# DPReview Adds EOS 5DS R To Studio Test Scene



## Canon Rumors Guy (May 6, 2015)

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DPReview has added the Canon EOS 5DS R to their studio test scene. You can compare it directly to cameras like the Nikon D810 and Pentax 645Z.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/image-comparison?attr18=daylight&attr13_0=canon_eos5dsr&attr13_1=nikon_d810&attr13_2=pentax_645z&attr13_3=phaseone_iq180&attr15_0=raw&attr15_1=raw&attr15_2=raw&attr15_3=raw&attr16_0=100&attr16_1=100&attr16_2=100&attr16_3=35&normalization=full&widget=1&x=0&y=0" target="_blank">View Canon EOS 5DS R Studio Test at DPReview</a></p>
<p class="fs16 OpenSans-600-normal upper product-highlights-header">PRODUCT HIGHLIGHTS</p>
<ul class="top-section-list" data-selenium="highlightList">
<li class="top-section-list-item">50.6MP Full-Frame CMOS Sensor</li>
<li class="top-section-list-item">Dual DIGIC 6 Image Processors</li>
<li class="top-section-list-item">Low-Pass Filter Effect Cancellation</li>
<li class="top-section-list-item">3.2″ 1,040K-Dot ClearView II LCD Monitor</li>
<li class="top-section-list-item">Full HD 1080p Video Recording at 30 fps</li>
<li class="top-section-list-item">61-Point High Density Reticular AF</li>
<li class="top-section-list-item">150,000-pixel RGB+IR Metering Sensor</li>
<li class="top-section-list-item">Native ISO 6400; 5.0 fps Burst Shooting</li>
<li class="top-section-list-item">User-Selectable Shutter Release Time Lag</li>
<li class="top-section-list-item">Dual Compact Flash and SD Media Slots</li>
</ul>
<p><strong>Canon EOS 5DS R $3899: <a href="http://adorama.evyy.net/c/60085/51926/1036?u=http://www.adorama.com/results/canonnewfeb" target="_blank">Adorama</a> | <a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1119027-REG/canon_0582c002_eos_5ds_r_dslr.html/BI/2466/KBID/3296" target="_blank">B&H Photo</a> | <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00T3ERPT8/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=B00T3ERPT8&linkCode=as2&tag=canorumo-20&linkId=X7P2IPISEXTZFLQ7" target="_blank">Amazon</a></strong></p>
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## mackguyver (May 6, 2015)

It looks closer to the 5DIII than the 7DII to my eyes, which is a very good thing. It looks quite good up to ISO 800, then it starts to fall apart a bit, but it's still decent at ISO 1600, which is probably the highest the target audience would set it to for most work. If you like at the etchings on the left, you'll see a fair bit of moire but also a whole lot more detail than the 5DIII. Definitely interesting to finally get a good look at the IQ.


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## bmwzimmer (May 6, 2015)

In the Studio Test Scenes, Can someone explain to me why DPreview is using the 85mm f/1.8 from 1992 which was designed for Film cameras on a 50mp 5DSR while the Nikon D810 studio scene gets the crazy good and expensive Nikkor 1.4G which is one of in not Nikon's very best prime lenses with barely any CA and excellent contrast?


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## neuroanatomist (May 6, 2015)

bmwzimmer said:


> In the Studio Test Scenes, Can someone explain to me why DPreview is using the 85mm f/1.8 from 1992 which was designed for Film cameras on a 50mp 5DSR while the Nikon D810 studio scene gets the crazy good and expensive Nikkor 1.4G which is one of in not Nikon's very best prime lenses with barely any CA and excellent contrast?



I can think of a reason... :


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## ritholtz (May 6, 2015)

bmwzimmer said:


> In the Studio Test Scenes, Can someone explain to me why DPreview is using the 85mm f/1.8 from 1992 which was designed for Film cameras on a 50mp 5DSR while the Nikon D810 studio scene gets the crazy good and expensive Nikkor 1.4G which is one of in not Nikon's very best prime lenses with barely any CA and excellent contrast?


Not sure if they intentionally did anything. Now a days I find dpreview reviews are just a wrapper/text around dxo numbers instead of showing what actual camera is capable of and how to get best out of the tool. They are pretty much into shadow noise and isoless shooting advocating group. 
Funny thing is, they kept on recommending d7100 over rest of the crop cameras including 7d2 based on shadow recovery and sensor performance ignoring everything. They conveniently ignored d7100 horizontal green banding. Now they are refusing to add d7100 to their exposure latitude test to compare with d7200. Their reason is, they do not have d7100. But they kept on adding rest of the cameras to their exposure latitude test.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (May 6, 2015)

I was comparing the colors to the other cameras, the saturation and color of the reds is better than the others.

