# Red AF in AI-Servo fixed in 1D-X before 5D Mk III



## se7en (Oct 18, 2012)

Why do you think this was addressed earlier than the 5d mark III, despite the 5d being released "long" before the 1dx? 

The simple answer would be: The 1dx costs more. "Professionals" demand it. etc.

But I don't think there are too many amateurs running around out there with $3000 bodies. 

I was relatively unconcerned with the large amount of discontent with the 5d mark iii preformance, personally feeling that the camera fit its role. 

I am, however; utterly pissed that Canon chose to overlook the fact that there are thousands of 5d mk3 users out there that have demanded, more or less, that the AF in AI Servo be changed through a simple firmware update, and instead, offer it to the 1dx that has been out for a fraction of the time.

I love Canon, but this really irks me, maybe unjustifiably, but irks me none the less, and where better to rant than cr? 

Grrrrr.


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## Tcapp (Oct 18, 2012)

se7en said:


> Why do you think this was addressed earlier than the 5d mark III, despite the 5d being released "long" before the 1dx?
> 
> The simple answer would be: The 1dx costs more. "Professionals" demand it. etc.
> 
> ...



I'm sure canon will get around to the 5d3 eventually. Hopefully. 

Or not. Force us to upgrade to the 1dx. Make more money. You know, canon's usual. Or should I say, a sane company's usual.


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## se7en (Oct 18, 2012)

Tcapp said:


> se7en said:
> 
> 
> > Why do you think this was addressed earlier than the 5d mark III, despite the 5d being released "long" before the 1dx?
> ...



All the while Nikon has a full body sensor, with greater DR, MP and arguably equal high-ISO performance, for less than the 5d Mark III? If they are truly that pompous, I don't see myself sticking with Canon for the long haul. I do, truly value good technology, and will pay top dollar for it. I won't pay top dollar for sub-performing, support lacking "technology" though. We are not, after all, talking about turning the 5d Mark III into the hubble fucking telescope, simply changing the AF focus point color. Something that should have been dealt with by Canon months ago. 

Instead, we are sitting here reading this grandiose announcement about the "improvement" to a $7,000 camera that should have been default, had Canon done any decent amount of testing with decent photographers. An "improvement" that should have been a no-brainer for all of their DSLRs, not just their top of the line SLR. I repeat, pompous. Pompous crooks. 

This is a slap in the face of consumers, and only makes the D800 that much more appealing.


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## Menace (Oct 18, 2012)

I just hope Canon do the same fix for the 5dIII - SOON!


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## kasperj (Oct 18, 2012)

I couldn't have said it better

Never mind the AF at f.8 limited tele lenses, just correct the red illumination issue already!

Grr


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## petrosv (Oct 18, 2012)

Canon, red in 5d3 it's so simple!!!!!!!!!


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## expatinasia (Oct 18, 2012)

I think it makes perfect sense that they put it in their flagship pro model first. If it had been the other way round, that would have been strange imho.

But like someone said, I am sure they will get round to the 5D Mark III eventually. If you read the 1D X threads the red AF is not really what many users were hoping for, there is talk of "Disco Lights" and other things, so maybe you should feel grateful you haven't got it!! ;-)


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## Eimajm (Oct 18, 2012)

Tcapp said:


> I'm sure canon will get around to the 5d3 eventually. Hopefully.
> 
> Or not. Force us to upgrade to the 1dx. Make more money. You know, canon's usual. Or should I say, a sane company's usual.



I wouldn't count on it, they never bothered with the 7D.


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## simonxu11 (Oct 18, 2012)

expatinasia said:


> If you read the 1D X threads the red AF is not really what many users were hoping for, there is talk of "Disco Lights" and other things, so maybe you should feel grateful you haven't got it!! ;-)


That's why canon should put it into 5D3 first, get all the feedbacks. It's not such a good idea to let flagship's users to test this function.


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## tron (Oct 18, 2012)

kasperj said:


> I couldn't have said it better
> 
> Never mind the AF at f.8 limited tele lenses, just correct the red illumination issue already!
> 
> Grr


Why only the red illumination issue only? The fact that you do not care want it does not mean that others do not want it fixed!
It is a 3.5K camera not a 600$ one.


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 18, 2012)

kasperj said:


> Never mind the AF at f.8 limited tele lenses, just correct the red illumination issue already!
> 
> Grr



Nevermind the red illumination issue, just let me AF at f/8 already!

