crazy really - my 400mm lenses could have serious amounts of explosives in them, unlike my iPad.


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 27, 2017)

AlanF said:


> Slowcoach - we cabin luggage only brigade are out way before then.



I can do that with short trips, two days or so. For longer trips, 2-3 suits, 4-5 shirts, shoes, tripod, a change of casual clothes, etc., won't all fit in a carry on. For me, international trips are usually a few days in duration, which helps make the flights worthwhile (although I did once do a round trip to Switzerland where I was there for only ~4 hours). Except for Canada, from here an international flight generally means at least five hours in the air, whereas from the UK, international could be done in a puddle jumper. Reminds me of when I lived in San Francisco, where a driving trip to the next state was a major undertaking…but here in New England, I can drive through three states in my lunch hour.


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## degos (Jul 27, 2017)

zim said:


> TBH I've never heard of 'precheck' I've also never understood why a camera doesn't have to come out as per computer equipment or how jam is a liquid. ???
> So with precheck security is now just another money making exercise?



Of course it's just revenue.

Once someone has passed PreCheck they could still be cajoled, threatened or blackmailed into nefarious action or into carrying something 'electronic'. 

If PreCheck really was the solution to security issues then everyone would have to undergo the same screening before flying.


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## Orangutan (Jul 27, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> AlanF said:
> 
> 
> > Slowcoach - we cabin luggage only brigade are out way before then.
> ...



Yes, out here in the western U.S., sometimes driving to the next county (no "r") is an all-day trip.


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 27, 2017)

degos said:


> Of course it's just revenue.
> 
> Once someone has passed PreCheck they could still be cajoled, threatened or blackmailed into nefarious action or into carrying something 'electronic'.
> 
> If PreCheck really was the solution to security issues then everyone would have to undergo the same screening before flying.



I disagree, at least it's not _directly_ about revenue. If it were mainly about revenue from travelers, they would charge a lot more. For example, 'gold parking' at Logan Airport in Boston costs $300 for the first year and $100 annually thereafter. All that offers is the convenience of a guaranteed parking space near the terminal...you still have to pay the same parking rates as everyone else. 

I suppose one could argue that it's about revenue from the standpoint of lower TSA labor costs because of expedited screening, but that holds true only if you believe TSA cares about how long people have to wait in line, and I doubt they do (at least until it gets so bad that constituencies force their elected representatives to take action at the legislative level). 

Rather, PreCheck/Global Entry is really about risk management...prescreened passangers are lower risk. The Real ID requirement (mentioned above, where lack of state compliance with drivers license issuance policies mean those IDs aren't valid for air travel) is similar, it in effect means states must run a (limited) background check before issuing the license.


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## AlanF (Jul 27, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> AlanF said:
> 
> 
> > Slowcoach - we cabin luggage only brigade are out way before then.
> ...



2-3 suits! A commentary on a topological paper in _Nature_ on how many ways to knot a tie started with: "When I go to a conference, I have to raid the dirty linen basket to find suitable casual clothes".

Generally, for business trips I travel with smart casual jacket and trousers, and for conferences hardly that. A regular 55x40x25 cm suitcase will house my extensive electrical gear, toiletries, medicines, 5 shirts, 5 underpants, 5 pairs of socks, a pair of chinos and leave room over. If I stay longer, I wash the laundry with hotel shampoo and allow to dry over the bath. I take one pair of shoes that can be used for formal and walking. My camera gear goes in a 30x20x10cm case (5DIV + 100-400mm II). If I really need a suit, I'll wear it. Even Ryanair allows two cabin items now.

On holiday with the wife, I admit it's a big suitcase in the hold, with the 55x40x25 cm case taking to the 400mm DO II etc etc.


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## kaihp (Jul 27, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> stevelee said:
> 
> 
> > But I have the Precheck anyway. Didn't help me flying home from Dublin, though. But I do feel like my $85 for five years was well spent.
> ...



Global Entry is great _if_ you can use it. Besides US citizens (and lawful permanent residents) it is only available to citizens of 13 countries


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## amorse (Jul 27, 2017)

I think I've been asked to take out my camera gear nearly every time I've traveled with it. My bag's camera compartment is not in an obvious place, so it's always a question of how long I let the agent fumble with the bag before I show them where the zipper is. Offer to help too soon and they think I'm hiding something, offer too late and they can get pretty aggressive with the bag :-\


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## Mikehit (Jul 27, 2017)

Traveling from the UK to Europe, the only time I have been asked to take my camera out of my bag was when they could not see what was what on the X-ray screen. When taking my laptop out pre-check, I have asked if they wanted to see my camera as well and they said no. 
My last trip to US was late 2016 so maybe that is the reason?


