# I compiled a 60D/70D/80D/7D2 feature comparison table



## Sharlin (Mar 13, 2016)

So, apparently (as a 60D shooter) I'm uncharacteristically excited by the upcoming 80D and have too much spare time. I compiled a table of most of the quantifiable differences between the 60D, 70D and 80D bodies. It is based on the official specification documents and should be near-exhaustive unlike the comparison tools found on various websites. Any errors and omissions should be my own, and feedback is gladly accepted.

EDIT: Now with even more features and a 7D2 column!

https://jsbin.com/bizepi


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## Don Haines (Mar 13, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



Sharlin said:


> So, apparently (as a 60D shooter) I'm uncharacteristically excited of the upcoming 80D and have too much spare time. I compiled a table of most of the quantifiable differences between the 60D, 70D and 80D bodies. It is based on the official specification documents and should be near-exhaustive unlike the comparison tools found on various websites. Any errors and omissions should be my own, and feedback is gladly accepted.
> 
> https://jsbin.com/sobeqakare



Nice chart.....


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## YuengLinger (Mar 13, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*

My 60D has ''Creative Filters,'' but I never use them. 


Also does have AI servo.


A few other errors perhaps.


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## Sharlin (Mar 13, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



YuengLinger said:


> My 60D has ''Creative Filters,'' but I never use them.



Yes, I should probably clarify that one. The 80D has a "basic zone" shooting mode where a given creative filter is auto-applied to each shot, and you get a live preview of the filter if you use the Live View. In the 60D you can only apply filters manually.



> Also does have AI servo.



In viewfinder shooting, yes, but not in Live View or movie shooting. Viewfinder AF modes are not listed as they have not changed.


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## axtstern (Mar 13, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*

Nice work
The 80D will be my new 60 too


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## ajfotofilmagem (Mar 13, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*

Thanks for the work. Very useful.


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## greger (Mar 13, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*

Your comparison list was Time Well Spent! The 80D needs a couple more features to surpass the 7Dll which I don't think will be upgraded. If my 7D died I would buy the 80D.


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## ajfotofilmagem (Mar 13, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



greger said:


> Your comparison list was Time Well Spent! The 80D needs a couple more features to surpass the 7Dll which I don't think will be upgraded. If my 7D died I would buy the 80D.


I think differently ...
I think Canon has decided to unlock some resources in 80D to become competitive with Nikon D500. If the D500 sell well, will stimulate Canon to make a 7D Mark iii with very advanced features.


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## tolusina (Mar 13, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*

This table is a list of improvements in the Canon EOS 80D compared to its ancestor the 60D. It is meant to be nearly-exhaustive, with the constraint that only easily-quantifiable features included in the official specifications are covered. The corresponding attributes of the 70D are also included for the sake of completeness. 


