# Digital Rev!



## wayno (Feb 18, 2013)

Haven't bought from these guys before but had only heard good things - until this...

http://www.news.com.au/technology/biztech/camera-company-digitalrev-busted-selling-used-cameras-sold-as-new-online/story-fn5lic6c-1226580348144


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## paul13walnut5 (Feb 18, 2013)

The guy should count themselves lucky, you should have seen the nick of the 7D they sent me, looked like it had been set on fire, spray painted and frozen. Worked fine though.


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## Zv (Feb 18, 2013)

paul13walnut5 said:


> The guy should count themselves lucky, you should have seen the nick of the 7D they sent me, looked like it had been set on fire, spray painted and frozen. Worked fine though.



Loved my 7D a little more after seeing what it can put up with!!

;D ;D ;D


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## Viggo (Feb 18, 2013)

This is so not great news for them.. I really like that it's in out there though. I would go mental if I found out someone was running around testing my gear before I bought it thinking it was brand new. I could buy a demo-product, but not when it's full retail and nothing is said about it. Really dissapointing stuff..


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## crasher8 (Feb 18, 2013)

Kai lost a few rep points there for sure.


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## charlesa (Feb 18, 2013)

This will cause a big chunk in revenue downgrowth...


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## Dukinald (Feb 18, 2013)

Part of the risk buying online. Good thing there are sites you can go to to check shutter counts and serial numbers. I would definitely do my due diligence if i'm purchasing a big $ item.

On the bright side, it is not as bad as someone getting floor boards for his 5d3


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## Axilrod (Feb 18, 2013)

paul13walnut5 said:


> The guy should count themselves lucky, you should have seen the nick of the 7D they sent me, looked like it had been set on fire, spray painted and frozen. Worked fine though.



;D Nice one Paulie


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## JerryKnight (Feb 18, 2013)

crasher8 said:


> Kai lost a few rep points there for sure.



You really think the production crew has anything to do with the online store? Kai did what Kai does - he's not supposed to treat the equipment like it's going to be sold as new afterwards. It's the store's fault for letting the review camera back into their inventory. Probably an honest mistake, but a potentially costly one.


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## tomscott (Feb 18, 2013)

Got my 5DMKIII from DR, arrived in 3 days to UK saved nearly £700 over UK prices with a a 24-105mm and 100mm Macro. Came with all UK standard kit etc great service IMO.

There will always be scaremongering around about companies, with the amount of kit they sell the likely hood of receiving a unit used in this way is so minuscule its not worth worrying about. Would not stop me buying from them again.


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## crasher8 (Feb 18, 2013)

JerryKnight said:


> crasher8 said:
> 
> 
> > Kai lost a few rep points there for sure.
> ...



He represents DR in the public's eye. Tell me where did I say he had anything to do with the screwup? Are you just in the mood to be a net corrector?


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## noisejammer (Feb 18, 2013)

I dealt with DR twice... The first time was fine, the second was the last. Basically, they took my money and didn't ship an expensive lens for more than a week. My emails went unanswered until the item was finally delivered at which point they wanted to know why I was tense.. I have no problem waiting for an item but BE HONEST if it's not in stock.

I looked around and discovered that there are several suppliers that are less expensive, more reliable and faster... The usual suspects... Aden, B&H, Adorama and 2filter....


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## crasher8 (Feb 18, 2013)

I'd never buy from them I just look to them as a source of both entertainment and info.


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## Radiating (Feb 18, 2013)

wayno said:


> Haven't bought from these guys before but had only heard good things - until this...
> 
> http://www.news.com.au/technology/biztech/camera-company-digitalrev-busted-selling-used-cameras-sold-as-new-online/story-fn5lic6c-1226580348144



""The logistic team, keen to meet the performance indicators set by the company, have in three occasions when the products were out of stock managed to return the products to the inventory," Ms Poon said.
"DigitalRev Online Store is now in touch with three affected customers to recall their products for refund or replacement."
Though it had discovered a few isolated violations of internal policy, Digital Rev said it takes the matter "extremely seriously."