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## Luds34 (Jul 27, 2017)

AlanF said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > AlanF said:
> ...



That pretty much echos my thoughts as well. I can get a ton of clothes in a carry on size, especially if I start rolling up my pants, shirts, etc. I just did a 10 day trip to France and used a carry on size. However, what kills me is if I have to pack more than an extra pair or shoes. I wear (US) size 13 and those take up a lot of space. Plus a hard dress shoe is awkward and doesn't pack as well as clothing.


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## Mikehit (Jul 27, 2017)

Luds34 said:


> I wear (US) size 13 and those take up a lot of space. Plus a hard dress shoe is awkward and doesn't pack as well as clothing.



Tie the laces round your shoulders and pretend it is a dual-use hard-shell lens case.


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## rrcphoto (Jul 27, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> Going out on a very short and sturdy limb here: TSA-Pre membership is about to skyrocket.



this is really no big deal. other places in the world have had this for a while now.. aka Mexico City.


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 27, 2017)

AlanF said:


> Generally, for business trips I travel with smart casual jacket and trousers, and for conferences hardly that.



Maybe it's a biopharma vs. academia thing.  




Luds34 said:


> However, what kills me is if I have to pack more than an extra pair or shoes. I wear (US) size 13 and those take up a lot of space. Plus a hard dress shoe is awkward and doesn't pack as well as clothing.



+1 – A pair of dress shoes and a tripod, and there's not much room left in a carry-on case.


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## ahsanford (Jul 27, 2017)

rrcphoto said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > Going out on a very short and sturdy limb here: TSA-Pre membership is about to skyrocket.
> ...



I'm not claiming this is the end of traveling photographers -- I'm just saying that people who are traveling with >$1000 worth of camera gear won't bat an eye to pony up $85 for five years of not having to pull it out every time they go through security.

- A


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## m8547 (Jul 27, 2017)

gregorywood said:


> I have considered signing up for TSA Precheck many times but didn't think it worth the cost.
> 
> As of 10 minutes ago, I have an appointment next Tuesday at one of their locations for fingerprinting and document review. Given the latest additional delays for cameras, I'm all in.



I travel only a few times a year, but Precheck has paid for itself by preventing a few missed flights and reducing stress. 

This new rule is annoying, but not terrible. The large electronics ban on some international flights would have required anything bigger than a cell phone to be in checked luggage. No way I'm going to check all my camera equipment. Even with a hard case (which I don't want since it draws attention), there's too much risk of it getting stolen or lost.


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## ahsanford (Jul 27, 2017)

BTW, here are some other electronics items larger than a cell phone:

Tablets
E-readers
Some portable hard drives
Lenses
Speedlites
Some battery chargers
Electric razors
Some laptop power cables

Will all of these need to come out as well? 

- A


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## Mikehit (Jul 27, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> BTW, here are some other electronics items larger than a cell phone:
> 
> Tablets
> E-readers
> ...



In theory. And prove they work.


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## Pookie (Jul 27, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> BTW, here are some other electronics items larger than a cell phone:
> 
> Tablets
> E-readers
> ...



You forgot personal vibrating devices....


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## Mikehit (Jul 27, 2017)

Pookie said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > BTW, here are some other electronics items larger than a cell phone:
> ...



Bigger than a mobile phone.....  :-X My electric toothbrush is way smaller.


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## masterpix (Jul 27, 2017)

This is a regular procedure in Europe already. They asked me to take the camera and all the lenses out of my camera bag for X ray each individually.


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## ahsanford (Jul 27, 2017)

masterpix said:


> This is a regular procedure in Europe already. They asked me to take the camera and all the lenses out of my camera bag for X ray each individually.



Not everywhere, apparently. In May I went from the US --> Heathrow --> Copenhagen and back with Stockholm --> Heathrow --> US and my camera and iPad never left my bag. Go figure, perhaps its an elective call they make or a random selection sort of thing.

Looks like TSA will implement this new stuff for everyone without TSA Pre / Global Entry.