Another thing to look at is the file sizes. Canon and presumably the other three use lossless compression, but efficiency varies. Canon seems to have very efficient compression, at least, for 50mp, their file size is smaller.

At high ISO's, the Pentax wins by a stop or a little more. The Nikon D810 pulls away at higher ISO's.

The price for better colors definitely is a tradeoff with high ISO performance.


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## bmwzimmer (May 6, 2015)

I was looking at their Nikon D7200 studio test scene against a the Samsung NX1 and the contrast and sharpness blew it away. Then I realized they used a 16-50mm zoom lens on the Samsung against a Prime lens on the Nikon. Seriously, it's pretty rediculous


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## SPKoko (May 6, 2015)

bmwzimmer said:


> In the Studio Test Scenes, Can someone explain to me why DPreview is using the 85mm f/1.8 from 1992 which was designed for Film cameras on a 50mp 5DSR while the Nikon D810 studio scene gets the crazy good and expensive Nikkor 1.4G which is one of in not Nikon's very best prime lenses with barely any CA and excellent contrast?



+1 +1 +1 +1 +1


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## RGF (May 6, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> bmwzimmer said:
> 
> 
> > In the Studio Test Scenes, Can someone explain to me why DPreview is using the 85mm f/1.8 from 1992 which was designed for Film cameras on a 50mp 5DSR while the Nikon D810 studio scene gets the crazy good and expensive Nikkor 1.4G which is one of in not Nikon's very best prime lenses with barely any CA and excellent contrast?
> ...



I can think of two - either intentional or just sloppy


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## bmwzimmer (May 6, 2015)

Canon 5DSR = $350 lens announced in 1992
Nikon D810 = $1600 lens announced in 2010
Pentax 645Z = $4500 lens announced in 2013 or 2014 

Notice the magenta fringing on the Canon lens in RAW? In JPEG, Lens correction cleans it up nicely but loss of sharpness is a byproduct.


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## 9VIII (May 6, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> bmwzimmer said:
> 
> 
> > In the Studio Test Scenes, Can someone explain to me why DPreview is using the 85mm f/1.8 from 1992 which was designed for Film cameras on a 50mp 5DSR while the Nikon D810 studio scene gets the crazy good and expensive Nikkor 1.4G which is one of in not Nikon's very best prime lenses with barely any CA and excellent contrast?
> ...



Because Brian at TDP does such a good job that the DPR stuff is just inferior no matter what they do.


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## privatebydesign (May 6, 2015)

9VIII said:


> neuroanatomist said:
> 
> 
> > bmwzimmer said:
> ...



I think the real reason is DPReview use DxO equipment, and DxO have declared the Canon 85 f1.8 to be one of the best resolving lenses in the EF range. How DxO got to draw that conclusion is anybodies guess (thought here are conspiracy theory sounding suggestions), why they feel compelled to imply that as a lens choice to other testers is interesting (and really feeds into the conspiracy theories), but of an even more critical note, why DPR can't see that it is bad advice I can't help but put down to incompetence or maliciousness.


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## exquisitor (May 6, 2015)

Despite the strange choice of the lens 5DS R delivers really good results.
It's interesting that 5DS has exactly the doubled linear resolution compared to the first 5D classic and was announced 10 years afterwards. Looking from this side the naming makes even more sense...


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## ritholtz (May 6, 2015)

privatebydesign said:


> 9VIII said:
> 
> 
> > neuroanatomist said:
> ...


I think you are right. DPR thinks this is the sharpest lens that is reason he used it.

As others have indicated, this is one of Canon's sharpest primes. It outperforms the 85/1.2 across the frame.
We've had issues with off-brand primes and how much light they let through compared to our on-brand primes, which prevent us from switching over, as it would invalidate comparisons to previous cameras shot with on-brand primes.


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## zim (May 6, 2015)

What lens should they have used, and why?

They seem to be having issues with off brand, so that would rule out a zeiss otus 
and of course rule out at least some cross brand consistency.


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## Lawliet (May 6, 2015)

mackguyver said:


> It looks quite good up to ISO 800, then it starts to fall apart a bit,



Iso100: look at the Color wheel/red patch next to the playing cards - imagine that seeping into something you want to show to a client. The same with the color checker, most obvious in the 2/2 blue patch. Or the green below it.


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## exquisitor (May 6, 2015)

Lawliet said:


> mackguyver said:
> 
> 
> > It looks quite good up to ISO 800, then it starts to fall apart a bit,
> ...


This is probably some strange effect of the beta software that was used to convert the raw. If you download the raw file, it looks just like every other camera.


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## Don Haines (May 6, 2015)

bmwzimmer said:


> In the Studio Test Scenes, Can someone explain to me why DPreview is using the 85mm f/1.8 from 1992 which was designed for Film cameras on a 50mp 5DSR while the Nikon D810 studio scene gets the crazy good and expensive Nikkor 1.4G which is one of in not Nikon's very best prime lenses with barely any CA and excellent contrast?