The logistics team essentially stole 3 cameras from the production team because they were out of stock and wanted to fulfill orders faster. All 3 cameras are being recalled without the other two owners asking for anything.


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## Rienzphotoz (Feb 18, 2013)

_Head of marketing and PR for Digital Rev, Julia Poon told News.com.au that an internal audit revealed three violations carried out by the logistic team that resulted in products lent to DigitalRev TV to be returned to the Online Store's inventory.

"The logistic team, keen to meet the performance indicators set by the company, have in three occasions when the products were out of stock managed to return the products to the inventory," Ms Poon said.

"DigitalRev Online Store is now in touch with three affected customers to recall their products for refund or replacement."_
_Though it had discovered a few isolated violations of internal policy, Digital Rev said it takes the matter "extremely seriously."

"We have made it the management’s top priority to make sure more trainings are provided and no further violation is going to happen. We are also hiring internal auditors to ensure internal compliance of the operation," Ms Poon said.

"All products offered on DigitalRev.com are brand new products. DigitalRev Online Store does not sell used or refurbished products, and we value the trust our customers have placed in us over the years. We wish to offer our most sincere apology to the customers affected and will make sure that similar incidents will not occur in the future."_

Read more: http://www.news.com.au/technology/biztech/camera-company-digitalrev-busted-selling-used-cameras-sold-as-new-online/story-fn5lic6c-1226580348144#ixzz2LHDMGKKb

DR is a highly reputable company and thousands of photographers in the Middle East (including several of my colleagues) order from DR Shop online ... I do not believe that DR deliberately cheats their customers.


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## JerryKnight (Feb 18, 2013)

crasher8 said:


> JerryKnight said:
> 
> 
> > crasher8 said:
> ...



I'm slightly offended that you're accusing me of being a nit-picker.

"Kai lost a few rep points there for sure." As near as I can tell, you were using English, and in most forms of English, that statement would imply that Kai had something to do with the mix-up, beyond being a representative of the name. You're saying he actively did something - he "lost"... What exactly did he do to lose points?

If you're more deliberate with your words, you won't attract so-called net correctors. Saying something like "This sure looks bad for Kai" more accurately represents your point.


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## tomscott (Feb 28, 2013)

I emailed DR 6 times regarding my order, with small changes. All were answered within the time zone of working hours, as being im the UK. Usually within 6 hours, I have had nothing but great service from them.

Especially as all the emails were written back to me in English, and well written and answered all my questions and couldn't have been more helpful.

People love to scaremonger and as they are significantly cheaper people think stay away. But everything has been fantastic and I would recommend them to anyone. 

Ive had two cameras and two lenses. Happy chappy.


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## infared (Feb 28, 2013)

tomscott said:


> Got my 5DMKIII from DR, arrived in 3 days to UK saved nearly £700 over UK prices with a a 24-105mm and 100mm Macro. Came with all UK standard kit etc great service IMO.
> 
> There will always be scaremongering around about companies, with the amount of kit they sell the likely hood of receiving a unit used in this way is so minuscule its not worth worrying about. Would not stop me buying from them again.



...but...did you give your camera the sniff test?


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## tomscott (Feb 28, 2013)

I assure you it was brand new in a sealed box


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## infared (Feb 28, 2013)

tomscott said:


> I assure you it was brand new in a sealed box



Just a little humor.


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## SilverSnake (Feb 28, 2013)

tomscott said:


> Got my 5DMKIII from DR, arrived in 3 days to UK saved nearly £700 over UK prices with a a 24-105mm and 100mm Macro. Came with all UK standard kit etc great service IMO.



Is that including import fees and such, or did you manage to get around that somehow? If it's possible to buy gear from them without having to pay local sales tax or import dues then that would be mighty interesting!


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## Scott_McPhee (Feb 28, 2013)

I was looking at DR when I was purchasing my 5D3.
Cheap prices but the lack of a UK warranty for something so expensive and time critical to me put me off buying from them.

The Kai show is entertaining, but I stick to UK based companies.