- A


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## wojtek (Jul 27, 2017)

many years ago I was traveling to Poland with my 1ds (mark 1), the security screened it and as it was a first time they came across a camera with such big battery, they asked me to take a picture which I did. All went nice and in a friendly matter so I suppose it is ok if the security takes a better look at such things for a greater good. The batteries are the danger I think as they are probably very near in terms of consistency to some potential explosives, when screened...


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 27, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> masterpix said:
> 
> 
> > This is a regular procedure in Europe already. They asked me to take the camera and all the lenses out of my camera bag for X ray each individually.
> ...



+1 - Flying to the US out of airports in Switzerland, France, Germany, and the UK, my near-fully loaded Lowepro backpack has just gone through the Xray machine every time. 'Fully loaded' means a 1D X with 3-4 lenses and an M2+M11-22. I say 'near-fully' because the pack (DSLR Video Fastback 250) also holds my 17" MBP, and that has to come out before the pack goes on the belt.


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## AlanF (Jul 27, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > masterpix said:
> ...



+1
It is simply untrue that it is a regular practice in Europe. I have had 3 trips in the last month and just as for the 100+ trips in recent years, I have never has to take my cameras and lenses out.


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## photojoern.de (Jul 28, 2017)

For travellers from abroad, this really sucks. I will certainly not hand over my camera as normal luggage, so I have to carry it on. Pretty lot of hazzle. For what reason again, please???


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## Mikehit (Jul 28, 2017)

photojoern.de said:


> For travellers from abroad, this really sucks. I will certainly not hand over my camera as normal luggage, so I have to carry it on. Pretty lot of hazzle. For what reason again, please???



What is the hassle? Take your camera out of the bag, have it x-rayed and put it back in your bag. Just like you do with a laptop.


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## kirispupis (Jul 28, 2017)

As has already been stated, this isn't a huge hassle. Just take your camera out of the bag or sign up for PreCheck or Global Entry.

What I've found more painful is the increased security on flights to the US. We traveled from Morocco via Madrid/Heathrow four months ago and the Heathrow experience was the usual. A few days ago we traveled again through Heathrow (from Johannesburg) to the US and several steps were added to the usual security.

- A new line where all passengers flying to the US must undergo a short interview. In our case, she spent most of her time questioning our kids. I noticed foreign passengers were asked detailed question about their jobs and reasons for traveling to the US. The major pain here was the understaffing - it took about 45 minutes to get through the line.

- At the gate they then checked our passports (another long line), then the final line involved a guy with a list. In our case, he just checked our passports again and waived us forward, but I noticed other passengers had to remove everything from their carry ons for inspection.

We had 2 1/2 hours between flights and it was barely enough.

Once we arrived in the US, entry procedures were unchanged and moved quickly.


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## bandido (Jul 28, 2017)

Mikehit said:


> photojoern.de said:
> 
> 
> > For travellers from abroad, this really sucks. I will certainly not hand over my camera as normal luggage, so I have to carry it on. Pretty lot of hazzle. For what reason again, please???
> ...



Of course it is a hassle. It is not just the camera. Even before the new regulation I had to use 2 bins for shoes, belt, jacket, laptop, iPad...plus the 2 carrying bags. Remember, you have to arrange the items in the bins in a way that they are visible and not blocked by other items.


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## Mikehit (Jul 28, 2017)

Extending your passage through X-ray by what...a minute? Maybe 2. 
Hardly a 'lot of hassle'. You spend many times that waiting in a queue to buy a coffee or duty free. Maybe time to do one more clue on the crossword? I think some perspective is needed.


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 28, 2017)

Mikehit said:


> Extending your passage through X-ray by what...a minute? Maybe 2.
> Hardly a 'lot of hassle'. You spend many times that waiting in a queue to buy a coffee or duty free. Maybe time to do one more clue on the crossword? I think some perspective is needed.



Agreed. Call it an extra minute. So, if there are 60 people in front of you (certainly not uncommon in many airports), an extra minute each means an extra hour in line, and perhaps missing your flight. How's that for perspective?


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## Mikehit (Jul 28, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> Mikehit said:
> 
> 
> > Extending your passage through X-ray by what...a minute? Maybe 2.
> ...



Rubbish. You take the kit out of your bag while you are in the queue (no extra time) and it is the other side putting it back that delays you. 
I spend more time waiting behind bozos who act all surprised when the security explain they have to throw away water bottles, take off their jackets and make sure they have no coins or phones in their pockets despite passing the myriad signs on their way in and the audio announcements while they are in the queue.