60D80D70D ProcessorDIGIC 4DIGIC 6DIGIC 5+ Sensor resolution18 Mpix24.2 Mpix20.2 Mpix Viewfinder96% coverage100% coverage98% coverage Touch screenNoYes, multitouchYes, multitouch Wi-FiNoYesYes NFCNoYesNo Battery life1100 shots960 shots920 shotsCIPA ratingExposure Metering sensor63-zone iFCL63-zone 7560-pixel RGB+IR63-zone iFCL AE/WB bracketing3 exposures up to ±3 EV2, 3, 5 or 7 exposures up to ±3 EV2, 3, 5 or 7 exposures up to ±3 EV2, 5, and 7 via C.Fn I-5Auto WB white priority No Yes No  Lens correctionVignettingVignetting, distortion, CAVignetting, CA ISO speedAuto, 100..6400, H: 12800Auto, 100..16000, H: 25600Auto, 100..12800, H: 25600 Auto ISO exposure comp.NoYesNo Auto ISO min. shutter speedNoYes, auto ±2 EV or manualYes, manual Multiple exposureNoYes, 2..9 exposures add/avgYes, 2..9 exposures add/avg HDRNoYes, 3 exposures up to ±3 EVYes, 3 exposures up to ±3 EV Bulb timerNoYes, from 00:00:01 to 99:59:59No Flicker reductionNoYesNo Picture styles78780D adds Fine DetailScene modes5107Food mode included! Creative filter modeNoYes, 10 filtersNo Drive Continuous shooting5.3 FPS high, 3 FPS low7 FPS high, 3 FPS low7 FPS high, 3 FPS low Silent shootingNoYes, one shot or 3 FPSYes, one shot or 3 FPS Maximum burst16 RAW, 58 JPEG25 RAW, 110 JPEG16 RAW, 65 JPEGWith a UHS-I card Interval timerNoYes, 1..99 shots or until stopped
Interval from 00:00:01 to 99:59:59No Autofocus  AF sensor9 points45 points19 points AF at f/8No Yes, center point with all lenses
27 points with 100-400 L II + 1.4x III
and 200-400 L + 2x III
No AF sensitivity-0.5..18 EV -0.5..18 EV
Center point to -3 EV at f/2.8, -1 at f/5.6 -0.5..18 EV AF point selection Single-point
All points  Single-point
Zone (nine 3x3 zones)
Large zone (three zones)
All points  Single-point
Zone (five zones)
All points  AF color trackingNoYes, with skintone detectionNoAssist AF using metering sensor AF microadjustmentNoYesYes Live view AF in Live ViewContrast detectDual PixelDual Pixel AF operationOne shotOne shot, AI ServoOne shot, AI Servo AF methods Quick AF (flip mirror)
Live AF
Face detect Live AF  Face detect + tracking
Single zone (35 points, 9 zones)
Multi-zone (35 points, 9 zones)  Face detect + tracking
Single zone (31 points, 9 zones)
Multi-zone (31 points, 9 zones)  Touch AFN/AYesYes Touch shutterN/AYesYes Movie shooting Recording size 1080p at 30 fps
720p at 60 fps  1080p at 60 fps IPB
1080p at 30 fps ALL-I
720p at 60 fps IPB  1080p at 30 fps ALL-I/IPB
720p at 60 fps ALL-I/IPB  FormatsMOVMOV, MP4MOV Digital zoom480p crop mode3..10x3..10x Past 4GB recordingNoYesYesSeamlessly start a new file at 4GB Movie Servo AFNoYesYes Movie HDRNoYesNo Movie Creative FiltersNoYesNo Timelapse videoNoYesNo Video snapshotsNoYesYes Headphone jackNoYesNo Internal microphoneMonoStereoStereo Customization My Menu1 tab, 6 items5 tabs, 6 items per tab1 tab, 6 items Custom shooting modes121 AF Custom Functions41613 Focusing screenInterchangeableFixedFixed 


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## chrysoberyl (Mar 14, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*

I considered a new body for wildlife - either a 7D II or a 5D III - because my 6D was not very good for BIF. Neither felt right. Then the 80D was announced, and given that wildlife is secondary to macro and close-ups, I ordered an 80D yesterday. Will it be as good as the 7D II for BIF? No, but in my hands it will be close enough. And the additional DOF will be very welcome for macro and close-ups.


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## midluk (Mar 14, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



chrysoberyl said:


> And the additional DOF will be very welcome for macro and close-ups.


I don't think you will get "free DOF" with APS-C. With the higher pixel density of APS-C you will see the diffraction limit earlier, which means you can stop down less until your image sharpness will suffer. Of course if you choose the smallest possible aperture for a given lens, you will get more DOF on APS-C than on FF, but the in-focus areas will be less sharp.

And for roughly the same noise performance you need to open up the aperture (f number) about one stop further on APS-C than on FF, which then gives you the same DOF (same absolute aperture when you scale the focal length as well as the f number with the crop factor).

What you will gain with APS-C for macro is that the effective maximum magnification is increased by the crop factor. And for the 80D, the swivel screen is extremely useful for macro work.


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## LoneRider (Mar 14, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



ajfotofilmagem said:


> greger said:
> 
> 
> > Your comparison list was Time Well Spent! The 80D needs a couple more features to surpass the 7Dll which I don't think will be upgraded. If my 7D died I would buy the 80D.
> ...



Thank you!

I think I've now decided to hold onto the 7D, and just wait for the announcement on the 5DX.

But I would agree, the 7D-ii is not going to be around for a long time. The 7D-iii will have to have touch screen and will get ADC on die if our guesses are correct. Release of the 7D-iii will be after 5DX though.

Looking at the 1DX-ii and the 80D, I think the only item on my wish list for the 5DX that maybe missing is the GPS. And I will admit, that will piss me off that they can't spend the under 20 bucks on a Trimble (or other manufacture) GPS unit and antenna into the top of the enclosure of the camera!