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## NetDog (Feb 28, 2013)

I believe that HDEW Camera's in the UK offer similar prices, but you also get Canon UK warranty as the camera's are purchased in the UK. (HDEW is seen by Canon as a UK company)

I have only heard good things about them....

... and no, I don't work for them or have any connection to them!


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## tyrant (Feb 28, 2013)

this is the guys blog http://www.prettyinwhite.com/digital-rev-hey-thats-my-camera/

looks like digitalrev took care of him and did the right thing.


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## cervantes (Feb 28, 2013)

In the comments to the OP's link someone says something like those DRev guys don't even know the difference between a dSLR and DSLR. Me neither.

Does anyone have an idea what the difference is?


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## tomscott (Feb 28, 2013)

Scott_McPhee said:


> I was looking at DR when I was purchasing my 5D3.
> Cheap prices but the lack of a UK warranty for something so expensive and time critical to me put me off buying from them.
> 
> The Kai show is entertaining, but I stick to UK based companies.



The Warranty thing is rubbish too. Typical scaremongering. 

They offer a full year international warranty which can be extended to three and have a UK base where you send them for warranty repair. Export to the UK is a big part of their business, if they didnt offer support they would get trashed on the internet which is what happened in the early days now they are an international business so must offer support. Mine was a UK spec camera anyway, the first camera I bought from them in 2006 (40D) was not it was a chinese version with a chinese battery charger, but a quick call and they sent me a UK replacement for free. They have expanded exponentially since then with it being 7 years ago, and as such my 5DMKIII 24-105mm and 100mm L arrived in full UK spec with all documentation and sealed.

The price you pay Digital Rev includes UK import tax it says so when you go to check out. Therefore you have no issue with customs and hidden charges. If anything your just as protected as UK companies except you get the significant cost difference. £700 is another lens if you can afford to have to find another £700 for a lens then go for it. For me as an up and coming photographer every penny counts.

Obviously places like calumet are the best places to go if you are in the UK. You wont get the same protection as if you bought from them but Calumet are the most expensive in the UK also the most professional.

Like I said this is my second camera from them and I have had no issues what so ever.

Service I have received has been fantastic, and the delivery time of 3 days with free postage awesome. That was jsut before Christmas too.

If you can afford to spend the extra money then I suppose ye... go waste your money. Most of us pros have somewhere local you send your kit for service and repair so that has never been a problem for me.

They are driving prices down in the UK which is not a bad thing! Electronics are hugely over inflated in the UK compared to America, in the UK you pay the same number as the american equivalent but obviously the dollar is worth about 2/3s the pound. Rip off.

Here is a link to more info on the warranty although the ebay side of the business. It states once purchased and payment accepted you get a 1 year warranty.

http://ww3.digitalrev.com/ebay/guide/uk/warranty.asp

From the website

http://www.digitalrev.com/help/terms-of-product-warranty/NDE_A


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## Dick (Feb 28, 2013)

You guys make it sound like the warranty would be the most important thing. I get why this is, but then if I look at my purchases of all things I've ever bought, I can't remember the last time I ever needed a warranty. What are the odds for needing it? I guess it makes sense to play safe, but the real wins in life come with risks. Items usually break right when the warranty period is over. Just got my watch serviced 2 years and 1 month after purchase and it had a 2-year warranty.


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## tomscott (Feb 28, 2013)

Ye I agree but I suppose for a lot of people £2-2500 for a camera is a massive purchase to have no comeback, from a business point of view its the bread and butter, failures happen and they get hammered which is why knowing a repairer is important and someone you know is much more trustworthy.

My pro kit is insured too so if the worst happens thats what its there for.

But I agree in my experience Canon cameras are like tanks. Had two 40D well over 150k actuations and apart from a sticky button where I had been in the sahara where it was incredibly dusty then back in rainy Cumbria where the camera got drenched and the shutter button started sticking. Bit of alcohol sorted that a treat. 

Other than that nothing, and the 40D isnt a pro spec camera. I expect the 5D to be more resistant.