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## kaihp (Jul 28, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> masterpix said:
> 
> 
> > This is a regular procedure in Europe already. They asked me to take the camera and all the lenses out of my camera bag for X ray each individually.
> ...



I've found that Amsterdam Airport (Schiphol) to be the absolutely worst and most random of the airports I've gone through. I would get different directions as what to take out every time I was there (I commuted weekly through AMS for 5 months last year). When I ask the security person they get irritated, especially when I point out that what they are asking for is inconsistent with the guidelines that is shown on the monitors in the security waiting line (which can be very very long).

The best thing to do in Schiphol is to take _all_ electronics out of your carryon, even if they don't ask for it. And I do mean all of it. The persons looking at the X-ray images are either not very proficient at examining the images or overly cautious. 

As for camera gear, my S100 was fine but when I moved back from China, I had to empty the entire bag of photo gear. "That's the EU rules" they argued - which is blatantly incorrect. I never had problems in any other airport with my DSLR gear. The Chinese just wanted to peek inside the bag to confirm that it was indeed camera and lenses.


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## ahsanford (Jul 28, 2017)

Mikehit said:


> Extending your passage through X-ray by what...a minute? Maybe 2.
> Hardly a 'lot of hassle'. You spend many times that waiting in a queue to buy a coffee or duty free. Maybe time to do one more clue on the crossword? I think some perspective is needed.



TSA says "all electronics larger than a cell phone" = _each and every lens_, your speedlite, your battery charger, your ipad, etc.

1) Added Time to pull everything out and put everything back

2) Risk of a drop handling each lens

3) Risk of your lenses banging into something else in the tub while it's on the conveyor belt 

4) Risk of the person before/after you in line lifting/jostling your tote full of lenses with their tote (it's common the 'lip' of totes get overlapped in line and need to get lifted/unstuck)

5) Risk of theft (admittedly, a small one)

I mean this: if they enforce this to the letter, it may drive some bag companies to make lens caddies or lay-flat removable lens modules expressly for going through security.

- A


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## privatebydesign (Jul 28, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> I mean this: if they enforce this to the letter, it may drive some bag companies to make lens caddies or lay-flat removable lens modules expressly for going through security.
> 
> - A



They already do and I wouldn't travel without my SwissGear Scan Smart backpack. Designed for laptops so far but I've never had anything taken out from the 'other' side either. I'm flying tonight too....


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## AlanF (Jul 28, 2017)

kirispupis said:


> As has already been stated, this isn't a huge hassle. Just take your camera out of the bag or sign up for PreCheck or Global Entry.
> 
> What I've found more painful is the increased security on flights to the US. We traveled from Morocco via Madrid/Heathrow four months ago and the Heathrow experience was the usual. A few days ago we traveled again through Heathrow (from Johannesburg) to the US and several steps were added to the usual security.
> 
> ...



If you are from a country that has visa waiver arrangements with the US (EU etc http://www.esta.us/visa_waiver_countries.html), then you buy an ESTA every two years and get cleared from that hassle in advance.


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## Skywise (Jul 28, 2017)

I long for the days when I could sprint through an airport 10 minutes before my flight - throw the carryon through the x-ray scanner and walk through the metal detector (which was not sensitive enough to be set off by my belt buckle) grab the bag then sprint down to the gate and hand over my boarding pass. No "papers citizen?", no stripping down to your skivvies, no "this time do my individually bottled toiletries stay in the carryon or not today?" and getting a dirty look from the TSA agent because they keep changing the rule. Forgetting my fitbit is still on my wrist...

This isn't horrible per se - I usually keep my camera at the ready for shooting photos while in the air but I usually pack the extra lenses at the bottom of the carryon (more protected). I also pack a messenger bag to carry my lenses in anyway so now it'll probably be clothes, camera bag, camera - Take the camera and camera bag out - probably put the lenses on top of the camera bag in the tray, put the cellphone back in the carryon along with my belt and wallet and pull out the laptop if I've brought that too and then another tray for the coat and shoes.
So... camera tray, laptop tray, shoe/coat tray and 1 carryon (not in tray today because that's the current TSA standatd... but might not be tomorrow!)

Then pray it's all there when I get on the other side... Gonna have to look into precheck...


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## ahsanford (Jul 28, 2017)

privatebydesign said:


> They already do and I wouldn't travel without my SwissGear Scan Smart backpack. Designed for laptops so far but I've never had anything taken out from the 'other' side either. I'm flying tonight too....