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## chrysoberyl (Mar 14, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



midluk said:


> chrysoberyl said:
> 
> 
> > And the additional DOF will be very welcome for macro and close-ups.
> ...



I agree - no 'free' DOF. But when I went from 60D to 6D, I struggled with DOF. I found I was stopping down to f/11, when before I used f/6.3 or so. Lenses are sharper at f/6.3 or so, so I expect some net improvement.

I totally agree on the swivel screen! I look forward to having that again.

The effective maximum magnification - really? So my 100L becomes a 1.6X 160 and my Sigma 180 becomes 1.6X 288? And with a 2X extender, it will be a 3.2X 576?? Am I understanding this correctly?


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## midluk (Mar 14, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



chrysoberyl said:


> I agree - no 'free' DOF. But when I went from 60D to 6D, I struggled with DOF. I found I was stopping down to f/11, when before I used f/6.3 or so. Lenses are sharper at f/6.3 or so, so I expect some net improvement.


11/6.3=1.75, which is roughly the crop factor. So assuming you have also scaled the focal length by roughly this factor, the absolute aperture and DOF should be about unchanged. As the absolute pixel size is bigger for FF compared to APS-C, the effect of diffraction (this is what makes lenses less sharp at smaller apertures) should become noticeable only at a smaller relative aperture (which then gives the same absolute aperture) on FF than on APS-C.
Of course it only applies to cameras with the same pixel count. And I have to admit that I have not tested this myself yet (still waiting for the 5D4…).



chrysoberyl said:


> The effective maximum magnification - really? So my 100L becomes a 1.6X 160 and my Sigma 180 becomes 1.6X 288? And with a 2X extender, it will be a 3.2X 576?? Am I understanding this correctly?


The 100 f/2.8L with 1:1 macro effectively becomes a 160 f/4.5 with 1.6:1 macro, because the minimum focus distance does not change. It still physically is 1:1 (1cm in reality becomes 1cm on the sensor), but it produces images like 1.6:1. Of course you can only profit from it, if the lens is sharp enough to make use of the increased pixel density.


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## chrysoberyl (Mar 14, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*


The 100 f/2.8L with 1:1 macro effectively becomes a 160 f/4.5 with 1.6:1 macro, because the minimum focus distance does not change. It still physically is 1:1 (1cm in reality becomes 1cm on the sensor), but it produces images like 1.6:1. Of course you can only profit from it, if the lens is sharp enough to make use of the increased pixel density.
[/quote]

Sigh...I've tried so hard to not get overly excited... But seriously, thanks for the education. I believe that this is not the first time, either, so thanks again.

Now I'm thinking about my next lens for this camera. I want 400mm with good AF and IS, but can't afford Canon. And maybe a Zeiss Makro. But that's another topic.


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## Sharlin (Mar 15, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*

Hi all,

I added several features missing from the original, most pretty minor though. Also added a 7D Mk II column, the comparison with the 80D is pretty intriguing. Enjoy!

https://jsbin.com/bizepi


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## Don Haines (Mar 15, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



Sharlin said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I added several features missing from the original, most pretty minor though. Also added a 7D Mk II column, the comparison with the 80D is pretty intriguing. Enjoy!
> 
> https://jsbin.com/bizepi


Very interesting.... makes me wonder what the 7D3 will bring to the table....


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## LoneRider (Mar 15, 2016)

Thank you, interesting table.

It is funny, I held back on the 7D-ii because of the lack of touch screen. Pretty happy about that. I must admit, shooting video on my 7D and some of the "sports" picture would have been better with the 7D-ii, but I am glad I waited. If the 5Dx does not have touchscreen and GPS, I am not sure what I will do.


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## Valvebounce (Mar 16, 2016)

Hi Sharlin. 
Thank you for your effort and sharing your creation. Very interesting. 

Hi LoneRider. 
To me the touch screen is not a big deal, I have tried my friends 70D touch screen and most of the time I found I could make the adjustments as easily using the normal controls. Also I forgot it had touch screen most of the time though I'm sure using the camera more frequently would soon over come that issue. 
I have the 7DII and the AF is fantastic in video / live view mode, and once you get used to the controls it is very customisable. 
There is always an upgrade coming next year or next month or whenever, at some point you have to jump and accept that the next camera along may better your recent acquisition on some levels but look at all the shots you have got before the new body came along. 