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## Rienzphotoz (Mar 2, 2013)

Scott_McPhee said:


> I was looking at DR when I was purchasing my 5D3.
> Cheap prices but the lack of a UK warranty for something so expensive and time critical to me put me off buying from them.
> 
> The Kai show is entertaining, but I stick to UK based companies.


Clearly you have not added anything to digital rev basket or have not read their warranty / shipment details ... for shipments to UK for 5D MK III they clearly state the following:
PS. The price is with 24-105 lens and a few other small items bundled ... for body only I think it is 2059


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## Rienzphotoz (Mar 2, 2013)

SilverSnake said:


> tomscott said:
> 
> 
> > Got my 5DMKIII from DR, arrived in 3 days to UK saved nearly £700 over UK prices with a a 24-105mm and 100mm Macro. Came with all UK standard kit etc great service IMO.
> ...


According to Digitalrev:
*"No Import Tax/Duty to Pay:
Any import tax/duty charged will be billed directly us".*
Also, Shipment is Free and they provide Local UK Warranty ... read their terms and conditions for more details.
You will find that info when you add your items in the "Shopping Basket"
But sometimes digitalrev prices are far more than buying from B&H and paying for shipping ... it depends from product to product ... I always check the prices between Digitalrev & B&H (Adorama if its a Nikon item as B&H does not ship Nikon gear to Middle East)


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## Harry Muff (Mar 2, 2013)

Why bother with DigitalRev when ProCamerashop is cheaper and based in the U.K?


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## zim (Mar 2, 2013)

Harry Muff said:


> Why bother with DigitalRev when ProCamerashop is cheaper and based in the U.K?



Good shout. I like DRev but on the shopping list I'm looking at I would be saving £153 going PCS. I've been watching DRev prices for some time now and yes they are a lot cheaper than UK shops but they are going up.

I've not bought from ProCamerashop anyone have any experience?


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## zim (Mar 3, 2013)

mmmm........

Maybe not so safe, makes their web site look rather misleading now:

Domain name:
procamerashop.co.uk

Registrant:
Smart Choice Photo Ltd

Trading as:
ProCameraShop

Registrant type:
Non-UK Corporation

Registrant's address:
1223 Trans HK Commercial Building, 41 - 43 Carnarvon Road
Kowloon
Tsimshatsui
NA
Hong Kong

Registrar:
Webfusion Ltd t/a 123-reg [Tag = 123-REG]
URL: http://www.123-reg.co.uk


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## MadHungarian (May 28, 2015)

Well i just had a less-than-ideal experience myself with my first order to digitalrev...

I decided that for some reason i needed an M3 and a couple lenses. Don't ask why -- there's not really any sane reason for it. And unfortunately, digitalrev seems to be the only real game in town for this sort of stuff for USA customers, as far as i can tell.

So i try to place an order, and my creditcard company immediately goes into a fraud-alert frenzy, rejects the transaction, and also places a fraud lock on my card. Okay, so i eventually get that taken care of with my bank. And I do eventually manage to place an order for a couple white-box EF-M lenses. So they show up okay. One of them was new, and the other one was relatively new but had clearly been mounted on a camera before and the front element had to be cleaned a little. Well, i guess that's the risks you take with random white-box stuff.

So then a few days later i place a second order (for the M3 itself). But the next day digitalrev cancels my order because they say they can't verify that my shipping address is legit or something. But they'd already delivered the first order, and also isn't it just a simple google query these days to see that person X lives at that address, if you have any concerns?

So now digitalrev insists that i send supporting documentation proving that i really live at that address. Like a copy of driver's license or something. Well it'll be a cold day in %#%[email protected] before i send that sort of thing to some random chinese company!

Anyone else had issues ordering from those folks? Or any suggestions?