But other than pulling out an entire photo cube/insert (example below from the PRVKE 21, first pic) and putting this directly on the belt, photographers may have problems complying with 'pulling them out' _and giving them safe transport down the conveyor belt_. I'm not sure that simply opening a traditional clamshell photography backback (see pic 2 below) so that lenses are in view will qualify as 'pulling them out'.

- A


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## Skywise (Jul 28, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> But other than pulling out an entire photo cube/insert (example below from the PRVKE 21, first pic) and putting this directly on the belt, photographers may have problems complying with 'pulling them out' _and giving them safe transport down the conveyor belt_. I'm not sure that simply opening a traditional clamshell photography backback (see pic 2 below) so that lenses are in view will qualify as 'pulling them out'.
> 
> - A



Agreed - We'll have to see what the actual rules are - but laptops can't be in their own bags either - they have to be by themselves in their own tray. I'm hoping it's at least OK to have the lenses on top of their own bag rather than be all by themselves.


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## biglipps66 (Jul 28, 2017)

Im the guy with 2 laptops, 2 iPads, a phone, my camera bag and a whole LINE OF BINS at the security belt. I literally take up the whole table section. 

Mac laptop - 1 bin
Surface pro laptop - 1 bin
iPad mini - 1 bin
iPad mini -1 bin
Camera - 1 bin
shoes and misc - 1 bin
laptop bag to push through
camera bag to push through

6 bins and 2 bags, are you S___ting me?


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 28, 2017)

Mikehit said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > Mikehit said:
> ...



So...I'm supposed to take out two cameras and 4-5 lenses while I'm in the queue and what...juggle them in midair as the line moves along? Set them on the floor play 'kick the can' with them as I move down down the line? Or is TSA going to add more/longer tables at every scanner to give people the time/space they will need for their 3-5 bins of stuff?

And now you're going to have to spend _even more_ time waiting behind bozos who also have to be reminded to take out any electronic device larger than a cell phone despite passing the myriad signs on their way in and the audio announcements while they are in the queue.

Bottom line, this is going to mean longer waits at checkpoints for most people. I'm glad it won't affect me.


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## Mikehit (Jul 28, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> So...I'm supposed to take out two cameras and 4-5 lenses while I'm in the queue and what...juggle them in midair as the line moves along? Set them on the floor play 'kick the can' with them as I move down down the line? Or is TSA going to add more/longer tables at every scanner to give people the time/space they will need for their 3-5 bins of stuff?
> 
> And now you're going to have to spend _even more_ time waiting behind bozos who also have to be reminded to take out any electronic device larger than a cell phone despite passing the myriad signs on their way in and the audio announcements while they are in the queue.
> 
> Bottom line, this is going to mean longer waits at checkpoints for most people. I'm glad it won't affect me.



PAH!
Anyone who's flown in or out or Israel any time in the last 20 years will look jealously at your inconveniences. :


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## ahsanford (Jul 28, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> Bottom line, this is going to mean longer waits at checkpoints for most people. I'm glad it won't affect me.



+1. If this rule is implemented for all non-Pre travelers (as the notice would imply), folks here are delusional if they think this is just another 'plastic bag of liquids' that they need they pre-plan for.

Forget photographers for a moment, rando regular old people today travel with:

Cell phones
Computers
AC power (with large transformer) for said computers
Tablets
Cameras
Lenses
Flashes
Drones
Battery chargers
Gaming systems
DVD players (dying out, but I still them for kids)
Large noise-cancelling headphones
Hair dryers
Hiking headlamps and small lanterns
Fish finders
GPS devices
Audio recording devices
Insulin pumps
Baby monitors

The notion that everyone (a) will be prepared for this and (b) will manage that above list in an orderly fashion is nonsense. If implemented to the letter, it will be a clusterf--- for a good 6 months before people get wise and change their packing habits with this check in mind. 

Even then, some of the items above don't pack well in the smaller of your two carry-ons, so that will mean that roller board suitcases will need to be opened and rummaged through to fish things out even if you were prepared for it.

And TSA can't scale up proportionally to the hit this will create -- they can add bodies, but many airports are space-constrained for the number of aisles they can run.

So I can't state this enough: TSA Pre- or GE (or possibly just checking your bags for non-photographers) just went from a really nice value-add convenience / efficiency to being outright essential.