Cheers, Graham.


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## niels123 (Mar 16, 2016)

Nice chart!

Is the 7D2 compatible with the GP-E2?


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## nhz (Mar 16, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



Sharlin said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I added several features missing from the original, most pretty minor though. Also added a 7D Mk II column, the comparison with the 80D is pretty intriguing. Enjoy!
> 
> https://jsbin.com/bizepi


very nice! Maybe you could add LCD resolution (haven't checked but I guess there has been some improvement over time and admittedly not a major decision factor).

For me just the tilt screen and the significantly lower weight seal the deal in favor of the 80D compared to 7D2. The only spec still missing is low ISO DR, if that is significantly improved (13.5-14 stops should be possible) I will buy the 80D (the lack of improvement in 70D kept me from upgrading to that camera). I'm expecting High ISO performance of 80D to be close enough to 7D2 that the difference doesn't matter to me.


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## Sharlin (Mar 16, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



nhz said:


> very nice! Maybe you could add LCD resolution (haven't checked but I guess there has been some improvement over time and admittedly not a major decision factor).



Thanks! Yeah, I did check that and believe or not all the four cameras use the quantitatively same 3-inch 1.04-megapixel LCD. However, the newer cameras seem to have ClearView II without air gap for better glare management, plus some sort of a smudge-resistant coating. These are for some reason not mentioned in the specification, only in marketing materials :/


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## Sharlin (Mar 16, 2016)

niels123 said:


> Nice chart!
> 
> Is the 7D2 compatible with the GP-E2?



Thanks! Appears it isn't :/ Built-in only.


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## LoneRider (Mar 16, 2016)

Valvebounce said:


> Hi LoneRider.
> To me the touch screen is not a big deal, I have tried my friends 70D touch screen and most of the time I found I could make the adjustments as easily using the normal controls. Also I forgot it had touch screen most of the time though I'm sure using the camera more frequently would soon over come that issue.
> I have the 7DII and the AF is fantastic in video / live view mode, and once you get used to the controls it is very customisable.
> There is always an upgrade coming next year or next month or whenever, at some point you have to jump and accept that the next camera along may better your recent acquisition on some levels but look at all the shots you have got before the new body came along.
> ...



Graham,

Thanks, I looked for youtube video of someone using the 7D-ii for video, and could not find one. But as time went on I started to look towards FF, as I was not sure the 7D-ii was going to work well enough in lower light situations. As well, I want to play around with "depth of field" more with a FF sensor. So yeah, if I knew back then what I know now about the 7D-ii I might have gotten it. No doubt the 7D-ii is a big jump over my 7D.

Thank you,
Thomas


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## K (Mar 24, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



ajfotofilmagem said:


> I think Canon has decided to unlock some resources in 80D to become competitive with Nikon D500. If the D500 sell well, will stimulate Canon to make a 7D Mark iii with very advanced features.




I'm not so sure. The D500 is there to put a halt to all the Nikon defectors who can't fork out $6,000 for a flagship camera. Nikon has been losing users to Canon in this regard. For a long time now, Nikon has had nothing in this area. Users will put up with slightly inferior...but they can't put up with nothing.

Both companies have had a really slow upgrade cycle on these flagship crop cameras. I believe it is because they both felt the flagship DSLR was a dead concept with FF on the rise in that price bracket. Apparently, that isn't the case. The main draw of these flagship crops is the 10fps, build and pro-ish features. 

Overall, these cameras don't really compete directly. These are for users who are already "in system" either Nikon or Canon. 

Since the D500 announcement, I've been hoping the D500 puts pressure on Canon to release a 7D3, but I'm doubting that because they don't compete. It is hard to imagine someone dumping their system to go to the other side for what amounts to minuscule advantages. Only the most fanatical pixel peeper would cross the river for that, and this would be enthusiasts demanding the best with lot of money to spare. 99% of everyone else is not going to do that.

How many first time buyers are there of flagship level crop cameras? I would think that is a small percentage of buyers. I think buyers of a flagship crop would be those who want to upgrade to the best APS-C coming from entry level of enthusiast cameras...and mostly FF owners of 2nd tier pro bodies like the 5DX or D810 who want a "cheap" sports/wildlife camera that is blazing fast and has more reach. Throw in some event pros who want a pro-capable camera at the $2K or less price point. These are people who want strong body, dual cards, speed, handling, controls and other features of these bodies....but who can't spend $3K on the pro FF's.