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## Hjalmarg1 (May 28, 2015)

wayno said:


> Haven't bought from these guys before but had only heard good things - until this...
> 
> http://www.news.com.au/technology/biztech/camera-company-digitalrev-busted-selling-used-cameras-sold-as-new-online/story-fn5lic6c-1226580348144


I have only bought cheap items from them and not a single problem


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## Random Orbits (May 28, 2015)

MadHungarian said:


> Well i just had a less-than-ideal experience myself with my first order to digitalrev...
> 
> I decided that for some reason i needed an M3 and a couple lenses. Don't ask why -- there's not really any sane reason for it. And unfortunately, digitalrev seems to be the only real game in town for this sort of stuff for USA customers, as far as i can tell.
> 
> ...



I haven't had any problems. I've used them 2-3 different times. The tracking they provide is useless, but I've never had any problems getting the order in.


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## martti (May 29, 2015)

I got stuff from them more than once. Never problems. I did not realize they have their own shop outside eBay now. Not that I need to buy anything, either.

As for the OP, he should just get a new one with Digitalrev taking care of the freight.
Or a refund. This is very bad for their business and I am sure they will bend backwards to make it right.


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## martti (May 29, 2015)

JerryKnight said:


> crasher8 said:
> 
> 
> > Kai lost a few rep points there for sure.
> ...



In business world Kai is the face of DigitalRev. He personifies the company. The company goofs, the market says it is Kai's company, it is his fault. This is how people think. In the States a weather man had rubber boots thrown at him because it rained on a football game. Like he was in charge of the anticyclones going this way and that.

Kai has pretty brilliant stuff there...I did not even realize there is a shop there as well!


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## candc (May 29, 2015)

I had a bad experience with them. Had some issues with a sigma 18-35; cistomer support was awful. Slow and cryptic. Was then told the return period had expired and that only unopened items could be returned or exchanged. Never again.


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## bereninga (May 29, 2015)

candc said:


> I had a bad experience with them. Had some issues with a sigma 18-35; cistomer support was awful. Slow and cryptic. Was then told the return period had expired and that only unopened items could be returned or exchanged. Never again.



Whoa, that is really sh!tty. I def will be staying away from purchasing from them.


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## martti (May 29, 2015)

DigitalREv is living in a very competetive business environment and they have been around for a while.
My last purchase from them dates from 2008. 
If a very visible company like theirs starts getting bad feedback, it wil cost them thousands of dollars daily.
Given the chance, they will do everything in their power to get the customer the product he will be happy with ASAP. 
They cannot afford 95% satisfaction rate, it has to be 99%. The one per cent being French who did not understand the operating instructions. And, of course, if you do 10 000 transactions a month, statistics are against you how ever hard you might try. Many clients who have absolutely nothing happening in their lives, live fully the experience beuíng bullied by the International Capitalism.
Hogwash.
Those HK guys who have a 10-year track record are good.
That's the point where we should start. If there is a problem, they are more than willing to fix it at their own cost rather than let it go public.

That's their way of doing business. I have some experience.
Stay clear of the French sellers, however. They steal.
Also, it is a good idea to check that the seller's name corresponds to the billing eMail.
PayPal is your friend when you are buying but a bitchy SOB when you are the seller whose product has not arrived.

I think the Market has taught them to be bitchy...attack the guy whose money you have access to, not somebody in Azerbhaidzan Tribal Areas...


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## MadHungarian (May 29, 2015)

Of course if you choose to buy gray-market stuff from overseas, I guess by necessity you're taking some chances and dealing with some non-top-flight vendors perhaps. So I suppose you just have to pick the best of the perhaps less than ideal sources.

Sorry though, forgot to mention that I resurrected an old thread here. Whatever may have happened with Kai was two years ago. Old history now.


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## East Wind Photography (Jun 11, 2015)

Ordered my M3 from them. It arrived here in the U.S. in 4 days. Very happy with the service and the camera. I too would be put out if I got a used camera but I did not and only have great things to say about them.


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## Admin US West (Jun 11, 2015)

MadHungarian said:


> Well i just had a less-than-ideal experience myself with my first order to digitalrev...
> 
> I decided that for some reason i needed an M3 and a couple lenses. Don't ask why -- there's not really any sane reason for it. And unfortunately, digitalrev seems to be the only real game in town for this sort of stuff for USA customers, as far as i can tell.
> 
> ...