Easy!
It is because it is the same very sharp lens they have been using to test canon FF cameras with forever.... that way the bias in the results remains consistent. (Bias is not necessarily bad) 

Hopefully they will repeat the tests with lenses that are not 25 years old, made with modern materials, newer coatings, and designed for digital photography.... but what lens would that be in order to keep it in the same range as the other lenses being tested on different bodies?


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## mackguyver (May 6, 2015)

exquisitor said:


> Lawliet said:
> 
> 
> > mackguyver said:
> ...


Exactly and you can open the RAW file in the latest version of ACR (LR or PS). It looks pretty fantastic to me and much better than the JPEG on the website. Also, the Adjustment Brush with Moire reduction set to 50 or so does a nice job cancelling out the moire. I'm definitely glad I pre-ordered the 5DS R model now 

EDIT: looking a bit closer, the color wheel is a little speckled because the halftone pattern of the printing dots is _almost_ resolved by the lens/sensor. If you look at the playing cards, which are printed with solid ink (spot colors), you'll see there's no noise/speckling in them, even the black.


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## Lawliet (May 6, 2015)

exquisitor said:


> This is probably some strange effect of the beta software that was used to convert the raw. If you download the raw file, it looks just like every other camera.



It's an artefect of demosaicing & AB stretching from random LSBs.
ACR doesn't have mandatory denoising parameters set yet while DPP already knows what to do. Transforming from L to AB makes things less obvious, but more intrusive and harder to fixthough. :-[


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## neuroanatomist (May 6, 2015)

Lawliet said:


> Iso100: look at the Color wheel/red patch next to the playing cards - imagine that seeping into something you want to show to a client. The same with the color checker, most obvious in the 2/2 blue patch. Or the green below it.





Lawliet said:


> exquisitor said:
> 
> 
> > This is probably some strange effect of the beta software that was used to convert the raw. If you download the raw file, it looks just like every other camera.
> ...



Speaking of bias...you were quite happy to bash the camera's IQ, presumably knowing at the time that the issue was the half-baked RAW conversion software. Interesting....

If you're in the job market, you should see if DxO is hiring. You appear to have the necessary qualifications…


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## Lawliet (May 6, 2015)

neuroanatomist said:


> Lawliet said:
> 
> 
> > Iso100: look at the Color wheel/red patch next to the playing cards - imagine that seeping into something you want to show to a client. The same with the color checker, most obvious in the 2/2 blue patch. Or the green below it.
> ...


It either speaks of your bias or inability to read to the last sentence.


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## PureClassA (May 7, 2015)

Downloaded RAW and opened in LR. Looks good. Color Moire in black and white pencil sketches (played with the one on the left) , but Moire brush got rid of it nicely.


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## PureClassA (May 7, 2015)

And yes, the 85 1.8 is very dated, but it's still a darn good performer. It is a bit frustrating though that these other camera bodies are being shot with much newer and far more expensive glass. If the more appropriately comparable $2000 85L really wasn't ANY better then no one would be buying it...


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## zlatko (May 7, 2015)

bmwzimmer said:


> In the Studio Test Scenes, Can someone explain to me why DPreview is using the 85mm f/1.8 from 1992 which was designed for Film cameras on a 50mp 5DSR while the Nikon D810 studio scene gets the crazy good and expensive Nikkor 1.4G which is one of in not Nikon's very best prime lenses with barely any CA and excellent contrast?



The reason is ... let's see ... um ... oh, yeah ... WTF!


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## sanj (May 7, 2015)

I checked on Brian's website. It is not amongst Canon's sharpest lenses.


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## Eldar (May 7, 2015)

zim said:


> What lens should they have used, and why?
> 
> They seem to be having issues with off brand, so that would rule out a zeiss otus
> and of course rule out at least some cross brand consistency.


In my view they should have used an Otus. Then you could have the same top performing lens on both Nikon, and Canon. That would make their comparison tool much more interesting. I do not understand why they should have issues with 3-party lenses, if that is what makes your comparison valid.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (May 7, 2015)

sanj said:


> I checked on Brian's website. It is not amongst Canon's sharpest lenses.



Other than LOCA's, the 85mm is sharp enough, and at f/5.6, the corners and edges are virtually equal to the center sharpness. That's a very important item that is often overlooked. CA's are low as well.

Just be happy they did not use the 50mm f/1.4, it has the center sharpness, but otherwise it suffers.

It would be interesting to have them use a Zeiss lens that was similar for Canon, Nikon, and Sony, but they have a huge database of images using that lens, so its probably better to keep on using it for comparisons sake.