Now, the 80D will dig into 7D2 sales. Those cameras now compete. At this point, if you don't need 2 card slots and 10fps isn't mandatory - the 7D2 offers little over the 80D. Many users within a camera system will rank IQ up high as a factor. Across systems, not so much. Within a system, you have the same glass and that is a big consideration for many, many reasons.


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## weixing (Mar 24, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



K said:


> ajfotofilmagem said:
> 
> 
> > I think Canon has decided to unlock some resources in 80D to become competitive with Nikon D500. If the D500 sell well, will stimulate Canon to make a 7D Mark iii with very advanced features.
> ...


Hi,
As a 7D2 owner, I was quite interested to switch to 80D due to many F8 AF points, but there is one custom function that 7D2 had, but not on 80D (base on manual) that really stop me from switching:
The ability to assign "AF-ON" button as One-shot and "*" button as Servo-AF or vice versa. With this setup, I can use one-shot or Servo AF by pressing either button which is very importance to me.

Also, the level indicator in 7D2 viewfinder is easier to use than the 80D.

Have a nice day.


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## xps (Mar 24, 2016)

Thanks for sharing!

As written some days ago, an member of our photoclub (who works for an really big German photographic equipment selling business chain) was able to take some shots with the new 80D. He is in the opinion, for the "normal" enthusiastic wildlife/birds... shooter the 80D will be the better option than the 7DII, especially if you go 100-400& 1.4x externder. He reported that IQ is visibly better, AF at F8 works fine and the overall performance is not so much worser than the one of the 7DII. Some special things are missing (Af cases). 

He reported yesterday, the AF accuracy (as critiziced in recent Color-Foto Magazine) is better than the AF of the 7DII. They took shots on moving targets at an shooting range. They got more sharp pictures, especially when the target is stopping and starts moving again.


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## nhz (Mar 24, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



K said:


> I'm not so sure. The D500 is there to put a halt to all the Nikon defectors who can't fork out $6,000 for a flagship camera. Nikon has been losing users to Canon in this regard. For a long time now, Nikon has had nothing in this area. Users will put up with slightly inferior...but they can't put up with nothing.
> 
> Both companies have had a really slow upgrade cycle on these flagship crop cameras. I believe it is because they both felt the flagship DSLR was a dead concept with FF on the rise in that price bracket. Apparently, that isn't the case. The main draw of these flagship crops is the 10fps, build and pro-ish features.
> 
> Now, the 80D will dig into 7D2 sales. Those cameras now compete. At this point, if you don't need 2 card slots and 10fps isn't mandatory - the 7D2 offers little over the 80D. Many users within a camera system will rank IQ up high as a factor. Across systems, not so much. Within a system, you have the same glass and that is a big consideration for many, many reasons.



I think you have a bit too limited definition of 'flagship camera', as if it is all about sports and super-fast wildlife. That's just a small percentage of the market IMHO. Maybe it looks like that because Canikon competes mostly on extreme High ISO performance, high framerate and tough build quality (Canon does this for all all their FF models except 6D, while Nikon has a more balanced approach with their FF cameras).

I would have no problem paying a lot of money for a very different APS-C 'flagship camera', one with primarily very good LOW ISO performance instead of extreme HIGH ISO performance. And not super-tough, weather sealed and heavy but compact and light while still having good build quality. APS-C is fine if they provide a few high quality SWA lenses. Just look at how e.g. a D7200 sensor beats all Canon FF sensors in DR at low ISO (the 5DS has much higher resolution, but apart from that model the D7200 has the same resolution too). Although I don't need many of the 'tough' features of a D500, it looks like a very interesting camera to me - the only reservations I have are the higher weight (still low compared to 7D2 though) and that low ISO performance might be a bit compromised (we don't know yet).

Agree that 80D now competes with 7D2 because it caters to a potentially much bigger group of users and it ahead on some specs. The only fly in the ointment might be that 80D sensor could be significantly weaker for medium-high ISO than 7D2 (above 800 ISO or so - but maybe the first reports about that aren't reliable).