You are looking at a issue which online sellers and bloggers must deal with.

There is a reason as to why you were flagged.

You are behind a proxy and that raises a red flag. That's exactly what online spammers and scammers do.


In your case, its your employer who is not sending information out with your IP address which identifies the origin of your order. Its common for companies and government agencies to do this, but its a big issue for online sellers.

Amazon and some of the large online retailers can afford smarter systems that know the IP addresses of cities, companies, and government agencies.

If you tried to order from within the same IP that you use to post here, its going to cause a issue with a small overseas company that receives fraud attacks by the dozen every day. 

We often block new signups who hide behind a proxy, because 99% are spammers.

Send them what they requested, or don't hide behind a anonymous IP.


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## East Wind Photography (Jun 11, 2015)

MadHungarian said:


> Well i just had a less-than-ideal experience myself with my first order to digitalrev...
> 
> I decided that for some reason i needed an M3 and a couple lenses. Don't ask why -- there's not really any sane reason for it. And unfortunately, digitalrev seems to be the only real game in town for this sort of stuff for USA customers, as far as i can tell.
> 
> ...



It's also common practice for companies to only ship to the same address on record with your cc company. This helps prevent people from using stolen credit cards to purchase items online. If your shipping address is different you can call your cc company and let them know you are having an online order shipped somewhere else to pre-approve the order.

Not sure if this was the case for you or not but could be one reason for an order issue.

Just because they did it once doesn't mean someone didn't make a mistake at the store and released the order without verifying.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jun 11, 2015)

East Wind Photography said:


> It's also common practice for companies to only ship to the same address on record with your cc company. This helps prevent people from using stolen credit cards to purchase items online. If your shipping address is different you can call your cc company and let them know you are having an online order shipped somewhere else to pre-approve the order.
> 
> Not sure if this was the case for you or not but could be one reason for an order issue.
> 
> Just because they did it once doesn't mean someone didn't make a mistake at the store and released the order without verifying.



Store owners do not actually process credit cards by hand, its a bit more complex. When you enter your card info, it is entered into as gateway, which usually is a company specializing in taking credit cards and screening them for errors, fraud, etc. There are settings in the gateway for basic checks, address match can be full address, postal code, verification code, etc. They also look at the IP to determine if the country matches that of the CC, and, of course, the cc number is a different number of digits for the USA.

Depending on the risk level for the type of business (Cameras and Lenses is a high risk target), the merchant can set restrictions tighter or looser. If a card fails one test, its going to be rejected. If it fails multiple tests, its going to trigger a fraud alert. When I buy a $3,000 lens or camera from my local merchant, my phone rings 1 minute later with Amex asking if I purchased the item. That's because Amex looks to see if you have done business with that merchant recently. Since I only purchase a big ticket item from him every 2-3 years, the phone usually rings.

I buy from Adorama and B&H frequently enough that I usually don't get those calls about purchases there.

I ran a online store and dealt with gateways, card processors, etc. There are multiple levels of checks, and still fraudsters occasionally get thru.

The OP should be happy that the store takes security responsibly and is protecting his credit card from a possible unauthorized purchase.


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## East Wind Photography (Jun 11, 2015)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> East Wind Photography said:
> 
> 
> > It's also common practice for companies to only ship to the same address on record with your cc company. This helps prevent people from using stolen credit cards to purchase items online. If your shipping address is different you can call your cc company and let them know you are having an online order shipped somewhere else to pre-approve the order.
> ...



It depends upon the store. Pure online stores can deal with processing a bit differently than a brick and mortar store that has to deal with inventory levels and a separate point of sale system to integrate. We are also dealing with a Chinese company here so what we do here in the states and what they do may be completely different.

One thing is for sure if the shipping and billing addresses are different, that raises a big red flag...no pun intended there. Once you get burned, you question ALL of the red flags.

Also people don't realize while you as a consumer are offered great protection against fraudulent purchases, the merchant does not. He therefor needs to get it right.