Grr

Oh, wait...they did (for me). 

Yay


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## expatinasia (Oct 18, 2012)

simonxu11 said:


> expatinasia said:
> 
> 
> > If you read the 1D X threads the red AF is not really what many users were hoping for, there is talk of "Disco Lights" and other things, so maybe you should feel grateful you haven't got it!! ;-)
> ...



No, but that is why Canon should do more tests before it launches a "flagship". That, and the fact it does not sync the data on the two cards, is really quite remarkable considering it is a US$ 6,XXX camera that is supposed to represent all that is good with Canon DSLRs. They even forgot the headphone jack as well! Just shows how forgiving Canon users are.


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## InterMurph (Oct 18, 2012)

se7en said:


> a simple firmware update


There is no such thing as a "simple" firmware update.

Software is complicated. Adding features without breaking anything else is very difficult. And verifying software is unbelievably difficult.

Some are better at it than others. But you definitely want "correct" much more than you want "soon".


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## Louis (Oct 18, 2012)

You guys have to realise that there might be other things to fix also with the 5D3, there is no point rolling out a firmware for the Red Points, to only roll out another later, Chill, the 2 cameras are different, I actually agree that the people who have paid 5k should and get a fix earlier if it can be made, remember in Canons eyes the 1Dx's are being used on field with Pro photographers and they need an update fast.

The 5D3s turn will come, also with other fixes, relax


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 18, 2012)

expatinasia said:


> ...the fact it does not sync the data on the two cards...



Personally, I'd rather it didn't. I can see the logic of syncing when shooting RAW to one card and JPG to the other, which I suppose many 5DIII users may do because writing RAW to the SD card is a speed bottleneck. But on the 1D X, with dual CF, I write RAW to both cards - slot 2 is a backup, and just stays in the camera until the images transferred from card 1 are processed and backed up in multiple locations. Much like the two-step delete on most computer OS's (nove to trash, empty trash), having 'deleted' files on a backup card may be useful at some point, and simply copying them off card 2 is easier than file recovery from card 1.

But that's me. I hope that if Canon does implement this 'fix' they make it a controllable behavior.


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## bbasiaga (Oct 18, 2012)

I know it shouldn't by now, but it always surprises me when people take this stuff personally....

Its been pretty good to see some features being added via firmware to the 7D and now 1DX. I'm sure we'll get something for the 5DIII eventually. In the mean time I'll just have to resign myself to thoroughly enjoying the most versatile camera I have ever owned. Darn those Canon [email protected] 

-Brian


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## Bombsight (Oct 18, 2012)

You get what you pay for .... never fails.

Funny how the 5DMK3 owners couldnt be happier with the decision they made not long ago (5DMK3 instead of "overpiced 1DX) .... Now, all of a sudden, the monetarily ugly child in the family gets a little exra attention and the pretty daughters start whinning. :

Happy with MY decision of a 1DX ... and throwing it back on all of those who blasted it for one reason or another.


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## expatinasia (Oct 18, 2012)

neuroanatomist said:


> Personally, I'd rather it didn't. I can see the logic of syncing when shooting RAW to one card and JPG to the other, which I suppose many 5DIII users may do because writing RAW to the SD card is a speed bottleneck. But on the 1D X, with dual CF, I write RAW to both cards - slot 2 is a backup, and just stays in the camera until the images transferred from card 1 are processed and backed up in multiple locations. Much like the two-step delete on most computer OS's (nove to trash, empty trash), having 'deleted' files on a backup card may be useful at some point, and simply copying them off card 2 is easier than file recovery from card 1.
> 
> But that's me. I hope that if Canon does implement this 'fix' they make it a controllable behavior.



Even the best photographers take bad pictures from time to time. If you know for a fact that you want to delete picture 111 from CF1, then it should be deleted from CF2 as well. Otherwise you end up with files that you do not need or want. Those files take up space on your back up HDs and while one or two may not make a difference, they will soon begin to add up. Plus, it is a question of time. If you know for a fact that picture 111 is a throw then, it saves you time to make that decision just once, and on the camera.

At the end of the day it is a flasghip camera so it should be customisable, so I do agree that when they do implement this "fix" they allow users to choose how the delete works.