- A


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## neuroanatomist (Jul 28, 2017)

Mikehit said:


> PAH!
> Anyone who's flown in or out or Israel any time in the last 20 years will look jealously at your inconveniences. :



Thanks to PreCheck, they're not _my_ inconveniences... 

Edit: damn, actually they are. When I leave Logan for overseas, the international terminal doesn't have PreCheck lanes. At least the business/first lines are shorter...


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## Act444 (Jul 28, 2017)

Ugh. As if flying weren't enough of a hassle already. 

At least I don't have to fly often - but both TSA AND airlines seem to like to throw in every disincentive possible. 

Honestly I think I've yet to take a DSLR through the airport system - usually I've just taken my M (and before, P&S cameras) but often times I have other electronics with me as well.


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## ahsanford (Jul 28, 2017)

Act444 said:


> Honestly I think I've yet to take a DSLR through the airport system - usually I've just taken my M (and before, P&S cameras) but often times I have other electronics with me as well.



The distinction never mattered before. My photo backpack or satchel with a Tenba insert would just slide through on the conveyor belt without much fanfare. The only 'mental check' I had to do with sending my (more-commonly-traveled-with) satchel through was that it has Bellingham-like buckles on it, and I had to make sure I re-set those buckles after pulling my bag of liquids out -- forgetting to do that with a bag laid on its side could have something fall out during transit down the belt.

But that was the height of my traveling with cameras stress. Now, not so much. 

TSA Pre will let me skate past that, and I live near a major US airport that will let me make the most of Pre, but there are some tinier airports I fly to where Pre- lanes might not exist or be unstaffed that day. So this announcement will bite me eventually.

- A


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## sanj (Jul 28, 2017)

For those who are concerned about the extra 15 odd minutes taken for this security: Are you suicidal? Instead of being upset with the security people who are doing this for your own and other passenger safety, direct the rage towards the radical terrorists who are forcing such measures. 
Get real.


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## privatebydesign (Jul 28, 2017)

sanj said:


> For those who are concerned about the extra 15 odd minutes taken for this security: Are you suicidal? Instead of being upset with the security people who are doing this for your own and other passenger safety, direct the rage towards the radical terrorists who are forcing such measures.
> Get real.


Really? 

The 'security' people at TSA are poorly trained, poorly paid, staggeringly inconsistent and have been proven to be very ineffective in actually stopping people taking dangerous stuff on to planes. Further they are controlled by a mix of empire building bureaucrats chasing ever bigger budgets and internal importance and a government trying to drive an agenda that we should all be scared all the time, but don't worry 'they' will look after us.

The mission of the TSA has been entirely corrupted and is the perfect example of a 'solution' to a problem dreamt up by government and 'enhanced' by bureaucrats.


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## ahsanford (Jul 28, 2017)

sanj said:


> For those who are concerned about the extra 15 odd minutes taken for this security: Are you suicidal? Instead of being upset with the security people who are doing this for your own and other passenger safety, direct the rage towards the radical terrorists who are forcing such measures.
> Get real.



Settle down. No one's saying TSA is the enemy here. They are just doing their job in light of (what we presume) is credible DHS intel that is shaping these policy changes. How effectively they do that job we can debate, but they are a reality we must play ball with. 

Yes, safety comes first. But for those of us that _aren't_ hellbent on blowing things up, TSA is simply a hurdle we must game with some savvy. That's what we're talking about here. Wanting to get through security quickly does not mean we are blind to why security is there. 

I just treat security as a given and comply. But knowing we can comply to different levels depending on choices we make means that _I will make those choices very carefully_. 

- A


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## rrcphoto (Jul 28, 2017)

neuroanatomist said:


> Mikehit said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...



actually in mexico .. no real different in times going through security.

and it's really not that hard.. Hell, I had two laptops, 4 external HDD's, two external 15" LCD USB screens, and 4 cameras to pull out.


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## ahsanford (Jul 28, 2017)

rrcphoto said:


> and it's really not that hard.. Hell, I had two laptops, 4 external HDD's, two external 15" LCD USB screens, and 4 cameras to pull out.



That doesn't sound like fun, that doesn't sound fast, and it sounds like a chance that some ham-handed jerk in a hurry to grab their tote that is interlocked with mine might accidentally chuck my junk on to a tile floor.

...or Americans can pay $17 a year 'insurance' to bypass that at most airports / on most flights. Done.