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## Valvebounce (Jun 12, 2015)

Hi Mt Spokane. 
Well said. 
This is done to protect your credit rating, (and the credit company) it may seem inconvenient, but not as inconvenient as having to cancel your card (or having it cancelled automatically) because of fraudulent activity. It would have been nice if the seller had informed you when they cancelled your order that they had and why, but then it might not have been you they contacted anyway! ;D
Just do what we all have to do from time to time, jump through the hoops they have set up for you and move on! 

Cheers, Graham. 



Mt Spokane Photography said:


> East Wind Photography said:
> 
> 
> > It's also common practice for companies to only ship to the same address on record with your cc company. This helps prevent people from using stolen credit cards to purchase items online. If your shipping address is different you can call your cc company and let them know you are having an online order shipped somewhere else to pre-approve the order.
> ...


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jun 12, 2015)

East Wind Photography said:


> We are also dealing with a Chinese company here so what we do here in the states and what they do may be completely different.




The credit card companies call the shots, they publish a extensive set of requirements that sellers must follow. They have issues a common set of rules that apply Globally, no matter what country you are in. If you want to accept Visa, MasterCard, Discover, AMEX, you must abide by them, and the rules require a independent verification that you are following the rules.

That's one of the reasons that I finally stopped taking credit cards last July. It had become expensive for a small business. There are indeed different procedures for Brick and Mortar, but everyone is connected to the internet now, and card data is transmitted over the internet, so the computer security is very tight (Some still don't get it).


The PCI Data Security Standard
PCI DSS is the global data security standard adopted by the payment card brands for all entities that
process, store or transmit cardholder data and/or sensitive authentication data. It consists of steps that
mirror security best practices.

https://www.pcisecuritystandards.org/documents/PCISSC%20QRG%20August%202014%20-print.pdf


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## East Wind Photography (Jun 12, 2015)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> East Wind Photography said:
> 
> 
> > We are also dealing with a Chinese company here so what we do here in the states and what they do may be completely different.
> ...



Yes but there are some that still get around that practice...for example..I go into a restaurant to buy food, I never have anyone ask me for my billing address. When I order online some but not everyone ask for the CID...which I thought was a requirement.

Anyway, I think we can say for the fees charged, the system still is not perfect.


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## Mt Spokane Photography (Jun 12, 2015)

East Wind Photography said:


> Mt Spokane Photography said:
> 
> 
> > East Wind Photography said:
> ...



The billing address is optional, and a cid check is also optional. Its up to the business. PCI deals more with security of data and protecting credit card numbers. In cases where a customer I have dealt with for years places a order with just his card number, I don't bother him for the CID, I just turn the check off for him. Another thing about the address check, is that its just for the zip code. I don't know why, but that's all the card companies provide to the gateway companies for a address check. They all act as though its a check of the address, but its not. Scammers know this. I can set it to the basic 5 digit code or the zip plus 4 (US customers). When accepting International credit cards, many banks still do not have all the data online, or its unreliable, so its common to ask for a scan of some ID.

If a business is not worried about a customer, they are allowed to take the risk, but are fined for a excessive number of chargebacks. Those engaging in professional fraud are usually looking for something in high demand, cameras, lenses, video games, smart phones, anything they can resell quickly and easily.


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## TeT (Jun 12, 2015)

oops... but that is probably all it is oops and not malicious intent on a grand scale...


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## East Wind Photography (Jun 12, 2015)

Mt Spokane Photography said:


> East Wind Photography said:
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> 
> > Mt Spokane Photography said:
> ...



When I've had to deal with big charges, I've actually called the card issuer and asked to validate the address I was given in the order. If it didn't match then I cancelled the order or had the customer call his card company to register his shipping address. It was huge manual PITA but it helped root out fraud. Any of these automated verifications are also suspect. Once a hacker gets into a merchant he pretty much has access to all of the resources needed. 

While the manual person to person address verification was a BIG pain, it was the best way at the time. I now outsource all of that so the liability is not on me as a merchant.


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