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## neuroanatomist (Oct 18, 2012)

expatinasia said:


> Even the best photographers take bad pictures from time to time. If you know for a fact that you want to delete picture 111 from CF1, then it should be deleted from CF2 as well. Otherwise you end up with files that you do not need or want. Those files take up space on your back up HDs and while one or two may not make a difference, they will soon begin to add up. Plus, it is a question of time. If you know for a fact that picture 111 is a throw then, it saves you time to make that decision just once, and on the camera.
> 
> At the end of the day it is a flasghip camera so it should be customisable, so I do agree that when they do implement this "fix" they allow users to choose how the delete works.



Oh, I delete plenty of images.  My point is that for my workflow, not deleting the image from CF2 at the same time has no negative impact (because I don't transfer images from that card normally, it's only in case CF1 fails), and _might_ have a positive impact if I accidentally delete an image I shouldn't have deleted, it's still there on CF2.

But I absolutely agree that it should be customizable - that way, everyone gets what they want. I am just expressing a hope that Canon doesn't apply an irreversible fix for a problem I don't currently have, and thereby _create_ a potential problem for me.


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## tron (Oct 18, 2012)

Bombsight said:


> You get what you pay for .... never fails.
> 
> Funny how the 5DMK3 owners couldnt be happier with the decision they made not long ago (5DMK3 instead of "overpiced 1DX) .... Now, all of a sudden, the monetarily ugly child in the family gets a little exra attention and the pretty daughters start whinning. :
> 
> Happy with MY decision of a 1DX ... and throwing it back on all of those who blasted it for one reason or another.


So 5DMK3 is a cheap camera that does not have to be updated?


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## spinworkxroy (Oct 18, 2012)

I honestly doubt Canon updated the 1DX because people asked for it..well maybe partitally.
it's about matching your competition..
The 1dX's competition is the Nikon D4 and the 1DX beats it in every aspect except the f8 autofocusing…

On the other hand Nikon doesn't have anything to match the 5D3 in what it was made to do.
And Canon doesn't yet anything to match the D800 in what that does. To me, they're both not cameras to be compared with..same price but not same purpose.
So having said that, updating the 1DX, not only because it's the pro's camera but because it has to be the best Pro camera out there and this update confirmed it even more.

The 5D3 on the other hand, i doubt Canon will update it..there's no need to improve something that there's no competition for...


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## AmbientLight (Oct 18, 2012)

Canon wouldn't provide firmware upgrades the way they did for the 7D and the 1D-X, if they weren't dedicated to deliver to their customer base, irrespective of competition, because I don't see any competition for the 7D.

The f8 issue, although quite important for me, isn't everyone's cup of tea, especially since f8 autofocus has previously been available in 1-series cameras anyway, so I think this fix still applies to 1-series only.

Fixing the black and now flashing red focus point issue is important for both 1D-X and 5D Mark III users, so you can expect something like this coming up in a 5D Mark III firmware update as well.

Maybe the solution for the 5D Mark III focus points will even be better than the one provided for the 1D-X, because Canon can react to the initial 1D-X user experiences. In any case I don't see any reason to whine about 5D Mark III users not receiving an update. I expect it is only a matter of time, so get your hopes up!


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## Razor2012 (Oct 18, 2012)

I don't know why people still complain about the price difference between the 5DIII & D800. They are totally two different cameras. If they were pretty much identical then you'd have an argument. I feel totally satisfied paying a bit more for better AF, ISO and FPS.


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## bigmag13 (Oct 18, 2012)

bbasiaga said:


> I know it shouldn't by now, but it always surprises me when people take this stuff personally....
> 
> Its been pretty good to see some features being added via firmware to the 7D and now 1DX. I'm sure we'll get something for the 5DIII eventually. In the mean time I'll just have to resign myself to thoroughly enjoying the most versatile camera I have ever owned. Darn those Canon [email protected]
> 
> -Brian



+1


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## rpt (Oct 18, 2012)

InterMurph said:


> se7en said:
> 
> 
> > a simple firmware update
> ...


+1 +1 and +1


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## infared (Oct 18, 2012)

kasperj said:


> I couldn't have said it better
> 
> Never mind the AF at f.8 limited tele lenses, just correct the red illumination issue already!
> 
> Grr



I totally agree. The 5DIII is a $3500 camera body. Let me say that AGAIN. The 5DIII is a $3500 camera body!
It is touted as an exceptional tool to make images with. The feature should be there in THIS camera body. Period.
The fact that this feature was changed/overlooked is embarrassing. ...but then Canon has been doing a LOT of embarrassing things lately and overcharging for them, too. Take the "M" for instance...........