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## sanj (May 7, 2015)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> sanj said:
> 
> 
> > I checked on Brian's website. It is not amongst Canon's sharpest lenses.
> ...



You right. I checked only at full open. But most lenses fine at 5.6. No?


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## exquisitor (May 7, 2015)

PureClassA said:


> And yes, the 85 1.8 is very dated, but it's still a darn good performer. It is a bit frustrating though that these other camera bodies are being shot with much newer and far more expensive glass. If the more appropriately comparable $2000 85L really wasn't ANY better then no one would be buying it...


I also wondered how 85L II can be worse than 85/1.8. According to TDP the 85L II looks a bit better in the corners than 85/1.8 at f/5.6. http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/ISO-12233-Sample-Crops.aspx?Lens=397&Camera=453&Sample=0&FLI=0&API=6&LensComp=106&CameraComp=453&SampleComp=0&FLIComp=0&APIComp=4 At least not worse... Of course there is sample variation, but I would expect the much newer design like 85L II (2006) to deliver better results than old design for film (1992), especially in terms of contrast given new advances in coatings and optimizing it for digital.
Anyway, IMO the comparison is still valuable and telling a lot about the performance, which is great...


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## Valvebounce (May 7, 2015)

Hi Dilbert. 
That is part of the human condition,* mostly we will complain about stuff to anyone and everyone except the one person that can actually change what we are complaining about! ;D
* It seems to be a very British condition but happens to some extent everywhere I have been!

Cheers, Graham. 



dilbert said:


> bmwzimmer said:
> 
> 
> > In the Studio Test Scenes, Can someone explain to me why DPreview is using the 85mm f/1.8 from 1992 which was designed for Film cameras on a 50mp 5DSR while the Nikon D810 studio scene gets the crazy good and expensive Nikkor 1.4G which is one of in not Nikon's very best prime lenses with barely any CA and excellent contrast?
> ...


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## zlatko (May 7, 2015)

zim said:


> What lens should they have used, and why?



85L or 100L, because they are better lenses.


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## privatebydesign (May 7, 2015)

I have always hated it when people have proclaimed a sensor size smaller as a next size up "killer", ie, the latest Nikon DX or the Fuji X100T is a FF killer. 

I have always baulked at people who have said any 135 format sensor is a medium format killer too, but looking closely at the test images it seems there is a much bigger difference between the Phase One IQ180 and the Pentax 645Z than there is between the 645Z and the 5DSR, which I find remarkable.

Obviously the best MF digital is still going to best the 5DSR with ease, but for those contemplating a 645Z (and the associated lenses), depending on your shooting style and subject matter, the 5DSR deserves a serious look, particularly when you throw in the Canon range and quality of lenses.

I think as the software and processing skill level increases on these 5DSR files we are going to have a bit of a base level realignment.

Personally I still dn't have a need or desire for 50MP, I'd love an excuse for one but I just don't have it, but if these IQ improvements are carried through to the 1DX MkII at 25ish MP I will be one very happy photographer.


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## ritholtz (May 8, 2015)

zlatko said:


> zim said:
> 
> 
> > What lens should they have used, and why?
> ...


DPR says it is the sharpest prime with FL between 50-85mm. Can't believe Canon yet to come up with better prime than 25 year old one. Sharpest Canon prime between 50-85mm FL is a nice discussion to start.
From DPR:
Essentially, we try to shoot a camera w/ the best available on-brand 50-85mm prime. For Canon, that's the 85/1.8.


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## raptor3x (May 8, 2015)

zlatko said:


> zim said:
> 
> 
> > What lens should they have used, and why?
> ...



Neither of those lenses are significantly sharper than the 85 1.8 at f/5.6.


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## privatebydesign (May 8, 2015)

raptor3x said:


> zlatko said:
> 
> 
> > zim said:
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The 100L is noticeably better in the corners, certainly for contrast (which is a core aspect of resolution), and in the center it doesn't introduce the false colours the 85 f1.8 does so an accurate resolution measurement is much easier.

In truth the 100L would be a much more appropriate lens to be doing these tests with.


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## zlatko (May 8, 2015)

privatebydesign said:


> raptor3x said:
> 
> 
> > zlatko said:
> ...



Thank you. I was just about the write the same thing. IQ tests on the-digital-picture show the 85L is slightly better in the corners, and the 100L is significantly better in the corners. The 85/1.8 is a fine lens, but there is a difference.


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## zim (May 8, 2015)

zlatko said:


> privatebydesign said:
> 
> 
> > raptor3x said:
> ...



Thanks for all the replies, very interesting, the 85L has it then as the 100 is outwith the range they use which is a pity.
As an aside I didn't realise that one of the great strengths of the 85L was actually sharpness at higher Fs, all talk seems to revolve around wide open creamy goodness. It must be a fabulous lens to use!


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