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## nhz (Mar 24, 2016)

xps said:


> Thanks for sharing!
> 
> As written some days ago, an member of our photoclub (who works for an really big German photographic equipment selling business chain) was able to take some shots with the new 80D. He is in the opinion, for the "normal" enthusiastic wildlife/birds... shooter the 80D will be the better option than the 7DII, especially if you go 100-400& 1.4x externder. He reported that IQ is visibly better, AF at F8 works fine and the overall performance is not so much worser than the one of the 7DII. Some special things are missing (Af cases).
> 
> He reported yesterday, the AF accuracy (as critiziced in recent Color-Foto Magazine) is better than the AF of the 7DII. They took shots on moving targets at an shooting range. They got more sharp pictures, especially when the target is stopping and starts moving again.



Clearly many experienced wildlife photographers have trouble getting really (reliably) sharp images with the 7D2 for moving subjects and there still is no good explanation for that. We need the 80D in the hands of more users, with different lenses and shooting conditions, to be sure of AF performance. If it can avoid the glitches of 7D2, whatever their real cause, that could be a major advantage. A higher frame rate is of little help if a large percentage of shots is just OOF ;-(


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## xps (Mar 24, 2016)

nhz said:


> xps said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks for sharing!
> ...



You are right. Better lower fps, but many more sharper images. The collegue tested it with his 100-400 II +1.4 extender and 300mm 2.8, 600mm L IS I. And the 80D seems to be better in AF at shooting moving subjects.

But he heared (rumor from others), that Canon (maybe) will release an updated firmware, as the AF system is capable of better performance. But he does not know, if this is true.

If you come from Germany, read the test in Color-Foto. I was astonished, that the AF has such "problems". I thought, this AF will be the best of the tested cams. But it was not. I read in another forum, the low fps rate of the silent shooting mode was the reason for this, but I do not believe this.

G


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## K (Mar 24, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



nhz said:


> Agree that 80D now competes with 7D2 because it caters to a potentially much bigger group of users and it ahead on some specs. The only fly in the ointment might be that 80D sensor could be significantly weaker for medium-high ISO than 7D2 (above 800 ISO or so - but maybe the first reports about that aren't reliable).




That is an interesting report, here's my thoughts...

The 80D has a brand new sensor with on chip conversion. It *should* have better high ISO performance than the 7D2, even with its higher megapixel count.

There's also that crowd in the internet that says pixel size doesn't matter. I don't think so. I think it does matter. But even if it did, 20 to 24 MP isn't a huge difference like say 12 to 24mp is. What is a huge difference is that the 80D sensor is much newer and has a significantly improved technology for increasing DR and reducing noise. That is a more relevant factor. Not 4 more megapixels.

What, other than having 4mp less, does the old tech sensor of the 7D2 have to possibly allow it better high ISO performance?

I think absolutely nothing.


Thus, if it is true that the 7D2 has better high ISO - then there is 2 possibilities...


1. Canon 'tuned' these sensors differently and isn't a matter of technology. But this will certainly make the sensor geeks go crazy as they have said on this forum a sensor cannot be geared or tuned to have better performance in certain regards.

2. Canon is...uhhh I hate to say it...intentionally crippling the 80D's high ISO. Why? I have no idea. To leave something better about the 7D2's sensor and help keep it more relevant for sports/wildlife/event shooters? Maybe. That's a stretch, but Canon is capable of anything. 


ALL that said,,,,I will wait to see more results and comparisons. However, if it is true the 7D2 has better high ISO....then at least one or two prevailing wisdom group-think internet facts go down the toilet. Because these folks making these claims cannot have it both ways as illustrated in my points in this post.

My opinion, if the 7D2 has better high ISO, I think #2 "crippling" is taking place. Because there is no way a lousy 4mp less two-year old sensor trumps on-chip ADC. And I strongly doubt it has anything to do with the greater processing capacity of the 7D2. While processing plays a much larger role than people give credit for, the 7D2 has it for processing 10fps. It doesn't reduce noise that much to beat out a 2 years newer sensor with ADC.


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## Don Haines (Mar 24, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



K said:


> nhz said:
> 
> 
> > Agree that 80D now competes with 7D2 because it caters to a potentially much bigger group of users and it ahead on some specs. The only fly in the ointment might be that 80D sensor could be significantly weaker for medium-high ISO than 7D2 (above 800 ISO or so - but maybe the first reports about that aren't reliable).
> ...