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## Bombsight (Oct 18, 2012)

tron said:


> Bombsight said:
> 
> 
> > You get what you pay for .... never fails.
> ...



I dont know about the "Updated" part but, back when all of the new 5D3 owners felt like they got a great deal because there was only a 1-1.5 stop difference between the 5D3 and the 1DX .... and it was an unnecessary expense for frame rate only, the 5D3 owners thought they stole something from Canon. :

I see a lot of 5D3's being sold soon if Canon says no to the "pretty daughters".


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## Razor2012 (Oct 18, 2012)

Bombsight said:


> tron said:
> 
> 
> > Bombsight said:
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Don't make assumptions, I wasn't one of those people.


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## tron (Oct 18, 2012)

Bombsight said:


> tron said:
> 
> 
> > Bombsight said:
> ...



The 1Dx does not offer only 1stop of improvement. It offers speed and reliability and these are what a professional photographer needs. 

I do not know (or care) in which thread these declarations were made and how many people had written so.
However, your comments imply a kind of satisfaction and "revenge" (couldn't think of a more suitable word, I apologize for that) and they are rather childish. They do not even seem to come from a photographer. Enjoy your 1Dx


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## dawgfanjeff (Oct 18, 2012)

rpt said:


> InterMurph said:
> 
> 
> > se7en said:
> ...


Very true. As somebody who manages an enterprise dev shop in a Fortune 100, I certainly appreciate the costs of gathering requirements, performing development, validating in QA, user acceptance testing, etc... It's certainly not as simple as just turning something on and posting the new fw to the website and being done with it. As with anything, the hard part is making it look easy. 
As a 5DIII owner, I certainly appreciate why Canon targeted the 1DX first. Those users pay, in part, for the privilege of getting fixes and updates first. If i were a IDx user, I'd be scratching my head ad the 5DIII users getting it first.


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## Bombsight (Oct 18, 2012)

tron said:


> The 1Dx does not offer only 1stop of improvement. It offers speed and reliability and these are what a professional photographer needs.
> 
> I do not know (or care) in which thread these declarations were made and how many people had written so.
> However, your comments imply a kind of satisfaction and "revenge" and they are rather childish. Enjoy your 1Dx



1. It's abilities I know well.

2. That's what I thought of all the comments by 5D3 owners at the time. Just rubbin' it back on 'em after the "salt bath" of every 1DX thread in the past. A classic Eddie Murphy & the bread sandwich syndrome ... Eddie Murphy On McDonalds

3. Know that I AM a photographer ... & Thank you.
I will.


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## jdavis37 (Oct 18, 2012)

FWIW.. saw the comments on CR home page regarding 5D3 and AF:

>>If you remember the story about getting f/8 to work on the EOS-1D X with a Kenko teleconverter, Arthur Morris was unable to make the EOS 5D Mark III do the same thing with the exact same teleconverter. The fact that Canon hasn’t updated both cameras at the same time tells me there are indeed differences in the AF systems. I am reminded only the EOS-1 line has ever had f/8 autofocus, so it may not be something that gets added to the 5D Mark III anyway.<<

When I had my 2X TC II (Canon) and 1.4X TC ( both Canon II's.. now have the 1.4X II and 2X III), I was able to get somewhat decent Af stacking the TC's with my 300 F2.8 so I know the camera has some F8 AF ability. using 1.4X TC with 100-400L, however, results in nothing. Does not even try to AF.

I hope Canon does decide to bring F8 AF to the 5D3 but if I were a gambling person I would bet they won't, regardless of whether or not it is doable. That said a $3K body should be worthy of such a feature given nikon has F8 Af in the $2K realm.

But I can say I was able to stack TC's on my 5D3 with 300F2.8 IS and got good to fair AF. Going to keep fingers crossed on the F8 AF but won't hold my breath!


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## tron (Oct 18, 2012)

jdavis37 said:


> FWIW.. saw the comments on CR home page regarding 5D3 and AF:
> 
> >>If you remember the story about getting f/8 to work on the EOS-1D X with a Kenko teleconverter, Arthur Morris was unable to make the EOS 5D Mark III do the same thing with the exact same teleconverter. The fact that Canon hasn’t updated both cameras at the same time tells me there are indeed differences in the AF systems. I am reminded only the EOS-1 line has ever had f/8 autofocus, so it may not be something that gets added to the 5D Mark III anyway.<<
> 
> ...