Keep in mind I started this thread as a public service announcement, that's all. I have no bone to pick with TSA, I am not bemoaning the burdens of what security requires in the modern world, and if you want to fight through what surely will be slower security lines as a result of this, have at it.

- A


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## sanj (Jul 29, 2017)

ahsanford said:


> sanj said:
> 
> 
> > For those who are concerned about the extra 15 odd minutes taken for this security: Are you suicidal? Instead of being upset with the security people who are doing this for your own and other passenger safety, direct the rage towards the radical terrorists who are forcing such measures.
> ...


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## Ozarker (Jul 31, 2017)

Pookie said:


> ahsanford said:
> 
> 
> > BTW, here are some other electronics items larger than a cell phone:
> ...



Funniest comment I've read, ever. ;D ;D ;D


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## Bennymiata (Jul 31, 2017)

I started travelling internationally in 1976, and there was virtually no security.
You checked in your bags and just showed your passport, then directly onto the plane. It was so easy and even enjoyable.

Nowadays, waiting in line to check in, then go through security takes longer than a lot of flights!

So much for fast travel..........


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## ewg963 (Jul 31, 2017)

zim said:


> TBH I've never heard of 'precheck' I've also never understood why a camera doesn't have to come out as per computer equipment or how jam is a liquid. ???
> So with precheck security is now just another money making exercise?


+10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 yep another money making exercise....


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## ewg963 (Jul 31, 2017)

grainier said:


> I am so tired of government agencies who are incapable of doing anything abouth the illegal behavior and going after law-abiding citizens instead.


 +100000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000


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## kanehi (Jul 31, 2017)

A long time ago I was asked to step aside and asked to check my dSLR. The lady agent requested for me to take the lens off to see if there was anything in the camera. She also looked thru the viewfinder with the lens on. I did admire her for thoroughly checking items.


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## lion rock (Jul 31, 2017)

I had 2 cameras: 
5D3 with 24-70 mounted on a sling and was outside on a tray. TSA wanted me to shoot a photo with it. I obliged.
7D2 with 70-200 mounted in camera backpack. I tried to take it out to shoot for the TSA agent. He smiled and said no need, for which I still tripped the shutter. No problem, he waved me through.
Total exercise took about 1 extra minute apart from the usual x-ray job.
And this was a flight from Oregon to Virginia in May, not an international flight.
-r



kanehi said:


> A long time ago I was asked to step aside and asked to check my dSLR. The lady agent requested for me to take the lens off to see if there was anything in the camera. She also looked thru the viewfinder with the lens on. I did admire her for thoroughly checking items.


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## cayenne (Aug 1, 2017)

Mikehit said:


> I have never been asked.
> One time when gong through security in UK I jokingly said 'do you want me to take out my camera? It is really a computer with a lens attached'.



Yeah, I"ve never had to pull out of open my camera bag.....

I'm going to be flying soon....I guess I"ll pull out he 5D3 body with the lens that's on it, but the other lenses, aren't "electronic" equipment...so I'll leave them in bag.

I really don't want those things rolling around bumping into everything....especially when they carry it over when I request manual search....I don't want any extra radiation from the back scatter scanning units they use, so I most always ask for manual pat down...that and just to keep them busy.

I think this security theater is just that and mostly a joke, and more of a hassle for the public than it is as a deterrent.

If they "really" wanted security, they'd have everyone walk by bomb sniffing dogs and go through metal detectors...that would catch more likely than they do now.....

ok..rant mode off.

C


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## cayenne (Aug 1, 2017)

Mikehit said:


> photojoern.de said:
> 
> 
> > For travellers from abroad, this really sucks. I will certainly not hand over my camera as normal luggage, so I have to carry it on. Pretty lot of hazzle. For what reason again, please???
> ...



It is a PITA.

Let's see...i"m traveling on my own and if I have to scan everything they want....I'll have
1. container for my backpack
2. container for my laptop (work)
3. container for my iPad
4. container for my camera
5. container for my camera bag
6?? Maybe 3 more containers if they want one per lens I have in bag...?
7. OH yes...my fscking shoes on the conveyor belt....and then walking through without belt...then with everyone barreling through, have to get my belt and shoes back on before my pants fall down....then, put everything back into the proper bag (all those containers of mine along with everyone else piling up at the end of the belt.....

It's a major PITA....and still to this day, when the Feds test the system, they consistently get like 98% or better of the fake weapons and bombs through......

This crap does no good and only basically causes the law abiding public problems....

C


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