There is a third and much more probable possibility.... One sensor design works better at high ISO and the other sensor design works better at low ISO.

Anyone who has been following this forum has heard the endless droning on (by all parties) about the eternal Canon vs Nikon vs Sony sensor debate and how the Canon sensors are inferior at low ISO yet are equivalent (or slightly better) at high ISO. So now Canon comes out with an on-chip A/D and OMG! it is better at low ISO and worse at low ISO.... there seems to be a pattern here


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## midluk (Mar 24, 2016)

Or there is a new generation of DPAF which slightly reduces photon collection efficiency and therefore high ISO performance.


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## IglooEater (Mar 25, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



Don Haines said:


> There is a third and much more probable possibility.... One sensor design works better at high ISO and the other sensor design works better at low ISO.
> 
> Anyone who has been following this forum has heard the endless droning on (by all parties) about the eternal Canon vs Nikon vs Sony sensor debate and how the Canon sensors are inferior at low ISO yet are equivalent (or slightly better) at high ISO. So now Canon comes out with an on-chip A/D and OMG! it is better at low ISO and worse at low ISO.... there seems to be a pattern here



That answer seems too reasonable for the CR crowd.


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## Don Haines (Mar 25, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



dilbert said:


> Don Haines said:
> 
> 
> > ...
> ...


It does make sense  and you are right about things not being the same....

It all comes down to what the designs are and how they are implemented. Canon has been using off-chip A/D units from (I believe) AMD. Advanced Micro Devices has been in business a LONG time.....I was buying their A/D and D/A chips back into the 1970`s... They do a very good job. I am sure that they design better devices than Canon or Sony or Nikon. 

It is very possible that under some conditions, an off-chip A/D of superior design will work better than an inferior A/D that is on-chip. When you consider thermal noise, and that the sensor is the hottest chip in the camera, this becomes even more likely.


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## nhz (Mar 25, 2016)

*Re: I compiled a 60D/70D/80D feature comparison table*



Don Haines said:


> There is a third and much more probable possibility.... One sensor design works better at high ISO and the other sensor design works better at low ISO.
> 
> Anyone who has been following this forum has heard the endless droning on (by all parties) about the eternal Canon vs Nikon vs Sony sensor debate and how the Canon sensors are inferior at low ISO yet are equivalent (or slightly better) at high ISO. So now Canon comes out with an on-chip A/D and OMG! it is better at low ISO and worse at low  *high?* ISO.... there seems to be a pattern here



Agree, in technology there usually is no free lunch - just a different compromise unless someone has radically different technology which isn't the case here. The same seems to apply to Nikon D5 based on the latest rumors.

IMHO especially Canon has been putting way too much emphasis on extreme High ISO over the last years, at the cost of low ISO; maybe 1/2 stop better at high ISO but several stops behind at low ISO compared to Nikon. Maybe that made sense catering mostly to sports, event, wedding shooters etc. but not everyone shoots in near dark, I'm pretty sure most of their users shoot 100-800 ISO most of the time ... 

With the 80D there finally is a better balance between low and high ISO performance. At the same time, looking at e.g. Nikon D7200 you can see that both low and High ISO performance can be further improved, but maybe in that case the compromise is the lack of dual pixel AF (I don't really care about that), maybe compromised video (haven't checked because I don't really care about video either) and slow Liveview (that's more of a problem, especially if you need it for the most accurate AF).


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## axtstern (Mar 29, 2016)

Suestion from my side please check if there are more details for the comparrison sheet.

From my point of view:
My 80D does not allow to take pictures while having movie mode activated. I was sure that my 60D was still able to do that. Has this feature already disapeared in the age of the 70D?


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## Sharlin (Mar 29, 2016)

axtstern said:


> My 80D does not allow to take pictures while having movie mode activated. I was sure that my 60D was still able to do that. Has this feature already disapeared in the age of the 70D?



Already there, item "Still shooting" under Movie shooting. The feature is removed from the 80D for an unknown reason.


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## axtstern (Mar 29, 2016)

THX for the info


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## midluk (Mar 29, 2016)

Sharlin said:


> axtstern said:
> 
> 
> > My 80D does not allow to take pictures while having movie mode activated. I was sure that my 60D was still able to do that. Has this feature already disapeared in the age of the 70D?
> ...


The reason is likely: "We need some features to add to the 90D to sell more of those to 80D users."


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