F/8 should be available for 1Dx from the very beginning. Now the AF red illumination is very trivial to be ommited from both cameras. I believe they will fix it on 5D3. Now time will tell about the F/8. Not very likely BUT as you said the cheaper Nikon D800 has it!


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## Razor2012 (Oct 18, 2012)

tron said:


> jdavis37 said:
> 
> 
> > FWIW.. saw the comments on CR home page regarding 5D3 and AF:
> ...



Heh, there are probably complaints in the Nikon camp that the D800 should have certain features also.


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## tron (Oct 18, 2012)

Razor2012 said:


> tron said:
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> > jdavis37 said:
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That's interesting! Do you know which specific features?


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## jdavis37 (Oct 18, 2012)

Razor2012 said:


> tron said:
> 
> 
> > jdavis37 said:
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Im no holding my breath re F8AF and 5D3 if history has anything to say about it. Years back Canon refused to put ISO in the viewfinder in their lower bodies even though Nikon's $600 body had it. Each company has certain tendencies and feature sets they protect. it may well be 5D3 simply cannot do it but given my experience with 300 F2.8 + stacked TC's with decent F8AF it seems it is possible. Maybe a $3499 body (less now) is worthy.. time will tell but my guess is it just isn't going to happen. I like the 5D3 silent mode too much to go away from it.. really helps with birds and critters!


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## tron (Oct 19, 2012)

Right now I am not sure that 5DMkIII can handle it. I have 2 old teleconverters one Sigma 1.4X and one Tamron 2X.

I put the 1.4X to my 100-400 and I was able to focus only once inside my home (granted it wasn't very bright but still I had turned on all the lights
o the room (6 X 60W bulbs). I took the picture after many attempts, however then camera displayed Err01 (picture was saved to card).

Now this was my 5DMkII since 5DMkIII couldn't cooperate.

However my2X Tamron was accepted by both cameras (no error and no aperture change). 

Since it i was using the 2X teleconverter I tried it with my 24-105 f/4L and my 70-200 f/4L with 5DMkII and 5DMkIII.

Unfortunately neither camera could focus.

So I do not have high hopes. Of course I will be glad to be wrong since I also have Canon EF1.4X II and EF2X II.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Oct 19, 2012)

rpt said:


> InterMurph said:
> 
> 
> > se7en said:
> ...


And even after testing it to death, when the firmware gets out to 500,000 users, they find more bugs.


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## wickidwombat (Oct 19, 2012)

this thread deserves this again 

Canon 5D vs 1D


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## rpt (Oct 19, 2012)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> rpt said:
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> 
> > InterMurph said:
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The thing is when a company pays programmers to write programs, they get two deliverables for the price of one! The first that is being paid for - the software code and the other entirely free - the bugs!


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## Pompo (Oct 19, 2012)

se7en said:


> Why do you think this was addressed earlier than the 5d mark III, despite the 5d being released "long" before the 1dx?
> 
> The simple answer would be: The 1dx costs more. "Professionals" demand it. etc.
> 
> ...



oh yes there are quite a few amateurs with the 5DIII, anyway the update sucks, all the points are red since they cannot change the hardware of the lcd. You could set it to only show your point you are usin but still have that red glare/halo all over the VF...and if you do that you won't know where you can move your AF point to...LAst but not least IT BLINKS FAST so it wont effect exposure, how is that for a 7 grands body?


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## AmbientLight (Oct 19, 2012)

Do you really own a 1D-X? Mine certainly does not show the behaviour you describe.


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## Bombsight (Oct 19, 2012)

Pompo said:


> how is that for a 7 grands body?


A hell of a lot better than not being able to see the black ones. ;D


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## comsense (Oct 19, 2012)

Bombsight said:


> I see a lot of 5D3's being sold soon if Canon says no to the "pretty daughters".


The one acting petty daughter, son, brother-in-law, sister-in-law, or anyone else is YOU my friend in addition to those who thought/think that people buying 1DX are throwing away $4000. So don't drag normal people into your pettiness. It has already been said that this is not a 'coveted' xtra special pro*est pro feature which users are whining about unnecessary. Its like saying people buying cheaper cars should not ask for proper rear view mirror. It pertains to basic use and even Rebel series deserves it. 
Although it is annoying, I don't think it effects your image quality or creativity; so no, don't lookout for those sweet deals on used 5DIII flooded in the market even if Canon ignores it.


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